Hour 3 - Jayson Tatum

Summary

Podcast Summary: The Herd with Colin Cowherd – Hour 3: Jayson Tatum

Episode Information:

• Title: Hour 3 - Jayson Tatum
• Release Date: May 8, 2025
• Host/Authors: Colin Cowherd and Rick Bucher
• Description: A deep dive into the top NBA stories of the day, with a particular focus on Jayson Tatum and the Boston Celtics' playoff performance.

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1. NBA Playoffs Overview

Timestamp: 02:00 – 03:00

The episode opens with Colin Cowherd and Rick Bucher discussing the ongoing NBA playoffs, focusing on the intense matchup between the Boston Celtics and the New York Knicks. They highlight the Celtics’ appearance as world champions with a certain confidence, drawing parallels to other championship teams like Oklahoma City.

Colin Cowherd (03:00): "Usually the world champions at home play with a certain confidence, if you will."

2. Jayson Tatum's Performance: Analysis and Criticism

Timestamp: 03:04 – 19:26

A significant portion of the discussion centers around Jayson Tatum's performance in the playoffs. Rick Bucher critiques Tatum's shooting patterns, noting a decline in his mid-range and rim attempts in favor of three-point shots. This shift has positioned Tatum as the primary scorer, but it raises concerns about his aggressiveness and adaptability when his three-point shots are off.

Rick Bucher (03:04): "When two of the last three shots by Tatum were fallaways. It's almost like he has to be convinced to be aggressive, right?"

Colin defends the Celtics' strategy, emphasizing the franchise's offensive-minded approach under GMs Danny Ainge and Brad Stevens. He points out that Tatum's collaborative nature is integral to the team’s dynamic, contrasting him with legends like Michael Jordan and Kobe Bryant.

Colin Cowherd (04:50): "Michael and Kobe would have fought this. They would have said, and I love the Zen master. Phil Jackson knew there were moments we're not running the triangle."

3. Team Strategies and Management Decisions

Timestamp: 19:26 – 27:14

The conversation shifts to the Celtics' management decisions, specifically the acquisition of Kristaps Porzingis and Drew Halti. Rick questions the effectiveness of these moves, especially Porzingis' limited playtime due to illness, and whether they sufficiently address the team's deficiencies in supporting Tatum.

Rick Bucher (15:29): "Kristof Sporzingis only being partially available is a big factor in this because he's the one guy who has a mid-range game."

Colin argues that the front office is aware of Tatum's struggles and is taking steps to bolster the roster accordingly. However, Rick remains skeptical about the long-term efficacy of these adjustments, especially without a consistent mid-range threat.

4. Impact of NBA Officiating on Playoffs

Timestamp: 05:16 – 12:05

The hosts delve into the influence of NBA officiating on the current playoff series. Colin theorizes that Adam Silver has allowed more physical play, benefiting tougher, less offensively gifted teams like the Knicks. This shift leads to lower-scoring games, which disadvantage teams that rely heavily on offensive firepower.

Colin Cowherd (05:16): "Are they considering Adam Silver telling the officiating crews, let it be muddied up?"

Rick concurs, noting that the increased physicality has transformed the playoff landscape, making it harder for high-scoring teams like the Celtics to maintain their advantage.

Rick Bucher (06:03): "If you take a certain number threes, you have a better chance of winning versus teams that are following that formula."

5. Comparison with Other Teams and Players

Timestamp: 27:14 – 44:59

The discussion broadens to compare the Celtics' strategies and performance with other NBA teams, notably the Golden State Warriors without Steph Curry, and the Los Angeles Lakers. Colin highlights the Warriors' defensive prowess despite Curry’s absence, while Rick emphasizes the necessity for the Celtics to adapt their offensive approach without relying solely on Tatum.

Colin Cowherd (09:32): "I think people would, I suspect most people would submit to you that MJ's tougher to guard than Steph."

They also touch upon player dynamics, mentioning other Celtics players like Jaylen Brown, Kristaps Porzingis, and the overall team chemistry. The conversation critically examines whether the Celtics can sustain their championship aspirations amid these challenges.

6. Other Sports Discussions

Timestamp: 31:25 – 45:05

While the primary focus remains on the NBA, the hosts briefly divert to discuss the NFL, specifically criticizing Bleacher Report's quarterback rankings. They express dissatisfaction with the exclusion of top quarterbacks like Josh Allen, Lamar Jackson, and Patrick Mahomes from the list.

J. Mac (31:45): "Matt Stafford is not a top 12 quarterback."

This segment underscores their broader engagement with sports analytics and rankings, reinforcing their critical stance on conventional assessments.

7. Conclusion and Final Thoughts

Timestamp: 43:07 – 45:05

As the episode wraps up, Colin and Rick revisit their critiques of Jayson Tatum and the Celtics' strategic decisions. They acknowledge Tatum's undeniable talent but stress the importance of addressing the observed patterns in his gameplay to ensure the team's success in the playoffs.

Colin Cowherd (43:07): "What we are saying is there is a pattern and people in the building know it."

Rick Bucher reiterates the need for the Celtics to find a balance between offensive flair and defensive resilience, emphasizing that team chemistry and strategic adjustments are crucial for overcoming playoff hurdles.

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Notable Quotes with Timestamps

• Colin Cowherd (03:00): "Usually the world champions at home play with a certain confidence, if you will."

• Rick Bucher (03:04): "When two of the last three shots by Tatum were fallaways. It's almost like he has to be convinced to be aggressive, right?"

• Colin Cowherd (04:50): "Michael and Kobe would have fought this. They would have said, and I love the Zen master. Phil Jackson knew there were moments we're not running the triangle."

• Rick Bucher (15:29): "Kristof Sporzingis only being partially available is a big factor in this because he's the one guy who has a mid-range game."

• Colin Cowherd (05:16): "Are they considering Adam Silver telling the officiating crews, let it be muddied up?"

• Rick Bucher (06:03): "If you take a certain number threes, you have a better chance of winning versus teams that are following that formula."

• Colin Cowherd (09:32): "I think people would, I suspect most people would submit to you that MJ's tougher to guard than Steph."

• J. Mac (31:45): "Matt Stafford is not a top 12 quarterback."

• Colin Cowherd (43:07): "What we are saying is there is a pattern and people in the building know it."

