3 and Out - Shedeur FOURTH On Depth Chart, Stafford Injury, Anthony Richardson Officially A BUST, College Football Preview w/ Josh Pate

Summary

Podcast Summary: The Herd with Colin Cowherd Episode Title: 3 and Out - Shedeur FOURTH On Depth Chart, Stafford Injury, Anthony Richardson Officially A BUST, College Football Preview w/ Josh Pate
Release Date: August 12, 2025
Host: iHeartPodcasts and The Volume

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Introduction

In this episode of The Herd with Colin Cowherd, released on August 12, 2025, Colin Cowherd delves deep into some of the most pressing issues in the NFL and provides a comprehensive preview of the upcoming college football season with special guest Josh Pate. The episode is structured to offer rich, engaging discussions, complete with insightful analysis and candid opinions.

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Personal Anecdotes and Episode Kickoff (04:24 - 05:35)

Colin begins by recounting a recent weekend spent with a fellow sports commentator in Chicago. They shared experiences ranging from workouts and live golf sessions to casual dinners and cigars. Colin remarks, “[05:00] Colin Cowherd: Nice humble abode he's got in, in the suburbs.”

This personal touch sets a relaxed tone for the episode, illustrating the camaraderie and mutual respect between Colin and his guest.

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NFL Quarterback Dynamics: Shedeur Sanders and Cleveland Browns (05:35 - 17:13)

Shedeur Sanders’ Position on the Depth Chart

At [06:20], Colin introduces the primary NFL topic: Shedeur Sanders’ status on the Cleveland Browns’ depth chart. The discussion centers around the challenges faced by the Browns' coaching staff in managing quarterback talent. The commentator asserts, “There are NFL quarterbacks who know their team’s playbook inside and out yet fail to perform on the field” ([15:03]).

Analysis of Coaching Rigidity

The conversation highlights Kevin Stefanski’s coaching style, characterized by rigidity and high expectations for quarterbacks to flawlessly execute the playbook. The commentator critiques this approach, emphasizing that it can stifle a quarterback's natural abilities and adaptability. “[16:23] Colin Cowherd: You’re not going to be able to shake this.”

Impact on Team Performance

The rigidity in coaching is posited as a potential reason for the Browns’ struggles, especially if Sanders fails to meet performance expectations during preseason games. The commentator warns that persistent issues can lead to significant setbacks for the team: “[17:13] Sports Commentator: And this Shador thing already feels a little clanky.”

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Rams’ Quarterback Situation and Matt Stafford’s Injury (17:24 - 25:00)

Matt Stafford’s Injury Implications

Transitioning to the Los Angeles Rams, Colin and the commentator discuss Matt Stafford’s recent back injury ([17:24]). Stafford’s inability to practice has cast uncertainty over his availability for the season, raising concerns about the Rams’ offensive stability. “[19:10] Josh Pate: Help.”

Potential Season Fallout

The commentator predicts that if Stafford remains sidelined, the Rams could face a tumultuous season. He draws parallels to past NFL scenarios where quarterback injuries led to diminished team performance: “[19:35] Sports Commentator: They clearly do a really good job of team building and transition...but this year could be weird.”

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Anthony Richardson and the Indianapolis Colts: A Busted Quarterback? (25:00 - 35:00)

Richardson’s Performance Critique

A significant portion of the episode critiques Anthony Richardson’s performance with the Colts, branding him as a "bust." The commentator highlights Richardson’s inaccuracies and inability to read defenses, which resulted in a disappointing showing against the Ravens: “[21:28] Colin Cowherd: The game because his pinky finger was.”

Future of the Colts’ Quarterback Position

The discussion extends to the Colts’ broader quarterback woes, suggesting that without a reliable starter, the team’s prospects for a successful season are bleak. “[23:49] Sports Commentator: Anytime you have a busted quarterback and don’t have a fix it, the boat usually sinks.”

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College Football Preview with Josh Pate (35:00 - 76:44)

Evolving Roles in College Football Management

Josh Pate joins the discussion to provide insights into the evolving landscape of college football management. He explains the increasing significance of General Managers (GMs) in college programs, a role traditionally dominated by Athletic Directors (ADs). “[35:35] Josh Pate: It’s very much a role that everyone has now.”

Challenges and Financial Implications

Pate delves into the financial constraints affecting program decisions, particularly the complexities surrounding coaching buyouts and salary allocations. He notes, “[40:23] Josh Pate: And that’s why the buyouts of these coaches have gotten more complicated because of paying the players.”

Impact of Transfer Portals and Recruiting

The conversation shifts to the impact of transfer portals on team dynamics and recruiting strategies. Pate emphasizes the difficulty of retaining talent and the necessity for programs to adapt to the new competitive environment: “[43:48] Josh Pate: This is the first wave of kids coming through your program who have been like this since they were five years old.”

Specific Program Analyses

a. John Gruden and College Coaching: Pate discusses the potential hiring of John Gruden in college football, highlighting his adaptability and strategic prowess. “[49:14] Josh Pate: He’s a stud. He is the absolute right guy for that job.”

b. LSU and Alabama’s Prospects: The analysis covers LSU’s struggles under Brian Kelly and contrasts it with Alabama’s robust program under Nick Saban. Pate predicts Alabama’s continued dominance while expressing skepticism about LSU’s trajectory: “[71:37] Josh Pate: Bama is a better team. I trust their balance more offensively.”

c. Penn State’s Future: Penn State’s quarterback Drew Allar is scrutinized, with Pate expressing cautious optimism about the team’s potential if Allar performs consistently: “[85:00] Josh Pate: They are not shying away from this stuff up there.”

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Key Insights and Conclusions

1. Quarterback Performance is Crucial: The episode underscores the pivotal role of quarterbacks in both NFL and college football, highlighting how performance and coaching strategies directly influence team success.

2. Coaching Rigidity Can Hamper Talent: Rigid coaching methods, especially regarding playbook memorization, can limit a quarterback’s natural abilities and adaptability, potentially leading to underperformance.

3. Financial Constraints Affect Coaching Stability: Increased financial obligations related to player salaries and coaching buyouts are making it harder for college programs to make swift coaching changes, impacting team performance and adaptability.

4. Transfer Portals Reshape Team Dynamics: The rise of transfer portals has introduced new dynamics in college football, complicating recruitment and retention of talent, which in turn affects team performance and program stability.

5. Alabama’s Continued Dominance vs. LSU’s Uncertain Future: While Alabama maintains a strong position under Nick Saban, LSU faces uncertainty under Brian Kelly’s leadership, with Pate expressing doubt about their ability to reclaim previous successes.

6. Potential of Emerging Programs: Programs like Florida and Oklahoma show promise due to strong recruiting classes and strategic coaching hires, indicating potential shifts in traditional power structures within college football.

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Notable Quotes

• “[06:20] Sports Commentator: You got Scotty to win and I parlayed that with Tommy Fleetwood and Ben Griffin.”
• “[15:03] Colin Cowherd: Everyone’s watching.”
• “[21:57] Colin Cowherd: Brock Purdy saved Kyle Shanahan, right?”
• “[35:35] Josh Pate: It’s very much a role that everyone has now.”
• “[43:48] Josh Pate: This is the first wave of kids coming through your program who have been like this since they were five years old.”
• “[49:14] Josh Pate: He’s a stud. He is the absolute right guy for that job.”
• “[71:37] Josh Pate: Bama is a better team. I trust their balance more offensively.”
• “[85:00] Josh Pate: They are not shying away from this stuff up there.”

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Conclusion

This episode of The Herd with Colin Cowherd offers a thorough examination of key quarterback issues in the NFL and provides an insightful preview of the forthcoming college football season. Through candid discussions and expert opinions, Colin and Josh Pate shed light on the evolving dynamics of football management, the impact of coaching strategies, and the financial intricacies shaping team performances. Whether you’re an avid follower of the NFL or passionate about college football, this episode delivers valuable perspectives to enrich your understanding of the sports landscape.

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Note: This summary excludes advertisements, promotional segments, and non-content sections, focusing solely on the main discussions and insights shared by Colin Cowherd and Josh Pate.

Transcript

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[Katie Couric]

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[Sports Commentator]

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[Josh Pate]

The volume.

[Sports Commentator]

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[Sports Commentator]

You can bet on a guy top five. You can bet on a guy top ten. My bet last week I'm going to roll over again. I got Scotty to win and I parlayed that with Tommy Fleetwood and Ben Griffin. Two top 10. I think if you want to have a little action on Scotty, he was one missed putt away from being in the playoffs. We know Fleetwood's not going to win, but he's going to be in the mix. Ben Griffin is hot right now. One other GU guy, Cam Young. So between Cam Young, Tommy Fleetwood and Ben Griffin, I like those guys to top 10 and I think Scotty Scheffler gets it done. So any, any sort of combination with those guys this week I'm fired up on Take your swing at winning some dough this week. Download the DraftKings sportsbook app and use the code John. That's Code Johan for new customers to get 200 in bonus bets instantly when you bet just five bucks only on DraftKings. The crown is yours.

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[Sports Commentator]

On Everybody three and out podcast. We are back in action.

[Colin Cowherd]

Yesterday we recorded with Colin.

[Sports Commentator]

I flew into Chicago on Friday, went to Colin's house, went to dinner with Colin, hung out with Colin that night, had some cigars. Next day we went to we got up early, got a little workout in, went to live golf, came home, had some more cocktails, ordered dinner and left Sunday morning. And then I did a podcast with him Sunday afternoon. So a lot of a Lot of time with Colin in Chicago which was, it was awesome. He was, he couldn't have been any cooler. Had me stay at his house, wouldn't let me stay at a hotel.

[Colin Cowherd]

Nice humble abode he's got in, in the suburbs.

[Sports Commentator]

Absolutely. Chicago is beautiful. It really is.

[Colin Cowherd]

Went out to dinner, had some steaks.

[Sports Commentator]

Some cigars and had a blast.

[Colin Cowherd]

Had a really, really good time with the, the big boss man. So yeah, I thought we'd do a little podcast today.

[Sports Commentator]

Here's the plan. We, I, I did a, I recorded an interview early this morning with Josh Pate. He has a massive YouTube college football show.

[Colin Cowherd]

I'm a big fan. Fellow bald brother.

[Sports Commentator]

He has been doing it for years.

