← The Herd with Colin Cowherd
The Herd with Colin Cowherd
Colin Cowherd Podcast Prime Cuts - Final Four Preview, Tiger’s Troubles, Elite NBA Draft Class
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This is an iHeart podcast. Guaranteed Human.
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Today's podcast brought to you by Ferguson Home, where it all comes together. Whether you're a homeowner creating your dream space or a pro managing multiple projects, Ferguson Home is where you'll find top products by brands like LG. Visit your local showroom or visit FergusonHome.com
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and Doug, there's nowhere I wouldn't go
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to help someone customize and save on car insurance with Liberty Mutual. Even if it means sitting front row at a comedy show. Hey everyone, check out this guy and his bird. What is this, your first date?
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We help people customize and save on car insurance with Liberty Mutual together.
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We're married.
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Me to a human, him to a bird. Yeah, the bird looks out of your league anyways.
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Only pay for what you need@libertymutual.com Liberty.
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Liberty. Liberty. Liberty. I'm Daniel Alarcon and this is my friend. He's much more famous than I am. I wouldn't go that far, but I'm John Green, co host of the podcast the Away End with my old friend Daniel. On our podcast the Away End, we'll share with you you the magic of international football, all leading up to the 2026 World Cup. Together we'll find out why of all the unimportant things football, soccer is the most important. Listen to the Away End with Daniel Alarcon and John green on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts. The volume.
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Today's show is brought to you by our presenting sponsor, American Beverage. If you think about some of the most iconic drinks in the country, the ones you grab at a barbe, the ones you raised to celebrate your team, that have been part of your story for decades. Coke, Dr. Pepper, Pepsi. There's something people don't always think about. The companies behind those brands are still making their drinks right here in the US While there's a lot of talk about bringing manufacturing back, America's beverage companies never left. They're American companies making American products with American workers in America's hometown. So 275,000 men and women across all 50 states. Real jobs, good paying jobs. The kind of jobs you can raise a family on. So more than 100 years, those brands have been part of everyday lives. And they're still here, still investing, still, still operating in communities around the country. So if you care about strong local economies and companies that walk the walk, check out the good work and what they're doing@wedeliver for America.org all right. Well, it's March and it's madness. There weren't a ton of upsets in the tournament. I guess Iowa over Florida is the big one. So I got, you know, I. Michigan and Arizona are the two best teams I've seen. And I thought, I'm going to call Doug Gottlieb coaching now. The Green Bay Phoenix. Second year, they finished third in the Horizon League his first year, his top scorers all got hurt. Second year, he builds it back up and they were very viable to the very end. And I've been keeping in contact with Doug and his basketball journey and I thought, let's get him on here and talk about a lot of different stuff. I told Doug today, I said, hey, this Yukon Duke game, it's getting lopsided if you want to, if you want to record this early. He's like, hold on. It's, it's, it's Dan Hurley. Let's hold on. And he was right. So it's good seeing you. We've talked several times. You know, Doug, it's funny about UConn. I mean, we both lived there for a long time. It's really. They're like a pitcher who gets better in the later innings. Like, they're so good in the second half. They just wear you down. They're so physical. The boozer kids had a couple of bad turnovers. It's just like they're kind of built for March. The refs let you play a little bit like the NBA playoffs. The games get physical. Were you shocked they came back to beat Duke?
