Hour 3 - Dan Woike

Summary

Podcast Summary: The Herd with Colin Cowherd – Hour 3 featuring Dan Woicke Release Date: May 6, 2025

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Introduction

In the third hour of The Herd with Colin Cowherd, host Colin Cowherd brings together sports analysts Nick Wright and Bomani Jones to delve deep into current NBA dynamics, focusing primarily on the Los Angeles Lakers' recent performances, coaching decisions, and roster adjustments. The episode offers insightful commentary on team strategies, player performances, and the intricate balance between passion and professionalism in high-stakes sports environments.

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1. J.J. Redick’s Coaching Tenure with the Lakers

The discussion kicks off with an in-depth analysis of J.J. Redick’s role as the Lakers' coach, examining his approach and its impact on the team’s performance.

• Redick’s Passion and Intensity

  • No. 03:50 – Bomani Jones compares Redick’s intensity to a job interview answer, stating, “It is, though. Kind of one of those things… they’re too intense, they care too much.”
  • No. 06:00 – Bomani emphasizes Redick’s adaptability, noting, “J.J. Redick's coaching philosophy on day one was different than his coaching philosophy on game five. He needs to coach to the strengths and the weaknesses of his team.”

• Performance Under Pressure

  • No. 06:47 – Nick Wright highlights Redick’s internal pressure to win: “His pressure does come from within. Like, he wants to win as badly as anybody I've ever met.”
  • No. 07:00 – Bomani discusses Redick’s strategic decisions during playoff games, critiquing the Lakers' stamina: “Tired players do miss layups… that was why the Lakers were tired.”

2. Lakers’ Strategic Challenges Against Luka Doncic and the Mavericks

The conversation shifts to the Lakers’ struggles against Luka Doncic and the Dallas Mavericks, focusing on defensive strategies and roster construction.

• Defensive Matchups

  • No. 16:09 – Bomani explains the Lakers’ difficulty in containing Doncic: “This is why you … need rim protector.”
  • No. 17:00 – Bomani further elaborates on team defense: “They need more length and athleticism on the wings, more two-way players.”

• Roster Building and Player Roles

  • No. 19:06 – Nick Wright questions the retention of Austin Reaves, suggesting a need for more impactful players: “They need to move Austin Reaves and get a legit big.”
  • No. 23:25 – Bomani discusses potential roster moves, emphasizing the importance of fitting Luka Doncic into a suitable team structure: “What matters most is what you put around him.”

3. Comparative Analysis: Lakers vs. Western Conference Contenders

Nick and Bomani compare the Lakers’ strategies to other powerhouse teams in the Western Conference, such as Oklahoma City (OKC), Houston, and San Antonio, highlighting differences in team building and potential for future success.

• Team Building Philosophies

  • No. 21:04 – Bomani critiques the Lakers’ tendency to make “huge swings” in their roster, contrasting them with teams like OKC that steadily build through draft picks.
  • No. 22:05 – Nick Wright reinforces the idea that the Lakers' reluctance to move key players like Austin Reaves hampers their ability to strengthen the roster effectively.

• Future Prospects

  • No. 25:03 – Bomani speculates on future roster moves, suggesting that the Lakers need to focus on acquiring quality big men to complement Luka Doncic.
  • No. 26:33 – Nick concludes that the Western Conference will be dominated by teams like San Antonio and Houston, based on their strategic acquisitions and draft capital.

4. Player Performance and Team Dynamics

The analysts delve into individual player performances, particularly focusing on Austin Reaves and Luka Doncic, and how their dynamics influence the Lakers’ overall effectiveness.

• Austin Reaves’ Role and Potential

  • No. 10:04 – Bomani praises Reaves’ adaptability: “He has the relationship with his organization… he is the guy that everybody can talk to and he's a problem solver.”
  • No. 22:05 – Bomani emphasizes Reaves’ importance as a bridge within the locker room, enhancing team cohesion.

• Luka Doncic’s Defensive Capabilities

  • No. 15:45 – Nick Wright criticizes Doncic’s defensive efforts: “Luka will never be a great defender.”
  • No. 16:39 – Bomani acknowledges Doncic’s occasional defensive brilliance but notes inconsistency: “He has flashes like you see… but it wasn’t consistent enough.”

5. Concluding Insights and Future Outlook

As the episode nears its end, the hosts summarize their viewpoints on the Lakers' current state and outline potential strategies for improvement in the upcoming seasons.

• Self-Assessment and Team Identity

  • No. 27:21 – Nick Wright asserts that the Lakers’ self-identity is flawed: “They think there's something they're not.”
  • No. 40:35 – Bomani emphasizes the necessity for self-scouting and honest evaluation: “You have to know yourself before you're scouting guys.”

• Strategic Recommendations

  • No. 22:43 – Nick recommends that the Lakers must be willing to make tough decisions, such as moving Austin Reaves, to enhance their competitiveness.
  • No. 23:43 – Bomani advises focusing on adding quality big men and maintaining the core around LeBron and Doncic to build a championship-contending team.

Notable Quotes

• Bomani Jones at [03:50]: “It is, though. Kind of one of those things… they’re too intense, they care too much.”
• Bomani Jones at [06:00]: “J.J. Redick's coaching philosophy on day one was different than his coaching philosophy on game five. He needs to coach to the strengths and the weaknesses of his team.”
• Nick Wright at [06:47]: “His pressure does come from within. Like, he wants to win as badly as anybody I've ever met.”
• Bomani Jones at [17:00]: “They need more length and athleticism on the wings, more two-way players.”
• Nick Wright at [19:06]: “They need to move Austin Reaves and get a legit big.”
• Bomani Jones at [22:43]: “What matters most is what you put around him.”

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Conclusion

In this episode of The Herd, Colin Cowherd, along with analysts Nick Wright and Bomani Jones, provides a comprehensive examination of the Los Angeles Lakers’ current challenges and future prospects. Through thoughtful analysis and candid discussions, listeners gain a deeper understanding of the complexities involved in team management, coaching strategies, and player dynamics within the high-pressure environment of the NBA. The episode underscores the importance of self-awareness, strategic roster building, and adaptability in pursuing championship success.