---

Conclusion

In this episode of The Herd with Colin Cowherd, the hosts provide a critical examination of Jayson Tatum's evolving role within the Boston Celtics amidst the NBA playoffs. They explore the implications of team strategies, management decisions, and league officiating on the Celtics' performance and playoff prospects. Through insightful analysis and spirited debate, Colin and Rick offer listeners a comprehensive understanding of the current NBA landscape, emphasizing the delicate balance between individual talent and cohesive team dynamics.

Transcript

[Colin Cowherd]

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[Colin Cowherd]

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[Colin Cowherd]

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[Rick Bucher]

Yeah. Well, he doesn't have a go to spot, he doesn't have a go to shot. And in looking at look after they won the championship last year and the way he played for the better part of the regular season, I thought I was seeing a different guy. I thought he had taken a step up in confidence. Prior to that, it was Jaylen Brown who wanted the ball and was willing to go get it. I saw more from Jason like he was willing to get it. But then I did a little deeper dive and he was willing to shoot the three more and be aggressive in shooting that. And he hit some clutch shots from three over the course of the season. So it gave you the appearance that that he'd become more of that go to guy. But it was at the cost of his mid range game and finishing at the rim. He took fewer shots at the rim this season than he ever has in his career and his mid range went down as well. What compensated for that? He took nearly half of his shots from three point range. So now we're looking at your go to guy who if his three point shot is not falling, which it has not in this series, what's he going to. And on the other side of the equation you have the New York Knicks who have the most clutch player who is comfortable playing at all three levels. Jayson Tatum has morphed where at maybe at the beginning of his career, you could say he was a three, you know, three level scorer. He's not now.

[Colin Cowherd]

Okay, so I'm gonna throw this at you is that. And this is where I defended him. I said the G, Danny Ainge and Brad Stevens essentially are the franchise. They have built this passing shooting, you know, it's a very offensive minded franchise. And because Tatum is such a collaborative guy, he'll beat guys off the dribble. Pull back three.

[Rick Bucher]

Yeah.

[Colin Cowherd]

Michael and Kobe would have fought this. They would have said, and I love the Zen master. Phil Jackson knew there were moments we're not running the triangle. Michael's taking it over this organization. It's almost like the GMs have too much power. It's so analytically driven that Tatum, you can watch him, Rick, he'll beat guys off the dribble, pull back and take a worse shot.

[Rick Bucher]

You saw it in game one. I mean, Joe Missoula said, hey, you know, took 63s, but they were good looks. So essentially I'm good with us taking 63s. And the thought is you shouldn't be good with that because you lost. And there are other ways to play the game. And maybe the best thing, not that I'm wishing that the Boston Celtics lose or not repeat, but perhaps the best thing for the game would be if they get knocked out with their philosophy because it's a copycat league.

[Colin Cowherd]

Yes.

[Rick Bucher]

People believe that. If you take. I mean, I can literally tell you and, and plenty of GMs and coaches hate it. But they've been told analytically, they've been shown the formula. If you take a certain number threes, you have a better chance of winning versus teams that are. That are following that formula.

[Colin Cowherd]

Okay, but are they considering Adam Silver telling the officiating crews, let it be muddied up?

[Rick Bucher]

Well, that's the huge difference here. And that's what we're seeing.

[Colin Cowherd]

By the way, my theory, why are road teams and underdogs doing well? Because if you have two teams, one with a better record, with a home court advantage, a pretty offensive team, and the league goes, you can wrestle with them. Well, it's the finesse team is like, whoa. And the wrestling team is like, well, this is who we are. So you're finding these teams like New York and Golden State, by the way, without Steph, they love grabbing and pushing tonight's game. Now, I think Minnesota will win, but my. Take it, we're seeing all these underdogs win. The league's allowing officiating that plays to the less aesthetically pleasing team, the grinders, the grabbers. And that's what the Knicks are.

[Rick Bucher]

Well, essentially it makes it a lower scoring game.

[Colin Cowherd]

Yeah.

[Rick Bucher]

And it becomes a possession by possession game. And you're right. And I don't know that we've ever seen the physicality, it's crazy that we've seen in this playoffs. I, I love it.

[Colin Cowherd]

So do I.

[Rick Bucher]

Right. Because it forces. The other thing it forces you to do, by and large, is if you're going to create shots, you have to run offense.

[Colin Cowherd]

Real offense.

[Rick Bucher]

Yes, real offense. You can't just come down and chuck shots or expect that you're going to get to the rim.

[Colin Cowherd]

Okay, so now. Oh, J. Mac threw this one out there. He said if you get beaten five games or four, and I don't think they will but you get beat by the Knicks.

[Rick Bucher]

Yeah.

[Colin Cowherd]

Brian Windhorse today said, listen, if they just keep their first round pick and fill the roster with a pick, they can't even bring Al Horford back. They'll be over 500 million.

[Rick Bucher]

Yeah.

[Colin Cowherd]

He said they're gonna make moves here. And I do think, here's my take is that we thought Denver was going to win multiple and then they get rid of a. Was a Bruce Brown.

[Rick Bucher]

Bruce Brown.

[Colin Cowherd]

Pope. All of a sudden you look up.

[Rick Bucher]

And you're like Jeff Green.

[Colin Cowherd]

We're just, were just a good team.

[Rick Bucher]

Yeah.

[Colin Cowherd]

What would change that for Boston? Giannis. So you go Giannis and Tatum and now you have a true dog in the number one. And so my take is if they lose, you're not. Should you just do it Denver and go. You know, we'll lose a couple pieces but we'll be very good. You kind of have a passive star on this.

[Rick Bucher]

Yeah.

[Colin Cowherd]

And, and, and so I get. My take is you have to make a move if you get shelled by the Knicks. Do you not?

[Rick Bucher]

I would expect that they would. I thought that they would, they would carry the freight and you would pay the price. If you win the championship and you have a chance at a three peat, you're almost obligated to try to bring everybody back. Al Horford, I can give or take essentially the. If you're keeping the rest of that core and by the way, a big factor here that we're not going to get into now. But Kristof Sporzingis only being partially available is a big factor in this because he's the one guy who has a mid range game. That's where I would push back on you with Giannis being the solution. Yes, he's going to bring more dog and aggression, but he's not your go to closer. Again, what you're seeing is the teams that are winning against this physicality. It's basically we're going to run you off the three point line and we're going to meet you at the rim and we're allowed to body you when you're going to the rim. So you're not going to score at the same level. So what do you have for a mid range game? The teams that are being successful all have mid range scorers and that's the one thing that Boston is missing with Kristaps Porzingis not being available. That's where he was key and that's where he's most valuable.

