Dragnet: The Big Love (EP4804)

Summary

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"Dragnet: The Big Love" (EP4804) — The Great Detectives of Old Time Radio

Host: Adam Graham
Release Date: September 18, 2025

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Episode Overview

This episode presents a harrowing case from 1951 Dragnet, dramatizing the real-life investigation into the disappearance of a woman, Barbara Gorman, and her two-year-old daughter, Nancy. As detectives Joe Friday and Ben Romero pursue limited leads, a tragic story of jealousy, infidelity, and child murder unfolds. The case challenges not only the detectives’ resolve, but also listeners’ emotions and moral sensibilities.

Listener guidance note: Adam Graham prefaces this episode with a content advisory due to its disturbing themes (03:10).

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Key Discussion Points & Plot Progression

1. Case Introduction & Initial Interviews

[04:56–07:57]

• Sergeants Friday and Romero receive a missing persons report: Barbara Gorman and her daughter Nancy vanished with no clear motive.
• Neighborhood leads surface: A neighbor, John Pearson, informs police that Barbara was involved with a man named Ralph Kane; both Barbara and Ralph have disappeared.
• Quote:

  "Seems for years the wife's been afraid we'd never get Alice married off. Now it's finally in the works, the wife's still unhappy."
  — Ben Romero, [05:44]

2. Building Suspicion: Motive and Relationships

[09:35–11:18]

• The detectives interview neighbors Pearson and Thelma White, who both corroborate Barbara Gorman’s affair with Kane. Suspicion grows that Barbara left with Kane.
• Notable skepticism:

  "If you're gonna run off with a man, you don't take your family along."
  — John Pearson, [11:19]

3. Interview with Philip Gorman (the Husband)

[12:10–16:15]

• Philip initially denies knowledge of his wife’s affair, but under pressure admits he knew, concealing it to avoid scandal.
• The main concern is Nancy’s safety, as both the father and neighbors say Barbara was not devoted to the child.

Quote:
"I just want my little girl back, that's all."
— Philip Gorman, [14:48]

4. Search Intensifies, Grim Discovery

[17:02–18:00]

• Detectives trace the trio to an auto court (motel): they find a child’s picture book and a blood-stained piece of a little girl's dress in the trash (later confirmed as human blood).
• Despite the evidence, no bodies are found and Barbara and Kane remain at large.

5. Break in the Case: Suspects Found, but Child Still Missing

[19:24–20:57]

• Detectives locate Barbara Gorman and Ralph Kane in an East LA auto court; Nancy is not with them.
• Interrogation:
  • Barbara offers inconsistent stories of Nancy’s disappearance, denying responsibility and claiming the child “ran away”.

Quote:
"I've told you everything I'm going to tell you. I don't know what's happened to the kid. She's gone, that's all. She's gone."
— Barbara Gorman, [20:12]

6. Confessions and Tragic Details

[21:13–25:37]

• Pressure and a partial confession from Kane lead Barbara to admit they formed a suicide pact:
  • After days of drinking, unable to resolve what to do with Nancy, they decide all three will die together via gas.
  • Barbara admits after waking, she and Kane found Nancy dead and buried her in the desert.
  • The confession is laced with despair and self-justification.

Quote:
"She was mine, wasn't she? I thought we could go together, all three of us. But it didn't work that way."
— Barbara Gorman, [24:24]

7. Final Revelations and Legal Consequences

[25:59–27:15]

• The autopsy reveals Nancy died not from gas but from two gunshot wounds.
• Both Barbara and Ralph confess to murdering the child while intoxicated.

Quote:
"That night, after hours of interrogation, Ralph Kane and Mrs. Barbara Gorman both broke down and confessed that they'd killed the child in cold blood."
— Joe Friday/[Narrator], [26:48]

• Father Philip Gorman is notified and taken to identify his daughter in the morgue, expressing heartbreak and disbelief.

Quote:
"She's only two. What can make anybody do a thing like that?"
— Philip Gorman, [27:56]

[28:10–29:36]

• Legal outcome:
  • Barbara Gorman: Life imprisonment
  • Ralph Kane: Death penalty, executed at San Quentin

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On the futility and agony of the case:

  "You think you got the finest setup in the world. Nice home, job, baby... Everything you need. Yeah, everything but a wife."
  — Philip Gorman, [16:03]

• Joe Friday’s moral coda:

  "[Barbara’s] wife called it love."
  — Joe Friday, [28:01]

• Barbara’s final self-delusion:

  "It doesn't matter what happens. It's for Raph. ... We'll pay for our mistakes."
  — Barbara Gorman, [25:47]

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Host Commentary & Listener Feedback

[31:11–43:34 and post-episode]

• Host Adam Graham discusses his personal reaction as a father, describing the episode as “a rough one,” particularly due to the final revelation that the suicide pact was a lie covering up premeditated murder.
• Graham reflects on societal and legal issues raised, such as jury reluctance to sentence women to death, and comments on Dragnet’s storytelling choices, especially mention of accents and period-specific details.
• Listener feedback covers topics including perceptions of age in historical context, legal changes in search and seizure procedures, and the evolution of Dragnet and radio police dramas.

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Key Segment Timestamps

| Timestamp | Segment/Content | |-----------|----------------------------------------------------| | 03:40 | Official Dragnet episode begins | | 04:56 | Case assigned to Friday and Romero | | 09:35 | Interview with neighbor John Pearson | | 12:10 | Interview with Philip Gorman (husband) | | 17:02 | Discovery of blood-stained dress piece | | 19:24 | Kane and Barbara Gorman located, Nancy missing | | 21:13 | Interrogation and Barbara’s shifting stories | | 23:06 | Kane’s partial confession, death pact details | | 24:24 | Barbara confesses to the method and location | | 26:30 | Autopsy results: Nancy was shot | | 26:48 | Final confession and legal resolution | | 27:56 | Philip Gorman’s heartbreak in the morgue | | 28:10 | Legal outcome narration | | 31:11+ | Adam Graham's commentary and listener feedback |

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Tone, Style, and Atmosphere

The episode features Dragnet’s signature stoic, documentary approach, utilizing terse, realistic dialogue and procedural reconstruction. Interrogations are methodical and relentless. Emotional moments — particularly the parents’ anguish — are handled with restraint but leave a profound impact. Graham’s commentary is measured, informative, and empathetic, providing broader cultural and legal context.

