3 & Out - Deshaun Watson was a swing and a miss, 49ers and Brandon Aiyuk, Jets buyout 170 employees

Summary

Podcast Summary: "3 & Out - Deshaun Watson was a swing and a miss, 49ers and Brandon Aiyuk, Jets buyout 170 employees"

Host: John Middlekauff
Podcast: Three and Out
Release Date: April 1, 2025
Duration: Approximately 82 minutes

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1. Introduction to the Episode

John Middlekauff opens the episode by setting the stage for a comprehensive discussion on recent developments in the NFL. He highlights the significance of the NFL owners' meetings and previews the key topics: Deshaun Watson's career trajectory, Brandon Aiyuk's situation with the 49ers, and the New York Jets' massive employee buyout.

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2. Deshaun Watson's Career Prospects

Timestamp: [24:44]

John Middlekauff delves into the ongoing saga of quarterback Deshaun Watson, emphasizing the Cleveland Browns' decision-making concerning his future. He cites Jimmy Haslam's blunt assessment of Watson's performance:

John Middlekauff: "Jimmy Haslam came out today and said in regards to Deshaun Watson, 'it was a big swing and a miss' (24:56)."

Key Points:

• Contractual Obligations: Despite acknowledging Watson's underperformance, the Browns are bound to honor his hefty $230 million contract, spreading payments over the next few years.
• Injury Concerns: Watson's torn Achilles severely hampers his ability to return to peak performance, making his future in the NFL highly unlikely.
• Reputation Impact: Middlekauff argues that Watson's off-field issues and declining performance render him untouchable in the league, effectively ending his NFL career.

Conclusion: The Browns are unlikely to reinstate Watson as their quarterback, and other NFL teams may be hesitant to sign him due to both his injury and reputation issues.

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3. Brandon Aiyuk and the 49ers Dilemma

Timestamp: [35:20]

The conversation shifts to the San Francisco 49ers and their handling of wide receiver Brandon Aiyuk. Middlekauff critiques the team's management decisions surrounding Aiyuk's contract and potential trade.

Key Points:

• Contract Concerns: Aiyuk was recently granted a substantial contract exceeding $75 million, marking it as one of the most guaranteed deals for a player drafted in the first round.
• Performance Evaluation: Despite Aiyuk's contributions, the 49ers are considering trading him, possibly due to his injury status or off-field behavior.
• Team Strategy: Middlekauff questions the logic behind the 49ers' decisions, comparing it to a failed personal relationship where commitment falters once significant investment is made.

Notable Quote:

John Middlekauff: "The 49ers did not make the playoffs. So starting in January and by the combine, that's five months... how could they just be open to this?" ([35:50])

Conclusion: The 49ers' oscillation between supporting and possibly trading Aiyuk reflects deeper organizational challenges, particularly in balancing financial commitments with player performance and team chemistry.

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4. New York Jets' Massive Employee Buyout

Timestamp: [50:10]

Middlekauff addresses the controversial move by the New York Jets to offer buyouts to approximately 170 employees, drawing parallels to executive departure strategies in other industries and critiquing the underlying motives.

Key Points:

• Severance Packages: Employees receive substantial severance packages, often exceeding six months of pay, which contrasts sharply with typical in-house layoffs where employees receive minimal support.
• Ownership Decisions: Woody Johnson's approach is likened to copying strategies from figures like Elon Musk and Donald Trump, focusing on broad organizational overhauls without addressing core team performance issues.
• Impact on Team Performance: Middlekauff argues that eliminating non-coaching staff will have negligible effects on the team's on-field performance, suggesting that the real issues lie within team management and player acquisition.

Notable Quote:

John Middlekauff: "Woody Johnson is not leaving. So the ownership, there is no change of leadership... this is his idea" ([60:15]).

Conclusion: The Jets' extensive buyout is largely symbolic, failing to address the fundamental problems within the team that contribute to their lackluster performance. Middlekauff believes that such superficial changes will not translate to on-field success.

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5. Broader NFL Ownership and Management Issues

Timestamp: [65:00]

Expanding beyond individual teams, Middlekauff critiques the NFL's overarching management strategies, including playoff hosting rules and quarterback management, using examples like Aaron Rodgers and the Minnesota Vikings.

Key Points:

• Playoff Hosting Criteria: Middlekauff supports allowing division winners to host playoff games, arguing it honors team achievements despite overall season records.
• Quarterback Dynamics: He discusses the potential acquisition of Aaron Rodgers by the Steelers, emphasizing the complexities of managing star quarterbacks and the delicate balance between player performance and team dynamics.
• Management Accountability: The host advocates for accountability among GMs and coaches, suggesting that persistent underperformance warrants significant organizational changes rather than surface-level adjustments.

Notable Quotes:

John Middlekauff: "What you pay to the quarterback... is never going to change anything in your life, your future children... it's the wiggle room that we have" ([70:20]).

Conclusion: Effective management in the NFL requires a holistic approach that goes beyond financial investments, focusing on strategic decisions that enhance team performance and foster a winning culture.

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6. Final Thoughts and Future Outlook

Timestamp: [80:02]

In wrapping up, Middlekauff shares his insights on the future trajectory of the NFL, emphasizing the importance of strategic drafting, player development, and the potential for teams like the 49ers to rebound from recent setbacks.

Key Points:

• Draft Strategies: He underscores the importance of drafting based on team needs versus best available talent, advocating for a balanced approach that strengthens foundational positions.
• Team Rebuilding: Middlekauff remains optimistic about the 49ers' ability to rebuild and become contenders again through smart management and player acquisitions.
• Industry Trends: He notes the increasing commercialization and international expansion of the NFL, predicting that these trends will continue to shape the league's future.

Notable Quote:

John Middlekauff: "If you just draft good players, no one's really going to complain." ([78:15]).

Conclusion: The NFL's future hinges on the league's ability to adapt to changing dynamics, prioritize effective management, and maintain a balance between commercial growth and maintaining competitive integrity.

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Notable Quotes and Insights

• On Deshaun Watson:

  "Deshaun Watson will never play another game for the Cleveland Browns... his NFL career is done." ([26:00])

• On Jets' Buyouts:

  "Woody Johnson is copying Elon and Donald who did that... but he's barking up the wrong tree." ([55:40])

• On Draft Strategies:

  "If you just draft good players, no one's really going to complain." ([78:15])

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Conclusion

John Middlekauff's episode of "3 & Out" offers a critical examination of recent NFL developments, providing listeners with in-depth analysis of player contracts, team management decisions, and broader league strategies. Through insightful commentary and well-supported arguments, Middlekauff underscores the complexities of navigating success in the highly competitive landscape of professional football.

For those seeking a nuanced understanding of the NFL's inner workings, this episode serves as a valuable resource, highlighting the interplay between financial commitments, player performance, and effective team management.

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Listeners are encouraged to subscribe to the "Three and Out" podcast for ongoing discussions and analyses of the latest sports stories and trends.

Transcript

[Jeremy Hobson]

We live in a divided country and our media couldn't be more polarizing. That's why we started the Middle with Jeremy Hobson. It's about bringing voices not from the extremes, but from the vast middle into the national conversation. Each week we hear from ordinary Americans from all over the country. And when you subscribe to the Middle, you also get an episode each week called One Thing Trump did that focuses on just one item from the avalanche of news. Listen to the Middle with Jeremy Hobson on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

[Bob Pittman]

Hi, I'm Bob Pippman, chairman and CEO of iHeartMedia. I'm excited to introduce a brand new season of my podcast, Math and Stories from the Frontiers of Marketing. I'm having conversations with some folks across a wide range of industries to hear how they reach the top of their fields and the lessons they learned along the way that everyone can use. I'll be joined by innovative leaders like chairman and CEO of Elf Beauty, Tarang Amin, legendary singer, songwriter and philanthropist Jewel.

[Julie Swerbinks]

Being a rock star is very fun.

[Damian Muller Donato]

But helping people is way more fun.

[Bob Pittman]

And Damian Muller Donato, CEO of American Financing.

[Julie Swerbinks]

I figured out the formula. I just have to work hard then that's magic.

[Bob Pittman]

Join me as we uncover innovations in data and analytics, the math, and the ever important creative spark, the magic. Listen to math and magic on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast.

[Nate Thompson]

What's up, everyone? Julie Swerbinks here, along with former NHL player Nate Thompson.

[Julie Swerbinks]

We're doing a new podcast together. Here we go.

[Nate Thompson]

The name Energy Line with Nate and jsb.

