Best of The Herd

Summary

Podcast Title: The Herd with Colin Cowherd
Host/Author: iHeartPodcasts and The Volume
Episode: Best of The Herd
Release Date: June 17, 2025

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Introduction

In the “Best of The Herd” episode released on June 17, 2025, Colin Cowherd, alongside co-hosts J. Mac and Nick Wright, delivers an engaging deep dive into the current landscape of major sports, with a particular focus on the NBA draft, the importance of defense in sports, and an exclusive interview with Jim Harbaugh, the head coach of the LA Chargers. The episode seamlessly blends expert analysis with insightful discussions, providing listeners with a comprehensive understanding of the topics at hand.

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1. NBA Draft Analysis and Oklahoma City’s Defensive Prowess

Timestamp: [03:10] – [12:12]

The episode kicks off with J. Mac and Nick Wright discussing the recent NBA draft, highlighting the Oklahoma City (OKC) Thunder's strategic positioning. They emphasize OKC's focus on defense, boasting two first-round picks and potentially five of the top 30 defenders in the league.

Key Points:

• Quality of the Draft: Considered one of the better drafts in recent years, with speculation that 12 to 14 players could become all-stars.
• OKC’s Defensive Strength: The Thunder may possess five of the top 30 defenders, including two players who have made the All-Defensive Team.
• Jalen Williams’ Impact: Highlighted as a college grinder whose gradual improvement has made him a significant asset for OKC.

Notable Quotes:

• J. Mac: “When a historically great defense meets a fast-paced or dynamic offense, the defense usually prevails.” ([04:17])
• Nick Wright: “There’s a reason I’ve got a different facial hair look this morning, Colin. That’s because I’ve been going into witness protection because I’ve been bashing these guys all season and now they’re going to be the champs.” ([04:06])

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2. The Underrated Value of College Basketball and Jalen Williams’ Journey

Timestamp: [12:12] – [16:19]

J. Mac passionately advocates for the recognition of college basketball players, arguing that the NBA has marginalized college talent in favor of the G League. He spotlights Jalen Williams, detailing his steady progression from Santa Clara to the NBA, emphasizing his work ethic and shooting efficiency.

Key Points:

• College vs. G League: College basketball offers better coaching and high-pressure environments compared to the G League.
• Jalen Williams: Praised for his consistent improvement, scoring efficiency, and versatility on the court.
• Defense as a Foundation: Emphasizes that great defense requires teamwork, chemistry, and relentless effort, drawing parallels to historical NBA defenses like Jordan’s Bulls.

Notable Quotes:

• J. Mac: “In college basketball’s got better coaching. Major March Madness environments, packed houses, TV pressure.” ([14:11])
• Nick Wright: “He's guarding guys seven inches taller. That is effort. And Jalen Williams on both ends.” ([13:28])

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3. Defense vs. Offense: Historical Perspectives and Current Implications

Timestamp: [08:32] – [14:12]

The discussion shifts to the broader theme of defense versus offense in sports. The hosts draw comparisons with legendary teams and coaches, illustrating how strong defensive strategies often triumph over dynamic offensive plays. They reference the “Bad Boy Pistons,” Belichick’s New England defense, and historical NFL defenses to underscore their points.

Key Points:

• Historical Examples:
  • Bad Boy Pistons vs. Michael Jordan’s Bulls
  • Belichick’s Patriots vs. the Greatest Offenses
  • Saban’s Dominant Teams
• Current NBA Playoffs: The Indiana Pacers’ strong defensive showings are highlighted as a potential game-changer in the absence of key players like Tyrese Halliburton.
• Defense as Effort and Strategy: Emphasizes that great defense is about constant pressure, teamwork, and making the offense uncomfortable.

Notable Quotes:

• J. Mac: “No, those teams had the best defense in the league. Michael Jordan's Bulls, M.J. Rodman and Pippen.” ([08:32])
• J. Mac: “Defense is all about effort and work. Nobody's born a great defensive player.” ([13:28])

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4. Exclusive Interview with Jim Harbaugh: Building a Champion LA Chargers Team

Timestamp: [29:25] – [46:58]

Jim Harbaugh joins the podcast to discuss his role as the head coach of the LA Chargers. The conversation delves into his strategies for cultivating leadership, the importance of recruiting the right players, and the challenges of competing in a highly competitive division.

Key Points:

• Team Development: Harbaugh emphasizes the significance of recruiting leaders and fostering a strong team culture.
• Leadership and Effort: Highlights how players like Justin Herbert and Derwin James embody the team’s values through their dedication and work ethic.
• Competitive Division: Discusses the challenges of coaching in a division with top-tier coaches like Andy Reid and Sean Payton, emphasizing the need for continuous preparation and adaptation.
• Player Highlights: Najee Harris is praised for his consistent performance and leadership qualities, showcasing the impact of effective recruiting.

