Hour 2 - Aaron Rodgers created his own problems in New York, Albert Breer

Summary

The Herd with Colin Cowherd - Episode: Hour 2 - Aaron Rodgers Created His Own Problems in New York

Release Date: June 19, 2025
Hosts: Colin Cowherd, Joy Taylor
Guest: Albert Breer

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1. Introduction and Early Conversations

The episode begins with Colin Cowherd briefly mentioning receiving insider information about JJ McCarthy, a topic both he and Joy Taylor hint at without delving into specifics. This sets the stage for the day's primary discussions.

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2. Aaron Rodgers’ Tenure with the New York Jets

Colin Cowherd opens the discussion by criticizing Aaron Rodgers' decision to join the New York Jets, suggesting that Rodgers has exacerbated existing problems within the organization.

Colin Cowherd [02:30]: "Aaron is smart, talented, but the Jets have been dysfunctional for a decade and a half. You chose him, then you chose Nathaniel Hackett—and look where that led us."

Joy Taylor concurs, emphasizing that Rodgers' influence has permeated the locker room negatively.

Joy Taylor [02:50]: "Aaron led the league in non-football distractions, seeping into the locker room awareness."

Albert Breer, joining live, provides a balanced perspective. He acknowledges Rodgers' challenges but highlights his rapport with Steelers' coach Arthur Smith and the established culture in Pittsburgh.

Albert Breer [05:35]: "Aaron has built a good rapport with Arthur Smith and has been diligent in staying in touch, which is fostering a positive environment in Pittsburgh."

Breer contrasts Rodgers' situation in New York with the Steelers', suggesting that Pittsburgh offers a more stable and supportive framework for Rodgers to focus solely on playing quarterback.

Albert Breer [06:10]: "The Steelers are asking him to just be the quarterback, not to lift every other part of the organization."

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3. J.J. McCarthy and the Minnesota Vikings’ Quarterback Dilemma

Shifting focus, Colin Cowherd raises concerns about JJ McCarthy's development and readiness compared to other quarterbacks like Bo Nix and Jaden Daniels.

Colin Cowherd [10:34]: "JJ McCarthy is not Bo Nix or Jaden Daniels. He’s still a work in progress."

Albert Breer responds by highlighting the differences in experience and the Vikings’ strategy of building around a young quarterback.

Albert Breer [11:22]: "The Vikings drafted JJ McCarthy with the plan to develop him as a reliable starter, not necessarily to make him a Mahomes overnight."

Breer emphasizes that the Vikings' focus is on consistency and long-term development, rather than immediate superstar performance.

Albert Breer [12:05]: "They don’t need JJ to be Patrick Mahomes right away. They need him to keep the train on the tracks."

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4. Potential NFL Team Sales and Ownership Changes

Colin Cowherd inquires about the possibility of NFL teams being sold, drawing parallels with recent sales in the NBA.

Colin Cowherd [13:27]: "Is there an NFL team that’s looking to be sold like the Lakers or Celtics?"

Albert Breer speculates that while outright sales are rare, partial ownership changes are more likely, citing the recent sale of the Seattle Seahawks and the Las Vegas Raiders.

Albert Breer [14:03]: "Seattle might be the most likely candidate for a sale, but overall, it's more common to see pieces of teams being sold rather than whole franchises."

He points out that financial pressures and the high valuations of NFL teams make full sales challenging, but partial sales or ownership stakes could increase.

Albert Breer [14:30]: "With valuations skyrocketing, especially in markets like the Pacific Northwest, partial sales or bringing in new investors seem more probable."

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5. New York Knicks’ Search for a Head Coach

The conversation shifts to the New York Knicks’ recent decision to fire Tom Thibodeau and their search for a new head coach.

Joy Taylor [21:22]: "The Knicks are looking at Mike Brown as the favorite candidate, followed by Taylor Jenkins and Johnny Bryant."

Colin Cowherd expresses a preference for Mike Malone, praising him as a top-tier coach.

Colin Cowherd [23:10]: "Mike Malone is an excellent coach. They need someone with a strong vision and plan, and I think Malone fits that bill perfectly."

Joy Taylor brings up concerns about Mike Malone's previous tenure in Denver, where he reportedly clashed with the front office over player development.

Joy Taylor [23:42]: "He feuded with the Denver front office because he wanted to ride veterans instead of focusing on young players."

Colin Cowherd counters by emphasizing the Knicks' need for a coach who can lead effectively without being overly influenced by ownership whims.

Colin Cowherd [24:28]: "We need a great coach, not someone who just complies with ownership. Malone is among the top coaches in the league."

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6. Detroit Lions’ Jared Goff and Team Performance

Joy Taylor brings up the Detroit Lions' quarterback Jared Goff and the skepticism surrounding his ability to lead the team to success.

Joy Taylor [25:03]: "The Lions have too much talent not to bounce back, but can they make a Super Bowl run with Goff?"

Colin Cowherd argues that Goff's immobility and the Lions' offensive line issues may hinder their championship aspirations.

Colin Cowherd [26:36]: "Goff isn't a mobile quarterback, and with the O-line struggles, it puts additional pressure on him to perform."

Joy Taylor notes that despite Goff having a career year, defensive vulnerabilities remain a concern.

Joy Taylor [26:48]: "Goff had 37 touchdowns last year and a career-best QBR, but the defense was wide open and inconsistent."

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7. San Francisco 49ers’ Defensive Strategy

The discussion moves to the San Francisco 49ers and their recent hiring of former Defensive Coordinator Robert Sala.

Joy Taylor [27:34]: "The 49ers brought back Robert Sala to overhaul their defense after a poor showing last season."