[Colin Cowherd]

I had him on the podcast last week. So we recorded an interview this morning. I think it's like 45, maybe close to an hour, 50 minutes.

[Sports Commentator]

And I thought, you know what, instead of just doing the interview, I had some takes on the NFL from Shador.

[Colin Cowherd]

Sanders still being the four string quarterback to Stafford's back won't stop hurting to.

[Sports Commentator]

The Colts quarterback situation, Kyler. So I want to do a couple.

[Colin Cowherd]

Quarterback things before we dive into him. So that's the plan. I feel re energized today.

[Sports Commentator]

Feel good.

[Colin Cowherd]

So we have some, I'm interviewing Greg Olson tomorrow, obviously the Fox, you know, broadcaster, longtime tight end, a couple other ones in transit, potentially some other interviews.

[Sports Commentator]

So we're, we're mixing up a little.

[Colin Cowherd]

Bit as we, as we head toward.

[Sports Commentator]

The season, but very, very excited.

[Colin Cowherd]

You guys know the Drew.

[Sports Commentator]

If you listen on Collins Feed three.

[Colin Cowherd]

And out, make sure you subscribe. Also have a YouTube channel and we're pumping out podcasts all week, so subscribe.

[Sports Commentator]

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[Colin Cowherd]

Very careful in business with your family.

[Sports Commentator]

With your wife about being very, very rigid. And I think rigid people really struggle.

[Colin Cowherd]

In fluid situations when it's like sometimes.

[Sports Commentator]

You have to, I don't even want to say color outside the box, but be open minded to certain situations. And coaches can be like this to a degree that just makes fans, front office, personnel and definitely ownership go, what is going on? And I've always said this about coaches and Kevin Stefanski is an Ivy League guy. He is really, really smart and he's proven to be a good coach, right? He's won games with, with Joe Flacco, he won games with Baker Mayfield, he won in Cleveland where a lot of guys lose and whenever he gets fired, which you know probably not going to be there too long, the next guy will probably lose because that's kind of what happens in Cleveland. So I do not think Stefanski is some scrub, but I think coaches sometimes can get so consumed with the rigidity of, you got to know my playbook inside and out. And if you don't, I'm not even giving you a chance. And I know the playbook. I need you to know it like me, which is great. There are a lot of quarterbacks all throughout the NFL that know their team's playbook really, really well and are geniuses and their skill set fits that offense. Yet when they get out to the field, stink, cannot get a first down, could not lead a touchdown drive. I mean are God awful. The fans can see it, the front office can see it, the owner, but the coach, like, I love this guy. I was just watching the SEC show and Billy Napier, who's the head coach at Florida, was like obsessed with Graham Mertz, who seems like a great guy, seems like a high character, super smart, good dude, want to be friends with him. But it was like, you probably should play DJ Lagway. Like, well, he doesn't know all the plays. No one cares. Have the 10 plays that he knows. Run those because this other guy, you got no chance to win with this guy. And NFL coaches can be like that and listen, you need human beings to believe in you. We talked about this last week when Shadors opportunity came, right? You never complain or worry sometimes how the opportunity presents itself. Once it's there, it's on you to take advantage of. Whether that's someone listening that has an interview coming up that their uncle set up, whether it's the guy they're working with got sick and now you're in charge of the meetings, whether you're a quarterback and everyone on the team pulled their hamstring and now you're starting. Who gives a shit? It's your shot. Obviously LeBron James is a famous basketball player and that's the reason his son got drafted and got a four year contract. Well brought against playing games now. So if he wants to and he's good enough, he can take advantage of that situation happens all the time in all different industries. So how you get there, who cares? It's clear that the front office and the coaching staff were not big on Shador Sanders because if they were they would have drafted him in the third round. Instead they took another quarterback which listen, personnel and scouting and determining who's going to be good on your team, especially past the top elite players is a very subjective business. There is no exact science to this thing. I told this to Colin yesterday. There are guys all over the league. Shador just happens to be by far the most famous third day pick. But he is not alone. There are fourth rounders, fifth rounders, sixth rounder, seventh rounders all over the league that were underdrafted, who aren't just going to beat out first, second and third round picks on their own team over the course of the next year are going to run circles around those guys, are going to get second contracts and are going to be Pro bowl players. Every single draft produces these individuals. And the one headline I did see today when it came to Sandoz article on the quarterback tiers was a head coach in the NFL said the draft is over in relation to the polarization of Brock Purdy. Who gives a shit, four or five years ago he was drafted in the seventh round. We're in 2025 and he has several years of data of playing. So I'm guilty of this too. We hold on to like hey this guy was a 5th round pick. After a while it does not matter. And one thing's clear with Shador. He's an instinctive natural thrower of the ball in terms of Layering the ball, having touch on the ball. He made a couple throws in that game that were awesome. Whether it's a preseason game, who he's going against, he brings something to the table. But Stefanski's got to be very careful because the fans do not care. If you're like, well, we like Dylan Gabriel more. We think Kenny Pickett really knows the offense, that's fine. But you throw Kenny Pickett out there, throughout his career, when he's been thrown out there, he has not looked good. So you throw him out there. Let's just say this upcoming preseason game and he looks awful, no one's going to want to see him again. Not a soul. It's why, if I was them, I would start. If you want to start Dylan Gabriel, which is your prerogative, you drafted him over Shador. Because the one elephant in the room with this situation, the team's. The team is not going to be good. So when your team is not really good, it's hard to justify. It's like, well, let's just see what this guy can do, right? It's easy to do when your team's good. Be like, not play the young guy. Andy Reid did it once upon a time with Patrick Mahomes.

[Colin Cowherd]

Now he was a high draft pick.

[Sports Commentator]

Shador is not. But let's be real, like, not all situations are the same. And this is kind of an outlier situation. This guy is already feels like one of the more famous players in the league. So everyone was watching it. You got Jamie Foxx, you got LeBron, you got all these people tweeting and posting on Instagram and supporting this guy. And then he comes through and makes a bunch of plays. And I was like, well, we're going to kick him. That's not the way it works. Because in other positions, when you start making plays, you move your way up. But coaches with quarterbacks, they already have in their mind what they want. And clearly the coaching staff and the GM didn't want this guy because if they did, they would have taken him in the third round when they took Dylan Gabriel. So I'm cool with that. If you want to start Dylan Gabriel this week, but you can't convince the fans, you're not going to be able to convince the owner. If Dylan Gabriel looks terrible and Chador comes, we saw Shador playing preseason game look pretty good. And if Shador plays in the preseason game, once you yank Dylan Gabriel and he looks better than him, you can't be like, well, we like, no one cares. And this is What I think coaches struggle with, and I understand Bill Polian once had a, had a saying, listen to the fans, you'll be sitting with them. And there's probably some truth to that in certain situations, but there are some things that are just obvious. And in this situation, if I'm a Browns fan, I don't want to watch Kenny Pickett ever take a snap. I have seen him play for years on other teams. He's not good. Listen, I would be dubious of Dylan Gabriel, but you drafted him. I'll give him a benefit of the doubt. I'm an open minded fan. It's like, okay, put him out there, but if he ain't good in a fucking preseason game, I don't care. I don't want to see him in terms of like, he's ahead of Shador. And that's where I think Kevin Stefanski's got to be very, very careful in terms of like thinking, well, I know more than you guys when these games happen.

[Colin Cowherd]

Everyone's watching.

[Sports Commentator]

And now in your situation, more people are watching than ever. You're getting a little bit with Chador Sanders of like the cowboy treatment. What's not one of those, well, you guys don't really know what you're talking about. You don't know the plays. I know the play when the ball is snapped and he makes a move and he fucking layers the ball over a linebacker, a safety and a trailing.

[Colin Cowherd]

Corner and hits a guy in stride.

[Sports Commentator]

My mom can see that. And you watch enough preseason games where other random guys come in. All these situations are chaotic and they look like crap. We saw backup quarterbacks all over the NFL not be able to function.

[Colin Cowherd]

And we've seen it for years in the preseason.

[Sports Commentator]

No one's acting, no one with the brain is acting like this guy's perfect or he's going to be some star in the NFL. I think any level headed person just goes, maybe you should just give him some more time. And again, if he's bad, then you, then it's easier for you to pivot. But it's hard when you're like, yeah, we're just going to put him back.

[Colin Cowherd]

In the line again.

[Sports Commentator]

And I can already see this coming. This thing could get away from Kevin Stefanski. These guys, these two Ivy League elites are used to like, kind of getting like flying under the radar and some of this stuff, I mean, we've talked about this before. They've drafted multiple guys that haven't made.

[Colin Cowherd]

It to week one without having a domestic violence arrest.

[Sports Commentator]

Now I don't, I wasn't there. He said, she said stuff but like not happening for every team.

[Colin Cowherd]

They've been a part of this desean.

[Sports Commentator]

Watson thing that because it's the Browns, it was so ugly, people just like.

[Colin Cowherd]

I don't even want to talk about this anymore.

[Sports Commentator]

And again, that might be more on Haslam, but like these other situations in different markets, I don't think you could just shake them like this.

[Colin Cowherd]

You're not going to be able to shake this.

[Sports Commentator]

This is not going away. And he throws some more touchdowns and other guys struggle. Like you can't be like, well, let's just see Joe Flacco. You can do that Week one because like, hey, we owe this to Miles Garrett to play a veteran guy who.

[Colin Cowherd]

Knows what he's doing.

[Sports Commentator]

But after a couple weeks, no one's.

[Colin Cowherd]

Going to want to watch him take a snap.

[Sports Commentator]

I think this could really get away.

[Colin Cowherd]

From the Browns if they don't handle this in a way that they have just struggled to handle quarterback situations in recent past. They did a poor job clearly with Baker Mayfield. That situation got away from. The desean Watson thing is one of the biggest embarrassments in the history of the NFL.

[Sports Commentator]

And this Shador thing already feels a little clanky. Speaking of just weird situations, I think the Rams have a serious problem on their hands. I think there are some parallels with.

[Colin Cowherd]

Matt Stafford to Christian McCaffrey last year.

[Sports Commentator]

Where it's like, what's his injury? What's going on? Why can't he practice? And then he finally comes back to practice and then leading up to week one, after practicing for the week, Friday felt weird and then he wasn't able to go Sunday. And then the season was basically didn't.

[Colin Cowherd]

Happen until he came back and he got injured and it was just over before you even knew it.