Transcript

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[Jason McIntyre]

Thanks for listening to the Herd podcast. Be sure to catch us live every weekday on Fox Sports Radio and noon to 3 Eastern, 9am to noon Pacific. Find your local station for the [e-mail] or stream us live every day on the iHeartRadio app by searching Fox Sports Radio or FSR.

[Bomani Jones]

Now let's get this party started.

[Fox Sports Radio Announcer]

You're listening to Fox Sports Radio.

[Nick Wright]

One of our guys, Dan Woicke, covers the Lakers. Went to every single game this year. And by the way, these days in the media that doesn't know what's happened you got television broadcasters not even go to the same game. Anywho, that's a different topic. Okay, Dan, you got a lot of stuff to talk about. And let's start with the. It's a little bit of the elephant in the room, the J.J. reddick stuff.

[Bomani Jones]

Okay.

[Nick Wright]

So I was saying, I had heard Bomani Jones and Nick Wright brought this up. I thought it was a fascinating take. Is that a lot of people who are anxious, they bring it on themselves. It's not external forces. JJ Got very tight in his biggest game as a college player, as an NBA player, very good player. I think he was the 11th pick of Orlando out of the draft, but he. He was a different player in the playoffs. He. Not a lot of big shots, was less of a player. And then you watch him in the Lakers and he runs tight and he gets snippy. And I, And I thought to him, and they're, they're. They theorize is like, this is not just a comfortable college basketball job. It's 82 games. It's NBA, it's the Lakers. It's a big market media. And let's just. Let's just talk about J.J. redick's personality. Is it a little bit of a concern?

[Bomani Jones]

I think maybe a little bit. It is, though. Kind of one of those things, Colin, where, like, if you're at a job interview and somebody asks you, like, what's your biggest weakness? And it's like, I care too much. It's like you're also. It's also kind of flexing how much you care. Right. And I think there are certainly worse things that you can say about somebody other than they're too intense, they care too much. They're too passionate about what they're doing. They put too much into it. And I do think with JJ there is an element of this, right? Like, this is. And it's funny because that this was the type that the Lakers were sort of chasing. The other name, right? The other person who got off of the job. One other person got off the job is Dan Hurley. And if we talk about being wound tight and stuff like that, they were clearly looking for that, for that level of intensity, right? That level of passion.

[Nick Wright]

In the NBA, there's always been this theory you're either a scheme guy or you're like Joe Tory in baseball. Now, Steve Kerr is both, Spoelstra is both. Or you're a good in the room guy. Now, now, young coaches tend to be really good with the players.

[Bomani Jones]

JJ Had a really good year with players.

[Nick Wright]

That's Right. Is he a good scheme guy?

[Bomani Jones]

I think so. I mean, I think, like, it is, you know, look, he made a really showy decision. Right. And their staff made a really showy decision to play the same five players for 24 straight minutes, and then they ran out of gas at the end of the fourth quarter. He defended that decision. I disagree with the defense of the decision. Like, tired players do miss layups. Tired players do turn the ball over. But they were tired in game one when they played seven guys. They were tired in game two. They were tired, Colin, because they had to play small so much. That's why they were tired. Right. Like, Minnesota's big, and Minnesota's really, really big, and they're really dynamic and they're really athletic, and it was a horrible matchup, and that's why the Lakers were tired. I do think that the best thing I can say about J.J. redick's season, having seen it, as you mentioned, you know what? You got along with him 93 games. I've known him a very long time, is that J.J. redick's coaching philosophy on day one was different than his coaching philosophy on game five.

[Nick Wright]

Yeah.

[Bomani Jones]

Of the west, the first round of play. And that doesn't mean he was soft on convictions. I think you could. Anybody who's seen JJ R. Talk knows that he's not soft on convictions. I think his primary conviction was, I need to coach to my team, and I need to coach to the strengths and the weaknesses of my team. And that's. That is my philosophy. So when he had Anthony Davis and LeBron James, that meant shooting 20 threes a game. Cool. They shot 20 threes a game. That meant when they had Luka doncic, they shot 50. It is. There's a flexibility there, and that would give me, I think, the most confidence moving forwards is that he's going to do. To Bomani and Nick's point, he is very hard on himself. His pressure does come from within. Like, he wants to win as badly as anybody I've ever met. He hasn't won. It's been a long time since he's won a championship.

[Nick Wright]

Yeah.

[Bomani Jones]

You know, he's going to do. He's going to do everything to put himself in a position to be better, and I think that's good. Now when the moment comes again, you know, is. Is he going to. I mean, that's part of. That's part of being who he is.

[Nick Wright]

Part of. It reminded me of Brandon Staley with the Chargers. I'm like, when you start attacking the pretty nice LA Media. This isn't Philly. This is in Boston. This isn't, you know, Chicago, Louisiana. Media is pretty fair.

[Bomani Jones]

Yeah. And I mean, look, we. We did, you know, I'd say, you know, as I'm counting it out in my head, if it's, you know, six preseason games, 82 regular season games, five playoff games.

[Nick Wright]

He had three bad pressures.

[Bomani Jones]

93. Yeah, we. We talked to him pre and post. 93 times. There were a couple clips that. That went viral. Yeah. You know, I. I think, again, I prefer in these situations, a coach who will listen to what we ask, who will answer the questions that we ask. He told me at times this year he thought I was grasping at things. Fine, let's have it. We'll have a conversation about it. And I think, like, that part of it, to me, more signaled. I think the more revealing JJ Redick press conference moment for me was before game one of the first round of the playoffs when, again, he had had a week to think about a game, and he looked it and he acted it in a way where the team had no. He was so.

[Nick Wright]

Yeah, they didn't scrimmage.

[Bomani Jones]

Yeah. You know, they were just too. They were just. They wanted it too much, or at least as a coaching staff. And like, that wasn't the right. It wasn't the right energy. Minnesota seemed much more relaxed, much more loose. Seemed like they had more fun.

[Nick Wright]

Yeah.

[Bomani Jones]

And I think that showed off in the court.

[Nick Wright]

Okay. I've been saying this for years. I understand when people. America likes the underdog. I don't. I'm a Yankee, Dodger, Ohio State.

[Bomani Jones]

You sound like LeBron.