George Kittle, a key player for the 49ers, is quoted expressing enthusiasm for Sala's return and the upcoming season.

George Kittle [28:09]: "He's really good at his job and is getting the players fired up. Violence is coming."

Colin Cowherd supports Sala’s capabilities, suggesting that consistency in coaching staff is crucial for defensive improvement.

Colin Cowherd [28:30]: "Sala is an excellent defensive coach and deserves a second chance. His return is a positive sign for the 49ers' defense."

Joy Taylor predicts that the 49ers will be the number one seed in the NFC and contemplates their Super Bowl potential.

Joy Taylor [29:01]: "The 49ers will likely be the top seed in the NFC, but whether they can win the Super Bowl remains to be seen."

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8. Additional Sports Highlights

Towards the end of the episode, Colin and Joy touch upon various other sports topics:

• Los Angeles Lakers and Boston Celtics Sale: Discussion on the high valuations and potential ownership changes, with a focus on the Lakers' $10 billion sale connected to a massive TV deal.

  Colin Cowherd [34:43]: "The Lakers sold for $10 billion largely due to their 11-year $76 billion TV deal, reflecting the immense value of NBA franchises."

• Los Angeles Dodgers Attendance: Highlighting the Dodgers surpassing 2 million in fan attendance, attributing success to players like Shohei Ohtani.

  Colin Cowherd [37:54]: "The Dodgers' 14th sellout is the Ohtani factor—turning regular games into major events."

• WNBA’s Caitlin Clark Effect: Comparing Caitlin Clark’s impact on attendance and game significance to that of high-profile athletes in other leagues.

  Colin Cowherd [40:07]: "Caitlin Clark’s presence transforms WNBA games into major events, similar to how Ohtani elevates Dodgers games."

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9. Closing Remarks

The episode concludes with light-hearted banter between Colin and Joy, touching on personal anecdotes and teasing future discussions.

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Notable Quotes with Timestamps

• Colin Cowherd [02:30]: "Aaron is smart, talented, but the Jets have been dysfunctional for a decade and a half. You chose him, then you chose Nathaniel Hackett—and look where that led us."

• Albert Breer [05:35]: "Aaron has built a good rapport with Arthur Smith and has been diligent in staying in touch, which is fostering a positive environment in Pittsburgh."

• Joy Taylor [23:42]: "He feuded with the Denver front office because he wanted to ride veterans instead of focusing on young players."

• George Kittle [28:09]: "He's really good at his job and is getting the players fired up. Violence is coming."

• Albert Breer [14:30]: "With valuations skyrocketing, especially in markets like the Pacific Northwest, partial sales or bringing in new investors seem more probable."

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Conclusion

In this episode of The Herd with Colin Cowherd, the hosts delve deep into the complexities surrounding Aaron Rodgers' stint with the Jets and his subsequent move to the Steelers. They explore the broader implications of team dynamics, ownership, and coaching decisions within the NFL. Additionally, the discussion extends to other sports leagues, highlighting significant ownership changes and the impact of star players on team attendance and performance. The insights provided by guest Albert Breer add depth to the analysis, offering listeners a comprehensive understanding of the current sports landscape.

Transcript

[Colin Cowherd]

This is an iHeart podcast. Thanks for listening to the Herd podcast. Be sure to catch us live every weekday on Fox Sports Radio and noon to 3 Eastern, 9am to noon Pacific. Find your local station for the [e-mail] or stream us live every day on the iHeartRadio app by searching Fox Sports Radio or FSR. Thanks for listening to the Herd podcast. Here we go, hour two. All fired up lies. It is the Herd. Wherever you may be and however you may be listening. Thanks for making us part of your day. I got last night J. Mac somebody I'm not gonna get into names.

[Joy Taylor]

Oh, okay.

[Colin Cowherd]

But it's somebody I implicitly trust, has been a very good source for me. They, they used your name. They said, oh, I, I got, I got some news for you on JJ McCarthy and I don't think J. Mac's gonna love it.

[Joy Taylor]

Okay.

[Colin Cowherd]

So I'm just telling you.

[Joy Taylor]

No, no, I, I know, I, I think I know what you're talking about. I, I, I heard from somebody something similar after I went on my rant. You know, Minnesota Vikings fans loved it. And then other people were like, j Max, slow down. Here's what's not out there that you need to know. And I was like, all right, fine. I heard about it.

[Colin Cowherd]

All right? I'm just Ian J. Mac. I'd get ready for a fourth place. Isn't the worst place in the world, let's say. Come on.

[Joy Taylor]

Listen, he, if he plays and delivers, it's no big deal. But I do like how people are hitting you up and referencing me, man.

[Colin Cowherd]

Wow.

[Joy Taylor]

I've really come a long way.

[Colin Cowherd]

