← The Herd with Colin Cowherd
The Herd with Colin Cowherd
Colin Cowherd Podcast - Rory REPEATS At The Masters, A Tradition Like No Other, Vrabel/Russini Controversy, NFL Draft Preview
00:42:25
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The volume today's show is brought to you by our presenting sponsor, American Beverage. If you think about some of the most iconic drinks in the country, the ones you grab at a barbecue, the ones you raise to celebrate your team that have been part of your story for decades. Coke, Dr. Pepper, Pepsi. There's something people don't always think about. The companies behind those brands are still making their drinks right here in the US While there's a lot of talk about bringing manufacturing back, America's beverage companies never left. There are American companies making American products with American workers in America's hometown. So 275,000 men and women across all 50 states, real jobs, good paying jobs, the kind of jobs you can raise a family on. So more than 100 years, those brands have been part of everyday lives and they're still here, still investing, still operating in communities around the country. So if you care about strong local economies and companies that walk the walk, check out the good work and what they're doing@wedelia deliver for America.org. All right. It's a rare repeat. It's been done a few times. Jack Nicklaus, Tiger Woods, Nick Faldo, the green Jacket, and now Rory McElroy. You know, it's interesting, last year, that roller coaster where he had, you know, the shot goes into the drink and he has to go to a playoff. It's interesting the confidence John he had today, multiple shots where he got into trouble. You know, he has some trouble detour, saved himself multiple times. I mean, there were chances, even on 18, you're like, oh, brother. But I mean, the reality is this is what happened with John Elway and your Ohtanis and your Shaqs. You know, you have that, oh, this, this prodigy talent, right? And you can struggle, struggle, struggle, and you get the first one. And it's remarkable. We had Alan Shipnock on, he said, you know, Thursday, Friday, this is going to be, you know, as as much fun as Rory's ever had playing golf. And it was, and I just, I, I thought his ability and his confidence when he got into trouble today all stems from last year, which is fairly obvious.
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A
Yeah. I mean, when you have a, he went into this week with no pressure, right? He's the defending champ, just come in, have a good time. But then he has a six shot lead after two days and you're like, well, you kind of, you can't blow it now. And then yesterday was a roller coaster. I do think having that championship, you know, winning it last year, Freddie couple said after the dinner, his first thought was Rory might never lose again here because the con, he's clearly the most talented guy, him and Scheffler.
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B
Yeah.
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A
But Rory battles the difference between Tiger, who would just suffocate you. Rory to me is like Phil on steroids. He is a roller coaster. He is great theater, CBS has to love this. I mean, you were just on the edge of your seat over the weekend. At any moment he could have a 10 foot eagle putt or be hitting out of the trees and holding on for dear life for bogey. And clearly today, like he could have a hole. You're like, he's going to lose this guy. And then he birdie back to back holes and then he'd have another shot where he'd rip it way left. He'd rip away right even on 18. Yeah, you're like, Rory just hit a five iron down the middle of the hole. Just, just play conservatively. And you could tell he was like, should I do that? They hand me the driver and he pumps it into the trees. Even CBS cameras couldn't find the bowl when he hit it over the trees. Like, what did he just do? Yeah, but he has a chance. You know, he's still in the prime of his career, mid-30s, in great shape. He's going to win this tournament again. You know, he's going to be one of those guys that wins the Masters three or four times. He rattles off a couple other majors, probably never catching Tiger, but he's now tight. Phil, he's past Koepka. I mean, you're looking at a guy that's probably going to end. He's got a pretty good chance to have double digit majors and be clearly, I don't know, be considered a top five golfer of all time behind Tiger Arnold, like in that, in that class, clearly.
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B
Yeah, I thought, I thought today about recovery shots that I really, if you had to, you know, repeat and recovery from Rory just recovered constantly. So Jack won six Masters, Tiger five, Palmer four. And then there's a bunch of guys at three and now Rory's at two. You know, it's interesting. You talk Tiger. My producer Ryan sent me a text. He's like, you know, Tiger in his prime was a little like Brady, almost robotic.
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Almost.
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I mean if he went into a Sunday with a lead, he's just going to extend it. He didn't give you any chance. Whereas Rory, to your point, is more disciplined than Phil. But he's got a little mahomes where he's going to ad lib a little bit. He's got flair. I mean, they're all like Mickelson in his prime, especially. Tiger and Rory are incredible off the tee. But I, I find there was something about all of them, the aspirational sort of nature of Tiger, the wildness of Phil. But I, I think like Rory is a balance for Me, I find him more likable than Tiger. I think he's more disciplined than Phil. And I don't know, I just. When I. When I. He gets me to a television set and I don't leave. I mean, I didn't, I watched it an hour and a half before it started. I didn't miss a shot today. It was great.
