← The Herd with Colin Cowherd
The Herd with Colin Cowherd
3 & Out - Mike Tomlin OUT in Pittsburgh, Guy Haberman joins the show
01:24:01
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- [00:00]
John Middlekauff
This is an iHeart podcast.
- [00:02]
Guy Haberman
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- [01:19]
John Middlekauff
What is going on everybody? John Middlecoff3out podcast how are we doing today? We I recorded with a good friend of mine. He officiated my wedding. I was the best man in his wedding. He has been the voice of the 49ers this year, filling in for both our good friends. Greg Papa, who's been battling leukemia. He's called Warrior Games, A's Games. He does Big Ten Network, so he's done Signetti Games. He's he works with Yogi Roth. He's on the two team for the Big Ten Network. He's done Fox stuff. He's a stud play by play. Guy we used to have a radio show together. He's the guy that got me into the kind of this business and world. Then we had a podcast together after, you know, I essentially got us in a little trouble in the radio world. But Guy Haberman will join us and I was planning on just doing that because we talked for like an hour. But while we were talking or maybe right before the news broke about Mike Tomlin, who has officially resigned, said he'll, you know, I'm stepping away. So we'll discuss the Mike Tomlin situation, which I think we all saw as inevitable. Still, it actually happened, which you know, you can't ever bet on till it actually did. And it finally did. So some thoughts there. And that'll be the show today, so make sure you subscribe wherever you may listen. A lot of you guys are asking me about Netflix. We're not going live on Netflix. After these games, you know, the rest of the year. Now granted, there's only a handful of games left that is something that's very fluid for next fall, something I've already talked about with some of their executives. That is something we need to figure out. But obviously it's only January. We have a long time. For those of you that watch the youtubes after the the games on Sunday night, Monday night, Thursday night, now going to Netflix, that's they can't post till the following day, which is bright and early in the morning. It's like 5 or 6am My time, mountain time, so usually 7, 8am Eastern time. So they're posting early in the morning. And let's face it, most of the content moving forward is not reactionary anymore. The two games, because we only got what, six or seven left. Count college one, we got four this week we got two. That's seven. We got eight games left, counting the super bowl in the national championship. So as of right now, all of our videos moving forward, Netflix, bright and early in the morning. Make sure you subscribe, hit a little alert button as well. Appreciate everyone that's already checked that out and we'll just keep rocking and rolling. So let's just talk Mike Tomlin. I do want to start with Mike Tomlin because it wasn't shocking at all, right? Whether he was fired, whether he quit, whether it just was going to end. The writing has been on the wall for years. And even Mike Tomlin could understand that after last night. One, his team's not remotely close. Two, they're very old. They have no answer at the most important position. They're not bad enough to draft high enough. They have a bunch of older players that make a ton of money. You know, when the house is on fire, you got to run out. And I think Mike Tomlin just went sprinting outside. He was a prideful guy. He probably overstayed his welcome in the sense that I don't know if we'll ever see a Coach go essentially 20 years ever again. Like, look at Sean McVay and Kyle Shanahan. They both. Sean started when he was 30 and Kyle started, I think, when he was 39 or 40, and maybe he was a little younger, 37. Do you think either one of those guys are going to be coaching 19 years for the Rams and the 49ers? Because you know what? I would bet against it when you factor in burnout and wealth, right. Mike Tomlin's been making big money for a while, but early on in his career, I would say it was probably a little easier. The NFL world, it's changed dramatically with social media. It's changed dramatically once Ben Roethlisberger retired. And this doesn't, like, directly impact him. It's not like he worked with this guy. Right. And they weren't like business partners in the sense they all both work for the NFL. They're just rivals. You have to think that the Harbaugh thing, when he was let go last week, like, it just felt over for everyone involved. We all know people that got divorced. It's like, yeah, their relationship was probably over two years ago. It happens all the time. And I would argue the best thing that's ever happened to me is failing in the NFL. Like, you know, Chip Kelly comes in, I get let go. And when my radio show was canceled both times, it excelled my career forward. Partly because you look back and you go, yeah, it's. It was off for a while before that happened. And when you're Mike Tom and you're coaching the Pittsburgh Steelers, I completely understand the pride you take in holding that job, which is historic in this country, being the head coach for that franchise. But he couldn't stand there on the sideline after watching decades of football at the highest level and go, I still want to do this shit. And he answered it today. I don't. I'm out now. To me, the most logical place. People have been reporting for a while, that television, obviously television networks are going to be interested. Florio, I think, like, within the last month, said that Tomlin started contemplating this. I think the thing that makes the most sense is Amazon, like Tomlin to me, gets wasted in a studio show with 15 other people around a desk. To me, I want Mike Tomlin in a booth calling a game. Now, does he want to travel city to city and do that? Well, what if Amazon gives him the private jet so his travel actually isn't that bad? And if he wants to, I'm sure he's got a second home, you know, in Florida, Miami, which, who knows. I'm sure they're contacting him that if he truly is going to take a year off, I think Amazon makes a lot of sense. Herb Street's done a respectable job. Given that they wanted McVeigh, they wanted John lynch, those guys wouldn't leave. Now you can get an NFL guy in there for this last year of Al and who knows, maybe Tomlin loves it. You know, Bill Cower went to tv, never left. John Madden went into tv, never left. John Gruden went into TV and was there for a decade. Sometimes you go on a tv, it's like, wait, you're going to pay me the same amount I made for working 90 hours a week. I can't lose a game and everyone likes me unless I'm Romo. Then people turn on you. But, like, more than likely, Mike Tomlin would get rave reviews. The critics would be pretty silent. It would be a lot of positive reinforcement. I kind of like this life. 53, let's take a couple years, take a deep breath, you know, and who knows, maybe over the course of the next couple weeks, some of these teams, Atlanta, Miami, get pretty aggressive with them. It's been well reported he's still under contract. This is kind of a Sean Payton. And if he did what Sean Payton did, like, if it's, if it's actually taken at face value, everything they're saying, we believe it's 100% the right move. Sean Payton said, this team sucks. I want out. I don't want to quit coaching, but I got to get out of here. And then they made it complicated when he went to Denver. I, I don't think Mike Tomlin, like, I don't think they're getting a first round pick for him, but I think the Steelers, you know, he doesn't want to be there, would gladly take a couple threes or whatever. And I think teams would trade for him. I would imagine we'll see. You know, Miami as a new general manager. I guess Atlanta has neither. I guess they got Matt Ryan, who's going to hire both guys. I, I would imagine these teams desperately want to talk to him. And this gets back to John Morrow's brother going to John Harbaugh's house. If John Harbaugh makes sense, Mike Tomlin makes sense. I've been saying forever, Mike Tomlin to the New York Giants. Now that was before John Harbaugh just got shit canned on the drive home on a Tuesday afternoon. But I think we'd all agree, like Mike Tomlin, relative to what they had, would be an all time upgrade. I mean, look at the coaching stretch that they have had for a decade. Plus, obviously the Miami Dolphins, there is some toughness, some leadership that they are desperately seeking. They should be all over it for him. Now, does he believe that that's a place that is conducive toward competing and winning? I don't know. They obviously have some financial issues, not with their, not because their owner's not rich, but because of the TUA contract and the team's not that good. You know, Atlanta's pretty interesting, but the quarterback situation is a little iffy. Like, if you're not a huge believer in Pennix he does have a, currently has a torn acl. Cousins is under contract, but are you going to bring him back at whatever 35, $40 million? So we've just seen Tomlin. If any human being goes wherever I go next, there has to be some sort of stability at quarterback. It would be Mike Tomlin, after what he just experienced for the last several years, where I could see John Harbaugh being a little more open minded. Like he pivoted through the situation. They drafted Lamar at the end of the first round. Or if you're Tomlin, you, you can't take a job which is essentially like the job you just left, which many would consider over the history of the sports. It's one of the great jobs of all time. What's the stat? They've had three coaches since like the 60s. Now granted one of the guys was there forever, but they've had two coaches since the mid-90s. So the one thing with the Ravens and with the Steelers is the support you get with ownership. But part of that support, like even if we nitpick Mike Tomlinson and obviously Steeler fans and NFL fans have, he never lost. I mean he lost games but he never had, you know, Tomlin had that one four and you know, 13 season like that did not exist. So when you never do that, you gain a little bit more bulletproof. You know, it's like wearing a bulletproof vest in terms of being a coach. It's harder for them to come at you and because the moment you start losing, they get rid of everybody. Right. John Harbaugh missed the playoffs under 500. See ya. Andy Reid, you know, one awful year gone. But when you say every year it's harder for them to do it even as you get farther and farther removed from the Super Bowl. So I personally hope Tomlin does Amazon as a consumer and as someone that watched all these Thursday night games, does a lot of content about them around that game. And some of those games, you know, are better than others. So sign me up for that. But I do think these teams, like if you're Matt Ryan, you want to start strong, get a guy in there that knows what he's doing. You're Steven Ross. You've been dreaming about a big name coach forever. Makes a lot of sense. So obviously he's going to have suitors. What would they demand back? Because the Saints truly did not want to like get rid of Sean Payton. This one felt like, yeah, Tomlin might have been like, I'm over it. But like you guys were over it. Too. So like fourth round pick, we're a long way from that. Who knows if he even takes interviews. Like John Harbaugh is kind of actively taking interviews or at least making contact. Obviously Tomlin will. But maybe Truly is just cool with just moving on and taking a year. That. Who knows, sometimes a year turns into 10 and maybe he becomes some legendary TV guy. Or maybe Truly is a year and he misses the grind. That's a long time in one place and the pressure. A lot of eyeballs, big time franchise. Pretty legendary run, right? I, I do. People make fun of it because part of. I made fun of it because it felt like it was never going to lead to this day when it just felt like kind of was time, like a couple years ago. It is pretty impressive what he did. Just refused to have a shitty season, refused to bottom out. I mean, the 49ers last year went 6 and 11. A couple years ago the Rams had like the top five, top five or six pick. Now granted, it went to the Lions, right, for the Stafford trade. But like a lot of great. Have awful years. What was the Chiefs record this year? 6, 11. Like, it's just, it's inevitable. You get a couple injuries, weird things happen. Happens to everybody except that guy. And it truly is. I think now that he's just in whatever a situation is. Unemployed, retired, quit actively seeking employment in the media industry. We can kind of just. That was, that was a