Joe and Jada - Fat Joe & Jadakiss on squashing 50 Cent beef, Eminem's first NYC show & Big Pun joining Terror Squad

Summary

Podcast Summary: The Herd with Colin Cowherd
Episode: Joe and Jada - Fat Joe & Jadakiss on Squashing 50 Cent Beef, Eminem's First NYC Show & Big Pun Joining Terror Squad
Release Date: July 3, 2025

In this riveting episode of The Herd with Colin Cowherd, hosts Fat Joe and Jadakiss delve deep into the intricate web of hip-hop history, sharing personal anecdotes and behind-the-scenes insights into some of the genre's most iconic moments and figures. The discussion seamlessly transitions between memorable performances, influential partnerships, and longstanding beefs within the industry.

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Eminem's First NYC Performance at Lyricist Lounge

Fat Joe recounts the electrifying experience of witnessing Eminem’s first performance in New York City alongside himself and Big Pun. He vividly describes Eminem’s intense energy and undeniable talent, highlighting the moment they realized Eminem was a unique force in hip-hop.

Fat Joe (02:00): “The first time in New York City we ever seen Eminem, they were holding him by the back of his T-shirt so he wouldn't fly off the stage. He was just spitting so crazy.”

Jadakiss echoes this sentiment, emphasizing the surprise and admiration they felt for Eminem’s raw talent.

Jadakiss (03:13): “Who’s this white boy? That boy’s crazy.”

This performance at Lyricist Lounge marked a pivotal moment, showcasing Eminem's ability to captivate an audience and solidify his place in the hip-hop community.

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Big Pun's Integration into Terror Squad

The conversation shifts to Big Pun’s influential role within Terror Squad, detailing how his presence elevated the group’s status in the hip-hop scene. Fat Joe shares nostalgic memories of Big Pun, highlighting his charisma and the deep bonds formed through their collaboration.

Fat Joe (05:22): “Big Pun had 10 Benzes and Beamers in front of his place. He wouldn’t leave the hood; he was still in the South Bronx.”

Jadakiss adds depth to Big Pun’s legacy, illustrating his dedication and the impact he had on those around him.

Jadakiss (08:32): “Pun was like the first real nigga out there. He didn’t have a crew; he had an army since kindergarten.”

Their stories paint a picture of Big Pun as not only a talented rapper but also a cornerstone of Terror Squad’s unity and success.

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Attempting to Squash Beef with 50 Cent and Ja Rule

A significant portion of the episode focuses on the infamous beef between Fat Joe, Jadakiss, 50 Cent, and Ja Rule. Fat Joe candidly discusses his attempts to mend fences and the challenges faced in resolving long-standing conflicts.

Fat Joe (75:42): “50 Cent told me, 'I never really had real beef with you. It was just, you know, you jump,' and then somebody told me.”

Despite good intentions, the dynamics of social media and public perception complicate efforts to heal rifts, with Ja Rule expressing reluctance to resolve the feud for fear of losing viral attention.

Jadakiss (74:51): “Why would I squash this? Every time I diss them, I go viral.”

This segment underscores the complexities of modern hip-hop rivalries, where personal relationships often clash with public personas and business interests.

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Suge Knight's Influence and Stories of Confrontation

Fat Joe shares intense stories involving Suge Knight, shedding light on Knight’s pervasive influence and the fear he instilled within the industry. From eerie encounters at award shows to direct confrontations, these narratives reveal the darker side of hip-hop’s power structures.

Fat Joe (06:03): “When Suge Knight walked in by himself, he scared the whole place with a cigar. Lisa Keys was running back... He was like, 'Yo, you don't appreciate how you put in the store.'”

The anecdotes highlight Suge Knight’s intimidating presence and the pervasive sense of fear he maintained, affecting even peaceful environments like award ceremonies.

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Personal Anecdotes and Early Experiences in Hip-Hop

Both Fat Joe and Jadakiss reminisce about their early days in hip-hop, sharing stories of block parties, first performances, and the formative experiences that shaped their careers. These personal tales provide a glimpse into the grassroots origins of their passion for the genre.

Fat Joe (14:16): “I remember the first time I saw KRS1 in Cortland Projects. I was mesmerized.”

Jadakiss (19:36): “We went to the Park Jam, they were doing Eric B. and Rakim, and we started doing the Wap.”

These stories emphasize the community-driven nature of hip-hop and the pivotal moments that inspired them to pursue their dreams.

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Conclusion: The Unstoppable Momentum of Hip-Hop

As the episode wraps up, Fat Joe and Jadakiss reflect on the relentless pace of the hip-hop industry and their place within it. They acknowledge the viral nature of modern music and the challenges it poses to personal relationships and artistic integrity.

Fat Joe (75:55): “Everything we talk about, super viral. There’s no way to stop it, brother.”

The hosts encourage listeners to stay engaged and continue supporting the music, emphasizing the importance of resilience and adaptability in an ever-evolving industry.

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Key Takeaways:

• Eminem's Breakout: Witnessing Eminem's first NYC performance was a defining moment for Fat Joe and Jadakiss, recognizing his unique talent early on.

• Big Pun's Legacy: Big Pun played a crucial role in Terror Squad, bringing charisma and unity that significantly impacted the group's success.

• Resolving Beef: Attempts to resolve conflicts with 50 Cent and Ja Rule highlight the complexities of modern hip-hop rivalries influenced by social media dynamics.

• Suge Knight's Impact: Suge Knight's intimidating presence had a profound effect on the hip-hop community, instilling fear and shaping industry interactions.

• Early Hip-Hop Experiences: Personal stories from Fat Joe and Jadakiss illustrate the grassroots origins and community essence that fueled their passion for hip-hop.

This episode offers an in-depth exploration of pivotal moments and relationships within hip-hop, enriched by the hosts' personal experiences and candid reflections.

Transcript

[Joseph Reeves]

Show me how good it can get today, God, and show the rest of the world what we already know it can't get. No better than being hella black, hella queer, and hella Christian. My name is Joseph Reeves. I am the creator and host of Hella Black, Hella Queer, Hella Christian, a fully black, fully queer, fully human, fully divine podcast. From iHeartMedia to Hella Black, Hella Queer, Hella Christian on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast.

[Ebony]

Welcome to Pretty Private with ebony, the podcast where silence is broken and stories are set free. I'm Ebony, and every Tuesday, I'll be sharing all new anonymous stories that would challenge your perceptions and give you new insight on the people around you. Every Tuesday, make sure you listen to Pretty Private from the Black Effect Podcast network. Tune in on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.

[Katherine Townsend]

Over the years of making my true crime podcast Hell n Gone, I've learned no town is too small for murder. I'm Katherine Townsend. I've heard from hundreds of people across the country with an unsolved murder in their community.

[Caller]

I was calling about the murder of my husband. The murder is still out there.

[Katherine Townsend]

Each week, I investigate a new case each. If there's a case we should Hear about, call 678-744-6145. Listen to Helen Gone Murderline on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

[Jeff Perlman]

I'm Jeff Perlman.

[Rick Jervis]

And I'm Rick Jervis.

[Fat Joe]

We're journalists and hosts of the podcast Finding Sexy Sweat.

[Jeff Perlman]

At an internship in 1993, we roomed with Reggie Payne, aspiring reporter and rapper who went by Sexy Sweat a couple years ago.

[Fat Joe]

We set out to find him, but.

[Jeff Perlman]

In 2020, Reggie fell into a coma after police pinned him down and. And he never woke up.

[Fat Joe]

But then I see my son's not moving.

[Rick Jervis]

So we started digging and uncovered city officials bent on protecting their own.

[Jeff Perlman]

Listen to finding Sexy Sweat on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

[Fat Joe]

You know, I was there. The first time in New York City we ever seen Eminem. They was holding him by the back of his T shirt so he don't fly off the stage. He was just spitting so crazy. And me and Pun, we all looking at each other like, oh, my God. Who's this white boy? That boy craz. Yeah. Yeah. What up, y' all? This is Joe Crack the Dawn.

[Rick Jervis]

It's your boy, Jada. You know what it is the Joe and Jada show, man. What's up, y' all?

[Fat Joe]

Yo, Jada, you got that fly on? That's what you got, bro. That you got. You gotta stop playing. You bought that baby pastel out. No, I'm saying that Balenciaga.