[Julie Swerbinks]

Each week we'll get together and talk about hockey life. All topics are fair game, right?

[Nate Thompson]

Exactly. And you'll never know who will drop by to join us.

[Julie Swerbinks]

Julie is pretty well connected. She has text threads going that you wouldn't believe.

[Nate Thompson]

Listen to Energy Line with Nate and JSB on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

[Jemele Hill]

You have to be very careful with tradition because sometimes tradition is just dead people's baggage.

[Roy Wood Jr.]

I'm Jemele Hill, host of the sports and politics podcast Sports Politics. On this week's episode, I talk with comedian Roy Wood Jr. About the lack of African American star power in Major League Baseball.

[Jemele Hill]

Baseball needs an Anthony Edwards and I don't know who that could be. Mookie Betts is Steph Curry. He's exceptional and likable. Million Dollar Smile. But you also need Chaos Negro.

[Roy Wood Jr.]

Listen to spoletics on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts.

[John Middlekauff]

The Volume.

[Julie Swerbinks]

What is happening everybody? How are we doing? Hopefully everyone is having a great day. I'm John. This is three and out podcast and today we're going to be talking a little football. The National Football League owners meetings. Lot of stuff coming out. Jimmy Haslam, he just acknowledged Deshaun Watson's career over. John Lynch, Mike Tomlin, Andrew Locke, lot going on in the football world. A lot of comments, a lot of headlines. Woody Johnson trying to fire everyone in his organization but willing to give out some golden parachutes to some depending on how long you've been there. So we will dive into it all as well as the middlekopf mailbag @johnmittlekopf @johnmittlekopf is the Instagram fire in those dms and get your questions answered on the show. We did a podcast Sunday that was out yesterday, so if you missed it, we had a podcast for Monday and this will be Tuesday. And I think I'll do a golf podcast tomorrow. So keep an eye for that if you want to get in on the golf mailbag at golopod. Any golf questions? We have the Masters next week, so any questions you have @golopod. We'll do a mailbag on the golopod tomorrow. But that's the Instagram @golopod and fire in those DMs with any questions. But we'll just keep the football podcast rolling. We will know if the Tush push gets banned or not. I will react to later this week. Who knows, I mean I'm not confident either way, it's going to be fascinating if it gets banned. Howie and Sirianni are going to be pissed. But other than that, subscribe to the podcast. If you listen on Collins feed, subscribe to our YouTube channel. And before we dive in to the old podcast talking about some football, can I tell you about my friends, my partners in the official ticketing app of this podcast? You know what I would love to do? I Born and raised about 15 minutes away from Sacramento, they now have the Ace are playing in a 15,000 AAA stadium. The size of the stadium fits about 15,000 people and I think the A's are going to be pretty good. And if you live in Northern California to go to an A's game at Raley Field in Sacramento, it'd be pretty sweet. The Oakland teams love to move. You got the warriors in San Francisco, you got the Raiders in Vegas. Now you got the A's in Sacramento. So they're Spread out. But if you want to go to a baseball game, if you're a Yankee fan and want to watch these Torpedo rocket bats, go check them out and do it on us, obviously. Comedy shows, concerts, you name it. Gametime is the best, easiest ticketing app I've ever used. I have been to more events in the last couple years working closely with these guys and using their app than I have in years. And I've got Christmas presents and birthday presents off the app. Obviously, if you want to get out of the house, do something fun, go enjoy yourself, do it. And take the guesswork out of buying tickets with GameTime. Download the GameTime app, create an account, use the code JOHN for $20 off your first purchase terms apply. Again, create an account, redeem the code Johan for $20 off down the game to have today last minute tickets, lowest price is guaranteed. You know, owners don't talk very often and rightfully so. If I owned a team, I would not take the Jerry Jones approach. I would only speak when it was kind of mandated that I speak. Like at these owner's meetings, when you really can't hide, or after a monumental decision for the organization, a hiring of a coach, a firing of a coach, even a big signing of a player. Like, ultimately, that's why I paid my GM and the head coach millions of dollars and I gave Jimmy Haslam credit. When Miles Garrett demanded his trade and who's represented by Clutch and Rich Paul, and they wanted a one on one meeting with Jimmy Haslam, Jimmy Haslam simply told him, meet with my gm. He's in charge. Now. Ultimately, in a weird way, it all kind of worked because Miles Garrett got a historic contract. But I do think for a guy that has, you know, a past, that's more than questionable with Flying J and the trucking company who's had a disastrous ownership, there is no disputing that no owner has spent more actual cash than Jimmy Haslam over these last four years. You know, now clearly that hasn't equated into dominating the NFL. But it's not from a lack of cutting checks. He is doing things that a lot of teams take a lot of shit in this league. Hell, Jerry Jones, who is an extremely wealthy man, is often criticized for sneaky. He pays some of his top guys, but not spending as much cash as other owners. And Jimmy Haslam spares no expense when it comes to his football team, specifically the players. Now, I remember reading an article within the last month, or maybe it was within the last couple months, that said you can't always Buy your way to championships. Obviously, culture, the right coaching, the right players, who you're actually paying really matters. So there are a lot of variables to this. But you know, it's pretty rare that you get a microphone in front of an owner, a guy that you have on your current team who you are paying a lot of money, even if it is an epic all time disaster, that you get them to be honest, that you get them to be candid. Because let's face it, you know, we use the term coach speak a lot. When coaches just basically say nothing, yet they're talking a lot. It's like he just talked for 15 minutes. I don't think he said anything of value. And they're good at it and I don't ever blame them for doing it. And owners and GMs do the same thing. Jimmy Haslam came out today and said in regards to desean Watson, quote, it was a big swing and a miss. I was like, damn. Even though every human alive, whether you're in Cleveland, Ohio, whether you're in Scottsdale, Arizona, whether you are in the, in Dubai, if you follow football, you know that the Sean Watson trade contract has been an all time disaster. But usually they just give you a B.S. listen, we're going to keep trying to add to the football team. Deshaun's doing everything possible to rehab and get his Achilles right. And you know, he has the right attitude and just all the BS cliche stuff is typically what I would have expected if you told me Jimmy Haslam today at the owner's meetings is going to be asked about DeSean Watson. I would not have expected this. And you know what we have to acknowledge because I think with this, desean Watson will never play another game for the Cleveland Browns. His career for the Cleveland Browns is over. Because I don't think you say a comment like this without basically acknowledging like this thing is a wrap. Obviously we can't cut him because it accelerates the contract, but he's got a torn Achilles. We never plan on making him our quarterback again. And the 90 million plus we owe him, we will pay over the life of the next couple years. And it is what it is. And over the next couple of years he will be, I'm sure, released from the Cleveland Browns. Whether that's 26 or 27. I'd even go as far to say I don't think DeSean Watson will ever play in the NFL again. And if you've listened to me long enough, you know I'm not some moral high horse guy when it comes to the private sector, whether that's whatever industry you work in specifically. Obviously, I talk a lot about the NFL. Like the job of an NFL GM and an NFL head coach is not to teach society life lessons. There have been a lot of bad guys, questionable characters, who have played a lot in the NFL. Why? Because they could play. And that is the job of a team, to get the best players possible. That gives you the best chance to win, but the moment you can't play. And desean's clearly proven the last couple of years he can no longer play at a high level. Honestly, he's awful. Like, he's objectively one of the worst players his time in Cleveland that we've seen in the NFL for decades. Now. You factor in extensive injury history, shoulder, Achilles, then you factor in the baggage off the field. I don't think he ever gets signed in the NFL again because if he had been a high level player and became available, you would be naive and ignorant to think a lot of teams wouldn't line up to acquire a quarterback. Right. That's why the Cleveland Browns gave him $230 million, because they thought they were getting a star player from Houston. All this stuff off the field was being discussed. What was out there didn't matter. They didn't care. And then desean's like, I'm not going to Cleveland. And they said, what will it cost you? And they gave him the contract terms and Jimmy Haslam gave it to him. But the reason this contract has been a disaster, he's awful. And now he's injured. And now to the rest of the NFL, I think he's untouchable. When you factor in just the toxic nature of his name, you just say desean Watson. An NFL fan goes, but he can't play. It's the reason a lot of guys with questionable off the field situations, whether they are guilty in the court of law or not, that's not the NFL's job. This isn't the Justice Department. Honestly, if you are a free man walking, they don't give a shit if they think you're a high level player. It's been proven over and over and over and it will continue to be proven over and over moving forward. If you are a high impactful, talented guy, you are going to get countless shots. Deshaun Watson no longer is. And when I think you factor in the baggage and the toxicity that he brings moving forward, I think his NFL career is done. And I don't throw that out lightly. Like I said, zero moral stance. Coming Here it's just simple of like his production to baggage talent rate is all out of whack and there's going to be no way to prove it because clearly he's never playing another snap for Cleveland. So I think we have seen the end of Sean Watson, John lynch and Kyle Shanahan. 1 the coaches photo came out today. Saw a lot of smiles. You got McVeigh, huge smile. Andy looks happy. Jim Harbaugh looks like he just hit the lottery. Just a lot of good vibes off season, not much going on. These dudes are in Florida. They're all flying private jets are first class there. Mike Tomlin sweating his ass off. So you know it's, it's good weather especially for these guys coming out of cold weather cities. Yet Kyle Shanahan looks like someone just stole his dog. I mean looks miserable. And I was thinking about this today, by all reports and all accounts is Brandon Iuk will not be traded by tomorrow when they owe him a large sum of money. I think it's like 25 plus million dollars, give or take. And it's pretty clear that they wanted to trade him. That they went into this offseason hoping someone would give them something of value where they could unload this money. And I started thinking like I just got married. Brandon Iuk was signed right before the season started. So basically September, October, November, December. The 49ers did not make the playoffs. So starting in January and by the combine, that's five months if you count January. But by the combine it was reported and John lynch did not push back of like, yeah, we'll trade him. Like we're open, we're listening to everybody. If in five months. And they just gave this guy a massive contract beside Nick Bosa, I think it's the most guaranteed money they'd ever given to a player. 75 plus million dollars. A guy they drafted just got married. If in five months, I'm like, yeah, I'm telling people, I, yeah, wouldn't be, I'd be open to a divorce. That'd be a problem. And that'd be a reflection of like what were you doing in the first place. So the 49ers who had this back and forth with Brandon Iuk after being on this rookie contract, essentially in my analogy, dating for a long time, why wouldn't you have just pulled the trigger and traded them before the draft? Like, what could have happened? Did it get that weird and toxic once you gave him the money? Kyle had to kick him out of a practice for wearing the wrong Clothes. But like, that is enough to just be totally out on the guy. I don't quite understand how a mistake like this could happen. And clearly they view it as a mistake. This is not an opinion because you would not, even after the injury, of like, listen, we believe in this guy. He's one of our core players. Like the way they talk about Nick Bosa or Fred Warner or George Kittle, they don't ever talk like that. Yet Brandon Iuk, they immediately treated like most NFL players are treated like, yeah, we get rid of them for the right price. You just gave this guy $75 million. I don't quite get it. Listen, some mistakes, the Trey Lance thing, he's still not signed to a team. It's been well documented. Awful decision, A lot of variables playing a part. Covid's going on no season. They took a swing, backfired. They got very lucky to pivot off that. Like that happens. We've seen a lot of teams make awful decisions in the draft. The jets did. Was Zach Wilson, right? He was on what, his third team in three years? Justin Fields, Mack Jones, all these guys are on different teams. So, like, you'd be like, that's even Trevor Lawrence, who got paid $200 million, most of us would argue is even that good. And I think the jury is definitely still out. But Brandon Ayuk was a guy you drafted in the first round, a guy that you had been with for years, won a lot of games with, and then five months after giving him a historic contract, you're like, this sucks. We want out of this business. I. And listen, I think it's always easy to criticize these situations. And it was easy to criticize last year, which I did a lot. I thought they never should have paid him a lot of money, mainly because he had just got 75 balls, which was a career high. Like, guys in your offense paying him what top receivers are going to get, it's never going to work. It's always going to be, you're not going to have 100 catch guy. That's not the way your team's built. And most specifically, your head coach, who's the coordinator, runs an offense. So doing a deal with him like this, from a financial standpoint, even separate from however weird it got off the field and the injury didn't make football sense. But what could have happened within five months where you're like, yeah, we just, we're not really into this guy. And they can say whatever they want now. He's still our guy. Like, bullshit. You don't entertain a trade like this and let's face it, want to trade them. No one's giving you anything of value for a guy owed basically 50 million over the next couple years who has a torn ACL and McLaren. Right. It needed major surgery and it's not even going to be ready till the next, till the middle of next year. Now maybe this was. They knew they could never trade him and they're playing psychological games with him because they thought that he fucked with him last year, which has been well reported and they did not like the way the negotiations transpired. But what a bizarre situation it really is. The Steelers and Mike Tomlinson. Now, Tomlin was asked about Aaron Rodgers and he gave one of his classic like Tomlin's. I'm comfortable being uncomfortable this time of year and I'm used to the weirdness of, you know, free agency, which I don't think he's really lying. And I think all signs right now point Aaron Rodgers being on the Steelers. I heard, I think some people had believed that Rodgers was going to make the announcement on Pat McAfee's like, I think he has like a show. I don't know if it's actual like live show when his show's on air or just a show at night, but it's in Pittsburgh. And most people think that Aaron Rodgers is going to come out during that period of time. And when I first heard, I forget where I heard this. It's like, I don't know. That's so long to wait. He's really going to. No. Now I kind of feel like, yeah, maybe there is some validity to that and that's ultimately what's going to happen because there was a picture going viral today of Rogers throwing with DK Metcalf, who is obviously no longer on Seattle and on the Steelers. You're like, this thing's going to happen. But that's not what I want to talk about. Mike Tomlin, he had a quote today that I thought, which I'm kind of torn on. And he was asked about, you know, the receding which is getting pushed in these owners meetings about teams with better records than division winners having to go on the road. And obviously there are teams pushing to have a team like the Minnesota Vikings would not have. Now, technically that game ended up in Arizona, but would get to host the game because they won 14 games. Instead they're going on the road to play a 10 win division winner. And Mike Tomlin supports division winners getting to host playoff games because he thinks basically winning the division matters. And he's a big believer in rivalries, which I am too. I'm all for it. And I used to believe this. If you, if you won your division and it was one of those weird crappy years and your team was under.500, which we've seen before in rare circumstances. I think the Panthers one year, the Saints on the. Was it the beast Quake in, in Seattle, they had to go on the road. Seattle was like 7 and 9. Won an awful NFC west like Pete Carroll's first year. I'm all for, you don't get to host a playoff game. And I'd. Even before in that situation, you don't even make the playoffs. But I think guys like Tomlin would push back against that. I think if you're under.500 and you're like, well, if you're not one of the top seven teams, you just don't get to make the playoffs, I'd have no problem with that. But I do think this, if you win your division and this is going to be like, you know, I'm going to pull some stuff I don't want to say out of my, you know what. But this is just, I was thinking about this. If you win 10 or more games, let's use the Rams as an example. Like they didn't feel like a random playoff team this year, but they weren't. Minnesota, Detroit, Philly, like they weren't 13, 14, 15 win team, but they were clearly pretty good and they went 10 and 7 and they won their division. I have no problem with them getting the right to host a playoff game. But if you tell me you go 9 and 8, which in 17 game season is essentially 8 and 8 now, it's not under.500, but it's still like you're 9 and 8 and you're always going to be more than likely the fourth team. If you go 1, 2, 3, 4 in the divisions, you're hosting a team. I would say if we just look back on the last decade is probably on average going to have two, potentially three more wins than you. Feels a little out of whack. So I'd have no issue with this. Under 500, you're not guaranteed a playoff spot. If you win the division at 8 and 9 or worse, if you go 9 and 8, you get to make the playoffs even if you're not one of the top seven rosters or I mean records because you won the division. But you get to, you got to play on the road and if you go get 10 plus wins, you get to host the game and you'd be like, well why do you just choose those numbers? Well, it's like I was thinking about this today where they get the 15 yard penalty. Why is it not 10 in 100 yard field and we're at the 30 yard line? I mean you're talking, that's a huge, huge advantage. Why is it 15 yards automatic, 15 yard penalty, automatic first down. Why can't it be 10? He just chose a 15 and we just go along with it. Which I'm not against but when you, when you really think about the fields, 100 yards. So if you get a 15 yard penalty, that's 15% and that's assuming you're basically at the zero yard line. Well, if I get a 15 yard penalty, I'm at the 50. Shit, I'm already in field goal range. Well, that's 10 and changed a little bit. So we already kind of do that with penalties. Why can't we do it in this situation? I do just think that something about under double digit wins. We got a question. The finals for March Mania are here. And the only thing for sure is it's the last time you can bet on college basketball this season. Get in on all the action expected and unexpected with DraftKings Sportsbook. 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[Jeremy Hobson]

We live in a divided country. I am a lifelong Republican with all kinds of different people.

