Daniel Cormier Show - Aljamain Sterling on Sean O'Malley, Jon Jones, Petr Yan fight, Mayweather story

Summary

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The Daniel Cormier Show: Aljamain Sterling on Mayweather, Jon Jones, Petr Yan, Fighting, Fatherhood, and Finding Purpose

Podcast: The Herd with Colin Cowherd – Daniel Cormier Show
Date: October 16, 2025
Host: Daniel Cormier
Guest: Aljamain Sterling

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Episode Overview

In the premiere episode of the Daniel Cormier Show, former UFC champion Daniel Cormier sits down with Aljamain Sterling—one of the most decorated bantamweights now making waves in the featherweight division. This deep-dive conversation explores not only Sterling’s career highlights and rivalries but also his lesser-known personal challenges: balancing business ventures, navigating complicated family dynamics, finding motivation after criticism, and healing from a turbulent upbringing. The discussion is at turns funny, raw, and emotional, giving listeners an unfiltered look at both the fighter and the man.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Life and Career at 36

• Sterling’s Current Hustle (04:10–05:30)
  Aljamain describes the busy realities of life as an elite fighter and growing entrepreneur—balancing fight training, running a rum company (Funk Harbor Rum), coaching, podcasting, acting, and a new marriage.
  Quote: "I have friends that tell me they have no idea how I do what I do... Podcasting, brand, training, coaching, having a fiancé, even some movies… It’s a lot to juggle." – Aljamain Sterling (04:45)

• Daily Routine Changes
  He’s able to sleep in a bit more than during his 20s, but international business and training obligations now dictate his schedule.

• Chess as Competition & Therapy (06:00–06:33)
  Sterling credits chess for keeping his mind sharp—picked up during COVID after watching Queen's Gambit, now floating around a 1300 Elo.

2. The Real Mayweather Story

• Floyd Mayweather & Sterling’s Fiancé (07:55–10:53)
  Sterling recounts an infamous story from his early UFC days where Mayweather tried to hit on his fiancée at a club, leading to a tense but nonviolent confrontation.
  Quote: "He’s undefeated in boxing, I’m undefeated in MMA, and if he wants to figure out what sport is better, we can find out today." – Aljamain Sterling (10:37)

3. Staying Motivated & Navigating UFC Politics

• Motivation Evolving Over Time (11:26–13:04)
  He discusses how early hunger was driven by financial need, but now focuses on setting and chasing new personal goals. Quote: "In the beginning, I’m hungry. I wanted more. I’m a broke kid… but as you get older, you check things off the box and create new goals." – Aljamain Sterling (11:26)

• Learning to ‘Take More Than The Game Takes’ (14:24–15:02) Understanding that the UFC won’t change for him, Sterling focuses on maximizing his opportunities and gratitude.

• Title Shot Politics and Opponent Debates (15:02–19:20)
  Discusses recent Ortega win, possible match-up vs. Diego Lopez, and rifts with contenders like Lerone Murphy, and the politics of who deserves a title shot.
  Quote: "The one thing you can never say is that I turned down a fight. I take on the toughest fights, the ones I’m set up to lose… and generally, I have always won." (15:37)

4. Peaks, Setbacks & Controversy

• Realizing He Was ‘The Best’ (25:57–28:12)
  Pinpoints his post-injury win over Pedro Munhoz and then Corey Sandhagen as moments he truly believed he was world-class.

• Petr Yan Rivalry, The Notorious Illegal Knee, and Fallout (28:26–33:46)
  A detailed, honest breakdown of the Yan fight, the backlash after winning the belt via DQ, his own concussion, and the emotional toll of being painted as a villain. Quote: "No fighter wants to quit, but I’m glad Mark Smith [referee] called it… He saved me from myself." – Aljamain Sterling (31:20)

• Handling Racism and Online Hate (36:29–40:39)
  Sterling acknowledges relentless racist, hateful attacks after the Yan fight and how he learned to distance emotionally from fans and be less open to strangers. Quote: "I had a year and a half of just straight clown emojis on my page. And after I won, the clowns just upped their game... you have to have thick skin." (36:29)

5. Sean O’Malley, UFC Pressure, and Organizational Friction

• Burnout and the O’Malley Fight (41:28–45:47)
  Sterling admits he never wanted to fight O’Malley right after Cejudo, saying he felt pressured by both his manager and UFC—leading to a performance he sees as a result of not being mentally or physically ready. Quote: "I said no five times… I caved. I rolled the dice, and it just didn’t work out… That’s why you don’t take fights where you don’t want to be in there." (42:40–45:02)

6. Roots, Fatherhood, and Purpose

• Wrestling’s Transformative Power & Early Support (46:13–49:26)
  Details how a mentor, Dave Matana, invested in him when he had nothing, shaping his own drive to “pay it forward.”

• Early Meeting with Jon Jones (48:56–50:05)
  Sterling’s introduction to Jones at college, shaping his early journey into MMA.

• Family Life: Chaos, Siblings, and a Complicated Father (54:07–65:39)
  Reveals he grew up with 20 siblings, a chaotic household, a father he describes as an absent ‘street pharmacist,’ and regular physical and verbal abuse. Quote: "You just think that’s something they’re supposed to do as a parent, provide… but you crave a relationship." (57:14)

7. Childhood Trauma, Healing, and What’s Next

• Channeling Pain into Purpose (66:00–67:42)
  Wrestling became therapy; competition was a way to transform anger from abuse into something constructive.

• Desire for Recognition and Closure with Father (69:32–71:18)
  Sterling grows emotional confronting his lifelong need for his father's love and acknowledgment, referencing advice from his mother. Quote: "Don’t worry. One day you’re going to grow, you’re going to be big and strong… You’ll be able to do anything you want." (68:18)

• Legacy & Being a Father (73:09–75:17)
  Sterling reflects on how he hopes to be remembered: as a fighter who always showed up, but more importantly, as a future present and loving father and husband. Quote: "I’ve come from never feeling good enough to finally becoming the best in the world. That for me is like the American dream." (74:31)

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On beating the system:
  "It’s easy to find resentment when you’re having those tough conversations with bosses and things like that… These are my bosses, they ain’t going nowhere. I’m probably going to be gone before they are." – Aljamain Sterling (11:47–14:13)

• On public backlash:
  "They were in the DMs, dropping the N-bomb, calling monkeys... So I had a year and a half of straight clown emojis on my page." – Aljamain Sterling (36:29)

• On the O’Malley loss:
  "They said no [to a rematch clause] and that’s when I started reading the writing on the wall. I was being set up to fail and I know it… Just being in Octagon when you don’t want to be in there, you can’t." – Aljamain Sterling (44:07–45:02)

• On the lasting effect of his father’s abuse:
  "I always had to be the little man… I was always propped and left with responsibility… I guess they kind of forgot you should develop a relationship with your kids." – Aljamain Sterling (60:22)

• On breaking cycles and moving forward:
  "Just being present [as a future father]. Just try to be better. I still have his blood, but I’m trying to be a better person; contribute to society a better way, help pull people up where I can." – Aljamain Sterling (71:29)

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Key Timestamps

• Life and Motivation at 36: 04:10–06:41
• Mayweather Nightclub Story: 07:55–10:53
• Staying Motivated and UFC Politics: 11:26–17:48
• Diego Lopez and Title Shot Arguments: 15:02–19:23
• On Fame and Fans: 36:29–41:14
• Handling Racism and the Yan Fallout: 36:29–41:14
• O’Malley Fight, UFC Pressure: 41:28–45:18
• Upbringing, Father, Trauma: 54:07–67:42
• On Legacy and The Next Mountain: 73:09–75:53

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Tone & Style

Cormier hosts with warmth and directness, prompting both humor and honest reflection. Sterling’s tone is candid, sometimes self-deprecating, and deeply authentic especially when confronting shortcomings, pain, and hopes for his own future as a father.

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Conclusion

This episode peels back every layer: Aljamain Sterling as champion, underdog, entrepreneur, and wounded son. Beyond fighting, Sterling wants to be remembered for resilience, presence, and for rewriting the narrative of his own father’s legacy. This is a must-listen for any fight fan or anyone who wants to understand what it means to battle both inside and far beyond the Octagon.

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Transcript

[Daniel Cormier]

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[Daniel Cormier]

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[Johnny Knoxville]

Hello, America's sweetheart. Johnny Knoxville here. I want to tell you about my new true crime podcast, Crimeless Hillbilly Heist. From Smartless Media, Campside Media and big money players. It's a wild tale about a gang of high functioning nitwits who somehow pulled off America's third largest cash heist.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

Kind of like Robin Hood, except for the part where he steals from the rich and gives to the poor. I'm not that generous.

[Johnny Knoxville]

It's a damn near inspiring true story for anyone out there who's ever shot for the moon, then just totally muffed up the landing.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

They stole $17 million and had not bought a ticket to help him escape. So we're sitting like, oh, God, what do we do? What do we do? That was dumb. People, do not follow my example.

[Johnny Knoxville]

Listen to Crimeless Hillbilly Heist on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

[Ed Helms]

Hey, it's Ed Helms, host of Snafu, my podcast about history's greatest screw ups. On our new season, we're bringing you a new Snafu Every single episode.

[Sponsor Announcer]

32 lost nuclear weapons. You're like, wait, stop, stop.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

What?

[Ed Helms]

Yeah, it's gonna be a whole lot of history, a whole lot of funny, and a whole lot of fabulous guests. Paul Scheer, Angela and Jenna, Nick Kroll, Jordan Klepper. Listen to season four of SNAFU with Ed Helms on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

[Hell in Heaven Podcast Narrator]

Two rich young Americans move to the Costa Rican jungle to start over. But one of them will end up dead and the other tried for murder three times. It starts with a dream, a nature reserve and a spectacular new home. But little by little, they lose it.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

They actually lose it.

