← The Herd with Colin Cowherd
The Herd with Colin Cowherd
Hoops Tonight - KEY Game 2 adjustments for OKC Thunder & Indiana Pacers in NBA Finals | Mailbag
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Zoe Saldana
This is an iHeart podcast.
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Lester Holt
NBC Nightly News Legacy isn't handed down or NBC News.
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Tom Brokaw
I'm Tom Brokaw. We hope to see you back here.
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Lester Holt
I'm Lester Holt.
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Tom Yamas
It's carried forward.
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George M. Johnson
Tom Yamas is there for us.
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Lester Holt
Firefighters are still working around the clock.
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Tom Yamas
As the world changes, we look for what endures.
- [00:19]
George M. Johnson
We are coming on the air with.
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Tom Yamas
Breaking news right now. We look for a constant and from one era to the next, trust is the anchor.
- [00:26]
George M. Johnson
For NBC Nightly News, I'm Tom Yamas.
- [00:29]
Tom Yamas
A new chapter begins NBC Nightly News with Tom Yamas. Evenings on NBC.
- [00:35]
Jason
This Pride Month, we are not just celebrating, we're fighting back. I'm George M. Johnson, author of the most banned book in America. On my podcast, Fighting Words, I sit down with voices that spark resistance and inspire change.
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Lester Holt
This year, we are showing up and showing up.
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Tom Yamas
You need people being like, no, you're not going to tell us what to do.
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Lester Holt
This regime is coming down on us and I don't want to just survive. I want to thrive.
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Jason
Fighting Words is where courage meets conversation. Listen on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts.
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Tom Yamas
I know a lot of cops. They get asked all the time, have you ever had to shoot your gun? Sometimes the answer is yes. But there's a company dedicated to a future where the answer will always be no. This is Absolute Season 1 Taser Incorporated.
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Lester Holt
I get right back there and it's bad.
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Tom Yamas
Listen to Absolute Season 1 Taser Incorporated on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts.
- [01:42]
Dan Flores
Why is a soap opera western like Yellowstone so wildly successful? The American west with Dan Flores is the latest show from the Meat Eater Podcast Network. So join me starting Tuesday, May 6, where we'll delve into stories of the west and and come to understand how it helps inform the ways in which we experience the region today.
- [02:04]
Colin Cowherd
Listen to the American west with Dan Flores on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts.
- [02:12]
Lester Holt
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That's code hoops for new customers to get $300 in bonus bets. If your bet wins when you bet five bucks only on DraftKings, the crown is yours. Gambling Problem Call 1-800-Gambler in New York, call 877-8-HOPENY or text HOPENY to 467-369 in Connecticut. Help is available for problem gambling. Call 888-789-7777 or visit ccpg.org Please play responsibly on behalf of Boothill Casino and Resort in Kansas. 21 plus. Age and eligibility varies by jurisdiction. Void in Ontario. Bet must win to receive reward. Minimum minus 500 odds. Required bonus bets expire 168 hours after issuance. For additional terms and responsible gaming resources, see dkng Co Audio. All right, welcome to Hoops Tonight here at the Volume. Happy Saturday everybody. Hope everyone's having a great start to their weekend. As promised, we're going to be covering a mailbag today. A bunch of you guys dropped a bunch of really good questions over on Twitter. Bunch of stuff on the NBA Finals. We'll be talking about some big picture concepts within that series. And then at the tail end of the show, I have about a half dozen questions surrounding some big picture stuff around the league. Some Detroit Pistons, some New York Knicks, some who's going to trade for Kevin Durant, who's going to trade for Giannis? Some fun stuff at the tail end of the show. You guys know the drill. Before we get started, subscribe to the Hoops Tonight YouTube channel so you don't miss any more of our videos. Follow me on twitter@_jasonlt so you guys don't miss show announcements. Don't forget about our podcast fee wherever you get your podcast under Hoops Tonight. It's also super helpful if you leave a rating and a review on that front. Jackson's doing great work on our social media feeds on Twitter, Instagram and Facebook and TikTok. Make sure you guys follow us there. And last but not least keep dropping mailbag questions in our YouTube comments. We can hit them in our weekly mailbags throughout the remainder of the year. All right, let's