[Rick Jervis]

It's that mint. That mint chocolate chip. Mint peppermint.

[Fat Joe]

Let me tell you something, boy. He threw that on, you know. Hip hop at its finest. I've been in the game professionally, I would say 33 years. How many years you've been in the game?

[Rick Jervis]

20 something.

[Fat Joe]

20 something. And people don't understand. I got an ill story with you. You didn't even know about. No, I had an ill story. I might have saved you. And you ain't know it, right? It was one time. I never forget. We had a show in Chicago. And then Chicago has said, anybody come from out of town, we robbing them. You don't remember that shit. At one time, they was. I could tell you who it was. But you was there when I walked in. Jadakiss was already there. I walked in with extra jury. I went. I went. I went out there. You know, I got a hole.

[Rick Jervis]

I do remember we had a show. We had a. We had a show one time in the shot. I remember that.

[Fat Joe]

And that was. I don't know if you knew that what was going on behind the scenes. It really was nothing to do with us. It just. It was. So we landed on Plymouth. Yes, yes. We landed on Plymouth Rock. They had the pimp with the machine gun under the fucking. He was like on the wheelchair. Got real crazy out there. And I remember I seen Jada and the guys from Chicago salute. Who was threatening everybody. It was the first guys I saw when I walked in, I had the stupid. I wore extra jury because they was like, yo, anybody coming here, we robbing them streets. Was like, yo, I went over there with the dumb jury that day. But, you know, I got the crazy. You know, I got the crazy crew in Chicago too. They seen the. The seven headed Swordsmans that never come out the house. They was like, I. This guy came in. But, you know, thinking of terrifying events, you know, really makes me think of one guy. There's a historical figure in hip hop. And now that the man blind, he in jail, lost all his money. People like use his names and raps and all that. But when Suge Knight had $300 million, they were terrified of this man Sugar shaking up.

[Rick Jervis]

He was shaking.

[Fat Joe]

Shaking or super shaking?

[Rick Jervis]

He was shaking.

[Fat Joe]

The man goes, no, I don't know, right? Because the theory is. I forget what. What movie it was. I think it was Bronster, where he said, I'd rather be feared than love. I used it in. I shot you right? I'd rather be feared than love. Do you truly rather be feared than love in real life? Because this man was so feared that I don't know if I would feel good about myself. You know, I went to an award show one time, and I ain't gonna talk about the Vibe Awards. That would. That. But I went to an award show. That's crazy. I was there.

[Rick Jervis]

I got. That's the one of the first awards I ever got.

[Fat Joe]

The Vibe. You was there?

[Rick Jervis]

Yeah.

[Fat Joe]

When Suge Knight walked in by himself, he scared the whole place with a cigar. You want to talk about that? Lisa Keys running back. She. You know, she pulled me to the side because I told this story before. She was like, yo, bro. I was like, you know, I worship you, Alicia. But you did run past me in the. With the red dress, like, you know, Russell Simmons. All he did was walk in. Everybody ran out. The whole. It was no violence, yet everybody was running. Swiss was like, yo, she don't appreciate how you put in the store. I said, no, she's my sister, and I worship her. But she ran right past me with the red gown on. Like, Russell Simmons was tumbling over. Like, it's like the great white shot was in the building. They just let him out of jail. He walk in his. He have a gun. His was a cigar. He was like this. The whole awards. And I wasn't even talking about that because I don't want to go into that one, right? But matter of fact, I felt right, because I'm only there with my wife. I think I'm there with Armageddon, Tony. I wasn't there with the goons, but it felt like saving Private Ryan or something. Like, when you see the guy in the middle of a war zone and somebody standing there and everybody's running, getting like, I'm standing there. I see Nori stood there. And it's just. Everybody was running for no reason before the violence. This is like the minute they saw him. I'm at a. I'm talking about a whole nother time. I'm at a BET Award or something. Then we go to the. After they got the restaurant that's open. Got a thousand people in there. The whole industry. I'm not just talking about rappers. Was in there talking. It was loud. It was this. Next thing I know, the whole restaurant is quiet, and I turn around, the whole restaurant Emptied out. It was us eating, and Suge Knight sat down in the table right next to us. Him just walking in the restaurant. The whole restaurant ran out. The restaurant, like. It was like they were so shook of this dude. Everybody out there that, you know, I. I just. He was like, what up, big up. For some reason, he would call me all the time, Big homie. What up, big homie? I'm like, yo, what's up, yo? This sat down, we ate our food, we left. And.

[Rick Jervis]

And.

[Fat Joe]

And people were just terrified of him on site. I'll tell you this story that Cool and Dre told me, right? So Cool and Dre super produces my brother's terror squad. They went to LA for a BMI award. And when they went to LA for the BMI award, there was a line going in. So they stood online thinking, that's the line to go in. So all of our favorite rappers and producers and all that was on that line. As they were going in closer and closer, they realized at the front of the line was Suge Knight. And everybody was taking off their earrings politely, their chains, their watches, just no way. Okay, okay. You know, Cool and Dre, they telling you. And I'm talking about, yo, listen, kiss. Famous friends of ours, you would never believe was on that line. Famous friends was voluntarily on that line running the Jews. And so the line wasn't to the front door. It was a line to Suge Knight. Give me your jury. So Cool and Dre looking. They like, you know, they'll tell you they not gangsters. They were like, okay, we figured we getting robbed. They got the TS chains on, they Rolex. They go up to the front, Sugar Knights. Like, ain't you don't produce this guys with Joey. And then he's like, yeah, you know, Cool Andre. They was like, yo, you tell a big homie, man, it's all love this and that. Just walk in this, this, this. So they almost felt like they almost wanted to get robbed with everybody else, because everybody else was looking at him like the fix was in. Like they was down with the. Yo, I'm. You had any run ins with Suge Knight that he tried to, like, say, yo, can I sign you with some?

[Rick Jervis]

Because Suge. Cause she mom's crib. When we was in, like, the. When we was young, right before, right when the bad boy deal was on the table.

[Fat Joe]

Oh, before you signed the debt, Bad Boy, he heard that you were signing somebody.

[Rick Jervis]

Somehow he heard. And we was in Cheeks crib watching video music box. And Suge called his crib Lucha Must have been like, hold on. Coming, you know, it's Sug on the phone. So we, like, what? Then he like. I remember they said, yo, we want to sign. They never even heard us. They just must have, because Puff heard about the sign and say he like, yo, y' all could get on the red eye tonight with how many people? However many people you want to come over here with. I could fly out tonight. We thought about it. He was like, we can't do that. It wouldn't have been. When it was all said and done, it wouldn't have been a good look. Wouldn't. It might have worked for the men, but it probably wouldn't have worked overall for the. You know what I mean? Now you gotta represent over here.

[Fat Joe]

You're absolutely right. You know, but then.

[Rick Jervis]

Then after. I got on, after. After, you know, I'm in the game popping everywhere. I would come, he would. It's like, as soon as I get my bags from baggage claim, they was calling them, and everywhere I had to be was popping up. You know what I'm saying? He wasn't on. No, he was just. He was just everywhere I was at. But it wasn't. He wasn't on. He wasn't. He wasn't on no type of time. Definitely was. I think he already had a relationship with Dee and him, so he knew. He knew how it was gonna go down if.

[Fat Joe]

Yeah, he did have a relationship with D. Yeah.

[Rick Jervis]

Yeah, he was. He had a relationship already.

[Fat Joe]

Yeah, he did. And he was cool with Irv, too. He was cool with a couple of people. Pistol Pete was hanging out in LA with him everywhere. Yo, these cats. This is crazy, man. These guys hang out together, right? This shit is nut. I think about when we talk about hip hop, right? And, you know, I come from the birthplace. So what I try to explain to people when we go into. Yeah, yeah, yeah. But look, yo, Jada, it's not my fault. I'm born there, right? So when you. You Muslim, you look at the Mecca where they walking around the. It's not my fault I'm from that place. Melly Mel lived in my neighborhood. Grandmaster Flash live in my neighborhood. She Shy Rock, first female MC in my neighborhood. Little Rodney C, Ruby D, the first Latino MC ever live in my neighborhood. Love Buck Starsky lived in my neighborhood. All these guys lived in my neighborhood. Mr. Ness. So I'm from the birthplace. So when I talk in my shit, it's kind of hard to argue with me because I'm actually there, like, as a little kid, when they see me they go, little Joey, that's Angel's brother. Little Joey. Smack me on the head, yo, I'll keep it moving. It's like, that's how I grew up in hip hop. But I think about. I remember the first time I ever saw KRS1 was in Cortland Projects. Shout Out, Sadat X. And he had. He was this skinny. He had this Bob Marley shirt on. T shirt with the fucking roster hat. He did the South Bronx. I was mesmerized. This before we even heard it. By the second time he did it, the whole jam was going south, bro. South. We knew the song the second time he did it. He did it one time. By the second, it was. It was pandemonium. Crazy, right? I'm thinking of, who do you see perform for, like, the very first time that you seen him ever perform?

