Patrick Sharkey spent years studying the causes for the national decline in crime that took place from the 1990s to the 2010s. A Professor of Sociology and Public Affairs at Princeton, and the author of Uneasy Peace: The Great Crime Decline, the Renewal of City Life, and the Next War on Violence, he warned that it would prove unsustainable to rely on aggressive policing and mass incarceration to keep the peace in America's cities. Now, he is ideally placed to answer why violent crime has surged in the past year and what to do about that.

In this week’s conversation, Patrick Sharkey and Yascha Mounk discuss the recent rise in violent crime, how this trend hits disadvantaged communities the hardest, and why neither defunding the police nor returning to the old model of keeping the peace offers a real solution.

This transcript has been condensed and lightly edited for clarity.

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Podcast production by John T. Williams, and Brendan Ruberry

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