Notable Quotes:

• Jim Harbaugh: “What you say. I can’t even hear what you say because what you do speaks so loudly that I can’t even hear what you’re saying.” ([32:21])
• Jim Harbaugh: “Don't change the thing. Do not change a thing about Justin Herbert.” ([35:32])
• J. Mac: “You recruit leaders. You draft leaders.” ([32:21])

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5. Shohei Ohtani’s Outstanding Performance and Its Implications

Timestamp: [42:29] – [45:52]

The hosts shift focus to baseball, highlighting Shohei Ohtani’s exceptional performance in a recent game against the Padres. They discuss his dual role as a pitcher and hitter, emphasizing his remarkable versatility and impact on the game.

Key Points:

• Ohtani’s Versatility: Praised for his ability to excel both as a pitcher and a hitter, making him a unique asset in baseball.
• Performance Highlights: Notable for pitching without warm-ups and maintaining high velocity, Ohtani’s consistency and rhythm are underscored as key factors in his success.
• Impact on the Game: His performance is lauded as a blend of athleticism and strategic play, setting a new standard for players in specialized roles.

Notable Quotes:

• Jim Harbaugh: “Everything he does is to create the rhythm. He does it the same way every time.” ([43:01])
• Jim Harbaugh: “You gotta be able to get the rhythm. You get out of rhythm, you start trying to make adjustments and then you’re out there floundering.” ([43:31])

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Conclusion

The “Best of The Herd” episode offers a comprehensive analysis of current sports dynamics, emphasizing the critical role of defense in team success and the importance of cultivating leadership within teams. Through expert discussions and an insightful interview with Jim Harbaugh, listeners gain a deeper understanding of the strategies that drive championship-winning teams. Additionally, the spotlight on Shohei Ohtani underscores the evolving nature of player roles in modern sports.

This episode serves as a valuable resource for sports enthusiasts seeking in-depth analysis and expert opinions on the latest developments in the sporting world.

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Notable Quotes Summary

• J. Mac: “When a historically great defense meets a fast-paced or dynamic offense, the defense usually prevails.” ([04:17])
• Nick Wright: “There’s a reason I’ve got a different facial hair look this morning, Colin. That’s because I’ve been going into witness protection because I’ve been bashing these guys all season and now they’re going to be the champs.” ([04:06])
• J. Mac: “In college basketball’s got better coaching. Major March Madness environments, packed houses, TV pressure.” ([14:11])
• Jim Harbaugh: “What you say. I can’t even hear what you say because what you do speaks so loudly that I can’t even hear what you’re saying.” ([32:21])
• Jim Harbaugh: “Don't change the thing. Do not change a thing about Justin Herbert.” ([35:32])
• Jim Harbaugh: “Everything he does is to create the rhythm. He does it the same way every time.” ([43:01])

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Key Takeaways

• Defense is Paramount: Whether in basketball or football, a strong defensive strategy can often be the deciding factor in high-stakes games.
• Leadership and Culture: Building a team with strong leaders and a cohesive culture is crucial for sustained success.
• Player Development: Emphasizing gradual improvement and work ethic, as seen with Jalen Williams, can yield significant long-term benefits.
• Versatility in Sports: Players like Shohei Ohtani demonstrate the evolving demands of modern sports, where versatility can set players apart.
• Recruiting Excellence: Effective recruiting, focusing on leadership and commitment, is essential for building a competitive team, as exemplified by Jim Harbaugh’s approach with the LA Chargers.

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This comprehensive summary encapsulates the essence of the “Best of The Herd” episode, providing listeners and non-listeners alike with valuable insights and key discussions from the podcast.

Transcript

[Colin Cowherd]

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[Colin Cowherd]

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[Colin Cowherd]

To the Best of the Herd podcast. Be sure to catch us live every.

[J. Mac]

Weekday on Fox Sports Radio and noon.

[Colin Cowherd]

To 3 Eastern, 9am to noon Pacific. Find your local station for the [e-mail] or stream us live every day on.

[J. Mac]

The iHeartRadio app by searching Fox Sports Radio or FSR.

[Colin Cowherd]

This is the Best of the Herd with Colin Cowher on Fox Sports Radio.

[J. Mac]

Here we go. It is a Tuesday. This is gonna be a good one. Jim Harbaugh, Nick Wright stopped by J. Mac and I joining you. You know J. Mac, sometimes as a young broadcaster you don pay the respect that certain teams and players so richly deserve. And I'm watching OKC last night and this is a very good you follow the NBA draft? It's a very domestic draft. It is a very good draft. People are speculating there is 12 to 14 players in this draft that could be at some point in an all star like it's a. It's one of our better drafts in a while. And OKC has the first pick out of the lottery. They got two picks in this first round and they may have five of the top 30 defenders in the NBA right now. Two guys who made the all defensive team. But you got to be honest, J. Mac, I know they're not aesthetically pleasing, but they're an all time defense.

