939: A Conversation With My Mom About Time, Motherhood, and What Gets Passed Down

Summary

Podcast Summary: The Goal Digger Podcast

Episode 939: A Conversation With My Mom About Time, Motherhood, and What Gets Passed Down
Host: Jenna Kutcher
Date: December 15, 2025
Guests: Jenna’s Mom, Jenna’s Sister

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Overview of the Episode

In this heartfelt episode, Jenna Kutcher invites her mom back onto the show—joining her sister as well—for an intimate, multi-generational conversation about motherhood, time, identity, and the wisdom that mothers pass down to their daughters. The trio reflects on legacy, generational shifts, the joys and challenges of raising children, and the ever-evolving roles of women. The episode is divided into three main themes: legacy/mothering, generational differences, and identity/seasons of life. With humor, candor, and vulnerability, they explore what gets passed down, what changes, and what remains timeless.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Legacy and Mothering

Motherhood’s Surprises & the Fleetingness of Time

• Both Jenna’s mom and sister discuss how quickly time passes as children grow, and the way grandparenthood brings this into sharper perspective ([04:35]-[06:27]).
  • “How fast it goes was what came to mind right away. That’s the cliché, but...when you look at your life like a pie...your perspective is so different.” – Jenna’s Mom ([04:35])
• They reflect on how as parents, you think times are permanent, but everything is actually so temporary—a realization that can be both comforting and bittersweet.

Individualized Mothering and Embracing Children’s Interests

• Jenna’s sister shares admiration for her mom’s ability to mother each child uniquely, creating space for curiosity and creativity.
  • “You had an endless capacity to mother each of us individually... That takes a lot of work.” – Jenna’s Sister ([06:30])
• Jenna’s mom explains her philosophy:
  • “I don't think we're meant to be in a box...if you can do anything to encourage and not stifle that...” ([08:54])
• Anecdotes like arranging a surgery shadowing experience or enabling various passions are highlighted as examples of nurturing curiosity.

Reflections on Imperfection and “Doing Your Best”

• Jenna’s mom isn’t a worrier, acknowledging she did the best she could even amid financial ups and downs. In retrospect, she wishes she could have saved more for college but recognizes that hardships also taught her children resilience ([10:13]-[13:54]).

2. Letting Go, Generational Differences & Technology

Knowing When to Hold On or Let Go

• The discussion covers “rites of passage” (e.g., starting school, staying home alone), emphasizing the importance of raising independent children.
  • “My job as a mom was to raise you to be an independent person...I wanted you to love yourself and be good individually.” – Jenna’s Mom ([16:59])

Generational Shifts: Technology, Social Media, and Human Connection

• Jenna’s mom observes that technology and the immediacy of life today worry her, particularly the loss of human connection, but also acknowledges its potential for good ([18:59]-[21:35]).
  • “I see so many people glued to their phones and young kids, too...we’re missing human connection.” – Jenna’s Mom ([18:59])
• Jenna and her sister reflect on being the first generation raising kids with full access to social media, and the complexity it brings.

Hopeful Trends

• A return to “roots”—chickens, gardening, slow living—gives Jenna’s mom hope.
  • “A lot of your generation is coming back to the basics and realizing the beauty in that...and I feel like that is...a trend.” – Jenna’s Mom ([21:51])
• She notes men’s increased participation in childrearing as a positive generational shift.

Pressures Faced by Women, Then and Now

• The conversation touches on the generational move from homemaking to juggling work, home, and processed-food convenience, setting the context for current cycles of returning to homegrown/cooked food ([23:34]-[24:30]).
• If Jenna’s mom were in her daughter’s shoes, she would avoid social media entirely due to her sensitive nature and aversion to criticism, admiring Jenna’s strength in managing public-facing work ([25:08]-[26:07]).

Motherly Worries Across Generations

• Gun violence and general safety are flagged as worries current mothers must face in a way previous generations did not ([30:20]-[31:29]).
• The breadth of career choices and entrepreneurship opportunities available to women now is contrasted with the limited options (secretary, nurse, teacher, homemaker) available before ([32:17]-[32:35]).

3. Seasons, Identity, and Lifelong Growth

Embracing Change Through Therapy & Self-Development

• Jenna’s mom—at her daughter’s suggestion—started therapy at 65, experiencing profound personal growth:
  • “At 65, 66, I started therapy for the first time in my life...just to dig into it and do the work, it’s like, whoa, it truly is work.” ([36:36]-[37:45])
• Both acknowledge the richness and shared language therapy has brought to their relationship, shattering stigmas about self-work at any age.

Letting Go of Responsibility

• Therapy helped Jenna’s mom see her “responsible child” role, and the power in stepping back to let others contribute. This relinquishing of control has led to healthier, more collaborative family dynamics ([42:59]).

Reframing Aging

• Jenna’s mom finds older age liberating, emphasizing “time luxury” and the freedom to fill her days with chosen activities, relationships, travel, and lifelong learning.
  • “There’s almost like a luxury and not having the time constraints of work...to not have all of those pressures...is almost like a vacation for yourself that’s kind of endless.” ([44:41])

Mother-Daughter Relationship in Adulthood

• Mother and daughter describe their relationship as increasingly reciprocal, built on respect, friendship, and mutual mentorship.
  • “Now...it’s truly friends...it’s a reciprocal friendship. I look up to you a lot.” – Jenna’s Mom ([50:51])
• The family’s value of “time as currency” carries through all generations, and the ability to be present together is cherished.

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• The Fleetingness of Motherhood:
  “I know people always say, like, don't blink. They grow up. But I do think it goes fast.” – Jenna’s Mom ([04:54])
• On Nurturing Curiosity:
  “If you want to do something, let’s explore that...nothing seems that crazy. Try it on, see if it works.” – Jenna’s Sister ([08:54])
• On Mothering and Independence:
  “I always felt like my job as a mom was to raise you to be an independent person.” – Jenna’s Mom ([16:59])
• On Social Media’s Drawbacks:
  “I think you’ve changed lives...but I would have never...I don’t think I could stand all the negative stuff.” – Jenna’s Mom ([25:40])
• On Multi-Generational Change:
  “Women can do it all, but we need support. And that was something that you really didn’t have a lot of access to either.” – Jenna’s Sister ([29:20])
• Therapy and Growth at Any Age:
  “I started therapy for the first time in my life...digging deeper into myself. Why am I wired like I’m wired?” – Jenna’s Mom ([36:36])
  • “I love who you are, but I love who you’re becoming. You’re never done.” – Jenna’s Sister ([48:00])

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Timestamps for Important Segments

• [03:44] - Reunion with Jenna’s mom on the show; introduction to themes.
• [04:35] - Reflections on legacy and the passage of time in motherhood.
• [06:30] - Mothering each child individually and nurturing curiosity.
• [10:13] - Fears of getting things wrong as a parent (financial stress, college).
• [16:59] - On raising independent children and when to “let go.”
• [18:59] - Generational change: technology, social media, and human connection.
• [21:51] - Renewed focus on roots, slower living, and men’s involvement.
• [23:34] - The evolution of women’s roles from processed food/convenience to home cooking.
• [25:08] - The emotional toll of public criticism and social media.
• [30:20] - New worries facing mothers today (e.g., gun violence, safety).
• [32:17] - Career diversity and entrepreneurship for women.
• [36:36] - Therapy in later life and embracing change/growth.
• [42:59] - Letting go of the “responsible child” role.
• [44:41] - The joys of aging and “time luxury.”
• [50:51] - Adult mother-daughter relationship as deep friendship.

