← The Herd with Colin Cowherd
The Herd with Colin Cowherd
Ryen Russillo on NBA Draft Coverage, ESPN stories, Great Podcasting, College Football | Colin Cowherd
01:03:47
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- [00:00]
Colin Cowherd
This is an Iheart podcast, okay? Have you heard about this? Last year, Degree changed the formula for their Cool Rush deodorant, and their fans rebelled and wanted the old scent back. And Degree listened. That doesn't happen often, they admitted they effed up and they're bringing back the original Cool Rush scent. They're bringing it back and it's exactly how you remember it. Cool, crisp and fresh. There's a reason it's the number one men's antiperspirant. And it's back in Walmart, Target and other stores now for under four bucks. So try and see what the fuss is about. Head to your local Walmart or Target to try the OG Degree Cool Rush for yourself. Just like how true champs master both offense and defense, the BMW IX masters both ultimate performance and unbeatable space. Love mine. The greatest legends in sports never compromise in any aspect of their game.
- [00:49]
Ryan Russillo
So why would you settle for anything.
- [00:50]
Colin Cowherd
Less from your SUV or. What I love about my BMW IX is that it redefines the electric vehicle experience seamlessly integrates powerful performance. It's bold, daring design, a refined interior.
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Ryan Russillo
Details cutting edge technology. Basically pushes the boundaries of innovation.
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Colin Cowherd
Thousands of details went into creating the ultimate electric SUV compromise. Not one of them.
- [01:12]
Ryan Russillo
Summer is here, and you can now get almost anything you need for your sunny days delivered with Uber Eats. Now, what do we mean by almost? Well, you can't get a well groomed lawn delivered delivered. But you can get chicken parm delivered. A nice tan. Sorry. A box fan. Happily, yes. A day of sunshine? No. A box of fine wines. Yes, Uber Eats can definitely get you that. Get almost almost anything delivered with Uber Eats. Order now. Alcohol in select markets. Product availability may vary by region. See app for details.
- [01:50]
Jim Rome
Oikos presents 15 seconds of strength.
- [01:53]
Colin Cowherd
Here we go. Steve's got a trunk full of groceries and no one to help him.
- [01:56]
Unknown
Oh, that's tough.
- [01:57]
Jim Rome
Jim looks like a five trip load at least.
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Colin Cowherd
He grabs the first bag the second Bob.
- [02:02]
Jim Rome
It looks like he's trying to do.
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Unknown
It all one trip.
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Colin Cowherd
He shimmies the door open, steps over the dog. Oh, and he stumbles.
- [02:07]
Unknown
Oh, right into the kitchen without missing a beat.
- [02:09]
Jim Rome
Jim. Now that's a man who eats his protein packed Oikos.
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Colin Cowherd
With 15 grams of complete protein in each cup. Oikos Triple Zero can help build strength for every day.
- [02:18]
Jim Rome
Oikos Stronger makes everything better.
- [02:22]
Colin Cowherd
The volume. Well, it's nearly two months till the Cowboys play their first preseason game, but Dallas is about to heat up. That's because one of golf's biggest stars Bryson DeChambeau is coming home to play the live Golf Dallas event June 27th to the 29th. Dallas is going to be out in force to see their hometown favorite in action, but he's going to have a stacked fight on his hands. Brooks Koepka, Phil Mickelson, Joaquin Niemann, the current front runner of the individual championship. So they'll all be leading their teams into battle. And if it wasn't enough to get you out in the zone, here's a live show from Texas own Whiskey Meyer. Saturday, June 28th. Best of all, there's loads of ways to beat the heat. It's going to be the coolest place in Dallas that weekend. So if you want to come make some noise with Bryson to can't miss experience. Grab your tickets now@livegolf.com l I v golf.com or if you can't make it this time, you can follow every shot live and exclusively on Fox Sports. Okay, Ryan Marcillo is joining me. I'm doing 30 minutes because the guy works his ass off and I'm not going to grind him. That or he can go on local Des Moines radio and talk about the 28th pick in the second round. Okay, so I have something I'm going to throw at you because you're a writer and I was kind of proud of it.
- [03:38]
Jim Rome
I never could tell if. If.
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Colin Cowherd
So a lot of people.
- [03:40]
Jim Rome
Well, actually, I can tell. Usually when people say, hey, you're a writer, it's actually an insult because there's nothing of note yet, at least publicly. But yeah. Okay. I think we're cool enough that I'll let you make the joke, but go ahead.
- [03:53]
Colin Cowherd
Okay. No, I have a lot of respect for your writing because I think it's hard. So you know how people talk about fomo?
- [04:01]
Jim Rome
I do.
- [04:01]
Colin Cowherd
And I had a teenage daughter and I lived through it a little bit.
- [04:04]
Jim Rome
You were jealous of her?
- [04:05]
Colin Cowherd
And I came up with something. Oh, no. So what's funny is through the years I've tried to think of something, you know, kind of an anecdote to it. And I said I came up with I have phobia, which is fear of being in any. And over the last several years on effing TikTok, if you're not selling me sit ups and mushroom coffee and vacations in Dubai, you know, Bogota, I'm like, there's this thing going on. And the reason I bring this up because I think as a broadcaster, sometimes Fox really protects me. And I'm not joking. They. They, like put a fortress around me they don't let it because they understand three hours a day is a lot of talking. And I, I, I've watched Stephen A. Smith, some of the criticism about him. And my take, he and McAfee bust their ass. They work really hard. I mean, McAfee has no days off in the football season. And my takeaway is, is that it's impossible to be like the perfect parent, great in your career, four kids, every recital, every little league name. My take is most broadcasters at some point, pick one or two things. You've picked NBA among yours, and NFL is mine. I go a mile deep on it and everything else suffers a little bit. And I don't. You and I don't. We both worked at espn, but I always felt the ideology of ESPN was if you make good money, we're working you, we're getting you on a lot of stuff. Fox, interestingly, is the opposite. Their thing is we'll compensate you. We want you to be great on what you're great at, but we're not putting you on a bunch of stuff. And so when I watch the NBA coverage and I think the NBA is big enough, you should just do NBA. And that is your beat. Like, Windhorst is not doing baseball. Am I a relic? To think if you're a network and doing a sport and you're a marquee personality, that's it. That's what you do.
- [06:19]
Jim Rome
No, I don't think you're a relic. I do think that there's a tendency for those of us, again, this is a very small window of the population, but that do this all the time because, like, when people ask me, like, hey, what do you do? And then they're me, like, that's amazing. That must be awesome. And I'm like, it's great. You know, I had some goals. I've, I've reached some, I haven't reached others. But I think you and I would admit, like, your worst day, going into ESPN to bullshit for three hours. Like, even I, as a younger guy that was mad at the world and felt slighted at every turn, I, I still could allow myself to go, hey, this isn't that bad. Like, this isn't that bad of a life. But what I would say is, the difference is, is that when I go home, work doesn't stop. And for me in Connecticut, too, especially at that time, you know, it was waking up thinking about what I was going to say, prepping to say what I was going to say, say what I was going to say for three hours, four o' clock, run home gym, food and then watch games and think about what I was going to say for the six hours I was watching games on top of the 20 for football. And look, I've probably because of my background, felt like I had to prove myself all the time. So I almost felt like you owed the audience, right? You owed the audience to be into it. So as you say, like, is it to be, is it to be a relic to suggest that you should really only follow one thing? Well, if you're a wind horse and that's your beat, I don't expect Wind horse to break down the college football rankings on a Tuesday night. But if you're doing what you and I were doing in, in some forms, like you're still doing exactly what you're doing, I'm doing less. But as much as I'm an NBA guy, I'm probably living in Florida and not Manhattan beach if I'm not doing any NFL. Like you have to figure out a way to do NFL. And I love college football. I like it more than the NFL. So I still want to watch college football on Saturdays. I've definitely, as I've gotten older, been like, can I, is there any way I can like dial back some of this? I mean, baseball is a sport I love, grew up with. It was my first job. I don't have time for it. When all this basketball stuff is over next week, I'm not just going to be like, okay, it's baseball season and I'm going to sit at home, I'm going to get out of the house, I'm going to travel, I'm going to do some things. So I don't know if you're saying this because it's the right approach to prevent ourselves or if it's a little, if you'll allow me, like, is it at all self serving what you're saying at this point in your life?