talk some basketball. First question hey Jason Shea took 30 shots and only had 31 points on those shots, not including free throws while only dishing out three assists. It sort of felt like he tried to be Superman and it played right into the Pacer's hands. What do you think Shay has to do differently in Game two? Love the show. Thanks again for supporting the show. So I those of you guys who watched yesterday's film session will have a a little bit of an understanding of this concept from the film, but I talked after Game one about how it felt to me like Shea was trying to kind of force his way into rhythm under the NBA Finals environment. And after rewatching the game and I talked about this in the film session, I actually ended up disliking a lot of the shots that he took early. You know, I've I talked about in the film session the idea of investing in rhythm. And that to me is such an important part of a point guard's job. You are the ultimate decision maker on a possession by possession basis on the offensive end of the floor. And if you invest in rhythm by moving the ball, it's more likely that later in the game AI is redefining what's possible for your business. Are you up to the challenge? Microsoft is helping leaders like you get AI ready faster with unified data and simplified platform management, unlocking up to 150% improved output. Cross industries leaders are turning to Microsoft's AI tools and guidance to rise to the challenge. For the NBA, that means using AI powered insights to deliver more personalized fan experience. For BMW, it means innovating their development process safely and securely. And for Lego House, it means creating new interactive experiences for people to explore. With Microsoft's trustworthy AI tools and guidance, you can drive greater impact. Business leaders Microsoft surveyed saw an average of 3.7 times ROI per $1 invested in generative AI. Whatever challenge comes next, let Microsoft help keep pushing you forward. For more details, visit Microsoft.com challengers@&t has a new guarantee because most things in life are not guaranteed. Like actually getting the rental car you requested or your wedding turning out just like you dreamed it would and someone making another pot of coffee in the break room after drinking the last drop of the last one. Yeah, don't get me started. Not guaranteed. In a world where Nothing is guaranteed, AT&T is bringing something new to the table AT&T is introducing a guarantee with connectivity you can depend on deals you want and service you deserve or they make it right. So if you want to know more about the ATT guarantee, head to att.com guarantee@&t connecting changes everything. Terms and conditions apply. Visit att.comguarantee for details.
- [07:46]
Zoe Saldana
Hi Zoe Saldana. Welcome to T Mobile. Here's your new iPhone 16 Pro on us.
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Unknown
Thanks. And here's my old phone to trade in.
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Zoe Saldana
You don't need to trade in. When you switch to T Mobile, we'll give you a new iPhone 16 Pro. Plus we'll help you pay off your old Phone up to 800 bucks and you still get to keep it.
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Unknown
There's always a trade in.
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Zoe Saldana
Not right now. @ T Mobile.
- [08:04]
Unknown
I feel like I have to give you something in return for karma.
- [08:06]
Zoe Saldana
That's okay.
- [08:07]
Unknown
I don't really have much in my purse. Oh, let's see. Hand sanitizer. It's lavender.
- [08:12]
Zoe Saldana
I'm good. Seriously.
- [08:14]
Unknown
Let me check this pocket. Oh, mints.
- [08:16]
Zoe Saldana
Really, I'm fine.
- [08:17]
Unknown
Oh, I have raisins. I'm a mom. Wait, wait one sec. I've got cupcakes in the car.
- [08:21]
Lester Holt
It's our best iPhone offer ever. Switch to T Mobile. Get a new iPhone 16 Pro with Apple Intelligence on us. No trade in needed. We'll even pay off your phone up to 800 bucks with 24 monthly bill credits.
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Tom Yamas
New line $100 plus a month on.
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Lester Holt
Experience beyond finance agreement.
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Tom Yamas
$999.99 and qualifying ported for well qualified plus tax and $10 connection charge. Pay off via virtual prepaid card.
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Lester Holt
Allow 15 days credits end and balance due if you pay off early or cancel.
- [08:45]
Dan Flores
See T mobile.com the American west with Dan Flores is the latest show from the Meat Eater Podcast Network. Hosted by me, writer and historian Dan Flores and brought to you by Velvet Buck, this podcast looks at a West available nowhere else. Each episode I'll be diving into some of the lesser known histories of the West. I'll then be joined in conversation by guests such as Western historian Dr. Randall Williams and best selling author and meat eater founder Stephen Rinella.
- [09:17]
George M. Johnson
I'll correct my kids now and then where they'll say when cave people were here. And I'll say it seems like the Ice Age people that were here didn't have a real affinity for cave.