[Sports Commentator]

Matt Stafford was supposed to practice today. It's what Sean McVeigh said the other day. He threw 60 passes on Saturday to kind of warm up for today to be the full time starter. The Rams guy, the person Mike Sando, based on coaches and GMs has as the fifth overall quarterback in the NFL.

[Colin Cowherd]

But he couldn't practice today because his back hurt.

[Sports Commentator]

And you see guys all around the league that terror meniscus, I think that happened to landon Dickerson.

[Colin Cowherd]

The 49ers had a guy with a high ankle sprain today.

[Sports Commentator]

There are some timetables where it's like, hey, this is a 4 week injury, 6 weeks worst case scenario. They're very black and white. Most injuries right ACL out for the season, broken hand, however many Weeks, it's very like you have a very good idea, start to finish. What you're dealing with maybe a week or two here, things can change. But like, you're not going in blind. The worst thing with the back is no one has any clue. And even when you think you've passed the litmus test or the line of everything's going to be all right, you wake up the next day and it hurts. I mean, I'll never forget when I lived in the Bay Area and Steve Kerr and became such a national story because of the Warriors. He couldn't coach because his back hurt. Tiger woods is my favorite athlete. Dealt with back issues forever. You just don't know. Some days it's fine.

[Josh Pate]

Help.

[Sports Commentator]

If you told me Matt Stafford had a month this year where he was awesome and just felt great, I'd believe you. If you told me that he's able to play week one and then the next day it's like stories have come out. Matt Stafford couldn't even get out of bed and he is for sure out the next week. Like that's possible. They are staring down a season that could get away from them very fast.

[Colin Cowherd]

Because I like Sean McVay as much as the next guy. He is an elite coach.

[Sports Commentator]

They clearly do a really good job of team building and transition from the.

[Colin Cowherd]

Jalen Ramsey kind of Aaron Donald era to kind of the young group than which they have now. It's been very, very impressive.

[Sports Commentator]

But they've won 10 games the last.

[Colin Cowherd]

Couple of years and sometimes they're talked about like they're the Chiefs or the Eagles. Right.

[Sports Commentator]

They haven't been winning 13 games. If Matt Stafford is compromised, as he clearly currently is, with an injury that doesn't just magically go away, I think we have to be real. Even with Jimmy Garoppolo, their playoff chances would be in major fucking trouble. Which big picture, if they had kind of a weird, disastrous season, wouldn't be the worst thing given that they got multiple picks and they clearly would need a quarterback. Matt Stafford's on a one year deal. He's old and it would be over. But this year could be weird, especially in a division that's kind of hard. So I think the rams and Sean McVay, he can put on a brave face and they're saying all the right things. They know everyone in the media, but they got to be losing some sleep right now. I think we also have to acknowledge the Colts are screwed because Anthony Richardson, I think we're all on the same page. Is not good. I don't pretend to be some schematic genius. You know, anytime that I have a question, I will either text a coaching buddy, a player like Jeff Schwartz, someone like that, if there's a specific question. And you guys know on this show, we don't get that into the weeds. Mainly because I don't pretend to know. Like, you know, I'm Kyle Shanahan or.

[Colin Cowherd]

Sean McVeigh or Andy Reid on a whiteboard when I don't really even care.

[Sports Commentator]

And if I have a question, I can ask and get the answer. But every single former player, the majority of them offensive linemen or quarterbacks, absolutely destroyed Anthony Richardson for the other day when he got lit up in the Ravens game, which knocked him out of.

[Colin Cowherd]

The game because his pinky finger was.

[Sports Commentator]

Facing the wrong way. And it was a blitz that he didn't see coming on basically a protection that the guy was not going to be blocked, that every single person that played in the NFL called that day one stuff. Guess what? Anthony Richardson is not a day one player. This is year three. He already had serious issues in terms of injuries, constantly inaccuracies.

[Colin Cowherd]

I mean, he's one of the more inaccurate quarterbacks that I can remember in the NFL.

[Sports Commentator]

And let's face it, he was one of the biggest projects over the last 10, 15 years. I mean, anyone with his resume drafted in the top five, pretty unheard of. It's not going to work. Like, it's kind of over. And it almost felt over before it even started. Now the Colts have a good team, like, beside the quarterback. If you told me, just give me a good quarterback. If you told me, like, Dak Prescott.

[Colin Cowherd]

Or Brock Purdy was their quarterback. With Shane Psych and back, this team can win 10 games easy, you know.

[Sports Commentator]

But Daniel Jones, who I made a prediction. I'm like, if things go right, they could be good. But I don't think Daniel Jones any good. I watched Riley Leonard run around the preseason game. He looks terrible. We know Anthony Richardson can't even read a fucking defense. So let's face it, the Colts are screwed. I said it last week that there is not a bigger lock in the NFL than the Houston Texans winning that division. It's like, what about the Jags? Travis Hunter? It's like, well, yeah, they drafted a wide receiver, okay? They got two good wide receivers. See, Travis Hunter tried to make an open field tackle. This isn't the Big 12, brother. This is the NFL. And I don't think playing both ways is possible. And they traded an enormous haul to get him. And I'M pro Travis Hunter. I like Travis Hunter, but it's not like they're getting, you know, Malik Neighbors and Deion Sanders on their team with him. He's going to be hell. He'd be their number two wide receiver.

[Colin Cowherd]

Behind Brian Thomas Jr.

[Sports Commentator]

Which is a good thing.

[Colin Cowherd]

I mean that's a pretty talented offensive.

[Sports Commentator]

Unit, but that's a franchise that doesn't win. But I'm just out on the Colts and I think big picture, everyone likes this guy in the NFL.

[Colin Cowherd]

People I know that have worked with.

[Sports Commentator]

Him think highly of him. I think he's done a good job drafting non quarterback positions and putting together a roster, but I think they're staring.

[Colin Cowherd]

Down a pretty big disastrous season and.

[Sports Commentator]

Anytime you have a busted quarterback and don't have a fix it, the boat usually sinks. Like we have seen some busts and disasters at quarterback.

[Colin Cowherd]

Brock Purdy saved Kyle Shanahan, right? Jalen Hurts saved everyone in Philadelphia for Carson Wentz. I don't see their savior like what are they going to do?

[Sports Commentator]

And how many times can you just make an excuse, miss the playoffs and keep your job? Especially like Jim Ursay's passed away now his daughters, which are wild card, we.

[Colin Cowherd]

Don'T know exactly how they're going to.

[Sports Commentator]

Operate, but I think we all would have to admit it has major, major.

[Colin Cowherd]

Problems written all over it.

[Sports Commentator]

The other thing is I'm not comparing.

[Colin Cowherd]

Kyler to Anthony Richardson.

[Sports Commentator]

Kyler is a legitimate NFL player and has had some awesome moments and if you watch him on the right week.

[Colin Cowherd]

Kyler can go toe to toe with any quarterback in the NFL on a specific weekend.

[Sports Commentator]

He can make plays with his legs, with his arms, throw bombs. His highlight package throughout his career is awesome. He's a special talent. He's also 5 9, he can't see and a lot of people like an NFL hipster pick is like, oh, I like the Cardinals to win the division and make the playoffs. You do have you google the history of the franchise, how often they make the playoffs? Have you googled the history of Kyler Murray as the starting quarterback? Which basically every year except one the team hasn't has finished no higher than third, the majority last place. So this is a team that doesn't win very often. Now listen, I like their roster and a lot like the Colts. If you told me like Josh Allen was the quarterback of the Cardinals, I'd be like, I think they can make the NFC championship. But he had a throw in the game against the Chiefs that was just like what is going on? And that's the problem with Kyler, he can make like, you could just turn on a game. Like week four, three straight drives, like, God, the Cardinals look really good. Two field goals and a touchdown. And they're just, they're just rolling. And then all of a sudden he can have like the worst play of the day. And that's the issue with him. And I think it all stems back to no one's ever questioned his arm strength, no one's ever questioned his athleticism. Like those things are high end. Just as a physical, you know, being relative or separate from his height, pretty special talent. But when you're five, nine, you can't see anything. And I think, you know, sometimes you say, like, a guy can't see the field. To me, there's like Anthony Richardson. I think he's looking. He has no clue what he's looking at. I think at this point, Kyler's got a pretty good idea. He just legitimately can't see. And then sometimes when he can, he's on the move. I just think he makes some poor decisions. So this pick of a lot of people, they're sexy. Like, I could see the Cardinals making. I cannot. I 100% cannot. And I think there's a reason on a yearly basis, even when they've had some talent, like, they're just an inconsistent operation. And it just gets back to him now, unlike Anthony Richardson or Daniel Jones. Like, I couldn't even imagine having to stomach as a fan, watching guys like that, that would suck like that, that would be miserable. That'd be torture.

[Colin Cowherd]

Might as well waterboard me.

[Sports Commentator]

It's like, this is what I gotta watch Kyler. Like, I do understand, like, getting excited for him as a fan. Hell, I get excited sometimes to watch him. I remember a couple years ago when he came back from the acl, he had. He had a game against the Eagles when they were kind of spiraling. It was like one of the most fun halves over the last couple years. He's a very fun player. I'm just not sure he's a winning player when it comes to winning the division. So you can pick Cardinals all you want. Your boy.

[Colin Cowherd]

I'm out.

[Sports Commentator]

You showed up for a quick nine that turned into 18.

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[Jasmine Crockett]

I think Democrats have for a very long time allowed Republicans to play them. So essentially Republicans came up with a narrative and Democrats decided to play into that and that only hurt the Democrats Democrats.

[Katie Couric]

I'm Katie Couric. Jasmine Crockett, Democratic Representative of Texas, is not known for holding back and our recent chat on Next Question is no exception. But when you hear how she got to where she is, her intensity makes perfect sense.

[Jasmine Crockett]

It's just hard to imagine a world where you don't have enough people that care to do right by people. And so that same passion that carried me through as a public defender that led me to want to change laws and thinking about the harm that will happen not just to my constituents, but just generally like I carry that weight with me because you've seen it up close. Yeah.

[Katie Couric]

Listen to next question with me, Katie Couric on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts.

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[Colin Cowherd]

Okay. Very, very, very fired up for an Internet tycoon. I. I spent the weekend with Coward and we were talking about Josh Pate a lot. So Josh Pate's football show, which he got a new studio in Nashville and it looks sweet. Went. Went live for the first time with his.

