← The Herd with Colin Cowherd
The Herd with Colin Cowherd
Hoops Tonight - LIVE: Game 3 Reactions: Celtics Cruise vs. Knicks + Timberwolves Escape With Win vs. Warriors
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Podcast Host
You're listening to an iHeart podcast.
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Basketball Analyst 1
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Basketball Analyst 2
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Basketball Analyst 2
The volume.
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Brand Representative 4
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Basketball Analyst 1
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Kind of a typical type of what you would expect from the best defense in the league. Since the end of January versus Minnesota in a game like this, Minnesota has struggled against Golden State's defense. Kerr leans into Jonathan Kaminga. Jimmy Butler. We finally get the Jimmy Butler hyper aggressive offensive game and we get a hyper competitive, very entertaining basketball game until late in the second half. Over the last quarter and a half, Anthony Edwards and Julius Randall completely find a groove and build some margin. The warriors offense cools off late and the timberwolves take a 21 lead in that series. We're breaking, breaking down that game from the perspective both teams after that, the Boston Celtics looked like the Boston Celtics for the first time in their series against the Knicks. I want to go into some of the specific dynamics at play and I want to talk about what the rest of this series is going to look like because the Celtics have to win four out of five games in order to come back and win this series. And I want to talk about the idea of how every basketball game kind of takes on a different feel and how in each specific type of basketball game it calls for different types of approaches from both teams. And so we're going to talk about what Boston needs to do in order to get the additional three wins they need in the series. And then the Knicks as well. We're going to dig into some of the issues they were having with their pick and roll coverage versus their switching and containing in one on one situation. So lots of interesting stuff to get into in both of these games. At the tail end of the show, we'll take about 10, 15 minutes of questions from the chat and then when we are done here tonight, we're going to head over to Playback TV Slash Hoops Tonight for our usual after show. There. We get to have callers on stage, we look at film, we get into more of an informal interactive kind of vibe over there on Playback. So you guys can join us. Again, the links in the description but Playback TV Hoops Tonight is where we will be for the after show tonight. You guys know the drill before we get started. Subscribe to the Hoops Tonight YouTube channel so you don't miss any more of our videos. Follow me on Twitter at_jason lt so you guys don't miss show announcements. Don't forget about our podcast feed. Wherever you get your podcast under Hoops Tonight. It's also super helpful if you leave a rating and a review on that front. Don't forget about the new social media feeds we have on Twitter, Instagram and Facebook where Jackson's doing great work. Follow us there. And last but not least, keep dropping those mailbag questions in the chat so we get to them at the tail end of the show. So this game pretty quickly took on a simple dynamic. You have two elite defenses, right? And especially with Golden State playing at home, you're going to get an exceptionally good effort. And in a desperation type of situation too, right? We've talked before, after the Steph Curry hamstring injury, the warriors basically have to get one of these two games at home because if they do, that puts a game six guaranteed on the calendar. And a game six is still more than a full week from now, that is on May 18th. And so there's a real opportunity there for Steph to potentially get back and have a chance to play at the tail end of this series. Now, as we know, that's a tricky hamstring injury. It might not even matter. But for any hope that the warriors have to advance in this postseason run, it was going to depend on them getting one of these two games at home. So you're going to expecting a certain type of super intense effort. And so it pretty much settled down into a shot creation contest between Julius Randall and Anthony Edwards and the new iteration of the warriors without Steph. We talked last night about how Steve Kerr got into the idea of how you have to basically play a completely different brand of basketball in order to make the situation work when you lose your star. One of the things that's interesting about the warriors roster construction is it's built on a lot of defensive minded athletes that are good read and react players that operate well in the inverted spacing that Steph provides. Meaning as Steph is coming off of action and he's bringing multiple players out, often bringing a big man out. In a ball screen coverage, there are these four on threes or three on twos, quick advantage situations that break down on the backline. And on the backline it becomes very much a make decisions athletes. You know, it's a very different game than spacing the floor for a rim, pressuring forward, right. Like if you're playing with Luca or Giannis or LeBron, it's like you need shooting. But the warriors, they emphasize more versatile athletes that can work with the advantages that Steph creates on the perimeter to have success on the interior. And so Steve Kerr essentially had to rebuild a basketball team on the fly. And so he used game two as a launching ground. And what do we get? We got a high dose of Jonathan Kaminga. We Talked after Game 2 about how Jimmy Butler would likely be much more aggressive at home. We got a much more aggressive version of Jimmy Butler tonight. He went for 26 shot attempts in this game. And then the same steady diet of Buddy Heald