← The Herd with Colin Cowherd
The Herd with Colin Cowherd
3 & Out - Best of The Week: What are the Browns doing, The latest with Belichick, Draft grades
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- [00:00]
John Middlekauff
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- [00:29]
Colin Cowherd
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Whatever you need. And it's guaranteed to fit. Which means no more crossing your fingers and hoping you ordered the right thing. All the parts you need at prices you'll love. Guaranteed to fit every time. Ebay Things people Love. Calendar. See ELS the best selfies. Samsung Galaxy S25 from Galaxy AI, Verizon. Maslovicious. The volume. What is going on, everybody? Hopefully everyone's having a good weekend. We put together a little best of little best of topics for the weekend. Obviously, the Cleveland Browns made headlines multiple times with a massive trade with the Jags, but. But then they ended up with Shador Sanders. So what are they doing? We will dive into that. You know, draft grades are funny because no one knows anything, but we did do a dive on some of the teams and the picks that we liked and are high on. And what is going on with Belichick I mean, this situation, this story has taken on a life of its own with his young lady friend who went viral this last weekend. So. So this situation I give some thoughts on, but let's talk a little football. Okay. There's a lot going on and I didn't do anything on Saturday. Partly I just needed a breather. You know, Mel Kuiper was fuming. I'm pro Mel Kuiper, but I do think he was clearly. I don't know why he was so angry. And you know, Louis Riddick and Reese Davis and they were going back and forth and it was like, God, to be exhaust. I. I was exhausted from the story. I needed to take 24 hours off. So me and Colin touched on it. I've had some time to think about it and I'm going to rehash a theory that I just told Coward. So if. If you already heard it, sorry. And if you haven't, this is my theory because I. I don't think it's that complicated because it doesn't make much sense to take multiple quarterbacks in a draft, especially in the third and the fifth round. That's. That's unheard of. You know, you go back to RG3 and cousins, it was because Kyle Shanahan and Mike Shanahan did not want RG3. Kyle Shanahan was trying to convince them to trade back and take Cousins early. He's talked about this. This was a situation where I think I just read something that the Cleveland Browns had flown out and it never got out and met with Jimmy Haslam, with the coach, with the gm, with Dylan Gabriel. They liked him a lot. Now, I don't even necessarily agree with their assessment. I think drafting Dylan Gabriel in the third round is a little rich for my taste. Right. It's like paying a million dollars for a $700,000 home now. Value in the eye of the beholder on draft day. We can argue that till we're blue in the face. I don't think he was going in the third round. I actually feel pretty confident now. You could always make the argument, how do you know? I've been doing this long enough. Pretty good idea. There's a reason the Will Howard's, the Riley Leonard's, the Quinn Ewers, like you didn't need to take those guys in the third or fourth round. You knew they were going to be there in the sixth or seventh. I do think Dylan Gabriel at the latest. I mean, I think he could have got him in the fifth, but whatever. My thought is this as Shador Sanders starts to drop. When you work with someone long enough, it's like when you're growing up and you live with your mom, your dad, your brothers, you really know them well, right? You know what sets them off. You know, what buttons to push to piss them off. You know when it's like, okay, I. I better. I gotta be. Especially if you have an older brother or an older sister. Like, okay, I'm gonna. I'm gonna avoid this issue. I know my dad really values this, even though my mom doesn't care. And so you just kind of work the room a little bit, right? Definitely. If you've been in a company and you've worked with someone, you've worked for someone, you get a pretty good feel for their demands, what they're into, what if they are an overbearing boss, what they will force you to do. And you kind of know how to play them a little bit. I don't mean, like, nefariously, but just, like, to settle everything down. Once Shador Sanders starts dropping, Andrew Barry and Stefanski aren't dumb. They know that Jimmy Haslam is going to be interested. Why? Because Jimmy Haslam has forced several quarterbacks on them that they did not want, and they clearly in this draft, wanted Dylan Gabriel. So once he starts plummeting, they go maybe texting to each other, maybe talk in their office, close the door. Like, maybe we should draft this guy a little bit higher than ideally we want to. So we just get a quarterback in our draft class, and then Chador will go some picks later, and we don't have to force this upon us. Because Shador Sanders, When I think Kevin Stefanski, I don't think an ideal fit. I actually think Shador's playing style is a lot like desean Watson. Now, I think desean was a better college player and a better prospect