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Conclusion

"Dragnet: The Big Love" is a deeply disturbing but expertly crafted episode exemplifying the grim realities underlying some police work. It combines authentic period law enforcement methodology with a tragic dramatic arc, illuminating both the darkness of human failings and the slow, determined pace of justice — all mediated by the steadfast presence of Friday, Romero, and host Adam Graham’s reflective commentary.

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For listeners: This summary conveys all the critical plot points, moral and emotional stakes, and memorable exchanges from the episode. If you wish to experience the emotional resilience of classic radio drama or understand the evolution of police procedurals, this is a quintessential and enduring example.

Transcript

[Joe Friday]

What do you think makes the perfect snack? Hmm, it's gotta be when I'm really craving it and it's convenient.

[Barbara Gorman]

Could you be more specific?

[Commercial Announcer]

When it's cravinient.

[Philip Gorman]

Okay.

[Adam Graham]

Like a freshly baked cookie made with real butter, available right down the street.

[Joe Friday]

At a.m. p.m. Or a savory breakfast sandwich I can grab in just a.

[Commercial Announcer]

Second at a.m. pM.

[Joe Friday]

I'm seeing a pattern here.

[Adam Graham]

Well yeah, we're talking about what I.

[Barbara Gorman]

Crave, which is anything from am pm.

[Ben Romero]

What more could you want? Stop by AM PM where the snacks.

[Adam Graham]

And drinks are perfectly craveable and convenient.

[Joe Friday]

That's cravenience.

[Commercial Announcer]

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[Joe Friday]

Foreign.

[Adam Graham]

Welcome to the great detectives of Old Time Radio from Boise, Idaho. This is your host, Adam Graham. In a moment, we're going to bring you this week's episode of Dragnet. But first, I do want to encourage you if you're enjoying the podcast to please follow us using your favorite podcast software. Our listener support and appreciation campaign continues. You can support the show on a one time basis using the Zelle app. And I want to go ahead and thank Christopher for supporting the program. That way you can also become one of our ongoing Patreon supporters for as little as $2 per month by going to patreon.greatdetectives.net and I want to thank Cassandra for becoming our latest Patreon supporter at the dollar or more per month. Thanks for your support Cassandra. And I also want to go ahead and thank Matthias for upgrading his Patreon support from the rookie level to the Shamas level. Again, thank you so much for your support. Now, I spoke not too long ago on the Great Adventurers podcast about trigger warnings and now I generally don't use them, but this is an episode that had a advisory at the time, somewhat vaguely worded. I will encourage listeners to take that seriously. This one is a rough one, but that out of the way. Let's go ahead. July 5, 1951. Here is the big love.

[Narrator]

Ladies and gentlemen, this program is for you, not your children. The story you are about to hear is true. Only the names have been changed to protect the innocent. You're a detective sergeant. You're assigned a homicide detail. A woman and her two year old child disappears suddenly. There's no apparent reason for it. Five days pass, no trace of them.

[Joe Friday]

Your job.

[Narrator]

Find them. Dragnet. The documented drama of an actual crime. For the next 30 minutes, in cooperation with the Los Angeles Police Department, you will travel step by step on of the law through an actual case. Transcribed from official police files. From beginning to end, from crime to punishment, Dragnet is the story of your police force in action.

[Joe Friday]

Was Tuesday, April 20. Was overcast in Los Angeles. We were working the day watch out of homicide. My partner's Ben Romero. The boss is Captain Blaine Steed. My name's Friday. I was on the way back from communications and it was 1:35pm when I got to room 42, Homicide.

[Ben Romero]

Hi, Joe. What's doing?

[Joe Friday]

Well, not much, Mac. Where'd Ben go?

[Ben Romero]

Inside. Captain's office. Be right back.

[Joe Friday]

Oh, thank you. Keeping you busy?

[Ben Romero]

Oh, about the same. A little hectic around the house though.

[Joe Friday]

Well, that's right. Ben mentioned something about that. You're getting ready for a wedding out there, aren't you?

[Ben Romero]

Yeah, my daughter Alice. Sure getting a nice fellow.

[Joe Friday]

Is that so?

[Ben Romero]

Yep. Ambitious kid. Part time accountant. Goes to law school at night down Loyola. Real nice fella.

[Joe Friday]

When are you getting married?

[Ben Romero]

Week from Saturday. Gonna be a big church thing. Sure glad. Doesn't happen often, huh?

[Joe Friday]

How do you mean?

[Ben Romero]

Big production. Never saw so many bills in my life. New dress for Alice going away. Luggage, bridesmaids, dresses, eats, drinks. New carpet for the hall. New curtains in the living room. Wife must think I'm made of this stuff.

[Joe Friday]

You should have had all boys mank. Yeah. You're giving your daughter away, huh?

[Ben Romero]

Yeah. Well, it reminds me. I gotta be sure and send my suit to cleaners. Get a good press job on. It sure is funny.

[Joe Friday]

What's that?

[Ben Romero]

Seems for years the Wife's been afraid we'd never get Alice married off. Now it's finally in the works. The wife's still unhappy.

[Joe Friday]

Oh, well, how's that?

[Ben Romero]

Goes around moping around the house, wiping at her eyes. Keeps muttering something about losing her little girl. Her little girl's leaving her?

[Joe Friday]

I don't know. Well, how old's your daughter? 32.

[Ben Romero]

Well, I'll be down in stats office if anybody wants me.

[Joe Friday]

Right, man.

[Ben Romero]

Oh, pardon me, Ben. Excuse me.

[Joe Friday]

I didn't see it.

[Ben Romero]

Hi.

[Joe Friday]

Where you been?

[Ben Romero]

Making a couple of phone calls. I think we might have something.