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Yes. Yeah. From this perspective, you know, again, like, you watch it, I've always watched it a little bit differently. Right. In my analyst days. Now as a coach, you watch it completely differently. And I was so impressed by Duke's preparedness for all of what UConn does. You know, UConn's post double, they just sliced it and diced it for the first, I don't know, two thirds of the game. And then UConn, they don't really, they don't really have, they have a half court offense, but they run a lot of sets and pre planned stuff. And when you have one day to prep, you can't really, you can't prep for everything somebody does, you know, so you. Right, right. So you got it. You have to, you have to have had kind of the fundamental core. This is what we do. When this type of set, when this type of offense, if it's a zoom, you know, if it's an away action, if it's a Ball, screen, whatever. Again, like, I want. I'm. I'm watching this game going, man, how does Duke know everything that UConn's doing? And they're using it against them empty side ball screens, easy dunk, layup. And then something just changed. You know, where they started to get stops. They got a couple run throughs. They hit a couple shots. You know, Mullins hit the big three, obviously, to win it, but he missed one right before the TV timeout with, like 12 and change. And I was like, ah, they're not going to get over that hump, you know, because they had other opportunities to get. Get it back to where all of a sudden you get some clenching from. From Duke. So I just. Again, that's. It's an incredible staff. And Danny's. There's no perfect coaches, no perfect people. But the one thing Danny is, he's a fighter. And, you know, his whole sideline demeanor, which everybody talks about, it's all directed at the officials and the crowd. It's not directed at his players. Yeah, now, look, I can't get away with it. You know, I got a tea this year. I didn't say anything like, it's crazy. But he. He pushes that border. But what it does is he fights for his players to the very last moment. And the players are. The players play above their level of toughness, if that makes any sense. Like, he's got tough kids. He's got tough kids, but they play even tougher because they got that maniac over there on the sideline. I think that's all part of why it works.
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Yeah. Yeah. I mean, for a while, it was terrorist Reed against Duke. I mean, seriously, he was the offense. And it was. It was funny because I kept thinking, oh, man, they just need a Stefan Castle. They just don't have.
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That's what this team is missing. They don't have a. Throw it to the dude, he's going to go get you a bucket guy. That would they have.
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Yeah. You know, they were 30th in the country. I mean, I've watched them get blown out by Marquette. I mean, they just have nights when they can't hit shots. But there is a toughness to UConn. I mean, I've just always liked the program. And what's interesting, you go from Calhoun, who, like Hurley, just preach toughness, just. Just grind. And it took them a while. They had Kevin Ali, they had coaches. And then they find Hurley. Hurley's a little bit of an extension of Calhoun, where he's just really. Yeah, he's they kind of found their secret sauce. It's not the sexiest program, but they always have length, they always have toughness. They play defense. You know, it's interesting. And Michigan, Arizona looks like the marquee game. But you know, be careful because UConn and Illinois are great in your world. It's fascinating about this. So Illinois has a player that was the 261st ranked player in high school. Yeah, I mean, literally small town, public high school guy, the Keaton Wagler kid. And he shows up, he may be a lottery pick. And what's fascinating about college basketball is that, and you're in this world now, you have to project a lot. I mean, even in an NBA draft now some of These guys are 19, 20 years old in the NFL draft. As you know, a lot of guys been in school four years. I got three years of playing tape. You know, I don't have to project. I kind of know if you have good feet, bad hands when you recruit, how much do you know, like with this kind of kid and how much are you just kind of hoping?
