The Great Con-Woman of the Gilded Age (Pt 2)

Summary

The Greatest True Crime Stories Ever Told
Episode: The Great Con-Woman of the Gilded Age (Pt 2)
Host: Mary Kay McBrayer
Release Date: April 15, 2025

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Introduction

In the second installment of "The Great Con-Woman of the Gilded Age," host Mary Kay McBrayer delves deeper into the intricate schemes of Cassie Chadwick, a masterful grifter who ascended into high society through deception and manipulation. This episode unpacks Cassie's elaborate cons, her interactions with influential figures, and the eventual unraveling of her fraudulent empire.

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Cassie Chadwick's Rise to High Society

The episode picks up with Cassie Chadwick maneuvering through New York City's elite circles in 1902. Mary Kay McBrayer narrates how Cassie strategically positioned herself to gain the trust of influential men, particularly James Dillon, a respected lawyer and friend of her purported father, steel magnate Andrew Carnegie.

At [02:08], Mary Kay sets the scene:

"Cassie knew that James would recognize the address and she took the opportunity to explain her position... Her father was still a man of integrity, though. He set up a trust in her name."

Cassie's claim of being Carnegie's illegitimate daughter was a calculated move to secure her financial position and gain access to high society's resources.

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The Promissory Note Scam

Cassie's ingenuity in manipulating financial institutions became her hallmark. By [18:33], Mary Kay recounts Cassie's interaction with Charles Beckwith, the president of Citizens National Bank of Oberlin, Ohio. Cassie secured significant loans under the guise of managing her "trust."

"She signed it immediately. It guaranteed that before July 1, 1903, the Carnegie Trust must be turned over to him and he would receive a $40,000 bonus... Cassie used that receipt to her advantage." [18:33]

Cassie leveraged forged promissory notes and securities, amassing debts that would eventually cripple both her and the banks that trusted her deceit.

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Interaction with Charles Beckwith and Financial Overreach

Cassie's relationship with Charles Beckwith illustrates her ability to exploit trust and professional courtesy. Initially, Charles viewed Cassie as an easy target due to her perceived financial naivety. However, Cassie's continuous demands and the rising debts led to significant financial strain.

At [26:54], Mary Kay describes the impending downfall:

"By fall of 1903, though, Charles was running very low on funds. He had $102,000 tied up in Cassie Chadwick... Cassie went to Charles Beckwith again, and he raised the $15,000 she needed."

Cassie's relentless pursuit of funds through loans eventually attracted federal scrutiny, leading to a critical investigation by Comptroller Levi Miller.

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The Collapse: Bank Run and Exposure

As Cassie's fraudulent activities became public, the ripple effects were devastating. Depositors, fearing for the security of their savings, initiated a bank run on Citizens National Bank of Oberlin.

"People who had entrusted their savings to Wade Park Bank read about Cassie Chadwick's scandals in the local paper. They knew how closely their bank was associated with her, and everyone rushed to the teller to withdraw their deposits." [29:37]

This mass withdrawal led to the suspension of the bank's operations, triggering a cascade of financial failures and exposing the depth of Cassie's deceit.

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Annie Reid's Insights: Interview with the Author

In a compelling segment, Mary Kay interviews Annie Reid, the author of "The Impostor Heiress, Cassie Chadwick, the Great Grifter of the Gilded Age," providing deeper insights into Cassie's life and methods.

Research Methods and Discoveries

Annie discusses her meticulous research process:

"I have an outline that's 270 plus pages of just outlining the newspaper articles from the different times that she was in trouble." [38:57]

She highlights the importance of primary sources, such as Cassie's letters and historical records, which shed light on the nuances of her fraudulent activities.

Cassie's Sophistication and Charm

Annie elaborates on Cassie's innate talent for deception:

"She was so smart. She just picked up on things really quickly... She picked up on banking and legal jargon..." [41:46]

Cassie's ability to adapt and refine her cons over time demonstrated her exceptional skills as a con artist, allowing her to manipulate even the most educated and cautious individuals.

Missed Anecdotes and Unverified Stories

Annie shares intriguing stories that didn't make it into her book due to insufficient corroboration:

"She talked to the servants and said, 'I'm a society lady and this maid is applying to work at my house.'” [45:40]

While these anecdotes added depth to Cassie's character, the lack of concrete evidence required Annie to omit them to maintain factual accuracy.