[Nick Wright]

I'm not.

[Bomani Jones]

This is the LeBron. This is the LeBron fandom list. Yeah.

[Nick Wright]

Yeah. I'm not an underdog fan. You can draft TCU players. I'll draft Texas guys. I don't care. And so Brock Purdy, everybody roots for him. It gets rainy and he can't hold the ball. Austin Reeves is undrafted. There's a reason I like Austin Reeves. They don't have a big. If he's a 3, you're not winning the championship. If he's a 4, I don't think he's nearly as good as Derrick White, but if he is a four, you could maybe get to the finals because I'm looking at Michael Porter's a four with Westbrook playing well, he. Is he a five for Denver, their fifth best player. What is this? What is this? Are they going to move Austin Reaves and how do they view him in house?

[Bomani Jones]

I don't think they're going to move them. I don't think there is a.

[Nick Wright]

He was awful against the T Wolves.

[Bomani Jones]

He was, he had a bad series.

[Nick Wright]

And by the way they kept throwing athletes at him.

[Bomani Jones]

Bad series. But still Colin, I mean like, I mean bad series to the eye test, more so than the numbers. Certainly couldn't get to the line. You know, I think and some of that, like this sounds like an excuse and it is what it is. If you're on the court, you're on the court. He was playing through a pretty severe foot injury, pretty severe toe injury in games four and five. I think the thing with Austin, there's a couple things. One, this is a guy who every time they've a challenge has been kind of issued to him.

[Nick Wright]

Yeah, he's answered it.

[Bomani Jones]

He's answered it right from being undrafted to being. Can he be a rotation player to being a starter.

[Nick Wright]

Can he be, can he play with.

[Bomani Jones]

Luke, can he play with Luka? Can he be, you know, at times the second best offensive player on this team? You know, I think at the contract he's at, certainly the relationship he has within the organization with, with people in the organization. The relationship he has with his, in the locker room as sort of like the bridge between the LeBron tier of the locker room and say like the bottom tier of the locker room. Like he's the, the glue of all of this. Right? He is the guy that everybody can talk to and he's a problem solver and they believe in him. They really believe in him. They think this was a bad series.

[Nick Wright]

They want to, they want an all star back.

[Bomani Jones]

He's, I mean, yeah, like this is like tippy top. I mean this is a, they view him as an all star level player who makes $15 million. So at, at, at the early stages of his prime now, cuz I don't.

[Nick Wright]

Think you can run this team back. LeBron is hit and miss.

[Bomani Jones]

They need a center. There's no doubt about it. I mean and there's no doubt about.

[Nick Wright]

CJ Reddick doesn't play Jackson Hayes. He's telling the front office, get me a legit bit.

[Bomani Jones]

So if there, if there was a center, Colin, that was like a big time needle mover. Not just like he's a good center because we need. That's not a big, not a big. I mean they're good players and they're players that would fit what the Lakers are doing. They're not players that the Lakers would part with Austin Reeves for Nate Claxton.

[Nick Wright]

They wouldn't.

[Bomani Jones]

No.

[Nick Wright]

Okay.

[Bomani Jones]

I don't believe so.

[Nick Wright]

Okay, here's another one. There are certain things where people don't change. Like you can get. You can get. Like for instance, you could tell somebody, hey, if you don't stop smoking, you're going to die.

[Bomani Jones]

Yep.

[Nick Wright]

And they will stop smoking. Or you need to lose weight. You're unhealthy in your appearance.

[Bomani Jones]

Do you have my medical files back there, Colin? It seems like you might. Did somebody violate hipaa?

[Fox Sports Radio Announcer]

Okay, be sure to catch live editions of the Herd, weekdays at noon Eastern, 9am Pacific on Fox Sports Radio, FS1 and the iHeartRadio app.

[Colin Cowherd]

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[Jason McIntyre]

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[Colin Cowherd]

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[Jason McIntyre]

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[Colin Cowherd]

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[Jason McIntyre]

Now, what do we mean by almost? Well, you can't get a well groomed lawn delivered, but you can get chicken parm delivered. A day at the lake? That's a no. A Philly cheesesteak? That's a yes. A nice tan. Sorry. A box fan. Happily, yes. What about a day of sunshine? Not happening. How about a box of fine wines? Yeah, that's happening. Delivery's on its way. Okay, how about some clear skies? Nope. Well, how about some french fries? Yeah. So how about a freshly cut lawn? Can't help you there. But a barbecued prawn? Order it and it's on its way. Even throw in some paper towels. Clean up after the feast. So while you can't get fun in the sun delivered, don't worry because you can get pork buns delivered. Uber Eats can definitely get you that. Get almost. Almost anything delivered with Uber Eats. Order now. Alcohol in select markets. Product availability may vary by region. See app for details. Looking to transform your business through better HR and payroll? Meet Paycor, a paychecks company. The powerhouse solution that empowers leaders to Drive results. From recruiting and development to payroll and analytics, paycor connects you with the people, data and expertise you need to succeed. Their innovative platform helps you make smarter decisions about your most valuable asset. Your people. Are you ready to become a Better Leader? Visit paycor.com leaders to learn more. That's paycor.com leaders.

[Colin Cowherd]

Hey, so we all make mistakes, but.

[Jason McIntyre]

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[Colin Cowherd]

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[Nick Wright]

There are other things that people are what they are. Yeah. And I'll give you an example. Work ethic. You either grind or you don't. If you're. If you're wake and bait guy or you've always been party guy on campus, I love you, but that's who you are.

[Bomani Jones]

Sure.

[Nick Wright]

It gets to all the guys that were party guys in college, they kind of. They are what they are.

[Bomani Jones]

Yeah.

[Nick Wright]

So defense. James Harden has never cared about it, Carmelo Anthony never cared about it, and Luca doesn't care about it. Now Jokic has made an improvement. He's never going to be great defensive.

[Bomani Jones]

I have two. There's another name of mine.

[Nick Wright]

So my knock is if you're. If you're having these meetings with Luca and you're like, listen, we need you to be blank defensively. This is what he is now. He can be a better version of this, but how many years do I have to see teams attack him before we just acknowledge he's been playing basketball for 18 years? This is what he is defensively.

