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- [00:00]
Podcast Host / Advertiser
This is an iHeart podcast. Guaranteed Human.
- [00:05]
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Sophie Cunningham
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- [01:15]
John Middlecoff
So let me get this straight.
- [01:16]
Malcolm Gladwell
Your company has data here, there, and.
- [01:18]
John Middlecoff
Everywhere, but your AI can't use the data because it's here, there, and everywhere? Seems like something's missing.
- [01:28]
Malcolm Gladwell
Every business has unique data. IBM helps your AI access your data wherever it lives. To change how you do business, let's create smarter business.
- [01:38]
IBM Executive / Expert
IBM.
- [01:43]
Colin Coward
Hi, it's Colin from the Colin Coward Podcast. I've been around long enough to know quality when I see it, or in this case, when I taste it. Tito's Handmade Vodka. Good stuff. No flash, no gimmicks. Smooth, clean tasting. No made the right way. Tito's made in Austin, Texas. Real attention to detail. I like to keep it simple. Tito's Soda, one lime, a lot of ice. Refreshing, easy. Summer, winter, spring. Totally versatile. Always works. Listen, baseball season's here. The perfect time to kick back with some Tito's. It's what I pour. You should, too. Distilled and bottled by 5th Generation Inc. Austin, Texas. 40% alcohol by volume. Savor ra responsibly.
- [02:23]
Total Wireless Announcer
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- [03:16]
Malcolm Gladwell
The volume.
- [03:29]
John Middlecoff
What is going on, everybody? John Middlecoff three and out podcast brought to you by my friends at Zone Zone Pouches. Appreciate you guys sponsoring the show, being part of the show. Love these guys. Went through about a can in the last 24 hours. No big deal. Hopefully every one of you are getting involved because this is a great product if you like little nicotine in your upper lip, because I know I do. But today I thought because middle of the week I just need to take a deep breath. My staff, we just been grinding here during the holiday. So I said let' swe didn't do anything on Wednesday.
- [04:02]
Or maybe that was Thursday. We didn't do anything. I didn't record anything Wednesday that came out Thursday. So I said, you know what? I. I got a bunch of mailbag questions. Let's do a big mailbag little weekend mailbag at John Middlecoff. At John Middelkopf. Is the Instagram Firing those DMS? Not sure. I I mentioned this on the YouTube page, but I haven't mentioned this on the on the podcast. I know a lot of you guys, I listen to podcasts, watch them on YouTube. They're kind of all the same. Any of you guys that send me those wraps of you watching like top, you know, half percenter or 1 percenter, appreciate it. You guys, I don't know how you stand this much of me, but I'm very grateful that you do so. I from the bottom of my heart. For those of you diehards, I appreciate it. I was actually we started watching bed last night that that Eminem documentary of his crazy fans. So yeah, hopefully you guys aren't that crazy. But I appreciate all of you guys for sure. So thanks for spreading the good word and listen to the podcast. I'm glad you guys like football, but you guys know the drill. If you listen on Collins feed, make sure you subscribe. If you want to watch all of our content, it's on YouTube. Just type in our name. Subscribe and you'll never miss a thing. Let's. Let's just start. Wanted to say I've been a subscriber for a while and some kind words. I appreciate it. I think this is k your knowledge of football educated opinions truly have taught me. You know I try here's the question. Now my question is pretty simple. Who do you think the best coaching staff is in the NFL and how significant is your coordinators and personnel coaches compared to the head coach alone? Do they all full staff weigh more than the head coach comparably to the impact of teams success on both sides of the ball?
- [05:50]
I actually just was watching this clip of Urban Meyer talking now college a little different than the pros because during the season recruiting is such a big element in college football. We're in the pros like Andy Reid and Kyle Shanahan. Unless they're in their hotel room or at home watching a little college football, they are not scouting college football that way.
- [06:12]
Just in the same way that a college coach has to kind of be dialed in on the, on the class. But Urban basically said is obviously the head coach if he's not the play caller. And this is true for the, for the NFL is a big part of the culture of the vision of the message, of the way practice is structured. But he's like once the ball's kicked off, you know, beside maybe chiming in with a run here, go for it on 4th down there calling a timeout. The coordinators are in full control. So like to me, the most powerful coaching staffs I think pretty consistent around the NFL are the head coach being the offensive coordinator, Andy Reid, Sean Payton, Sean McVeigh, Kyle Shanahan, Matt LaFleur and then a really, really good defensive coordinator. And to me, I know they're 6 and 6 right now, but their track record over the last.
- [07:04]
Since Spags got there kind of speaks for itself. I would say it's hard to trump Andy and Spags. I mean that's a pretty dominant one, two combination, I think. I mean Kyle and Sala pretty, pretty tried and true formula. Shula has been really good with McVeigh. Vrabel doesn't fall under that category, but clearly he's pretty elite. And having Josh who's not going to leave is pretty damn good. So I think anytime that your head coach is a play caller and he just has so much of an impact because he's doing all that leadership stuff and he's calling the game. So Mike McDonald and Kubiak have been excellent this year, but I have a hard time not giving it to Andy and Spags. I mean they're just. Their record is unimpeachable in this little run.
