Steve Kerr (6:50)

To stretch, you know, a lot of tough plays that, you know, we couldn't get to, a loose ball, you know, things like that. And oftentimes that's the difference. So. But overall, I thought, you know, the first three and a half quarters, I.

Colin Cowherd (7:06)

Thought very, very good.

Steve Kerr (7:08)

So obviously we have to close out better.

Colin Cowherd (7:11)

Yeah. And the other thing is the Knicks really fight scratch and claw for baskets. They really do. They work their tails off. They play hard every night. Did you notice last night how often the Lakers, they get kind of easy hoops? Like, it's not a very good set. They don't quite look organized and they just get baskets. And again last night just like, hey, Gabe. Vince, it's open. Take a shot. LeBron talked about that after the win in overtime about just everybody on this roster. Luka and LeBron are the stars. Everybody matters, though. There's no such thing as non key players on this team. Everybody is key. You know, and everybody steps on the floor, has a role, and they go in and match that. And I thought. Thought our bench gave us a great lift once again. And Gabe was, you know, single him out. He was spectacular. You know, his play both on the defensive end and obviously with a shooting, and we need it. So we'll get a little bit of a preview potentially, of the NBA Finals. I have Boston. I think they're going to meet either the Lakers or OKC in the Finals. But this idea. Charles Barkley. I'm sorry. Lakers are good. They're more interesting. LeBron and Luka is magical. It's only getting better. Luka is still not shooting great. He's still. He was so inactive for so long. I don't think he has his legs quite under him yet. He looks a little lighter, a little quicker than he did a week ago. That's what I can see. Not shooting great. He's having trouble. First step, getting quite as open as he used to. But he's Luca and he's a savant offensively. But this thing's only getting better. They're going nowhere. I mean, again, Rui's not playing Austin, Reeves, not 100%. It's working okay. So I feel like I've led with these two guys for the past week. So now let's get the Steph Curry. And this is the way, you know, don't forget. You want to know the tours that made so much money last year. Bruce Springsteen, Madonna and the Rolling Stones. You guys can put the old ones to bed. But once again, there's a reason that when LeBron and Steph play on like Christmas or in a big Saturday night game, it's the highest rated game of the year. These guys are still great. Sometimes they get bored, Sometimes they're not pushed. I felt LeBron and AD kind of like treadmill to nowhere. But now you give Steph Jimmy Butler and the show is back. And if you didn't see it last night, he had 40. They won again. Third game, four nights. Steph with a bad ankle, but he still put on a show.

Steve Kerr (9:42)

You do have it at single digits. And that was the goal when you were down 22.

Colin Cowherd (9:48)

Steph from midcourt. Oh, come on. Did he ghost him on that, too? Oh, my goodness. Curry from 45ft. Yo, this dude is an alien. What did he just do? Every night this week, different city. He's putting on a show. And listen, the showmanship warriors are back. Oklahoma City's really good. It's about defense. Boston's really good. It's about roster construction. The Nuggets are about fundamentals, and it's. The Cavs are about efficiency. The warriors are about the show. And the NBA has always been better when it's got a show. It can be the Heatles, it can be Shaq and Kobe, Katie and Steph. But when you go to watch Steph play halfway through that game last night, those Brooklyn fans, they weren't rooting for the Nets. They were, they were Steph fans. And fans show up early to watch his warm ups. That's what a star is. You always feel like you're two to four seconds away from seeing one of the greatest plays in basketball history. And, you know, I'm watching him last night and we love to bury the old guys. And they always have something left in the tank. They always do. I mean, Jason Tatum had 34 points last night and nobody outside of Woosta cares. Steph's playing Brooklyn and New York City's a buzz. And here is Steve Kerr after Steph just had an incredible trip, put on a show in every city. What he does this, it's amazing.

Steve Kerr (11:26)

Just the, the show that he puts.

Colin Cowherd (11:28)

On, the, the joy that he brings to so many fans who are coming to see him play in all these different cities. You know, every, every fan base loves Steph, you know, and it's, there's a reason he's, he's an incredible performer. It's very rare that. Here's the Michael Jordan quality with Steph Curry is that everybody loved Michael. I mean, yeah, in Detroit maybe your primary rival, but I covered him when I was in Portland. I saw him play live four or five times. I saw his last game in Portland as a Wizard. Halfway through the game, you were just rooting for Michael to do something amazing. And that's what Steph Curry is. And that is absolutely what Steph Curry is. You just feel like you're a moment away from an all time YouTube clip. And both LeBron and Steph have been energized because of smart moves by the front office. Just like the NFL, the great players are largely beholden to the guys upstairs, making sure they construct a real team. Additives, not liabilities. It is great for the NBA. J. Mack, we were going to go to that thing, I had a little meeting, but I gotta, I gotta watch it. And the show is back for the Warriors. You know, it's funny, a month ago, before that Jimmy Butler thing, I had said on the air, I'd said if Steph's not on the floor, they're one of the most boring teams in the league. Isn't it amazing? By just adding one player. And by the way, Butler's not necessarily assimilating, but he has created this sort of joyfulness for Steph. Now they're back to being the show that you can't. You can't wait for the games.