[Colin Cowherd]

So I think when we think of the warriors because of the splash Brothers. And because Steve Curry is the coach and Steph Curry, we think offense, they're actually the league's best defense since Jimmy Butler arrived. And the advantage of not playing with Steph is they can even. It's almost like hockey. You don't need anybody to protect your Gretzky.

[Rick Bucher]

Yeah.

[Colin Cowherd]

Curry may be gone. Yeah. They can double down on physicality. And who are you going to go after?

[Rick Bucher]

Right.

[Colin Cowherd]

Like. Like Butler loves physicality. In a. Weird. Now, I'm not saying I do think the warriors can win a game and push it to a 6 or a 7 without Steph. Do you?

[Rick Bucher]

I think it's possible because I think that their basketball IQ and their system trumps all the other advantages that Minnesota has. Minnesota is more athletic, they're deeper, they're more versatile. Big, bigger, all of that. But basketball IQ and your system can negate all of that, as we saw in game one. Right. Because you had Buddy Heald and any number of guys fitting in. Now, I do believe that Minnesota is going to be. They're going to respect Buddy Heald and they're going to respect Draymond Green and Gary Payton in a way that they didn't.

[Colin Cowherd]

That's right.

[Rick Bucher]

In that first game. And think if you, you saw it down the stretch, once you tighten up on them, they're not the same three point shooters.

[Colin Cowherd]

Right.

[Rick Bucher]

Right. So. And by the way, the warriors are an example of what you're talking about with Boston. They were the first team to run into. We won a championship and then. But we did it on lesser contracts. And now we pay everybody and, and now we're. Now we can't add the pieces that we would like. You have to start handing them off. That's what Denver did.

[Colin Cowherd]

Right. Right.

[Rick Bucher]

They had to, they had to get frugal. And Adam Silver looked at it and said, I don't want anybody or not. Adam Silver, the owners without as much money said, you can't let these guys just pay the luxury tax because they can afford to. That's not fair because they're gonna just keep adding players. Right. And they're gonna go get the free agents that get the buyouts. Right. And join. And so Adam was like, okay, here's the compromise. Going to take away all of your ability. Like we're going to. We're going to tax you even more.

[Colin Cowherd]

Yeah.

[Rick Bucher]

And then we're going to take away the exceptions. We're going to take away. If you make a trade, it's got to be one for one. Like we're going to make it. So Difficult for you to do anything with your roster above and beyond what you have, that that is going to even the playing field. And that's essentially what teams are now facing.

[Colin Cowherd]

Yeah. No, I mean, I. We were theorizing earlier, why are there so many upsets? Because there's not a great team. And Boston's the best team. They're a good team. But I mean, I watch Indiana and I watched Indiana and Cleveland and I'm like, if Garland's not playing, Indiana's a better basketball team. Yeah, they're just a better basketball team.

[Rick Bucher]

And what's. And what do those teams have in common and the ones that are the up and comers is that they haven't paid their stars yet. By and large, you're not paying Andrew Nemhardt yet. You're not paying Aaron Neesmith. Right. And so. And Oklahoma City's in the same. In the same boat. They really haven't had to pay anybody yet. And the rest of the Western Conference, there's a difference between one or two games. Right. Between the second seed and the seventh seed. So that parody is already there.

[Colin Cowherd]

Okay, so this was. I talked about this yesterday. I think the Lakers and the Clippers, but let's talk Lakers. I think they're a bit diluted. I think the marquee looks big. The movie's not. This is a player that won't get in shape. Austin Reeves is undrafted and got overwhelmed athletically against Minnesota. LeBron's older and it's. You can't ask him to play 75 games and be brilliant in the postseason. They don't have a big. The coach likes. And I'm not sure the coach is quite ready to be next level yet. That's the movie, the marquee sound. J.J. redick, LeBron, Luka. It sounds great. I'm not saying it's Ishtar, but it's. It's not the Godfather. Okay, so the marquee is way better than the movie. You could fix that, though, if LeBron took the least he's allowed to take. And with that, my radio audience, Rick is shaking his head. What do you. What do you. Why do you do that?

[Rick Bucher]

So. So he's got a chance. There's a couple things. Number one, you're not going to be able. You need to turn the page. You need to. It's not. We're not remaking the movie. We have a different leading star and we need to get him a different plot.

[Colin Cowherd]

Yes, because.

[Rick Bucher]

And a different supporting cast.

[Colin Cowherd]

We know he needs Biggs because there's Only one way to build around Luka. Size. Yes, you can't do it any other way.

[Rick Bucher]

But you also have to make it his team.

[Colin Cowherd]

Okay, fine.

[Rick Bucher]

And as long as LeBron James is in LA, regardless of how much he's making, LeBron James, is that when you walk into the locker room where you're going to look, there's Luca's locker and there's LeBron's locker, you're still looking at LeBron.

[Colin Cowherd]

They should trade him.

[Rick Bucher]

No, I wouldn't say that because I don't think that they can get anything significant for him. I'm just saying that you're not going to be able to build your next title contending team until Labrana is gone. And I'm not ushering him into retirement. I'm not suggesting that he should retire, but he can take whatever he wants. First of all, he's making 52 million next year. Okay. If you there, if he signed the minimum and you let all of the cap holds and the unrestricted free agents go, like the Jackson Hayes and the Alex lens and all that, I think you would have $10 million worth of cap room. What's that going to do for you? I don't know that it's going to do enough. And that's not even counting the fact that you have to resign, presumably. Resign. Dorian Finney Smith.

[Colin Cowherd]

You can trade Austin Reeves, can't you?

[Rick Bucher]

I know, but what are you gonna, what are you gonna get for Austin Reeves?

[Colin Cowherd]

How about that big guy in Brooklyn, Nick?

[Rick Bucher]

Which big?

[Colin Cowherd]

Nick Claxton.

[Rick Bucher]

Okay. Like, is that gonna change you?

[Colin Cowherd]

Well, it gives you big.

[Rick Bucher]

I don't know, but it's like, it's one piece that you need and they need like three or four pieces.

[Colin Cowherd]

Oh, I don't think they're a championship team. I'm saying if LeBron did that, it would get. I can't look at, I can't look at San Antonio, Oklahoma City and Houston. All the picks and all the young talent. Yeah. This is the worst they'll ever be.