[Rick Jervis]

One time when I was little, my moms came and snatched me off the block. That's how I always like to say. My mom's is responsible for my hip hop career. One time, late 80s, I'm chilling on the block. We playing High Water, Low Water. When you got to jump over the rope. And they keep raising. So it's the whole block. A summer day, you know, on a day. A summer day in New York is better than anywhere.

[Fat Joe]

So that's a fact.

[Rick Jervis]

The whole block is playing. Is lit. Beautiful. My mom's come, get in the car. Me, I want to get in the car. We having the best time, boy. Get in now. I'm tight and she's like, yo, a couple of your mans could come and ask their moms get in. She bring me to Mount Vernon Memorial Field. Open the car door, say, yo, when you get at this time, meet me back here at the car. I get in, I get in the field. It's the Fat Boys was crazy, though. I'm like, fat Boys. How the hell did she. Then it was Fat Boys, it was Rapping Duke, then Run Crazy Dog, Run dmc. Rapping the best. That was. I'm like, how the. It was no grammar. None. It was no. It was barely newspapers. But I'm like, who gave my mom the cold? This was. And that would probably change my life right there.

[Fat Joe]

Yeah, you know. You know, me and my. My brother, you know, my Uncle angel, you know, he's a pastor now and all that. But he had promised us he was going to take us to that concert in Madison Square Garden. That Run dmc, the one they say. Everybody put up the Adidas in the air.

[Rick Jervis]

Fresh fetch.

[Fat Joe]

We waited for him in front of the Building like, yo, that's. Yo. Let me tell you something. When you see these movies of kids waiting for their father to come, and they father never come. When? When I tell you, me and my brother was looking at every fucking headlight coming up the block, hoping my uncle came.

[Rick Jervis]

He never came.

[Fat Joe]

Nah, he never came. And you know what? My uncle angel, he wasn't even like hip hop like that. So I believed him. We sat in front of the projects waiting for hours, and then all you can hear is the legendary stories about motherfucking lift up all the Adidas and all that. But we. Maybe we was too young. That also got. You know, people always like to say, yo, hip hop started peaceful. But every block party I went to, somebody pull out a shotgun and robbed the whole park. So a stampede or started a stampede, right? So even that fresh fest, no matter everything that happened, they said, brooklyn's in the house. Like, you know, like, they were like, you know, it was going down in that motherfucker. They was throwing dudes over the whole shit. So when it comes to first, you know, I was there the first time in New York City we ever seen Eminem. And so he opened up for me and Pun at the Lyricist Lounge. The Outsiders group out of New Jersey, they brought him out. And this man was. You knew he was special. And all of the dudes got dreadlocks and all that. And he was so skinny, they was holding him by the back of his T shirt so he don't fly off the stage. He was just spitting so crazy a man, Pun, we all looking at each other like, oh, my God, who's this white boy? This boy. That boy crazy. You know, I was at this thing called Zodiac 2. I used to go to. Over there is considered High Bridge now. And so we used to go to that club all the time. And I was there the first time I saw Biz Markie bring out Big Daddy Kane. Big Daddy Kane had the roster hat Kango tilted to the side, right? And this is when hip hop was hip hop to where you could have been tough if you wanted to be tough. But it was really about loving the hip hop moment. So, you know, guys had the Benetton bags and all that shit. And when that man said Big Daddy came, went up there, it's like he was like, super Califragilistic. That's real gauche. I literally seen dudes trying to run up the wall, like, defy gravity. This one used to be like, oh, and you wilding and shit like that, man. You know, I was there when Big Daddy Kane brought out Jay Z for the first time. It was in Manhattan. Big Daddy Kane brought him out, and Jay Z start spitting. And you knew he was special because at the time, Jay Z water. I mean, the Big Daddy came water crown for him to bring a young boy out there in Manhattan to get that boy to spit, you know, so you.

[Rick Jervis]

You.

[Fat Joe]

You know, there was. There was things like that that was legendary to me. Who I say, of course, I seen Finesse bring out Big L for the first time. You know, Finesse had, like, your fans, okay, so Finesse had fans that would just go. They didn't even want to hear the beat. They didn't hear. They just wanted to go, oh, they.

[Rick Jervis]

Want to hear the lyrics.

[Fat Joe]

Oh, and they were. And the fans almost lined themselves up. They be in the crowd lining themselves up just to cheer. They'd be like, lord Finesse is the man that you got to hear. So. So they just keep going. That was his fan. And so when Big L came out there and started spitting with Finesse, I was out there. The first show, it was. It was uptown. It was like in. That's considered Dominican land now or Marble Hill and all that. That was the first time Finesse brought him out.

[Rick Jervis]

It's going down. Friday, July 11th. Netflix and most valuable promotions are bringing the fight the whole world's been waiting for.

[Fat Joe]

Yo, one and two was legendary. If number three is anything like one.

[Rick Jervis]

And two, the trilogy, baby. Check it out. Katie Taylor is chasing ultimate glory. Amanda Serrano is fighting for redemption and revenge. This is more than a fight. It's the first ever women's boxing trilogy. You heard that mean it's the third time in the world is watching.

[Fat Joe]

Man, I was just doing, like, boxing blows, but it looked more like the elliptical machine. Go ahead, Jada.

[Rick Jervis]

The first female trilogy. Y' all don't want to miss this. Live from the iconic Madison Square Garden in New York City is Taylor versus Serrano One last time. It's about to get personal. You don't want to miss this. Smoke the stakes sky high. The rivalry, legendary. Who you got to win this crack?

[Fat Joe]

I got Serrano to win, but I definitely notice it's going four fights. I'm just being honest.

[Rick Jervis]

Oh, that's going to really be history if you are not tapped into this fight. What are you even doing? Watch Katie Taylor versus Amanda Serrano. Friday, July 11th at 8pm Eastern, 5pm Pacific live only on Netflix.

[Joseph Reeves]

Show me how good it can get today, God. And show the rest of the world what we already know. It can't get no better than being Hella Black, Hella Queer and Hella Christian. My name is Joseph Reeves. I am the creator and host of Hella Black, Hella Queer, Hella Christian, a fully black, fully queer, fully human, fully divine podcast edit. Explore society, culture and the intersections of faith and identity. Listen to Hella Black, Hella Queer, Hella Christian to hear conversations about what it means to sound the way you look.

[Fat Joe]

I think what I've had to make peace with is that every iteration of my voice is given to me by God and I love it.

[Joseph Reeves]

Books that validated our identity.

[Fat Joe]

The library now for me is a safe space as someone who is writing books that they're trying to take off.

[Joseph Reeves]

Of shelves and how we as black queer folks relate to our Christianity. Listen to Hella Black, Hella Queer, Hella Christian on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast.

[Katherine Townsend]

Over the past six years of making my true crime podcast Hell and Gone, I've learned one thing. No town is too small for murder. I'm Katherine Townsend. I've received hundreds of messages from people across the country begging for help with unsolved murders.

[Caller]

I was calling about the murder of my husband. It's a cold case. They've never found her, and it haunts me to this day. The murderer is still out there.

[Katherine Townsend]

Every week on Helen Gone Murder Line, I dig into a new case, bringing the skills I've learned as a journalist and private investigator to ask the questions no one else is asking.

[Caller]

Police really didn't care to even try. She was still somebody's mother. She was still somebody's daughter. She was still somebody's daughter Sister. There's so many questions that we've never gotten any kind of answers for.