Jason McIntyre (13:03)

It is nice to see a rejuvenated Curry, a rejuvenated LeBron. They're probably both going to be first team all NBA again this year. Like, LeBron is legitimately in the MVP discussion. He probably won't win it because the media loves SGA and Oklahoma City's winning like 70 games. But LeBron and Curry just. It's just fun, man. It feels like an extension from the Olympics. Remember how they were like the superstars on the team, the old guys? It feels like an extension. And I, I think they could probably get both going to meet in the Western Conference finals.

Colin Cowherd (13:31)

And this is a prime example. We've talked about this, the Jayson Tatum stuff this week. When you put Jason Tatum around all those old stars, he shrinks. When you put LeBron and Steph around the stars, pow. They're motivated. They want to show off to the kids. So a lot of times with these older star players, Favre did this in Minnesota. He just needed to be inspired. You know, you forget these guys. An NBA life is not just the games. It's shoot around. It's at the hotel at 3am it is slogging in a winter league to a hotel, trying to get sleep. You get up, shoot around, breakfast. It's repetition. It's tedium. It's getting taped. It's. It's a lot of film, it's a lot of tape. It's a lot of boring. It's like being an attorney. You know, you watch Perry Mason or you watch LA Law, Corbin Burns, and you're like, I want to be an attorney. 90% of cases don't go in front of a judge. You're settling out of court.

Jason McIntyre (14:24)

You think that would be boring?

Colin Cowherd (14:25)

No, I mean, being an attorney, it's not like on television. It is a lot. It's. It's accounting. It's. It's just a lot of minutiae. And that's what the NBA stars, they love, they love playing. But 90% of this league is not playing. So the LeBron's and the Stephs, it's tedium. It's a lot of boredom. And if you give them jet fuel, it's like, they're like different players. In the last three weeks Imagine if.

Jason McIntyre (14:49)

The Lakers came to you and said, colin, we want you to experience 72 hours with the Lakers. You're on the flight, you're in the film room, nutrition, weightlifting, shoot around. Would you do that? I think that would be like the most fun thing ever.

Colin Cowherd (15:00)

Try doing it for 22 years in a row. Right?

Jason McIntyre (15:05)

You're not digging ditches, that's for sure.

Colin Cowherd (15:07)

I'm not relative to the average person, but I For superstars, it is hard to get on that treadmill every day. Fighting for a playing game. Yeah, no, for certain. If you feel like owning a home is out of reach, Rocket is here to give you the keys back to that dream. They think everybody deserves a shot at it. Own the dream. Visit Rocket.com and call 800-4Rocket. Be sure to catch live editions of the Herd, weekdays at noon Eastern, 9am Pacific on Fox Sports Radio, FS1 and the iHeartRadio app with Amex, there's always.

Capital One Bank Guy (15:45)

A new experience to explore. From curating the perfect vacation and chilling in the Centurion Lounge before you get there trying out that new trendy restaurant. Thanks to Priority Notify with global dining access by Resy and getting straight to the action at the big game with card member entrances at select venues with AMEX Platinum, you can experience it all. That's the powerful backing of American Express. Terms apply. Access to the card member entrance not limited to the American Express Platinum card. Learn more@americanexpress.com With Amex, Omaha Steaks delivers.

Colin Cowherd (16:15)

The world's best steak experience and it brings people together with more than 100 years of family owned expertise as America's original butcher. Omaha Steak's legendary filet mignons are extra aged to maximize tenderness and are tested to the highest standards to maintain the coveted distinction of USDA Certified tender. And now during their semi annual sale, you can get 50% off site wide at Omaha steaks.com plus our listeners get an extra $30 off with the promo code Herdherd at checkout. This weekend was a great time to bust open my Omaha Steaks assortment. Pack air Chilled boneless chicken breasts, ribeye and steak burgers, gourmet jumbo franks. They're great butcher's cut top sirloins and for dessert, caramel apple tartlets. It doesn't get better than this. From legendary steaks to classic comfort food, bring home that exceptional handcrafted flavor and convenience of Omaha Steaks. Every steak perfectly aged. Five generations of uncompromising quality. Omaha Steaks has been America's original butcher since 1917. Don't miss the semiannual sale at Omaha Steaks. Visit Omaha Steaks.com for 50% off site wide and for an extra $30 off, use the promo code herdherd at checkout. That's 50% off at OmahaSteaks.com and an extra $30 off with a promo code herd at checkout. You can count on T Mobile to help keep you connected from big cities to small towns on America's largest 5G network. Switch the T mobile keep your phone and they'll pay it off up to 800 bucks per line via prepaid card. Learn more@t mobile.com Keep and switch up to four lines via virtual prepaid card. Allow 15 days qualifying unlock device credit service port in 90 plus days with device and eligible carrier and timely redemption required. Card has no cash access and expires in six months.

Unknown Speaker (18:15)

Make some noise for the greatest shooter of all time, Steph Curry. We went live from All Star Weekend for a new podcast called goat greatest of their era and we ranked our top five shooters from the 2000s.

Unknown Speaker (18:28)

Peja 5 Dirk Ford.

Colin Cowherd (18:30)

Peja is elite.

Unknown Speaker (18:30)

Okay, okay.

Colin Cowherd (18:31)

I'm mad him. I left him off my list, but.

Steve Kerr (18:33)

I still like my list.

Unknown Speaker (18:36)

You won't believe who Steph left off his list.

Unknown Speaker (18:38)

That's so tough. That's why we have these conversations. Absolutely love it.

Unknown Speaker (18:43)

Steph talked about what separates the truly elite NBA.