- [08:33]
Colin Cowherd
No, I think what I'm saying, I misstated it. I think you're from. If you're on a marquee television network broadcast. I'm a generalist, so nobody considers me an expert. Right. Like I'm not on the NBA draft or the NFL draft or the postseason baseball or the Indy 500 crew or the World Cup. I'm a generalist. I'm not on a network Tiffany marquee event. But as I watch the criticism for broadcasters that make mistakes on these events, my take is once you pay $11 billion for events as a network, like, I don't want to see Joe Buck And Aikman. That's what they do. They go a mile deep. They should have an off season. And I don't want to dilute them. Like, that's what I think of them as. They're the NFL guys.
- [09:24]
Jim Rome
Yeah. Yeah. And look, they don't want to be diluted. I always joked once I'd been in the business enough that I was like, I want to come back as a former college football quarterb quarterback, and I want to see you at the end of August, and then maybe I pop up on the draft and then I'll see you. Like, that's the gig. That's the ultimate gig. But there is something that happens to all of us. I remember I was trying to fight my way through Boston. I go, why does this guy get a radio show? And then he's on this TV show every single night. And then he's also doing pre and post this. Like, why can't you just have one job? And for whatever it is our industry, I don't. You know, this has changed a lot. It's like, we still need all the stuff. And I know ESPN's taking a ton of. Because of their draft coverage. I used to be on the radio coverage. You know, I was never going to be on TV there. So the fact that I was never at that desk, I couldn't even. It wasn't like, sure, I would have loved to have been able to do it. I was never going to be able to do it. I was never going to be invited to that. So my criticisms are not based on, like, any jealousy. I usually like to think I'm pretty aware about stuff, but, you know, whether it's, you know, I don't really feel like talking about Stephen A. All that much. And, you know, hell, my contract's up here, too. So, like, what am I going to start doing? Ripping everybody everywhere? Right. That wouldn't make a ton of sense. I. I think I would ask anyone this. It's like, the draft itself is a huge commitment to be prepared for that. And it. Right.
- [10:37]
Colin Cowherd
Oh, my God.
- [10:38]
Jim Rome
I used to drive myself crazy just having to do the radio thing. And then I would host the combine for television. I did that for, like, five years. And I love the draft. It's my favorite sporting event of the entire year. But what I'd ask certain people is, do you just want to be on the marquee event without any concern for how prepared you are for how much goes into this? And that's where I think it's either somebody who's working too much. You could say, hey, this person spread really thin. But, you know, I just. I just feel like it happens a lot in our industry. It's like, do you. Do you want the title or do you want the job? And I think a lot of guys love the title. And if. If people are going to let you do whatever you want to do, then what are you supposed to say? No. But I look at some of the thoughts around, like, oh, you know, this person's a huge star, so we'd like to get him involved here, like, to get him involved there. It's like, my first thought is, if I were offered something, it's like, am I even ready to be on this broadcast? And if I wasn't, I'd be ashamed to be there.
- [11:42]
Colin Cowherd
I was on the draft, NFL draft for two years on radio, and I. And again, I'm pretty good. I didn't feel. I just didn't feel. I just. I kind of was like, oh, no, no, no, this. I shouldn't be stealing somebody's gig. I'm not going a mile deep. I mean, I read everything. I made calls. But I'm thinking, I'm not. This is not me. This is not what I am. I'm not good enough on this to do this. And I'm not knocking anybody who. Like, there are certain people that they are so good on stuff, they should do it for the rest of their life. But it's interesting is I've watched some of the criticism of people, and a lot of it's been Stephen A. And my takeaway is, man, it's. I think in these marquee events, I think networks have to step in and just say, you gotta have specialists. It's almost like in baseball, there's literally the bullpen, there are setup men, closers and middle relievers. And I think if I ran it, like, at the volume, like, I have Daniel Cormier, for one thing. I don't bleed my guys over at all. I want you to be a middle. Kofta's golf and lives for it, but it's like, at the volume. And I have much less of a budget. My whole thing is, I'll be a generalist. Nick Wright's a generalist. Everybody else is a specialist. And I. I like it. I. When I go to a guy, I know exactly what he's going to talk about.
- [13:08]
Jim Rome
Yeah. But here's. And this is not a disagreement. This is about the programming part of this and. And the realization that I had, you know, the epiphany years ago that I Realized, like, ultimately, I think there are certain people that are stars and not stars, because the audience, as much as they complain about it, it's a lot like a movie. Like, if you suggest a movie to somebody else, the first question they'll probably ask is, who's in the movie? And if you're like, oh, it's a bunch of underground guys, you know, your second city, you won't. You won't know a single guy. The other person is more likely to be like, well, I'm not. I'm probably not going to watch that unless there's some art house goon. Right. So when I think about how some of this stuff is staffed when you are a star in our business, wherever you are, espn, Fox, it. The idea is like, let's. Let's get those people on. Like, look, Mike and Mike along with you. And all those years, monster radio shows, monster successes. I think I remember, you know, Mike and Mike finding new ways to get the Mike and Mike part of it. On some more of the NFL coverage, they had their own NFL show. So you can be saying, hey, this is spreading our guys a little thin because, you know, it's a brutal life in general to work a morning show, but at the same time, it's like, hey, we're launching this new show. Well, who's on it? Oh, these really good young guys. These. These awesome researchers. You've never heard of one of them? Well, you're not. You're not introducing that upfront. Advertisers aren't excited. Whereas you go, hey, we got Mike and Mike for 30 minutes. The Mike and Mike football show that we're playing in the afternoons, once a week. Turnkey advertisers are already excited about that. Like, wasn't there even a time where it was thought that you could be on college game day and you probably would have done it and it actually would have made sense because it probably would have brought a different level of juice to the show. That. Not to say that that show was ever really in trouble, because it's a great show. It's been a great franchise for a really long time. Yeah, you would have been prepped up on it because I know how much you love college ball. But that's. That's probably spreading you a little thin, especially with the travel. But there's a point in time where I'm sure you would have said yes, and it would have brought something different to that show.
- [15:18]
Colin Cowherd
Yeah, no, I. Listen, I. McAfee, bust his ass. He's got my respect, and so does Stephen A I'm. This is not criticism of them. I mean, McAfee could fall to bed and be interesting with wrestling. The guy's like an encyclopedia. If he's just unbelievable. Years ago, Nick Khan asked me about him, and I'm like, how come he's not on the payroll? He's like the best wrestling guy out there. They didn't know if Roman Reigns was the guy. I'm like, I'd make McAfee or heavyweight champ. You know, put him on something and add £40. That's who I'd watch. No, it's just interesting. So the other night, I will. Nick, he's busy. So the other night I had dinner. It was one of these. I don't do this. This is not my scene. But it was. The San Vicente bungalow is the one in Santa Monica. So it's overlooking Santa Monica. Very nice. And so I had it with an executive with a streaming service. And it was just kind of a, you know, just a nice guy that a buddy wanted me to meet. We had a great, great dinner, and we were talking and this guy said. He goes, people have no idea. Like, Sunset Boulevard is dead. Like, it's been dead for two years. And I don't think. And this person was talking about when he does zooms at this big company he's at, he goes, I get budgets. Should we do it? Should we do it in Vancouver, Georgia, Louisiana? Los Angeles, Singapore? He's like, Los Angeles is 30 to 40% more expensive than flying everybody to Melbourne to do the show or Dublin. And I don't think people know this outside of Los Angeles, but, you know, everybody's heard of Sunset Strip. And when I just moved to Chicago, and what was interesting is about two weeks, three weeks before I left, I met somebody on Sunset at night, Ryan. There was nobody there on a Thursday night. Like, there was no juice stuff boarded up. And I wonder your thoughts, because you're in this business, you're writing and meeting with people, does anything get made anymore? How much stuff is being made?
