Greg Olsen (2:12)

Now let's get this party started.

Colin Cowherd (2:14)

You're listening to Fox Sports Radio. Here we go. Our number two Live in Chicago, it's the Herd. Wherever you may be, however you may be listening thanks for making us part of your day. I can't wait to tell Nick that I took the train to work today. I want to see his reaction on that. So I gotta start with this. J. Mac One of the things about the draft is we find stuff out during and after the draft that we didn't know. So as Shadour Sanders falls in the draft, part of it is because I kept saying why didn't Pittsburgh draft it? I would have drafted him. I was Pittsburgh. We're finding out now. J. Mack it looks like Art Rooney is saying he wants to come here. We should hear any day now. So it does feel like part of the precipitous drop is the Giants didn't want him. He bombed the interview and the Steelers already had Aaron coming back so and Tennessee was going to get their guy. So the draft has always been such a weird thing to cover. As Mel Kuiper told me like 15 years ago, you never get lied to in sports more as a reporter than a month before the draft and Mel thought he was going first round. So it's interesting. There have been several stages of Aaron Rodgers career. We've Stage one he plays for a great organization and he's in his prime. MVPs, Super bowl trophy, consistent division winner. Stage two was he changes coaches. He now looks like he's out of his prime. He's still really, really, really good but the last year he missed the playoffs. Stage three is bad organization clearly passed his prime because of an injury. He was 5 and 12 and now the final stage looks like if he signs with the Steelers he's on the doorstep of retirement. He is clearly a pocket quarterback with a big brand that's well run except for offense and folks, that doesn't sound like a playoff team in a division with Lamar Jackson and Joe Burrow it doesn't feel like a playoff team. It feels 8, 9, 9 and 8. Also he plays Burrow twice, Lamar twice, Josh Allen, Jared Goff, Justin Herbert, Harbaugh, Jordan Love. Also he plays Caleb Williams and Drake May who now have big time coaches and much better rosters and playmakers. So I think it's going to be an 8, 9, 9 and 8 season. This is not Brady to Tampa where they were actually highly talented and highly productive on offense. Jamis just threw like I don't even know what it was 30 picks. I forgot the number. I mean Tom got in there and it's like he went to Tampa because they were so good offensively. So I and let's be honest about this, I don't think this is a shot. Aaron's probably not the most committed off season quarterback in the league right now, so I think it's fine. I think it's interesting. Every year there's a team that's really interesting but not really good. Last year I thought the Chicago Bears were fascinating up until Thanksgiving, but not very good. I think Pittsburgh is going to be that team. They're not going to have long winning streaks. Also, the Steelers, here's a reality of their offense. It always gets worse in December. You ever noticed that? Why? Because Mike Tomlin is mostly a motivational coach and that kind of runs dry by week 12, 13, 14. Last year they were a pretty good team. And then the last five weeks they couldn't move the ball at all with Russell Wilson. So I think Aaron will be interesting. I don't think there'll be a playoff team. And with that, Nick, right now, joining us, the host of First Things first live from New York. Okay, before we start anything, I took the train into work this morning and I loved it, Nick. Loved it.

Joel Klatt (6:02)

Yeah. Yeah. That'll last a few days and it'll be back to car service for Uncle Colin. I can't wait. I can't wait for your updates from the front of a rugged Midwestern city. Next week, you're gonna be like, I ate a hot dog sold by a vendor off the street and paid cash. It's gonna be the whole brave new world. Listen, you used to be a man of the people. Then a decade in Los Angeles softened you up. So I'm glad that Chicago. What you will learn is this. As a Midwestern kid myself, you now have the benefit of the single best time zone to be a sports fan.

Colin Cowherd (6:43)

Yes.

Joel Klatt (6:43)

So where 10am football, 9am college football out west is a little too early, but 1am finishes out east a little too late. It makes more sense in the central time zone. You know, when the NFL starts noon and three, like it was built for the Midwest. It's great. 11am College football, you'll love that. The nightlife will be great. I'm very excited for you. As I told you, I'm going to come visit you. We'll go to Bavettes or one of those fancy Chicago steakhouses you're buying. It's going to be great. You're now closer. Can't wait to see you, buddy.

Colin Cowherd (7:18)

Okay, so I picked the Rockets to win. I thought depth, size, and I said yes. I know all their best players are 21, 22. I get it. But the Warrior players, they're all Old and I don't know if pods is ready. And I'm watching that game last night and the Draymond Technical and the Jimmy Butler and and Kerr's coaching and I'm like, I should have known. I should have known. Doesn't it just come. Because if you look at the box score, Houston did enough to win, no question.

Joel Klatt (7:44)

Yep.

Colin Cowherd (7:45)

But in the end, I felt like I was watching a little bit of the Wiggins Warriors. It felt so warriors to me. Who did you pick and what?

