← The Herd with Colin Cowherd
The Herd with Colin Cowherd
Warriors Offseason Reaction: Jonathan Kuminga questions, Al Horford rumors, how to help Steph Curry
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Podcast Host
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Sports Analyst
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Greg Rosenthal
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Sports Analyst
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That's code Hoops for new customers to get $150 in bonus bets instantly. When you bet just five bucks only on DraftKings, the crown is yours. Gambling problem. Call 1-800-Gambler in New York, call 877-8-Hopeny or text Hopeny to 467-369 in Connecticut. Help is available for problem gambling. Call 888-789-7777 or visit ccpg.org Please play responsibly on behalf of Boot Hill Casino and Resort in Kansas. 21 plus. Age and eligibility varies by jurisdiction. Void. In Ontario, bonus bets expire seven days after issuance. For additional terms and responsible gaming resources, see DKNG CO Audio. All right, welcome to Hoops Tonight here at the Volume. Happy Monday everybody. Hope all of you guys had an incredible, incredible weekend. Got a jam packed show for you guys today. We're hitting a couple of big storylines from around the NBA. I want to start with the Golden State Warriors. We haven't actually talked about them yet this off season because they've had a very uneventful off season to this point. But there are a couple of things that are hanging over them. A potential center signing that we will discuss as well as the Jonathan Kaminga situation. Just how we got here. Some of my frustrations just from afar watching this whole situation and what could potentially come good from that situation. So some warriors talk off the top after that. We've had extensive reporting from around the league that Bradley Beal might reach a buyout with the Phoenix Suns today. So I want to talk about what Bradley Beal season looked like, two seasons looked like in Phoenix, some of the realities about his game, how it didn't work there, and what types of teams make sense for him to go to moving forward, including a trade that took place this morning that I think opens the door for an obvious Bradley Beal destination. So lots of stuff to get into today. You guys know the drill before we get started, subscribe to the Hoops Tonight YouTube channel so you don't miss any more of our videos. Follow me on Twitter at_jason lt so you guys don't miss show announcements. Don't forget about our podcast fee wherever. Get your podcasts on our Hoops Tonight. It's also super helpful if you leave a rating and a review on that front, don't forget about our social media feeds on Twitter, Instagram, Facebook and TikTok where Jackson is doing great work. And then last but not least, keep dropping mailbag questions. We're doing our mailbags out of the YouTube comments now that we're out of our live shows. So all you got to do is in the YouTube comments, put mailbag with a colon, write your question and once a week throughout the off season we will be hitting your guys's mailbag questions from those comments. All right, let's talk some basketball. So this is the extent of the Golden State warriors off season so far. They got into the Kevin Durant trade as one of the seven teams and acquired the draft rights to a couple of late second round guys. They lost Kevon Looney, who signed a deal with the New Orleans Pelicans, and they're letting Gary Payton II go, although he hasn't signed elsewhere yet. But that's it. So not an ideal summer yet for a Warriors team that just loaded up with Jimmy Butler. It could really use an upgrade in the form of a perimeter scoring threat. I've been fixated on this for a while. Those of you guys who have been listening to the show. This is something I've been specifically shining a light on over the course of the last few seasons. Because even though the Jimmy Butler trade addressed a myriad of issues and I still think it's a resounding success, the Jimmy Butler trade, and it definitely vaulted Golden State into that second tier of contention. But what Jimmy did not do is demonstrate reliable scoring. He was basically just as likely to fail to score 15 points as he was to score 25 points as a member of the warriors to end last season. Again, I still view the trade as a massive success because of all of the other things that Jimmy Butler brings, including his playmaking on both ends of the four, as a defensive playmaker alongside Draymond, and as a guy that create advantages on the offensive end, his connective passing playing off of Steph. There are a million things that Jimmy has done well that have made the warriors better. But there's still a hole on this team in the form of that reliable perimeter scoring. Another stat to drive this home. When they got reliable perimeter scoring last year off of Steph, they won. When Buddy Heald scored over 20 points last year, they were undefeated. When