[Hell in Heaven Podcast Narrator]

They sort of went nuts until one night, everything spins out of control. Listen to Hell in Heaven on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

The volume.

[Daniel Cormier]

What's up, guys. Welcome to the first episode of the Daniel Cormier show, brought to you by Total Wireless, the official wireless provider of UFC. They're in your corner with unlimited 5G data that will not slow you down. Today, I am joined by one of my favorite guys in all of mma, one of the best fighters to ever compete in the bantamweight division, who is now still one of the most important guys now fighting in the featherweight division, as Al Jermaine Sterling is ranked number five in the world. This guy defended that championship against some of the most dangerous guys in the entire ufc time and time again. He went out there, he fought, he won. He's been misunderstood. He's had some ups, he's had some downs. I want to allow you guys to get to know Al Jermaine more than just what's on the surface. So I want you guys to help me as I welcome in one of the greatest bantamweights, one of the best fighters in the world, Al Jermaine Sterling. Alja. What's up, brother? How you doing, man? How you been?

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

Thank you.

[Daniel Cormier]

Good, man.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

Good.

[Daniel Cormier]

You're a man.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

You. You.

[Daniel Cormier]

You deserve flowers.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

Thank you. I appreciate that.

[Daniel Cormier]

Yeah. So, Al Jermaine, 36 years old now. Dude, how. How. What does your day look like today opposed to what it looked like 10 years ago? Because the goals are the same. Become the world champion. But at 36, you got to kind of approach it a little differently.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

Yeah, I feel like it's still relatively the same. Same type of hustle, same type of mentality. Yeah, I'm a lot older now. I've accomplished all the things that I've wanted to accomplish. But then as you get older, you check things off the box. You want to create new goals. Right. So that's pretty much the phase that I'm in in my career and in my life right now.

[Daniel Cormier]

But it's also fighting and business, right? You're. You're venturing into business. Becoming a businessman. Like, that is a whole new element as you age. Right. Because you got to start looking to what's next.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

Yeah.

[Daniel Cormier]

How does that change the day?

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

It's just busy, man. Like, I have friends that tell me they have no idea how I do what I do. Really? Because there's just so much, like, how do you. You have. The other. Some of the guys, they say, do you have, like, extra hours in a day or something that we don't know about? Because podcasting, working on my. My brand, Funk Harbor Rum, which I founded, obviously, training for a fight, coaching some of the Guys, my training partners that now live here in Vegas. So teaching or being a training partner when I can. And of course having a fiance that I'm about to get married to. So it's, it's a lot to juggle in. I've actually done some movies, you know, so we actually hopefully have one that I'm supposed to be in, like a boxing film. Hopefully that all goes well. Yeah. So just busy, man. I just try to balance it as best as I can.

[Daniel Cormier]

Earlier mornings.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

Earlier mornings, I would say it's. It's a little different. Where before it was earlier mornings, I think now I at least have a little bit of a luxury where I can sleep in a little. But then there are the days where I have to do business with the east Coast.

[Daniel Cormier]

Yeah.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

Or overseas in the Netherlands where I have to get up early or I have to stay up late in order to get these conversations going. Like tomorrow I have to stay up until about 12, which I'm gonna be up anyway. But I'm working.

[Daniel Cormier]

Yeah.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

At 12.

[Daniel Cormier]

Yeah. You're not playing video games.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

It's. It's very, very different. The only video games I have time to play is like chess and I can only play five minute rounds.

[Daniel Cormier]

You like chess?

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

I do.

[Daniel Cormier]

It's not a fun game.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

It's a very intuitive game. Yeah.

[Daniel Cormier]

Yeah.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

And I think it reminds me of fighting so much and I'm just super competitive. Once I learned how to play during COVID after watching Queen's Gambit, I just got hooked. I tried the game, download the app, and then I had to stop playing. I'm generally around like a 1300 Elo. So that's like decent for a guy who plays only occasionally. It's not studying prints.

[Daniel Cormier]

I have no idea what that means.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

It's like you're rating.

[Daniel Cormier]

Yeah.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

So when you beat a player, you get like a couple points depending on the level of competition, how often you're winning in a row. It's. It's fun.

[Daniel Cormier]

Aljo, that was one thing about you that I had no idea. But like, what else could you tell fans and people that? Because honestly, the relationship that you have with the fans, they don't get to see the inside and the details. Like, what's something about Al Jermaine Sterling that people may not know on the surface? Like something you enjoy outside of chess and something you enjoy doing in your. In your free time.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

I mean, I watch a lot of TV shows when I can. What, like my favorite thing to do? Especially because I need something to do with my fiance. It's hard to do outdoor activities with her because it's, I'm always in a camp or I'm helping somebody and then after I'm coming back home from training, I'm like, okay, today's gonna be the day. We're gonna go out and do something. As soon as I get home, I have my, I have my post workout meal. And then itis just kicks in, bro.

[Daniel Cormier]

Like, sorry.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

And I'm like, babe, I'm sorry. I need to take a nap before the next training session. So the next, the easiest thing that we could do is just find movies, find TV show series to watch. Right now we just finished the Last Kingdom. We're watching the movie of it. The Last Kingdom. Seven Kings Must Die. I love the Viking stories. Just kind of crazy how that whole era was just people. Yeah. Just slaying each other. Al Joe, I gotta ask you a question. What's up?

[Daniel Cormier]

That Floyd Mayweather story, is that real with your fiance, was that a real thing? Because I even said that to my producer Luis, and he goes, I've heard that story. Like, was that a real thing or has this story just taken on legs that isn't true?

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

It's a real situation that happened. It's just funny because it's so long ago. I think it was like, it was.

[Daniel Cormier]

A long time ago.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

2015, 2016, I think it was.

[Daniel Cormier]

You were just starting.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

I was just starting. I was undefeated on my second contract for the UFC. So I'm feeling good, I'm 12. And oh, he sends over, he's like pointing to my fiance and her friend at the time, or our friend, I should say. They come over, they send somebody up, she comes, she tells me. He's like, Mayweather just pointing to us and was telling us like waving us down, Mike. So what does that mean?

[Daniel Cormier]

Like, do you want to kick his ass?

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

Nah. But then he.

[Daniel Cormier]

Because you can't, like, that's the thing, right? Like, you can beat Floyd Mayweather even at the time when you were a young fighter, because you could just take him down and throw him to the.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

Ground in an actual fight.

[Daniel Cormier]

Yes, yes, but that's what happens. But no, you can't outbox him. But in a fight, like, that's what happens. Like, what are you thinking in that moment?

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

Because it's kind of disrespectful in the moment. I was kind of more of a young hot headed kid. So I'm thinking a couple things. I'm like, if shorty goes down there, it's over. It's sign sealed.

[Daniel Cormier]

Were you Long in the relationship or had you guys just started dating?

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

No, we've been along. We were probably like, 2016. That was like five. Five years.

[Daniel Cormier]

How many you. How long have you guys been together now?

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

2011.

[Daniel Cormier]

Jesus, that's good. That was time to get married.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

We were dating before then, like 2010. But then we actually became like, a thing. Like an official thing in 2011. It was on her terms. You know, she wanted to wait. Like, it's fine with me. I'm, you know, I'm play the field. But she probably going to hate that.

[Daniel Cormier]

But, yeah.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

So going back to me was, he send somebody up. I go over to them. I talk to them like, hey, man, I know how this goes. You're trying to tell me to bring her down. No, I don't work like that.

[Daniel Cormier]

You went to him?

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

I went. They came into our section because this is when Wyoming just won. And I think he had just beat Vitor Belford. So we're at the Palms, really. So they go back, they come back again, and they're trying to recruit both of us now. And like, he said, you could come down, too. I'm like, nah, nah, nah. Like, I've seen this movie before. We go down together. She goes in, they try to stop me. It's going to be an issue because I ain't going to be made to look like no fool.

[Daniel Cormier]

Absolutely.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

Yeah. I'm like, I don't care how many of those guys in there. I'm just not going out like a sucker. Like, it is what it is. So I'm like, you could tell him. So then I think they. I don't know if they came back a third time. I forget the story, but I told them to tell him. He's undefeated in boxing, I'm undefeated in mma, and if he wants to figure out what sport is better, we can find out today.

[Daniel Cormier]

And that was the end of it.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

I. I don't know if he actually went there and told him, because that's.

[Daniel Cormier]

Probably somebody that was in his circle. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

Boys are like, yeah, I don't want those problems. But I'm just saying he wants to find out.

[Daniel Cormier]

Yeah, yeah, he can find out. I. I always kind of wondered if that was a real story. You've been in this thing for a while now. I fought UFC 170. You made your UFC debut. 2025. You're still in the top five in the world. The motivations don't change. How do you stay motivated as you get to this point? And what is the difference in the feeling. Right. The mindset in regards to training and competing because you're just fresh off of a big victory over Brian Ortega, where I thought you looked fantastic.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

Thank you. I think that the motivation is definitely different and I think it just goes back to those goals that you write, the new ones that you set for yourself as you keep continuing to check them off the list. In the beginning, I'm more hungry. I wanted more. I'm a broke kid. I got my college degree, but I put on the back burner to try.

[Daniel Cormier]

Chase this thing, take a leap of.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

Faith and see where this thing will go. Thankfully, it worked out, but at the time when I was. Could have gotten a full time teaching position, I would have made more money doing that the first, probably four or five years if I had just did that. Yeah. With increasing salary, benefits, the. The pleasure of coaching kids, which is my passion for wrestling. So this sport is, it's. I. So I want people to understand is this sport could take and give you so much where you can find resentment and it's easy to get resentful when you're having those tough conversations with bosses and things like that. And it's easy to get, like, just wrapped up in it and just find negativity in every single thing. So for me, it's just, how do I look at this glass half full? Like, these are my bosses. They ain't going nowhere. I'm probably going to be gone before they ever. Yeah, for sure where they're going to be going. So how do I look at this and flip my perspective that they don't hate me, they just don't prefer my style. And once you understand that, it makes it a little bit easier to have that relationship and to do business as best as you possibly can, make as much money as you can, take advantage of the opportunities, traveling the world, being a guest fighter, meeting all these great fans from all over the world. I used to travel the world as a guest fighter and then I would tell people and post on Twitter, come spar with me. Come be.