running off of screening action. So essentially it turned into this new dynamic of the warriors versus the same old Minnesota Timberwolves with Anthony Edwards and Julius Randle. And for the first two and a half quarters, the warriors were really controlling things. Ant was in a pretty big funk. Golden State's defense, as I mentioned earlier, in their last 34 games this season, so a sample size of almost a half of the season, they had the number one defensive rating in basketball. They are, I was thinking about this earlier. I think this is the best defense that Ant has played in his time in the NBA. They are not as good at the rim in terms of rim protection as Dallas was, but I think they're much faster on the perimeter, much smarter, more well coached. I think they're just a more dynamic defense overall. And it's not exactly a slump in Draymond Green that you have at the basket or a slouch or whatever you want to call it. Draymond's, you know, one of the better rim protecting smaller bigs that we have in the league. Right. And one of the things the warriors have done with Ant that's caused some problems for him is ball pressure. They're picking him up and making him uncomfortable in his like kind of dance with the basketball situations. And it's forcing him to drive earlier in the schedule than he wants to. And then in those situations they keep throwing bodies at him. He's over penetrating and trying to find kickout opportunities while he's kind of indecisive in the lane. He's slaloming through two or three guys at the basket trying to find a finishing angle to finish. And he's smoking layups. He just was struggling for really the first two and a half games of this series, but into the second quarter tonight. And Julius Randle was struggling a little bit too tonight. I was confused a little bit with his strategy. Cause he kept just trying to attack Draymond Green one on one. And like I get it, if it's late in the shot clock and like the, you got tossed a grenade with five seconds left and you have to create something. But with the way that you should look to approach on offense for the first 15 seconds of the shot clock, you need to be hunting easier opportunities, a better matchup in advantage. You can create an action, some sort of easier opportunity before you rely on isoing their best defender like you, you, if you repeatedly attack their best defender, you're just making life harder on you than it needs to be. And so Julius was struggling a little bit and then with the warriors they were getting great production. Jimmy was fantastic tonight scoring the basketball. We got that aggression from him. Jonathan Kamiga goes for 30 points. The warriors actually won his minutes tonight. Buddy healed early in the second half, gets going, starts hitting some threes. And so the warriors built a little bit of margin. I think they ended up going up by as much as 7. I'll pull up the largest lead, but I think they want. Yeah, the largest lead was seven for the warriors in that early third quarter stretch. But right around that time, a couple things started to go Minnesota's way. Ant got a couple decent catch and shoot looks in off ball situations. We talked a little bit about this in the Lakers series. The idea of ant being really good attacking closeouts off of Julius Randall, post ups ain't got a little bit more rhythm with his jump shot. Julius Randall started to have a little bit of success against Draymond in large part because Draymond got into some foul trouble. And then Draymond had to be a little bit more conservative with his approach. So he's like more gambling on, on Julius further out from the basket, trying to like disrupt him before he even got into his attack because he knows once he gets into his attack, there's not much contact that he can get away with there. And so all of a sudden these cracks started to open up and, and starts hitting even some tough pull up threes. I was talking with Jackson before the the show. Like, you know Jackson, obviously Jackson's a Celtics fan, but he also roots for the warriors. And he was like, we were talking just about what it was like for me as a Lakers fan watching ant repeatedly in these early fourth quarter stretches, just hit these crazy difficult pull up threes and it's like you're in a groove, you're playing hard, your defense is locked in, and it just doesn't matter because when ant goes into that move, there's really nothing you can do but just hope he misses. And it's just such a remarkable piece of athleticism to be able to separate from a defender, a great defender late in the clock and then set your base and elevate up over the top of a great contest, sometimes a double team and rise up and knock down a shot like that. And all of a sudden it just was cooking. And gets a huge driving dunk on Kevon Looney. Another amazing dunk to add to Anthony Edwards highlight reel of playoff dunks in his career. Started in general to find some more seams right at the front of the rim where he was getting cleaner finishing angles. And all of a sudden what looked like a puzzle that ant was struggling to solve. He finishes with 36 points in this game. And that was kind of my takeaway when we were in that mid second quarter, mid third quarter stretch. I'm thinking, okay, this is the best defense that Ant has ever played in his career. They're kind of kicking his butt a little bit. We talked about this after game one. Let's see if it can figure it out. Like, is this going to be like the Dallas series where it didn't really seem like he ever made any headway or is he going to make some headway? And like, here's the thing, there's no doubt that not having Steph Curry out there changes the dynamic of the game. And I'm not trying to sit there and pretend like this is the most challenging win of Anthony Edwards his career. It's not. But this is a very good defense and he did start to find some ways that he could get going off ball in catch and shoot situations. Driving closeouts got a little bit more comfortable and