hell of a run. That was. That was really impressive, you know, and I, I think it's going to really age well. I also think there's a power in getting away for a while, right? I think about this a lot in the podcasting world. Like, do I do too much content sometimes I'm like, well, during the football season, it's kind of the business I'm in. And I, I try to think about that a little bit more in the, in the slower times. Like sometimes just not being heard all the time is not the worst thing. It definitely works in the coaching world where, you know, five years after Gruden got fired from Tampa, people like this guy. Greatest thing since sliced bread. It's like, did you guys watch the end of his Tampa Bay career? It did not go. And I'm, I'm pro. Gruden entertains me on the Internet. But I remember thinking when he got back with the Raiders, I'm like, they just hired. This guy's a superstar, remember? Like, maybe. But the perception and the buzz and the media hype, it's what all my scouting friends always tell Me, they got to be very careful about that February, March and April leading up to the draft because you can let it all cloud you. You hear what middle Cop saying, you HEAR what Todd McShay is saying, you hear what Daniel Jeremiah is saying, and all of a sudden it starts messing with your own mind. That's the way this world works, right? And I think with a coach like Tomlin, who is so good in front of a microphone and just so unique, like his experiences, obviously the success he had, the people he's coached, the people he's coached against, like, think of the eras in which he coached against. He's been in the league against like the Farvest and the Aikmans up through the. Caleb Williams, he's coached against them all. So I think he's. I hope he does Amazon. That's what I'm rooting for him to do, Amazon. But I do think there would be some massive, massive. Now he's. I think he was one of the higher paid coaches in the league. Like 15, $16 million a year. I. Would you be shocked at the Miami Dolphins? Like, here's five for 100. You know, it's easy to say like, yeah, money's not everything. It's like, you see that contract, I'll just, I'll keep coaching. I'll live in South Beach. But Amazon could do the same thing. So fascinating to watch this play out. I think we all saw this coming in some form or fashion. It was just inevitable. And it, to me, it really felt more inevitable. Harbaugh last week, the, the, not just the outcome of that game, but as the game went, it's like, these guys are getting clowned and this is not the Buffalo Bills. This is not the Andy Reid Kansley Chiefs. This is Houston Texans. You know, I get they've won the division a bunch of times over the years and won some home playoff games. They're going to Hines Field. I think it's called something different now in the cold and beating your ass and you look around, you're like, we got a lot of older guys. It's like, it's time. So glad this saga is over, you know, because it was, it was a topic that I personally was a little tired of talking about because it just kind of felt like it went in circles. And now we have like, it's over. And Mike Tomlin and the Pittsburgh Steelers can go on with their way. And obviously one story that we will continue to give thoughts on is like, who are they going to hire? My initial thought would be some, like, they're going to want a tough guy. Like they're not going Mike Tomlin to Mike McDaniel. So defensive guys tough. Brian Flores worked there a couple years ago. Robert Sala kind of feels like a Pittsburgh Steeler. You know Frank Signetti or Frank Signetti's brother Kurt Signetti is born and raised in Pittsburgh, obviously having a lot of success in Indiana. Now granted he's never coached. I don't think in the pros. Longtime college guy could be wrong on that. Maybe he's had a stint but I'm pretty sure it was from NC State to Bama to becoming a head coach for a long time that, that, that would be pretty risky but hell the Steelers would be like well we hired Mike Tomlin once upon a time. Most of you guys had never heard of him. He'd been one year defensive coordinator for Minnesota. Now granted looking back it's like he was coaching the DBs with, with for Gruden and Tony Dungey with Tampa Bay. Last time I checked, two of the four DBs are in the hall of Fame. So pretty good group. I think John lynch swears by the guy and it's, it's, it's just an all timer little shocking. Honestly it's probably the closest thing over the last 25 years to McVeigh. When it happened it was kind of pre, definitely pre social media but pre the Internet. The power of the Internet, right. You know Reddit and all these places didn't exist but it would have been the equivalent of that now would have been like who'd they just hire? And clearly they got it right because he went on to be one of the best coaches of his generation and now they got to try to replace it and it's not easy to do right. It's. They went from Coward to Tomlin. I say this forever about quarterbacks like what going from Favre to Rogers to Love that's pretty lucky. A lot of times even farve to Rogers to some scrub and going the run they've been on even back to Chuck Noel is who I don't remember coaching a game but always ready was pretty good and the clips in the 70s obviously had some squads, won some Super Bowls is good luck replacing them. And I think one thing different that the vibe I get from people in that world is the Steelers aren't as good in the front office anymore. That's a knock and that to me is a big difference between the Ravens and the Steelers. The Ravens front office is still viewed as top notch in the NFL. The, the Pittsburgh Steelers is not. So who they can get to sign up with. Their operation is going to be fascinating and something to monitor also because like kind of a bottom out job, like if you get hired by the Ravens. Bushadi, I guess I haven't even seen his press conference yet today. I saw his quote saying that, that they want to extend Lamar Jackson. Obviously he's on the books next year for $75 million. But if you sign up for the Ravens as a coach, whether you're. Stefanski, Sala, I was gonna say Harbaugh, whoever it is. Right. Marcus Freeman, you name it, you have a several year window. Like the pressure. Anything less than the playoffs next year would be a failure. And I'd argue if you come into the playoffs, they're gonna want playoff victories. Pressure is 10 out of 10. I think with Pittsburgh, do you know, a lot of people want nuke this thing. Let's finally bottom out for a year. Let's take a deep breath, let's shed some of these salaries. So the Raven and Steelers, who have always been kind of a parallel operation, competing against each other and both have always. The Ravens had a couple down years over Harbaugh's tenure, but for the most part they've been really good. 12 of 18 years. Making the playoffs then you won six divisions. It's the Ravens expectation and rightfully so is next year. We're competing for the super bowl and I would imagine the gambling odds, you know, in March, April, May, they will be one of the super bowl favorites. The Steelers will not. And I think the Steelers are going to, for the first time probably in franchise history, take a long look in the mirror and say we're going to need a transition year. And honestly, I think a lot of fans will be like, thank God we needed this because watching us go 10 and 7 and getting beaten like a drum at home is not fun. It's. It's actually kind of tiresome at this point, which you go, whoa. And I love when I hear people say this. Most teams in the league would die to have that. Well, yeah, the Steelers have had that now for 45 years. So their expectations are a little bit different than the, than the Raiders or the Arizona Cardinals. Right? They're like, listen, we're cool with going to the playoffs if we have a shot, but we know we have no shot. So we'd rather just have one year, go four wins and be like drafting in the top five and like turn our thing around. If the Chiefs have a second run in them, it will be because of this off season and this draft specifically it will change the course of their franchise. Well why were they able to do it? They went 6 and 11. It sucked. Now it was easier to do for them because they had just been to five or six Super Bowls. Steelers haven't won a playoff game. And what's the year January 17th to like the 2016 season. Been a while and honestly didn't feel like wasn't even close. I mean they've been blown out in their last three playoff games against high end competition. So props to Mike Tomlin. Hell of a run, all time, great NFL figure and the one thing the NFL is very lucky at. Before we dive into guy here and Tomlin fits. This is the key to this business right now. Obviously the games are fun and gambling and talking about what happens for the 60 Minutes this weekend throughout the season is the main business model of the NFL. But it's driven by the characters and obviously the players are characters but the coaches now are so famous and the coaches personalities help drive this whole thing. You need not just main characters but supporting actors. And I just think you get that like Mike Tomlin is just a unique individual in NFL history. And I said this one, Sean McVeigh, remember when he was gonna like quit and go to Amazon? It's like Sean, you're still so young. I hope you just stay in the NFL. We need you as a character in this whole thing that entertains us all. So as long as Mike Tomlin stays in the world, I'm cool with. Right. Like I know they love the Sean Payton at Fox. I think we're much better having Sean Payton coach than on television. Like I think big picture for Mike. I hope that he comes back like it doesn't just turn into a John Madden. Wouldn't be the worst thing. I mean if he turns into a John Madden I wouldn't blame him. That that means he's in very involved in the NFL too. But like Rex Ryan does television for espn. I, he's kind of irrelevant to me. Right. And he was a huge character when he was in the league and I'm not comparing Tomlin to, to Rex Thomas obviously had way more success. But like we need big personalities and not just with players but with coaches, with assistant coaches, with everyone involved. And Mike is, is just one of the better, you know, non players and most important non players in the NFL. So hopefully just maybe one year hiatus and then, and then he comes back and, and we get him back on in big games and people start saying he sucks or he's good or whatever. But that's, that's all part of it. Mike Tomlin done with the Pittsburgh Steelers. Let's, let's dive into Guy. Today's show is brought to you by our presenting sponsor, Hard Rock Bet, the official sportsbook partner of the AFC south champion Jacksonville Jaguars. Duvall is going to be jacked up this weekend. You know what I love doing with these standalone playoff games? Same game parlays, baby. Lock in one matchup at a time and stack your picks. Maybe a quarterback throws 250 yards, maybe a running back hits 100 tight end punches and a touchdown. Got you covered. And if you miss kickoff, do not worry. Hard Rock Bet has live in game betting. So you're never too late to the action. Find a winner or grab a player prop you meant to play. And live bet between snaps. It's just that easy, baby. 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Very, very excited to bring on a man that officiated my wedding that I was like, God, it's been a long time. He's been married a while. I think I was the best man in his wedding.
- [26:33]
Guy Haberman
Correct.
- [26:34]
John Middlekauff
He resurrected my career when your boy was literally on the street and brought me in to do a radio interview in San Francisco. And it's got my radio career going. We had a radio show for the Bay Area for years. We had a podcast for years. He is now currently our very close friend, Greg Papa. Legendary voice in the Bay Area, nationally. Just a legendary guy in the play by play broadcast world. He has been battling leukemia. So Haberman has been calling the 49er games and just had some of the most legendary calls in the history of the franchise. I Don't know. I mean, it's. It's up to you to determine that. It's subjective. I. I would put him up near the top, right there with Owens. Owens. Nothing other than I'd say this is his Netflix debut, but, you know, Guy Haberman. You never know where he's been. Guy, what's up, bro?
- [27:30]
Guy Haberman
It's great. I mean, I. It probably is, unless there's like. Yeah, I think it probably is my Netflix debut in terms of being on watching, not my debut. I've watched a lot of Netflix, but.
- [27:39]
John Middlekauff
Did you say anything to Howie the other day?