- [07:57]
Happy holidays. Why does college football have conference championships? Meanwhile teams have already made the playoffs. Basically get a buy before the playoffs. It's like the Top two seeds in the nfc, the Bears and the Rams, having to play to see who's the number one seed. Well, this will be the last year, or maybe we got a couple more years of the iteration of which it is now. I'm recording this on Friday afternoon before the Ohio State Indiana game. They are both getting bys and this is a massive game in like the history of Indiana. But what if I tell you like Ohio State doesn't try because Stuckey was on yesterday and he's like, just look at the path. It's going to be way easier at three than it is at one. It happened to Oregon last year. So like if I told you what happens week 17 in the NFL, right? If you are winner get into the game, winner get into the playoffs, is usually the Sunday night game. And two playoff teams playing if one team's not trying. I think where we are destined to go are playing games this week. The reason they're happening is they are very, very lucrative. They make the networks a lot of money, they make the conferences a lot of money. But I'm fascinated this Ohio State Indiana game, like, what is the benefits specifically for Ohio State defending champs undefeated. I know Indiana is too. But like they are the heavy favorites to win it again. What do they have to gain here, right? Especially last year they benefited. You know, they took out Oregon. So they saw on the flip side of what it can do, getting a really tough matchup where it's like, well, if you're the 3 seed, like Indiana would probably be if they lose, you might get Virginia in the first round or Ole Miss without a coach. So I, I'm. I don't know. I don't know how this thing's going to play out. But it's, it's destined to be done here soon. The conference championships, the way it is now. Now what is inevitable are games this week. And to me, if there were play in games, Miami vs Texas, Notre Dame verse it have to be in the conference. So you would take two Big Ten teams. You know, once we go to 16 teams, which is inevitable, it'd be like USC versus Washington. It would be Vanderbilt versus Texas.
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IBM Executive / Expert
That.
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John Middlecoff
That would be the game. And winner gets in.
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Which would be sweet.
- [10:20]
What if we did Notre Dame Miami rematch, winner gets in. Really, they just take them both.
- [10:26]
Question for the mailbag. What is the point of an offensive coordinator, in the case of a coach being the play caller? For example, The Ram, Sean McVeigh is the play caller. So what does the offensive coordinator Mike LaFleur do or is he in charge of in the case question? Love the pot. Well, it's like.
- [10:49]
Just because you're not calling plays on game day doesn't mean you aren't a major factor in the weekly game plans. And Sean McVay, because of his head coaching responsibilities, right, he has to dedicate time to media availability, to meeting with the defense, to meeting with personnel people. Like he has just other responsibilities, right? So that guy, whoever that is the offensive coordinator and maybe sometimes like a run game coordinator, they have specific roles during the week, right? First, second down, third down, red zone. They help script, break down, develop the game plan each week. So they are an extension of the play caller that helps put the whole thing together. That when they meet, they've already done a lot of legwork. Now, it doesn't mean that Sean is not doing extensive work in all those situations, right? Because you're not just going to go into the game and call plays. But I would imagine like any industry, when you have right hand man, right hand men who you can rely on, you can, you don't have to micromanage, you can let them do stuff and maybe there are things that he doesn't have to waste time on and he can trust come game day, hey, we love these three things. You can call them in these situations, we'll be good to go. And he's like, okay, let's roll. And they work through it at practice. But they are a major, major factor in terms of, I would say Monday, Tuesday, Wednesday, game planning. While that guy does other stuff and then comes in, you know, at periods and meetings and stuff and gets up to speed with anything that they've already done. You know, short yardage, red zone tendencies, just stuff that they can dedicate more time. So they have a pretty big role and they make a lot of money. And those guys, I mean, Kevin O' Connell never called a play for Sean McVay. And look at him, he's a head coach.
- [12:45]
Mike McDaniel, same thing, never called a play, head coach in Miami. I know everyone is down on Mike McCarthy because he has been fired twice and the team has gotten better. But I would argue the Titans, Falcons or the Giants cannot take a huge risk. McCarthy is a proven, he's proven to work well with quarterbacks and these teams could do much worse. Also, is there any help for the Raiders and Dolphins? Could Mike Tomlin save either franchise.
- [13:12]
Thing in Arizona? Your lips get so chapped when you go for like a walk. You're out in the sun, just so dry here. I would say this about Mike? I think he's a pretty safe option to what I thought Pete Carroll was going to be with the Raiders. It turned out Pete Carroll here was. Pete Carroll's problem is Pete Carroll had been the boss for so long that he has one way of doing things. Well, Pete had no leverage when he got hired with the Raiders. So what did they do? They forced coaches on him. They forced Chip Kelly on him. Pete Carroll not a million years would have hired Chip Kelly. He literally had him forced on him. And what happened? He made Chip run Shane Waldron's offense. So if you're going to hire a guy and then you start dictating the terms to him, that's where it gets weird. If you just trust Mike to hire some coaches to do his thing, he will just get you going in the right direction. So I'm in agreement there is some value there. I've been talked to by people in the league that have kind of convinced me he's probably a little overrated because I was higher on him in his cowboy tenure. And looking back, I just think their team's pretty talented and they got, you know, good quarterback now. He did a good job, but so to kill him more, I mean, it's like.
- [14:27]
You could do worse. And I'm with you. There are certain teams that, like the Titans, can't just. Let's just take a flyer on a coordinator. Godspeed on that one. The Giants definitely cannot. So I think Mike McCarthy, like Mike Tomlin, if and when he becomes available, their value is you kind of know what you're getting, and there is big time value in that. I mean, Titans fans would have said a couple of years ago, mike Vrabel is kind of overrated, right? Because it kind of got weird there at the end. Might have been because they didn't have a quarterback, but I think there's a value in a guy.
- [15:00]
Listen, there are people like Ben Johnson that just hit the ground running and are really, really impressive and very comfortable in the seat. And those guys are outliers. Most people are completely overwhelmed and most people fail. It's an extremely difficult job. Like, extremely difficult. I bet. I mean, honestly, it is a harder job at a lot of these places than like a lot of these Fortune 500 companies. Because you're not dealing with widgets, you're not dealing with products. Every single one of your assets is a human being, young human being. It's. It's very, very hard. You're controlling a staff. I mean, a lot of your coaching staffs now, I mean, look how many guys coaches are now in their 30s. You know, position coaches, coordinators, big egos. Everyone's making money now. I mean, you got running back coaches making 800 grand. So it's like everyone's kind of rich, like not just the players. Like all your assistant coaches, you know, are driving up in Range Rovers. So it's very, very difficult and those guys are comfortable doing it. Listen, I've known Matt Nagy for a long time. He's going to get another shot, Robert Sala is going to get another shot. But there's no guarantee that those guys, when they do get their other shot, it's going to work. Right now the thing they have going for them is they've sat in that seat and there's value to that. And, you know, I think when the Eagles originally hired Andy Reid in the late 90s, they had run this study and found out that you're no more likely to be a star head coach, you know, coming from a coordinator, than you are a position coach. Because Andy had never even called plays in the NFL, obviously working for Mike Holmgren, who called the place and I think what it showed and their study really kind of pulled out. Like being a head coach is much more about vision, leadership, discipline.