[Nick Wright]

Yeah, well there's a reason I've got a different facial hair look this morning, Colin. That's because I've been going into witness protection because I've been bashing these guys all season and now they're going to be the champs. That's what I have to do.

[J. Mac]

Well, let's do. I think the series is over okay going back to Indy, but I think it's over with Halliburton's injury. But once again, when a historically great defense meets a fast paced or dynamic offense, the defense usually prevails. Times a flat circle. History repeats itself. It could be the Bad Boy Pistons. Yep, they kept beating mj. It could be Belichick's defense in New England beating the greatest show on turf. It could be a Saban's dynasty time after time dominating a great offense. The truth is the Pacers have the lead leading pace and they look at times completely out of sorts, overwhelmed by this relentless defense which again may have five of the top 30 defenders in the league. It's got a Seattle Seahawks Legion of Boone feel where it's like fast and relentless and well coached and twitchy and aggressive. Go ask Peyton and Manning about it. Even when Brady beat him in the super bowl, it was a defensive interception. The Patriots game plan was catch it and go forward. Do not run side to side or they'll strip you of the ball or tackle you for a loss. That's how much the Seahawks defense was in Brady and Peyton Manning's head in Halliburton's injury. That's like the one way to beat him. Halliburton's pace, his quirky, herky jerky style, it can be hard to defend. He moves the ball so well. He's hurt now, so. We spend so much time in basketball discussing offense, KD and the Splash brothers. No, those teams had the best defense in the league. Michael Jordan's Bulls, M.J. rodman and Pippen. First team all NBA defense multiple times. The Kansas City Chiefs wide receiving core has been a mess the last two years. The run game sometimes disappears. Last time they won a Super Bowl. Yeah, Spags defense was number two in the NFL and that's why the Lions died, not Jared Goff. They couldn't stop anybody. They were all beat up. Yeah, I know SGA doesn't dunk a lot and you don't know much about Jalen Williams, but there's a reason James Harden, Dominique Wilkins, Mellow and Allen Iverson have no titles. You gotta make stops too. Yeah. Yeah. Iverson stole a lot of balls. Yeah, he cheated on passing lanes, but in the end he didn't guard anybody. Oklahoma's City's offense, especially on the road, can disappear at times. It can be a little hit and miss. It's very young. Young players don't play as well on the road. If SGA is not getting to the free throw line, then a lot of time that Thunder offense on the road, it can have bad quarters. But here's what travels well. Defense. And The Indiana Pacers are.07 in the playoffs when they score under 110 points. Yep, that's the series. And without Halliburton. Good luck. So defense is not just about steals. It's not just about blocks. It's like defense. Great defense is like two factor authentication. It's just tedious and aggravating and it makes you work a little harder and it really is annoying. And that's really the defense for Oklahoma City. The ball pressure on the perimeter. Meaning if you do get past him, you're off balance, there's always a body on you. And then Holmgren is a great rim protector. So like he didn't have a great offensive series, but he can defend you on the wing. At 7:2 or he can defend you at the basket. Even when you try to get put backs off block shots. Those can get blocked. Last night I think okay, he had 14 blocks. But it's not just about blocks and steals. It is the constant pressure. The minute you take it over half court they make it constantly uncomfortable and in the end it's switchable, it's twitchy. Guys can guard you outside all the way down the floor, they can block a shot at the rim and sga, their best offensive player notices.

[Jim Harbaugh]

We were very disruptive defensively.

[Colin Cowherd]

Kind of had them on their heels.

[Jim Harbaugh]

Was pressuring and we because of that had like felt three or four steals in a row. Then we were able to get, run, get, get out and run, get easy baskets. But yeah, it always starts defensively for us.

[J. Mac]