[Julie Swerbinks]

You know, I'm a mother, I'm a grandmother.

[Jeremy Hobson]

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Anna, I'm calling from Las Vegas.

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Thanks for having me, Jeremy.

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Thanks for having me.

[Jeremy Hobson]

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[Julie Swerbinks]

Hi, my name is Venkat. I'm calling you from Atlanta, Georgia.

[Jeremy Hobson]

And when you subscribe to the Middle, you also get an episode each week called One Thing Trump did that focuses on just one item from the avalanche of news.

[Julie Swerbinks]

We should be examining what our government spends its money on and are these jobs necessary? And what are we doing here?

[John Middlekauff]

But that doesn't seem to be what we're doing in this situation.

[Jeremy Hobson]

Listen to the Middle with Jeremy Hobson on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts.

[Damian Muller Donato]

If you are more concerned about what your fellow racists think about you, you've already lost.

[Julie Swerbinks]

Lost.

[George M. Johnson]

Hi, I'm George M. Johnson, a best selling author with the second most banned book in America. Now more than ever, we need to use our voices to fight back. And that's what we are doing on the Fighting Words podcast. Listen to my new episode with the iconic Gabrielle Union. We've cleared the air about a recent controversy with actor Matthew Lawrence, who claims she reported him on set for refusing to run lines with her.

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This is like two husbands ago. Like, what are we even talking about?

[George M. Johnson]

And I ask her what it's like raising a trans daughter during Trump's second term.

[Damian Muller Donato]

When you offer up the trans community as a sacrificial land. If you open the door to say, well, take these people now. The door is open and they coming for everybody.

[George M. Johnson]

Listen to Fighting Words on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast.

[John Middlekauff]

On November 5, 2018 at 6:33am, a red Volkswagen Golf was found abandoned in a ditch out in Sleep Hole Valley. The driver's seat door was open. No traces of footsteps leaving the vehicle. No belongings were found except for a cassette tape lodged in the player. On that tape were 10 vile.

[Julie Swerbinks]

No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no.

[John Middlekauff]

Grotesque.

[George M. Johnson]

Oh my God.

[Julie Swerbinks]

Oh my God.

[John Middlekauff]

Horrific stories that to this day have been kept restricted from this too. A horror anthology podcast. Listen on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts.

[Jemele Hill]

You have to be very careful with tradition because sometimes tradition is just dead people's baggage.

[Roy Wood Jr.]

I'm Jamal Hill, host of the Sports and politics podcast Spolitics. On this week's episode, I talk with comedian and CNN host Roy Wood Jr. About the lack of African American star power in Major League Baseball.

[Jemele Hill]

Baseball needs an Anthony Edwards, and I don't know who that could be. Mookie Betts is Steph Curry. He's exceptional and likable. Million dollar smile, that's important. But you also need chaos, Negro. You need.

[Roy Wood Jr.]

So you think Anthony Edwards is a chaos agent?

[Jemele Hill]

He told. He talked. Did you saw the clip of him talking to Obama? He was talking to Obama like that was his little brother. Oh, yeah. You what you did. You killed bin Laden. That's what's up.

[Roy Wood Jr.]

Listen to Spolitics on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast.

[Julie Swerbinks]