[Bomani Jones]

Yeah. I think the frustrating part with. With Luka Doncic, defense Is that in. In flashes like you see, you know, the six foot seven guy, use his body well, position it well, move his feet, get, get into, get into the spots that he's. Use his brain, right. To be an active defender. You see it at times. You saw it for lightning bolt flashes in this series when the stakes were highest. It wasn't consistent enough. The Lakers know it. Luka Doncic knows it. The Dallas Mavericks knew it. Nico Harrison knew it.

[Nick Wright]

The league knows it.

[Bomani Jones]

The league knows it. This is why you. This is the big. The. One of the biggest differences between last year's playoffs versus this year's playoffs when it came to Minnesota was that they went at Luka Dacic harder this year. They put him in that position and quite frankly, the way you need to do it is that you need to build the right kind of team defense around him and you can get away with it.

[Nick Wright]

Dallas gave you the roadmap. So when Kyrie and Luka were together, they started tanking to get. And then the next year in the trade deadline, they went and got big. You have. So the Lakers liability is the opposite of what works with Luka. You need rim protector.

[Bomani Jones]

Yeah. Colin and I think you know that, that sort of, you know, Hollywood Summit or meeting or whatever you want to call it between Luca and Rob Polinka and J.J. redick. It was not all this stuff, right? It was the trade happens, right? And it is about getting Luka Doncic as comfortable as possible, as fast as possible. After having like, you know, his entire professional, like, world just like kind of ripped out, right? Like, because that's what this was. He didn't expect to be traded. He was going to finish his career in Dallas. And then all of a sudden he's not. Right. He's somewhere totally new, really, playing for the third team in his life. As a, as a. Since he was 15, this is the third different team he's ever played for. So I think the season was about getting him as adjusted, as comfortable as possible and trying to maximize a roster that quite frankly wasn't built for him.

[Nick Wright]

Right?

[Bomani Jones]

And he's the kind of player who, when given a roster built for him. We saw what happened last year in Dallas and I think, you know, my understanding is what that meeting was, was not just JJ and Rob telling him, put down the bread basket, like, you know, we're going to go keto this summer. That's not what it was. It was what. Let's talk basketball now. Now we can get into the part of this. You're here. We think you're going to be here a long time. How do we make you the best version of yourself? What can we do to, to, to maximize your skills? What kind of players do you want to see around you? Let's get to work. I'm building this thing out and we've talked about it. You know, they need more length and athleticism on the wings, more two way players. They need more size. Easier said than done. Most teams want those things. They don't have a ton of assets to get it. But you know, I think there is a belief at least you know, from the dodgy camp in sort of what a LeBron Luka Austin reaves core can do and then building around it.

[Nick Wright]

I think you got to move off Austin if you want to get a legit big. That's an uncomfortable conversation.

[Bomani Jones]

It is. I just think that like by the.

[Nick Wright]

Way, OKC's younger and better. Cleveland's younger and better. Indy's younger and I think better. Boston's better. At some point you just got to say guys, we won the Luca trade by a mile. We could lose a little.

[Bomani Jones]

I just think that's the, the question to me is just still again is like where the big is and who the big is. And I, and I think like Gafford for Austin Reeves. I think they can get Gafford without Austin Reeves.

[Nick Wright]

All right.

[Bomani Jones]

I mean that's, honestly they have a, like they have a first round pick. You know, they have a, a player in Dalton connect that, that has some value. I think that can kind of get you there on the starting point. I think, you know, you have your swaps, you can be more creative. You have like you have in a roster building thing. Right. And it's, it'll be interesting how different the team is to, you know, we don't know what LeBron's long term future is. Yeah, I mean we do. It's retirement eventually but, but, but you know, when you have a player you can count on around $15 million and you've got your, your, your megamax guy, you have more flexibility than it might appear. And, and I think I'm curious to see what the Lakers do with their expiring money. They have some expiring contracts. They have a first round pick they can trade. Yeah, they can get a little creative in that and I think, you know, they felt one of the other things and it's funny how, how much five games and four losses can change things. But you know, going into this playoffs, Colin, like I've been around teams that have said they Think they can win championships and we all know they couldn't. This Lakers team had that belief like they had really had that belief is.

[Nick Wright]

Belief is.

[Bomani Jones]

No, but like an authentic belief. Like a truly authentic belief.

[Nick Wright]

I think you can authentically believe a lot. That doesn't make it true.

[Fox Sports Radio Announcer]

Sure.

[Bomani Jones]

And I think. I think when they will approach this offseason, they need to do so with. This is the hard part about team building in the NBA. You don't want to be react. You don't want to be too reactionary to what just happened. But you have to look at yourself in the mirror and know where you're. Where you're soft.

[Nick Wright]

Yeah. And they don't. Rams are really good at looking at themselves and asking hard questions. I'm not sure the Lakers are.

[Bomani Jones]

I mean the Lakers lost the first round series with three years ago. Three years ago. Three or four years ago to the Phoenix Suns. Right.

[Nick Wright]

Right.

[Bomani Jones]

And decided that the best course of action was to trade for Russell Westbrook. That was an overreaction. It was an over calculated. It was. It was an overreaction to. To what had happened the season before. They thought they needed more punch, they needed another ball handler. They needed all these things.

[Nick Wright]

Yeah.

[Bomani Jones]

They needed to make a big change. That big change set back the organization multiple years and they were given a.

[Nick Wright]

Way out this year. What you're largely saying is, and this is true, the Lakers have always been at their best taking huge swings.

[Bomani Jones]

They get the big stuff right.

[Nick Wright]

Yeah. If you're not.

[Bomani Jones]

They got to get the small stuff right. This way, if you're not willing to.

[Nick Wright]

Move Austin Reeves, you're not taking a swing. Oklahoma City will be marketably like Cleveland. They'll be better next year. Like they're not going backwards.

[Bomani Jones]

Sure. Like San Antonio is going to. San Antonio's coming. Everybody knows that's going to happen.

[Nick Wright]

We're going to keep Austin, but we're going to find. Okay. You need to have.

[Bomani Jones]

You have to believe in Luca. You have to believe in like you have to believe in Luca. Luka doncic1 and you have to believe in Austin Reeves.