- [16:55]
I just. Emotional stability. You look at some of these guys who are not emotionally stable in the NFL, like in college, you can be a little bit of a nut, right? Nick Kirby. These guys run hot. They don't lose very much. So it's like in the NFL you can have an excellent season and go 12 and five, those five long weeks, you know, and some of those wins, I mean, they were close wins. You know, you're coaching in Georgia and listen, Kirby's a stud, but like on a terrible year for him standing to a terrible year for him standing too. He's going to have a lot of years where he's 12 and 0. 11 and 1.
- [17:35]
I'm about to start grad school at a small D3 university. My company is covering tuition and still paying my salary, so I'm able to work for free. I'd love to get involved with the football program as a ga, but I'm not sure how to approach it. Do I walk in the facility with my resume and ask for help or should I reach out to someone already on staff for context? I study mathematics at University of Pittsburgh and did my senior project with the Pittsburgh Pirates on optimizing pitch selection strategy. So I've got some sports analytics experience. I'm a total football junkie and would love to Contribute.
- [18:11]
It's a good question.
- [18:13]
We actually, this, this topic came up during Thanksgiving with my family here, my brother, my in laws, and we were talking about, you know, back in the day, especially before technology, if you wanted to get your foot in the door with something, you had to be very aggressive in person, right? Knocking on doors, showing up at company, the office, whoever you wanted to work for. Famous story about Jed Fish showing, putting a note in Steve Spurger's car every day for like a year straight back in the 90s, just to get his foot in the door. And my, my wife's mother was telling the story about someone in her life, a young kid who's like telling his parents that he's being really aggressive. He's sending a lot of emails in LinkedIn messages, and there's some tr. Like you could send 500 LinkedIn messages a day. There's a chance you never get one response. And I'm not anti doing that. But there is value in just literally the way I got to Fresno State. My cousin had played there and, and he was done playing and I had gone down to visit him and I had seen. I'm like, the Internet, there was an opening and he, he's like, bro, just go by the facility. And I, I just walked into the facility and introduced myself and obviously I had a little bit of an in because they knew who my cousin was because he had played there. But like, they didn't know me from Adam. And it was one of those things that just kind of materialized and took off. I mean, there was. I look back sometimes and go, if that didn't happen, I mean, what would I be doing? I mean, there's a decent chance your boy might have a shovel in his hands digging ditches somewhere. So I think sometimes there is value to just showing up. And I mean, I've known a lot of people, it happens less and less in 2025. But I'd also argue that works to your benefit. So go to the. I'm assuming you want to work in recruiting.
- [20:11]
Just find out who their recruiting coordinator is, Director of football operations, and just go introduce yourself. I mean, there is a power. I mean, it wasn't that long ago, like, no one's ever gonna fly or meet anyone in person again. No, it's bullshit. There's always gonna be value in that. That were it works, always has, always will. So I, I just think I would 100% go in, introduce myself in person. And who knows? I'm not. There's no guarantee they might not want to talk to you they might blow you off. I mean there's no guarantee it goes well.
- [20:46]
But I would take your chance that way. Had a thought about the Falcons. With elite talent like Bijan and Drake. London on the offensive side and no viable quarterback along with no first round pick, do you think it would be smart to sell those two players and tear this thing down to the studs? It's a great question. Bijan would have a lot of value. I mean so would Drake. But you could, you could get a haul for both guys. I just think we got a who's taken over, you know, what do they do? They've had the same GM now for two different coaches. Who's their head coach? Assuming they fire everybody, I just think they're kind of a wild card. I don't know why. I think you could easily justify firing everybody. They made a historic quarterback, just mistake. I mean giving cousins $90 million and then a month later taking a quarterback who again, I'm not acting like I loved him now Maybe it's the Pac 12 and me biased. Maybe it's because I bet on him a lot. One of the biggest bets of my life was on them beating Texas and panic slinging that thing around. I was a big panics guy. Most of my friends in the NFL, a lot of them have super bowl rings. We're like bro, you're insane. We don't even, we don't have top 45, 50 grades on them. A lot of teams didn't have them really high, not a first round pick. I mean you can find people didn't have them in the second round and then there were all the medical questions and it has completely blown up in their face. So that alone. And then obviously listen, he's just not a very good head coach. I mean there's, there's no really arguing that seems like a great guy. And to me, I, I, I, I think there's a very good chance if Robert Sala were to get ahead coaching job that Kyle Shanahan would hire him to be the defensive coordinate. He will be the defensive coordinator of the 49ers next year if Saul is gone, assuming he gets fired. But I, I just think as a head coach it is, it's gone worse. So I, I don't know. I, I think there are two schools of thought. I think the analytical kind of new modern version of the way these guys view it is much more, you know, baseball, basketball, blow it up, get picks. I think old school football people would go, well I'm going to come in I'm going to try to win and I want those two guys because Bijan Robinson and Drake London are my two best players. So I need them on the team. It just depends who you hire.
- [23:16]
So I, if I was a betting man, I bet they're on the team. I mean, is Drake London? Didn't he get a contract extension?
- [23:24]
I'd have to go double check that.
- [23:28]
Question for the bag. The narrative this year, look at who the Patriots have played. Seems nonsense, nonsensical to me. If people actually paid attention, they realized they have absolutely crushed some of the teams they played. Beat the Titans 31 to 3. Like, you don't need to listen.