It was a reference that you were annoying. So it wasn't the greatest reference. Okay, so I want to say this. So according to this is good. Mark Schlerith, who's at FS1, obviously, and he is, he is friends with Rogers for the time being that could, you know, who knows? The four time mvp according to Mark Slearith often went on a diatribe with issues with the jets organization. And Mark said Aaron and I had a conversation when he was with the jets about how abysmal their running game was and how schematically it made no sense. And Mark started the conversation and he said Aaron went on for about a 25 minute diet drive just on their run game. So I've said this about Aaron Rodgers and Kevin Durant. Love their talent, don't love their choices. So for Aaron to be upset with the jets run game and dysfunction, bro, you brought Nat Hackett there. The jets have a 14 year playoff drought. Longest in North American sports, Canada, US, every league. And in December, Aaron Rodgers had a quote. This is not me saying it. This is Aaron Rodgers. He says I didn't do myself any favors with the girls I've dated. Okay, that's his opinion. I'm not saying that. Okay, so my, my take is this goes to the heart of what I've said about Aaron. I'm not saying he's not smart and I'm not saying he's not talented like kd. I don't love his decision making. The jets have been dysfunctional for a decade and a half. You chose him. Robert Sala was on the hot seat. You chose him. Nat Hackett was a disaster in Denver. You chose him. You can't blame anybody. And I've argued this the reason Pittsburgh's not a great fit. And I'm serious. You think the jets are dysfunctional. The Steelers aren't organizationally dysfunctional, but the Steelers are offensively dysfunctional and have been since Big Ben's last couple years. They can't get the offensive line right. Najee Harris got traded and said they've got no plan offensively. So, you know, it's, it's just with Aaron, I know he's smart, I know he's talented, but there are times he just lacks an awareness. That feels so obvious to me for a smart guy. Remember when he said this during the season for the Jets? Remember this?

[Albert Breer]

Anything that doesn't have anything to do with winning needs to be assessed. If you want to be a winning organization and to put yourself in position to win championships and be competitive, everything that you do matters. And the bull that has nothing to do with winning needs to get out of the building.

[Colin Cowherd]

I agree. Unfortunately, many of the dramas in the building were created and teammates asked about it, induced by Aaron having a weekly hit on a TV show. That was part of it. So Aaron led the league as a quarterback in non football stuff, seeping into the locker room awareness. I, I, I, I. That's why I said I would retire before I go to the Steelers. They're dysfunctional. Not organizationally, not defensively, but offensively, they're dysfunctional. How many ocs can we have? Musical chairs, offensive line, Just my take. Albert Brewer is now joining us live Monday morning. Quarterback, let's just talk. And again, I don't, I don't like being always knocking Aaron. That's why I always say, I said it's with KD. I can love your game, not love your choices. LeBron, I love both. Brady, I Love both. Peyton Manning. I love both the choice thing. So let's just talk the first couple of weeks. Aaron in the building with the Steelers. What are you hearing?

[Albert Breer]

Really good. He's got a good rapport with Arthur Smith, which really was built up since March. He's been in touch with Smith and Mike Tomlin really pretty consistently throughout. Now. They didn't have scheduled check ins, but Aaron was diligent about staying in touch with them and they were building an offense for him. And you know, Arthur Smith had connections to two of them. Of Aaron Rodgers last three play callers, both Matt LaFleur and Todd Downing worked with Arthur Smith over the years in Tennessee. So he had relationships he could pull on there. So it's easy to say it in June. Right, like, but so far so good. And I do think that there's a little bit of a nuance here. Colin, just to jump in on what you said before I came on there, which, like. And I think this is kind of why Aaron picked the Steelers over the Giants in the first place. When he went to the Jets, I think he was being asked to lift all boats and I think he probably felt like he could do it right. You had a really talented core of young players there, guys like Breeze hall and Garrett Wilson and Sauce Gardner and Quinn and Williams and Jermaine Johnson and Holu Fashanu coming in last year. And the idea was Aaron's going to come in and he's going to push these guys over the edge and we're going to become a winner because of Aaron. I think the Giants would have been asking him to do the same thing with their core guys like Dexter Lawrence and Brian Burns, guys who hadn't won before. Andrew Thomas, Malik neighbors coming in. That's not what the Steelers are asking. The Steelers are asking him to jump on a moving train. And even if the things aren't perfect there, there is something established. That culture has been in place for almost 20 years now. And so I think what appealed to Aaron about coming to Pittsburgh versus what he had to do in New York the last two years is Aaron just come in here and play quarterback. That's all we're asking you to do. You know, and having talked to him a couple times last summer about this, I know he was kind of digging in on. I'm more appreciative of just the opportunity to go play football. I think the Steelers will give him the chance to focus on just doing that and not lifting up everybody around him.

[Colin Cowherd]

Okay. I said last hour, I was really, I was Very much champing in. Champion.

[Albert Breer]

Championing. I missed it, too.

[Colin Cowherd]

How do you say that? I was a champion.

[Albert Breer]

Championing. There you go.

[Colin Cowherd]

Right?

[Albert Breer]

Championing. There you go.

[Colin Cowherd]

And I always got a good B plus in English. Sorry, I butchered that. America.

[Albert Breer]

So.

[Colin Cowherd]

But at the quarterback position. And I did this with Baker, I did it with Manziel. I can remember. I've taken my shots at. Okay. It's different. I want you to be Jalen Hurts. I want you to be Dakota. I want you to be Herbert. I want you on that Wednesday podium. Your job's to put fires out. You know this. Brady used to do a Monday hit in Boston radio. You know this. And all it was, he didn't need the money. It was to create the narrative for the week so the media, the aggressive Boston media couldn't attack. That was Brady's brilliance. Big Ben did this in Pittsburgh for a while to kind of create the narrative of the week. It's very smart. It's not the end of the world. But between that legendary draft room which was cringy and 100 mile an hour speeding ticket. I'm sorry, Albert. It matters and it bothers me. It is something. Yeah.