Unknown Speaker (18:46)

When you have a scouting report and you're on the list as not just a shooter, but we have specific rules for how we guard you. There's a fear factor that's associated with anytime you're wide open. Like, you might as well just count that and get on back on defense.

Unknown Speaker (19:02)

Listen to Goat G o t e Greatest of their era on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast.

Colin Cowherd (19:11)

All right, welcome back. Finally, Mark Cuban is addressing the, you know, disastrous trade that Nico Harris and the GM made to, you know, Nico Harris and the GM of the Mavs should get consideration to the basketball hall of Fame for special contributions to the game. I mean, the Lakers now have revitalized the NBA, which had gone through a couple years of soft ratings and uninteresting a lot of international stars. Who's the face of the league? Well, now, now the warriors, the Celtics, the, the Knicks, the war. You know, you got big cities now engaged. And here's Mark Cuban on the trade. If the Mavs are going to trade Luca, that's one thing. Just get a better deal, you know, no, no disrespect to Anthony Davis, but You know, get three. If I still firmly believe if we had gotten four unprotected number ones and Anthony Davis and Max Christie, this would be a different conversation. Would you ever have traded Luka Doncic? I'm not going to go there. It's not. It doesn't matter. Okay. So when Jimmy Johnson won the trade, trading Herschel Walker to the Vikings, it wasn't just that they gave up Herschel Walker. They got eight draft picks. So it's not just about the hall, it's the yield. And they hit on their draft picks. I have no problem selling the mansion. You got to get a windfall back. You got to get flexibility. Oklahoma City moved off Harden and Westbrook. They get draft picks. That's why Oklahoma City and Sam Presti for the last several years have had the most flexibility in the league. You have to move off stars. The Chiefs moved off Tyreek Hill. It happens. Bengals are going to move off an edge rusher. I wouldn't. But if you're going to do that, you want to put yourself in a position to get flexibility. I have no, I mean, when, when the Pelicans moved off AD they got Brandon Ingram, they got Josh Hart, but they got three first round picks, and one of those was Zion. If Zion would have remained healthy because he was great when he entered the league. He was. He had Wilt Chamberlain numbers. If he would have remained healthy and had his diet and body together, you wouldn't even remember AD Because Zion's game's more exciting. So I don't mind moving players. Three first round picks, AD Austin Reaves. I wouldn't do it, but I don't think it would get lamented because, you know, I mean, Luka wasn't in shape. He was hurt, he'd missed back to back camps. He's an awful defensive player. You're even seeing now, he's still not in great shape and he's been in Los Angeles kind of the tutelage of J.J. redick and LeBron, guys who have always been in great shape when they played or if they're coaching. So it, it's just, you got to get some. Danny A. Has moved off Stars, always gets flexibility. Sam Presty, same thing. That's because now they have the. I think the Mavs are best off not playing AD not playing anybody and just getting a better pick. Try to get a top 1012 pick. You're not going to get into the lottery. You got too many wins. But I would just try to get. Try to salvage it because you don't control a lot of your future picks. You got your one first rounder this year and it's a pretty good draft. It's a very domestic draft. I mean, by the way, you tanked a couple of years ago and got the kid from Duke who's a very good player now. You got fined for it, but you did a soft tank. So I mean, it happens in the NBA, but to get no flexibility and less of a player, that's how you get fired. Be sure to catch live editions of the Herd weekdays at noon Eastern, 9am.

Capital One Bank Guy (22:36)

Pacific with Amex, there's always a new experience to explore, from curating the perfect vacation and chilling in the Centurion Lounge before you get there trying out that new trendy restaurant thanks to Priority Notify with global dining access accessed by Resy and getting straight to the action at the big game. With card member entrances at select venues with AMEX Platinum, you can experience it all. That's the powerful backing of American Express. Terms apply. Access to the card member entrance not limited to the American Express Platinum card. Learn more@american express.com With Amex, you can.

Colin Cowherd (23:07)

Count on T Mobile to help keep you connected from big cities to small towns on America's largest 5G network. Switch the T Mobile, keep your phone and they'll pay it off up to 800 bucks per line via prepaid card. Learn more@t mobile.com heap and switch up to four lines via virtual prepaid card. Allow 15 days qualifying unlock device credit service port in 90 plus days with device and eligible carrier and timely redemption required. Card has no cash access and expires in six months.

Unknown Speaker (23:42)

Make some noise for the greatest shooter of all time, Steph Curry. We went live from All Star Weekend for a new podcast called Goat Greatest of Their Era and we ranked our top five shooters from the 2000s.

Unknown Speaker (23:56)

Paja 5 Dirk Ford Paja is elite.

Colin Cowherd (23:59)

I'm mad him. I left him off my list, but.

Steve Kerr (24:01)

I still like my list.

Unknown Speaker (24:03)

You won't believe who Steph left off his list.

Unknown Speaker (24:06)

That's so tough. That's why we have these conversations. Absolutely love it.

Unknown Speaker (24:10)

Steph talked about what separates the truly elite NBA shooters.

Unknown Speaker (24:14)

When you have a scouting report and you're on the list as not just a shooter, but we have specific rules for how we guard you. There's a fear factor that's associated with anytime you're wide open. Like you might as well just count that and get on back on defense.

Unknown Speaker (24:30)

Listen to Go G O T E Greatest of Their era on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts or Wherever you get your podcasts.