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Well, here's what I'm going to do. I'm going to tell you a story. I'm going to do story time with Colin instead of Colin doing story time. So his AU coach is a guy named Victor Williams. Victor Williams was the point guard. After I graduated, he red shirted because he transferred in from Illinois State my senior year. And so Vic runs his own program, it's independent, in Kansas City, Missouri. And when I tell you, he called everybody, everybody and said, hey, I have a pro. And now he's on an independent circuit. So some of this is that he's on it. It's. He's on a circuit called Recruit. Look, and, and you know, I was there this summer. I mean, I, I learned my lesson really, really early. And that you just have to be so thorough because there's going to be guys that fall through the cracks. So remember what's happened since COVID is guys are getting extra years. You know, Yaxo Landenberg, you know, he, he's been in school since the Beatles were out. You know, like, I mean, it's so, so the, the trend in college basketball has been get old, stale. That's. Everybody says get old, stay old. And after my first year, at the end of the year, we had eight freshmen, one junior, one sophomore. And I was like, man, I got, I told my staff, I said, look, we're a nightclub, okay? 21 and over. Nobody gets in 21 and over, right? But then you saw this year, the freshman class has been outstanding. And he's the one that was most overlooked. And I think he was most overlooked because he wasn't on the shoe circuit. He was. How about this one? He was loyal to his AAU coach, right? He was. There's a. One of the best AAU programs in the country is called mocan, Mocan Elite. They're out of Kansas City now. They have kids from Oklahoma. They have kids from all over and they play on the EYBL circuit. That's the Nike circuit. So whether. I don't know. I think they invited him to try out for it and he didn't. Why? Because he was actually loyal to Vic Williams, who he played for since like seventh grade. So all these things, one high school, I mean, college head coaches, a lot of them don't go out. And if they do, they just go to Peach Jam and watch the creme de la creme. And then, you know, their assistants, we're so busy in the portal and recruiting overseas and Illinois has done a very good job overseas that a lot of these kids get missed. And then you're like, well, I'd love to have an 18, 19 year old, but if I bring him in, he's not going to play. Then he's going to transfer, I'm going to pay him and I'm going to develop him for somebody else. And so you got to credit Vic, but you also got to credit Illinois. They saw him, they recruited and they took him. And then when he showed up, they're like, holy cow, we didn't even know. There's no chance they knew he was this good ever. So they, they, yeah, you can do it. And I. Illinois has a lot of money. They don't have Duke money, they don't have Kansas money. Yeah, but you can do it if you're creative. And look at their starting lineup. Two overseas players who, they're well compensated, but not to the 2, 3, 4 million dollars of some of these guys. And one freshman. Right. Who he didn't cost them hardly anything. Nothing. Zero. You know when I say nothing for a high major team, Colin, guys that make 250 to $300,000 a year don't play. If you make that much money, you can expect to not play. I swear to God. That's, that's the, that's the scale right now. Okay, so I'm guessing he's. I haven't asked. He's probably on that 2,5300 sort of range, whatever. And they might have bumped him up in the regular season, once he starts humming and, and playing really, really well. But it's, it's difficult. You have to be thorough. You're going to miss some guys, but you have to use all the resources at your disposal and then go eyeball and see guys. Because what happens with the portal is, yes, guys have been. You have a GM and, or, you know, your job as a coach is to research who might be in the portal. But it's like speed dating. So if you don't know who you're recruiting, if you don't know what you're getting, you're. You're taking somebody else's word for it. So you have to recruit based upon who they played for. You have to go see them with your eyes if you can. And then you really, really got to try and know the kid, know the person, so you might know what you're getting even then you're going to miss. Because recruiting is not an exact science.
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The Big Ten schools, those kids, there's not a lot of jobs in the Midwest outside of Chicago, they flee to the coasts and they make really good money and they still love their, they love their Big Ten teams and they'll write checks. And the Big Ten has three straight national championships in football. This year they return seven first or second round quarterbacks and they dominated this tournament. I mean, if I had to guess today, I would have Michigan against Illinois and the Natty. Although, you know, I mean, Arizona's guards are great, Tommy's great, and you know, Dan Hurley wins in the March. But is it, is, is the Big Tens resurgence and dominance? Is it just checks, Doug? Is it from my purview, it's really good coaching and checks.
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Yes, yes. And I would say there's great coaches in the Big 12. I would say that the Big 12 has been an unbelievable conference.
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Yeah.
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Kansas a little down this year. Houston not as good as they had been this year. But here's the. Let's cut the brass tacks. You and I know this. The SEC cheated their brains out for years, right. In football. So it's, it's a curious thing when everybody can spend money on their roster, right? So now is now. Let's see how good you are, right? When everybody's got dudes because they used to, they just used. You go and look. There's still a different caliber of athlete at times in the SEC than some of these teams. But I used, when I worked at cbs, I started covering more sec and I got to go to SEC football games as well. Just as kind of a fan and be on the sidelines. And back then, like, there was just a different. You look at. Even now you look at the Big 12, they just look different. The basketball expression is that guy. Sneakers squeak different. Right? And I'm not. Again, I'm not saying that. That the Big Ten was high and mighty. They had plenty of scandals, right? Minnesota had one. Michigan obviously had a big one. Ohio State had one. Whatever. Illinois, you know, got caught. Whatever. But the point is that generally, yes, the SEC was seen as a cheaters league. It just was.