[Rick Bucher]

Fair.

[Colin Cowherd]

And you want me to put the Lakers in that class? I can't.

[Rick Bucher]

No, no, no, Agreed, agreed. But if we're going to get, if we're going to get, let's. Essentially we're going to give Luka Doncic team that we last saw him have in Dallas that he took to the, to the finals.

[Colin Cowherd]

Right.

[Rick Bucher]

Which is that, that's, that's the blueprint.

[Colin Cowherd]

Right?

[Rick Bucher]

Right. You didn't have just Nick Claxton, you had Derek Lively and Daniel Gaff.

[Colin Cowherd]

Right.

[Rick Bucher]

So you had A big. On the floor at all Times. You had PJ Washington, who far better defender than LeBron James is right now. Maybe not quite the score or playmaker, but you didn't need that because you had Luka Doncic. So I just look. And then, you know, they picked up Derrick Jones off of. Off the scrap heap. Oh, and by the way, you had Kyrie Irving, who played a monstrous role in the playoffs last year. That's probably overlooked. Yeah, I don't have that quality of a number two. And no, LeBron James isn't capable of being what Kyrie Irving was last year at this stage of his career. So, again, like, it's. It's. For me, the heart of it is, until you can start looking at this as we're building around Luka Doncic, you're still comp. You're compensating the fact that you have LeBron James, your former superstar, still sitting there right next to him. Does that. Am I like, does that make.

[Colin Cowherd]

I. I just think LA is in the business of selling us movies, and what the Clippers and the Lakers to a larger degree are selling us is a really average movie with a great poster.

[Rick Bucher]

When was the last time that the Lakers legitimately were a title contender?

[Colin Cowherd]

Take out the COVID year.

[Rick Bucher]

So I'll give you the COVID year. It's still five years, right?

[Colin Cowherd]

Right. Yeah.

[Rick Bucher]

So we've in our minds, we've always had them. Oh, they're just a piece away. They're right there. They could go. And yeah, I know they went to the Western Conference finals, got swept by Denver.

[Colin Cowherd]

But let me ask this. So let's just get down to the Giannis piece, okay? Because we all felt with the Knicks, they need another piece, and maybe they do, but it may not be as big a piece as everybody thinks because maybe Brunson is a one and he's not a top five or six one, but between Bridges and og and you're like, well, we don't need it because our two and our three and Josh Hart. So my takeaway is new information. Give creates new opinion. I thought they got to make a big Giannis move. And I'm like, well, Giannis would be great because Brunson and Hart are great free throw shooters late. So you wouldn't have to have Giannis necessarily close. Giannis would give you leads and Hart and Brunson, ball in their hands, get fouled. So I think Giannis would make them. And to me, Giannis brunt if you could keep. But you'd have to give up so much to get him. I guess this is the question. If the Knicks knock off Boston and they get to the Eastern Conference finals and they beat Boston, they can get to the finals. I'm sitting there thinking maybe they just need another Mikhail Bridges level guy. Or doesn't it not change how we think about the Knicks needing blank. Yeah, this series is changing how? I think if the NBA is going to allow tug of war during the playoffs, I'm not sure they need a lot.

[Rick Bucher]

No, I agree with that. I think it's wide open. I think the Indiana Pacers and the New York Knicks both are capable of getting to the Finals.

[Colin Cowherd]

They just keep changing big. So you keep Hart, Brunson, OG McHale and then you just every year or two try to get a big. That fits.

[Rick Bucher]

Yes. Here's the thing though, and it's not as sexy as Giannis going to New York, but, and I agree with you 1000%, what I want to pair him with is a dynamic point guard who can be who's my closer. That's what I want. And so you have that. Oklahoma City. You have that in. Where else am I thinking? I looked at Orlando with Paolo Banchero as a point forward. I think that works. Houston? Not quite there. Detroit, I think, is a great pairing with Kate Cunningham and those teams have young pieces and, and draft capital. If I'm Milwaukee, would I, you know, getting Karl Anthony Towns. I would rather have a number of picks and a couple of young dynamic players that I'm, I'm starting over with than going to try to get an established star and build around Karl Anthony Towns. I already saw that movie in Minnesota and it didn't get that far.

[Colin Cowherd]

Rick Bucher. Good stuff. Delivery.

[Rick Bucher]

I think we got a lot done today.

[Colin Cowherd]

We did.

[Rick Bucher]

We were very efficient.

[Colin Cowherd]

Spring cleaning. We got everything bagged up and ready to go.

[Rick Bucher]

Yeah. There'll be more next week.

[Colin Cowherd]

Live in la, it's the Herd. Be sure to catch live editions of the Herd, weekdays at noon Eastern, 9am Pacific on Fox Sports Radio, FS1 and the iHeartRadio app. Summer is almost here and you can now get almost anything you need for your sunny days delivered. When with Uber Eats. Now, what do we mean by almost? Well, you can't get a well groomed lawn delivered, but you can get chicken parm delivered. A day at the lake, that's a no. A Philly cheesesteak, that's a yes. A nice tan. Sorry. A box fan. Happily, yes. What about a day of sunshine? Not happening. How about a box of fine wines? Yeah, that's happening. Delivery's on its way. Okay, how about some clear skies? Nope. Well, how about some French fries? Yeah. So how about a freshly cut lawn? Can't help you there. But a barbecued prawn? Order it and it's on its way. Even throw in some paper towels. Clean up after the feast. So while you can't get fun in the sun delivered, don't worry because you can get pork buns delivered. Uber Eats can definitely get you that. Get almost, almost anything delivered with Uber Eats. Order now. Alcohol in select markets. Product availability may vary by region. See app for details.

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[Colin Cowherd]

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[Rick Bucher]

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[Colin Cowherd]

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[Rick Bucher]

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[J. Mac]

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[Colin Cowherd]

Nice.

[Rick Bucher]

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[Colin Cowherd]

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[Rick Bucher]

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[Colin Cowherd]

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[J. Mac]

When you're with Amex Business Platinum, going the extra mile for your business pays off.

[Colin Cowherd]

With five times membership rewards, points on flights and prepaid hotels booked through amextravel.com.

[J. Mac]

You can earn more points to help grow your business.

[Colin Cowherd]

And with access to more than 1,400 lounges globally through the MC American Express.

[J. Mac]

Global Lounge Collection, including the Centurion Lounge.