- [23:47]
There's a major difference between, like, Indiana, like Indiana play. Last year they didn't play. This year they beat Oregon. Like, that's a really good win. In college, most of these conferences is like, well, we played one really good team, right? In the NFL, even when you're playing random teams, it's like, I'm guilty of this. I gave the Packers a hard time. Like, the Panthers are not bad. That's not that terrible of a loss. I think we talk about, how did they lose the Panthers? Well, they are 7 and 6. Like, losing the Panthers and losing the Browns are not the same. I was in the car the other day and I heard, I was flipping around and it was like Florio, because I was on NBC radio and he's like, people question LaFleur because he loses. The teams like the Browns and the Panthers, like, those fucking teams aren't the same. The Browns, they are in their own category of dysfunction and losing because that's what they do a lot. The Panthers are winning this year. They got seven wins. They're going to have an. I Bet there are 9 and 18 minimum potential chance to get to 10 and 7 depending on how their games go against the Bucks. But that's like, that's not a terrible. It's very, very difficult. I'll never forget when I say this name, you might laugh because he was. He had no business being a head coach, but incredible guy, good position coach David Cully. And one of my jobs when I got hired by the Eagles was, I mean, this. I mean, nowadays with technology, it sounds so stupid, but the injury report would happen, right? So when you see like so and so's questionable, so and so's limited in practice, so and so's, you know, whatever, doubtful throughout the week, I would print all those out and I would go room to room and hand them to the. All the position coaches, all the coordinators and Coach Reed and I remember going to David Cully's and sometimes I. You'd stay, you drop it off. And technically, because in the east coast time, it was a little later, right around dinner time and usually shoot the shit, you know, have a casual conversation. I remember saying something like, we were playing the Bills, who this is pre. Josh Allen. They were pretty bad. And I was like, that is an easy game this week. And he was so offended by me saying that. And he just kind of went on this one like, bro, that's not. There are no easy games in this league. They got a ton of guys that live in big ass homes and drive nice cars and they got kids and been to pro Bowls, right? Even the bad teams. So the NFL, like if the Patriots go 13 and 4, like, yeah. Did they play the packers every week? Of course not. But that's still really impressive. Just because you have an easier schedule, you still got to win the games. So I'm not, I'm not disputing anything about the Patriots. And ultimately his question was like, why is everyone blowing the Broncos? Both the teams are pretty good. I think they have a better team than you. Like, they have more higher end players, but you guys have the much better quarterback. So it's like, who would you take, John? Would you take the team with a little bit better talent but a quarterback who might just suck in a given game, or would you take a team with maybe a little less talent? Both teams are winning and the quarterback, they might win the mvp. If we didn't know the teams and we played blind resume, we would all take the MVP quarterback, every single one of us. So it's like, I think we get caught up in the conversations of like, oh, they didn't beat anybody. It's like, well, the, the 49ers are. Schedule is easy. They've lost half their team. They. Well, we're nine and four. We haven't beaten anybody. Well, look who we're playing with. Half these guys. Middle cop would have said they wouldn't be selling insurance like two months ago. But we have seven injuries and we need to call this guy and then this guy and then this guy gets hurt. I mean, their practice squatters are getting hurt. Foreign.
- [27:33]
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- [29:01]
Podcast Host / Advertiser
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- [29:29]
Malcolm Gladwell
Hello. Hello, I'm Malcolm Gladwell, host of the podcast Smart Talks with IBM. I recently sat down with IBM's chairman and CEO Arvind Krishna and I asked him how can companies use AI to its fullest potential to create smarter business?
- [29:45]
IBM Executive / Expert
My one advice to them Pick areas you can scale. Don't pick the shiny little toys on the side. For example, if anybody has more than 10% of what they had for customer service 10 years ago, they're already five years behind. If anybody is not using AI to make their developers who write software 30% more productive today with the goal of being 70% more productive. Yeah, so we are not asking our clients to be the first experiment on it. We say you can leverage what we did. We are happy to bring out all our learnings, including what needs to change in the process. Because the biggest change is not technology is getting people to accept that there's a different way to do things.
- [30:36]
Malcolm Gladwell
To listen to the full conversation, visit IBM.com smarttalks.
- [30:47]
Colin Coward
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- [32:59]
John Middlecoff
Hey John, why should I get excited about these Mike Tomlin rumors about a Giants? As a Giants fan, he hasn't won a playoff game in a decade. Here's the thing. James Harrison I saw say this the other day. He essentially said like stop calling him a great coach. He's a good coach. Do you know what the Giants would do for a good coach? Think about that. Do you know what you guys would do for a good coach? Think of the run you're on. From McAdoo to Schirmer to Joe Judge to the last couple of years of Brian Dable. Do you know what you would do for the last couple years of the Steelers just being 10 and 7, 10 and 7, and this year maybe 9 and 8.
- [33:37]
A lot. I mean, and you guys are more equipped with your roster to be better than them. So this notion that you guys are too good for Mike Donlon, you weren't too good for Joe Judge or Pat Shermer. Those guys are fucking terrible. Joe seems like a nice guy. He's just awful head coach.
- [33:59]
Whenever I see this notion, like, do you know what, it's why when Ben. When Roethlisberger said that Tomlin should go to Penn State, I was like, bro.
- [34:13]
You know what the Titans would do to go from Brian Callahan to Mike Tomlin? He doesn't have to go to Penn State and live in State College. It's like the fifth best Big Ten job.
- [34:26]
Which obviously. What's his name with the funny hat? Purdy's guys going.