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Tone and Language

The entire episode is warm, conversational, and deeply empathetic. There’s evident respect, affection, and gentle humor between the generations. The tone invites listeners to reflect on their own familial relationships, challenging traditional notions of motherhood and encouraging openness, curiosity, and lifelong growth.

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Closing Reflections

Jenna closes by encouraging listeners to connect with the women who have shaped them, ask questions, and seek wisdom from those who’ve led in quiet but powerful ways:

“The most powerful leadership happens in the in between moments, that being a safe space is the greatest gift, and that asking the right question can change someone's life.” – Jenna Kutcher ([53:37])

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Key Takeaways

• Parenting and legacy are shaped by both presence and imperfection—the beauty is in the effort and connection, not perfection.
• Each generation faces new pressures, but wisdom from previous generations can provide grounding and inspiration.
• Nurturing curiosity and supporting growth at any age creates lasting impact.
• Friendship between mothers and daughters evolves, deepens, and becomes richer with time—and remains one of life’s greatest friendships.

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For more insights and resources from this episode, visit goaldiggerpodcast.com.

Transcript

[Jenna Kutcher]

Today's episode is sponsored in part by Revolve and Spectrum. Revolve is my all time favorite place to shop. For my dream wardrobe, head to Revolve.com forward/gold digger to shop my favorites and get 15% off your first order with the code Gold Digger. Spectrum Business keeps your business connected with reliable service you can count on. Visit spectrum.com forward/free for life to learn how you can get business Internet free forever. As always, you can find all of our amazing deals in the show notes. Now let's get into it.

[Jenna's Mom]

And I feel like too, even though I said I'm so proud you're independent and that was my goal as a mom.

[Jenna's Sister]

Like.

[Jenna's Mom]

Like when I knew you were going through some of those roller coasters or some of those tough times with criticism or pushback like my mom. My other like hurting.

[Jenna Kutcher]

I'm Jenna Kutcher and I help you trade hustle for purpose and build a business that gives you the life you actually want to live. From a 300 Craigsl camera to a seven figure business I run from home, I've learned that success isn't just about what you do, it's about how you live. Here you'll get strategies that work, systems that give you your time back, and steps that turn your effort into results and impact. If you're ready for clarity, confidence and a business that feels as good as it looks, you're in the right place. This is the Gold Digger podcast. Today, I'm sitting down with someone who is incredibly dear to me. It's my mom. She has been on the show before, but it has been years and honestly, every time that she's here, you ask me to bring her back. You want her wisdom and her perspective, the way she sees straight through to what actually matters. My mom was a nursing instructor for 30 years. We literally can't leave the house without running into one of her students and the love that they have for her. It's immediate. You can see it in their faces. The kind of teacher that she was and the impact she had on their lives and in their careers. She was also the kind of mom who would ask 21 questions. The one who my friends would actually open up to. The one who made everyone feel safe enough to tell the truth, even when I was rolling my eyes in the backseat. My mom is fierce. She is crazy persuasive and her well of empathy runs so deep that people just trust her. And she's really deeply, deeply respected because of it. She built her impact face to face in classrooms and living rooms. And hospital hallways. She shaped people and held space and asked the hard questions that made them think differently. And I realized that as I've gotten older, we need, collectively, to learn from women like her. The ones who. Who led in different ways than we do. The ones whose platform looked different but whose influence was undeniable. The ones who remind us that impact.

[Jenna's Sister]

Isn'T about how loud you are.

[Jenna Kutcher]

It's about how deeply you show up. So today, we're talking about motherhood and identity, about the differences between her generation and mine, about what it means to be a safe space for people, about what gets passed down when you lead with presence and not performance. This conversation is for me. It's for my daughters. It's for anyone trying to learn from the women who came before us, the ones who did things differently and the ones whose power showed up in ways we're only now learning to name. So, mom, I know you were reluctant, but thank you for being here today. You get to be everyone's mama. Let's talk.

[Jenna's Mom]

Well, hi there, mom.

[Jenna's Sister]

Hi there, Jump. Welcome back. Okay.

[Jenna's Mom]

I'm so excited about today.

[Jenna's Sister]

Thank you for saying yes. It has been three years since you came on the show. That's a long time.

[Jenna's Mom]

That is a long time.

[Jenna Kutcher]

Yeah.

[Jenna's Sister]

Time goes by so fast.

[Jenna's Mom]

It does.

[Jenna's Sister]

Okay, so I wanted to break this up into three different parts. So the first part is just kind of like, legacy and mothering as a whole. And then part two, I want to talk about what's different, because I think from, like, a generational perspective, there's so many things that we're dealing with that you didn't and things that you had to deal with that we don't even understand. And then lastly, just talking about, like, identity and seasons, because as women, I think we go through a lot of different evolutions and, you know, aging and all these different things. And so let's start at the top, which is kind of a legacy piece. So when you think about how you mothered us and looking back, like, what surprises you the most about that journey?

[Jenna's Mom]

Yeah, I think how fast it goes was what came to mind right away. And again, that's the cliche everyone says. But again, already seen the grandkids or, like, seen. For example, the oldest grandson is almost as tall as me now. And, you know, our oldest Joe's gonna be 40 this year.

[Jenna's Sister]

Like, dad and I just felt like.

[Jenna's Mom]

We were 40 just a blink of an eye ago.

[Jenna's Sister]

So I know people always say, like, don't blink. They grow up.

[Jenna's Mom]

But I do think it goes fast. And I remember you know, my dad who passed away recently, always said, even the older you get, the quicker it goes. And I almost think, too, because if you look at your life like a pie and, like, how much is left? So if I live a good, long life, I have maybe a third left if I'm lucky. So I think when you look at perspective or, like, as a child for Christmas to come, your perspective is so different.

[Jenna's Sister]

Right?

[Jenna's Mom]

So, yeah, I think just how fast it goes is probably the biggest thing for me.

[Jenna's Sister]

I feel. I mean, I even feel that now today, like, my oldest is sitting at the table, and I'm like, your legs are so long. And, oh, my. Like, it's just, like, all these things, and it's crazy because everything is so temporary, even though it feels, like, so permanent when you're in it. And then it's like you look back and it is such a blur, which is good in some parts and bad in some parts. But it's like, I get it. Like, I was just holding a newborn baby the other day, and it was just like, whoa. Like, this feels both like yesterday and a lifetime ago. Right. And I'm like, is that the rest of our lives?

[Jenna's Mom]

Like, that's kind of what it seems. Yes and no. You know, we'll talk a bit more later. I feel like the stage of, like, it has slowed down in some ways, but it still goes super fast. So it's kind of. Time is kind of abstract to me to describe. I do think how fast it's grown. And then I think I even see it more now with all the grandkids, because.