Joel Klatt (7:54)

I picked the same as you. I picked Rockets in seven for a lot of the same reasons. I thought, listen, Steph has had two phenomenal games. Game one, he was outstanding, even better than the box scorer. Game 3 with no Jimmy Butler, I thought was an all time Steph and Steve Kerr performance. But the Rockets have held him in check in the other two games and Jimmy Butler, you know, missed a game. And there were a lot of reasons that you thought or I thought the Rockets could lean on them physical enough. And by game seven, they're beat up. And listen, yesterday, if Shingoon makes that shot, maybe you and I are looking smart. Now it's a best of three with the Rockets having home court. But to me, the story yesterday was about a Warrior you and I have talked about a lot on this show. It was the vintage, perfect for good and for bad Draymond Green game because it was his fourth. And I say this with deep respect for who he is as a player, even though he has always kind of irritated me with some of the on and off court antics. But what you saw from Draymond Green, who yesterday hit two shots to open the game, then did not score another point, who had five fouls, one technical, one flagrant, and could have had nine fouls, three technicals and two flagrants, he was the most important player on the court. He was the connective tissue for the Warriors. He was doing all the vintage Draymond stuff. And on the Outpern Shingoon yesterday, when Draymond was out of the game, no Warrior could stop him. And when Draymond was in the game, he wanted nothing to do with the paint. And so when Draymond goes into the hall of Fame as a first ballot guy, this game is a perfect example why. It was his fourth straight triple single. None of the stats are impressive. He's barking, he's yelling, he's irritating, he's almost fighting. And he is helping the warriors win unlike any player other than Steph Curry in this era. And so listen, Draymond is not a big fan of mine. I understand that that's probably fair, but hats off to him for last night and for once again proving, as he said, he is a 16 game player, not an 82 game player. And no one was more valuable to the warriors last night than Draymond Green.

Colin Cowherd (10:31)

So I think the Lakers are in big trouble for a lot of reasons. And people send messages. J.J. redick sent a message to Rob Pelinka which is fix the roster. But I, I, and I, and I say this, they didn't play again until like Wednesday. So I know J.J. thought I'm going to empty the tank, we're not playing till Wednesday. But come on. If LeBron was in year 12 and not 22, if Luca would have come into the season in shape, I thought it was a calculated risk you didn't necessarily need to take because Minnesota's deeper and Julius Randall's playing out of his mind finally in the playoffs. I didn't love the coaching decision. What did you think about it?

Joel Klatt (11:10)

Yeah. You thought JJ doing something literally no coach in basketball history was maybe a mistake. Yeah. And listen, I think jj, I think JJ has been excellent. I think he deserves credit. And I think there are, there are a lot of fingerprints on this Lakers loss. I think that a smart point that was made by I think Silver Screen and Roll, one of the Lakers blogs, I apologize if I'm misattributing it, was that the original fingerprint on this loss was the front office's passivity before they got Luka Doncic in the last couple years of LeBron and Anthony Davis and not treating it like it was a championship roster that needed championship role players. And you saw the atrophy of that in this. Some of the fingerprints on this loss is the lakers not or J.J. i should say it's not so much about LeBron and Luca playing the whole second half. There's a lot of playoff games where you're two stars even if one's a little overweight and the other's 70,000 minutes in at 40 years old. Play the whole second half, it's that you didn't think you could get one minute from Gabe Vincent or Jackson Hayes or Jared Vanderbilt to where may Austin Reeves and the other guys are more fresh. So there's that. It was the fact that LeBron, I think made a calculated decision in that fourth quarter, which was I only have this much energy left. And because we have Luka Doncic, I'm saving it for the defensive end where you saw some Vintage all time LeBron defensive stops. @ the end of that game, Luke will be able to take care of the offense and he couldn't. LeBron himself, a minute left, ball in his hands, up two takes a tough three instead of, you know, using whatever energy he had to get to the basket. All of that conspired to put a Lakers team that has no business being down 3:1, down 3:1. And Colin, do I think they have a chance to win this series? I do. But do I think it actually really matters at this point? I don't. And that's for two reasons. One is because this thing, their best case scenario is it goes seven. What that means Colin is starting tomorrow until they are eliminated. They are every other day the rest of the playoffs until the finals if you were to get there. But it is, it is literally on the Lakers schedule in the month of May. It is 15 games in 30 days. If they were to get that opportunity, you see they don't have the depth of the roster to handle that. They needed this series to be quick. They needed the LeBron 38 point masterpiece on Friday to be enough. And they needed that game, a double digit lead in the fourth quarter on Sunday to be enough. Neither was. And now they're up against it. And even if they get through it, all that means is they're going to be dog tired going into round two.