than Shador, but I think there are some similarities. Well, in Kevin Stefanski's offense, and this is the Kyle Shanahan thing, they don't really into freelancing. Right? They're into do exactly what I tell you. We can argue till we're blue in the face. That's how they want to play. That's why they like guys like Kirk Cousins and Brock Purdy and Joe Flacco and Dylan Gabriel, he will get rid of the ball quick and go exactly where you want to go with him. Now, can you see that guy? He's kind of short. We'll find out. But I think they did that to hopefully, like, okay, this will shut the owner Up. The problem is, is that Shador kept dropping. So it's like we didn't know and picked him in the fourth, and then he's still there in the fifth. Now it gets to a spot where the owner tells you we're taking them. And when you watch the reaction of those guys in the draft room, and I know they push back against this, you could see in Stefanski's eyes he wanted no part of that. Andrew Barry did not want to make that pick. And then when they discussed it in the. In the press conference, it was clear like this was not their doing. And we have a long enough history to now know this owner forces them to do things they don't want to do. I think Andrew Barry and I think Kevin Stefanski are good at their job. Now, I don't have to agree with their quarterback evaluation because I think Shador Sanders is a better NFL prospect than Dylan Gabriel. They clearly did not. And it makes no sense to take a guy in the third and then another in the fifth because Michael Lombardi used to talk about this for a long time. The NFL practices are math equations. You don't get an unlimited amount of plays. This isn't basketball where it's like, well, just run it again. Eventually you can only run so many plays with your players, especially now, because of the rules. So in a practice, and I'm just going to pick some even numbers to make things even, let's say during a team period, we will have 30 reps of ones versus ones, twos versus twos, threes versus threes. Well, we're not. We don't spread those equally. Right. I give more reps to my better players, especially once the pads come on and train again. So when I got pads on my ones, and I've been to a lot of practices, and every coach does a little bit differently. Get 70% of the reps, then the twos come in and get the next 20% of the reps. And then the threes get, let's say, 10 to 5% of the reps. Now, it might change on a given day, but it is disproportionately weighted to starters, backups, and threes. And the thing is, like, at tight end, if I'm George Kittle, I'm like, hey, coach, I need a blow. I'm exhausted. It's like, hey, take this. Take the next 10 plays off. So the ones, the twos and the threes, he just sits on the sideline. And the other tight ends rotate with the ones, rotate with the twos, rotates with the threes, I can do that at wide receiver, I can do that at running back, I can do that at all the other skill positions. Right. I cannot do that at quarterback. Quarterbacks aren't coming in and out. They stay with the unit. Now with the threes, you can rotate the threes or you can rotate a guy with the twos, I guess. But like if you are the twos quarterback, you get those reps. It's why you see when there's a competition for the backup job, they usually rotate them through training camp. But over time, like one guy ends up getting more reps. What you would have given going into training camp. Obviously Joe Flacco is going to get the ones and just based on his experience and I don't think this guy's any good. He's going to start with the twos, that's going to be Kenny Pickett. So you're going to have two guys rotating with the threes. You're just not going to get that many plays. So it doesn't make any sense. I've seen a lot of people try to justify it's like just keep throwing darts at the dartboard. And I agree with most positions it is just very difficult to take multiple quarterbacks in a draft and get a feel for either one throughout practices. So you can't convince me and other people have written about this in the Athletic that this wasn't the owner. And anytime the owner, I'm all for the owner having opinions, it's his team. But when he's forcing you to take players and this feels like it's like this is out of Shadors control. But I just think it's a weird spot. And the other thing, and I mentioned this to Colin, is coaches and front office people sometimes disagree, right? I like a player that you don't like or vice versa. And sometimes we just agree to disagree and we take the player. And if the coach doesn't like the player that the front office drafted, he can manipulate how many reps that guy gets at practice, how much energy and effort I put into them. Right? Especially when you're talking mid to late round picks. And if the coaching staff, if the head coach, especially if the front office as well is not on board, they will not care. Because part of, and this is the cool part about like being Jalen Milroe, listen, I thought he's a pretty big wild card, pretty risky pick. But here's what I know. John schneider and Mike McDonald all in on him. Think about Mike was around Lamar for years. Think