[Joe Friday]

Yeah, what's that?

[Ben Romero]

The Gorman case had a call from one of their neighbors while you were gone. Where was that calendar of ours?

[Joe Friday]

Gee, I don't know. Well, here, I got one in my pocket here in my wallet. Oh, good. Here you are.

[Ben Romero]

Okay. Well, let's see now. Mrs. Gorman and her little girl, Nancy disappeared on the 15th. Is that right?

[Joe Friday]

Yeah. Thursday. Quite.

[Ben Romero]

And the husband, Mr. Gorman, filed a missing complaint on Friday morning, right?

[Joe Friday]

Yeah. What are you getting at?

[Ben Romero]

Well, you remember when we talked to Mr. Gorman, he couldn't think of any reason why his wife and his little girl should disappear like they did.

[Joe Friday]

Yeah.

[Ben Romero]

Remember me asking him the question if his wife ran around at all, if she was interested in any other man?

[Joe Friday]

That's right. He told you no, didn't he?

[Ben Romero]

This man who just called in, he lives out in the Gorman neighborhood. He swears up and down that Mrs. Gorman was keeping company with another man.

[Joe Friday]

Who is this neighbor, anyway?

[Ben Romero]

Name's John Pearson. Lives about four blocks from the Gormans.

[Joe Friday]

Well, we talked to neighbors a lot closer than that to the Gormans. They didn't seem to know anything about it. What else did this guy tell you?

[Ben Romero]

Well, let's see. The man Mrs. Gorman was supposed to be running out with is a Ralph Kane. Lives next door to Mr. Pearson.

[Joe Friday]

Well, how'd this Pearson sound to you?

[Ben Romero]

Pretty typical neighborhood watchdog. But here's the interesting part. Mrs. Gorman and little daughter Nancy disappeared last Thursday. Now, according to Pearson, this Ralph Kane hasn't been seen around since Friday night. He told me on the phone he saw Kane toss a couple of suitcases in his car late Friday night and drive off. Said he hasn't come back yet.

[Joe Friday]

Might be something. How much of a romance was Mrs. Gorman supposed to be having with this Ralph Kane?

[Ben Romero]

It's pretty heavy, according to Pearson. Said it's been going on for six months anyhow.

[Joe Friday]

And Mr. Gorman didn't know anything about it.

[Ben Romero]

He got me there. If he did, he didn't let us in on it. Wonder if he'd have any reason to cover it up.

[Joe Friday]

It's possible, I guess. Didn't want the scandal. How sure are you that Ralph Kane's really missing? Might be just off on a weekend.

[Ben Romero]

No, I checked the place he worked. He's a printer. Didn't show up for work Monday. Didn't show up today either.

[Joe Friday]

No message, no excuse, nothing.

[Ben Romero]

I called a friend of Kane's that Pearson knew about. Friend doesn't know where he's going.

[Joe Friday]

I guess we better get on. It's the first decent lead in five days.

[Ben Romero]

Yeah, just thinking, Joe. Neighbors like Pearson. What would we do without him?

[Joe Friday]

Five days before, on a Thursday evening, a Mr. Philip Gorman returned to his home in the Westlake district of Los Angeles to find his wife, Barbara Gorman, and his two year old daughter Nancy, missing. There wasn't any note, no explanation of any kind. Few clothes were gone. Mr. Gorman filed a missing report and a broadcast and an APB were gotten out on the mother and daughter. Neighbors, friends and relatives were checked. No leads. Routine investigation failed to turn up anything Mr. Gorman could give us. No explanation for the disappearance. After three days, we got out of a radiogram. Still no results. Tuesday, 1:50pm Ben and I got in the car and drove out to see John Pearson, who'd phoned in the information about Mrs. Gorman's supposed boyfriend, Ralph Kane. We found Pearson out on the back porch of his home feeding some milk to a pair of house cats.

[Philip Gorman]

I thought Everybody knew that, Sergeant. Mrs. Gorman running around with that Ralph Kane. I'm no busybody. I wouldn't have mentioned at all if this hadn't happened.

[Ben Romero]

You say Kane had been seeing Mrs. Gorman for the last six months. Is that right, Mr. Pearson?

[Philip Gorman]

About six months. That's how long I've seen it. Go on, James, don't be such a hog. Let Fred have some of the milk, too. Greedy little devil.

[Joe Friday]

Do you know of anybody else in the neighborhood who's been aware of this? Mr. Pearson, I mean, Mrs. Gorman and Ms. Ralph Kane.

[Philip Gorman]

Well, I know for sure that Thelma White next door knows about it. She's mentioned it to me. Kane used to park with Mrs. Gorman near that vacant lot by Thelma's house. Those were the nights that Mr. Gorman was working late.

[Joe Friday]

Would you know if Mr. Gorman was aware of this? That his wife was running around with another man?

[Philip Gorman]

I'm pretty sure he did, Sergeant. That's the strange part about it. Well, how do you know George, the man who delivers the groceries? He just happened to mention to me once. All right, James. Right, it's all gone now. Run off and play. Yes, George, the grocery man. He made a delivery to the Gormans once and heard them round about it. George said Mr. Gorman was very mad. Talked divorce, all that sort of thing.

[Joe Friday]

How about the Gorman's little girl, Mr. Pearson? Little Nancy?

[Philip Gorman]

Tragic, Sergeant. Such a sweet little thing. Mrs. Gorman kept her under an iron hand. Imagine, the little girl's only two years old. Mrs. Gorman was after her with a stick all the time. She's not much of a mother. Not the way I look at it, anyway.

[Joe Friday]

Well, what's your opinion of all this? Do you think that Ralph Kane has run off with Ms. Gorman?

[Philip Gorman]

What else can you think? Two of them carry on for six months. Mrs. Gorman disappears Thursday. Mr. Kane leaves Friday night. What else can you think?

[Ben Romero]

This neighbor of yours, Thelma White, does she live in this house over here? Over on the right?

[Philip Gorman]

That's right. Right next door. You go over and talk to her. She's home now. Thelma will tell you the same thing I did.