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A
This tournament's great. This tournament, when you have one of the all time greats in the mix or have a great chance, is to me as good of a theater non football as we have in this country. And I think the thing that Rory has, people forget this. You know, Tiger came up in an era where the equipment, what you sprayed the ball around. So if you watch some of the Tiger highlights, it's hitting shots over trees from 200 yards to 10ft. Phil was, you know, that was his game, right? I mean, one of the great short games of all time. Because he was way right, right. So he had to hit a crazy flop shot. Rory has this element to his game that is just. You never know what's coming. Like on any given shot, right? He could hit it into the water or hit it into the trees. Koepka, when he was rolling and winning the majors. Fairway green, two putt. Fairway green, two putT. Occasional birdies, no screw ups. That was Koepka, right?
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No, he was five under this weekend. So a good, a good weekend for him.
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Playing well. Yeah, Scotty today can get rolling. Scotty's just fairway hitting it close. Rory has those holes, clearly, but he also has holes. Rory, what are you doing here? I actually think these last couple years for non niche golf fans, he's become much, you know, forever. Tiger was the, you know, probably in the 2000s, as famous as anyone on the planet, Right. And it was making at golf $90 million a year. Remember Phil was like 60, 70, and these two guys and Phil kind of drafted off Tiger. Yeah. Rory to me has vaulted himself. And just everyone, like my wife's talking about him, my mom, he's just a polarizing individual because it's like, is this guy. Because the one thing with Phil I've always, I was always a Phil fan. But is he authentic? Is he authentic? Tiger sometimes is too robotic, too big of an a hole. Rory's pretty genuine, you know, just all of his press conferences this week was just like, you know, this is awesome. But I got to close step by step. Keep swinging hard. Like he kind of embraced it. Clearly less pressure than the elephant, you know, the monkey that was on his Back about that. Clearly freedom up. Like, I don't know if he blows the six shot lead yesterday, if he hadn't won the Masters.
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That's right.
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He's able to win today.
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Exactly.
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And that you have that confidence because I had confidence in him today. I just didn't know if like Justin Rose was going to birdie, you know, eight holes coming down the stretch and maybe. But I didn't think Rory was going to quote, unquote, choke like he almost did last year. Yeah, it was. He was going to make enough birdies. I thought he made some big shots today. He birded when it was kind of falling apart. He birded seven and eight. Yeah, he missed a close one on nine. Like he started playing well when it got really shaky. And I don't know if he settles the shift because historically he didn't. And I think last year, I think this opens the gates for. I think you're looking at a guy that's going to win four or five more majors over the course of the next three or four years.
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Where do we put. You know, I was thinking about Mickelson. So Mickelson was Never rated number one, although he was number two for 270 weeks. I don't know why that's embedded in my head, but it is.
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It's like asking Peyton Manning, why aren't you the best quarterback ever? You're like, I play with Tom.
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Well, but Phil won three Masters. Phil also, he was never number one. Phil didn't win a US Open, although again, I think he finished second sick six times.
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Probably should have won about three.
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Yep. Some of that is own undoing, I think. I think Rory to me is just the perfect combination of Tiger in his prime and Phil, he's just a wild card enough to make him fascinating and vulnerable. You know, Scotty Schefter is a bit robotic. He had a shot today toward the end where I thought to myself, oh, here he comes, here he comes. And that's why I. The ball went back off the green, rolled back and I thought, oh, that's a rare for him. That's an incredible rare miss. But I don't know, I look at. Is Rory better than Phil Mickelson all the time? I think I would put him ahead.
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Yeah, to me it's close to a coin flip. I mean, Phil truly is one of the great players of all time. I mean, if Tiger doesn't come around, it's kind of like Peyton Manning. I mean, we're probably considering this guy a little differently. And we already consider Them very highly. You know, I mean, there's a chance Tiger doesn't come around. Phil has 12 majors, right. Just because there was an intimidation factor for a long time. Phil didn't win his first major till his mid-30s. You know, Rory just had that drought, right? Rory banged off like four early, and then he missed 10 years. I think the thing that Rory has going for him is it feels like he's entering the prime of his career.
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Well, he's in impeccable shape.
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Impeccable shape. His mental fortitude and toughness now has been on display these last couple years. So he's think. Think about the reps he has. I mean, he's been playing this tournament since 2019, when he was 20 years old. Did you watch the Amazon prime doc on. On Rory?
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B
No, I have. I just finished the book.
