← The Herd with Colin Cowherd
The Herd with Colin Cowherd
Colin Cowherd Podcast Prime Cuts - Bills Dominate Chiefs, Rams Keep Getting Better, Jury Is Out On J.J. McCarthy, Caleb Williams Is Coming Along
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- [00:00]
Colin Cowherd
This is an iHeart podcast. This podcast is sponsored by PayPal. Okay, let's talk holiday shopping. When you want to make the most of your Money, head to PayPal's app before you check out. They give you the flexibility to pay in four no fees, no interest. And this is big. Bigger than the 12 foot snowman on your lawn right now. You can get 5% cash back when you pay later with PayPal. So whether it's the must have merch or for that signed jersey you've been eyeing, PayPal helps you make the most of your money this holiday. Save this offer in the PayPal app.
- [00:37]
John Middlekauff
Expires 1231 see paypal.com promoterms subject to approval.
- [00:43]
Colin Cowherd
Learn more at paypal.com payin4paypal inc.nmls910457 if you smoke or dip, I'm going to give you a few good reasons to try Zynn Zyn Nicotine Pouches. First, it's America's number one nicotine pouch brand. And and Zyn offers a robust rewards program. There's a lot of options for nicotine satisfaction, but there's only one Zyn. So if you go to zyn.com find that's z y n.com find to find Zyn at a store near you. This product does contain nicotine. Nicotine is an addictive chemical. Today's episode brought to you by a scent that's made a legendary comeback degree Original Cool Rush the OG is back and better than ever. Cool Rush isn't just a scent. It's a movement kind of fragrance Guys remember, ask for by name and rave about online. It's bold. It's fresh all day. Sweat protection, cool crisp vibe that made it legendary. So whether you're heading to the gym, the office, or just trying to stay fresh all day long, Cool Rush has your back. So if you haven't tried it yet, head to your local Walmart. Grab degree Cool Rush, the fan favorite scent from the world's number one antiperspirant brand. Get almost anything you need delivered with Uber Eats. What do you mean by almost? Well, you can't get a well groomed lawn delivered, but you can get chicken parm delivered. A little escape? No. Delicious bowl of grapes? Yeah. An afternoon stroll? Sorry, no. A burrito bowl? Happily, yes. How about the clear skies? Can't deliver that. But French fries? Yeah. Get almost almost anything delivered with Uber Eats. Order now. Alcohol in select markets. Product availability may vary by region. Ciapp for details.
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- [03:21]
Colin Cowherd
The volume all right, I'm a football fan for a long time, since the 70s. I don't watch football without something to eat and drink. Trust me, it's, it's a whole different ball game when you're eating right now. I got two things today from Uber Eats right now. When you buy one large extra most bestest pepperoni pizza from Little Caesars like this one, you get another one free. By the way, one of these has already been eaten by me and my wife 15 minutes ago. Yes, that's right. An extra extra most bestest pizza thrown in there. Extra cheese, extra pepperoni, all for the price of just one. And since Uber Eats is the official on demand food delivery partner of the NFL, you know all the game day deals keep coming all season long. Wings and tacos and subs and pizzas, chips and dips, whatever, whatever it is, Uber Eats delivers right to your door. So when your team puts up the extra point, reward yourself with an extra pizza. Order Little Caesars on Uber Eats today we did. Terms apply. See the app for details. Pizza, Pizza extra extra. Something's going on here. All right. John Middelkoff, former NFL scout, has his own podcast, Three and Out. Can't tell you how many people come up to me in Chicago GMs, they're like, oh, I love, I love middle cough so much. They never say that about me. They love you.
- [04:44]
John Middlekauff
Well, tell them I don't know if middle cop's going to the hall of Fame like, like you. So congratulations by the way. That, that's, that's pretty cool.
- [04:53]
Colin Cowherd
I appreciate it. Buffalo 28 Kansas City 21, I looked at this number today. To me, this was, this was really the game is that Mahomes was uncomfortable and Josh Allen was really comfortable. He was sacked three times, hit 15 times. And when Mahomes, John doesn't trust his offensive line, it changes. It changes the way he plays, he presses, he takes more risks. And I thought the game really came down to that is that I just thought Josh was really comfortable and Patrick wasn't.
- [05:29]
John Middlekauff
I just know this. If the Bills can find a way to play like they do against the Kansas City Chiefs in the regular season, in the postseason, they will win the super bowl because they thoroughly outplayed him today, outgained him by a hundred yards. We're up double digits in the fourth quarter. I mean, it took a fourth and 17, which only Andy Reid would have a fourth and 17 play that would come wide open. But listen, that Bill's team, that we just saw, that team can win the Super Bowl. Yeah, but we see them on a weekly basis not look as good on defense. The pass rush isn't always there. Joey Bosa looked like, I don't know, his third year with the Chargers today. So I don't know where that version of the Bills is always because they make a ton of plays when they have to against the Ravens and in the regular season. I mean, Colin, this is now kind of a theme obviously at home. And, and this is why I've been, I've said from the jump, getting home field for the Bills is really big. And today was, was a bigger game for them because at the end of the day, like Chiefs have already won Super Bowls. Like I, I think they will eventually win another one. But if they get bounced in the first or second round one year, whatever, this year for the Bills, you just have to hold serve with the Patriots. They have an easier schedule than you. They keep taking care of business. If they would have lost today, they would have been out of one game deficits and they've already lost to them. So there was a lot of pressure and in fairness, I thought they answered the bell beside a couple of plays in the second half.
- [06:47]
Colin Cowherd
Right.
- [06:48]
John Middlekauff
They were really good. Gollen.