Colin Cowherd (24:39)

We live in a divided country. I am a lifelong Republican with all kinds of different people. You know, I'm a mother, I'm a grandmother. That's why we started the Middle with Jeremy Hobson. It's about bringing voices not from the extremes, but from the vast middle into the national conversation.

Jason McIntyre (24:56)

Anna, I'm calling from Las Vegas.

Colin Cowherd (24:58)

Each week we bring together an all star panel. Mark Cuban, so great to have you on the Middle. Thanks for having me, Jeremy, Neil Degrasse Tyson, welcome to the Middle. Thanks for having me. And hear from ordinary Americans from all over the country on the most important issues. Hi, my name is Venkat.

Steve Kerr (25:13)

I'm calling you from Atlanta, Georgia.

Colin Cowherd (25:15)

And when you subscribe to the Middle, you also get an episode each week called One Thing Trump did that focuses on just one item from the avalanche of news.

Steve Kerr (25:23)

We should be examining what our government spends its money on and are these jobs necessary and what are we doing here? But that doesn't seem to be what we're doing in this situation.

Colin Cowherd (25:31)

Listen to the Middle with Jeremy Hobson on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts. So I sometimes it's funny. So yesterday I saw that I was trending and I laughed. Of course I was trending because of what I said about Jason Tatum. So I've never had a topic where I just give you data and facts and one city is more outraged. I don't even understand it. Yesterday I said, you know, they're 10 and 2 when he doesn't play. That's not an opinion. I said they score eight points more a game when he doesn't play. That's not an opinion. The field goal percentage, the net rating, the 3 point percentage all goes up when Jayson Tatum doesn't play. Those aren't opinions. In the Eastern Conference finals and the NBA finals, Jaylen Brown was the mvp, not Tatum. That's not an opinion. In the Olympics, those second to last game against Serbia, coaches decision, they wouldn't play him in the gold medal game. He had two points. These are not opinions. You are trying to make him jokic, Giannis, Stefan, LeBron and Luca. I'm not. I'm just saying he's not in that class. And all the numbers prove it. I mean, and by the way, you know who else proves it? Shoe companies. LeBron, Steph, Katie and John Morant have their own brand. Tatum doesn't. He's got a shoe under Michael's brand. So the Olympics, what did it prove? He shrinks against with great players around Eastern Conference finals. What did it prove? What's production data prove when he doesn't play? I'm not saying he's not a star at the NBA at any one time. Has two superstars, maybe three, and then about 12 stars. I'm just saying he's not in the three. He's in the 12. And people are outraged by it. I think it's, you know, that's why the fate. This all started with the Face of the League stuff. And I think when in terms of Face of the League, he's more Tim Duncan, where he's efficient, productive, good guy, excellent player, can win you championships, but there's not a lot of aura there. There's not a lot of personality. I don't think that's a criticism. So you're the one trying to get me to compare him to superstars. There's a lot of good soccer players and not a lot of Messi's and Ronaldo's. At any one time, the world's got two of them now. The world's got 15 other great soccer stars. But at any one time, Mbappe, Messi, Ronaldo, it's got about three superstars, global stars, and this is a global league. And Tatum's not a global star. I said this before, is that we talk about Michael Jordan. He hasn't played forever. We talk about Magic and Bird and Dr. J. You know who we don't talk about? Tim Duncan, Karl Malone. They're great players. Jason Tatum's gonna retire four years later. There'll be no Jayson Tatum talk. Doesn't mean he's not great. You're the one jamming him in to this global elite group. And I'm just saying numbers don't prove it, you know? Do you know what his nickname is? So the NBA, Twitter is a thing, and they make up nicknames all the time. This year, they've given seven new players nicknames. I didn't. I'm just gonna tell you what the nickname was. His nickname. Tatum's nickname, the Anomaly. That's. That's the nickname they gave him. The Anomaly. Does that sound like it would sell shoes? So. So. So I think his nickname should be the password because he's commonly forgotten, but I'm gonna get shots for that. I threw a couple up there. All right, we're being snarky, but it. I would. We're just being snarky. We can have fun, right? It's an entertainment.

Jason McIntyre (29:15)

Wait, you need to read those out loud for the radio audience because they're so disrespectful.

Colin Cowherd (29:19)

The Miss army knife, the last one is terrible. 75 cent. He misses in the fourth. You know, missing.

Jason McIntyre (29:26)

I know, I know whose work that is.

Colin Cowherd (29:27)

I'm familiar with the ball. Somebody on our staff thought they were.

Jason McIntyre (29:29)

I know he's a funny guy, but.

Colin Cowherd (29:30)

Listen, yeah, whatever you can take.

Jason McIntyre (29:32)

That is so disrespectful.

Colin Cowherd (29:34)

No, I, but I. People are putting him in this Ronaldo Messi class. I'm just saying he's more Wayne Rooney, okay? I'm just saying he is great. Wayne Rooney was the biggest star in England, but he's not messy.

Jason McIntyre (29:50)

So he's a second tier star is what you said at the end.

Colin Cowherd (29:52)

My whole life, the NBA's had like when I was a kid growing up, Dr. J was a star. George McGinnis was. I mean, I can name 20 guys that were great. And by the way, Shaq and Kobe were stars. Okay? Those were superstars.

Jason McIntyre (30:08)

Okay, so your top tier stars right now, Giannis Curry.