- [17:25]
Jim Rome
I'm not the right guy to ask because I'm. I can answer it to some degree because of where I'm at now. I do have some really good things that are going on, but every time you get a yes, all you're waiting for is the more significant yes. So there's. I've had a few yeses where it's like, this is a big deal until you have to get the next yes. And so, you know, I've. I have friends that are in the industry that are like, it's really hard to get stuff made. I also think that we're comparing what's happening now, which is basically a pullback from where it felt like everything was getting made because you had so many. I mean, think about it. Traditional television, traditional cable to now streaming networks doing whatever they can to get into the content game and try to outflank each other. So whether it was executives at different studios getting promoted and just be like, we're going to bring you in and we're going to do this, and then just people getting shows green lit, or at least they were getting the pilots bought. I don't know how many people were selling things that weren't written ahead of time. But it is a very challenging time because of something that, again, I, I'm not really allowed to get all that into it. But, you know, at one point there's a thing that I was working on and I was really flattered by how many people wanted to work on this one project. And I asked one of my friends, I was like, man, you know, this is really. I'm, I'm kind of in shock. And he was like, yeah, it's also like a good job. So cool, cool job on your laptop, but it's also like a very good job. And people want.
- [18:57]
Colin Cowherd
Yes.
- [18:58]
Jim Rome
You know, again, this is sort of a weird thing for me because it makes it sound like I'm trying to make something sound a lot cooler than it is. And I, and it's not my day to day, you know, I'm not in the Hollywood game day to day, but it's definitely been a massive learning experience. The seven years of like, how I thought it, but I knew, I knew I was already naive, which helped me in a way. So I was never really truly disappointed when things didn't work out, but I don't. I think everybody would agree that there was. We, we might say it's harder to get things made now, but what are we comparing it to? It was like a gold rush of content there for a lot of creators out there.
- [19:32]
Colin Cowherd
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- [20:11]
Jim Rome
Gambling problem.
- [20:12]
Colin Cowherd
Call 1-800-GAMBLER in New York, call 877-8-HOPENY or text hopeny467-369 in Connecticut. Help is available for problem gamb, call 888-789-7777 or visit ccpg.org Please play responsibly on behalf of Boot Hill Casino and Resort in Kansas, 21 and over. Age and eligibility varies by jurisdiction. Void in Ontario, new customers only. Bonus bets expire 168 hours after issuance. For additional terms and responsible gaming resources, see DKNG Co Audio.
- [20:41]
Ryan Russillo
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- [21:52]
Colin Cowherd
Can now get almost anything you need.
- [21:55]
Ryan Russillo
For your sunny days delivered with Uber Eats. Now what do we mean by almost? Well, you can't get a well groomed lawn delivered, but you can get chicken parm delivered. A day at the lake? That's a no. A Philly cheesesteak? That's a yes. A nice tan? Sorry. A box fan? Happily yes. What about a day of sunshine? Not happening. How about a box of fine wines? Yeah, that's happening. Delivery's on its way okay. How about some clear skies? Nope. Well, how about some French fries? Yeah. So how about a freshly cut lawn? Can't help you there. But a barbecued prawn or it and it's on its way. Even throw in some paper towels. Clean up after the feast. So while you can't get fun in the sun delivered, don't worry, because you can get pork buns delivered. Uber Eats can definitely get you that. Get almost. Almost anything delivered with Uber Eats. Order now. Alcohol in select markets. Product availability may vary by region. See app for details.
- [22:54]
Colin Cowherd
Hey, so we all make mistakes, but.
- [22:56]
Ryan Russillo
Owning up to them is the right thing to do.
- [22:58]
Colin Cowherd
So you know Degree Cool Rush deodorant, right? Well, last year they changed the formula, and it did not go over well with their fans. So Degree's whole thing is it turns up the sweat and odor protection when you turn up up the effort. And good thing it does, because Cool Rush fans really turned up the effort to bring the original formula back. One guy even started an online petition, and degree listened. They admitted they effed up. They're bringing back the original Cool Rush scent. They're bringing it back, and it's exactly how you remember it. Cool, crisp, and fresh. It's back in Walmart, Target, and other stores now for under $4. There's a reason it's been the number one men's antiperspirant for the last decade. It's the same reason why people were not happy when it changed. So if you've never tried it, it might be a good time to see what the fuss is about. Head to your local Walmart Target and try the OG Degree Cool Rush for yourself.
- [23:43]
Unknown
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- [25:29]
Colin Cowherd
I want to talk because your primary thing now is podcasting, and I thought about this the other day. I was watching a Joe Rogan clip, and then it was followed by a Dax shepherd clip. And, you know, if you would have guessed 15 years ago, you just said, what are the biggest Hollywood podcasts or the biggest podcast? If I'd have said Dax Shepard and Joe Rogan, you'd have thought like, well, did Denzel do one? Or did you know what I mean? Like, did Bo Bridges do one? But I was thinking about podcasting and I was thought about, tell me if this is a weird take. I thought the other day I was like, what makes a great podcast? Broadcasting, which I grew up in, and I'm still a broadcaster who has a podcast, but I'm not a podcaster. Broadcasting was always about the skill of broadcasting. You didn't necessarily want to show vulnerability. You were basically polished and you were current, and even if you were curious, you didn't get to talk about what you wanted to talk about. And I'm watching Rogan and Dax Shepard, and I thought if there's a thread on what makes podcasting really good. Joe Rogan and Dax Shepard have had really difficult journeys. They talk about all their shit, and they're two of the most curious guys, genuinely curious guys. I mean, Rogan cares about shit that I wouldn't spend a minute on, and he's an expert on it. And I was thinking about, you know, people ask me all the time, I want to do a podcast. And my takeaway is, are you insanely curious? You don't have to be skilled at broadcasting. You can burp twice an hour, twice a minute. But your take on the difference between broadcasting and podcasting, and I think it's tell everybody your warts and be curious as hell. And that essentially if you're those two, you win.