Colin Cowherd (14:15)

I want to talk Sidor Sanders because it's, it really got people worked up and I've, I've. Most of my contacts are in the NFL. So most of my people just said, you know, listen, Dion is popular, he's worked at major networks. Peter Schrager mentioned this as well. Nobody wanted to tell Deon the truth. Like your son's not interviewing well and maybe he's not as good as you think. Whatever Dan Marino sled, Aaron Rodgers slid Johnny Manziel, half the teams took him off their board. I do think there was a lack of self awareness butchering the Giant. I mean the Giants were willing to give up two firsts to get Cam Ward and three picks for Jackson Darth. They wanted a quarterback. And yet Shedeur, by the way, it came out after the fact. Yeah, he bombed the interview. So some of it was there's a scarcity of teams that need it and there weren't very many good quarterbacks after Cam Moore. There's been a lot of comparisons to a lot of people. I think it's just people dropping the draft and I do think quarterbacks me on Baker Mayfield. Quarterbacks are judged differently. If a wide receiver had a Draft room that said legendary, I wouldn't care. But a quarterback. But it feel it, some of it felt cringy. Maybe that's it.

Joel Klatt (15:25)

So there's, there's so much here the part, the point you were making about the difference in personalities. Quarterback, wide receiver, or let's take Abdul Carter. Like Abdul Carter, you know, got in some trouble off the field. There's questions about his motor. The moment he gets drafted he's like alt, come off that 56 buddy. And everyone's like, can he get me 12 sacks a year? He can. He's an edge rusher. Who cares? And the fact of the matter is this, I think this was a multi front failure. I think it was a failure. If I'm being honest by a lot of the NFL insiders in not having anywhere close to their finger on the pulse of what clearly the majority of the league thought of Shador, I think it was and I think Deion has been the type of father that I think a lot of fathers, myself included, aspire to be where you can be simultaneously friends with your kid while a hardcore disciplinarian while involved in their lives. I think he's been a great dad. I think this was his first miss where he clearly let made Shador believe because why wouldn't I trust Dion that I am viewed as a blue chipper and a blue chipper can do the things Shedeur did. Shador to me conducted the draft process as if he knew for certain. Yes, if I'm there at 21, Pittsburgh is taking me. And therefore he appeared from the reporting to almost intentionally turn off certain teams because he wasn't worried about the money to go along with draft slot. So he's like, no, I'd rather go to Pittsburgh than say New Orleans or wherever else. And he was just flatly wrong that no team viewed him as a first round pick. No team viewed him as a clear cut future starter. And then all of a sudden you find out, oh, I was interviewing for the wrong job. Yeah, they were interviewing me to be a backup. That's a very different job. Like if I were to come to you, Colin, it's a different job. If it's like, hey, we're interviewing someone who when Colin's off to fill in or you're interviewing someone who's going to produce the show, like I need to know what job I'm interviewing for. The backup quarterback job is much more about personality, study habits, you know, disposition, starting quarterback job is how pretty is that throw? And Shador thought that that was going to carry him. It was a misjudgment by him. And I think this is a. It's a tough lesson. Now, with that said, if he is anywhere close to the player he and the people around him clearly think he is, he should win that job this year. I don't know that he is that player, but it's a Flacco. Kenny Picket, Dylan Gabriel, quarterback room. If, if the league was wrong and he's right, he's a first round talent. He's the only first round talent in that room.

Colin Cowherd (18:41)

Okay. Weirdest story that nobody knows how to cover is Belichick and Jordan Hudson. And I said this. One of my rules on this show, one of the rules on my show, it's not about being right, it's about getting it right. And I thought it was sort of icky and cringy. And then I watched the CBS interview and I'm like, oh, no, that's essential. Every CEO, senator, college coach in his 70s has handlers. We're just not comfortable with them being young girlfriends. But she is. Now, Bill didn't need this in the pros. In college, Mike Lombardi and Bill have no interest in the sid, the ad, the college nonsense. They don't have a bridge. And when she's barking at cbs, I'm like, that's what sids do. I've seen PR people do this with politicians. Bill doesn't want to be a college coach. He's a college coach because the way it worked out and it's mutually beneficial, it's a little cringy for people. But that CBS interview, I'm like, I've seen that 10 times. It could be the Clintons. It could be a CEO, it could be Bill Belichick.

Joel Klatt (19:45)

Yes, of course you've seen it 10 times. The problem is when you're envisioning that college coach and the SID seven days prior was that college coach laying prone on the beach with the SID laying on his. On his feet doing the Titanic pose. Like in these instances where you're like, it's a politician and their aide was three weeks prior was the politician fishing the aid out of the sea as a mermaid for the Instagram following like that, to me, the context of that is what informs this. If it was just, hey, listen, you know, old soul, young heart, you know, to each their own. And she's helpful where he's lacking, which is media stuff or whatever.

Colin Cowherd (20:41)

Oh, yeah.