Yes, defense first. When historically great defenses meet fast paced or dynamic offenses, often the result is this. And even when you do have all time great offenses, the Randy Moss Patriots, they didn't win a Super Bowl. They did that. The defense wasn't as good as the Katy Warriors. They were great defensively. Iggy at one point got an MVP of a Finals. I want to talk about Jalen Williams. So I have been on this kick for multiple years about Jalen Williams, not Jalen Williams, but on this kick is that the NBA has tried to marginalize college basketball for years and I think it's a huge mistake. Where are all the G league stars in this final? Where's Scoot Henderson? Anybody seen Jonathan Kaminga? Jalen Williams, small college, military parents, three years grinding his butt off. Not seeking a shorter route or a quick buck. College basketball's got better coaching. Major March madness environments, packed houses, TV pressure. I'm going to show our TV audience this. Look at the last six years of Jalen Williams basketball journey. Look at these numbers. Santa Clara 7, then 11 points, then 18, then to the NBA 14, 19, 21. No shortcuts. Gradual improvement. He's got the touch that tells you he has spent so long in the gym. He can score in transition, he can hit a three. He's got mid range but it's that beautiful touch around the basket with his enormous length. That's time in the gym. And there'll be a point at some point and I think Adam Silver is now realizing it, that the NBA will treat college basketball like the NFL's always treated college football as an adversary, as an ally. The coaching's intense, the environments are intense. You come into the NFL, you've played in Blacksburg or Tuscaloosa, you've played in Austin or Norman, Oklahoma or Madison, Wisconsin or Athens, Georgia. You played in front of 100,000 people to Saturday night. It's been intimidating. Ain't getting that in the G League. You're not getting big time coaching in the G League. Look at this finals. Look at Jalen Williams is just what this finals is all about. Jalen Williams, Tyrese Halliburton, Nem Hart, Alex Caruso, TJ McConnell, Pascal Siakam, Niece Smith, Obi Toppin. Lot of guys who spent multiple years in college grinding. Oh yeah, there's a one and done guy here, there. Not a lot of G leaguers. Not a lot of G leaguers. When I watched Jalen Williams last night, dude, that dude has grinded his way to being an offensive machine. He didn't just get 40, 56% from the floor. Only had one turnover. Super efficient. I mean that, that is what it takes to be great. Halliburton was overlooked. Jalen Williams goes to Santa Clara. I'm not saying SGA shouldn't be a one and done or a Miles Turner. Some of these guys, you know, they're just, they're just like prodigies. But Oklahoma City may not be a riveting team, but I respect the hell out of them. The culture, the coaching, the grind. You listen, offense is fun, defense is work. Oklahoma City plays defense like a hard coached college team. And here's Jalen Williams, a 40 spot last night.

[Jalen Williams]

Every time you play in the finals, it's the biggest game of your life. You know what I mean? So I think that's given me a little more comfort and just like playing hard and playing aggressive, I think I just understand the opportunity that we have and I just try and play as hard as I can and then whatever happens after that is is where the chips fall. But I'd be lying if I said I couldn't imagine doing what I did tonight, but I definitely could have seen myself here a long time ago. I just didn't think it would happen this past and I didn't think it would be with a group of guys that, you know, I truly am like.

[J. Mac]

Grateful to be around to play this level of defense. The Seahawks may have fallen apart later and pointed fingers. The Seahawks culture maybe didn't last forever, but generally to be a great defensive team, it's teamwork, it's chemistry, it's coaching. You've got to all be tied together by a string. You have to believe in the same thing. That's why I criticize guys like Luka. I'm like, dude, it can't just be about getting buckets. You got to defend on the other end or else it, it tears at the fabric. Because defense is all about effort and work. Nobody's born a great defensive player. There are people that are born long and good genetics. They're long and they can be athletic and they've got like, you know, the right hips to be a corner, you know. But defense, nobody comes out of the womb. All NBA first team defense, that is effort. There have been great big sewer defenders, small players who are great defenders. I mean, Alex Caruso, that is effortless to be a defender like Alex Crusoe. He's guarding guys seven inches taller. That is effort. And Jalen Williams on both end. I watch Oklahoma City, man. I respect that culture. Those are workers. Even SGA's game, he's not jumping over you. He's not dunking over you. That's just years in the gym. J Mac, it is time you paid a little respect.

[Colin Cowherd]

Wow.

[J. Mac]

To the Thunder.

[Colin Cowherd]

Wow.

[Nick Wright]

Colin, I gotta say, bravo. That is a great take on Jalen Williams. I'm not gonna lie. The audience couldn't see it. But when you said, I want to talk about Jalen Williams, I honestly rolled my eyes like, oh, what, what is he the best number two in the league? Colin, that's a great take because you're spot on. This guy, when he came out of college, I remember he was drafted 12th overall and there was a guy sitting there who just won MVP of the final four from Kansas. And I'm like, why are they taking this guy over Agbaji, who. Who just won the MVP of the final four and Oklahoma City saw something in him and you're right, he stuck around in college. Slow growth. Colin, that's a great take. I, I totally agree with you. And I wonder if you look at this draft coming up, are we going to see more guys instead of, hey, let's just grab a freshman. Is there a junior or senior who can help us win in the next like two years?

[J. Mac]

Well, I think what you're seeing, between Halliburton and Siakam and Jalen Williams and sga, you know what I'm seeing?

[Colin Cowherd]

Maturity.