[Ben Romero]

All right, sir. Thank you very much.

[Philip Gorman]

Not at all, Sergeant. Just one thing I can't understand about Mrs. Gorman's little girl. Little Nancy. Can't quite understand why she's gone. Doesn't seem to fit somehow.

[Joe Friday]

How do you mean?

[Philip Gorman]

If you're gonna run off with a man, you don't take your family along.

[Joe Friday]

2:15Pm we went next door and talked with a neighbor, Thelma White. She told us the same story as Pearson. From the two of them, we got the description. DMV furnished us with the license number of Ralph Kane's car. We checked further with Kane's friends, relatives and his landlady. No one had seen or heard from him since late Friday. We searched the duplex where he lived. No leads. We went back to the office and checked Kane through R and I. He had one arrest for petty theft we got out of broadcast and an APB on him. That night, Ben and I drove out to see the husband and father of the missing woman and youngster, Philip Gorman. He was employed as a groundskeeper at one of the baseball parks in the city.

[Ben Romero]

Pretty fair turnout tonight, huh?

[Joe Friday]

Yeah, weather's cleared up a little. Probably helped, huh? Where's the groundkeeper shack? Down at the end there.

[Ben Romero]

Yeah, you can't see it from here. It's just below the end of the bleachers there.

[Joe Friday]

Well, come out here very often?

[Ben Romero]

Not as often as I'd like to. It's down this way. Hey, watch your step there, Joe. Is a mud puddle Yeah, I see it.

[Philip Gorman]

Sorry, you. You'll have to get back in the stands.

[Ben Romero]

You're not allowed down this end. How are you, Mr. Gorman? Fighting Romero. You remember that?

[Philip Gorman]

Yeah, sure. I didn't recognize you for a minute.

[Joe Friday]

We got a few minutes. Mr. Gorman would like to talk to.

[Ben Romero]

You if we could.

[Philip Gorman]

Well, sure. Right now, if you want. You found out something about the wife?

[Ben Romero]

Little girl?

[Joe Friday]

No, sir. Nothing definite. Got a few questions we'd like to ask you.

[Philip Gorman]

That's fine with me. I got nothing to do for a couple of mornings. What's it all about?

[Ben Romero]

Well, when we talked to you at your house the other day, Gorman, you remember me asking if you could think of any reason why your wife and your little girl should disappear like any.

[Philip Gorman]

Yeah, I remember. There's nothing I can think of, Sergeant.

[Joe Friday]

Would you recall us asking you if your wife might have been interested in some other man? Somebody she might go off with?

[Philip Gorman]

Yeah, yeah, I remember all that. I told you, I didn't think that was it.

[Joe Friday]

Now, look, if you know something and you're not telling us because you don't want the scandal, you can forget that, Gorman. Because whatever you tell us is in strict confidence. You know?

[Philip Gorman]

I don't know what you mean, Sergeant. I told you everything I know.

[Ben Romero]

We'll be honest with you, Gorman. We think you're trying to cover up.

[Philip Gorman]

Well, that's not true. I don't have anything to cover up.

[Joe Friday]

We picked up some new information on your wife this afternoon. We hear she was pretty friendly with a man named Ralph Kane. Lives a few blocks from your house. We hear that you knew what was going on. You and your wife, Barbara had a row. You talked divorce. How about it?

[Philip Gorman]

Well, let's go inside the shack here, huh? Get away from some of this noise.

[Joe Friday]

Fine. Sure.

[Philip Gorman]

I hope you don't mind it in here. It's a little dirty. I keep all the maintenance stuff in here.

[Ben Romero]

That's all right, Gorman. Now, how about Ralph King?

[Philip Gorman]

Yeah. Yeah, I knew about it. It's like you said, all the scandal. I just didn't want it to get out.

[Joe Friday]

Well, look, if you're gonna hold out on us, it's not gonna help much to find your wife and little girl.

[Philip Gorman]

I know, Sergeant. I just didn't want people to find out what a bum I'm.

[Ben Romero]

Right.

[Philip Gorman]

You know what some neighbors are like.

[Joe Friday]

Mm.

[Philip Gorman]

I can't understand how it happened. I. I met the wife when I was in the army.

[Joe Friday]

I see.

[Philip Gorman]

I brought her back out here. Everything was fine after the baby was born. She started to change. Nothing Satisfied her. She began to run around nothing but a bum. And I guess I found out too late.

[Joe Friday]

Now, that's Ralph Kane. What do you know about him?

[Philip Gorman]

He's a single guy, works at a print shop downtown. Pretty good looking guy. He's got money to spend. That's all Barbara cares about.

[Ben Romero]

Well, what's your idea about him? You think Kane and your wife have gone off together?

[Philip Gorman]

To tell you the truth, I'm not sure.

[Ben Romero]

Maybe they did.

[Philip Gorman]

I've been trying to check around them all. I'm not getting very far. The only one thing I'm really worried about, that's my little girl, Nancy. I don't care what my wife does or how far she goes. I just want my little girl back, that's all.

[Joe Friday]

You any idea at all where your wife might have gone?

[Philip Gorman]

No, none at all. She doesn't know California too well. She's only been out here a year.

[Joe Friday]

You don't know any of Kane's friends, his hangouts or places you think he might go? No.

[Philip Gorman]

I never even met the guy, Sonia. I'm going to, though. I know what he looks like.

[Ben Romero]

I'll meet him. There's just one more thing, Gorman. If your wife was set on running off with another man, why did you take your little girl with her? She wasn't too devoted to the baby, I understand.

[Philip Gorman]

That's right. That's what's got me worried. The only thing I can figure out is the wife hated me more than I thought. She knew that I thought Nancy was about the greatest thing alive. I guess rather than let me have her, she took Nancy along with her.

[Joe Friday]

Well, is it possible she might drop the baby off of some friend or relative, tell them to keep?

[Philip Gorman]

Well, I've checked on that already, Sergeant. You got the names of all the people we know? I'm sure they'd get in touch with me if they had names.

