← The Goal Digger Podcast | Top Business and Marketing Podcast for Creatives, Entrepreneurs, and Women in Business
The Goal Digger Podcast | Top Business and Marketing Podcast for Creatives, Entrepreneurs, and Women in Business
915: Why Your “Too Small” Idea Might Be the Exact Thing People Pay For
00:57:55
With Jennifer Gulizia and Jenna Kutcher
Loading summary
Transcript87 lines
- [00:02]
A
The Digital Course Academy doors are open right now at jennacutcher.com forward/dca DCA is Amy Porterfield's complete system that takes you from idea to profitable course to successful launch, step by step by step. This exact program launched my first online course and changed basically everything for me this year. When you join dca, you'll also get four rounds of human feedback Feedback, real experts reviewing your course outline, sales page and launch plan, giving you strategic input so you can move forward fast. Plus, there are AI tools trained on Amy's framework to help when you're stuck. It's basically like having Amy in your back pocket. This isn't watch and hope, it's a finish line focused program when you Enroll. Now through jennacutcher.com DCA I'm adding my entire course business blueprint as your bonus. I'm talking my proven email funnels, launch templates, sales systems that convert without feeling pushy, everything I use to run my multimillion dollar online course business, yours to copy and customize. Amy teaches it. I've done it. You get both While everyone else is googling how to create an online course you'll be launching with proven tools that work Doors close soon, no extensions. Head to jennacutcher.com DCA so you can stay, stop waiting and start building. Your course won't create itself, but with Amy's system and my bonuses, it almost will. Jennakutcher.com DCA Huge savings on Dell AI PCs are here and it's a big deal. Why? Because Dell AI PCs with Intel Core Ultra processors are newly designed to help you do more faster. It's pretty amazing what they can do in a day's work. They can generate code, edit images, multitask without leg draft emails, summarize documents, create live translations. They can even extend your battery life so you never have to worry about forgetting your charger. It's like having a personal assistant built right into your PC to cover the menial tasks so that you can focus on what matters. That's the power of Dell AI with Intel inside with deals on Dell AI PCs like the Dell 16 plus starting at $749.99, it is the perfect time to refresh your tech and take back your time. Upgrade your AIPC today by visiting Dell.comdeals that's Dell.com deals think your business is too niche to succeed online? In this coaching session, I'm chatting with Jennifer about how to sell a highly specific online to a small but mighty audience and how to attract the right people to Grow a business that feels Deeply aligned. I'm Jenna Kutcher and I help you trade hustle for purpose and build a business that gives you the life you actually want to live. From a $300 Craigslist camera to a seven figure business I run from home, I've learned that success isn't just about what you do, it's about how you live. Here, you'll get strategies that work, successful systems that give you your time back, and steps that turn your effort into results and impact. If you're ready for clarity, confidence, and a business that feels as good as it looks, you're in the right place. This is the Goal Digger podcast. Have you ever wondered if a mini course, something super niche and seasonal, could actually become a legit revenue stream for your business? Or maybe you felt stuck thinking, why would somebody pay for this when there's so much free content out there? If so, this episode is exactly what you need to hear. Today I am coaching Jennifer Galizia, a flower farmer and garden educator who turned her passion for dahlias into a beautiful educational business. She's the founder of the Flowering Farmhouse, which is a regenerative flower farm in Oregon, and she's created a seasonal mini course to help home gardeners learn how to dig, divide and store their dahlia tubers with confidence. I can talk about this like I know what I'm talking about, because I do. Thanks to her. I actually came across her first in my Instagram comments and then she sent me some dahlia tubers which are growing in my garden as we speak. And I am a member of her community. I am learning from her. I am like proof that what she teaches works. And so here's what makes this conversation just feel so special is Jennifer is also a student of Amy Porterfield's, just like I am. She took Digital Course Academy and she's back at the table looking to refine her offer, grow her community, share what's working, and get clarity on how to market something that is niche, that is rather time sensitive, and doesn't always fit the traditional signature course mold. So if you are someone who you've ever worried like is my topic too specific or too seasonal in order to succeed? This coaching session is for you. And listen, if Jennifer's story today has you thinking, wait, I have something. I could do this too, then I want to personally invite you to check out the Digital Course Academy. It is the very program that helped me launch my first online course, that helped me change my entire business, my entire life, that literally helped me free up time so that I could do things like plant dahlia tubers in my free time. And enrollment is open right now, but only for a few more days, so definitely do not delay. Head to jennacutcher.com forward/dca to save your seat and to get my exclusive bonus suite design designed to help you actually implement what Amy teaches. That's Jenna kutcher.com forward/dca. And of course, it's linked in the show notes for you too. Let's dive on in and coach Jennifer and help her continue to get her course out into the world and hopefully spark some inspiration for your own. Jennifer, welcome to the Gold Digger Podcast. All right, Jennifer, welcome to the Gold Digger podcast. I am so excited to take this conversation outside of our DM thread and our text thread and bring it to the earbuds of our listeners. So before we dive in, I know a lot about you, but kind of give us the, you know, 30,000 foot view of who you are and what you do so that our listener knows where you're at in your journey.
- [06:33]
B
Thank you, Jenna. It's such an honor to be here today. This is kind of that pinch me moment where it feels so special. So I am Jennifer Galicia. I am a cut flower farmer in Hood River, Oregon, in the Columbia River Gorge. We specialize in growing dahlias. And I'm in my fourth year of hybridizing dahlias. And one of the things that I love so much is how flowers really force us to slow down and connect with others and be present in the moment. So it is my, I'd say it's my mission and purpose in life to just spread the beauty of local flowers. And one of the ways that I'm trying to do that is through my podcast, the Backyard Bouquet Podcast, and then through the Dahlia Patch, my online community and my mini course, which you're going to help me with today.
- [07:21]
A
Yes. Okay. So Jennifer and I, we connected a while ago, but Jennifer has always been. There are just like a handful of people that I see in my comment section on every post, and I know them and I remember them. And like, you are just such a cheerleader, like, just a natural cheerleader. And we've actually connected outside of Instagram because we're both in the process of building greenhouses. I will say Jennifer sent me a message and it was like the weirdest serendipitous thing where she's like, have you ever considered a greenhouse? And I literally had a Pinterest board of greenhouses. And so we are working with the same company Talk a little bit about that and then we can dive into the content. But I'm like so excited. We're designing our dream greenhouse. I can't wait to garden year round. Who ever would have thought I would say these words?