about what made John Schneider a legend. He pounded the table for Russell Wilson. So those guys believe in mobile quarterbacks. You know, Russell was a better thrower than Lamar right away just in terms of accuracy. Lamar obviously became a much better player over the course of the last four or five years. But when people support you, and this is no different than any industry, when you work at a place where the guy that hired you or the guy that runs the company believes in you, wants you there, it's much easier to succeed as a player. Just like as any normal employee, you can start sensing like, do these guys even want me here? How often have we heard over the years older veteran guys, just players throughout the history of the league to be like yeah, I was out of place. The coach in the gym didn't like me, but they just didn't want me there. And I knew it was destined to fail early on. Happens all the time, will continue to happen. It's happened historically in the, in the league. So I think this is a very clunky, weird, bizarre spot. And while in theory I get like I'll just throw darts at a dartboard. Accumulate as many players as you can. Well yeah, it's easy to rotate slot corners in and out. It's easy like this slot receiver gets these reps. It's not really how quarterback works. You kind of got to get a cohesion with the unit you're repping with. So it's just very bizarre situation there. Blending Vice's signature dynamic storytelling with the high octane world of sports, Vice Sports brings an exciting and diverse range of programming that goes beyond the game catch action packed live events and exclusive sports documentaries and profiles only on Vice TV. The NBA 82 game grind is done and now the real fun begins. The NBA playoffs are here and it's time for the high stakes drama, clutch moments and jaw dropping plays. Can't wait if you're looking to make the playoffs even more exciting. DraftKings sportsbook has you covered as an official sports betting partner of the NBA. From the play in games all the way through the finals. Now the time to back your favorite players and teams as they chase glory. All season long, DraftKings has been your go to spot for NBA player props. And that doesn't stop now. Want to make your playoff experience even more intense? 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- [15:16]
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- [15:46]
John Middlekauff
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- [16:36]
Colin Cowherd
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Okay, let's start with William Belichick because listen, I From just. I think a lot of people are judging this guy, and it's, it's a human reaction. When you see a guy in his mid-70s who's really rich, dating a girl in their mid-20s, a lot of people are going to have opinions, a lot of people are going to be judgmental and, and most importantly, a lot of people are going to make fun of you. Now, if you think that Bill Belichick is the only coach in the NFL and definitely college football, who is older than 55, 60, that has a young girlfriend, you would probably have to live under a rock. Now, just because these things aren't publicly, they are definitely going on. And some of these men, I promise you, have wives and kids at home. So, like, Bill Belichick is not some lone wolf here. He's definitely not the first old rich guy to date some young girl. And in his business, which is very public, whether you're an NFL coach, whether you're a college coach, all these people have PR directors. And I've interviewed coaches, GMs, some players back when I was doing stuff with the Niners and Raiders over the years. And typically when you're doing one of these interviews, the PR director is sitting or standing right there. And honestly, it's never been weird. I've never been told by one of these guys. And I have relationships with a lot of these individuals with different teams. Worked with many when I was with the, with the Eagles, met many through the Niners and the Raiders. Most of them are pretty cool, and I'm pretty chill. It's. It's not that serious. Now, if there's something controversial or something they know is unfair, maybe they will chime in. But for the most part, like, you just become. You just build a normal relationship with the individual. Now, typically the coach or the player is not sleeping with that human being. But I would imagine in Hollywood, in some of these other industries where there is a female PR director, and I, I've never experienced that in the NFL, though some of the people under the top dog in the NFL have been women. And who knows, maybe these people have slept around. But that is a, is a different dynamic. So when you see Bill doing this interview and she's chiming in from the side, if that was John Middelkoff At 40 years old, I don't think it would be that weird. I honestly don't think it would be that big of a story. It would just be the PR guy doing his job. We are not here to talk about that. That happens in these circumstances. All the time. How often are you watching a press conference for your team? Right. During the season when you. Your team loses a game and you turn on