[Colin Cowherd]

Can I get you a refill? You can stay fresh wherever your business travel takes you.

[J. Mac]

That's the powerful backing of American Express.

[Colin Cowherd]

Terms apply. Learn [e-mail] AmExBusiness if you're an inventory specialist in a warehouse, Grainger knows you've probably faced a situation like this before. Your forklift, your facility's workhorse, is leaking hydraulic fluid. And with a full schedule of shipments on the docket, this has the potential to cause a major delay of game. But you're not worried. You're prepared for this type of situation and you have an ace in the hole. Grainger Grainger offers professional grade products for every industry from hydraulic oils and hoses. So much more. Plus next day delivery. So you can be confident that you'll have the product you need on hand to fix that forklift and get it back in the game. Call 1-800-granger. Click granger.com or just stop by Granger for the ones who get it done. I sobbed through about eight hours of sleep last night. And after watching that game, I had just visions of Knicks jumping over the Celtics into the Eastern Conference finals. Isn't that crazy? The NBA you know, it's funny, sometimes there's unintended consequences and unintended benefits of allowing stuff. So the NBA is like, we're going to allow the most physical playoff action we ever have. And what it's done, it's given the less beautiful teams, the more physical teams, you know, like Golden State without Steph or with Steph, Butler and Draymond, they're just grabbing. And Minnesota's like, this is like we're playing football. And it's given the Knicks, which are a tough, physical, resilient team, a huge edge over Boston. I don't think it's a bad thing the Knicks winning, but it's interesting. It's like an unintended. It's not a benefit or a consequence, it's unintended result, which is road teams, lower score. If you have lower scoring, that always benefits the less gifted offensive team. It's a. I mean, if neither team can score, that. That benefits the defensive team that's not known for its scoring anyway.

[J. Mac]

Colin, that's good.

[Colin Cowherd]

And.

[J. Mac]

Well, what do you think Adam Silver is going to say when it's June 1st and the NBA Finals? Is Indiana at OKC or.

[Colin Cowherd]

What if it's. What if it's the New York Knicks and Denver?

[J. Mac]

I'd rather New York Knicks versus Steph.

[Colin Cowherd]

Curry, but I would love the Knicks versus anybody.

[J. Mac]

It's not a guarantee. The Knicks get by the Pacers. They are good.

[Colin Cowherd]

I would. I wonder if they'd be underdogs then.

[J. Mac]

The Pacers, by the way, the second most popular basketball team in Indiana. You know who number one is? Yeah, Caitlin Clark's Fever.

[Colin Cowherd]

Listen, I'll say this. Indiana won't get a number, but I find them incredibly fun to watch. I love their style of basketball. I think Indiana's not dependent on. I love Halliburton. People. People are crazy. He's great. I love their roster. Siakam and Turner. The other guard from Gonzaga.

[J. Mac]

Oh, nemhard.

[Colin Cowherd]

Yeah. Yeah. Like, it's a really. In their. Well, I don't have a problem. I mean, I know it won't be. I mean, if it was Indiana and Denver, you'd not get a number. I gotta tell you something.

[J. Mac]

It's just. It's not a.

[Colin Cowherd]

New York makes the final.

[J. Mac]

That would be great. It's been, what, 20 something? I think, because I found last night.

[Colin Cowherd]

Boston Tatum is irritating now.

[J. Mac]

Oh, come on.

[Colin Cowherd]

Come on. Steve Kerr at the Olympics knew the truth.

[J. Mac]

Why don't we just ship him to the Lakers, see if he's so irritating. Let's get him out here to the Lakers. Give up Austin Reeves.

[Colin Cowherd]

A lot of irritating things in my life. I don't want to trade all of them. I'm just saying Tatum last night was irritating. You're the star.

[J. Mac]

He did dunk to give his team the lead with 18 seconds.

[Colin Cowherd]

Celtics are 11 for 11 on dunks. How about to do a few more of Those? They've missed 75 threes in.

[J. Mac]

Maybe Joe Missoula, second row Joe or whatever his nickname is. Maybe he needs to get Tatum some help. Maybe the team's not that stacked.

[Colin Cowherd]

Colin, you never forget what Brad Stevens did. He got Drew Holiday and Porzingis because he had questions about Tatum closing. He added two new offensive guys.

[J. Mac]

By the way, Porzingis is sick. Only played like 14 minutes. He's not what he was. There's some alarm about what the heck his illness is because this has been like five, four or five months of poisonous ill. He's not.

[Colin Cowherd]

Mookie Bets for the Dodgers has that he's got an illness and I don't. Can anybody figure out what's going on? There's a stomach thing. Strange. Yeah. In the winter. I don't know. All right, J. Mac with the news. No, no, no, no.

[Rick Bucher]

Turn on the news.

[Colin Cowherd]

This is the Herd line news. All right.

[J. Mac]

No Steph Curry tonight for the warriors due to the hamstring, he has been talking to the media today. I've been tracking. Doesn't sound like he's anywhere close to anything. He's out for at least a week. And Steve Kerr knows they'll have to adjust their offensive approach in Minnesota.

[Colin Cowherd]

When it comes down to it, this is about Steph, this whole thing.

[J. Mac]

He's like Tim Duncan in San Antonio.

[Rick Bucher]

You know, it's Michael Jordan in Chicago. There's none of it happens without Steph. And everybody knows that.

[Colin Cowherd]

We're absolutely going to rely on Jimmy.

[Rick Bucher]

Like we have, you know, when Steph's.

[Colin Cowherd]

Been off the floor the last couple months.

[Rick Bucher]

We basically run everything through Jimmy in.

[Colin Cowherd]

Those moments so he'll take on more responsibility. But we. We can't just rely on him, you.

[Rick Bucher]

Know, creating every single shot.

[Colin Cowherd]

What do you make of it, jma?

[J. Mac]

I like that he's like Michael Jordan in Chicago. I hear that. And I'm like, I bet you it's tougher to game plan for Steph Curry than it was Michael Jordan, because Steph curry will be 30ft from the hoop and you've got to be guarding him. You have to be out there, and then it creates space for everyone else. You're getting three on two runouts because they're double teaming curry 35ft from the basket. He's just without him, I don't see how.

[Colin Cowherd]

Well Michael, you had a vertical dimension that Steph doesn't. You know, Steph's game is horizontal. You know, Michael could jump over you, go past you. So What?