[Nick Wright]

LeBron's not getting younger.

[Bomani Jones]

Sure.

[Nick Wright]

Luca will never be a great defender. And Austin is undrafted. Good. But he's undrafted.

[Bomani Jones]

Yeah.

[Nick Wright]

He was physically worked.

[Bomani Jones]

Yeah. I think this is. And when J.J. redick says things like we need to be in championship condition, like he's not just talking about Luka. Like it, it is a, A a more of a. A roster wide thing where they need to be. They need to be in a better position. Should. Should they have to play that style again for the amount of time that they did. Now, perfect world, you don't have to play that style. You get the big. You get the right guy in there. I think you keep your core together. And that's the plan. And that's the plan.

[Nick Wright]

The Lakers are becoming the Clippers.

[Bomani Jones]

They're not going to like that.

[Nick Wright]

Hey, you know next year when Kawhi comes back. No, no. Kawhi will play 40 games.

[Bomani Jones]

Sure.

[Nick Wright]

Well, James Harden will be James Harden. The Clippers now are trying to talk them. People do this all the time.

[Bomani Jones]

But like Luka Dachicola doesn't lose in the first round of the playoffs. This is the anomaly.

[Nick Wright]

That's great.

[Bomani Jones]

This is the anomaly.

[Nick Wright]

Austin's undrafted and JJ Redick's got a ways to go. Elite coach. Those things do not change.

[Bomani Jones]

Yeah, I agree with you. And I think that, I think you're.

[Nick Wright]

Higher on the Lakers than I am.

[Bomani Jones]

I think what I think I. I think I believe in a, in a Doncic. Like I've seen enough of like what Luca at the core of a team can be when it's. When it's not a great fit with.

[Nick Wright]

A great center rotation.

[Bomani Jones]

But when it was not a great fit, he went to the Western Conference finals. Like when. With a really good center.

[Nick Wright]

With a really good, better coach. Absolutely. And a great center rotation. Lakers don't have one center they trust. Not one.

[Bomani Jones]

I know. And that's. And that is the task this offseason. That is top line number one.

[Nick Wright]

You can't get there without moving on.

[Bomani Jones]

I think you can. You mentioned if Nick Claxton to you answers that question, you can get Nick Claxton without training Austin Reeves like you can. You have expiring money. You have a first round pick that'll get you Nick Claxton like they were. I mean, if Mark Williams, if they felt better about what they saw with Mark Williams, knees and ankles and stuff like that. They get Mark Williams with Dalton connect in a first round pick and the problem solved, they can get there. I think it is going to be a very focused thing. The caution I would say is again, is that on paper they can the Lakers win the offseason all the time. On paper doesn't mean anything. You might wake up on July 2nd and Clint Capella is on your team and Brook Lopez is on your team and you're like, we've got centers. They might not be the right fits if you watch, if you watch the playoffs. Colin, this is the biggest thing for me when I look around at the playoffs last night, and I was talking yesterday to a scout about this. Look at a guy like Isaiah Hartenstein, right guarded Jokic Cray. Last night, the Clippers, like, chose John Wall instead of Isaiah Hartenstein. Isaiah Hartenstein was on the Knicks and no longer on the Knicks. Isaiah Hartenstein was on the Rockets and no longer on the Rockets. You gotta get role players at the right time, at the right situation. He wasn't dead. You got to get him at the right time in the right situation. And that's where the best executives do their best work. The getting Luca is the most important part.

[Colin Cowherd]

Yeah.

[Bomani Jones]

What matters most is what you put around him.

[Nick Wright]

All right, 30 seconds. KD. 30 seconds. Where's he end up?

[Bomani Jones]

I think it's Houston. Just seems like the most logical San Antonio if we want to get really wild.

[Nick Wright]

They got a lot of. Well, I mean, Houston's not getting both of them.

[Bomani Jones]

Like, I, I mean, like, I, I, if, if, if Giannis wants to win, that's a fun pathway to winning. If he wants to go to a big market, it gets a little trickier.

[Nick Wright]

Well, yeah, big markets don't matter anymore, I don't think. I mean, I think it helps Jay.

[Bomani Jones]

Quality of life. It matters. Quality of life. People at a certain point when they, where they want to live. But, like, I think, I think Giannis is fat. Like, Giannis is fascinating because he has maximized his opportunity in Milwaukee. He's enjoyed it there. He's been great for that community. There's tons of, like, the ties are really strong there. We'll see. I mean, Miami, you could build around him pretty easily there.

[Nick Wright]

What do they have to give me?

[Bomani Jones]

Tyler hero, Milwaukee zone, Wisconsin legend. Tyler here.

[Nick Wright]

Miami doesn't have enough to give it bigs.

[Bomani Jones]

I mean, like, it's gonna have to be like. I mean, the teams that have this.

[Nick Wright]

Stuff, I want Shen Gooner. We're not. I'm hanging the phone up.

[Bomani Jones]

Oh, well, Houston would do that in a second for Shanghai.

[Nick Wright]

No, no, Shangoon. I'm not getting them. I want Sengun.

[Bomani Jones]

You're starting with the men. Thompson. That is where that conversation.

[Nick Wright]

They're not moving him. I wouldn't move.

[Bomani Jones]

Maybe they don't get Giannis. Like, that's where you don't have to trade him in. You don't want to put yourself in the Nico position where you don't end up with the players you want. You got to get. Well, he got the player one. It was Anthony Davis. You have to get the young players you want if you're going to trade.

[Nick Wright]

Giannis, Shen Goon, Jalen Green. Three first round picks.

[Bomani Jones]

Not enough.

[Nick Wright]

And Jabari Smith.

[Bomani Jones]

Not enough.

[Nick Wright]

Not enough.

[Bomani Jones]

Not enough. Not for Giannis.

[Steve Covino]

We can offer more than that because I'm looking at chat GPT the most draft capital next five years. Okc Brooklyn, Utah.

[Bomani Jones]

I mean okc. OKC can get there. That's OKC can get there fun. And they can get there quickly.

[Nick Wright]

They could win next year anyway.

[Bomani Jones]

We'll see. They got some big game work to do.

