The goop Podcast: Charli XCX

Host: Gwyneth Paltrow
Guest: Charli XCX
Date: November 4, 2025

Episode Overview

This episode of the goop podcast explores creativity, authenticity, and the messiness of womanhood with Charli XCX, one of the most innovative and boundary-pushing voices in contemporary pop. Gwyneth and Charli dive deep into the chaos and contradiction of making art on your own terms, the pressures of public perception, the transformative power of female rage, and how to balance wellness with the inspiration found in club culture. Alongside candid insight into her life, music, and marriage, Charli shares her thoughts on the societal expectations of women and how embracing messiness can lead to true self-expression.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. The Creative Process: Instinct, Contradiction, and Authenticity

• Songwriting: Charli describes her creative process as “selfish,” emphasizing intuition over analysis or audience expectation.
  • “I find songwriting is quite like a magical experience… Sometimes it ends up being good, and sometimes it ends up being, you know, awful.” —Charli XCX (03:33)
• Contradiction in Music: She’s drawn to contrasts—“high and low,” “soft and hard.” Songs can spring from deep emotional places or blunt party experiences.
  • “I like the contrast of, like, high and low. That’s something that’s always really appealed to me… The kind of Warholian, like, high and low art type thing.” —Charli XCX (05:06)

2. Messiness and the Female Experience

• Duality in Life and Art: Charli and Gwyneth discuss the cultural compartmentalization of femininity and the stigma surrounding conflicting desires (like motherhood vs. partying).
  • “The contemplation of having a baby and then, like, talking about blowing lines in a club. Like, that’s perfection. There are no rules.” —Gwyneth Paltrow (07:23)
• Gender and Public Image: Both deliberate on being “put in a box” by the public and press, pushing back against simplistic or comfortable interpretations of womanhood.
  • "It’s just interesting to me, like, the facets of people's personalities that people pick up and run with and then make like, this is who you are." —Charli XCX (09:44)
  • “Your music is not digestible… There’s a real pulse of freedom within it.” —Gwyneth Paltrow (10:08)

3. Influences and Collaboration

• Musical Influences: Charli cites Lou Reed and The Streets (Mike Skinner) as big inspirations, especially in conversational lyricism.
  • “You’re the first fucking person [to bring up The Streets]. To me, it’s so obvious. It’s such a reference.” —Charli XCX (13:40)
• On Not Listening to Music While Writing:
  • “I don’t really listen to music when I’m making… I listen to Lou Reed, Arthur Russell, Vernon Spring—totally not related to what I’m doing.” —Charli XCX (15:29)
• Creativity in Partnership: Charli talks about collaborating with her husband, George (of The 1975), and finding a shorthand that’s both professional and intimate.
  • “I’ve never been in a relationship with anyone that I’ve made music with… Now that we’re in it, well, I’ll be like, again, booze, let’s go…” —Charli XCX (17:54)

4. The ‘Brat’ Phenomenon & Culture

• Meaning and Marketing: Charli reflects on how “Brat” took over culture, even being appropriated by brands and politicians.
  • “I find all of the combinations of [art and capitalism] really interesting… But when it’s your own work… it does feel quite scary.” —Charli XCX (32:09)
• Essence of “Brat”:
  • “It’s sort of like volatility, you know, and mess and insecurity and confidence… When people are brats, it’s coming from sometimes a place of defense and insecurity.” —Charli XCX (33:28)

5. Public Perception, Social Media, and Letting Go

• Processing Criticism: Charli describes her evolution from consuming all press to stepping back for her own mental health.
  • "I don’t anymore, to be honest… I can’t. I can’t do it.” —Charli XCX (34:17)
• On Fact-Checking and Cultural Noise:
  • “I think we just… live in a world where if there’s enough noise around a certain sentiment or story, it doesn’t really matter whether it’s true or not. The loudest noise becomes fact.” —Charli XCX (38:52)
  • “The real spiritual ascension is to try to really let go of misperceptions… I’m not responsible for this misperception.” —Gwyneth Paltrow (40:50)
  • “It’s really just the people in your life that matter… the people that you spend your Sundays with.” —Charli XCX (41:29)