[J. Mac]

That's only two points. Give me the 30 foot threes that are just absolute daggers from the greatest shooter in NBA history.

[Colin Cowherd]

I think people would, I suspect most people would submit to you that MJ's tougher to guard than Steph.

[J. Mac]

Who do you. Do you think the worst win this without Curry? Any chance?

[Colin Cowherd]

No, but I think they can ugly it up and get to six or seven. I absolutely think they'll win a game in the Bay. I just think they're so good defensively and buddy, they've got enough offense. Butler, Draymond will shoot three buddy pods. You know, you got the guy from Netherlands post.

[J. Mac]

I don't know about him, but Butler can certainly go for like a 40 burger and keep them in the game, I think. Next story, sticking with the NBA, the Clippers, they got bounced in Game 7. They had Kawhi, they had James Harden. James Harden didn't really show up. We call him Jim Harden. He had seven points in an elimination game. So GM Lawrence Frank bizarrely expects to run it back. Colin with the star duo and he thinks that la, the Clippers, that is, are going to be a free agent destination moving forward.

[Colin Cowherd]

We're super excited about the direction going forward. We're going to continue to compete, compete at a high level while also preserving a path forward using financial flexibility and the different advantages that we have with our organization.

[J. Mac]

With Steve T. Lou, the great city.

[Colin Cowherd]

Of Los Angeles, the Intuit Dome, our players, we feel we are a high.

[J. Mac]

Highly appealing place for players to be.

[Rick Bucher]

So make no mistake, we want to.

[Colin Cowherd]

Contend in the present.

[Rick Bucher]

We also have a plan for the.

[Colin Cowherd]

Future and we'll take the necessary steps to implement it. Well, listen, it's, it's. You're going to be the same franchise if Harden's available in May and June as your closer and Kawhi is playing for. You can say all that stuff. You. I would, I would move. Harden always has a market because he's good in the regular season.

[J. Mac]

Oh really? You think there's a market for Harden?

[Colin Cowherd]

Not a huge one.

[J. Mac]

So I'm looking at their salary cap breakdown. Basically their top eight guys are all back next year. None of them are free agents. I don't know that this team can really get over the hump and get better. Unlike the Lakers, who added Luca mid season. I don't think they're in the same class. Paper clips are not even close to the Lakers. I, I, I.

[Colin Cowherd]

You realize Giannis is going to end up on one of these really interesting Western teams. Then how far are they going to be back?

[J. Mac]

The paper clips? Yeah, yeah, that's. No, no bueno. But they got Bogdanovich, Norm Powell. I like their team. I still can't believe they lost that series called. They were up 2. 1 and at home to go up 3.

[Rick Bucher]

1.

[Colin Cowherd]

And by the way, they lost to an interim coach. Yeah, and, and I mean, I thought.

[J. Mac]

Tyler was a genius. Say that. Anyways. Let's go to the NFL. Colin, listen, I don't even know how to get this one out without sounding like a. So Bleacher Report has put out their list of the best 12 quarterbacks entering next season. I'm just gonna. They have Patrick Mahomes as four.

[Colin Cowherd]

Whatever.

[J. Mac]

Matt Stafford is not a top 12 quarterback.

[Colin Cowherd]

Like, I can't take you seriously if Matt Stafford's not in Canada is on the list. You're gonna put Purdy, Jordan Love, and two on the list. I can't take it seriously. Knocks out. It's like. It's like saying the top draws in Hollywood and not having Tom Cruise near the list.

[J. Mac]

Yeah, this is a bad list. Let's be real. Jared Goff ahead of Jaden Daniels.

[Colin Cowherd]

Come on. What for? For? I mean, again, is this based on the next five years and top quarterbacks entering next? You're gonna say you trust Tua over Matt Stafford in a snow game in Philadelphia to drive you down the field. So for the radio audience, where's Baker Mayfield?

[J. Mac]

Not on the list. Josh Allen is 1, Lamar 2. Burrow 3. Patrick Mahomes 4.

[Colin Cowherd]

Hertz 5. Who did this list?

[J. Mac]

The Bleacher Reports.

[Colin Cowherd]

I don't know.

[J. Mac]

Disdain on cowards or something. When Zach the producer rolled up with this list, I was like, come on.

[Colin Cowherd]

That you get. I can't. That can't make you.

[J. Mac]

Coward's gonna lose his mind. Matt Stafford not on the top 12. Baker Mayfield not on the top 12. Tyreek Hill had Baker Mayfield top five earlier this week.

[Colin Cowherd]

Bleach reports.

[J. Mac]

Gotta clean it.

[Colin Cowherd]

You know what? This looks like a list the big lead would have had when you owned it.

[J. Mac]

Wow, that's harsh. Not with me at the helm. Hell no. I mean, listen, you know, I don't think much of the Chiefs.

[Colin Cowherd]

That's. That's as bad as that Time magazine, 100 most influential people. 16 WNBA players. No Caitlin Clark. It's like, what? What is going on? Pat Stafford's not on the list.

[J. Mac]

Yeah, that's embarrassing.

[Colin Cowherd]

Whatever.

[J. Mac]

I like when you get fired up about something. It just dismisses. It's like when somebody puts a plate of veal parmesan in front of you. Get that out of here. No, thanks. That's the disdain you just displayed.

[Colin Cowherd]

Are you done? Because I'm done with this list, I'll tell you that.

[J. Mac]

You don't want to do another minute on this.

[Colin Cowherd]

You have another story?

[J. Mac]

I thought Justin Fields had no idea. No, we're good.

[Colin Cowherd]

Jay McLean. Well, that's the news. And thanks for stopping by the herd. Lie news. Have you ordered flowers hours for Mother's Day? You might want to get on that.

[J. Mac]

You're not being serious, are you?

[Colin Cowherd]

Did it this morning. Come on, bro.

[J. Mac]

I did that like two weeks ago. Oh, and by the way, the slick move, when you order them offline, don't send them on Friday, Saturday or Sunday because that they jack up the price. Set them on Wednesday so the moms get them early in the week. You are aware of this, right?

[Colin Cowherd]

That's a horrible move.

[J. Mac]

What do you mean? Then they get to celebrate Mother's Day for like, four days with the flowers. Okay, you're an actor.

[Colin Cowherd]

Christmas in October, it really. It really is an emotional night.

[J. Mac]

Come on.

[Colin Cowherd]

You give him on Mother's Day.