[Katherine Townsend]

If you have a case you'd like me to look into, call the Helen Gone murder line at 678-744-6145. Listen to Helen Gone Murder line on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

[Erica]

The OGs of uncensored motherhood are back and better than ever. I'm Erica. And I'm Mila, and we're the hosts of the Good Moms Bad Choices podcast, brought to you by the Black Effect Podcast Network every Wednesday. Historically, men talk too much and women have quietly listened. And all that stops here. If you like witty women, then this is your tribe with guests like Corinne Stephans.

[Katherine Townsend]

I've never seen so many women protect predatory men.

[Fat Joe]

And then me too happen. And then everybody else want to get pissed off because the White said it was okay.

[Erica]

Problem?

[Fat Joe]

My oldest daughter, her first day in ninth grade and I called to ask how it was going. She was like, dad, all they do is talking about your thing in class.

[Rick Jervis]

I ruined my baby's first day of high school.

[Erica]

And slumflower.

[Fat Joe]

What turns me on is when a.

[Erica]

Man sends me money.

[Fat Joe]

Like, I feel the moisture between my.

[Erica]

Legs when a man sends me money.

[Fat Joe]

I'm like, oh, my God, it's go time. You actually sent it.

[Erica]

Listen to the Good Moms Bad Choices podcast every Wednesday on the Black Effect podcast network, the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you go to find your podcast.

[Dan Bush]

What happens when we come face to face with death?

[Fat Joe]

My truck was blown up by a 20 pound anti tank mine.

[Katherine Townsend]

My parachute did not deploy.

[Fat Joe]

I was kidnapped by a drug cartel. I just remember everything getting dark. I'm dying.

[Dan Bush]

When we step beyond the edge of.

[Fat Joe]

What we know, to open our consciousness to something more than just what's in that western box.

[Dan Bush]

And we turn.

[Fat Joe]

I clinically died. The heart stopped beating, which I was dead for 11.5 minutes.

[Dan Bush]

My name is Dan Bush. My mission is simple. To find, explore, and share these stories.

[Fat Joe]

I'm not a victim.

[Rick Jervis]

I'm a survivor.

[Fat Joe]

You're strongest when you're the most vulnerable.

[Dan Bush]

To remind us what it means to be alive. Not just that I was the guy that cut his arm off, but I'm the guy who was smiling when he cut his arm off. Alive Again, a podcast about the fragility of life, the strength, strength of the human spirit, and what it means to truly live. Listen to Alive again on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.

[Fat Joe]

They went crazy, of course. Me with Big Pun, you know, Big Pun was just this big fat Puerto Rican dude, right? He would wear them hats like, like, like.

[Rick Jervis]

Did you know Pun when he was small?

[Fat Joe]

No.

[Rick Jervis]

You did.

[Fat Joe]

I met Pun Big.

[Rick Jervis]

Yeah.

[Fat Joe]

So I'm coming out the bodega. I'm. I'm finishing my second album. Look at like I'm handing in my second album and, and coming out the bodega and they freestyling and he's like, yo, yo, let me go to it. Now I know I was set up at that time. I thought it was like, God, a miracle or some. Now I know Big Pun set me up. Like, he came to my block to rhyme and he was like. His whole intention was like, yo, let's see if Fat Joe listens to us. So I come in front of the store, they got a couple of dudes freestyling. They go, yo, yo, yo, yo, yo, let me go. He's already semi big, right? So then he do that. Oh, it's just the early beige. Snatch the moon out the sky and blow the sun away. Me and my playing hardcore, hardcore lyrics till I finish. I was like, no, stop. I had. I did the Jada. Whoa, yeah, stop. No, I had the. The Lexus 400, the big boy. I opened that door like, concierge. The man came up in there, sat down, the whole went down. And his crew, they look so sad because it was a group. They look so sad, like, because he was the only one I put in the car. But I pointed at them and I said, yo, Pun, don't worry. We're gonna put them on. You gotta worry about you right now. I'm gonna bust you out. You gonna blow up. And then you put your man's on. You know what I'm saying? He was like, all right, word, word, word. And then we just cruise. He told me his whole life story. That's a whole. You know what's crazy is Pun told me is life story, right? So I come from selling drugs, dealing with the wildest animals you ever dealt with. It did complete treason of treason. Fucking what? Betrayal? Robbers. Just people you just can't trust. So I couldn't believe that he was telling me his real life story. The first second I ever met him, he got in the car. One deal he made with me, he said, yo, man, he said, so Pum was like this real, live, real nigga, but that never really had a crew, a pistoleros. He didn't have a crew. I had an army since I was a kindergarten, bro. I'm telling you, I got a story. He rest in peace. Fuente. Julio Fuente, my barber for many years. He said, I was five years old, I walked to his barbershop with 20 kids. And he said. He was like, yo, I can't cut your hair with these 20 kids. And he said that I told them all to go outside and wait for me. And they all went outside. And that's when my barber, Julio Fuentes, told me. I knew you were the leader. I knew you were gonna run this shit. You was five years old, telling 20 guys, wait outside, right? So, Pun, the point I'm making is. Pun says, is those Terror Squad? Is that going to be my crew? I said, yes. I knew. Listen, I'm such a fan. Kiss, Eminem, Nas, G, Rap. I know. I'm studying hip hop so much. I knew I found the illest thing in the world. I was like, yes. He said, so they're going to do what I say? I said, they're going to. They're going to love you. They could do whatever you say. Oh, I'm in. I'm in. He's like, he always wanted that army with him, right? And sure enough, to this day, they lawyer YouTube. So. But we drive. I tell you an ill stories. The Pun tells me a story how he was homeless, nobody he wanted to show his family, his bloodline, his DNA, that he wasn't going to be a piece of. They always told him he was going to be a piece of. He's telling me this the first minute I met him. I never seen vulnerability like that. But then he tells me this one story. He says, man, I want to, I want to impress my uncle. Some say your uncle. He was like, yeah, man. He said, I got an uncle. He's really rich. He said, and one day I went to him and told him I was hungry. And he went in my hand and he gave me a bunch of rocks, rocks, like rocks. And told him, eat that. So Pun is like, yo, my uncle's rich. I told him I was hungry. He put rocks in my hand, told me to eat that. So long story short, successful first Latino double platinum, filthy rich. Now let me explain Big Pun to you. Big pun had 10 Benzes and Beamers in front of it. He wouldn't leave out the hood. I was begging him. I was already in Jersey. I'm already hearing birds chirping, little kids playing hockey in front of the. I'm gone. Like, he's still in the South Bronx. He's still not the South Bronx. He's soundview. Everybody know 10 Benzes. He had a limousine on 24 hour hold. 365 days. He had a guy, a limousine with a driver just sitting in front of the crib 24 hours a day, right? Little dogs. If he had a fur, his kids have furs. They even got the furs for the dogs. And the dogs was from like Europe or some. He was the true pedestrian of blowing the bag. Big Pun, he like, he, he couldn't hold on to money. He was just going crazy, yo. Where he probably was the first rapper with three Rolex watches on. Like this guy was out of control with it, right? So Pun, unfortunately he passes away, we do the funeral, right? So I rent this big ass funeral in the Bronx. We get people to put the. His whole families there. So you know how they do the. You see the body before everybody. Long story short, his Family's there. We all crying. Everybody's crying. So the door opens, and a man walks it down. See the whole family jump up like. Like they saw a savior. Some, right? And Pun's bodies right here. Right? I'm just saying. I'm looking at. Oh, oh. They was acting like that. You already know what that is. I come from where my uncle was rich. My uncle failed. From all the number spots. They seen the guy with the bag, they all jumped. Oh, right? So he walks in, he says hi to the family. You know what he says to me? He says, yo, what is this guy doing here? Meanwhile, I paid for the whole fucking funeral, My nigga. Like, everybody knows it's Joe and Pun. That's like looking at Styles of Jada. Like, what are they doing here? So I'm sitting there like this. He says, what is this guy doing here to his family? And his family's like, no, no, no, no, no. For multiple reasons. Joe paid, and Joe will you up like you. You really. You playing a terrible game right now.

[Rick Jervis]

Wrong. Wrong one, huh?

[Fat Joe]

Yeah. You might go early downstairs. You don't want that shit, right? So the man. The man turned around and do that to me, and I said, yo, I know who you is. He was like, oh, you know who I am? I said, yeah. I said, you. You're the uncle. The rich uncle. First five minutes I met Pun, he told me how much of a piece of shit you was and how he told you he was hungry and you gave him rocks. I said, let me tell you something, man. Welcome. I paid for all this. And number two is your family's about to tell you, we will beat the living out of you right here now. And they'll drag you out the back of this. He shut the up the rest of the funeral, right?

