Dragnet: The Big Crime (EP4688)

Summary

Podcast Summary: The Great Detectives Present Dragnet (Old Time Radio) Episode: Dragnet: The Big Crime (EP4688)
Release Date: April 26, 2025
Host/Author: Adam Graham

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Introduction

In Dragnet: The Big Crime, host Adam Graham delves into one of the most gripping episodes of the classic radio series Dragnet. This detailed recounting not only explores the procedural elements of the investigation but also highlights the emotional and societal implications of child abduction and molestation in the 1950s. Graham enriches the narrative with his insights, listener feedback, and comparative analysis with the television adaptation.

Case Overview

The episode centers around Detective Sergeant Joe Friday and his partner Ben Romero from the Juvenile Bureau of the Los Angeles Police Department. Their task is to locate two missing four-year-old twin girls, Joan and Tilly Carsten, who disappeared after playing in a local park.

Key Incident:

• Date & Time: Saturday, August 7th, 7:35 PM
• Location: Eucalyptus Grove, 7th Avenue Park, Los Angeles
• Victims: Joan and Tilly Carsten, aged four

Notable Quote:

"It was hot in Los Angeles... But now, from February 15, 1951, here is the big crime."
— Narrator, [03:34]

Investigation Process

Detectives Friday and Romero embark on a methodical search, canvassing the neighborhood and interviewing witnesses. Their investigation reveals that the girls were last seen playing near eucalyptus trees before vanishing without a trace.

Key Developments:

• Witness Testimony: An ice cream vendor, Mr. George Comanches, reports seeing the girls with a man near the park.
• Physical Evidence: Torn petticoat and dress fragments recovered near the disappearance site.

Notable Quotes:

"The kids might have turned up while we were gone. I hope so."
— Detective Ben Romero, [05:00]

"He was walking them out of that clump of trees over there."
— Mr. Comanches, [07:15]

Culmination and Resolution

The breakthrough in the case comes from a keen observation by Comanches regarding the suspect's language around children. This leads the detectives to cross-reference registered sexual psychopaths, pinpointing Lester Wiley as a prime suspect.

Key Actions:

• Suspect Identification: GHL Gramberg, later identified as Lester Wiley, an organist with no prior criminal records.
• Suspect Interrogation: Persistent questioning reveals inconsistencies in Wiley’s alibi, leading to his eventual confession.

Notable Quotes:

"You got a friend living near the school... They just don't want to let you alone."
— Officer Frankie Carsten, [20:30]

"You’re gonna say I took em. You’re gonna say I did things to em."
— Lester Wiley, [25:45]

Host's Analysis and Insights

Adam Graham commends the episode for its balanced portrayal of sensitive issues without delving into explicit details. He underscores the importance of such narratives in shedding light on the challenges law enforcement faces, especially concerning crimes against children.

Comparative Analysis: Graham contrasts the radio episode with its television counterpart, noting differences in performance and narrative closure. While both versions effectively convey the gravity of the crime, the TV adaptation adds visual tension by lingering on critical evidence, such as the knife, to emphasize the potential severity of the situation.

Notable Quote:

"This big episode shows how Dragnet balanced the need to show sensitivity while also shining light on difficult issues."
— Adam Graham, [31:51]

Listener Feedback

The episode garnered significant attention from listeners, eliciting a range of emotional and analytical responses:

• Emotional Impact: Parents found the episode particularly harrowing, with one listener expressing it as the "single hardest episode to listen to" on the channel.

  "As a parent, I think this might have been the single hardest episode to listen to of any show on your channel."
  — Listener, YouTube Comment

• Legal Perspectives: Some listeners critiqued the sentencing portrayed in the episode, feeling it was lenient given the gravity of the crimes.

  "One year for manslaughter of a child seemed rather lenient."
  — Fosty Boo Boo, Spotify Comment

• Character Appreciation: Appreciation was expressed for the authentic portrayal of Detective Ben Romero, highlighting his deadpan humor and professional demeanor.

  "Ben Romero is my favorite partner of Joe's. I enjoy their small talk and the way they express their friendship."
  — Harrison, Instagram Comment

Notable Quote:

"The sound effects team rocked. Melanie Webb actually had five sound effects men work on Dragnet and there was just a great dedication to realism."
— Brains Benton, Instagram Comment

Conclusion

Dragnet: The Big Crime stands as a testament to the enduring legacy of the Dragnet series, showcasing meticulous police work and the emotional weight of solving crimes involving children. Adam Graham's comprehensive summary not only recounts the episode but also engages with broader themes and listener sentiments, offering a multifaceted understanding of this classic radio drama.