Couple things in regards to the Colts. Andrew Luck is now the GM of the Stanford Cardinal, and he just fired his coach, Troy Taylor, who ironically is a former Cal quarterback and coaches Stanford just like Mark Madsen, former Stanford great Cows basketball coach. But there was an article within the last, I don't know, three or four weeks. I haven't talked about this on the show because I read the article and it said he was doing, like, really mean things to women within the office, but it didn't really give details. So it was like, it was hard for me to have a take when, I don't know, like, is he just. Football coaches can be dicks. A lot of stress. They're not winning. Is he just not being nice or is he doing specific things? Like, I need examples to have an opinion on, like, yeah, this can't be tolerated. Or is like, yeah, welcome to football. But he got fired and Andrew Luck fired him. And today it was announced that Frank Reich, his former coach and obviously former Panther coach, former Eagles offensive coordinator, former quarterback in the NFL, will be the interim coach with Stanford, but only for this year. Now, if Stanford wins like eight, nine games, maybe he just keeps the job. But they're claiming that he, they fired Troy Taylor, which, you know, was, I guess, Andrew Luck's decision, potentially the president's decision. You fire a guy in the middle to late March, you can't just go on like a normal coaching search. But Frank Reich will be the coach. So listen, the Troy Taylor experiment. He got 3 and 9. He got 3 and 9. Stanford's kind of in shambles. They're now playing in the acc. Good opportunity for Frank to kind of get his swag back because it kind of feels like Frank's never going to be a coach again. And all of a Sudden, if he can resurrect Stanford in a year, I don't think it's inconceivable that he just keeps the job. I listened to Chris Ballard. Oh, Florio. He sat down with Florio, and I listened to that interview and then I read some quotes from Shane Steichen. It's pretty clear that the Colts like Daniel Jones. And one thing Ballard said is the last couple of years, we've just tried to sign the best backup quarterback we could. Gardner Minshew 2 years ago, Flacco last year. But those quarterbacks, their skill set didn't have anything in common with Anthony Richardson. So when Anthony Richardson would leave the game, injury, suspended, whatever, I guess he wasn't technically suspended. He was just benched. We'd have to change the offense. And this year we went into it thinking, like, we need to get a more athletic quarterback where the offenses can be pretty similar. I think they like Daniel Jones and I think Anthony Richardson's job. And again, I'm not pro Daniel Jones, but he better play well because if Daniel Jones, if all things are equal, I think they'll go with Daniel Jones. I think they are very, very unsure right now on Anthony Richardson. I don't blame him. And psych and mentioned the day like, he's got to be more accurate. He used the Gruden quote, you can never go broke taking a profit. You know, the, the spider two wide banana. The whole point of that was like, you can dump it at the fullback. It's an easy play. And the one thing with Anthony Richardson, you don't really get easy plays because he's pretty inaccurate. And I'm not saying Daniel Jones is any good. Listen, I don't even think I would have signed him if I was them, but clearly they are not comfortable with Anthony Richardson. And right now I would say it's a coin flip. Week 1. Who the starting quarterback is shows you how fast things change. And I think they have a front row seat of watching these other situations, like you kind of know, you know, and they saw it with the Niners and Trey Lance, they saw with the jets and Zach Wilson, they saw it with the Justin Field situation. Like, you just kind of, once you kind of start questioning a guy, it's pretty rare that you pivot back with a super young player. And maybe over the course of a decade, maybe he can figure it out. But as I'm sitting here right now, March 31, 2025, if you tell me Anthony Richardson becomes like just a solid starting quarterback in the NFL, my guess would be. It happens with someone other than the Indianapolis Colts. This was an interesting story. The New York jets, it was reported by, I think the Sports Business Journal that of like 220 employees, they offered like 170 or 180 of them the opportunity to quit and basically get paid to go away. Which I've always said. Some of these coaches like Josh McDaniels got like $50 million to leave. You know, no human can relate to that. You read some of these articles about like CEOs getting the golden parachute. I remember when I got firing radio and they owed me like 10 grand over the course of two months. I thought I was like, I'm getting 10 grand for two months and not do shit. This is awesome. Most human beings when they are laid off or fired, not only don't get much, a lot of them are at will employees. They get nothing and have to take unemployment. And it sucks. I've been there where you're just like have no money coming in. You have, you don't even know what to do. I feel little sympathy the way this is going to work with the jets where a lot of these people are 10 plus years, some of them are 20 plus years. You get three weeks severance for every year you work there. So if you work there for 10 years, you would get 30 week severance. I mean that's more than, more than six months. Some of these people up to 80 week severance. Do the math. We're talking a year and a half. So like it's a pretty, if you, it's pretty clear if they don't want you to work there and they're offering you a year worth of severance, it's like I, I'm not feeling bad for you. I'm not looking at you like the, the dude at some job that just gets laid off and now has no income coming in. That sucks. That's not the case here. Woody Johnson's throwing this out. He's copying Elon and Donald who did that. I actually know a guy who got offered this, I think was it early February, late January, and he took it. He's being paid by the US government till I think September to just. He got paid to leave. And he was in a situation where he was between jobs. He took this job, he didn't like it and they offered him that. He's like, see, I'm out. This situation, which I would say is a little unheard of. The difference in the government thing that's going on is there's administrative change. There is A new boss and there are people, if you don't align with the values and you are not going to want to do what they're going to want to do or you think that they're going to bring in people that don't align with the way you view things, you ultimately will get fired or forced out. You're like, okay, I'll take my quote unquote golden parachute right now in this situation. Woody Johnson is not leaving. So the ownership, there is no change of leadership. The reason the jets haven't made the playoffs in I think it's the longest standing professional team in all of all of sports, all the four major sports in America is not because of any of these individuals. Sure, some of them you could trim some fat, probably you could upgrade. But Woody Johnson looks at it like we need a full scale change. Let's fire everyone in the building and start from scratch. Woody, you're not a startup. The reason your team hasn't won many games, you've picked the wrong players, you've hired the wrong coaches, you haven't figured out the quarterback position. The third dude in the marketing department who's worked there for six years has no impact on winning and losing. I promise you that. I've been in these buildings. They do not impact it. It's not their fault. So like I understand what he's trying to copy, but I think most people would tell you he's the problem and as long as he owns the team, nothing's going to change. So they could get all these people, 200 plus people could, could basically agree to pay me to go away, which for some of these people is a long time, I'd argue is an American dream. But I don't think it's going to have any impact if Justin Fields can't complete an out route, if the defense can't get a third Nate stop. If Sas Gardner plays like he did last year, not his first two seasons, if their pass rush isn't very good, if Aaron Glenn's not a good coach, if this dude they hired from Denver is not a good gm, they could replace all those fucking people and it will have no impact on whether they can beat Mike vrabel or Sean McDermott. So sexy headline. And I would imagine that a lot of these people end up taking these once they realize that they are not wanted anymore. Because the one thing I look back at when you know, I've left places was like, why would you want to be somewhere that doesn't want you now at the time it's Very difficult. When you're hearing that news, it is not fun. But when time passes and you look back, you're like, why would I want to work with these people? And the answer is, you wouldn't. If they don't want you there, especially the guy that owns the team if he wants you gone. I mean, this is, I promise you this, this is his idea. He's clearly good buddies with Donald. Their wives were models in the 80s or whatever. And he's copying Doge and Elon. I just, I just think, to think that the dude selling sweets is the reason the jets get made fun of a lot and have had issues over the last 15 years, I just think is fundamentally like barking up the wrong tree. You're just, you're trying to fix something that is not going to change the thing that matters the most to everybody, which is the on the field product. Couple other things. The, the international games, they're looking at Greece in the United Arab Emirates. My take on this has been pretty consistent. I do believe that this is not about international expansion of putting a team in England or Spain or in any of these place. It's just about building an international fan base for Netflix and Amazon and Apple TV and Hulu or whoever they end up going into business with. That's what I think they're doing. And they're going to play a game in Greece, they will play a game in Dubai. Like this is all inevitable. It's pretty clear where this is all going. But to me it is all based on the ability to stream these games and have more and more people watching outside the United States. That is important to them. And when they inevitably sign a big deal with Netflix, they will have hoped to have built that base over the course of the 2020s and they are actively doing that. Thursday Night Football. They've added the ability to flex games over the last couple years. They just had to give you a 28 day heads up. So if they were going to flex your Thursday night game and you know they, if they were going to put you, you're on a Sunday game and now they're going to flex your game because it's better to Thursday Night Football, they had to basically give you a month. Well, they've cut off a week and now they only have to give you 21 days. I think they are dead set on selling this package for way more money than they just did to Amazon and they understand that when you're getting 10 to 15 million people to watch these games, how valuable is that? We just saw The NBA almost triple their deal and they've lost half their audience. They won't have one game this season, including the NBA Finals unless the Lakers or Warriors make it. That will get over 10 million people. Yet the NFL on Amazon prime is disappointed when only 10 million people watch. So I think the league is licking their lips on upping the value of all these packages and they don't want a game that looks good at the beginning of the season. And then all of a sudden is a disaster sitting there on Thursday night and all of a sudden it's not as important to watch. I'm going to watch. I don't miss any Thursday night games. But it's much more enjoyable when it's Bengals, Ravens or Chiefs, Broncos than when it's, you know, Jags, Titans. And I think they've made that decision and they will keep getting aggressive and this is probably as close as you can get. The detractors will say, what about the fans? What about the people who have made the decision to travel in to buy a hotel room and buy tickets? They don't care about you. They care about the dude on the couch. They care about the person that accounts for one of those 11, 12, 13 million people. That's where they derive their cash. It's where they make their money. The value of you sitting in the game used to be really valuable. It's really valuable in baseball because I got 80 home games. It's really valuable in basketball because I got 41 home games. I value my season tickets. I value the people that buy game day tickets. They are just not nearly valued by the league office that views things from a macro perspective. So a lot of people are going to write articles and complain about this, which I get. And listen, it sucks if you make a decision to go to that game. Especially, you know, a decision if it's like Raiders, Broncos, and all of a sudden, I'm not trying to shit on the Raiders, but they just have no chance to make the playoffs and all of a sudden they move that game for let's say Rams, Packers. It's like, well, I've already bought my tickets to Vegas. I already reserved my room at the Aria. I already was going to go fly in Thursday morning and stay through Saturday. They're just going to tell you shit out of luck because they're not really worried about you. And for the money that you used to generate them 20, 30, 40 years ago, you're such a small piece of the pie now. And the only thing they care about is Amazon prime and whoever's going to buy that deal in a couple of years, sees the big numbers, and the bigger the game is, the more people they're going to watch. Last but not least, Kevin O'Connell said that two things can be true. We really like JJ McCarthy, and we're all in on JJ McCarthy. But we would not be doing our job if we didn't thoroughly discuss and go over the scenarios about Aaron Rodgers. I think he's right. You could argue, like, listen, Aaron, we are going to offer you a contract. One year's $5 million. One year, $5 million. What's he gonna say? No? It's like, okay, go to Pittsburgh for 25 or whatever. We're offering you by far the best opportunity with the guy. As Kevin O'Connell said, I've known since I was playing one year, $5 million. You've made 450, you probably made $600 million on and off the field. Whether you get paid $20 million or $5 million isn't going to change anything in your life, your future children, if you choose to have them, anything about the rest of your existence on this earth. But we are going to give you $5 million. And that would give them the wiggle room. Like, if it's not going well, we just cut you. That's what I would have done if I was Minnesota. Yeah. I'm not giving you 25, 30, $40 million. Here's our offer. If you want to be a part of what we're doing and somehow end up on the same path that Favre ended up on, the guy that you, like, detested because he was mean to you, and then you played for the same teams and clearly Rogers was hoping the Vikings offered him a contract. You could argue, like, hey, league minimum and Rogers league minimum, because he's been the league 20 years, might be two or three million dollars, but this is what we'll offer you. What's he gonna say? No, like, okay, cool. This is what we wanted. We wanted the wiggle room of, like, if this doesn't work out, we can bounce because we don't want to be tied to you, but we do value. Like, maybe you're better than J.J. mcCarthy right now, maybe you're not. I don't know the answer. Obviously, you know, three or four years ago, you wouldn't. Aaron Rodgers already been on the Vikings. It would have been a no brainer. But at this point in time, he's 41, he's declining. What if JJ actually is good, but what if he's bad? Like, I understand why they had these conversations, but if it ever got down to making him an offer, I think the offer would be for a very, very small amount of money and basically put it in his court. Like, how bad do you want this? Because we got the leverage. You want to be here more than we want you. So I'm a little surprised that they ended up not pulling the trigger on just a. Basically a low ball offer. I don't even want to use the term lowball. Just a, just a. Listen, we want you on this team. We think you still have something left, but financially, this is the wiggle room that we have and basically don't even pay him more than JJ McCarthy. So if JJ McCarthy actually hits, you know, there's not resentment, big picture. But they chose not to do that. And they're all in on J.J. mcCarthy. And now the hopes of Minnesota Vikings fans and the future of a franchise that's absolutely loaded on paper falls on a guy that's never taken a regular season. Snap.

[Jeremy Hobson]

We live in a divided country. I am a lifelong Republican with all kinds of different people.

[Julie Swerbinks]

You know, I'm a mother, I'm a grandmother.

[Jeremy Hobson]

That's why we started the Middle with Jeremy Hobson. It's about bringing voices not from the extremes, but from the vast middle into the national conversation.