[Daniel Cormier]

Yeah.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

And I'll just have random guys coming into the hotels. This was before, like, they got really strict with letting in people.

[Daniel Cormier]

Yeah.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

Fans, China, they ain't do none of that.

[Daniel Cormier]

They let people just kind of come in.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

They were just in the lobby. Just. I'm like, this is so.

[Daniel Cormier]

Well, it's just a throwback. It's a throwback. I remember one time when I was younger and I was in Strike Force at the time, and they used to do those UFC expos.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

Yes.

[Daniel Cormier]

They had an expo in Houston, Texas, and I was there, and they were fighting. It was Gray Maynard fighting Frankie Edgar. Bro. The lobby of the hotel was crazy. It was a party the entire time.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

How do you allow that?

[Daniel Cormier]

I don't know. I just think that the UFC at that time was a different organization. I think today it's a machine. It's grown so big that it's. It's a machine.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

I think the risk versus reward with that, because there is a lot of potential for altercations to possibly happen, especially when people are talking. Yeah. Like, you just don't know. And that's. That was always my thing. Especially, like, with the yon fight and the aftermath of that, not knowing which fans actually were genuine coming up to me. Yeah.

[Daniel Cormier]

Yeah.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

For sure. Someone might actually try to do something stupid where now I'm putting myself in a position where I have to retaliate.

[Daniel Cormier]

Yeah. Well, it's hard. It's hard, right? It's hard not to. To be the fighter. We'll talk about that a little bit later.

[Sponsor Announcer]

Yeah.

[Daniel Cormier]

In the conversation, I. I want to get into that a little more in.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

Depth, but just with that motivation, I. I think the main thing for me, just understanding how the game works.

[Daniel Cormier]

Yep.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

And then taking more from the game than the game takes from me.

[Daniel Cormier]

Absolutely.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

And I think that's where I find peace and I could find motivation and want, because before I got to a point, I was like, yeah, this is stupid, man. I'm about to just go back and be a teacher. But, yeah, like, but what am I giving up? I'm giving up an opportunity that someone would fight for free, for, which I hate that fighters say that, but they would. They would do it just to have an opportunity to switch spots with me. Yeah. You know, so I take advantage and I keep myself grounded and remind myself to be grateful. The opportunity that I have, that I have a skill set to do this and to be doing this as long as I have been and to be ranked in the top five and top 10 as long as I have been. There's not many guys who can say that they did that for this long.

[Daniel Cormier]

Absolutely. And you won that big fight over Brian Ortega. And so the conversation starts about, could I fight for the belt? Could I do this? Could I do this? And then Diego Lopez looks like he looked at Noche ufc. And so I'm floating the Internet, and people start throwing in ideas of what they want next. I see Al, Jermaine Sterling, Diego Lopez. Do you feel like that's a fight that would interest you and if so, like, if not, why, like, why do you think that that win justifies you fighting for the belt right now?

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

I've never turned down any fight that the UFC has ever offered me. That's the one thing the fans could say. You faked and did all this other stuff. You can, One thing you can never say is that I turned down a fight. I take, I take on the toughest fights, the ones that I'm set up to lose in, because it's just better for business and generally I have always won. So with that said, Diego Lopez is nothing special in the sense of I'm not going to. There's nothing new that he's doing that I haven't seen before. With all the, what, 23 fights in the UFC that I've had to date. Yeah, it's not a fight I'm interested in. I'm interested in the belt. But if that. To fight another one and that's the opponent, then saddle up.

[Daniel Cormier]

But there's, there's like a. Everybody's angry right now. Laron's, Madon's, Laron's mad. Why are you so tight's mad that you're actually even putting yourself in the conversation? I'm.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

I'm mad that he's trying to take me out of the conversation.

[Daniel Cormier]

It's.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

It's laughable, really. You, you've got like two finishes in.

[Daniel Cormier]

The ufc, maybe three, but he's only one. I don't want to play devil's advocate, algae. He's only one.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

He's only one.

[Daniel Cormier]

He just wins.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

And he wins fights, maybe nine in.

[Daniel Cormier]

The ufc, but then that I have twice as many fights as I understand.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

I beat a guy who fall for the belt twice. I understand I beat more ranked opponents than he has. I understand I fought an undefeated fight and arguably one on a different night where two other guys got robbed on Versus Volkov.

[Daniel Cormier]

Yep.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

And. And the other one was Randy Brown versus Brian Battle. Yep. On another night, I probably win that fight. So just laying out the lay of the land for him to try to discredit me as a potential challenger for the title is kind of.

[Daniel Cormier]

He doesn't want your name in the conversation at all. Do you think that's because he feels maybe it's cuz he thinks that you deserve it. Exactly. Do you think? No. Or maybe when a guy like Al Jermaine Sterling starts to get. Get into the conversation now, it's a problem because. Because he's got name value, he's been a champion, and for all those other reasons that you said, right, I just asked you about fighting Diego Lopez. You said, okay, sure, if I have to, that's what I'll do. But you're like.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

Because I know he's not getting the title shot next. Diego Lopez, he just fought for the title.

[Daniel Cormier]

Yeah. No, Diego Lopez is not fighting for the title. But if you needed to fight a fight, they may say, you need to fight Diego Lopez. And you go, sure. I've never turned one down. Laron is sitting there going, I get it. He's got more fights than me. He's been the champ. There are a lot of reasons why, when looking at potential opponents for the champion, they go, well, Al Jermaine Sterling does fit what we need for Volkanovski.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

And Volks said, he's down to throw my name in.

[Daniel Cormier]

And that's even worse because for lerone, Volkanovski was all in on him after he knocked on Aaron Pico. And he says, I'm okay if Al Jermaine gets it. So you got to be able to understand where the road is coming from.

[Sponsor Announcer]

A little bit, please.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

Would that be the ranked fighter?

[Daniel Cormier]

He just beat Aaron Pico.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

They put him in the hole.

[Daniel Cormier]

They put him in Alger. They put him in the hardest fight possible for him. How Aaron Pico was a beast on short notice.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

I am not discrediting Aaron Pico, but he's lost multiple times, and he has lost multiple times the same.

[Daniel Cormier]

The same way. I hear you.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

And then you come over, never winning a belt in another major championship organization, Understand? And getting a win and a finish in the first time in years for LaRue Murphy, and then you thinking that grants you the title shot. And don't get me wrong, it was.

[Daniel Cormier]

A spectacular, cool main event, pay per view.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

It was a big opportunity, and he stepped up, and I. I applaud him for that. He stepped up for the ufc. Mozart got injured. But if you're going to compare resumes and say, I'm not saying I deserve it over him, but I say I have a pretty damn good argument that I should possibly be nuts because he.

[Daniel Cormier]

Is mad that you're even saying I deserve.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

And also me and vocal the same age, man. Let the uncles fight, right? Yeah. Let big un fight. Yeah. So stupid.

[Daniel Cormier]

Alo, when you look. When you look back, I understand.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

I'm clown, man. I respect joking around.

[Daniel Cormier]

I understand.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

Have a good time.

[Daniel Cormier]

But you gonna get along. Gonna be all mad then you playing with him. Hey, Alo, when you. When you were training with Ray Longo.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

And those guys, you know, I never Fought a black guy.

[Daniel Cormier]

You've never fought a black guy?

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

Never fought a brother.

[Daniel Cormier]

You got to tell you something, they strong too. They so strong. Hey, bro, I used to wrestle black people. I hated it if I wrestle black. I was like, yo, I'm trying to throw them and do some of the things that work. It don't work on them. That's not. That's bad aljo. That's bad aljo.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

I'm like, I don't want to fight him, but I'm like, yo, I don't.

[Daniel Cormier]

Mind fighting the brother, but I'm like, yo, a lot of stuff that work, normally, it just don't work. They got the brothers be having different types of hips, different types of explosions and everything. They strong too. I could only imagine fighting Francis. Could you imagine Francis, how strong he would be?

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

Not at all.

[Daniel Cormier]

That would actually be so crazy to.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

Grab it all for me.

[Daniel Cormier]

That's kind of crazy that you've been here as long as you haven't. You haven't fought a brother before in.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

The UFC or in the regional circuit.

[Daniel Cormier]

That's gonna be you and Laron Murphy at some point.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

I know, it's kind of crazy. I'm like, yeah, I'm gonna fight my first brother that's gonna be undefeated for.

[Daniel Cormier]

The championship at home. You know, maybe for the championship if one of you guys fighting.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

Oh, that was a fun fact. So I figured I had to kind of throw that out there. But, yeah, for some reason, we just strong.

[Daniel Cormier]

Yeah, I don't know what's going on with that. And I'm kind of light skinned, so I'm not even strong as y' all dark skinned brothers.

[Sponsor Announcer]

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[Daniel Cormier]

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[Daniel Cormier]

Call 1-800-GAMBLER this is the story of.

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[Ed Helms]

Hey, it's Ed Helms. And welcome back to snafu, my podcast about history's greatest sweet on our new season, we're bringing you a new snafu every single episode.

[Sponsor Announcer]

32 lost nuclear weapons. You're like, wait, stop.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

What? Ernie Shackleton sounds like a solid 70s.

[Ed Helms]

Basketball player who still wore knee pads.

[Sponsor Announcer]

Yes.

[Ed Helms]

It's gonna be a whole lot of history, a whole lot of funny, and a whole lot of guests. The great Paul Scheer made me feel good. I'm like, oh, wow, Angela and Jenna, I am so, so psyched you're here.

