‘Conclave Fever’ in Rome, and Trump’s Plan to Send Migrants to Libya

Summary

Podcast Summary: The Headlines Episode: ‘Conclave Fever’ in Rome, and Trump’s Plan to Send Migrants to Libya
Release Date: May 7, 2025
Host: Tracy Mumford
Reporter: Jason Horowitz

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I. The Papal Conclave in Rome

Jason Horowitz provides an in-depth analysis of the ongoing papal conclave in Vatican City, describing it as a period of intense “conclave fever” where 133 cardinals are meticulously deliberating to select the next Pope. Over the past two weeks, the cardinals have engaged in numerous private meetings aiming to define the characteristics they desire in their successor, though specific preferences remain undisclosed.

Horowitz explains the conclave's procedures, highlighting that the cardinals are confined within the Sistine Chapel from 4:30 PM onwards and will continue voting until a two-thirds majority is achieved. He notes, “It seems like a majority maybe want a mix. They want to keep going in the general direction of Francis, but maybe want someone a little more moderate...” (02:17).

The unpredictability of the conclave is emphasized, especially with many new cardinals appointed by Pope Francis hailing from diverse global backgrounds, which complicates alliance formations. Horowitz speculates, “These past two weeks have been sort of a learning process, a speed dating, if you will, for these guys...” (02:17).

Notable Candidates:

• Cardinal Perelin of Italy: Viewed as a steady and competent choice, albeit somewhat bland.
• Cardinal Taglay of the Philippines: Potential first Pope from Southeast Asia, known for his dedication to assisting the poor, aligning closely with Pope Francis’s progressive agenda.

Horowitz anticipates that a swift decision on the first day is unlikely, suggesting a prolonged conclave with potential black smoke signaling no consensus, thereby heightening the uncertainty surrounding the next papal selection.

II. Escalation in India-Pakistan Conflict

The podcast transitions to the escalating tensions between India and Pakistan. Earlier this morning, India conducted strikes against Pakistan, intensifying their long-standing conflict. These strikes followed a recent attack in Kashmir, where over two dozen civilians were killed—a tragedy India attributes to Pakistani-backed terrorists, a claim Pakistan denies.

In response to the strikes, Jason Horowitz states, “India will now face Pakistan's very fierce response” (04:48). Shortly after, a Pakistani official asserts the nation’s intent to retaliate, emphasizing the fragility of peace in the region.

The situation remains volatile, with local reports indicating that two Indian military planes were downed during the strikes, further complicating the geopolitical landscape and raising concerns about a potential escalation into broader warfare between the nuclear-armed neighbors.

III. Developments in the Trump Administration

A. Agreement with the Houthis

Vivian Nirheim shares significant news regarding the conflict in Yemen. The Houthis have declared their cessation of hostilities against American ships in the Red Sea, a move announced by President Trump. In return, the U.S. will halt bombing operations against the militant group in Yemen.

Tracy Mumford reports, “President Trump said the US had reached an agreement with the Houthis. The US will stop bombing Yemen...” (05:09). The Houthis, who had been disrupting one of the world's busiest shipping routes, portrayed the agreement as a victory, while American officials view it similarly. However, analysis from an unnamed expert suggests uncertainty remains about the Houthis' future actions and the shipping industry's response to ongoing risks (06:11).

B. Deportation Plans Involving Libya

Tracy Mumford reveals that U.S. officials are planning to deport a group of migrants to Libya. Details are scarce, but Libya’s detention centers, notorious for human rights abuses, would handle these migrants. This initiative follows similar actions, such as deportations to El Salvador and preliminary discussions with Rwanda. The plan underscores the administration's ongoing efforts to manage immigration through international agreements.

C. US-China Trade Talks

Scheduled trade meetings in Switzerland mark the first formal engagement between the U.S. and China since the imposition of over 100% tariffs by President Trump, escalating the trade war. Jason Horowitz anticipates that these talks will focus on de-escalation rather than comprehensive trade deals, asserting, “My sense is that this will be about de-escalation, not about the big trade deal...” (08:03). The prolonged trade conflict has had significant economic repercussions, affecting consumers and industries in both nations.

D. Termination of Energy Star Program

The administration has announced the termination of the Energy Star program, a long-standing initiative aimed at promoting energy-efficient appliances. Tracy Mumford highlights the financial implications, noting that the program cost approximately $30 million annually but generated $40 billion in utility savings for American households and businesses. This decision represents a shift away from government-led climate change initiatives, drawing criticism from energy efficiency advocates.