- [27:41]
Guy Haberman
I never. I never ran into Howie. I passed Sirianni in the hallway. I saw big Dom on the sideline with his chain on. Never saw. I was looking for Howie so I could say something to him. I did post a picture from outside the link that said the house the middle cough built. I don't know if you saw that. Never saw Jeffrey Lurie. Yeah. Didn't a bunch of people. I didn't. Never. Donovan McNabb. Never saw him. Not the awesome one. Never saw him.
- [28:08]
John Middlekauff
They. They, they. Dom. Dom did one of those Chip Kelly moves with Dom to get in the car. We're taking to the airport. You're out of here, bro.
- [28:14]
Guy Haberman
But I might have been the last person to see Sirianni. I guess we'll find out.
- [28:16]
John Middlekauff
Yeah. What. What was the weather like on the. Was. It was obviously windy, but was it cold? Because Dom does not even think. He just wears an undershirt and, like, a jumpsuit. Like, he's got to be a little chilly, doesn't he?
- [28:25]
Guy Haberman
You know, I just remembered I used to have a photo of. Next to Andy Reid on the sideline in, like, a big hoodie. And Andy, you're, like, in the background. You must. You were on the sideline for that game for what? It must have been your first year in Philly. I gotta go find that picture.
- [28:37]
John Middlekauff
Might have been a training camp photo.
- [28:38]
Guy Haberman
No, it was a game. I'm pretty sure it was a game photo. Although I don't know why you were standing next to Andy. Ball game. It was nice. Philly. Warmest cold booth I've ever been in. Like, you know, you open up the window when you're calling the game, and I. I. Great temperature. It was like, 21 degrees with a windshield. The wind was a major factor. I don't know. Did it feel that way on television? That the wind was a major factor?
- [28:59]
John Middlekauff
Y. Brady was talking a lot about it, and I think when he did. Have you gone back? Did you watch TV, copy after.
- [29:05]
Guy Haberman
I'm an all 22 guy.
- [29:09]
John Middlekauff
You know, Brady, he's doing the. It was actually one of his probably, definitely standout moments of his career. The ball thing about how you don't want the ball to go up. It's like a golf shot. Right. You want to keep it low. The problem. And I wanted to say, hey, Tom, you're six foot five. Six foot six. Brock is six one ish. So he. It's harder for him to throw down. Easier for you to throw those little Edelman, you know, slant routes out routes. But, you know, he. He went. It was a cool moment. It was actually pretty interesting.
- [29:37]
Guy Haberman
I do like watching the.
- [29:38]
John Middlekauff
You see Tom that.
- [29:39]
Guy Haberman
I did see Tom. Security in front, security in back as he walked by. Burkhart came by. As you know, he's a very cool guy.
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John Middlekauff
Security too, for him.
- [29:48]
Guy Haberman
No, he was. He was floating free. But, you know, I mean, Juan Jennings was a big time high school quarterback prospect, and he's 63, and he's the one that threw the. Probably the pass of the game to Christian McAffrey. Tom always did have that down angle, the ball coming out of his hands. And I do think that that Juwan throw was with the wind. The wind kind of comes across out of the open end of the stadium, which is the opposite end of the stadium for where McAffrey caught that ball. So it was kind of coming across and then down like that direction. And that's right where the broadcast position, like right where we're looking on radio. And when the ball left Jennings hands, I. I swear to God, for the rest of my life, there was an alternate universe. You know, when you watch a game or a movie back that you know what's going to happen and you're still like kind of scared when the Freddy comes around the corner or whatever.
- [30:36]
John Middlekauff
Yeah.
- [30:36]
Guy Haberman
There's still like a part of me that sees the ball going over Christian's head and him not catching. I thought time stood still. I swear to you, time stood still. I could see Christian. I could see the ball halfway in the air, and there was no way McCaffrey was going to catch that ball. And somehow he did. It's one truly. It almost brings me to tears, what an incredible physical accomplishment I witnessed. It's one of the greatest things I've ever seen.
- [30:59]
John Middlekauff
Well, how often do you watch? Definitely a lot on Saturdays, but even a ton on Sundays is a guy can't quite track the ball. And to track the ball that clearly he thinks coming the one way, he has to Turn the other way. It's obviously. I mean, he's overthrown. He's a wide receiver. I mean, it's just. It's. It's. It's a play to be made. Maybe you would have to leap, but not having to leap, keeping his feet. And really, Willie amazing, that thing. Which is kind of somewhat ironic because that game, he made incredible catches. Right. I mean, obviously the game winner. But didn't. Was. Was it two weeks, it wouldn't have been in Seattle. When he high pointed. He high, high pointed a ball in that game. Because I thought it was Kittle at.
- [31:41]
Guy Haberman
First and it was Caffrey drive.
- [31:42]
John Middlekauff
Yeah. So you're like, he's making. And he just had probably one of the worst moments of his career where even he said, like, the game's on me, even though he didn't lose the game. But when does Christian ever drop a ball?
- [31:53]
Guy Haberman
I mean, other than that, in the Super Bowl. That feels like one of his worst moments was the week 18 Seattle drop.
- [32:00]
John Middlekauff
So you thought when the ball's in the air, no chance he's catching.
- [32:03]
Guy Haberman
No, the wind was at the back. It was going over. It was 1000% going over his head. And then even as it came down, I was like, his arms. There's no way he's going to get it turning over his body. I'm telling you, bro, like, I am tearing up. Not because the Niners want it was.
- [32:18]
John Middlekauff
Oh, you're a Niner fan.
- [32:20]
Guy Haberman
So are you. You know, like, when you hear people tell their stories, like, I saw Mickey Mantle and he had a ball off the facade and Yankee stadium, it was 717ft. You're like, whatever. I'm telling you, nobody that Jerry Rice, like, I don't think 99 of receivers catch that ball. And the crazy part is Juan Jennings threw a pass that was better than. I bet if you went and asked Brock Purdy and Mac Jones, could they have made that pass? Of course they would say yes. But I think if you have a quarterback throw that ball 10 times, like, it maybe gets completed too. It was just.
- [32:58]
John Middlekauff
You know, watching back the highlights. Kmbr, big local station in northern California, really goes through all California. It's kind of like wfan.
- [33:06]
Guy Haberman
You can probably hear it in Arizona, in Scottsdale.
- [33:08]
John Middlekauff
Yeah, I probably could find spots for sure. You thought after you made the call and you looked down, you saw the flag, that it up your call, huh? That's a little broadcaster. Thanks.
- [33:18]
Guy Haberman
What I do is I finish the call. Just because what you don't want to do is be like that's a flag. And then you don't finish the call. So I tried to finish the call and. And then I had to acknowledge the flag, but it did. It's different on the road to the crowd's not that crowd is all Philadelphia crowd is. You know, they don't do any like in stadium pa. All right, guy. Or like, you know, here I'm over here in section 217. We're giving away Chicky and Pete's gift certificates to the first fan that can name the last Eagle to. They just play rock music and rap music and do crowd shots every commercial break. And the place goes absolutely bananas.
- [33:52]
John Middlekauff
It is. How many Niner games you do this year on the road?
- [33:56]
Guy Haberman
I think that was a on the road. I don't know. Ten, I think. I'm not nine. And one Summer. Summer.
- [34:02]
John Middlekauff
No big deal. Best it is. You know, people always said that their fans are like. Were they. Were they saying. Saying goodbye to Kittle when he was getting carted off.
- [34:12]
Guy Haberman
Said, you know, I think there's 67, 000 people in that stadium. So I'm sure. Of course there was somebody by the tunnel. I don't know. It did not feel like the crowd was cheering George Kittle's injury. You know what I mean?
- [34:24]
John Middlekauff
Yeah.
- [34:24]
Guy Haberman
Like, I'm sure that there's eight. You can literally find every opinion you want to find if you go poll 67,000 people. So not to excuse it. I'm sure it happened. But the crowd to me actually seemed kind of sympathetic to the moment.
- [34:36]
John Middlekauff
Yeah. To me, obviously, it's a polarizing fan base. But I've always said, like, I've only worked for one NFL team.
- [34:44]
Guy Haberman
There's the Chiefs.
- [34:46]
John Middlekauff
Yeah. Line of delineation of, like, the franchises that really matter. And I'm not just talking, like, television ratings. I'm talking when you work there, it matters. Right. And we've been lucky. We were, you know, you and I, for those that don't know, went to high school together. When I became a G at Fresno State, you had gone to Fresno State and you were doing radio then. So I. We moved in together with our buddy AJ who ended up who played basketball, Fresno State. And then he went to work at Sac State. So you and I lived together with him for a year, and then he bounced after a year. So like, you know, the 40, we just got to you just kind of fan where you grow up most of the times, like, just happen to get like, Barry Bonds and Steve Young when we were kids. Like, that's pretty lucky. But I Remember going to Philly, it's like this really matters and it's a great sports town. But like the Eagles and I think clearly Chicago's a lot like this too. Like obviously the Bulls with Michael Jordan or the Cubs, there's nothing like the Bears. And you feel it now. It's like the Bears and the Eagles. It's like an SEC environment there. And that's why it's like how long is the time before you can boo? Well, it's like when your offense looks like that the guy just paid $300 to sit in the fourth level. Like he, he's allowed to boo. Watching a team that can't complete a pass.
- [36:00]
Guy Haberman
That was what they booed by my count, four times during the game. And within 30 seconds the rock music started and they just started going crazy again.
- [36:09]
John Middlekauff
Yeah, like, it was like. It's, it's a, it's, it's for a team coming off super bowl with basically the majority of the nucleus in all the same cats. Right. It's like it's all, it's, it's the group. So it's, it's the same guys. Like if it was the equivalent with the 49ers, these guys want to love the team, but it's, it is hard. You, you taught me when I got into radio, if a baseball team is not hitting, it looks like they're not trying looks. So you just think these guys don't give the first. They, they just. No, they just. 26 outs were like strikeouts.
- [36:40]
Guy Haberman
Josh Redick was jogging to first.
- [36:43]
John Middlekauff
So in football, when you start going three and out a lot. I don't know what. They ended this. You'd probably have this. They led the league for a large partial season. Three now.
- [36:51]
Guy Haberman
Yeah, they, they, they let it leather league and three and out.
- [36:55]
John Middlekauff
Three and out.
- [36:56]
Guy Haberman
That matters.
- [36:57]
John Middlekauff
Yeah, I bet it historically top 5 drafting team usually in that category. I bet if we looked over the course of like 20 years, it's probably not like a defending super bowl champion division.
- [37:08]
Guy Haberman
Definitely not two 1000 yard receivers and the reigning offensive player of the year.