Joel Klatt (20:41)

So be does not feel like that to me. And I don't think I am not one typically to comment on someone's personal life. However, if they make it their public life and a big part of their public Persona, then I think it is for fair if it's relevant and what I do think is relevant here and what is honestly most interesting to me, because I don't care that much about North Carolina Tar Heel football with respect to Mitch Trubisky and Lawrence Taylor. What is interesting to me is, is this one of the reasons the NFL was not interested in Bill Belichick? Yeah, one of the reasons Bill did not get interviews was because people in NFL front offices already knew, hey guys, so he's got a new girlfriend. She was born in the 2000s and she's super involved. And Bill seems okay with it like that to me. When we're talking like we can't do the and I'm not saying you're doing this, but we as a media can't say, hey, one of the reasons Shedor fell in the draft was when you are the quarterback of a team, optics disposition, how you carry yourself matters. And it turned off NFL owners and not say a similar turning off of NFL owners might have happened with Bill and his, you know, loving girlfriend.

Colin Cowherd (22:15)

Yeah, no, that's a good point. I think all that stuff, I mean, listen, I said this, you know, going back to Shador, I said this either on a podcast or on the show. I said the NFL is very protective of its culture. It's not going to go baseball and give you a 10 year deal and it's not going to tolerate load management. It is a front office coach sport. Is it? If Sean McVay is done with you, Vaughn Miller, Cooper cup, bye bye. And that's the way it works. Jalen Ramsey, nice knowing you. And I do think on the Shador front and the Bill front, you make a good, a really interesting point that I hadn't thought about. They are hyper protective that we're not letting coaches and we're not letting quarterbacks, especially young ones, run the league. We run the league. It's an old boys club. And I think to your point, it could be Shador, it could be Johnny Manziel, it could be Bill Belichick. It's like slow down. And I yeah, you may have.

Joel Klatt (23:13)

That's a pretty good point again, unless you are there is always this, oh, wait, but we think you're the best in the world like Cam Newton for whatever, you know, his failings or successes as a pro. He did win an mvp, go to a Super Bowl. People still think he underachieved. Whatever it is. He was as brash and confident and braggadocious as you got sells Peter King. I want to be an icon and entertainer and we still remember it. But we also know this. He was pick one, one with a bullet because it's like, I don't know. Did you see last year at Auburn? Holy moly, that guy's unbelievable. And if this was, if this were Belichick coming off the last Brady super bowl where they win 13 to 3, shutting down Sean McVay's Rams, Todd Gurley led offense, then I think we'll be like, all right, man. It's a weird thing we're going to have to deal with, but we'll deal with it. But as the moment you're not, whether it's quarterback coach, any of these guys, a gotta have it guy, then you better fall in line. And that maybe it shouldn't be that way, but it pretty clearly is that way.

Colin Cowherd (24:22)

Yeah. Nick Wright. Well, can't wait to get on the.

Joel Klatt (24:26)

Old enjoy the train train, buddy. I cannot wait until the first person walks up to you and does this one you're calling who do you think is going to win? And before you can even answer, they then give you their seven minute answer of their own question, which is why they asked you the question. You're going to love it. Oh my goodness. Get ready to take some pictures. See you later, buddy.

Colin Cowherd (24:49)

All right. Nick Wright. No J. Mac. It is actually. It is interesting is that, and I really believe this is that the NFL looks at baseball and says to itself, how do you guys give out 10 year contracts? The NFL looks at the NBA and goes load management. So they are hyper protective of their culture. And their argument is look at our ratings and look at yours. Look at our revenue. Look how much leverage we have over people say, well, there's only one game a week. It's not just that the NFL tells networks what you'll pay. That's what the NFL that Robert Kraft calls Fox CBS and says, here's what we've decided, you're going to pay. That's how it works. So when you literally lead an industry by that much, it could be Coca Cola's recipe for the we're going to be hyper protective of it. And I think you can say you don't like it. The media generally, especially print media, hates power. But the NFL's like, no, we're, we're. That's why the NFL, if you go look at their CBAs, I could argue baseball's umpire union has as much power as the NFL players union. They push the players around because they can and it works.

J. Mac (25:56)

A lot of ratings talk from you.

Joel Klatt (25:58)

I.

J. Mac (25:58)

What's going on? Like ratings. We know things. The NFL way bigger than NBA, period. It's not even a discussion. Come on. NFL season is like four months. That stuff is so essential and matters. NBA season. Can you remember what I can remember? Week five games in the NFL. Can you remember December games in the NBA? No, of course. I don't like those comparison, Colin. It's like apples to elephants. Like, stop. They're. They're not really close to one another. I don't like that comparison.

Colin Cowherd (26:26)

Okay, coming up, Steph Curry won another award. An award you rarely see a star winning. It's the herd. One more herd. The herd streams 24 hours a day, seven days a week within the iHeartRadio app. Search herd to listen live or on demand whenever you'd like.