[Albert Breer]

And I think it's. The issue now is that really if you're the Browns, what you're looking for Shadow or Sanders to do from a work standpoint is come in and operate as if he's the 30th or 40th or 50th guy on the roster. Because that's exactly what he is as a fifth round pick. He's a guy who's fighting not for their starting job, for a job on the team, period. And so generally your tolerance for this sort of stuff with, with. With guys who are in that position is going to be far less than it would be with a star player. I don't think this is the most serious thing in the world, but it is, you know, an early test of how he handles it with the team and everything else. And so I think that's part of it. The other thing is like he is playing from behind here. And look, the reality is the reason he got less. Less 11 on 11 reps than the other quarterbacks, the reason that he got less first team reps than the other quarterbacks in the spring is because he had more ground to make up. He was behind. And that's something you heard consistently from teams ahead of the draft was this guy were a little surprised based on his background that he's as behind as he. As he is from a football Know how standpoint. So he's already playing catch up behind even Dylan Gabriel, let alone Kenny Pickett or, or Joe Flacco. And you're looking for him to blend in, which he did a nice job of that. Like he was a worker be in May and June and he did put his head down and go to work and do the things you need him to do. But again, like this is a guy you're looking to blend in. And so this is one of those things where it's like, ah, that's not great. Now let's see how he'll react. Again, it's not something that's going to get him kicked off the team, but it's something you pay attention to.

[Colin Cowherd]

Okay, so last night I got a text from somebody I have a great deal of respect for and they said the JJ McCarthy situation, it is a work in progress. He is not Bo Nicks, he is not Jaden Daniels. He is not that, that. Those guys came in a lot of starts ready to play. They've been in shootouts, they'd had multiple coordinators, the teams leaned on them. They played a lot from behind or in big games, those guys. Bo Nix was ready to play and so was Jaden Daniels. In my opinion, so was Michael Penix. But Kirk Cousins was in Atlanta. Yeah, I say, I said a couple of weeks ago, Albert, I love mystery in a true crime series. I don't like it with my quarterbacks. What are you hearing on J.J. mcCarthy?

[Albert Breer]

Well, I mean the guys you're comparing them with, I mean Jaden Daniels is a five year college player. Penix was in college for six, Bo Nix was in college for five. All those guys had a massive amount of starts. So it isn't the same thing. There was more of a learning curve. And you know, I think a piece of this is, you know, inextricable from reality is the injury, you know, and the injury last year and kind of the after effects of that and how that affected his whole year and you know, mentally, physically, how is he handling all of that? The weight loss, all of that stuff is, is a part of the mix when you're talking about where JJ McCarthy was going into 2025. Now that said, after the season ended, he's been in there every day, he's doing his best, he's put the weight back on and so is he going to snap his fingers and be with Jade Daniels was last year? No. But that was never the Vikings plan anyway. The Vikings plan was, and this goes back to when Kevin got there three years ago was eventually we're going to reset with a young quarterback. And because that young quarterback's on a rookie contract, we're going to be able to build aggressively around the young quarterbacks. That's exactly what they've done after they let Kirk Cousins go. Last year, they go and they bring in Jonathan Garnard and Andrew Van Ginkel and Aaron Jones, and this year they go and they shore up the interior of the offensive and defensive lines by bringing in Will Fries and Ryan Kelly on. And Jonathan Allen on defense. And the whole idea here is we don't need JJ McCarthy to be a great player. We need him to be a bus driver. Now, you drafted in the first round, you eventually need, you're eventually going to need more from him if you're going to give him a second contract. But in the here and the now, the idea is going to be for J.J. mcCarthy, who does have talent, to come in and keep the train on the tracks. And I think that's the piece of this that people miss sometimes is like, it's not about getting him to be Patrick Mahomes immediately. It's about getting him to be the best dancer for a team that won 14 games a year ago and has very serious championship aspirations. Can you get him there by August? I think that's a very realistic thing.

[Colin Cowherd]

All right, but for the record, the, the Lakers sold yesterday, the Celtics sold recently. Is there an. And I'm just thinking, is there an NFL team? If I said an NFL team just got sold, is there anybody you think is looking to sell in the NFL?

[Albert Breer]

Like, out of nowhere, you're saying, well.

[Colin Cowherd]

I mean, there are certain, like, like the Brown family can't compete financially in Cincinnati. I feel like they, they, they feel like the, that I've got the quarterback and the stars, but they just can't feel like they can. I mean, every star player, it's, it goes, it becomes public. It's a mess.

[Albert Breer]

I mean, the one that you've heard the most about, you know, I think from a speculation standpoint, just because they don't say much as Seattle, you know, the death of Paul Allen, obviously, you know, changed some things. And, and Jody Allen, his sister, has been in charge and she's sort of been a little bit of a mysterious figure. And because of where that franchise is, you know, and the amount of wealth and you know this better than anybody, you're from the Pacific Northwest, Colin. The amount of money that is in that region of the country, there's always been that thought that they could cash out and Then you look at the numbers here and I think that's probably part of the deal with the Celtics and the Lakers. Selling is like the numbers have become so big now that it's almost impossible for people who own these teams to ignore. So like if there was one out of nowhere and I think it'd be really tough to pull that off in the NFL to have like, it's just completely clandestine team sale that flew completely under the radar and boom, it's there. And I think the Lakers was kind of that way. Right. You know, I think it will be Seattle. I think what you're going to see more of in the coming years is what we've seen over the last year or two, which is pieces of teams being sold. You see the Raiders, they're selling to big money guys like Meldman and Egan, Durbin and Tom Wagner and obviously Brady's part of that now too. Where that serves two purposes. It gives teams an influx of cash and it also probably long term lessens the blow. From an estate tax standpoint. I think that's probably what you're going to see a little bit more of. The Eagles, Jeffrey Lurie sold pieces of his team off. We've seen some teams sell pieces to private equity. I think you're going to see more and more of that. As far as like a whole team being sold. Seattle's the only one that I can come up with offhand that strikes me as like if there was one that was going to kind of come, come up, sneak up on people, maybe that would be the one that will get sold. Yeah.