in a rhythm as a pull up shooter and starting to find those driving angles closer to the basket. I think there's even more room for improvement with him. He gets a little bit rushed going downhill to where there's not a lot of change of pace. We talked about this on playback a couple nights ago, but Anthony Edwards is taking about half as many mid range jump shots as he did in last year's postseason run. He just was a little bit more willing to work in the middle of the floor at that point. And I think there's a little, there's still growth that Ant can, that Grant can benefit from in the form of just being more comfortable operating at a slower pace or with change of pace in the middle of the floor and making better use of the of that mid range jump shot. I think there's a lot of opportunity for him to improve. But the indomitable scoring talent was on display in that second half. It just didn't matter that he's a little one dimensional at this point in time or that he still isn't reading the floor as great as he could. Potentially 36 points against the best defense in the NBA in my opinion. And then Julius Randle. He's been sneaky, fantastic this entire postseason run. I didn't like his game one of this series, but for the most part in the Lakers series and the most part in this series, he's consistently been very comfortable operating out of the midpost and out of the low post. He's been playmaking at an extremely high level. Goes for a triple double tonight. 24, 10 and 12. His passing out of the mid to high post has been a consistent, kind of like underrated part of his game. He's actually one of the better, like, kind of entry points for Minnesota to use just because at this point he's more willing to hunt those advantages than Ant is. And again, Ant will figure that stuff out in time. But at the end of the game, you know, it was funny because Jackson and I were talking like the warriors did everything tonight that they could have done. You get two 30 point performances out of like, if you, if you would have told me before this game that you're going to get 33 out of Jimmy and 30 out of Jonathan Kaminga, you're thinking a Warriors win, right? But it just was that much better for man and Julius. They were able to get the job done in that second half. And here's the thing, like, I think the warriors have exposed some obvious flaws in this Minnesota attack on both ends of the floor in terms of their attentiveness to ball and player movement, in terms of their vulnerability to the offensive glass when they're in rotation, in terms of just their ability to handle ball pressure and physicality in a better defensive construct than what they've attacked in some of these playoff series. But you just need to get through this series. And then maybe if you're lucky, Denver beats Oklahoma City. And that's a team that you've had their number for the last two years now. So, like, the finals are there. They're, they're, there's a pathway there for Minnesota to get through this and to get all the way to the Finals. And I think they match up pretty well with the teams coming out of the Eastern Conference. And you know, I was actually thinking about this the other day. I think you could talk me into all eight teams in this postseason run being a legitimate championship contender. Indiana, you know, obviously had a rough game three. I wouldn't be the least bit surprised if they beat Cleveland, beat whoever came out of the Knicks Celtics series, and then beat whoever came out of the West. That's certainly a possibility. I could see Denver winning the West. I could see OKC still coming back and win the series. I could see Boston repeating. I could see Cleveland getting, you know, just wiping the floor with Indiana for the next three games and then running into a Celtics team that's still in a little bit of a funk and getting it done, like, it feels wide open at this point. And there is a legitimate pathway for Minnesota to work through here. You get a really good opportunity to finish this series off against a Warriors team that's missing their best player. You have a potentially great matchup waiting for you with the team leading 2:1 in the next round in Denver. A team that you've had their number consistently and then I can't think of a type of team that I'd like to see more against a Boston. I think, you know, I think after today we could all agree that Boston is still probably the favorite to win the east and Minnesota would just be such a fun matchup in that series with their ability to switch and contain. Basically, Minnesota is a much, much better version of Orlando and we saw what Orlando was able to do at times against the Celtics. So super, super interesting series on the warriors front. Couple of specific things you this was the game that I had kind of marked as the the, the best chance they had to steal one. But you it was very unlikely you were going to get both. You really just need to get one. So it's just all eyes turned to Monday night now and you got to figure out a way to get that particular game. And again, as you've proven, you can make this offense uncomfortable. You can slow them down. Minnesota to their credit, kind of got going in that second half. They had 62 points. That goes to show you how important it is for your best player to produce when you get into these settings. But this is going to be a fun series and it's going to come down to Game four. Whoever wins Game four is going to be in a really good position moving forward. If the warriors win, then they got Steph coming back and a good chance to win the series. And if Minnesota wins, they're going home three, one and probably closing this thing out in five. AI is redefining what's possible for your business. Are you up to the challenge? Microsoft is helping leaders like you get AI ready faster with unified data and simplified platform management, unlocking up to 150% improved output. Cross industries leaders are turning to Microsoft's AI tools and guidance to rise to the challenge. 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Basketball Analyst 2