he scored at least 18 points, they were 16 2. And all those numbers include playoff games. By the way, this is why I spent so much of the year last year talking about a guy like Cam Johnson, who obviously is a Denver nugget now, but there's a reason why I was fixated on that type of player. We saw that for years with Klay Thompson playing off of Steph, and we've seen it at spurts when different guys like Buddy Heald or Brandon Pajemski or whoever it was who was playing off of Steph at that second perimeter guard when that guy went off, they were very difficult to beat. That isn't to say that they can't contend as currently constructed with Jimmy Butler. They certainly can. But it's what separates them from that first tier to take that leap from being a team that can win the title if everything's go, if everything goes right versus we are one of the apex predators in the NBA and they just haven't been able to address that yet. But there are a couple of things that are hanging around out there that could potentially turn things around for them. First of all, this Mark Stein report. Mark Stein reports that he believes Horford will sign with the Golden State Warriors. I continue to hear this is the exact quote from his substack. And by the way, if you're an NBA fan, I highly recommend Mark Stein's substack. He just does such great work with like quick, concise reads on the goings on around the NBA. It's a great way to stay in the loop on that front. But the specific quote from Mark Stein's substack was quote I continue to hear that Horford is dead destined to land in the Bay Area. That's pretty strong wording there from a respectable reporter and Mark Stein. So I think Horford would be a great get for Golden State. Golden State has been wanting a stretch five that can defend for a while. Couple reasons they want to play Draymond at the four More in the regular season to save wear and tear on his body. And they want to have a too big look for certain playoff matchups. And the problem that they've had with centers that they've tried over the years is either they can't shoot which causes problems for them in the form of the top block and funnel scheme that everyone's been running against them. Basically, if you have Draymond out there with another non shooting big, the opponent's just going to put their two best, like vertical, vertical rim protecting threats in the paint. They're going to try to top lock all the perimeter players. That forces them to back cut into all that size and it can cause issues for them in the half court offensively. So when they've had centers that can't shoot, that has caused it. Whether it's, you know, Trace Jackson, Davis or it's Kevon Looney, whoever it's been over the years that has resulted in their offense stalling out in the half court. Or they can shoot guys like Quentin Post, but that don't bring the level of defensive versatility and upside that they need from that position group. Horford is a natural on those two fronts. Even in old age, he's still a pretty useful switch defender. He's good at just like kind of changing his pickup point based on where he trusts his length to contest a pull up shot or how much he views the pull up shot as a threat. He's very good at anticipating which direction a guy's gonna go and taking a good angle to cut him off and beat him to his spot. He's a particularly very high IQ defender, which is something I'm very excited about because I would argue that's half of the genius when it comes to Draymond and Jimmy in the. In the work they do defensively is just the way they communicate, the way that they can kind of like anticipate what's going to happen in terms of what the offense is running and the types of looks they're trying to get out of that action. They're just kind of like a step ahead because of their defensive iq and they can blow plays up that way. I'm legitimately excited to watch Al Horford. If Al Horford ends up signing with Golden State to watch some units with Jimmy Draymond and Al out there together just being this big, switchable, super smart defensive front line. And then Horford also brings the ability to reliably shoot the ball from above the break. And that unlocks all sorts of spacing upsides. Again, there's a huge difference between above the break spacing and corner spacing. When it comes to bigs, the corner is a shorter closeout and it leaves the big man in a more traditional help side position right underneath the basket. So if you beat your man off the dribble, you're running into a center. But if you have a center that can space the floor out above the break and you can put smaller players in the dunker spot, smaller players cutting smaller players in the corner, that puts those smaller defenders at the rim. It inverts defensive spacing and puts rim protectors out on the perimeter to deal with Horford. Whatever bigger player you're putting there, you can stash him further away from the basket. That is the upside of having a shooting five in that lineup. It