[Rick Jervis]

As he should.

[Fat Joe]

No, no, he shut the up the rest of the funeral. And, you know, it is what it is. I'm. You know. But anyway, that funeral, I'm sure you guys came through. Puff came through, little Kim Mac 10 flew in TLC. You know, it was so crazy because you know how you get the flowers in the funeral? I'm reading the flowers. So the flowers is, like, sent by Eminem. Eminem might have sent seven flowers for the big pond funeral. Whitney Houston send, like, seven flowers. Like, these people we never met. This is like, you got to go to the Grammy to meet all these people. And all the stars from all over was sending flowers, and I'm reading, and I couldn't believe it. Like, tlc. T bars walked up in there. Everybody, they had so much respect for him. I remember them, you know, the Biggie funeral, you know what I'm saying? I went to Brooklyn in front of his old crib and I just was out there in the streets. When you see the video, the streets of everybody wild because I pulled up in front of the funeral and I just felt like I didn't want to see Big like that. But I was across the street from the Frankie Campbell. You went to the big funeral?

[Rick Jervis]

Yeah, I went.

[Fat Joe]

You had to be sad, huh?

[Rick Jervis]

Yeah, hell yeah. I mean, I was. That was traumatizing for me. For us, you know, that was our first time in LA when that happened with him. So that wasn't. And we made. We always love Big Papa. They played that. They actually played in the funeral. They played it for the Mafia and his family. Yeah, that's. We only made it for that. We never made it to be released. We only made it to play for them. I mean, then Buff end up releasing it with missing you and all that. Yeah, that was it.

[Fat Joe]

Hip hop. What made you get in the game? What lets you know this is the reason you picking up a mic or you writing, you know, in on your paper.

[Rick Jervis]

And for me, when I was little, I was always break dancing, doing. I was the known on the block as the Little. I just was intrigued by hip hop in my uncle's room, like I said, listening to the Fairies five and they used to have park jams in. Yo, I was sneaking in all of them joints one time I. I went all the way across town to Black Heritage Day. When I was little, my mom was gonna whip my ass. But she saw that I love hip hop so much. I. I ain't get in trouble. But I should have gotten how far I went and how young I was. I could have been dead right now. Hip hop saved my life for real. You could say she was gonna kill me. I was just sitting on the. On the hill looking at the niggas performing.

[Fat Joe]

And what I say is that that's similar to me. I remember the first time I heard Eric being Rakim with the don't but don't don't boom, Bono. And we went to the what we went to what's called now where a boogie in them is. Is from, right? But at that time it was on University Avenue. We had to take like 2, 3 trains from the 5 and 2 to the 4. We then you get off at Burnside and you got to walk up that big ass hill.

[Rick Jervis]

Burnside.

[Fat Joe]

There's one thing, you drive that hill, you Walk that. Oh, my God. Like, it felt like the warriors when you. When you like. And so we on the other side. It's almost like being in California, you know, from where I'm from. At that time, we ain't know no car.

[Rick Jervis]

We ain't.

[Fat Joe]

No. We taking trains for hours. And that's where we saw the Wap for the first time. And they was playing that shit. Boom, boom. And back in the days, you know, and we studying them and we trying to do the dance. We took that bitch back home. That next day, we went to the Park Jam. They doing that Eric B. And Rakim. And we start doing the Wap.

[Rick Jervis]

Yeah.

[Fat Joe]

And everybody starts studying the Wap. I mean, you know, back. Back in that day, it was more word of mouth.

[Rick Jervis]

Yeah. The only way is. Is word of mouth or the phone with the.

[Fat Joe]

The speed that made me think of an ill story, right? And so part of being a great storyteller is, is you tell your wins and you tell your losses. You know what I'm saying? You got to be able to, you know, you got to have people tune in where they feel like they there, right? So I come from a project called Godsville, right? So also, it was like the Mecca of the Five Percenters. So everywhere, I was the God. Crack Kim. Great God, Allah. Yo, I'm telling you what it is, right?

[Rick Jervis]

Crack Kim, is you gotta.

[Fat Joe]

Yo, listen. You gotta think. You gotta think.

[Rick Jervis]

What is this?

[Fat Joe]

Listen, yo, you gotta think. There's no other way to do it. You gotta think. Y' all everybody go check out this movie back in the day. It's called Fresh. You gotta think, Chuck.

[Rick Jervis]

Remember Fresh Buster. Funky dope move.

[Fat Joe]

But think Chucky from Fresh Ferry, right?

[Rick Jervis]

Now we fellas. Yeah.

[Fat Joe]

Cause.

[Rick Jervis]

Cause I ain't. My man. My man. That's in Fresh. The Fresh used to work out with us. He moved it. He moved to Cali now. But when we got.

[Fat Joe]

I gotta feed him. I gotta meet Chucky.

[Rick Jervis]

We didn't meet him. We just found him. He said Dallas Ferry. Also, you ain't Chucky if you watch this show. Come on.

[Fat Joe]

I gotta meet Chucky. So Fat Joe is Chucky for friends. There's no way around. In real life, that's what he was. The yo punishes we bust a stupid. That was just Joe, always the guy starting the trouble. Always getting in trouble. Always trying to do too much. Always trying to, you know, wild out just every time, right? And so I grew up, my projects 90% black, 10 Puerto Rican. It is what it is. So the gods being there, and I'm Chucky for Fresh. Like, yo, get the up out of here. They building, trying to do the cipher. I'm saying lambs to Lemon bacon or I'm with everybody, right? So you got the gods from Section 5, Co Op City, Patterson Projects. All the gods know. They come to my. My projects is the Mecca, Godsville. And he was the little. I was the annoying fat Puerto Rican that would with everybody. So he said, yo, you ain't God body, but, you know, you bear witness. God. The God cry. Yeah, I'm the God. Crack him. Great God Allah. Y' all know it's right. So if you want the picture, this is what it is, right? So now they have some in Manhattan, right? They had some in Manhattan. I'm gonna tell y' all true story. Don't get mad at me. Bronx, they had this called March a Dime.

[Rick Jervis]

I remember the.

[Fat Joe]

Lori shouldn't even listen to this story, because this is like. This was like, you know, Matzah Dime was raising money in this.

[Rick Jervis]

Yeah. The thing with the change in it. This, remember?

[Fat Joe]

But at the end, just before you go to the ferry to Staten island, whatever that is, Battery, whatever that shit is down there. So one day we said. Because Brooklyn used to be there deep. So one day we told the whole entire Bronx, the whole entire Bronx that we going down there. And I ain't gonna lie to you, say they was 20, 30, 40,000 black dudes. They had one fat Spanish read. I was. You might as well say I was surfing on the. On the trick. Yeah, what's up? The BX? I'm like Chucky from Fresh. Like, I'm like, on 10,000, right? So we get out. It's to every train. It was like the warriors was just thousands, hundreds of guys from the Bronx, from Co Op City, the Valley, all the way down to Patterson. I mean, everybody got the memo. We going down there, right? So we get out the train and Battery Park, South Bronx South. South Bronx. South Bronx is. I mean, thousands of us, right? South Bronx. Next thing you know, as we getting closer to the park, I start hearing like, south Bronx, South, South Bronx. And I'm still like, yeah, south road South. And, man, we get to this part, and what I don't think we relied on is people having cousins in Brooklyn, right? So they must have told Brooklyn the Bronx was coming out there. Geographically, Brooklyn is like seven times bigger. The Bronx, if we had 20,000, they had 100,000. Brooklyn in the house. Brooklyn, yo. And then I. I ain't going to lie. The base in the Bronx voice really told man, we got it popping instantly. It was just the Bronx against Brooklyn. We fighting all over. I see all these guys who I thought was the toughest guys getting hit. They will hit you with the frankfurter, man. The. The frankfurter truck. They pounding you out.

[Rick Jervis]

They threw the whole guy, yo.

[Fat Joe]

They throw the whole truck on you. Like, this was bad out there. Like, yo, we was taking a beat. I just seen everybody's getting. We fight. Of course we got. You know, Bronx got the realest. You know, we out there fighting thousand people. I'll tell you one thing. I'm sure there was some other Puerto Ricans, but, man, it was scarce. I mean, they.