- [37:13]
John Middlekauff
Did you feel like it was really angry in there? Like as the game went on, like, or was it just more intense?
- [37:17]
Guy Haberman
I thought it was more disbelief. When we, when we rolled in on the bus travel with the team when we rolled in on the bus, a lot of middle fingers but like honestly, kind of endearing a lot of people. You know, you people like flying the bird. But it was kind of like they just knew they had a standard to uphold, which is to flip. You off on the team.
- [37:37]
John Middlekauff
There's no. Cynthia Jones is in the media there. You know, I think that's her name. You know. Do you see that clip of her talking to Liam Cohen?
- [37:44]
Guy Haberman
Oh, I didn't know who. I didn't know the name.
- [37:46]
John Middlekauff
But yeah, she like yo, most people have seen it. That's, that's environment there.
- [37:51]
Guy Haberman
The Eagles should hire her to go to go to a Sirianni press conference.
- [37:54]
John Middlekauff
Howie would fire. He wouldn't want that type atmosphere.
- [37:56]
Guy Haberman
You're right. That's what's great about. That's what's great. Like somebody told me a Larry Brown though basketball coach quote, he's like, you know, some people are just happier when they're mad. Which you know, I think we can all identify with a little bit. Yeah, yeah. So like yeah, they're going to yell at you, but they're going to equal opportunity yell at their own team. So I think it's pretty stunning not that they lost but that the defending champs, you know, they were 5 and O at home. John. In the playoffs. They'd won by 21 points those five games with Jalen Hurts and Nick Sirianni. The only time they trailed at home in the playoffs was three. Was a three point deficit to Washington last year. Then they scored 55 on them. Killed them like they have been killing people. Like that's part of the story is I was saying to you on the phone the other day, how many guys on the Niners defense would have started for the Eagles defense? Maybe one.
- [38:40]
John Middlekauff
None of the D lineman, right? This version. Yep.
- [38:42]
Guy Haberman
None of the D linemen.
- [38:43]
John Middlekauff
Obviously the linebacker. Their linebackers are good. Lenore would be their second corner.
- [38:49]
Guy Haberman
Would one of the other Niner safeties start in place of Mark Marcus Epps?
- [38:53]
John Middlekauff
Well, Stout is a fantastic rookie, but Cooper is the best slot corner in the league. Exactly. So it's like he's not beating him out. Yeah, I don't know. I mean not many. Their defense is legitimately good, right? I mean you number one defense in.
- [39:06]
Guy Haberman
The league since they traded for JALEN PHILLIPS Week 10. 10 points a game.
- [39:10]
John Middlekauff
Do you think like for the Bears Packer game. Were you watching that team Hotel Kyle Bears Packer game?
- [39:19]
Guy Haberman
No, that was. I was team room, team meal room. I was watching the Carolina game but then back in the room for the Bears game.
- [39:29]
John Middlekauff
So that's probably obviously a devastating loss for the packers. But that was a more. It was like a religious experience in Chicago. That, that, that was really cool. I thought it was a better win than a bad loss. Especially Micah Parsons on crutches. It's like, if they played that game 10 times, it might not look like that, but like, the Bears are going to win a bunch of games. It's not that crazy. This game, it felt like. I feel like that's one of the worst losses I've ever seen. When you factor in, I mean, Kyle after the game, that picture, do you see the viral picture of, like, him hugging George and the eyes of Brandon Graham behind him have this look of like, why did I pick up how he's calling, come back. This could be me on that. Like, I got. I made my Super Bowls, made my money. What am I doing? The eyes in Brandon Graham seeing, like a fellow fallen warrior of like, what am I doing this for? This is crazy. That to me, as powerful as Kyle's face was, Brandon Graham's eyes in the background were like, damn, this is. That's one of the better photos. That's not positive in, like, sports history, I think.
- [40:28]
Guy Haberman
Yeah.
- [40:29]
John Middlekauff
Those three men, Kittle's face, Kyle and Brandon Graham. Brandon Graham's like, one of the great Eagles of all time. And you just. His face kind of told it all, honestly. It's like, symbolizes the Eagles. Almost like, what are we doing here? Can we just go home?
- [40:41]
Guy Haberman
But I did get that five for the Eagles. Can we just go home after the game?
- [40:45]
John Middlekauff
Yeah, I just think that. And maybe part of it, why it feels as crazy is the way the Niners had just looked against Seattle. Who. I don't know. I. I feel like the Eagles have better players in Seattle. You did both. You've been around both. Does it feel that way or is that.
- [41:01]
Guy Haberman
I mean, on. I would say it's hard. Like, Seattle's better.
- [41:05]
John Middlekauff
Got a better, you know, more dynamic coach because he calls the defense. But Vic's great defensive coach against Shanahan.
- [41:11]
Guy Haberman
Like, he doesn't give points to the Shanahan guys. But, like, I think Vic is a known entity, entity to Kyle.
- [41:17]
John Middlekauff
Right.
- [41:17]
Guy Haberman
Like, Kyle, even though Vic is kind of kicked his butt previously, he. He knows how. He knows what's coming. I think Mike McDonald is kind of a new. He's brought a new flavor. That said, I did think looking at Seattle's guys on The Field Week 18, Nick Emman worry, their defensive line, they're not quite legion of boom. Like Sherm and all those guys walking around Cam Chancellor, but they did feel pretty physically like. It felt like, okay, this is Jimmy's and Joe's. Like, that's what that game felt like. And then they were also schematically really excellent on defense. The Niner, they were just never where they were supposed to be defensively, and it screwed things up week 18. So it'll make the rematch really interesting. But I felt the same way. Like, I remember you and I used to go to like, Raider games all the time, and we just stand on the field when Carson Palmer would come out or Peyton Manning. These guys are humongous.
- [42:05]
John Middlekauff
Ben Roethlisberger and Eli were huge.
- [42:08]
Guy Haberman
They're just blue chippers. And to me, like, Seattle on defense and the Eagles on defense are just stacked with blue chippers.
- [42:16]
John Middlekauff
Well, like if. If Leonard Williams walks by you or Jalen Carter, do you notice that big of a difference?
- [42:20]
Guy Haberman
Leonard Williams ran by me when I was standing on the. Before the game and I thought I was going to fall over. He's. Because he's so. What do you. What do you scout say? Like, he's high. He's just like, he's built like a six, three guy, but then just he's so proportional.
- [42:34]
John Middlekauff
Right?
- [42:35]
Guy Haberman
And then he's stretched out and so. But I mean, this. The NFL, this is National Football League, John. That's the way these guys look. And then you look at the Niners and they got some guys starting at linebacker. Who hasn't started in 62 weeks of football? It's crazy.
- [42:47]
John Middlekauff
Yeah, that's the craziest thing. I mean, you've been to NBA Finals, Major League Baseball, playoff. You've been to it all the craziest thing you've ever witnessed given, like, even the 49ers, they truly believe going into that.
- [42:58]
Guy Haberman
And then Kittle I. I would guarantee you not the team. But if we just pull the organization pre game, like, all right, who thinks we can win this game? I bet there'd be a lot of like, well, you know, we had a good run. We had a good run. At least we made a playoff game.
- [43:14]
John Middlekauff
They made it weird long enough that all of a sudden the other team started thinking about it.
- [43:18]
Guy Haberman
I think when don't you think this too? Like, there are just some teams that are weird. Like, Seattle's not weird, Philly's weird. And when you play a weird. Just like all the dynamics, like A.J. brown and Nick Sirianna yelling at each other on the sideline, like, why is this team the fan? Like, if you. Last week I went to a Syriani YouTube and just like, am I allowed to say YouTube and. And press conference. And like all the comments were just like, fire this Periscope. Eagles fans, periscope. So I just think when you. I thought it was a big intangible game, right? Like, the margins are so thin if you're buttoned down, if you're disciplined. Niners only committed one penalty. Eagles committed like seven. And still they could have won the game.
- [44:00]
John Middlekauff
Clear. There's something. And I think Seattle's going to have a lot of this. But the Niners, like, even though they're missing guys, there is still an. And you've done Indiana games, you know, Big Ten network, no big deal. Signetti. Something. There's something about like people really. This probably works in any line of work. Like when you really like the people you work with. And in a business that is like physically taxing and you're, you have to like lay it on the line with fatigue and mental toughness and all these things come into play. Like, I think of how he had a do over. He would have traded A.J. brown. Like keeping that around, it's hard to do because it's like he made plays early in the game. You're like, how are they going to cover him?
- [44:43]
Guy Haberman
It's like Lenore, you talk a big.
- [44:44]
John Middlekauff
Game like, this is a, this is a, this is an elite player. But then like you have a drop and then it just, you know, DK is kind of like that too. Now. I think AJ's better than DK, but they're just, I, you know, like McCaffrey's really, really dependable. It's like the, the Coach K thing on that doc when Laitner missed, he's like, he, he might make or miss, but he ain't going to be afraid. And it's like use check. And the Eagles like the town. Their defense to me was. It wasn't their issue. Right? But offensively, it's like they're all looking in the huddle. Do they really like each other? Brandon Graham, last year, remember when he was like doing the chicky and peach thing, he's like, yeah, the Jalen and AJ just can't stand each other. And then like immediately, like an hour later, how he's, he's like, I take that back. I didn't mean it like that. It's like he, he. You know what's cool about Brandon? You get old enough, you like not even thinking you like your corporate coach player speaks is off. He's like, yeah, like they just hate each other now. And I don't think you. And in fairness to Jalen, you're like, you hate on me. You've made a pretty public. You did a commercial that feels like it's just directly at me and Then you're dropping balls like it's hilarious. I mean, I can't. Sometimes I. I'm like, I can't believe he did this. I know, but, you know, A.J. unless I don't blame him. But it also. You get in that moment like it really matters. And you can see, like, this team doesn't really like each other. And the thing is, what was January 13th? Is there a bigger lock than AJ being traded to, like, the Patriots on the first day of free agency or maybe even before it's broken? Like, he's not even gonna be on the team. So you go down swinging with this guy's not gonna be on a team and not. Not gonna be on the team because, like, yeah, we just needed to save some cap space. Like, a lot of teams, it's like, we gotta get this guy out of here. We gotta. We gotta try to save this operation. Right. And the Niners don't have any of that right now.
- [46:26]
Guy Haberman
Well, because Iuk's not around.
- [46:28]
John Middlekauff
True. But he just drove off and he's going so fast. No one ever seen him again.