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Basketball Analyst 1
Move on to Celtics Knicks. Over the course of the last two games, we've been talking a lot about this concept of offensive versatility. And essentially what that means is like, you know we were talking about this with the Thunder Denver series last night, right? Like the for Denver, they just have so many different ways that they can attack. Like okay, this is a series where we're just spamming Jokic Post ups no this is going to be a series where we're running a ton of Jokic Murray two man game right in the middle of the floor. Oh, we got this matchup. Aaron Gordon is a legitimate post matchup Hunter, like we can go to him there. There's like a five out flow with ball and player movement with Jokic kind of flowing side to side and everyone involved in sweeping side to side action that they could go to. They have a devastating transition attack. They have just such a versatile offense that they can like identify the situation and be like, this is the way we're going to go. Kind of like for instance, late in Game 1, Denver Spams post ups for Jokic right in the middle of the floor. Cause Yokich is having the greatest game of his life. Game three, Yach is having probably the worst game I've seen him play. And all of a sudden, you know, Jokic is still involved late and he still is looking to score. But it's a lot more diverting to Jamal Murray and letting him be aggressive in those situations. Trusting Aaron Gordon to take a big three in the left corner when he gets left open in the transition sequence, there's just. They have the ability to adapt to the surrounding circumstances. The reason why that matters is every basketball game is different. Your stars are in different rhythm from game to game. Like we talked, Jamal Murray, great rhythm. Game three, Yich not Jokic, great rhythm in game one. Murray not right. You go into tonight's game with the Celtics, it's like game one. In game two, Jason Tatum and Jaylen Brown consistently kind of like in a funk out of rhythm. Tonight, Tatum and Brown in great rhythm. Fundamentally different basketball game, different role players. Oh, like tonight this guy's really engaged, locked in. He's doing his job. He's not making mistakes, he's hitting shots. Well this next game he's just a little bit more off in those areas. That's why they're role players. Role players are inherently inconsistent. If they were amazing at knocking down catch and shoot threes and amazing at defending every single night, they'd be a $30 million player on the wing. That's, that's what that type of position, a bonafide, great two way three and D Wing is a $30 million player in today's league. And so the point is, is there is a lot of inherent inconsistency in the way basketball games go. So for instance, the Celtics have like a core basketball philosophy. Their willingness to create advantages, hunting mismatches and to drive and kick for quality catch. And shoot threes. That's like their foundational approach on the offensive end of the four. Game one, they just play the dumbest half of basketball I've ever seen. There's not a whole lot to get into other than they just played really dumb basketball in the second half. Game two was very different. Their core philosophy failed them. They played Celtics basketball just fine in the second half and missed shots. Now, they didn't have another method that they could go to. We'll talk more about that concept in a little bit. But the point is, is that their core offensive philosophy failed. Tonight was a classic example of the Celtics core formula working and working extremely well. We've all seen the Celtics win exactly that type of game 100 times over the last couple of years. They came right out and hit six of their first seven threes and they were the same types of shots they were missing in the first two games. Tatum hits a pull up three and against drop coverage. Jaylen Brown, same shot he bricks at the tail end of game two, that drop coverage three right at the top of the key hits it to start this game. Derek White hits like a contested step back three in a late clock situation. Cat sinks in a little too far off. Al Horford swing pass. There's a contest, but Horford knocks down that mildly contested three that he was missing in the first two games of the series. You could feel the confidence dynamic completely swing after that happened. Boston only had one 30 point quarter in the entire series before today. Then they had two back to back 35 point quarters to start today's game. Peyton Pritchard exploded for 23 points. The Celtics offense hummed at the level we knew they were capable of humming at because we've seen it a hundred times. They got that engine going. New York just folded from there. And by the way, Boston's defense was incredible. We're about to talk about that in a minute. But New York also just kind of lost their confidence and played some really poor offensive basketball. Brunson all the way down. Cat was the guy hitting a couple shots early in the game, but he was the primary defensive culprit. No one was really playing well. Mikhail and OG were both out of rhythm. Josh Hart's first couple catch and shoot threes were like very clearly very short right out of his hand. Like you could just tell. Everybody was like shook by the way that Boston was playing. And they were just never able to recover. Now again, there will be different types of games in this series. Let's shelf that concept for just a second. I Want to just shout out Boston's defense? I thought down the line everyone was great. Tatum and Brown switching in and out of action with pressure and physicality. Efforts at the rim from Derek White. Drew Holiday did another great job on Jalen Brunson tonight, but I want to specifically highlight the bigs because I thought Horford, Porzingis and Cornette were all amazing in this game. Cornette continues to impress. He's become