IV. Unique News: Job Opportunity on Colonsay

In a lighter segment, Tracy Mumford shares an intriguing opportunity for those seeking a drastic lifestyle change. The owner of a fish smokery on Colonsay, a remote Scottish island with a small, aging population, is offering his business to a young couple or family willing to relocate. The island boasts amenities such as a golf course, a bookshop, and sandy beaches, making it an attractive prospect for dreamers and schemers alike.

The offer has garnered significant interest, reminiscent of similar initiatives in Ireland and Greece aimed at revitalizing remote communities. Interested individuals are encouraged to visit Colonsay via ferry, highlighting its accessibility despite its seclusion.

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This episode of The Headlines encapsulates a wide array of pressing global issues, from the sacred deliberations of the Catholic Church to geopolitical tensions and significant policy shifts within the U.S. administration. Through insightful reporting and expert analysis, host Tracy Mumford and her team provide listeners with a comprehensive understanding of the day's most impactful stories.

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Timestamp References:

• 02:17
• 04:48
• 05:09
• 06:11
• 08:03

Transcript

[Tracy Mumford]

I gave my brother a New York Times subscription. We exchange articles and so having read the same article, we can discuss it. She sent me a year long subscription so I have access to all the games. The New York Times contributes to our quality time together. It enriches our relationship. It was such a cool and thoughtful gift. We're reading the same stuff, we're making the same food, we're on the same page. Learn more about giving a New York Times subscription as a [e-mail] gift from the New York Times. It's the headlines. I'm Tracy Mumford. Today's Wednesday, May 7th. Here's what we're covering.

[Jason Horowitz]

What we have in Rome right now is a case of conclave fever. Over the last two weeks, Vatican City has been full of cardinals. They've been in the back rooms of churches, space spinning about what type of pope they want. They won't say exactly who they want, but they'll get close by saying what characteristics they're looking for. Around St. Peter's Square, you'll see reporters trying to ambush cardinals on the way out of these daily meetings that they have behind Vatican walls. In restaurants, waiters will also give you their short list based on who's been eating there and what they're overhearing at tables. Everyone's just desperate to know as much as they can about which way these 133 cardinals are Le my colleague Jason.

[Tracy Mumford]

Horowitz is covering the Conclave, the Catholic Church's ritual for selecting the next pope. It begins today at 4:30pm when the eligible cardinals are locked inside the Sistine Chapel. They'll stay there and vote until a two thirds majority can agree on which one of them will lead the church and its 1 billion members worldwide. The ballots will be burned after each round and the chimney of the chapel will release colored smoke, black if there's no consensus, and white when they've made a decision. Jason says the cardinal's votes will in many ways be a referendum on how Pope Francis led the church before he died. Some cardinals may push for a new pope willing to continue in Francis footsteps, talking openly about progressive issues. Others may push for a candidate who will reinforce more conservative church doctrine.

[Jason Horowitz]

It seems like a majority maybe want a mix. They want to keep going in the general direction of Francis, but maybe want someone a little more moderate, someone who is not going to shake the institution so much and give them a rest. But you know, that's just one theory of the case. Conclaves are always unpredictable because, you know, you never know who's going to come out of it as pope. But this one seems especially unpredictable because there are so many new faces, so many new cardinals that Francis appointed from all over the world. So because they don't know each other often it's harder to form new alliances. And not everybody has such a good read on everyone's politics, their ideology, their culture. There's all sorts of things that people don't know know about one another. And so these past two weeks have been sort of a learning process, a speed dating, if you will, for these guys to really get to know each other and decide who amongst them has the charisma, who has the leadership abilities and who agrees with them on their vision for the church. So today it would be astonishing if they come out with a Pope because usually on the first day it's sort of symbolic candidacies. They're feeling one another out. But there's a sense that this one is going to take longer. And if we get into the end of Thursday without a pope, and especially if we get through Friday without a pope and there's just black smoke and no white smoke, I think the ideas of the strong candidacies that we had going in are probably out the window. And whoever comes out on that balcony is going to be anyone's guess.

[Tracy Mumford]

At the moment, the two most talked about candidates to replace Pope Francis are Cardinal Perelin of Italy, considered a steady, competent, if somewhat bland option, and Cardinal Taglay of the Philippines, who would be the first Pope from Southeast Asia and shares Francis dedication to working with the poor. Early this morning, India said it had carried out strikes against Pakistan, escalating a decades long conflict between the nuclear armed neighbors. The strikes came weeks after more than two dozen civilians were killed in an attack in Kashmir, the disputed border region between the countries. An attack that India blamed on Pakistan based terrorists, which Pakistan has denied. India said its forces hit nine different sites across the region and Pakistani military officials said at least eight people have been killed. Local news reports suggested that amid the strikes, two Indian military planes had been shot down.

[Jason Horowitz]

India will now face Pakistan's very fierce response.