- [27:28]
Jim Rome
Yeah, I think a lot of what you said makes a lot of sense, and I think you and I are a little similar in the way we got into broadcasting, where, you know, look, I had the Syracuse Newhouse school application filled out. I don't know if I was going to get in. I might have gotten into, like, some. Yeah, some thing that allows you to go there and then maybe you get into the school. And that was with a. A degree already from Vermont. And then I. After years of kind of toiling around and then wondering if I really want to take on more student debt, you know, I ended up getting a job in minor league baseball, which, you know, I've talked about. But that was like, when I. That was like when I was turning 26, 27. And so, you know, there's one thing about being a broadcaster that understands, hey, this is how I want to start the beginning of my monologue. And then this is what I want to make sure I do. And, you know, sometimes even at espn, I was like, do you give a. About anything I say in between the rejoins and the teases and the resets? Like, I swear most of the feedback always felt. And then I. Like, if I were maybe getting a little pissy, I'd go, cowherd sucks at all the four Maddox. And you guys all worship him and be like, oh, that's Colin. You know, that's. But ultimately, like, I was. I was sitting there thinking, like, what Colin is saying in those opens is so much more important than anything else. I don't care if his rejoins suck. I don't care if he forgets to reset. I don't care if his teases are terrible. What's important is the meat. Like, you know, what's the meat? Because the meat is what's going to bring me back. And it's funny, too, because I started to realize, like, when I would drive into work and I would catch you, or if I was already there and, you know, you were on in the hallway or on in the office, I would be more annoyed when you had a guest than when you had an open segment. Even if I disagreed with everything that you were saying, I at least was interested in the way that you were going to perceive things. Right. And this is what I think is, like, a real difference between who is somebody that people want to listen to versus, like, who is a good broadcaster. Because we can get into the whole podcasting thing, too, where it's like, look, you can be a podcaster this afternoon after going to Best Buy, if you really want to be one. You know, when I first started trying to read books about screenwriting, Robert McKee and story, which is kind of like a standard Book, he would say, like, who would ever pick up a guitar and be frustrated that they couldn't play a song that afternoon? But yet everybody would open up final draft and think like, hey, I'm a screenwriter. It's like, well, because one is the most intimidating thing, and the other thing is just sort of typing, and you have to be bad at it before you can be good at it. But you don't realize how bad you are as a writer. You realize immediately how bad you are as a guitar player. And I think there's some similarities in, like, podcasting, where you go, well, what's so hard about that? Like, I'm just gonna grab a mic and I hit record and look at me. I'm a broadcaster. But I think the radio instincts helped a lot of us become better podcasters. But the real answer to what you were talking about, which I've sort of delayed in getting there, is that you have to have life experiences to be interesting. And if you are like, hey, I'm high school football. I am doing all the Syracuse stuff. I'm doing all the Mizzou stuff, Northwestern stuff. And now I have a job, like, right away doing updates at 22 years old in Chicago. It gets great that you've already mapped it out and you're already on the air at that in the traditional sense of things, you know, where you had to kind of get somebody to say yes to you, where now no one has to say anything to you, and you could just be a podcaster. But what made you interesting, and I think what makes a Rogan interesting or Dax interesting is that if you have to fill up all this space, you better have gone through some different experiences in life to then form perspective on all of these other topics that are. Go far beyond, like, the technical ability that you might learn in. In a more traditional way that I don't think you and I ever learned.
- [31:21]
Colin Cowherd
Yeah, no, that's just stuff I think about all the time. I've thought about it a lot with the volume, is when I'm listening to people, what turns me on, what turns me off. And a lot of times it's people with a lot of crap and they talk about it, and it forms their opinions and life kind of perspective. And I think it's speaking.
- [31:38]
Jim Rome
Let me stay on this. Like, I went. I remember you got really personal once because of something you were going through. So I don't. Right. It was a divorce, right?
- [31:48]
Colin Cowherd
Yeah.
- [31:50]
Jim Rome
So you started talking about your divorce. I think you got a little. For doing it. You wanted to share it with your audience because especially in radio, which again, the fact that you've continued to do this three hours a day for this many years, as somebody that had to do it for 10 years, I don't know if, I don't know if I could do it. I don't know if I could. Like, when I was in it, I didn't think about it. Now that I've been out of it for seven years, I don't know that I could go back to doing it. But I don't know that you can become great at this. Whether it's the talk show and obviously we're talking audio more here. Think about how many people are investing their time into you. And I've always felt like one of the biggest lessons was that they want to know more about you. So even though it may seem unprofessional, it may even seem weird, hey, stick to sports. If you can find a way to make the human connection, I think you get paid back with such incredible loyalty because you open up a little bit more. You show that you're vulnerable. Like, all of us want to be right. All of us want to sound like we're the coolest guy in the room all the time. But like, you can't, you can't really do that. Like, you have to, you have to be. It's not even self deprecating. You have to be willing to share moments of your failure. And I think you did that in a way where in the, in the moment, a lot of people didn't understand it, but I really think that's what the audio relationship is about because they, you have to pay back. All of those people that are investing so much time with you as part of their daily routine.
- [33:15]
Colin Cowherd
Yeah, I mean, people, some people, I know me, I tune into a show every single morning. Like, I have a, I have a rhythm to my day. Like, if the podcast isn't there every Tuesday and Thursday for people, I'm like, I'm kind of bitter. I'm like, you're my. I'm on the train now. I want to be entertained. So it's like you do give yourself to people. By the way, I do take the train. And I didn't know trains do this. I know, it's crazy, right? It's just fricking crazy. So I was in Manhattan beach the last couple days. I was in, out, I had to go see dentist and all that crap. So I was just in and out. But you know, Nick Wright was joking. He's like, dude, you will be off that train in two days when you get a car service. I thought I was going to be, but the burbs to the city in Chicago are worse than LA traffic. It's a 29 minute train ride and they have a quiet car, bro. I have never listened to more podcasts, yours included. I get on that thing in the morning at 7:30 8:05 Ogilvy Transportation Center. My driver picks me up, I go to the Big ten network, do my show. It forces me to podcast. Otherwise I just, I'll sit around and just spitball and waste time and clean the house. It forces me to listen to podcasts I listen to every five days a week. I'm on one for 30 minutes every day. So in a strange way it forces me to be disciplined, listening to other people's work. And I love it.
- [34:41]
Jim Rome
Do you find yourself like trying out things that you would never listen to because, I mean, there's so much stuff out there. Do you, do you look at it like, I wonder how much of it is as a consumer versus like an evaluator or somebody who's done the job for this long.
- [34:56]
Colin Cowherd
Okay, so I, I, that's a good question. I trust my staff at the volume. They come to me with stuff, but I trust them to find stuff. The first year I was helping to find stuff, but now I feel like I've got my farm system. I mean, I've got my scouts all line up and that's what they do and they'll bring stuff to me. So I'm generally looking for people. You know, it's like, oh, somebody told me about Sam Harris. Well, let's give that a run. And somebody told me about this. Okay, let's give that a run. I'm experimental. Like I, I'll listen to, I'll listen. You know, for about a week and a half, two weeks, I was listening to Jake Tapper interviews. I wanted, I didn't buy his book, but I wanted to hear him try to kind of wiggle his way out of.
- [35:34]
Jim Rome
Isn't that fascinating? I like, I, I'm halfway through the book. Oh, and I, it was sent to me.
- [35:41]
Colin Cowherd
How would, where do you land on that? How do you feel about that?
- [35:44]
Jim Rome
I have an analogy, but it's a little too harsh. It's a good line, but it's too harsh. It has nothing to do with my political leanings one way or the other. I think you and I are actually pretty aligned with the way we see the world, you know? Yeah. I could sit there and get mad about a ton of Stuff. I just don't know why you'd want to do that all day long and just share it. But some people are super into doing that. You just, all day long, let them, you know, fire them off. This is wrong. This is right. This is wrong. I think Tapper, like a lot of people in the media to pretend that the rest of us were the, that were like, what's going on here? And then to be the guy that writes the book. Maybe it's as simple as the publishers going, this is the best. Like, let's get him to write the book. Have everybody be pissed about it. And Alex also wrote the book with him. I just wonder if that was a tactical thing where it felt pretty gross to have Tapper be the guy that's going to write the book, that's going to set the record straight. And again, I don't know how much did Alex do more of the work that that's the co author of the whole thing. I just wondered if it was like a publisher's dream, despite the questions.
- [36:57]
Colin Cowherd
So Alex is like the guy who just won that primary, you know, the socialist Democrat in New York. I always thought it's strange, that guy because the last two weeks I followed that religiously. I was fascinated by it. A socialist, by the way.
- [37:12]
Jim Rome
I just want to make sure I said his last name. I felt bad that I didn't have it.