whoever your coach is and he's given the press conference and you're watching on YouTube, you're watching on Twitter, and you hear two more questions. Guys, that's the PR person. Like, they have a job to do. I think the reason we judge this completely different is because we know Bill's banging her. And that is a situation in itself. I found kind of funny. Now, the interview was extremely awkward and very weird. Newsflash. Belichick gives some weird interviews. He has a long history of doing that. I do think, as this week has played out, like, I got to the point where, like, I can't keep clicking on these back and forth between cbs, between her, you know, publicly putting out emails. Here's what I know. This is not Ole Miss. This is not Arizona State. This is North Carolina, a pretty serious academic institution. And Belichick has had a unique reign in football. In a world where these teams are worth billions of dollars, typically they have had many powerful people in the building. Usually the GM has a lot of sway. What he says matters. Typically in a lot of these places, the president has a lot of juice. Belichick was basically the king of the operation, despite him not owning the team. Obviously, the Crafts did. The Crafts didn't tell Bill what to do. Hell, he kicked Tom Brady to the curb. So Bill is used to this world where he is actually much closer to one of these legendary college coaches like Coach K. Like, you know, Bobby Knight's downfall, like Roy Williams was in North Carolina or some of these football coaches, Bobby Bowden, Nick Saban, you name it, where they could do whatever they wanted. No one told them what to do. Here's the problem. Bill doesn't have this equity with this institution. So these institutions are running by presidents. Right? And they typically are on the academic side. It's why when you have these situations, it falls on the athletic director. But they're not even technically the boss. If the presidents, or depending on how these academic institutions are set up, the Board of regions, whoever, it's almost like a private company where it's like you're answering the CEO and mainly the board of directors. That's how college football operates. And Belichick, like, this has got to be what is going on right now. What did we get ourselves into? And I am pro Bill Belichick. Anyone my age? Definitely. If you're older than me, I'd even say if you're in your mid to early 30s and you witness the entire Belichick run. There is no way that you could argue he's one of the greatest tacticians you've ever seen. He was a fucking genius. What his teams consistently did since till from 01 to like 1819 was remarkable. Now we can argue till we're blue in the face about the credit between him and Tom Brady. You could not have watched Bill Belichick in these big games and think that he didn't have a massive advantage over the other coach. And that's from Pete Carroll to Andy Reid. I'm talking hall of famers to Sean McVeigh. He was getting the best of them constantly. Mike Tomlin never had a shot against William Belichick. But this situation now, PR in college matters in the NFL. Ultimately it doesn't because if you win, everyone shuts up. Now that's true in college as well. But you're recruiting even in this world of nil and revenue sharing, like you are the front facing individual of your sport or and of your university. The way Kirby Smart and Nick Saban and Ryan Day and even Jim Harbaugh Michigan acts conducts themselves, the headlines they make matter. This would be embarrassing if it was the NFL. I do think in college this is almost worse. And I started thinking like, you know, everyone considers Al Davis one of, if not the greatest football minds in the history of the NFL. His last six, seven years got really weird and it's sad for younger people. That's how they remember him. This current iteration of Jerry Jones has just gotten bizarre. I think he'd be widely considered one of the greatest and more impactful business minds of one of the great American businesses we've ever seen, the National Football League. When you get old and you get rich and it's hard for anyone around you to check you whether that's of like Jerry. We probably shouldn't do this many interviews, Al. Like this is probably not a great idea. Bill. You probably shouldn't make the 25 year old you're banging your PR assistant manager. Probably not the best idea. Let's, let's separate some things here. But who's going to tell him that? I mean, his son works for him. Clearly doesn't have the juice to tell him that Mike Lombardi also works for him. Clearly doesn't have the juice to tell him that. And even if they did, he's not listening because he's shown over the last couple decades he ain't really listening to anybody. And for the most part it's Worked out in his favor. I do think once you go to college, though, this has got a chance. He's not at Texas. I saw today a headline. They're going to have a $40 million payroll this fall. Sark, who's become a really good coach, I'll give him his flowers, has a budget that not many teams are going to be even close to, I would say. And imagine the only teams that could even sniff his budget would be Ohio State and