[Tracy Mumford]

In a TV interview, a top Pakistani official said his country would retaliate.

[Jason Horowitz]

Make no mistake, because our desire for.

[Tracy Mumford]

Peace should not be mistaken for our weakness. At the White House yesterday we had.

[Vivian Nirheim]

Some very good news. Last night. The Houthis have announced that they are not, or they've been announced to us at least that they don't want to fight anymore.

[Tracy Mumford]

President Trump said the US had reached an agreement with the Houthis. The US Will Stop bombing Yemen, where the militant group is based, and the Houthis will stop attacking American ships in the Red Sea.

[Vivian Nirheim]

They were knocking out a lot of ships going, as, you know, sailing beautifully down the various seas.

[Tracy Mumford]

For more than a year, the Houthis have been launching strikes against commercial and military ships along what had been one of the busiest shipping routes in the world, saying they were attacking out of solidarity with the people of Gaza. The attacks caused major disruptions to global trade. And in the past few months, the U. S had launched a billion dollar military campaign against the group that was so intense, some US Military commanders were concerned it was depleting the Pentagon's stockpiles.

[Unnamed Analyst]

The Houthis are very skilled at propaganda and they pretty much immediately began portraying this announcement from Trump as a major win for them, almost that, you know, the US Is standing down.

[Tracy Mumford]

My colleague Vivian Nirheim has been covering the conflict.

[Unnamed Analyst]

Of course, the Americans are also celebrating it as a victory. And what actually sort of matters in terms of the effects for global shipping are two things that we need to wait to see, basically. Are the Houthis going to stop attacking any ships at all? Is it purely, you know, American vessels? Are they going to continue to target vessels that they believe are linked to Israel? And then we also need to wait to see how the shipping industry is going to react to this degree of uncertainty. You know, does this really change their evaluation of how risky it is to sail through the Red Sea and pass Houthi territory? Or are they going to take the safer route around the southern tip of Africa, which they've already been doing for a very long time at this point?

[Tracy Mumford]

Now, three more quick updates on the Trump administration. The Times has learned that US Officials are planning to send a group of migrants to Libya as part of the administration's deportation efforts. Many details of the plan are unclear, including the nationalities of any migrants that would be sent and where they would end up. But Libya has a network of detention centers that have been used to house migrants who tried to get to Europe from Africa. Human rights groups have called those centers, quote, a hellscape, where people have faced sexual violence, torture, and even slavery if it goes through. The Libya operation would mark the latest deal the administration has made with a foreign country to take migrants from the U.S. hundreds of people have been deported to a prison in El Salvador, and there have been early talks with Rwanda about sending migrants there. Also, administration officials are set to have their first formal trade meetings with China since President Trump hit the country with tariffs of over 100%. Escalating the trade war between them. The meetings are scheduled for this weekend in Switzerland, with Treasury Secretary Scott Besant leading the US Delegation.

[Jason Horowitz]

My sense is that this will be about de escalation, not about the big trade deal. But we've got to de escalate before we can move forward.

[Tracy Mumford]

The trade war has sent economic shockwaves through both countries, threatening to raise prices for American consumers and potentially put millions of people out of work in China. And you know those little blue stickers with a star on them that are on a lot of dishwashers and refrigerators? They come from Energy Star, a government program designed to help consumers easily spot efficient appliances and save money on energy costs. Now the administration has announced the decades old initiative is ending as it guts programs that were designed to fight climate change. The head of one energy efficiency advocacy group told the Times that Energy Star only cost about $30 million a year to run, but it saved American households and businesses $40 billion a year on their utility bills. And finally, here's an interesting job offer for you, depending on how much you would like to escape from the world and how you feel about smoked fish. The owner of a fish smokery on a remote island in Scotland is giving his business away if you're willing to commit to living there. The island, Colonsay, has a population of 125, the majority of whom are over 60. The owner wants there to be more young people, so he thinks the ideal candidate for the smokery will be from a young couple or family. After putting the offer out there this week, he told the Times he's gotten a lot of interest already. Quote, I'm getting loads and loads of inquiries from people I'd call dreamers and schemers. This is not the first one of these kind of offers. In the past few years, Ireland's offered to pay people willing to live on remote islands, and an island in Greece launched the same kind of scheme. If you are considering Kolonsee, it is reachable by ferry. It's got a golf course, a bookshop and sandy beaches. You can send us a postcard or some salmon or no, maybe, maybe no fish in the mail. Those are the headlines today on the Daily the legacy of Warren Buffett, who announced he's stepping down from his role running one of the most successful companies in modern history. That's next in the New York Times audio app, where you can listen wherever you get your podcasts. I'm Tracy Mumford. We'll be back tomorrow.