[Jenna's Sister]

Yeah.

[Jenna's Mom]

And on the various stages and how quick they're all spurting up.

[Jenna's Sister]

Yeah. It's crazy. I think when I think of this question, too, what surprises me the most now as a mom, looking back at how you mothered, is I. I feel maybe this is like the superhero mom status is that you had an endless capacity to mother each of us individually. And now I'm like, holy crap, that takes a lot of work.

[Jenna's Mom]

Do you think that I. I feel complimented that you say that, because at the time, I don't know if I was mindfully thinking about that, but I do feel like when you have interests, I tap into them. So I don't feel like it took a lot of energy because I truly enjoyed it. Like, I can tell motherhood, like, I'm looking at you. Motherhood gives you joy, and it truly gave me joy. Like, I've done a lot of things in my life I'm proud of, but being a mom is probably My most proud, because I truly loved it. I did. You know, it's just like even growing up, I shared this on a podcast years ago. But that was like, what I always wanted to do is be a mom where that isn't what everybody wants to do. And not that it's always easy, but I truly felt that was destiny for.

[Jenna's Sister]

Me or what I wanted.

[Jenna's Mom]

And it came true. And I'm thankful. You know, I was just telling someone.

[Jenna's Sister]

The other day, so, like, when she says she tapped into, like, our interests, I feel like I was the multi, multi, multi passionate child. You did not know what was going to come out of my mouth. And I mean, we laugh now because we have so many funny memories, but like, the year I wanted to do 4H and like, showed my bunny in this fair and like, people had purebred bunnies, like, this bunny was mutt, like, that we got from some random house. And like, my parents are just like, sure, you can do 4H, or I was telling someone this story the other day about how when I would say, like, I want to be a vet, my mom would reach out to the local vet. And I'll never forget, she set up. I mean, I was probably nine, maybe I got to job shadow the vet. And I remember getting to watch like, cats get fixed and a turtle get dissected. I was like, nevermind, I want to rescue animals. I don't want to cut them open. But like, you also created opportunities where it was always like, if you want to do something, like, let's explore that. And I feel like that probably ignited the fuel of, like, it's okay to have a lot of ideas and passions. And I think that has helped me a lot moving forward of like, well, nothing seems that crazy. Like, try it on, see if it works.

[Jenna's Mom]

Yeah, and I totally believe that too. I don't think we're meant to be in a box. And I think we are meant to be creative. And I think kids are intrinsically creative and life and society stifles that. So I think as a parent, if you can do anything to encourage and not stifle that, or like, one I'm proud of, like, when you wanted to be a surgeon and I arranged a day for you to be in surgery.

[Jenna's Sister]

You know, I mean, I'm.

[Jenna's Mom]

And I'm the kind of. I always told you to, like, just ask. If they say no, you're no worse off. But, you know, I'd ask people with confidence and they'd be like, yes, I'll take your daughter.

[Jenna's Sister]

Yeah, I mean, I know I was telling someone that the other day I was like, I watched colonoscopies, a gallbladder removal, herniate repair, like, I mean I just was in it. And a lot of people don't realize like I went to school, when I went to college, I was signed up for pre med. Like that was the path I wanted to go down. I mean, totally different than what I'm doing today. But yeah, I just think when I look back, what surprises me now as a mom is just your ability to like foster, like well, let's be curious about it and not shut it down. And I think that gave me a lot of permission as an adult to carry that forward.

[Jenna's Mom]

Thank you. Yeah.

[Jenna's Sister]

Okay, so what's something you were afraid you were getting wrong as a mom that you've now either like made peace with or you see the hidden benefits in it that.

[Jenna's Mom]

Okay, I feel like when I was in the thick of it maybe because again, life was busy and I didn't have all the external pressures. I honestly am not a worrying type as a rule. And I don't feel like I worried a lot about getting wrong because I feel like we're going to get things wrong. We're not perfect. And I did my best and I knew I went to sleep at night that I did my best even if I messed up. So I don't think I worried a lot about things. Looking back, one thing I wish we could have done different is, you know, I feel like we were a middle class family. I felt like we always provided things and opportunities but I wish we would have more mindfully potentially safe for college. But I also feel like we did the best we could and you also learned things because of it. But I felt in hindsight that you probably had stressors that at that age of life you shouldn't have. Maybe, but I don't lay at night worrying about it. But that's one thing. I would have maybe been wiser about that somehow, but we truly didn't have a lot of extra money either. And you know, dad had that year of strike and all those life happened but still that's one thing I wish would have been a little different. But I don't kick myself about it.

[Jenna's Sister]

Yeah, I mean I think it's so interesting because I'm raising kids in a very different state. I think you and I talk about that a lot because looking back growing up, like there were seasons that were challenging financially and then there were seasons where we just, we got by and it was fine and we were great. And I think that We. I learned a lot through every different season. I think I was very aware, like, just hyper aware. And I think that that has made me who I am today. And so, like, looking, you would now have three financially independent children who have gone on to be incredibly successful, frugal wise with their money. So, like, can you. Can you really look back? But I also do see your point in, like, I remember a summer working three jobs or things like that where it was like, well, we're gonna do it. And so I. I mean, who knows? It could have been the thing that was the benefits.

[Jenna Kutcher]

Right.

[Jenna's Sister]

To all of us. And I think that a lot of money, mindset things are things that you just have to work through. Like, no matter if you're a child.

[Jenna Kutcher]

Or an adult, like, you have to.

[Jenna's Sister]

Learn those lessons at some point. And so some people just learn them earlier. I think I have been thinking a lot, even just with, like, the economic situation and, like, with benefits changing and people worried about putting food on their table, it does send me back to, like, the year when dad was on strike. And I remember, like, a turkey showing up at our door. It's like, wow, like, how quickly the rug can come out from under people that are hardworking. And also just the reality of, like, oh, all of a sudden it's a one income family. Right.

[Jenna's Mom]

For my kids when I was part time.

[Jenna's Sister]

Yes. And so, like, I just see, too, I think I see the humanness in how situations can quickly change and how people are literally doing the best they can. Hickey Darkly it's wild.

[Jenna's Mom]

It is wild.

[Jenna's Sister]

Yeah. I've been reflecting on how old was I. I was trying to find these articles.

[Jenna's Mom]

I know. Yeah. Jenna wrote a letter to the editor when my husband was on strike. I think you were roughly seventh grade.

[Jenna's Sister]

Yeah.

[Jenna's Mom]

And in some ways, too, when you said, I was very aware. Again, in some ways, too, I don't know if I added to your stress or I was trying to be honest with you, but we were like, well, how are things? I'd be like, well, we got to buckle up a little bit because this is a situation. And. And then I think because you were so wise, you maybe took, you know, maybe I shared more than I should have. Again, I don't kick myself because I felt like I was being honest with.

[Jenna's Sister]

You, but as I think I asked a million queues.

[Jenna's Mom]

Yeah. And I tried to, you know, foster that curiosity. But also, you don't want it to be a worry thing either. But you wrote a beautiful letter to the editor and.