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Yeah, through the churches and through the car dealers and. Absolutely, yes.
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Brown paper bags. Yes, all of it. Okay? Now when it's. It's. It's not equal. And the reason that you have the 160 favorites is the rest of us, the little guys, we got no shot. We just do. We could. You can win a game, you can't win two or three. You just can't. You know, I, I'll never forget Colin. We were playing Ohio State last year, and I had Anthony Roy, who was leading the country and scoring. He has 30, and it was eight. And all of a sudden we changed ball screen coverage and it's 18. I emptied my bench and it's 30. And I was just. I'm sitting in there and I'm apoplectic. And I have this and I. And I have a. I have a assistant named Eric Sanders and his nickname is 8th grade. And 8th grade puts his arm around me and I go, take it. I shouldn't have changed that ball screen coverage. I screwed up. I messed this up. And he's like, Coach, they got three and a half million dollars. We got $95,000.
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All right?
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Don't beat yourself up. We never had a chance, you know, so. So the point is that now it. There's the haves and the have nots, right? But you give Michigan legal money cheating, right? You give them elite coaching, right? And yeah, they're better than all those SEC teams that have always that. Now, look, the SEC has had some elite coaching as well, obviously, and they've been really, really good. But I really think that's what happened in football. That's what happened in, in basketball, right? I mean, Kurt Signetti is a hell of a coach, but he's made much better when he's got $30 million to spend.
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So I wrote down my. My NBA mock lottery draft, and I do think AJ DeVonta at BYU probably today would go number one. I think one of the things I said, like, like Cam Boozer is not a super athlete. But he's going to go top five, I think. Caleb Wilson's ceiling is insane. He's not polished yet, but, God, he had. You can just see there'll be two or three plays a game, and you're like, holy. You know, is he. Bam, out of bayou with a higher ceiling, Like. Like, what is he. So the Darren Peterson thing's fascinating because. And you played against him this year. Your Green Bay team played against. You're the one that called me and said, you got. You gotta watch this guy. And it's very early in the season, it was like I watched five possessions. I'm like, well, that's what Kobe probably looked at. 18 years old, he looked like Kobe. I mean, it's kind of an easy comp now. He was. He got beat up. The calf, the hamm. He wasn't. He wasn't as athletic. He wasn't durable. The two things that worry me, one's obvious, I'll get to in a second. The first thing that worries me is he plays in a silo. A little like Kawhi. First five years in the league, no assists, has the ball a ton. No assists. He's playing in a silo. He's playing for himself. Don't love guys like that. As great as Kawhi is, he is a little bit like Kawhi, not stylistically, but plays in a silo. Durability issues. If you're hurt. In college, the rules always been bigger, stronger dudes than the pros. It's hard. But I think what really worries me is when he comes out and says, this thing got into my head, and I start thinking about. And this is not analogous, but, oh, Ben Simmons, Markel Foltz, Royce White. And listen, I feel I have sympathy for anybody that can struggle with mental health or whatever it is, but if I'm an NBA in a loaded draft where I watch Caleb Williams and I'm like, he's only 50% of the player he's going to be in three years. I see, you know, AJ de Monta.
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I see.
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I see Wagler, the guard at Illinois, and I'm like, is he the next sga? Jesus. He's six. Six again. He's not even halfway home. What do you do with Darren Peterson? If you were a gm, could you. Could you draft him?
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Number one?
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Well, here's the. You know, when I used to work at CBS and espn, they talk about the eye test.
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Yeah.