- [08:13]
B
It makes me so happy because I mean, gardening is so good for the soul. We always talk about how food is important for our lives, but we live in such a fast paced society that we often forget to slow down. And flowers do that. They ground you, they connect you to a place and they create memories. And I mean, they need us at all of life's moments. And we could have a whole nother conversation about that. But when I got started growing flowers, I was thinking to myself, and I was a photographer too at the time actually, and I was growing my flowers initially so I could have these really pretty pictures to take with my clients. I was like, I need a greenhouse, of course. And so I think I went on Pinterest and I started looking for the prettiest greenhouses that I could find. And then I came across Northwest Green Panels, who at the time was located close to me in Oregon. And so I reached out to them and I said, I have this new property. I'm starting this garden. I need a greenhouse. And we had a white modern farmhouse at the time. And I said, I need my greenhouse to match our house. And so Northwest Green Panels worked with me to build an 8 by 12 greenhouse. That got my start. And little did I know this was right before COVID I had no idea that the world was about to shut down. And that little greenhouse launched my cut flower career.
- [09:34]
A
Oh, my God. So, yeah, it's crazy. I am so excited. We're working with them to build a greenhouse chicken coop combo. And I'm like, so wicked excited about it. And you know, the other night I like went into the garden and harvested kale and tomatoes and basil and all these things, and I put together this like, delicious salad and I went in and cut up my sourdough. And I was like, what life am I living right now? But, oh, it is, it is so good. Okay, so let's dive in to your topic. And one of the things that I'm so excited to explore with you is like, I feel so in your world right now as a member of your community and as somebody who took your course. So I hope I can give some really good advice. So let's dive off with like your first question and we'll kind of work through it together.
- [10:22]
B
Perfect. So we live in a world right now where there is so much free content out there. And everyone is interested in gardening right now, and everyone is a gardening expert. And so right now, I'm finding that there's so much free information out there. How do I position my mini course on digging and dividing and storing dahlias as a paid offer when there's so much free content out there?
- [10:46]
A
Okay, so I love this question. And I also feel like it's super pertinent in the age of AI as well. Right? And I often look at information in two camps. So there's, like, interesting information and then there's useful information. And as I've gotten way more invested in data and understanding, I've learned this from our data team of, like, why do you need to know something? Is it just because it's interesting or is it because it's actually useful? And so the goal here in an information age is to focus on transformation, not on information. Free content is usually scattered. It's usually incomplete. Right? But your course or your guide or whatever you are creating, in this case it's your mini course is this curated, proven path with a clear outcome. And so what I love about this is a lot of times people, we are so. We are so generous with ourselves, saying, like, I will learn this myself. I will DIY something. And then two months from now, we realize we are no further in the journey or the process because information is everywhere. We have no skin in the game, and we have no clear path forward. And so what I absolutely love about mini courses is that it is solving just one problem, right? You are not teaching somebody everything they need to know about everything. When it comes to growing flowers, you are literally teaching them one part of the process. You are solving a very big problem with clarity. So you want to focus on the transformation. And what I would say is in your marketing, you want to literally call attention to the fact that, like, information is everywhere. In fact, you might have consumed it. And you are nowhere closer to. To understanding how to do this process. Right? Or you might be seeing conflicting information, which only leaves you confused and paralyzed and in a state of inaction. Right? And I think a lot of times in marketing, we're so scared to, like, say the thing out loud, right? Because it almost feels like, wait a minute, like, am I calling attention to this thing? But I actually feel like in this era that we are in. Trust is the currency. And if people know, like, hey, I am calling this thing out, and this is probably the reality for you, as it was for me. Here is from start to finish. Let me save you Time, energy, mistakes, and money. And let me teach you the full thing. So one of the things that I learned from Amy Porterfield, who we both have studied under, is this idea that she learned from Dan Sullivan, which is the gap in the gain. And so the gap in the gain is really in your marketing and how you talk about your offer. Show people, okay, I understand what the gap you are in in terms of where you are now versus where you want to go. And then show how your course bridges that gap, right? So paint that picture of, like, okay, you might be curious about how to do this, and you might be getting started, and you might become obsessed like I was, but there's still a lot of confusion on how this actually works and what you do. Let me show you exactly what to do step by step, by step, so you don't make mistakes, so you don't ruin your harvest, and so that you maximize your results. And so I think that that is the way that you approach it. A few other ideas include having, like, exclusive frameworks or templates or checklists or guides, because a lot of times the information isn't paired with anything that puts people into action. It is literally purely just information. And so any sort of thing that you can do that gives them the steps to follow and that leads them to action is going to be where you actually get people with results. But here's the crazy thing is when people pay, they pay attention, right? And so people that are putting free, like, I have so much free content out there, right? Like, we have 900 plus episodes of this podcast, thousands of blog posts. I love free content. But the people that actually get the biggest results are the people who had skin in the game and an investment. And so you can even say, like, if you are willing to put down money to actually take action on this, this is for you. And so I think a lot of it just comes down to positioning and just making sure that it is very clear and not clever. You don't need it to be, like, the most interesting thing. You just need it to be the most promising thing. And so that's where I feel like when we look at online courses and where they're headed in this information age, it is, how are we actually helping people get into a state of taking and putting it into action? And I think that is where things like courses and mini courses and memberships are absolutely going to shine because people have too much information that they're doing nothing with. Does that make sense?
- [15:45]
B
It does. I love how you worded that. Thank you.
- [15:48]
A
Yes. Okay. What's the next question?
- [15:50]
B
Okay, so the next one, you were talking about freebies.
- [15:53]
A
Yes.
- [15:54]
B
Growing dahlias is so seasonal, especially for someone like you. I was looking at your growing zone last night, and you're actually your zone. I think four or five.
- [16:03]
A
Yes, four. I think, yes, Zone four.
- [16:05]
B
Okay. And I'm zone seven. But our frost dates are very close to the same time, so we have a very similar growing window. And neither one of us can afford to leave our dahlias in the ground. So. But with that, it's not like you can plant your dahlias in December and Duluth or even in Hood river, we have to wait for certain times. So I have a seasonal offer. How do I offer a freebie or launch Runway with a seasonal offer?