[Jenna's Sister]

Yeah.

[Jenna's Mom]

So I felt like I wanted to tell you enough to be aware but not to add stress to your life. Like, we're fine but we got to buckle up, you know, kind of. Yeah, no, I think it's good.

[Jenna Kutcher]

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[Jenna's Sister]

When I.

[Jenna Kutcher]

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[Jenna's Sister]

How do you know when to hold on and when to let go. As a mom, I think that's something that even now I'm, like, noticing with my oldest of, like, testing and boundaries. And, you know, I basically feel like I'm mothering myself in a lot of ways because she is so, so much like me. I see that creative spirit and that drive and that stubbornness, and, like, I'm, like, I am reparenting myself through parenting this child. And so any advice on that?

[Jenna's Mom]

Well, some letting go comes through rites of passage, like going to kindergarten or going to college. I mean, some of those just are natural. Letting go, even though they kind of hit your heart. Other times, I think it's individualized based on the child. Like, you know, when we started leaving you home alone, for example, is like, when do we feel you're responsible enough? And each child might have been a little different age. So you individualize it to the person but still try to be fair overall throughout the three. But still, you're individuals, too, and you use your common sense and your gut instinct. And I always felt like my job as a mom was to raise you to be an independent person. Yeah. And I am an independent person, and I value who I am as an individual, and I love you all to pieces, but I wanted you to love yourself and be good individually. So, yeah, I felt like my job was to launch you and be there for you, but let you be and grow independently.

[Jenna's Sister]

Yeah, you did a good job on that one. I feel like you see all types of mothers, and I think no mother is better than the other, but there are the moms who are, like, they want to just be deeply intrinsically involved. And I feel like you were as available as you were in the capacities that we needed and without, like, meddling or overstepping, which I think is a delicate dance.

[Jenna's Mom]

Man. Sick. Oh, thank you.

[Jenna's Sister]

Yeah. Okay, so I want to scoot to, like, generational, because I genuinely have been thinking, even with Grandma, we've been doing visits with her, and just, like, thinking of the beautiful things that can be passed down and the lessons we learned. I actually feel like I've been channeling Grandma a lot with gardening and just, like, different things that, like, really brought her joy and connecting with that. And so my first question is, what do you see in my generation of women that worries you and what gives you hope? Because I think there's a lot happening right now.

[Jenna's Mom]

I think all the technology and social media and pressures and immediacy of everything and even AI, I mean, that's all stuff that was not Even a thing in our generation. But with that also can come, you know, reliable evidence based information, you know, support groups you can follow that go around your belief system. I mean, there's a lot of beauty too. But I almost like when I walk around or go out to eat, you know, I see so many people glued to their phones and young kids too. And that just makes my heart sad. Like I feel like we're missing human connection and technology has gotten to be too big. And again, there were, you know, no.

[Jenna's Sister]

Yes, you know, so dial up Internet that we barely got on our dirt road.

[Jenna's Mom]

Hey, exactly. So I think that's probably the biggest thing that comes to mind for parents and children, honestly. And I think even as a parent, I think it can be a fine line, like, when does your child get a phone and what parameters do you have on it and how do you keep them safe? And then all their peers are and you're not ready. And I mean, all those things can I think sound super challenging. And I didn't have to deal with that. Yeah, I think we dealt with, you know, when you had a phone when you were 16. That's what I told Coco the other day.

[Jenna's Sister]

She goes, when can I get a phone? I said, when you're 16 and driving a vehicle. So, yeah, I mean it is, it's a whole new ball game. And I think we've had to navigate and figure out, like, what does this even look like?

[Jenna Kutcher]

Because, right.

[Jenna's Sister]

Like we're the first generation raising kids with access to all of this, both in how we're showing our own journeys, but also then how are our kids being influenced by them. And it's a lot of trial and error. And I feel like we're finally hitting a point where a lot of those kids that grew up on social media are now adults. And like, what is that impact and what does that look like? And obviously I've changed my mind and perspective on what that looks like. And I feel, you know, my deep desire is to not be glued to my phone and I model that. And so if that's my desire for my kids, like, it's also my desire for me. And that is such a tricky thing. Right. Especially because the Internet has afforded us so many incredible things and connections and impact. And so it's a big untangling of like, the role it plays, what you give it merit in your life, what you allow to come in and what you allow to go out, like, it's, it's interesting. And I feel like I've made a huge shift in recent Years of just, like, privacy and, like, how I want to be on the Internet. But, I mean, honestly, most days I don't even want to be on the Internet.

[Jenna's Mom]

So. Yeah, I feel like that's the biggest thing I see. Yeah. But then I even see a lot of my generation scrolling all the time and being on phones excessively. Yeah. So, yes, it's not just your generation, too.

[Jenna's Sister]

It's.

[Jenna's Mom]

It is universal. It is. And. Yeah.

[Jenna's Sister]

Sad. What gives you hope about our generation?

[Jenna's Mom]

I think I see, like, how I've seen you kind of go back to roots, you know, in regard to chickens and gardening and sourdough and honeybees and all the things. Like, I do think a lot of your generation is coming back to the basics and realizing the beauty in that and, you know, simplifying, slowing down, hands in the dirt, you know, And I feel like that is, you know, again, not with everyone, but it feels like a trend where that's kind of coming back for a lot of people or just wanting to slow down and be more present. Another thing that I see in your generation, more positive. I just see the fathers much more involved.

[Jenna's Sister]

Yeah.

[Jenna's Mom]

You know, so I mean, for example, you know, when I see her drew with us, and.

[Jenna's Sister]

Yeah.

[Jenna's Mom]

So I just see differences generationally that are really cool. Yeah.

[Jenna's Sister]

I mean, it's interesting because we laugh because we had a garden, and I told my mom the other day, I mean, we did our best, and we would set up a baby monitor, and then we'd hook it up to the radio under the kitchen sink and, like, listen to music out in the garden. And I remember singing Calendar Girl, all these different songs together while we would weed the garden. And I think about your generation, which was really the one coming out of where the woman stays home and is the homemaker. And for your generation, when you look at just what was trending and what was happening, it was a huge. Surgeons of processed foods. It was, you know, the Weight Watchers generation. It was women trying to do it all and juggle it all like they have never had to in the past. So now you have a career. You're also raising kids. You're also putting food on the table. And so it became this generation of convenience out of necessity. Right. Like, there weren't options.

[Jenna's Mom]

Right.

[Jenna's Sister]

And so it is interesting, this cycle we're on, just like all fashion trends come back around. I do feel like I feel connected to grandma. Not that you didn't have a garden, but, like, it was so natural to her. It was like. Like composting was as, like, breathing to her, you know, and so I feel like it is interesting to think of just the pressures and the things that you dealt with, and then now that we're kind of coming back around, I do think it gives me hope.

[Jenna's Mom]

Right? Oh, yeah. With food, too.

[Jenna's Sister]

Yes.

[Jenna's Mom]

Again, our generation was kind of like a first generation where most all my peers, all my female friends were out working.

[Jenna's Sister]

Yeah.

[Jenna's Mom]

But doing, you know, still. There was still the stereotypes of female roles and male roles.