[Rick Jervis]

They.

[Fat Joe]

Brooklyn definitely saw the fat Puerto Rican dude going all out fighting everybody. That. But it was just. We had to get the up out of there bad, though. I mean, you see every God, this one, that one, this. Everybody was shoot shooting past. It was just. They was just way too deep. And we went over there super deep. But it. That. This. I guess that's like the great adventures of, like, being a kid without a car, rolling with your project somewhere, Catching the L. Where do you go to with your projects? That. It got a little bit too.

[Rick Jervis]

I never lived in the projects, but my neighborhood was just as up as the project. But, like, Halloween nights, they used to have shits with every one whole side of town and just mad projects and mad blocks just get together and go somewhere and do some crazy.

[Fat Joe]

You know, I did that. I used that one time. But I was a young kid hustling, selling drugs. I know that that's not popular to say, and I'm not co signing, but better than using. I remember. That's a fact. I remember right. It was one Halloween and they had these dudes. I had this little crack spot. It was clicking. And these dudes were grown men, right? They would.

[Rick Jervis]

They.

[Fat Joe]

You know, I'm only 14, 13, 14, and I got a spot and it's clicking. So these guys were grown men and they came through and they just set up shops in the park. And they was like, yo, shorty, man, you dead. Like. Like, I'm telling you the truth. Yo, you dead on this. Like. Like, come on, man. This. And I'm only like 13, 14. But my projects used to get together for Halloween. It was hundreds of us. And we go to everybody else's projects with the socks, with this. So it happened to be Halloween, right? And it was. They was super deep. And I told everybody, yo, I'm gonna give you the signal. Y' all come around the corner.

[Rick Jervis]

Dude.

[Fat Joe]

Ah, yo, I'm 13. I walk up to these dudes, they grown men. I'm like, yo, y' all can't pump out here. They like, what? Like, yo, didn't we tell you this? I was like, hey, yo, they just came around the corner. The whole project looked like Halloween. These with socks, with this. This nigga was like, yo, they with you? I said, yes, this is my crew. Like, what y' all want out here? Man, them boys left that spot so fast, man. I think the project ain't. No, I used them to. To run these guys out of you. These guys were grown men, 30 years old. When I say, yo, hundreds of guys came with the face painted, the socks. They was like, no, no, no, no, no. We out. Don't worry about it. We won't come back over here no more. This, this, that I use Halloween a couple of times. Nah, you know, this is all theater.

[Rick Jervis]

When theater. One time I blocked. We was hustling because we used to hustle together. So I lived in the middle of the block. I came out, like, in the evening one time. Like, no, I'm. I'm. I'm catching, like, the sundown shift. So I come out how to. I probably had a hundred. Couple hundred pieces on me. Come out, dab everybody up. Go put my pack in the building. Like, two. Look, come out. What's up, Crack? Put my. My man. And this is the crazy. He's Mary's cousin. He's the one who actually passed the demo. It's J Bot. My man Jamal. He actually passed the demo to Mary that went to Puff that got assigned. So fast forward, I come. I come out the crib shower ready to knock my work off. Put it in the. Put it in the middle building up in the elevator thing. Come out, two seconds, somebody else. Somebody come, they want some custody. I go back, it's gone now I'm like, my man. I said, bob, you. There's no way. It was. When I tell you was this fat. I came out that put the pack in the building, went outside them. Yo, let me get something. Went back, nothing. Me. Yeah, you got my pack. And we almost had it. We got down to, like, Nose didn't know. He like, sure, I don't got your. I'm like, you gotta has no ways.

[Fat Joe]

Nobody.

[Rick Jervis]

Yeah, I'm not taking no for it. So we all got, like, heated. They calmed it down, but I still. I can't sleep because I'm like. I went to the house and got some more, but I'm like, this. My whole night was up.

[Fat Joe]

Oh, yeah.

[Rick Jervis]

So we chilling a few hours later. Always come a smoker come out. Did you have them green bags they having a party in Deb's house with?

[Fat Joe]

I said, oh, you was like, who's pumping the green bags?

[Rick Jervis]

So now we got to the bottom of it. My man nut oh, he recipe he alive. Peanut obi's alive.

[Fat Joe]

We have killed peanut Stolen.

[Rick Jervis]

Yeah, we have killed them.

[Fat Joe]

Not. You know I was the bathroom on yourself.

[Rick Jervis]

We obliterated them.

[Fat Joe]

Let me tell you something.

[Joseph Reeves]

Show me how good it could get today, God. And show the rest of the world what we already know. It can't get. No better than being hella black, hella queer, and hella Christian. My name is Joseph Reeves. I am the creator and host of Hella Black, Hella Queer, Hella Christian, a fully black, fully queer, fully human, fully divine podcast that explores society, culture, and the intersections of faith and identity. Listen to Hella Black, hella queer, Hella Christian to hear conversations about what it means to sound the way you look.

[Fat Joe]

I think what I've had to make peace with is that every iteration of my voice is given to me by God and I love it.

[Joseph Reeves]

Books that validated our identity.

[Fat Joe]

The library now for me is a safe space as someone who is writing books that they're trying to take off.

[Joseph Reeves]

Of shelves and how we as black queer folks relate to our Christianity. Listen to Hella Black, Hella Queer, Hella Christian on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts or web. You get your podcast.

[Katherine Townsend]

Over the past six years of making my true crime podcast Hell and Gone, I've learned one thing. No town is too small for murder. I'm Katherine Townsend. I've received hundreds of messages from people across the country begging for help with unsolved murders.

[Caller]

I was calling about the murder of my husband. It's a cold case. They've never found her. And it haunts me to this day. The murderer is still out there.

[Katherine Townsend]

Every week on Helen Gone Murder Line, I dig into a new case, bringing the skills I've learned as a journalist and private investigator to ask the questions no one else is asking.

[Caller]

Police really didn't care to even try. She was still somebody's mother. She was still somebody's daughter. She was still somebody's sister. There's so many questions that we've never gotten any kind of answers for.

[Katherine Townsend]

If you have a case you'd like me to look into, call the Hell and Gone murder line at 678-744-6145. Listen to Helen Gone Murderline on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

[Erica]

The OGs of uncensored motherhood are back and better than ever. I'm Erica. And I'm Mila. And we're the hosts of the Good Moms Bad Choices podcast brought to you by the Black Effect Podcast Network every Wednesday. Historically, men talk too much and women have quietly listened. And all that stops here. If you like witty women, then this is your tribe with guests like Corinne Steffens.

[Katherine Townsend]

I've never seen so many women protect predatory men.

[Fat Joe]

And then me too happened and then everybody else want to get pissed off because the white said it was okay.

[Erica]

Problem.

[Fat Joe]

My oldest daughter, her first day in ninth grade and I called to ask.

[Rick Jervis]

How I was doing.

[Fat Joe]

She was like, oh, dad, all they were doing was talking about your thing in class.

[Rick Jervis]

I ruined my baby's first day of high school.

[Erica]

And Slumflower, what turns me on is.

[Fat Joe]

When a man sends me money. Like, I feel the moisture between my.

[Erica]

Legs when a man sends me money.

[Fat Joe]

I'm like, oh my God, it's go time. You actually sent it.

[Erica]

Listen to the Good Moms Bad Choices podcast every Wednesday on the Black Effect podcast network, the iHeartRadio app, Apple podcast, or wherever you go to find your podcast.

[Dan Bush]

What happens when we come face to face with death?

[Fat Joe]

My truck was blown up by a 20 pound anti tank mine.

[Katherine Townsend]

My parachute did not deploy.

[Fat Joe]

I was kidnapped by a drug cartel. I just remember everything getting dark. I'm dying.

[Dan Bush]

When we step beyond the edge of.

[Fat Joe]

What we know, to open our consciousness to something more than just what's in that western box. In return, I clinically died. The heart stopped beating, which I was dead for 11.5 minutes.

[Dan Bush]

My name is Dan Bush. My mission is simple. To find, explore and share these stories.

[Fat Joe]

I'm not a victim.

[Rick Jervis]

I'm a survivor.

[Fat Joe]

You're strongest when you're the most vulnerable.