- [34:31]
Clearly JJ isn't the guy. So where do the Vikings go? Clearly no good free agents. Do you try and trade for Mac Jones or get a guy like Jamis and have a fun year before you fire the gm? It's a great question. I don't know. I think anytime you're in that situation, it's a scary place to be. Because there aren't really good answers. Because if I told you Mac Jones, their quarterback next year with Kevin o', Connell, with the talent they have, if Floors is still there, they could easily be a 10, 11 win team. But like, if I'm Kyle Shanahan, like I'm not just giving him to you for nothing. He's really valuable for us. So the price that I would need to give him up is a price like I can't give a second round pick from Mac Jones. And maybe you'd say, well, maybe you can't. Do you want to win 11 games or do you want to be in the position you're in right now? Because if. Who do the Vikings play this week?
- [35:25]
I don't know why I'm blanking right now, but let me look it up really quick. The Vikings.
- [35:33]
Or the. Oh, they play the Commanders.
- [35:37]
If you.
- [35:40]
Lose the Commanders and he looks terrible against that defense, I just think Vikings fans will be over him. And one thing you cannot do is like roll back. Like, we'll give him an off season. This. I hate it when people like, what about the patience? A lot different. When teams were worth like $400 million in 1996 and the biggest contract was like Emmett Smith getting four years, $15 million, which don't get me wrong, was a ton of money back in 1993. But when you're talking about giving countless people on your team hundreds of millions of dollars, when you're paying in a coach $15 million. Like, the timelines are just different. They just are no different than quarterly earning reports in 2025 have more impact on the market than they did 20 years ago. Times have changed. We live in a different world. We have less patience. It doesn't mean that he'll never play in the NFL, but his Vikings tenure, I would say, is like a couple more bad games from being like, borderline officially over. Anyone saying otherwise is on drugs.
- [36:45]
I can't help but find myself more and more nervous after every win. I love Sean Payton and the defense is nails, but Bo and the offense terrify me. I can't help but think the fourth quarter magic will run out. Do you think they can go all the way? I have a couple tickets left at the beginning of the year, and one of them was I put $100 on a Packers Broncos matchup in the Super Bowl. That thing pays over $8,000. So I am rooting for the packers and Broncos to play in the super bowl unless I'm playing with some house money. And I have a huge, like, division parlay, which I need the Texans to win that division and I need Seattle to win the division. I'm in pretty good shape with Denver and Tampa's not even done yet. So I. That might not hit, but a hundred dollars to win 8,000, like, that's. I'm rooting for that. So I hope so. I don't feel great. I don't. I think it's going to be. Getting home field is going to be big. So however it plays out between you and the Patriots, pretty clear the AFC is going to go through New England or Denver. Kind of like old times.
- [37:57]
I get a lot of questions. What do you think the. The Denver Broncos should do? Or excuse me, this. I don't know why I said Denver Broncos. What do I think the Vikings should do? I just don't think there's a concrete answer. I think the. You know what these guys are hoping. It's like he'll just figure it out. I, as crazy as that sounds, which is not going to happen. But at this point in time, with whatever five games left, you're just praying like, could he just rattle off like three good games and just shut everybody up? Probably not going to happen. But I think that's where they're head. I don't even think, like, they can contemplate what their options are. You can't draft another quarterback high. There aren't really great options. It's not like even the good options like Mac Jones would be an okay option, but he's not even available.
- [38:47]
They're in a tough spot. I saw with the 49ers. They were completely screwed and they got lucky with the seventh round pick. You know, the, the, the Colts a little bit too. They just could sign Daniel Jones and even now he's got a broken fibula and sauce is hurt and it's kind of feels like it's unraveling. Stuckey kind of broke down the schedule. They lose this week to the Jags. Like they could lose out.
- [39:11]
Your guy. Tim Skipper taking over Cal Poly, awesome for that program. I'm very happy for him. Not gonna lie. I texted him probably a week ago when kind of rumors were flying. I said, skip, go to the sec. Go be someone's assistant head coach. It wasn't that long ago he was Florida's assistant head coach when they were winning the SEC East. And you know, I just think he's so much better than these guys getting opportunities. I'm such a believer in the human being. And listen, I went to Cal Poly. I don't care that much about the football program. I do now. And the program is extremely lucky and I mean extremely lucky to get Tim Skipper like the school out kick their coverage like this. He's just, he's too good for them. I mean, and I say that with pride, like they're very, very lucky. And you know, when I was there, they had Rich Ellerson who was a defensive coordinator for some of the great Arizona teams in the 90s like Teddy Bruski. And Cal Poly was very lucky to have him as a coach and he went on to coach at Army. I would be stunned if Skipper does not have success putting together a staff. Started texting with some former dogs and just bring a toughness there. And again the standard at Cal Poly. Get to the playoffs in Division 1 AA and he'll be the next coach of Fresno in a couple of years. But I'm happy for him because you get become Jeff Tedford quits in the summer. You're thrust on being the interim coach with none of your own people. And then obviously this year at ucla, kind of unofficially ending the James Franklin era. Pretty historic moment, right? Take it out. James Franklin in that game as a 25 point favorite. I know you have some great things about to say about Patrick Mahomes guts and tough play this season. He has lost some close games and seemed A bit off in throws when trying to push the ball down the field. Do you think it's because Patrick is getting older and lost a step or is the fact that the offensive line looks suspect and wide receivers don't get the same separation? I think two things can be true. He's still a stud and everyone in the league would want him, right? I think the only guy teams would consistently pick over him is Josh Allen. We could make the argument like, you know, Drake May, you got to do it multiple years but obviously he's on the come up. There are other good quarterbacks but he's. His resume speaks for itself. You also would like a little more, you know, he's missed a lot of these passes down the field and not all of them are just like 60 yard bombs. Some of them are like in stride. He should be able to hit with his eyes closed. He's missing. So I would say his superpower of dominating in 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, he just hasn't quite been the same guy. And there are variables around you, but I do think if the Chiefs are going to continue this run, they're going to need him to be a dominant player. And he's shown flashes but you know, he's 30 years old, he's played a lot of football.