[Jenna's Sister]

Yeah, totally.

[Jenna's Mom]

And I think that just keeps evolving. But, yeah. And yeah, again, processed foods, that was, like, promoted. Like Hamburger Helper. This was your CF alarm. Yes, exactly. Yeah. And you thought you were doing healthy things. Yes.

[Jenna's Sister]

And I mean, 100%. Like, that's where. I mean, it's interesting because it's like, even. I mean, I remember you would make us eat Brussels sprouts, and my friend Molly hated Brussels sprouts, and she ate at her house all the time. And, like, you had the balance of a meal, but it was all coming out of a box, and that was just literally the reality. And so it's interesting, too, to think through, like, just beliefs and patterns and things like that that come given the context of the culture. Right. So, yeah, it's been interesting. If you were navigating my life right now, what is the first thing you think you would release or do differently? Like, if you were in my shoes.

[Jenna's Mom]

Like, if I were in your shoes, I don't think I ever would have been. Like, on social media, I mean. I mean, to the point you are. I am with my friends.

[Jenna's Sister]

Yeah.

[Jenna's Mom]

No, at a low level, but I think I'm too sensitive. And I don't. You know, when I'm seeing. I just feel like there's so many opinions and pushback and criticisms that I think I have too tender a heart, that I couldn't be in your shoes and be strong enough.

[Jenna's Sister]

So would you give up social media for me? I would. I. True.

[Jenna's Mom]

I mean, that's the one thing I like. I think you've changed lives. I'm very proud of you. You've been influential in my life in a beautiful way. But I know I would have never. Even if people said, here, you can be a social media star, I would say I do not want them because I don't think I could stand all negative stuff.

[Jenna's Sister]

Yeah.

[Jenna's Mom]

Goes with it.

[Jenna's Sister]

I mean, I don't think I can either. I mean, it's like, I think we all have, like, really tender hearts.

[Jenna's Mom]

Yeah.

[Jenna's Sister]

And I think I've had to learn how to use that muscle. And I mean, thank God for therapy and all the things that have helped me just separate, like, my life from the Internet to, like, my actual life. But I think for many years, they were very murky, and it was like, where does one start and the other one end? You know, like, what is that intersection of both of those things? And now I feel pretty unrattled. I feel, like, very firm and clear. I don't lose sleep over it, especially if I'm standing in my truth. I'm like, I feel good about it. But, yeah, we've kind of seen the whole roller coaster of it. And just, you know, I think, like, that's why I can't imagine having kids on it, because it's like, as a grown adult who has done a lot of healing work and is very confident, it can shake you to your core. Right. It can make you question everything about yourself. The way you look, I mean, everything. Right. And so it's fascinating to me that, you know, they. They have all these projections of, like, kids. That's what they want to do now because they see this, and it's like there's a dark side to all of it.

[Jenna's Mom]

Right.

[Jenna's Sister]

And it's like very few people can actually manage it and manage it well. Yeah.

[Jenna's Mom]

And I feel like, too, even though I said, I'm so proud you're independent, and that was my goal as a mom, like. Like when I knew you were going through some of those roller coasters or some of those tough times with criticism or pushback, like my mom. Yeah. My other's heart, where life's, like, hurting.

[Jenna's Sister]

Yes.

[Jenna's Mom]

This is not good.

[Jenna's Sister]

Yeah. You know, so I just let it.

[Jenna's Mom]

Yeah.

[Jenna's Sister]

Yeah. I freaking fight like a little mama wolf. If someone just pulling out for my babies.

[Jenna's Mom]

That's how I feel.

[Jenna's Sister]

Oh, okay. What did you have to fight for at my age that I might take for granted?

[Jenna's Mom]

I felt like when again, I worked part time, I worked the school year, I took a big pay cut, so, you know, financially, and then I think, again, the gender roles, I think I grew up in a traditional household back in the day where, you know, my mom did the. What you would call domestic work and my father did the outside. We were on a fireman. My husband's family, the same. So when I worked part time, I was fine with that. But then I felt like when I started picking up more shifts, I felt like there was conflict in our marriage because we were trying to change that dynamic. I feel like, you know, in retirement now, we've come to a real good place where we found our places. And, you know, he's stepped over and I've. I mean, it's just come to a nice place. But I think that was kind of a big struggle where I just see where, like, how you and Jiru work it out is beautiful and it works great for you, but very different than what my reality was.

[Jenna's Sister]

I think, like, my feminist heart comes from, like, I think I had a deep attachment to you of, like, what is fair and what is just and, like, the equal partnership. And I think I would, like, be the one that would be, like, ferocious. Like, why are you at the laundry room at 9pm at night? You know? And I totally can see after so much work, like, every generation is doing better, right? Like, I think we can be quick to discount the ways that maybe our parents did the best they could.

[Jenna's Mom]

Right?

[Jenna's Sister]

Like, we can be quick to forget, like, wait, they. Everyone is a product of their environment, and everyone is trying to do better. And it's. It's just interesting how much things have shifted because even Drew comes from a very traditional family as well, and we've all kind of been cooked in the same broth, Right? And so it's. It's really interesting. And I think watching you navigate that has made me want to have, like, equal play and, like, step up. Like, everyone can do every job. And so I think it's. I mean, I think, again, to that benefit of, like. Yeah, but I think I'm like a deep down feminist of, like, women can do it all, but we need support. And like, whatever that support looks like, whether it's your partner, your spouse, whether it's a parent or a nanny or a house manager or whatever that is, I think women just need more support. And that was something that you really didn't have a lot of access to either.

[Jenna's Mom]

Interesting.

[Jenna's Sister]

Yeah. What do you think that our generation is fighting that you never had to. I can name one.

[Jenna's Mom]

Okay.

[Jenna's Sister]

Gun control.

[Jenna's Mom]

Oh.

[Jenna's Sister]

I mean, just like, the reality of that worry. I. I was just at Target, and we had picked the kids up from school, and I was going to a Mom's Demand action meeting, and I was telling Coco that I wasn't going to be there to put her to bed. And she was like, why?

[Jenna's Mom]

And I was trying to figure out.

[Jenna's Sister]

How to phrase it, you know, like, just, I'm going to a meeting to figure out, you know, how we can create a safer world. And this older lady who was probably in her 80s, was sitting next to us, and she was like, you know, when I was a mom, I didn't even have to think about that, you know, And So I feel like that's one thing where like the hyper awareness around everything from predators to the. And I think too sometimes it's the fact that information is so available that we are literally witnessing every possible threat. And so it's like our nervous system is always activated in that verb, fighter flight. Yes. I do think that's one thing that's different in, you know, our mothering journey.

[Jenna's Mom]

Yeah, I don't know. I agree too. And again, kind of technology influences, again, access, all of those things.

[Jenna's Sister]

But I mean, it's interesting. And I think every mother now is fighting something different.

[Jenna's Mom]

Right.

[Jenna's Sister]

Like whatever that is, whatever the different thing that looks for them. I think that women are feeling more empowered in making new decisions and in like figuring out what is their path. Like, I think women are choosing alternate routes more commonly now than they maybe did in the past. Whether it's homeschooling, things like that.