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Final Downfall and Legacy

Despite her tenacity, Cassie's web of lies could not sustain indefinitely. Faced with mounting debts and legal pressures, she resorted to feigning illness to avoid prosecution. Her arrest marked the beginning of the end, culminating in her conviction for conspiracy to misappropriate funds.

Andrew Carnegie, though indirectly affected, responded philanthropically by aiding those harmed by the scandal, showcasing his commitment to social responsibility.

"He wrote back asking for a list of the students and townsfolk who had been affected... He donated $125,000 to help them in their hour of need." [48:43]

Cassie's legacy serves as a cautionary tale of how charm and intellect, when wielded unethically, can lead to widespread financial devastation.

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Conclusion

Mary Kay McBrayer's in-depth exploration of Cassie Chadwick's life reveals the complexities of her fraudulent schemes and the societal vulnerabilities that enabled her rise and fall. Through meticulous storytelling and expert interviews, this episode underscores the timeless relevance of fraud prevention and the impact of individual deception on broader financial systems.

Listeners are encouraged to reflect on the intricate dance between trust, charisma, and integrity, as exemplified by Cassie Chadwick's infamous exploits during the Gilded Age.

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Notable Quotes:

• Mary Kay McBrayer [18:33]:
  "She signed it immediately. It guaranteed that before July 1, 1903, the Carnegie Trust must be turned over to him and he would receive a $40,000 bonus..."

• Annie Reid [41:46]:
  "She was so smart. She just picked up on things really quickly... She picked up on banking and legal jargon..."

• Mary Kay McBrayer [29:37]:
  "People who had entrusted their savings to Wade Park Bank read about Cassie Chadwick's scandals in the local paper. They knew how closely their bank was associated with her, and everyone rushed to the teller to withdraw their deposits."

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Further Information:

For a more comprehensive understanding of Cassie Chadwick's life and her fraudulent schemes, listeners are encouraged to explore Annie Reid's book, "The Impostor Heiress, Cassie Chadwick, the Great Grifter of the Gilded Age," available on major book retailers and AuthorAnnieReid.com.

Stay tuned for the next episode of "The Greatest True Crime Stories Ever Told," where Mary Kay McBrayer explores the dark ventures of David Scotts, a funeral home owner turned criminal mastermind.

Transcript

[Mary Kay McBrayer]

Every morning brings a fresh new energy. And no matter what the day holds, we come to the Today show for all of it.

[Annie Reid]

We get the best start to the.

[Mary Kay McBrayer]

Day because we started together.

[California Psychics]

Watch the Today show weekdays at 7am on NBC.

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[Annie Reid]

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[Nyx]

Diversion audio.

[Mary Kay McBrayer]