Colin Cowherd (30:11)

No, the top Superstars globally, Stephen LeBron are 1 and 2, right. I think Luca, now that he's with the Lakers, that elevates his brand probably 25, 30%. That's a superstar. Giannis is classic. Giannis is much more like Duncan. Where the NBA playoffs four years ago when he was the best player in the league, they put him on a noon game.

Jason McIntyre (30:32)

Okay?

Colin Cowherd (30:32)

The NBA shoe companies tell you if you're a star. Shoe companies tell you he doesn't have his own brand. John Morant does. Now, John Morant blew it because of his immaturity. But the league, all these shoe companies are like Steph lebron, mj. They saw John Morant and go, that is a sizzle.

Jason McIntyre (30:53)

So, so Anthony Edwards is a bigger star than Jason Tatum. Is that what, Is that fair? No, no.

Colin Cowherd (30:59)

They're both stars. Neither one of those are global icons. They're not.

Jason McIntyre (31:05)

Yeah, I would agree with they're not global.

Colin Cowherd (31:07)

And by the way, Jokic is closer to Tim Duncan than LeBron.

Jason McIntyre (31:11)

If you're Jason Tatum and I say, what's wrong with global icon? Who cares? I'm a winner. I go to the Eastern Conference finals or the NBA Finals every damn year.

Colin Cowherd (31:19)

That's what every guy in Worcester is saying today. And I'm good with it.

Jason McIntyre (31:22)

Yeah. And you know what else? 95% of the league would kill to be in the playoffs.

Colin Cowherd (31:28)

I agree to win and go for it. I agree with that too.

Jason McIntyre (31:31)

Yeah, yeah.

Colin Cowherd (31:32)

The argument is people are offended when I give them actual data that the team is 10 and 2 without him. And offensively, net rating, field goal, 3 point points. They're better.

Jason McIntyre (31:45)

That might be that he took off games against crack teams and the Celtics are going to smoke him anyway.

Colin Cowherd (31:48)

Or it could be the truth.

Jason McIntyre (31:50)

I mean, what about his 51 burger in game seven?

Colin Cowherd (31:53)

You forget about that one.

Jason McIntyre (31:55)

Game six in Milwaukee at like 45. I'll never forget. And listen, I don't even like the Celtics. In fact, I hate all Boston teams because I'm from New York. I love Jason Tatum. A lot of Lakers fans, by the way, thought Jason Tatum would be a Laker at some point because he's like, Mr.

Colin Cowherd (32:10)

This is the CLA. This is the classic. I'm adding contextualization. You view it as hate. Like I said, Brock Purdy, I'd pay him 40 million.

Jason McIntyre (32:18)

Wait, don't you think you were trending yesterday because of the hate?

Colin Cowherd (32:22)

No, that's not my issue. I'm just.

Jason McIntyre (32:23)

I'm just reporting glazing Jayson Tatum. It would not have gone viral and got 2 million views or whatever. Right? If you're saying he's really great, but if you're taking some shots at him, saying he's not a global icon.

Colin Cowherd (32:35)

No, like I said, there are no shots. There are no shots. He's closer to Duncan. Karl Malone, who we don't talk about. They retired two minutes later. They're not a topic. Dominique Wilkins retires. By the way, Dominique Wilkins never made the Dream Team. Great player. Never made the Dream Team. Never made the end Bully. But Scotty Pippen did. Because Scottie Pippen was Robin to Batman on the world's best team. Scotty, I mean, so again, Scotty Pippen is one of those players. He's not as good as Tatum. Tatum's better than Scotty Pippen. Well, Scotty's good, but the difference is, Michael, they were the Rolling Stones that the Bulls were this. They're the biggest basketball brand. I think in my lifetime, they were the only team that surpassed any Celtic team or any Laker team was Michael Jordan's Bull.

Jason McIntyre (33:27)

You could argue the modern teams right now with the global reach of social media and TV games, that the teams now are way more popular than they were in the 90s.

Colin Cowherd (33:34)

I'm just saying, relative to the era. And so this idea about Jayson Tatum, I'm just giving you data. Don't let facts get in the way of feelings. I'm just giving you the data points. You're getting worked up over it. I'm just saying he's not LeBron. He's not Steph. He's not Messi, he's not Ronaldo. He's not Pele in his prime. You know, I mean, he's not Madonna or Bruce or the Stones.

Jason McIntyre (34:00)

What band would he be?

Colin Cowherd (34:01)

He would be a. He would be a multi Grammy winning band.

Jason McIntyre (34:04)

Weezer. I love Weezer. First band I ever saw.

Colin Cowherd (34:08)

He's better than Weezer.

Jason McIntyre (34:09)

I think Weezer's really, really, really good.

Colin Cowherd (34:11)

Okay, come on. I love Tatum and yesterday I said he. He reminds me a little of Klay Thompson. Again, he's better than Klay Thompson. But Klay Thompson played alongside a player who often in the biggest games, Klay Thompson felt like the second best player. Good God. Every time Jalen and Tater Murray's big series last year, it was Brown taking the shots. Now, I think Tatum's better than Jaylen Brown. Not as much as people think. I think it's closer than you think. But Tatum's better. But just. It's not perfectly analogous, but I do think he's got more of a Carl Malone, Tim Duncan. Jokic is fascinating because he's easily the best player in the league and he has no brand and doesn't want it.

Jason McIntyre (34:58)

Doesn't want.