like a legitimate playoff rotation piece for this team, especially in the universe where Hauser is is injured. But like all three of the bigs just kicked New York's butt on both ends as athletes. They combined for six blocks with their efforts around the rim. Horford and Cornette had five offensive rebounds. Those dudes were throwing people around like ragdolls to try to find offensive rebounding opportunities. I just thought all three of those guys played with more force than the New York front court and really controlled this game. I mean like this was the first game of the series where the Mitchell Robinson minutes did not go New York's way. They just got physically dominated while also throwing a great offensive punch and the result is 30 point lead, completely insurmountable. Yeah, there's a couple of third quarter pushes from the Knicks, but when you're pushing down from 31, it's different than when you're pushing down from 20. The 80 run doesn't cut the lead to 12 and let light the crowd on fire. The 80 run cuts the lead to 23 and it's a bigger lead than it was even in those peak moments in game one in game two. Now, looking forward in this series, couple of things for the Knicks. I still think they're conceding too many openings. What I mean by that is like in their natural ball screen coverages, when they're hedging and recovering with Brunson, but mainly the drop with Cat, they're getting fried in those situations. They were giving up quality looks in those situations in the first two games. They just weren't going in. They have consistently been better in this series when they've just switched and contained the ball. Simple stat to demonstrate this tonight. The the Celtics shredded the Knicks in pick and roll. That got an offensive rating over 120 including passes on ball screens where they were using some sort of traditional ball screen coverage, post ops and ISOs. Boston ran 27 post ops and ISOs in this game and got just 16 points out of them. It's very clear in the numbers that when they switch and contain, like there was a Like, there are examples where, you know, Tatum's got cat on the wing and they just kind of gap off of him pretty well and he's kind of sitting up there stunting and they just throw a swing pass and get out of it. Like, they're not doing a good job hunting these things one on one. They're just taking advantage of the natural openings. Like, oh, you're going to concede a pick and pop three to Horford that's going in. Oh, you're going to sit back cat, like in a deep drop coverage against Jaylen Brown and Jason Tatum. Like, yeah, they've been missing their pull up threes in this series, but they're certainly capable of making them. And so I still think their pathway moving forward is switching, contain, bait them into those poor isolation decisions. And then for the Celtics, as I mentioned, there will be very different types of games in this series, just purely jump shooting result. Boston got 1.28 points per jump shot tonight. The Knicks got 0.85. Another simple way to explain that is over the course of a hundred jump shots, the Celtics produced at a rate of 43 points more per 100 jump shots than the Knicks. They outshot the shit out of them tonight. Okay, that will probably happen again in this series. Like I think we all could probably agree, this series is going at least six. And there's going to be another game in this series where Boston just does what they did tonight and you basically just shake their hand and say congrats on the win. But there will be different types of games. There will be a game, for instance, where the Knicks just shoot better and if they do, it's a closer game. And if they do, there's more pressure on some of these tougher shots that's Boston's taking. And it's very possible that they find themselves in a situation where they go cold and the Knicks get a bunch of momentum and it's early fourth quarter and all of a sudden that 13 point third quarter lead for Boston is down to five. The crowd is raucous, there's a timeout called, Boston goes in their next couple of possessions, misses a couple of threes, and it's like, what do you do now? Because if you allow that situation to play out and you stay cold like you did in the first two games, it doesn't matter what kind of large volume production you're getting from your three point shot, if you can't score on those key possessions late. While Jalen Brunson has been the best closer in the league this season, and he's killing you on the other end of the floor. And so that's where I want to see what Boston does. There will be if they're if Boston's going to win the series, they got to win four out of five games. I find it highly unlikely that they just shoot the piss out of the basketball four straight times and win the series. Maybe they do, but I think if Boston's going to win this series, they're going to have to win another one of those ugly rock fights. And I'll just be really curious to see what Boston's attack looks like when they end up in that situation. AI is redefining what's possible for your business Are you up to the challenge? 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- [33:56]
Basketball Analyst 2
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- [34:25]
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Brand Representative 2
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Brand Representative 1
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Brand Representative 2
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- [35:16]
Brand Representative 1
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- [35:21]
Brand Representative 4
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- [35:50]
Basketball Analyst 1
Let'S do a solid 10 minutes of questions here.
- [35:54]
Podcast Host
Let's do it. First question well, all of our questions are basically about the Warriors Wolves. First question pods was awful tonight. Shot 1 of 10 and only had two assists. Should the warriors shorten his minutes?