- [16:35]
A
Okay.
- [16:36]
B
Or is it better to just keep it evergreen?
- [16:38]
A
Well, I know, so I. You can keep it evergreen, meaning it's always available. But I think that we want to be super strategic with the promotions and the windows and the pre launch. And what's so cool, Jennifer, is like, you already have the offer. Right. So now is where you get to have fun with. How do I get people to it? It's kind of like so many entrepreneurs have experienced it, whether it's a website or content, that whole, like, if you build it, they will come is not true in the land of digital marketing. And so now you get to have fun with, well, how do I bring people there? And I know we are both so seasonal because you and I are like texting pictures of the gardens and all the different things. And so what I would think that I would plan for is almost doing like these launches or mini launches during peak times for maximum conversions. So you have actual urgency baked in, where it's not fake urgency. Right. Like, even when you were sending me my tubers and you were like, okay, you gotta kind of get these in the ground soon. Like, if we're gonna maximize this, we've gotta figure this out. And so you actually have real urgency, which a lot of people are lacking in the digital space. And what I think is kind of beautiful about it too, knowing you on a more personal level, is that you can have this kind of launch window and then you get to go back into the gardening for yourself that you love. Right. So it's not like you're launching all summer long when you're also in the thick of growing your own garden and figuring this all out. And so for seasonal topics, I would consider figuring out a Runway where you are first entering into people's planning stages. Right. So how do you hit People in the stage where they are starting to plan their garden or they're thinking about what do I want in my garden this year, what is the layout of the garden? Etc, and you want to meet them in that planning stage with the type of content that they would need at that stage of the game. So that would make an epic email freebie, like some sort of opt in where you're launching it as people are starting to think about like, well, what is this going to look like as we get closer to the season? And then I would definitely make sure that you have in that urgency around. Okay. This is the timing that you need to nail based on your zone. So you could even do like a fun, almost like a quiz or like help them qualify. What zone are you in? And here's the ideal planting window and then here's how to do it successfully. Right. So there's so many different ways that you could hit on that. But what I think would be smart is having it available all the time. Anyone can join at any time, but then baking into your content and your calendar, figuring out, okay, what are these launch windows that make sense based on the seasonality and how do I go a little bit harder and more thoughtfully in leading up to that Runway? When I say this, like, what kind of things come to mind in terms of content creation and or timing for you based on your product?
- [19:32]
B
What comes to my mind? Well, I love your idea of the quiz.
- [19:35]
A
Yeah.
- [19:36]
B
Because not everyone has to dig their dahlias.
- [19:39]
A
Yes.
- [19:40]
B
But there's lots of people that do.
- [19:42]
A
Yes.
- [19:43]
B
So anyone in zones 7 and below have to dig their. Well, there's a few exceptions where you can leave them in the ground in zone seven, which I do cover. But if you're zone seven and below, if you want your dalas come back the following year, you need to dig them. And then there's those that are above that zone. So in zones 8. So for example, people like in Portland, Oregon or lots of the country is in a warmer climate where they don't really get below freezing in the wintertime if they leave.
- [20:11]
A
Right.
- [20:11]
B
I know it gets so cold here. I was looking at your cold temperatures. I was like, I can't complain. But if they leave them in the ground, they don't get the benefit of dividing them. And when you divide your dahlias, you can multiply your stalk and have even more flowers, whether you want to plant more in your garden or you want to share those tubers with other people. So there's benefits for everyone to dig their dahlias and then Once you dig them, it's like, what do you do? How do you store them? Because they're finicky and you have to. You can't.
- [20:39]
A
I need to know all of this.
- [20:41]
B
Yes. Because if you just leave them in your greenhouse, they will turn to mush this winter unless your greenhouse is heated. There's certain temperatures and certain humidity that they need to stand. So I think the quiz is a really good idea.
- [20:53]
A
Do it really cool too, where it's like, do you know what zone you're in? If you don't, here's how to figure that out. Okay, then, like, do you have a plan for what this happens? Like, and it. You don't even have to be the information know all, but you can help guide them to know the right questions to be asking, to know the next steps they need to be taking. And then your offer is the natural next extension based on their responses of like, okay, if this is a process that you need to follow, I have literally mapped this out for you. Steps A through Z. Right. Like, don't even go any further. I've literally mapped this out for you. So I love that. But definitely when it comes to seasonality, I think really maximizing that through your channels and just thinking about the different phases of the journey when it comes to, you know, planning and then planting and then harvesting and then all of the dividing and all the different things. Mapping that out into your content strategy not only gives you frameworks, which I think can be so helpful in terms of like, well, what am I going to say today? Or what do I have to post today? But it'll also just help people in that process, which is great. Let's hit pause for just a second to thank our sponsors for making this conversation possible. And while we're here, I want for you to think about your own audience. What pain point do they have that you could help solve? Remember, nothing, and I mean nothing, is too niche. When we come back, we're diving into how to create urgency around Evergreen offers even when there's no countdown timer. We'll be back in just a minute. You know that sinking feeling when you see your latest campaign report? 87% of your budget went to people who would never buy from you. Random scrollers clicking your business course. Ad students engaging with your entrepreneur content. You're perfect ad creative about building sustainable income shown to people who aren't even trying to build a business. That's why LinkedIn ads exists. While other platforms. Guess who might be interested? LinkedIn knows who your buyers are. Target the exact job titles making purchasing decisions reach VPs of marketing at growing companies find HR directors at mid sized firms Target entrepreneurs ready to invest in their growth. Zero waste, maximum impact. Stop hemorrhaging, budget on random audiences and start reaching actual decision makers who can write the checks only with LinkedIn ads. Spend $250 on your first campaign on LinkedIn ads and get a free $250 credit for the next one. Just go to LinkedIn.com goal that's LinkedIn.com G O A L Terms and conditions apply. Can we talk about how bad underwear can ruin your entire day? Like I used to put on underwear and a bra knowing that I'd be adjusting it by 10am and completely over it by lunchtime. That is why I am obsessed with the Skims Fits Everybody Collection. Now, I bought skims for years, but I swear this line is a total game changer. The Fits Everybody Scoop Roulette has buttery, soft fabric that literally feels like nothing and I mean that in the best way I can put it on and I forget that it exists. I'm so confident in these pieces that when I packed my grease suitcase, it was basically all skims. I even wore their bodysuit for a recent branding photo shoot. Because when something fits this well, you just trust it. When your underwear actually works, you stop wasting precious mental energy on it and you can focus on everything else that matters. If you're tired of uncomfortable intimates, this is your sign to try Fits Everybody Shop Skims Fits Everybody collection@skims.com Once you place your order, make sure to let them know we sent you. Just select Podcast in the survey and choose the Goal Digger podcast in the dropdown menu that follows. Running a business means wearing every hat, creating content one minute, handling customer service the next, then trying to figure out shipping logistics. It can get overwhelming fast. When you're building your dreams, finding the right tool that not only helps but simplifies everything is a game changer for millions of businesses. That tool is Shopify. Shopify powers millions of businesses worldwide and 10% of all e commerce in the US from Gymshark and Mattel to brands just starting out with hundreds of ready to use templates, you can create a store that matches your brand. Shopify's AI tools write product descriptions and even headlines so you can create content faster. Plus, with their built in email and social tools, it's like having a marketing team in your back pocket. From inventory to shipping to returns, Shopify is the partner every entrepreneur needs. If you're ready to sell, you're Ready for Shopify. Turn your business idea into. With Shopify on your side, sign up for your $1 per month trial and start selling today at shopify.com gold digger go to shopify.com golddigger shopify.com gold digger okay. Do you have another question?