[J. Mac]

Okay, you want to pay the premium, like an extra $15?

[Colin Cowherd]

You literally are on television for a living. Your wife's not worth an extra 15.

[J. Mac]

Well, no, I'm sending it to the wife, the mom, the mother in law. So now you're stacked.

[Colin Cowherd]

Honey, I got a great summer vacation. Go to. Let's listen. I mean, let's go to Anchorage. I mean, at some point, you got to pay for what you get. Yeah, okay. And go hang out with the caribou. You want a nice summer vacation, you gotta be at a beach caribou. Well, I'm just saying, five days early on flowers.

[J. Mac]

You don't think that's smart?

[Colin Cowherd]

I don't think maybe it's fiscally responsible, but it's not. Sometimes you just got to deliver. You know how the moms feel when they're timing matters.

[J. Mac]

Seeing the flowers, Wednesday, Thursday, Friday leading up to Mother's Day, it's just great.

[Colin Cowherd]

There. There is a not so fine line between frugal and cheap. All right. Yeah. Birthday present. 64 days early doesn't feel the same. Christmas, November 3rd doesn't.

[J. Mac]

Christmas is canceled. You can't reference that anymore.

[Colin Cowherd]

It's the Herd. Be sure to catch live editions of the Herd, weekdays at noon Eastern, 9am Pacific. Hey, Steve Covino.

[Rick Bucher]

And I'm Rich Davis.

[Colin Cowherd]

And together we're Covino and Rich on Fox Sports Radio.

[Rick Bucher]

You can catch us weekdays from 5 to 7pm Eastern, 2 to 4 Pacific.

[Colin Cowherd]

On Fox Sports Radio. And of course, the iHeartRadio app. Why should you listen to Covino and Rich?

[Rick Bucher]

We talk about everything. Life, sports, relationships, what's going on in the world.

[Colin Cowherd]

We have a lot of fun talking.

[Rick Bucher]

About the stories behind the stories in.

[Colin Cowherd]

The world of sports and pop culture.

[Rick Bucher]

Stories that, well, other shows don't seem.

[Colin Cowherd]

To have the time to discuss.

[Rick Bucher]

And the fact that we've been friends.

[Colin Cowherd]

For the last 20 years and still.

[Rick Bucher]

Work together, I mean, that says something, right?

[Colin Cowherd]

So check us out. We like to get you involved too. Take your phone calls, chop it up, as they say.

[Rick Bucher]

I'd say the most interactive show on Fox Sports Radio, maybe the most interactive.

[Colin Cowherd]

Show on planet Earth. Be sure to check.

[Rick Bucher]

Check out Covino and Rich live on Fox Sports radio and the iHeartradio app from 5 to 7pm Eastern, 2 to 4 Pacific.

[Colin Cowherd]

And if you miss any of the live show, just search Covino and Rich.

[Rick Bucher]

Wherever you get your podcast.

[Colin Cowherd]

And of course, on social media, that's Covino and Rich. Summer is almost here and you can now get almost anything you need for your sunny days delivered with Uber Eats. Now, what do we mean by almost? Well, you can't get a well groomed lawn delivered, but you can get chicken parm delivered. A day at the lake? That's a no. A Philly cheesesteak? That's a yes. A nice tan. Sorry. A box fan? Happily, yes. What about a day of sunshine? Not happening. How about a box of fine wines? Yeah, that's happening. Delivery's on its way. Okay, how about some clear skies? Nope. Well, how about some French fries? Yeah. So how about a freshly cut lawn? Can't help you there. But a barbecued prawn? Order it and it's on its way. Even throw in some paper towels. Clean up after the feast. So while you can't get fun in the sun delivered, don't worry because you can get pork buns delivered. Uber Eats can definitely get you that. Get almost, almost anything delivered with Uber Eats. Order now. Alcohol in select markets. Product availability may vary by region. See app for details.

[Rick Bucher]

Introducing Instagram teen accounts.

[Colin Cowherd]

A new way to keep your teen.

[Rick Bucher]

Safer as they grow.

[Colin Cowherd]

Like making sure they always have their seatbelt on. Alright, sweetie pie. Buckle up. Good job.

[Rick Bucher]

Or ring the bell on their bike.

[Colin Cowherd]

Okay, kid, give it a try. Nice.

[Rick Bucher]

Or remember their elbow pads.

[Colin Cowherd]

Knees, too. Okay. Yep. There you go.

[Rick Bucher]

New Instagram teen accounts.

[Colin Cowherd]

Automatic protections for who can contact your teenage and the content they can see. You don't want vacation to end, but.

[J. Mac]

With Amex Platinum, you're already planning the next one. Because you earn five times membership rewards points on prepaid hotels and more booked.

[Colin Cowherd]

Through amextravel.com so every trip to the.

[J. Mac]

Beach and the city and the country and back home again leads to another destination. That's the powerful backing of American Express. Terms apply.

[Colin Cowherd]

Learn [e-mail] withamex. If you're an inventory specialist in a warehouse, Granger knows you've probably faced a situation like this before. Your forklift, your facility's workhorse, is leaking hydraulic fluid. And with a full schedule of shipments on the docket, this has the potential to cause a major delay of game. But you're not worried. You're prepared for this type of situation, and you have an ace in the hole. Grainger. Grainger offers professional grade products for every industry, from hydraulic oils and hoses. So much more. Plus next day delivery. So you can be confident that you'll have the product you need on hand to fix that forklift and get it back in the game. Call 1-800-GRAINGER Click grainger.com or just stop by Grainger for the ones who get it done. Remember that movie Goodwill? Our graphics team did a pretty funny little graphic here on Jalen Brunson. Here's Jalen Brown on being down 02 to the Knicks.

[Rick Bucher]

Being down 02, it sucks.

[Colin Cowherd]

But, you know, we got a great.

[Rick Bucher]

Group, and if I had to select.

[Colin Cowherd]

Any guys that can get it done, it's the group.

[Rick Bucher]

It's the group that we have in our locker room.

[Colin Cowherd]

We just got to come out, be.

[J. Mac]

A little bit more poised, you know.

[Colin Cowherd]

Take a deep breath, convert our opportunities. We missed the layups. Easy baskets. Yeah, I wish it was that easy. It's weird to see a world champion look anxious. It's usually the young team. I mean, I. You watch these teams that have been around like Golden State, they don't look nervous at the end of games. They look poised. They're getting good looks. Everybody's engaged in the timeouts. Like you don't. Golden States never looks, you know, nervous. Boston, it's, you know, it's so collaborative. Who's the guy they're all looking around at? Tatum. Here's Rick Bucher. Earlier on, Tatum's clear struggles in this series.