[Jenna's Mom]

Yeah.

[Jenna's Sister]

But I don't know. I just think that we as moms now are like, having to stand up for like, social causes more because we're seeing like, whoa, things are moving fast and like, what type of world do we want to raise our kids in? And I think every woman and mother is just having to choose what they believe in the most.

[Jenna's Mom]

One thing I think of is again, how diverse occupations are now where again, when I grew up, it was, you know, the three routes I think were secretary, nurse or teacher. Yeah. Or homemaker.

[Jenna's Sister]

Yeah.

[Jenna's Mom]

And I mean, out of my high school class, a couple went to college maybe.

[Jenna's Sister]

Yeah.

[Jenna's Mom]

But most, you know, a lot of people worked in the factory and most were homemakers. So. Yeah. So I think just seeing all the diverse occupational opportunities and entrepreneurship too, that was not a thing, you know, so.

[Jenna's Sister]

Well, that leads me to my next question, because you never would have. I mean, you didn't call yourself an entrepreneur. You weren't, you didn't think of yourself as entrepreneurial. I mean, I was first generation entrepreneur out of our family. But you had a really entrepreneurial spirit. And I feel like I tell stories all the time of the things that you did. And so, like what? Where did that come from? Or do you start to recognize that now as an adult?

[Jenna's Mom]

I think as an adult now I see it at the time, I didn't think of it as entrepreneurial. I just said it was resourceful.

[Jenna's Sister]

Yeah.

[Jenna's Mom]

And I think it's from my mom. I think my mom figured out how to make things happen for us.

[Jenna's Sister]

Yeah.

[Jenna's Mom]

So I'm just like, I'm the way. I mean, I'll figure out a way.

[Jenna's Sister]

Yeah.

[Jenna's Mom]

And I didn't think of it entrepreneurial. It's just like kind of like the barter system or how can I make this happen?

[Jenna's Sister]

So, yeah, I mean, we should give examples. So two stories that come to mind. One was we wanted to get new bikes, and my mom was like, well, how are you going to get them? You got to pay for them, right? And so she called the city of Duluth and there was a race happening down and was a snapper. Yeah, down in Park Point. And she asked if we could set up a little face painting booth. And me and my brother, who were very young and not skilled painters, painted faces and earned money to buy our bikes. So, like, that's one example. Another example is when I got very into gymnastics. I mean, tuition was expensive. We had to travel for meets, we had to buy leotards, we had to pay coaches fees. And it was so out of our budget. And you never, ever said like, no, you can't do this. You were like, we'll figure it out. And my mom would write contracts in Microsoft Word for our head coach, who was the saint. I mean, he was a funny, amazing man, but like, he never said no. He had such a heart. And she would barter. So we renovated the locker room, we renovated the kitchen, we redid the bathroom. And every year, my mom would think of no new things that we could do to add value at the gym that would allow me to do gymnastics for free. And, like, what a blessing for you and for your partnership with Mark.

[Jenna's Mom]

Right?

[Jenna's Sister]

And like, it helped him out.

[Jenna's Mom]

A win win.

[Jenna's Sister]

Yes, it was a win win. And I just think, like, yeah, when you're lacking resources, yeah. Is beautiful. And so now I like, look back and I'm like, no, you were really, you were a hella entrepreneur. Like, yeah, you have that spirit. And I mean, all of us kids kind of went down non traditional paths. And so I think we harnessed that.

[Jenna's Mom]

Oh, I appreciate that.

[Jenna's Sister]

I love that.

[Jenna Kutcher]

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[Jenna's Sister]

Okay, so last part is let's kind of talk about seasons and identities. And so when was the last time you felt yourself changing in a way that started surprised you?

[Jenna's Mom]

So this would be about a year ago. And you made a comment to be like, mom, don't be offended, but I have a suggestion for you. And I'm like, what's up? What do you think? She goes, I think you could benefit from therapy. And at the time I was, you know, my parents are elderly and I was doing a lot for them and maybe that sandwich generation, just trying to be there for a lot of people. And I was just kind of feeling maybe caregiver burnout or I don't know. And I think, you know, I was always honest with Jen on my feelings, and I wasn't offended at all. Like, you know, like it was a caring gesture. But at 65, 66, I started therapy for the first time in my life. And yeah, I feel like that was probably the most changing. That surprised me because again, I always, I always felt like, you know, everybody has stuff and I can figure it out and it's not that bad. But yeah, it was kind of getting heavy and hard and. And then just to dig into it and do the work, it's like, whoa, it truly is work. You know what I mean?

[Jenna's Sister]

An emotional work.

[Jenna's Mom]

So I think that's probably what surprised me the most this last year is just digging deeper into myself. You know, why am I wired like I'm wired? How do I want to grow? How do I want to.

[Jenna's Sister]

How do I do that? How do I work on it?

[Jenna's Mom]

How do I. Yeah, kind of looking at everybody's inner child, you know, I feel like I've been a compassionate person, but I feel like I have a deeper level of compassion. Yeah. So I think that's been a evolution in progress that's most surprise to me.

[Jenna's Sister]

I love it. I mean, so I didn't start therapy until a couple years ago, and my friend Mel Robbins suggested her therapist, and we had been on a girls trip and she was like, oh, my gosh, Ann is prolific. She's incredible. You would love her. And so I took Mel's suggestion and started working. And then I remember when I started, my mom kept being like, what are you talking about? And what's going on? And, like, it was interesting because, too, I think we have such pride and love for our families. And I remember on the first call, she was asking a ton of questions about family and origin and all this stuff, and I was like, I feel like I'm betraying my family just by even sharing anything. You know what I mean? Like, it felt like this, like, protective nature. And I feel like in expanding your consciousness around, like, there is no resentment. There is nothing but love there. But you can acknowledge, like, oh, these certain things made me into the person I am, good or bad, right? And anyways, it was just beautiful because you were really curious about therapy. And then when I suggested it now, looking back, it was such divine timing with my grandpa and him passing away, and just, I got to be your daughter, and knowing you were supported, and, like, we were both going through it together, and both of us have that. That daughter syndrome of, like, step up, figure it out. We'll handle it all. And it was beautiful to just be like, wow, my mom is supported right now also by Anne. I bet it's so fun for Ann because she gets to hear from both of us. Right? But I think it paints a beautiful picture, and I'm really proud of you, because I feel like so many people just are kind of like, I'm done learning. And you are a lifelong learner. You are the most devoted students to life that I've ever met. And so I think it's been beautiful. And it just enriches our conversations because we have a shared language we can talk about, like, what are your resources? Or, what are you talking about with Ann? Or what are you working through? And I know for other people close to me in my life, it's opened the doors for therapy as well. And I just think, man, everybody could benefit from it. I wish it was more exciting, accessible. I wish it was more affordable. I wish it was universal. Like, I feel like that's a cause that everyone could get behind. But I don't know. It's awesome. And it's funny, too, because you'll be like, I'm leveraging what I'm learning in therapy to ask for help. Or, you know, like, where I'm like, you're doing it. It's changing you.