[Colin Cowherd]

And that's a well run organization that somebody be getting themselves a gem. Good seeing you. Albert Brewer, Zoas Monday morning quarterback. Thanks man.

[Albert Breer]

All right, thanks, Colin.

[Colin Cowherd]

And just to give you a sense of how valuable ownership is, look at the exit of Dan Snyder and the entrance of new ownership literally changed the entire trajectory of the franchise overnight. I mean that, that is the greatest turnaround. You know what's funny in the NFL is I've seen this multiple times in the NFL where a team gets purchased and they get better fast. In the NBA, Matt Ishbia bought the Suns and there are just certain things in the NBA that the NFL doesn't deal with. It's a much more of a players league. The, the NBA though is going to start looking much more like the NFL. General managers are going to be the key to this league in five years. Here's my. You know, in the NFL we always talk about Howie Roseman and Chris Ballard and John Lynch And Les need and, you know, we all. John Snyder in Seattle and Jason Light and Tampa. And we all know that, you know, Brett Veach in Kansas City. We know the GMs, you know, you know that there's certain stewards and GMs in this league. We talk about in the NBA, you got to, if you're a casual. Yeah, you don't really follow. I mean, you know, Danny Ainge now in Utah. That will change in five years. Because the NBA, if you look at the new aprons and collective bargaining, you can't stack rosters. You can do it. You have to get rid of guys or you have to just draft and develop. Well, general managers, not the players. This is like the NFL. You get the occasional Mahomes, the occasional star player. Those GMs, they're running the show. Howie Roseman is running the show in Philadelphia. You're going to see more of that in the NBA, obviously. Sam Presti in Oklahoma City. Brad Stevens in Boston's terrific. Riley's been, you know, a stud forever. So that's going to become a bigger deal and a bigger conversation.

[Joy Taylor]

Are you surprised, Colin, that so many people out there are like, can you believe an NBA team sold for 10 billion? I don't think people get that. The NBA is a global sport.

[Albert Breer]

Right.

[Joy Taylor]

There is an appeal to. In China, in the Middle East. I mean, USA Basketball, remember before the Olympics? Where did they go, Colin, to put on a show? They went out to the desert and saw all those rich, all the guys with the oil money. And guess who invested in the Lakers? Take it. I mean, you don't have to do any deep diving here. ESPN's reporting that a lot of it is coming from Saudi Arabia.

[Colin Cowherd]

Yeah, yeah. I mean, it's, it's, it's funny. We don't talk about ratings for sports at all except the NBA, because it's a more political league and because they lean left on their politics. People that are moderate to right kind of attack the league for its ratings. I get it. That's the world we live in. But the truth is they signed a $76 billion deal. And the reason the Lakers sold for $10 billion, a big chunk of that is the 11 year $76 billion deal. The Walters Group gets their cut of that. If that deal is for 35 billion, not 76, they're not selling for 10 billion. And the Celtics aren't selling for six. The Celtics are selling for four and a half. The Lakers are selling for seven and a half. So the reason it's selling that, that valuation is connected to that massive TV deal and it's up to the networks to get ratings. NBA got their bag, players got it, Adam got it, owners got it, coaches got it, they got theirs. It's up to NBC, ESPN and Amazon to make it work. That's not an NBA problem. Coming up, the things we build our future around Family assets. They are worth protecting Making an estate plan now can be as inexpensive as $199. With trust and will you can create and manage a custom estate plan starting at just 199. Each will or trust with trust and will is state specific, customized to your family and needs your nomination, guardians, final arrangements, power of attorney, care wishes. Avoid lengthy, expensive legal proceedings or the state deciding what happens to your assets. Brutal, simple by step processes. Accessible and affordable. Start to finish with ease with trust and will. They also offer live customer support through chat, email or phone. How good is that? Overall Rating Excellent by Trustpilot 5 star reviews used by hundreds of thousands of American families and counties. Secure your assets and protect your loved ones with trustandwill.com herd 20% off your estate plan documents. That's trustandwill.com herd.

[Unknown]

Be sure to catch live editions of the Herd weekdays at noon Eastern, 9am Pacific on Fox Sports Radio, FS1 and the iHeartRadio app.

[Colin Cowherd]

We all want to feel completely safe locking up at night. Get 50 off your new Simply Safe security system first month free if you go to Simply Safe. Colin.com here is J. Mack with the news.

[Albert Breer]

No no, no, turn on the news.

[Unknown]

This is the Herd line news.

[Joy Taylor]

All right, Colin, My Knicks, they still are looking for a head coach after surprisingly firing Tom Thibodeau a couple weeks ago. You know, it's frustrating when the Knicks kept getting denied by teams to talk to their guy, but it looks to me like right now Mike Brown is the the favorite. He's the betting favorite at plus 125, followed by Taylor Jenkins, Johnny Bryant. Michael Malone, the former Denver coach is a little ways down the list. I like Mike Brown a lot. He's been a good coach. I thought he got jobbed in Sacramento after doing a. I mean he got him to the playoffs. Sacramento never got to the playoffs. He's a Steve Kerr guy, you know Mike Malone.

[Colin Cowherd]

Mike Malone to me is an excellent coach and I you have to be careful about this. Reportedly they don't want Mike Malone because his intensity matches Tibbs and they don't want rough guys back to back. I'd be very careful about that. I mean, what happens In I've. This has happened to me in my life where, like, I've worked with people that. You have a news director when I was in local tv who was a yeller and a screamer, but highly effective, and then he gets run out of the building. And then you go the opposite and hire somebody that says, as strong as a down comforter, and you go the opposite. The pendulum swings too far. Tibbs built a really tough culture because he's hard on players. Don't forget that. Don't go, I don't want a Mike d' Antoni clone because he's a swell guy. You know, Tibbs was hard on the players. Yeah. They got better in the regular season, the postseason, and this team has deficiencies in personnel. Do not let the pendulum. Mike Malone, to me, is the coach here, and I don't even think it's that difficult a decision.