- [06:49]
Colin Cowherd
Well, I mean, and the other thing that's, I mean, Bosa is healthy. He's 30. Greg Russo was 25, A.J. epinisa is 27. You know, these guys are in their athletic prime and they've drafted pretty well in the back end. So Denver is now on a heater. Denver's 9 and 2 and now plays Kansas City next. And Kansas City is 5 and 4 and so now Joe Alt got banged up today, but the chargers are 6 and 3. So you get into a really weird situation here where if Denver beats. I mean, it was the worst thing possible for Denver. I don't know what the line is. I'm taking Kansas City against Denver when Kansas City loses. But I think the thing that jumped out to me today was, you know, we've talked a lot about the defense. Ed Oliver didn't play, but we talk a lot about Buffalo's defense all year. So much of defense is effort, right? Like, I was, I got a. I was talking to somebody the other day about this, is that, you know, offensive players out of high school, they'll follow a coach. Offensive players want the coach. You know, defensive players, you know, they high schoolers, they want to go to big schools, right? They, they. Most defensive coaches, they see as the same thing. Defensive players are about wrecking things. And I do think when you take that Buffalo defensive front and they play Mahomes, they play differently. It's just a different. It's different than playing Michael Penix. And I've always felt offense is about choreography, but I felt like, I felt like the defensive front today for Buffalo knew the red light was on. That's what it felt like to me. It felt like they played with way more energy. Many of the same players played above what they've been playing at all year. I just, I feel like defensive players can play at a different intensity level depending on the opponent. Ten times they've played five and five, and I don't know, I thought that was the difference. I thought the defensive line for Buffalo was great.
- [08:58]
John Middlekauff
Well, can I piggyback off what, what you just said about the defense? I think, and I've said this now for a while, that when you look at the NFL and they've tried to clean up the game, right? So now when you watch, you know, guys are much safer. They take a very conscious effort to officiate dirty calls. And I think most guys now, if you're 25, you have gone through college in the NFL being taught how to hit right and not use your helmet. But I do think if we miked up defensive coordinators, like, if you got the defensive meeting room on Saturday night and before the team came out this week, and probably all week, fans would be uncomfortable what's being said in there, especially from the Buffalo side, and you could go around the league, I bet if you, if you got Brian Flores miked up this week on Wednesday night, on Saturday night, it would make a lot of People uncomfortable with what they were. I enjoy that and I know what I'm saying. But I still think the way they talk and the, what they preach is, still has similarities going back to the 80s and the 90s.
- [09:58]
Colin Cowherd
Yeah.
- [09:58]
John Middlekauff
And you know Buffalo's front is really talented and they just lost at Oliver, the, the first round draft pick from Kentucky. I mean Patrick Mahomes. Listen, I'm with you. His offensive line was in tatters. You can't throw that interception late in the game because they never got the ball back.
- [10:12]
Colin Cowherd
Right.
- [10:13]
John Middlekauff
You know, essentially. Right. So it's like that was killer. And they just need some more impact plays on defense. We'll talk about the Steelers. Well, what happened today, they're high priced guys, especially up front made huge plays.
- [10:26]
Colin Cowherd
Huge.
- [10:26]
John Middlekauff
So when, when you're playing in playoff games, I'm sure we'll talk about the baseball game too. Sometimes you just need a random guy to make a big ass play. Whether that's a tip ball for a pick, whether that's a fumble and obviously your stars to make big plays. So you know Buffalo in Coach Reed and all the Brett Veets, all these guys will tell you Josh Allen is the best player they play.
- [10:45]
Colin Cowherd
Yeah.
- [10:46]
John Middlekauff
And has been for now five years. I mean he. Cause not only he matches his play against the other randoms against them. And he's one of the rare ones, if not the only guy who has consistently done that now for four or five years.
- [10:56]
Colin Cowherd
Well, they were 60% on third down. They had 140 yards rushing. I thought, you know, and I thought it was going to be high scoring. And I was, I said I'll take Kansas City. But when these two teams play, you know, you never count Kansas City out. But I felt like today this was Buffalo's day because Buffalo had lost at home to New England. So again I watched that game. The intensity felt different today it feels different in the stadium when Kansas City plays there. You get Nance, you get Romo, it just feels different. And you know, Josh Allen, they said this during the game. 79 rushing touchdowns in eight years. Jesus, that's just insane. He is one of the things when I watch and I feel this way to a lesser degree with Lamar Jackson, but I do think there are certain things, I guess I would say this. I feel generally Kansas City has slightly better personnel than Buffalo. But right now, does Buffalo have the right ingredients? Star running back Mahomes doesn't. Better defensive front with more high level guys. Right. Chris Jones has not had a great year. So we know Buffalo and Kansas city have good GMs and great quarterbacks. And we know Andy's very clever in these games. But a lot of times, John, it's units. You know, the two times Mahomes has been blown out in Super Bowls, he had a bad O line. The O lines are both fine, although Kansas City has got overwhelmed today. But that defensive front right now for Buffalo, it reminds me there's just a lot of guys, I feel like there's just a lot of guys that play. Throw Milano in there when he's healthy. I mean, Josh is only 29. He's going to have six more cracks at the super bowl minimum. But I felt today watching him, I'm like, that's they've got it, they've had it before. But Cook playing at this level, Buffalo's got all the ingredients.
- [13:01]
John Middlekauff
I would say this too. If Kincaid is going to look like that, that's what they drafted him. High to look like a Laporta, to look like a Tucker Craft.
- [13:08]
Colin Cowherd
Yes.
- [13:08]
John Middlekauff
A Kiddle, a Kelsey. So if he's going to play like that, I mean Cook, if you had to look at 20, 25, you would say Jonathan Taylor's had the best year at running back. McCaffrey is just week in, week out bringing it. And you would put Cook, I mean he's been one of the best running backs in the NFL this year and you watch him on a weekly basis. Not really debatable. So you get high level tight end play, you get high level running back play. I would say since Cook has become a high end starter, it's really changed the Bill's offense and it's made Joe Brady look a lot better. The other thing is if you have a good defensive line, the Chiefs are missing their star rookie left tackle who's been gone now for several weeks. Today they had multiple injuries at right guard, at right or at left guard and at right tackle. Well, that means your backup left tackle is starting because Simmons is gone. So you actually are going to like a backups backup. The domino effect was pretty big and you just saw him kind of under duress. And the reality is sometimes when he's under duress, he will make decisions like, you know, other run of the mill quarterbacks and not one of the great players we've ever seen. And he did today.