allows for some more conducive spacing to score the ball. So to put it simply, Horford would give the warriors the look. They haven't had a too big look, a reliable too big look for a postseason setting. And it would make them a deeper, better, more versatile basketball team throughout the regular season. Now, that perimeter scoring role would be harder to come by. They basically look, they, they have to look to facilitate that type of move via a Jonathan Kaminga sign in trade. If you look at their payroll right now, you've got these big contracts at the top and Draymond, Jimmy and Steph, none of which you're willing to trade. And then there's this Moses Moody contract in there. That's a kind of middling salary that at this point. Moses Moody is, is a very important player for you. He's your starting point of attack defender at this point in time. And so you don't want to send him out unless you're getting somebody back who can start in his position group. And frankly, his salary is not big enough to be able to pull back that type of player right now. But Jonathan Kaminga could potentially be that vehicle. He could be the vehicle through a sign in trade that gets you back some of the salaries that you need to potentially move for that type of perimeter score. And the warriors are actually sitting pretty in terms of their draft compensation that they have available to them. If I'm not mistaken, I believe they have all of their first round picks available except for the 2030 first round pick. So they can get some tradable salaries. They're positioned well for something that could be there down the line. But before we get to that, I do want to take a minute to just look at the absurdity of this particular situation with Jonathan Kaminga. It's hard to find options for Jonathan Kaminga side in trade. Kaminga has not shown the ability to do anything reliably well at the NBA level. He can score the ball, but he's an iffy decision maker and he's super inconsistent as a shot shot maker off the ball. He's a poor three point shooter and a poor closeout attacker. That puts him at slightly below average as a spot up player this year. He's an okay rebounder, but not exceptionally so considering his tools on defense. He has some utility on the ball, but he's not an elite on ball defender and he's pretty bad off the ball in terms of his attentiveness. The tools are there, but none of it has come to fruition in a real and consistent way. This has been the great miscalculation of Golden State's management of the end of Steph's career. The warriors should have traded Jonathan Kaminga in the summer right after the 2023 season when they were eliminated by the Lakers. At that point we had two years of evidence that Jonathan Kaminga absolutely had some potential but was not a franchise altering foundational future, top tier superstar type of talent. He clearly had fringe all star potential and I, I still believe he does. Like if you told me Jonathan Kaminga made one or two all star teams in his career, I would not be surprised. But it seemed like fringe all star was a ceiling and it seemed to be at least five years away where he would need to go refine his skills over years and years. And again, he was very clearly not the untouchable franchise foundation that would guide the Golden State warriors into a new era. And most importantly and most damagingly, his attitude and his skill set did not mesh with what the warriors were trying to do in the short term at that point. In 2023, Jonathan Kaminga had two years left on his rookie deal. He was a very positive asset. You didn't have to do much to match his salary. You could make a move for him and evaluate him in your system for two years before signing him to a rookie extension. The warriors could have legitimately moved him for a guy like a Pascal Siakam or an OG Anunoby, guys that were that immediately vaulted their respective new teams into deep playoff runs. But they didn't. Joe Laka was unwilling to admit that Kaminga was not that franchise altering star. So he clung to him in hopes of his development panning out. And now here we are. Jonathan Kaminga is a very different asset now. He's due a new deal, he wants a lot of money and so now a team has to be willing to pay him a large salary without actually knowing what he would look like in their system. That makes him very high risk relative to 2023. If you make a move for him in 2023 as a new, as a team, you get to see what he looks like for two years and then make that sort of decision at that point in time. Any team that makes a sign and trade for Kaminga now is going to take on a good amount of risk in the form of a large salary in a theoretical basketball player. So now he's suddenly a substantially lower value asset and the warriors need to turn him into something valuable and that's going to be difficult to do. And to make matters worse, it's just a brutal off season market for restricted free agents. I would argue Quentin Grimes has more utility in the