[J. Mac]

I'm see these are really focused, mature teams and it's impressive. I'm like, I don't care what the TV ratings are like. All I know is when I watch this final, I see committed athletes that are coachable, that work their butt off. I don't want to talk about Scott Foster. I want to talk about the defense and the pacing and the maturity and the effort. There are a lot of good basketball players. When I watch, when I watch sga, when I watch Jalen Williams, I. You can see the time in the gym to have Jalen Williams touch. Yeah, he can shoot at three, he's got a mid range game. He's still, he's got handles. He's got beautiful touch. Dude, you don't that again, that's in the gym.

[Nick Wright]

And it's funny, that is work because remember the one and done guys. Ben Matherin had one good showing. Otherwise he's been kind of all over the place. And I'm not bashing Chet Holmgren. He was terrible last night. I think like 4 for 15 shooting another one and done guy. And I'm, I'm not blasting them, but they don't have the maturity to consistently show up the way some of these other veterans have. That's a, that's. Listen, that's one of your better takes this summer, Colin.

[Colin Cowherd]

Well done.

[J. Mac]

Well, I really appreciate. I didn't know we had a leaderboard on that, but I do appreciate it. Nick Wright and Jim Harbaugh today.

[Colin Cowherd]

Be sure to catch live editions of the Herd, weekdays at noon Eastern, 9am Pacific on Fox Sports Radio. FS1 and the iHeartRadio app.

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[Colin Cowherd]

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[J. Mac]

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[Colin Cowherd]

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[J. Mac]

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[J. Mac]

Thing we talked about yesterday? We said if, if I said to you, you're not going to believe what Blank did in sports, the two people I would put in there are Caitlyn Clark and S.H. otani. Caitlyn Clark had 38 seconds this weekend in the WNBA. It was the greatest, most exhilarating 38 seconds in WNBA history. She was shooting 33 footers. Bang, bang, bang, demanding the ball. It was it. It didn't look real. Okay, so Ohtani pitched last night against the Padres. By the way, he is now pitching and hitting. The Padres sent out their ace because he's pitching. He came up to face the race. No practice swings. He threw over 100 miles an hour. And Dave Roberts is to a point now where he is the Dodgers manager. But he acknowledges it's hard not to just be a fan of Shohei Ohtani.

[Dave Roberts]

I thought the stuff was really good. Much better as far as the fastball velocity than I think anyone anticipated. Hit 100. You know, I was thinking 95 to 97. But I think that just a competitor adrenaline came out in him to see him come into the dugout from the pen. All that stuff I was kind of fanboying for like a half an inning.

[J. Mac]

So even in high school baseball, kids become what they call POS pitchers only like, like we know in baseball that how, how taxing just pitching is. I mean you'll often hear this in the postseason. I don't know if we can throw Verlander on short rest. You know what rest. Ohtani gets four and a half minutes in the dugout until he's hitting. I mean it's insane that he is an ace in 2025 with how specialized pitching is. This is Derrick Henry of the Ravens being the leading tackler for Baltimore at linebacker. Or Patrick Mahomes being the top edge rusher in the conference. I mean, just insane. He is the best player in bait the gap between Ohtani and the second best baseball player. And that second best player, maybe Mookie Betts. And he even. He gets engulfed by the gravitas and the talent of Ohtani. And you know, a lot of times you hear about the Mount Rushmore. I would. There are a handful of athletes, I would call them. They make the. The mount just more. They're just more than even the second best person in their sport. Michael Phelps would be on my mount just more. 10 more Olympic medals than anybody else. 14 more gold medals than anybody else. When I was a kid growing up, it was like Mark Spitz. I mean, it's an afterthought. And by the way, if you're saying, well, how come there are so many faces? That's why it's called Mount Just More. We even have just more faces. Number two would be Usain Bolt. Three straight Olympics, 100 and 200 meter champion, three consecutive Olympics. As an old man, he was the world's fastest guy in two events. I would say Wayne Gretzky at 1.8 straight MVPs. Wayne Gretzky would be on the mount just more. That's like when he's 23 years old. Also, he still holds 55 NHL records. Now think about how fast hockey is, how international it is, and how good the athletes are. He still shares or holds 55 career NHL records. Serena Williams in the open era, 23 more major women single title than anybody else. And by the way, a dominant doubles player, singles doubles, dominant. Tiger woods, highest career earnings, lowest career average, and literally change courses. I think it's fair to say he like changed equipment and changed courses. And I think then you have to go on my mount just more. It's got to be Ohtani in a specialized world of sports where in high school, if a guy is a great pitcher, that's just what he's going to do. First player in Bell, by the way, he's not only a great hitter, he's not only an ace. He'll steal you 54 bases. I mean, it's just insane what Ohtani does last night. He's pitching, goes to the dugout, comes out Padres throwing their ace. He doesn't even warm up. He just goes pitching. Boom. Gloves off. I'm gonna go hit. There's just nothing like it. I mean, even, even Dave Roberts, I'm gonna fanboy a little bit.