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Notable References:

• Ideal Bakery Mention:
  "If you want to just have Ambred shipped to you and find out what it is that so excited the Romeros about this then... go to idealbakery.net."
  — Adam Graham, [40:45]

• Upcoming Content Tease:
  "This weekend, we are bringing you the big cast television version with Lee Marvin."
  — Adam Graham, [46:34]

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Join the Conversation: Listeners are encouraged to share their thoughts on Instagram at @greatdetectives and on Twitter @radiodetectives. Your support and feedback help keep these captivating stories alive.

Transcript

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[Jack Webb]

Back Cap apply with Blue Cash Preferred. Welcome to the Great Detectives of Old Time Radio from Boise, Idaho. This is your host, Adam Graham. In a moment, we're going to bring you this week's episode of Dragnet, but I do want to encourage you. If you're enjoying the podcast, please follow us using your favorite podcast software and today's episode is brought to you in part by the financial support of our listeners. You can support the show on a one time basis at support.greatdetectives.net and I want to thank Christopher for supporting the podcast that way. You can also send a Super thanks on YouTube by clicking the dollar sign when watching the video and I want to thank CK for sending along a donation that way. Thank you so much for the super thanks. In addition, you can become one of our ongoing Patreon supporters for as little as $2 per month at patreon.greatdetectives.net and I want to welcome Diane and Jennifer as new Patreon supporters at the detective sergeant $7.14 or more per month and Sam at the shamus level of $4 or more per month and Steve at the rookie level of $2 or more per month. Again, thank you so much for your support. It is truly appreciated. Now I do want to say that there is actually a parental advisory that Jack Webb recorded before today's episode and I'd say that is something you may want to keep in mind if you particularly young listeners who are co listening with you. But now, from February 15, 1951, here is the big crime.

[Kristen Bell]

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[Jack Webb]

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[Jack Webb]

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[Jack Webb]

Make sure our stuff fits nicely.

[Kristen Bell]