- [42:20]
I think sometimes too when you go to a on a long, long run and they've been to five Super Bowls in six years and the one year they didn't go, they lost in the AFC Championship game. If they do miss the playoffs, like they get a long, long break refresh, come back and have the best season or one of the best seasons of your career, like to me, if they miss the playoffs, the expectation if I'm Coach Reed and Veach and the Chiefs brass is like, okay, you take a long break, we'll do a good job restocking the cupboard here. We're going to have a better team next year. We'll hit on some draft picks. We need you to be like right there with Josh Allen and a couple years ago like Lamar when he's healthy, like dominate the league like you did when you hit the scene. Double middle fingers every single week. Kind of what Brady, you know, Manning had that when he got to Denver. Just be pissed off for greatness and be fascinating to watch.
- [43:19]
Big time Charger fan, my question is, do you think the Chargers in a hypothetical situation where both tackles are healthy, I mean we could play that all, every team in the league, could you guys compete to win the super bowl if everyone was healthy I know what you're saying, but it's like there are so many injuries in the NFL. I do think this with Jim Harbaugh and the infrastructure that he brings, that you guys are going to be a contender for years to come. And to win a Super bowl, you need to have health on your side. You guys can't afford to lose your two star tackles and compete for Super Bowl. It's impossible, right? So you know, you lose Najee Harris Hampton gets injured like you just had with a coach that wants to run the ball. So it's like, wait, I lose my two best offensive line, two running backs and the dude from the backup has been good. I actually kind of like him. But you guys will have a chance. You guys are not going anywhere. It's not going to be the up and down kind of Philip Rivers era as long as Jim Harbaugh is there.
- [44:25]
In retrospect, do you think things which have played out better if the Chargers were the team that went to Vegas and the Raiders stayed in Oakland, Rams would get LA all to themselves. Oakland doesn't lose their team, so the Raiders keep their core fans and the Chargers get a new billion dollar stadium plus a state all to themselves. The Raiders could have even moved back to their roots in LA if Oakland couldn't afford them, couldn't afford to keep them. I think Oakland fans would say their roots in la. They were in Oakland and you guys took them from us for 15 years and they came back. Well, I, I was, you know, some might say I became a podcaster because my takes on this story in its heyday, the Raiders and me butted heads over this one. And at the time we had, I had a big core group of Raider fans and I felt really bad for them and I talked a lot of shit about the Vegas move. It was an emotional take and I was completely wrong. The best thing that ever happened to the Raiders by a mile was leaving Oakland and going to Vegas. Financially, they're at a different level. It's great for the league. Now you can say their home games are altered. That is true. It was not sustainable what was happening. And there was just a siphon. It's like another team playing in Chicago, another team playing in Philly, another team playing in Dallas. It's not the 49ers take too much of the energy and you were always going to be little brother. And so moving from a financial standpoint, from a market standpoint makes a lot of sense now. You got to win. But the league also was never going to allow them to go to la. They weren't allowing the Raiders to go to Los Angeles like that. That was a big thing. They weren't going to. It wasn't going to happen. So I think it worked out best actually for the Raiders and the Rams, the Chargers, I think Dean would say there is an economic element to San Diego. They clearly have more money in Los Angeles. Clearly a little bit of an afterthought, obviously. Listen, financially the Chargers and the Raiders benefited greatly. The Raiders have the city to themselves. In Vegas is. While the casino industry, like tangibly the Strip, I think is going through hard times. I would bet the farm on the overall economic ceiling of Vegas. No taxes, companies will move there. So it might shift from being gambling heavy to other industries. But I got news for you. New companies aren't probably starting in California over the next hundred years. When you factor in taxes and getting employees to move like Vegas is going to benefit greatly. They already have. So it was a huge win. Every team left Oakland. Every single one. The A's were the team that desperately tried the most and had the hardest time. Joe Lake bought the warriors to move them to San Francisco and Mark Davis had desperately been trying to leave. So I think everyone kind of won. It's. It's not a perfect situation, but I think we got the right outcome. If you've never been to the Coliseum, I mean, obviously the older stadiums that are now long gone, it is a relic. It is such a dump. I, I can't even. It's hard to describe the. I mean it's. I, I would take dynamite and blow that to smithereens. You. I would go to baseball games. The A's would be playing like the Yankees. Well, the Yankees would get fans, but definitely a random team. It was like A's Rangers. This was Major League Baseball, this one. The A's were winning like 95 games. I mean they had teams that you thought could win the World Series. They always shit the bed in the playoffs. You would go to a game on Wednesday and I shit you not, there were 700 people in the park. It's like, what is going on? It just, it's, it's kind of sad what happened because once upon a time, obviously the raiders in the 70s, the A's in the 70s and 80s, those times are long gone. And I think a huge reason is that the 49ers and the San Francisco Giants, their success, their corporate success of getting the sponsors, it just separated, you know, little mom and pop shops that used to crush it and then target moves in next Door puts you out of business. Luckily for those teams, A's, who knows, the Raiders are fine.
- [49:01]
When we discussed the greatest coaches of all time, we usually bring up the guys that have the most Super Bowls, which is completely valid. In your opinion, who are some of the best coaches that don't have a Super Bowl? It's a good question. I would say Brian Schottenheimer's dad obviously would be near the top of that list.
- [49:21]
When I was a kid, I mean, I felt like Marty's teams, I even missed some of his Cleveland teams that lost to John Elway in that famous drive game. But his Kansas City teams were awesome. He just couldn't get it done. I would say currently, you know, forever it was Andy Reid and then obviously he shut everyone up. Kyle right now has to be near the top. I mean, you have a lot of guys in the league right now. I mean, Kyle's been to two Super Bowls and had leads in the second half, lost them both. Now they both come to Andy and Patrick. But.