- [36:08]
Basketball Analyst 1
So I this is complicated because I saw a lot of people saying stuff about, about how about how Pajemski was playing throughout the game and I think it's more nuanced than I'm seeing on Twitter. Like, I'm seeing people that are just saying he sucks. And then I'm seeing, you know, I'm seeing Tim Legler talk about how he's being, you know, amazing in all these other ways. And I'm seeing Pajemski being really effective in every single way except for offense. And on that offensive end of the floor, I still think there's some poor shot selection going on. Like, on the one hand you have to empower him a little bit to where because without Steph you need offensive production. There's gotta be a certain amount of leash that he has. But there were like three or four shots he took tonight where I was like, that's not the one you need to take. Like, and so you need to acknowledge that he's defending like crazy and he's rebounding extremely well and he's making good connective passing reads. But I would love to see him trim like two or three of those bad shots out. Another way to another way to look at it, guys, is like this game was winnable. Three or four possessions go a different way. You win. If Instead of a seven point lead, you get it up to 13, you probably win. And so I just think that there's a, there's still a little bit of refinement. Jackson, you, you mentioned to me before we went live, like, the. Just a couple of mistakes Kaminga made late, like just hesitating on that last little catch in the middle of the lane that allowed him to get stripped before he went up. Just like little tiny things that could make a big difference over the course of the series.
- [37:53]
Podcast Host
Yeah, it's tough, it's easy to nitpick, pause. But to your point, when Steph is out, you kind of got to just say play free to everybody, right? You can't be like, you can't be encouraging people to pass up open shots. Really, you're struggling to create offense. It doesn't mean take bad shots, but you can't be trying to limit your players, especially ones like pods who are usually operating off someone off in a sort of secondary sort of situation. There were a couple very, very open threes that he missed that would have been big run extenders for the, for the warriors. And I can definitely understand getting upset, that feeling like he needs to make those. But the, the, the critique about the assist number, he's not, he's not playing Trey Young ball. No, no, he is. He's important to their offensive flow even though he needs to make more shots. And he led the team in rebounding. So like it or not, this is sort of. With Moses Moody playing this bad, especially, like, you don't have a lot of options. What are you supposed to do? Who are you supposed to give more minutes to if you're taking away pods? If you're dropping his minutes, you know what I mean?
- [38:51]
Basketball Analyst 1
And, and he was minus 2 and 39 minutes. Like, again, he's 1 for 10 from the field. There's. He takes two or three better shots or like passes up on two or three bad ones. To your point, hit a couple of those run extending type of threes. All of a sudden he's playing a fantastic game and we're talking about like kind of like a, like a special game in his career. The, the big thing that I'm seeing on film, he's shooting a little bit of a flat ball right now, so he's getting some unfortunate bounces. And this dude is getting clean opportunities in the mid range for floaters. He has got to get that floater polished up. That needs to be A shot that he can hit consistently because that's there for him. But it wants once again with the floater he's shooting it flat and so he's not getting very good rolls on it.
- [39:36]
Podcast Host
And I think we gotta also remember that he is a still a very, very. Despite him playing kind of not a not young style of game, he plays a very veteran game for the most part. I think he is still a very, very young player.
- [39:47]
Basketball Analyst 1
He's 22, he's younger than Ants and he had.
- [39:49]
Podcast Host
And because of that he's going to have some really good like he had some a couple, two games I want to say in the Houston series where he was cashing all of his mid range pull ups. He's hitting those awkward step throughs, he's getting people up in the air and then he had a couple of games where he shot really poorly and that's for a guy who's no one is expecting to become a high, high, high level scorer. Like I just don't think that's really in his range of outcomes. Even though I think he's a very good player. That's what's going to happen to a guy who's in his. What is he third year like it just sort of.
- [40:16]
Basketball Analyst 1
He's got such good lift and his, he's got a nice compact release to where like I do think he could be a very good catch and shoot player eventually.
- [40:26]
Podcast Host
Me too.
- [40:26]
Basketball Analyst 1
It's there, it's there, it just, it's. And that's the thing like this is with pods. I'm glad you brought up his age because I think I think there's. He does just play like a vet and he's been one of the guys that does been in Steve's like kind of inner circle of guys that he trusts and he's, he gets so much more leeway for poor shooting result than Moody does because he's just such an impactfully in all these different areas but like ultimately like this is a development process and in the same way like I feel like Austin Reeves has to make substantial improvements in terms of his strength dealing with like bigger physical players and holding up better defensively with pods it's becoming a more consistent offensive player. We saw it. I mean we watched that chunk of games there. Towards the end of the season there was like a multi month stretch where pods shot like 42% from three and was getting buckets and having some really big games and so it's in there but as we always talk about it's like the, the hot Stretches for younger players tend to be shorter and the slumps tend to be longer. And part of being a vet is like extending your success and limiting your failure and failure. And it just takes time. It just takes time to figure that stuff for sure.