Oh the right. Still need to buy the car. Getting ahead of ourselves here. Buy your car with Carvana today. Ladies and gentlemen, this program is for you, not your children. The story you are about to hear is true. Only the names have been changed to protect the innocent. You're a detective sergeant. You're assigned a juvenile bureau. A worried mother calls your office and reports that her four year old twin girls are missing. Hours pass, the children fail to turn up. Your job. Find them. Dragnet. The documented drama of an actual crime. For the next 30 minutes in cooperation with the Los Angeles Police Department, you will travel step by step on the side of the law. Through an actual case. Transcribed from official police files. From beginning to end, from crime to punishment. Dragnet is the story of your police force in action. It was Saturday, August 7th. It was hot in Los Angeles. We were working the day watch out of juvenile bureau. My partner's Ben Romero. The boss is Inspector Bowling. My name's Friday. It was 7:35pm when we got to where we parked our car. 80k there. Let's see now. Your house is back that way, huh? Yeah. Why don't you swing around here, huh? All right. How am I on that side? Okay. Plenty of room here. No, you better wait a minute. Okay, it's all clear now. I don't know about you, I think there's something sour about the whole thing. Wait til we check at the house. The kids might have turned up while we were gone. I hope so. Sure hate to go back there empty handed. Not one lousy lead. It's hard to figure. If the little girls just wandered off, somebody should have spotted them by this time. Unless there was some kind of an accident. Yeah. What time you got? 20 minutes to 8. 5 hours. That's a long time for a pair of 4 year olds to be out of sight in it. Parents are gonna be worried sick when we tell them. That's it. Up in the next block in it. Oh yeah. Might as well pull up right here, huh? Yeah. That's good. Let's go. Lousy job. I'll put in with you. Oh, yeah, Officers, come in. Thank you. Have you heard anything? No, sir. Not too much, Mr. Carson. We just finished checking the neighborhood. Somebody around must have seen the kids. Did you talk to everybody? We checked out all the names you gave us, sir. Everyone who knows your little girls. The kids they play with, their friends, parents, storekeepers in the area. But somebody had to see them. They gotta be around someplace. Joan and Tilly got lost in that park. I know they would have headed up toward home. Sergeant. What is it? Did you find. No, we're still checking, Ms. Carson. There's nothing much to tell you right now. Dear God. Somebody's got to have seen Tilly. And Joan couldn't have wandered off that far. I don't think it's as bad as it might seem to you, ma'am. Children have been missing a lot longer than your two little girls and turned up. All right. Just try to relax, Ms. Carson. Why hasn't somebody seen? They wandered off from us in the park. But it's only three blocks from the house. Why isn't somebody seen? It's dark out. God knows what could have happened to them at night. Take it easy, honey. Don't start imagining things. I think it's just a matter of time, ma'am. We've got three teams of men working on it with us. Gotten out of broadcast on your little girl. Did you talk to the Stanleys down the street in the Petersons? Yes, ma'am, we did. We checked out all the names that you gave us. There is one thing we wanted to ask you about. What's inside your. About the spot in the park where you had your picnic this afternoon. Where the little girls wandered off from. That's exactly where I pointed it out to the other officers. By the eucalyptus Grove, right off 7th Avenue. Just about 2:30 this afternoon. We finished lunch. Frank was taking a nap and I was reading. I saw the girls playing tag over by the trees. I looked up in a few minutes and they were gone. Just like I told the other officers. Then you're sure about that location, huh? Of course I'm sure. Why should I lie to you? I want to find the girls. Please find them, Sergeant. Find them. Yes, ma'am. Come on, honey. Take it easy, huh? It. It's just never happened to us before, Sergeant. Joan and Tiltie have never gone off like this. It's not like them, that's all. Only babies, really. Would you like me to get that for you, Mr. Carson? Yes, sir. Would you, please? Sure. Oh, hi, Wilkie. Joe, anything? No, not yet. You want to step outside? Yeah. Yeah. Ralph and I checked with a guy who runs an ice cream wagon. He works the area in the park where the kids disappeared. What'd he tell you? He saw a couple of little girls about a half a mile from that eucalyptus Grove about 3 o'clock this afternoon. They were with a man. Yeah. Says he saw the man put the kids in a truck, drove off with him. 8:00pm Together with Tom Wilkie. Ben and I left the home of Mr. And Mrs. Frank Carsten, the parents of the missing girls, without telling them about the latest report until it was positively confirmed. We felt that telling them would serve no purpose other than to worry them needlessly. The ice cream vendor, a Mr. George Comanches, who had reported seeing the four year old girls, consented to drive out with us to the park area where he'd spend in the company of an unidentified man. I was right over there, officers. This big guy, mustache. He had the little girls, one on each hand. He was walking them out of that clump of trees over there. Think you can describe the man for us, Mr. Comanches? I didn't look that close. I thought he was the father. The kids were sniffling, you know, maybe like they'd been crying. Better check the ground over there by the trees, huh, Wilkie? Yeah, sure, Stan. Ralph, want to give a look over here? Didn't you notice anything at all about this man, Mr. Comanches? I mean, other than his mustache? Well, big man, big shoulders, regular truck driver. You know, work shoes, blue shirt, blue pants, jeans, I guess. How about the color of his hair? Some kind of distinguishing marks maybe? No, I don't know. I thought he was the father. The kids were sniffling there, the little girls. Was Anything wrong? It didn't look like it. How about this man's truck? Did you notice that? No, I didn't. I was busy with the freezer motor then. Gives me lots of trouble all the time. What about the license number? Did you happen to look at that? Maybe I should have looked. I didn't. Bag of peanuts. Orrises. Warm, nice and fresh. Yeah, thanks. There you are. Why don't you eat them while they're warm? Good. No, I saved them for my boy. He's crazy for peanuts. Joe. Ben. Excuse us, Mr. Comanche. Sure, sure. Go ahead. Yeah, welcome, Stan. Found these over in the bushes by the trees there. Let me see. Little girl's petticoat. Little girl's dress. Ripped to pieces. 