- [14:14]
Colin Cowherd
All right, Minnesota 27, Detroit 24. Before we get to J.J. mcCarthy, Goff got sacked five times, hit 11, 10 tackles for loss. Brian Flores was on his game today. They couldn't run the football at all. So it was Amar on St. Brown and Sam Laporta were excellent, but Detroit could not run the ball. And that's kind of the engine that makes everything slick and click there. J.J. mcCarthy was. After the first couple of drives, he was about 50% again, but I got two touchdowns, ran for another. Okay on third down. I thought he was very good in the scripted stuff early. Overall, he moves well. He looks, it's funny about size. He looks a little small to me. It's so funny. Mahomes is six one and a half. Feels huge to me. I don't even. Aaron Rodgers is six one and a half. He feels six four. McCarthy sometimes feels like he gets engulfed, but overall I thought he moved well and played pretty well. Did you have a strong take on him?
- [15:11]
John Middlekauff
I. I think your take on the weight, I think it's a girth thing. You know, the size, the thickness. Because Russell Wilson never felt like he was small. Right. Even though he's 5 10. He. Because he's 220 pounds.
- [15:20]
Colin Cowherd
Yeah.
- [15:21]
John Middlekauff
Caleb's a good example.
- [15:22]
Colin Cowherd
Yeah.
- [15:22]
John Middlekauff
Shorter, but feels like he's 215.
- [15:24]
Colin Cowherd
Caleb's 6ft tall. I'm taller than Caleb by like an inch.
- [15:28]
John Middlekauff
One thing we said about JJ last year during the injury, and I think Albert Brewer, a bunch of guys, he lost a bunch of weight and was like 185 pounds. So I think it's harder for Mahomes probably weighs 230 pounds. So I think that factors in. The number one thing with JJ today were the good plays, were touchdowns. So if you're going to count for three touchdowns, you could have 20 incompletions and have some terrible plays. It's when you're not scoring and bringing none of that to the table, it's just a complete disaster. Flores, I thought if you were going to give one game ball to a coach today, it probably have to go to him because you're on the road in Detroit. That was. That. That was excellent. I mean, his guys were flying around. Goff's good against the blitz and early on I think they had blitz like five or six times. It sacked him on two of them. Goff was all out of sync. Their offense was out of sync. And I, it. It felt like he gave the speech, we're going to have to win this thing.
- [16:25]
Colin Cowherd
Yeah.
- [16:26]
John Middlekauff
Because in fairness, coming into that game and they kept hitting on it. On the broadcast of. I thought Tom did a good job. He said there's no one disputing his arm strength. But, you know, Burkhart must have come in late from the baseball game last night. Was there Talk about a guy grinding. And Brady's big thing was clearly he knows Kevin pretty well. It's like sometimes you need to do a changeup, sometimes we need to get some off speed. Sometimes you need touch balls.
- [16:54]
Colin Cowherd
Yes.
- [16:54]
John Middlekauff
Because you watch the arm strength is fine. But on some of these balls over the middle on third and eight. And even in his interception was a little behind his accuracy. Like Caleb, like some of these guys is a work in progress.
- [17:06]
Colin Cowherd
Yeah. JJ's interception was low and down and it. And the Lions player came over it. No, that's. That's. Matt Stafford is the master of tempo. Like he can sling it sidearm, he can throw. He. And I think it's just, it is a little bit like being a baseball pitcher. I. What I worry about with J.J. mcCarthy is. And I felt like this with Brock Purdy, you know, when the Niners. Christian McCaffrey is upright, I don't even care who the quarterback is. I mean, like if Christian McCaffrey plays today, he had half their yards. It doesn't matter if it's Mack Jones or Brock Purdy. I do feel with Kevin o', Connell, Justin Jefferson, good left tackle. I kind of feel like it's hard to evaluate JJ because the coach, the left tackle and the receiver are so good. It's like San Francisco with Kyle and Chris McCaffrey. And then when Kittle's healthy and Jennings can be, you know, highly productive, how valuable is the quarterback? So this isn't anti JJ McCarthy. I just think, I think again, I think I just need more of him. I just have to see more games. I thought Brian Flores was game ball. Brian Flores, that.
- [18:16]
John Middlekauff
That's why I think it's fair for J.J. mcCarthy, the bar of how he's being judged should be higher than a lot of random young quarterbacks on bad teams. When you play for crappy franchises and you lose, I expect that, like whoever the Carolina Panthers draft, I don't expect it to look great. But when you get Justin Jefferson in his prime, Hawkinson, Jordan Addison, Kevin o'. Connell, if we had a coaching draft, where would Kevin O. He'd go in the top five.
- [18:42]
Colin Cowherd
Yes.
- [18:43]
John Middlekauff
So everything. And this was Trey Lance's thing. When you get drafted to a team whose expectations are, yeah, let's win 14 games and compete for the conference championship, you just get judged a lot differently. And I'll give JJ credit, in the Bears game, he had huge moments in a big time today. At the end of the game with the game on the line, his coach put it in his hands and he delivered and that's where I think a lot of his defenders go with the quote unquote, he's a winner. There is some winning characteristics when you're comfortable in big moments. You go back to that moment against Alabama where it looked like Harbaugh had this all time great roster and he was going to lose in the, in the playoffs to Nick Saban on probably I bet Nick would say one of his worst ever playoff teams. JJ made some great plays. You watched his first start against the Bears, big spot, made some great plays. And today on I thought they were just going to run it and just hey, lean it on floors. They put it in his hands. Great throw Colin. Not a good throw.
- [19:38]
Colin Cowherd
A great throw. Yeah, well when I watched him at Michigan that was always my take. Moves well gritty kid, didn't make a ton of big throws but he'd make one or two NFL Sunday throws. He can make the big throws. So I just don't have a ton, you know, I mean like say what you want about Bo Nix. I've got like a six game winning streak and he's got a 119 passer rating, nine touchdowns, no pick in the fourth quarter. I've got a lot of samples of Bo Nicks. He can have gaps but late he's really good. So with jj I've never been a huge believer but I thought you know what to go to Detroit you got the, you know you win a lot of different ways. Not every Sunday for Brady was great. That Teddy Bruski crew. There were days that Tom didn't do a lot of heavy lifting. He was 20 at 28 with a lot of underneath stuff. So yeah, if I was going to.