[Ben Romero]

We'll double check them anyhow. Now, if there's anything else comes up, you let us know right away, huh?

[Philip Gorman]

All right, Sergeant. It's just the baby, that's all Nancy is as far as I'm concerned. My wife never lived. Kind of hard to take her with.

[Joe Friday]

Yes, it is.

[Philip Gorman]

Think you got the finest setup in the world. Nice home, job, baby, good furniture. Everything you need. Yeah, everything but a wife.

[Joe Friday]

The search for the missing wife and the two year old daughter went on the broadcasts and teletypes on Mrs. Gorman and Ralph Kane failed to net us a thing. A week passed. There were no leads. Another week went by. Nothing. The half dozen replies we'd gotten on our teletype, went nowhere. They were blind leads. Wednesday, May 5th, we got a call from the manager of an auto court in the south end of the city. He told us that a man, a woman and a little girl answering the description of the missing trio had stopped at his place the night before, along with Jack McCready from Homicide. Ben and I drove out and interviewed the man. We showed him Pictures of Kane, Mrs. Gorman and 2 year old Nancy. He identified all three. He could give us no idea where they'd gone. We checked through the cottage where they stayed.

[Ben Romero]

No, nothing. Just about as clean as you can get.

[Joe Friday]

A little something here.

[Ben Romero]

What's that?

[Joe Friday]

Look here. Kid's picture book. Let's see. Yeah, take a look right here.

[Ben Romero]

This book belongs to Nancy Gorman. Well, we know they were here. That's about it. Hey, Ben. Yo.

[Joe Friday]

Yeah, Max, where are ya?

[Ben Romero]

Out in the back. Come here. All right. What have you got? Come here. Have a look.

[Joe Friday]

Where'd you find that?

[Ben Romero]

Poking around this trash barrel here. Looks like part of a little girl's dress, huh? Yeah. There's not much there. Did you find the rest of it? That's all there is. Just that little collar.

[Joe Friday]

Take a look here, Ben. These stains right here. Over here, too. Yeah.

[Ben Romero]

What do you think, Mac?

[Joe Friday]

Blood stains?

[Ben Romero]

I'd say so.

[Joe Friday]

We drove back to the office, to the crime lab and had Lee Jones run the stains on the dress. He ran a benzidine test and then a biological precipitant. The stains were made by human blood. Well, it still didn't put us any closer to the missing child or her mother. The search went on. We redoubled our efforts. No luck. Another 10 days passed. We had a few more responses to our all points bulletin, but none of them panned out. On May 16, we got two more leads to check out. They went nowhere. We got back to the office a.

[Ben Romero]

Little after 6pm Better call Mr. Gorman after we check in, huh? Keep him off of our backs.

[Joe Friday]

Yeah, I hate to keep telling him the same thing. No word. Yeah, how about it? You call Gorman tonight, huh?

[Ben Romero]

All right, Mac. What's Dylan got? Something for you. Sheriff's substation called. East la. Well, what about the Gorman case? They found him. Where? Another auto court right there in East LA. Ralph Kane and Mrs. Gorman. They got them both under surveillance.

[Joe Friday]

How about the little girl, Nancy?

[Ben Romero]

Well, that's a hitch, huh? No sign of her.

[Narrator]

You are listening to Dragnet. Authentic cases from official files.

[Joe Friday]

Saturday, May 16, 9pm along with Levinson and McCready from Homicide. Ben and I drove out to the sheriff's substation in the east end of the city. One of the deputy sheriffs directed us to the motor court where Mrs. Barbara Gorman and Ralph Kane were under surveillance. We found the two of them in one of the rear cottages. There was no trace of two year old Nancy Gorman. Levinson and McCready took Ralph Kane out to the car to interrogate him. Ben and I remained in the cottage with Mrs. Gorman. She was a tall blond, thin faced and nervous. She spoke with a decided accent. We questioned her for more than two hours. We got nowhere.

[Ben Romero]

Why don't you sit down, Mrs. Gorman? Relax.

[Barbara Gorman]

How can anyone relax? These questions. You have no right to do this.

[Joe Friday]

Maybe you haven't got it straight, Ms. Gorman. It's a pretty important matter we'd like to find out about your little girl.

[Barbara Gorman]

I told you, I don't know. She ran away.

[Joe Friday]

Yes, ma'. Am. Now we've had 10 different versions. You stopped at a hotel in Nevada and she disappeared. You were at an auto court in Bakersfield. She ran away during the night. We've heard just about all of them. How about the truth?

[Barbara Gorman]

I've told you everything. I'm going to tell you. I don't know what's happened to the kid. She's gone, that's all. She's gone.

[Ben Romero]

Got to be an explanation for it. Where is she? Gone.

[Barbara Gorman]

She ran away. How many times do I have to tell you? I left with Raph, who went out of the city after a few days. Nancy got loans. She wanted to see her father. We were asleep one night and she ran away. That's all there is to it. It's simple. Why can't you understand?

[Joe Friday]

You're gonna have to do better, Ned. Ms. Gorman. Now how about the truth? What happened?

[Barbara Gorman]

Can't keep me here all night. Where's Raph? I want Raph.

[Joe Friday]

Why'd you take the child with you in the first place? Ms. Gorman? It's pretty obvious that you didn't want her. Did Kane want you to take her along?

[Barbara Gorman]

Oh, no. He wanted me to leave her. Just he and I, that's all he wanted. Should have left her there. All this trouble, questions.

[Ben Romero]

It's an easy remedy, ma'. Am. What'd you really do with a little girl?

[Barbara Gorman]

She wandered off. The truth. We didn't know it. She wandered off. We couldn't help it.

[Ben Romero]

How about the little dress we found in that auto court with stains on it?

[Barbara Gorman]

Same questions. You always ask the same questions.

[Joe Friday]

What about the dress, ma'?

[Ben Romero]

Am?

[Barbara Gorman]

Do I always have to repeat I Told you Ralph got his hand. He was shaving. It was just an old dress. A rag. Ralph bandaged his hand with it.