- [09:27]
Dan Flores
So join me starting Tuesday, May 6th where we'll delve into stories of the west and come to understand how it helps inform the ways in which we experience the region today.
- [09:39]
Colin Cowherd
Listen to the American west with Dan Flores on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.
- [09:46]
Lester Holt
When you need people to be involved, when you need guys to make shots, it's more likely that they'll knock them down. We've jokingly been talking about the Indiana Pacers and the damage that they've done in this postseason run with crazy shot making at the end of games. And we jokingly call it like devil magic or voodoo or whatever it is. And there's a certain amount of like, yeah, it's pretty wild that they've hit as many tough shots as they have hit. But as, as is always the case, variance or randomness is going to be pretty far down the list in what plays into that outcome compared to real basketball concepts. And if there's something to be said about the way the Pacers play, it's that they keep everyone involved throughout the game. The usage rate for their top player and Tyrese Halliburton is about 21% in the regular season, right? That's way below what you see from a typical on ball guard who is usually determining the outcome of every single possession. Starts from Tyrese and Rick Carlisle and the identity they breed in the team. And then from there it's just the group of players all trusting each other and keeping the ball moving from side to side and keeping everyone involved as a result. Like, let's look at those tough shots that got made down the stretch that game. I saw Miles Turner hit a contested three over Hartenstein on the right wing, a contested step back three over Chad Holgren on the left wing, a really tough leaning kind of drop cover like pick and roll, pop like short roll shot around the right elbow that he hit there down the stretch. Who else hit a tough shot? Aaron Neesmith flying into that left corner off of the move, right? Who else hit a tough shot? Andrew Nemhard hitting off the dribble, crazy step back against Shay Gilders Alexander, right? Then Tyrese Halliburton hits the game winner. A bunch of different guys hit tough shots because a bunch of different guys are involved throughout the game with Shay Gilders Alexander. Randomly, we got some good rhythm for Lou Dortmund, who made a lot of pretty tough contested shots in that game. But no other Thunder player outside of Shea or Lou Dort was in any sort of rhythm. And that is the downside of approaching the game the way that Shea did. Again, if you guys want to see visual examples of what I'm talking about, go to our film session that we released yesterday. But the Long and short of it is Shea came into this game and took a ton of mediocre shots that he could have got later in the clock. Go move the ball around. If Indiana closes out well and dudes don't get good looks, it'll work its way back to you. Go take that same contested 18 footer. But I thought he took a lot of those shots early in the clock and kind of bailed the Pacers out and it prevented his team from getting into the rhythm that they needed to get into to be better on the offensive end of the floor. Next question. Who is the most important role player moving forward in this series? This is an interesting question. So I think on the Pacers front I'm going to stick with exactly what I said in the series preview and I said I thought it showed again last night. Miles Turner. When Miles Turner is hitting threes and when he's beating post mismatches or beating offensive rebounding mismatches, he is deadly impactful in this particular matchup against a Thunder team that can't match up with his size even with their bigs, who can be a little small right compared to him. So like Miles Turner to me is the key to everything for Indiana in terms of their role player talent. If he's hitting pick and pop threes and he's successfully beating post mismatches and rebounding mismatches, he is the catalyst for their ability to score against this Oklahoma City defense. On the Oklahoma City front, it's really all of their spot up shooters, but I'm going to focus on Lou Dort just so that I can give you one specific player. But it's really all of their spot, their spot up shooters. As you guys saw in the film session yesterday, really, really overreacting to Shea and J Dub drives, sometimes three, even four helpers meeting in the lane. The kickouts were there. Kason Wallace got good looks late, he missed. J Dub got good looks late, he missed. Lou Dort is going to be the consistent guy because J Dub I don't think counts as a role player. He's the co star. Kason might not be on the floor when they go big with Isaiah Hartenstein and Chet Holmgren, right? So the consistent guy who's probably going to keep getting those clean catch and shoot looks throughout the series and needs to hit them is Lou Dort. So those are who I think are the two most important role players in the series for either team. Other question. Also, one thing that stood out, especially after that first avalanche of turnovers, is that Indiana Starters outplayed Okcs pretty consistent, pretty convincingly in that second half. Startling trend considering the massive success, the massive success that Turner, Halle, Nemhardt, Neesmith and Pascal have already had. So here's the thing. I agree that Indiana's starters outplayed Oklahoma City starters, especially in the second half of that game. But I think it's pretty clear that there was an order of operations problem with Indiana or with Oklahoma City with Shea and J Dub not investing in their other role players more frequently throughout the game. Like, there's a chance that you get more out of chat, you get more out of Case, and Wallace, you get