- [20:33]
John Middlekauff
Defend, you know, JJ hasn't been playing, Carson has or but definitely Caleb Williams their D. I mean Caleb's defense. Sometimes you watch the Bears on defense and they just look atrocious. And Minnesota till today they had been pretty bad this season, Colin. I mean today was even today they gave, it's not like they gave up 10 points. I mean they, and they had some drop balls. I mean there were plays to be made like the defense is on those two teams. I mean Bo Nix, we might have just watched the two best defense of the league play each other today, right? The physicality of Denver and Houston and how good their defensive lines are. So anytime you have a defense that is that good, that's back you up when you're not making plays. But I'd say all three of these guys have one thing going for him. J.J. mcCarthy. Now obviously Caleb and Bo Nix making plays in big spots. And I think when you look at Caleb and Bo Nix, they've had a lot of snaps now in their career.
- [21:25]
Colin Cowherd
Well, they also had Sean Payton. I mean, look at the, look at the coaches.
- [21:29]
John Middlekauff
Kevin o', Connell, Ben Johnson.
- [21:30]
Colin Cowherd
Ben Johnson. Such an advantage. Such a huge advantage. Today's show is brought to you by our new presenting sponsor, Hard Rock Bet. This is that golden time of the year when it's not just pro football, NBA, college football, college hoops, hockey, all share the stage. There's always something to bet on. If you haven't tried your first bet on Hard Rock Bet yet, there's still time to get 150 bucks in bonus bets. If you win, all you have to do is place $5 bet. That's it. Five bucks. If it hits you, not only get your winnings, but 150 bucks in extra bonus bets. And if you're looking for an edge before you lock in, check out the Hard Rock Bet Stats Hub trends. It's loaded with streaks stats to help guide your pick. So numbers don't lie. Neither does the data in there. The Hard Rock Bet App Sportsbook. It's the only legal sportsbook for whenever you're in Florida. It's also live in Arizona, Ohio, New Jersey, Indiana, Tennessee, Virginia, Illinois, Colorado. Coming soon to more plus, Hard Rock Bet offers new promos every single day. So whenever you are listening, just open the app, check out what you've got. Any day of the week, download the Hard Rock Bet app and make your first deposit payable and bonus bets. Not a cash offer offered by the Seminole Tribe of Florida in Florida. Offered by Seminole Hard Rock Digital LLC in Alder States. Must be 21 plus and physically present in Arizona, Colorado, Florida, Illinois, Indiana, New Jersey, Ohio, Tennessee or Virginia. To play terms and conditions apply. Concern about gambling In Florida, call 1-888- admit it in Indiana. If you or somebody you know has a problem wants help, call 1-800-9 with it. Gambling problem. Call 1-800- GAMBLER Arizona, Colorado, Illinois, New Jersey, Ohio, Tennessee, Virginia. This podcast is sponsored by PayPal. Okay, let's talk holiday shopping. When you want to make the most of your Money, head to PayPal's app before you check out. They give you the flexibility to pay in four no fees, no interest. And this is big. Bigger than the 12 foot snowman on your lawn right now. You can get 5% cash back when you pay later with PayPal. So whether it's the must have merch or for that signed jersey you've been eyeing PayPal helps you make the most of your money this holiday. Save this offer in the PayPal app expires 1231.
- [23:39]
John Middlekauff
See paypal.com promoterms Subject to approval.
- [23:43]
Colin Cowherd
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Colin Cowherd
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Colin Cowherd
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- [27:17]
Colin Cowherd
You know what's remarkable to me and maybe it's I was thinking about this today. So the Rams beat the Saints 34 to 10. Time of business possession was 43 minutes to 17. I mean it was. It almost felt like a practice. Is that whereas Philadelphia and Green Bay kind of struggle to figure out what they are because the Dodgers are taking so much glare in Los Angeles away from football and should The Rams are really good. I mean we forget they went in London and they blow out Jacksonville like 35 to 7. Rams right now John are really really good. Puka came back today. Corum played okay. They have a two headed run game now they have four healthy tight ends. Jordan Winningham, that six round draft pick. They have a six and a seventh round wide receiver that can play a little bit. The defense is excellent up front. I think quietly. I mean if you took and I really believe this. I think the Rams are the most consistent, best coached right now. Healthiest team. I don't think the O line is great. I think it's very good. I think they have a great guard tandem. But I you know and I had this was a lower right hand corner game as I was watching Kansas City and Buffalo but Jesus, I mean it was. I mean we've seen a lot of upsets this year and a lot of weird shit. That thing today was a practice. It was just, it was just easy peasy. And I mean Stafford at one point I don't know what he finished. He had four touchdowns, no picks. Jesus. They were getting seven yards a carry. The Rams are really good.
- [29:09]
John Middlekauff
He was 34, 32 for 280 yards and four touchdowns.
- [29:12]
Colin Cowherd
34.
- [29:15]
John Middlekauff
The the other or no 20, 24, 32 for 280. So he had eight incompletions. I'd say the scary thing these last couple games is Devonte has five touchdowns. So when that you figure out that report to go along with Puka now Puka at any moment, you know, take some vicious hits, he runs guys over, you know, it's can this guy stay healthy. But when those two guys are on the field right now, they're, they're as good of a 1, 2 combo as like in terms of production. And what they bring to the table is like Chase and Higgins, they're on kind of unstoppable. And the one thing with Devonte, he's very comfortable with the high end veteran quarterback in, in his prime. With Aaron, it's kind of starting to feel like that those guys cohesion, especially in the, in the red zone has Matt Stafford kind of quietly because you know, today I don't think super, a lot of people are dialed into the Saints game, right? But four touchdowns, five touchdowns.
- [30:08]
Colin Cowherd
Oh, he hit the jag.