[Sponsor Announcer]

What was that like for you to soft launch into the show?

[Ed Helms]

Sorry, Jenna, I'll be asking the questions today.

[Sponsor Announcer]

I forgot whose podcast we were doing.

[Ed Helms]

Nick Kroll. I hope this story is good enough to get you to toss that sandwich. So let's see how it goes. Listen to season four of SNAFU with Ed Helms on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

Podcasts.

[Hell in Heaven Podcast Narrator]

In the new podcast, Hell in Heaven, two young Americans move to the Costa Rican jungle to start over. But one will end up dead. The other tried for murder. Not once.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

People went wild.

[Hell in Heaven Podcast Narrator]

Not twice, stunned, but three times. John and Anne Bender are rich and attractive, and they're devoted to each other. They create a nature reserve and build a spectacular circular home high on the top of a hill. But little by little, their dream starts to crumble, and our couple retreat from reality.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

They lose it. They actually lose it. They sort of went nuts.

[Hell in Heaven Podcast Narrator]

Until one night, everything spins out of control. Listen to Hell in Heaven on the IHEARTRADIO app, Apple Podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts.

[Snax from Trap Nerds Podcast]

What's up everybody? This is Snax from the Trap Nerds podcast and we're bringing you the horror every week all October long.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

Kicking off this month I'll be bringing you all my greatest fear inducing horror games from Resident Evil to Solid Hill. Me and Tony bringing backfireteam on Left.

[Daniel Cormier]

4 Dead 2 and we just gonna.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

Be going over some of the greats.

[Snax from Trap Nerds Podcast]

Also in October we'll be talking about our f favorite horror and Halloween movies.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

And figure out why black people always gotta die first. The Umbral reliquary invites any and all foolin brave enough to peruse its many curiosities. But take it all sales are final. Weekly horror side quests written and narrated by yours truly with a full episode read and a commentary special.

[Snax from Trap Nerds Podcast]

And we will cap it off with Horror Movie Battle Royale. Jason versus Freddy. Michael Myers versus the Alien thing with the little Tongue Monster. October, we're doing it Halloween style. Listen to the Traverse podcast from the Black Effect Podcast Network on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcast or wherever you get your podcast.

[Daniel Cormier]

Aljo Was there ever a time when you were training, beginning of your career where you can point back and go I think I might be the best in the world. I'm very close to it like in training in a fight where you go, I think I may just be the best in the world like or I'm ready to fight the best in the world because you know, you know in your career I'm pretty good at this but I don't know if I can be that guy yet. But I, I feel in time I will be able to. Can you point to a time where you went now? Now I'm ready. I'm complete.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

I would say the first feeling of that where I could like give us, give myself a self nod and like you're him was after I fought Pedro Munoz in 2019 and Chicago and it was an all stand up fight. I had torn the ligament in my wrist so I got two scars here from the surgery. They took out the tendon from there.

[Daniel Cormier]

Yeah it all up.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

So from 2015 I tore it and my grappling has substantially gotten weaker over the years where I would shoot and guys would just pull the leg back and I couldn't grip. I went from doing pharmacies of 120 pound dumbbells, 100 pound dumbbells easy to this was like 40.

[Daniel Cormier]

Come on.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

So serious. So when I fought him, that's one of the lowest has ever been. And I. I got to a point where I was super nervous because, like, dude, I'm not going to be able to wrestle this guy, and I know he's going to be looking for a guillotine. I was forced to stand up and trade. And when I was able to out strike a guy like that who just knocked out Cody Garbar, that gave me the confidence to know, like, he's a gamer. He's a heavy pressure fighter. He doesn't quit solid jiu jitsu. He's also been a perennial top contender. Top 10, top 5. And at the time, he was ranked top 5. So. Yeah, so that was, like, the first glimpse of that where I was like, dude, I. I have the whole package. I can strike, I can grapple. Obviously, wrestling is my expertise in jiu jitsu. And then when I fought Corey Sandhagen, that solidified it, and I just knew. It was like, I had to fight three top five guys in order to get a crack at the belt. And I beat all of them. The last one was the icing on the cake, and I finished Corey Sandhagen, like, 88 seconds.

[Daniel Cormier]

I remember that.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

Yeah.

[Daniel Cormier]

And after that was like, that's when we knew. At the broadcast table, like, you and.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

Rogan, I remember listening to that. And then you were kind of like, saying, like, this. They. They want the new shiny thing. And then Rogan was kind of like, well, we didn't know. We didn't know. I'm like, yeah, I've been right here the whole time.

[Daniel Cormier]

Whole time. Sometimes it's the person that you don't expect.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

Yeah.

[Daniel Cormier]

That shows up. Al Jermaine. You win that fight, then we get to the Peorian fight. Right.

[Sponsor Announcer]

But.

[Daniel Cormier]

But it was, to me, when I look back on it, I think back to. It was a nervous Al Jermaine Sterling inside the Octagon that night, fighting really outside of himself. But you won the belt in such a strange way right after that illegal knee. I want to know what the moment for you was like in real time.

[Sponsor Announcer]

Right.

[Daniel Cormier]

Because we're in the apex.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

Super quiet.

[Daniel Cormier]

It's quiet. You can hear us at the commentary table talking. Or could you. Could you hear us? Or were you out of it to the point that you're, like, operating in, like, almost a concussed state? Like, I was. I always wondered, like, what were you thinking in there? Because it's like, I can get up and fight this dude, right? Yeah. But I'm gonna be severely compromised, and I may lose this fight. Maybe the next shot knocks me Out.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

Yeah.

[Daniel Cormier]

Were you aware that if you weren't able to continue that the fight was going to be over and you would win the belt?

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

No.

[Daniel Cormier]

You thought it was me. A no contest or something.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

I didn't know what it was going to be because I think we were like over three rounds.

[Daniel Cormier]

Yeah.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

Or something like that. So I didn't hear you guys when you guys were talking. When I go. You couldn't hear us. No, because it was. You guys were like whispering. But at that point, after I get punted in the head with the knee, I'm just trying to think like how. And what the fuck was this guy thinking to even do something stupid.

[Daniel Cormier]

Yeah.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

And I'm sitting there on one knee, waiting to get up because he had his hands on my head. So 1. I can't see him looking at the ground. I can't see you. But strategically I know I can't get kneed here.

[Daniel Cormier]

Yeah.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

So you could call a stall in the fight. I call a fight iq. I'm dead tired.

[Daniel Cormier]

Yeah. You looked exhausted.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

Barely. I was. I was exhausted from the first round. And that's because of the rehydration was just off. Terrible. And when I went through the. The day with the PI team, they explained it to me. It's like you didn't put nowhere near as much refuel in your body as you should have. I was like, I'm telling you, from the whole day in the. I normally take a nap before the fight. I had about five hours and I could not sleep. And the performance showed.

[Daniel Cormier]

Yeah.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

But I didn't hear anything. What you guys were talking. I'm just trying to collect my thoughts, gather myself, and I'm thinking, get up and fight. Get up and fight. And then when Mark came over, he said, you got five minutes. I was like, that's when I went and just laid back down. And I understand that the way it looks, people are like, oh, you were selling it. You were acting. Because after you told me, I sat up and then I kind of do one of these things and I'm like, oh, I can see why the fans are mad. Like, oh, this guy's acting. Blah, blah, blah. But it wasn't anything like that. Just trying to lay down, relax, and hopefully stay in the fight. Because no fighter wants to quit. But I'm glad Mark Smith called it. Yeah. Because he saved me from myself.

[Daniel Cormier]

You would have got up before.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

I would have got up and fought. But then it would have been, yeah, one shot could have probably put me out and then it would have been all for for what?

[Daniel Cormier]

Just a short extra time.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

Yeah.

[Daniel Cormier]

For ego.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

For people to pat me on my back. I'm like, you don't care about my bank account. Yeah. Like, in hindsight, it worked out for my bank account. Yeah. Peer on to this day, says I owe him 10 because he changed my life.

[Daniel Cormier]

He did, but it really did, though. It really did change everything.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

But it's funny, he's like, I changed his brother life. You owe me 10. 10.

[Daniel Cormier]

Pon's a killer, man. But he. He. He made a really bad mistake in the fight that night, and he really is.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

Yeah.

[Daniel Cormier]

What do you think the toughest part of dealing with that was? Was it the backlash? From the fans would, like, the pundits. Like, everybody criticized you from.

[Sponsor Announcer]

From.

[Daniel Cormier]

From. I bet there was very few places in this world where you could go and escape it. So you're holding this new belt, but you can't really celebrate it because everybody's on your neck about what you did or how it looked.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

Yeah. So I got to a point where I was like, well, I'm just going to play the heel, because clearly what I said doesn't matter. Peer on posted a picture and said he was acting. And everyone took that as gospel and ran with it. And this is the guy who was just in the bathroom throwing up, who has about 30 people at his house that flew in from New York for their homeboy to go fight for a world title.

[Daniel Cormier]

Yeah.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

The fight goes the way it goes. I still have all these people in my house. What I'm gonna do, tuck my tail and go to my room and say, guys, go home.

[Daniel Cormier]

Yeah.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

So that everyone came when I got home back from the hospital. Everyone tried to cheer me up. And the funniest part is, like, oh, Dana said you had a CAT scan and there was nothing wrong with you. I'm like, CAT scans don't detect concussions. I think you actually know how concussions work.

[Daniel Cormier]

Yeah.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

But with that said, get back and hang out with everybody. And one of my best friends, he's like, he's gonna be at the wedding, too. And he comes over. He's like, yo, bro, he gave me the bell. He's like, yo, I don't care what happened. Bump that you're a UFC champion. I need you to say it. And just kept coming over. I was like, I don't want to even say that right now. But he kept saying he wouldn't leave me alone until I said it. And I was like, I'm a UFC champion. I'm a UFC champion. And then we. Everyone Kind of came in Marabos to do his toast.