[Dan Bush]

To remind us what it means to be alive. Not just that I was the guy that cut his arm off, but I'm the guy who was smiling when he cut his arm off. Alive Again, a podcast about the fragility of life, the strength of the human spirit, and what it means to truly live. Listen to Alive again on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.

[Fat Joe]

I was way too young in the streets doing the shit I was doing. Of course when I got older, it was like really not fair for people, but I was way too young. So they, I get it while they was trying me because it was like, yo, this guy's 13, 14 out here. Really trying to. So this one I remember. Nah, we did some foul shit. It was like this crackhead. I had him, cell phone, baby. He was 7ft tall, still had size, this, this, that. So he dead me.

[Rick Jervis]

Oh, he did it.

[Fat Joe]

Yo, bro, I'm not lying to you. He deaded me. He was like, yo, I ain't got your money. This, this step. So now I'm, I'm like with like three or four of my mans with me, right? We still all little dudes though. But so I'm like, let me tell you, snitching never sat right with me. Never ever, ever, ever, ever sat right with me and letting somebody get one up on me. Never ever. To this day, I don't think there's somebody who got one up on me, right? Physically meaning, right? So he's down there, he pumping, we over here and I'm telling him, yo, that he beat me for like a hundred dollars and he ain't coming next to us or nothing like this. So they was like, word, pound them out. God. I'm like, yo, I'm like, yo, let's pound them out, right? So the dude was addicted to gambling. So we went and took like three rocks. We didn't even have dice. We down the block, we act like we gambling. We throwing the rocks against the sea low, yo, doing whatever this come over. We put the beats on this guy. So body slam this dude, we pounded him out. So legend. And so you know, where I put in this is real was like one time I went, I went to see my aunt stuck up my cuz.

[Rick Jervis]

Yeah, come on, man, come on. Crap. Come on.

[Fat Joe]

When I put on the is real primo edition one time I went to see my aunt, stuck up my cuz, right? So now it wasn't me. I don't want to say nobody business, but one of my, my uncle, he got beat, right? So he gave somebody some work, they didn't pay him back. This, this, that. So he calls me, he says, you know, it's my cousin. This is my uncle. And my cousin was a grown ass man. I'm 14, 15, right? So my uncle calls me and says, yo, that work you gave me, Our cousin such and such he beat you. He. He talking about he ain't paying. This was way too big for us. Like a grown man. Yeah, my own cousin, right? He did. You know, you 14, you trying to give dudes work. You think you cool. These guys are 28, 30 years old. They don't give a.

[Rick Jervis]

About what you saying you was Young enough to knock off your own work.

[Fat Joe]

Let me tell you what happened. So I walk in. This is a true story. I walk into my aunt's house, and that dude is gambling in the hallway. He's getting. He's my cousin. We put the beats on him. So legend. So legend in front of the whole hood, yo. So legend. He was shooting dice. We pounded him out. To this day, I don't even feel right when I see him at funerals and all that, because he talks to me, but he knows what we did to him. No, I'm telling. I'm telling you the truth. I see him. He's my. He's my cousin, you know, he spoke at my father's funeral recently. Like, oh, Ernesto was. You know, this. But he caught.

[Rick Jervis]

He.

[Fat Joe]

He had to. I never let him. I never let him. There's this guy. Let me tell you something, right? There's this guy. I wrote about it in my book, the Book of Jose. This guy. And they know what I'm talking about. I gotta say it, because I said it in this. In the thing, but his name was Monkey Face Carlos. Monkey Face Carlos from the Bronx was a killer.

[Rick Jervis]

You hear me from the bx.

[Fat Joe]

Yes, he was a legit killer, because I don't know where he's at, but he was there with Chicky for Southern Boulevard. And all these. These guys is the most dangerous crew in the Bronx. Don't let nobody lie to you. These guys, they're underneath the jail. They told the judge, told him, please don't, guys. Yo, I want to snitch on another body. For who? Chicky. Please, we not doing no more chicky stories. Like, we don't want no more by, like, they Underneath the jail, right? The realest guys ever in the Bronx. There's just no other way to explain it to you, right? He's one of them. So he's going out with a girl from my building, right? So, of course, you know, I'm young, I'm. I got the wood. So I tell him, I said, yo, Monkey, yo, I got some work. When he's like, yo, give me 500.

[Rick Jervis]

What's his name? Monkey.

[Fat Joe]

Monkey Face. Carlos had the green eyes. They know what I'm talking about and.

[Rick Jervis]

Look like a monkey, though.

[Fat Joe]

No, he was actually a fairly handsome guy, but that was just. That's what they called him. And he was way advanced for me. I'm only 14. He's. He's like. They putting in work. Legend out there, right? But he go with the girl in my building. So I've Been calling him. He don't pick up the phone, right? So he walk out my building, right? And I ain't gonna lie to you. I'm still just a kid, right? So he walk out my building. I'm like, yo, yo, yo, yo, Carlos up. I've been calling you. He was like, yeah, for what? I was like, you know, that I gave you. He was like, oh, you dead on that. Like, you like that, though, man, I swear to God, man. Yo, is crazy. Do they know what they with here, man? I'm like. I'm looking at him. I'm just a kid, but I'm like. He was like, oh, you.

[Rick Jervis]

You.

[Fat Joe]

You want. Oh, you dead on that. And he keeps walking. And I'm watching them. It's turning, like, whatever they call that twilight. It's turning dark. And I watch him. Why? While he's walking down the block, I'm talking to myself, my conscience. I said, man, you this played. You use a sucker like, you let this guy beat you. This is. So I'm talking to myself, right? So he gets like a block down, almost by Diamond D building. And I said, yo, monkey. He turned around. He was like, what? It's like, no, one second, one second. So I'm jogging over there. Nah, Monkey, yo, check this out. I got some work. Boom. I duffed this dude, right? He fall on the floor. Pound them out. Legend.

[Rick Jervis]

Legend.

[Fat Joe]

He's on the floor, pounded out. And let me tell you something. Thank God he ain't kill me. He ain't come back with the mob. Thank God he ain't do none of that. But I was so impressed with my courage to stand up to this guy. I could not believe I. He was just. What? So I never, you know, it never been a thing to me. You know what I mean? Like, to. To get played like that. Get beat and the snitching. It doesn't exist.

[Rick Jervis]

Revenge is a disserved. However the you want to serve it. That's my smoke. You heard?

[Fat Joe]

Revenge is a what?

[Rick Jervis]

A dish served however you want to serve.

[Fat Joe]

However you wouldn't. Yeah, that's a good one. Revenge is a dish.

[Rick Jervis]

Serve a chilled warm. Oh, man, leftovers.

[Fat Joe]

That's why this guy's talking.

[Rick Jervis]

You want to get your revenge? This is on you.

[Fat Joe]

Oh, yeah. I could never live with that, man. I couldn't live with, you know, anybody trying to play with me. I said, one time, I come out, Jimmy's Cafe. The guy, you know this guy, too. I'm telling you this story about. I come out of Jimmy's Cafe. And I don't know why, because I'm always there. But he come out of jail. I seen him with y' all, right? No, I'm just saying he's not a member of your crew. But I've seen him. He's a well respected guy from the Bronx. He's. He's not. But he look at me and he was like. Or they let you in here. And I'm like, he just came home from jail, right? But all these. Oh, my God. So he comes home from jail, right? So I guess he's thinking like, you know, he's tough now or something. And so he's like, oh, they let you in here? I said, what? What you mean? And he said, nah, you could still be in the hood. Like, you ain't supposed to be either. So I smack his cheek off in the bathroom. Dude, one second, smacked his cheeks. No, I'm telling you, I gave him that fire. Boom. Then he tried to act up outside. I finished it off outside. I really pounded him out, Legend, you know what I'm saying? I ain't gonna lie. I ain't see him for years till I seen the locks with him somewhere. I said, he still think he tough.

[Rick Jervis]

Who is this guy?

[Fat Joe]

They'll sue you now if you say the name right. I don't need to put. I'll tell you in your ear. Nah, he was probably like the 10th. Trust me, he wasn't with me. No, he wasn't with y' all. I'm just saying he's considered a real guy. He's just considered a real guy with fetch. I'm just telling you the truth. He caught. He caught an L. His sister had to jump in, who's well respected. You know what I'm talking about? In the street. She jumped in like, Joe, that's my brother. Please know this. I just. And it was that. I just can't tolerate the disrespect. Like, you know, like I. I never. Let's just get off that subject. They come up with the. The duos. I was thinking about the best groups of all time. Groups. You know, where did.