- [46:31]
Guy Haberman
I mean, it's not like they've been without drama the last several years in Debo, it's. But I think the reason I always.
- [46:39]
John Middlekauff
But Debo for his limitations was a guy that you go to war with and get his best effort. Now it might not, you know, as he got older, he wasn't as good. But you felt going to war with Debo Samuel, like he was going to go down with the ship with you.
- [46:51]
Guy Haberman
I think go back to your Signetti point. Like, I love watching Signetti talk, and I'd be interested, like, would he take the Steelers job? He's about to get his, like, third extension in six months, probably in Indiana. But when you watch him talk, like, if you go watch his introductory press conference or any interview he does, he rattles off every core value like it is imprinted on his brain. Right. Every play has a. Has a. A mind of its. Every play is a story of its own. You, nine seconds to greatness. He just like. And even when the Niners are like a six win team or whatever, or Kyle doesn't end the half with the ball or I should have used the time out there. I wish he was more aggressive. I think the most powerful thing is players think that he can make them reach their full potential. Like, they all believe in him. Players believe in the head coach, period. And I think that is the fundamental reason why I had somebody tell me once, like, you know, it'll never come to this. But if anybody could call offense and defense, it would be Kyle Shanahan, I think. Well, Ryan Walters, you remember him. He was Washington's defensive coordinator this year. He was Purdue's head coach member. He was a defensive coordinator Illinois for Bielema. Then he becomes Purdue's head coach. And he took over offensive play calling, like, two years ago.
- [48:08]
John Middlekauff
But he'd been like, yeah, I remember that story.
- [48:09]
Guy Haberman
Yeah, Colorado. But like, I just think that is. I think it has to start there with it. And so, you know, Sirianni, they've taken play calling. Not that I'm the Sirianni expert, but he was the OC and then he's not the OC and then he's the play caller again. He's not the play caller.
- [48:26]
John Middlekauff
I don't. I don't think he's called places. They yanked it away the site. I don't think he's touched a play goal.
- [48:31]
Guy Haberman
I just think there's a fundamental thing, and I think this is. Signetti is like. Signetti is not gonna pop into every room and, like, put his arm around every guy and like, check on you. And I don't know if you saw one of his players said, like, I don't think he's ever been happy. Things like, yeah, I've been happy. I just don't show them that I'm happy. Right. Yeah, I just think he is. So he just makes everybody so much better. I think it's the fundamental reason to me, that's the number one thing you need to find a head coach is like, do the players believe he can make them better? And I think it's why the 49ers play with a purpose. They play with an intensity because they believe what they're told is going to work. Doesn't always work back to your latener point. But they believe it's going to work if they do it the right way.
- [49:25]
John Middlekauff
Is it fair to say the guy. Tim Ryan, who back in. When I was. I remember when I got Sirius XM in the Honda Accord and I was driving around the country to scout, he had a radio show with Pat Kerwin moving the. Moving the chains, which was elite. Yeah. Tim is an underrated. When he was doing national stuff, how good and entertaining he was an excellent. Like, it was just. It was an awesome show, you know, I think he does it now with Bruce Miller. It ain't the same nothing. No shot of Bruce. I just think that highly attempt as an entertainer. But he's. He's really tight with Bob Salo. Right. Like, they're They're. Yeah.
- [49:57]
Guy Haberman
He calls him Bob.
- [49:57]
John Middlekauff
Yeah. Have you spent a lot of time around Robert?
- [50:00]
Guy Haberman
A little time in the meal room when, when you know, Tim's like, hey, come sit down, talk to Bob.
- [50:05]
John Middlekauff
Carbs, proteins, what's his.
- [50:07]
Guy Haberman
Oh, he's very. He's like tell. He was telling somebody one time like, oh, you can't drink that because of this, this and that. So he's dialed very disciplined, very friendly, extremely friendly guy. Like, see him in the hallway, see him at the elevator. You know what I mean? Like, have you. You've talked to him, right?
- [50:21]
John Middlekauff
I briefly once. I mean I've never heard a bad word about him.
- [50:24]
Guy Haberman
I'm so sharp. Like he to me is clearly an NFL head coach. There's just a challenge of, you know, there's some good defensive coaches right now and I do think it's challenging to hire a defensive guy. But Tim Ryan, did you happen to catch. I sent you the clip for people you go on Instagram, knbr that John mentioned earlier. There's a clip. Self promotion. It's not about me going around of one of my calls because they put like a GoPro in the booth, which I don't like, but people like it.
- [50:51]
John Middlekauff
What's a double pass?
- [50:52]
Guy Haberman
Right before the play, Tim breaks a. What you call it like a smelling salt. Like hits the smelling salt like, like that and then the play happens. So he's like an OG football guy. And you're right. Like he's been. He was on Fox for many years. D line, SC's huge. Long hair.
- [51:10]
John Middlekauff
He's a big ass dude. Great hair, elite. I mean you got, you got high end hair. His hair is I would say the, the cream of the crown. Like it doesn't get any better. The flow. How's it always wet? Is it is a product?
- [51:23]
Guy Haberman
No, it's not. I thought it was, but it's not. So he's a bear. I'd love. It'd be sweet to go play the. Go play the Bears for the NFC championship game. That to me there is not. You were there when they had this in Philly. We were around it with the San Francisco Giants here especially. Like I guess you were here in 2012. I wasn't. I wasn't living here in 2010. But from afar. Like when you. The Phillies had it. When you win for the first time or like when you're really in it for the first time, they're just. It's not the same the next like three times and that's what it feels like.
- [51:54]
John Middlekauff
Chicago has Right now, Guy and I were at a. A Giants playoff game. It probably would have been 14. My guess would be. So this is like Buster Posey, Hunter Pence, and they're playing the Nationals.
- [52:08]
Guy Haberman
Yeah.
- [52:08]
John Middlekauff
And Bryce Harper, I think in this game, hit one of the longest home runs, like Barry Bond, beside Barry Bonds ever hit that ball. Still flying. It's like out in the middle of the ocean. But we. We didn't. Like, there was no place to sit. The press box, would you say, with the Giants, isn't that big, like, relative to a football press conference.
- [52:23]
Guy Haberman
And we're not press box guys, you know?
- [52:25]
John Middlekauff
Yeah, no, we're out there rubbing the elbows with people. So we're just like standing room only kind of behind some seats. All of a sudden, like, it's like the sixth or seventh inning. Might have been the seventh inning stretch. And I don't know. It happened to be the lead singer of Journey, Steve Perry. Steve Perry's right in front of us. And they just start playing. Don't start. Stop Believing. And he has a microphone and we're standing. I mean, it's. It's one of those, like, pre. Again, the phone, we were like, why.
- [52:50]
Guy Haberman
Is there a camera right here? Like, who is it shooting?
- [52:52]
John Middlekauff
Yeah, I think it was right. Over the next couple years, his phones and videos were really taken off. It was pretty. When you just lived and you just experienced. You just got to tell people's story and you can even fake the story. Like his other band mates were there and they busted out guitars. You can say whatever you want because no one has video of it. And he just started singing Don't Stop believing and all 60 or 50,000 people. It's. It's one of those things you just. I'll never forget that moment to the day I die. And they came back and won.
- [53:15]
Guy Haberman
I'm pretty sure they did that. That game. They were down like, I don't know, 11 to 4. You know, they were down in that game. You remember who else we saw that day? You tried to say, you said, what's up to him? And he just, what's up? And kept going. You remember Jack Del Rio?
- [53:29]
John Middlekauff
Oh, yeah. But he wasn't coaching the Raiders yet, right? Or was he?
- [53:32]
Guy Haberman
I think he. I think he was about to, because we were like, well, that's weird. What is he doing here? It was like out on the McCovey coat. The landing is where we saw him, up out right field.
- [53:41]
John Middlekauff
Maybe he had just been hired.
- [53:43]
Guy Haberman
I don't know.
- [53:43]
John Middlekauff
No, it would have been the winner. Maybe he was Kind of sniffing around.
- [53:46]
Guy Haberman
I think he'd been hired yet.
- [53:47]
John Middlekauff
Yeah, no, he hadn't. Maybe he was out of football and he just, he knew Mark, he knew Mark was going to be looking for a coach. Yeah, they. I mean they didn't have a coach. Right. Because they had fired what's his name and RIP. Tony Sparano was the interim coach that. That year because he took Del Rio takes over the next year probably in like January. So he, he's probably working the phones to get Mark.
- [54:05]
Guy Haberman
I remember content people need is this.
- [54:08]
John Middlekauff
Yeah. Jack Del Rio story. One person that was on a staff for a while. So like a legendary story that he like told his agent right before he like was about to go into the in person interview with Mark and whoever else was like, I'm gonna crush this interview and this is gonna be my job by the end of the day. And I think it was, you know, at the time they had slim pickings, right? Raiders were down and out. But then a draft, I think they. Mack and Derek Carr were drafted like a couple months later and it changed forever. They would have been already on the team.
- [54:37]
Guy Haberman
He coached the Paris Musketeers of the my. Our guy Yogi Roth is like a minority owner in the team this last year.
- [54:44]
John Middlekauff
Is that one of the UFL or AFL teams?
- [54:47]
Guy Haberman
No, no. It's like it's a European football league. Quick Raider Middlekoff story. Dennis Allen is the coach of the Raiders and we're working at the Raiders flagship. One of the great honors of our lives, the Raiders flagship radio station which where John hosted Raider post game for no extra money and love the game, bro. Love the game. And we go. Dennis Allen is giving us. We're in the Raider meeting room and there's all what are the signs?
- [55:13]
John Middlekauff
Say, like just win, baby.
- [55:16]
Guy Haberman
There was like a. Anyway, we're sitting there, everyone's quiet. Dennis Allen is taking 10 minutes out of his day, the head coach of the Raiders. And he's up there on the stage and there's a phone starts ringing. Like, what is going on? Milo's like scrambling like, oh, it's John. Doesn't silence it. Phone rings again. Dennis Allen stops. It's like looking midolf.
- [55:35]
John Middlekauff
Pulls the phone out.
- [55:36]
Guy Haberman
Of course it's your mom calling. It's like, oh, sorry, it's my mom. Turn it off again.