In 1902, Cassie Chadwick stood in the gorgeous lobby of the Holland House on the corner of 30th street and 5th Avenue in New York City. Men in bowler hats and frock coats passed her and she scoured their faces for one in particular. She spotted James Dillon standing alone. He was a lawyer, a friend of her husband's, and she let her shoulder graze his when she passed him. Naturally, he excused himself. Cassie whirled around and said it was such a great coincidence to see him here, so far away from her home in Cleveland. Actually, she was on her way to her father's house. Would he mind escorting her there? He couldn't very well say no. He hailed an open carriage. As it slowed, Cassie gave the driver the address. 2 East 91st street at 5th Avenue. James was shocked. Before they even got in the carriage, she'd given the cab driver the address to the four story mansion of steel magnate Andrew Carnegie. Cassie knew that James would recognize the address and she took the opportunity to explain her position. What he was assuming was true. She was Carnegie's illegitimate daughter. That's why coming across James in the lobby was so serendipitous. She needed a trusted friend and lawyer in this instance. Her father was very sensitive about who knew his secret. An illegitimate child could destroy his reputation. He was still a man of integrity, though. He set up a trust in her name. But she still had to make periodic trips to access it. As they pulled up to the mansion, Cassie hesitated. Actually, her father might not like the presence of someone he didn't already know and trust. It might be better if James waited here. Would that be alright? James said yes again. He couldn't very well say no. He watched Cassie ring the bell and a butler let her in without hesitation. From the carriage. James couldn't hear the conversation. Cassie had just asked to speak to the head housekeeper. Over the next 20 minutes, Cassie explained that she was thinking of hiring a new maid. And one of the maid's references was the Carnegie house. She was stopping by to check the applicant's references. Naturally, no such woman existed and neither did anyone by her name. The housekeeper told her as much. But still, Cassie managed to stretch the talk of housework to around 20 minutes, which was perfect. On the way back to the carriage where James, the lawyer, waited, Cassie slipped from her coat a big brown envelope containing two promissory notes for $250,000 and $500,000. Signed by Andrew Carnegie, plus securities valued at $5 million. She showed James its contents. It was a matter of weeks before James spread Cassie's secret all over Cleveland. Which was exactly what she'd been counting on him to do. Welcome to the Greatest True Crime stories ever told. I'm Mary Kay McBrayer. This is our episode about the great con woman of the Gilded Age. It's part two of the story of a woman who wanted into east coast high society and got there by deception. Join me for the second installment of this wild ride right after this break. When we last left Cassie, she had realized that diamonds had huge value. And not just in what someone would pay for them if they were buying. Jewels were what first lured her into conning when she was just a kid. But now that she had more or less made it into high society, they served more purpose than just luxury. Because Cassie had begun the promissory note scam again, she was passing them off at many banks. Or trying to. Big city banks were harder to swindle than small town Ones maybe simply because they dealt in bigger volume and so they had run across more fraud. Regardless of why, Cassie had to be prepared. When bankers first balked at a promissory note, she'd offer a diamond in addition. And they'd almost always take the note in that case, because who on earth would have a loose gemstone on hand except for a rich woman? When we left Cassie in last week's episode, she had been accumulating and smuggling jewels for her own personal use. And a customs agent had busted her on one piece of jewelry, which she had surrendered. And then she told everyone about the inconvenience. She even asked a few friends to write to the customs board on her behalf. Not only had she never smuggled jewels, she said, but any customs agent should know you don't owe duties on reset gems anyway. So they wrote for her. Not only did customs return her necklace on no evidence, only character references from other rich folks, but she also got agent William Theobald fired after being around ridiculous wealth the likes of which could just write a letter and get a federal agent fired. Cassie was realizing that sophistication wasn't just about being rich. As she studied her new friends, she uncovered that it wasn't just about having a lot. Everyone at this economic level had a lot. You had to have rare things, novelties, one of a kinds commissions, customs. So Cassie's interests got weird. Listen to this. She