- [49:55]
You know, you'd say like Mike Vrabel, like Mike Variable's been a one championship game. So it's like if you get to Super Bowls and lose, you know, Marv Levy losing to those Bills games. Did Marv Levy ever win a Super bowl somewhere else? I don't think he did, but that was a little before my time.
- [50:11]
A lot of guys you think about the best coaches win Super Bowls. Marv Levy.
- [50:18]
Man, never won it.
- [50:21]
Coached in Canadian League for a while.
- [50:27]
I, I would say Marty Schottenheimer would be near the top. I would say currently it'd have to be Kyle just been to two, lost them both, and he gets knocked for the one that he was offensive coordinator for.
- [50:41]
I noticed that KOC has been missing on play calling. He's great as a head coach, but has been regressing on the play calling. Do you think it's time for him to give up play calling and focus on the players?
- [50:53]
I heard someone say, I haven't seen the clip that he kind of admitted either on Sunday. I don't think it was after the game. It might have been on Monday or Wednesday's press conference. He didn't really change the game plan for the, for the kid that came in and was an unmitigated disaster. I think it's really, really hard to judge in these type situations. Like, I don't know what he's really supposed to do. Like last week on the road in Seattle that was. That had disaster written all over it.
- [51:25]
J.J. mcCarthy, like Bill Walsh could be calling place. If he's overthrowing guys by 17ft, what are you gonna do? So, I, I just, I don't know. I, no one would look good in this situation. Not a soul.
- [51:41]
My boyfriend deactivated his Instagram account, so I'm asking this question for him. Do you think about Dak to the Vikings in the offseason? Assuming the Cowboys fizzle out before or during the playoffs, they seem like they're going to sign George Pickens. They have the draft capital for Micah to trade. And if the Vikings give them a first and possibly a second, maybe throw in JJ McCarthy, there is no chance that the Cowboys are getting rid of Dak. All Jerry has said for like the last seven years, like, he's our most important player, he's our most important. He's more important than, than Micah Parsons kind of proven right. I also think that last night I'm recording this on Friday was a rough moment for George. And I text multiple high ranking NFL officials, what would you do? Like, would you pay George Pickens? And both of them replied, essentially, f, no, no chance. And there is no disputing his talent. But like, you're going to give. This is the cost of doing business with a wide receiver. It's not like, well, we can get him two years, $20 million. I mean minimum, he'd want like four years, $100 million. I, I, I, I, you, you got to get into business with people you can trust, like CDs, had some drops or whatever, but the guy's a war daddy. Dak, I'll go to war with Dak Prescott. Look at their guys on defense playing their ass off. George's like.
- [53:00]
I keep thinking about Mike Tomlin walking around the office just going like, I've told everyone, you guys watching this, it's like, mike, we're six and six and we're circling the drain. I don't care. You see George lollygagging on that comeback route? He was lollygagging. I saw. Then he's talking to Richard Sherman because Richard was like, bro, you gotta play harder. It's like, George.
- [53:25]
If you want the random people like us podcasters talking like, say in your lollygagging, I can understand, but you might want to Google that guy's resume. Like, no one's like, yeah, Richard's dogs. It guy won at a pretty high clip. I would say this lob would have taken your ass out if you were playing like that. When those guys are saying that, especially someone like him, that's offensive to them, right? It's a. You're going to lose.
- [53:52]
IBM Executive / Expert
It's.
- [53:53]
John Middlecoff
It's sports, it's life. You're not always going to win. But I think one thing, I'm about to have a son. Like, the one lesson that any father tries to teach a young man is like, we don't quit. And if you're going to do something, you got to try hard, right? Listen, you might not be good at it, but if you're doing it, you got to try. These are like basic principles of life. It's why I have so much respect. I mean, I always. I already really like the player and like the guy and everything he stood for. But my respect for Amon Ross, St. Brown, like, he's everything you would want in a player. He's everything that the Steelers, when they were rolling the Ravens, like, those are the type guys they go to war with back in like the 2000s. It's that type player. I'm 75%, who gives a shit? Shoot me up. Tape it up and let's roll. You got George. Like, I'm a Ross. Ben paid. His direct deposit's already hit with big numbers. George's the one that wants a contract, and he's playing like that. It was just.
- [54:57]
I have a lot of respect for making the NFL, and it's, It's. I didn't play in the NFL, so who am I to be like, oh, this guy. But, you know, you work in personnel. It's just kind of how they talk. The reality is, is certain people are not good enough, right? But then you get someone like this who clearly has a ton of talent, who's a blue chip or from Georgia. But there was a reason. When you Google him, he didn't go in like the top 20. And there's a reason. If you just know people in the NFL and you start texting, like, what do you think of this guy? Just. Just wait. That's a consistent theme. If you just text scouts, oh, yeah, it's going well now. Just wait. I don't blame the Cowboys for making the move, but you have moments like that that would almost be a defining moment for me. Like, I can't pay you. No, no chance. Can't happen. I can't do business with that. How do I say to CD like, I know you just got a concussion. You were about to go for 250 yards, and your running mate over here is just, I don't know, going for a jog.
- [56:01]
That's type stuff. Like, well, run organizations do not tolerate it. And Jerry, you know I think Jerry clearly like they have a lot of high level guys, but that's one where you know the coaching staff, how much juice they have.
- [56:17]
It'll be interesting how that plays out.
- [56:26]
Malcolm Gladwell
Hello. Hello. I'm Malcolm Gladwell, host of the podcast smart talks with IBM. I recently sat down with IBM's chairman and CEO Arvind Krishna and I asked him how can companies use AI to its fullest potential to create smarter business?
- [56:42]
IBM Executive / Expert
My one advice to them Pick areas you can scale. Don't pick the shiny little toys on the side. For example, if anybody has more than 10% of what they had for customer service 10 years ago, they're already five years behind. If anybody is not using AI to make their developers who write software 30% more productive today with the goal of being 70% more productive. Yeah.