- [41:39]
Podcast Host
Next question. About Anthony Edwards. Do you think with Ant was having a difficult time figuring out the defense in the first half, or did he have low focus or intensity? I believe Ant has a focus issue sometimes when there's no pressure. What. What do you feel like was going wrong for Ant in the first half compared to the second half in general?
- [41:54]
Basketball Analyst 1
I felt like it was a combination of two things. His, the ball pressure, just kind of rushing him into, like, kind of like attacks without a plan, so to speak. And then the jump shot, like the Ants jump shot. He's a very good jump shooter, but he can go through kind of like extended stretches where it's like a little flat and he's leaving it short, and it just is like a little bit off. And I think, like, some of that is natural. Like you shoot yourself out of a slump and then suddenly the shots start to go down. And that's very much what happened in that second half. But I. My biggest thing with him moving forward is just like, having a little bit more of, like, a controlled approach to his drives. It almost reminds me of, like, watching the young LeBron and young Wade type athletes, where, like, they kind of just only know one speed going downhill. But then all of them, when they got older, they became these guys that would put guys in jail and do some more methodical work in the middle of the floor. And that's just. That's really the big thing for me with Ant and his growth is I think he just has to become a guy he's never going to be able to process moving at that speed. He's too fast. He's too fast for his own good. Like, he's gotta find a way to, like, oh, I see a seam, I'm going for it. But if I don't see a seam, don't just go and then improvise. Cause that's where he ends up trying to knife through three bodies and he smokes a layup. It's like, if you see an opening and you see congestion behind it, beat your man off the dribble, get him stuck on your side or behind you and let the play develop. And there. There are going to be easier opportunities that come from that. I think it's all just part of his. His growth process.
- [43:28]
Podcast Host
I think that young LeBron and Wade comparison is so true. And I was thinking about it just in comparison to someone like Luca, who has never been a superstar athlete, so is forced if he's going to be, you know, a high level player, which he is obviously to play that stop and start, have the change of pace, master all of the sort of nuances of playing offense where when you're Anthony Edwards, you haven't had to until right now, basically you've been able to just be a super athlete and a great shooter and that gets you pretty freaking.
- [43:55]
Basketball Analyst 1
Yes, it does.
- [43:56]
Podcast Host
And, and, and he's also very young and so now he's reaching a point where he, if he wants to take the next step, he's going to have to do those things and I don't doubt he's going.
- [44:04]
Basketball Analyst 1
That's the, that's the fun thing with Anthony Evers. We were literally talking about this last night. Like he's so far from where he's going to be. Like this kid's going to get so much better.
- [44:12]
Podcast Host
It's like he's what, 23.
- [44:13]
Basketball Analyst 1
Played a. Yeah, he played like very much like a ram his head into the brick wall type of game tonight and still had 36. So like there's a, there's, there's just a version of this kid's career that could go to like I, I do not know how good Ant can be, but I do know that he can be the best player in the league. Will he get there? I don't know. But like I, he legitimately has that potential. He's that type of special athlete. That dunk on Looney, there's like a. The dunk he missed, the one he missed on Trace Jackson, Davis, the two hand like back like, like dude that.
- [44:44]
Podcast Host
Was coming from the side.
- [44:45]
Basketball Analyst 1
Oh my God. That like he. We were talking about this last night with respect to like Donovan Mitchell. There's like athletic and then there's transcendently athletic and ants. Just one of those guys. And that just means that any skill development is going to leap him up another level. It's like how did he produce at this playoff level in his playoff career? He's just been a steady 40% three point shooter in his playoff career. Like that because he gets such great lift and separation. Once he adds the methodical processing and all that stuff and all the in between game, it's just gonna. The sky's the limit for him for sure.
- [45:23]
Podcast Host
Let's do one more question and then we'll go over to playback. If the Wolves win game four, do you think Steph will Push himself to come back maybe a little earlier than he should with their season on the line. Obviously you can't get into his brain.