Colin Cowherd (34:58)

So Tatum wants it.

Jason McIntyre (35:00)

Well, how do you know he wants it?

Colin Cowherd (35:02)

He. Tatum has said, I check all the boxes. Like last week in a story, he said, well, I could be the face of the league. I mean, you know what's funny about it? If I'll give you an example, Go back to Duke. So when he was at Duke, Jason Tatum, did he lead him in scoring? No, I wasn't at Luke Kennard. What was he, the most talked about player? No, that was Grayson Allen. Well, who was the star? Mike Krzyzewski. He was the four on Duke. No, I mean, no, no. Grayson Allen was the most controversial and talked about, I think. I don't think he was the leading scorer. And Chefsy was always the star of Duke.

Jason McIntyre (35:36)

Yeah, I don't totally. All I remember is Coach K is the last guy to stop. Jason Tatum basically couldn't get out of opening weekend in the NCAA tournament. I remember that brutal loss.

Colin Cowherd (35:45)

Take a break. Be sure to catch live editions of the Herd, Weekdays at noon Eastern, 9am Pacific. Hey, it's Steve Covino and I'm Rich Davis and together we're Covino and Rich on Fox Sports Radio. You can catch us weekdays from 5 to 7pm Eastern, 2 to 4 Pacific on Fox Sports Radio. And of course, the iHeartRadio app. Why should you listen to Covino and Rich? We talk about everything. Life, sports, relationships, what's going on in the world. We have a lot of fun talking about the stories behind the stories in the world of sports and pop culture. Stories that, well, other shows don't seem to have the time to discuss. And the fact that we've been friends for the last 20 years and still work together, I mean, that says something, right? So check us out. We like to get you involved, too. Take your phone calls, chop it up, as they say. I'd say the most interactive show on Fox Sports Radio, maybe the most interactive show on planet Earth. Be sure to check out Covino and Rich live on Fox Sports radio and the iHeartradio app from 5 to 7pm Eastern, 2 to 4 Pacific. And if you miss any of the live show, just search Kobenon, Rich, wherever you get your podcast. And of course, on social, social media. That's Covino and Rich, Ryan Day, the Ohio State Buckeyes national champs, favored next year as well as joining us live. You know, I was thinking about this this morning. I was thinking about this years ago. Mike Krzyzewski, when they did the one and done, he didn't like it. And then I asked him about it and he goes, I didn't like it. And then three years in, I realized I was losing to all these one and done guys. So maybe it's time for me not to be stubborn. Your sport, Ryan, has become incredibly transient. I mean, just what it is. Was there a moment when it all came down the hill? Transfer portal, nil. Was there a moment where you said, this is a. I don't know if I like this. Is it. We're gonna just do high school guys or did you buy into it 10 minutes in?

Steve Kerr (37:35)

I mean, I, you know, there's still things going on that I throw my hands up right now. There's so many changes I think about, you know, the nil, the transfer portal, the conference realignment with 18 teams. So now, you know, in the Big Ten, we travel to the west coast and you have the playoff change. Like just, just those four things. Those are just four things that have all happened. Those are like major, major changes. So you just had to be comfortable being uncomfortable in solving it and getting it because nobody cares. Like, there's all kinds of things that happened, you know, in the last month or so that, you know, after our game we can get into later. But nobody cares about. Like, what matters is putting your talent, you know, talent acquisition on the field and putting together and putting a team together. So as much though, as things have changed to Me, I felt with this team, it was about the kind of timeless principles of hard work and sacrifice and loyalty and resilience that separated us.

Colin Cowherd (38:30)

So I. I'm a friend of Chip Kelly, and he, you know, he's told me about your friendship for years and years. And I said, I said, I predicted before the season, I said, ohio State's going to lose at Austin. I've been to too many games there. You can't hear yourself think. I don't think anybody in the country is going to beat this Oregon team at Austin. You got close. I said, ohio State's going to beat them. They're going to meet. They're going to meet later, and Ohio State's got better personnel and Ohio State's going to beat him. But one of the things I theorized, I said, Chip Kelly is a real advantage that you're not going to notice until the playoff. He knows how to stagger these games because college football now feels like pro football. You can lose late in the season. It's not a death knell. It's about staggering. It's about slowly unveiling. Take our audience into the value of Chip Kelly in that playoff that I can't see, you know, guys like me can't see. But inside your building, the additive value that Chip gave you, that had a little NFL feel to it.

Steve Kerr (39:27)

Well, yeah. Well, I think like you said, when you're Talking about now 16, 16 games in a long season with a playoff format at the end of the. It starts off with even this time of year, making decisions on how you want to proceed. Like, for instance, we decided to huddle on offense this year. We had never done that. Certainly Chip hadn't done that a lot, you know, with his background and tempo. But. But that decision was a huge decision and that, you know, we wanted to continue to evolve as the season went on, but. But then, you know, really have our best football for the end of the year. And I think having the NFL experience, I would think a lot of teams would tell you, you know, in the NFL in, In September, there's, you know, sort of the preseason October. They're finding their identity. And then by the time they get to November and December, like now, now they're going to play for. For. For the championships and everything's on the line. And I wouldn't say that that's the way it is in college right now, but it's trending towards that. And having somebody that's been in that position before, certainly with his experience in the NFL, it made a big Difference.