- [37:15]
Colin Cowherd
Formerly of the Atlantic. Now he's got a substack. So I've been following him for years. Much like that Mayor, mayoral candidate. Alex has a strength which is he's not snarky. In disagreement. He'll listen. The discourse is redeemable. He's not. Tapper's different. Tapper sat on the throne on CNN and could be an a hole and could be dismissive and snarky. So I'm much less willing to just go, whoa, he missed on that one. It's like how you presented it from your chair. Like Alex Thompson acknowledges, like, it's almost a journey with him. Hey, man, I'm fascinated by this. Whoa. I think I'm right. But he's not dismissive. Like, and that's okay. Like, I, I find that too many people, like I always say, I, I would like to be right, but I'd rather get it right. So, like, I never get too rigid on the right thing. I think my thing with Tapper was, bro, you came off as really condescending. I'm not into it. Bill Maher has strong beliefs but will laugh at himself if he's wrong. Like, just Be like, totally own it. And I'm like, that's exactly how to present it. Now, Bill's obviously a comedian, so he's better at that. But when the media is. And the media mostly leans left, CNN certainly does when the media presents itself. As your argument has no merit, it's like, guys, we all have TikTok. We're all seeing the Biden videos where he's just stiff, standing stiffly. It's like, yeah, we've all had a grandma like that or a grandpa like that. We know what's happening. So that's why, that's why I'm willing to give Alex the benefit of the doubt and not Jake Tapper.
- [39:00]
Jim Rome
Yeah, I would, I would say we're in agreement on that one. You know, I remember when Bobby Knight.
- [39:06]
Colin Cowherd
Yeah.
- [39:06]
Jim Rome
Went through all of his different stuff and it was the Neil Reed incident where, you know, he had choked a player. Allegedly choked the player. And then the video came out, right. And so it was like, okay, well now the video. Yeah. And then Bobby and I had a book that came out and I remember I didn't want to buy it because I don't want to read, you know, 200 plus pages of his self absorbed vibe, even if I can respect what he was capable of doing there for a really long time as a basketball mind. But I remember jumping. And I'm paraphrasing this because it was a really long time ago, but I remember where I was. I think I was like in Kenmore Square. There's Barnes and Noble there. And I was like, let me just see if I can find like the Neil Reed part of this book. And the way he tried to rationalize it and was like, you know, I also thought it was really interesting, like how grainy the video was. And I just was so disgusted. I was so disgusted reading that. Being like you're trying to figure out, I mean, this is almost like the defense attorney trying to conjure up any reasonable doubt. But you're like, hey, look, like this is a kid that went to your school and you lost your. And you have a track record of being unhinged. And now that you're going to tell me, you're going to tell me that I'm an for like questioning what happened here. And that's why I'm, I'm not super political at all. It has nothing to do with Biden or if it were the other way around, I'd feel the exact same way. If you felt like you had very curated opinions on this national story, it's a Global story. Anyone that had any kind of common sense was like, what's going on here? And then to be just reprimanded.
- [40:44]
Colin Cowherd
Yeah, yeah.
- [40:44]
Jim Rome
By so many people. And then to have one of the guys that reprimanded you now making millions off of this book. I wouldn't want to write it. I'd feel bad.
- [40:54]
Colin Cowherd
Yep. Yeah, that's how I felt. No, I. And it's. And by the way, I can, I can respect somebody's political acumen and their work ethic, but that's. That's how I always fall. The other thing.
- [41:08]
Jim Rome
About the Mavericks pick.
- [41:10]
Colin Cowherd
The Paul.
- [41:13]
Jim Rome
So much for the draft recap today.
- [41:17]
Colin Cowherd
Dude. Listen, you've done that, that.
- [41:20]
Jim Rome
Whatever you want to do, man.
- [41:21]
Colin Cowherd
Everybody knows you.
- [41:23]
Jim Rome
So.
- [41:23]
Colin Cowherd
No. So it's one of the things. This is the one thing about political talk that where it gets. It's really cringy when, like a comedian, a funny comedian. Dave Chappelle's really talented. It could be John Mulaney's really talented. It doesn't matter who it is. Nick Kroll, these guys are talented people and they do something that's funny, but it's a little political. And like. Or like Bill Burr says something. Now everybody's like, bill Burr's not funny. F off. He's hysterical. The guy is one of the all time great standup guys. The cringiest thing political people do or even the public does is when you take a comedian and let's face it, one of the funniest things Saturday Night Live ever did, and I'm no comedy judge, but when they did that bit on the night Trump won and all these liberals are upstairs, I think Chappelle's in that. And they're in the apartment upstairs. Did you ever see that one? I think that's the funniest thing I've ever seen. Oh, it's all. And what they're doing is Saturday Night Live. It's pretty introspective looks at themselves and they're like in a New York apartment and it's during the election and I think Chappelle's in it and they're making fun of themselves and how New Yorkers talk, like, as Trump is winning state by state. And it's like that moment, I had more respect for Saturday Night Live because they were making fun of themself. It was a real moment. I know you looked that up, but.
- [42:59]
Jim Rome
There was a clear shift with SNL where it was like, hey. And I don't know if that was because they were just, I don't know that it was aligned with Trump's victory. But it. It felt a bit of like, hey, we've been doing kind of the same material here for a long time. Like, when.
- [43:14]
Colin Cowherd
Right, For a long.
- [43:15]
Jim Rome
And when I see, like, a breakout clip of a monologue from a late night host and you're just like, dude, that was. That was a joke from, like, nine years ago, you know, you're still doing this. It has nothing to do with, like, political, like, sensitivities. You're just like, hey, I'm more offended as a content person. Like, you get to recycle this constantly. So I don't know if SNL did it, whether it was self awareness, whether it was tactical or, you know, it.
- [43:46]
Colin Cowherd
Was Chappelle, by the way. It was Chappelle. It's really. And it was really a moment for me. It was like, oh, they get it. Like, they get. We're all kind of making fun of what they've become. And I. So the only thing about politics where I'm really like, you know, ugh, is when people start telling me comedians who I've laughed at for 20 years aren't funny. You know, Chappelle did a transgender thing. And it's like, it may not be my favorite thing, but don't tell me he's not funny. Don't tell me he's not talented. That. And I always think to myself, are you trying to convince me that this comedian that I've watched six Netflix specials isn't talented? Like, stop. Like, that's how. It's almost like it poisons people. They get so into politics that they think they're trying to convince people on the Internet, stuff we know to be true isn't true. That's where it's weird.
- [44:39]
Jim Rome
Yeah, I just don't have any time for that stuff. I'm not passionate enough about it. I mean, I certainly have thoughts. I can think some things are right. I can think some things are wrong. But in our world, like, it doesn't really do us any good. I think every now and then, like, you'll feel motivated to go, hey, I'm actually going to use my platform to say this kind of stuff. I feel like there was a generation behind us at espn. Like, I've always, you know, this kind of goes back to your radio days, but. And I think I've said a version of this before, but every now and then, like, maybe every six months during your prime back then, he would. You would let something fly that was like a societal observation. And maybe there was a little hint of politics in there, but it just. It still felt safe. But it was a departure from the. I don't know if the Steelers have enough. You know, like, you were. You were like, look, I got to do three hours.
- [45:27]
Colin Cowherd
Let.