[Colin Cowherd]

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[Colin Cowherd]

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[J. Mac]

Let's bring him on. Been talking about this all day. Jim Harbaugh, coach of the LA Chargers, is joining us live. And often, as you see, Jimmy's got a smile on his face. I know why he's got a smile, because Joe Alt's in year two. Hampton Najee, Mike William, Trey Harris. I was saying this earlier, Jim. I followed your career. I always feel Jim Harbaugh teams in year one, you change the culture. But it's not until year two, when you have a second recruiting class or a second draft that I feel like it's a Jim Harbaugh team. I look at this team and I think, oh, that's a Jim Harbaugh team. Two tackles, two stud running backs. I felt last year, I'm like, it's not Jim's team quite. But the culture is good. Did you feel, do you feel like this is more complete this year?

[Jim Harbaugh]

I loved our team last year and as you know, I wanted, I wanted to get everybody back, run it back. Version 2.0. That wasn't the case. We couldn't do that this, this era of free agency and, and everything else, et cetera. But we made some great additions. Joe Ortiz, our personnel staff has done an incredible job. I mean, going out and finding some of the guys that that they brought in, plus what we did with the draft. That. Yeah, I do. I feel like we're. I know we're in a better place, you know, June 17th, than we were last year at June 17th. Yeah. Part of that is probably you're doing everything for a second time. Everything you've done before, you're. You're doing again. But, you know, the entire mentality of the. Of the team, and it's. It's from the leaders like, Like Justin and Derwin and K. Mac and Dan Henley, all the. All the guys. I mean, they. They. They train and prepare like they've accomplished nothing, so that when the season comes, they can. They can be that guy. So I am. I am taking that same lead. And we just don't talk about it really, you know, unless. Unless we're on an interview and somebody, you know, puts a microphone in your face, you know, then you really. You have to talk about it. But, you know, the guys are. The guys are doing and prefer to do. You know, they're talking in the training environment and on the practice field, and I am. I am drinking the Kool Aid, buying completely into that, and that's the way we've been rolling.

[J. Mac]

You know, if I think of Jim Harbaugh teams, your teams always have leaders. And I think to myself, do you recruit leaders? Can you tell when you're recruiting a kid if he's a leader? In high school, do you draft leaders? I mean, Joe Alt goes to Notre Dame. He's a smart, tough kid. Your teams, when I think of Harbaugh, I think tough and good leaders. How do you end up with it? Do you create them or do you draft or recruit them? Why do your teams end up with those?

[Jim Harbaugh]

The. Yeah, you recruit them. You draft them. You can tell. You can tell the minute they walk onto the field. You know, the minute Derwin James walked out of the field our first off season, ota, when I walked over to shake Justin Herbert's hand, it's, you know, right away, you know, there's a presence. There's. Same with Khalil Mack. There's the presence. When he talks, everybody's. Everybody's listening. When he's playing, everybody is watching. And it's never what somebody says. It's never what they say. It's what they do. And that gets reinforced with how they train, how they go about their business, how they play the game of football. We like. We have a saying that we really love, which is what you say. I can't even hear what you say because what you do speaks so loudly that I can't even hear what you're saying.

[J. Mac]

You know, it's obviously. And I said this when you went college to pro, I said, man, Harbaugh is going to be a great drafter for the first two to three years because he's recruited half these guys. Did you find in this draft, for instance, had you recruited any of your draft picks or at least seen their tape in high school? Did the Michigan stuff help you a little bit in the first two drafts, like Joe Alt you probably recruited at Michigan has. Have you found that it's helped you a little bit in the draft process?

[Jim Harbaugh]

It really helped a lot, Colin, and not just for. It was my knowledge of guys. It was Mike Elston's knowledge of Joe Alt, who told all the stories of the, you know, when he came in as a freshman, how athletic he was, you know, that Jesse mentor, you know, I could. Steve Clinkscale, who I believe is one of the best, if not the best secondary coaches in all of football. The guys they recruited, the guys they coach, the guys that, you know, they watched weekly because they were preparing for him in an upcoming game. So it was, it's not just me. It was, it was that cumulative effect of all of us who just really been in that environment. You know, just a couple months earlier.

[J. Mac]

I remember years ago talking to a guy named Bill Poley and the legendary hall of Fame front office guy, and he said when he drafted Peyton Manning, he said Peyton cared so much, he called him a teeth clencher. He said, sometimes we have to say, hey, Peyton, it's ice cream after practice. Lighten up, it's okay. And when I watch Justin Herbert, he cares so deeply that there are times I think he gets so frustrated with himself, he's too hard on himself. That's my view of it. Am I right? And if I am, how do you make sure Justin still. You got to have fun, Jim. You got to have fun when you coach. You have to have fun when you play. Do you ever worry that Justin is too hard on Justin? No.