more out of J Dub, even if the ball just is flowing more throughout the game. And so I think in general, Oklahoma City starters didn't play well, and so they're capable of playing a lot better heading into a game, too. But I do agree the Indiana starters outplayed them in Game one. How rare is it that the Pacers play with this consistent effort throughout the series? And games going against the traditional flow of playoffs, usually stealing Game one on the road would definitely mean the team will get blown out in Game two, but you know, that's not going to to be the case. So I've thought a lot about this within the concept of Game two, right? So in Game two, we have typically seen in this sort of situation, the team that's down one zero bring a ton of energy. And it's like a kind of a two very powerful forces of energy clashing here. Because on the one hand, we have an Indiana Pacers team that stole Game one against Milwaukee and then won Game two, and then stole Game one against the Cavs and then one Game two, and then. Well, I guess they actually, the games that they actually stole in the Cav series was game two. But the point is, is they won game two after going up 1 0, right. Against the Knicks, same thing. They steal game one in crazy fashion. They still come back and win game two. So Indiana is stolen game two after going up 10 on the road in all three series. But actually, I think in the Indiana series, they were at home for the first two games. But the point is, is they went up 20 in all three series and in the Cavs matchup and in the Knicks matchup, they managed to win Game two on the road despite going up one zero. But then we on the other side of it, we have Oklahoma City, who against Denver toasted off Game one, and then they came out and beat the shit out of the Nuggets in Game Two. Right. So which of those forces is going to win in this particular matchup? Well, let's talk about each team. What do we expect from Indiana in Game two? Pacers basketball? I expect Pacers basketball with fewer turnovers they had in Game one. So I'd argue the Pacers will probably play a little bit better in Game 2 than they played in Game 1. That said, as we saw in the film session, as we've talked about ad nauseam over the last couple of days, Shay can play a much better floor game just keeping his teammates involved. Jdub needs to not settle for so many jump shots earlier in the game and look to attack. And guys are certainly capable of doing a better job knocking down the open catch and shoot threes that those guys generate. Oklahoma City can play much better, and I do believe they will play much better in game two. I'm fascinated by T.J. mcConnell. Is he the least athletic, gifted rotation player on an NBA Finals roster in the modern era? Also, I thought Nemhardt bringing the ball up in the court in the fourth quarter allowed the Pacers to get into their actions much earlier. How does Oklahoma City counter this in game two? Great questions. First of all, TJ McConnell to me is actually a much better athlete than he gets credit for. He's a pretty damn big and strong guard. Like, he's got a lot of power to his game, but he's very good at changing directions, especially at full speed. He plays with a lot of pace. He's always attacking already on the move instead of attacking a set defender. And then he's very good at changing direction while going full speed with crossovers and spins and things along those lines. So I actually think TJ McConnell is a very gifted athlete. He has been, in my opinion, one of the best like dribble drive guards in the league for a while in terms of just beating people off the dribble. I don't think that he's a poor athlete or a guy who lacks athletic gifts. I think he's a guy that is actually a pretty underrated athlete at his position. The pace in general with the Pacers, I thought, I thought they did a nice job pushing the ball up the floor consistently in the second half without turning the ball over, which forced a lot of transition cross matches. I didn't think it was just Nemhard bringing the ball up the floor. I thought it was just kick ahead passes and just playing with a lot of pace and guys running and just playing Pacers basketball. Oklahoma City can only do so much to stop that with the way that Indiana plays, they did stop easy run outs. There's a few of them, like Siakam snuck past Chet for an easy layup at one point in the second half. But overall it's not like they were giving up like easy stuff in the early part of transition. It's just the cross matches that come from that. In Indiana's ability to punish mismatches, I thought the main thing that Oklahoma City could clean up defensively heading into game two is just their overhelp. There's just too many examples of them, like sending two, three guys at a dude in the paint. And when Indiana's not turning the ball over and they're spraying the ball out, there's easy open shots and it's like, yeah, like toppin's going to knock that down. You know, Turner's going to knock that down, the Neesmith's going to knock that down. So there's a certain amount of like they've got to be a little bit more decide like a little bit more picky, I should say, about when they decide to help in those situations. In game two, did Mark Dagonal blow his wad too early by adapting to Pacer style basketball before trying to play Thunder style basketball? What adjustments does he have left? Seems like he doesn't think they can get into their half court set against this team. I don't think Mark's worried about their ability to get into their offense. I think he knows that Shay and J Dub played a poor game and I think he's going to go over with them in film and I think they're going to clean it up. I think Shane J Dub are both going to be way better in game