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A
Yeah, the book I listened to with Ship Nuck. I didn't quite realize. The doc does a pretty good job. It's basically goes over last year's Masters. But a lot of look back to when he was a kid. He was, I don't want to say Tiger, you know, on TV at 3 years old, but he was a child prodigy over there.
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B
Oh, no question.
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And this is a guy. The reps this guy has and the talent this guy has was pretty well established by like 12 years old. And, you know, there's a ton of pressure, especially over there. Golf's a really big deal. He carries the weight, you know, of a nation, of the European golfers. And I think, you know, I think he struggles with the vulnerability. Now he's, you know, they just. You and Ship Duck talked about it, the live thing for a couple years. He's pretty freed up now. You know, his parents are healthy and happy and live by him. He gets to play with his dad all the time. He's got the young daughter that he takes to school. I think there's a chance that now he didn't play that great at times the last couple of days. I mean, he was spraying it all over the map. You know what I bet he says in his press?
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B
Listen, think about this. Think how many putts he missed on the front nine today.
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You know, if you were going up against like, Greg Maddox or Pedro or Nolan Ryan in their front, they're like, you know, I had my C stuff today. And you're like, you just went eight and struck out nine. Because they could have their cease or, you know, Tom Brady. I didn't play that well. Well, he led four touchdown drives because they could just find a way to figure it out. Happens with basketball players all the time to me, Rory, I, I'd say he had his B minus, C plus game over the aggregate of this weekend and still won. I guess he technically won by one shot but he was up six shots and you know, had a three shot lead back nine today through four he
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missed two birdie Potts. So it, it was, his putting was
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a little erratic and his driver the last two days on Friday shot, I think seven under. He was hitting out of the trees on. He didn't hit a par five fairway, but he made birdie on every hole. And people were talking about it to cover the sport of like he really knows now this course. The one thing that's unique about this course, remember a couple years ago, Phil finished second. Justin Rose is 45, you know, and finishing top five every single year. It feels like it's the only course of the majors where you come back every year and it's so unique. I truly believe he's got a chance to win this tournament. Like Freddie said, I don't know every year. But like wouldn't shock me if he wins two of the next four.
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B
You know, it's, it's a, you know, there's, I'm not really steeped in tradition, although I make an exception for the Masters. I mean Sergio slamming his club, Robert McIntyre's flipping something off and they didn't like that. No, I, I that well. But last year the Spanish golfer Pete in the Creek, he was like, you
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know, he's a college kid, didn't know the rules and said he had to go.
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B
So, and I think, you know, I'm not banning anybody. You get the life Sergio's won before. But I do think there's something to be said is, you know, I'm not somebody that again is a traditionalist in sports. I kind of like new stuff, but I feel differently about the Masters. It bothered me that Sergio did that I wouldn't ban him, but I don't like it. I think this is one of the great events. I mean, John, one of the reasons I supported liv, I didn't know what LIV was going to be. But my takeaway is I watch golf for golfers. I don't watch it for the course or for the brand PGA except Augusta. Now I do like the Open at Pebble beach and the British is great St. Andrews, but it's different at Augusta. I mean it's different from the merch, the prices, you know, amen corner. I do feel like you have to sit down with Like a Sergio or a McIntyre and have strict warnings. Do you. Are you kind of in that same space?
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A
I've always thought the unique part about golf is the most expensive country club. Where I live in North Scottsdale, it costs over half a million dollars to join. Rom's a member there. Michael Phelps is they have no rules. You could wear no shoes. You could wear. Ron plays in a T shirt all the time. You can wear basketball shorts to the club. And there are other clubs down the street where you. If you were caught with a cell phone on the putting green, on a phone, they don't care if you're Jeff Bezos. They're going to ask you to leave. And they have specific rules. You go into Olympic Club, you go into these places in Monterey and in la, in Chicago, you take your hat off inside. Just like if I enter your home and you say, john, we don't wear shoes in this home. I take my shoes off. It's your home. It's no different. A golf course, that's the golf course, the membership of that crew. And they have certain rules. And people say Augusta's stiffer than most. Yeah, it's true.
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B
Yeah.
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A
And that's. That's. That's their rules. Just if you don't like it, there are super nice courses all over America that are really expensive, that have no rules.
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B
Rules.
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A
And to me, the thing in Augusta is the reverence that every single golfer has for it that would gladly follow the rules. I don't even think they're that hard. Right. Don't you. You got to wear pants. Right. You can't. The peeing in the creek, to me, that was more funny, but I would. They have very strict rules about cell phones on property. And the. You can argue they're a little archaic. And I agree. I mean, you. You and I are talking about last week on tv. Like, a lot of people run businesses. You get phone calls. You got to, you know, you. I don't know, you got things going on in life like it is what it is, but it doesn't feel like any of these are changing. The Masters is the one place where it feels like everyone just embraces it.