Oregon. That's not Belichick in North Carolina. Their talent, even in a conference which is not nearly as good as the top two conferences, the SEC and the Big Ten, he's going to be at a disadvantage. Plus one huge advantage he had in the NFL, just like Andy Reid has now. Is he. Every single guy in the league he has seen or has exposure to coming out in the draft and every single coach he's going against, many he's gone against for years or decades, but he's seen every scheme. There's nothing you can throw at him on a weekly basis that he hasn't seen player wise or scheme wise. Well, college football is due to Bill. He hasn't coached against a lot of these guys. A lot of guys that he's going to see on a weekly basis have never worked in the NFL. Now, ultimately, you know, James Gladstone might be tried to tell you in Jacksonville that football is this complicated, almost like technological project. It's not that complicated. And Bill, a couple years ago when he did the top 100 players with, with Brady and the NFL Network, I think did a great job of articulating like Art of War. My strengths against your weaknesses. My weaknesses avoid your strengths. Like, we're not trying to overthink this. We're not building bridges here. We're not building high rises. We're not doing. This isn't a heart transplant. This isn't that comp. We're just trying to gain three yards on third and two. And I think Bill, his football knowledge speaks for itself all time. Great. This situation, though, you know, coward used to have a thing. Two things make smart men dumb, money and women. And for a while, you know, listen, Bill's a single guy. He can do whatever he wants. But this situation with this girl, empowering her feels like it's just. It's kind of jumped the shark here. And someone, if they can, needs to rein it in because it's got a chance to kind of derail this North Carolina experience before it even starts. Okay. I mean, I think the Shador Sanders topic is settled. Belichick and his girlfriend. That topic exploded on Sunday and means we're at spring football. So let's. Let's dive into some of your questions. Huge fan of the bag. Huge Niner fan. Curious to know your thoughts on their draft. Saw a couple draft grades, and the team got panned. I personally thought they made some great picks. One silly Shanahan reach with Watkins, the Ole Miss wide receiver. But everything else was value, with the defensive line as the main focus. Every year, the Niners get ridiculed in the draft, then the actual core talent is the rounds four through seven. How much stock should we even put into these draft grades? Listen, I mean, draft grades are the dumbest thing in the history of the Internet in terms of to take them seriously. No one has any clue. The graders, the teams, the actual players, the fans. No one knows you. Shit. I mean, no one has any clue. Now totally understand why they do draft grades, because the written word on the Internet has never been less powerful. Right? The videos and podcasts wiped them out, but that is still something that gets people to click. I'm guilty. I see someone. I was like, I'll click. I've clicked on multiple draft grades. Not even because I care. I just can't help it. It's like a. It's like an addiction. I've been doing it for multiple decades. No different than mock drafts. Think how irrelevant mock drafts are. Nobody knew that the Jags were going to trade up. Nobody. And then all of a sudden, they trade up. And the mock drafts are kind of irrelevant because all of a sudden, Travis Hunter is not playing for the Browns and he's on the Jacks. And then it sets off like a domino effect, and it happens every year, but we consume a lot of mock drafts. Kyle Shanahan said his wife called him on draft day that just said she looked at a mock draft, and they really wanted Mikel Williams, the guy they ended up taking, and he was like, pick 28. In the mock draft. She looked at and says, kyle, maybe she said, honey, maybe she said, babe, are we sure that we're drafting the right guy? Are you overvaluing this player? And even Kyle was like, had to, like, rethink. But, yeah, it's like the mock drafts, the draft grades impact the fun of this whole thing, but they don't matter. The 49ers. I've been to the majority of Kyle Shanahan training camps, and the one thing I've learned, you get really excited. Like any training camp you go to when you have a high pick and I would do in the Raiders forever. Khalil Mack, Amari Cooper, back to back years. You know, with the 49ers they had Solomon Thomas and then Nick Bosa. I think back to back years, obviously Trey Lance, when they drafted really high, it's exciting to go see the first overall pick. But look at the names that I just gave out. Solomon Thomas never got his fifth year option picked up and was on like fourth different team. Trey Lance is one of the biggest draft whiffs of all time. Why? Because Brock Purdy came in, Wally pipped him and it wasn't even close. Not a soul. That was at training camp. Brock Purdy's rookie year went, hey, there's Brock Purdy. Do you know that this guy's going to become the starter? No one said that. Of course not. No one ever would say that. And I think you got to