[Jim Harbaugh]

Don't change the thing. Do not change a thing about Justin Herbert. Yeah, he, he, he does everything. Everything great. How much he cares. Yeah, he, he cares. He cares deeply how much he trains. He trains the, the perfect amount. You know, everything that he does is, is. Don't change the thing. Our challenge is the rest of us, you know, especially the ones on the offensive side of the ball that Justin's counting on, you know, the playmakers, the offensive line, the backs, the tight ends, the coaches, you know, it is our challenge to get to his level because, you know, the only, in my opinion, you know, his biggest weaknesses is us. You know, we've got to, we have to be the ones that rise up to his level.

[J. Mac]

So you're in a division now with Pete and Chip, with Sean Payton's a pretty good coach. Andy Reid and Spags. It's the best coach division in football. You get no breathers. Every week is like a coaching challenge. You're, you are feisty and you're tough and you love challenges. It is a, you don't have a lot of breathers on that schedule, but would you rather face that schedule and those staffs and say, you know, the roadblock. You'd rather have a, the book on Pete, although you have a pretty good book there. Is there an advantage to being in a division that is the best coach division in football?

[Jim Harbaugh]

Well, first of all, I mean, there's, I've never seen the coaching, you know, at a level that it is across the entire National Football League. I mean, it's, it's great coach after great coach because the way they prepare their teams, everybody is great. Yeah, we're going to, we're going to play games. No matter who we're playing, it's going to get decided in, in the last two minutes of the game. They're going to come down to one score games. This is the National Football League. Everybody's really well coached, everybody's really well trained. Everybody has, has great players. You know, it's at an unprecedented level where the league is right now. I mean, everybody's good. Yeah, it's competitive, dog eat dog for sure. You know, tremendous in the AFC west, tremendous in every single division as you look across pro football. So it is, it is something you got to get prepared for. I mean, we know it. We're going to play the Kansas City Chiefs game one in Sao Paulo. Let's make sure we get ready for it.

[J. Mac]

I've said for years, I always like Najee Harris. He played in front of offensive lines that were kind of couldn't quite get it right. And I think you do occasionally find these players in the NFL that maybe the fit's not perfect and then they go to a second place and you're like, oh, he's better than I thought. I think Najee Harris is one of those guys. What did you see about him when you looked on film in Pittsburgh? What did you say? Okay, that, that's going to work here with the Chargers.

[Jim Harbaugh]

Everything that he does is, is at a high Level and great. And he's. He's there every week. He's there every game. And it's so cool. I mean, you mentioned a little bit about being in college before now and guys you recruited and guys that, That I coached. I mean, nobody recruited harder than Najee Harris, you know, up in Antioch, California. You know, as many trips as I could make, I made there. Yeah. And Makai back then, I mean, I'm just. I'm reminiscing, going back to watching Makai play basketball and in high school and being at a game where I see him. See him slam dunk a basketball and then. Then he gets. Then he got elbowed. He got elbow that. He might have broken his nose. And he went over the towel. There's blood coming out. He throw him a towel from the bench and, you know, he wipes it off. I think he was out for like, you know, like a whistle or two and then right back in the game and I'm like, yeah, yeah, that's. That's my kind of guy right there. He didn't end up coming to Michigan. He went to. Went to Louisville and had a tremendous career. But just so many, so many great guys, so many great, great stories that way. And I get, you know, you get a chance to be a part of it and coach these guys. I mean, you can imagine the excitement, you know, and still. Still kind of pull it down that we have Justin Herbert and Derwin James. I mean, I just. I just loved him, watching him play football, you know, just an appreciation for how he played the game. And now to be able to get to coach him. I mean, Derwin James, he likes people that like football. And if you like football, you're gonna like Derwin James and he's gonna. He's gonna like you back. And yeah, you just pull it down that you get to get to coach these guys. You know, it's. It's best darn job I've ever had.

[J. Mac]

Colin, I was gonna say you look good. You look. I look a little thinner than last year. You had a couple health things. Give me an update. How do you feel?

[Colin Cowherd]

How are you doing?

[J. Mac]

How's your. Because you look good. You look younger than the last time I had you. That's Southern California sushi. That's the sushi.