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B
Yeah.
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A
I mean, think about this. When you and I were at. Live in. Most PGA events are like this. If you go to a driving range. And most guys, when these golfers talk, they say, we had a great week. I owe it to my team. When they see their team, they're not just. That's not the caddy. That's their physio. That's Their putting coach, their chipping coach, their swing coach, their manager, their agent. These guys all, I mean they're, these guys are 15, 20 minimum million dollar a year businesses. Some of them like Rory, probably a hundred million dollars a year business. And at Augusta you're allowed one person, non caddy to come with you when you're hitting balls. One person. It's not like that at any of these other tournaments, any of the other majors. So there, those are their rules. And you know what? Every single person to a man that I always see, these pro golfers, they can't wait for this event. It's why you notice like early on when guys are struggling, you build yourself up so much for it. You know, Bryce just implodes. You can feel it on his body language. Like you got to wait another year to come back here and like you get these opportunities and they just lose it. Especially on Friday when you see a guy that's going to miss the cut. Their body language to me is different than any other tournament because of the gravity and the importance of this event. I actually think this event's popularity feels like it's grown maybe the way we consume sports now. I agree, it feels really, I mean I was just at a family event. I'm back home. We had, I had aunts, uncles, I mean everyone's watching it, talking Rory, Rory, Rory just locked in on the course. I don't know if that's happening. Non Tiger, five years, 10 years ago.
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B
I mean even the WNBA, even the WNBA is on like six networks. I mean it's everywhere, all the stream, everything's getting broader and wider and there's very few things that I know are always going to be there. NFL games at 10am Pacific and 1pm Pacific and the Masters on CBS on Saturday and Sunday. There's very few things that aren't up for grabs. Everything else is. I mean even second tier leagues, the WNBA is certainly not wildly profitable. Pre Caitlin Clark it wasn't. It's on, it's got all multiple platforms, it's on, everything's spread around everywhere. I thought Amazon did a pretty good job on coverage, but overall it's, you know, I'm just really, I find myself, I, I remember the Masters where special players won, you know, the Rory's, the Tigers last win was really super emotional when he was out of his prime. Phil winning three. Today's show is brought to you by our presenting sponsor, Hard Rock Bet. What a year they have had. Florida sportsbook springs in the air. That only means one thing. Baseball's back, baby. In full swing. Hard Rock Bet makes it easy to bet on America's pastime in just a couple easy taps. It's not just picking winners. You can bet on home runs, strikeouts, whether there's a run scored in the first inning, quick fast paced action right out of the gate. If you miss the first pitch, no problem. You can live bet every inning, every at bat, all the way to the final out. But maybe you're more into the NBA. That's heating up the playoff pushes here. So Hard Rock Bet every night there's a shot to build the same game parlay score a major bucket. You might like the hot hand to drop 30, you know, double double from your big guy. However you draw it up, Hard Rock Bet gives you tons of ways. They have epic same game parlays. So if you're ever late to a tip off, don't worry. Hard Rock Bet let you bet live all game long. So sign up today. Double your winnings on your first 10 bets. Maximum $50. That's right, double your winnings in your first 10 bets. So if you would have won a hundred bucks in your bet, now it's 200. Download the hard Rock Bet app today. Get the party started. Payable and bonus bets. Not a cash offer. Offered by the Seminole Tribe of Florida in Florida offered by Seminole Hard Rock Digital LLC in Alder states. Must be 21 plus and physically present in Arizona, Colorado, Florida, Illinois, Indiana, New Jersey, Ohio, Tennessee or Virginia to play. Terms and conditions apply. Concern about gambling in Florida, call one admit it in Indiana. If you or somebody you know has a problem wants help, call 1-800-9 with it gambling problem, call 1-800-GAMBLER Arizona, Colorado, Illinois, New Jersey, Ohio, Tennessee, Virginia. So I one of the things I want to pivot to and I'm not going to, I don't know how much. One of the great things about being on a podcast, I can talk about what I want and I don't have time restrictions. But one of the things I've noticed about the Mike Vrabel Diana Rossini story is and I haven't discussed it yet and I think sometimes consumers are like, well, why isn't mainstream media discussing it? Well, it's interesting because in my world there's moral and then there's ethical morals, personal, you know, if, if you lied to me or I lied to you about something, or you lied to your wife about something, I lied to my kids about something. That's a moral, that's a personal issue. Ethical is about it's on the outside it's standards. Fox and iheart have standards. The New York Times has ethical standards. I've never had a moral clause. I've had 15 contract. I've never had a moral clause.