[Sports Commentator]

He's got a lot going on.

[Colin Cowherd]

I mean, he's been, he's been moving and shaking. This guy knows college football as well as anyone I know. Josh, what is happening? My man? How you doing?

[Josh Pate]

I've just been doing this with my hands John for about the past, oh, I don't know, six months. So it's finally almost here. How about the fake looking brick in that new studio? That's the benefit of getting married because you got someone who knows something about aesthetics and design. I just would have thrown up some paneling and said, let's go, but she had her touch on that. So I can't take any credit for how beautiful that new studio is.

[Colin Cowherd]

I believed it. I thought it was. It's not actual bricks. He fooled me.

[Josh Pate]

I mean, it's, it's the kind you could, you could still go graffiti on it. Like, if we wanted to put the finishing touches on it, we could go like a boxcar. We could go graffiti. What do you write in the graffiti? So it's a work in progress, but yeah, as for now, we're going with a hybrid brick. We'll call it HB Hybrid Brick.

[Colin Cowherd]

You and I both got married in 2025, actually, and my, my wife you know, she's a Bay Area girl. Originally is where she grew up. She love NFL, but I've really got her into college football. You, on the other hand, married a college football girl who literally was working for Nick Saban. Correctly. Correct?

[Josh Pate]

Yeah, it's a very weird sort of dynamic because you get asked a lot. Hey, how did you guys meet? Well, my story with Savannah is, well, I knew of her for a long time. She's sort of running recruiting and marketing for Nick Saban. Before that, she was with Freeze at Ole Miss. Before that, she was with Les at lsu. So I knew of Savannah French for a long time. And then she kind of. She kind of knew of me because I'd be around on Saturdays. I'd be around the programs a lot. And then you finally hang out one time and you realize, wow, this feels a little bit different. Certainly, we got a lot to talk about. We got a lot in common, but there feels like there's a little bit beneath the surface there. And so, yeah, man, like, I'm doing a college football show, and I'm probably the only one in my space who, if his significant other were to come on the show, would have way better stories than I do. I mean, she's got stories for days and days and days.

[Colin Cowherd]

Well, congratulations, man. I. You. Last week, I. I was texting with Jim Nagy, actually, the GM of the Oklahoma Sooners, and he was going to come on the show, and he might come on later this week, and he was like, I actually got to go to this GM symposium. And then I saw a bunch of clips as you. You're interviewing Herb street, you're hosting different things, and we start texting about just the growing industry. And Jim Nagy is a good example, right? Former NFL guy. He now runs a crew of, like, they got a pretty accomplished staff. You know, we're working under him. I mean, you look a lot of people. The guy that got me started at Fresno State has been there since Bob Stoops and Lincoln Riley. I mean, they got guys that have done a lot.

[Sports Commentator]

So the GM job in college football.

[Colin Cowherd]

I mean, Ed Manowitz, who I think headed up this GM symposium, was one of the original guys 15 years ago for Nick Saban, but it wasn't really called the gm. So what it is now is a completely different ball game. You and I were talking about the power these guys are going to have. You had a theory in the next couple of years that, I mean, they're going to be 20, 25 guys making, you know, like, offensive coordinator money so are we in like the first inning of this thing? Like where are we in the GMs? Their role, you know, in the NFL.

[Sports Commentator]

Gets a little tricky because the coach still has a lot of juice. Are these guys working independently?

[Colin Cowherd]

Do they have more juice than the coach? How's this all playing out in college football?

[Josh Pate]

It's total case by case. And I know there are a lot of die hard college football fans watching this, but let me tailor this answer more towards a secondary or casual college football fan who sort of drives by the sport. Yes, the general manager role. Everyone's got one now. It went from this, this fringe sort of novel concept five years ago to everyone's got one. That's about where the similarities end. Because I could talk to Courtney Morgan at Alabama and the roles and duties on his plate are totally different than Nagy at Oklahoma, totally different than Austin Thomas, totally different than Chad Bowden. So you've got general manager in name and that's about where it ends. As far as me knowing what you do on a day to day basis. Some of these guys are directly managing Cap. Some of them outsource that or delegate that entirely. Some of them are heavily involved with their donor and booster class. Some of them outsource that entirely. Some of them are actually constructing roster. Some of them have final say or at least very influential say on depth, on personnel. Some of them would never touch personnel with a 10 foot pole, as Meemaw would say. So it's very, very much a role that everyone has. It's very much a high value, high leverage role. But defining what that role really accomplishes is such a case by case. But the second thing you asked, this is where I think we're very much evolving. So in the NFL, it's not crazy for you to know that the owner is, that's the star on top of the Christmas tree. But it's not crazy for you to tell me a general manager outlasts a head coach. A general manager's their coach gets fired. That's not crazy. In college football, we have not gone through this yet. So in college football right now, I can tell you there are at least two major programs out there where internally, one of the concerns I've gotten from head coaches is I'm in a situation where I'm not so sure who I'm answering to. This is over the past year, I'm not so sure who I'm answering to. I'm not so sure what the authority tree is in this organization. And there is a widely held belief that There have been some hires at the general manager position over the past few years that are built to outlive the head coach, that are built to be in lockstep with the athletic director. And the head coach is a lot more a variable in that equation than a permanent or a constant. And that's John, relative to the history of college football, that's like within the last 30 seconds that's happened big time. So we have not even started to recalibrate the way we think about the sport, the way we watch this sport to account for thinking that way. And I'll tell you what else is going to happen because of that. Because of head coach, case by case, no longer being the top of the ladder. Those earnings, those salary dollars probably are 70, 75% of what they are now, five, 10 years from now. And that's a byproduct of number one, your org chart changing. Number two, you've got to pay rev share to players. So you're looking to take back money anywhere you can. Maybe your head coach doesn't need to make eleven and a half million a year. Maybe seven million is okay.

[Colin Cowherd]

So we are not that far away then from forever. It was like program X needs a head coach, right. In college football, the AD kind of runs point and the president or however their university set up with academia is heavily involved. The GM running point on the search. Then within the next this calendar cycle or maybe within the next two years, would you say there's a prominent GM who is like with the ad, but really he's. The AD puts it on him a little bit more. The ad, I mean, kind of their job is coaches under them. Right. How is that where we're in kind of this weird joint? Where is some of these GMs going to have more juice than the ad when it comes to the football program?

[Josh Pate]

Yes. And I believe it'll purposely be set up like that. I mean, if I'm an athletic director worth my salt, yeah, I got a background in football, I know football. But I am looking to hire a general manager for that purpose. You mentioned Jim Nagy. All right. I'm pulling for Brenton Venables. I hope the dude wins 10 games this year. But if it were to go off the rails, if they had a repeat of last year, let's just say the Oklahoma job was open. I 150% believe Jim Nagy is running point on that coaching search. I don't think he's going anywhere. I think he's there. Even if the head coach and his staff is Out. And also, you're in an athletic director transition right there. Joe Castiglion's been at OU forever, and he's about to head out the door. I don't think it's just mere coincidence that they made sure they had. They had an ironclad general manager in place before they started that ad transition period. I don't even know who's getting the ad job at ou. So, yeah, I think absolutely Nagy would run point there. Now there's some other ads out there who wouldn't say, over my dead body is that going to happen? So yet again, it's very. It's very much case by case right now. It's very convoluted.

[Colin Cowherd]

You know, 10 years ago, I think the Belichick Lombardi thing would have been viewed a lot crazier than it is now because of the economic, financial, you know, transaction element of college football in the transfer portal. Even though it's a lot different than free agency, there are some similarities. You know all these coaches, you know all these coordinators and, you know, a lot of these GMs. What's the buzz on that operation in that program? Because one, from a talent standpoint, like, you know, Bill could overachieve with guys because he had Tom in college. Like, you play Clemson, you play whoever is good even. I mean, tcu, I'm sure, has a lot of talent week one. Like, if you don't have the talent in college football, you can be a great. A lot of great coaches have not won a lot of games and tough conferences and against good teams. Because this is not the NFL where there's a lot of equality from guy to guy. Looking across, you know, the white lines.

[Josh Pate]

At each other, I think their fundamental struggle there is going to be acquisition and retention. So the two core pillars of building a college football team right now, and the reason I mentioned those in comparison to what he did in the NFL is because you're right, like broad strokes purposes, there's some similarity in college football today. In the NFL, it is night and day different. The Sunday game versus the Saturday game is night and day different. You asked what the Buzz is. I'm telling you, most coaches in the ACC think he's going to fail. Most coaches in the ACC think he's going to fall flat on his face. And it's not because they don't respect him as a coach. Quite the opposite. I've had zero personnel people, zero staffers in the ACC trash Bill Belichick, the NFL coach. What they've said is, it's sort of an insult to read all these headlines and hear about how this guy and his team are going to come in and show college football something. Because the way they look at it, college football is about to teach Bill Belichick and his staff many more lessons than they're going to teach college football. So I want you to think about the dynamic here. Number one, if you could convince me that the expectation for Bill Belichick is to just do what North Carolina's always done, I would stop talking right now. He can do that. He can win seven and a half games. I've got no doubt about that. I don't think, nor do I believe you think they paid him $10 million a year to come in and just do what North Carolina's always done. So very clearly the insinuation in the room, the unspoken is he's going to have us contending for a playoff spot next couple of years.

[Sports Commentator]

Okay?

[Josh Pate]

I don't believe that's true. You've got to go acquire the talent. So if you're going to compete for playoff spots above and beyond just winning seven and a half, that means you're not beating Louisville and Maryland for talent anymore. That means you've really got to go head to head with Clemson and Florida State and Miami. You've got to be more attractive a destination than they are. All right, that's the first thing that's hard enough. The second thing that's hard is you got to retain. So what you were able to build in New England and the culture and the root system that was able to take in New England was because there were no exit doors on the facility. Once you're a New England patriot, you're a New England patriot. You're not going anywhere. There's an exit door in every room. In college football, figuratively, guys don't like the way they're being treated. Guys don't like the tough love. I'm not advocating for this. I actually hate that this is the dynamic. But they can leave anytime they want to. And also there's that pesky 20 hour a week rule where you're trying to install dude, and you're trying to run this kind of defense and that kind of offense and. And someone comes in your ear and says, bill, we can't keep them any longer. We've maxed out our hours that we can have these guys in the facility this week. Well, it's only.