[Julie Swerbinks]

Anna, I'm calling from Las Vegas.

[Jeremy Hobson]

Each week we bring together an all star panel. Mark Cuban, so great to have you on the Middle.

[Julie Swerbinks]

Thanks for having me.

[Jeremy Hobson]

Jeremy, Neil Degrasse Tyson, welcome to the Middle.

[John Middlekauff]

Thanks for having me.

[Jeremy Hobson]

And hear from ordinary Americans from all over the country on the most important issues.

[Julie Swerbinks]

Hi, my name is Venkat. I'm calling you from Atlanta, Georgia.

[Jeremy Hobson]

And when you subscribe to the Middle, you, you also get an episode each week called One Thing Trump did that focuses on just one item from the avalanche of news.

[Julie Swerbinks]

We should be examining what our government spends its money on and are these jobs necessary and what are we doing here.

[John Middlekauff]

But that doesn't seem to be what we're doing in this situation.

[Jeremy Hobson]

Listen to the Middle with Jeremy Hobson on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

[Damian Muller Donato]

If you are more concerned about what your fellow racists think about you, you've already lost.

[George M. Johnson]

Hi, I'm George M. Johnson, a best selling author with the second most banned book in America. Now more than ever, we need to use our voices to fight back. And that's what we are doing on the Fighting Words podcast. Listen to my new episode with the iconic Gabrielle Union. We clear the air about A recent controversy with actor Matthew Lawrence, who claims she reported him on set for refusing to run lines with her.

[Damian Muller Donato]

This is like two husbands ago. Like, what are we even talking about?

[George M. Johnson]

And I ask her what it's like raising a trans daughter during Trump's second term.

[Damian Muller Donato]

When you offer up the trans community as a sacrificial land, if you open the door to say, well, take these people now. The door is open and they coming for everybody.

[George M. Johnson]

Listen to fighting Words on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

[John Middlekauff]

On November 5, 2018 at 6:33am, a red Volkswagen Golf was found abandoned in a ditch out in Sleep Hole Valley. The driver's seat door was open. No traces of footsteps leaving the vehicle. No belongings were found, except for a cassette tape. Tape lodged in the player. On that tape were 10. Vile.

[Julie Swerbinks]

No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no.

[John Middlekauff]

Grotesque.

[George M. Johnson]

Oh, my God.

[Julie Swerbinks]

Oh, my God.

[John Middlekauff]

Horrific stories that to this day have been kept restricted from the public until. You feeling this too. A horror anthology podcast. Listen on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

[Jemele Hill]

You have to be very careful with tradition because sometimes tradition is just dead people's baggage.

[Roy Wood Jr.]

I'm Jamal Hill, host of the sports and politics podcast Spolitics. On this week's episode, I talk with comedian and CNN host Roy Wood Jr. About the lack of African American star power in Major League Baseball.

[Jemele Hill]

Baseball needs an Anthony Edwards, and I don't know who that could be. Mookie Betts is Steph Curry. He's exceptional and likable. Million dollar smile, that's important. But you also need chaos Negro. You need.

[Roy Wood Jr.]

So you think Anthony Edwards is a chaos agent?

[Jemele Hill]

He told. He talked. Did you saw the clip of him talking to Obama? He was talking to Obama like that was his little brother. Oh, yeah, you. Oh, what you did? You killed Bin Laden. That's what's up.

[Roy Wood Jr.]

Listen to Politics on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast.

[Julie Swerbinks]