be very careful with just drafts. And this is why I don't get that into it beside like the super famous players because we see it every year. I've been to these practices where all of a sudden it's like, well, the third round guy is getting beat out by an undrafted free agent. The amount of guys that signed undrafted free agent contracts that will make teams for everybody is pretty mind blowing. And the thing with the 49ers was clear. I disagree with Kyle Shanahan and John lynch in terms of their emphasis on offensive line, especially the tackle position. Like they are just allergic to taking tackles. I would draft tackles, multiple tackles throughout the draft. I would treat them like other positions. Like maybe we'll hit on a guy in the fourth round. I'm not looking for Trent Williams in the fourth round, but can I get a serviceable player? And they just don't do that, you know. Now maybe they were in position and guys went above them. I know in the third round the Raiders took a couple offensive linemen they were probably interested in. But I asked around the NFL because I felt like I like Jalen Walker a little bit more than Michael Williams. I was rebuffed. Like middlekop, I think you're overhyping it. I didn't meet many people that I know that didn't weren't extremely high on their first round pick. Six five, 270 pounds. Just, you know, he's a little stiff, but like he's got a chance to be a really, really good player in the NFL. Their second pick is 6, 5, 6 6, 330 pounds. The defensive lineman from Texas. That's where I got some think it's A little rich. A lot of teams put a lot of emphasis in pass rushing from their interior defensive lineman. This guy's not really a pass rusher. He's much more of a run stuffer and he's battled defensive or injury concerns over the course of his career. But one thing with those first two picks, they got enormous human beings and their defensive line is non existent. It's like Nick Bosa and then it's that Will Smith gif where he walks into the, you know, to the mansion. Everyone's gone. He's just standing on the rug looking around that that's what it looks like after they've literally got rid of everybody. So I never have a problem taking blue chip players from blue chip programs and it's on you to coach them up. And their defensive line coach has had a lot of success. I think in the third round they had drafted the kind of run and hit guy from Oklahoma State, which again, some of my friends didn't love the player. But you know, you watch his highlights. Howie Roseman talked about this over the course of the draft weekend. This game is so much about space and speed now and that's what this guy is. But I mean, put an emphasis on their later round picks. They have hit on a lot of those guys, but you know, who knows, I don't know. So I have no issue. I'm not pushing back against people going their drafts suck. Like nobody knows. They'll be fine. The key to their draft is going to be those two defensive linemen got to be good and obviously ideally hit on some random guys throughout the course of the third through seventh round. Right? But I think they had two high picks. Pick 11 and pick whatever it was 44 or 43 or 5 or whatever number it was in the second round. Like those guys got to be good. Like those were really, really, really valuable assets in this draft. The volume.
- [37:06]
John Middlekauff
Okay, have you heard about this? Last year degree changed the formula for their Cool Rush deodorant. The fans rebelled and wanted the old scent back. And degree listen and that doesn't happen often. They admitted they effed up out of bringing the original Cool Rush scent back. And it's exactly how you remember it. Cool, crisp and fresh. There's a reason why it's the number one man's antiperspirant. And it's back in Walmart, Target and other stores now for under $4. So try it and see what the fuss is about. Head to your local Walmart, Target and try to OG Cool Rush for yourself.
- [37:35]
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- [38:36]
Jeremy Hobson
A divided country, and our media couldn't be more polarizing. That's why we started the Middle with Jeremy Hobson. It's about bringing voices not from the extremes, but from the vast middle into the national conversation. Each week we hear from ordinary Americans from all over the country. And when you subscribe to the Middle, you also get an episode each week called One Thing Trump did that focuses on just one item from the avalanche of news. Listen to the Middle with Jeremy Hobson on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.
- [39:05]
Colin Cowherd
I'm Camila Ramon. And I'm Liz Ortiz. And our podcast Hastajo is where sports, music and fitness collide and we cover it all, the Arriva Hasta. This season we sit down with history makers like the Sucar family, who became the first Peruvians to win a Grammy. It was a very special moment for us. It's been 15 years for me in this career.
- [39:27]
Jeremy Hobson
Finally, things are starting to shift into a different level.
- [39:31]
Colin Cowherd
Listen to Astavajo on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts.
- [39:36]
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