[Joe Friday]

Well, you usually wear bandages a while, don't you? Don't just throw them away.

[Barbara Gorman]

It was only scratch. He didn't need the rag very long.

[Ben Romero]

Quite a few stains on the dress, ma'. Am. Must have been more than just a scratch.

[Barbara Gorman]

No, it was just a scratch. Can't you believe anything I say?

[Joe Friday]

No, not so far.

[Barbara Gorman]

Please, can't I go outside for a few minutes? I have a headache. It's so hot in here.

[Ben Romero]

All right, Ms. Gorman.

[Joe Friday]

Go ahead, baby.

[Ben Romero]

Yeah, thanks.

[Barbara Gorman]

The air so good. Terrible headache.

[Joe Friday]

You mind telling us something, Ms. Gorman?

[Barbara Gorman]

Please, can't you let me alone for a minute?

[Joe Friday]

Why did you leave your husband?

[Barbara Gorman]

Him? Any woman would leave him. It's wrath. I love Raph.

[Ben Romero]

And your little girl. What about her?

[Barbara Gorman]

My husband wanted her, not me. I'm just not like that. I didn't want her in the first place. It was a mistake. Terrible mistake.

[Joe Friday]

Is that why you got rid of her?

[Ben Romero]

What now?

[Joe Friday]

It's pretty obvious by this time, ma'. Am. When you left your husband, you took your little girl along for spite. Kane didn't want her. You found out you didn't either, so you got rid of her now, is that it?

[Barbara Gorman]

I didn't say that. You're putting words in my mouth. I didn't say that at all.

[Ben Romero]

Joe. Ben. Yeah, Mack. Over here. Kane's given us half the story. Shouldn't be too hard to get the rest.

[Barbara Gorman]

It's a lie. There's no story to tell. Nancy ran away. That's all we know, Mac.

[Ben Romero]

Kane says they tried some kind of a death pact. He and Mrs. Gorman here got in a room and turned on the gas.

[Barbara Gorman]

He didn't tell you? He didn't tell you?

[Ben Romero]

Afraid so, ma'. Am. That's your boyfriend's story. What else May? Well, as I say, Kane and Mrs. Gorman got in the room, agreed to end it all. They had a little girl with them in the room.

[Joe Friday]

Well, why was that?

[Ben Romero]

Kane says he doesn't know. Seemed to simplify things, having the kid with him. He tell you what happened? Yeah, they turned on the gas.

[Barbara Gorman]

No, don't.

[Ben Romero]

Never mind, Ms. Gorman.

[Barbara Gorman]

Never. Matt. You don't have to say it.

[Joe Friday]

You want to tell us about it, Ms. Gorman?

[Barbara Gorman]

Yes, I'll tell you.

[Joe Friday]

3Am we went back inside the cottage. At the auto court, we gave her a cigarette and Barbara Gorman sat down and told us the story. Four days after she'd left with her two Year old daughter and Ralph Kane. She knew she'd made a mistake. She admitted that she never should have taken the child. She said the little girl seemed to be in their way all the time. Kane was all for deserting the child or sending her back to her father. Mrs. Gorman wouldn't agree to it. Just out of pure spite. One night in an auto court, she and Kane had a big drinking party. They brooded over the mix up that they'd gotten themselves into. Kane didn't have any money to get married. He knew he'd lost his job. Even if they could get married, Mrs. Gorman wasn't sure she could get a divorce. Another full day and night of drinking and they decided on a lover's death pact. They turned on the gas.

[Ben Romero]

I don't get it, Mrs. Gorman. Why'd you have your little girl in the room with you? Why don't you leave her with somebody? With anybody?

[Barbara Gorman]

Why? She was mine, wasn't she? I thought we could go together, all three of us. But it didn't work that way.

[Joe Friday]

Well, what happened?

[Barbara Gorman]

Raph and I woke up. Throats were burning. My eyes were burning. Looked over Nancy, she wasn't moving. It was just like she was asleep.

[Joe Friday]

What'd you do then?

[Barbara Gorman]

We got in the car and left. We found a nice place in the desert. There were nice flowers there. We buried Nancy.

[Ben Romero]

How about you and Ralph Kane? You knew you were in deeper. Why didn't you try it again?

[Barbara Gorman]

Oh, we did. A couple of times. We loved each other. The only thing we could do. But every time we tried, we couldn't go through with it. We'd try. We never could finish it. Rav got a job. We were gonna buy a gun. Tomorrow we try again.

[Joe Friday]

Can you show us where you buried your little girl? Yes.

[Barbara Gorman]

Place in the desert. Out near Palm Springs. It was a nice place. There's lots of nice flowers around. You understand, don't you? We were in love, Raf and I. Yeah. My husband wouldn't understand the way I loved Raf. It was everything. It was the whole world. Raph and I. I didn't mean it that way for Nancy. It was a mistake. You've got to understand. I didn't mean it that way.

[Ben Romero]

That's the way it is.

[Barbara Gorman]

It doesn't matter. You can't hurt us, my Traff and I. You can't take away what we've got. You'll never take that away.

[Joe Friday]

All right. You want to get your coat?

[Barbara Gorman]

Yes. It doesn't matter what happens. It's for Raph. I don't care what they do, I'll keep on loving him. Same way I love him now. Doesn't matter. We'll pay for our mistakes.

[Joe Friday]

Yeah, lady. They're gonna cost you. At 5:00am we put in a call for Lieutenant Lee Jones and the crime lab crew in the coroner. When they arrived at the auto court, we drove to the spot in the desert near Palm Springs where Ralph King and Mrs. Gorman pointed out the spot where they buried Nancy. The body was uncovered at the exact spot was taken back to town to the county morgue where an autopsy was performed. Kane and Mrs. Gorman were booked on suspicion of murder. By five o' clock that afternoon, we had the results of the autopsy.

[Ben Romero]

Yeah, Doctor, huh? Right. Thank you. Bye. What's the story, man? Not what we thought.

[Joe Friday]

How do you mean?