two. Now when I look at it in terms of adopting the Pacer style basketball, the, the big criticism is that Mark Dagnaut went slow or went small down the stretch. Right when he went small, they started giving up a bunch of offensive rebounds to Siakam and Turner underneath the basket. Here's the thing, there's a certain amount of those offensive rebounds that they're going to be able to get no matter what against switches. Like it doesn't matter if Chet's on the floor, if Chet's on the perimeter and Turner, Siakam's got a small underneath the basket. And so to me it's more just they got to do a better job when they're giving up those mismatches of get like gang rebounding. Everyone's got to crash. Dudes got to come flying in to knock away the Ball overall, as a team, they got to do a better job playing, winning those contested rebound battles, right? As far as like defensive adjustments that are available to them, the only big one that I see is just those help and recover decisions that we talked about earlier. Just being a little bit more picky about when they offer a ton of help and leave shooters open in the process. Next question. Why didn't Indy take the ball out of SGA's hands and double? So this is complicated. They weren't doubling that much. They were throwing some pretty aggressive hedges in the second half and they gave up some slips and some rolls out of that. But for the most part they were offering all that extra defensive tension at Shea after he beat his man off the dribble. Like there was a play where he split a ball screen against Obi Toppin when he went to hedge and got right downhill and then three Pacers just met him right in the lane. The double team, so to speak. The getting the ball out of Shay's hand, so to speak, came late in the form of sending aggressive help at the rim and there being kickout opportunities. And honestly I thought Shea did a nice job down the stretch of making those kickouts. Dudes just gotta make shots. He. And the second piece of it is if Shea invests more early in the game at getting those guys shots, they might be more comfortable and more able to knock down those shots when they get into crunch time late. Next question. How did the Celtics out clutch the Pacers four times last playoffs? Granted, without Halle for part of it, couldn't that loss or could that loss be part of Carlisle's inspiration to build the most clutch and resilient team we've seen in recent history. Couple things. First of all, that Celtics team was a special team. Very, very, very good team that had the ability to consistently generate great shots down the stretch, punish mismatches and they were such a high level defensive team last year in the postseason. The second piece of it is I think Halliburton is the key like in these games that they've stolen. Who's been the guy that's had the magic late. It's been Tyrese Halliburton in his ability to beat Giannis off of the dribble for ISO scooping layup, right? It's been Tyrese Halliburton hitting that step back at the top of the key in Game 2 over Ty Jerome to win Game 2 against the Cavs, it was Tyrese Halliburton hitting the step back, foot on the line, jump shot against the knicks in Game 1 that sent that game to overtime. It was Tyrese Halliburton last night hitting the off the dribble jump shot like Tyrese Halliburton brings the upside because he's just a better player now than he was last year because he's healthier, he has his hamstring underneath him and he's in just in a better physical position to be impactful. Down the stretch of these games then down the roster, everyone's just a little better. Emma's a little better than he was last year. N.E. smith is considerably better than he was last year. Turner's playing the best basketball of his career. All these dudes are just playing better and so they're a better version of what that Pacers team was last year. Last question on this series and then we'll move on to some stuff around the league. After all the talk about the Thunder being compared to the KD warriors, how even more laughable is that comparison now after game one? Couple things. I agree that comparing this Thunder team to the KD warriors is silly. That team was obviously better. Kevin Durant was the third best player in the league at that point in time. Steph was the second best player in the league at that time. Klay Thompson was Probably the best 3 and D guy in the entire NBA at that point. Andre Guadalupe was probably like a top two or three like Swiss army knife role player forward in the league at that time. And Draymond Green is the best defensive player of his era and very much at the peak of his powers at that point in time. So like, I think there's a pretty large gap between Golden State and the second best champion of this era. If Oklahoma City can can win the series, which is an if, obviously, then I think they kind of take that second spot in terms of talent and what they have defensively and the job they did getting out of that Western Conference. But yeah, I think comparing them to the KD warriors is foolishness. That team is the most talented roster ever assembled in NBA history. Two of the top three players in the league, all veteran, experienced talent, not guys that are new and green and unfamiliar with this stage. So I didn't see that comparison. That said, before you go burying the Thunder, who cares if they will lose game one? If they win the next four and they win the series in five, they're still going to be looked back at as a team that's one of the most dominant teams in NBA history within a single season. So don't bury the Thunder yet. Even though I don't think they're as good as the KD warriors, they still have a very good chance to win this series and to win convincingly if they can apply themselves.