[Colin Cowherd]

Is that followed though, in 2025?

[Josh Pate]

It is. @ places like North Carolina, it's followed more than certain other places. That, you know, following the rules sometimes can bite you the ankles a little bit. So I just, I hear these people who keep telling me, well, he'll succeed in the, in the college football game because it's the right time, because college is like the NFL now. I think college football is about to deal a very harsh lesson. And ironically, if they do get it done, this year may be their shot because they got the most workable schedule they'll probably ever have, as long as he's there.

[Colin Cowherd]

There's also a generational gap of, listen, coaches. One thing that keeps you young, and you see it with Pete Carroll, you see it with Bill, is you're around young people. And even when you get in your 70s, Saban was the same way. There's a youthful energy. But you told a story on the show you posted on your social media about a guy in a competition to win a Power 4 starting quarterback job, and he just can't stay off his phone. And I, because he's quarterback, it's, you know, that's a, it's a sexy thing to say. But he cannot be alone. There got to be people all over the country in positions that are 18, 19 freshmen that this phone. And listen, we're all guilty of it. Could just not put it down. And you're not talking about like in the training room, you're talking about in the meeting when they're coaching up.

[Josh Pate]

Right.

[Colin Cowherd]

So how's Bill? I mean, that's, that's something all these guys are dealing with, right?

[Josh Pate]

Yeah, so that's a problem. But you know, that would be the 1994 equivalent of we can't keep our kid out of jail. Like, we can't keep him out of real trouble. You'll notice headlines about players getting arrested is falling off a cliff.

[Sports Commentator]

They don't drink.

[Josh Pate]

They're very anecdotal exceptions. I know that, but hardly any kids get in trouble anymore. I've had, I kid you not, I had a defensive coordinator in the Big Ten last year. Say, dude, just between us, I'd love for our kids to get a little closer to the edge. Like, I wish they would get in a little more trouble. We've just got, I mean, we've got like future librarians walking around the hallways and this is like a playoff caliber team. So what you'll think is, you'll think, oh, what did everyone like? Did character issues and flaws disappear? No, they just got re channeled. Now, your character flaw is not, oh, I gotta call. At three o' clock this morning, our kid got arrested. Cause he was out at the bars too late. Now it's this kid's battling for my quarterback spot. He's off in the corner. He's on his phone. I cannot keep this from in front of his face. It's an addiction. It's not just, oh, kids in their phones. I'm talking. This is the first wave of kids coming through your program who have been like this since they were five years old. No one's dealt with this before. It's the first generation. It's the first wave of that. So phone addiction is a huge problem. As dumb as it sounds to someone who's 52 years old just driving to work in Houston, it's a huge problem. Belichick will hear that and his instinct will be the same as Kirby Smart's instinct. He'll think, you know, be that as it may, I think there are 25 kids out there per cycle that we can take that buck that trend. We're already looking for the exceptions to the rule in recruiting. We'll go find 25 of them and John Kirby Smart will. Cause he gets his pick. That goes back to what I'm telling you or what I'm asking you. Do you think Bill Belichick, if the expectations are higher there now, do you think he can go out, recruit the big dogs for the very limited supply of legitimate, like high caliber players there are per cycle or can you go mine the portal for former three stars who were overlooked that are at New Mexico or Fresno right now and hats off to him if he does. It is an uphill battle to be able to do that every single year.

[Colin Cowherd]

John Gruden put out a YouTube which I somehow watched the whole thing and a headline came out because he said it and he was passionate about it. When he Kirby, it was basically he went to Georgia and then he went to, to Jacksonville and hung out. So it's like 30 minutes at each place. And the Georgia one, I mean he's addressing the team and he's talking about how he wants to coach again and he would love to coach in the sec. There was a clip that you, if you watch when he goes to Jacksonville, he's talking to Tony Baselli who if you Google went to USC and Baselli and he said I need a job. And bas, he said talk to me late in, you know, like in December, AKA usc. But that, I haven't seen that headline anywhere.

[Sports Commentator]

But that was a subtle.

[Colin Cowherd]

If I was Lincoln Riley, I'd be.

[Sports Commentator]

Like, Tony, what the hell, man? But this crude in college thing because.

[Colin Cowherd]

The NFL just might be like a Belichick thing. He might not be able to get another job in the NFL. But I, I, I wrote down some, I mean a couple Florida's teams, right? Florida State, Florida. I, I wrote down Auburn.

[Sports Commentator]

But then I thought like, would Gruden.

[Colin Cowherd]

I know Auburn has money, go against Alabama. You brought up another program that I have a buddy in Arizona who is an alumni of this school and says, John, you don't realize how much money we have nowadays. And I was like, yeah, that kind of makes some sense. Arkansas Razorbacks, baby. Pick Suey. Because a little bit of the thing.

[Sports Commentator]

With the sec, it's like Auburn can.

[Colin Cowherd]

Hire Hugh Freeze when no one else. There's a little renegade nature to some of these programs. Ole Miss, when they hired Lane, you know, and I would put Arkansas in that vein where it's like all the good would outweigh any couple negative headlines the New York Times might write.

[Sports Commentator]

And listen, Jon Gruden, the Raiders were.

[Colin Cowherd]

Starting to make some progress.

[Sports Commentator]

He knows what he's doing and he's.

[Colin Cowherd]

Got a lot of respect with coaches. Like it's, I think people would come work for him, especially because Arkansas would be cutting these checks to the, to the coordinators and the position coaches.

[Sports Commentator]

So what's, what's your thought on Jon Gruden?

[Colin Cowherd]

Like I, I would say it's, if.

[Sports Commentator]

You tell me John Gruden's a head.

[Colin Cowherd]

Coach in 2026, I'd say it's like 75% chance in college.

[Josh Pate]

The maybe I'm here is it is far more likely than not. Yeah, the vibe I'm getting, far more likely than not. He's a head coach somewhere. And if he's not, it will be because the options on the table weren't good enough. So to me the question's not can we find programs to offer him a head coach? The question is going to be is he willing to go work for those programs? So yeah, yeah. I mean, if the Florida State job came open, no brainer if they offer him Auburn. I think Auburn's a no brainer if they offer him. So Florida, obviously the reason I mentioned Arkansas to you is because I think that situation is very untenable. I think the Sam Pittman experiment maybe in the next four months will have run its course, which again, I hate one of the most likable guys you can ever hope to be around. But it's not going well up there right now. And I just want to mention three companies. One of them is Walmart, one of them is JB Hunt, Trucking, Shipping. And one of them is Tyson Chicken. And people who are listening to this may not know this, but all of them are located in northwest Arkansas, and that is what powers University of Arkansas athletics. So every now and then when you see them, you know, just randomly go hire John Calipari away from Kentucky. Well, that's how they do it. It's not cause the program is flush with cash. It's cause there are big money people hanging around saying, look, we're not going to light our money on fire, but if you sell us on something, there is no check big enough, too big rather for us to write. And I think they would do that for Jon Gruden. What you got to be able to do to win in college football is you got to be able to hire a great staff, which I think he could do. You got to be able to acquire talent, which I 100% think he can do. You got to be able to manage a cap now, which he's got a ton of experience in, and he'd bring people in the building to do that. You got to be able to retain players. You got to be very flexible. And this is the part where I think Gruden probably would have a leg up on Belichick. The the landscape of college football has been ever changing and ever turning recently and I think he could roll with those changes a lot more readily than maybe someone so set in their ways. But lastly, you got to have an infusion of juice into your fan base and your donor base when you get hired. That Belichick did do that at North Carolina. Huge. And I think I think Jon Gruden would do that. And so I people would turn cartwheels in Fayetteville, Arkansas and Rogers, Arkansas and the surrounding area if they were to go get him. And I'm like, you like I think it's more likely than not this happens in the next year. I just, I wonder where it's going to be.

[Sports Commentator]

You showed up for a quick nine that turned into 18.

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[Jasmine Crockett]

I think Democrats have for a very long time allowed Republicans to play them. So essentially Republicans came up with a narrative and Democrats decided to play into that. And that only hurt the Democrats.

[Katie Couric]

I'm Kitty Couric. Jasmine Crockett, Democratic representative of Texas, is not known for holding back and our recent chat on Next Question is no exception. But when you hear how she got to where she is, her intensity makes perfect sense.

[Jasmine Crockett]

It's just hard to imagine a world where you don't have enough people that care to do right by people. And so that that same passion that carried me through as a public defender that led me to want to change laws and thinking about the harm that will happen not just to my constituents, but just generally. Like I carry that weight with me.

[Katie Couric]

Because you've seen it up close. Yeah Listen to next question with me, Katie Couric on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts.

[John Lithgow]

Hello, I'm John Lithgow.

[Sports Commentator]

We choose to go to the moon.

[John Lithgow]

I want to tell you about my new fiction podcast.

[Josh Pate]

That's one small step for man.

[John Lithgow]

It's about Buzz Aldrin, one of the true pioneers of space.

[Colin Cowherd]

You're a great pilot, Buzz, as far as I'm concerned, the best I've seen.

[John Lithgow]

That's the story you think you know. This is the story you don't predisposition.

[Josh Pate]

To depression, alcohol abuse and suicide.

[John Lithgow]

We'll see Buzz try to overcome demons.

[Josh Pate]

What do you say, Buzz?

[Colin Cowherd]

Another beer.

[John Lithgow]

And triumph over addiction.

[Josh Pate]

Here's to you, Buzz Aldrin.

[John Lithgow]

Good luck to you and become a true hero.

[Sports Commentator]

Buzz and I will proceed into the.

[John Lithgow]

Lunar module, not because he conquers space, but because he conquers himself.

[Colin Cowherd]

Buzz, we intercepted a Soviet radio transmission.

[John Lithgow]

Starring me, John Lithgow.

[Colin Cowherd]

Can you put it through Translate on.

[John Lithgow]

The iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts?

[Sports Commentator]

Columbia.

[Colin Cowherd]

You know, it's easier. I mean, I don't know Sam Pittman at this point in time's buyout, it's probably easier to get rid of him than some of these other coaches. And one theme, and you talk, talked about it right before we hit record, is the buyouts of these coaches has gotten more complicated because of paying the players. I mean, I would imagine Brian Kelly's is still massive. Lincoln Riley's is still massive. So while, you know, I think, you know, I'll give Tony Bazelli to defend him, he's probably just a little tongue in cheek, you know, shooting the shit with having conversation. But there is some line of truth given that Lincoln hasn't had much success.