- [57:14]
John Middlecoff
Wow.
- [57:15]
IBM Executive / Expert
So we are not asking our clients to be the first experiment on it. We say you can leverage what we did. We are happy to bring out all our learnings, including what needs to change in the process. Because the business the biggest change is not technology. It's getting people to accept that there's a different way to do things.
- [57:33]
Malcolm Gladwell
To listen to the full conversation, visit IBM.com smarttalks.
- [57:44]
Colin Coward
PCs powered by Snapdragon X Elite processors are made to go the distance with blazing fast performance, next level efficiency and multi day battery life. Snapdragon processors are built to tackle it all, from highlight reel editing to intense player research so you can be at the top of your game wherever the day takes you. Learn more@snapdragon.com laptops Snapdragon the heart of your PC. Battery life varies significantly based on device settings, usage and other factors.
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Ryan Seacrest
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- [58:48]
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- [59:49]
Podcast Host / Advertiser
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- [60:32]
John Middlecoff
The AFC north coaching situation Fascinating. Harbaugh, Tomlin have each won a Super Bowl. Taylor has been to one and Kevin Stefanski is a two time coach of the year. And I think all fan bases would agree they've been largely underwhelmed or frustrated with their coaches in recent years. My question is this. How would you rank these four coaches on the hot seat are right now and secondly how would you rank them as potential candidates if they hit the market? I personally believe three of the four would quickly, quickly get another job. I think Zach Taylor would clearly be the last guy. I think Stefanski, who has not had a good year, been really weird the last couple years is really highly thought of. I think people would blame the owner. I think the first two guys, I mean the New York Giants would be all over either one. The the New York Giants John Morrow would cut off like his pinky toe to hire one of those two guys to be his coach right now. So their market they would be hired so fast you your head would spin. I think Stefanski.
- [61:36]
I don't know if he'd be a hundred percent locked but I I think someone would. I don't think anyone hires Zach Taylor. Maybe that's not fair, but I just think that just narratives Momentum, people just think it's all Joe Burl. I mean, I, I, I don't know. So I.
- [61:54]
I do wonder, what if the Steelers do somehow just win the division at 9 and 8 and the Ravens miss, could John Harbaugh be in trouble? Because again, I think the Giants would immediately hire the guy. And again, part of it also is like, who else are you hiring? Would the Steelers or the, or the Ravens hire Stefanski because he can call plays?
- [62:16]
That's a good question. Wind on this. Speaking of Joe Burrow, speaking of a guy that's zoned in there is, I use this analogy with Amon Ross, St. Brown just proving that you will play through an injury. The toughness and the mentality that it shows the entire team is something that you can't quantify, Right? And the momentum of Joe Burrow, even his pregame interview on Thanksgiving was like, I make a lot of money. I don't care what our record is. If I can play, I can play. And clearly when he's playing, he's one of the best players in the league. And this week they're playing the Bills. Who the Bills had a pretty embarrassing moment happened to him this week. They cut this guy, I forget his first name. His last name's Ingram to claim Darius Slay. They claim Darius Slay. Ingram then gets claimed by the Texans. Darius Slay quits and Ingram is now on the Texans. And Sean McDermott is like, what just happened? And McDermott loved that player, but they needed to make a roster spot. I don't know exactly how it happened. Disastrous personnel move. I mean, embarrassing. There's no way around it. And they are fighting for their lives just to keep up and have a chance to win the division, a division which they've dominated. Now, they do do well at home, but as my buddy Ethan, Diehard Bills fan, text me today, he said, bengals kind of on us. And I think this line of the Bills minus six against Joe Burrow, T. Higgins is back is kind of crazy. And like, I started looking at it because I thought, listen, like, they don't, they're four and eight. Well, the other two teams are chasing are six and six. One of those two teams is going to lose. And especially if it's an ugly game. There's no, those teams could lose to anybody at any time. So if you just run the table, which would be possible if you win this week. And it's been kind of a weird year for the Bills, and then they had that moment this week, they cut a guy that they would not have cut if they didn't want to claim a guy who doesn't want to play for them and then just quits and retires. That's rattles the front office coaching staff because someone in that organization, especially if it wasn't a coach, is pounding the table. Darius slays an upgrade which is insane. He just got benched for a terrible defense and just it's, it's that could rattle you. The Bengals come in with nothing to lose. Their quarterbacks back. T. Higgins is back. It would not shock me. You watch Joe Burrow throw a couple touchdowns. He's comfortable playing this team like they have kind of dominated. The Bills beat them a lot over the years. I'm excited to watch Burrow play and they win. Don't let the Bengals get hot and Zach Taylor kind of move up that ranking.
- [65:03]
Malcolm Gladwell
The volume.
- [65:07]
Colin Coward
PCs powered by Snapdragon X Elite processors are made to go the distance with blazing fast performance, next level efficiency and multi day battery life. Snapdragon processors are built to tackle it all, from highlight reel editing to intense player research so you can be at the top of your game wherever the day takes you. Learn more@snapdragon.com laptops Snapdragon the heart of your PC. Battery life varies significantly based on device settings, usage and other factors.
- [65:41]
Sophie Cunningham
Okay, only 10 more presents to wrap.
- [65:44]
Podcast Host / Advertiser
You're almost at the finish line. But first.
- [65:59]
There the last one.
- [66:03]
Enjoy a Coca Cola for a pause that refreshes.
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Colin Coward
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- [66:50]
John Middlecoff
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Ryan Seacrest
And enjoy the gift of staying connected.
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John Middlecoff
Switch and start saving today. Get four Samsung Galaxy S25 phones with Galaxy AI on us and four lines for just 25 bucks per line plus non stop talk, text and data between us and Mexico. Visit a store t mobile.com or call 1-800-T-Mobile 1-800-T-Mobile. See details@t mobile.com this is an iHeart podcast.
- [68:03]
Podcast Host / Advertiser
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