- [55:41]
John Middlekauff
And about as embarrassing as his tenure, it. It was, it was a low level look for me. Yeah. Also there is a Raider story that for many, many people don't know this. When I did Raider post game, they weren't any good. So you're reacting to these games and they are just getting shellacked. So it's, it's hard to be like, you know, the, the right tackle, he's really got some positive improvement. You're seeing. It's just, it's very negative. And Raider fans, they're leaving the Coliseum peppering you with calls. Also not happy. And so the Raiders, you know, they weren't happy. And I got a phone call one time after they, they were 0, 13 or no, they were 0 and 10. And their last three games, what it.
- [56:28]
Guy Haberman
Was right before they won that Thursday night game.
- [56:30]
John Middlekauff
Yeah. So they're oh and 10 and I think they just played the Rams and it's like Steve Spagnola might have been the. I don't even know who the coach was. And the Rams beat him like 16 or nothing. It's like, is this the worst team we've ever seen? So I tweeted out, I think 0 and 16 is possible. Their next opponents were like Chiefs, Harbaugh, Niners, just good teams, like Patriots. I don't even know it was good teams. And I got a call on the tarmac from their team president, like, you need to take that down. That is not true. Like you just lost 60 to nothing. You're oh and 10. I just tweeted, oh and 16 is on the table. I don't work for you guys. That was kind of the beginning of the end. They weren't, you know, he didn't, Mark Davis wasn't happy with me. And then your boy got escorted out of the building and I think they gave you the option to stay. But Haberman drew a line in the sand and said, no Moss, I'm out as well. So he came down with me.
- [57:20]
Guy Haberman
Crazy. As bad as the Raiders have been that they have, this is the first time they had the number one pick since 2007.
- [57:28]
John Middlekauff
I would imagine they haven't had the number one pick. Like they haven't been good for a long, long time. Even over the course, like post 80s. I think they were down until Gruden got there.
- [57:35]
Guy Haberman
It's only the second I've ever had.
- [57:37]
John Middlekauff
It in the history of the franchise. Yeah, I feel like they've had a.
- [57:41]
Guy Haberman
Lot of bad 62 AFL draft.
- [57:44]
John Middlekauff
Yeah, they've had a lot of God awful teams and they just pick fourth, fifth or sixth.
- [57:49]
Guy Haberman
Would you. Here's a question for you.
- [57:50]
John Middlekauff
That happened this year. I mean look at like a team drafting fifth or sixth or seventh. There were some for a while there were like, we're in December. There's like five, two, three win teams. It's like they're all battling. There's a big difference. Getting Fernando Mendoza if you need a quarterback and just no one else, I guess. What's his name?
- [58:08]
Guy Haberman
Dante. And I. I like Dante more if he comes out. Dylan Rayola's banking on it. See that?
- [58:15]
John Middlekauff
So he's, he's cool with him stand there's paying him so much it doesn't matter. Or is that he knows he's leaving.
- [58:20]
Guy Haberman
Maybe he knows he's leaving. I mean, Dante Moore did the same thing at Oregon the year before with Dylan Gabriel. He came and sat for a year. You get paid a lot of money. But I. I'd be surprised if he.
- [58:30]
John Middlekauff
Can they win a national championship with Dylan Raiola. Have you done Nebraska games?
- [58:34]
Guy Haberman
Yes.
- [58:35]
John Middlekauff
Is. I mean, maybe I'm too hard on him. I feel like he's not that good. But then I get people in my DMs or Die Hard Nebraska fans that are obviously, we're disappointed, but I think you undersell him. He's probably better than you think he is. Did he improve a lot this year? You do games this year at Nebraska?
- [58:48]
Guy Haberman
Yeah, I did. Nebraska, Maryland. Maryland's quarterback, actually. Is it like if as a scout he was a freshman, so you wouldn't.
- [58:56]
John Middlekauff
Have scouted him five star, like elite recruit, right?
- [58:58]
Guy Haberman
Yeah. Malik Washington, like, that guy's interesting. I don't know that Dylan got better this year. Like, I think that was probably the frustration, especially because then they had, they had Dana Holgerson as the OC this year and you thought like they were going to take a step. But I also think, like, I'm not saying he's Caleb, he's not Caleb, but he did some things where it's like they're not playing well, not playing well. And then he just makes a couple throws. You're like, oh my God, who else makes that throw? But he didn't do it as consistently as Caleb. Yeah, and he did it. You know, he's kind of similar to being like an Eagles quarter like he did. Nebraska's a tough play. It's just, it's a very. It's of all the fishbowls, like, it's a major fishbowl, you know, Ohio State, Nebraska's not even sneaky like major fishbowl.
- [59:39]
John Middlekauff
So, yeah, back to Maria showed me this clip. It made me laugh because Belichick, I mean, would have fired everyone on the spot, but the Patriot social media is actually pretty good now and they had this girl that Basically gave like a three minute reel on Instagram of the meal that they. She just showed them. They had a night game. What? What? From morning till they leave. Actually it started Saturday night into the all day Sunday.
- [60:05]
Guy Haberman
So a team employee.
- [60:07]
John Middlekauff
Yeah, you know, like teammates. Yeah, Team reporter or whatever. Team social media girl. And she's just showing them with the. And Maria was fascinated. She's like, how can they eat this much? Well, you've. Listen, I remember at Fresno State thinking you got to be very careful to not go, I can't eat like these guys. When you go with the Niners, what's the go to? Like, how do you approach that?
- [60:30]
Guy Haberman
Well, first of all, you land at 11pm and you get to the hotel and there is a full spread.
- [60:36]
John Middlekauff
They hand you a snack when you get on the plane too.
- [60:38]
Guy Haberman
Well, you can, you can grab your Chick Fil A on the tarmac. Then you get on the plane and you have a choice of red Robin burgers, fried chicken, salads, wraps. I try to go grilled chicken wrap. Then there's also full airplane fare. You like five different things. Do you want the, you know, the shrimp pasta or whatever. Then you can just walk back and there's just all these tray. It's like full size Twix bar, KitKats, 17 different types of chips. I discovered finally this last week. There is ice cream on the plane. Magnum bar. You know, it's just, it doesn't stop.
- [61:11]
John Middlekauff
You serve yourself, you just walk back.
- [61:13]
Guy Haberman
You can ask, they'll serve, they'll happily serve you. But you can go back and just like start grabbing stuff out of the bins. Sour Patch Kids dangerous. You get to the place, line of food like it's a wedding and it's again, you know, a lot of really good hot food. The really dangerous part, and I know you would, is the, the cookie ice cream bar. Friday night before the game. I always make sure to come back for that. Like Haberman is in here a lot. Use it. The meals at 3:30, another meal at 5, a snack at 8. Sneaky. These guys eat every two hours too. So it's just way too much free, accessible food.
- [61:50]
John Middlekauff
I get it from the player standpoint, they're burning a lot of calories. Some of those guys metabolism. They're 25, they could eat. I remember seeing like Desean Jackson would eat burgers and fries. Wouldn't face like Lenore. Like for him to gain weights, probably gonna be hard. And then you get the bigger guys that have to maintain it. But the coaching staff, it's why I Have so much respect. Even like I saw this clip of John Harbaugh his workout. Like he's pretty dialed to have that. You talk about the ultimate discipline is who doesn't like food? One and no one in the football world doesn't like food. So like Robert Sala who's clearly bigger now from a muscle lower body fat standpoint than he was. His discipline has to be. I mean what's. Is Kyle just eat air? Like I could.
- [62:33]
Guy Haberman
I've seen him once, you know, I know I watched that Elway doc and caught you know, Kyle the fun, the great. One of the great things about that doc is like skinny like 18 year old, 17, 15, whatever year old Kyle in the background behind Mike holding his cords. I don't know if his waist was 30 then it's probably 34 now. Maybe 30, a little bigger.
- [62:55]
John Middlekauff
He's a little bigger now.
- [62:56]
Guy Haberman
But yeah, it's, it's. And then you know, half the time you just uber eats your own thing. Like you may not even eat the food.
- [63:04]
John Middlekauff
Is that per diem?
- [63:05]
Guy Haberman
Yeah, I get 70 bucks so I'm not doing that. So baseball used to get like 110 a day.
- [63:11]
John Middlekauff
What was.
- [63:12]
Guy Haberman
They probably get more than I get.
- [63:27]
John Middlekauff
You know, your boy here in the peak of the the Golden State War. Was Kevin Durant on the team then?
- [63:31]
Guy Haberman
Yeah.
- [63:32]
John Middlekauff
Didn't you do a couple road trips with him?
- [63:33]
Guy Haberman
Sure did. Team meal at no Boo Manhattan.
- [63:37]
John Middlekauff
Yeah. So it's, it's a little different animal with basketball because they eat super late, right? They do that after the games.
- [63:43]
Guy Haberman
No, that wasn't like night before because they had so many off days in basketball.
- [63:47]
John Middlekauff
Yeah, you know that's true.
- [63:48]
Guy Haberman
You get so many off days. I have a question for you, unrelated. If you were, if you were Fernando Mendoza or any other quarterback, would you look at the Raiders differently Because Tom Brady's there. You know, like if Brady's not there, you're like, I don't, I don't know if I want to play for the Raiders. I don't know the coaches unstable, blah, blah blah. But then you get free access to the, one of the, you know, arguably the greatest quarterback of all time.
- [64:11]
John Middlekauff
I think it's gonna be very, I think it's gonna be very telling. I don't know what he did last year. And we'll have to see. I mean they don't even have a coach, right? So who they hire? Who's the. If that guy's an offensive play caller, you know, with Matt Ryan. Like Matt Ryan's gonna be at the combine, I would guess, like, is Tom at the combine for this one? Because to me, he has to be. If you're going to play, you can't. It's a. One thing I respect about Elway is when Elway became the gm, like, Elway quit everything else. It just became the gm. Now, was he working as hard as, like, John Schneider or whatever? I don't know. On a daily basis.
- [64:42]
Guy Haberman
He saw he had to sell his car dealerships too, right? Like, it was his.
- [64:45]
John Middlekauff
He went all in, right? And Matt Ryan. At first it was reported as like, hey, you know, Matt's going to still do cbs. Like, you can't.
- [64:51]
Guy Haberman
That's not going to work.