[Sports Commentator]

But are they just going to pay.

[Colin Cowherd]

Him $60 million to go away when you're also paying the players? Same thing with LSU in the buyout of Brian Kelly. But at those programs, if it does get bad enough, like, if you go seven, five, one of those two teams.

[Josh Pate]

It would be really, really ugly.

[Colin Cowherd]

And you talk about this all the time, especially in the Big Ten, but specifically the SEC is everyone thinks they're going to win nine or 10 games, and it's just there's not enough wins to go around. Someone's going to win.

[Sports Commentator]

Look at USC last year.

[Colin Cowherd]

Like, they easily could have won 10.

[Sports Commentator]

But they won seven.

[Colin Cowherd]

And it's going to happen to one.

[Sports Commentator]

Of these teams, like Sharon Moore, like, he could be way better this year and still barely get to eight.

[Colin Cowherd]

And it kind of looks weird, you know, So I, I think Gruden, who knows, maybe his options expand a little bit.

[Sports Commentator]

But the money thing, to get these.

[Colin Cowherd]

Guys to write these huge $50 million, a lot of money to buy a guy out when you also got to pay the players another 20, 25.

[Sports Commentator]

Right?

[Josh Pate]

Especially when the money's real. The money used to not be real. Like, I mean, we're. We're fresh off a world where Texas A and M looked at paying Jimbo Fisher $70 million to not coach. And they said, okay, yeah, we'll do that. Just insane. That will never ever, ever happen again. Those clauses won't even be in contracts anymore. There's no way. So that's a bygone era already. And that's literally three years ago. I believe it is the most under talked about big story in college football right now. And that is the unwillingness to fire. I mean almost every head coach is back in the SEC this year. Almost every coordinator is back in the SEC this year. And that's never happened before. And the reason is not cause they're all great. The reason is because the standards have changed. The barrier to fire someone has changed. Because you got to pay real money. And by real money, I mean everyone's all of a sudden got to adhere to a budget because you got to pay the players, you got to pay athletes 20 plus million dollars a year. And so where's that going to come from? Well, it comes from that endless pool that you used to spend on water slides and fountains and buyouts and now you got to actually account for that money. And what's crazy is Florida is the best example of this, man. Florida is still led by Billy Napier. I think Florida could be a wonderful, like great story this year. Could be a great team, Got a tough schedule, could be a great team. John, Billy Napier is not even the head coach of that team. If it's five years ago, they fire him mid season last year. If this is five years ago, instead they retain him, he pulls the nose up, we find out who DJ Lagway is, they kill it second half of the year. I got him power rated as a top 10 caliber team coming into this year. And it begs the question, how many coaches got fired one year too early in the history of college football? And now how many more offenses, defenses, et cetera, programs in general will reap the benefit of money being real and their guys being retained and being given more length of rope because they can't afford to be fired. Now the follow up to that is, what if your program's totally dead in the water? What if Hugh Freeze is 6 and 6 again this year at Auburn? Auburn is a place that's had a ton of churn. They're still playing, they're still paying. Brian Harson, by the way. What, what if, what if the program's just dead on arrival, recruiting class falls apart, no one wants to be there, what do you do? Do you spend that kind of money again because Frieza's got a big buyout and you're going to have the natives with torches and pitchforks outside the gates, like, what are you doing with our program? We got to make a move. We got to make a move. Well, you got to spend money to make that move. You got to spend 60 million to fire someone. You got to spend 70 million to go get a new staff. You still got to pay the players. And that's the. That's the catch 22. Everybody's dealing with this now, and I don't. I just don't think it's being talked about. It's not being picked up enough on the radar yet.

[Colin Cowherd]

Well, I'll give you one. I mean, the standard at LSU is to win a national championship. I mean, they had three coaches in this decade. They've all won national championships. I mean, and the worst one of the three had the best team of the three in Ed Ogeron. But I mean, the Brian Kelly thing, the floor felt so high.

[Sports Commentator]

Even if, like, oh, he's never.

[Colin Cowherd]

Even if you told me he never wanted, I'd be like, he's going to have a bunch of like 10, 11 win seasons.

[Sports Commentator]

And it's like, what if they win eight this year?

[Colin Cowherd]

I mean, just look at the schedule.

[Sports Commentator]

Every year in the sec, we saw last year, a couple games, they just fell apart.

[Colin Cowherd]

You'd probably have a better feel for the roster. But everyone I've known, Doug Nussmeier for 20 years, his son has become, I mean, one of the better quarterbacks in the country, a really, really good player.

[Sports Commentator]

We know their roster is always loaded. But like, I watched that SEC show, I'm like, there is a chance. And I've always believed this.

[Colin Cowherd]

Regions in college football matter in terms of where you're coaching and where you're from. Urban was an outlier. Urban could have coached in Alaska and won national championships.

[Sports Commentator]

But most guys, Southern guys thrive in the South.

[Colin Cowherd]

West coast guys have thrived historically in the west coast, the Northeast guys.

[Sports Commentator]

It's like kind of a.

[Colin Cowherd]

It's hard to be an outsider in the south when you're not winning.

[Sports Commentator]

And it feels like Brian Kelly, like, what if they go eight, nine wins.

[Colin Cowherd]

And don't make the playoffs this year?

[Sports Commentator]

I. Obviously the money thing, like, you just.

[Colin Cowherd]

Factored in, but that would be. It'd be a colossal failure so far, correct?

[Josh Pate]

Yeah. So I think the two most alarming things about Kelly entering this year at LSU is we're coming off a year where they couldn't run the ball, they couldn't play defense. So to go back to your initial point, if you were to tell me he's not going to win a national title. Okay. At least they're going to be able to run the ball and play good defense. They did neither of those last year. So it's kind of slid further and further away from what you would. Would think the identity of a Brian Kelly team would be. All right, let me tell you what happened with him at lsu. Give me like two minutes on this. When he got to lsu, yeah, he was an outsider. So was Nick Saban. When he got to lsu, Saban understood the importance of harnessing Louisiana. It's a first 10 priorities on his to do list. Fill this building with people who know Louisiana, fill my staff with people who can recruit Louisiana, put a fence up around Louisiana, and just keep all the talent in state, and we'll win a title. And that's exactly what they did. And they won a title. Brian Kelly came in, and I'm told he's been pretty remorseful about this internally since then. He came in and I don't know if it was ego, I don't know if it was hubris. I don't know what it was. He viewed his way, his formula to win as a formula that can be copied and pasted anywhere. And it's not so much about fitting, it's not so much about unique geographical culture, what one at Notre Dame will win at lsu. And he got to the point where it was almost like, you want to bet? You want to test my theory? Watch and see. And he flushed the program of Louisiana influence. He flushed a lot of people out of that building that were from Louisiana, some of it, just for the sake of doing it. And so what happens when you do that? If you win, no one will care. But the moment that it doesn't take off like a forest fire, you are going to be the absolute scorn of everybody on every message board, every talk radio show. Cause they know. They know. Cause people from Louisiana, when they get fired, they're still in Louisiana and they talk. And so they had a program that was regressing year over year, and they had none of their people in the building hardly. And so what happened is administratively, even above his head, he was sort of given an ultimatum, you better course correct this. And there were certain non negotiables. And I'll tell you, one of them was Austin Thomas coming in as his general manager. And people don't need to know who that name is, but I'm telling you, he's one of the best GMs in the country. Came back there from Ole Miss. He is a Louisiana guy. I'm in that building at least once or twice a year. There are people from Louisiana in that building Again, they hired a great defensive staff last year, sort of what Lincoln did at lsu. It just takes a year or two. So I think they've made the right moves. I think he's made the right moves. I think there's a very, very striking parallel between the trajectory of Brian Kelly's LSU and the trajectory of Lincoln Riley's usc. They made poor decisions hiring at the outset. They suffered the consequences. They course correct two or three or four years in. The big story is, are they going to be given time to let that new root system take? Because you are in very short supply of patience in this sport four years into your tenure. And that's not even unfair. It's not unfair for those to be the expectations at USC or lsu. So that's what happened at lsu and they're still trying to get back on track from that.

[Colin Cowherd]

Do you think them, you know, Alabama, I think the AD last year, remember he put out that tweet like basically asking for money. They can get talent coming there. But now with the financial, they just have some limitations that maybe some bigger fight schools with bigger boosters with more money maybe don't have. Are they losing guys that they used to. When we go, you walked out to AN LSU practice 10, 15, 20 years ago, they were probably too deep. NFL guys. Now that backup goes, well, if someone paid me 700 grand and Brian Kelly's like, I don't know, I got to allocate my money, it's a little more complicated. Do you think that has impacted Alabama and obviously LSU the last couple of years, their roster, hard for them to financially compete with just other schools that might have a enormous billionaire booster behind them?

[Josh Pate]

I'm going to be honest with you, I think it's overblown as a story. It exists, I'm telling you. I'm not denying it exists. I know the particulars in some of these recruitments, in some of these portal moves. And it's not so much highest bidder every time. In fact, a lot of times it's not highest bidder. I know the layering that goes into a lot of these decisions and sometimes it is just flat out, a billionaire came in, put it on the table, okay, we got to bow out. It's just really, really overstated as the core tenet in a lot of this. And I will also say some of the feedback I've gotten from GMs and player personnel types, not even in the SEC, but about the SEC over the past couple of weeks. Talking to him is the Rev Share stuff that everyone thinks won't hold up in court has more teeth in it. Right now, that decision has more teeth than people are claiming it does. That doesn't mean that it's going to be blanketly adhered to. But what I want to do is I want to give myself another 12 to 24 months now that this new system, this new way of doing things is in place. Because I think what we're going to see is, I think we're going to see that talking point you talked about decrease a little bit. And I do think we'll probably head to more of just a straight up Rev Share era, which is notable given the program you're talking about. Because the last time I was at lsu, I was sitting in Brian Kelly's office and he looked me in the eye and said, I cannot wait until we get to this new era. And his fingers crossed, he's saying, I hope it's what they presented as. I hope that the players get the money, but I hope that we all have roughly the same thing to offer in Rev Share because at that point, it's back in my wheelhouse. I love evaluation. I love development. I love that being what college football is about. I love knowing my guys are going to be in the building two or three years. So I can just say if we, if we steer towards that harbor by his own words, it's what he claims he wants. We'll see if they get it done.