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And the problem with the eye test is it kind of depends upon the day when you see a guy. So again, you have to remember that we watched all the preseason stuff. We watched and we were, like, in love with Darren Peterson. And then, I mean, we. We had no chance. He was so good. So, you know, what do I. And I was one. I said, like, he's like Kobe in that. He can literally say, like, you remember Larry Bird, those old Larry Bird, Living legend videos? I'm going to get the ball right here, and I'm going to drill right there. I'm going to shoot it. I'm going to make it. And then he did it.
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Yeah.
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It feels like he gets to his spots and he plays. He's never sped up. He plays at his own pace. He's great.
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Yes.
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First thing everybody should know is that if the Utah Jazz have the number one pick, they're taking AJ DeVontza. How do I know? He went to Utah Prep, which is funded by Ryan Smith. He went to byu, which is funded by Ryan Smith. Ryan Smith owns the Utah Jazz. If you want to call something tampering, there's never been a person that has ever been tampered with more than AJ DeBonsa to end up with the Utah Jazz. Ever, ever, ever in the history of anything. Everybody knows it. Everybody. So that's the first thing. It doesn't matter who else. Jesus Christ could be getting ready to walk on water and turn water into wine. They're drafting A.J. deBonso. Outside of that boy, it's hard because the Arkansas point guard, he's tremendous. God, Tremendous dude. He's. He's fantastic.
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And. And by the way, he's athletic and can also catch and shoot. A lot of athletic guards are rhythm scorers. He can catch and shoot. And he's also a great passer, which a lot of great scorers aren't.
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Yeah, well, he. Listen, you can. He'll run your offense tomorrow, and he'll be. He'll be great at it. Would I draft him? I'd really have to know what's going on with the shutting it down at halftime thing. Again, all my information is second and third hand, so I don't want. Especially with. With medicals. I don't want to. I can tell you that, you know, we had. My point guard had cramping issues, and it does mess with you mentally because you might feel one coming on and you're like, okay, take me out. I feel one coming on here. And we tried pickle juice. The packers gave us this medicine they give to NFL players that didn't work. There is a mental component to it where your brain triggers the cramping again. This is from, from actual experience with one of my, with my, my, my leader, my team captain. So I would just have to know more about the, about the medicals. I do agree he's not really a creative passer. No. He is a score. He is a throwback classic. He's somewhere between Kobe and DeMar DeRozan. But here's the part I do like. Unbelievable competitor. Not scared of the big moment. And has a, has a body, you know, he's got just a body like a Greek God. So he'll assimilate to the NBA game quite well. Yeah, I would like him to pass a little bit more. But the biggest thing with him is the medicals. Is he going to play every night?
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Yeah.
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And you're right, like, I'll give you the example. Embiid hurt in college, hurt all the time in the pros. Kyrie hurt in college. Her all the time. Zion hurt in college, hurt all the time in the pros. So you have to trust your medical people and you have to figure out what you need. But the answer is yes, I would if I was. All that stuff was cleared. He's just again, his sneakers squeak different. He moves at a different gait, a different pace, a different rhythm. And I do think that as the NBA game opens up, he's got even better spacing. And they play with great spacing at, at Kansas, but even better, obviously, like, it's just hard to see. How are you going to stop him? I know he's going against college kids, but he's a real college kid. Yeah, I'm personally a big fan. I think DeBonsa goes one. He'll, he'll probably go too. But it's all going to be about the medicals. And then the question is, and this is this, this goes to your Kawhi thing. Was the dad telling him to shut it down at halftime or was it him, his body? Right. Is the dad too involved? Whereas with Kawhi, it's the uncle that's apparently too involved.
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Hey, Donald, really flying on that treadmill. I'm trying to run as fast AS
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B
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Oh no.
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C
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We're married. Me to a human, him to a bird. Yeah, the bird looks out of your league.
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B
Wouldn't you know it?
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C
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- [27:49]
C
There is seemingly some sentiment of like the PGA Tour is should like cut ties with Tiger Woods. I will be floored if that happens.
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B
Right?
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Like I have plenty of Tiger thoughts that we can get to. But like he is so valuable to them on so many levels. Forget captaining the Ryder cup or if he plays on the Senior Tour, like, they are trying to modernize the tournament. Over a million people watch the golf league for it's. It's guys playing golf on a simulator. But they. Over a million people watch it. When Tiger woods plays like he. He is like a singular force of nature. And that. I do not believe that Augusta or the PGA Tour or his sponsors are all of a sudden going to turn their back on Tiger woods because of this latest incident. He's too valuable to the entity. Now, that might also be part of the problem that enables him to not change his behavior. But these companies are not going to take up a moral stand against their bottom line with Tiger Woods.
- [28:56]
B
Well, my take on him was people always say, when you know, rich men and rich, successful men, often athletes get into car wrecks or DUIs. How stupid. How do you not have a driver? Number one, I get in my car five times a day. You know, it's not like Tiger's got a 9 to 5 job. Drop me off at work and pick me up. So Tiger doesn't want to pay a million dollars, a half a million dollars a year for a guy to park outside his Jupiter, Florida home and take him to Vons or Safeway. Okay? Secondly, a lot of successful men and athletes are adrenaline junkies. They got six cars, maybe 12. They like to drive them, and they think they're bulletproof. So if they got a cocktail or four, if they smoke a blunt or two, they like to get into the car and they, hey, man, I'm bulletproof. So when I look at that, do I feel bad for Tiger? Absolutely. I think his job now is to be a better dad. Right. The golf thing is secondary, but when I hear people just jump to the, how can he not have a driver? Guys, athletes, you know, it's an outlier to find a wealthy athlete with fewer than a half dozen cars. Guys in cars, I mean, it's an alpha quality. It is a testosterone quality. Fast cars, fast driving. And so, you know, I just. I'm not defending the actions of Tiger, but he's clearly got a major problem. There was a story about opioids found in his body. It's awful.
- [30:36]
C
Well, that's what it is. Yeah.
- [30:38]
B
Yeah.
- [30:38]
C
Like, so, like, listen, the. The half a million or a million dollars a year Tiger could afford, it chooses not to because of what you were talking about. Most likely he likes. He likes either driving his cool cars. I mean, that car that he flipped was $250,000 car. And he probably has a lot of them. And also this is pure speculation, but we have reason to believe it. I mean, Tiger woods has done some shady things with relationships, and he might not want a witness to where he's going at all times to see who he might want to see. But the thing that is just so obvious, you talk about having a few drinks or smoking the. Smoking a blunt, you know, he blew a 0.0. He had no booze in his system, but they found two hydrocodone in his pocket. Like he's had a ton of surgeries. He clearly is. Listen, I can't diagnose addiction, right? It is fair to speculate that he is addicted to pain pills or at the very least dependent on them, and is clearly and has just from the last DUI in the toxicology report that came out, there was a bunch of it in his system. He represents a lot of the symptoms of it. Glassy eyed, puffy face, lethargic. You know, pill opioids are scary because they work like, you know what I mean? Like, they're, it's, it's big business. Someone very close to me has a serious problem with it. We've tried many different things to get them help. It's a scary thing. But if you deal with chronic pain and that little white pill is the only thing that gives you relief, it's hard to say no to it because dealing with chronic pain is awful. But the thing that you can't do, you have to have better judgment than to get behind the wheel of a car. If you're taking opioids every day, you just. It's dangerous. You are a danger to yourself and society. And if he had pills in his system, which we again assume that he did based on his previous history and based on the reports of the officers at the scene and the physical evidence of he had more in his pocket, it's just dangerous, man. It's just straight up dangerous. Even if he's not behind the wheel of a car, taking that, being that dependent on that quantity of opioids is just a very dangerous thing. And when he's had a couple dozen surgeries at this point, it's no surprise that that's the situation that he's got himself into. So you're right about men and cars and adrenaline junkie and all that. But if he's taken a high dose of pain medicine every day for chronic pain, he's probably never in condition to drive. If we're being totally honest, like he really. It gets, It's a hard thing to manage. So I, I do feel badly for him. But he's gotta. He's gotta stop driving somehow because. Or he's gotta get the pain situation under control because it's dangerous, man. It's.