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Colin Cowherd (29:26)

You know it's. I saw NBA players, players voted Steph Curry best teammate of the year in the NBA and you don't get the superstar getting that very much. But I think it speaks to his self awareness and there's a certain intelligence between Kerr and Curry and Draymond and a self awareness. I mean don't kid yourself. Draymond knows what he's doing. But you know, Daryl, I don't care if it's Hollywood or the NBA. A lot of people care about those Twitter streets and Steph Curry doesn't. He's just a remarkable teammate. And I thought last night his ability to understand the temperament of Draymond, to allow Jimmy Butler to take over in the fourth, to even allow pods to, to take over in big spots in the game. Warriors had, you know, a huge run in the third quarter. It doesn't work. I mean Carmelo Anthony was threatened by Jeremy Lynn who had a good two week run. Like you think to yourself, stars are all very secure and they have self awareness. They don't. So Steph Curry and as I watched that game last night and I think Nick Wright had it right that Draymond Green can just take over games and he's combustible. But Steph Curry's always been okay with it and okay with KD taking the shot and Jimmy Butler taking the shot and young pods controlling the game in spurs to be the man, the great ones. Brady was like this. You don't want to be the only man in some games you aren't the man. Here's Kerr on last night's win and non Steph Curry stardom. He's the best defender I've ever seen in my life.

J. Mac (31:05)

And he rises to the occasion, you know, on top of being, you know, a great defender, he's an incredible competitor. And so anytime. And we've seen it.

Colin Cowherd (31:17)

I've seen it for 11 years.

J. Mac (31:19)

Game on the line, Draymond making a stop. It's like having Steph Curry take the shot.

Colin Cowherd (31:26)

Obviously talking about Draymond, not Steph. But it does remind me a lot of Dennis Rodman and Michael Jordan. Loved Rodman, loved him. Michael understood. He does things I don't want to do. He's a disruptor. You know, a lot of the stars. I mean, it's. Michael was willing to play with some different characters. Steph Curry has been willing to play with a lot of different personalities. I mean, as great as the late Kobe Bryant was, he could struggle with people like he struggled with Phil. He struggled with coaches. He struggled with Shaq. Is that D. Wade's another player. I always thought D. Wade may have had the keys to the city. In Miami, he had no problem saying, Shaq, LeBron, go for it. And so the D. Wade's, the MJ's, the steps that can step back and say, by the way, it's. It's, you know, Michael Jordan listen to Phil Jackson said, oh, I'm let Paxton and Kerr have the final shot in games. You think that's obvious? It's not. There are people in pro sports Hollywood. They've got to be first, front and center on the marquee. So I think that ability by. I mean, there are games like last night in the fourth quarter that was not close to about Steph. That was Jimmy Butler's quarter. J. Mack with the news. No, no, no, no.

Greg Olsen (32:45)

Turn on the news.

Colin Cowherd (32:46)

This is the Herd line news.

J. Mac (32:48)

Jimmy Bucket's taken over. Hey, you know who also taken over? The 49ers. Colin. They are a big talking point right now because after going down defensive heavy in the draft, Pro Football Focus gave them a D. Worst draft in the league.

Colin Cowherd (33:01)

However, I didn't like it.

J. Mac (33:02)

Chris Sims. You remember him, he former quarterback. I think he's been on the show a bunch of times. He thinks the Ners hit a home run.

Colin Cowherd (33:09)

I thought the San Francisco 49ers absolutely crushed the draft. They got back to a little bit what we talked about on Friday morning.

Joel Klatt (33:17)

Their.

Colin Cowherd (33:17)

Their roots. This is what they were. This is when Shanahan and Lynch took over. This is how the team was formed. Bunch of badasses on the defensive side of the ball. Let's accumulate that. Let's kick the crap out of everybody else. They'll get over to the offensive side of the ball here. But Shanahan's awesome and he can cover some holes over there with how he coaches and does that. Let's get this going first.

Joel Klatt (33:40)

Okay.

Colin Cowherd (33:41)

I didn't like their draft. There were only two drafts I did not like. Really? Miami Dolphins, San Francisco 49ers. And I think here's the problem. When Belichick got too much power in New England, their drafts went downhill. It's impossible to be a great GM slash head coach. McVeigh has an opinion. Les and the scouting department feed him all year the necessary information. I think Shanahan essentially makes the call. And by the way, John Snyder's drafts and we defend Pete Carroll, but Pete got too much power in Seattle. John Snyder threatened to go to Detroit. He got the power back when they had that, you know, Paul Allen passed away. There was a vacuum of power here. And then John Snyder took the drafts over and the Seahawks have last four drafts. To me, three of the four have been great. Michael Jordan tried to play baseball, Randy Moss basketball. It is hard to be great at one thing. I think the Niners I think Shanahan now has too much of a say in their drafts. I really do. And I think McVeigh has power but it's ultimately less. And the scouting department that is doing the lead work. And by the way, Les and Sean have a very good relationship. You see it every year in the draft room. I think the Niners now it's too much. It's what's happened in New England. I think it's gotten lopsided by the way Brett Veach, Andy Reid and he lets him run the draft. Seattle, John Snyder is now running. I thought the Seahawks had the best draft and I didn't necessarily think it was that close because John runs it. Not the. Not the second year head coach.

J. Mac (35:20)

So it's interesting.

Joel Klatt (35:21)

They.