Okay, Mailbag time at John Middlekopf. At John Middlekopf is the Instagram fire in those dms. I have a lot, so I just. If I haven't got tears, I'm going to try to just keep banging them out over the weeks, the off season. We'll just, we'll just keep up. Hopefully I can get most of them before the draft because obviously once that happens, then we have a whole new influx and there's just, you know, if I don't get you by then, you probably get lost in the shuffle. So I got to start grinding over these next couple weeks from Landon. Love the content. Been a listener for years, huge fan of Nil. I think it's great because college athletes can make money off their popularity and branding. My question is, how much money do you think football icons like Johnny Football and Reggie Bush would have made in their college careers? You know, the irony of you saying off their branding and likeness, their image, you know, that's name, image and likeness. That's not what these guys are being paid to do. I think Deion Sanders said it. He's like beside like Shador. Who do you see in commercials? These guys are just being paid to play, which again, I don't care. But it's basically I'm just paying you to play football. I'm not using your name, image and likeness anywhere in terms of like commercials, like businesses. It's just like I have $500,000 for you here. So it's kind of out of whack. But in this system, I think both, I think they would have been them, Cam Newton. I mean, talk about in more Johnny Football and Reggie because they had a build up. Cam just had the one year with Auburn. I mean, he would have been asking for a raise by like week four. But Johnny Football would have made a lot. I mean, after that, huge was his redshirt freshman year after Reggie Sophomore. Yeah, it would have been millions of dollars. As a former scout, how much of your time was spent traveling to watch players live versus evaluating them on film? And did you enjoy the travel side of the job or do you prefer breaking down the tape? That's a good question. I would say I like driving. You know, I could drive for hours. Now the problem in that business is, you know, when I drove from Arizona State to Vegas or LA to Cal Poly to Cal and Stanford, you just spend a lot of time in your car where you can't get any work done. So it's like at least when you're flying around and in the airport you can work. Like when you're driving, it's just kind of dead time. And it's just time when you are from three to eight at night, if you're on a five hour drive, when it's. You're just getting nothing done. Listen, we all have to commute at times and you waste an hour or two. But when you have consistent four or five hour drives, it's just a lot of extra time that you're gonna have to spend when you get to your hotel. I'm very Comfortable in a hotel. I can work in a hotel, turn the AC to about 65 degrees. I can, you know, eat snack and beef jerky and subway sandwiches. Like, I can live that life no problem. I mean, I don't think I'd want to do it as much now, but I didn't have a problem with that at all. I don't travel nearly as much now, obviously, for this, but every once in a while, like, go to the combine or go to the super bowl and just stay in hotel. It's like, I'm very comfortable in that environment. I'm very comfortable in a hotel room. And maybe it goes back to that. I don't know. And this is someone as a kid, like, we didn't. It's not like this term gets thrown out a lot. Vacations, vacations. It's like, you know, Maria's like, I need a vacation. Like, when I was a kid, we didn't go on many vacations. Like Mo. I don't think most people in society are just getting a couple vacations a year. Like, kids get spring break or whatever. When I got spring break, I just was with my friends at home or I'd go with my dad to work. So I. I didn't get to travel as much. I definitely didn't fly a lot. Like throughout junior high and high school, like, with my family, we didn't really go anywhere. If anything, I went, like, with my friends. When I got to go on quote, like to Lake Tahoe or whatever it was, like to my friend's house, it wasn't ours. So maybe I value that ability to do that now. Sure, there's something psychological to it, but I love a good Marriott. As an aspiring NFL NBA content creator on YouTube, what tips do you suggest for getting started? How do you grow to have a following that you have now? Well, I've been in this business now, you know, the podcast space for going on nine years. I've been doing YouTube stuff for five. Plus I've made my living off the Internet for a long time. So I would say my number one piece of advice to any human, just do like, you gotta stop talking. You just gotta do it. Some stuff is not gonna work. The best part about the Internet business, there aren't really that many rules. Just do whatever you want to do and if it works, double down. If it doesn't stop, I. It's just, it's. It's the best. I mean, it's, it's for all the industries we have in the world. I would say content creation Is a little bit podcasting, YouTube, TikTok, you fucking name it, kind of. That world is still like the wild, wild west. It won't be forever. But right now, like, you look at some of these worlds, like banking or real estate, and some of these things are very, very corporate. And you got to follow a bunch of rules. Ain't many rules. The number one rule you should follow is just try to do content as much as possible. You know, I don't have to. I didn't have to do a podcast Sunday. This could have been my first podcast of the week. Record on Monday for Tuesday and just essentially take Friday, Saturday, Sunday off. Because I'm. I don't record anything Friday for Saturday. But I, you know, I start questioning myself, like, am I being lazy? And the answer I gave myself was, yeah, let's do something. So I recorded something like, the best part about this world is like, you don't have to do anything. Like, you get to choose what you. Now once you got ads and people in business, like, there are certain requirements based on certain deals. But, like, you kind of get to pick and choose when you want to do stuff. So pick and choose to do stuff more often. And then through that you can figure out what works and what doesn't. Since we're in the off season, can you walk us through the process, comma, activities and schedule from the draft until the regular season? Game 1, players, coaches and rookies? I've always wanted to know what's going on behind the scenes. Well, that's a long period of time. I'll just walk you through the next couple months. March 31st. So once the owners meetings end and all the GMs and the coaches go back to their facilities, I don't know whether they fly out Tuesday night or Wednesday, either by Thursday or Friday or maybe next Monday, you will start intense draft meetings of taking everything that you have gathered since the combine at the pro days, all the information, and really hammer home the end of your draft board. Now, your coaches will be involved. They will have worked guys out. They will have evaluated players on film so their opinions will come into it. The coordinators, the position coaches, and you will all work to get your draft board situated over the course of two or three weeks. And like I know Veech and the guys in Kansas City, they spend a lot of time in that room. Anytime there's a question or an argument on a guy watching games together as a group and they just kind of work their way through it. Some teams do less of that. So every team is A little different. And then you just set your draft board and the draft comes. Obviously you pick the players and then within, I don't know the exact time, usually this after not the first weekend, but the second weekend, you have a rookie minicamp where those guys, you know, your Friday, Saturday, Sunday, all the guys you just drafted, all undrafted free agents, and then a bunch of like random tryout guys and you just run pretty discombobulated practice. And over the course of that time, you know your, your OTAs phase one, but it's really just working out. Guys are in town working out, they're in there during, over the course of April and you're just kind of all integrating together. It leads to OTAs and OTAs. You know, for a place like Kansas City or Baltimore or Buffalo or the Rams or the Niners. Niners have a lot of new players, but some of these teams with like pretty established rosters, you know, it's, it's, I wouldn't say the Eagles. It's a three day work week. Tuesday, Wednesday, Thursday. And a lot of times you're getting three day weekends, Friday, Saturday, Sunday off. Monday's relatively chill. You work out some guys who are on the street, maybe older free agents during that time. But when I was, when I worked for the Eagles, like we were playing a bunch of golf, you know, they weren't crazy long days, like eight to three or four. Now it's intense for the rookies and some of these teams, like, you know, if you're the Titans or a new coach, you know, Pete Carroll, obviously some days are longer, like the Chiefs and the, you know, the Eagles. Like certain teams, it's, it just depends where you're at. And then you basically do OTAs, which are just, I mean, kind of stupid at this point, with all the rules till summer break, which is about, give or take 35, 40 days where you just do whatever the hell you want. A lot of these guys, you know, a lot of coaches are rich. They go to cool places and then you reconvene for training camp. I'm not going to do a training camp breakdown right now, but the off season, once the draft ends, becomes pretty chill, becomes, I would say, very relaxed. It's a good time, you know, for like me. I'm going to try to get out and interview some of these guys during the months of May and June because it's, it's very relaxed time. The spirits are very high for all these teams. Who do you think is the best contender to go from worst to first in their division? This year, I mean it probably have to be the 49ers. Just because when you look around like, is it going to be the Carolina Panthers? Is it going to be the New York Giants? You know, even the New England Patriots who could have a massive bounce back, like they're not going to have a better record than the Bills. So I think the most realistic team would have to be the Niners. Yeah, the Patriots. I just, even if they were to get a wild card, they're not taking the Bills out. Browns no chance. Titans feels hard pressed. Raiders no chance. Giants definitely no chance. I do think the Bears could be a lot better, but I mean their, their division, 15 wins, 14 wins and 11 wins. So they combined for 30. They combined for 40 wins. The three teams they got to take out, Saints, I'd say probably no chance. It feels like the Niners would be the only guess you could have. That could be real Good question. If you were going to build an NFL team, when you build through the trenches, this seems like an obvious concept, but the bottom 12 teams in the NFL seem to constantly be rebuilding over and over. Are these coaches and GM scared of getting fired and that's why they bring in new flashy skill position players? Would you approach it as a gm? Well, I think if you, if you, if your fundamental football belief is to draft big guys. I think most people say that right? When they get introduced as a head coach, when they get introduced as a gm, when they do interviews, like we believe in the line of scrimmage, but then you're on the clock. Let's say you're the Cowboys, right? You're at pick 12. It's like you should probably take an offensive or defensive lineman. Zach Martin just retired. You've just lost some defensive players over the course of the last couple of years. Like you could definitely add a young talented guy to go with Micah, especially a D tackle. All these GMs often also say is like take the best player on the board. So if we get to pick 12 and the best player on our board by far is Ashton Genty and let's say McMillan from Arizona, who I saw kind of went viral because someone got him for saying he doesn't watch film. It's like guys, a lot of college players don't watch a lot of film outside of their, the coaching staff. Like he's not, it's not abnormal. Now will he develop into that whole time will tell. But like I don't think he's alone. But if those are the best two players on the draft and you don't have a defensive or offensive lineman on the same level as those guys. That's when often you get in trouble is when you reach for a need. So I do think it's easy for us to criticize them. And then when they take a need and it works, they look like a genius. And when they take a skilled guy and it backfires, they