Colin Cowherd (40:28)

So you have a player, you have two players. And I had said this, I had an NFL general manager tell me a month ago that if Jeremiah Smith and Caleb Downs were in this class, they'd probably be the second and third guys taken. They're unbelievable players. You guys have done a really good job. And I think this is really hard because especially now, you're paying players, that you have these superstar players, and yet it felt like such a team. You felt like such a team. Your sideline, your body language. Is it harder when you have, you know, Ohio State's one of four programs, maybe three that gets those guys? When you have, literally NFL players, they're just not eligible yet. You're paying them. You're not paying everybody big money in the NFL. Everybody's doing fine in college. There's a little gap. Is that hard for you to massage as a coach?

Steve Kerr (41:15)

Well, I think it starts with the identification. I mean, there's a lot of NFL players that, you know, aren't at Ohio State, you know, that. That maybe just aren't the right fit for who we are. And so we try to do, you know, a great job of identifying, you know, the right people that fit us. You know, there's a lot of great players out there, but what, you know, Ohio State's not for everybody. And, you know, we try to make sure that we bring in the right folks that fit our culture, because again, like you said, these guys are making money now, so it's now even more important to bring in the right fit. And then what you. What you say to them in the recruiting process, you better follow through with, because they can literally walk out the door tomorrow if they wanted to.

Colin Cowherd (41:51)

Yeah.

Steve Kerr (41:51)

So, you know, it's really forcing everybody to really, I think, follow through with what they talk about on the front end. But then these guys still want to be held accountable, you know, and coaching them hard and giving them life lessons and. And building trust within the building is. Is very, very important. And I think, you know, our fan base and being in Columbus and what comes with that, you know, our guys understand that there's a big obligation when you come to Ohio State, what comes with it. So, you know, the fact that we were able to overcome some things this year and then prevail in the back end certainly is going to, you know, carry over into the season.

Colin Cowherd (42:23)

You've got a bunch of guys that are going to be very good. I mean, you're really a factory now. You've become the best. You know, you guys have done a little bit Alabama did so. Saban was a defensive coach, and by the time he left Alabama was known for wide receivers and quarterbacks. Ohio State in my lifetime was running backs. Oh, linemen, linebackers, and now it's. It's wide receiver. You and I, I've said this, I told Urban Meyer this once. I said, when you have receivers as good as Ohio State, you got to feed them. And I said, I think it can hurt your run game and physicality. How do you simultaneously build power football? It's easy for hardball with the Chargers now, by the way, because they don't have superstar receivers. Once you have four of them, is it hard for you as a coach? Okay, we want to be explosive, but we want a little 1985 Ohio State, too. Is that hard for you?

Steve Kerr (43:12)

Oh, I think it's a great conversation, Colin. I think it's, it's a great point because when you're in the Big Ten, like, you've got to play smash mouth football, but then you also got to be able to go out to the Rose bowl or down to, you know, the Cotton bowl and play Texas and Oregon and attract me, you know, and so that's the combination of things that we're constantly trying to make sure we balance out. And the only way you can do that is if you have unselfish guys. So, like, you know, to have Trayvon Henderson and Quintean junkins together in the backfield together and let young players see that their unselfishness and willing to sacrifice being the guy or a number of carries so that they could play really, really fast and really physical down the stretch made a big difference, I think.

Colin Cowherd (43:49)

Yeah.

Steve Kerr (43:50)

And the only way that that happens is if guys are unselfish. And to your point, you know, if you have selfish guys who just want the ball and don't understand how important is to establish the run, it's not going to work. And vice versa, you know, if you have, you know, running backs who want certain number of carries when the ball needs to get thrown out to some of our receivers, it isn't going to work. So buying into the team is critical.

Colin Cowherd (44:11)

You know, there's been a couple moments in my life when I had my first child that I literally was floating like, I didn't feel like. I'm like, what's happening to me? I got salty discharge. I'm crying, you know, and so we. You have had that too. We've all had personal moments, but I want you to pivot now to a professional moment, because there is a difference between work and home Even though we love both. Take me back to the moment you knew you were going to be national champion. Who was the first person you thought of?

Steve Kerr (44:43)

Well, for me, it was my father. And I didn't really make this public before, but since you asked me, I'm going to answer the question. I lost my father on January 20th when I was 9 years old.

Colin Cowherd (44:55)

And.

Steve Kerr (44:55)

And I saw when the schedule came out that the national championship game was on the same day that I lost my father. And so, you know, I just knew that he was with me that day, and that was the first guy that I thought of.

Colin Cowherd (45:08)

Oh, that's a great story. We've said this before. You know, you're at a good program when you get heat for losing occasionally to Jim Harbaugh. Georgia. Right now, it's the best program in my opinion. It's the best program in college football. Nil, transfer, portal, coaching destination. It's Ohio State. Do you ever, ever just get to go for a walk in the park in Columbus, put a baseball cap on and not get noticed? Or do you sometimes feel like, man, this is a lot. It's a lot. Coaching the Buckeyes in Ohio State. How's that land for you?