short term for an NBA team than Jonathan Kaminga because he's such a good shooter and he's actually a pretty good point of attack defender in that role. Kamingo will be a better player than Quentin Grimes in the long run, but in the short term, Quentin's better and more useful and he hasn't been able to find a deal yet. And so now the warriors are in a holding pattern, just waiting for something to materialize. And it feels like their best bet now is just to get some middle range salaries back that they might be able to package with some draft compensation for that wing score archetype that we talked about earlier on that front. Let's pretend that the warriors pull that off. They end up getting some middling salaries back. Obviously there are some pipe dream targets out there. Giannis, antenna Kumpo, for example, LeBron James, potentially. Devin Booker is another guy that could potentially come onto the market within the next year or two. But those guys are pipe dreams and it just, it just, I think it's a waste of time to plan your future around that sort of thing. You want to be positioned for it, but it's, it's not, it's not something you can be planning your entire future around. Especially when you look at the realities of Steph and how old he is and the very, very short window you have to operate there. So what are some other guys, some other guys around the league that could potentially come available over the course of the year that can score the basketball effectively and efficiently and consistently in Golden State system? And so I put together just a short list out of Boston guys like Derek White or Anthony Simons, Those are guys that potentially come available over the course of the year that I, I think both of them would be fantastic in Golden State system. Offensively, Tyler Harrow, if the Miami Heat fall apart, Tyler Harrow, if he's your lead perimeter shot creator, going to be a problem if he's playing off of Steph. I bet you he's very, very impactful. If things go south with the Mime heat, Norman Powell is a guy that you could potentially look at. There's also some potential there for a sign in trade considering Miami could be interested in a guy like Jonathan Kaminga, Trey Murphy out of New Orleans, CJ McCollum or Chris Middleton out of Washington. Those are obviously discounted options. Those are veteran older options, but I think both Khris Middleton or CJ McCollum would be good basketball players in Golden State system. Emmanuel Quickley out of Toronto is a guy to keep an eye on. These are all guys that I think would kick ass alongside Steph in Golden State system. But in order to pull that off, you've got to get some easily tradable salaries back from that coming assignment trade to pull something like that off. There's something special about folks who come through without being asked. Like your coworker surprising you with your favorite coffee just because. Or your friend handing you the ox cord the moment you in the car. No debate, no fight, just positive vibes. That kind of love. It just hits different and that's exactly the energy AT&T is on with their new guarantee. If there's ever a network interruption, AT AND T will proactively credit you for a full day of service. No calls, no emails, no jumping through hoops. 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- [22:03]
Greg Rosenthal
Players before training camp kickstarts a new NFL season, NFL Daily is going to look back. It is a special six episode series where myself, Greg Rosenthal and some of the top NFL minds like Kevin Harlan, Mina Kimes and Bill Barnwell make the case. For each player, we're taking a look back, giving you NFL Daily's top 25 players of the last 25 years. So who made the list? You know Tom Brady's on it. Where's Patrick Mahomes?
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Sports Analyst
Kansas City. He's on it.
- [22:36]
Greg Rosenthal
How about Lamar Jackson?
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Narrator
Jackson takes it himself. Look at him dart back and forth.
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Sports Analyst
Oh, he broke his ankles. And he's got a touchdown. He is Houdini.
- [22:46]
Greg Rosenthal
You are gonna have to listen. To find out, listen to NFL Daily's top 25 players of the last 25 years, starting on June 30 on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.
- [23:01]
Narrator
I know a lot of cops and they get asked all the time, have you ever had to shoot your gun? Sometimes the answer is yes. But there's a company dedicated to a future where the answer will always be no.
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Sports Analyst
Across the country, cops called this Taser the revolution.
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Sports Analyst
Cops believed everything that Taser told them.
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Advertiser
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Sports Analyst
It's really, really, really bad.