bought literal musical chairs, like they played songs when her guests sat down. Same with plates that played music when you picked them up. She also bought a pipe organ for her husband, Dr. Leroy Chadwick, to play in the basement. And Cassie bought the bed that President McKinley slept in the night before his assassination. She must have had a soft spot for him, since he's the one who had earlier shortened her prison sentence after that letter writing campaign. She was also very generous with her money. She not only gave her friends presents like seal skin coats or pianos, but she paid her servants very well, even giving them gifts like custom suits on special occasions. And of course, like any truly rich person, she donated to charities. That last part was especially important for the next part of her ruse. By early 1903, Leroy had recovered from his long fight with Roman fever and returned to Pennsylvania. Cassie sat him down in private and broke the news. She had a secret. It was important and he deserved to know. She confessed that she was the illegitimate daughter of Andrew Carnegie. Cassie told Leroy that it was a very important secret. She could ruin the great philanthropist's reputation if word ever circulated. And a reputation was very Important for a man of integrity like Carnegie. Leroy didn't breathe a word except to call over his longtime friend and banker, Erie Reynolds. If you remember in part one of this story, Eri was the friend who kind of endorsed Cassie to leroy before he proposed. He was the buddy who would tell him if he was making a mistake. Now, Erie was nearly as close to Cassie as he was. Leroy, his own children, thought of Cassie as their second mother. Erie arrived to their home and the Chadwicks passed him a stack of papers to sign for verification. As a banker, his signature would be recognized even if others on the forms were not. One paper was a note for $1,800 signed by Daniel Pine. If that name sounds new, that's because it is. Daniel Pine did not exist. Also, in good faith, erie signed a $3,400 mortgage on this fictional Pines home. I mean, imagine $3,400 for a house mortgage. Then there was another note, this time for $5 million. That surprised him a little. He knew Cassie had money, but he didn't know she had big money. And what surprised him even more was the signature at the bottom. It read, I, Andrew Carnegie, of New York City, New York, do hereby acknowledge that I hold in Trust for Ms. Cassie L. Chadwick, wife of Dr. Leroy S. Chadwick of 1824 Euclid Avenue, City of Cleveland, county of Cuyahoga county and State of Ohio. Property assigned and delivered to me. Property of the appraised value of $10,246,000. The note then detailed what the property was, and it included shares of Great Western Railway, the Caledonian Railway, as well as bonds of the United States Steel Corporation. And it agreed to pay all this over to Cassie semi annually. The trust had been enlisted to Cassie's legitimate uncle, and that uncle had carried it out as a mysterious benefactor until his death. Maybe I should pause here and remind you. Though Cassie made all of this up, she not only wasn't Andrew Carnegie's kid, but she didn't even have an uncle by the name she stated. Erie didn't suspect that. Not exactly. He did think the story was wild. But stranger things had happened than a tycoon of that caliber having an illegitimate child. Charles Schwab was a gambler. William Vanderbilt had a mistress. And it was an open secret that JP Morgan had many. Plus, Carnegie was known as a philanthropist. Just a couple of years ago, he'd written that a man who dies rich dies disgraced. If he did have an illegitimate child, this route seemed like a plausible one for him. Before the information really had the chance to sink in. The Chadwicks asked him the thing they'd brought him in for. They wanted Erie's bank to hold the original copies of the securities. And they wanted Erie to copy and sign the forms in case another bank came asking questions about Cassie's worth. Afterward, the whole package was sealed and vaulted at Erie's bank. And Cassie had in hand a receipt placing the full weight of the best bank in Cleveland behind her millions. Cassie used that receipt to her advantage. She went to Carnegie's friends asking for loans because she was sure that they would keep his secret for him. After all, it was far more likely that Carnegie, who had married late in life, had an illegitimate daughter during his early adulthood than that a nice, young, well bred woman like Cassie would forge all of this paperwork and forge it so legitimately. So she asked people like the lawyer for magnate Henry Clay Frick and the attorney for Henry Phipps Jr. In the same trip to New York where she'd convinced James Dillon that she was Carnegie's daughter, she gleaned $300,000 from Carnegie's friends. You might be wondering. And then what happened? Well, I'll tell you after the break.

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[Annie Reid]

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[Mary Kay McBrayer]

Charles Beckwith was 62 years old when he first encountered Cassie Chadwick. He was the president of Citizens national bank of Oberlin, Ohio, and he was well respected as well as somewhat resented. Charles had a reputation for denying loans. He was very careful and he had an eye for a good deal. When Cassie's representatives got in touch with Charles about a loan for her, they already had his ear because they'd been in business together for a long time. Again, who she knew proved to be crucial. Charles asked around about Cassie. It definitely seemed like she had money. She certainly spent freely and she seemed overall mystified by her finances. Basically, she was an easy target, or at least she seemed to be in person. Charles said the bank could loan her $6,000. Cassie pushed back almost stupidly that she needed almost double that 13,000. And he agreed. Look, as a principal, I avoid playing dumb because it perpetuates stereotypes about women in general. But Cassie really made that prejudice work for her. She repaid the debt, but it wasn't long before she was back asking for more. Charles often made extra side money doing private lending, so this time he made Cassie a personal loan. And then they became friends, at least in some capacity. Charles thought he was legally making money off her ineptitude. And Cassie knew she was making illegal money off his. It wasn't long before Cassie told him of her parentage. She showed him the receipt that Erie Reynolds had signed and she explained how her estate was currently administered by three men in New York. That was a lie. There were no three guys. And now she told Charles she thought maybe it was time to change up the administration, and she swore Charles to secrecy. She said when her contract with the three New York guys was up, which was also fake, she wanted to move her business to him in Oberlin. He drew up a contract double quick, and she signed it immediately. It guaranteed that before July 1, 1903, the Carnegie Trust must be turned over to him and he would receive a $40,000 bonus plus $10,000 per year while they managed her estate. With that contract as an assurance and Carnegie's signature as a guarantee against default, Charles went all in on loaning Cassie money. All the while, he thought he was taking advantage of her. Until July 1 came and went with no change. Cassie explained that she still intended to move the handling of her estate over to him, but she needed more time. Charles wrote that off as the cost of dealing with a mindless heiress. But Carnegie would come through. By fall of 1903, though, Charles was running very low on funds. He had $102,000 tied up in Cassie Chadwick. In today's money, that's about $3,218,000. And of course, Cassie needed more money. But he and his companion, Arthur Speer, couldn't just walk in and out of Oberlin's bank with a stack of cash for her. She couldn't write personal checks either, because she didn't have any money on deposit. So Charles provided her with certified bank checks. Three, actually. One for 12,500, one for 50,000, and one for 30,000. She deposited them all in a bank in Cleveland. I'm not really clear on why Charles Beckwith would throw good money after bad, except for that he maybe couldn't accept that it was bad money. After all, he had essentially signed away his retirement savings, and that couldn't have been an easy thing to come to terms with. His confirmation bias simply would not allow him to believe that he had made a bad investment of a lot of money. Of all his money, really. Still, when National Examiner Levi Miller came to Oberlin to check its records, Charles started to sweat. He tried to explain to Cassie that if Levi discovered the bank was missing $92,500, not only would he and Arthur lose their jobs, but the bank itself could be shut down. He needed her to repay that loan now. But Cassie played dumb and helpless. Charles repaid the bank loan out of his own funds, and she went on to swindle more professionals. It was a matter of time before she defaulted on a loan. Then There was a $28,800 loan from the American Exchange bank, and it was a secured loan. Specifically, it was a loan secured against her household furnishings. Now she had to go to court. And until they settled, $28,800 worth of her belongings now belonged to the bank. Cassie went to Charles Beckwith. For some reason that I can't fathom, Charles came to her rescue again. I have to assume it's severe denial on his part since she already owed him so much. He raised the $15,000 she needed, and she bought herself some time paying back the rest. Still, her creditor started to hound her. And she tried to explain that when you're this rich, you just couldn't get your hands on that kind of cash. Especially not when most of it was locked in a trust. She enlisted more lawyers, more bankers, more lenders, more loans. And she had herself covered until Levi Miller returned to Oberlin Bank. He told Charles that the bank had a hole of $227,500 and all of it had been loaned to CA Chadwick. Charles tried to explain that yes, that's what it looked like. But really, the bank was healthier than ever because those loans were secured. Over secured. Really. Levi was awestruck. Had Charles loaned this Mr. Chadwick 38 times the legal limit? Charles corrected him. They had loaned 38 times the legal limit to Mrs. Chadwick. The loan should have never been made, but especially not to a woman. Levi would have to report this to the Comptroller. November 1904 was the beginning of the end. Herbert Newton brought a lawsuit against her. And Cassie had listed Wade park bank as a party defendant. Newton told Erie he needed to see the securities. Erie himself said he'd never seen them and Cassie would not give permission for them to be unsealed. Cassie Chadwick and her debts then made the newspapers. That's what started the bank run. And then it got worse for everyone. Stay with us.

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[Annie Reid]

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[California Psychics]

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[Mary Kay McBrayer]

People who had entrusted their savings to Wade park bank read about Cassie Chadwick's scandals in the local paper. They knew how closely their bank was associated with her, and everyone rushed to the teller to withdraw their deposits. It was a disaster. The bank made it to closing without buckling, but it wouldn't last much longer. Soon after, the board of directors voted to suspend the business of Citizens national bank of Oberlin. When depositors came on Monday morning, they were met with a closed sign in the window. Her other creditors came knocking too, and that's when they started pushing for her to declare bankruptcy. Cassie assured her lawyers that none of this meant anything. It was just that these secret financial matters took a while. Plus, they realized their position. If they pushed her too hard, they'd lose everything. If the bank seized what she had or tied her assets up in court, she would not only lose her own wealth, but she'd also lose the money they lent to her. The rationalization is crazy, but it's almost like they had to spend more money to earn back the money that was technically already theirs. And that is why rich people have rebranded debt as leverage. Meanwhile, Cassie's renown was spreading. And it finally met the ears of Andrew Carnegie himself. His personal secretary broke the news. Carnegie naturally wanted no part of it. Even to deny such a claim as an illegitimate daughter was to acknowledge it in some way. He ignored the slander for as long as he could, but when it didn't go away on its own, he issued an official statement. On November 29, 1904, quote, Mr. Carnegie read this report and pronounced it absurd. Mr. Carnegie does not know the woman at all. But his denial convinced no one. Probably because they didn't want to be convinced. Their own fortunes were on the line. Oberlin bank was meanwhile under fire by a federal prosecutor, Robert Lyons. Charles and Arthur's names were on everything. Everything Robert saw suggested they had been misappropriating funds for Cassie Chadwick for years. He couldn't prosecute state crimes like forgery if Carnegie's name had been forged. And he couldn't blame Cassie for misappropriating bank funds. She didn't work at the bank. She had basically run the bank for two years, but she didn't work there, so she couldn't be charged with its destruction. Right. And Cassie did what any high society lady would do at a moment like this. She fell ill. Of course, that was just a tactical retreat. That her doctor diagnosed her with an antiquated term for anxiety should come as no surprise to any listener, though she had defrauded multiple banks and they were now all coming to collect. Of course, she had some anxiety. Actually, when the marshal showed up to serve her in her hotel room, where she rested, she said, I don't want to hear it. I don't want to hear it. Man, if only that line worked for avoiding news you don't want. He served her a warrant for her arrest. Madam, he said, you needn't be alarmed. It's not as bad as it might be. Cassie Chadwick was ultimately charged for conspiracy to misapply the funds of the Citizens national bank of Oberlin, even though it was technically a charge that only bankers could commit. Charles Beckwith knew the jig was up when he heard about her arrest. If Cassie hadn't been able to save herself, she wouldn't be able to save him either. He was ready to make a full confession now that he knew he had lost his entire fortune. Meanwhile, Erie's lawyer unsealed the securities. They were worthless. She had forged Carnegie's signature. One would think at this point it would be time for Cassie to give up the ghost. But she was tenacious. When a reporter asked if she had a comment, she said, it has done me much good to have so many letters and telegrams from so many of my friends as have reached me here. And she swore to repay all the money. She thought surely one of those friends that she'd been so generous to would jump at the chance to repay her kindness. Even as they took her to the Tombs, New York City's prisoners, she thought for sure that someone would come to her rescue. There were plenty of men who didn't want her in prison. She was in the Tombs when she read that Erie had opened the securities and the bubble had burst. In the article, the reporter noted, the errors are not gross, but are such as a lawyer, doctor or educated man would not make. I know the writer meant that as an insult and her fraud is certainly unethical and needed to be punished. But it is quite a testament to how much someone will overlook when they think it benefits them or when they're hearing what they want to hear. Basically, a small town woman had defrauded her way into high society by using the confidence of one rich man to bolster the next. And she had done it for years. Ultimately, neither of the banks ever reopened. Her husband, Leroy, was shocked at the fraud. Even though he did not participate in it, he had suffered its consequences. Unlike with her first husband, Cassie had accrued these debts while she was married to Leroy. So he was responsible for them. And I don't want to point fingers here because sweet Leroy certainly did not deserve to lose his family home or all his wealth. But this is why you need a prenup agreement, y'all, because you are signing one. When you get married, it's just a matter of whether you want to write up your own terms or default to the ones that the government decided for you. Not only had Leroy lost everything, but his daughter had also lost the inheritance from her biological mother. The families of the other people that Cassie swindled suffered as well, especially Charles Beckwith's widow and children at his subsequent death. Let's talk about what Andrew Carnegie did. He is really unaffiliated with this scandal, besides being rich and famous. And yet. A pastor in Oberlin wrote to Carnegie about the bank closing. So many people lost their savings, he said, but among them were many students. Many of them were black students who needed the money for their Education. Carnegie saw this opportunity as a moment to practice what he preached. Those students had been hit with a hardship that was truly through no fault of their own. He wrote back asking for a list of the students and townsfolk who had been affected. He specified to leave off the businessmen, though, because they could take care of themselves. Carnegie sent a check for $15,000 for the pastor to disperse. He also noticed that Oberlin College had requested funds for a new library three years earlier. He had rejected the request then, like he rejected most university libraries. But now he donated $125,000 to help them in their hour of need. Cassie was ultimately finally convicted on the conspiracy charges. She was sentenced to 10 years in prison and all her appeals were denied. Before she was transferred in, though, she was allowed to collect $3,000 worth of possessions from her former home. With those, she decorated her prison cell. And now I'm excited to share this talk I had with Annie Reed, author of the Impostor Heiress, Cassie Chadwick, the great grifter of the Gilded Age. Here it is, foreign. Hey, Annie, thank you so, so much for coming to talk to me about Cassie Chadwick. Real excited to get your take on this imposter eras. Congratulations on your book release. So you're a historian. Can you tell us about your research methods and what kind of hacks you can share with, like normal people who like historical crime and how did they apply to Cassie Chadwick? So it was like a three part thing, right?

[Annie Reid]

First of all, I want to say thanks so much for having me. I love your podcast. It was with Cassie, it was very much a learning curve and I feel like I know so much more now than when I started researching. It was a lot of newspaper articles, just hundreds of pages. I have an outline that's 270 plus pages of just outline the newspaper articles from the different times that she was in trouble. Basically. She made the news a lot. There is also I went and read a bunch of her letters at the Cleveland Historical Society. It was really cool to like hold things where her name was signed on the bottom and a lot of vital records, like census records, city directories, blue books, things like that. But I feel like now I have a good idea of different online archives that like actually have like Google Books. If you go to Google Books, there's a lot of really old books that have just been digitized. And I got to read these two different memoirs of go government officials who had dealt with her case and they talked about her case in their books. So it was so cool to read it. From the other side, yeah.