- [25:49]
B
I do. So, as we just talked about, dahlias are time sensitive.
- [25:53]
A
Yeah. Yes.
- [25:54]
B
How do I drive urgency and conversions if the course is available year round, but the content is time sensitive? So I know it's a little bit along the same lines of what we just talked about.
- [26:07]
A
Yeah. So I would definitely consider using different, like, limited time bonuses. So one of the things that we do is a lot of our programs are technically open year round, but during the launch windows, you get specific bonuses that do disappear. Like, you can only get certain bonuses during the live launch. And so there is true urgency and it is a very honest representation of the offer. And so what I would consider is, like, what are some time limited bonuses where it's like, if you join by this time next week, you get X, Y, or Z up for something that's really valuable at that time. And then also just leveraging the, like, knowledge of like. Like, you need to get these in the ground now. Because that made me urge it, like, where I was like, okay, they're coming in a box and I'm gonna plant them. And I've got this because I know that there is a true window of time. For me specifically. Another idea is you can offer enrollment but have different bonuses tied to different times of the year. So let's say if you just broke up the year into the four seasons, spring, summer, fall, winter, and you had a specific bonus that would be helpful for people if they purchase in winter. If you have a specific bonus, that would be helpful. And that is a really easy way to serve the people, no matter where they're at, no matter when they join, but also to show, like, there are things you could be doing year round for this. Right. Based on what you're doing or what you're learning. So there are things you could be learning or doing as you learn about this process. So I would really just consider what are some true bonuses that you can take away. And then again, how do you create urgency? And one thing that would be really fascinating would be if you did Facebook ads and you could sort by geographic region. So you could literally be like, in the Midwest. These are the planting guidelines. Here's the deadline for planting. And you could just break up the country into different areas and have the deadlines on there. I mean, it would take a little bit of groundwork. Yes. But the more specificity and the more niche down you are, the more people trust you, because it's like, she's not just. Just a general person. Like, I have a really dear friend who's an epic gardener. Well, they live in California. It's totally different. They don't know what it's like to be in Minnesota. Right. And so, like, I remember when they came out here, and they were like, oh, my gosh, this is wild. And I'm like, yeah, it's a whole different beast. And so the more specificity you give, the more confidence somebody has that you understand their unique situation or that you can help them through it. So I would just also consider that. And then the last thing I would say, too, is one of the biggest things that we are shifting in our business that is so beautiful is how are we using case studies and testimonials throughout our marketing to help show different success stories in different areas or different times of year from your students. So, like, yes, you are the creator. You are the hero of that story, but how do you also position your students as the hero of their own journey and, like, what they've learned? And so we've gotten super serious about our testimonial process and how we collect them and the way that we can share them so that it's not just like, well, Jenna got this success, so surely it can happen for you. But it's like, no, no. Look at this is the process that these people followed and what they got. Does that make sense?
- [29:29]
B
I love that. Yes. Because my community already has some amazing success stories that I need to give you my success.
- [29:35]
A
When I. When those dahlias pop, girl, I'm coming at you. I love. So good.
- [29:40]
B
You're. You're in the nurturing phase right now, and your hard work is going to pay off very soon. When this airs, you're going to be swimming in dahlias.
- [29:49]
A
I can't wait. Okay, what's your next question?
- [29:53]
B
Okay, so my next question. I actually learned to launch a podcast from you, and so I have a Cut Flower podcast. How do I authentically use my podcast to promote my mini course that for digging, dividing, and storing dahlias along with the Dahlia Patch community?
- [30:11]
A
Okay, I love this. So first off, congrats on your podcast. I love it.
- [30:16]
B
Thank you.