- [23:21]
A
Do I have one in the volume? I didn't check the contract.
- [23:24]
B
No, you do not. I don't think you have an ethical one at the volume either. And football coaches don't have ethical ethical clauses. Journalists have ethical clauses. Broadcasters have ethical clauses. People tend to. Some people think moral, ethical. It's the same ethical is. Is. Is external. You know, it's a company. It's a code of conduct. Morals, personal. Football coaches don't you know, if you're winning in the NFL as a football coach and Vrabel took a team to the super bowl who had no business that had no business being in the Super Bowl. If these allegations. All we have is pictures. I have two subjects. I don't have two sources. And the more serious a story is, I need two sources. Just pictures. Right. So it's just a moral issue. If the allegations are true. With Diana, it's moral and ethical because she has in her contract. There are standards and procedures from the New York Times. I mean, they fired. Jason Blair was a reporter. I remember that 15, 20 years ago, whenever that was. So I think the audience is like, well, why don't you talk about. I don't talk about moral stuff. I've said this for 33 years on the end. I'm not a moralist. What you do in your personal life is. And people come up to me, I'm not a Christian. I'm more agnostic. Your morals aren't mine, by the way. My morals aren't yours. But we both live by the same ethical standards. If we work at a journalism, you know, the Times. And so. And I've just never. I've made it a practice in my life is I don't talk about the moral stuff. I mean, by the way, tmz, which. Which covers a much broader spectrum of stories than I do, they don't do. They will tell you they don't do marriage policing. They stay out of affairs. They just stay. That's. That's tmz, that's Hollywood, because everybody's having them, so they stay out of them. So I guess what I'm trying to tell people is don't confuse moral and ethical. Diana's in a space where it's moral and ethical. Mike's is moral. And again, these are allegations. That's the other reason I don't talk about it. But I do want to create or provide clarity on that. When you say, well, why doesn't the mainstream. I don't think mainstream broadcasters, writers talk about moral stuff. If it becomes ethical. If a reporter gets fired for this, then that means the New York Times discovered ethical breaches. Therefore, the mainstream media comes in to discuss. They have evidence therefore of an ethical lapse. So I'm supporting the mainstream media. It's one thing if you're a podcaster with a small following blogger, your latitude on this stuff. You talk about what you want, when you want. But for the main, for the major media players, mostly we wait for an ethical breach, which is confirmed by an employer to discuss.
- [26:22]
A
Well, I would say by this point, every single person agrees. The pictures that we saw, once you figure out the resort. I've never, I've lived in Arizona now five years. Never been to Sedona. It is a place that resort honeymoons, baby moons, anniversaries. It's a couple's resort.
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B
It looks bad.
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A
You're holding hands. Everyone assumes. Especially if you show that to your wife. I show that to my wife. My wife wouldn't have been able to point Diana Rossini out of a lineup if I say, hey, this is the Patriot coach. And, and I show her the pictures. So they're probably sleeping together on a date or whatever. We all agree there one thing I get a lot and I get a lot of dms of like, you know, and you see this on the Internet. I got one today like, well, he's not being covered. Like Sharon Moore. Well, Sharon Moore was having sex with an employee that worked for him. This, they don't work together, but you just see all these different takes of why aren't this right? Mike Vrabel's job. Robert Kraft went into a massage parlor the day of the AFC championship game in Palm beach and had to fly to Kansas City and got caught. The Patriot look at Belichick's off the field antic. They do not care. His job is to win games. If he didn't need to be fired. If he does, he keeps his job. Her job, like you said, is more, you know, tied around to getting these sources. And if you're sleeping with the source. I'm not a journalist. I don't know the rules. But clearly the New York Times feels like she's going to get fired now. Right.
- [27:43]
B
Okay, well, and also the Boston Celtics fired a coach because of lapses moral slash ethical with somebody, a partner in the building. So that's, that's, that's, that's that's, that's like the Michigan situation. That, that, that's what got the Celtics coach fire the it's not if you come into it with a clear mind and without an agenda. Because even my wife asked why does he get it passed and why doesn't she? And I said, well, there are standards and practices ethically that you in your contract as a journalist, football coaches, you win. There's, there's no, it's a moral issue and there's no moral clause in contracts.
- [28:22]
A
Well, I, I know the other thing I, I always say this about relationships and the older I've gotten, you know, I've had friends get divorced. I see friends in relationships. I, I, I, my marriage, like most people, we have unwritten rules like baseball. You kind of know what's allowed, you know what's not allowed. But I, and you're, you've been around longer than me and seen different relationships. There are a lot of people in relationships that would not fly in my home. I never assume other people are in whatever their marriage is what they're none of my business. You never know.