[Jenna's Mom]

It truly is changing me. Yeah. Things that you think like, well, this is life. This is how it is. This is who I am. It's like, you know, once you start changing patterns, it changes things for other people, too, in a beautiful way that I hadn't thought about.

[Jenna's Sister]

Yeah, I know.

[Jenna's Mom]

There's a ripple.

[Jenna's Sister]

Yes.

[Jenna's Mom]

So, yeah, it's been really powerful, and, yeah, I just feel like I'm evolving and growing, and it's been sometimes really hard, sometimes, you know, emotional.

[Jenna's Sister]

I've been.

[Jenna's Mom]

Like, Many calls would come on, and, yeah, there was. It seems like there's often something very pivotal to talk about. Yeah. But she's great at being intrinsically knowledgeable about what I need and when homework would be good and how to push me, you know, and I sometimes push back. And it's been. It's been a really growth process for me. And I do feel like it's added to conversations, obviously, with you when we have the, you know, the same language. But even I feel like with friends, with Tom, with my mom, like, I just feel like I have a different. I don't know, inside or thought process maybe would be the word. But, yeah, it's been great.

[Jenna's Sister]

I feel like it can be a bridge of, like, here's something I'm working through or here's something that's come into my awareness where it's, like, before. Like, how do you just randomly bring up something like that? You know what I mean? Like, it's kind of gives you an excuse to talk about deeper things and kind of unpack them, either with others.

[Jenna's Mom]

Or just to share. So, yeah, I'm thinking about, too, though, for a lot of people. Like, my whole life, I potentially had, as I was a state employee teaching nursing, and I had a counseling benefit I could have tapped into, but I never did, thinking, well, there's nothing that bad. But for anybody that has that benefit, if it's a free resource and you can use it, like, I think I could have benefited way earlier had I thought deeper about it. Yeah, you know, I think that's true. And I think, too, so much of.

[Jenna's Sister]

It is like our Midwest, like, hood spell. Like the SISU of just, like, pick it up, you got it. People have it worse, and I think that's.

[Jenna's Mom]

It's true.

[Jenna's Sister]

But everyone has trauma, Big T trauma, little T trauma, things that they're working on and working through. And I think, too, when you're held accountable to the work, you stay in it.

[Jenna Kutcher]

Right?

[Jenna's Sister]

Like, you stay committed. So I'm proud of you. I love it. Okay. What is something that you stop doing or let go of that ended up being the right call, even if it felt hard at the time?

[Jenna's Mom]

I've been working on in therapy as I've always been, quote unquote, the responsible child. And, you know, I've had that role pretty much my whole life. And I think because I always just step up right away and do things, it's expected. You know, it was by my parents and my siblings, but by doing so, I didn't always give my siblings a chance because I just did things. And some of it maybe is my own. You know, I can do it quicker, I can do it my way. I can get it done. Like, I know it'll get done, but to step back and let other people step up and realize they can and will, I think that's been a huge thing for me. And there's been different examples where that has happened. But had I not gone to therapy, I never would have even attempted those things because it was just a role ingrained in my head and I didn't see another option.

[Jenna's Sister]

Yeah, I have noticed that in you as well. And I think there's like a beautiful surrender, but then it's also like, wow, there are people that can support. Right. Like, there are more people that can be involved and it enriches them and it enriches the people that you're helping. And, yeah, I mean, I think that's for everybody. I think everybody listening is, like, responsible for something that you shouldn't be responsible for or that isn't truly your property to be responsible for. And so, yeah, I think it's been really beautiful to see. And also, too, it can be empowering for other people to, like, figure it out or step up her own thing. So I think that's like a universal thing that people can struggle with.

[Jenna's Mom]

That's right.

[Jenna's Sister]

Amazing, right? What do you wish more women understood about getting older? Like, what's actually true versus what are we afraid of?

[Jenna's Mom]

Oh, I think getting older is good, personally. Like, I. I feel like this stage of life for me, I feel like there's almost like a luxury and not having the time constraints of work, you know, like, not to punch and not to worry about an alarm clock or, you know, I had super early days at the hospital. I had to be there with my students and homework at night and student concerns and evals and all the things. So I worked super hard in my job, so I loved it. But to not have all of those pressures and to have a day in front of you and it's like, you know, yes. You know, like, there's things I need to do, but it's like a time luxury. Yeah. And you Almost feel like humbled by it because your whole life with kids and work, you're working around the. Those constraints. So all of a sudden it's almost like a vacation for yourself. That's kind of endless.

[Jenna's Sister]

Yeah, I love that for you.

[Jenna's Mom]

Yeah. So I feel really, I love this stage of life. I feel like it's a gift. I wake up, I'm like, oh, my God, look at that. You know, I can have this coffee in bed and start my day slow. And, you know, I feel like the last several years, I think a lot, thanks to the influence of you and Kate, I think I've become. This is something I wish I would have done earlier too, has been more health conscience earlier in regarding. And I think the trend right now too, is more protein and strength training and all that. And I've been working on that. I think your generation is too. And that's kind of a trending thing right now. But I wish I would have maybe jumped that bandwagon sooner. But again, I don't have regrets in my life. I did the best I could, but I feel like I'm focusing more on fitness, on better eating, on relationships, more time with my friends, you know, the grandkids, my mom. Like, I feel like I have a good life.

[Jenna's Sister]

I mean, you're busy, but it's a beautiful thing. Yeah. Like, it's, it's the fill the cup of business. Yeah, it's really famous.

[Jenna's Mom]

Yeah.

[Jenna's Sister]

Which is wild. I mean, I think you're busier than I am, but I like, also love, like, you've been on travels. Like, my dad had never been to Europe and loved it. And like, just like, I don't know, there's like this picture you sent us where you guys are just like giggling on a boat in Europe. And it's like, this is it. Like, this is pure. Like, this is the goals. This is the vision board. And I feel like you, whenever I think of you and dad, I'm like, you're never bored. I mean, you have a million things you want to do, a million things you can do. You want to learn new things, you want to try different things. Like, I don't know, I feel like you guys just have a lot of passion, and I think a lot of people don't have that. And then they go into retirement and it's like, you know, what, what is there? And it's like, oh, man. I think of you guys and I'm like, you are wildly passionate people.

[Jenna's Mom]

Right.

[Jenna's Sister]

A lot going on. I know.

[Jenna's Mom]

I feel like if anything, there's like so many things I want to do, you know. So again I'm thinking now I know Coco's taking piano, but I want to start playing piano more. Someone's doing online courses. Then I'm doing like the nursing honor guard now. And I still do make a wish and I'm doing things that are fill my cup, you know, I love it, but I always want to be that lifelong learner. I'm keeping my nursing license up because who knows, some cool mercy trip or something. I know, like I just found the sky's the limit. So do you see where I get this from?

[Jenna's Sister]

So yeah, I love the line in my book about just like I love who you are, but I love who you're becoming and I think that's such a beautiful invitation for everyone of like you're never done. Right. And so like what are you still becoming? Like when you think of your life.