look like an idiot. It's really, really difficult to draft. It is. It's so much easier for us all, including them, to play Monday morning quarterback, to look back a couple years ago and like, great pick, awful pick. You don't have any of that information. In a month you can only go off what you are projecting. Then in two years you got a bunch of film and you know, certain guy's been arrested and broke his leg and I got, I wouldn't have fucked with that guy. It's so easy to say after the fact and I'm as guilty as anybody. But I think if you just draft good players, no one's really going to complain. Look at the Eagles last year. They just, they desperately needed DBs and they drafted the two DBs. Well, you know what? Turned out both the DBs were sweet. What if those DBs sucked? It's like, Ah, those guys can't play. DeJean's a stiff white guy. Mitchell, overrated, small school guy. He'd be getting crushed. The key is to hit on the picks. Keys to hit on the picks. The Bengals took Jamar Chase over Penne Sewell, which if I just pulled every gm, hey, star tackle, star wide receiver, which one are you going to take? Take the star tackle. But if that guy's Jamar Chase, you don't feel really bad about it, especially in your offensive line. Still sucks. I was wondering your thoughts on the Ravens chances to finally make it over the hump. I feel like our roster is stacked and can beat any team. I know Lamar has been disappointing in the playoffs, but I think the improvements we've seen the last two seasons have been big. Do you think we will win the super bowl this year or Lamar will continue to struggle in the playoffs? I'll say this, if I'm the Bills or the Ravens, you keep giving yourself enough swings, eventually you're going to hit a home run. Eventually it's going to break your way. I've seen it play out with other teams. You know, Lamar and Josh are clearly the next two best quarterbacks in the league. Peyton Manning forever couldn't get over the hump against the Patriots and then he finally did and then he went to three more Super Bowls. It's like one of those two teams is, I would say in the next two years. Hell, I would say this year, it's a coin flip for the Chiefs. Are the Chiefs going to go to six Super Bowls in seven years? Yeah, they have one of the best coaches of all time. They have a great quarterback, but just history would tell us Belichick didn't go to the Super Bowl. And Brady, every fucking year, he got beat occasionally by Flacco, by Manning, like, it's just gonna bite by Mark Sanchez. So eventually it's just going to be like, oh, Bill's Ravens in the AFC Championship game. Bound to happen. This going to be your year? I don't know. I thought two years ago was your year. If Lamar keeps playing an elite level and you guys just keep building good teams like you've done for. Feels like most of my adult life. Yeah, you're going to have a shot. In your opinion, what do you think was the best decade of football? I'm 24, lifelong Pats fan, so I grew up watching the Dynasty in New England, but I love watching old highlights to see how much different things were. My personal favorite was the 2010s. I would say the best decade of football for my personal enjoyment would probably be the tens or, excuse me, the zero. The just the 2000s. It still had like a 90s, 80s, 70s level of you could get killed. Like, it was so physical and intense that only gladiators could do it. But there was still such a high level of, like, Brady in his prime, Manning in his prime. Favre was still playing. Breeze really hit the scene. Philip Rivers, Big Ben came, Eli. So you just had pretty high level quarterback play, especially in the playoffs. And there was like this gladiator element. I think the league was deeper than it was definitely when I was really, really young. The salary cap, I think, changed the world of parody. But like, you know, you came over the middle, John lynch or, or Brian Dawkins or some of the Troy Palomalu and Ray Lewis. There was just an element of this is crazy. I mean, these guys are nuts. And there's still an element of that, but, you know, the violence has just been officiated out of the game because they don't want to get sued, which I totally understand. If I was in their shoes, I'd do the same thing. But there was a level of violence up until whatever the mid 2010s that just doesn't exist anymore that I'm not ashamed to say. I Miss sometimes. And I think some of these players get away with poor play quarterbacks specifically. That wouldn't have been tolerated back then because you would have got guys killed. You wouldn't have been able to play you. And I do agree with Brady, you know, Mahomes, Josh, Lamar, these guys would have played in any era. But some of these random guys that are able to excel, like, could Gardner Minshew have played in 2004? No, I do not believe that. I don't think he would still be in the league. That's not. I'm not trying to take a shot at the guy. I just think you watch him play and he kind of little gunslinger like, I don't think it's possible he would have got people killed. So I'd go my personal favorite, the 2000s. Do you think? As more and more different head coaches and GMs win Super Bowls, Shanahan and Lynch will slowly become an overrated coach and GM combination. It always seems like he has a stacked roster and just coaches just like other coaches such as Sirianni. But the difference is that he can never take it all the way home. Hell, Zach Taylor made a Super bowl and Doug Peterson won one. Lynch overpaid Jimmy G. He used two first rounders on Trey Lance, three and could have whiffed on Mac Jones. Got lucky with a limited seventh rounder. Yeah, I mean, these guys, just until you win a Super bowl, you always have that hanging over your head and how close they've been. They're going to pay their quarterback. Yeah, they will get criticized. But here's the thing. Kyle Shanahan could have two awful seasons. He would immediately get hired. Immediately. It's like Andy Reid, Andy Reid got fired in Philadelphia. There were three or four teams lined up to hire the guy. John lynch, is he overrated? Underrated? Like, who's like, his resume speaks for itself. He drafted a lot of really good players. And Jimmy Garoppolo was not necessarily overpaid. Won a lot of games with him. Now, was Jimmy Garoppolo a franchise quarterback? It turns out he wasn't because he got injured a lot and then he kind of diminished as a player. But like, when they paid him, what were they supposed to do? They just made the Super Bowl. If Tua just taken the Dolphins to the super bowl or Trevor Lawrence, I would have been like, yeah, I have no problem with them signing that contract. Like, those guys couldn't piss a drop in the playoffs. Especially Tua. It's like, you can't. Jimmy Garoppolo is like making plays in the playoffs and in huge games to get them the number one seat in 2019. So they were kind of like what are they going to do? And then he just kind of fell off a cliff because he was injured a lot. But I don't have as big of an issue with them paying Jimmy Garoppolo. That was not the reason. Like that didn't derail their team at all. The Trey Lance thing is a way bigger issue, but they got out of it because of Brock Purdy. Now it's like Purdy's going to be judged differently because he's going to be paid a lot of money. Question for the Bag does the height of Genti really concern you enough to hesitate on him being one of the best running backs in the draft? I Understand he's only 5 8, but what about backslike Frank Gore? I'm from the Bay and had the privilege of meeting Frank and Willis at a birthday party in the San Jose hills. He was listed at 59 but in person didn't seem taller than 5 7. Tackle breaking ability like Gore. You're making my point though. Frank Gore, who's, I mean one of the more consistent players of his Generation was pick 65. I've never said that Ashen Genti isn't one of, if not the best running back in this draft. My issue is are you going to take a running back who's 58 in the top 10 when you could find a starter? No problem. In this draft it is considered one of, if not the deepest running back drafts in years. In the second or third round, aren't you better off taking a defensive lineman in the first round and then taking the third or fourth running back in the second round? That's my whole argument. I'm with you. He's not going to be a bust or a great player. His height is not going to determine his success. He can excel and be a Pro Bowler five eight, 100%. But am I taking a five eight guy in the top 10 at running back? That's where I struggle with and I'm with you. Frank Gore is a stud, but he was a third round pick. Now part of that was because of his knee injuries, but that's my argument. Why don't you just draft a Frank Gore in the third round and take other positions in the other in the other rounds. So when I look at the 49ers who took Frank Gore in 2005, they took Alex Smith with the first round pick. They took David Bass with their second round pick, I think played decent amount who's on the team for five years. So they got their starting quarterback and their starting center and then they're starting running back in the third round. That's my whole argument here. Take, take, get your starting tight end, Tyler Warren and then take whoever the fourth best running back or the seventh best running back in the third round who might be the next Frank Gore. Happens all the time. Alvin Kamara, third round. Nick Chubb, second round. LaShawn McCoy, second round. You don't need lots of guys like Adrian Peterson. I'm just Saquon Barkley. I'm just not taking the guy that high. When you were talking about guards and centers having elite toughness like wrestlers, it got me curious. Did you catch any of the NCAA wrestling championship this past weekend? As a Penn State fan, it's one sporting event where I get to experience winning natties. But the event overall had some awesome moments. Like I said, I just watched the highlights of of the dude that upset the guy from Minnesota, which was awesome. I think the Bills last year, either drafted in the seventh or as an undrafted free agent took the national champion wrestler from Minnesota. I don't even think it was a guy that just lost. Could be. Probably shouldn't bring that up. I don't have the information, but I'm pretty sure that they they brought a wrestler to the team. Dming you from my fiance's Instagram account, I think I have a great addition for Fugazi Friday. Decorative pillows. We currently have seven decorative pillows on our bed and none of them are ever used. What is the point of having and paying for seven pillows to take them off and use your actual pillows when you sleep. They are annoying. I hear you brother. You know the one thing is when you one thing ladies bring to our lives is the feng shui, the aura as the kids say that the vibes of the house because when they don't exist my house looks much worse in terms of decorations and like I would I never had any pillows on my bed beside the ones I used to sleep. And I think my mom before I moved to Arizona like the only reason my bed had like the extra pillows because like my mom bought them for me. But there are things I'm with you they just are there for looks and how often even when you bring people over to your house like friends, they're not hanging out in your bedroom. But maybe this is an old school thing my dad taught me like one thing I am good at and I'm disciplined with is making the bed Every day. It's kind of, kind of my job or it's just, I just end up doing it and I don't mind doing it. It's like, get out of bed, get out of bed, make the bed. Your bed does look better with the pillows, but I'm with you. When you sleep, we have like a chair next to the bed that you just put all the pillows in. And then when you make the bed, you just grab all the pillows and put them back on. Like you said. One, they're not comfortable. So even if you wanted to lay on them, they're always like, harder. They do improve the look. And that is something that ladies bring to our life, is they add the vibes of the house would look worse without them. Even if these things that they bring to the table aren't functional because from a functionality standpoint, they bring the pillows. Do nothing. You never use them. You only take and subtract them from the bed. When you actually use the bed, sometimes they go on the floor and then they get dirty. Kind of gross. But when they're all on the bed, the bed does, in theory, depending on, you know, the color of the pillows and the, the duvet and everything look better. But I hear you, I hear you. That's, you know, big pillows got us by the balls.