8, 24pm the area where the torn clothing was found was roped off and checked for for footprints and other physical evidence. None was found. Homicide detail was notified and joined in the investigation. The torn petticoat and dress were taken down to Lee Jones at the crime lab for examination. Then they were shown to the father of the missing children, Frank Carsten. He definitely identified them. The search for the four year old twins, Joan and Tilly was intensified. An emergency spot check was made of all known and registered sexual psychopaths. From the hundreds of names, the stats office came up with one that might possibly tie in. He was listed as GHL Gramberg. His address was at the end of 7th Avenue, close by the park area where the Carson twins had disappeared. On his mama sheet, Gramberg was described as tall, well built, dark hair with a mustache. We found him at his work, a small bar out in the Wilshire district. He was the organist there. Yeah, that's right. I live on 7th Avenue, right across from the park. What's the matter this time? Missing juveniles. Can you account for your time between noon and six o'clock tonight, Granberg? I don't know if I can or not. I don't keep a daily log, you know. They didn't tell me how to do that. Well, tell us where you were between noon and six tonight. That's all we want to know. That's quite a bit, don't you think? Suppose I told you I was playing canasta with a mate in that. Would that shock you? Look, we're not in the mood for smart answers. You just give us an alibi we can check, that's all. I don't know why you always have to bother me when something happens. You made your own reputation. We didn't. Now what about it? I left my apartment about 11:30 this morning. I went down the union hall and paid my dues. Had lunch with some friends at the Blue Pigeon out in Wilcox. Then we went on a tour of one of the studios. All right. Will your friends confirm that story for you? Oh no, they won't. They left town tonight. The 8:15 train for San Francisco. Oh yes, Mr. Selden. A special friend of mine from up north. Graham wants to hear Indian Love call. Okay. Certainly, Mr. Seldon. Right away. What about it, Granburg? Who's dodging for your alibi? Already told you. My friend's left town. You can check with a guard at the movie studio if you want. We had a pass. Time punched in, time punched out. It should be all there. You want to call and check that studio Yeah. I don't mean to be rude, Sergeant. I always did feel that registration business is unfair. Oh, that so? Of course. Grossly unfair. How do you suggest we keep track of you? Why do I have to be kept track of anyway? You know as well as I do, your record. It was all a lie. I hardly even touched the kid. I paid my time anyway. Why can't you give me a break? Every time something happens to a kid, I have a cop on my neck. Were you in the 7th Avenue park at any time today? Granberg? What? Were you in the 7th Avenue park today? Matter of fact, I was. Yeah. I took a walk there. What time was that? I don't know. I left my friends after lunch. Came home to freshen up about 1:30, I guess. I was in the park about 1:45, 2:00. Only stayed a few minutes. When did you leave? About 2:15. You went from the park to meet your friends at the studio? Exactly right. Chance, did you see two dark haired little girls while you were in the park? No, I didn't see anybody. I was by myself. Mm. You sure of that? Well, of course I'm sure. If I did see them, it wouldn't mean anything. I don't molest kids. I don't get along with them, that's all. Another one. Graham, I wonder if you'd mind playing Diane. Anniversary party, you know. All right. Thanks, Graham. What I was saying, Sergeant, it's the truth. I couldn't have hurt a little kid. I never could. No one says you have. I know, but I just want you to know how I feel. Maybe I don't get along with kids, but I couldn't hurt them. Little girls especially. I like kids. Really? I just don't understand how I like them. It's a real strange thing, isn't it? Yeah, it is. Joe, can I see? Did you talk to Studio? Yeah, I checked with the guard. What'd he say? Bamberg was there from 2:30 to 4:30. You double checked the times? Yeah. His alibi is good. 10:55pm The 4 year old Carsten girls were still missing. A special detail of men from Homicide were assigned to a general canvas of stores and homes in the park area. All the residents were questioned. No one had seen the children. 11:20pm we headed back for the Karsten home. I'm all out of smoke. Joe, you got some? No, I'm out too. There's a drugstore up ahead. I guess we can get some there, huh? A car in front of us. That's Wilkie and Bates. Car, isn't it? Let's see. Yeah. Oh, here's Wilkie coming out of the drugstore. Hey, Wilk. Romero. Joe just talked to the office. Anything new? They got a call from the Valley Station a few minutes ago. Yeah, Little girls. They've been found. You are listening to Dragnet for the step by step solution to tonight's authentic case. 11:25pm as soon as we got the word that the 4 year old Carsten twins had been found, Ben and I drove back to the office where Inspector Bowling filled us in. A few minutes past 11pm A motorist out in the valley spotted the two small girls walking hand in hand along a deserted side road off Ventura Boulevard. Their clothing was dirty and torn. They were alone. The motorist picked them up, took them to the Valley Division station where the girls were identified. We sent out a partial cancellation on the apb. The twin girls were taken