[Daniel Cormier]

Oh, my God, an hour of toast.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

So he brings everybody in, we do a toast. They asked me to say something, and then I just had a little glass of champagne. We did a toast. I take a little small sip, and then I put it down because that. My head is hurting. I'm just throwing up. I'm just like. I just.

[Daniel Cormier]

That's a bad one if you're throwing up.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

Yeah. So, I mean, it wasn't like, profusely or anything like that, but I did for sure throw up. And then I'm like, normally I would drink after a fight, but after that, I was just like, dude, my head is killing me. There's no way I could party right now.

[Daniel Cormier]

Did you regret it? Did you regret taking that photo?

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

I. I'm. I don't regret taking a photo because, again, I'm with friends. Friends and family and people I've went to school with since middle school, high school, college. Like, how am I to deny these people who spend all their hard earned money to come all the way out here to come spend the time, even.

[Daniel Cormier]

Have a drink with them.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

Yeah. You know, so that's the least I could do, you know, I. Yeah, of course they know shitty, but in hindsight, they brought it back up to me and they go, you guys are gonna do an automatic rematch. And I go, oh, I'm gonna get a pay bump.

[Daniel Cormier]

You get a pay bump, you get the pay per view. There was a lot of different things to that.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

So for me, I'm like, well, glass half full. I'm like, whoa, how do I turn a shitty situation to a positive one? So outside of that, that was like, the only way I could look at it in a positive light. Like, I get a chance to redeem myself. But then I had to get the next surgery right after.

[Daniel Cormier]

Yeah.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

Because to me, and all the slams he hit me with, just because of how. Notice he tried to do that in the second fight. Who has ever swept my feet and had fell over? And then people were saying, you were just terrible that night. You made so much great adjustments. I'm like, guys, I literally had no energy. If you ever cut weight, that's what it felt like. Trying to fight someone who was at full strength on your cutting weight.

[Daniel Cormier]

Why do you try to explain that to people?

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

Because they're like, what I don't like is they go, you are so much more improved than second fight. I'm like, I can do anything different.

[Daniel Cormier]

Other than I was just myself.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

Felt good. Like, I have in Every other fight and whenever I feel good, give me time to prepare, and I, I smash, dude.

[Daniel Cormier]

Yeah.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

I don't know.

[Daniel Cormier]

Going into that second fight, did that feel you like, did that feel you did? The idea that you could get things right and go right back and prove that it wasn't me, but you could take that, that negative because even Ryan Clark and I sat up there on ESPN and we talked about, oh, I'll do this. And I was trying not to do it because I understand. But like, Ryan, you know, he's, he's a football guy and he's like, loves mma, but he's like, well, that was this, that was that. Right? He had the, he had the, he had the opinion of the general sports fan.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

Yes.

[Daniel Cormier]

The general sports fan is who we want to draw in to mix martial arts. And when they saw that we're in the middle of pandemic, not many people had many other things to watch. But then to go back and do it, did that fuel you? Those people that were on your neck, did it feel you to go out and fight better?

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

100. Definitely fuel for the fire. And just imagine anything I posted, any friend or family member that posted me and I reposted shared to like my story or whatever, they would just be in the DMs, either dropping the M bomb, calling monkeys. Really? Or so we got racist. Yeah. And also just clown emojis non stop. So I had a year and a half of just straight clown emojis on my page. And then after I won the clown.

[Daniel Cormier]

Isn't it, Isn't that ugly, though? Like, isn't that ugly? But isn't that ugly that you got called those negative things that just racism because of a fight? Yeah, because the result of a fight and you weren't the one that actually did the illegal blow.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

Yeah, it's fascinating. It's this people man in society, this is what. Why for athletes you have to have thick skin. And I had many people and a lot of consults starting to tell me, like, stay off of social media. And I was like, no, I'm not gonna let nobody bully me. I ain't gonna let the fans bully me, ain't gonna let my family bully me into making me do something I don't want to do.

[Daniel Cormier]

Yeah.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

What I'm supposed to do.

[Sponsor Announcer]

I'm a man.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

I'm not gonna sit there and tuck my tail and hide from something that I'm not proud of. But I get a chance to write the ship and sure enough, I got to write the ship. You know, can I tell you something what's funny, what gets me during this whole period, too, and me explaining the situation, what I felt to my coaches, because I called for Peter Young before. For Sanhagen.

[Daniel Cormier]

Yeah.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

It was between Sandhagen, Marlon Morais, Peorian Shelby asked me who I want to fight.

[Daniel Cormier]

He said, peoria.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

I said, give me Peoria. That's the easiest fight out of the three, and this is in 2020. I think he thought I was crazy because I was like, nobody wants to fight this guy.

[Daniel Cormier]

Well, he was killing it.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

I want to fight this guy because I just didn't think he was as good as people were saying, like, he's a great striker. I'm going to show him what grappling could look like. And then I get the chance, and you see how I did. Corey skips to the cage, he starts defending. Bully him off the cage, lock in, climb his back, push off the cage. He can't stop anything I'm doing. I said, if I were to have been fully hydrated the way, refueled, ate the proper way. And it sounds stupid to say because people don't understand what it is to cut weight. So it's kind of like, are you saying you should have ate more? I'm like, yes. After you starving yourself, cutting down from £170 down to £135 and then not refilling your body, Yeah, I think that makes a big difference. But I also said in the first fight, if I had felt the way I should have felt, I think I would have finished him in the first round. Yeah.

[Daniel Cormier]

When you look back on that part of your career. Right. As we. We move forward, did it change your relationship with fans and with the people that cover the sport?

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

How could it not?

[Daniel Cormier]

Yeah.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

Oh. But even with that, even me explaining that, what I wanted to really say was I had my coaches even asking me, am I sure that's all it was?

[Daniel Cormier]

Are you kidding me, bro? That must have hurt, bro.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

Multiple times that must have hurt it. It hurt me here because I was like, why would I ever lie to you? You don't think I want to win? If I'm lying to you, then how do I get better? How do we get better for us to prove that we were the better guy? And that was just an offline. And I remember one time I kind of snapped at the gym.

[Daniel Cormier]

I was gonna say, did you have those conversations with them?

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

Yeah, multiple times. What was wrong? You know, you went to Vegas, and after you left here, you were in. Great. Then you went to Vegas. I'M like, you think I went to Vegas and just didn't trade partied? Like, yeah, when have you ever known me to do that? So there were some things that rubbed me the wrong way. But then I. One time I. I snapped a little bit and kind of told him, like, guys, stop saying this stupid narrative. I've done told you how many times what happened, and I guarantee you the second fight won't look like that, but I just had to get it out from my chest.

[Daniel Cormier]

But you keep those guys close to you, too, still even longer than those guys.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

They still.

[Daniel Cormier]

They played such a massive part.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

The main one kind of, like, didn't believe me.

[Daniel Cormier]

Like, bro, he's a real. He's a real guy, and he'll always ask the question.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

Yeah, but I'm like, how many times you gonna ask the same question? Like, I can only so many times before it gets annoying.

[Daniel Cormier]

Yeah.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

But, yeah, definitely, My. My relationship with the F. I would say, for sure has changed because it's like, how can you flip on somebody overnight like that and be so dark and ugly?

[Daniel Cormier]

Yeah.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

Like, to throw out racial slurs, attacking my family pictures with my mom, my sisters. There's only so much of that you could take and just try to have grace and want to be peaceful with everybody, because not everyone's a true, genuine fan.

[Daniel Cormier]

No. You know, not everybody's true.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

So that was. That was with that. But I just. I just learned to not get as friendly as I used to be. And my fiance, sometimes she tells me, like, why are you coming off so. So mean, so cold? I'm like, I'm not coming off cold. Like, I gave. He wanted a picture.

[Daniel Cormier]

I gave him a picture.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

It's like, I'm not gonna sit there.

[Daniel Cormier]

And give him my.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

My.

[Daniel Cormier]

My energy and my time like I would have before.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

Yes. Like, before, I would take a time and have a full conversation, even though I need to go to this place. But it's like, why am I doing that? For someone that can literally just do this and say, I'm nothing to them anymore.

[Daniel Cormier]

Yeah. You become the champ, defend the belt multiple times. You fight Sean o' Malley whenever. You really don't want to fight Sean o'. Malley. You have.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

Can I say I hate talking about this guy.

[Daniel Cormier]

I understand.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

Because people keep saying that he's living in my head.

[Daniel Cormier]

No, no. But it's not about rent free. It's. It's not even about the fight. Right. You fight the fight. You and I have spoken off the record. It's not a fight that you necessarily wanted to do.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

You did it at the time.

[Daniel Cormier]

At the time.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

Timing.

[Daniel Cormier]

At the timing. Meaning that it was a month or two after fighting Henry Cejudo.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

Three months.

[Daniel Cormier]

Three.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

Yeah.

[Daniel Cormier]

How did you get. How did you. How long did the bad blood or the. The bad emotions harbor?

[Sponsor Announcer]

Right.

[Daniel Cormier]

Because I. I would have felt almost betrayed by the organization. Like, man, I didn't want to do this. And then that happens. Like, did you have, like, real bad feelings about the situation towards the organization and how long they did. Did they last? If you did.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

I don't say it was bad feelings. I feel like I was more disappointed in myself for the. For. For caving.

[Daniel Cormier]

Yeah.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

Because I had said no from the very beginning. I said no again. Said no five times. She's. And I got to a point where I felt like my manager was almost like working for them because he. After I would tell him no, he would. It was almost like he was trying to convince me of why it was a good idea. Even after I told him, like, dude, I could barely walk because my legs. I just fought. I had edema in my legs. You could put a whole handprint in my shin.