J. Mac (35:22)

One of the things we thought they needed was a. A left tackle for the future cuz they're a Trent Williams away injury. Colin from being down the tubes. It's over for the season. And remember they lost his backup to the Chiefs so I was surprised they did not go offensive early. But when you look at the screen six defensive players for a defense that lost, I think three or four starters. So I, I think they're plugging holes. Obviously a Georgia edge rusher. I'm going to love Collins how do you guys play?

Colin Cowherd (35:50)

How. How do you not. You had an opportunity to get Kelvin Banks and you had 11 picks in a week graded that high. It was the highest graded left tackle. Will. I mean, again, Will Campbell, who I'm not a huge fan of. I thought New England had a good draft. I'm not a huge Will Campbell fan. He could play inside in three years. I wouldn't be shocked. But I. But I would say this. I looked at the draft. Yes, they did very well at defensive tackle. They need an offensive tackle. So Trent Williams goes down in week six. He's not going to play 17 games. It's over. So that division.

J. Mac (36:26)

Yeah, that division's going to be tough. Colin Arizona had a. They went all defense for Jonathan Gannon. Let me get my guys. Our offense. We got Harrison last year. We got the tight end. Arizona sneaky. Good. You have the Rams in the Super Bowl. I like the Niners. That's going to be a very tough division. I think we both agree. Seahawks are on the outside looking in. Right. But definitely behind the top three.

Colin Cowherd (36:46)

Yeah, I mean, I like Jordan James. That was one of the picks I like. They do need another running back. And again, I have no problem going with edge, rusher and defensive tackle. But if they are great at right tackle, they're old at left tackle. Yeah, you got to drive. To me, it was a miss.

J. Mac (37:02)

Okay, let's go to the Kansas City Chiefs. Their draft featured offensive tackle Josh Simmons out of Ohio State. Now, he is a much scrutinized player. Some people had him as the best tackle, but he's coming off a major injury. I saw a stat that 45% of linemen who suffer this injury never returned to form. Again, I don't know how accurate that is, but yesterday Chiefs director of player personnel Ryan Nutt compared Simmons to a couple of NFL veterans.

Colin Cowherd (37:31)

Josh is one of the better tackles in this draft class. I would give him. You could. You could make your case for the best, but he's definitely in top three.

Joel Klatt (37:39)

In this draft class in terms of what he provides.

Colin Cowherd (37:42)

The only difference maybe between him, some.

Joel Klatt (37:43)

Of the other guys is, you know.

Colin Cowherd (37:46)

He started two years and some of these other guys, like the lsu, Kathy started more. And you can say experience and stuff.

Joel Klatt (37:51)

Like that, but Josh is.

Colin Cowherd (37:53)

Physically, he is elite. I didn't have a problem. Again, massive need, really good player from a great program that gives us a bunch of NFL stars. I didn't have a problem with it.

J. Mac (38:07)

But what about the rest of the Chiefs draft? They go defensive tackle in the second. Sure I get it. Edge, rusher. Everybody needs one of those. Cornerback. That is an issue for them. Their cornerback situation was kind of wonky last year. A wide receiver who's like a dart throw in the fourth round and now linebacker and a running back. I didn't think it was a great draft, but everybody just thinks I'm a Chiefs hater. I'm not a Chiefs hater. I just. Well, I don't think they're gonna be great this year.

Colin Cowherd (38:30)

Sorry. I think the hardest place to draft is 25 and below.

J. Mac (38:35)

Yeah.

Colin Cowherd (38:36)

So you're paying first round money for a second round talent. I thought their draft was fine. You know, it does help to be in the top 15 again. I thought Miami and San Francisco had too many misses for me. I thought Seattle and Cleveland were fantastic. I thought Arizona was pretty good. I like what the Raiders did. But when you get to the bottom of the first round, I mean the Rams told you, listen, we need a tight end, we need more athletic ability and linebacker. But they didn't have a lot of picks. But I would say Cleveland and the Rams getting first round picks next year in a much better draft. Quarterback draft. You could argue Cleveland and the Rams won the draft because that's. They got good players this year. Both teams got two or three starters this year and a first round pick and a much better draft. So we never know how these drafts play out. But I do think there are times you can look at Seattle's draft and go, I watched all those guys in college. Those are starters for the Seahawks.

J. Mac (39:33)

But remember with the Chiefs lost Pacheco last year, their backups were terrible. Their running back, I. Eventually they settled on Kareem Hunt who was okay. But you, you can't rely on him for a big chunk of season next year.

Colin Cowherd (39:44)

I don't.

J. Mac (39:44)

I'm lukewarm on the Chiefs. I know Nick's watching and going to freak out and take shots at me. That's fine. I'm just telling you, keep an eye on the Chiefs as like a nine win team struggled to get in the playoffs. I'm on record. Final story. Colin is the Denver Broncos. Now this is a team where the arrow is pointing up, man. Their win total is much higher than people anticipate. And guess what Sean Payton did in the draft. They went and grabbed a two sport athlete kid named Caleb Lerner out of Utah with their seventh round pick. This kid played five seasons of college basketball. Okay? And Sean Payton famously drafted Jimmy Graham, turned him into an all pro tight end in New Orleans, and here's Peyton talking about how Lerner could provide a similar impact.