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Narrator
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Dr. Leitra Tate
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- [25:13]
Sports Analyst
All right, let's move on to the Bradley Beal Saga. So all the reporting is that Bradley Beal is potentially going to reach a buyout with the Phoenix Suns as soon as today. So obviously we'll keep an eye on that over the next couple of days. It's been reported that he's canvassing the league looking for potential options. So what kind of team makes sense for Bradley Beal to join? I thought most of the issue for Bradley in Phoenix had to do with redundancy. His strengths lined up with the things the Suns were already great at, and his weaknesses lined up with the things Phoenix actually needed him to be good at. If you take a look at the numbers, they weren't bad. Availability was an issue. He only played 53 games in each season, but his production was there. 18 points per game as a third option. That's fine. 51% from the field, 41% from 3, 81% from the line over the two years. That's 60% true shooting. He was very efficient. He shot 43% on unguarded catch and shoot jumpers. He was a knockdown catch and shoot guy. He shot 43% on pull up jump shots. So he had the ability to hit shots off the bounce. He was efficient at the rim. 66% overall according to Synergy, 64% on layups. The volume wasn't there, but a lot of that had to do with usage as well. But it was still fine and he was efficient when he got there. His shot creation was fine. He was a 62nd percentile pick and roll creator according to Synergy. A 72nd percentile ISO creator according to Synergy. He was up over a point per possession, 1.01 points per possession in ISO including passes. That's a really solid number. And yet in both years the Suns were actually a better team. When he was off the floor versus one he was on, they are 1.4 points better per 100 possessions when he was off the first year, 7.1 points per 100 possessions better without him last year. Why is that? Because Bradley Beal over the years in Washington had built out the habits that many lead guards in NBA history have built out. He was a capable defender. You can make some plays, but he wasn't used to the incredible possession to possession, attention to detail that you need from a role player guard whose job it is to do those things. When I would watch Phoenix tape, Bradley Beal was often the culprit in their defensive issues. He'd ball watch and get back cut or he lose a shooter off the ball or he'd give up an offensive rebound or he'd miss a rotation. He'd have good reps on the ball because he's such a good athlete. But it wasn't consistent there. Possession to possession. And on a team that couldn't rebound and couldn't protect the rim, that was a problem. There wasn't the requisite athleticism behind him to clean up those mistakes. Now it's typical for a basketball team to have on the team on the floor some guys that aren't necessarily great with dirty work, that's somewhat normal, but usually the other three guys or four guys or two guys, however many it is on the floor, usually those guys are professional dirty work players. And Bradley Beal just added another guy who could handle a lot of offensive responsibility, except for he wasn't getting the ball all that much. And it just meant one less guy on the floor who specializes in dirty work. And then Phoenix exacerbated the issue by bringing Tyus Jones into the mix. And it was just too much for those guys to overcome. Tyus Jones, Bradley Veal, Kevin Durant and Devin Booker. That foursome literally had a negative net rating last year for the Phoenix Suns. For Phoenix, this is actually a big part of why I could see them being a more feisty, tougher regular season team to play against. They'll now field a team with some professional dirty work guys like Dylan Brooks, like Ryan Dunn, with a substantially better center rotation. Now Devin Booker and Jalen Green don't represent the best core of shot creators in the world, but that team should be more balanced. That doesn't mean they're going to go win a playoff series or anything, but on the nights when Jalen Green plays well, the Suns are going to be a pain in the ass to beat because of that balance finally being restored. So with Bradley Beal soon to be a free agent, what kind of team makes sense for him? So this would be a team that doesn't need him to be a primary point of attack defender that has the rim protection and rebounding to make up for some of his off ball lapses and that could actually make use of his high volume ball handling. There are actually a few teams that make sense here, but we got to start with the obvious one. We had a trade this morning. The Jazz, the Clippers and the Heat engaged in a three team deal. Sends Norman Powell to Miami. They've been in desperate need of some reliable scoring punch off of Tyler Harrow. Norm is a really nice option for them there. Kevin Love and Kyle Anderson in a second round pick to the Utah Jazz. And then John Collins to the Clippers and suddenly with Norman Powell's exit a gaping hole in that scoring guard spot next to James Harden. So now the Clippers suddenly make a ton of sense as a Bradley Beal team. They have plenty of interior size and rebounding and rim protection that can cover for some of Bradley Beals off ball mistakes. They're suddenly like very deep. They have an excellent power forward center rotation now even in bench groups. If Bradley Beals playing with bench groups, Brook Lopez can help in that specific