to the Georgia Street Receiving Hospital where they were treated for cuts and bruises. Then they were returned to their home. The doctor reported that both girls had been criminally molested. The search for the abductor went on. Late the next day, Ben and I drove out to the Karsten home to talk to the twins, Joan and Tilly. We had no luck at all. They were still shaken up from the excitement and shock of their experience. We went back to the living room with their mother, Helen Karsten. It was the same thing this morning when I tried to question them. They just don't want to talk about it. Must have been horrible for them. Did they tell you anything at all, Mrs. Carson? Well, Joan just refuses to talk about it. She says the man was big. That's all I could get out of her. Tilly seems a little more willing to talk, though. She's always been a little more forward than Joan. Ever since they were babies, ma'am. I see. Well, could she add anything at all to what your other little girl told you about the man? She told her father the man had a mustache. Probably impressed her because my husband wears one, too. Pretty certain she's right about that. I can usually tell when she's making up things. Well, how about the way the man was dressed? His clothes? No, they didn't mention anything particular. Tilly told me the man was dirty. She said it two or three times. Dirty, dirty clothes. She might have meant the man had work clothes on. She has so many expressions. I don't know. How did the man get your little girls into the truck? Did he offer them candy or something like that? Well, Tilly said something about a kitten the man had a little kitten and he was gonna give it to them. I told him about that once. I told them a thousand times, stay away from strangers. Don't go with them. Yes, ma'am. Did they tell you anything else at all about the man's description? Tilly said the man was big. I don't know if you could count on that. Everybody looks big to her. I talked to her an hour, but she just kept repeating the same story. Man made them cry, tore their dresses, hurt them. Just horrible for them. Yes, ma'am. Did it tell you anything at all about the truck the man was driving? Maybe the color or something like that? Well, Tilly called it a big car. Funny big car. She said it was red with red pictures all over it. Can't put much faith in that, though. Why not, ma'am? Everything's red to Tilly now. Everything has red pictures on it. Just the phase she's going through. A few weeks ago it was blue. Everything was blue to her. Now it's red. Everything's red. I see. You think they might be able to tell you a little more in a day or so, after they've quieted down? Well, I don't know. I certainly hope so. Thank God it's all over. Their home's safe. That's all that counts. Oh, ma'am, I'm afraid there's more to it than that. What? The man that did it. Still free Monday, August 9th. The search for the suspect went on. All of us, the men from Juvenile and homicide detail were pretty much feeling our way in the dark. Repeated questioning of residents living in the area where the abduction took place netted us nothing. Our two star witnesses, the four year old twins, were able to contribute little. We stayed on it another three days of pounding the pavement, knocking on doors and asking stock questions led nowhere. As in most cases like this one, the criminal enjoyed the distinct advantage of having victims who were unable because of their age, to clearly identify him. Tuesday, August 10th. In the late afternoon, we got a call from Bernice Hopper, a real estate agent in the West Hollywood area. 4:15pm Ben and I drove out to interview her. Excuse me, Officer. I just gotta find that listing book first. Well, right ahead, Ms. Harper. I just know it's gotta be here someplace. Only yesterday morning, I remembered a stink. Oh, here it is. There. Now I can start to do business again. Well, I don't know if this is gonna help you any in your case, officers, but I certainly think something should be done about it. Flagrant. That's the only word I Can think of just flagrant. Would you like to tell us about it, ma'am? Well, I saw him yesterday, for one thing. See, I was coming back from lunch about 2:30 in the afternoon. Mondays I always have late lunch. Yes, I see. I was just passing the corner a few blocks from the grammar school right up above on Prospect Avenue, and I saw this truck parked and this truck driver leaning out of the window talking to some children. Just tops, they were. Just tops. Yes, ma'am. What happened? Well, what happened is not so much that. It's just the way this truck driver was talking to these children. I must have been at least 20ft from them and even I could hear. What was that, ma'am? His language. Just filthy. I couldn't understand a grown man talking to little tots like that. Every kind of filth, every obscene word you think of. Flagrant. Just flagrant. Was there any point in the way he was talking to the children, Ms. Harper? I mean, was he mad at them? Did he seem sober or what was it? It was filth. That's all I know, officer. Just dirt and filth. Some of the children didn't like it and they told him that only made him do it all the more. I really think you ought to check up on him. Yes, ma'am. Well, can you tell us anything else about it? Oh, would you excuse me? Yes, ma'am. Go right ahead. How do you do? My name's Bernice Hopper. May I help you? How do you do? I'm Arthur Tomilson. You showed me in the wife place last weekend. No. Oh, yes, of course, Mr. Thomason. A cottage out on Norwich, wasn't it? Yeah, that's right. Well, the wife and I certainly did like it. She wants me to put a deposit on it. It's still for sale, I guess. Well, no. As a matter of fact, I sold it Monday. It's just like I told you. Things go fast. Of course, you had a substantial down payment to make at the time. Oh, yeah, it did take me a few days to get some money together. That's too bad. Lorraine certainly loved the place. It's too bad, I guess. I'm very sorry, Mr. Thomason. There wasn't anything I can do. Oh, yeah, I know that. Well, thanks anyway, ma'am. I guess we'll keep looking. Something