- [45:35]
Basketball Analyst 1
No, you know, if Steph, if, if the Wolves lose game four, I shut Steph down for the season. And the, the reasoning is pretty simple. Like the warriors made it pretty clear to Steph by all indications after they made the Jimmy Butler trade that this was a two year window that they were going to try this year and that they would try again next year. They have the assets at their disposal to make a substantial move this summer to anchor them with even more talent. They can go get a, you know, potentially a guy like a Cam Johnson or they could go get like a, or like a Patrick Williams from Chicago, something like that. Like they can go get a good player that can be useful for this team and, and, and, and, and potentially have more firepower for this setting next year. I think we'll even look, I think we'll even see them look for. I think Cam Johnson is just such an obvious fit because it kind of checks two boxes. It's like the, it's the clear three that they desperately need in terms of just like that rangy athlete that can guard the ball but also that provides like legitimate scoring pop instead of inconsistent role player. Like maybe pods is making a shot today kind of stuff. It's like Cam, Cam's going to average 20 points a game for you.
- [46:42]
Podcast Host
Cam's just a better version of Buddy.
- [46:44]
Basketball Analyst 1
But kind of absolutely great. That's a great point. Look at how useful Buddy's been in this offense.
- [46:48]
Podcast Host
So he's been so good and like that.
- [46:50]
Basketball Analyst 1
That would be the Buddy Heels trajectory from his early career to what he's done for Golden State where like last year, in addition to him just being a guy that was a frustrating player for his entire career. Was it two years ago that he played for Philly or was it last year? I think it was last year. Yeah. The, the series where he steps in for Philly and everyone's like, man, Buddy heel. It's like useless in the playoffs. Like, what does he do? Like? And he's been like legitimately, reliably, good night tonight for them for the last couple of weeks. In a way that's been really important. And so if they can take, take Buddy Healed, which to your point is just literally a lesser player than Cam Johnson in every single way, and turn him into like a core part of their five best players in these lineups, then you can only imagine what a guy like him could do. But the point is if you go down three one, you're not winning game five at Minnesota without Steph. Even if you did, like, he's got to turn around and play again and again and again and go right into the next round. Like, your best case scenario is coming back from down 3:1 and winning in a game seven before you roll up either into the Denver Nuggets will beat you up on the inside or the Oklahoma City Thunder will beat you up on the outside. There's just like, no version of that that, like, Steph is going to be near the peak of his ability, where he needs to be to be good enough to win that, that, that type of stretch of games. And so at that point, you, you, you cut your losses, you let Steph get a good summer rehab, no chance of re injuring that hamstring. We've seen a lot of examples in NBA history of, like, dudes hurting their hamstring and then not being the same, like Devin Booker, like James Harden, like, but a lot of that is like, them trying to come back and play and re injuring it and re injuring it and re injuring it. And so, like, there's a version of this, or STEPH could get 100% recovery and then you're just a better basketball team next year. I do think, and let me ask you this, Jackson, before we move over to playback. Do you think the warriors have done enough to this point? Let's say they lose game four and they lose game five. Do you think the warriors have done enough at this, to this point to justify making a really aggressive trade this summer and going for it next year?
- [48:52]
Podcast Host
I do.
- [48:52]
Basketball Analyst 1
I think so too.
- [48:53]
Podcast Host
I do.
- [48:54]
Basketball Analyst 1
This defense is real.
- [48:56]
Podcast Host
It's so real.
- [48:57]
Basketball Analyst 1
Their defense is real. Steph has proven that he can still reach that level in this postseason. Jimmy Butler has as well. Every time that they've needed him to do so. Yeah, there's, you know, there's. There's just. There's still, like we talked about, the young players, Moody and Pajemski and Trace Jackson, Davis and all those guys getting another year, Quentin Post getting another year. You know, you make another nice move on the margins, you make a bigger trade. This is absolutely a team that has some legitimate chance next year. And so everything has to be a calculated risk. I wouldn't bring Steph back under any circumstances unless it's game six. And like, it's. Unless the series gets pushed to game six. That's the only scenario where I would consider it. All right, guys, that's all we have for tonight as far as YouTube goes. We're going to be heading over to Playback again. That's Playback TV Hoops Tonight. You can also find it in the description. We'll hang out for another 45 minutes or so. We'll take callers, we'll just kind of hang out and talk hoops for a little bit longer. What's up guys? As always, I appreciate you for listening to and supporting Hoops Tonight. It would actually be really helpful for us if you guys would take a second and leave a rating and a review. As always, I appreciate you guys supporting us, but if you could take a minute to do that, I'd really appreciate it.
- [50:03]
Basketball Analyst 2
The Volume.
- [50:07]
Basketball Analyst 1
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- [50:36]
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- [51:04]
Basketball Analyst 2
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- [51:33]
Brand Representative 4
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- [52:04]
Podcast Host
You're listening to an iHeart podcast.