[Nick Wright]

Well, yeah, that's we'll see.

[Bomani Jones]

They got some big game work.

[Nick Wright]

One guy on this set thought Denver had a shot in this series. That's right, the old gray haired guy.

[Bomani Jones]

Not the former smoker with the weight problem. That's good. I'm glad it wasn't him.

[Nick Wright]

Of the LA Times. We break it there.

[Fox Sports Radio Announcer]

Be sure to catch live editions of the Herd weekdays at noon Eastern, 9am Pacific.

[Rich Davis]

Hey, it's Steve Covino and I'm Rich Davis and together we're Covino and Rich on Fox Sports Radio.

[Dan Woicke]

You can catch us weekdays from 5 to 7pm Eastern, 2 to 4 Pacific on Fox Sports Radio. And of course, the I Heart Radio app.

[Rich Davis]

Why should you listen to Covino and Rich?

[Dan Woicke]

We talk about everything. Life, sports, relationships, what's going on in the world.

[Rich Davis]

We have a lot of fun talking about the stories behind the stories in the world of sports and pop culture. Stories that, well, other shows don't seem to have the time to discuss.

[Dan Woicke]

And the fact that we've been friends for the last 20 years and still work together, I mean, that says something, right?

[Rich Davis]

So check us out. We like to get you involved too. Take your phone calls, chop it up, as they say.

[Dan Woicke]

I'd say the most interactive show on Fox Sports Radio, maybe the most interactive show on planet Earth.

[Rich Davis]

Be sure to check out Covino and Rich live on Fox Sports radio and the iHeartradio app from 5 to 7pm Eastern, 2 to 4 Pacific.

[Dan Woicke]

And if you miss any of the live show, just search Ko, Vino and Rich wherever you get your podcast. And of course on social media, that's Covino and Rich.

[Colin Cowherd]

At the end of the season, there's only one team that can call themselves NBA champs. Only one player that can call themselves the number one pick in the NFL draft. Well, there's only one electric SUV worthy of the title.

[Jason McIntyre]

The ultimate.

[Colin Cowherd]

The all electric BMW ix. What I love about the IX is that it delivers legendary BMW performance, while its sleek design exudes innovative style from the inside out, not to mention how much space and utility it provides over 75 cubic feet of cargo space. The IX is completely changing the game. With an all electric suv, the greatest legends of sports never compromise any part of the game. So why would you settle for anything less from your suv? After all, there's only one ultimate the BMW ix. Everything you love about the ultimate driving machine. Electrified summer is almost here, and you.

[Jason McIntyre]

Can now get almost anything you need for your sunny days delivered with Uber Eats. Now, what do we mean by almost? Well, you can't get a well groomed lawn delivered, but you can get chicken parm delivered. A day at the lake? That's a no. A Philly cheesesteak? That's a yes. A nice tan. Sorry. A box fan? Happily, yes. What about a day of sunshine? Not happening. How about a box of fine wines? Yeah, that's happening. Delivery's on its way. Okay. How about some clear skies? Nope. Well, how about some french fries? Yeah. So how about a freshly cut lawn? Can't help you there. But a barbecued prawn? Order it and it's on its way. Even throw in some paper towels. Clean up after the feast. So while you can't get fun in the sun delivered, don't worry, because you can get pork buns delivered. Uber Eats can definitely get you that. Get almost. Almost anything delivered with Uber Eats. Order now. Alcohol in select markets. Product availability may vary by region. See app for details. Looking to transform your business through better HR and payroll? Meet paycor, a paychecks company. The powerhouse solution that empowers leaders to drive results. From recruiting and development to payroll and analytics, paycor connects you with the people, data and expertise you need to succeed. Their innovative platform helps you make smarter decisions about your most valuable asset. Your people. Are you ready to become a Better Leader? Visit paycor.com leaders to learn more. That's paycor.com leaders.

[Colin Cowherd]

Hey, so we all make mistakes, but.

[Jason McIntyre]

Owning up to them is the right thing to do.

[Colin Cowherd]

So you know Degree Cool Rush deodorant, right? Well, last year they changed the formula and it did not go over well with their fans. So Degree's whole thing is it turns up the sweat and odor protection when you turn up the effort. And good thing it does, because Cool Rush fans really turned up the effort to bring the original formula back. One guy even started an online petition and Degree listened. They admitted they effed up. They're bringing back the original Cool Rush scent. They're bringing it back and it's exactly how you remember it. Cool, crisp and fresh. It's back in Walmart, Target and other stores now. For under $4. There's a reason it's been the number one men's antiperspirant for the last decade. It's the same reason why people were not happ when it changed. So if you've never tried it, it might be a good time to see what the fuss is about. Head to your local Walmart target and try the OG degree. Cool rush for yourself.

[Nick Wright]

Good argument. I think the Lakers have become the Clippers. How they view themselves is not realistic. And all the good teams in the NBA like Houston and OKC just in the west, those teams have so many first round picks, they're just going to get better and better. And San Antonio is just going to get better and better. And the Lakers and Clippers are like, hey, we're not changing a thing with Austin Reaves, you better. San Antonio, Houston and OKC, this is the worst they'll be for the next five years. And you got old LeBron, you got Luka not in shape, you got Kawhi that never plays. You got James Harden who just doesn't deliver consistently in the playoffs. And they're all old. The west is going to be dominated by San Antonio, Houston and Houston's gonna go get KD or Giannis and beat the doors off those LA teams by next year. J Mac with the news.

[Bomani Jones]

No, no, no. Heard on the news.

[Fox Sports Radio Announcer]

This is the Herd line News fired up today.

[Steve Covino]

Oh my goodness. Let's see if we can do anything here for you. Kenny Atkinson won the NBA's coach of the year in his first year with the Cavs. They won 64 games and the number one seed in the East Colony got 59 of the 101st place votes. Atkinson said, I've changed. I wouldn't have been ready for this job before. I need to get fired. I needed those experiences, needed to go through all that. Remember, he was fired specifically by Kyrie Irving in Brooklyn. Bicker Staff of Detroit finished second, which was a little surprising since they tripled their win total. And then IME Udoka of Houston finished third. Listen man, if by the way, I don't want you to go overboard here. Cats practice today. No Mobley Garland or DeAndre Hunter. That line is plummeting. If the Pacers go up 20 in the series, I think it's over. And then what do you do for Atkinson? Like he was great this year. Well, but you get bounced in the second round, bro.