- [45:27]
Jim Rome
Let me. Let me expand a little bit. But it didn't feel like that's what you really, deep down, wanted to do. And it usually was really good. And then it would stand out because it was a departure from the norm. It was insightful. Maybe it got some people in the car thinking a little differently, and it would have this moment where it would kind of stand out. And then I started noticing, like, more and more. I was like, I feel like everybody's kind of doing this, like, a lot more. And then it was like, I don't know. I still like to watch games, and I'm. I'm right. Like, I'm not. I'll admit, like, I don't know that I'm super educated on this. I can have a thought, but there'll be immediately all these people telling me that I'm wrong, depending on how they're aligned. And so, you know, back in the day of starting this whole stuff of, like, hey, I want to do NFL Mondays, But I'd really start. You know, I want to start talking about, like, you know, county seats and, you know, the change of representation. Like. Like, start mixing that in a little Tuesdays. Maybe I can compare it to the Rangers bullpen. I don't know. But, like, I'll figure out a way. But let me start dancing in those lanes. And I. I think we had talked about this where I. I started to wonder, like, are you doing this to stand out? Are you doing it because you think it's right? Are you doing it because it's just way easier than watching a million games and staying on top of everything? And so it felt like for a while there, the job was kind of changing. And this has nothing to do with, like, how I feel about what you do or you don't believe in. When we started, I got in because I loved sports, and I don't know if the SNL thing's, like, a good parallel to this, but maybe it has kind of come back around. Like, maybe, you know. Yeah, it kind of matters all over again. Because if you're really doing yourself, unless you're just going to lean in so far one way or the other, you're like, okay, I'm aligned with this group, and this is always going to be my group, and they're always going to have my back, and I'M going to have daily content and make fun of the other one. Like the political content people. I'm jealous of them. Like every day you get something that you can make fun of that you'll have so many people supporting you.
- [47:25]
Colin Cowherd
No. Right.
- [47:25]
Jim Rome
But for us, like, I want, you know, look, you do this long enough, you're gonna have plenty of people that don't like you. But it, I don't know why I would ever really want to like have, have one career where I'm trying to like show off of, like, here's, here's all this other stuff that I could talk about and get to again, because I don't know that I feel super comfortable about it. But the boss, the boss would always be like, what the are you doing? Why are you, why are you doing this? Somebody may love your football stuff, they may love your basketball stuff, but the second you start doing some of this other stuff, like, you're immediately going to piss off people that are just listeners and viewers and we're not actually in business to be losing those people. So even though I know there was an argument in the past of like, it doesn't matter about any of that, I'm like, really? Because I've never worked anywhere where they were like, hey, don't worry about your audience size, just do you.
- [48:22]
Colin Cowherd
Yeah, that's still. It doesn't matter what platform. It's all about that. Hey everybody. This message brought to you by Green River Whiskey, the official whiskey at the Colin Coward show and the Herd podcast. Summer is here, so it's a lot of long days and warm nights and the perfect time to kick back with a glass just that it two nights ago of Green River Whiskey. You're grilling, you're out at the lake, just enjoying the sunset with friends and family. Green river is your go to pour this summer. Smooth. It's classic. It's got a story that goes back over a century. Find Green river near you@greenriverwhiskey.com that's it. Greenriverwhiskey.com here's to green River Whiskey being sure to raise your spirits this summer.
- [48:58]
Ryan Russillo
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- [50:03]
Colin Cowherd
Can now get almost anything you need.
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Ryan Russillo
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- [51:09]
Colin Cowherd
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- [51:54]
Unknown
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- [53:39]
Colin Cowherd
So I said today on the show, I said, listen, I'm not going to come in hot on the draft because it's a projection draft. Yeah, I'm like, yeah. I mean, I just, I said, I think Cooper Flag's really good. I think he's a more aggressive, better defender right now at this point than Tate Tatum. I said, I think he's really good. He's not good as Tatum. He's really good. The kid from Baylor, he's a disruptor. Defensively, he looks like he's going a thousand miles an hour. I'm like, that's an NBA athlete. Is he going to score a lot? I don't know. I thought the spurs did pretty well. You know what I do think and I've talked about this a lot and I want your reaction. I've been on this now for about two months. There was about a 20 year period. So you and I grew up with the Big east and if you were a great player in the Big East, Pearl Washington, sort of an exception, or if you're a great team, you were going to be an NBA player. Ewing was going to be great in the NBA. I mean, just the way it was. There was about a 20 year run in college basketball when the G League happened. Guys went to Europe, played one year of college where like Doug McDermott was the college player of the year, Tyler Hansborough was. You go to the pros and they were rotational guys. And then two years ago I watched UConn and I went, oh, shit, there's seven NBA players. They have NBA length. They're a great. These are great players. And I thought, oh, that team could play with UNLV and Duke. That is a real team. And the reason it happened was guys are staying maybe a year longer with nil. Now American universities are poaching European players. I honestly feel like the last two years when I've watched college, we had a 20 year period. We were trying to pretend the sport was good. And Jay Billis said this the other day, NBA guys don't miss open shots. Like, it's just the seven foot guy shoots better than the six, two guy in college. And I do feel like the NIL for all the bitching about it. Rick Matino said this the other day. It's kind of made the G League irrelevant. Shit, I watched the playoffs. Indiana, Oklahoma City, no G League guys. I mean, Amen Thompson's one of the only G League unite guys. It's like second two year college guys, three year college guys. Chet Holmgren one year, probably should have stayed a second because his offensive games hit and miss. But I do feel like the last two years I've watched college and I think this will help the draft, Ryan, because it won't all be Euros. It'll even the Euros are coming and playing now at Texas. They're coming to play at Connecticut. I feel like college basketball was kind of unwatchable for 20 years and people kept saying, oh, it's great. It wasn't. It was diluted.
- [56:18]
Unknown
It was bad.
- [56:18]
Colin Cowherd
In the last two years, I've been glued to March Madness and there's just more NBA dudes.
- [56:22]
Jim Rome
College basketball is in a weird spot because, you know, growing up, I probably would rather watch Big Monday than NBA. You know, back when it was the Big east and then, you know, it wasn't. And then you packed 10 teams that were loaded with NBA players. You know, going back to those UCLA squads. Remember Washington State, loving that team that year. Robbie Calgill. Well, I guess you want to talk about the NBA guys So shout out to Robbie. But I, I, I'm, I'm with you because I, I think I even remember like you and Gottlieb arguing a bit about it being like, hey look, college basketball is largely irrelevant up until we get to march. And with everything feeling like it has to be an event, which I think Silver's doing with the NBA, it's like, hey, we've got the in season tournament, we've got plan. Like we have more almost like specialty events that we can partner in different ways. Like we're kind of just titling some of the same stuff. But you know, if this means more revenue, then that's the game. And even though like I've talked about baseball with this being like, hey, be really happy you're this incredibly successful local market thing and that your playoffs are an incredible product and you just hope that you have enough story lines to carry over that secondary interest. The tournament doesn't necessarily need all these crazy story lines because the event itself is still one of the greatest sporting events in the world. But you're right to point out like whether it was ignite, you know, with Scoop, they had Dyson, Ed Hardy, Jalen Green, Kaminga, and then you had the amendment Asar Thompson deal with overtime. I think, yeah, it felt it was starting to feel like, okay, this is, this is like even more tenuous for a, for a product that was already really struggling with its regular season in college basketball. So I think the tournament has always been something everybody's always going to care about because it's basically like a football version of gambling in a different sport where it's just so much fun and you almost feel left out of American society if you're not in the tournament. I don't know that they're ever going to recover any of that stuff from the regular season. But the draft trends of what was happening with guys circumventing college because of the compensation, going to New Zealand, you know, playing the Australian League and then come back here like it hurt the draft wise for you to have eight. What college guys before S& gay. Well, SNK went 11th, so. Well, no, Colin went well. You went 11th.
- [58:49]
Colin Cowherd
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
- [58:52]
Jim Rome
The other guy went ninth to Toronto. And even Jaeger Demon, you know, he comes from Russia, but he's at BYU because of the nil stuff, whatever it was. And I don't, I don't know all of a sudden if everybody's going to be prioritizing regular season college basketball over the NBA. But there was something that was incredibly fearful as these Other alternatives that the NIL has helped college basketball solve in the short term?