Dutch Spokesperson (40:24)

If it turns out like the last one did then, then we'd be real excited. And you go all the way back really in our league historically, you know, Gates was signed, I believe undrafted. And so it's kind of one of those things where the body types for tight end, it's not like they're making less of them. They may be playing volleyball, they may be playing basketball, but, but it's, it's projecting.

Colin Cowherd (40:56)

Yeah, I've said this before. The one position that's really changed to me when I was in the 70s and 80s, I mean tight ends, it was unique. If you were Kellen Winslow and could beat somebody down the field, it was blockers. There was Dave Casper, the Raiders or maybe a Kellen Winslow. You have these six, five and a half, 248 pound athletes now that can run a four, four, nine or a four, five, two. And I think tight end is the one position in this sport that doesn't look like it used to look 30 years ago at all. I mean running backs were always shifty and tough, cornerbacks were always twitchy and athletic and receivers have always had good hands and they're fluid. Tight ends now are often, I mean there just wasn't a lot of Travis Kelce's and now there's multiple guys like that. So I don't have a problem with a pick. I, I mean I remember watching Antonio Gates as a rookie and I like the draft and I'm like, he played like Wayne State or something basketball. And I'm like, how did everybody, you could tell literally his rookie year you're like, how did everybody miss on him? And it was a smart GM move where he was just a great athlete. So I don't have a problem with it. Yeah.

J. Mac (42:03)

So Colin just. I'm on record. This Denver roster is really freaking good. I mean I love everything about their defense. Just remember last year Riley Moss and Saran when they were a bookend cornerbacks, they were awesome late in the season. I know the Bengals obviously lit them up in the final game, but I'm just telling you, this secondary, adding Baron, they're going to be really good. This is a sneaky team. Not to just get into the playoffs, but to make some noise. I do have some questions about the running back room. McLaughlin, Harvey, I don't know about that, but I trust Sean Payton and, and you were right on this team last year. So me down for Broncos in the playoffs.

Colin Cowherd (42:38)

JMAC with the news. Well, that's the news. And thanks for stopping by. The Herd Lie News warriors and the T Wolves getting closer to closing it out. Some thoughts. Hour threes around the corner as well with Greg Olsen and Joel Clapp. The Herd. Be sure to catch live editions of the Herd weekdays at noon Eastern, 9am Pacific on Fox Sports Radio, FS1 and the iHeartRadio app. Hey, it's Steve Covino and I'm Rich Davis and together we're Covino and Rich on Fox Sports Radio. You can catch us weekdays from 5 to 7pm Eastern, 2 to 4 Pacific on Fox Sports Radio. And of course, the iHeartRadio app. Why should you listen to Covino and Rich? We talk about everything. Life, sports, relationships, what's going on in the world. We have a lot of fun talking about the stories behind the stories in the world of sports and pop culture. Stories that, well, other shows don't seem to have the time to discuss. And the fact that we've been friends for the last 20 years and still work together, I mean, that says something, right? So check us out. We like to get you involved too. Take your phone calls, chop it up, as they say. I'd say the most interactive show on Fox Sports Radio, maybe the most interactive show on planet Earth. Be sure to check out Covino and Rich live on Fox Sports radio and the iHeartradio app from 5 to 7pm Eastern, 2 to 4 Pacific. And if you miss any of the live show, just search Kobe Nonrich wherever you get your podcast. And of course on social social media, that's Covino and Rich.

Greg Olsen (43:59)

Hey, so we all make mistakes, but owning up is the right thing to do. You know a Degree Cool Rush deodorant? Well, last year they changed the formula and it did not go well with their fans.

Degree Spokesperson (44:09)

Degree's whole thing is it turns up the sweat and odor protection when you turn up the effort. And good thing it does because Cool Rush fans really turned up the effort to bring back the original formula. One guy even started an online petition.

Greg Olsen (44:25)

And Degree Listen, they admitted they effed up and are bringing the original Cool Rub scent back. And it's exactly how you remember it. Cool, crisp and fresh. It's back in Walmart, Target and other stores now for under $4.

Degree Spokesperson (44:37)

There's a reason why it's been the number one men's antiperspirant for the last decade. It's the same reason why people were not happy when it changed. So if you never tried it, it might be a good time to see what the fuss is about.

Greg Olsen (44:50)

Head to your local Walmart Or Target to try the OG degree. Cool rush for yourself.

Colin Cowherd (44:56)

Introducing Instagram Teen Accounts. A new way to keep your teen safer as they grow. Like making sure they always have their seat belt on. All right, sweetie pie, buckle up. Good job. Or ring the bell on their bike. Okay, kid, give it a try.

Joel Klatt (45:10)

Nice.