[Daniel Cormier]

And you're skinny.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

That shouldn't happen from just kicking with Henry. So I had a whole month off that I couldn't actually train. I rolled the dice, cuz I eventually caved. I rolled the dice and it just didn't work out. All that weight I had to cut again, I was like, dude, I told you guys, I just need a little bit more time to actually mentally be there and to physically be ready to go. And then the counter is. Well, he. Bro, he popped the rib in training. I'm like, dude, but that happened in training. He didn't fight for 12, almost 12 months. He literally sat on the sideline and got gifted a golden opportunity at an opportunist time. And I don't fault him for taking it. He was giving that opportunity through the ufc. I wasn't giving that favoritism. So it's hard not to be upset about it. But again, I. I still look back at myself and go, well, I rolled the dice. I came up short. And then that's when I kind of went on vacation with my fiance. We took like a month, and I.

[Daniel Cormier]

Saw that you guys were going crazy.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

That was living my most best life.

[Daniel Cormier]

And when you got back, were you able to go like, all right, it is what it is. This is what they wanted. I did it. I caved, even though I shouldn't have. I got to just move forward.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

Yeah. I mean, that's all you can do. I'm not going to. They're not going to. I asked for an automatic rematch clause. They said no. And that's why I was kind of like reading the writing on the, on the wall. And I was kind of like, I'm being set up to fail and I know it, which is why I'm saying no. And the fact that I eventually caved in, I was just like, that's a.

[Daniel Cormier]

Hard thing to do. Going there, knowing that.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

Yeah. Like, just being in Octagon when you don't want to be in there, you can't. And I sold the fight. I sold it as best as I could because the part of it was like, well, people think that you're not fighting. You're saying that you're not fighting in the media, but then you're telling us you are. I'm like, yeah, because I told you guys that I don't want to do this. I don't know what my, what this guy has told you that I don't want to fight. I said, I don't want to fight. You know, so it's, it's, it's a very, it depends on what side of the fence. Like, yeah, I take fault for accepting the fight.

[Daniel Cormier]

Yeah.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

And the worst version of myself showed up throwing this ugly ass cross. I couldn't get a takedown. This, My timing was off. I felt slow, and I was just like, yeah, this is why you don't take fights where you don't want to be in there. And you see this happen to a lot of guys. It's just, it's just a bad place to be.

[Daniel Cormier]

Yeah. You got to know that you want to be inside the Octagon. If you sign up for the fight, it's, it's a real problem.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

Thomas told me the same thing too, because he kind of compared it to like Willie. And it was like I told one of the same things, like, if you don't want to take, if you don't want to be in there to fight, don't, don't do it. And I told him, I was like, I'm gonna try to psych myself up and get myself in the headspace. But I thought I was doing it. And then when I got in the cage, everything felt like super dreamy. And it was like, I just want qualification.

[Daniel Cormier]

Yeah, bro. Well, you had, you, you got to do that.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

Yeah.

[Daniel Cormier]

But before all this, like, before all of this, you are a long time athlete, right? Wrestling, Uniondale High School. Who do you think was the first person, as an athlete that really bought into you. Do you remember who was the first person that bought into you as an athlete and said, wow, I got this full support and they believed in you.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

I would say Dave Matana. He's the one that took me to like, all my offseason wrestling tournaments, paid for my food. He would, he was probably like 20, 20, 20, 30 minutes away from me, and he would drive in the morning, come pick me up for those 6am.

[Daniel Cormier]

So he was driving 30 minutes to get you, then drive you all the.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

Way back and then drive you to the tournaments.

[Daniel Cormier]

And then what do you think, what do you think made him. What do you think made him make that investment in you like that?

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

I could not. I couldn't put my finger. I've even. I've asked him to this day, and I don't. I couldn't remember exactly what he said, but it was just kind of like he just felt something that was just like I could do something. And, you know, thankfully, I just had that opportunity. And that's why I do so much with the coaching, helping the training partners. I'm flying out a week before my fight to go help corner guys and then fly back to my fight to finish cutting weight. So I feel like I. I've done a fair share of helping everybody and, and paying forward, and that's why I continue to do so. Because of a guy like that. Yeah. Didn't know me from a hole in the wall. Wrestled his son.

[Daniel Cormier]

Did you, did you. How did you meet? Did you go into a practice wrestling?

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

I wrestled his son in the finals, national, the sectional qualifier to go to sections, which qualifies you for state. So I beat him in the qualifying tournament.

[Daniel Cormier]

So a man whose son you beat then takes an interest in you to help you.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

Yeah. And then me and his son became good friends. We both wrestled D3 in college. Yeah. Trained together sometime from time to time. When we came home doing like Christmas, Thanksgiving, and we're still friends, he's actually coming to the wedding, him and his son. So it's. It's just crazy. Like life, you just don't know what's gonna happen.

[Daniel Cormier]

No, you don't.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

Yeah.

[Daniel Cormier]

At what point did you realize that wrestling was more than going to be just a time consumer and a hobby?

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

After my, my first pro fight, I won.

[Daniel Cormier]

But it wasn't a hobby whenever you were in high school.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

No.

[Daniel Cormier]

But you still didn't know that it was going to be something that changed.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

Your life for wrestling?

[Daniel Cormier]

Yeah.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

I knew it would get me to college.

[Daniel Cormier]

Yeah.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

Almost got me a Ride. But I just didn't pass the NCAA clearinghouse to my grade, which they don't have anymore. Yeah, my grades were awful. I wish. Because I would have loved to have gone D1, but I didn't have the money to pay for it. You got parents that are street pharmacists. You know, it's like. Well, my dad really, you know, supplying the streets.

[Daniel Cormier]

No, I know what you're talking about.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

So you gotta tell me.

[Daniel Cormier]

I'm from the ghetto, bro.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

Yeah. So it's just that. And didn't have the grace to get in, so I was forced to go upstate New York. That's where I actually went to Mooresville. That's where I actually met John Jones. And then I transferred from there. And then he was training you in high school?

[Daniel Cormier]

You. You in college?

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

Yeah. So freshman year I went to Mooresville.

[Daniel Cormier]

And John was in high school.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

John was in college where. Just a national at Iowa Central, but he already transferred to SUNY Mooresville.

[Daniel Cormier]

And he wrestled there.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

He was supposed to. I guess you had that one year you had to sit out kind of a thing.

[Daniel Cormier]

Yes, yes.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

So we were juco, but he came over. That's where I first met him. He was like teaching me some stuff. Kind of like almost like mentoring me at the time because I wasn't really good. He was really good. Like, I didn't know who he was. People were telling me about him. I'm like, I don't. I know wrestling by.

[Daniel Cormier]

He got recruited everywhere.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

Out of high school, out of college. So then they were telling me he's a juco national champ. I'm like, so why the hell is he here at this school?

[Daniel Cormier]

Yeah.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

And then I transfer SUNY Cortland and he's tr. I see that he's fighting, doing jiu jitsu stuff on his MySpace. I reach out to him and he invites me to come down to the gym. I asked for the address and it's five minutes from my college campus. And I'm very thankful of that opportunity because me going and getting an opportunity to try just kind of gave me an opportunity to see if this was something I want to do. And I gave it a shot. And it just happened to work out.

[Ed Helms]

Hey, it's Ed Helms, and welcome back to snafu, my podcast about history's greatest screw ups. On our new season, we're bringing you a new snafu every single episode.

[Sponsor Announcer]

32 lost nuclear weapons you're like, wait, stop.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

What?

[Daniel Cormier]

Ernie Shackleton sounds like a solid 70s.

[Ed Helms]

Basketball player who still wore knee pads.

[Sponsor Announcer]

Yes.

[Ed Helms]

It's gonna be a whole lot of history, a whole lot of funny, and a whole lot of guests. The great Paul Scheer made me feel good. I'm like, oh, wow, Angela and Jenna, I am so psyched you're here.

[Sponsor Announcer]

What was that like for you to soft launch into the show?

[Ed Helms]

Sorry, Jenna, I'll be asking the questions today.

[Sponsor Announcer]

I forgot whose podcast we were doing.

[Ed Helms]

Nick Kroll. I hope this story is good enough to get you to toss that sandwich. So let's, let's see how it goes. Listen to season four of SNAFU with Ed Helms on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts or whatever, wherever you get your podcasts.

[Hell in Heaven Podcast Narrator]

In the new podcast, Hell in Heaven, two young Americans move to the Costa Rican jungle to start over. But one will end up dead, the other tried for murder not once. People went wild, not twice, stunned, but three times. John and Anne Bender are rich and attractive and they're devoted to each other. They create a nature reserve and build a spectacular circular home high on the top of a hill. But little by little, their dream starts to crumble and our couple retreat from reality.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

They lose it. They actually lose it. They sort of went nuts.

[Hell in Heaven Podcast Narrator]

Until one night, everything spins out of control. Listen to Hell in Heaven on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts.

[Snax from Trap Nerds Podcast]

What's up everybody? This is Snax from the Trap Nerds podcast and we're bringing you the horror every week all October long.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

Kicking off this month, I'll be bringing.

[Daniel Cormier]

You all my greatest fear inducing horror.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

Games from Resident Evil to Solid Hill. Me and Tony bringing Backfire team on.

[Daniel Cormier]

Left for Dead two and we just.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

Gonna be going over some of the greats.

[Snax from Trap Nerds Podcast]

Also in October we'll be talking about our favorite horror and Halloween movie and figure out why black people always gotta die first.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

The Umbral reliquary invites any and all foolish brave enough to peruse its many curiosities. But take it all sales are final. Weekly horror side quests written and narrated by yours truly with a full episode read and a commentary special.

[Snax from Trap Nerds Podcast]

And we will cap it off with Horror Movie Battle Royale. Jason versus Freddy, Michael Myers versus the Alien Thing with the Little Tongue Monster. October. We're doing it Halloween style. Listen to the Traverse Podcast from the Black Effect Podcast Network on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcast or wherever you get your podcast.