- [28:53]
B
And I, and I, I don't care and I don't want to know and it's none of my business. And I just, I'm not into that stuff. Like, I just, I've always been one of those guys. There's. I don't talk about media much. Some hosts and podcasters do. I don't I they that some people specialize in it. I don't, I also don't talk about moral obligations. I don't talk about that either. I think there is, you know, I, and if people want to do it, go for it. But I'm just, I got pictures I don't have sourcing on this.
- [29:25]
A
Well, I think why and I don't know. I was at a family event trying to watch the Masters. I did see something come across like pop up on my phone. Mike Vrabel because every coach or gm, a lot of teams have the coach and gm. The NFL is great about this, right? They make a speak of the combine. They make us look at the owner's meetings. Then you're mandatory to speak again before the draft and then during the draft and after the draft, keep that cycle going. He is not going to speak. I think they're going to put Elliot Wolf, typically, I would imagine Mike and Elliot would both speak before the draft. Clearly they're not putting him out there in this situation because no one would ask them what they're going to do with the 31st pick in the draft, he would just get inundated. And Elliot Wolf is going to get asked about this question. Right. It's going to be a story. It's not going to go away, especially if, you know, by all accounts, she's been sidelined. And listen, I said this on my podcast because I, I like this stuff probably more than you do, but also, like, listen, she's always been cool to me. I like her.
- [30:23]
B
Like, I don't know.
- [30:24]
A
Or it's like, I, I listen. I don't know.
- [30:27]
B
Rabel.
- [30:27]
A
But it's all. I think we all agree what we're seeing, what's going down, probably. But like you said, like what they're not. What's the outcome of this? Okay. They're cheating on their husbands and wives. Like, okay, what. What. What's. What do you allegedly.
- [30:41]
B
Right. Yeah.
- [30:41]
A
Yeah, but. And she's breaking stories that what, that he's going to cut some guy. That story comes out anyway. Ethan Strauss has been on this forever. These news breakers. This news exists no matter whether they exist or not. Right. If I trade tomorrow, Patrick Mahomes and I break the story, or nobody breaks the story in the Kansas City. Just post. We just trade Pat. The events happening no matter what. So a lot of stuff that these insiders now get, you know, do beside the news is, well, they're weighing these options. Then it becomes newsworthy. But it's not actually. It's just kind of getting leaked to see. Yeah, I always think that's kind of stupid. You know, when teams use the media to do stuff and put stuff out there. And we talked about this with the jets, with David Bailey. It's like you're either going to get it right or wrong, and that's what you're going to be judged on, playing the media game. You know who doesn't do that? Sean McVeigh, Andy Reid, Kyle Shanahan, they don't waste time on that. So I think we make a big deal of it. But I just think her role, like, I get where women are, like, what the hell you make. If I'm doing it the right way. Right, right. Doing this would be pissed off.
- [31:47]
B
Right.
- [31:48]
A
But this notion that Mike Vrabel. Mike Vrabel's job is. Look at the guy. He. I guess he technically didn't replace Belichick, but he kind of did.
- [31:55]
B
Yeah.
- [31:55]
A
Moral, ethically, Belichick had no standards. His job was to win and win big, and that's all that matters in the end. That's what they're employed to do.
- [32:01]
B
And people could say, well, what about Spygate? That's an ethical lapse. There are standards and procedures that you can't take. Deflategate. Ethical, not moral. Moral is personal. Ethical.
- [32:13]
A
Bounty gate with Sean Payton. Ethical. Right.
- [32:15]
B
That's ethical. So. And well, they're the same. They're not the same. I stay out of. I'm not. I don't do moral morality police. And you can criticize me for that. And I have two things on the top of my head right now that I know morally about high profile people. They're not elected officials. I just consider it none of my business. And I just. So I'm not going to talk about it. I'll go to my gray with it. I don't care. I'm not real nosy that way. I don't care. So there you go. All right. So the NFL draft, we're about 10, 11 days out.
- [32:54]
A
Pretty crazy. Came up fast.