Colin Cowherd (45:11)

Or remember their elbow pads. Knees too. Okay. Yep. There you go. New Instagram Teen Accounts. Automatic protections for who can contact your teen and the content they can see. At the end of the season, there's only one team that can call themselves NBA champs. Only one player that can call themselves the number one pick in the NFL draft. Well, there's only one electric SUV worthy of the title. The ultimate. The all electric BMW ix. What I love about the IX is that it delivers legendary BMW performance. While its sleek design exudes innovative style from the inside out. Not to mention how much space and utility it provides. Over 75 cubic feet of cargo space. The IX is completely changing the game with an all electric suv. The greatest legends of sports never compromise any part of the game. So why would you settle for anything less from your suv? After all, there's only one ultimate the BMW ix. Everything you love about the ultimate driving machine.

Dutch Spokesperson (46:10)

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J. Mac (46:41)

Arlington Renegades take on the St. Louis Battle Hawks Fox UFL Friday kicks off at 8pm Eastern.

Colin Cowherd (46:49)

So have you used the term multiple times over the last few weeks that a quarterback dad has become pageant mom is their heart is in the right place but that that kind of intense helicoptering is not always best for the kid. And Nick Wright was on earlier this hour and his belief is mine is that Deion Sanders in this instance didn't do Shador a lot of favors.

Joel Klatt (47:18)

I think this was his first miss where he clearly let made Shador believe because why wouldn't I trust Dion that I am viewed as a blue chipper and a blue chipper can do the things Shedeur did. He was just flatly wrong that no team viewed him as a first round pick. No team viewed him as a clear cut future starter. And then all Of a sudden, you. You find out, oh, I was interviewing for the wrong job. They were interviewing me to be a backup. That's a very different job.

Colin Cowherd (47:57)

Yeah. Than being a starter. And the other thing is, Shador was not the only quarterback to drop in the draft. Quinn Ewers a year ago was considered a first round pick. And before the draft, he was considered a fifth round pick. He went to the seventh. Only one quarterback moved up, Jackson Dart. And that's because one team really liked him. That's it. I will tell you this. I think I can say this now. My friend Tom Telesco used to run the Chargers and Raiders. He really liked Jackson Dart. He goes, I really like his tape. And so he and I went back and forth. I'm like, I don't love him. He goes, I really like him. And so. And Tom wasn't the only one to do that. But he was the first person that came to me about two months ago and he said, hey, I think Jackson Dart's really good. And it's like, well, he drafted Justin Herbert. He's pretty good with that thing. So, I mean, it just. We had a lot of quarterbacks. I thought. I thought Kyle McCord would go third round. Kyle McCord went later. Now, I wasn't into Quinn Ewers, but, you know, I mean, Dylan Gabriel to me was overdrafted. Shador Sanders was underdrafted.

Nick Wright (49:09)

Okay. Have you heard about this? Last year, Degree changed the formula for their Cool Rush deodorant. The fans rebelled and wanted the old scent back. And Degree listened, and that doesn't happen often. They admitted they effed up and are bringing the original Cool Rush scent back. And it's exactly how you remember it. Cool, crisp and fresh. There's a reason why it's the number one men's antiperspirant. And it's back in Walmart, Target and other stores now for under $4. So try it and see what the fuss is about. Head to your local Walmart Target and try the OG Cool Rush for yourself.

Colin Cowherd (49:37)

Summer is almost here, and you can now get almost anything you need for your sunny days delivered with Uber Eats. Now, what do we mean by almost? Well, you can't get a well groomed lawn delivered, but you can get chicken parm delivered. A nice tan. Sorry. A box fan. Happily, yes. A day of sunshine. No. A box of fine wines. Yes. Uber Eats can definitely get you that. Get almost. Almost anything delivered with Uber Eats. Order now. Alcohol in select markets. Product availability may vary by region. See app for details.

Joel Klatt (50:17)

It's nostalgia overload as Wilmer Valderrama and.

Colin Cowherd (50:20)

Freddie Rodriguez welcome another amigo to their podcast, Dos Amigos. Wilmer's friend and former that 70s show castmate Toby Jennifer Grace stops by the speakeasy for a two part interview to discuss his career and reminisce about old times. We were still in that place of like, what will this experience become? And you go, you're having the best time. But it was like such a perfect golden time. Listen to Dos amigos on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts.

Joel Klatt (50:47)

We live in a divided country, and our media couldn't be more polarizing. That's why we started the Middle with Jeremy Hobson. It's about bringing voices not from the extremes, but from the vast middle into the national conversation. Each week we hear from ordinary Americans from all over the country. And when you subscribe to the Middle, you also get an episode each week.

Colin Cowherd (51:05)

Called One Thing Trump did that focuses.

Joel Klatt (51:07)

On just one item from the avalanche of news.

Colin Cowherd (51:10)

Listen to the Middle with Jeremy Hobson.

Joel Klatt (51:12)

On the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast.