S3E3: Spyfall, Sparks & the Papasians

Summary

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The Havoc Rundown

S3E3: Spyfall, Sparks & the Papasians

Date: February 19, 2026
Host: Hunter Bro Studios (Justin et al.)
Guests: Julian and Dima Papazian
Theme: An in-depth, playful, and sometimes chaotic dive into the new NHRL season, “control bot” controversy, the Papasian siblings’ journey, branding, and spicy community moments—plus a long-awaited pizza debate.

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Episode Overview

Season 3, Episode 3 of The Havoc Rundown features an exuberant breakdown of the recent 2026 NHRL opener and dives deep into both the competitive and cultural sides of combat robotics. The hosts are joined by the infamous sibling builder team Julian (of Meiko) and Dima Papazian (of Turbo Fiend), two crowd-favorite competitors known for their lively personalities and strong opinions. This episode balances technical discussion (esp. new judging rules for control bots), playful banter, spirited games, community listener questions, and a hearty exploration of bot design philosophy (and pizza).

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Key Segments & Timestamps

• [00:52] Season Opener & Guest Welcome
• [03:22] Game Corner: “Spyfall” Robot Edition
• [22:42] Five in Focus: Interview Segment
  • Pizza, Connecticut food, Stage Performers, Evil Robot Identities, Global Events
• [77:47] Listener Mailbag
• [110:29] Expressive Aesthetics & Community Influence
• [115:29] Havoc Inside the Arena: Worldwide Event Recap
• [117:45] Closing Reflections

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Detailed Breakdown

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1. Kicking Off: NHRL 2026 Recap & Papasian Welcome

[00:52]

• Host Justin welcomes listeners back, hyping the “aftermath of the first qualifying event of the 2026 NHRL season” as “full of shake ups, surprises and signature chaos.”
• Guests: Julian and Dima Papazian, introduced as a legendary, energetic sibling team with credits behind fan-favorite bots Meiko (Julian) and Turbo Fiend (Dima).
• Early banter about name pronunciations and cursing on the show sets a playful tone.

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2. Game Corner: “Spyfall” – Combat Robotics Edition

[03:22 – 22:38]

• Ryan introduces a podcast-first: Spyfall, adapted for combat robots. Each player either gets the name of a secret robot or is the “spy” trying to guess it.
• Hilarious and often offbeat cross-questioning ensues (“Do you know my boy Andy Capp?”), with betrayals, alliances, and confusion—Julian and Dima combine cunning strategy, deadpan humor, and sibling rivalry.
  • Quote:
    • "This is like Among Us, but yes, it is very Among Us." – Ryan [05:42]
    • "I think he might be the spy. I'm not locking it in, but that's kind of suspicious." – Julian [07:29]
• Two rounds are played; plenty of baiting and misdirection.
  • Memorable moment: Justin wins as spy in the first round without being suspected ([14:44]).

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3. Five in Focus: Deep-Dive Interview

[22:42 – 60:11]

a. Pizza and Connecticut (and food culture tangent)

[23:21 – 32:12]

• Ashley’s question: “Favorite pizza place in Old Lyme area?”
• Julian and Dima express impassioned, detailed opinions on local pizza, New Haven vs. New York vs. Greek styles, and personal pizza memories.
  • Quote:
    • “I am very opinionated about pizza in Connecticut...there are a lot of pizza places that use pre-made dough, and I don’t know how they get any business...” – Julian [23:21]
    • “I think the more burnt is better...Frank Pepe’s is not cooked in the oven high enough.” – Dima [26:22]
• Veers into discussion of the legendary Little Rendezvous (Meriden), Louis’ Lunch, and ethnic/local food rivalries.
  • Quote:
    • "The burger’s just like mama used to make…that’s what people want." – Thomas [30:31]

b. Rule Changes & The Fate of Control Bots

[32:12 – 51:49]

• New judging rules at NHRL and their serious impact on control-focused bots like Meiko.
  • Julian: “With the new rules, like, I’m literally not going to fight Meiko under these rules…Sometimes a mess up and I think this is a mess up…” [32:41]
  • Dima (on parallels with MMA/fighting game “patches”): “It’s like they removed grappling out of MMA…It’s not breaking bad news, but it’s a change I am now the face of.” [35:58]
  • Debate includes whether judges’ learning curve is the issue or if rules are the issue (“growing pains”).
• Devil’s advocate—crowd and broadcast excitement considered.
  • Quote:
    • "Flamethrowers are played out and I don’t love them anymore. I’m so sorry." – Ryan [50:42]
    • “One of the most exciting fights in any combat sport are when you have a huge power striker and somebody’s going to try to outskill them...these rules are just encouraging a lot more power strikers.” – Julian [51:06]

c. Secret Question: Stage Performers & Amusement Rides

[52:03 – 55:00]

• Favorite historical stage performer? Julian instantly answers Houdini.
  • Quote:
    • ("I’m a big Houdini head. I believe his real name is Eric Weiss...") – Julian [52:20]
• Amusement rides: The Houdini ride at Six Flags is a shared favorite.

d. Dream Events & Global Combat Robotics

[55:18 – 58:55]

• Where would you go? Julian: Robot Wars UK (“even if the bots are crummy, it’s so much fun...”).
• Dima wants to attend crazy UK beetleweight events for their wild arenas.

e. Secret Bot Identities & Theatrics

[63:40 – 72:34]

• If you could secretly run another bot, what would you do?
  • Julian plots a pro-wrestling-style “mask” alt-identity for Meiko, complete with Discord sock-puppet accounts.
    • “...I already have alt Discord accounts…pretending to sell Meiko and then someone else shows up driving it. That would be me under a luchador mask, of course.” [64:56]
  • Dima wants to be a “wretched monster with a lifter in 3, 12, and 30 pound classes, full villain mode.”
• Discussion of the challenge of being an “evil persona” in such a welcoming community.

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4. Listener Mailbag: Questions from the Community

[77:47 – 115:00]

• Nick (Crafty Cat Combat): Teases Papasians about bots with no vowels (“Have you ever considered renaming your robots MK and TRBFND...?”)
  • “This is a bad guy right here, and this is why we’re not friends.” – Julian [80:11]
• Announcing vs. Competing:
  • Dima: “People don’t understand how hard it is to do commentary for hours and hours and stay interesting...The hardest part is you don’t get to just have dead air.” [81:57]
  • The value of builder insights for commentators, builder sheets, and research.
• Sibling Rivalry:
  • If you competed in something outside robots or video games, who would win? Both land on a cooking contest.
    • “Obviously, I’m going to poison you.” – Dima [87:09]
• Bot Branding, Colors & Simplicity:
  • "Making big pieces of plastic that are easy to repair...lends itself to a bright, toy-like design." – Dima [105:03]
  • “We don’t know how to do belts or gears...It’s not really a joke, it’s just true.” – Julian [109:07]
• Spotlight & Visibility:
  • “It means a lot when young kids come up to me and say, ‘Your robot’s so cool; can I get a picture?’...especially for nerds like us, having a sport like this where you can be yourself.” – Julian [111:57]
  • Dima: “NHRL was one of the first times in my life where I was out as myself...I expected to be Julian’s sidekick, but we have different roles now, and I’m visible for something outside of even just competing by his side.” [112:58]
  • Emotional, candid segment highlighting the inclusive heart of the community.

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5. Havoc Inside the Arena: Global Results & Recap

[115:29 – 117:45]

• Recap of global event winners from NHRL to Latvia, highlights the reach and diversity of the combat robotics world.

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Notable Quotes & Moments

• On NHRL rule changes:
  “Sometimes I mess up and I think this is a mess up...without getting too much into this, I feel like this makes control-focused robots not...it’s not clear how you are supposed to drive them and the rules sort of encourage you to drive them unintelligently.” – Julian [34:56]

• On Attitude as Competing Siblings:
  “Julian is like, ‘I’m evil, I’m evil,’ and I’m like, ‘I’m going to poison you,’ and you’re like, ‘It’s fine.’” – Dima [87:45]

• On Theatrics and Community:
  “I feel like a lot of times the best robot builders treat it like chess...But it’s a coliseum, you know what I mean? Like, yeah, be crazy. They’re gladiators.” – Julian [67:57]

• On Influence & Representation:
  “It just means a lot...being an influence...where it’s okay to be weird; it’s okay to have fun and still compete your heart out.” – Julian [111:57]
  “NHRL was one of the first times in my life where I was out as myself...and it’s a really beautiful thing to be seen.” – Dima [112:58]

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Episode Highlights

• Spyfall Game: Social deduction game brings out the Papasians’ banter, reveals podcast crew dynamics, and injects a party-game vibe into the robotics scene.
• Judging Rules Deep Dive: One of the most thorough, candid dissections of judging changes, balancing technical detail and lived experience; draws analogies with MMA/fighting games.
• Food & Pizza Rants: Hilariously earnest and heated; a love letter to Connecticut’s food scene.
• Listener Interactions: Rich, varied, and unscripted discussion ranging from robot design choices to how it feels to become a role model in such a unique community.
• Authenticity & Emotion: The episode’s candid, emotional moments—particularly as the Papasians discuss visibility and community—are both affecting and inspiring.

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For New Listeners: Why This Episode Matters

This episode is a quintessential Havoc Rundown—nerdy, inclusive, and thoroughly in love with combat robotics and its community. It’s as much about technical innovation as it is about humanity and joy. Whether you care about rule minutiae, robot lore, pizza science, or you’re simply seeking two hours of witty, whip-smart sibling sparring, this episode delivers.

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Listen for:

• The most epic discussions of pizza, robots, and sibling rivalry you’ll find anywhere.
• Hot takes on the controversial “control bot nerf” with both strategy and heart.
• How to become a “character” and crowd favorite in robotics—intentionally or not.
• Community Q&A with laugh-out-loud stories (the “chicken parm incident,” [100:27]) and honest thoughts on what it’s like to be out, visible, and “weird” in a sport that loves you back.

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“It’s okay to be weird, it’s okay to have fun, and still compete your heart out.” – Julian [111:57]

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End of Summary

Transcript

[A]

Sam.

[B]

Welcome back to the HAVOC rundown. I'm your host, Justin, and tonight we're diving into the aftermath of the first qualifying event of the 2026 NHL season, which took place on February 7th. From wild upsets to dominant runs, this was a stack event full of shake ups, surprises and signature chaos. And to help us unpack it all, we funded two of the most iconic and chaotic forces in the NHL universe, or Combat Robotics universe as a whole. Julian and Dima Papazian.

[C]

Right.

[B]

I said your name. I say your name all the time, and I feel like I say 100%.

[A]

Right.

[C]

Okay.

[B]

Awesome. Beautiful.

[D]

That was, like, better than I could do.

[B]

You might know Julian from the energetic chance behind Meiko or Dima from the fiery madness of Turbo Fiend. But together, they're one of the most recognizable and entertaining sibling teams in the entire scene. From bold bot branding to bold desk takes, they've been part of every corner of the NHL experience, and we're excited to hear their take on the season kickoff. So welcome Julia Nadima. We are so excited to have you on. Thank you for being here.

[D]

Heck yeah. I'm very excited too. Can I curse? How many curse words in my life? I'm just kidding.

[E]

Fiddlesticks.

[C]

Yeah, like, oh, shoot. Like, yeah.

[A]

What the.

[D]

Sorry, I interrupted you, Dima already.

[B]

If you can't control yourself, I can go back through and. And correct any of really bad ones, but it's fine.

[C]

By the way, high rain.

[B]

He did so well during the fantasy draft, but we'll. We'll get to that a little bit later. Okay, so joining me, as always, for the is the rundown crew. We are minus Ashley tonight, but with me in the studio is the game master, Ryan Hunter.

[C]

Hello.

[B]

Our chaos conduit, Thomas Carroll.

[E]

Marty is a great robot and we need more of them and set them free so they can roam in the

[D]

field

[B]

if anybody doesn't know what he's talking about. Who don't have Stop and Shops near them. It's the Stop and Shop cleanup robot and the webmaster, Tony Baker.

[F]

Hello, everybody.

[B]

Okay, so we are going to kick it off by going over to our favorite little corner of the podcast, and Ryan has a game that I'm very excited for that we've seen across social media, but I don't think we've ever seen it done with Combat Robotics. So we're going to head over to Ryan's game corner.

[C]

So. So tell us what we're doing. So, originally I was going to do a wrestling thing, but Ashley would kill me if I did it without her. So we're not doing wrestling stuff tonight. So instead, we're going to do something that I've been thinking about for a little while. We're going to play spyfall. If you guys don't know how to play Spyfall, Spyfall is a very fun game. So this is how it goes. One of you is the spy. The rest of you all know a secret code word. In this case, the code will be the name of one specific combat robot. I'm going to DM everybody the code word, and the spy will be just DM'd. Spy. So please have your discord open.

[D]

I don't think I'm the spy.

[C]

Oh, Yeah, I haven't DM'd you yet. I haven't DM'd you yet.

[E]

All right, he doesn't know.

[C]

So at this point, the spy does not know which robot it is. Their job is to figure it out. Now, everybody else knows what the. What the robot is. So in order to find the spy, we are all going to ask each other questions, except for me. I'm just going to be the game master. I'll be out outside.

[B]

We're going to ask questions, or we're going to say, usually as you say, a word that's related.

[C]

No, no, no. So you're going to each take turns asking each other questions. You cannot directly ask for the name of the robot, of course. You can ask smart questions, though. If you're not the spy, you want to answer in a way that proves that you know the bot to everybody else without giving away what the robot is. You don't want to look suspicious or anything like that, but the spy wants to figure out what the robot is. We will go with two questions each. So we're all going to go through one question, and then we'll start again another round with another question, and then at the end of that, we will all vote to figure out who the spy is. All right. At any time, though, the spy can interrupt the proceedings, guess the name of the robot. If they are correct, they win the round. If they are incorrect, instantly done. Instantly lost.

[E]

Okay, you know the name. If you just say the name of the robot, then you can just throw the whole game.

[D]

That's why if you ask questions, you got to make sure you know you're not too direct. Yeah, this is tricky. This is like Among Us, but yes,

[C]

it is very among us. Yes. Yes. All right, does anyone have any questions? About what? About the game. Does everyone understand?

[F]

Sure. We'll figure it out.

[A]

I think so.

[C]

Okay, All Right. So I'm going to set it up by dming everybody.

[E]

It's a good thing that we're allowed to say mako Right.

[A]

Now. I have one crazy question.

[C]

What?

[A]

What if when you are told the robot and you're not the spy, you just say. You just guess it instantly and say I spy. And then if somebody. Nobody can challenge you on it, and then somebody else has to say, wait, but I got the spy in the. Excuse me. In the web app.

[G]

And.

[A]

And then who do you believe then?

[G]

That's the true second layer among us.

[A]

Part of it. Oh, God.

[G]

On that later.

[C]

All right, we should be set up. Everybody should have received a message. All right, we can begin.

[A]

The secret robot is Chainsaw Kitty.

[C]

I'll tell you what, Thomas. You have the first question. You pick one person.

[E]

I pick one person. Ask them one question. Yes, Julian, what'd you have for dinner tonight?

[D]

I actually had a single bag of Andy Capp's hot fries. And that's all I ate today. Shout out my boy, Andy Cap.

[A]

Hmm. You know Andy? Do you know Andy?

[E]

They're delicious.

[D]

I guess I can ask. No, Andy, that's not my question. They are delicious.

[C]

All right. That's how Thomas decided to spin the first question. All right, Julian, don't ask a question. Fix. Somebody ask a question. All right.

[D]

Thomas, do you know my boy Andy Cap?

[E]

I have no idea who he is.

[D]

Oh, my God. I think he might be the spy. I'm not locking it in, but that's kind of suspicious.

[A]

Ryan's like, oh, yeah.

[F]

This is gonna be yours.

[D]

Does anyone know who Andy Cap is?

[A]

Me. I handed you the bag of hot dog earlier.

[D]

All right, sorry.

[B]

And now we know who Andy Cap.

[A]

It's a weird spy check to have to answer. But I know who Andy Gaff is.

[D]

Okay, Thomas, do you like this robot?

[E]

What robot?

[G]

The robot.

[E]

The what? Andy Cap.

[D]

I mean, like. No, the robot. The robot.

[E]

Oh, wait. Yeah, yeah. I'm not a spy. I actually love the robot.

[C]

Yeah. Thomas. Thomas is either screwing with this game or playing it very well.

[E]

I don't know which one it is supposed to work.

[D]

Jeopardy May have gone better for.

[A]

You're letting Thomas. Who's lying? You, by the way, fatal.

[B]

Yeah.

[C]

All right, Thomas, you have a second question. Thanks. So, buddy.

[E]

Tony. Wait. Am I supposed to ask a question about the robot?

[C]

Yes, you're supposed to. So basically the point is the question

[F]

to determine if I'm the spy.

[C]

Yeah.

[F]

Unless you're the spy. Then you have no idea.

[E]

Tony, do you like the color scheme of this Robot. It's pretty good.

[F]

Yeah, I know. There's some other ones that are better, though.

[E]

Yeah, well, yeah, I guess.

[C]

All right, Tony, is your question.

[F]

I'm gonna ask Justin.

[C]

Okay.

[E]

Oh, no, not Justin.

[F]

Let's see. Do you know what sound this robot makes?

[B]

Loud.

[C]

I. I feel like there's a valid answer. I don't. Yeah, I mean, I'm trying to play how.

[D]

I'm trying to play how.

[B]

How I've seen it played before where. Where it's usually like a one word answer or everyone says like one word about, like, so. No, that's how you don't give enough information away. You're supposed to be able to answer without giving enough information away.

[A]

When you gave the answer, I thought to myself, not bad. But I don't know if I'm supposed to judge your answer.

[D]

Yeah, well, most robots are allowed, so

[B]

I guess for this one.

[C]

All right, Justin, is your question.

[B]

Thomas kind of stole my color question. I mean, so Thomas.

[C]

No, don't ask Thomas. Thomas is out. Thomas has asked two questions.

[D]

Okay.

[C]

What do you mean?

[F]

I am.

[B]

Oh, great answer, Julian. Well, I don't know if this would. In one word, how would you describe this bot's fighting style?

[D]

Chaotic. All right, so now it's my question.

[C]

Yep. Yep. Julian, your second question.

[D]

I think I know who the spy is already. I'm not gonna. But here we go. Dima.

[G]

Yeah?

[D]

Would you consider this robot angelic or evil?

[G]

100 evil.

[D]

Okay.

[A]

And I'm the best judge of it.

[D]

Okay.

[A]

Sorry. They said something about Turbofane being chaotic flames earlier, and I got excited.

[D]

Well, that's true.

[C]

I. I thought. I thought about doing one of your robots and I was like, no, I'm not gonna do it. I'm gonna take those off. It is not Mako are either. I was thinking about doing spy and then having Julia be the by doing Mako, but it's not. What's going on?

[A]

Does Julian ask a second question or do I ask a question now?

[C]

No, you ask a question now. You are on your first question thinking,

[A]

I can't ask Thomas another question. I just want to be sure.

[E]

That's so lame.

[G]

I just want to be sure.

[A]

Thomas, you tripped me up on that.

[E]

I should definitely be able to answer a question. This is. I'm being oppressed.

[C]

I think you have to go to one of the ones that haven't had their second question yet.

[A]

Ryan.

[C]

No, no, no, not me. No, no, no, no. I know who this guy is.

[B]

The house can't win this one.

[C]

No.

[A]

Did not realize.

[G]

Justin Yep.

[A]

I don't even think it's you.

[G]

So this is just a test.

[A]

Yes or no, would you describe this robot as skeletal?

[B]

Yes.

[G]

Boom.

[C]

Okay, imagine having.

[A]

Imagine having a clear answer to that. You know what the robot is?

[C]

Justin, you could either go back to Tony or Dima.

[B]

I think we'll go to Tony, and then Tony last. Dima, I think that's how we'll do this.

[C]

Yep.

[B]

Tony, is this a bot you would draft?

[F]

Yes. Okay. Dima.

[C]

Okay.

[F]

Have you fought this bot?

[A]

Ooh, that's a.

[G]

That's a. Oh, man.

[C]

I am unsure of this answer. I'm sure Dima knows the answer.

[B]

Dima knows the answer.

[G]

So I've.

[A]

I was a mini bot. Does that count?

[C]

I think that counts. I think that counts.

[D]

Hey, we fall, like, 100 times, so that's.

[F]

Yeah, I think it's hard.

[C]

Dima, you have one last question you can ask of anybody you want.

[A]

Thinking. I feel like nobody's asking technical questions. Do people get hyped for this robot? And that one goes to Julian.

[D]

What's funny is I was just involved in a conversation where they did not get as much hype on Saturday as they normally do, and it was kind of strange, but overall, big time. Big time.

[G]

All right, I think.

[C]

Wait. Nope. We are done. Those are two questions each.

[D]

Sorry.

[C]

Now we go into voting.

[E]

Yes.

[C]

All right, the plurality votes for the spy. All right. If the spy is picked, the spy can still win by telling us what the name of the robot is.

[B]

Nice.

[C]

All right. Okay, so I'm going to start with Dima. What is your vote?

[A]

I vote Thomas.

[C]

Okay, there's one vote for Thomas. Justin, what is your vote?

[B]

Mine's for Thomas as well, but Thomas's face.

[C]

Okay, Thomas, what is your vote?

[E]

Y' all are getting played like a fiddle. It's Tony.

[G]

Yeah.

[C]

Okay, Tony, what is your voice? Your vote? So far, we. We have two for Thomas, one for Tony.

[F]

I'm gonna go with Thomas.

[E]

See?

[C]

3. Thomas.

[E]

That's what a spy would say.

[C]

Julian.

[A]

Julian.

[E]

Even though we can't win, you can at least show your support.

[D]

I can at least show my support. And I will say that Tony didn't answer instantly about the fantasy thing. And I know, like, for anyone, that's an instant yes. So I'm voting Tony.

[C]

Okay, that's two. Tony.

[D]

But it's probably Thomas. It's probably Thomas.

[C]

So we have a plurality towards Thomas. All right, so will the spy reveal themselves by making a guess of what the robot is?

[B]

Anubis.

[C]

Oh, my. It is not Anubis. Justin was the spy, however, and wasn't voted once.

[D]

Oh, my God.

[A]

Why did you answer Skeletal like that?

[B]

I. I was either gonna say yes or no, and I knew I had to do it immediately.

[A]

Oh, my God,

[C]

please. Like, honestly, when he said yes, I was like, that was so good.

[B]

I was like, I have the 50.50shot. I'm either about to be blowed up or not. But I. I can't. I just have to say yes or no.

[A]

I had you.

[E]

You had. You thought you had me, you know?

[A]

Yeah, I. I never had your car. I thought that perfectly eliminated any possibility. That wasn't Thomas. I gave you seven.

[G]

I put such perfect benefit of the doubt into that one question, too.

[D]

That was.

[G]

I was. I was like, it might really not be Thomas.

[A]

Let me.

[G]

Let me throw a really good one at you.

[D]

Yeah, I think I kind of threw this with that Andy Cap question, but it was important.

[C]

All right, so here's my question. Do we want to do one more round, or do we want to go on to the interview?

[E]

We need to do one more. I need to. I need to.

[C]

Okay, okay. This time. This time we're going really quick, though.

[D]

Okay.

[C]

Really quick.

[B]

Well, we should just go around in a circle. We should just do an order, and I'd be able to ask anyone a question.

[C]

Okay. All right. I am going to start sending right now. All right. Yeah.

[D]

Can't believe Justin would lie to me like that.

[E]

Justin never lied.

[B]

I didn't lie to you. I lied to Diva.

[D]

Justin would lie to me.

[B]

You have to have, like, these messages ready next time we.

[C]

I'm doing it right now. I'm doing it.

[B]

I know, but, like, as we're playing, you should just mark these out and just be able to hit enter. Enter, enter, enter.

[A]

I kind of. I kind of like the typing break, like, listening to a good type.

[C]

All right.

[A]

Yeah.

[C]

All right, everybody has their assignments.

[A]

The secret robot is full court.

[C]

Let's start with Dima. Dima, you get the first question. I have such. Let's go. Let's go quick.

[G]

Okay.

[C]

Snappy.

[G]

Julian, I already asked you this literal question. Do you get hyped for this robot?

[D]

Of course. All right, so now I'm going. I'm going for Tony.

[A]

Yeah.

[D]

Tony, would you draft this robot?

[F]

Yes. All right. Justin, is this bot bigger or smaller than Julian's bot?

[B]

Bigger. Oh, and it's me. Oh, I can't ask that one. Is this bot in the same size category as. Oh, I'm asking. Thomas. Is this. Is this spot in the same size category as Julian and Dima's bots, like, combined or. No, no, in. No, in the same. The same weight category.

[A]

Okay.

[D]

What did he say?

[B]

He said bigger.

[E]

Do I ask Dima?

[C]

Yes.

[E]

Dima, just give an example of a sports team this robot might like.

[G]

The Lakers. Is that good?

[E]

Yeah, I guess.

[G]

Who do I ask?

[C]

You pick second question.

[G]

So, Julian, you know it's a bigger

[A]

weight class than you, according to Thomas. How do you think you would do fighting this robot?

[D]

I already know that I would beat it.

[E]

I mean, Julian would be any robot, so.

[D]

But this one specifically. Of course I would. Not that it's a bad robot, but we.

[G]

He literally can't stop himself from being

[A]

about to describe how bad he would beat this robot.

[D]

Not what I meant.

[E]

He's a Julian Papasian.

[A]

All right.

[G]

Is that every question?

[C]

Yep. No, no. Julian gets the second question.

[A]

All right.

[D]

Dima, would you beat this robot?

[G]

I don't think so.

[C]

Okay. All right.

[A]

I don't want to discount myself. I could get extremely lucky, but it's probably not gonna ever happen.

[C]

Dima, you've had your second question, so pick somebody. Ask their next question.

[A]

Tony, ask somebody a question.

[F]

Thomas, what color is this bot?

[B]

Red.

[D]

Ish.

[C]

Ish.

[B]

I love their paws.

[C]

Thomas, your question.

[E]

Tony, do you already know who the spy is?

[F]

Yes.

[C]

Justin, your second question.

[B]

Is there another classic NHRL robot that this robot takes its design style from? Tony?

[F]

Yes.

[C]

Okay, we are in the voting block. Okay, let us start with Thomas Julian. Okay. Justin, I'm gonna say Tony. Okay. Dima, we're one. One.

[G]

This is really hard. I'm gonna say Tony.

[C]

Okay. Two for Tony, one for Julian. Tony.

[F]

Thomas.

[C]

Okay, so far, the plurality is Tony. Julian, who's your vote?

[D]

I mean, it's obviously Tony, right?

[C]

Okay. The plurality has voted Tony.

[F]

Okay, that's really not me. It's over.

[C]

Will the spy reveal themselves by making a guess of what this robot is?

[D]

Is it blue Marlin?

[C]

It is not blue Marlin. No, it should not comment to me.

[B]

Almost gave it away. Diva said what the sports team. And Julian said the Blinkers.

[E]

Lakers flew on.

[D]

Hold on, hold on, hold on. In my defense. In my defense, you didn't know if

[A]

I was a spy. You didn't know if I was a spy.

[G]

And I did say Lakers.

[E]

How did everybody. How did everybody miss this?

[D]

Hold on, hold on. I thought that. Well, a Lake, first off. Second off, I thought it was blue Marlin. Because Thomas did the red thing. Yeah, because red.

[F]

Ish.

[A]

Yeah.

[C]

Okay.

[D]

And then I thought Dima was baiting me, because that's one of the only robots I faced at £12.

[C]

No, no.

[G]

But you're going to love what the robot is because I kind of gave you a super easy.

[D]

It's full court.

[F]

Yeah.

[B]

It was between Tony and Julian for me. And I just thought Julian had like a crap ton of confidence. That's why I kind of like, oh, yeah. He thinks he could just cut full court in half. That's why the only reason that I went for Tony was that last question. We were like.

[C]

And I was like, me, dude, speed, evil Julian.

[F]

I'm like, wait a second.

[C]

I'm like, yeah,

[A]

no, I. I saw. I saw why he was doing that. I was. I was thinking, like, full court isn't like it's.

[G]

It's different when you size it up.

[A]

Different. It's not one.

[C]

One. I honestly thought the game was given away when somebody asked Julian if it's the same size and he said bigger. And it's like, no, Leviathan is a 12 pound. So it's the same size technically, I thought. But that's. It's technically bigger because it's wider and everything like that. But okay. You know what? I really like this game. This game is definitely coming back at some point. I really like it. All right, that's the end of the game corner. Thank you, spies.

[D]

All right, thanks for having us on.

[B]

Oh, yeah, that's all the episode is, just game corner.

[C]

I would love to do a full spy fall episode and everything like that. That would be fun. All right.

[B]

Yeah.

[C]

Get out of my game corner.

[B]

Well, thank you, Ryan. That was a fun new game for us to try. So we are going to move right into our signature signature interview segment. Time for five in focus. So I am going to start off with Ashley's question because Ashley is not here tonight, but she did submit a question for you. And Ashley loves asking people's favorite music, favorite things. Just getting into our guests a little bit. So her question was, what's your favorite pizza place in the old Lyme area?

[D]

I am very opinionated about pizza. In Connecticut.

[B]

In Connecticut, if you were opinionated about pizza.

[D]

But more than most people, like there are a lot of pizza places that have like a pre made dough and I don't know like how they get any business at all. Like, you go on Google and like Every restaurant has 4.5 stars, so you never know. Regardless, right now I think my favorite pizza place is Sal's pizza in old Saybrook. Not a sponsor, but if you're interested. I'm interested. And if you've ever seen that office episode which is like, do you want a medium amount of good pizza or a large amount of bad pizza? I tend like the size of the pizza really can sway me, but it's also good pizza, so it's a double threat for me. But also pizza works in old Savoric is also very good, but the pies are so small.

[C]

What's your preferred style of Kaeke pizza?

[D]

Oh, I like a thin crust. Dima will argue and say that I like New Haven, but I like New York. I like a little bit of a floppy crust. Yeah, New Haven is sort of burnt on the bottom.

[B]

Yeah, I was gonna say New Haven's gotta have that ash to it. And it's not everyone's favorite. The one that I always point to because everyone always points to Pepe's for New Haven style pizza. And they do New Haven style pizza. But the one that like really leans into that New Haven style is modern in New Haven because they really char that crust and that's kind of like New Haven's signature thing.

[E]

You don't have to wait more than 20 minutes for a table even if the line is out the door.

[B]

This is all. This is also true. Yeah, Pepe's is kind of gotten that fame where Sally's is Pepe's.

[C]

Sally's is also a good way. I do like Sally's. Like some people don't like the sauce for Sally's, but I really do like Sally's above Pepe's, like in Modern for me was never my favorite, but I do appreciate being able to get into modern.

[E]

Sally's has a different sauce. It's got a lot more tomato flavor, less on the cheese. So if you're more into that, go to Sally's. Otherwise modern is more the standard style style.

[B]

And then if you want to go a little bit down the street street from Pepe's and have a real Italian pizza. Like a real Italian pizza. You go to the parties and it's only about a 2 minute walk down the street and it's real Italian pizza versus New Haven style or whatever.

[C]

So. Yeah, I mean, I also like. Can I get Greek style? Like Greek style is really good too. Yes, Greek style is amazing. We, we have our local pizza place around here that we love that's Greek style. It's got like a really nice, like the crust is basically. They make it into the oil pan so the crust gets like fried in a way. It's really, really good.

[A]

I'm like, I'm like about to break a pen in half trying to figure out when to get a word in. I'm insane about New Haven Pizza. I think it's. I think it's the best in the world.

[C]

I think.

[A]

I think the more burnt is better.

[G]

I think Monitor is amazing. I think Sally's is great.

[A]

I think Frank Pepe's is not cooked

[G]

the oven high enough and the dough is too thick.

[A]

And the reason that Julie. I say Julian likes New Haven pizza with the ash on the bottom is

[G]

because our childhood pizza place is called

[A]

Paisan's, which is a hilarious name, by

[G]

the way, for a childhood pizza place.

[A]

And they burnt the heck out of it. It wasn't that floppy.

[G]

But now I understand that Julian likes

[A]

just gigantic pizza, which can hold no structure whatsoever.

[G]

He likes his pizza so big that

[A]

it just can't hold.

[E]

I have a clarifying question.

[G]

Yeah.

[E]

When you say that Pepe's does not cook their pizza enough, are you referring to the original in New Haven or are you referring to the franchise locations?

[A]

It's been a while.

[G]

The most recent one I had was

[A]

the Mohegan sun one. But then I was like, it kind of tastes oddly similar, which disappointed me.

[E]

The Pepe's Original does cook it crispy, like, to where it's black, although the franchises do not.

[G]

Who is crispy?

[D]

He's like some Boulder Nice.

[C]

So the real real is the Little Rendezvous in Meriden.

[E]

Yeah.

[C]

Oh, the Little Rendezvous. The Little Rendezvous, especially for people outside of Connecticut. So there's this place that the oven is over 100 years old. Like, the oven used to be used for just baking bread, basically. And it has survived and survived. It is in this tiny little building that you. It's a shack. It's a tiny little shack. And you go in the front door, then you have to walk down this long, like, hallway, and then you end up in the back of the place, and that's where the oven is and everything like that. The owner is a great guy, but he does not like people. He hates people.

[D]

I'm pretty sure he doesn't hate people.

[E]

Okay. There's this guy.

[C]

That's what he does a lot.

[A]

No, no, no, no, no, no.

[E]

See, I've been going in there for well over a decade, and the guy has always been chill. The problem is there is this guy who I will not name, who sits on a bar stool day and preaches how one bite.

[D]

No.

[E]

That guy is a menace to society. His recommendation has ruined this tiny location. Used to be able to call in, get a pizza in, like, 20, 25 minutes. Now, if I want to sit down there and get a pizza. You have to call him, like, four, five, six hours on the weekend ahead of time.

[C]

Sometimes you have to call the day before. You have to call the day before. Freezing. It is so. But the pizza is so good. The environment is, like, perfectly what you want from a pizza place. It's just like, oh, this isn't like a modern. Like, there's no, like, modern amenities. There's no nothing. It is a booth that looks like it was torn out of a diner in the 70s or 80s and placed in this place. And that's where you sent. And you drink your birch. Your birch beer, and that's it.

[B]

So before we move on, and I

[A]

will not be taking any questions making me so hungry.

[G]

It's insane.

[E]

Out of their environment because there's wastewater and factories. There used to be, like, Italian mobsters, like these old guys that always be in the plate in the dining room. They're the only people that ever eat in the dining room. And ever since this guy. You don't see them anymore?

[C]

No.

[A]

It's like the wild.

[E]

The wildlife are gone. Now it's just a tourist drive to Massachusetts. New Jersey.

[C]

Yep.

[B]

So can I drop a very similar unpopular opinion about a small place in New Haven before we move on?

[E]

Yeah.

[B]

Louie's lunch is not as good as people think it is.

[C]

Louis lunch is the worst.

[E]

Whoa, look at that here.

[G]

I'm kind of getting upset. I'll let you. I'll let you make your viewpoint, but

[A]

I demand a momentary defense afterward.

[B]

Go ahead, Go ahead. I've had it a lot of times, both sober and. And not sober, and I. I do not. I don't like their. I don't like the burgers, and I think they're way too overhyped.

[A]

Tell me. Yeah, tell me. What about it is mid. Does it just not.

[C]

It's soggy. It's. It's what you would get. It's what your mother would make you.

[A]

It.

[C]

Toss on a piece of bread, but it's worse because it's soggy.

[D]

Oh, no.

[G]

Oh, no. The burger's just like mama used to make.

[E]

That's what people want.

[C]

And the place is tiny, and you go and is at all busy.

[E]

What were you just saying about little rendezvous?

[C]

You're just like, oh, what were you saying about character? Yeah, it's exactly what you want out

[G]

of a burger stand. Like you were just saying a second ago about the burger place.

[E]

I will say you don't go there for lunch.

[A]

Oh, oh. They use ovens from 100 years ago. These people Use, like, steamers from the Victorian era.

[C]

Yeah.

[E]

Everything you just said about the pizza

[B]

place,

[C]

I'm pretty sure he doesn't know what salt and pepper is. I really don't think that does. You gotta really.

[A]

You gotta really.

[B]

For ketchup, you gotta taste the steam.

[A]

I guess they picked it up, put

[E]

it on the back of a truck and moved the entire building. That's how good this place is.

[C]

Are you eating it in there? Yes. Every time I be in, I've eaten it in there. So that's because you go outside and it's like you're right at the back of one of the hospital buildings, basically, if I remember, right across the street

[B]

from, like, bar, from, like, the nightclub area right there.

[F]

Yeah.

[A]

Okay. It's a real place in a real location that people actually go to.

[C]

Okay.

[E]

We will move this 5pm or later, so the lines are short.

[B]

We will move this conversation offline. Let's. Let's continue. Ryan, why don't you ask.

[C]

I thought this was the Connecticut Food Podcast and we have to go back to robots now.

[A]

It is now.

[C]

All right.

[B]

Yeah, we'll come out with that. We'll come out with the Connecticut Food Podcast. Ryan, you ask your question.

[C]

Okay. From one controversy to another, my question. So my question is, there's a new rule update, a new judging rule update. And I know. I've seen. I've seen Julian talk about it and everything like that. So my question is basically with Meiko kind of being nerfed at this point, what are your plans for next to robots? And how are you. How are you doing with that design limitation. Limitation.

[D]

So this is a big hot button thing.

[C]

Yeah. I also would love Dima's opinion, too.

[D]

Yeah. But, like, I am. So I've been waiting to move away from Mako, first off, just because I've been building it and remaking it and trying to squeeze everything out of it for, like, now two and a half years, which is kind of crazy. It's been that long already. But with the new rules, like, I'm literally not going to fight Mako under these rules. And I know that that is, like, inflammatory and kind of extreme. But I also have talked. You know, I'm not out here screaming and shouting, saying, these rules suck. I have actual critical thoughts about them, and I'm attempting to go through the correct avenues to discuss those. I hope I'm heard out. I think my opinions are well thought out. I actually have a bachelor's degree in game design, and Dima and I were obsessed with combat sports. A lot before this. And I think there's a lot of parallels between video games and combat sports. So I sort of have a unique perspective. And without getting too much into this, I feel like this makes control focused robots not. It's not clear how you are supposed to drive them and the rules sort of encourage you to drive them unintelligently. So like I'm. I'm not going to, you know, I tried it and. And again, this is going to sound like, oh, I lost. So I'm upset. Like as soon as the rules dropped, like, I was like, I don't want to run Mako under these. Actually, I had two JDs and both of them were flipped in my eyes. The first one I thought I lost under the new rules and I would have understood that. And my opponent thought they won. Turns out I won, which shocked me. And then the next fight, I tried my best to fight under these new rules. I was hyper aggressive. I wound up taking extra damage from being hyper aggressive. But I thought, okay, well I won and I did not. So that's very frustrating. I understand that NHRL is putting a lot of work into making the new rules. I still love nhrl. I'm wearing NHL hoodie and NHRL shirt. It is like the pinnacle of combat sports. Sometimes I mess up and I think this is a mess up, you know, and hopefully people don't hear that and decide they hate me now. But like I'm trying to be a straight shooter about it.

[B]

Like, I don't think you're not being super inflammatory about any of it at all. I don't think there's anything you've said that's really. No, my question on that is about being evil.

[A]

Can I, can I get it? Can I get a sense?

[C]

Yes, yes, yes.

[A]

Let me add to what he said. So the day before nhrl, I am texting a friend of mine who knows me very well and knows about like what Julian said. I've done combat sports and I parallel it with basically everything that I do. I parallel it with robots. I parallel it with fighting games, which is like my other competitive hobby. And this friend also played fighting games. So it was like kind of easy to.

[C]

We.

[A]

We both made the same two parallels. My parallel that I made to her because I know she's more of a. She doesn't do combat so she only plays fighting is. But she knows that I do. I. The parallel I made to her was it's a new season in a fighting game and it's up to me to read. It's up to me to read people the patch notes. It's up to me to explain to the audience a heck of a lot. If anything has changed. Like. Like, you know, it's. We're trying to be in the moment, but sometimes you're like, this robot fought a lot last season. It's fighting differently now. Like, I was ready for that to come up, and she went back at me and was like, oh, it's like they. It's like they removed grappling out of mma. And she said that because. She said she. She also said that because she knows

[G]

me and Julian are grapplers.

[A]

So it was a little bit, like. How do I put this? She had, like, an instant gut reaction. As somebody who's, like, a mega fan of the things she does. Like, she instantly was like, how does. How does the community see it? Like, what is the. What is the big change? And I'm doing, like, a bias yet unbiased perspective. It's just. It's. Sometimes you walk into a room and it's not like, breaking bad news, but you're going to be like, this is a change that. I know why was made, and I know why. I know why is good. But I am gonna talk to a bunch of people who don't like it, and I am the face of that change in some ways.

[B]

Makes sense.

[A]

That's all I'll say.

[D]

Yeah.

[B]

Do you think it's also. My only question with that is, do you think it's also partly. Not all of it, but partly because the judges have not gotten a chance to envelop the new rules enough and understand them enough to be able to judge, like, maybe specifically those two fights being swapped. Do you think, you know, part of it might be the fact that the judges just don't understand enough of, like, how to apply what's being given to them? Because it was a very short window between these rules being applied and them going, okay, we're going to teach the judges these, and then the judges actually having to apply them. So do you think there's. There's something there where the judges just don't understand it well enough yet? And maybe with a little bit more time and tweaking it, it will settle better. Or is it just the rules themselves?

[A]

Can I answer first?

[C]

Yeah, go ahead.

[A]

So I was asking more Julian that because he was about to launch into it.

[D]

Oh, yeah.

[C]

So.

[D]

So.

[A]

So first. So first thing, that's a heck of a loaded core question. And there's, like, data to pour over.

[C]

Like, we have to look at a

[A]

lot of yeah, we have to look at a lot of fights. We have to look at statistics like, oh, how was this kind of fight judged? How was, how are these fights judged? After this and that we have to look at, we have to watch a lot of footage and it's Wednesday, guys. Like we're not even, we're not even a week out. On the other hand, when you launch a new season patch for a video game and you changed all the, of a bunch of stuff, there's growing pains. That's how I'd like to phrase that. However, Julian probably has a way more direct answer.

[D]

I sure do. As I said, it's very frustrating that I read the rules and did my best to fight under what they expected. And one can say in my first match I fought more like it was last year and it was judged more like it was last year. So any, like, it's hard to explain but just like if I'm reading these rules and even if they were, even if they were judged perfectly, they're still complicated and they, they remove an important part of both of our robots. Like I am a control based fighter and even, and I think everyone here can agree that I make the fights exciting.

[C]

Oh yeah.

[D]

If I feel like I go for risky shots, I try not to kill my saw but if I'm losing, I'm going to throw my saw until it explodes. Until my robot explodes. So like no amount of rule changes are going to force exciting fights, but they are removing my, you know, ability. It feels almost to fight intelligence.

[F]

Well, I looked at it as they, they took like their bot that they were promoting is like the best bot, Jelly Baby and did it.

[D]

Yeah. And I do think that's, I obviously these rules are somewhat anti control bot and I kind of get that. You know, this is a part where I'm, you know, some of you guys might disagree with me, but down at that event where Hokum was competing and Jelly Baby were competing, they were both like top eight. There was like a feeling in the stands where it's like, oh Jesus, if it's Jelly Baby versus Hook em in the finals and it very well looks like it could be like everyone, no one's gonna be happy. But I, I don't know, maybe, maybe some people would have been. I thought it would have been boring.

[C]

I think I personally really like the way that Jelly Baby fights. No, I do too understand like and I think it would be interesting to watch Jelly Baby versus arguably two smaller Jelly Babies.

[G]

Sure.

[C]

I, I completely understand why that's boring to Most people, though. Yeah, completely, completely understand it.

[D]

And that's what I mean. Like, I, again, like, I might find it interesting, but, like, yes, I could feel it in the. In the building. Even with Bill, it was just like, oh, brother. But even then, I think it's. It's a combination of a lot of things. And like, the fact that they're multi bots, the fact that, you know, the fact that they. In last year, they weren't. They were basically allowed to fight like Wedgebots. Now we have stronger dummy rules.

[A]

Yeah.

[E]

Yeah.

[C]

I would hope that. I hope it gets patched a little bit to allow a little bit more for lifters and control bots to have a little bit more. Like, I hope, like, control comes back in some way because, like, my thing has always been as far as control. Like, I like to watch sumo matches sometimes. Hell, I like to watch Sumo. Sumo. So, like, that's a whole other thing, though.

[A]

But, like, let's go, by the way.

[C]

Oh, yeah. Sumo is fun as hell, especially once you understand, like, everything about it and, like, such a deep dive. But, like, I. I really enjoy also the parts of matches where like. Like impact. Like, impact can turn down that weapon really low and just be controlling because. And you have to. When you're judging, you have to be like, impact might not be no longer roofing people, but impact is, like, on it. It's on it. And like, even like Turbo Fiend, like, terrible fiend. Yeah. Is Control is a control bot. As far as I'm concerned, Turbofiend is a control bot. Just as much as it deals damage, it's a control bot. And that's the same thing for, like, a lot of bots especially. That shape is like, that's a control bot first. That has a weapon on it and the weapons dealing damage. But really you're just. You're controlling your opponent and making sure your opponent goes where you want the opponent to go, and you're not allowing the opponent any control over the box.

[A]

That opponent is devil's advocate. Yeah, let me get a little devil's advocate. You may hear. You may hear people say, oh, well, flamethrowers get to hold as many pins as they want because they're attacking the whole time.

[C]

Yeah.

[A]

This came up in, like, a very serious discussion about the rules, which was. I. We actually started on a separate tangent. We said a supreme ruler is always going to argue that it runs out of fuel. Yep. And then the answer to that is, well, of course he's incentivized to.

[G]

And then another question on top of

[A]

that was, excuse me, burped up potato chips. Then you go. You go one past that question, and it says, well, how did you argue? Then I said, wait a minute. In my grand finals win against Supreme Ruler, they asked us point blank how we think the fight went. And it was sort of a little bit like, let me put on my lawyer hat and argue why I won that fight. Because I knew it was a complicated.

[C]

I knew.

[A]

Oh, okay. English major, Linguistics major. I knew it was a complicated question. And I said, I really chewed up his flamethrower. Good. And part of that was because the sort of secret sauce of Turbofiend is when you hold a pin, you are actively using the weapon the entire time to grind them up at a high speed. It's sort of. The fact that it can also roof shot people means that it gets to be a sort of versatile. Yep, it's a versatile, like, controlly based play on the vert archetype, which is what makes it so interesting. If you mess. If you mess with pins, you mess with that. I'm not done with my comparison because I think this has a lot of parallel to Magic the Gathering as a sort of esport, especially because we're rolling out of Pro Tour. A, there's a lot of nerd overlap. B, it's a very cerebral type thing. C, you just said something about hook EM versus Jelly baby. You know what that screams to me? Control mirror. A lot of people. A lot of people, A, are bored by them, or B, you know, have a hard time really understanding at the highest level what makes them interesting. The parallel. There is grappling matches in the middle of an MMA fight. People don't always understand what makes it interesting, and it can become boring. Sorry to shoot.

[B]

Yeah, Dimir mage right here. I. I know Control.

[A]

Yes, but.

[C]

Yes, But I also. I also think it's another part of the conversation where you pointed out, as far as, like, Turbo Fiend being able to roof people. Sometimes if you left your weapon at the speed where it's roofing people, you want to make it the whole match. Would you like. Would you be able to run at 100% the whole match and be able to run it?

[A]

Yes, I. Full blast that time. I. I'm. I'm. I am.

[D]

It's.

[E]

I'm.

[A]

Turbofeed is hell on. I am throttling that weapon.

[B]

Are you kidding me?

[E]

Yes.

[D]

If I could jump in again. It's funny because Turbofiend actually spins faster to be more controlly.

[C]

Okay.

[D]

Yeah. So it's kind of the opposite of what you'd think, but sort of stepping back about turbofiend, the way we demo wins against a lot of big verts is by getting one or two pins, and then suddenly that bird has to fight off the back foot. They might spin a little faster. Then suddenly they become easier to control. And then Dima knows, like, okay, now I can actually hit them a lot harder. Like, go watch Dima against any big vert. Like, the tide turns when Dima starts controlling them, they know, oh, oh, crud. Oh, C word. You know, I'm losing out of control now. Now I need to win on damage. And now suddenly that control is either neutral or negative. You know, that's the way I see it right now. It removes a lot of the strategy. It's the same thing with the robot, like Maximizer. We've seen Maximizer vs. Caldera a lot, right? When Maximizer, like, wins and wins hard, it's because Jake fights more intelligently. And that's not to say that, you know, Glenn fights unintelligently. It's that. That's what that archetype is, Maximizer. He can use the plow, he can use the forks to control the enemy and then pick his shots. And I feel like the new rules sort of force it to be an arms race where it's just who's going to do more damage, who's going to take more damage. And sort of a phrase I've been trying to figure out how to explain is that it's important to cause harm or damage or whatever, whatever you want to call it. So if we can all agree on that, including NHL, then it has to be important to prevent it. You know what I mean? It has to be important to pin a robot and stop them from causing harm. You know, And I. And I do think it's fine if NHRL wanted to tweak those knobs, you know, knock down control a few points, even if it was one or two points, like, I don't think that's insane. It would hurt robots like me because, you know, it would be harder for me to win on control. But that's not what I try to do. I try to win on control, then kill people. Anyway.

[A]

Can I play a couple double Devil's advocates here? Turbo Peace. Turbo pins. First thing, you can kind of have your cake and eat it too. With regards to having big birds just smashing against each other and like you said, tweaking the knobs and five second pins is something not. It's something like, not explored. There's also the Idea of. How do I put this? Points or pins counting against you after the second or so. What if they just weren't worth anything? What if control. What if control still wasn't a score but you weren't penalized for those pins, so you weren't benef. Like, there's so many, there's so many variables to consider and so many alternate, like outcomes that even a little change would cause. Second point. I don't, I'm still stuck on Jelly Baby versus Hook Em because I think there's a place in this, I think there's, I think there's a literal place in the sport for that. If Jelly Baby is possible and Hook Em is possible, if they're both possible robots, they should have a shot at grand finals if they're competent in design, which they both are. But here's the thing. NHRL is a live event. And if you if 30s just smashed against each other and there's one more fight left and it's Jelly Baby versus Hook Em and the fight's quiet and the crowd's quiet, it kind of stinks for everybody but the die hardest of fans, which is okay. Which is okay if you're watching a TV show version of BattleBots and you can say, let's just skip that one. Or that's, that's, that's one episode in, in 30 per season. But I think the, the one of the biggest takeaways is they simply just want you to be attacking. And I think there needs to be a way for a bot like Mo to be like, I am pinning you and attempting to attack you. And if there's no attack, I go for a different one and I'm not penalized for going for a new one. That's, that's, that's the big thing. The other part of it is some archetypes, like it is the buffing and the nerfing thing. But I think, I think there's a, there's a little bit of a reckoning with that. When flamethrowers are obviously exciting, but the crowd seems a little. I don't. Hey, this, this is, this isn't a. Yeah, burnt out is a perfect, Perfect, perfect. I was about to say.

[C]

I was about to say.

[B]

I was gonna say.

[A]

I didn't want to say something negative, but like I am in there with, I'm in there with great audio quality. I can hear. Hey, I mean, quiet.

[C]

I, I'm going to end this because like we're, we're gonna go into a two hour episode and I love this Conversation. We could continue having this conversation, but like, this is gonna be two hour episode. Maybe we can come back to this.

[B]

We're good.

[C]

Go ahead. Controversial episode. Controversial take. Flamethrowers are played out and I don't love them anymore. I'm so sorry.

[D]

Hot take. Flaming hot take. The one thing I'll say is some of the most exciting fights in any combat sport are when you have a huge power striker and somebody's going to try to outskill them.

[B]

Yes.

[D]

Yeah, absolutely.

[B]

Yes.

[D]

And these rules are just encouraging a lot more power strikers. And that's fun sometimes, but it's not the only thing that's fun. You know, it's very fun to watch. Like, imagine Mike Tyson versus someone who's trying to dodge all his punches and tire him out and then beat him out. Yeah, well, that's.

[B]

That's the other thing too, is like the other side of the boring thing is not just the control, but the other side of the boring thing is, okay, these two robots came in, they hit once, and the fight is over in 10 seconds. Like, do we want that to be every single fight? Because then that starts leaning in the other way of boringness. And so, yeah.

[F]

Oh, but Those make great YouTube shorts.

[B]

Well, then we're going into a whole. We're going into a whole other side of this.

[C]

Thomas, why don't you ask your secret question?

[D]

Oh, yeah.

[C]

It's time.

[E]

Okay. Julian and Dima, do you have any favorite stage performers either creating current or historical? And do you have a favorite amusement ride that might be related to this stage performer?

[G]

Oh, baby.

[D]

I didn't know where Thomas was going with this one, but I'm a big Houdini.

[B]

Never do Houdini.

[D]

A big Houdini head. I believe his real name is Eric Weiss. God rest his soul.

[A]

You say, I believe his name is Eric Weiss. I remember you listening to the audiobook book biographies several times. I know you know what it is.

[D]

I think that's it. I gotta look like a fool if it's not his name right now.

[A]

Do not be so humble about your Houdini knowledge.

[D]

It is that. I don't think I'm pronouncing it right, but that's it. First man to fly a motored plane in the continent of Australia, by the way.

[C]

Whoa.

[D]

So chalk that up for. Or put that in your brain because it's really important, but big fan of the Houdini ride at Six Flags New England. Is that what it's called?

[E]

Yep. New England and Great adventure.

[D]

And Great Adventure. Only better than New England one. Thomas and I were there a few months ago, and I'll tell you what, when the ride started, you know,

[C]

for

[D]

the viewers at home, you know, you don't have video, but my camera just zoomed in a lot because this part's really important. I don't want to spoil the ride if rides are spoilable. But you're sitting.

[E]

You just talk about it as if it's doing the thing it's doing, because it is, right?

[D]

The room, like, the whole room starts moving. And there was a guy sat next to me. I was like, oh, God, is this part of the ride? And he laughed. And that gave me life. Fuel to sustain myself.

[A]

Please, please, please let me discuss the fact that you use that bit when we're in an elevator.

[D]

Yeah, I do that, too. That's my new favorite one. When you're in an elevator, you go, oh, God. I felt like the whole room just moved.

[G]

It kills me every time.

[A]

Like, he'll do it twice in the same day. Like in the Santa Pulse day.

[D]

Yeah, right. Does that answer your question?

[E]

Yeah. Also, Dima, do you have any favorite stage performers?

[C]

Yeah.

[A]

Houdini.

[C]

Whoa. Family.

[G]

I'm the youngest sister. I don't have any taste of my own.

[D]

Houdini's pretty good.

[B]

Hand me down tastes.

[D]

Yup.

[C]

Yeah.

[B]

Believe it or not, I'm done with this Combo Robotics. Dima here, you can have.

[G]

Well, in a wholesome way.

[A]

He did get me into it, but. But, yeah, that means it wasn't mine.

[E]

Talking about rules.

[B]

Yeah. Well, that's why I like putting yours in the middle as, like, a sandwich in the middle of the five.

[A]

That's messed up.

[G]

That's trickery.

[A]

It works every time.

[F]

It does work very well.

[B]

Tony, why don't you go?

[F]

So, as you know, we're expanding around the world with our Combat Robotics take and everything else. So if you can go to any combat robotic event in the entire world, where would you want to go and why?

[D]

Oh, am I allowed to time travel?

[E]

Don't say New Zealand. Wait, what?

[A]

Sure.

[E]

Yeah.

[D]

I'm older, so I really, really liked Robot wars growing up. Even if you go back and watch it and all the bats, all the bots are crummy. It's just so much fun with, like, that housebots or whatever they were called, you know, will come out and crush the loser. Or if it's a boring fight, like, they'll make it fun. There's the pit. I think they were dropping a refrigerator at one point. It's just so much fun. And as deep fans Of Mako and Julian know I'm a big wheely, big cheese fan. Robot Wars, Tons, tons of fun. I know it's gone now, but, like, I'm gonna use that as my answer.

[F]

Well, just a little sneak print. We might be having things like that on our site.

[D]

Ooh, very cool.

[F]

Yeah, I might be bringing back, like a weekly, like, find an old episode and post it up on our site.

[D]

Yeah, I've seen, like, I don't know if they're twitch channels or YouTube channels where they will re watch old videos, old tournaments, and sort of do commentary. I don't know if that's even legal, but I thought about doing that before, especially because my memory's crummy. Like, it wouldn't be boring for me. It would be exciting. Even some older BattleBots seasons that are still part of the reboot.

[B]

Oh, the classic Comedy Central battlebot stuff.

[F]

We'll have to talk because I think that would be an awesome little thing

[B]

that we could do on the site.

[D]

Yeah, I definitely be on board with

[E]

that MXC style where you just dub the entire episode.

[C]

Hell, yeah.

[A]

Yes, please.

[D]

Yeah, yeah.

[B]

Not just the commentators, the robots. You have to dub the robots. The thoughts of the robots.

[D]

And I think this is sort of a tangent, but I was a Super fan of BattleBots as soon as it came out. Like, I saw the commercials, I was like, oh, this I love this. Like, before I even saw it. And I always have, but I was one of those dumb fans who was like, well, the big ones are fun, but all the small ones, they must be born. So until I, you know, discovered nhrl, that's kind of what I thought. NHRL does a fantastic job of the presentation. A lot of events, even if there's great robots fighting there, it looks like a dingy basement. No good commentary. Dima's not on the mic. NHRL does a very good job of making people realize, like, how good this stuff is. So I know I just maybe talked a little badly about the rules, and I do stand by that. But I also think NHREL is just a fantastic place, fantastic organization that, you know, even if they ruin the rules 100%, I'll still show up. I'll build whatever the heck you're gonna force me to try to win. Like, I. I very much love nhra.

[A]

He's so evil. I am evil. I didn't get to answer, but I want to go to the UK to go to those crazy Beetle Weight events where they have ridiculous arenas. It feels like Halo 2 maps. That's where I want to be one of the most fun. Some of the. Some of the most fun I've ever had at NHRA was playing King of the Hill with Turbo Friend. That's like that. That was a great rumble, too. And you can tell because it keeps getting used in content.

[C]

Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah.

[A]

Sorry.

[C]

Yeah.

[A]

I really enjoy the Strawberry Rumble, but honestly, it's a little more niche compared to the King of the Hill rumble.

[B]

We used to try and push a lot more of that stuff. Megan is more in charge of the freestyle stuff and a lot of that rumble stuff now, but we used to try and push that stuff a lot. And NHRL is very busy doing the production and making sure the show and. And the regular tournament goes. So we would have these ideas and we would present them, and then sometimes they would get through, like the. The King of the Hill. But most of the time, a lot of the stuff just, you know, they would say, oh, yeah, yeah, you can put it here. And then all of a sudden, we had to push fights there, and it just happened.

[C]

The background of the King of Hill was. We didn't think it was going to happen. That was like an idea for a long time where I was going to happen.

[A]

I. I pushed it really hard.

[G]

Day of.

[C]

Yes. And also, like, we were like, oh, okay, is it gonna happen? We were talking to Jimmy about it and stuff like that, and then suddenly it was Sam's building it, and we were like, oh, is that it's gonna happen? Like, it's actually like Sam's building it. Okay. And it comes out and we get there and we're like, oh, look, it's a cool thing. Oh, it's such a good. It's so good. I think it has to be somewhere still, right? It has to be in the building.

[B]

Well, they use the. The footage all the time. It's got to be somewhere on the Brett Zone or on the YouTube channel. It's somewhere.

[A]

Bear in mind, that was also my main robot was only Turbo Friend. And I was begging, saying, please, please, please. I. I don't, like, consider it, like, I need to run King of the Hill today.

[D]

Yeah,

[C]

I meant to. I meant to bring this up earlier. What the hell happened? I was all excited for Mass D to see Furious George and Turbo and Turbo Friend. And then suddenly you two come and you destroy the competition.

[D]

Sorry.

[C]

What the hell?

[D]

Wait, there's a wrong dance.

[A]

Is Curious George three Pound Monkey Business.

[D]

It's Furious George.

[C]

Yes.

[D]

Furious George, which is a fantastic name. Not to bring down the mood of the podcast or anything, but that is certainly a robot I want to work on. My employment has been sort of dicey lately.

[C]

Oh, okay.

[D]

So I was like, maybe I don't spend $300 on a robot when I might not be employed in two weeks.

[A]

Yeah, I'll front it. But it has to be. It can't be. Furious Storage.

[D]

It's such a good name.

[B]

It has to be Backer. Change that name now.

[A]

No, no, it's a really. It's a really good name. But I. Those bots explode, dude. And if I'm fronting the money, it's got to be Turbo Freak.

[D]

Who said you're funding the money? I was just gonna wait until I could afford it.

[A]

I'm your manager

[D]

for the listeners at home.

[F]

Assistant's gotta get something out of this deal.

[D]

But what I was saying is for the viewers at home, I have a one founder called Monkey Business, which is sort of a nightmare inspired vertical spinner. It's actually kind of a lot like backlash waves where it's just like a big blade. It's invertible. It actually has a 6 inch blade in a net wing, like sitting it next to Prince. It was almost like the same footprint, only they were a lot beefier.

[A]

Obviously.

[C]

Yeah.

[D]

But I want to. Spider.

[G]

That barrage say what?

[A]

Also inspired by Adamant Barrage.

[D]

Exactly.

[F]

Yeah.

[D]

Adamant barrage is the 12 or 12 hours.

[A]

Yeah.

[D]

What I was going to say is like, I want to scale it up. I don't want to do this thing where you just call it like Monkey Business three or whatever. So I was like, I want to find a monkey or a chimp name. And Furious George came up and that's just like such a good name. So I feel like I have to use it.

[A]

Can we say something about how there's been a wave of first name bots recently? I'm kind of. I'm kind of for it.

[F]

Yeah.

[D]

John Undercutter. I'm a big fan of that.

[C]

Yeah. You can't scare me with a big vertical blade. I took Rickety Cricket to the face so you can't scare me anymore. Yeah.

[B]

That's a big boy.

[C]

Oh, yeah.

[A]

It is so awesome.

[C]

It's so cool. But it's not cool when you're like, how do I approach this thing With a robot that can't drive? Right. Okay, I'm dead. Thank you. Sometimes.

[A]

Okay, a bit of an aside. You know how there's a lot of engineers who do this board? There's different kinds of sciences and there are some robots. You'll show somebody who I guess likes rocket science. You'd show them, Clyde.

[G]

If you are.

[A]

If you know people who are like, biologists, you show them, like, rickety cricket.

[D]

Yeah, I guess so. That's funny.

[C]

Oh, man. All right.

[B]

Okay, so last question of the five in focus is mine. And my question is, you've both become crowd favorites in NHL, but if you could secretly run a second anonymous bot under a different name at NHL, what would it be? And how would you disguise your identity? So this is kind of a Mark Tony question.

[A]

This is the best question I've ever heard in my entire life.

[D]

I don't.

[C]

Can't be Tony Clifton. I'm sorry.

[A]

Oh, how'd you know?

[C]

Wait, wait.

[A]

Why not give us.

[C]

Give us your Tony Clifton impression. Let's see.

[A]

Julian, you first, because I know what you're going to say, because I don't want to steal your, like, one quote from you.

[C]

He's been on the podcast before.

[D]

Oh, okay.

[A]

We're doing impression of Tony Klitzer from decades ago as well. That's not.

[D]

I can't do it very well. You go ahead, Dima.

[A]

A little bit of whoopty doo.

[C]

Whoopty die.

[A]

Stick a needle in your eye.

[C]

Okay. Okay.

[D]

That's a good one. Okay, hold on. Now I'm confused. Are we just comparing Tony Clifton impressions, or are we answering the question? Because I got.

[C]

Answer the question. Yeah.

[D]

As you guys know, I'm a big fan of the theatrics involved in pro wrestling, so this is actually something that I've ex. I've considered greatly, to the point where I already have, like, alt Discord accounts made where I've thought about pretending to sell Meiko and then someone else shows up driving it. That would be me under a luchador mask, of course.

[A]

He's talked about selling Meiko so many times, I did not even realize that this was, like, the pro wrestling storyline. Outcome was that it would be a different guy driving Mako.

[D]

I don't know what we got. I think this kind of got derailed because D. Mon started commentating, but this is the first time I'm revealing this to anyone besides Gwen.

[C]

But is this secretly why you cut all your hair to fit underneath the luchador mask?

[D]

No, but now that it's revealed, I. This will have to wait for, like, years or less. Be something other silly thing.

[F]

Nobody listens to this podcast. That's all good.

[C]

Yeah, don't worry about that. It's fine.

[D]

Yeah, but even on, like, all the side Discord servers, I was like, yeah, I got someone who offered me a bunch of money for. For makeup and not just makeup, but, like, the rights to make them. So I guess I'm selling it. And then of course it was going to be me and a mask. And it's like, I mean, you can look at me, you'll obviously know it's me. But the bit would be, you know, me pretending it's totally someone else.

[A]

This. This, like, got me. Like, I didn't know this.

[E]

Like, yeah, everybody listening to this podcast, do not tell anybody about this.

[B]

This.

[D]

If.

[E]

Just go with it.

[A]

You're in on it.

[C]

You.

[D]

You're in on.

[F]

You are in.

[E]

You have to get hyped, though. You have to. You have to help convince the other people.

[A]

If not Jillian, how hard is that?

[D]

And I even was to the point where I was going to, like, message Gil and be like, hey, this is me. I'm registering under a different name because you guys all know how, you know, a lottery works. I wasn't trying to game the lottery, but it would also be very funny if, like, I went to the bathroom, bathroom, change clothes, and then suddenly it's Julian working on the robot, but I disappear when it's time to drive it.

[C]

No.

[D]

Or whatever.

[C]

You don't change your clothes at all. You just put the luchador mask on.

[A]

I. I literally like hearing his voice saying, like, guys, I got. I gotta go to the bathroom.

[D]

But

[F]

phone goose.

[C]

You get by. You could buy some really nice luchador masks too. Like, custom made. Like, really nice.

[A]

Like, yeah, we all, we have mass wrestled before.

[C]

Oh, there you go.

[D]

I actually have a collection of about 30 masks, but unfortunately I have a massive head, so like one and a half fit me. So I'd have to get like a custom one made.

[A]

I. I have one right next to me.

[D]

There you go.

[C]

Yeah.

[D]

We aren't currently big fans of pro wrestling, but conceptually I'm a big fan of it. I'm a big fan of getting the crowd more involved, of just hyping everything up. I feel like a lot of times the best robot builders treat it like chess. Like, why, good sir, we're about to have a great match and just shake hands at the end. And of course I respect everyone and I love that too, but it's like a coliseum, you know what I mean? Like, yeah, be crazy. They're gladiators. Like, it's the same where, like, I make my robots exciting. It's like you want to excite the crowd. You want them to go, oh, crap, it's Mako. You know what I mean? So I'm on board with doing anything that makes the fans more excited, involved or whatever.

[C]

Yeah, yeah, Mark. I really miss having Mark around so much for that sort of stuff.

[E]

Absolutely.

[D]

Yeah. And I've sort of been trying to prove that you can be crazy and silly but still win, try to win, you know, I don't know how much of this is true, but I heard that in the old BattleBots days, J. Mo was asked if he wanted to be a villain, and he flat out said no. And I respect that because in a sense, like, robot combat, like, this isn't

[G]

enough for you guys.

[D]

You know what I mean? It's very exciting.

[F]

He asked him about that, actually. He talked about that on the podcast.

[D]

I'll have to go back and listen because this is something I, like, re. Reheard again. And, like, I'm the type of person where if someone asks me to be a villain, obviously I'm going to say yes as Evil Julie this year.

[B]

It's really funny.

[D]

Good.

[B]

Before we ever started NH Roll, before we ever met Ray Billings in person, like, they did such a good job making him seem like a villain for those first couple seasons he was on. And even I'm forgetting his name from Hydra.

[C]

The Ewarts. The Ewarts, Yeah.

[B]

They do a good job. And I've been told multiple times that he's like the nicest guy. That is not his personality at all, that that's just a production crew making him out to be that way. And again, Ray Billings, we met him, he's the nice. Like, such a nice person and they just made him out. Especially. I remember the one clip where, like, he was attacking and he was, like, doing a lot of damage to his opponent. And like, they were showing the same, almost the same clip of him, like, laughing maniacally over and over again. And they were twisting in a way of like, oh, look how twisted he is enjoying doing this. It's like he's fighting. Like, it wasn't until later on that you realize, like, he's fighting robots. He's just having a good time fighting robots. He's not laughing because he's destroying his opponent's robot. Like, that's not what's going on. But, yeah, I didn't.

[A]

I didn't even get to answer the question. Just say I am. I am 500 times. But also, nobody. You guys don't even realize I already am a villain. I'm. I in terms. In fighting games. In Tekken, I'm like a dastardly villain. I'm despised.

[C]

I. I'm.

[A]

I'm honestly well loved. But, like, people know When I am on screen or on stage, I'm about to do some BS and I'm about, I'm about to taunt like a monster. I've invented new ways of taunting that only I do. I've invented taunting that requires, like, technical acumen, that like, requires skill. As if I was given the opportunity to just like, be separate from the Dema Papazian name. I would put on a luchador mask and a suit of 3D printed armor and I would be an absolute wretched monster with the lifter. I would, I would make you do the thing twice every single round. Ko with a lifter. Every single round. All three weight classes too.

[G]

Screw it.

[A]

3 pounds, 12 pound or 30 pound.

[F]

Same bot. Stick it in there.

[A]

Yeah, just multiply it each time.

[C]

Yeah, See, but the problem is now I really want to see this. This is all I want. Now I just want. I Illusionors.

[A]

I will figure out how to make an evil stable, which is all that we can do.

[G]

Yeah,

[C]

it's just so funny because the commerce, the whole community is just so nice. Yeah, it's just so nice. It's like, that's part of the problem is like, how are you? How do you be evil in this community at all? It's like it, it, it's so impossible.

[A]

Well, at this point, outside of the game, in fighting games, I'm also well loved. Like, people have me over Christmas and stuff.

[C]

Yeah, yeah.

[A]

But once, once the, once the cage doors close. Dude, we're about the game, so. Yeah, yeah, lock in.

[D]

Oh, this sort of like. Yeah, good. Sorry.

[B]

No, I was going to say that's not an environment that I know a lot about because fighting games are not, not usually my, my forte. So. Yeah, it's not.

[C]

I, I, I think, I think I've put on maybe competitive mode on probably like Soul Calibur or something like that.

[B]

SoulCalibur is probably the closest.

[C]

Just immediately regretted it. Just backed out like. Okay, sorry about this. I didn't mean to come into your space. I don't know what this is.

[D]

That's good.

[B]

Smash Brothers. I used to play Smash Brothers a lot online, but like, not, I would not be good at it.

[C]

Oh, BlazBlue. I love playing Blaze Blue against, against the computer. I'll play Blaze Blue against any other human being. Hell no.

[A]

By the way, that's, that's like some taste. That's, that's a fine one.

[C]

It's a good game. It's a good game. You know, you get like, you get like credit.

[A]

Any fighting game, local you go to just by saying you like Blazblue.

[C]

The first time I played Blaze Blue was.

[B]

No, not Blaze Blue.

[C]

The one it was originally was. What the hell is this called? It's got. No, no, no, no. It's got soul.

[B]

Soul.

[C]

Bad guy Soul.

[B]

Caliber.

[A]

That's Guilty Gear. But it's different game.

[C]

Guilty Gear. The first time I played Guilty Gear was on a broke PS2 that was allowed to play Japanese games, and it was just a Japanese import of Guilty Gear. That's a sick experience knowing, like, my. My high school girlfriend, like, her brother just did the. All the Japanese games, like, everything. Like the DJ game. All the. I played. I played. What the hell is it?

[B]

I.

[C]

Why can't I think of all these. But like, every single Japanese game and they blow every English game out of the. Out of the water, and you're like, these are the coolest games for. Oh, God, now I can't think of the name of it. You roll around a ball.

[D]

Katari Katamari.

[C]

Original Katamari is just like the coolest game ever.

[A]

Oh, that is one of my favorite games of all time. I can't. I can't play it because I get a vertigo headache.

[C]

Oh, yeah, yeah. That was.

[B]

That was probably one of the first not com. What. What's the genre of just of just like.

[A]

They call it cozy gaming.

[D]

Cozy.

[C]

Very cozy. Comfy game. Yeah, yeah. Oh, the. The tight. The Taiko drum game too. Whenever they.

[A]

That's the cutest guy ever.

[C]

Yeah. Oh, and then playing Tetris on invisible mode so you can't see the actual blocks as they go down. So a lot of stuff. But, you know, we're just.

[A]

We're talking games right now.

[D]

Yes.

[C]

Can I.

[A]

Can I. Another quick aside. Let me know. Let me tell you my favorite thing besides fighting games. I feel like people would appreciate this. It's called mystery games, and it's a. It's a tournament where every round is a different game. And they're typically 1v1 game, so you're still facing somebody, but instead of just like, yeah, oh, we're gonna sit down.

[G]

Play Street Fighter.

[A]

It's like, okay, round one is you have to race each other in Cruise in USA for the N64. Nice. Round two. Round two is you have to play a literal pong. Round three is, I don't know, super monkey ball versus mode.

[C]

Yeah, it's.

[A]

It's a really, really, really. It's a really, really fun experience. If you just love video games. If you just love playing different video games. And it's like Christmas because you never know what the next game is going to be. And every time it's like, all right, we're sitting and playing the enter the matrix versus mode on the PS2. It's like awesome. This game. I've never seen this game before in my life and I never will again and I'm about to play it for a tournament. It's fun. Sorry, I just wanted to. I just wanted to plug that. It's like. It's like you're good. It's like my gaming passion. I actually care about it more than fighting games.

[B]

No, that's very cool.

[H]

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[A]

Foreign.

[B]

Hey everyone, you're already listening, so you know the fights don't end when the episode does, but the Havoc Rundown now lives over@ Havocrundown.com again. That's Havocrundown.com that's where we're posting Combat Run Robotics news, hosting every episode of the show and running the largest Combat Robotics bot registry that's ever been put together. Stats, history, teams and results all built to grow alongside the sport. We're also curating fight videos, rolling out community games and dropping merch for anyone who wants to rep the chaos. And the 2026 fantasy league is live right now. You can create your own fantasy league for a full season or spin one up for a single day event. Draft robots track performance across events and competition compete in a way that actually fits how Combat Robotics is run. This year our focus is the sport as a whole. If robots are fighting, it belongs in the conversation. All leagues, all formats, all rule sets. From local events to competitions around the world. We have got you covered. Thank you for listening everyone. Let's get you back to the episode and back to the chaos right now. Okay, so we're gonna move from that. We're going to move on to our next next segment. So we're going to. We open up the questions before an episode to our listeners to see what our listeners want to know from our guests. So we're going to dial into our voicemail and see what's on the listener mailbag. You've reached the voicemail of the havoc rundown. Please leave your message after the tone. So I have quite a few here. There's a couple people that asked specifically Nick, who's going to be the first one. He's always the first one asked. One question for Julian, one for Dima, and then one for both of you. So we'll start with Julianne. Nick from Crafty Cat Combat says, hi, Julian, longtime fan, first time caller. We all know that's wrong. Nick, you literally ask the question every single episode.

[E]

First time. What?

[D]

First time.

[B]

Have you ever considered changing the name of the boss to MK and trb Fnd now that you have seen how vowels can slow you down. Hashtag, fry the fish.

[D]

All right, so here's a guy, and we could just stop recording right now. Here's a guy who's specifically antagonizing me and doing it on purpose. And he's trying to. He's just. This is a bad guy right here, and this is why we're not friends. If you guys can't tell, there's little evil Julian there. He's bullying me because I lost to berserker with no. No vowels. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I'm considering everything at this point. Extra vowels, extra vowels.

[A]

Bro, I'm with you. Torch that bridge. I honestly really like vowel as turbo fiend. I'm not going to lie. It is impossible to read that and get the real pronunciation.

[D]

But it looks.

[A]

It would look so. It would look so cool on a T shirt. Whatever.

[F]

That's going to be your license plate. That should be your license plate.

[G]

Ooh, nice.

[A]

Let's go. I Locking in that paperwork tomorrow.

[C]

Yeah, get the. Get the pizza plate. Get the pizza plate. No, I can't wait to.

[A]

I can't wait to merge without looking and cut somebody off. And they're like, what is turd fund?

[E]

Do they work for a hedge fund?

[C]

Yeah, it's fine. You won't be driving as bad as the New York drivers. It's okay. Don't worry about it.

[A]

We've been driving New Haven Pizza.

[G]

Don't mind if I do. Yep.

[B]

Okay, so that. That is Nick Trying to antagonize Julian.

[D]

And it worked.

[B]

He said, dima, you've really thrown yourself into the announcer side of things at NHL as someone who has done all day as both competitor and announcer. What's one thing you wish the two sides knew about the other that might otherwise go unnoticed?

[G]

Okay.

[A]

I have had some people, I'm not going to say who kind of imply to me like, oh, I could just do commentary. And I'm like, yeah, you have a lot of insight. It is kind of hard, though, to do it for, like, hours and hours, hours and stay interesting. And, like, even I know, like, I could. I could be doing a lot better with my bits. And. And he was like, no, I could. I could totally do that. And I seen him not have the stamina in competition.

[C]

And it's.

[A]

Honestly, it's. Oh, I'm not going to say who. What if I was just making it up? But regardless, like, the. The commentary side of it is like, you really. You don't get to just have dead air. That's the.

[G]

That's.

[A]

That's like the super hard part. It's like you really just are on. And like, after the event was done, I hung out with some people afterward, and guess who couldn't shut off because I. I put in all the effort to. I put in all the effort to get ridiculous. Like, have.

[B]

Be ready, turn that switch on. And you couldn't turn the switch off.

[A]

It's. It's like a switch that's, like, you can banter infinitely as long as you have the stamina. And I could not turn the switch off even when I did not need to anymore.

[E]

My problem is, you know those smoke alarms that have the battery that never dies? You just, like, turn the kill switch off at the end. I've got one of those batteries.

[A]

Yeah. I need a kill switch installed on the asap.

[E]

No, no, do not. Do not do that.

[A]

No, it's just. It's. It's just for the banter switch. Geez. I didn't get to answer, like, what's the. What's the part. The other. The other folks wishing to. Yep. From the commentary side, thinking about the competitors. Like, those builder sheets are awesome and they're not like a guideline. Like, it kind of. It kind of. I feel really bad sometimes when I mispronounce somebody's. I feel awful when I mispronounce somebody's last name. Sometimes they write it down and it's on me that in the moment, I might slip up in speech, but it's. I. I Got to do better about it. But it's. It's so rough when it happens, and it's just an honest mistake.

[G]

Yeah.

[D]

And what if you're trying to pronounce someone's name for 10 seconds and then suddenly the fight's over? You know, you have to, you have to keep it.

[A]

You have to keep it moving constantly. And I can't have my nose in the sheet. And I. But I. When. Okay, so sometimes in the pit on Friday, I will, I will walk with the builders and say, like, tell me something interesting about your bot. I, like, if you could just give me, if you could just throw me as a commentator, like a fun fact every now and then. It's something you want the audience to know. That's what I keep phrasing it, like, to people is like, I'm going to. I get to tell everybody about your robot. Tell me something awesome that you want the audience to know because I. Because I really am, like, for the builders in commentary. Because I know how awesome it is to be a comment, to be a competitor and have the commentator read my bio and, like, talk about it for a second or just like, I don't know. The commentators are fans of the sport too, so you end up being a fan of whoever you're talking about in the moment. That's the beautiful thing about it. Sorry, I'm ranting a little bit.

[C]

No, no, you're good.

[B]

Yeah, no, absolutely.

[E]

Yeah.

[B]

No, you're fine.

[A]

10:30 something.

[C]

Do you guys, do you. Do you all have a master sheet still? Or are you doing your own, like, notes or. Like, there's.

[A]

There's a live statue. I don't know if I'm supposed to be sharing secrets. There's a live stat sheet that gets updated, and when you click on a fight that's upcoming, it brings up the builder sheet for each robot sometimes.

[C]

Oh, that's cool.

[A]

Yeah, it is. It is really cool. Sometimes it'll. Sometimes it'll be missing one and I don't know if it's like, due to error or something. And sometimes I'm on my phone, phone, and I don't got Internet and we're in a five mile underground bunker. And I got to start bringing a laptop, but I don't own a laptop. I got to buy one.

[E]

You can just run like a five mile ethernet cable.

[A]

Yeah, I love, I love, I love asking. I love being like, hey, thank you so much for having me. Can I run some cables through here?

[D]

That's good.

[C]

Well, you could. You could always find, like, one of the million iPads that are around the building and do that too.

[A]

People are. People are using those. When I had.

[C]

When I was.

[A]

When I was concierging, I was like, don't steal my iPad.

[G]

Oh. Oh.

[A]

I had that. I had the, like, the armband thing, and I was a concierging, and I had. I felt so, like, bossed up in the pit, you know what I mean? I had a little pip boy.

[B]

So.

[C]

Yeah, like this. Yeah, okay.

[A]

Yeah, yeah, it was sick. I'm not gonna lie.

[C]

Yeah.

[B]

So next question for the two of you is, outside of video games and combat robots, what's something neither of you have done that you think you could compete in and be fairly even with another. Each other in.

[D]

Ooh, I saw this question. I saw all these questions. Not to ruin the mystique.

[A]

Something we're evenly matched at.

[D]

I've always wanted to face someone in a cooking contest.

[A]

Bro, I'll get you.

[D]

You'll get me?

[A]

I'll get you, man.

[C]

Sorry.

[D]

Especially if it was, like, a blind taste test where it's like, you know, we both cook meals, and no one's trying to make one or the other happy. Just, like, I think that would be very fun, and I think we would be potentially evenly matched, but, like, of course I would win. Like, we all know that I would

[A]

point in, you idiot.

[G]

What?

[B]

Oh, I love. I love hearing the. The sibling rivalry.

[A]

As soon as you mentioned we eat each other's food, I was like, obviously, I'm gonna poison you.

[D]

That's not what I. No, other people eat it. Poison them.

[A]

I don't care.

[D]

I guess all the judges are dead, so I guess I win by default.

[B]

I was gonna say, you can't judge me if you're dead.

[D]

Yeah, that's. That's good.

[E]

As.

[C]

As a former chef and somebody who has done former food competitions before. Yeah, sounds fun. If you need a judge.

[A]

I mean, like, you really want to try judging after the conversation we just had?

[B]

You're not gonna kill me.

[C]

I'll be fine.

[A]

Julian is like, I'm evil. I'm evil. And I'm like, I'm gonna poison you. And you're like, it's fine.

[D]

And the cops investigate it, but both of us poisoned him.

[C]

Yep. Yep. And the two poisons just, like, hit each other in my stomach, and I'm fine.

[A]

It's like an always sunny plot line.

[C]

Yes.

[B]

Oh, yes. Well, they did. They did have the flip cup episode where they poison them.

[A]

Yeah, there's that, but there's also. There's also the bit about stomach Neutralization that Mac brings up.

[G]

Yeah, yeah, it's two part.

[B]

Okay, so let's move on to Matt from Panda Bots from Pandemonium. He says, julian, how do you come up with chance and awesome branding ideas? And Dima, when Turbo Fiend return,

[D]

I guess I'll start with this.

[A]

The question was to you first. My bad.

[D]

Yeah, no, that's good. I think Matt's bringing this up because I was the one who was leading the charge on the it's the wall in finals. Well, Versov is just like, a very good phrase to say even before. Like, I've always really liked hyping up the matches if I don't know who it is. You know, it's just fun to get the crowd excited. Like I was saying before, I've noticed that chants don't really work. You know, if it was the wall. The wall or whatever, like 10 people might get excited and it's just going to die 10 seconds later. So instead of trying to get that going, I just decided, I'm going to scream. That's the wall. Every almost constant. And then Kevin and Matt were next to me, and anytime that I was quiet, they would just chime in. So it was almost just like we were bouncing off each other, just constantly yelling, and it was hilarious. And it got people into the match. And anytime, something fun, you know, anytime Ben did something good, we would go, that's the wall. I think at one point the camera got taken out and I was like, that's the camera. And it's just, you know, like I said before, like, this is. This is robot fighting. Like, we're allowed to have fun. And I think.

[B]

Good on your point of the chance. I think chance is a stamina thing, as people sometimes just run out of interest in doing it and they don't know when to end it. It's the same thing with, like, when you go to a certain sports, any kind of sports game, and they do the wave, like, people are like, I kind of want to do that. Even if it goes through one way, people continue trying to do it. And you're like, why? I think it's the same thing with chance. Like, it. It's. Yeah, I totally understand what you're saying with that.

[D]

Yeah. But so my point was like, I'm just. I'm gonna do this. So if anyone else wants to chime in, you guys can, but if not, I'm just gonna be screaming about the wall every three seconds. It was a lot of fun. Another recent one I think I did was at Massd showtime. I just kind of got a good win and I was like, oh, I think it might be showtime. What time is it, guys? It's showtime. And then I think it may have been like, Kokoto or someone who was next to me is like, it's 6pm so that was really good. Like, I just. I'm a big fan of just, you know, being silly, like everyone. We can have fun and still be silly.

[A]

I love. I love making hype too. I should just be louder on camera. I gotta. I gotta train my voice. It's a little difficult, guys. Turbo fiend return when it's hard. Everybody's. Nobody is giving me any negative feedback whatsoever on commentary, which is really frustrating me. A, because it's not giving me anything to work on. B, it's just making me think, like, oh, well, I'll just stay here. This is awesome. I get to watch robot fights all day and just talk constantly, which I love doing. Love the sound of my own voice. It's. It's hard to say.

[G]

You're going to have to either kick

[A]

me out of the writer's room or you're going to have to, I don't know, incentivize me.

[G]

Offer.

[A]

Offer me some sort of ridiculous grudge match or like a Faustian bargain or a deal with the devil. That'll get me. That'll get me back behind the turtle feedsticks.

[B]

Okay, so Matt with the builder behind Kilico, who's on our server, says Julian and Dima, with both your backgrounds, to my knowledge, not being in engineering, how have your experiences, success and failures helped you in other industries?

[D]

So this is an interesting one. And yes, he's correct. I have a computer science and game design degree. It's like sort of adjacent, but, like, as you guys all know, like, there's not really coding in robots unless you're doing like a melty brain or something. There. There can be, but.

[B]

Unless. Why am I Pearl?

[C]

Unless you're Pearl.

[D]

Right, Right. Yes. There are ways to evolve it, but, like, it's not a key to success, I suppose we'll say.

[B]

Right.

[D]

It's funny, like, anytime I talk to someone, I'm like, yeah, I build robots. You're like, oh, that's cool. Do you code them all and everything? And I'm like, yes, but there's not really coding. But to answer the question directly, I am just very obsessive about this and I'm very competitive and I think it's my drive that allows me to be as successful as I am. I don't think I'm very good at designing compared to a lot of people. And I look at people like Seth or Liam and I think they're way better drivers than me. But I do my very best just to learn everything. I try to read literally every message that comes through on the three pound chat, even though it's. There are times when it's just useless garbage. But I just try to soak up all the knowledge I can. And I think my obsessive nature more than my background is what allows me to succeed. Yeah.

[C]

Okay.

[A]

What do you think?

[C]

I don't know.

[A]

It. We didn't. We kind of barely even touched on, like, how competitive we are as people. Like, for me, kind of all my hobbies are competitive and my, even my non competitive ones, Like, I love doing visual art and stuff like that. I'm competing with myself. And that's kind of how I treat commentary. Like, I'm always trying to do a better job, yada, yada, yada. The question said industry specifically. And I want to chime in and be like, you mean like work? You want me to talk about work?

[C]

I.

[A]

Most of my career, it's kind of. Not right now, but most of my career has been in sales, which I love. And sales kind of. You either love it or you hate it. Especially if you want to do it for like multiple years and not just like, try to get a bag and get out. I love it because it enables a competitive personality and you're constantly trying to win. Like you are. You have deals that you're trying to win. And it's, it's funny when you log a deal in like your CRM or whatever for those that, you know, work with those things to like log a deal as well. Closed one and like smack their hands together. Be like, yup, I just made a bunch of money. It owns so hard. It rules. And I'm using an entirely different set of slang that I would use on NHL commentary, which is funny because it's like my other voice. But I don't know, it's just. It translates to robots in a different way. Like, we, our backgrounds aren't in engineering. Our backgrounds are in computer competing. And we really wanted to compete. We really wanted to compete in this and we did. And we kicked everyone's butts.

[D]

I don't have a dumpster yet.

[C]

Whatever.

[A]

You could be. You could be like 1% more evil, bro.

[D]

I'm trying.

[C]

Yeah.

[D]

Here's a funny story related to that. Like, Dima just won masty two weeks ago or whatever. At this Point. And, like, she won. And for a split second, she. I don't know if she said it out loud or she just said it later, but she was like. She thought that was the first time she won a tournament.

[C]

Yeah.

[D]

And that just. Shit.

[A]

Yeah, I. I, like, I almost. I almost teared up for a second. I was like, wow, my first win. And then I was like. I, like. I, like, shook my head like a cartoon character. Like, what am I thinking?

[C]

It.

[A]

I. That maybe that's just my weird attitude and personality.

[D]

Yeah. I think it's actually something that Dima have. I have talked about recently within smaller communities where it's like, is our drive like nature or nurture?

[A]

Well, never. We'll never know.

[D]

We'll never know. And I think part of it, I think it's sort of like I have a chip on my shoulder to try to prove that I am good to myself. But everyone else, you know. But yeah, like, even, you know, I got third at Worlds or whatever, so a lot of people would be happy with that. And not this year, but last year, 2024 now. Man, I'm washed up. That's why I'm evil. Julian, what was this?

[A]

Kids don't even say washed up. They just say washed.

[D]

Yeah, I'm washed. I'm unwashed, I'm stinky, and I'm washed. What was I saying? Like, I really never, like, to accept. Like, okay, that was good. And of course, I do, you know, take a step back and, like, appreciate my accomplishments, but, like, I always want to do more. Like, I think the ultimate goal is to get first and second at Worlds one day. With Dima, that might not be the current goal, especially because she's commentating and kicking butt. But, like, you know, I think that is just, like, you can't get much better than that. But, yeah, like, I'm just very driven, and I don't think I'm necessarily the best at designing. I know I'm not the best at designing. Like, my robots are kind of silly and dumb.

[C]

Wait, wait, wait, wait. You're not the best at designing? Let's go backwards in Mako. Okay, let's go backwards in Mako. You started as a modified ssp, right?

[D]

Yep, yep.

[C]

And with that first modified ssp, it was good enough that people knew Mako after that tournament. That's. That's an accomplishment. You put yourself out of the Beetleweight tournament, and everybody after that tournament was like, oh, look, it's Meiko. And now you've designed a robot that everybody knows what it is. Everybody knows who you are. And you have won so much. You were like, the number one for a while.

[D]

You don't have a dumpster, though. I don't have a dumpster, though.

[C]

It doesn't matter.

[A]

Ryan, I love you, but you, you're never. You're never going to get it either. And he's never going to listen because that's, That's.

[C]

I understand.

[A]

That's the attitude.

[C]

On the same way I. I love hyping up people that, like, I. I really enjoy. I want. I just want you to be hyped and understand that people, like, are super hyped to even, like it. Be in the same room as you and like, fight alongside of you and everything like that. Like, you gotta come on.

[D]

No, no, I.

[C]

You. You'll get a dumpster, but your dumpster will eventually come. You just need to make a meta robot that NHRL likes.

[D]

Okay, that actually reminds me. You were like, when I play fighting games.

[E]

Oh.

[D]

Like, I accidentally wound up in ranked, and it's like I'm stepping back. Dima and I are the type of people where it's like, we're entering ranked as soon as we can. Yeah.

[A]

Yeah.

[C]

Can I. I play. I play Farm Simulator as my number one game. So, like, that's. That's how I chill. I mean, like, I'm playing grounded too, right now, which is like, it's a little bit. Like, it's got a lot of fighting and kind of cool stuff in it. But, like, my number one hours is like Farm Simulator and like Power Wash Simulator and stuff like that. So I like, I chill. That's what I do.

[G]

We have no chill.

[A]

I get. I get yelled at in fighting games

[G]

because people know I won't even enter

[A]

the practice mode whatsoever.

[G]

And my combos, my com. I am maybe one of the.

[A]

I'm probably the best at my character in North America.

[G]

And my combos aren't perfect. Like, they're not even optimal. But I have. I have 20, 000 ranked games.

[C]

There. There is competitive farming simulator. It is a whole thing. That's, like, hard to explain why it's a whole thing, but it is a whole thing. But I don't do that.

[D]

And I'm.

[C]

Okay. Yeah, we. We should. We are, like, getting late, so I feel like this is going to be like a heart. I. I'm just trying, you know, speed. Okay, I know this is a question. So, Justin.

[B]

So without getting too far into it. Hey, Julian, Anthony wants to know what happened to the chicken parm.

[D]

Oh, my God. You just talked about how we can't go on late. And now we have to talk about this.

[G]

This is bad, this is bad, this

[D]

is bad, this is bad. This is real bad.

[E]

The audience needs to know.

[D]

The audience needs to know. You're trying to split up the Papasian siblings.

[G]

Okay.

[D]

This was a long time ago, probably about 15 years at this point. I worked retail, living at home. Dima also living at home. People who work retail, you know, like, sometimes you get called in on like a Saturday afternoon and if you're a good worker, you show up. So I, I had heated up a mighty fine platter of chicken parmesan family.

[G]

I'm pull up which frozen meal it was.

[D]

You're going to what?

[G]

I'm going to pull up which chicken parmesan it was.

[D]

Oh, yeah, yeah. Probably Stouffer, regardless.

[G]

Yeah, hold on, hold on. I got it though.

[D]

Beautiful dish. Enough to feed a whole family. Or me. I heated it up and then I got called into work and I went to work. It was probably like a six hour shift, cuz, you know, it was like the afternoon I come home, the entire thing was gone, the whole platter. And Dima can pick up here and tell the, tell the.

[G]

My side of the story. My side of the story.

[A]

Okay.

[G]

We're both living at home. I'm a hungry middle schooler. I have just gotten home from school at 3:00 clock or so, and I don't think Julian is home.

[D]

I wasn't.

[G]

He wasn't. And what is in the fridge? I mean, what is in the microwave, literally sitting in the microwave, but a chicken parmesan meal that has already gotten

[C]

cold again and is. And is already. I don't.

[G]

I. I can't speak. The true memory. I feel like I might have asked my. That I. I might have asked my mom. Is anybody gonna eat this?

[D]

Oh, and you didn't know? You didn't assume it was gonna be.

[C]

No.

[G]

You didn't know how you are getting home like six hours after this point?

[D]

Yeah, it's not in the fridge.

[G]

And you didn't tell anybody to put it in the fridge, Right.

[D]

So you had to heat it up instead of putting it in the fridge. Right?

[A]

I just, I didn't heat it up. I just ate it.

[D]

Okay, the point is, Dima's in the right. If I'm fortunate enough to outlive Dima, I'm going to be bringing this up at her funeral and there will be no forgiveness.

[A]

Plus, guys, you don't know how good it is to be doing your wrath

[G]

of the Lich King weeklies and dailies with a full chicken plate of chicken parmesan. Yeah, I'm rubbing it in bad right now.

[C]

Oh, man.

[E]

If this funeral does happen, I will defend Dima, honest.

[D]

It was good.

[C]

It's a good meal for one. I do know because I used to be an Italian chef, and I used to come home and do wow afterwards with whatever leftover food I had. So, yes, let's go. So I will say, growing up as siblings with Justin, I think I. Every time I've eaten, especially, like, in a new relationship or something like that, and people watch me eat, they're like, why do you eat so fast? I'm like, because it'll be gone.

[D]

Yeah.

[C]

It's like, oh, no, Because. Because if I don't eat as fast as possible, then there is no sharing left, and that's why it's gone. So, you know. Yeah, I could totally see warming something up and coming home and be like, where'd it go? And Justin being like, I don't know. It was delicious, though. I had no idea.

[D]

Oh, wait. The funny thing is, there was no, like, debate. There was no confusion. Kim was like, yeah, I ate that. Yeah, I ate it and it was good.

[C]

I did eat it.

[A]

It's not a. Yeah, we know.

[C]

Yeah.

[B]

Okay. Well, that clears up that mystery. Megan says. Megan, actually, our freestyle guru has a question from her dad, who says, your bots seem to be very. So this is for both of you. Your bots seem to be very stylish and colorful. Mako, for example, can you describe the process of what goes into building decisions, materials, weapons, colors, names for your robots.

[D]

Dima, you want to start? I've been dominating the conversation a bit.

[G]

It's okay. So Julian likes to go with a sort of simple is best design, at least to start on a robot. He'll iterate from there. But one of the reasons our robots are so bright and colorful is because it ties into the fact that we're making big pieces of plastic that are easy to repair and sort. I think that sort of, like, easy to repair and, like, I don't want to say simple design because it's not simple. And over all the iterations, it's become more and more complicated with tons of little tiny details that most people won't notice or ever know that, like, kind of inform why they're. Why they fight the way they do and why they're so good and why they're so fun. But we're making. We make things in big chunks, in big pieces. There's not a ton of Tiny assembly happening there. There's not a ton of tiny machine pieces or whatever. I think that those, like, sort of the big plastic that we're doing lends itself to a bright, vibrant toy like design. And yeah, I infer toy way more for Turbo Fiend and Turbo Friend because they're anthropomorphic. Not anthropomorphic. They're not like human, but they're like little creatures.

[A]

They have.

[G]

They have little eyes. Mako doesn't have little eyes, but it moves like an animal. And I think part of it is just like, I don't know, we're given the option of being. You could just use black TPU if you wanted or just. Or just white tp. Although we did do that once. Probably.

[A]

Probably never again.

[C]

Can I offer you see through tpu? See through tpu.

[D]

That's a risk.

[C]

Then they'll see where they got it in.

[G]

But. But you. You know what I mean? Like, we could just go for black tpu, or we could go for something neon green that glows in the dark. Or we could go. Or we could go for bright, bright, bright red that, like, looks like a. A big gummy.

[D]

Yeah. And it's funny because, like, when I ran makeup the first time as an ssp, like, I almost. I, I. It was up in the air what color I was going to use. It was like, oh, it's gonna be orange. It's gonna be purple. And I think the commentary the first time they saw me, they were like, why is a shark bright yellow? But, like, as soon as you see it fight a few times, like, that's just what it is.

[G]

Yeah.

[D]

And the colors were sort of synonymous. I think, like, the iconography is also interesting on Meiko. Like, Dima's robots are sort of like creatures. Mine actually has, like, a creature drawn on it. So, like, the little guy is Meiko. Like, in, like, the classic shorts that have gotten a lot of views. Like, you see the cut happen, and then you see, like, a little shark with the angry eyebrows. It's sort of memorable and it's unique. Where I think a lot of robots are sort of like, badass. That's sort of like the default theme, and those are very cool too. But it's sort of fun to have your. Have your own thing where Meiko is like, an evil, cute, little, mischievous shark, and then you sort of just work backwards from there, I guess.

[C]

Yeah.

[G]

Part of it is it ends up, like, feeling like we just. We slap on design elements that feel natural in the moment. Like, we just talked about how Meiko was originally an SSP kit. It wasn't totally completely lime green. And then it was like, well, I'm gonna, I'm gonna keep going with the lime green parts. I might as well be entirely lime green, etc. For turbo fiend, it got like more curved and evil looking over time because it kept, kept fighting with it and it like turned. Took on like the devilish tone. Hell's always part of like the theme. But, you know, we kept iterating and we kept just being like, well, this feels natural. Right. Julian does more of the design work than I do most of it. But you know what I. You know what I mean, right? You can corroborate that?

[C]

Yep.

[G]

The question also asks weapons, and I think the ease of use thing kind of feeds into the weapon. Not saying that Mako's weapon design doesn't have a ton of thought put into it, but like, he does often brag about how it's a shell piece you can just buy. I mean, a saw off the shelf you could just buy. And Turbofiend uses a hub motor, which is comparatively easier to use than other motor and weapon assemblies. So part of it is just like, we're gonna, we're gonna try an easy thing that's new to us and see what happens. It just happens that it ends up usually working really well and we keep going with it.

[D]

Yeah, I think the, one of the classic jokes about DMNI is that we don't know how to do belts or gears. And it's not really a joke, it's just true. I've talked to multiple people. They're like, bro, I will show you how to do belts. And I'm like, yeah, maybe we'll see.

[G]

It's an extra point of failure. It's fine.

[D]

Yeah, I like the simpler a robot is, the better. Like the best robots in the world, their belts randomly get hit, you know, thinking, what was it? Chop versus bite force, Remember? Is that, is that the one that's like the only loss they really had where it was like they lost their weapon, where if the weapon was. You know what I mean? Not that I'm comparing myself to that robot, obviously. I'm saying when I don't have belts, I don't have gears. My design doesn't have to take those into account. I can focus on other things. You know, I'm not going to lose a match here or there because my belts fail, you know, lose matches for other reasons. But like, yeah, I like simple designs. The simpler the better.

[A]

Nice.

[B]

Okay, so we're Gonna move on to our last question, which is actually the closest we've ever had to a live asked question. Che actually put this in the mailbag 10 minutes ago as we were chatting. So I'm gonna choose. She put two. I'm gonna put. I'm gonna read you the second one because you already kind of answered the first one about aesthetics and that kind of stuff. So no. Question is.

[G]

I did see that question. Let me get to it after.

[B]

Okay.

[C]

Why do we pick that one?

[A]

Then it was.

[G]

It was like, is artistic expression slash fashion something that's always been part of your lives? Because she shouted out my jacket, Which I was really. I was really proud of. Fashion has not always been part of my life. I did not want to dress myself until I was an adult and out on my own. And admittedly transitioning, not to make it all about me, but we love being flashy and, like, we wore luchador masks and tights in the ring. We love. We love that aspect of it. It's just that artistic expression isn't always something that bleeds through, but sometimes it does. And if. If it's just something that we apply to our hobby or ourselves. Like, I admit I don't really care about dressing up for work to go to the office, but I. Whenever I. Whenever I go out to literally any event, I obviously throw a little something together. But, yeah, we all. But in fighting games, like, I built my own controller. I did. I did express myself that way. I think that sort of expression is a big part of us. We're very expressive people. Sorry about the second part.

[B]

No, no, you're fine. So you both seem to find yourself more and more in the spotlight as recognizable influences in the sport, which the Lee family loves. What has it been like to experience and navigate that visibility?

[D]

I'm actually almost crying, which is kind of crazy. But it means a lot to me when, like, young kids come up to me and be like, yo, your robot's so cool. Can I get a picture with you?

[C]

Or whatever.

[D]

Like, I had, like, four people ask for selfies on the past Saturday, which is just crazy to me because it means, like, they're getting excited about this. And I think, especially for nerds like us, having a sport like this where you can be yourself, it just means a lot. And being an influence to these people, where it's like, it's okay to be weird, it's okay to have fun and still compete your heart out, it means a lot. Evil Julian shouldn't be crying.

[A]

I'll jump in. I'll Say that because you're not evil.

[E]

Look what you've done.

[G]

Being in the spotlight has been super

[A]

important to me and not nearly as I should have. Never been as afraid of it as I was.

[G]

And I've.

[A]

I've told people in NHL staff this as well, but NHRL was one of the first times in my entire life where I was, like, out as myself. I kind of the. The start of my NHRL career kind of coincides with the start of my hrt, which is essentially the start of my medical transition. And it's not related in that way, but it's. It just happened to coincide that way. I didn't expect to become visible through the sport. I expected to be Julian's sidekick, if anything. And we have different roles now, and I am visible for something outside of even just competing by his side. What has it been like to experience it? Unreal. I'm talking to people right now who are listening to, like, my real unfiltered voice and actually care what I have to say. It's ridiculous. In all my other sports and combat robots. In martial arts, you're a silent figure for the most part. You just get up there and play the game. People listen to me talk sometimes around there, but not nearly to the same regard as I'm held at NHL, which is just so strange to even be held in your people's regard. It's a really beautiful thing and it's not hard to navigate at all. And every, like, every fan, every build that I've ever spoken to, this is the literally the best community ever. Everybody's so sweet, especially. Especially the people who ask this question. But, yeah, but I. Yeah, I have a. A fan made a candy bracelet for. For me and Turbofiend that I wear every day. I take it off to sleep. Yeah, I take it off to sleep and go to the shower. And that's maybe it. And there's never. I'm probably going to get a tattoo of Turbofiend eventually and Turbo Friend, but it's. I. I don't know. I guess we are. It is getting late, so I take the opportunity to use this question to say thank you guys for making us visible. Because it's really beautiful to be seen. Isn't it awesome?

[E]

We got the most wholesome question as we were recording.

[B]

Thank you, Trey.

[A]

Buzzer beater. Let's go. Yeah.

[B]

Before we wrap things up, let's zoom out for Norwalk and take a look at what's been happening across the combat Robotics world over the past couple of weeks. In our segment Havoc inside the arena.

[A]

Foreign.

[B]

We're going to start with the big one, of course. The NHL Open World Championship round one on February 7th. The 30 pound champion was Kazalite. The 12 pound champion buzzkill three pound champion was Wall part two. And new for this year, the XP three pound champion was Gremlin. We're gonna move up to Massachusetts for mass destruction. The the Plastic Ant Weight champion was Illegal Dorito. And Beetle Weight champion was Turbo Fiend down in North Carolina at the St. Valentine's Day Massacre Mixer. The Beetle Champion was Snuggle Muffins. And the Plastic Ant was Viewfinder. The Ant Weight was Cinnamon Roll. And Fairy Weight was Scintillator. Moving over to Winter Wars 26 in Oregon. Beetleweight was toad rage. The plastic second winner was void. And the Fairy Weight winner was Zipzob. Moving over to the online at bot rumble for January 2026 from Utah. The 150 gram combat winner was Swiss cheese. And the 150 gram control winner was Wide Boy. We're gonna zoom way out and go over to Latvia. At Prelude Robotics in their competition. The Beatleweight winner was Tara Bates. The Ant Weight was Nicks. And the Fairway champion was Quattro. No Mini. I think that's how you say that. Moving over to Oklahoma, the Tech Center Takedown. The Ant Weight winner was Not a Boy. And Plant was Sidewinder. Moving over to New York. Big Apple Bash. The Antway winner was Enigma at Scar in California. Clash at the Comb. The Antway winner was G Money. And for Fairy Weight was Splinter. And from the Impact Robotics leave Winter Wreckage in California. The open division winner was Arc Star. The Intermediate division was Megavolt. And the Beginner division was over. From 150 gram bots to 30 pound bruisers. From Boston to Latvia. The sparks are flying everywhere. The 2026 season is officially underway. And it's only going to get louder. Now let's finish up the episode that's going to wrap up season three, Episode three of Havoc Rundown. Huge thanks to Julian and Dima for joining us and sharing their stories, their madness, their deep dives into their branding, their bots and everything in between. Thank you guys so much for being on. It was an amazing conversation.

[D]

Thank you for having me. And when I was crying earlier, that was fake. I was hacking. That was me testing a new good character. Okay, Just saying.

[B]

I thought you were going to say that's something that we, we put in

[D]

post or that it was cgi.

[A]

Thank you. Thank you guys for having me. I got to talk at you guys on the NHL stream all day on Saturday. And you guys want me to keep talking? Awesome.

[C]

Yeah.

[B]

Yeah. No, we love that you guys are awesome.

[C]

Yeah.

[E]

Let's talk. Won't stop.

[C]

Yeah.

[B]

So whether you're rooting for Mako Turbofine or just here for the ride, this was a stacked episode that kick off our NHL 2026 coverage. And we're just getting started. If you want to keep up with us, check our fantasy standings. To learn more about upcoming guests and episodes, head over to our official site, havocrundown.com and that's heav rundown.com there you can get our podcast, episodes, merch, games, fantasy, everything that you want out of the podcast. Thanks for listening, and as always, we'll see you in the pet. Everyone say goodbye.

[C]

Everyone say goodbye.