[Sad Oligarch Podcast Narrator]

The Rich Russians Falling out of Windows podcast is back. Sad Oligarch Season 2 since we left you in 2023. After season one, many politically motivated Russian Millionaires have continued to die in suspicious circumstances. We dig deeper into these odd deaths, which include everything from mushroom poisoning and mysterious heart attacks to window clumsiness and suicide by decanting decapitation. One thing we have found since we started back in 2022 is the information on the suspicious deaths has become much harder to find. Not just that. It seems as if state controlled media in Russia is being utilized to purposely confuse and contradict the reporting that gets put out. As you can probably imagine, season two gets very weird. This is a sad oligarch on the island. IHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

[Daniel Cormier]

You said that Uniondale shaped you.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

Yes.

[Daniel Cormier]

Your city. A lot of gang violence. Not the ideal situation. You had a lot of siblings and half siblings. 7 siblings.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

20.

[Daniel Cormier]

20 siblings. 7 siblings. Like your actual full blood siblings were 7 and you had 13 half siblings. How in the world did that work?

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

It was chaotic, man.

[Daniel Cormier]

How many were living in the house?

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

I think at the point, at one time, in terms of. I think the kids, at most was 11 or 12.

[Daniel Cormier]

11 kids living in the house. So does your mom have kids before your father or does your father have kids?

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

Yes, she has two before my dad, so she has 10 kids total, but she has eight for my dad.

[Daniel Cormier]

Wow.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

Who am I?

[Daniel Cormier]

So, and Your dad has 10 kids?

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

He has the other. Yeah. Jesus. But then this, the side that are from my mom's side, they're not through my dad, so they're also my siblings, but not through my dad's side.

[Daniel Cormier]

Wait, I'm confused. Of course they're not. Otherwise you'd be cousins.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

No, no. So what I'm saying is the other kids that my. My mom has, the other two, they're from two different guys.

[Daniel Cormier]

Okay, okay, okay.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

They have no. They have no affiliation with my dad. So my dad's kids and then my mom's kids and then my dad and my mom's kids.

[Daniel Cormier]

I get it. I understand. 20 plus 20 kids. I understand. So my father had two kids after my mom.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

Okay.

[Daniel Cormier]

My mom had two kids after my dad, so yes, I get it. We were five, though. We're seven total, not 20. How many were living in the house?

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

Like, I think 11 or 12 at a time.

[Daniel Cormier]

12 kids.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

I think. I know you're 11.

[Daniel Cormier]

What kind of house are you guys living in?

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

My dad was a street pharmacist. Yeah, it wasn't a very big house, but then he did build it up. But the way they built it, these guys that he used were just not good construction Guys.

[Daniel Cormier]

Yeah.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

So there's a lot of janky shit going on because you try to get it for the cheap. Yeah, for sure. Very good. For sure. But we had like six bedrooms and then a basement. That's when he built it up.

[Daniel Cormier]

But the basement is probably where you guys are probably hanging out the most.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

Yeah, yeah. And then you can fit a lot.

[Daniel Cormier]

Of kids down in the basement.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

He boxed up.

[Daniel Cormier]

Just not. And not like in terms of stealing them. Cuz that sounds horrible. You can fit a lot of kids in the basement, but like put a whole bunch of air mats down and everything. You guys can sleep down there.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

Yeah. But he would box up the room so everyone kind of had like their own space, kind of. And then some rooms have two beds. Yeah. The older kids, at least.

[Daniel Cormier]

Yeah. You got a real unique relationship with.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

Your father, I would say. Yeah. Unique is a good way to.

[Daniel Cormier]

Yeah.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

Because if you can consider it a relationship.

[Daniel Cormier]

Because when you are someone's kid. Right. Especially sons. Because I remember this means the most to me. My dad went to one wrestling match when I was in high school. I never forget it because he went. He was always so busy. He could never go. You as a kid, you look to your father almost to find strength, right?

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

Yes.

[Daniel Cormier]

You didn't have that.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

No, we didn't have much fatherly love, I would say. And I, I get like the running the streets and everything. You're paying the bills. But when you're a young kid that you don't really. You just think that's something they're supposed to do as a parent, provide. But you're. That the one part that you crave as a kid is like some type of relationship with your parents. Yeah. You know, so growing up, I didn't really have that with either of my parents. My mom and I were a lot closer. But it was never like a real like, come here, son, we can talk about certain things. It was never a relationship like that. It was just more like I was like the oldest at the time in our group that was actually on my dad's side and that lived with everybody. So I was responsible for a lot of things. I was almost treated as an adult really, really early. And I guess they kind of forgot that portion where you should kind of develop a relationship with your kids.

[Daniel Cormier]

I've, I've, I've. I've seen in past interviews where you said I felt like a broken kid and I had no direction.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

Yes.

[Daniel Cormier]

And you directly attributed that to your relationship with your dad. Was it because he was absent and he was on The. Out in the streets, and he. Or he just. Because he didn't provide that. That. That guidance that kids generally look for when they think about a. A parent or a dad, at least. You know, my son on the wrestling mat, football field, looks dad. Dad. Like he loves having his dad there.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

Yeah. And I'm hoping that's the one thing I could give my family when we do have one. That's the one thing I said I would make sure I never. Never keep out on, you know, make sure, because it's. It's. It's an investment. You should want to invest in your kids because they're. They're a better version of you. That's what you hope for. So with that, like the gang violence and everything, my brother ended up going to jail. I did four years when I was in college. He was a member of the Bloods. Same thing. Never my dad never around. But anything he wanted, he gave it to him and just. Just never really there to. At least from what my point of view was to actually guide him and teach him things. And so you want that. Not having that for myself, it was just on top of that for. To have someone like that who was never really around and then come home and beat the out. You was just like. You're just like. You almost feel like you can never do anything right. And then when they would verbally abuse you, just call you stupid for everything, call you a dunce cop, we would say, well, yeah, yeah, yeah, dunce cop. Yeah, dunce cop.

[Daniel Cormier]

He said, you said it made y' all pit me. It's just like your dad would say that to you.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

He would say it to all of us.

[Daniel Cormier]

You said it made you feel small, right?

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

All the time.

[Daniel Cormier]

Why? Because you were the oldest.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

I don't know. He would call me a mama's boy, and I'm just like, I don't understand why you don't like me. Did he see what I want you to do is like me?

[Daniel Cormier]

Did. Did he see maybe you as a better version of him? And maybe it, like, became like a little bit of an envious relationship. When you look back on it as.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

An adult now, maybe at this age, when I was in high school, you couldn't understand it.

[Daniel Cormier]

I get it. But you're doing things that are very positive. He's still doing what he's doing. You think maybe that was a little envy in the relationship?

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

I wasn't. I wasn't a straight A student at the time, so it was not like I was killing it in a way that was different from him. He would always call me Lickerman, which was like his way, I guess, of kind of giving me praise because I would be the guy who would have to take responsibility for a lot of things when these guys were gone. I was in the house alone with just me and my. My sister and my younger brother and then my other little sister who was then born. And we were just living together. They'll leave. You don't answer the phone. You don't touch the door. And whenever someone comes knocking, they call them. I was the guy, the one the little ones want to try to answer it, like, no, you heard what they said. You don't do it. So they always looked at me as the little man because I. I was always propped and left with the responsibility of just being an adult sooner than I probably needed to be. Well, it's not a bad thing. I think it's. That's why I made you grow up. Made me grow up. Why I feel the way I do with the world today. But I also is why I'm so kind of, I guess, callous in showing emotion. Yeah. And why probably I joke around so much because it just. It just makes it easier to not.

[Daniel Cormier]

You're trying to shield yourself from the hurt, I guess.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

I guess. So to speak, he would have, like, I don't look people in the eyes as much as I should. And it's because of him why whenever something would happen and he would call us to the room we had ready to whoop our ass and ask him, us, what happened. And if you looked him in the face, he said, he, as we say, cut to my box. Slap the. Out of you backhand or forehand. And then he said, now look Parmen fierce. And I'm just like.

[Daniel Cormier]

But that is one thing we learn as men, to look directly in a person's eye, to show respect.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

Yeah. So imagine having that pretty much your whole childhood. And then even as a young adolescent in High School. 9th, 10th, 11th senior year was the last time he put his hands on me.

[Daniel Cormier]

What happened?

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

He took a cable cord. He taped it up. Well, first he took it, he doubled it. He rolled the bottom handle into. He taped it up, then rolled the bottom handle into like a. A grip. Long cable cord, double thick. My brother opened his cases of Red Bull, the one that's the gang. Gang. Throw it, would you, babies? Now in jail again. He drinks the Red Bull, opens the case that we were told not to touch. I take one because the good son that he never punishes. Nothing's going to happen if he did it. I take one. Somehow I am the one that gets crushed with this thing. Welts on my back, hits me with one on my head. I heard a ringing and I still feel like sometimes my earrings a little oh, Joe on this side because he just. And my mom told him. My mom, I remember her telling me because I heard her screaming like why the would you, why would you do that to him? And it was just always me, could.

[Daniel Cormier]

She protect you or. No.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

She got it too.

[Daniel Cormier]

Really?

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

Yeah. So imagine sometimes I want to just, you know.

[Daniel Cormier]

But you never, you, you never, you.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

Never did him anything as you're just not big enough. Yeah, until I got older. And then when that incident happened, I didn't fight back to like the very end and I was like grabbed him. I pretty much, I, I left the house afterwards and I told him like don't ever post. Don't ever put your hands on me again. Like this is just not one of us is gonna have to go. Wow, this is like. It gets to a point where it's like enough is kind of enough. And even now I've tried to make amends with him, but this, that's a whole nother story. I won't even get into that. But it's hard to forgive that. I just don't talk to him. Yeah, he's just very stuck in his ways. He's stubborn, he's selfish, he's conniving and he's two faced.