- [25:07]
Tom Brokaw
Blending Vice's signature dynamic storytelling with the high octane world of sports, Vice Sports brings an exciting and diverse range of programming that goes beyond the game. From action packed live events to gripping behind the scenes documentaries, to hard hitting investigative pieces and in depth profiles of athletes, coaches, teams, Vice Sports captures the raw energy, drama and passion that make sports truly unforgettable. Catch live events and other exclusive sports programs only on Vice TV. Go to vice tv.com to find your cable channel.
- [25:41]
Lester Holt
All right, let's move around the league a little bit. This was a report Gary Woelfel reports that the Knicks are preparing a tsunami type offer for Giannis. The question was, what offer do you think this is? Maybe McHale and Towns. Here's the thing also, if they get out bid, should they shift towards a more achievable target like Kevin Durant? So a couple things. If the Knicks are preparing an offer for Giannis, what does it look like? Okay, from what I understand, I believe they only have access to one first round pick this summer, if I'm remembering correctly. So they don't have the draft compensation to get into a bidding war for a guy like Giannis in theory. Now if you get a third team involved or if you can convince the Bucks that they want to take back a Mikhail Bridges or you know, I would argue you might want to even look at trading OG because he plays the same position as Giannis. But whatever it is, if you're going to look to move one of those guys and the Bucks are like, yeah, we want win now pieces, sure, let's do it, that's great. But like I think that the Bucks are probably more interested in draft compensation and if that's the case, then you got to get a third team involved. And so now you're looking at getting a third team involved and trading basically OG or McHale or towns or whoever it is, whatever you decide to give up for draft compensation that then gets rerouted towards the Bucks in a Giannis deal. But like to me it's just the reality is is that there are teams that can absolutely outbid everybody with respect to Giannis. Like the spurs just have so many more picks to throw on the table. The Rockets have so many more picks to throw on the table. If one of those teams decides to get involved with Giannis, they can just so much easier get that Sort of deal done right and so view it as a long shot. But if they do get out bid, should they shift towards a more achievable target like kd? Absolutely. Their roster is pretty much guys in their late 20s, so they're a bit of a shorter window anyway. So I wouldn't be overly concerned about tying myself to an older player. KD's game translates super well in the late phase of his career, especially in a team like this that has so much talent that he wouldn't be depended on as much. And there's an easy vehicle in the form of Karl Anthony Towns. Phoenix really wants a kind of a franchise starting center if that's the framework of the deal and it's Karl Anthony Towns and a first round pick for Kevin Durant and the Suns get a younger star that's been to back to back conference finals. And look, do I think that makes the Suns a very interesting team? No, but I don't think the Suns are a very interesting team now. So at that point, whatever. And if you could somehow pull that sort of deal off and get Kevin Durant, that, that puts you in a pretty damn strong position going into next season. Especially in an Eastern Conference that is wide open with Boston falling apart, with Milwaukee falling apart. Like this is a, this is a winnable conference out east and I would view Kevin Durant as a target there that I think would put the Knicks into another echelon. Echelon in terms of reliable scoring talent. Also, Kevin Durant's a very good defensive player in a low man context when he can protect the rim, be a defensive rebound or things along those lines. So like again, if you need to get more draft compensation, maybe you do end up including like an OG in a separate, you know, three team structure that sends more draft compensation towards the Suns. But if you can get rid of Towns and keep one of your two forwards and keep Brunson and get Kevin Durant, I think that's a very interesting team in a wide open Western Conference or Eastern Conference. Excuse me, not quite related to this finals, but seeing how far the Knicks went and how open the east is next year, should the Pistons consider going in a bit harder next year seeing that they might not actually be that far away in general, what's a realistic move for them this summer? So again I, if I'm remembering correctly, if the Pistons let all of their cap holds walk, so if they let like Dennis walk and Tim Hardaway Jr. Walk and all these guys, I think the max cap space they can put together is about 19 million. It's like 19, 20 million. Something along those lines. That's not enough to bring in a super high level free agent. Right. Especially when I would argue that Tim Hardaway Jr. And Dennis Schroeder kind of if you can bring them back on team friendly deals, that's actually better than going out to