[Bomani Jones]

Come on.

[Nick Wright]

Well, it's injuries. I mean if you don't have Darius Garland and I got Halliburton spinning and Dealing and pacing that one time.

[Steve Covino]

All star Darius Garland.

[Nick Wright]

Darius Garland is their setup guy. The rest, Donovan Mitchell's not a point. He shoots too much when he has.

[Colin Cowherd]

The ball too much.

[Nick Wright]

You have to set him up to succeed. If you don't have. If you don't have Darius Garland. Mobley, you're not beating in. Indiana is a good team.

[Steve Covino]

Sometimes you're missing a star. You got to pivot on the fly. Atkinson did not do that.

[Nick Wright]

Oh, boy.

[Steve Covino]

On days I'm out, you surely work with Jordan. You guys are fine.

[Nick Wright]

And Andy Reid didn't have a good left tackle. Andy, you got to pivot sometimes the other team has better players.

[Steve Covino]

Fix the problem. You're a championship coach. Fix it. Come on. Kenny Atkinson.

[Nick Wright]

Kenny Atkinson.

[Steve Covino]

He's not win tonight.

[Nick Wright]

Well, he doesn't have to win. He's not going to get fired.

[Steve Covino]

You go down 02. A series over.

[Nick Wright]

What is if, if you go down 02. Let's, let's play the game first.

[Steve Covino]

Play the game. So line was 10.

[Nick Wright]

You're sounding like. You're sounding like perk.

[Steve Covino]

Oh, no, don't do that to me, Nick.

[Nick Wright]

Nick's win a game and just swear to God, he's the whole holy.

[Steve Covino]

Oh, gosh, please don't compare me to that guy.

[Nick Wright]

Come on.

[Steve Covino]

Next up, let's move on. How about this, Colin? Okay, so Dylan Gabriel was doing some pre draft social media stuff.

[Nick Wright]

Yeah.

[Steve Covino]

And somehow predicted exactly where he was going to be drafted. Are you. Here we go.

[J]

That bird back there.

[Bomani Jones]

What they saying?

[J]

Cleveland Browns 94. That's what he said.

[Steve Covino]

Cleveland Browns with the 94th pick in the 2025 NFL Draft. The Cleveland Browns select Dylan.

[Nick Wright]

Oh, my God.

[Steve Covino]

Pretty cool. Now listen, my brother and his wife are big. They, they call birds. They do that. It's crazy to see. I don't know anybody who's into birds. The fact that Dylan Gabriel could predict this talking to the birds and the way the Browns were pumped to get him. I know people are excited for Shador Sanders.

[Nick Wright]

No, I, I, I make very clear. I make eye contact with our dog Wrigley, and I can talk to my dog without talking to him. If I look at him a certain way, he knows he's in trouble. I can communicate with our dogs and.

[Steve Covino]

He'Ll just go sit in the corner.

[Nick Wright]

Or whatever and I can't, I have to talk with Dan. I can't just.

[Steve Covino]

Colin, this video there is. It's just a quick clip, but how excited Stefanski is that they're getting Gabriel? I'm just telling you Shador has a big mountain to climb here. They love Dylan Gabriel. I don't know why, but they do.

[Nick Wright]

So your, your, your brother talks to birds?

[Steve Covino]

He does, yeah. He's listening now too.

[Nick Wright]

So what do you say? Talk to birds.

[Steve Covino]

You do this bird call with this app and then the birds talk and then they'll like come in your orbit because they think it's another bird.

[Nick Wright]

So do they, when they're there, do they get stuff out of it? I mean they make life decisions based.

[Steve Covino]

You can call like a bird and then he comes over. It's kind of neat for me, but it's neat.

[Nick Wright]

All right.

[Steve Covino]

I'm not, I'm not that impressed.

[Nick Wright]

No, it's not that I'm not impressed. I just, I talk to my dogs.

[Steve Covino]

Yeah, I like dogs as well. Final story. Colin is your guy. Jim Harbaugh drafted one of the top running backs in the class. Oh, Marion Hampton.

[Nick Wright]

Boom.

[Steve Covino]

North Carolina Thumper. Man, I like this guy. Look at that speed. Plus he's got the half shirt on, which is cool. Flex. Anyways, Hampton and Harbaugh seem like a perfect fit.

[J]

Fit in situation is way more important because I feel like you can go anywhere and if it's not your fit, then you won't be able to produce what you can do. We know they're going to run the ball. So I'm loving, I'm excited. I mean we got me and Najee, we got a dominant duo backfield. So I'm excited to learn from him. I'm excited to get out there. Got a good office aligned, good quarterback. I feel like we're building a really something special here.

[Nick Wright]

Listen there. This is really going to be a Harbaugh team. This is going to be. It's a two headed running game, great offensive tackles and a big strong quarterback. They're not going to be. Everybody's freaking out. Oh, the receiving room. That's not, that is not how pharmacist Jim Harbaugh deals the pills. He is a run first power offense, control the clock. He likes his practices to be intense. When he was with the Niners getting the Super Bowls, he had Michael Crabtree. Michigan won a natty with one go to receiver. They threw to the tight end but.

[Steve Covino]

We saw how limited that offense was in the playoffs.

[Nick Wright]

That's because they didn't have the backs. I mean JK Dobbins was banged up. This is going to be a. And by the way, Joel Walt was a rookie at right tackle. This is going to be a much different looking offense over the Chiefs. I have him winning 12 games.

[Steve Covino]

So now when Sean Payton texts you after the show, dude, did you forget about us?

[Nick Wright]

I have you. I have them winning 10 and the Chiefs 910 and the Chargers 12. That's a great. That's the best division in football. And I think by a long you.

[Steve Covino]

Had that over the North. Now that coaching is better than the NFC North.

[Nick Wright]

Keep your eyes Sam Darnold leaving Minnesota. Skull will be.

[Steve Covino]

Well, I, I'm all in on the Vikings this year with J.J. mcCarthy.