[John Middlekauff]

The volume.

[Julie Swerbinks]

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[Jeremy Hobson]

We live in a divided country, and our media couldn't be more polarizing. That's why we started the Middle with Jeremy Hobson. It's about bringing voices not from the extremes, but from the vast middle into the national conversation. Each week, we hear from ordinary Americans from all over the country. And when you subscribe to the Middle, you also get an episode each week called One Thing Trump did that focuses on just one item from the avalanche of news. Listen to the Middle with Jeremy Hobson on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

[Damian Muller Donato]

Are your ears bored?

[Julie Swerbinks]

Yeah. Are you looking for a new podcast that will make you laugh, learn, and say que? Yeah.

[Damian Muller Donato]

Then tune in to locatora radio season 10 today.

[Julie Swerbinks]

Okay. Now that's what I call a podcast. I'm Diosa. I'm Mala, the host of Locatora Radio, a radiophonic novella, which is just a.

[Damian Muller Donato]

Very extra way of saying a podcast. Listen to Locatora Radio Season 10 on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

[Nate Thompson]

What's up, everyone? Julie Swerbinks here, along with former NHL player Nate Thompson.

[Julie Swerbinks]

We're doing a new podcast together. Here we go.

[Nate Thompson]

The name Energy Line with Nate and jsb.

[Julie Swerbinks]

Each week we'll get together and talk about hockey life. All topics are fair game, right?

[Nate Thompson]

Exactly. And you'll never know who will drop by to join us.

[Julie Swerbinks]

Julie is pretty well connected. She has text threads going that you wouldn't believe.

[Nate Thompson]

Listen to Energy Line with Nate and jsb on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.