may turn out. I'm sure it will. Thanks for stopping by again, Mr. Thomason. Yeah. Bye. Oh, my. Everybody wants something for nothing. They want houses, but they don't show the money. Now, what was it the truck driver that you saw, Ma'am? Oh, yeah. Well, after hearing that talk of his, I just copied down the license number of the truck. I've got it right here in my desk. How about the truck driver, ma'am? Did you get a good look at him? I certainly did. The way he acted to those children. Anything unusual about his appearance? No, nothing besides his foul mouth. He was tall, dark, had a mustache, ties in. One more thing. Truck he was driving? Yes, ma'am. There were pictures painted on the side. Circus animals, I think. Did you notice the color? Oh, yes, it was red. Even the pictures were red. 4:45pm we took the license number of the truck which Bernice Hopper had given us and drove back to the office and checked it through dmv. We found the truck was registered to a commercial baking firm in the south end of town. Through their personnel department and their dispatcher's office, we got the name and address of the employee who was driving the truck. The same day Bernice Hopper had spotted the driver talking to the school children. His name was Lester Wiley. We checked a little further, found that he was driving the same truck the day the Karsten twins were abducted. We called into R and I. Wiley had no criminal record. 6:30pm we located the suspect at his home, an old style green and white bungalow on the edge of the Highland park district. He sat in the dining room and drank some kind of sweet wine from a large water glass while we questioned him. That's sure stupid of me, huh? I didn't even ask if you wanted some of this. No, thank you, Wiley. Like to have you explain about your language in front of those school kids. Nothing to explain. Bunch of those kids are hanging around the truck. Thought maybe they wanted to get in and grab some of the cakes and stuff. I read them off, that's all. Well, that still doesn't explain the filthy language, Wiley. I don't know. Maybe I wasn't feeling good that day. Might let a few cuss words slip. I didn't mean anything by it. I like kids. Do you usually make deliveries up around that school area, Wally? Once in a while, yeah. I get around quite a bit. That's not what they tell us down where you were, huh? You had no business in the neighborhood of that school. You deliver routes on the other end of town. So I can't drive where I want, huh? I get the deliveries made. What are they squawking about? Like to know what you were doing up in that neighborhood. I was on my lunch hour. Drove up to see a friend. I got a friend living near the school. What's the matter anyway? Don't you think you've had enough of that? Look, you're not telling me what I have to do in my house. It's my house. I want a glass of wine. I have it. You're not telling me what to do. All right, Wiley, just take it easy. Take it easy, Nothing. I talked to you too. Long enough. There's the door. You're not coming in here telling me what to do. You better get your coat. We'll talk downtown. We're not talking any place. Now get out. Get out of this house right now. Afraid your alibi's not gonna hold up, Wylie? That it? I don't know what you're talking about. You're trying to frame me. Don't you think I know that? That doesn't make much sense. Why should we want to frame you? I know what you're getting at. Just what you're getting at. Those two little girls last week. You're gonna say I took em. You're gonna say I did things to em. Well, I didn't anything to do with it. Didn't you? Well, no. No, I didn't. Oh, look, I'm sorry. Why don't you sit down? I didn't mean what I said. Cause I just got nervous. Sure, Wiley, we understand. Why don't you let me get a couple of glasses, huh? Have some of this wine. Warms you up good. No, thank you. Just like to have you straighten us out on a couple of things and we'll let you alone. Yeah. Like to know if you can account for your time between 12 noon and 11pm last Saturday. That's the day somebody picked up those two little girls, isn't it? Yeah, that's right, Wiley. I don't know. I was making deliveries like I always do up to 11 o'clock at night. I was a little late. Yeah. Nothing unusual though. That so? Another working day. It's all that's good wine. I might have been near the park where those kids were. Doesn't mean anything, though. I get around quite a bit. A lot of deliveries to make. All right, come on. How about it, Wiley? Did you grab those two little girls? Watch a joke. All right, mister, that's enough. Get out of my house. Get out of my house. All right, Ben. Get him on himself. You never prove it, you know that? What about it, Wiley? It's the use. It's no good at all. You want to tell us about it? I didn't mean it. That's so. I didn't mean it just once in a while something goes wrong with me. I like kids. Like them too much, I guess. I didn't mean to hurt them. You ready to go now? Anything you say. Thought I had it with me when I grabbed the kids. What? Thought it was in my coat pocket. Glad I lost it. Glad you lost what? A pocket knife. I was gonna kill him. The story you have just heard was true. Only the names were changed to protect the innocent. On December 10, trial was held in Superior Court Department 87, City and County of Los Angeles, State of California. In a moment, the results of that trial. Now here is our star, Jack Webb. Thank you, friends. As you might have heard me say before, on Dragnet we try to present the kind of entertainment that you want. You're the boy. Lester Wiley waived his rights to a preliminary hearing and at his arraignment in Superior Court, he entered a plea of guilty to one count of kidnapping and one count of child molesting. He received the sentence as prescribed by law and is now serving his term in the state penitentiary. You have just heard Dragnet a series of authentic cases from official files. Technical advice for Dragnet comes from the office of Chief of Police W.H. parker, Los Angeles Police Department. Now there's more exciting listening with counterspy on NBC.