[Nick Wright]

Yeah, you were on the Saints last year or that was the year before. No comment.

[Steve Covino]

That was my last story.

[Nick Wright]

But was that your last story, Skull? No, no, no. The Saints in bitcoin. No. You're not a bitcoin guy?

[Steve Covino]

Well, actually I've gotten into it recently.

[Nick Wright]

Oh boy.

[Colin Cowherd]

A little bit.

[Nick Wright]

Another thing we don't agree on.

[Steve Covino]

No, listen, things don't work out. Certain places you got. You got to go bitcoin. That may be the savior. I don't. I have no idea.

[Nick Wright]

J. Mac with the news.

[Fox Sports Radio Announcer]

Well, that's the news and thanks for stopping by the Herd lie news.

[Nick Wright]

You know 94 year old Warren Buffett, you ever asked his opinion on bitcoin? Yeah, not very high.

[Jason McIntyre]

I'm going to go with that guy.

[Nick Wright]

He's. He's pretty smart. Dan Woicke and I. So he just view. I think the Lakers are the Clippers. I think their self identity struggling. I think they think there's something they're not. This is always one of those things where you hear these psychologists talk about this all the time. You have to be more people now in this world are more connected with people that don't matter to them on their phone than they are connected to themselves. You have to be connected to you. Don't worry about the phone. Put the phone down. If it's good with you, the phone will be fine. If it's not good with you, you'll spend all day on a phone feeling bad about yourself. It's the same in pro sports, self scouting. You have to be able to self scout. If you think you're going to keep Austin Reaves and get like a second tier center and going forward beat Houston, who's going to get either KD or Giannis beat okc. This is the worst OKC. You're going to have team for the next five years. They're going to get better and better with all their draft picks. Houston's getting better and better, Wemby's going to get better and those teams have more picks younger in their prime. Hey, we're not willing to move Austin Reeves.

[Colin Cowherd]

Well, are you willing to do the.

[Nick Wright]

Playing game for the next several years? I mean, you got to be able to self scout and be honest with.

[Steve Covino]

The three seed and you're talking playing. What's the disrespect? It's Austin Reeves. He was fantastic all season. He had a rough series going against the face of the game.

[Nick Wright]

He was banged up in this series. Like this is not being disclosed. He was injured.

[Steve Covino]

LeBron got injured. He had to miss the Met Gala last night. He's on the shelf. Luca missed 30 games.

[Nick Wright]

Saquon Barkley was at the Met Gala. He was there. He looked very professional. Yeah, that's. That's. That's high fashion.

[Steve Covino]

I'm surprised you weren't there.

[Nick Wright]

Oh, God, that's the. There's no place in America. And no day in America I would be more uncomfortable than the Met Gala.

[Jason McIntyre]

Really?

[Nick Wright]

I don't like dressing up. Dude, this is it. This is as good as I get.

[Steve Covino]

Yeah. What was the last time you were. A tuxedo.

[Jason McIntyre]

Wow.

[Nick Wright]

Junior year of high school.

[Steve Covino]

Oh, my. You didn't wear one for your wedding?

[Nick Wright]

No.

[Steve Covino]

What. Where'd you get married? On the beach.

[Nick Wright]

I got married near the beach. You know how it is. If you're within a mile. If you can ride a bicycle from where you're getting married to the beach. No tuxes, no talks.

[Steve Covino]

Okay. I'm learning a lot about you. You got your PhD in psychology, I'm assuming, based on that riff just now about phones and being okay with yourself.

[Nick Wright]

I'm just saying, if you don't have yourself, if you don't know yourself, you're not good with yourself. You're on the phone all day, you're seeking stuff you got. You gotta say, it's the same with NFL teams, NBA teams. You gotta know you before you're scouting guys in Dusseldorf. Who are you?

[Jason McIntyre]

What do you need?

[Nick Wright]

What. What are your limitations? You're not going to move Austin Reaves. Well, then you're going to get whacked by the spurs in the first round.

[Colin Cowherd]

See you tomorrow. Summer is almost here.

[Jason McIntyre]

And you can now get almost anything you need for your sunny days delivered with Uber Eats. Now, what do we mean by almost? Well, you can't get a well groomed lawn delivered, but you can get chicken parm delivered. A nice tan. Sorry. A box fan. Happily, yes. A day of sunshine. No. A box of fine wines. Yes. Uber Eats can definitely get you that. Get almost. Almost anything delivered with Uber Eats. Order now. Alcohol in select markets. Product availability may vary by region. See app for details. Looking to transform your business through better HR and payroll? Meet Paycor, a Paychex company. The powerhouse solution that empowers leaders to drive results. From recruiting and development to payroll and analytics, paycor connects you with the people, data and expertise you need to succeed. Their innovative platform helps you make smarter decisions about your most valuable asset your people. Are you ready to become a Better Leader? Visit paycor.com leadership to learn more. That's paycor.com leaders okay, have you heard about this?

[Colin Cowherd]

Last year, Degree changed the formula for their Cool Rush deodorant, and their fans rebelled and wanted the old scent back. And Degree listened. That doesn't happen often. They admitted they effed up and they're bringing back the original Cool Rush scent. They're bringing it back and it's exactly how you remember it. Cool, crisp and fresh. There's a reason it's the number one men's antiperspirant, and it's back in Walmart, Target, and other stores now for under four bucks. So try and see what the fuss is about. Head to your local Walmart or Target to try the OG Degree Cool Rush for yourself.

[Jason McIntyre]

Hi everybody. This message is brought to you by the official Whiskey of the Herd with Colin Coward podcast, Green River Whiskey. As you know, we've been having some fun getting to know Green River Whiskey.

[Colin Cowherd]

And we just learned they've launched their.

[Jason McIntyre]

First advertising campaign in more than 100 years. You see, it seems the team from Green river in reviving the whiskey have accidentally also revived its resin ghost. So if you want to see the ghost of Green river come to Life, check out greenriverwhiskey on their YouTube channel or head on over to greenriverwhiskey.com here's to green River Whiskey. Raise your spirits. Product of Green River Distilling Co. Owensboro, KY. Alcohol by volume varies by product. Greenriverwhiskey.com Please drink responsibly.