- [59:21]
Colin Cowherd
Yeah, no, I just. I watched the draft last night and I watched UConn a couple years ago, and I watched March Madness. And I'm like, okay, I'm back into the sport, like. And I. I've always been sort of loyal to the number. Like, I stopped talking college football for about 10 years because it was Alabama, Clemson and Georgia, and I felt like nobody Denver west gives a. You know what. And when the. When I remember when the PAC 12, sort of when USC decided we're going in UCLA, I got a call. I was in Turks and Caicos with my family, and Eric Shanks called me and said, just want to give you a heads up. This is going to be announced in about three hours. I was in an airport and I couldn't tell anybody, but I started doing some social and having our staff get ready for it. And I remember thinking, oh, I can talk college. I can talk college football again. You know, like, oh, USC is going to a conference. And then. And then there was a lot of talk even then about Washington, Oregon getting in. I'm like, okay, that's a real conference difference, that they'll be able to compete. They'll get some Midwest kids, they'll get Big Ten money. They'll be more fortified because the PAC 12 was paying you 30 million a year. Big Ten is paying you 70. USC was complaining to me. It's like, we can't compete with anybody. We don't have the money. And so I feel like I just follow what the audience is following. And I would see those numbers for Alabama couldn't sell off some home games. I would see some of those numbers and it was like. Like people were getting tired of it. I was getting tired of it.
- [60:47]
Jim Rome
So Alabama, though, I don't know. I'm gonna push back on that. Alabama was an incredibly spoiled fan base to the point where Saban had to beg fans for day games to come in on some of those lower level matchups because they just expected a national championship every time. I mean, it's the only campus that I'd ever been to when I used to travel for college game day, because I did the radio part of it, along with tv, where it was the only. It was the only campus. It'd be like, oh, game day's here again. Like, whatever. You know, let's. I'm gonna. I'm gonna sleep in, you know, every other place. It's like a. Not even a national holiday because, you know, it might not ever Be coming back. So as you say that, though, like, let's be honest. Would you have avoided talking college football based on some numbers if you were still at ESPN? Because I sensed an sec 10 shift there, buddy, when you started. When you started working somewhere else.
- [61:36]
Colin Cowherd
No. Well, no, I would say this is. That clat is a big thing I've noticed. And so, yeah, so I was always. I said this for years. SEC is the best. They went on recruiting day, they went on draft day, they went on Saturday. That's the best. I don't want to hear it. But I did notice about four years ago and when the NIL started and there's a lot of money in those Big Ten schools. Those are 60,000 student body. A lot of those graduates do very well. I started noticing, like, four years ago. I'm like, yeah, people are poaching Georgia and Bama and they're. They don't like. I think Nick Saban realized, like, before Texas came in, it's like, oh, shit, Texas is bigger than Alabama. Texas looks better than Alabama. So about four years ago, I started saying. And then it was. It was the Harbaugh team before they won. I'm like, yeah, I think that's. They're as good as Georgia. Like, I'm watching the Saturday, and I'm like, like, they got like 10 NFL guys, you know, all over the field. Georgia maybe has 12. So I do think about four years ago, I just watched the games, and it's like, you know, when I first started watching Caitlin Clark, I was just like, oh, shit, she's shooting from 33ft. That doesn't even make sense. I mean, the line's 22, so I tend to trust my eyes. And when the Big Ten, When Harbaugh's team the year before they won, I was like, oh, they caught up. At least the top of the Big Ten is as good as the top is the sec.
- [63:02]
Jim Rome
Yeah, I've heard this. I actually think people are, like, more unfair and how they critique the SEC than it is about being pro sec. Because I just see a lot of media members that all have Big Ten backgrounds that have been, like, incredibly celebratory about what's happened the last couple years. Now I've heard the NIL theory. I think Saban would have figured it out if he was motivated to figure it out. But he may have been at. Yeah, right.
- [63:25]
Colin Cowherd
He's also old.
- [63:26]
Jim Rome
He's been there since 2009. Or, no, 2007. Excuse me, 2007. That first year where they lost to Louisiana, Monroe. So no, I'm trying to remember if I have that year right. I feel like. I feel like I'm messing up a year because I would have been on college game day for Tuberville Iron Bull. They got smoked. I think that would have been 2008. So, anyway, I got to look that up. I need. I need more results. I need more parody. I mean, I need more balance. Because, you know, the people that didn't like the SEC still didn't like the SEC when they had seven different national. Or, excuse me, seven national championships in a row. You could run through four or five programs. You're like, okay, they could win a national championship. They're playing for a national championship. It didn't feel like the other conferences could be that deep. Certainly the Big Ten is in the conversation now, especially when you add a team like Oregon. You could say, hey, you're also adding Washington, who plays in a national championship two years ago. So that puts them on the probable list, even if that is probably more of an aberration for that program and just having an incredible year where everything kind of came together. So you might be entirely right about the balance of it. Of it flattening out the top here a little bit. But I guess for the people that I know hated the SEC so much, they were still arguing against the conference when they were winning all these titles. And so now if the standard is the.
- [64:45]
Colin Cowherd
That, yeah, I wasn't one of those.
- [64:46]
Jim Rome
Standards that the big. I was won back to back with two different teams the first time in 80 years, then the thing that you said didn't even matter when they were winning is now the thing that matters the most. Because you could also. You could also just say, hey, the SEC had an awful quarterback here, so maybe there is this shift, a shift that's long overdue. You know, sports are cyclical. Maybe the Big Ten's about to have this incredible run. But it's very hard for me to say that because of the national championship results. And look, Tennessee looked just fucking frigid against Ohio State. That looked like a football team that was not interested in competing. And they get trucked in that game. I just have a hard time with the people that do this for a living, that are on the evaluation side. They're like, that's still the best conference. Are you like, what's. What's going on?
- [65:38]
Colin Cowherd
I think the sixth best team. I think. I think I will say this year, I think about the sixth best team in the Big Ten will be Washington. And I think the sixth best team in The SEC could be Oklahoma. And so that to me is where about. I think about where we're at. I think, I think they're both. And if they played, it's a go either way game. Whoever is at home wins because I think Penn State's going to win it. I have, I picked. I remember when Ohio State lost to Michigan, I said my favorite part about college football is Ohio State's going to lose as a 20 point favorite in their last big game and they're going to get into the tournament. And by the way, Kansas City, the year that won the Super bowl two years ago, got beat by Oakland in like weeks 16 or Las Vegas. And I'm like, yeah, they should be in the playoffs. I don't care. Just like putting the best teams in. I got Penn State winning it. Singleton's amazing. Drew Aller's getting better. I think they're the best backfield by a mile in college sports.
- [66:35]
Jim Rome
Just to clean it up, it was 2008 Iron Bowl. Tuberville did get smoked and that was his last season. So that's. I remember just being down there for that. But Saban had already been there obviously the previous year when he had the bad record and people were like, is this guy really going to be that good?
- [66:50]
Colin Cowherd
He's really good on tv, by the way.
- [66:52]
Jim Rome
Yeah, I think he, you know, I think he wants to. He takes it really seriously.
- [67:00]
Colin Cowherd
Yes.
- [67:01]
Jim Rome
Yeah.
- [67:01]
Colin Cowherd
Like he's, he's in them, you know.
- [67:03]
Jim Rome
I know a couple guys that are really close with him that are with them all the time when they're on the road. And he is like adamant about making sure the stuff that he's talking about, like he's, he's not just out there, like he cares. He actually cares. Like, what are we doing? How are we doing it? Which actually makes the most sense ever. If you know anything about the guy where. I remember this story because I'd been down there a bunch of different times and I really loved. I just have so much respect for Saban. I've loved interviewing him. I always hated any Belichick comp because I was like, Belichick is not interesting. Like he goes out of his way to not be interesting. And that's like the game he's playing. And Saban is really thoughtful and for whatever reason, people try to like lump them in because they were both successful and had kind of this dead.