- [30:17]
A
And okay, so there's so many different ways. So one of the things that I often think about when it comes to podcasting, and it's so funny because every time I think about It I can literally flash back to the college classroom I was in when I learned this marketing concept. So it's like, whoa, this is still standing the test of times, but it is covert marketing and overt marketing. And I think about this literally on the daily. So when you have overt marketing, it would be more so like a podcast episode where you are consistently talking about pitching and promoting your membership site. Right. Like, it is very obvious, here's what you're doing. But my favorite way to leverage things like free resources like a podcast is more covert marketing. And it's not in the in your face, sales pitch way, but it's more in the making sure that people are aware that this is an opportunity for them, helping them to understand who it's for and what it does without it feeling like a sales pitch. And so examples of this would be when you're in an episode, can you take a story or a question from your community where you can reference, hey, inside of my membership, the Dahlia Patch, one of my students asked this question and I thought this was such a great question. I wanted to bring it to the episode today. And here's my response, right? Oh, wow, that was free value. It was super informative. And oh my gosh, maybe I should be a member of the Dahlia Patch. Right? And so I love thinking of different ways where you can integrate, sharing that this is an offer that exists, that people are taking advantage of. This is the value that they're getting without it being this overly, you know, hyped up marketing, bro marketing, like, you know, tough sell. And so I would really consider just different ways that you can leverage that community as inspiration for your content as well as leveraging member like, you are a member of our community, which is why you are on this podcast today. And so how can you bring your students into the fold so that they can naturally. I mean, you just naturally talked about my podcast course without us talking about the podcast course on the podcast. Right. And so if you can see how that totally makes sense, you're adding value to your community members. You're also adding awareness to your podcast listeners in a really beautiful way. And so I think that is like, my favorite way is just like, what are covert ways to reference my product services, offers, testimonials, students, or questions inside of my content so that I am adding value for someone, even if they're not a part of it, but also giving them awareness that it exists and it could be a natural extension for them based on where they want to go. And then I would Also, just say too consider different times of the year where you maybe add in a little ad for it. Like, if you love today's episode, consider joining the Dahlia Patch. Here's what you get it. Here's what we do in it. Here's why I love it. Here's why. It's the next step for you. And so I think a lot of times we are apologetic in selling our own offers, but when we shift it and look at selling as a service, a lot of times people listen to a podcast episode and they're like, this was awesome. But like, what next? What now? Where do I take this? How do I put this into action? And so again, you can connect that information into action inside of your membership or your mini course and position them both throughout your content. And so maybe the challenge for you is, is every time you record a podcast episode, what is one covert way that I can reference one of my offers, students or testimonials inside of this episode just to build awareness? How does that feel?
- [33:55]
B
I love that.
- [33:55]
A
Yeah, that is, it's.
- [33:58]
B
It's serving them versus selling.
- [34:00]
A
Yes. And I like, personally, it lights me up so much in the sense of, like, I get to feature my students and their success or their questions, so they're getting like, next level guidance while also serving the broader community. I don't know, it just changes the frequency of selling because I think for a lot of women especially, we think of selling and we're like, I don't want to do that. And it's like, no, no, no. This is actually really fun. So I love that. And honestly, like, when you have something like a podcast, you know, it is a lot of work. And so it's like, how do I help connect the dots so that it leads to real results in my business? And I would argue that that is the best way to do it is to leverage your paid communities, help you generate content that serves them at the core of it and then on the fringe, it serves the general public as well.
- [34:53]
B
That's awesome. Thank you. I guess.
- [34:57]
A
All right, next question.
- [34:59]
B
Yes. Okay, so my next question is about the promotion of my course and membership. What is the best way to get affiliates excited to promote a smaller offer, like a mini course, and also keep them engaged over time?
- [35:13]
A
Okay, I love that. So my first question for you, I'm going to toss a question back for you, is why do you want or need affiliates? Where does that come from?
- [35:25]
B
I think it just helps expand the reach and gives me a new audience, reaches other people. So right now I have other flower farmers, but I also have home DIYers and other gardeners as affiliates because I can't reach that whole audience by myself.
- [35:40]
A
Okay, I love that and I know this about you, but you've been affiliate for things in the past. What made you want to affiliate for something else?
- [35:50]
B
Because I had experienced the transformation myself.
- [35:53]
A
Yes. Okay. So the first thing that I would say, and this is actually something we're getting better at in my own business as well, is first, anyone who is affiliating for something and we actually don't do a lot of affiliates in my own stuff, but is get their testimonial first. Right? Make sure that they have had that transformation. Right. Because like I am the queen of affiliate marketing. I, I love being people's hype girl. Like it is the thing that lights me up. Let me talk about skincare or vitamins or courses. Like I just, it's, it's like I can't hold back. I'm like the worst gatekeeper of all time. But I am successful as an affiliate because I have had transformations with products. It makes it so easy for me to talk about. Like I just naturally want to talk about those things. And so the first thing I would say is make every affiliate hop on a zoom with you or give you their testimonial to ensure that they have experienced a transformation that they can talk about and like shout from the rooftops. Because if they're only affiliating because they see a cash grab or like a money opportunity, they're probably not going to be successful. And they also probably won't honor your work or your message in the way that you created it to be shared. Right. So first start with that and make sure that they've had the transformation, they've experienced it themselves. The second thing is, is create competition. And this is a little spicy, but what I would do is like I love affiliate opportunities when there are condensed launches. So you will probably not see a lot of success if you just have an open ended affiliate program with no special promotions or pushes where you're like, like share about it when you want to. But instead if you're like, okay, I know that March is a huge time where people start planning out their gardens and they're starting to think about this. So I'm gonna get 10 affiliates in and we are gonna do a leaderboard and the winner gets to come to my house and do X, Y or Z or whatever. They don't have to come to your house but like you could do like.
- [38:05]
B
They can come to the farm.
- [38:07]
A
Exactly. Or they could do like a trip or you could give them $500 or a free MacBook Pro or I don't know, you, you can set the stage of whatever that is or even headphones, I mean whatever that is. But here's the thing. People love a leaderboard and they will push it way harder when they see where they're ranking. And so if you did a concentrated one week long push with a few affiliates, it would be way more successful than having affiliates that are just open ended it year round, I promise you that. And so it is amazing. Alex Hermosi right now is launching a new book and I just, he's just fascinating. I know him personally, but I just, he's so fascinating because I feel like he is that like where people zig he zags like it's. I'm always just like so curious about like well, what is he doing? And he is doing a book promotion and he did this huge contest where it was like, if you are in the top 100 affiliates, you get this a top 10 top one, blah blah blah. And obviously we don't have the mass scale of that, but people go nuts. I watched one of my friends jump into his affiliate competition and was like, we're gonna get to top 10. And she was like celebrating with her audience as they got in and got the buy in. I'm like, people love a leaderboard. So I would just say like concentrated efforts over communication, giving them the assets they need to talk about your programs in the ways that you want them to talk about, making sure they have everything that they need to be a successful affiliate and just being available to guide them if they need help. The reason why affiliates can sometimes be challenging and what I would consider is you don't always want to line up your affiliate launches with your own launches because it almost becomes two launches in one where you are pouring into the affiliates and then you are also pouring into your new students. So unless you have the infrastructure and the team to support that, I would say have your affiliates do a separate launch window, separate from when you are going more public with your offer. Now that we know that this urgency and scarcity will be a thing and just kind of create fun within it and in the community. One thing that's really helpful is if you open up a Slack channel just for affiliates. And that's a really great way to communicate. Leaderboard information, updates, et cetera and for affiliates to connect with one another as well. What do you think about all that?