- [64:52]
John Middlekauff
Matt Ryan, I was watching on cbs. You were probably on the bust of the game. He actually gave a pretty good. Like, they talked about it, and it was just like, Matt Ryan's an impressive guy. And he's like, I'm all in, right? I'm gonna be. Because that's what. How are you gonna beat, like, Lesney, John Schneider, John Lynch, Kyle, like, this guy. These are these guys lives 24 7, 365. So to me, Tom, which I don't blame him, he's playing at these sweet country clubs in Florida. He's living live. He takes the PJ the night before the game. But if you gonna. If you're going to impact this, like, you need to be a little bit more involved. If you're going to come in with opinions, like, you got to hire Chip Kelly. Why? Because Bill told you their buddies? Like, from what I told is Chip was on the phone with his coaching buddies, like, 60% of the day. It's like. But you would never have allowed that to happen, Tom, if you were in the. It wouldn't have been tolerated. You would have snapped as a player, let alone, like, what your role is now. But when you're out of sight, out of mind, like, I just think it's going to be interesting. Does he get more involved? Because the one thing that I've always defended Mark is Mark really wants this to work. He's just trying to get some help. He begged Jon Gruden to do it. Gave him $100 million. He begged Tom Brady. Like, he was the guy that went to Tom. You know, he's trying to do like Mark is act like people crush Mike Brown. Some of these, like, I do they care or not? Like, you know, Mark tries and he goes like, I don't really know what I'm doing. I don't even want to try this. Like, I. I'VE gone after Jon Gruden and Tom Brady and it so far it's all blown up in his face, but it's not from lack of effort. I, I do think that Fernando Mendoza, if Tom goes to the combine and surely he's going to be involved, I would imagine he would fly out for a workout or something to meet him. Like, how do you. It'd be pretty exciting if you were him to do it. I think Tom especially like I like to me, if I was a betting man right now, I could see Robert Sala being the coach there. Well, some type guy they need.
- [66:42]
Guy Haberman
Yesterday I saw somebody say, like, did Tom Brady just see what Robert Sala just did? Not that the Eagles offense is some juggernaut, but like Robert Salah's performance with a bunch of like it was kind of Belichick esque in that, you know, Belichick obviously had good players. You can't not have good players but maximized his talent. Those two talking, I, no, I didn't. Doesn't mean they didn't. But wasn't it after a play, was it after a playoff game that John lynch called? Kyle Shannon was like, hey, I, I could come be your gm. Like, I, I do think there is, there is a pretty significant value. You meet with these people, you study them, you watch them up close. I do think the television thing, you get such access to coaches. Like, I bet people would be surprised how much, you know, you saw the Aikman news. Like some of this stuff has become a little more public.
- [67:32]
John Middlekauff
How many Packer games you think Troy's done the last 20 years?
- [67:34]
Guy Haberman
Yeah, I think people would be surprised to find out, I don't want to say the influence that some of these big time analysts have, but they, they are, they can be kind of unofficial search firm help. You know, when you call a guy. Because who meets with this many coaches other than big time TV analysts. College too, right? Like, let's just say you're hiring a college football coach and you're hiring at Texas. So like you have the pick of the litter. Well, who I want to call, like, well, who meets with the most offensive coordinators and defensive coordinators? I want to call, let me call Joel Klatt. Let me call, you know, like we'll explain that.
- [68:11]
John Middlekauff
If you're doing, if you're doing Indiana, Nebraska and you're meeting with Indiana, how does it work? Who do you talk with and how does it go?
- [68:17]
Guy Haberman
So if we're doing a football game, we on Wednesday, we'll do a zoom with the Visiting team with the head coach for 30 minutes or an hour, you know, 30 minutes to an hour with the head coach. 30 minutes with each. The offensive coordinator, the defensive coordinator. You probably talk to the quarterback for 15 minutes, that sort of thing. And then on Friday, we'll fly in. And then Friday morning we'll go to the team facility and you'll sit down in a meeting room, one on one. So you'll get the coordinator, the coordinator, the head coach, and then some players. And. And we'll also go to practice on Friday. 9.9 times out of 10, you'll go to walk through on Friday. So you'll watch guys, you'll actually watch him practice. Like, you'll watch a coach, you know, like, do stuff.
- [68:56]
John Middlekauff
Would you say the NFL's same?
- [68:59]
Guy Haberman
So I. I think there's a little more, like Saturday. I think there's a little more zoom in the NFL. I'm not positive. I don't know their schedule as well. I do think some guys will go to, you know, practice. I guess you'd go through like, a, what, a Friday walkthrough or you go to a Saturday walk.
- [69:14]
John Middlekauff
I remember seeing guys at the facility if we had a Sunday afternoon big Fox game or the Sunday night game, like, the big boys would be in. In the cafeteria. I felt like on Friday afternoon.
- [69:25]
Guy Haberman
Yeah. Okay, so you will get some of that. Probably not both teams, because Saturdays, a.
- [69:29]
John Middlekauff
Lot of places, a quick walkthrough, guys are at home. Right. Or, you know, they kind of get. It's kind of a day off. They don't want to do anything.
- [69:35]
Guy Haberman
It's just a weird deal to. To be there two extra days. Right. To come in Friday. And then what do you do Saturday if you're, you know, whoever. So I would imagine you get quite a bit, especially a little more. People are making 15 million now. You got a PJ. Like, you're probably not coming in on Friday as much.
- [69:49]
John Middlekauff
Well, how many of these guys are flying commercial airlines anymore? Like, all the big boys calling these games.
- [69:55]
Guy Haberman
Yeah.
- [69:58]
John Middlekauff
Haberman.
- [70:00]
Guy Haberman
But.
- [70:01]
John Middlekauff
So, like, I think Tom Brady matters.
- [70:04]
Guy Haberman
Yeah. I also think at first, the broadcast.
- [70:08]
John Middlekauff
Thing, too, keeps him elevated at a high level. I. And that's. I don't know. He. Obviously they paid him $370 million. But I do think, especially now, I was a hater last year. He's kind of hitting his stride. He's past Romo. I mean, Romeo's going the other way because Tom's a football guy. Likes how easy Tom Brady calls. Do you know what he's Dropping a lot. I thought he got banned. He's like, yeah, talking to Kyle or he's dropping a lot of that, you know, because those guys call him. They want to talk.
- [70:35]
Guy Haberman
An answer is call, you know, but it's one thing. I wonder if it would be different if the Raiders are the AFC west champs, like right now. Like, yeah, Tom, I'll tell you whatever, right?
- [70:44]
John Middlekauff
Well, specifically to me, where it would get weird would be like, the Andy, Sean Payton, Harbaugh crew have to be a little uncom. They're not. They're not talking to Tom a lot. I think very specific to that division, those three guys. But like Kyle or Sean McVeigh, what do they give a Right?
- [71:00]
Guy Haberman
Why would that Kyle's happy or mad to pick up Tom Brady's call. Like, he's got questions for Tom. But I, Yeah, I just. I think it's. I. I think people would be surprised the level of. And again, like, think about who, who would you ask? But the guys that gets to talk to all these, because they, they'll have a list for you. Like, you know, who's impressive this. Because here's the other thing that happens. You go to practice, you're out there, 15 minutes before practice starts. Like, you just. Here comes the running back, the quarterback coach I love talking to. Like, you go on the field before the game, you're just talking to like the assistant QB coach. And guess what? That guy's an OC in five years, right? So, like, that's how I get. I mean, you. You're great at it. Like, I talk to scouts on the field before the game and I'll say, like, hey, what do you think of. What do you think of this guy? I run into all your buddies and I'm like, hey, middle cough.
- [71:46]
John Middlekauff
Like, oh, yeah.
- [71:49]
Guy Haberman
So there's just so much. There's so much information that is just. There is no replacement for human to human contact when it comes to information gathering. And that's what you did. That's why you were driving your Honda Accord throughout the country. Because it's better to meet with somebody face to face. You're going to get so much good intel.
- [72:03]
John Middlekauff
I don't know if he. I mean, you see him at these games. I think he still goes 49 games. But one of the greatest sideline bullshitters and. And networkers I've ever seen is Mike Silver. I mean, his talent.
- [72:13]
Guy Haberman
I see him all the time.
- [72:14]
John Middlekauff
He is. He will know everyone on the sideline getting. He's getting my number when I was a nobody. I mean, he's got the head. This guy can just. I mean, he's. It's a talent. And the better you are at it in those jobs, it gives you much more access. I mean, when I worked for. When I first got hired for the Eagles, you know, this is 2010, so it's not like there weren't cell phones. But how he used to call the office line. You know, that ain't happening anymore. Or not. Excuse me. Adam Scheffer used to call Howie's office line and Katie would be like, Adam's on the phone. Like, that's. You know, but. But back then, you know, you're just working the phone. You know, you don't know people as well, maybe. And at this point in time, the. The network, I feel like in football, probably like in all sports, but specifically the NFL, is like shrunk. I feel it's really closed down right now. It's like the same crew of like three or four guys getting all the jobs. Yeah. And now maybe a change. Like the Ravens used to be a. Right. A springboard for a lot of the league. That. So that. That might change. Same Steelers, probably not as much, but I mean, the Ravens are, you know, Mike McDonald Minter's probably going to be a head coach. All their personnel guys, you know, does that get blown up? But Obviously Kyle and McVeigh have been going pretty strong.
- [73:24]
Guy Haberman
Yeah, they were getting jobs and it didn't really work out for any of them. But if I give one piece of advice to like a 22 year old doing anything, it would be like, ask for the phone. Ask for a phone number. People will, nine times out of 10, give you their phone number. You know, I think I want to figure out, like, just ask that coach first and then like start texting them. It's cool.
- [73:44]
John Middlekauff
I was thinking, you know, like, you grew up, you wanted to like, call games. Right. And that it felt like an unattainable be on TV or call an NFL Major League baseball game. Do you think there are a lot of kids now that want to do that or they're more likely to, like, I want to make content for tick tock and reels.
- [74:01]
Guy Haberman
I mean, sure. But I just think, like, there's.
- [74:06]
John Middlekauff
First of all, my point is there's. There are less. Less depth of talent coming up. That actually makes it easy. One of my brother's best friends. No, I think is a general contractor. He's like, no one wants to do these jobs. I'm getting double the amount of work because my competition is diminishing.
- [74:18]
Guy Haberman
Interesting. I think there's more because, like, I think there's more to do. You can do more. Like, you can. You know, when I started, I was willing to do whatever for free or next to nothing. So I did. But it had to be on a radio station or a local TV station or whatever. You can go do your own thing right now, wherever you want to do it. And I think more people have kind of seen that. And there's. I get a lot of, like, if I go to a college game, I, without fail, at least one or two students comes up to me and ask some advice, which is great. I did the same thing when I was at a game. But yeah, it feels like if I, if you look out right now, there's just like a bunch of guys in their mid to late twenties out of Syracuse just like doing big time stuff. Noah Eagle's killing it. He's excellent. And that's an exception. But there's still, there's a lot of. I.