- [32:56]
B
It did. The big question in the draft is what do the jets do with number two? I think they're far more interesting things because it doesn't matter who the jets are going to draft, they're going to be awful. I'm fascinated to see if the Raiders trade up to get Omar Cooper at the top of the second or does he fall to them? Because if I was the Raiders and I could get Omar Cooper the Hoosier wide receiver, the favorite target of Fernando Mendoza, that would be my pick. Quarterback, wide receiver. This is, this is what like a McVeigh does. Or, you know, I mean, when Shanahan gets Brock Purdy, they do everything they can to add more offensive elements. I think they overdraft wide receivers, but they're doing it for a point. Let, let's help, let's help our young quarterback, Ben Johnson. Let's get Drew Dolman, let's get Jonah Jackson, let's get Joe Tuney, let's draft Luther Burden. That's the way to do it. And so I think John Spytack, the gm, and Clint Kubiak. My take is they're going to go get a tackle. They need a right tackle. They drafted a kid a couple of years ago, third round. He can play in or out. He's okay. I. My take is I would just go quarterback, receiver, tackle. Then if you have defensive needs, go for it. Just make sure you get the quarterback right. That's fascinating. I think, I think what the Dolphins have with four third round picks, do they move up in the first round, give up a third round pick? Because a lot of teams want to move down. John. I Could see the Dolphins saying, hey man, we got, you know, if Jeremiah Loves available at the sixth pick. And they're like, well, okay, we don't need a running back. Let's say, let's say, you know, they have a defensive coach, Jeff Halfley, and they're worried about Caleb Downs. I can see them saying it like number nine. We're going to get the best safety in the draft. Move. I don't know if you move up for a safety. Is there a team in particular to you that, that really interest you on draft day?
- [34:42]
A
I think the Chiefs, because all these teams with two first round picks are bad teams, right? The Browns are not going to win any games next year. The jets are going to be bad. The Dolphins are literally trying to reset this thing and ideally, like they would sign up right now to be the have the number one pick next year, even though they might like this quarterback is being Malik Willis. I think the Chiefs could do a lot of different things. I think if they love Sonny Styles, they could trade on or, you know, pick a player that they like. Is not going to be here at 9, but we could move up the Giants. Hey, you, you need a lot, John. You want to keep, you know, build around your own guys. You want to go from five to nine, we'll throw in a second round pick. We got two first, right. Or whatever it would cost. And they are a team that if they come out of the first round, like there's a decent chance to me, they could stick at nine, trade up from 29. Because like you said, a lot of teams want to go back, but not a lot of teams want to come up. But how many teams like the Chiefs are kind of truly every year kind of put all their chips in the middle of the table right now because Coach Reed's getting older. Like to me you get from 29 into the teens because all these teams would love to come down. You know, this draft is pretty polarizing in the sense that it's not viewed as great. Right. There are a lot of players like,
- [35:56]
B
I mean at running back, the best wide receiver.
- [35:58]
A
It's not exactly Jamar Chase.
- [36:00]
B
No, it's like, like at running back, a tight end. It's weak. It's a weak draft.
- [36:06]
A
Someone told me it's the worst they've been in the league almost 18, 20 years. The worst running back class they've ever seen. Yeah, by far. And they say centers and guards now are very hit or miss because all these guys are transferring that centers and guards. When I was gotten football even I remember in high school recruiting you could find those guys, develop them in the NFL. You'd be like, well, just wait till the fourth, fifth, sixth round. We'll draft a guard in the center and one of those two guys will eventually become a pro Bowler. Now you're terrified. You get to the third day, you're like, there's not even a guy on our board that we think is draft worthy. So I think the thing has, the NIL has reshaped college football. I think for the better, it's made it more interesting. It's really impacted the depth of draft, you know, because top end guys, if I'm on the fence, right, it's like I could be a first rounder. Well, sometimes those guys, as the combine happens, as the draft pro day and pre draft workouts, that guy goes from pick 32 to 15, right? He kind of rises. Well, that guy stayed at Ohio State. That guy stayed at Oregon for a lot of money. Dante Moore. Ten years ago, it's like you could, you can't pass being the second overall pick. You might get injured. Now it's like, well, I'll just go back to school for five, six million dollars. I've made five, six million dollars last couple years. I'm having a blast. Like I don't, I don't need to come out. So there's been this huge trick, you know, kind of domino effect from the first round to me through the third day. And I think all these teams are still kind of, there's a feeling out process of how do we handle big picture next year? Like do are some of the top players getting pushed back next year? But can you ever rely on that? Because our guys going to keep going back to school. I think teams are still, there's like these last couple years that they're really feeling out the NIL landscape. The good part for them is I know how the guy handles money because if you tell me right, yeah, this guy was just making, you know, the last two years he made about $2 million total. Didn't miss a workout. First guy there treats everyone exactly the same as when we met him in high school. You're like, that's a high character. You feel good about it. Where the number one question I remember when I got in the NFL and up through like the last four or five years, like, how will this guy handle money? Because it's one thing to get a bag with 10k cash in it, it's another thing to get direct deposits every two weeks at enormous numbers. When you're Just like the starting right tackle, you know, like, yeah, make 900 grand. You know, the money. These football players, I mean, the roster, I think some fans. You're telling me this roster is $40 million? Like, yeah, this roster is 40 million. This is Ohio State. They are paying 22 star, some of these backups because they're five stars.