- [40:26]
B
I love it. It's Great, because I was thinking back to affiliates that I've done and they have had those slack channels. And the other thing you said at the very beginning was how you are able to talk about the products you love.
- [40:39]
A
Yes.
- [40:40]
B
And that's so true because when I've been an affiliate, I only say yes if I have used the product and I truly believe in it.
- [40:46]
A
Yes. Yes. And you know what's so funny is like I only do things that I have personally paid for, taken and been transformed by. So whether it is skin care or vitamins or online courses or offers, I will only affiliate things for that I am willing to pay full price for that I am willing to do the work for. And then it's like, oh my gosh, let me talk about what you've done. It's so great. And so you want affiliates that are that way because those are the true transformation stories. When people can see the transformation they've experienced, the natural next question is, well, how did you do that? And if they haven't gotten those results, that question doesn't even exist. Therefore the audience isn't there. And so I've seen a lot of people too, who have had, you know, hundreds of affiliates go down and say, I just want 10. I want like the 10 that have experienced a transformation, that know how to talk about it, that use the right language that I would use use to communicate that. And so I think that's like the best way to do it. And I love it.
- [41:47]
B
That is great advice. Thank you so much.
- [41:49]
A
Yes. Okay, I think we have time for two more questions before we wrap up this coaching session with Jennifer's final two questions. Let's take a moment to thank the sponsors who support this show. And hey, if this episode has sparked ideas for your own digital product or helped you feel just a little less alone in this process, this send it to a friend who's building something too. We're closing things out with a question about pricing that I know you've been wondering about. We'll be back soon. This message is sponsored by green light. My 6 year old woke up this morning asking if she could do chores to earn money. Why? Because she read a fancy Nancy book where Nancy worked to buy fabulous shoes. And suddenly my daughter wanted to experience the same pride of buying something special with her own money. Money. But here's what hit me. I had no good way to help her actually see and feel her money growing. Cash gets lost, piggy banks are abstract, and she can't really understand the connection between effort and reward that's why we started using Greenlight. Greenlight is the easy, convenient way for parents to raise financially smart kids and for families to navigate life together. And maybe that's why millions of parents trust and kids love learning about money on Greenlight, the number one family finance and safety app. App. Now when she does chores, I can instantly send her earnings to her card. She watches her balance grow in real time and feels genuine ownership over her money. And when she's ready for those fabulous shoes, she'll swipe her own card and experience that incredible feeling Nancy had. Don't wait to teach your kids real world money skills. Start your risk free Greenlight trial today@greenlight.com golddigger that's greenlight.com go digger to get started greenlight.com golddigger this podcast is brought to you by Mercury Banking that helps entrepreneurs do more with their money When I first started taking my business seriously, I remember feeling stretched thin. I was juggling invoices, tracking payments and managing cash flow across different tools. It was messy and I thought banking had to be that way. That's why I was impressed with Mercury. Unlike traditional banking that feels clunky and outdated, Mercury is designed to make managing money effortless so that you can focus on what actually grows your business. Everything you need is in one intuitive product. Banking cards, spend, management, invoicing, and more all in one place. Plus, Mercury flexes to fit all types of businesses, so whether you're a funded startup agency or e commerce brand, it can be tailored to you. You visit mercury.com to join over 200,000 entrepreneurs who use Mercury. Mercury is a financial technology company, not a bank. For important details, check the show Notes Drew and I have been so lucky to travel to some amazing places over the years, and Airbnb has been at the center of so many of our best memories. We've stayed in some unforgettable places, like a house with an indoor pool in the Midwest where the girls practically turned into mermaids, and another with a hot tub that they refuse to leave even for dinner. We have celebrated holidays in these cozy homes away from home, gathering with families and creating new traditions and spaces that make us feel instantly welcome. And it got me thinking. If you've got a few trips on the calendar and your home's going to be empty anyways, you should be hosting. The best part is you don't have to do it all on your own. With Airbnb's co host network, you can team up with a local co host who handles the details for you. You from Guest messages, reservations, even on site support. So your home is cared for and your guests get that same kind of unforgettable experience you'd want for your own family. Find a co host@airbnb.com host.
- [45:38]
B
So my flower farm and brand is the Flowering farmhouse.
- [45:43]
A
Yes.
- [45:43]
B
And it has been slowly scaling over the last six years. And obviously I have the podcast, I have the mini course, I have my membership now. And we're working on a documentary about why flowers matter. How do I know when it's time to introduce multi tier offers or begin building a team around this?
- [46:03]
A
Okay, I love this. So do you have any team members right now?
- [46:08]
B
Do you count my daughter and husband and your dog? And my three dogs, yes.
- [46:14]
A
You don't have a VA or anything right now?
- [46:17]
B
No.
- [46:18]
A
Oh, my gosh. Okay, so first things first. What I would consider is absolutely inviting in. And here's what I would do. I would do a time audit and like a really honest time audit. And honestly, this is the best time of year to do a time audit, as a lot of us are scooting out of summer and coming back into more structured time and days, especially if we have kids. And so, like, time audit is amazing to see. See the areas of your business where you're spending a lot of time on. And I don't love to just look at time. I also love to look at like, well, do I enjoy that or am I putting that off or am I avoiding that? What's interesting with AI now is like, you can leverage AI to help, let's say, in a support inbox, not in the way of eliminating the human in it, but also in a way of helping you elevate your communication or speed up your communication. I would say that I would be hesitant to introduce multi tier offers because it adds in a lot of complexity and it also adds in a lot of assumption in terms of what is the progression that someone might take? Because it might look different for everybody, right? Like someone might just be a hobby gardener with one garden bed a year and they're good on that. Right. Like, just because somebody does X doesn't necessarily mean they're going to go to Y next. And so I think that staying simpler and getting known for one thing is better. And also knowing that your dream is not necessarily to build this digital empire, but it is to inspire more people to get out into nature and do what you're doing and find the joy in cultivating that. I would say that I would focus on really leveraging what you've already got going and going deeper on that and not wider in terms of offers. And so I would say only introduce a new offer when you feel like your main offer, whether it's the mini course or the membership, is delivering results and you have the bandwidth to expand it. And one thing that's interesting, and I often think back to like the wedding photography days is like I had six months out of the year that was kind of an off season, right? So I had bandwidth and time and energy during that time to do coaching, to create courses for photographers, etc, but there was no way I was doing that in the summer months when I was shooting, right. And so it's like kind of figuring out what is that rhythm, what is that bandwidth and what does that look like. And then I would say that when you hit a place or a point, when you are doing repetitive tasks, tasks over and over and over again, that is when I would consider hiring someone. And honestly, I don't think you need a big team at all. I think even just having one person that can answer questions, that can be in your inbox, that can free you out of like the email jail is kind of all you need. And one thing that's really awesome, and I talk about this in my conversation with Amy Porterfield, is a lot of people are looking at ChatGPT with fear or like, you know, like, oh no, it's going to take over my information. But you can very easily build out what's called a custom GPT using your ip, your content, your frameworks, your information, and you can give that to a virtual assistant and they can answer students questions using all of your information, your voice and your frameworks so that you are not the one having to personally support an answer for your community. And so there are ways where you can either speed that up for yourself or hand it over to a virtual assistant where they can literally give your responses to your students without you having to physically type out, okay, here's step one, here's step two, here's step three. And so I always look at like repetitive tasks and my team is like so good at this. Of like, can there be a template? Can there be an automation and. Or is there a way to leverage AI from an ethical, conscious and brand standpoint in this to speed this up or to make this easier. And so I don't actually picture you, Jennifer, and maybe I'm wrong, I could be totally wrong. I don't picture you having this massive team. Like I picture you in your garden with your family and having this be the engine running behind the Scenes that isn't taking over your life, but that is affording you and giving you the balance to have the life. Am I wrong in that? I don't know.
- [50:56]
B
Oh, you're a hundred percent right. I want this to be what inspires other people to want to go out and do the same thing and believe that they can grow beauty in their life too.
- [51:06]
A
Yes. And that's where I'm like, I feel like we're in a beautiful, almost renaissance in a lot of ways, of women really asking, what is success for me, what do I want this to look like and what do I actually need? Like, what is enough and not chasing more for the sake of more without having it tied to, like, something actually tangible. And so I actually think you could run this incredibly lean and even having, like, a virtual assistant that was a member of your community that just wants to pick up a few hours or think things like that, where it could just be on, like, you know, three hours a week basis, things like that. Like when I hired my first virtual assistant, her name was Caitlin, and all she did was go in my inbox and give people responses because I would, like, I am notorious for reading and then marking an email unread. Actually, you experienced this when you were trying to send me the tubers and I was like, yes, I want this. Oh, my gosh. And then, like, I totally forgot about it and then I had to circle back. And so it's like, like, any response is better than no response. And when you start to, like, loosen the grip on some of those control things, you start to see more opportunities where you can either call in support or get support from somebody else. And sometimes too, just getting people in your own community where you're like, hey, would you like to make a hundred dollars a week? Just helping support could be amazing. So I wouldn't, you know, imagine this huge team. I don't think that's necessary for what you're doing. And I also don't think it's aligned for what. What your version of success is.
- [52:34]
B
I agree. Thank you. Yes. I think a VA is a great next step for me.
- [52:38]
A
I love it. Okay, final question.
- [52:42]
B
Perfect. Okay, so my mini course just covers the end of the season on digging, dividing, and storing dahlias so people can grow them again the next season. How do I strategically guide my students from my mini course into my membership, the dahlia patch, which covers a everything on growing dahlias without it feeling just like a hard sale at the end of the mini course?
- [53:05]
A
I'm literally your, like, dream audience. But I'm already a member of the Dahlia Patch, so are. Okay, so I love this. So Amy Porterfield does this in her membership where the only way to join momentum is through taking her program, Digital Course Academy, because it kind of like, lays the foundation, right? And it's like, if you know all of this, then you're a right fit for this. A few, like, very minor strategic things. So inside of your mini course, you can have based on what platform you're using. What platform are you on?
- [53:36]
B
I am on Kajabi.
- [53:37]
A
Okay, so, so are we. So we use Kajabi. So inside of Kajabi, you can actually build out a sidebar on your course and you can upload a beautiful graphic that says, like, do you want ongoing support? Join the Dahlia Patch. So you can actually build offers inside of offers inside of Kajabi. You can also have triggers inside of your courses. So inside of your mini course, you can have a trigger that says, if somebody gets to this module, start this email sequence or present them this offer. And I love this because a lot of times we were kind of assuming, like, well, by week two, somebody should be at module two. And it's like, that's not how life works. Works, right? Like, some people Netflix, binge it and they're done in an hour, and then other people are like, three months from now finally logging in. Right? That's just. And so what I love about Kajabi is that you can build in different triggers so that if somebody makes it through, you know, module three of your mini course or lesson three, then you can trigger, hey, it looks like you're making awesome progress. If you want ongoing support or if you're curious about these next steps, we cover this all inside of the Dahlia Patch. So it works specific to each student, which I think is just, like, amazing. And if somebody's listening to this, I want to backtrack for one second. Kajabi is just the platform where we host our online courses. I think I've used them for a decade. I love Kajabi, but there's many other platforms. There's teachable, you can build it in WordPress. There's a lot of different offers that you can do to build this out, but I love Kajabi and I feel like they are very innovative in that. That. And then the final thing too, is inside of your mini course, you could record a final lesson that's like, congratulations, you did this. This is amazing. Here's what we just covered inside of the mini course. If you want more, here's what we cover inside of the dahlia patch. And maybe you could even gift them like one month for free. Like join us inside of the dolly patch. Your first month is on me. I know you're going to love it. I know you're going to want to stick around. Here's how to claim access and you can either have that just be open the whole time or you could unlock it once they hit a certain level inside of that mini course. So that, that is the natural extension and then with a membership too. One thing that I have been learning a lot about, and again I don't have a membership, but I have so many friends who have incredible memberships is that you, if you want to keep getting new members in to your membership each month, you want to have some sort of exciting update or exclusive content or aspiring content to give you something to promote about the membership each month. So my friend Bonnie Christine, she teaches surface pattern designers and she has an awesome membership and she does this thing where each month they get the opportunity to pitch their designs to different brands like anthropology. And it's like this is how you will get your work in front of the people you want to be in. And then next next month it's a different company etc and so you want to have some sort of angle that allows you to talk about your membership with freshness, to get new people into it. But I think there's a lot of synergy in taking people from the mini course into the membership because they're going to want that continued support or that next level support or access to you to ask their personal questions.
- [56:56]
B
That is so helpful. Thank you. I love the idea of having that messaging in the mini course. I had no idea that you could do that through Kajabi.
- [57:04]
A
And honestly the one like we have three words in our business that we try to think about, whether it's a podcast episode, a blog post, of course, and it's no dead ends, meaning I never want somebody to finish something and be like, okay, now where? Now what? And so it's like it's just an invitation, right? That's all it is. It's not a pitch, it's not you hard selling. It is literally an invitation. And how fun is it that we get to give people those invitations to their next step? So I would just look for ways that you can inject it in. You could put it into the workbook of your mini course and say like, hey, like even we've done this in terms of freebies, where we have a freebie and we're like, hey, if seeing is believing and you are a visual learner, you might want to learn this inside of our map masterclass, right? And it's like, just how do you cue it up so that you are truly adding more value? And so, like, at the end of the workbook, you could have, like, join the Dalia patch for one month free. Here's a QR code to claim that offer. Anyone who's in the mini course gets that. And so just think of places where there might be a dead end currently, and how do you just extend the invitation, whether it's the sidebar inside the course, inside a lesson, inside a module, inside the workbook, et cetera. And for many courses, when people are paying a low ticket amount, it doesn't feel like you're trying to upsell them. It is truly a natural extension because oftentimes the mini course only solves one part of the problem and they need the next steps, Right? They have more problems than the one you just solved. And so it just makes sense.
- [58:40]
B
That was so helpful. Thank you.
- [58:43]
A
Oh, my gosh. Okay, so one final thing. I know that you took Amy Porterfield's digital course Academy, as have I, and that we were kind of in that same orbit together. If somebody is considering creating an online course or kind of extracting their knowledge or their passion or their expertise and wanting to put it out into the world to impact others, what would you say to them?
- [59:06]
B
Say, a course is absolutely the best way to get your message out there. You're not selling, you're serving your audience. And I think Amy helped me understand that so much that if you position it the correct way, you're literally providing this value that they can't find elsewhere. And it's your own unique perspective. I think one thing Amy said was that you don't have to be the most knowledgeable person. You just have to teach it your way and show up as you are because you are offering something special that no one else can do. And getting to learn from her course really helped me launch my course. I don't think I could have launched it without it.
- [59:45]
A
Oh, and I'm so grateful because I've taken your course. And I. I was, like, prone to be like, jennifer, what do I do? How do. Is this right? And I was like, no, I can literally log in and look at all of this online because you've created it. So it also saves you so much time answering the same questions over and over and over again and just giving people, you know, I'm out in my garden at 7 o' clock at night, like, this is not the time to be asking questions. And so I just love it. I adore you. I love getting to know you. You have inspired me so much. I have your tubers in my garden. I'm gonna have a greenhouse thanks to you and our connection of, like inspiring me. Like, go for it. Just go for it. So thank you for being a part of my life and my community. Where can everybody find you and connect with you and watch you and learn more from you?
- [60:34]
B
Yes. So I am@thefloweringfarmhouse.com and on all social media, the flowering farmhouse. Or if they want to get more cut flower gardening advice, they can listen to the backyard bouquet podcast.
- [60:47]
A
Amazing. Thank you so much for doing this and being a part of it. It was such a joy to have you on the podcast.
- [60:52]
B
Oh, I loved this. Thank you, Jenna.
- [60:55]
A
Oh, I just, I love Jennifer. It's so fun. She feels like a true friend. We didn't bring this up in the episode, but I am the godmother of her puppy because I named. She sent me pictures of her dog that she was going to get and I said that looks like a Winnie and they named the dog Winnie and she is so cute. She is just such an amazing member of my community. And I just want you to know, like, I see you, I learn from you, I am inspired from you. When you reach out, it is really me on the other side of the screen. And I'm just so grateful to be able to pour into people like Jennifer and people like you. It is is such a gift. So just thank you for being a part of this community. If you are inspired and you want to create your own digital course, whether it's a mini course or you want to do more of a membership, let me tell you that there is nothing better than to learn from the best. And in my opinion, the best is Amy Porterfield. It's who I learned basically everything course related from her digital course Academy is open for enrollment and you can head to jennacutcher.com forward/dca. And we also have a an epic bonus suite waiting for you. Free when you join the digital course Academy. That's Jenna kutcher.com forward/dca. I can't wait to hear your success story. Thank you so much for listening to this episode of the Gold Digger podcast. Of course, if you know someone who could benefit from this coaching episode, please send it to them. And if you would like to be coached on air on the podcast, head to our Facebook insiders group. Which we've linked in the show notes and show description for you. This is where we source our students to invite onto the podcast people of our community that I want to serve and help. And of course, until next time, keep on digging your biggest goals. And thank you so much for listening to this episode of the podcast. Thanks for listening to the Goal Digger podcast. I hope today left you inspired and equipped with something you can put into action as you build a business that truly supports your life. If this episode resonated with you, here's how you can help this show reach even more entrepreneurs. Hit follow, share it with a friend who's building something meaningful, and if you're feeling generous, leave us a review. Those reviews help other listeners discover these conversations when they need them the most. This show has become so much more than I ever imagined, and it's because of listeners like you who show up and share. You are helping build something that will inspire entrepreneurs for years to come. For show notes, links and resources, head to golddiggerpodcast.com keep digging your biggest goals. The world needs what you're building. Please note this episode may contain paid endorsements and advertisements, and individuals on the show may have a direct or indirect financial interest in products or services referred to in the episode. Your support through affiliate links or sponsored content helps us continue to bring you valuable content. Thank you for being a part of the Gold Digger community.