- [75:14]
John Middlekauff
I do think there's a power because it's never been easier if I was like 20 years old to say, oh, I sent a bunch of emails and I sent a bunch of LinkedIn messages. Like the phone call. And obviously getting in person is way harder. It's easier to justify. Like, I didn't have to do it because I already contacted him. Like, I sent them four dms or I sent them five emails, right. And that's where I wonder the people that are going to separate, because I see it with Maria's in real estate, like younger people that are hustling that their, their physical showing up really separate. Because a lot of people are gonna say, well, I called, you know, I sent five text messages or whatever. It's like, yeah, people just delete that.
- [75:51]
Guy Haberman
I mean, I, you know, you're about to have a baby. I just had a baby.
- [75:54]
John Middlekauff
I was gonna, I was gonna end with some, some parenting advice.
- [75:57]
Guy Haberman
He's. He's two months old. And so, you know, I'm watching a lot of parenting videos and they all say, any parent watching this or listening to this, I mean, you know, there's a million of you, more than a million of you out there. So, like, I'm not breaking any ground here, but they all just say grit, like, I've watched a lot of videos. They're like, don't tell your kid he's smart. Don't be like, oh, you're so smart. Compliment them on. They did this study where they took two groups of kids and they had them take a test and then after the test, they told one half of the kids, good job working through all the problems. And they told the other half of the kids, wow, you're so smart. And then they retested and the test was a little harder. And the kids that they just said, you're so smart to tested worse than the kids that they complimented, like, how hard they worked on it. Right. And that was really interesting. That was really interesting.
- [76:48]
John Middlekauff
Have you already used that to your young son?
- [76:51]
Guy Haberman
Oh, yeah. I'm not telling me smart ever. And based on the genetics.
- [76:58]
John Middlekauff
What, what would you say early was in on this parenting advice? Slash, you know, the, the experience for the two months has been like, oh.
- [77:07]
Guy Haberman
God, that's a great question. I would say it is. It is like you, you hear people say all the time, and it's true. Like, oh, Mom's a superhero. It is so true. And like your only job, not your only job, but the main job, just be like, hey, whatever you're feeling, it is impossible for me to understand what you're feeling. It's impossible when your body is about to physically go through, especially, you know, if it's like a planned surgery. So I would say you just, like, you wake up every day and tell yourself, today I'm going to be the most patient person I can possibly be. And that's the number one thing I need to do today. So, I mean, that's up there. And then, yeah, it's like, I don't even. The lack of sleep is, I think if you're working a 9 to 5, the lack of sleep is probably a factor. If you're a podcaster, like, you'll be.
- [78:06]
John Middlekauff
Called, just call a playoff game. No big deal. You'll. You'll be fine.
- [78:10]
Guy Haberman
You know what I mean? Like, I get, like, that's where I really. I think it's probably when people like, oh, I slept four hours last night. Like, you can get up at 4:30. I've enjoyed that. Get up at 4:30, put the baby down for like three hours. I remember seeing a meme one time, like, I became a dad and I finally understand why. My dad used to sit alone at the Breakfast Nook at 4:30am with this coffee. It's like you do. You get it immediately.
- [78:31]
John Middlekauff
So just your own peace and quiet.
- [78:34]
Guy Haberman
Yeah.
- [78:35]
John Middlekauff
Yeah, it's incredible, man. Yeah, congratulations. And just buckle up. I don't, you know, you just, you start, you start getting close and you start thinking this thing's really about to be here. You know, my life is never going to be the same in a great way, but it's like, whoa, this is. I. I better. You feel a lot of pressure, you know, of just doing it right, being the right type person. Because your, your actions, like you said, not only your words as they get older, but like the way you conduct yourself, the way it's going to be a huge role model. The kid, especially early on in their life, before they're out and about with friends through junior high and high school. But like that, that stretch of in their single digits as they become a human being and walking and talking, they're just looking at you and her. So you better be a freaking good role model. You can't just emotionally snap when the Internet's slow or get pissed off, you know, at just stuff that just doesn't really matter. That's what you kind of think about. You're like, how much stuff in life is kind of trivial and doesn't really matter that much. It's like when you hear older people, you go, you know, I stopped giving a. When I realized none of that actually mattered. I, I think I read something or heard someone say that on average, this person that worked at like a funeral home that said by far less than 10, 10 people cry at a funeral or something. It's like so just. You just start realizing like in your life, it's such a small amount of people that truly care. Like, usually like you're immediate. The point was usually immediate family, like people been in business with and you know, random neighbors and stuff. It's like not saying they don't care, but like emotionally or just a wreck at a funeral. It's a very small percentage even on big funerals. So it's like you realize like how many people. True. And no one's going to be more dependent on you than that little individual. As and as they get bigger, hell, they ideally, you know, grow up and healthy and happiness and know just kind of can live a successful life and whatever they want to do. But you are a big conduit of leading them somewhat in the direction. That's what's crazy.
- [80:27]
Guy Haberman
I think there's a lot of things you worry about right away that like, are not like, can I change it?
- [80:32]
John Middlekauff
This is the dad Diaries. I added something to the podcast every Tuesday I did the dad Diaries. And last week it was like all the scams of, of different things you buy. And you looking back, like, you and I have talked about it, like, I feel like I just had a crib and like a blanket as a kid. And I get it, times have changed. But, you know, and that stuff you look back and kind of laugh at.
- [80:50]
Guy Haberman
Best thing we got is the pacifier. Someone's like, what's the best thing you got? I'm like, the pacifier. Like, it's. That's the only thing I need, is.
- [80:55]
John Middlekauff
The best pacifier bottles, right? Even the bottle cleaner. This thing we got is insane. It's. It was super hot. You're doing all these different contraption. Like, this is crazy. My mom. No way. She had this. We did not. One. It didn't exist. But I. Again, I. I look back, and there's nothing wrong with it. It was like. I feel like I just had a crib in my room. And then even when I became like, an, like, 10, I feel like I just had a bed and a couple pieces of clothes. I don't know.
- [81:18]
Guy Haberman
The craziest thing we got this kid is a cell phone. Like, you know, but we got him a cell phone all the time. I think you guys got us the little mat with, like, the little things hanging. Like, he likes that. That's. That's a good one. But there's just stuff that, like, you think, can I change a diaper? And then it's just. I was terrified of it. I was like, God, I don't know. This is kind of smelly. And then it's fine. But I'm also aware it's been eight weeks. Like, right now it's just manual labor. I haven't had to make any hard decisions about how do I lead this child yet. You know what I mean? Like, that, to me, seems to be the part.
- [81:52]
John Middlekauff
What do I give the emotional best lesson as he goes off to junior high? Yeah.
- [81:57]
Guy Haberman
Like, that's the part that right now I'm just like. It's just willpower. Can I get up? Well, I have to. I got shoved in bed the other night for snoring. And it wasn't me.
- [82:07]
John Middlekauff
It was the baby.
- [82:09]
Guy Haberman
And I got. I got punched in the arm.
- [82:11]
John Middlekauff
Good snore. Like, good loud snore.
- [82:14]
Guy Haberman
It's gonna freak you out, these babies sleeping. The noise that you're like, is he okay? Like, I think he's choking right now. Like, no, that's just. That's how babies.
- [82:22]
John Middlekauff
I do think it's crazy. I mean, she's. She's literally about to pop. How they can just live in that thing for that long, how they survive. That's. That's what's.
- [82:30]
Guy Haberman
I'll finish with this, John. I. And this is something. Hopefully people watching this will have some. I keep asking people who are been Parents for a long time. Like, does this feeling when you look at them of total disbelief, does that go away or are you just always. Because right now I am every just in total disbelief. Like, where did you come from? Where did you come from?
- [82:53]
John Middlekauff
My dad would say, like, well, yeah, when he rear ends a car and drives home and says, dad, we got a problem. And like, that starts happening. Yes. The disbelief turns into swear words, screams and things being thrown at you. But right now, when they're young, I think it rests.
- [83:07]
Guy Haberman
Or you were like a block from home.
- [83:09]
John Middlekauff
Yeah. You know, it's like you get caught with, you know, your buddy's bag of weed under your bed. You're like, there is no disbelief there. It's just eyes of like, are they gonna kill me right now? So, yeah, I'd say yeah. And I think. I think it definitely fades if there's a problem. Police.
- [83:27]
Guy Haberman
Lights out the window. It's John.
- [83:30]
John Middlekauff
What time does the. The bird take off from Santa Clara or sfo?
- [83:35]
Guy Haberman
Santa Clara, sfo. San Francisco. Back. One o'. Clock. One o' clock bus on Friday. So I get first bus. So I get to the Chick Fil A first, which I skip. Self control.
- [83:47]
John Middlekauff
What will you do? You do anything Friday night or. Just gonna lock in.
- [83:52]
Guy Haberman
Lock in, yeah.
- [83:53]
John Middlekauff
It's a big one. You can just get, I don't know. Another legendary car call in the history of a franchise.
- [83:59]
Guy Haberman
You don't think they're gonna win, do you?
- [84:00]
John Middlekauff
I mean, I didn't think they were gonna win last week. It's weird. Like, I say the same thing about the Bears. Like, I'm not betting against them. I think I saw seven and a half points. Feels a little strong. But the George Kittle thing, it's one thing in the moment, like, that's pretty devastating. You know, just. It's kind of important. Just makes a plays. I don't. I mean, Trent Williams walk today. That's.
- [84:19]
Guy Haberman
Yeah. They played six games without Joe. They beat him without. I mean, George got hurt in the first game.
- [84:23]
John Middlekauff
Yeah.
- [84:23]
Guy Haberman
So who are you picking to win the Super Bowl?
- [84:27]
John Middlekauff
I think if the Bills win this week, watch out. Like, it might just be he. He was a man amongst boys in that game. Now their team's not as good, but I'm not betting on Bo Nicks. The Rams look way off. Who knows, Maybe Seattle. If. If Sam Darnold's on, they're going to be really good. The Patriots. I don't know. I think it's wide open. If the Niners had a couple more bodies, like they could win it just hard. Can they win four games with the crew they're rolling out? It'd be the greatest accomplishment anyone has ever seen. It would be okay. Adios, haberman.
- [84:57]
Guy Haberman
Later. The volume. This is an iHeart podcast. Guaranteed Human.