get a free agent. I would try to get those guys tied up on relatively short term mid level contracts meaning around two years or less or like a team option for the third year. Sure. So that you have some flexibility. But like a two year deal somewhere in the 15 to 20 million range. If you can do something like that for those guys where they're in mid level contracts where like you know, one of them's in the you know, 5 to 10 million range and the other one's in the 10 to 15 million range or something, they become trade pieces at that point. Trade filler. If the right sort of move just kind of materializes this summer for you to jump on. But again, don't jump the gun on a player that is going to shorten your window. Cade is a franchise altering type of talent. He has proven that he can succeed at the highest levels of basketball. I'm a believer in him. You have Jaden Ivy coming back. You've got young role player talent in the Sar Thompson, you like, you have the ability to be patient here while also having guys like Tobias Harris, guys like Malik Beasley, guys like Tim Hardaway Jr. On team friendly deals that you can still be competitive in the short term but then turn your attention in the draft towards off ball scoring talent. That's the big one with the, you know, I think Sar Thompson obviously has the ability to be one of the better kind of like perimeter like DN3 types of players in the league. Right. As a guy that can guard the opposing best player, he's a guy that obviously they can unlock some of the vertical spacing stuff with that the Rockets do with the men. Thompson, he can become a better offensive player and we'll see how his jump shot develops over time. Ron Holland obviously is like another kind of like athletic type of young wing. What they're missing is like older college talent. So like guys that are in, you know, three, four year college guys that you can find in the middle of the first round, late first round guys that can that have been playing in a winning context as like weak side scorers, guy that can knock down jump shots and drive closeouts, things along those lines. I think there's a lot of opportunity in the draft for that sort of talent. So the point is, is like, let this thing grow slowly. Don't jump the gun for an Eastern Conference finals appearance that ends up shortening your window. Don't make the mistake that the Cavs did with LeBron in early, you know, in the early part of his career where they kept making these kind of mediocre, aggressive deals and getting guys like Antoine Jameson and Mo Williams that were good players, made team better, but didn't make them a championship team. And so patience is the name of the game, the specific type of talent they need. I like where they're at at center. I like where they're at with their shot creators. I like where they're at in terms of having athletic guys on the perimeter that can guard and fly up and down the floor. What they're missing is just off ball skill, basically. Guys that you can phase out Tim Hardaway and Malik Beasley and phase in younger versions of those players that you find in the middle to late portion of the first round in the draft. All right, we have five more questions. I heard Sam Versini suggest the framework of an Austin Reeves, Derek Lively trade. What are your thoughts on that from both sides? I said this a while back and I. It's kind of my current stance with respect to an Austin Reeves trade. I think it makes sense to trade Austin Reeves as long as you get back either one, a very good ball handler that can be that secondary ball handler next to Luka and is a better athlete. Okay. Or two, two high level starters. Okay. If I can turn Austin into Derek Lively and a guy like a PJ Washington, then sure, I think it starts to make some sense. But if I'm just getting Derek Lively, I feel like Austin Reeves just a better player, a better asset, even though I think Lively obviously fits the big picture goals of the Lakers. And so I would trade Austin for Derek as long as I also got PJ back as a legitimate starting caliber piece of forward depth. Right. And that's a guy that, when LeBron retires, PJ Washington could just slide in at the 4, you know, and obviously he brings a depth piece in that regard in the short term. Right. But. But like just flipping Austin for like a starter, he's a better starter. That doesn't make any sense. I think it makes some sense to at least look around trading Austin because I don't think it makes a ton of sense to have two unathletic guards in Austin and Luka as foundational players in your starting lineup. But you don't Just get rid of them for the sake of getting rid of them. You get rid of them for high value and nothing less than that. All righty. I changed my mind. I actually doubled up the, the Giannis question. So we actually have, we actually only have three questions left. Looking at this Pacers and Thunder team, what could they do in the offseason to further push them to the chip? Both have a good amount of draft picks and it seems the Thunder needs scoring and playmaking help. I think the Pacers could use an upgrade at the 2, 3 position. So