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[Jack Webb]

Welcome back. This is a great episode. It shows how Dragnet balanced the need to show sensitivity while also shining light on difficult issues. In this case, it dealt with the very real issue of child abductions and molestation without getting too explicit, and it highlighted the problems out there. Certainly the police can question registered offenders, but so many are not caught or have not been caught and fly under the radar. The only way they found out in this case was because of the language he was using around kids. I questioned in the past and still question whether he'd even be reported today. I think so many people feel free to talk however they like around kids that no one would take notice of it. The TV version of this is also very good, and it's a little different for the performance of Jack Krushen, who played the criminal. The TV episode actually ends after Friday and his partner leave with the suspect the camera panning down to show the knife on the floor and dwell on it, showing how something that was this horrible really could have actually been much, much worse. Well, now we turn to listener comments and feedback and we start on Instagram with a comment regarding the radio version of the big cast Brains Benton writes, that was a creepy criminal. Great job by Stacy Harris and Melanie. Comments Fun fight scene. The sound effects team rocked. Thanks. Melanie Webb actually had five sound effects men work on Dragnet and there was just a great dedication to realism and professionalism in the way they did everything. And they did a great job making that story come alive. I will go ahead and tease and I'll tease a bit at the end of the episode. Our video theater this week will actually be the TV version of the big cast, so you can compare it to the radio version. I actually think that while Stacy Harris did a good job, the actor in the TV version does even better. And there were also some interesting things that they did with the TV version of the fight. So I encourage you to check that out on video theater. And the History Chaser writes, thank you for keeping these pieces of history alive. And another listener comment specifically regarding the episode, add insult to injury, the mom only gets a year on a manslaughter charge. Children didn't rate too highly even back then. And in a similar vein on Spotify, Fosty Boo Boo writes, one year for manslaughter of a child. I would agree that based on everything we heard in that episode, one year seemed rather lenient. I checked, and under current California law, involuntary manslaughter can carry a sentence of up to four years in prison and voluntary manslaughter up to 11. I don't know if the statutes have been changed over the years to make the sentence for manslaughter harsher, but again, we didn't get anything in that episode that would make us think that there were mitigating circumstances that would indicate a lesser sentence. It does always seem that there are some judges who just don't take these sort of things as seriously as they ought. Every few years there'll be a situation where there's a crime against a child and their person is found guilty. And the sentence just doesn't seem just at all. Another comment from YouTube regarding this, a listener writes, as a parent, I think this might have been the single hardest episode to listen to of any show on your channel. Thanks for the comment and sorry about that. Of course that was posted before today's episode, which for many listeners might be much more difficult, but on this one anyway, I warned you and so did Jack Webb. Thinking about it, there are a number of episodes that really do hit hard and hit differently for me now that I'm a parent. This one and the big children to a certain extent, and then something like 22 rifle for Christmas. Now keep in mind that they replayed 22 rifle for Christmas in December of 19, so parents got all three of those episodes within about a two and a half month period. I will say that while there are some episodes that can be emotionally challenging to a degree, I don't think you really get something quite on that level throughout the rest of the radio series. So I don't know, maybe they got a few letters from parents asking them to maybe tone it down a tad back to Spotify. And another comment regarding the big cast, Mike writes, 12 men dropped completely from sight. Serial killer much? Yeah, I think that the killer in the big cast would fit the modern definition of a serial killer. It just wasn't a term in use back in the 1950s, at least not on Dragnet. But he definitely fits. And there were serial killers like that. You might think of some of the ones who were more sensationally perverse, but there were quite a few serial killers in more modern times who very much fit the profile of the man in that episode. And then we have some comments from Harrison regarding few episodes and we start with the big jump where he begins with a quote from the this Harrison is a mental case. Well, that's a fine how do you do Ben? I've had a few episodes I've listened to where the villain killer bad guy lowlife was named Graham and it is a little weird listening to, so I empathize. He goes on to write, this episode is one of my favorites. The last line you told me which way to lean is why Ben Romero is my favorite partner of Joe's. I enjoy their small talk and the way they express their friendship through lines like that. Well, thanks so much Harrison. And I think that there is something about Ben Romero. When you get into Ben Alexander and later Harry Morgan, they do bring a certain added entertainment value to the episodes. If at all possible, writers give them two or three minutes for A comedy sketch in which they show how odd and quirky they are. And I quite enjoy that. But with Ben Romero, I think you do have someone who feels more authentically like an actual police officer. An actual typical police officer with deadpan humor and ways of trying to make light of situations that really could have been quite deadly. My favorite example of that is in that episode, the City hall bombing or the Human Bomb, where Friday gets the bomb and trips and falls down the steps. The bomb goes flying but doesn't go off, and it turns out that it needed a hard pull. So they're safe, though they easily could have got blown up. And Romero just comes over to Friday and says, clumsy. That is such a real moment. And it. It really does work quite well in the context of the show. And I don't think any other Joe Friday partner would pull that off. And regarding the big family, he writes, maybe I missed something. But isn't the crime at the Isn't it a crime to, at the very least the wasted man hours of the police department? I figure if anyone would be irked at that, it'd be Joe Friday. Well, to be fair, I think Joe Friday showed he was irked in a professional way. He's not going to go off on the gentleman, but he did tell him, you know, aren't we kind of entitled to an explanation? We were put to a lot of trouble because of this or words to that effect. Obviously, he was annoyed and he felt like, come on, you gotta explain what happened here. But it's not something you can prosecute for. Now, you or I, at any time we'd like, can go down to the bus station, buy a ticket to Oklahoma City, not tell anyone where we're going or why we're going, and just wander around Oklahoma City, hitchhike around Oklahoma. And that's not a crime. Unless hitchhiking in Oklahoma is. Then don't hitchhike in Oklahoma. I'm not an expert on Oklahoma law, but regardless, if you just want to wander around Oklahoma, that's not a crime. Of course, if you get in the wrong place, there are vagrancy laws and things like that. But if I disappear from Boise without giving any notice, I don't have any responsibility to the city of Boise to tell them, hey, I need to let you know where I'm going so that you don't worry, because I'm not accountable to them. Now, there are people I am accountable to, and I'm not going to do that. But the city is not owed an explanation. And the best defense if they try to drag him under court for some pretense and say you caused us to spend a lot of man hours. And his response would be, who asked you to? I didn't ask you to. I didn't ask you to go and spend your time searching for me. Oh, yes, the police were irked. But no, that is not a crime. And then we go back a bit where Harrison writes regarding Ben's quest for Graham bread. You mentioned a place in Illinois that supposedly still makes their version of the bread. Well, it just so happens I live in Illinois. Maybe this could be a podcast special assignment. I do want to be careful here because actually as a state, Illinois has some of the highest concentration of listeners in the entire country. I could say the entire world, which would be true, but 80% of our listeners are in the US so that is just being overly dramatic. Illinois has the sixth highest population in the United States, but produced the third most downloads to our podcast. A bit more than Florida, which has double the population. All that to say, want to swamp this poor bakery. But they do actually ship their bread, which is good because our Illinois listeners are centered around the Chicago area. And of course, according to Google Maps, this bakery is about a 40 minute drive. Which you think about it, you know, both ways, you're looking at an hour and 20 minutes to try out some bread and even further if you're in other parts of the state. And let me just say, I do not have any experience with this bakery. They aren't paying and I can't vouch for the quality. But if you want to try it out, it is The Ideal Bakery. Idealbakery.net and they are in Elk Grove Village. If you have to drive any distance there, I would go on the website, get their phone number and call ahead. But if you want to just have Ambred shipped to you and find out what it is that so excited the Romero's about this then. Yeah, just go to idealbakery.net and you can order it shipped and probably from outside of Illinois as well. All right, well, now it's time to thank our Patreon supporter of the day. And I want to go ahead and thank Eliza. Eliza's been one of our patreon supporters since July 2021, currently supporting the podcast at the shamus level of $4 or more per month. Thanks so much for your support, Eliza. That'll actually do it for today. If you're enjoying the podcast, please follow us using your favorite podcast software. And if you're enjoying the podcast on YouTube. Be sure to like the video, subscribe to the channel, and mark the notification bell. All those great things that help YouTube channels to grow. We'll be back next Saturday with another episode of Dragnet for public domain video theater. This weekend, we are bringing you the big cast television version with Lee Marvin. You can find that on our YouTube channel. You can also find it at videotheater.great.detives.net and wherever you get video podcasts such as the Apple Podcast store or Podmain. And now on Spotify. And then join us back here on Monday for the adventures of the Falcon.