way. And now they're really light on ball handling. You have Kawhi Leonard who played 37 games last year, and James Harden. Bradley Beal is almost the perfect type of player for this situation because when Kawhi is out of the lineup, which he's obviously going to be at minimum for 20, probably 30 or 35 games this year, Beal can scale up his usage and basically play as the secondary ball handler off of James Harden. And then when Kawhi is healthy, the Clippers can benefit from all of the offensive stuff we talked about earlier. Again, offense wasn't the issue with Brad in Phoenix. I read you guys the number. He was a 50, 40, 80 guy. He was efficient, driving closeouts in spot up situations. When he put the ball on the floor to run action, he was fine. Offense wasn't the issue in Phoenix. He will be able to help the Clippers in that way, but at the same time they have the size and the rebounding and the rim protection to cover for him. And when Kawhi Leonard steps out of the lineup, he can step into that featured role on the ball and do an admiral job of that. In other words, they could benefit from Bradley Beal's strengths and they can withstand his weaknesses. So I think the Clippers make a ton of sense. They don't need him to guard the other team's best player. Chris Dunn And Derek Jones Jr. Can do that. And frankly, given Kawhi's injury history, it doesn't make any sense for the Clippers to move Norman Powell unless they know Bradley Beal is coming. So I'm guessing this ends up happening sooner than later. But again, it's not confirmed yet. Other teams that have been brought up that I've, I've heard talk about Miami, but obviously that doesn't make a ton of sense. Now that they have Norman Powell, we're looking at big physical teams that need ball handling. Orlando makes some sense. Houston makes some sense. Like Bradley Beal next to Katie in Houston makes some sense in a way that didn't back in Phoenix. Boston could use some shot creation. They don't have the means with which to make up for Bradley Beals weaknesses, but they don't really have championship goals at this point. Of more would just be bringing him into the system and seeing how the fit works. Milwaukee, this is another one that I've been thinking about a lot this morning. It'd be a tough sell for Beal. I don't think they can offer him as much money, but this is a team in Milwaukee that desperately needs his ball handling. Like he could literally step in the front door and be in the Damian Lillard role. He could walk right in as the lead shot creator off of Giannis. And Brad's in a similar situation to what we talked about with deandre Ayton where, you know, he's a guy who puts up big numbers and has kind of some of some splash surrounding his name. But there's obvious impact metrics that kind of undercut his value over the last couple of years, which again, I think a good amount of that has to do with fit. But the reality is those numbers exist. And so Beals kind of a distressed asset at this point going into a place in Milwaukee where he'd have a very good chance to make a conference finals run at minimum, if not a finals run, to play alongside one of the best players in the league in a feature Day one, I'm leading this team from the perimeter. Type of Role like that makes a lot of sense to me in Milwaukee. I haven't heard buzz there, but that. That I would argue if I was Bradley Beal, I'd ra. I'd rather go play in Milwaukee than playing Los Angeles with the Clippers. Substantially tougher conference like Bradley Beal goes to the Clippers, there's still a just as likely chance is not that they get eliminated in the first round. Again, you look at the top of the west if, if it ends up being a Oklahoma City and a Houston and a Denver. If you fall to six, seven or eight, you're going to be an underdog in the first round. So like I look at Milwaukee as a really, really seamless option for Brad. I don't know. I don't know if he'll seriously consider it again. I just don't think you make the Norman Powell deal if you're the Clippers unless you feel like Bradley's coming. So I, I would be shocked if he doesn't end up with the Clippers at this point. But Milwaukee makes a lot of sense for me as well, all right, guys, that's all we have for today. As always, we sincerely appreciate you guys for supporting us and supporting the show. We'll be back tomorrow. We're going to do a mailbag as well as a We're going to cover my top five biggest takeaways from last year's season, which we do every year. So we'll see you guys tomorrow and then obviously we have a fun weekend planned for summer league. We'll see you guys then. What's up guys? As always, I appreciate you for listening to and supporting Hoops tonight. It would actually be really helpful for us if you guys would take a second and leave a rating and a review. As always, I appreciate you guys supporting us, but if you could take a minute to do that, I'd really appreciate it.
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I get right back there and it's bad.
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Podcast Host
Welcome to Pretty Private with ebony, the podcast where silence is broken and stories are set free. Free. I'm ebony, and every Tuesday I'll be sharing all new anonymous stories that would challenge your perceptions and give you new insight on the people around you. Every Tuesday, make sure you listen to Pretty Private from the Black Effect Podcast Network. Tune in on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to your favorite shows. This is an iHeart podcast.