[Jenna's Mom]

What do you think you're still. I think I'm still becoming like a picture. Like when I'm getting a massage, I picture my old like my old self. Like my 90 some year old self. Yeah. And I picture like being active and being involved in the grandkids lives and you know, working on fitness and still learning and being with my friends and being active and just like enjoying life. Like I just feel like it's endless and I feel like there's still a lot of really cool things out there, but I don't feel a big urgency. I just feel if opportunities come up, I'll probably go for it. Yeah.

[Jenna's Sister]

Yeah. You are kind of like a say yes, figure it out later person. I feel like I'm similar to that in that way. I love that. Okay, in closing, what do you think has been like the gift of this stage of life to you? I know we talked about retirement, but like the part nobody warns you about that turns out to be so beautiful. Like what do you think you could have never saw coming about where you're at right now?

[Jenna's Mom]

I think again, the time, luxury again. Even though it's full, it's more optional how I choose to fill it.

[Jenna's Sister]

Yeah.

[Jenna's Mom]

Versus constraints with parenting and working. Yeah, I know. It's just. Yeah.

[Jenna's Sister]

I feel like our family is like time is our currency. Yeah. I do feel like that. Like we live like that.

[Jenna's Mom]

Yeah.

[Jenna's Sister]

And it's like, how do we fill our time? With the right things and the right people and.

[Jenna's Mom]

Yeah.

[Jenna's Sister]

I feel like you pass that down because I feel like I've always had a sense of like time.

[Jenna's Mom]

Right.

[Jenna's Sister]

You can always go out and earn more. You can always do more. But like, what is time? I love that. I love time. Luxury. I think everyone, if you could even adopt five minutes a day that feel luxurious, whatever that is, you know, like, it might not come in big bits and spurts, but it might just be ways that you invite that feeling in.

[Jenna's Mom]

Right. I do feel like too, I've always been maybe a goer, a doer, but I feel like as I've gotten older, I've gotten more inward, I think. And like, even when I come to town, I batch things. Like I do a bunch of things when I come in and then my days home are days home. And I love my home days. Yeah. You know, so I do feel like I need the balance between going and just being. So in some ways I think I've turned more inward in regarding more pausing, more reflection, more meditation, more just being. And I like that. Yeah.

[Jenna's Sister]

Yeah, I love.

[Jenna's Mom]

He recharges me.

[Jenna's Sister]

Okay, final one. When you think about our relationship now, mother and daughter, we're both grown up, what feels different than you expected?

[Jenna's Mom]

I think, I mean, I always felt like we. Like they always say when you're a parent, you're the parent, not the friend. Like, I remember that from a parenting expert in my era, but I feel like now truly friends. Yeah. And then I feel like you're like a mentor to me, you know? And I feel like even when my dad was dying, sometimes you were like mothering me in a way. Like I counted on you. So I feel like it's a reciprocal friendship. But I look up to you a lot. I respect your opinions. I feel like you're always sending me cool ideas and thoughts. So, yeah, I feel like I don't feel like you're being my mother, but it's really difficult. It's reciprocal.

[Jenna's Sister]

Yeah.

[Jenna's Mom]

Yeah. It just feels real reciprocal. And I feel like too, if I see cool things, I'll send them to you. But yeah, I just feel like we're there for each other. It's a friendship. It's rich, it's beautiful. I love watching the joy that you get from parenting, you know? Yeah, that's cool. I agree.

[Jenna's Sister]

I think it's like when I see my kids, I'm like, ah. Like, I hope that like me and Kate and Joe often talk about, like, how wild it is that, like, we all are here in town. We all love being with our family. Like, there's no drama. We all turn to you and we need things, but you can also turn to us if you need something. Like, I feel like it is that family dynamic of, like, they'll. We'll show up. We'll be there for each other, whether it's in the bleachers or at the birthday parties or in the crappy times, too. And. Yeah, I feel like it's beautiful. I think it's. It's like, it is. It's a deep respect and a deep friendship, and, like, we want the best for one another.

[Jenna's Mom]

It's.

[Jenna's Sister]

I don't know.

[Jenna's Mom]

It's pretty cool. Wild. No, I'm very thankful. I do. Dad and I often are. Like, how lucky are we? You know, we truly felt.

[Jenna's Sister]

Did a lot of work, though, too.

[Jenna's Mom]

We did, but it didn't seem like it at the end. I mean, just do it.

[Jenna's Sister]

You know what I mean?

[Jenna's Mom]

Like, you just do it. You don't think of it as work. You're just in it, you know?

[Jenna's Sister]

What is your hope for me in this next stage of life?

[Jenna's Mom]

I think a parent's hope is always that your child will be at peace and be content and be good with who they are, you know? Yeah. I don't love it. Yeah.

[Jenna's Sister]

And I think you are.

[Jenna's Mom]

I think you're doing an amazing job. It's fun.

[Jenna's Sister]

Well, thanks for coming back on the show.

[Jenna's Mom]

This is fun. Yeah. I'll keep talking.

[Jenna's Sister]

A little time capsule for us to always remember.

[Jenna's Mom]

Exactly.

[Jenna's Sister]

Oh, and you are, like, everybody's mom. I feel like my team, my friends, like, everyone is like, your mom is our mom. So until next time, gold diggers, do you know line mom.

[Jenna's Mom]

Keep following your biggest dreams.

[Jenna's Sister]

Keep on digging your biggest goals. Oh, keep on.

[Jenna's Mom]

I'm sorry.

[Jenna's Sister]

She's my number one listener, so worry about it.

[Jenna's Mom]

Okay?

[Jenna's Sister]

Aw, Mom.

[Jenna Kutcher]

Thank you. Thank you for this conversation. Thank you for being the kind of woman who leads with empathy and shows up with presence. Thank you for being fierce when it matters and safe when people need it the most. I think what strikes me the most is how much of who I am came from watching you care about people. Not because it was strategic, not because it would build anything for you, but because that's just who you are. You taught me that the most powerful leadership happens in the in between moments, that being a safe space is the greatest gift, and that asking the right question can change someone's life. To everyone listening, thank you for being here, for showing up to these conversations and tuning in, for caring about the.

[Jenna's Sister]

Big questions, the generational shifts, the wisdom.

[Jenna Kutcher]

That gets passed down when we pause long enough to actually listen. If you have women in your life who have shaped you, quietly but powerfully, call them, ask them the questions, learn from them while they're still here to teach you Gold diggers. Until next time, keep on digging your biggest goals. Keep on asking the big questions. Keep on learning from the ones who came before you. And remember, you don't have to do it all to do it well. Thanks for listening to the Goal Digger podcast. I hope today left you inspired and equipped with something you can put into action as you build a business that truly supports your life. If this episode resonated with you, here's how you can help this show reach even more entrepreneurs. Hit follow. Share it with a friend who's building something meaningful, and if you're feeling generous, leave us a review. Those reviews help other listeners discover these conversations when they need them the most. This show has become so much more more than I ever imagined, and it's because of listeners like you who show up and share. You are helping build something that will inspire entrepreneurs for years to come. For show notes, links and resources, head to gold diggerpodcast.com keep digging your biggest goals. The world needs what you're building.