[Mary Kay McBrayer]

Oh, that sounds fascinating. I remember in one interview that I think just came out, her stationary was really expensive. Like, she had them embossed.

[Annie Reid]

Yes. Clc. Yeah, they had her initials, like, embossed on the top. It was so cool.

[Mary Kay McBrayer]

That is really cool. So do you have any favorite newspaper archives that I can use your methods for?

[Annie Reid]

Well, okay, so when you're just diving into something, the place I always go is the Library of Congress. So they have, like, all. It's totally free and, like, searchable by keyword. And, like, you can do combinations of keywords that are, like, within 50 words, within 100 words, then five words. I needed to go to. I needed the Cleveland specific newspaper articles. So those were the Plain Dealer and the Cleveland Leader, and those were all digitized as well.

[Mary Kay McBrayer]

Speaking of the newspapers that you found in the articles, there's one line that really stuck out to me, like, after she got really busted. For real. For real. Which. And I can't remember exactly what. Where it was, but the quote was, the errors are not gross, but are such as a lawyer, doctor, or educated man would not make. And I. I think that was supposed to embarrass her, but she tricked so many of them, like, right. Like, I kind of liked her because she was better at the game than the guys who had all of the access to the education and were able to put it into use. And she just gamed them, like, better than her. So I wanted to confirm, like, she really had no formal training, right?

[Annie Reid]

Absolutely not. No. She had this, like, she went to the local village school for, like, grade school, and then that was it.

[Mary Kay McBrayer]

And then how do you think she was able to do it, like, without access to all of these, like, anything? How did she do it, do you think?

[Annie Reid]

Part of it.

She was just absolutely a natural con artist. She was so smart. She just picked up on things really quickly. I. I read this quote at my launch party. That was this society guy who later said that, like, if you talk to her, she'd be able to talk about, like, you know, foreign affairs, art, literature, as though she'd been learning about these things her whole life. And she just picked up on them from being in the same room with people or probably reading books. I don't really know about that, but she picked up on things very quickly. So I think that was part of this. Picking up on banking and, like, legal jargon and stuff like that. She also was running these cons from when she was, like, 21 years old. So I think she gets a little more Sophisticated each time, and she's learning and developing as she goes along.

[Mary Kay McBrayer]

That makes sense to me, too, because she. You'd have to be somewhat naturally intuitive to do. To be like a clairvoyant. You know, like, she just observes things about people and, like, tells it back to them. Right. Which is.

[Annie Reid]

Yes.

[Mary Kay McBrayer]

Also kind of like a great stepping stone into con artistry, I guess.

[Annie Reid]

Yeah, absolutely. I mean, it really honed her skills of like, walking into a room with strangers and, like, being able to read them and talk to them.

[Mary Kay McBrayer]

So how famous was she? Both as like, a con artist and as just like this Persona of Cassie Chadwick. Like, how recognizable was her name? Because she changed it a few times.

[Annie Reid]

So when you got busted as Cassie Chadwick, people remembered her prior bust and they didn't know that she was that person, Madame de Vere from. From Toledo. But they remembered that case because it made Cleveland newspapers. And Cleveland was very. There are these very snotty little diatribes in the paper about how, like, well, these Toledo bankers don't know what's going on. And then she just does the same thing under a different name. And as Kensie Chadwick, she's decently well known in Cleveland for just. She was a very eccentric shopper. She was throwing money around because she wanted everyone to know that she had this endless supply of money. And then she was going to these balls and parties. So she was pretty well known in Cleveland for sure. And then afterwards, obviously, she was just national headlines every day for like a month, basically.

[Mary Kay McBrayer]

Right, I guess that makes sense. Like, you would remember the person who bought the musical plates. Like, you would remember that would be.

[Annie Reid]

Yeah, well, clerks, they would fight over who got to wait on her because she was so generous and she bought so much. So they got really big commissions. And then, like, she would also sometimes just buy extra things for these department store girls because she was throwing money around. So they would kind of fight with each other to see who could wait on Cassie Chadwick.

[Mary Kay McBrayer]

Oh, my gosh. I would have 100% gotten in, like, a hair pulling fight to be able to, like, go with all of her weird aesthetics and weird wants. So once she went down, what did they do? Like, how did they react? Does it seem like they had much of a reaction? But I know they had to have, Right.