[Jim Harbaugh]

Jackie Harvaugh said the. Said the same thing. Yeah, get. Got a hip replaced. It's. It's working great. All patched up. The iron horse had to go in for a few fine tunings and I had an ablaze, had an ablation Done. That was, it was, it was really, really successful. I was, I was really super happy. My, my doctor, Dr. Shapata, he came in and tell me how it went. He goes, oh, it went good. It went really good. I go, what? Every doctor says it went good. I mean, I've never talked to a doctor after a surgery that said it didn't go well. I go, tell me about it. And he, I mean, he started describing what he did and, and it was like a, it was like a football player describing, you know, the miraculous, you know, way that he scored a touchdown. You know, he really, I could tell. Okay, now we're getting somewhere. And he really, he really feels, really feels good about it, you know, and then he kind of was described. Well, you know, why, why did, I asked him why, why didn't they, why didn't they fix that issue? You know, the, the last time I had this ablation, he goes, well, you know, it wasn't, you know, they're really good. The, you know, the technology's a lot better. I go, nah, doctor, it was you, it was you. And so, yeah, I feel, you know, just, it just fires you up when you get that kind of right here in, right here in la.

[J. Mac]

By the way, you saw Ohtani pitch last night. I think he's, it's just unbelievable. It's just unbelievable. He's good looking, he's great. Like, you talk about the whole package. He's magnetic. When, when you go to a Dodger game, it doesn't even feel, I mean, you know what great is when. Great is when among great players, they look up to you. I always used to say this about Mike Tyson. Other heavyweight fighters were intimidated by Mike Tyson. That's what great is. You watched Ohtani last night. What do you see?

[Jim Harbaugh]

I was just blown away by the whole thing. Just everything. His, his walk up song. I mean, you know, the, the way he puts his bat, you know, at the end of the, the top of the plate there and he measures it and he puts his foot in the same spot. And you know, I really watched him. I was there with my son Jack, who's a, who's a 12 year old baseball player, and son Johnny, who's 8, and, and Katie. And I'm going, okay, just study him. Just watch, watch, watch him. He, he's in a rhythm. Everything he does is to create the rhythm. He does it the same way every time. Look at that. The pitching motion, whether it's from the stretch or from the, you know, from the, from the wind up his, his routine. Rhythm, Rhythm, you know, Rhythm. Get the rhythm. Get the frick, you know, get the, get the freaking rhythm. Rhythm. Get the rhythm. Get the freaking rhythm. You know, it's. It. You just watch it with him. And yeah, the, the hit him. Nukes. A couple nukes. As Johnny, what my son, 8 year old would say, just incredible. The walk up song is, is so good. Just everything about it. But that's sports, you know, Colin, you gotta, you've got to be able to, to get the rhythm. You get out of rhythm, you start trying to make adjustments and, and then you're out there, you're out there floundering. So youngsters in sports, you know, get in the rhythm, have that rhythm trained and practiced and then go do your job. Get the rhythm and let the chips fall where they may. But don't try to start questioning yourself or making adjustments. I mean, that's probably my biggest takeaway of, of watching, watching last night's game.

[J. Mac]

Yeah. All right.

[Jim Harbaugh]

And another LA guy, JJ Spawn. How cool was that?

[J. Mac]

You know what's amazing is that JJ Spawn, did you hear the story that he literally. His daughter was sick. Is that JJ Spawn calling you? He's his daughter.

[Jim Harbaugh]

That morning I called her back.

[J. Mac]

So his, his daughter was throwing up Sunday morning. He was up at 3 in the morning, went to a CVS. He was working on four hours sleep.

[Jim Harbaugh]

Wow.

[J. Mac]

And then he goes in rain delay and this kid ends up hitting one of the great putts in the history of the US Open. He was up at three in the morning driving to a CVS because his daughter. That's what being a great dad is. And he said, actually, he said it took my mind off golf. Yeah, I didn't think about golf. I was worried about my daughter all day. And I was like, 64 foot putt that, that's a winner right there.

[Jim Harbaugh]

Yeah. How about the one where he hits the pin, you know, hits the great shot in there and kind of sucks up, then it hits the pin and then it goes, oh, brutal. All the way back down. I mean, just, I mean, one of the most brutal breaks you could get. And you know, it just, he was just an, he was just an iron wall to that negativity that, you know, just, just, just shattered. And that adversity, that negative, you know, negativity just crumbled. And to watch him go about his business, I mean, it was, it was tremendous.

[J. Mac]

Okay, listen, Andy Reid right now is working on plays. You got to get back. I want some razzle dazzle in that opener. Jim. I want something, I want something with Mike Williams. I want lad McConkey double pass. I want you to go because I that game I have you winning the division and he's a wild card team so I know he's working right now. You got. We got to get back to work, okay?

[Jim Harbaugh]

Yes, sir. Appreciate you having me on Jim.

[J. Mac]

It's great seeing you smiling more than you ever have. The great Jim Harbaugh. Thanks coach.

[Colin Cowherd]

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