6. Expanding Beyond Music: Acting, Producing, and Telling Stories

• Charli’s Entry into Acting: Fear and excitement over learning a new craft and building stories from the ground up.
  • “When I first… went on a set, I was terrified. And it was so cool.” —Charli XCX (26:23)
• Current Projects:
  • Producing/composing for TV show “Overcompensating” (Prime)
  • The forthcoming A24 movie “The Moment,” a “revisionist history of Brat”—a music industry satire with emotional depth.

7. Female Rage and Honesty in Pop

• On the “Female Rage Wave”: Charli and Gwyneth discuss how contemporary pop’s honest, raw energy is changing narratives for women.
  • “The language of songwriting and the language of women is so much more open… and I think that is really cool.” —Charli XCX (45:03)
• Rage as Self-Declaration:
  • “Rage declares you as you.” —Gwyneth Paltrow (46:43)
  • “Maybe rage is the truest expression of self.” —Charli XCX (48:45)

8. Wellness, Balance, and Partying

• On Wellness Culture:
  • “If I want to live the longest, I just have to be happy and I have to be free and I have to not feel the pressure of living my life in a certain way.” —Charli XCX (51:59)
• Finding Inspiration in Chaos:
  • “When I go out and I meet people and I’m in it with someone… It’s a huge source of inspiration for my writing. If I cut that off, it would be like cutting off a limb.” —Charli XCX (52:34)

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• “I now know that nobody changes until they change their energy. And when you change your energy, you change your life.” —Gwyneth Paltrow (01:31)
• “I think the whole point of the record as a whole is: life is messy…especially as women, in the public eye, there is this pressure to present in this certain way.” —Charli XCX (07:52)
• "There is a power and a kind of healing in letting go of misperceptions." —Charli XCX (41:29)
• “It’s really just the people you spend your Sundays with that matter.” —Charli XCX (41:48)
• “If I want to live the longest, I just have to be happy and I have to be free...” —Charli XCX (51:59)

Memorable Sections & Timestamps

• Charli on the songwriting process and intuition: (03:33–04:59)
• Contrasts in femininity, motherhood, and partying: (06:12–08:40)
• Pushing against “digestible” music and public compartmentalization: (09:41–10:53)
• Influences: Lou Reed & The Streets: (12:16–15:17)
• Working and living with husband George: (16:18–19:28)
• Brat’s messy themes and cultural takeover: (19:28–33:28)
• Navigating public perception and social media: (34:05–41:29)
• Female rage as declaration of self: (44:41–48:45)
• Wellness, happiness, and partying: (50:03–53:14)

Tone & Language

The episode is conversational, candid, and insightful. Charli brings humor and honesty; Gwyneth balances admiration, reflection, and probing curiosity. Both embrace complexity and contradiction throughout, maintaining an open, engaging dialogue.

For Listeners Who Haven’t Tuned In

This episode is an intimate, wide-ranging look into the mind of Charli XCX: her fearless approach to songwriting, the balance of chaos and creativity, and her pursuit of authentic living—both in her work and in offstage life. It’s essential listening for anyone interested in contemporary music, the evolving role of women in pop culture, or the challenges of staying true to yourself amidst the noise.

Skip to:

• 03:33 for songwriting origins
• 07:52 for embracing messiness
• 13:40 for talk about The Streets’ influence
• 31:41 for handling "Brat" going mainstream
• 45:03 for female rage in pop
• 51:48 for honesty about wellness and partying

Closing Note:
Gwyneth and Charli conclude with warmth and mutual admiration, reflecting on the freedoms they've carved for themselves and the power of creative, messy lives. The episode celebrates the courage to defy expectations and the joy of authenticity in all its forms.