[Annie Reid]

I think Cleveland society really kind of tried to ignore it. I think there was a lot of just not addressing the entire thing. I know there were a lot of men who she borrowed money from who just kind of quietly took the loss. They didn't want to be connected with her. They didn't want to be embarrassed. It definitely would have been a social faux pas to, like, have held a ball and invited this woman who was an ex convict and she came to your house and, you know, had lunch or whatever. There was a financial embarrassment and a social embarrassment, I think. Although there were some society women who attended her trial on one of the days, they made a note that these society ladies came to watch.

[Mary Kay McBrayer]

Is there anything you came across in your research that you wanted to include in the book but couldn't really corroborate enough to be like, yes, this is the facts. Is there any, like, anecdote that you wish you could have included but couldn't necessarily factually get behind all the way or support?

[Annie Reid]

So in the introduction of my book, and then, like, later on, I come back to the story full circle, but she takes this lawyer to this. To the Carnegie mansion and goes inside the Carnegie mansion for a little while and comes out and she's trying to make him think. Think that she went to see Daddy and get his signature on her. On her legal document. But what she does inside the Carnegie mansion, in later accounts, I would read a couple places that, oh, she talked to the servants and said, I'm a society lady and this maid is applying to work at my house. She gave you guys as a reference. So I. I'm coming to check on that. And that was what she said when she was in there. But the only stories I got about that, like, from the time of when she was busted, like, the earliest stories were a lot more bare bones than that. And I didn't feel like I could actually include what she did in the Carnegie house in the book, even though, like, I think that's a plausible thing to say. But I think that story kind of popped up later and kind of apart from the lawyer telling the story to the newspapers at the time.

[Mary Kay McBrayer]

Right. Because he wouldn't have known what happened either. He assumed.

[Annie Reid]

No.

[Mary Kay McBrayer]

That she was telling the truth. Right.

[Annie Reid]

No. Yeah.

[Mary Kay McBrayer]

Right. Okay. Is there anything I should have asked you about that I didn't. That you want to talk about that you have. That you don't get asked a lot about the book.

[Annie Reid]

One thing that I love talking about with Cassie Chadwick that people don't know as much about is that she was this pretty prolific jewel smuggler as well. So when she was Cassie Chadwick, she would go to Europe all the time, because that's what you did. You vacationed in Europe and she would bring over jewels, and she didn't want to pay the 10% duties on them. So she would hide them when she was coming over. She would not declare them to customs officials and then you just would not be paying the duties. And she actually the US government caught on in 1902 and they were surveilling her and trying to catch her and she ends up getting caught and having to like turn to her like network of friends in high places to get her out of it. And I just thought that was so fascinating and it's just not something that's talked about in too many places.

[Mary Kay McBrayer]

It is fascinating because she could afford it. Like she could afford the customers duty. She just didn't want to. She doesn't want to pay it. Yeah.

[Annie Reid]

No, no.

[Mary Kay McBrayer]

That's awesome. Where can our listeners find your work? Where's the best place to do it? And where can they follow you to see what you're doing next?

[Annie Reid]

So my book is pretty much everywhere online where books are being sold. Amazon, Barnes and Noble, Thrift books. And you can look at my website, ww authorany reid.com or follow me on Twitter. It's underscore Annie Reid. And then my Facebook is just Author Annie Reid.

[Mary Kay McBrayer]

Well, thank you again so much for coming to talk to us about Cassie Chadwick. Annie, can't wait to see what you do next. And I hope that this book is wildly successful because I loved it.

[Annie Reid]

Thank you.

[Mary Kay McBrayer]

Join me next week on the Greatest True Crime Stories Ever Told for our episode on the Criminal Cremators. David Scotts was the third generation in a family funeral home business and he was anxious to revolutionize the business business to maximize their profits. So he turned to some unorthodox criminal methods, all of which he might have shied away from if they hadn't been endorsed by his mother. I'd like to shout out a few key sources that made it possible for me to tell this week's story, especially Annie Reed's book, the Imposter Heiress, Cassie Chadwick, the Greatest Grifter of the Gilded Age. We also got a lot of information from Karen Abbott's Smithsonian article, the High Priestess of Fraudulent Finance. Both of them and all our other sources are linked in our show notes. The Greatest True Crime Stories Ever Told is a production of Diversion Audio. I'm Mary Kay McBrayer and I hosted this episode. I also wrote this episode. Our show is produced by Emma Demuth and edited by Antonio Enriquez. Theme music by Tyler Cash, executive produced by Scott Waxman.

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