[Colin Cowherd]

You know, speaking outsiders, DeBoer obviously, what he did at Washington and he was a shooting star and it was incredibly. Took him to the national championship, beat Texas. But he's not a Southern guy, honestly. I mean, he spent most of his career in the Dakotas, right? So you come to Alabama, you couldn't turn down that job. But it's. Sometimes it's, it's not easy to replace a guy like that. I mean, he's, he's a 1 of 1. It's like replacing John Wooden or something. So, I mean, by early last year, people were complaining about what he wore on game day, right? He wasn't wearing a collared shirt. He was wearing a T shirt under his pullover. What's that rope like there? I mean, what, what, what do we have to do this year to kind of.

[Sports Commentator]

Because it could, it, it could exponentially.

[Colin Cowherd]

Speed up an anger behind that. If all of a sudden they win eight, nine games, they're not in the playoffs this year.

[Golf Enthusiast]

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[Josh Pate]

You know what's funny is the war.

[Colin Cowherd]

I like him. I'm, I'm a fan. I'm rooting for him.

[Josh Pate]

The wardrobe thing last year, I can't help but remember they lost to Vandy and he was wearing like a jumpsuit on the sideline. Everyone hated it. They go blow out LSU wearing the same jumpsuit. No one says a word about his wardrobe. So it's just so funny to watch that unfold last year. Listen, Kaylin DeBoer is a stud. He is the absolute right guy for that job. I don't think he gave two seconds of thought to I'm replacing a legend. I mean, I've talked to him about this several times. Like he'll, he'll look you straight in the eye and if you're off the record, he'll shoot straight with you. It was not so much can I replace Nick Saban? In fact, a lot of the type A 1 percenters don't think like that now, dude, they look in the mirror and say, I may be the best to ever do it. Like for all I know, I may be the best to ever do it. If I'm put in the right situation, I don't care who I'm replacing. And he doesn't say it that arrogantly. I'm sort of speaking for him here. But DeBoer didn't look at Alabama and say, can I replace Saban? He looked and said, am I going to be given everything I need? Because a lot of times when you're replacing a legend, the reason it doesn't work is the legend hung on too long. And so you're having to take on a rebuild project with unfair expectations. Well, he, he may have high expectations there, but he inherited a world class program. I mean that's 1 or 1A right now in college football. And I'm telling you, dude, they stepped into a hurricane last year and no one was going to feel sorry for him because it was Alabama. But I'm very privy to some of the things they dealt with a year ago. And it was a what, an eight win season, nine win season, whatever. I always viewed it through the prism of 2025 and I think they'll be really good this year. And I more importantly think you need to look like Ohio State last year has all these dudes that forego the draft and they don't leave via the portal even though there are bigger offers. Well, that's Bama. This year they got a lot of guys, probably second, third round grades, could have made twice the money elsewhere in the portal. If they wanted to stay in college, they all stayed there. Point being, when you take over a job by your second year in modern college football, three transfer portal cycles have come and gone. So everyone who's still there wants to be there. Everyone who's still there is your guy. So you can push them last year in spring. They will never admit this publicly. They had to actively back off how they pushed guys in spring because they knew we just took over this job. A lot of these dudes are saving dudes. They're looking for the exit door. We've got a post spring portal window we have to worry about. So yeah, man, we want to install all our stuff. We want to go balls to the wall. But we got to be careful because we got to have a team to put on the field this fall. And they. That's just the reality of college football. Now a year later, they're not dealing with that at all. I think they. They in Georgia, I think have the two best coaching staffs in the league. And I think everyone knows that about Georgia. I'm not sure everyone thinks that yet about Alabama, but I would because Grub grubs back.

[Colin Cowherd]

So he got his boy back.

[Josh Pate]

He got him back and he's got. I mean, Kane Womack was a former head coach who they took on as def defensive coordinator and Kane Womack's done a really good job. But I mean, they've mo linguist coaching dbs there. It's just they got really, really good staffers. They got one of the best strength and conditioning staffs in the country. So I would be shocked if they're not in the mix this year. But if I'm wrong and they're not in the mix, you're right. You're right and rightfully so. There will be angst and anger and bitterness down there. You cannot take the handoff from Nick Saban. With the program as pristine as it still is and fail to make the playoffs two years in a row, you just can't do that.

[Colin Cowherd]

So of LSU and Alabama, who do you feel more confident is going to be one of the 12 teams in the playoffs?

[Josh Pate]

Bama. I think Bama is a better team. I trust their balance more offensively. I like them along the lines of scrimmage a little bit better. I think you may be looking at the best wide receiver DB combo in the league in Alabama, if not one of in the country. And I just the Garrett Nussmeier I am higher on as a quarterback because I've seen him do it, but I think Bama and the aggregate can get plenty good enough offensive production. I just there's some stuff about LSU from a transfer portal infusion standpoint and having a front loaded schedule. They got to come out of the gate hot and I have not seen them do it under Brian Kelly. It's been a chronic issue for them and I think I counted four or five losable games they have before Halloween so they have to take all these new pieces and I mean I'm hearing very mixed reviews. Offensive line out of fall camp. That's what fall camp is for. So it's not the end of the world. I think I feel a little more confident in Bama right now.

[Colin Cowherd]

So if we just pulled people in the South, I you know Texas would feel like a lock to go to the playoffs. I'd say most people pick Georgia. Is that fair to be a playoff representation?

[Josh Pate]

I would say Texas, Georgia, some combo of one two bamboo Emma LSU some combo of three four.

[Sports Commentator]

You showed up for a quick nine that turned an 18.

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[Sports Commentator]

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[Josh Pate]

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[Jasmine Crockett]

I think Democrats have for a very long time allowed Republicans to play them. So essentially, Republicans came up with a narrative and Democrats decided to play into that. And that only hurt the Democrats.

[Katie Couric]

I'm Katie Couric. Jasmine Crockett, Democratic representative of Texas, is not known for holding back. And our recent chat on Next Question is no exception. But when you hear how she got to where she is, her intensity makes perfect sense.

[Jasmine Crockett]

It's just hard to imagine a world where you don't have enough people that care to do right by people. And so that same passion that carried me through as a public defender, that led me to want to change laws and thinking about the harm that will happen not just to my constituents, but just generally, like I carry that weight with me because you've seen it up close. Yeah.

[Katie Couric]

Listen to next question with me, Katie Couric on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast.

[John Lithgow]

Hello, I'm John Lithgow.

[Sports Commentator]

We choose to go to the moon.

[John Lithgow]

I want to tell you about my new fiction podcast.

[Josh Pate]

That's One small step for Man.

[John Lithgow]

It's about Buzz Aldrin, one of the true pioneers of space.

[Colin Cowherd]

You're a great pilot, Buzz. As far as I'm concerned, the best I've seen.

[John Lithgow]

That's the story you think you know. This is the story you don't predisposition.

[Advertiser]

To depression, alcohol abuse and suicide.

[John Lithgow]

We'll see Buzz try to overcome demons.

[Josh Pate]

What do you say, Buzz?

[John Lithgow]

Another beer and triumph over addiction.

[Josh Pate]

Here's to you, Buzz Aldrin.

[John Lithgow]

Good luck to you and become a true hero.

[Sports Commentator]

Buzz and I will proceed into the.

[John Lithgow]

Lunar module not because he conquers space, but because he conquers himself.

[Colin Cowherd]

Buzz, we intercepted a Soviet radio transmission.

[John Lithgow]

Starring me, John Lithgow.

[Colin Cowherd]

Can you put it through Translate on.

[John Lithgow]

The iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts.

[Sports Commentator]

Columbia.

[Colin Cowherd]

So I mean, they're going to be teams like South Carolina. You know, Florida's got some, I hopes.

[Sports Commentator]

You know, I wanted to ask you.

[Colin Cowherd]

About the quarterback situation. I, I watched the SEC show and.

[Sports Commentator]

I didn't watch that much South Carolina last year.

[Colin Cowherd]

Obviously you can see Sellers, big time athlete. His story about getting injured kind of makes some sense how he ends up in South Carolina. I mean, dj, you felt like I was hearing about this guy and I'm not even a die hard recruiting guy.

[Sports Commentator]

16 years old.

[Colin Cowherd]

I mean, he's a highly touted big time player. You know that John Mattier for. So from a quarterback standpoint, you know DJ Lagway all of a sudden, if he is fantastic, that team could be nine, 10 wins.

[Josh Pate]

Yes. They play the toughest schedule in the country and could still do that. You are, you are hitting on what I think is the biggest story in that league. And that is for the first time in a long time, the Tier 2 of the SEC consists of like half a dozen teams that could reasonably win the conference. They have varying degrees of percentage chance to win the conference that you never would have said five or six years ago. You're talking about Florida there. Florida. DJ Lagway has a chance to be the best player in the country this year. He has, he is that talented, he's that skilled. His deep ball accuracy on top of just the athleticism he gives you with his legs. If he can stay healthy, which is the biggest concern in Gainesville right now, he's had shoulder and, and calf issues. If he can stay healthy, that can be an electric offense. And I'll tell you this, man, you think about that and you think, ooh, Florida electric offense. Score 45 a week. Maybe they don't come out of the gate high. The follow up to Florida. The reason I believe in them as being more than just some paper tiger type pretender is they could win A game 21, 19 the first few weeks of the season if they need to. They're great along the lines of scrimmage. They got really good tailback and offensive line depth. Defensive personnel front seven matches up with anyone in the conference. So if DJ is not red hot, on fire out of the game, I think they'll be okay. I picked Mater to win the Heisman, so that's how high I am on John Mateer at Oklahoma. I think he will fundamentally transform what they do. You're going to have some folks watch highlights of him in practice. They're going to say, oh, I don't like that arm angle, I don't like that release. Look at the lack of quality, of competition he played last year. All notable. I'm just telling you, I think he's going to be a stud. I think he had like 800 something yards rushing last year and it's his arm talent I'm most impressed with. So he's a true dual threat. A and M will not be what I just said at quarterback. They'll be a lot better in the vertical passing game, but they will be a team that makes no mistake what their Identity is they're going to run the ball on you. They're going to run the ball some more. Mike Elko's got both hands around the throat of that defense. After the way they finished last year, he will not allow that to be a repeat issue. They're going to play ugly football. It will not be aesthetically pleasing. But that's the kind of team that just hangs a 10 and 2 on you out of nowhere because they brutalized everyone. I also love that recruiting in college football in general has had to account for uptempo spread. Your linebackers are smaller, your defensive personnel in the aggregate is smaller. And every now and then, someone just throws out an offensive line that averages 330 across the front and three tailbacks who are bruisers, and they take advantage of that. That's what A and M can do this year. South Carolina, Yeah, there were nine and three last year. Dude, they're two plays away from 11 and one last year.