- [67:48]
Colin Cowherd
They're not the same guy.
- [67:50]
Jim Rome
And look, I think the world is Saban. And it seems like whatever he's going to do, he wants to make sure. Like, okay, what's. What's the best possible way for us to go ahead and do it? Which is exactly the way he runs a football program.
- [68:04]
Colin Cowherd
Wait. Well, yeah, it's when I. Urban Meyer is a friend of mine. And, like, Urban watches film. Did I ever tell you my Urban. And that's when Urban comes on the show. Mine. Like, he. I will talk to him before the break. I'm like, have you w. And he will have watched film. I never forget years ago, when LSU played Ohio State. Jim Trestle was the coach. And I. I saw Urban. I can. I can tell this story now. I saw Urban in. I think he was at Florida or was leaving or. I forget what it was, but he. I think he was at Florida at the time.
- [68:35]
Jim Rome
Yeah. Because they had just won the national championship the year before.
- [68:41]
Unknown
Yep.
- [68:41]
Colin Cowherd
And they were. LSU was playing Ohio State, and I caught. I caught him in the hallway. He went on for about eight minutes. He literally described the game. He said, ohio State will move the ball early. Mo Clorette had a big run early, I think for a touchdown. He said, Ultimately, LSU's got about twice as many good receivers, twice as many good running backs. They'll wear them down. They'll pull away in the second half, and they'll win by like 14. And he went, like, for eight to 10 minutes. He literally. I mean, he'd watched film for both teams. He literally. He recited the game. So I took that and went on the game and talked about the game, basically using all his stuff and say, hey, listen, I just talked to somebody I trust, blah, blah, blah. It made me sound so smart. But he. I like these ex coaches because a lot of times, I mean, Sable will watch film before that Saturday show. Urban will go and watch film and break it down like a coach. And it's it. And they're so freed. Right. There's no pressure. They're watching film now without an agenda, not to protect anything. And I think both those guys provide something, that film knowledge that's really valuable to me as a consumer.
- [69:50]
Jim Rome
Yeah. So LSU wanted in 07 when they had the second loss. Remember, that was the year in 2007 where UCF Boston College was ranked number two. West Virginia, if they. They beaten pit. It's still one of my favorite college football years ever, because whenever you go through any, like, the research packets for an upcoming weekend, it'll be like, this is the last time. The last time this happened was in 2007. Because, like, 2007 was a free for all. And even though LSU had That second loss, they're like, look, just going to vote this team back in. I remember Trestle after the fact saying, that was a game when we were preparing for it, we knew we had no chance. And then they lose to Ohio State and, excuse me, Ohio State loses the Florida the next year. And that was the thing. Like, this is the Big Ten argument. This is the pro Big Ten argument that for years we were conditioned. Like, remember the Alabama, Michigan State games where you would just go, Jesus, oh.
- [70:40]
Colin Cowherd
34 nothing or 35, seven.
- [70:42]
Jim Rome
That isn't happening as much anymore, okay? And that's not just about the Michigan and Ohio State national championships. And I think they're kind of like, further the point is that we may be on the cusp of this thing that, like, is real. It's just so hard for me to think that, like, there's going to be another region.
- [71:01]
Colin Cowherd
You know why, though? So here's my take on this. Alabama is doing car washes and bake sales. And Ohio State's not Big Ten schools. Most SEC schools are smaller schools. I think Auburn's like, is it 16,000, 18,000? Wisconsin, Ohio State, Michigan, Those are like small cities, man.
- [71:21]
Jim Rome
I mean, it's nuts.
- [71:23]
Colin Cowherd
And they. All those graduates go all across America and they go to New York and LA and they make a bunch of money and they give it back. It's much easier for these Big Ten schools. I mean, USC's now spending $20 million, nil. Their 20, 26 class, they just went and bought this insane class. And that's just because of nil. That's not because they suddenly figured out how to recruit. They've got money. And so now the Big Ten's got Seattle, Los Angeles, Columbus. You know, these are massive. I mean, Penn State's got Philadelphia and New York graduates everywhere. SEC is a lot of small towns. And I just don't think the nil money. I mean, I just don't think they have the nil money in most instances. I think Georgia does, but I don't think a lot of teams do do. Georgia is also closest to the biggest city in the South, Atlanta, where there's more money, more attorneys, more doctors, more, you know, venture capitalists. In Atlanta, in the south, and they're Georgia.
- [72:25]
Jim Rome
I do think sometimes too, you'll have, you know, it's a very human nature thing, but you become motivated by something that you don't think you can get as opposed to expecting it. Right? I mean, it's the king of the mountain analogy here where it was Georgia is motivated to spend when they put together these, these runs, like, what if Alabama's not in the playoff for 10 year? What do you think? Like, what do you think that nil is going to be like or whatever, you know, like Ohio State after losing to Michigan before the season. And it's still. This is one of the things I think with college football that even though people love the expansion, I don't. It's more of a reflection of how much I hate the realignment. I've already done these rants far too many times. But I'm watching your network and it's Ohio State, Michigan and the broadcast is like, this is for everything. And it's like, yeah, except it isn't because Ohio State's going to lose this and then win a national championship. And I will forever miss that. That is not on the line. But yes, it doesn't ruin my enjoyment of this incredible rivalry and what was like an ugly, awesome, just a brutal game. And you know, the emotions that game are just like they're on the TV screen. It's a awesome product.
- [73:33]
Colin Cowherd
Product.
- [73:35]
Jim Rome
But when I think about, you know, Ohio State this past off season and grabbing Caleb Downs as soon as Saban's out of there, going to get Will Howard, which, you know, at the time, remember, like the summer, it was a bit of an argument like, hey, well, if he was that special, like, why is this guy leaving K State and all these things? And it just works. And we knew that it was supposedly this $20 million program. Is this about Ohio State should always be able to fund all this stuff. You name the top blue blood programs, the places where it matters the most. I don't know that this is ever going be an issue, but there is something about that void. There is something about feeling like this is. That motivates you in a way that's, that's just hard to replicate when you're used to all the success. So I think that's what'll probably happen amongst the top schools. It's just a matter of like, how many of these top programs do you think will have access to maybe a spending spree? And look, apparently now we have a cap at 20 million for an entire academic department. Yeah, good luck figuring that one out. Good luck being the tennis coach, you know, like, hey, really? Like this kid from Choate, you're like, yeah, well, we. Our guy needs a six defensive back, so. Sorry.
- [74:48]
Colin Cowherd
Yeah, that thing. Bit of a circus. Yeah, Well, I, I told you it was only gonna take 30 minutes. But that's not. We can't talk for 30? This fucking thing's already gone an hour. Sorry. I didn't mean to do that. I really didn't. I want. I know you're busy. I know you gotta do like 16 local hits in Spokane.
- [75:04]
Jim Rome
Best available.
- [75:04]
Colin Cowherd
I feel terrible.
- [75:05]
Jim Rome
Are the Sonics coming back so well? No, man. I just love, love talking to you. You know how I feel about you. So whatever you need.
- [75:14]
Colin Cowherd
Same here. All right, buddy. Appreciate it. The volume. Okay. Have you heard about this? Last year, Degree changed the formula for their Cool Rush deodorant, and their fans rebelled and wanted the old scent back. And Degree listened. That doesn't happen often. They admitted they effed up and they're bringing back the original Cool Rush scent. They're bringing it back and it's exactly how you remember it. Cool, crisp and fresh. There's a reason it's the number one men's antiperspirant. And it's back in Walmart, Target and other stores now for under four bucks. So try and see what the fuss is about. Head to your local Walmart or Target to try the OG Degree Cool Rush for yourself.
- [75:53]
Ryan Russillo
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- [77:04]
Unknown
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- [77:55]
Ryan Russillo
This is an iHeart podcast.