[Rick Bucher]

Doesn't have a go to spot. He doesn't have a go to shot. He took fewer shots at the rim this season than he ever has in his career. And his mid range went down as well. What compensated for that? He took nearly half of his shots from three point range. So now we're looking at your go to guy who if his three point shot is not falling, which it has not in this series, what's he going to.

[Colin Cowherd]

I also think the cheapest tickets right now for the Knicks Celtics at Madison Square Garden. $800. The most expensive tickets right now, $54,000. I mean that, that, that thing, it's gonna be the biggest basketball game in New York in Pat since the Pat Riley era. What was that like 90s late. What was it? Late 90s, 98, 99. That 54000 bucks for a ticket. It's Caitlin Clark playing. What is that?

[J. Mac]

Can I push back so that Rick clip, he was like, hey, Tatum took too many threes. I looked at Anthony Edwards numbers, okay, Anthony Edwards, more than half of his shots were threes this season. Like that's the new trend in the league. That's what the coaches want. These guys could shoot it out. Edwards hit 39% from three this year. Tatum only 34%. Regressed a little bit. I, I don't. The consternation over Tatum is just puzzling. It's two games, Colin.

[Colin Cowherd]

That's it. No, it's it. Here's what it is. You got a kid and he gets in trouble just a little bit more than he should considering the family. And he just. When you thought he finally got it right, gets kicked out of college or gets in another really ugly situation and you thought he knew better because he's getting older and more mature and he's now sort of in those. Don't make dumb mistakes. Like we all have our kids make mistakes and then, you know, they go through stages and then they graduate and they shouldn't make those mistakes when they're 26. That they made it 16 and that we thought he was through this. He had his best regular season and now we have to just own and Steve Kerr saw it in Paris. This is who he is. Yeah. He is a guy that gets anxious. He doesn't have a stock go to move and frankly he is the anti brunson. One is work boots and one is leather loafers.

[J. Mac]

I do like that analogy. The leather loafers. I know you're a leather loafer guy.

[Colin Cowherd]

No, I'm not.

[J. Mac]

I will Say regarding Tatum, he's going to finish fourth in MVP voting. He will be fourth in. He will be four years in a row, first team, all NBA. Like, I mean, we've got the data of four seasons. He's a great, phenomenal player.

[Colin Cowherd]

Nobody's denying he is a great player. What we are saying is there is a pattern and people in the building know it. Brad Stevens went and got Porzingis and he went and got Drew Haldi. Why did they get rid of Marcus Smart? The reason they got rid of Marcus Smart was Jaylen Brown was taking the ball out of Tatum's hands when Marcus Smart started doing it, they're like, whoa, whoa, whoa. He would let Marcus Smart take. And then finally Brad Stevens said, let's get a better version of Marcus Smart. Who will understand his role. Jrue Holiday and Drew Holiday at, like, you know, veteran smart guys. Like, I'm not taking the ball to Tatum's hand late. Like, Marcus Smart's. Like, I'm gonna eat too. So, I mean, this. The organization upstairs knows the dilemma.

[J. Mac]

Okay, let me ask you. We talk about who number ones are in the NBA. Like, Luka's a one. Jokic is a one. Is Jason Tatum for you right now a one. Meaning can he be the.

[Colin Cowherd]

He's a one. But I'll take Jokic. Is Brunson a one? I think I have to come to terms with. He is.

[J. Mac]

Is Halliburton A1?

[Colin Cowherd]

Yes. As Kate Cunningham. Yes.

[J. Mac]

So you, Kate Cunningham and Halliburton. Yes. Brunson? I don't know.

[Colin Cowherd]

No, no, no, no. I'm saying Brunson's not a traditional one. A second round Villanova guy. More hearts than talent. More heart than talent. But I have to be honest here. There's, there's, there's the intangibles. He's a plus at those. And he's, he's, he's B plus at talent. So he's A, he's a one.

[J. Mac]

So. So Tatum is a one for you.

[Colin Cowherd]

Yeah, he's a one.

[J. Mac]

Seem a little reluctant there.

[Colin Cowherd]

He's a one.

[J. Mac]

Is Devin Booker one?

[Colin Cowherd]

No, he's a two. Great two. Could be the best two in the league. AD's a two. Maybe he's the best two in the league. Summer is almost here, and you can now get almost anything you need for your sunny days delivered with Uber Eats. Now, what do we mean by almost? Well, you can't get a well groomed lawn delivered, but you can get chicken parm delivered. A nice tan. Sorry, A Box fan. Happily, yes. A day of sunshine? No A box of fine wines? Yes, Uber Eats can definitely get you that. Get almost almost anything delivered with Uber Eats. Order now. Alcohol in select markets. Product availability may vary by region. See app for details. You don't want vacation to end, but.

[J. Mac]

With Amex Platinum, it doesn't have to just yet. You can sit back and relax at the airport with Centurion lounge access.

[Colin Cowherd]

And because you earn five times membership.

[J. Mac]

Rewards points on prepaid hotels and more booked through amextravel.com, your trip to the beach and back can take you somewhere different.

[Colin Cowherd]

Next time we should go to Thailand. That's the powerful backing of American Express.

[J. Mac]

Terms apply. Learn more@american express.com withamx just like how.

[Colin Cowherd]

True champs master both offense and defense, the BMW IX masters both ultimate performance and unbeatable space. Love mine. The greatest legends in sports never compromise in any aspect of their game. So why would you settle for anything less from your suv? What I love about my BMW IX is that it redefines the electric vehicle experience seamlessly integrates powerful performance, bold, daring design, a refined interior, details, cutting edge technology. Basically pushes the boundaries of innovation. Thousands of details went into creating the ultimate electric suv. Compromise not one of them. Banking with Capital One helps you keep more money in your wallet with no fees or minimums on checking accounts and no overdraft fees. Just ask the Capital One bank guy. It's pretty much all he talks about in a good way. He'd also tell you that this podcast is his favorite podcast too. Oh really? Thanks Capital One Bank Guy. What's in your wallet? Terms apply. See capital1.com bank capital1NA member FDIC. You're listening to an iHeart podcast.