[Colin Cowherd]

I know watching that SEC show, they easily could have beat LSU.

[Josh Pate]

They got the shaft in that game, man. I'm not one to throw officials under the bus, but they got the shaft in that game. But here's the problem we had. We had Beamer on the show in the spring, and I said, does your building have a firm grasp that as great as last year was, they don't get to carry any of that over. Like, momentum is so stupid in college football. People talk about carrying momentum over year to year. It's fake. It doesn't exist. You start 0 and 0 in the fall and they got to replace a lot of wide receiver talent. Five NFL departures from the. From the defense. And they recruit, okay. They don't recruit at the level where they just seamlessly backfill that stuff, but they could have the best quarterback in the country in Lenora Sellers. So there's. I didn't even mention Tennessee here. I didn't mention, like, Tennessee or.

[Sports Commentator]

I wanted to hit on Oklahoma with.

[Colin Cowherd]

You because John Mateer, I mean, a lot of people are high on him bringing his offensive coordinator. I went to the Oklahoma Texas game, and Oklahoma's defense is actually pretty good. And they were in that game at halftime and then unraveled on offense and the score looked bad. But their defense is good. Their coach knows what he's doing on defense. Offense was a joke, the Arnold thing. Now he's at Auburn. They are really high on John Mateer. They had a bunch of injuries last year, right? To wide receivers and offensive linemen.

[Sports Commentator]

Could Oklahoma be.

[Colin Cowherd]

Because a lot of people Said like.

[Sports Commentator]

Texas is going to make the transition easier than Oklahoma.

[Colin Cowherd]

It kind of overwhelmed Oklahoma a little bit, but clearly they are higher on this team going into this season than they have been on previous. From a talent standpoint, starting with quarterback where Oklahoma historically has been pretty damn good at that position. Right?

[Josh Pate]

The last 25 years. Yes, yes. You saw a team last year that had a fatal flaw. You didn't see a team that was fatally flawed. You saw a team that made a poor hired offense coordinator, quarterback never got off the ground and a top 20 defense got wasted and a lot of wide receiver injuries impeded them. So they did what they needed to do. They, they just, they put Brenton Venables back calling plays defensively. Brent Venables has no business being a CEO type head coach. He ought to be a guy who delegates offensively. And in this case they went and hired their new quarterback's former offensive coordinator. So that's a great package deal and he will have his hands on that defense. Dude, that conservatively should be a top 15 defense this year. Underreported is the fact that they also went to Cal and got Jaden Ott at running back. No one's talking about him because of John Mateer. So, so they got good tailback talent. They got excellent quarterback talent outside of a kid named Dion Burks who they took from Purdue last year, would have blown up last year had he not gotten hurt outside of him. They retooled that wide receiver room. That's what they had to do. So Oklahoma is a top 10 caliber team and I don't care who doesn't know that because they'll play Michigan and Auburn the first four weeks of the year, I think, and you'll see they have an egregious road game at Temple. By the way, I have no idea what they're doing. They, they go to temple. Not, not on Sunday, not synagogue, like they literally go to temple to play a football game. But outside of that, John, I think they're going to be undefeated when they play Texas in the Red river game. And I think by that point everyone's attention will be on, oh you, they, they next to Florida have the second toughest schedule to me in the country. Both of those teams are equipped, I think, to navigate that and be in contention. And you got to think if either of those teams can go nine and three, that's the kind of schedule that you can get in the playoffs going nine and three against.

[Colin Cowherd]

Okay, I'll get you out here on this. A guy who became star would be strong. But, I mean, a household name in the SEC was James Franklin. He went to Penn State and I was. I had a lot of money on them against Notre Dame. And he throws that pass across his body and that team was. That team was really good. And this team is supposed to be just as good. I mean, the clips of Lavar Arrington's true freshman son, you're like, this guy.

[Sports Commentator]

Looks exactly like Micah Parsons and Abdul Carter.

[Colin Cowherd]

Where do they find these guys? There's no disputing James is an elite recruiter, especially he's an offensive guy and he dominates defensive recruiting. Offensively, they got a quarterback, they got.

[Sports Commentator]

A good offensive coordinator.

[Colin Cowherd]

I know. I've heard you talk a lot about this. If not now, then when?

[Sports Commentator]

Not even just winning the national championship.

[Colin Cowherd]

But just winning some of these big games. Beating Oregon, beating Ohio State.

[Sports Commentator]

You know, they don't get that much credit, right? There are two playoff wins last year.

[Colin Cowherd]

Because they weren't against a Tennessee, an Alabama.

[Josh Pate]

They were.

[Sports Commentator]

They were against SMU and Boise State, and then they played Notre Dame and they lost. So what's, you know, these programs, you know, these coaches.

[Colin Cowherd]

What's your take on Penn State going into this year? Unfair.

[Sports Commentator]

Like crazy. Because they're going to be viewed as.

[Colin Cowherd]

Like an Ohio State and Alabama, Georgia, it's like almost like national championship or bust.

[Sports Commentator]

And the guys never even beat a team in the top five.

[Josh Pate]

Yeah, it's so crazy. Again, if we were to take a casual NFL fan who kind of sort of watches college, they would think if you told them James Franklin had doubters going into last year, Penn State had doubters going into last year, they would think, oh, they made the semifinals. Obviously that quieted the doubters, right? No, no. Every hater who was there is still there because the haters said you can't beat the big teams and you can't win a national title. And they got a shot at Ohio State, they lost. They got a shot against Oregon in the Big Ten title game, they lost. They win two playoff games against teams you're never going to get credit for beating in SMU and Boise, and the second they face off against Notre Dame, they lose. So they're all still there. I got to tell you, man, they are not shying away from this stuff up there like we're going to. I was talking to them two days ago and they are. They are very bullish on this team. They are very bullish that they hit on their wide receiver acquisitions out of the portal, which is where they've lacked. They have not had difference makers at that position. I can tell you, talking to defensive people in the Big Ten, no one fears Penn State beating them by throwing the football. And if that is different this year, that's the big change. It's not. Drew Aller magically becomes a better player. I kind of think he is who he is. Does he have better talent out wide to throw the ball to? Because, I mean, you've got a backfield. You're not going to have the tight end production that you had. So you got to have good wide receiver production. If they can do that. They got 2,000 yard tailbacks. They're probably nine deep on their offensive line. It's one of the deepest overall units in power four right now. They got Jim Knowles from Ohio State. They went and got a kid, Amari Campbell, I believe from North Carolina. You're not going to hear anyone talk about him. He is a home run out of the portal. They're going to green dot him. They will actually have him call plays defensively this year in all likelihood. So they've got good defensive personnel, they got good offensive personnel. The question is, are they still a seven or are they a nine and a half? Like if they're a seven, good, solid team, probably no more capable of doing anything more than they've done the last few years.

[Sports Commentator]

Years.

[Josh Pate]

It's just, it's like fractions of inches. Them and Clemson both. It's fractions of inches that it takes to go from being good to great. And there's no way to know that. You can't even. I'm going to go up there and watch them practice later next week. I think I won't know. You don't know until they play. And they don't play anyone until really Oregon in week five. And candidly, they should win that game. Oregon's taking a new quarterback into Happy Valley. Penn State I think has got to buy before that week. Oregon's got to travel across the country not rested. If they don't even win that game, I don't know how you convince me that anything's changed.

[Colin Cowherd]

Well, if we were doing a draft of like playoff locks, would Penn State make it past like two dudes?

[Josh Pate]

It's gotta be them. How do they miss? I mean, they're a playoff lock, right?

[Colin Cowherd]

I mean that's, that's what they feel like. So can they get it done? Well, Josh, enjoy. You going to a lot of training camps coming up?

[Josh Pate]

I'm going to try and hit Oregon and Bama and Penn State this week.

[Colin Cowherd]

Yeah, you're all over the country. Well, enjoy it and congrats on all your success. And we'll be watching and subscribe to his YouTube channel. It's just, I don't know, shooting like a rocket ship with. With the numbers. So thanks again for coming on and man, excited for this season. Excited to watch you.

[Josh Pate]

Pleasure as always, sir. Have a good one. The volume.

[Katie Couric]

On the latest episode of Next Question with me, Katie Couric. I sat down with Jasmine Crockett, Democratic representative of Texas. Texas. She's holding down the fort for her party in one of the most conservative states in the union.

[Jasmine Crockett]

I think that ultimately who will become the Democratic nominee for president will be someone that has been out there and has shown that they won't allow themselves to be punched and just say thank you like they will punch back.

[Katie Couric]

Listen to next question with me, Katie Couric on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast.

[John Lithgow]

Hello, I'm John Lithgow.

[Sports Commentator]

We choose to go to the moon.

[John Lithgow]

I want to tell you about my new fiction podcast, One Small Step for Man about Buzz Aldrin, one of the true pioneers of space.

[Colin Cowherd]

You're a great pilot, Buzz.

[John Lithgow]

That's the story you think you know. This is the story you don't. Buzz. Starring me, John Lithgow on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

[iHeart Podcast]

Summer's here, and with the kids home and off to camp, it's easy for moms to get lost in the shuffle on Good mom's bad choices. We're making space to center ourselves with joy, rest and pleasure. Take the kids to camp. You know what? It was expensive, but I was also thinking, you have my kid. This is kind of priceless. Take her, feed her, make core memories. I don't have to do anything. Main thing, I don't have to do anything. To hear this and more. Listen to Good Mom's bad choices from Black Effect Podcast Network on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcast, or wherever you get your podcast. When I became a journalist, I was the first Latina in the newsrooms where I worked. I'm Maria Hinojosa. I spent my career creating journalism that centers voices who have been historically sidelined. From the most pressing news stories to deep cultural exploration. Latino USA is journalism with Hart. Listen to Latino usa, the longest running Latino news and culture show in the United States. Hear it on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. This is an iHeart podcast.