[Joy Taylor]

But we need to admit he feuded with the front office because he didn't want to play young guys in Denver. He wanted to ride the veterans, which is not what you do, Collins.

[Colin Cowherd]

You don't.

[Joy Taylor]

You have to get you to the Finals right now.

[Colin Cowherd]

Okay? You don't have that dilemma here. You don't have that. The Knicks aren't depending on young players.

[Joy Taylor]

So that's the thing. Tibbs played his starters a lot and would not change. He was unyielding in refusing to bring, like, do some good ride off the bench. I know that's small potatoes, but Knicks fans know what I'm talking about. He was just a little firm in his ways because he's older. I think they want to skew younger. Someone who the front office is going to say, please do this. It says analytically, we need to.

[Colin Cowherd]

Okay, tell me the last great coach in any sport. Now, baseball, because of analytics, managers have limited power. But if you go NBA, NFL, you can go international soccer. Tell me the last great manager who basically complies with ownership and front office wishes. Like, you're hiring somebody that you can push around. I don't like that.

[Joy Taylor]

It's less about. I'm sorry, maybe I frame that wrong. Less about pushing around, but more about being on the same page. Hey, this is what the analytics say. We like this. What do you think?

[Colin Cowherd]

All right. Oh, yeah. Yeah. Being on the same page. As long as you agree with me, we'll get along. What does that mean, being on the same page? You.

[Joy Taylor]

I don't like philosophy, Colin. Like, you wouldn't have me on this show if we didn't agree on a lot of stuff.

[Colin Cowherd]

No, it's not true at all.

[Joy Taylor]

Takes disagree. We go head to head over plenty of stuff, but by and large we agree what works for the F. Because.

[Colin Cowherd]

You and I are on the same. I don't want to get into us, but you and I are on the same page. We work hard, blah, blah, blah, family, that kind of stuff. If you, if you were a squirrely guy. I don't care if we agree or not. We go back and forth constantly. I want as a gm, a coach with a strong vision and a strong plan. I don't have to have him succumb to my wishes. The Knicks want to hire comfortable and compliant. I want a great coach and I think Malone is a top 10 coach in the league.

[Joy Taylor]

I don't disagree. I think there's a middle ground. We probably agree, but let's move on to the Detroit Lions, who you know there's some pressure on your boy Jared Goff, South Bay's finest out here in la. Maybe you'll get a bite with him when you come out here next week. There is pressure on him. Quote, the Lions have too much talent not to bounce back in 2025, but the end of the season has to leave you wondering if the franchise can actually make a Super bowl run with Jared Goff. I think that's a little silly. He was moments away from a Super bowl two years ago in that San Francisco game.

[Colin Cowherd]

The bigger issue is he is not a mobile quarterback. And in this league right now, teams like, you know, Washington with Jaden Daniels, even Denver with Bo Nix can add about 20 to 25% of the playbook because you can constantly move the pocket. That's why Shanahan, by the way, likes Brock Purdy. One of the reasons he likes him is you can move the pocket. You couldn't with Garoppolo. So Garoppolo didn't throw deep and he couldn't move particularly well. One of the attractive things about Purdy, I can flush him left or right. He does move well and you get more plays. And so I think these quarterback, I think you look at, I think you look at if you have a. You just lost your center who retired. Not good for Detroit, not good at all. So the O line will not be as good, period, in the middle. And now you have an immobile quarterback. So I do think you start looking at this and thinking, hey, do we have to have a great O line in order for Goff to win? Because, you know, eventually some of these offensive linemen outside of Panay Sewell, you can't Afford all of them.

[Joy Taylor]

So by the way, Goff had a career year last year. 37 touchdowns. QBR, best of his career. I, I think the issue with golf, Colin, we're gonna notice it early. You remember last year, anytime the Lions played in golf's throwing guys are wide open. I'm talking like everywhere dudes are. Defensive backs aren't even close. If all of a sudden they're not as open because the new OC is not as good. I think you need to sell the Lions like in September you're gonna be able to tell early because those guys are so wide open.

[Colin Cowherd]

I still think they have a great roster. I'm, I'm. What is the over under? 11 to 11 and a half.

[Joy Taylor]

I think it's 10 and a half.

[Colin Cowherd]

Yeah. So I think they're an 11 win team. But I do think they, I think there's an argument when you lose two elite coordinators. Go ask Philadelphia. When Sirianni had two great ocdc, lost them, bad hires. That team was reeling. Think about how good Philadelphia's roster was a year and a half ago and it was reeling. They were a mess. So coaching matters.

[Joy Taylor]

Quarterbacks they got to face in the first six weeks. Jordan Love, Caleb Williams, Lamar Jackson, Dylan Gabriel, Joe Burrow and Patrick Mahomes. That's three. Three of the best four quarterbacks in the league in the first six games for your new defensive coordinator.

[Colin Cowherd]

Good luck.

[Joy Taylor]

Lions final story is the 49ers. Colin. They brought back former DC Robert Salah this offseason. They were brutal last year, 28th in scoring defense. George Kittle was on the Rich Eisen show and talked about the defensive side of the football. Here's George Kittle's message on the Niners.