[Ben Romero]

I think Mrs. Gorman sold us a bill of goods. Little girl didn't die in a room full of gas.

[Joe Friday]

What the doc say?

[Ben Romero]

He found two bullet holes in the body.

[Joe Friday]

That night, after hours of interrogation, Ralph Kane and Mrs. Barbara Gorman both broke down and confessed that they'd killed the child in cold blood. They pleaded drunkenness, that they weren't responsible for their actions. They were returned to their cells and held without bail. The child's father, Philip Gorman, was notified the following morning. Ben and I accompanied him to the county morgue.

[Ben Romero]

It's this way, Mr. Gorman.

[Philip Gorman]

Oh, thanks.

[Joe Friday]

You sure you want to go through with this, sir?

[Philip Gorman]

Mr. Gorman? Well, I might as well tell you the truth. I'm not sure I do.

[Ben Romero]

It isn't going to help much, Mr. Gorman. Believe me, he didn't.

[Philip Gorman]

I just wanted to see her. Just once more.

[Joe Friday]

Yeah, well, it doesn't work out. Wouldn't be the same. Not the way you remember.

[Philip Gorman]

Just wanted to see. I just wanted to find out. What's that about her mother, Ralph King. What is it that could make them do it?

[Joe Friday]

Lovely girl.

[Philip Gorman]

She's only two. What can make anybody do a thing like that?

[Joe Friday]

Your wife called it love.

[Narrator]

The story you have just heard was true. Only the names were changed to protect the innocent. On September 10, trial was held in Superior Court Department 89, City and County of Los Angeles, State of California. In a moment, the results of that trial. Mrs. Barbara Gorman and Ralph Donald Kane were tried and convicted in Superior Court of murder in the first degree. Mrs. Gorman was sentenced to life imprisonment. Kane received the death penalty. He was executed at the State Penitentiary, San Quentin, California. Ladies and gentlemen, the Bill of Rights section of the United States Constitution protects our freedom. Today that freedom is endangered by tyranny and aggression. Every American must help make our free government an example to all peoples by dedicating himself to a constant active citizenship. Freedom needs you. You have just heard Dragnet, a series of authentic cases from official files. Technical advice comes from the office of Chief of Police W.H. parker, Los Angeles Police Department.

[Philip Gorman]

Stay tuned for CounterSpy next over most NBC stations.

[Barbara Gorman]

This is the story of the one.

[Joe Friday]

As a custodial supervisor at a high.

[Barbara Gorman]

School, he knows that during cold and.

[Joe Friday]

Flu season, germs spread fast.

[Barbara Gorman]

It's why he partners with Granger to stay fully stocked on the product, products and supplies he needs, from tissues to disinfectants to floor scrubbers, all so that.

[Joe Friday]

He can help students, staff and teachers stay healthy and focused. Call 1-800-GRAINGER click granger.com or just stop.

[Barbara Gorman]

By grainger for the ones who get it done.

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[Adam Graham]