[Daniel Cormier]

But even as the world champion, did he not try to work his way back into your life?

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

No, but he tried. He's trying to take my money.

[Daniel Cormier]

How?

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

Through child support, through my mom.

[Daniel Cormier]

How in the world could he get your money?

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

Because he knows my mom doesn't work. It's not making money. He knows I will eventually have to pay.

[Daniel Cormier]

Because he takes it from your mother.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

Yeah.

[Daniel Cormier]

So putting your mom on child support.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

My mom is on child support to pay him. Yeah. Now the child support is up. My sisters who are just turned 21 have been paying him. They've been working for the last three years. They've been paying him 375amonth. And he knows that the money is coming from them and he still takes it.

[Daniel Cormier]

That's unbelievable.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

Even they told him like, you know, this is our money and he still takes it. And then their rears are like $54,000. But he only gets 50$50 a month. So he's like trying to go to the court to get that raised again so that he could get more money. But he's coming from me.

[Daniel Cormier]

So he took the attitude of the street, right, the hustling, and now he's applying it to life because he's probably too old to be able to hustle in the streets anymore.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

I just doesn't want to do it because I got other thoughts on that, but I just think he doesn't want to do it anymore.

[Daniel Cormier]

Aljo, when do you think you started to break free from those experiences and how did those experience with your dad shape you into who you are today?

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

I would wrestle with anger and wrestling, it was my outlet. I would wrestle with anger. Was it.

[Daniel Cormier]

What is it? Was it therapy? Was it therapeutic to be on the wrestling mat?

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

Therapeutic to be in a wrestling room fighting, just scrapping? Just be able to just feel like you can actually compete and do something and kind of stand up for yourself for something at least. You know, you see your dad beating down your mom and hitting her. You can't do anything. You're just a little boy constantly being smacked and talked down to you. Just. So that was my outlet, and then that was my therapy. And whenever I would wrestle in matches, I was just always trying to just kind of hurt kids.

[Daniel Cormier]

Yeah.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

And I would be thinking about him.

[Daniel Cormier]

Yeah.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

Just like the stuff that he was saying to myself. And then.

[Daniel Cormier]

Yeah.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

Like, just feel me up.

[Daniel Cormier]

So you carried that into the gym with you? Yeah, he made a horrible impact on. On what? In our adolescent years. Those are the most important years for young men, especially young black men, to develop, to try to be great in society. And to not have that. That guidance is very unfortunate. And when you think back to that. Right. What would you tell that young Al, Jermaine Sterling? Who would you. What if you had to go back today and look at that kid, right, that got hit with that thing in Uniondale? And you say, obviously you tell him it's going to be all right. Like, is it's actually going to be okay. I know it's dark now, but if you had to walk that kid through all those. Those. Those dark, vicious moments, like, what would you say to that kid?

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

Maybe something similar to what my mom told me. This is one thing I would never forget. And I give her praise for this because I didn't realize it until I got older. And I look back on it and now I'm like, huh, it's kind of crazy how everything has kind of come full circle. And I think it was after he kind of beat her up or beat this crap out of me, someone, one of us. And then I was crying, and I remember my mom saying, don't worry. One day you're going to grow and you're going to be big and strong. You're going to become a big man, and you're going to be able to do anything that you want. And I would say that to that kid.

[Daniel Cormier]

That's crazy, man. Because he did. He became a world champion. Right. Even in those dark times with the fans and all that, it could never have been that. Right. So even all those horrible experiences, they form us into being who we are as people. Because I had a lot of dark moments myself, and I always use them to propel me forward. Right. And it feels like you're gonna do the same thing, because those horrible experiences, they turn us into who we are. But when you take those lessons, Right. When you look at what you dealt with in all your family and your friends or your family and your siblings, how do you be? How do you. How are you? How can you be different? How can you ensure that to your beautiful fiance into your unborn children, that you're not only better than your dad, but you're one of the best fathers walking the earth. I mean, you have the example of what not to be. Yeah. How can you be better? A better father, better husband?

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

Just being present. I. I just don't think it's. I don't think what I wanted or what any of us wanted from it was very.

[Daniel Cormier]

Why did you still want that? If he was like. If it was bad, why do you think he still longed for that love? Ah.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

Tried not to get emotional, but.

[Daniel Cormier]

That'S all good.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

I would say. I would say a kid who just wants to just feel like. Like the kid is good enough, you know? Yeah. And even just having closure on some. Some explanation on how he was, why he was the way that he was. And then even talking to my younger brother, he told me that my dad randomly just told him his parents never beat him.

[Daniel Cormier]

Really?

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

So it's just.

[Daniel Cormier]

This wasn't a learned behavior.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

Yeah. So it's. But, you know, we learned this later on, and I just. I would just want to know, why did you treat us the way that you did?

[Daniel Cormier]

And.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

We don't have to have a relationship. I guess I always just want to close. My mom always said, you're too nice. You always extend the olive branch. I'm like. It's like at the end of the day, he's still my dad. It's like, you know, I'm never gonna wish ill on him, but I'm never gonna be like, I'm not gonna go out of my Way to, to do anything for the guy anymore.

[Daniel Cormier]

Al Joe's made that bed, Aljo. I can feel the pain of it, and it's hard. But how have you turned that pain into purpose?

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

Just trying to be better. I still have a lot of his, still have his blood.

[Daniel Cormier]

Yeah.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

He's trying to be a better person, do things better, contribute to society a better way, help pull people up where I can. Yeah. And that's all I could really try to do. You know, nobody can tell me how I feel and put themselves in the same situation that I've been in and experienced. So I'm sure other people have gotten their ass whooped by their parents too. But, you know, the, I guess the trauma you kind of take with it is just different from person to person.

[Daniel Cormier]

It is absolutely different. You, you never know how you take that stuff. It takes a strong man to sit here and talk about this. Like most can't do what you do and open the, the open your, your, your emotions and your, your life to people as you have over the last hour. And I hope people can understand and respect and get to know Al Jermaine Sterling a little better because I feel like right now I learned so much about you, about your mentality, about your thoughts, about your life. I thought this was very good for me. And it makes me wonder, right. With this and with other things that you've done when the door is closed. Right. Because at 36, it starts to get towards the end of the career for everyone when the door closes on him. What do you want people to say about Al Jermaine Sterling years and years from now?

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

Just that this guy never turned the down any fight. Always a gamer, fought the toughest opponents, called out the toughest opponents. And even if I came up short, I always gave him my best. And I, I think at the end of the day, that's all I want people to do. Like, life is hard. Life is hard. And even when you're successful, it's still hard.

[Daniel Cormier]

Yeah.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

Even dealing with this stuff that I have in the back scenes that people don't know about. But you don't give up. You just keep fighting and do the best that you can.

[Daniel Cormier]

Yeah.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

And I'm not the most talented or most gifted athlete, but I've made the most out of it. And that's really just through hard work. You know, I didn't get any handouts coming up and it had super support. Like some people have both parents that are able to take them around and give them that development early and things like that. I'VE come from never feeling good enough to do anything to finally becoming the best of the world or something. Yeah. And that, for me, is like the American dream. It fulfills my. I feel like if we're over today, like, I'm. I feel fulfilled. And I just hope people understand that I always gave my best with each walk that I make. To the ark.

[Daniel Cormier]

Yeah. Last thing. Outside of fighting, what's the next mountain and the last mountain you want to climb? Fatherhood.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

Well, scaling the company. The phone call to one company, which I mentioned I'm the founder of.

[Daniel Cormier]

You do real estate, too?

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

I do real estate, but more passively these days.

[Daniel Cormier]

Yeah.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

Not flipping like I was before. Maybe a little acting again. Like, I got that movie that we're working on. Hopefully nothing changes and I'm still in it. Yeah. Go out next this weekend for a fitting. So hopefully that all goes well. And that will be my third movie that I've done to date that's actually will be coming out and becoming a father. Yeah. Getting married and becoming a husband, then becoming a father.

[Daniel Cormier]

Yeah.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

I know some people say, what about the other part?

[Daniel Cormier]

So, yeah, that's amazing. Well, you've done well, man. I'm proud of you and everything you've done, man. You have been looking back now after hearing everything. It's been inspir. It's inspirational. It was always inspirational to watch you. I've seen you in some of the darkest times of your life to some of the most shining moments of your life, and they've always been tremendous to be a part of from the sideline. But now that I know your story much more in depth, I only wish even more greatness for you in the future.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

So I appreciate it.

[Daniel Cormier]

You know, man, I would never want to start this with anyone like Al Jermaine Sterling, guys. For Al Jermaine Sterling, Daniel Cormier. This was the Daniel Cormier Show. Thank you guys for watching Peace.

[Sponsor Announcer]

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[Al Jermaine Sterling]

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[Johnny Knoxville]

Hello, America's sweetheart. Johnny Knoxville here. I want to tell you about my new true crime podcast, Crimeless Hillbilly Heist from Smartless Media, Campside Media and big money players. It's a wild tale about a gang of hobbs high functioning nitwits who somehow pulled off America's third largest cash heist.

[Ed Helms]

Kind of like Robin Hood, except for.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

The part where he steals from the rich and gives to the poor. I'm not that generous.

[Johnny Knoxville]

It's a damn near inspiring true story for anyone out there who's ever shot for the moon, then just totally muffed up the landing.

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

They stole $17 million and had not bought a ticket to help him escape.

[Hell in Heaven Podcast Narrator]

So we're sitting like, oh God, what do we do?

[Al Jermaine Sterling]

What do we do? That was dumb. People, do not follow my example.

[Johnny Knoxville]

Listen to Crimeless Hillbilly Heist on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

[Daniel Cormier]

This is an iHeart podcast.