[George Kittle]

He's really good at his job and I'm really excited that we somehow convinced him to be our defensive coordinator again because he is, he knows what he's talking about. He's inspiring. He gets the boys fired up. I'm pumped to have him back in the building, just hanging out with them a little bit, talking about stuff. You can just tell he's, he's ready to roll this year and he's going to get the boys fired up. Violence is coming is what I would say.

[Colin Cowherd]

Yeah, I mean, I think everybody in the league, I, I. When the jets fired Sala, my take was you just let the best coach in the building leave and you were already babysitting that Hackett and it was a disaster. That's nothing against the guy that replaced him, but, you know, never let the Best coach in the building. Leave that. That's almost the always the rule. And it was not a terribly strong staff because the OC was, you know, came with Aaron. So I think Sol is a great coach. Whether or not he's a head coach. I mean everybody's get second chances. He'll get a. I would give him a second chance. I think he deserves it. But he's an excellent defensive coach.

[Joy Taylor]

Well, they'll be, they'll be the number one seed in the nfc. I think we both agree on that. Right? They got Brock Pie in an easy schedule. Can they win the Super Bowl? We'll see. I mean, no.

[Colin Cowherd]

Yes.

[Joy Taylor]

I think, I think Niners. You have Rams, Bills. I think I might have Niners Bills in the Super Bowl.

[Colin Cowherd]

Well, I have Rams, Seahawks making the playoffs. I, I do not have the Niners in the Super Bowl. I think that is. Listen, sometimes I win these bets against you and I see them coming a mile away.

[Joy Taylor]

You've got two months left to get off that horrible Seahawks take.

[Colin Cowherd]

Right?

[Joy Taylor]

Let's just move off that one quickly. You know how you move off real estate quick, quickly. You need to move off to Seattle Seahawks being a playoff team next year. That's just not happening.

[Colin Cowherd]

Let me tell you something. I already bought a couple of jet skis with that those winnings. I got jet skis.

[Joy Taylor]

Do they let jet skis go on Lake Chicago or whatever the lake is called over Lake Michigan.

[Colin Cowherd]

Geography. You may want to brush up on that a little. J Max Lake Chicago. Okay. J. Mac with the news.

[Unknown]

Well, that's the news and thanks for stopping by the herd line news.

[Colin Cowherd]

We all want to feel completely safe when we're locking up at night, especially next to Lake Chicago. You want to feel safe. Peace of mind. How about simplisafecollin.com 50% off your new system with professional monitoring in your first month [e-mail].

[Unknown]

Be sure to catch live editions of the Herd, Weekdays at noon Eastern, 9am Pacific continues with the Gold.

[Joy Taylor]

Cup tonight as the Stars and Stripes face off against Middle east powerhouse Saudi Arabia. No easy path, no second chances. Tonight, 9 Eastern on FS1.

[Colin Cowherd]

Now the odds for this one, little closer, a little more comfortable than people may suggest. So keep your eye on that. And everybody's feeling good about themselves after that 5 nothing Shellacking of Trinidad Tobago. But keep your eye on this one tonight. So sometimes I'm just flummoxed by something that I have always liked Kevin Durant as a player. There's a story today that he wanted to join both the Celtics and the Knicks in February at the trade deadline and neither was interested. Huh. I mean, he's the number one rated jump shooter in the league. Only two guys in the league averaged 25 points and shot 40% on threes, Jokic and KD. He's not disruptive. He's a nice guy. He's respected by players. He doesn't need the ball in his hands. I don't get it. He doesn't have a market. And I was thinking about that this morning, is that all of us communicate beyond talking tone, body language, who you hang out with. And I think his messaging is bad. That's the only thing that explains it. The best head coaches and general managers prioritize winning for second and third. And I don't think KD has always prioritized that. He did briefly with Golden State, then he got into his fields and left and he wanted to just go hoop and have fun. And people in the NBA, have fun in your own time. We want to win titles. I don't like his messaging. I love his game. You know, Jalen Brunson, whether it was Villanova or the Knicks, he dies a little with each loss. He is so competitive and he's got it all lined up. And that's the only, it's the only thing I can make sense of this, is that it's, it's so strange. And people say, well, he's going to want a new contract. He's not getting a super max. He wants a couple of years. He's giving you 25 a night. He can defend you get length. He's a bright player. He knows the game, he knows the ins and outs. He's mostly healthy. It's a shooter's league, by the way. He'll get mid range, he can hit threes. And with Brunson's game especially, you know, whoever plays with Brunson can't need the ball a lot. You gotta be able to play off ball with Jalen Brunson. That's why he and Luka weren't perfect, right? Like Kevin Durant is perfect. He's the perfect player for him. But I think if I said to you KD and I said word association, you'd think Hooper wants to play with friends, wants to just ball, doesn't want to really lead. And fair or not, I think that's how people view him. Because if I, if you could put him on the Celtics tomorrow, you could put him on the Knicks tomorrow. I don't get it. Rick Bucher talked about, you know, his lack of a dynamic market.

[Rick Bucher]

It's not so much the teams don't want KD and couldn't use KD as much as what are we going to have to give up for him and are we going to have to extend him? The reason that you're not seeing a more robust market for him is because teams are looking at it and saying, I don't know that within a year for what we might have to give up. That KD really moves the needle at this point.