Welcome back. This is one of those stories that now that I'm a dad, it just hits really differently, really hard. What these two people did. I don't have words. At least not edifying words. The suicide pact story was bad enough, but what actually happened was just horrific. The outcome speak to the reluctance of juries to give women the death penalty and that's the only explanation for why she would not have been executed. On the production side, the opening light hearted scene I'm sure I've heard before, I'm just not sure where I thought that it was the big pair, but I went and listened to that and it had a different wedding Related opener. The one odd part of this episode was where Joe Friday's narration told us the woman spoke with a heavy accent. That's one of those things that you shouldn't have to include in narration that should be obvious in an audio production and kind of irrelevant if you were doing the Dragnet TV thing where they occasionally did, where you'll just show them talking but not actually show the sound. And have Friday summarize what said the accent that she used is actually kind of vaguely European than anything I can specifically identify. Maybe it was out of some sensitivity to issues with making it too specific given the nature of the crime. You had many displaced persons in the world and many who had immigrated to the United States or wanted to immigrate to the United States, so highlighting a specific nationality may have been something they wanted to avoid. Listener Comments and Feedback Now Christopher writes, Love not Beat. Been listening since 1985. And now to your podcast. Thank you Adam. Well, thank you Christopher. Really appreciate your support and your listening to the podcast. And we have some comments regarding the episode the Big Run. Dawn writes, it may just be my point of view, but 58 isn't elderly in regards to the age of one of the victims. Come on Joe and Naomi Jo says Dawn, you beat me to it. I had to rewind to check I'd heard it correctly. Mechanic 66 pointed out, maybe not, but Jack Webb died at 61. People tend to live longer now, although lifespan for Americans is on a downward trajectory. I think it's an interesting point and always want to be careful and sensitive to my audience. A lot of people, you know, you hear your own age described as elderly and you kind of go, hey. I do think that to expand on what Mechanic66 said, Life was harder in the past. The further you go back and you don't have to go back to this era. There have been many points about how actors used to look older. You can go as recent as the first season of Seinfeld. Jason Alexander was 29 when he filmed that first season. Does not look 29. Apologies to Mr. Alexander, but he does it at least not, you know, like modern 29 year old. And it's even more stark. One I saw compared Carroll o' Connor at the age he started doing all in the Family to Paul Rudd, much older than o' Connor was then. And while there might be some Hollywood magic involved, even looking at non celebrity photos, you know, through the family albums, people just looked older and I think life took more of a toll. It tended to you tended to have more people who were involved in hard physical labor and there were so many things about diet and the way we took care of ourselves and then just the things that people had been through. If you were a 58 year old woman in 1951, you were born in 1893, you'd been through two world wars and a Great depression and who knows what other hardships and that will age a body. And we actually had a really good episode of the old Time Radio Snack Wagon we did with a couple couple of commentaries and stories by that great storyteller John Nesbit, about how life had become far more easy and convenient and healthy in the time between when he'd been a boy back towards the turn of the century and the 1940s. And it's been an even more dramatic turn since then. And you know, people will say things like the your 40s are the new 30s or the six your 60s or the new 40s. Well, there had to be an old 30s and an old 40s. And I will say that whether 58 would be considered elderly or not. I remember growing up in the 80s and into the 90s that there were restaurants where the senior menu was something you got when you were 55. And I actually figured out and told my dad how many years until he could get the senior discount. He was not pleased at the prospect, but it was a different time. And whether he was technically correct or not, even then, I think that it was something that could have had some merit. Also on Spotify, Mechanic66 writes, Once again, Joe Friday makes an arrest that any competent defense attorney would have been able to get thrown out for an illegal search. If you have to clean the window to see inside the garage, it's not in plain sight. And we know they would never have lied about that in court. Well, I appreciate the comment. The thing is, when it comes to questioning the legality of Friday's actions, they're often based on modern interpretations of the case law. The criminal case law in regards to criminal procedure, arrest, due process, and the interpretation of the fourth Amendment is something that has evolved over time. And we also have to keep in mind, while the Dragnet episodes were released in 1951, the cases they were based on could have occurred many years prior to prior. At the time of Dragnet in 1951, the controlling case regarding the exclusion of illegally obtained evidence was the 1949 case Wolf vs Colorado, in which they found the exclusionary rule, which they had applied to the Federal Government since 1914, was only adopted by 17 states, 30 others had rejected it and that it was not a departure from the basic Standards of due process to allow states to introduce illegally obtained evidence in state trials. This would not be overturned until 1961 or 10 years after this episode aired. So if this story happened in 1961 rather than 1951 or proposed before, yeah, it would get thrown out in state court. But it didn't. Now, Dragnet did acknowledge when laws changed, although not often in a supportive manner. One of the last radio episodes of Dragnet, the Big Ruling, has Friday none too happy with evidence being thrown out as a result of a new ruling he hadn't kept up on. And subsequent Dragnet seasons when the series returned in the 1960s showed how criminals were able to take advantage of loopholes. In the 1966 Dragnet TV movie, many viewers resonated and still resonate with his quirk in the law speech. Yet the Dragnet universe, I guess, if you want to call it, could also be a bit more balanced in terms of what is the duty of the policeman. It is the duty to follow the law as it exists. One of my favorite episodes of Adam 12 was called the Dinosaur, and it is about a police officer who had been amazing and heroic and had actually been someone that the hero of Adam 12, Pete Malloy, looked up to. But he had been injured in the line of duty and he spent eight years out of the force and came back. But when he came back, he was stuck in the old ways. He had been doing things, and as a result, criminals got let off and a woman nearly died as a result. And at this point, Malloy had kind of emerge into more of a leadership role. Not a sergeant left, but he just told the guy to pack it in. He said people need to grow with change, and you didn't have that chance. It illustrated the degree to which police procedures and the expectations of them in their jobs had changed over the few years as a result of various court rulings. And I guess as an aside, that also might be one reason why the 1950s dragnet kind of disappeared from circulation. One of the appeals of Dragnet was that it showed the police in action how they worked, but when how they worked to change radically. You also, of course, did have the appeal of the color episodes, but it made sense probably to stop syndicating the show. It is fair to question whether an arrest today would have been allowed or whether the evidence would be thrown out today or even a few years after the fact. But the fact is that it probably would not have been thrown out in 1951 because the exclusionary rule was not operative in most states in the Union. Now it's time to thank our Patreon Supporter of the day. And I want to go ahead and thank Robert patreon, Supporter since August 2016, Currently supporting the podcast at the Detective Sergeant level of $7.14 or more per month. Thanks so much for your support, Robert. And that will do it for today. If you're enjoying the podcast, please follow us using your favorite podcast software. And if you're enjoying the podcast on YouTube, be sure to like the video, subscribe to the channel, and mark the notification bell. Join us back here next Thursday for another episode of Dragnet. And next Monday, be sure and listen for Danger with Granger. But join us back here tomorrow for yours truly, Johnny Dollar Ware.

[Ben Romero]

I. I take it you and your husband haven't been too happy together recently.

[Mrs. Halser]

We haven't. That's why I'm not sitting around moping and moaning and weeping over his passion.

[Ben Romero]

And you have no idea what might have happened?

[Mrs. Halser]

No. That is, yes. Well, that isn't unless he got drowned or something like that on one of his silly fishing expeditions. Or unless someone found out how much money he was carrying and killed him for that.

[Ben Romero]

He took a great deal of money with him.

[Adam Graham]

Yes.

[Mrs. Halser]

He always did. How much, Mrs. Halser? He never told me. But it was thousands of dollars, you may be sure of that.

[Ben Romero]

He left here in February?

[Mrs. Halser]

Yes. The weather was too cold in Florida, too cold all along the Atlantic coast. At least that's what he said in his regular weekly post part. Though he tried up now, abandoned in Tennessee and then Kentucky and then heaven knows where. Then in April, he come back here. How long he was here? I don't know. I was in Fort Wayne for a few days.

[Ben Romero]

Then how do you know he was here at all?

[Mrs. Halser]

He moved one of the chairs in the living room to get to the floor safe to get some more money to waste on fishing.

[Ben Romero]

Well, how do you know he was going fishing again?

[Mrs. Halser]

Because of the note he left in the big freezer with the fish he brought back to put into it. Oh.

[Ben Romero]

May I see that note?

[Mrs. Halser]

I don't know why not, if the Missing Persons Bureau down in Fort Wayne are willing to show it to you.

[Ben Romero]

Oh, I see. And you're sure your husband left no.

[Mrs. Halser]

Clue as to where he was going? I'm very sure. Mr. Dollar? Yes? My husband is dead. If he weren't, I would have heard from him. You're doing nothing but wasting your time here. My time? I've told everything I know to the police over and over again. If you think you can accomplish more than they have. Why don't you go down there and talk with Lieutenant?

[Adam Graham]

I hope you'll be with us then. In the meantime, send your comments to box Thirteenreatdetectives.net Follow us on Twitter at radiodetectives and check us out on Instagram. Instagram.com Great. Detectives from Boise, Idaho, this is your host, Adam Graham, signing off.