Steve Kerr (45:43)

It is a lot. It is, but that's what you signed up for. And I remember when the first press conference, I was there with Urban, and a lot of people just kind of asked, how do you follow up Coach Meyer, a legend. What if you don't do this and what if you don't do that? And I just kind of had the mindset of, what if we do? What an opportunity to be at a place where there's just such great tradition. And my wife, that night, we're on the bed together, I had three young kids. Knowing that we were probably the first, you know, family to go through this with young kids, you know, going through elementary school and now into junior high and high school. And she kind of cried, and she said, this is the last time our family will be normal. And I didn't even understand at the time, but she did, and she was right. But. But, you know, it's. It's. It's part of the job. It's part of the obligation. And I think after this game, so many people have come up to me across the country when I've traveled to different places, and the first thing they say is, thank you. Just thank you for what you did this year. And they tell the stories of where they've been across the country or who they were when they watched the run that we went on. And it just makes you realize that Ohio State football is bigger than any one of us and the obligation that we have. And it's just a, you know, it's an honor to be the head coach at Ohio State.

Colin Cowherd (46:57)

I love all the. I appreciate you giving these stories to us because you don't have to, and you're opening up and it means a lot. Finally, a big thank you for. From me for playing Texas. So Ohio State, a lot of programs won't do this, and it drives me nuts, you guys. I remember when Pete Carroll, you scheduled the Trojans in la. You know, Ohio State played them at home and a lot of coaches won't do this. And, you know, you. You have just made a point. Let's, you know, I don't mind the Youngstown State. I don't mind that, you know, in state Ohio. But when you, when you. It's one thing to make a commitment. Three weeks before that game, are you going to be thinking, you know, we could have played Texas State at Arlington, it would have been. I mean, that's a hell of an opening game. You're going to lose some sleep when that thing's two weeks out?

Steve Kerr (47:53)

Well, I think it's 173 days from today, so. Yeah. To say I'm going to lose sleep. Yeah, you're darn right I'm going to lose some sleep. I. I think a couple of things. I think, one, it allows you, you know, an opportunity to figure out where you're at early in the season. And. But. But I think it's important moving forward with the playoff system that, like in the Big Ten, in the SEC and as we start to work through this, that we do get automatic qualifiers and a certain amount of automatic qualifiers. If we don't, then you're never going to see these games scheduled. To your point.

Colin Cowherd (48:25)

That's right. That's right.

Steve Kerr (48:26)

Yeah. So I think that's critical if we want these games, which I think we should have these games.

Colin Cowherd (48:30)

Yes.

Steve Kerr (48:30)

And we need to make sure that that happens because I think it's really, really good for college football.

Colin Cowherd (48:34)

Oh. I mean, I think the loss at Oregon, my takeaway is that was going to easily be the harshest environment you would play in, that I didn't care what you did the rest of the year. I don't care if you're. That was good. No, I mean, I covered Oregon. That is as loud as any football stadium I've ever been in, NFL or college. So in a way, you look at it at the time, and it stinks. Flying back to Columbus. But it paid dividends. Later, your guys saw what real duress is like in Ohio State. You don't face a lot of that. You don't, you know, I mean, you know, it's just. It's just I feel like the football gods, you should have won this year, and I love the way you won. And I want to thank you for coming on, giving us a little insight into your life and impossible not to root for. Ryan, thank you so much.

Steve Kerr (49:17)

I appreciate it, Colin. Much respect, man.

Colin Cowherd (49:19)

This is Nikki Glaser from the Nikki Glaser Podcast. On a more serious note, I'm still thinking about that commercial with Tom Brady and Snoop Dogg hating on each other, because when you listen to the reasons for hating someone or something, you realize just how stupid they really are. There is too much hate in this country and it's gotta stop. So join us at iHeart in standing up to it. If you see hate, speak up, call it out, and you can learn more by following OTs. UpWithHate.

Unknown Speaker (49:46)

Make some noise for the greatest shooter of all time, Steph Curr. We went live from All Star Weekend for a new podcast called Go Greatest of Their Era. And we ranked our top five shooters from the 2000s.

Unknown Speaker (49:59)

Asia 5.

Colin Cowherd (49:59)

Dirk 4 Peja is a loot.

Unknown Speaker (50:01)

You won't believe who Steph left off his list.

Unknown Speaker (50:03)

That's so tough. That's why we have these conversations.

Unknown Speaker (50:06)

Yes, absolutely.

Unknown Speaker (50:07)

Love it.

Unknown Speaker (50:08)

Listen to Goat G O T e Greatest of their era on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. What's up, everyone? It's Greg Rosenthal and I'm teaming up with the king of spring, Daniel Jeremiah. He requires me to say that we're going to be bringing you 40s and free agents, the only podcast you'll need this NFL draft season. From DJs, mock drafts to my top 101 free agents will have it covered for you with all new episodes every Thursday. Keeping you up to date as we.

Jason McIntyre (50:36)

Head to the NFL Draft.

Unknown Speaker (50:38)

Listen to 40s and free agents starting on March 6th on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast.

Colin Cowherd (50:46)

What's up, everyone?

Capital One Bank Guy (50:47)

Julie Swerbinks here along with former NHL player Nate Thompson.

Colin Cowherd (50:51)

We're doing a new podcast together. Here we go. The Name Energy Line with Nate and jsb.

Steve Kerr (50:57)

Each week we'll get together and talk about hockey life.

Colin Cowherd (51:00)

All topics are fair game, right?

Steve Kerr (51:02)

Exactly.

Colin Cowherd (51:03)

And you'll never know who will drop by to join us. Julie is pretty well connected. She has text threads going that you wouldn't believe.

Capital One Bank Guy (51:11)

Listen to Energy Line with Nate and jsb on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts.

Colin Cowherd (51:15)

Or wherever you get your podcasts.