[Colin Cowherd]

But I would add this. If you're hyper athletic like Cam Newton, you tend to age very quickly. But if it's about shooting and sort of basketball IQ, shooting and ball handling and lengths, those age very well. That's, that's why, I mean, if you look at LeBron James, he is athletic, but he's a great ball handler, one of the smartest players ever. You know, LeBron doesn't defend like he used to, but Kevin Durant's game, I think ages really, really well. He's not toxic. People like him. He's smart, he understands the game, he can shoot. I don't know, I like, I think Steph Curry is one of those guys he could play for a long time. I mean, Klay Thompson still playing, he's a catch and shoot guy. Whereas a Westbrook is bouncing team to team now because he was so hyper athletic. When you lose that, it's like it's not the same player. But the messaging matters. And I'll give you two examples. Sga. He's kind of boring. The messaging is winning. Jokic screaming at his teammates. The message winning. And we communicate with more than just words. Tone, who are your friends? Who are your allies? I, I was told this years ago by, it was somebody in LeBron's camp is a certain player's name came up that, that wanted to play with LeBron. And I, I, I didn't love this player, but this player was really, really talented. And he said, no, LeBron doesn't want to. That guy, that LeBron. Now, now, LeBron was okay with Westbrook briefly, but it was a player who was in their prime. And I remember somebody in LeBron's camp saying, LeBron doesn't want that guy near his brand. And he's, he's still going to, you know, he's still partying. Like, LeBron doesn't have any interest. They are the opposite personality, the opposite guy. And that stuck with me. So also, oh my God, look at that. All right. Dodgers surpassed 2 million in fan attendance last night, 14th sellout. That. That's the Ohtani factor, by the way. It's selling out on Wednesdays and Thursdays. I remember when A Rod went to the Yankees and, and remember he went to the Yankees and they already had Jeter. It's like he was a shortstop. People were saying A Rod revolutionized the game. They put him at third. It's like he was good for baseball, he was good for business. A Rod got people to the ballpark on a Tuesday night and a Wednesday night and a Thursday night. That's the Ohtani factor is their 14th sellout. Now, some of this is the Padres is their biggest rival and we were talking about AJ Brzezinski came on earlier and the Dodgers won with a walk off last night. This rivalry is, is. It is as even and as nasty as a rivalry in baseball can be. And AJ Przeinski an hour ago talked about it.

[A.J. Pierzynski]

Every team walks into a series with the Dodgers and there are teams out there that go, we can't beat them. Why are we even wasting our time? The Padres, they don't play like that. Mike Shield, Manny Machado, Fernando Tatis, all of these guys on the Padres, they don't play like that. We ain't afraid of the Dodgers, so we're going to show you. The Padres want to show the Dodgers. We're not little brother anymore. We're not afraid of you. We're going to stand up for our guys. And that's how you have to do it in today's game.

[Colin Cowherd]

You know, it is interesting with Ohtani because he played down with the Angels, but one of the reasons it made sense to get a Rod with the Yankees, because in 162 games, a Rod and Jeter together made the Yankee games feel like an event. And I mean, listen, Freeman's great, Betts is great, but it's Ohtani that makes every Dodger game feel like an event. Don't, don't confuse. Betts is an unbelievable player. He doesn't make a Tuesday game. He's just great. Ohtani, this is the Caitlin Clark effect. She's not the best player in the league. Caitlin Clark. Oh, you get tickets to a Caitlin Clark game in Indiana. That is a big event right now. I'm serious. The game with Caitlin Clark in it tonight, playing one of the more physical teams in the WNBA off that skirmish with Connecticut, honestly, to me feels bigger, or at least even with the NBA Finals game in Indiana tonight. Caitlin Clark makes stuff feel like an event. I mean, the Masters is already big, but when Rory McElroy is going for his big win. The numbers explode like, okay, we're watching history here. So that, that is what. And again, there, there are a lot of good teams. Like the Detroit Lions are a really good team. But part of what makes the Buffalo Bills games feel bigger is Josh Allen. Josh Allen's like, he'll do stuff that you may never see in a football field again. That's what Caitlin Clark's doing. That's what Ohtani is doing. And now you add the scrum and the physicality and the flagrants and the technicals as everybody's ramping up their defense. Rachel Nichols talked about that with Caitlin Clark.

[Rachel Nichols]

We've seen Steph Curry that you mentioned beat up like this for years. I mean, that is basically the game plan against Steph Curry is just try to out physical him and beat him up a little bit because of course you can't match the skill level. So I think the W is sort of taken a page from that. But so far, you know, she's been able to handle everything that's been thrown at her. I don't, I don't really worry about her toughness. She might be her own enforcer, so we'll just have to see.

[Colin Cowherd]

There's also another story with the Indiana Fever. Sophie Cunningham, obviously very appealing, tall, blonde, beautiful, and an enforcer. And her jerseys just sold out yesterday. Fanatic said the Sophie Cunningham jerseys, they brought her over like the Bulls did with Charles Oakley to protect Michael Jordan. They brought her over as an enforcer. And in this game, she enforced. And what I love about Sophie Cunningham, she is leaning in to all of it. The enforcer part, her appearance part, let's just be honest. That's. That helps. That helps is Sophie Cunningham is now a part of this thing. She's part of this. She is part of this sort of event. Feel, not just the enforcer, how she dresses, she makes sure the cameras are out. You ever notice with Sophie Cunningham, the cameras always. It's just perfect. She comes into the arena. I mean, come on, everybody knows what's going on here. We're all grown ups, right? Her social media people are like, yep, Sophie will be walking by in 45 minutes. Make that 20, make that nine. Here she comes. Boom. Picture hits the Internet. We all know, we all know what's going on. We're adults here, but it's a thing. And she is leaning into it. All right, J. Mac, my staff here is like, what is. Where is he going? We're adults here. Coward.

[Joy Taylor]

Unlike Shadour Sanders, you need to pump the brakes, buddy. Slow it down. All right. On Sophie Cunningham.

[Colin Cowherd]

This is an I heart podcast.