- [38:41]
B
Jermaine Smith, the wide receiver next year at Ohio State. I saw a story over the weekend. Is he going to get $10 million? Now I. Ohio State's got so much depth of that position, I'd never pay a wide receiver over, like, four, three. Like, I thought three was the number, the big number that a couple top receivers could get. But, yeah, and Ohio State recruits that position so well. I doubt they'd pay that. But.
- [39:04]
A
But even like this, this draft's a good example. The top tackles all played right tackle in college interviews, like solid players, and they'd be starters. Historically, I think those guys will in the 20s. But in this draft, it's like, I think Bane, well, I mean, is probably on tape is the best pass rusher, but he's 6:1 with short arms, right? Just on tape, like, he was the most dominant guy.
- [39:26]
B
You know what, John? I've. I think I've talked about this, I think, before in other podcasts. I don't think there's as much football talent in America. I think the quality of college football because the teams are older is better, but the depth in terms of talent. I mean, we were talking about this during the CTE discussions. A lot of moms didn't want their sons to play football. I mean, I have a friend in la, big football fan. His son played quarterback in, you know, west of the 405, as they say in. In LA. And like he said, everybody in my community is like, you let your kids play football. You know, you go. You go to some of these blue states and blue cities. Like, we don't let our kids play football. And I was like, really? And he's like, oh, yeah. He's like, you know, it's just you, you, you. They're there. It's harder. Fewer kids are trying out for it. And it'll always be big in the south and Texas and parts of the country. But I do think I've noticed it. This year is a great example. I talked about this four or five years ago. I noticed it in Southern California, the whole state of California. If you looked at high school football recruiting, the state of California would have, like, there's 38 million people. It would have two elite running backs, two like four star guys. Sometimes you wouldn't have and there'd be a few other good backs. But like wide receiver, you'd have 17 guys that were five or four star guy running back, you'd have like one, maybe two like in the state of California, if you went to, on three arrivals, you know, the recruiting sites and I was noticing this and the kids, they know where the money's at. Is it quarterback, it's at star wide receiver, it's at pass rusher, it's at great corner, it's, it's, it's not at running back. So young people have always determined like trends and whether it's you know, the revival of Puma, you know, you know, the shoe brand. And so kids like, you know, they're not dopes, they don't want to play running back. So I think it's a, and increasingly in the NFL it's hard to get that second contract if you're a running back. So it's a, you know, football's getting more three out and four out and that's just the reality of the sport.
- [41:36]
A
Well, that's why I think, you know, in this draft, one guy that is just, you know, historically linebackers, middle linebackers were not viewed as left tackles, pass rushers, obviously quarterbacks or even wide receivers. If you told me I could get Fred Warner on my team, or Brian or Lacquer or Justin Jefferson, I think Justin Jefferson, you know, if your quarterback gets hurt, it's hard for him to get five touches a game. We saw with JJ McCarthy and even if he is humming, he's touching the ball 10 times a game, 11 times a game, you get a top linebacker in this league that's spread out, it's sidelined to sideline and they cover the tight ends and the running backs. All the running backs now can catch. And look how good most teams tight ends are. So the value of a middle linebacker is not just stuffing the A gap, making a tackle now it's playing sideline to sideline and getting 15 plus tackles and covering sometimes the best weapon on the other team all the time in the bat. Like to me if Sonny Styles hits, his impact is immense at, you know, stand up linebacker and the versatility that brings and I think sometimes we don't value that position and I think it's stupid in this day and age where everyone's running Kyle Shanahan's offense. Well, what's Kyle Shanahan's offense? You tell the running back to just run at the right or left tackle and then just pick a lane. Well, who's the guy figuring out how to tackle the middle linebacker? You know, he's the guy making all the tackles in the Shanahan against the Shanahan running scheme that literally it feels like 80% of the team run now. So I think Sonny Styles is a guy that 6, 5, 4, 4. He's only been playing the position now for a couple years. He was just taught by an NFL coordinator. I think his impact could be just immense by whoever gets him and go down is like, damn, how did that guy fall to 7? You know, if he's the, he could be the best player in the draft.
- [43:34]
B
All right, John, that's an easy one tonight. Easy lift. 40 minutes. Easy lift. We're going to give Post Masters, we're going to give our crew an easy edit and have a great Sunday. I'm going to go watch some of the Post Masters coverage and thanks everybody.
- [43:55]
A
We'll talk soon. The volume Shoot your shot.
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