- [30:10]
John Middlekauff
I think he threw three in that loss against the Niners. He's got to be directly in the mix.
- [30:14]
Colin Cowherd
So I have said this before, this sounds crazy. So he was better than Aaron Rodgers in high school and he was better than Aaron in college and he was better than Aaron for the first four years of his NFL career. He's been better than Aaron for the last four years of his NFL career. Aaron had a 10, 11 year stretch at Green Bay where Matt Stafford was, you know, he was with a losing organization and Aaron had the well run outfit. What if Matt Stafford wins another Super bowl now think about that. He's got a better playoff record. He was better early, better late. If Matt Stafford win, well, he's already a Hall. I think he's a Hall of Famer now, right? Matt Stafford's a Hall of Fame right now.
- [30:59]
John Middlekauff
I'd put him in.
- [31:00]
Colin Cowherd
Yeah. Yeah. What if Matt Stafford wins a second Super Bowl? He's always been considered one of the best arm talents of our generation. That's indisputable. You could ask anybody. The Brady's, ask Aaron, ask Favre, they all go, yeah, Stafford's it. Where do you put them all time. Serious, serious question. Matt Stafford wins his second Super Bowl. I'm telling you, there's not a lot of guys I'd put above him. I mean he doesn't have, he doesn't have quite the gravitas of your Brady, Montana, Manning and Elway. But Marino's got new. No Super Bowls. He's got two. I don't know. I. Stafford is watching him this season. Shit man, he is. He is dialed in, he's comfortable. I don't know. What do you do with him all time if he wins a second?
- [31:48]
John Middlekauff
Well, to me it's hard. I mean you could make the argument Aaron's a top five guy, you know, with, with Manning, Montana, Brady Elway, pretty short list to me. I don't think most people would include Stafford in the top 10 of quarterbacks. Now granted he played for the Lions and not the Dan Campbell Lions.
- [32:05]
Colin Cowherd
Would you have put him right? If he has a second super bowl, he's a better arm talent than Drew Brees. Matt.
- [32:11]
John Middlekauff
Yeah, to me there is not. If I could get here, here's the argument. If you could get 23 year old Matt Stafford or and start listing out quarterbacks, he would go ahead of a lot of guys because he's showing now. What if Matt Stafford had been drafted by a Harbaugh brother, an Andy Reid, a Sean Payton right when he was 23 instead of going to the Lions who always drafted high, right. And their two best players beside him quit at 30 years old. I mean it's a pretty the Lions that if you're a 12 year old kid right now, you can't even comprehend this conversation. But I do think that the time in with the Lions he has had years where he's thrown a lot of picks. He can be a little reckless. The way he's playing right now though, like his ceiling. The one, one thing I will say about this, his ceiling is as high as any player. Yeah ever. Like he can go toe to toe when he's on. I say this about Cam. Cam can have individual games where he can outplay any guy in the league and that was prime Brady, prime Manning. Now Stafford's a better player than Camp but in that same vein of like if you get Stafford in the right day or the right month, he can just be the best player in the league now. And he's. I do think this second kind of iteration of his career with Sean is going to be a really powerful moment for his career and he'll have like the, the Kurt Warner type the individual seasons. I just think it's hard to shake that, that lion stretch because well, winning and losing isn't a quarterback statistic. Most good quarterbacks win a lot. Not all his fault, but I do think he probably developed some bad habits there.
- [33:44]
Colin Cowherd
Let's talk some World Series. So that's about as good a World Series, especially game six and seven as I've ever seen in my life. So, you know, I thought it was really interesting. You know, Dave Roberts pulled all these levers, you know, like, he just pulled all these levers. And to win a World Series where, you know, he puts in Rojas and then the out the defensive outfielder in the ninth, and he goes with Yoshi again, everything worked. But I think, you know, as I was. I was talking to a friend about this. Is that Ohtani, Roki and Yoshi. And right now, Yoshi is arguably the best pitcher, and Ohtani is the best player. Roki's been moved to the pen. But these Japanese stars and Japanese baseball is like really high, high aaa. It's not quite the bigs, but it's. It's. There's great players and it's a. The Dodgers have so separated financially from everybody else on, I mean, on the west coast that I mean, they always had money. But the gap now between the Dodgers and the Giants and everybody else, the Angels and the Mariners, is that these Japanese stars, between weather and proximity and how well run the organization is. And the Dodgers are smart. So they said, listen, the only downside, the taxes just defer the payment so you can get paid when you've retired and live somewhere else, is that. A friend of mine in New York was saying, God, our teams are bad. But I said, New York is cold, it's intense. A much harsher media, the city tax, L.A. is spread out. You can hide. I mean, I never see. I was in LA nine years. I'm here right now. You never see pro athletes in la. You can just hide. You never see celebrities in la, and they're everywhere. There's writers, directors, star. I mean, look how many pro teams are in la. You never see athletes ever. It's just so spread out. There's so many gated communities. Calabasas, Hidden Hills, Malibu. You know, everybody's got these enclaves. Beverly Hills, Bel Air, windy road. You can hide, Thousand Oaks. And I think. I think they. I think the Dodgers right now, Steve Cohen's got money with the Mets. The Yankees have money. They just feel like with these Japanese stars. And you know, the other thing, John, those guys don't listen to our media. It's like international NBA players, they come here, they play, and then they go home. They don't get caught up. They play. So, I mean, Yoshi plays so loose in these big spots. He's so unaffected by the intensity and the chaos of the World Series. I don't know. I just look at the Dodgers and I'm not sure there's another organization in North America that's run like they are.
- [36:35]
John Middlekauff
One of my best friends played college baseball and one of his teammates, you know, was like a fringe big leaguer, AAA guy and signed a deal with the Japanese team. When Ohtani, right before he came over, when he was alleged over there, and they went over and visited and went to the games and they were at the highest level and they said that it felt like an SEC football game. The intensity in the environment in Japan, the way these Yamamoto and Ohtani grew up playing, I mean they make it right when they're 16, 17, 18 years old, start playing in that league. And they just said the intensity of the crowd would be like going to Alabama, Auburn, how much these people know about baseball and how much they care. So these guys, the bright lights, completely unfazed. When, when Ohtani was like one of 25 through the first whatever of the playoffs, it wasn't because he was overwhelmed. He couldn't see the baseball. Right, right. But the difference, I would say of baseball, like the warriors can't win unless Steph is incredible during the playoffs. Right. In the NFL you could have a random guy make a big play in a Super bowl or an NFC championship, but your stars, your star quarterback, star pass rusher have to come through or you will lose. In baseball, that's not really how it works.
- [37:43]
Colin Cowherd
Yeah.
- [37:43]
John Middlekauff
I mean, I was a Giants fan. Cody Ross in 2010 hit home runs off Roy Halliday that no one saw coming. In Philadelphia, the Dodgers won the World Series last night, you could argue because they rolled out four guys they're paying a combined $1.5 billion to or because their ninth hitter in the, in the ninth inning hits a game tying home run where they were going to lose the World Series. And then that same guy almost falls, throws home and then their backup center fielder who had been benched, I'm watching with my wife, she falls out of her chair, she's like, what just happened? That had to be one of the crazier plays in World Series because it looked like he was going to basket catch it and this random center fielder tackles him like he's Ed Reed across the middle and, and saves the game. But that's baseball. It's not, it wasn't Ohtani hitting the walk, it was Will Smith. Will Smith, Rojas and that big guy in center field.
- [38:37]
Colin Cowherd
Yeah, it's, that's what makes baseball pretty.
- [38:40]
John Middlekauff
Unique in the playoffs. It's not just your stars.
- [38:43]
Colin Cowherd
Yeah. And I think, and again, even when if you go back and look at the great Yankee teams with Jeter and Bernie and Posada. You know, it was Scott Brocius from McMinnville, Oregon coming up big. So, like, nobody had a problem when the Yankees were buying the best players because people understood that Posada and Jeter, that was part of the Yankee farm system. Well, go look at the Dodgers. They haven't missed. I mean, they draft. I mean, Max Muncie was released from Oakland. I think they traded for Blake Snell. I mean, these guys are available on the market. The Steinbrenners could have afforded to buy Yoshi. They spent 300 million. The Dodgers had 335. They don't win the series without him. So they identify who they want. They are aggressive. I think where the Dodgers where I see their money being an advantage because Mookie Betts did not outside of September, just didn't hit this year. Played a very good shortstop, didn't hit. Freddie Freeman's more offensive, the defensive player. And Ohtani had real struggles at the plate throughout the playoffs. Where the Dodgers have an advantage a the Asian stars, obviously, but it's to get a. To get a glass now or a Snell who may not give you a ton of starts during the regular season. Most teams cannot afford to pay a guy if he's not giving you 25. I mean, Yoshi's the only guy that never misses a start. Like he's a true bonafide ace like Verlander in his prime. You're getting 30 starts. They can go get a Snell and a glass now. Remarkably talented guys and get 1012 starts in the regular season and just push them off to September. That's the advantage they have. But you can also. Lots of teams could defer payments and they don't. The Dodgers do. So yes, money is clearly an ex. But I think to your point, Yoshi was great, but there were a lot of guys slumping. I mean, if you go back to this World Series, the Blue Jays out hit the Dodgers. I mean, the Dodgers in game six one, I think they had four hits. I mean, they struggled the whole series to hit.
- [40:47]
John Middlekauff
I actually think baseball is much closer to football in terms of. In the Dodgers was two years ago. I mean, almost got beat by the Padres in the play. It's the baseball. I don't care how good your team is in basketball. When I got the Kevin Durant Warriors, I'm going to need Achilles tears and ACL tears to lose. Other than that, I'm a lock to win. Shaq, Kobe, Lake or Some of these teams, it's going to be 90% chance I win. The Dodgers roster can't get much better, and it was really difficult for them to win. Honestly, they probably should have lost. You know, that's baseball, though.
- [41:18]
Colin Cowherd
They won a World Series last year with really average starting pitching, and they won a World Series this year with a really average bullpen, which is virtually impossible to do if you're leaking in the back end. I mean, Yoshi basically is why they won the World Series. But I will say, having spent nine years full time in Los Angeles, they just don't make a lot of mistakes. They don't. I mean, they let Zach Grinke go. They could have made a big bid for him. He went to Arizona. They let Manny Machado go. They don't make a lot of mistakes. And they've also let Cody Bellinger go. They've let good players leave. So money's obviously a part, but I mean, the truth is, in the NBA during the David Stern years, money was a part, but the New York Knicks weren't winning. Some people don't spend the money as wisely. I mean, we know game day revenue. The Giants and the jets have much greater game day revenue than Green Bay. Green Bay spends their money more wisely.
- [42:22]
John Middlekauff
When I was working in radio, I got to go to a lot of the A's were really good then kind of in Billy Beane's prime, and the Giants were winning a bunch of World Series. And I think sometimes in baseball, especially probably over the last decade, it gets overlooked because we spend so much time talking about these kind of the quote unquote nerds running the sport.
- [42:39]
Colin Cowherd
Right.
- [42:39]
John Middlekauff
I do think the best kind of nerds understand character and cohesion. And one thing you watch with the Dodgers, like, feels like all these guys like each other. And they got a good. I would say with the Blue Jays, it jumped off the screen. It was like, yeah, this. This team looks like a college team all playing together. The San Francisco Giants. You always have that. Billy Bean always did a really good job of finding the right mix of guys. Baseball is about more. And you watch the Yankees, it seems like missing a little something. That's the knock. Like, at the end of the day in baseball, you still got to have some fast guys that can run. And you watch the Dodgers, definitely the Blue Jays, they got their best players are athletes. The Yankees are a good example. Their best players all look like, you know, move like defensive tackles. It's like, you guys need a little speed.
- [43:19]
Colin Cowherd
Well, the Yankees strike out too much. They don't play small ball. The Dodgers have the ability to. I mean, listen, Toronto hit the ball more consistently. The Dodgers had the better starting pitching. I mean, if you go back to last year's World Series, the only time the Yankees competed with the Dodgers is when Garrett Cole pitched. The Yankees didn't look athletic enough, didn't run the bases well. They're not a very good defensive team. The Yankees strike out too much and they have tons of money. So, you know, I mean, you think.
- [43:48]
John Middlekauff
That'S one of the most thrilling endings to a World Series you've ever seen?
- [43:52]
Colin Cowherd
I mean, I think game six and game seven, the final innings are the greatest, most drama filled. You have to go Back to the 75 thing. It was 75 World Series. It was Reds against the Red Sox. It's that Carlton Fisk homer at Fenway where he's, you know, waving at it. And I remember watching that as a kid. I mean, that's the first baseball memory I have is like the 74, 75, 76 Cincinnati Reds. Because I was in Seattle, we didn't have the Mariners yet. And that's when I fell in love with football over baseball. But mid-70s, the Big Red machine, I fell in love with it. And that had. I mean, I can go back to that series and throw names at you of guys you've never heard, but I thought the magnitude, it was just so. I mean, you had. Dave Roberts had to pull so many damn levers, you know, going with Rojas, like old guy. I'm not even sure when his last home run was. Dave Roberts said after his wife kept telling Rojas the whole series, you're going to hit a home run in the series. You are. And he's like, I'm not playing, I'm not getting up. She's like, you're going to hit a home run tonight. So I just thought it was, it was just everything. The announcing, the imagery, Fox, the Blue Jays. I mean, Blue Jays over under was like 78 and a half. Talk about a team that just mashed and overachieved. Good for them. This podcast is sponsored by PayPal. Okay, let's talk holiday shopping. When you want to make the most of your Money, head to PayPal's app before you check out. They give you the flexibility to pay in four. No fees, no interest. And this is big. Bigger than the 12 foot snowman on your lawn right now. You can get 5% cash back when you pay later with PayPal. So whether it's the must have merch or for that signed jersey you've been eyeing. PayPal helps you make the most of your money this holiday. Save this offer in the PayPal app expires 1231.
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Colin Cowherd
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- [49:25]
Colin Cowherd
Let's pivot now to the Bears. Sure they got the coach and the quarterback. The defense stinks. We still don't like the owner. The front office, I doubt. I love the coach. The quarterback. Super talented. There's a lot they're not doing right. But like a political party, the Bears now lead the NFL in big plays. That's good for me. And isn't it? They're a flawed team from ownership down, but they got the two things that appears right.
- [49:54]
Guest Analyst
Absolutely. There's no question. I mean the the one I always say, because it's a fun turn of the phrase is like the Bengals were the Bungles until they got Joe Burrow. You know the, the, the Chiefs didn't win a single game with a quarterback they drafted since Todd Blackledge and then it was Patrick Mahomes.
- [50:11]
John Middlekauff
You know.
- [50:12]
Guest Analyst
So like it can change on a dime and I find it to be amazing that the Bears are fourth and rushing, fourth in yards, sixth and scoring.
- [50:23]
Colin Cowherd
Crazy.
- [50:24]
Guest Analyst
Back in an explosive plays and everyone's like is Caleb good? I'm like and listen and by the way, to be fair, to be fair, as someone who's watched every snap of every game closer than any team in the NFL like they they got some of those numbers got fat against Dallas and Cincinnati. Objectively true. And some of the explosive play stuff is running game based and they've been much better running out of the buy Washington, New Orleans, Baltimore and then the game last week. But so it's not all because of Caleb. Caleb's not playing as well as Drake May. Caleb's not playing as well as Josh Allen or Patrick Mahomes. But if you told me 25 games into his career on his third play caller and second head coach that they would have, by the numbers, a top 10 offense and a winning record in year two, 100% of Bears fans would have signed up for it.
- [51:22]
Colin Cowherd
That, that's what I always tell whenever my wife's, you know, getting a little concerned about our kids. I'm like, if I'd have told you 20 years ago when we met, none of them would be in jail. None would have a drug problem. We'd have a vacation home and a nice house and our kids would still call us. Would you have signed up for it? Yes. Then don't worry about tomorrow. It's all good. Think about this. So my take is every NFL offense has a hole. Let me give an example. I'm going to give you the best offenses in the NFL. Two weeks ago, what you thought. Green Bay today, they have no offensive identity. These are the better offenses. The Rams, Puka's always hurt and Stafford has no mobility. Philadelphia depends on the game in the half. Denver, terrible offense for three quarters every single game. San Francisco battle line, totally. Christian McCaffrey depended. Indianapolis. Does anybody like Daniel Jones? I just named the good offenses in the NFL. Right, Right. So the truth is we pay so much attention to offense. Danny. That, and I'm guilty of this. We nitpick the Bears big plays, run the ball well coached, take it.
- [52:39]
Guest Analyst
No doubt. No doubt. And I have. I came into the year with optimism but with zero percent. Like they're a contender or they're going to win the Super Bowl. So to me, this season has been, it's been a little bit of like heart attack inducing. I might say some things during these Bear games that if like anyone other than like Nick Wright was next to me, I'd be like, that might get me canceled. Like, you know what I mean? Like, it's a stressful watch, but I have no illusions that this is a great team. Like the, the defense is flawed, the quarterback is young. It's a new system. The they've got, they've had serious left tackle questions. Their two best cornerbacks are hurt. We don't know if Jalen Johnson is coming back like this year. He'll come back eventually. Obviously. Like, they're not going to win the Super Bowl. They probably won't make the playoffs, though they might. We'll see. Because weird things happen in the NFL. But again, like, do you have the coach and quarterback? I can work with that.
- [53:40]
John Middlekauff
Yeah, because.
- [53:41]
Guest Analyst
Because they also. It's not just like the. They got a lot of talent. I hear you talk about this all the time. Like, Odunze is talented. Loveland is talented. Their right tackle, Darnell Wright, looks like a stud for years.
- [53:53]
Colin Cowherd
DeAndre Swift is an excellent top 12 back.