[Kristen Bell]

Where I. I wonder if you could help me out. If it entails making like a bird dog, I'm afraid not. I've quit the racket. This would be a cinch. I'm looking for a girl named Florette Duval. That's like looking for John Smith in New York. So I learned the hard way. I ran into one of them this afternoon. Almost got myself in a jam. What happened? It's a long, dull story. Well, I don't mind, as long as your brandy holds out. Well, during the war, my brother wound up in the hands of the gestalt, thanks to a Florette Duval. I got a tip she was in Paris and living in the Palouse de Vran. Lucky she was the wrong girl. Lucky for whom, huh? I see you're packing a gun. Yeah, if she hadn't done some fast talking, the gendarmes might be hunting a killer tonight. Obviously, she was the wrong girl. Yeah, she couldn't possibly have known Paul. She was brought up. Wait a minute. She knew his name was Paul? You probably told her. No, I just referred to him as my brother. She was the one who came up with the name. Look, how you know she was the right Florette Duval after all. Sorry, Waring. I gotta run. Where do you think you're going? Correct. A mistake I made. You're out of your mind. Be a good kid and stay out of this. Look, if you think I'm gonna let you walk out of here and commit murder. That's exactly what I think. Now get out of my way. Don't be a fool, Collier. Gonna get out of my way. Give me that gun. Okay.

[Jack Webb]

I hope you'll be with us then. In the meantime, send your comments to box Thirteenreatetectives.net follow us on Twitter at radiodetectives and check us out on Instagram. Instagram.com greatdetectives from Boise, Idaho, this is your host, Adam Graham, signing off.