I actually disagree with this. I, I don't think the Thunder should make a move for Giannis. They're obviously very, they're either a championship team, which the series isn't over, or they're very, very close to being a championship team. And Chet's going to get better, J Dub's going to get better. They're young, the sky's the limit. Like I don't think it makes a ton of sense to shorten your window to make, to give you a better chance at, you know, one single championship in this regard. Like I, and also I just think it'd be bad for the league if Giannis went to Oklahoma City. So I don't think Oklahoma City should do anything as far as the Pacers go. Like, like honestly there's a bit of a five out spacing concept with a guy like Siakam where even though Siakam's not as good as Giannis, I think there's a little bit of a diminishing return. The Pacers are very ball and player movement, heavy offense and Giannis is more of like a like brute force, you know, just sheer force of will and power type of weapon. He's not a guy that is known for being a super, super high level, quick decision, read and react player and three point shooter and all those things that are so important in the Indiana Pacers offense. So I don't really see that as, as a realistic type of move. And then as far as the two and three goes, I think, I think Nemhardt and Eastmith are strengths in this offense as ball pressure guys that can run action and shoot. Like, I don't necessarily think an upgrade. There is something that you look outside the roster for if anything, Ben Matheran in his potential and it continues to grow and develop in coming years and he becomes your upgrade at the 2 and 3 in the big picture. Highly unlikely that this would happen due to current circumstances and the beef, but I feel the Pacers are the perfect team. For Giannis, he'd elevate the defense and I feel Hallie would complement Giannis perfectly with east kind of in limbo right now. Thoughts on this? As I mentioned earlier, I just don't, I don't think Giannis fits as well with Indiana as he does in some other situations. That doesn't mean like Giannis would make the Pacers better. He's Giannis. But the point is, is like you'd have to give up a ton to get him and it is a little bit of a diminishing return in a system that prioritizes three point shooting and read and react quickness, which are two kind of weaknesses for Giannis relative to his strengths. Last question. Did we undervalue Indiana's shot making ability before the series? While weighing, while weighing Oklahoma City's ability to turn people over too much. Game is about getting buckets, making tough jumpers, and if the playoffs is any evidence, they do it better than almost anyone we've seen. This is an interesting question and I appreciate you asking it because it's caused me to look at things a little bit differently. I would argue that Shea and J Dub are better tough shot makers than Halliburton and Siakam as a unit, mainly on the strength of Shea, obviously. But where I think it gets interesting is as you go down the roster, I do think the Pacers are a better aggregate tough shot making team. Niecemith can make tough shots. Nemhard can make tough shots. Turner can make tough shots. TJ McConnell will make tough crazy fadeaways. Ben Matherin can make tough shots. Obi Toppin can make tough shots. I do think there's an aggregate tough shot making piece with the Pacers, which is really fascinating and has shown in a big way in this postseason run. And so honestly, with the way that their offense works and all the whirling around looking for great shots, it doesn't really matter where the ball ends in the sequence. You know, with four or five seconds on the shot clock, any of those dudes can put the ball on the floor and create a decent look for themselves. And I do think that that under, that, that aggregate shot making talent has been a little bit underrated as far as Oklahoma City's ability to turn people over and whether or not that's being weighed properly. We have one game and in the first half it worked marvelously and in the second half it did it. So I think we just need more data before we can really speak, you know, with conviction in that specific regard. All right, guys, that's all I have for today. As always, I sincerely appreciate you guys for supporting me and supporting the show again. We will be back tomorrow night after the final Buzzer of Game 2 of the NBA Finals with Colin Cowherd. So we'll have a breakdown with Colin, then we'll be heading over to playback after. Then on Monday morning I'll do more of like a detailed breakdown and then we'll do film on Tuesday. All right, I appreciate you guys. I will see you tomorrow. What's up guys? As always, I appreciate you for listening to and supporting Supporting Hoops tonight. It would actually be really helpful for us if you guys would take a second and leave a rating and a review. As always, I appreciate you guys supporting us, but if you could take a minute to do that, I'd really appreciate it.
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Unknown
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