- [33:51]
B
It.
- [33:52]
C
Those things are. They are scary with how much they work. I don't know if you've ever had a big surgery, but, like, I've had spinal fusion surgery, which is what Tiger has had.
- [34:01]
B
Yeah, yeah.
- [34:02]
C
And it's like you can be in the most pain ever, and then you take one of those pills and you feel like you're floating, you know, like, this is the greatest thing in the world. Yes. He's. He's got a serious, serious problem on his hands.
- [34:16]
B
Pivot to this. I am. I am on an island, but I think most officials are great. The NFL, according to NFL Ops, over 99% of calls are right now. Now, that's NFL ops, but I think that's a fairly reasonable number. We are watching the ABS system and what we're finding is home plate umpiring is difficult. But again, half the time the umpires are right and there's just not that many challenges, which is pretty amazing considering batters are different sizes, the zone is different, the ball's going 98 with movement, and even when you pat your head, it's a silimeter. It's just outside. So officials are good. So there's this sense that you can't go with replacement refs. And in most instances, I think there's very few great of anything. And I'm sure you can find replacement refs. But if I'm the NFL, here's my take. All you people do is complain about baseball umpires and NBA refs and they're full time and our guys get 99% hit rate. Our league is growing faster than any other league. So it's clearly tolerable for television and radio and streaming consumption. Well, it's working. Why do we have to go full time? The other sports? I mean, you can't win an NBA series without 75% of the fans claiming it's rigged. It's just an automatic. It's rigged. So my take is the NFL's like, folks, we got part time guys 99% right. Our games don't take 30 minutes for the last two and a half like the NBA. We don't need an ABS system necessarily at the. You know, for our calls, and it's working. So. So what? What's the point of us going full time?
- [36:20]
C
Yeah, listen, the argument for going full time is they have the money and that's. That's probably the only argument. I don't know if 99% figure is correct. I think that officiating has been damaged like the public perception of officiating has been damaged by HD television. Like we have this ability to microscopic slow down NBC it zoom in. They can show us three replays immediately before the next snap is done. And it's just total. And we're debating it for 45 seconds for a minute, for a minute and a half on these replays. And then the rules analyst will come on TV and be like that should be overturned. And then the ref on the field is like call stands. And we're like what the hell's going on? You know it's like I think that's why public opinion on refs is so much is so out of skewed with. Out of skew with the reality of it. Like of course they're very very good and umpiring is virtually impossible. I had a hard time doing it for like college age beer league baseball when guys are hungover puking in right field. I was an umpire for a couple of summ and I'm like this is ridiculous. Like I am straight up guessing as to what is a ball and a strike. So I can't imagine doing it at that level. But I just think that the the NFL is in such a position where they're Teflon whether they do it or don't replacement refs or not.
- [37:56]
B
And they know that.
- [37:57]
C
Fine.
- [37:58]
B
They know exactly.
- [37:59]
C
Exactly. And they and and they know it. And so I think that. I think you are probably right with the direction this goes. They win. They tend to win labor standoffs with players. They'll win this one with the refs. Like they are totally Teflon. And I agree by and large refs are better than we give them credit for. But I love that ABS exists in baseball now.
- [38:20]
B
Oh yeah, it's great.
- [38:21]
C
I do love
- [38:24]
B
it's a game show. I get a reveal and a studio audience.
- [38:27]
C
It's great and it goes fast. Like it might be the best use of replay since tennis where like tennis. You know tennis is just like in out and it's instant and it's binary like that's never going to be topped. But just like the speed of it, how infrequent it's used. The strategy behind like you save this one or do you use it? Should it be the pitcher, the catcher, the batter, like it's the dugout, can't call for it. It's great. It's a great ad for baseball.
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