- [53:56]
Sponsor Voice 2
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- [53:57]
Guest Analyst
Manon guy who is. Has been great the last game and a half since Swift has been hurt.
- [54:01]
John Middlekauff
Looks.
- [54:02]
Guest Analyst
Looks good. They have pieces, they have talent, and they are clearly on the up and up. And Caleb, he gives them a ceiling that feels kind of limitless because of how crazy the physical talent is. Like, if Ben Johnson can actually get him to be 90% of what his talent suggests that he should be, the Bears are going to be good for the next decade.
- [54:28]
Colin Cowherd
Darnold's an amazing story. We were talking about this in the show today. I said, you see all the time where a great actor, Tom Hanks, takes a bad movie, the Terminal, and you're like, oh, Marlon Brando did that. You'd have, you know, on the Waterfront and he had six bombs. You see great restaurants lose a chef, they go from Michelin star to just a really good restaurant. You never see terrible hot dog on a stick become Zagat rated. Like, that's not the way it works. There is no terrible to great from actors. You're either like, straight to video. Lindsay Lohan doesn't become Meryl Streep. It doesn't work that way. Except Sam Darnold. It's not that he was terrible. Then he became pretty good because Baker won a playoff game and in that year had a 96 passer rating. He was never terrible.
- [55:14]
John Middlekauff
Right.
- [55:15]
Guest Analyst
I mean, Daniel Jones got a second contract. Daniel. Daniel Jones won a playoff game. Sam Darnold was terrible. But he also, like, what did he have? 40 starts? 30, 35, 38 starts. Like, it wasn't like that large of a body of work.
- [55:31]
Colin Cowherd
He came into the league at 21. He was so young to think about that. He came into the league, yeah. Four years into the league. He was younger than guys that were getting drafted. Right?
- [55:43]
Guest Analyst
Yeah. And that's. I mean, that's like. Like, I think Trevor Lawrence and Michael Penix are the same age, like, right now, which is just like a weird. It's like a weird thing to deal with. And so, yeah, like, to me, the most interesting part of this is. I mean, obviously the Darnold story is incredible. And I think Seattle is the only team in the NFL right now top five in offense and top five in defense. Like, we have to treat them as Real. I did not believe in that Vikings team last year. I'm just not to. I, I do believe in the Seahawks team, but I want to know what teams are going to do. Like, are the Colts not going to give up on Anthony Richardson? Like, obviously, Daniel Jones is working. They just traded for Sauce Gardner. They're all in. They'll probably franchise tag Daniel Jones, I would imagine. But, like, is the lesson that these teams are going to take from Sam Darnold and Baker Mayfield and Daniel Jones being like, we can't give up on guys. Like, we don't have to play them, but we cannot give up on talent. Like, if we truly believe that there is a franchise quarterback in here, it would be. It would haunt me if I'm a Browns fan to see Baker Mayfield doing this or if I'm a Panther fan to see Baker Mayfield and Sam. And Sam Darnold doing this. I don't know how you, how you go to sleep. Go to sleep at night.
- [57:01]
Colin Cowherd
Okay, so what do Baker and Sam have in common? Baker went to Cleveland and then Carolina. Poorly run teams. And then McVeigh said, I like him. Okay, okay. Sam, Jets, Carolina. Then Kyle Shanahan's like, I like him. Is that. It could be in venture capitalism, it could be on Wall Street. It can be in sports. The smart take from the less skilled and the less smart is that the smartest people in the NFL, Daniel Jones goes from the shipwreck known as the New York Giants and Kevin o' Connell in season vultures circles, I'll take him. And then from there, Shane Steichen goes, they'll all take him. Is that there's a handful of super smart offensive guys and they look at all these bad. Smart people figure out who can play and who can't. By the way, Kyle Shanahan looked at Mac Jones. Shocker. Belichick didn't get him. Jacksonville stumbled. Oh, what a shock. Shanahan's like, no, actually throws a really good ball. I think we'll take him. There's about eight guys in this league now, maybe 10, but eight. And they're really smart. They're with winning organizations. And this happens in every walk of life. They go to the bad organizations with worse GMs, bad scouts, lousy coaches, lousy coordinators, scouting directors that are suboptimal, and they just raid them. Almost all of these reclamation projects started with bad franchises and get picked up by the smartest GMs in the league.
- [58:34]
Guest Analyst
Yeah, but the bad franchises don't believe that they're bad. Like, you know, they. It's delusional. Like, but I. So you're right. But Sean McVeigh can't sign everybody. Kyle Shanahan can't sign everybody. Like, at some.
- [58:47]
John Middlekauff
I just.
- [58:49]
Guest Analyst
I don't know what I think. Anthony Richardson's a decent example. And listen, Shane Steichen might just be an awesome coach, like one eight games and nine games with Gardner Minshew and Anthony Richardson and has a shot at the one seed with Daniel Jones. Right. Like, Shane Steichen might just be the next name that we need to include with andy Reid and McVeigh and Shannon.
- [59:08]
Colin Cowherd
He is right.
- [59:09]
John Middlekauff
That is.
- [59:10]
Guest Analyst
That is certainly on the board. But then my guess is.
- [59:15]
John Middlekauff
Two years.
- [59:16]
Guest Analyst
From now, Anthony Richardson is still a cult. They'll just be like, why give up on him? Like, we'll. We'll just. We'll keep him. We'll keep developing. And we're going to. We drafted him fourth overall. He can run like Lamar Jackson, but he's built like Cam Newton. Like, he's got an arm like Herbert. Like, we're going to just see if we can develop in between the years and slow the game down for him. So it'll just be interesting to me to see if teams, instead of like, cutting guys loose, be like, we'll just, we'll sit you for a little while. Like, we're not. We're not going to let the Baker Mayfield story happen to us because it's just a painful thing for an organization to go through to. Like, to see you, you drafted the right guy. So it's not. And then he's awesome elsewhere. So, like, the only. It's on you. It's just got to be such a shameful feeling for those organizations. The volume.
- [60:10]
Colin Cowherd
This is an I Heart podcast.