[Rick Jervis]

I did this already? Didn't we.

[Fat Joe]

No, we did duos.

[Rick Jervis]

Complex. Did duos. What have we done?

[Fat Joe]

Ladies, producers, songs. We ain't do the biggest. The best groups of all time. But there's probably a lot of crossover groups, though. There's some groups, there's duos and then there's some groups. There's groups. I don't think you count about a.

[Rick Jervis]

They running out of to make up. So they Broke down two man groups. Then next they come with three man groups. Then come with.

[Fat Joe]

How about them guys we did the show with? What's the. What the 520 boys. They brought out the LeBron Jordan. Like there's some. There's some shits that everybody keep playing into that. It's like that. Never gonna get old. You know you ain't with the groups today. You don't feel like it. You got the pastel on you.

[Rick Jervis]

Did the duos. We don't need to do the trios. The next month. Do something else.

[Fat Joe]

Top three posse cuts of all time. We could do five. But you know this guy don't want to do it.

[Rick Jervis]

We can do five.

[Fat Joe]

Five top five.

[Rick Jervis]

As long as they know.

[Fat Joe]

Why is it all I'm doing?

[Rick Jervis]

This is participate. This is him. Yeah.

[Fat Joe]

I gotta let it be known that he's with me. Me. This is my business partner. Don't let him just. He gonna get me up at a Rock the Bells concert. Right? I'm gonna get pound out things gonna pound me out of the right. They gonna be see the next little. What they do when they do them little cartoons. What they call that. Sketches. They gonna show Joe running from the Rock the Bells concert. Rock him ready to hit me with a stick or something. What top five posse cuts? You want to start or I start?

[Rick Jervis]

I go first.

[Fat Joe]

Oh, I knew you wanted to go first.

[Rick Jervis]

You gotta go first.

[Fat Joe]

I knew you wanted to go first on this one.

[Rick Jervis]

Stop the violence. Number one.

[Fat Joe]

Stop the violence.

[Rick Jervis]

No, no. Help this self destruction.

[Fat Joe]

Destruction.

[Rick Jervis]

Self destruction. I'm going with that. I'll get that out the way first. Bing bang, bang.

[Fat Joe]

I never knew why we never had a self destruction too. They need it. But the little kid got killed from Philly. He did it over.

[Rick Jervis]

I mean destruction. The scenario remix I could have took.

[Fat Joe]

Was that when he heard that's you say oh no.

[Rick Jervis]

Is when you heard you say oh, no.

[Fat Joe]

You.

[Rick Jervis]

All right? What I got? Self destruction scenario remix. I'm cooking with grease right now.

[Fat Joe]

No, no. Right now. You out of control.

[Rick Jervis]

Oh, the symphony.

[Fat Joe]

That's three.

[Rick Jervis]

I'm leaving the face.

[Fat Joe]

I ain't gonna lie to you. He took my. That's my number one. You started it.

[Rick Jervis]

Okay.

[Fat Joe]

That's my number one. I got two more left. I'm just telling you. I would have went that. That would. That was on the top of my list.

[Rick Jervis]

Scenario he up my whole life. Destruction.

[Fat Joe]

He up.

[Rick Jervis]

Now.

[Fat Joe]

Don't give up.

[Rick Jervis]

I'm not even gonna use me.

[Fat Joe]

I'm gonna use you.

[Rick Jervis]

Yeah. I'll let you use me. Verbal intercourse. Right?

[Fat Joe]

Number four.

[Rick Jervis]

Yeah, I'm smoking now. Here.

[Fat Joe]

No, no, no. You doing.

[Rick Jervis]

Damn. Come back.

[Fat Joe]

The symphony. I didn't think you was gonna do that. It's getting out of here.

[Rick Jervis]

What? What's my four right now? Self destruction scenario. Symphony. Verbal intercourse. And this. Let me finish it off with a.

[Fat Joe]

Yo.

[Rick Jervis]

Yeah, I shot you.

[Fat Joe]

It put me in the game. I shot you. I shot you. Put me. That's just me.

[Rick Jervis]

No, no, I shot you. Self destruction scenario. Remix. The symphony. And what was piece of. I left shits out for you. Yeah, I left you shits.

[Fat Joe]

I'm going Benjamin's.

[Rick Jervis]

Okay.

[Fat Joe]

Then I'm going live at the barbecue. Then I'm going banned from tv.

[Rick Jervis]

And then he goes. Then he's going, brain freeze. It's more shit, though. I'm just looking.

[Fat Joe]

I got. Hold up.

[Rick Jervis]

Don't give us this.

[Fat Joe]

No, no, I know what it is. It's John Blaze.

[Rick Jervis]

Right after that.

[Fat Joe]

It's what it was.

[Rick Jervis]

I know what it is.

[Fat Joe]

Don't say nothing. It is what it is.

[Rick Jervis]

I know what it is.

[Fat Joe]

What's the list?

[Rick Jervis]

I'm in three of his five. I love him.

[Fat Joe]

You are one of the greatest rappers in cyphers ever. You took my Tell me.

[Rick Jervis]

And he got John Blaze.

[Fat Joe]

I got Alzheimer's.

[Rick Jervis]

John Blaze, man from TV and the Benjamins. He said, oh, so you got four. You need one more.

[Fat Joe]

Yeah, that's a tough one. That's where I'm stuck in the reservoir. I mean, I'm stuck in Muddy Waters.

[Rick Jervis]

Oh, you just said it. You just said it.

[Fat Joe]

Hold up. Wait a minute.

[Rick Jervis]

Might as well put me in five with my fourth. Make me four out of five, man. Let me get you one. Reservoir Dogs done started something. It's better, I guess. What you want?

[Fat Joe]

Yeah, but you know what I'm thinking of? Yeah, I want to keep I Flavor remakes. That's it.

[Rick Jervis]

That's it.

[Fat Joe]

That's it. That's the five.

[Rick Jervis]

Those is good five.

[Fat Joe]

What's my five again? Because this guy took all the.

[Rick Jervis]

Yo, put this thing on this post when you put it.

[Fat Joe]

Yo, flavor in your ear remix. I get more butt than ass chase a fair one. Ski mask way. Damn.

[Rick Jervis]

Do you know?

[Fat Joe]

Do you know from here?

[Rick Jervis]

A little birdie told me that verse that big. He was talking about Craig Mack on his own song.

[Fat Joe]

I heard about that. Nah, I heard about it. Rest in peace.

[Rick Jervis]

Bound to get dropped.

[Fat Joe]

Would you get. You bound to get dropped. Damn. I mean, the same thing happened with cannabis in LL when he put him on that Other joint.

[Rick Jervis]

Yeah, that was.

[Fat Joe]

That was a great song, but I. I don't think it makes the type. I don't think it makes the first five. Like. Like when he said the first five scenario and then, you know, that was a good one. But that wasn't. That wasn't ashacha. It wasn't. But that Cannabis Lo battle, who you thought was winning that at the prime of that battle right there, I didn't like.

[Rick Jervis]

That was the start of our demise of. With this comparison. Because it's a young. A young aspiring rapper to be. Have a career going. That battle with the first person that ever signed a Def Jam. It's not right. We should have never let that happen. That was a flag. But we. We like negative and we like controversy so much. He went to the army, right? He went. He went military.

[Fat Joe]

Yeah, Cannabis went to the military.

[Rick Jervis]

Military man. He done. He's super nice.

[Fat Joe]

If there was anybody that Big Pun wanted to smoke with, it was Cannabis.

[Rick Jervis]

He didn't want to smoke with Cannon.

[Fat Joe]

No, because, you know, Pun respected him.

[Rick Jervis]

Blinky Blink went left Harlem, went to his album release party and Julio him on cannabis.

[Fat Joe]

Yeah. What for? He was an llc.

[Rick Jervis]

He said he's something about him in the rhyme. Used to you son.

[Fat Joe]

Went to his album party with his album release. I never liked the KRS 2pm dawn off the stage. I used to love PM Dog, bro. I didn't like that. There were certain shits that we didn't like.

[Rick Jervis]

I wasn't supposed to say nothing about Chris, though, man. The teachers, man.

[Fat Joe]

Did he say something about Chris? PM dawn, he had to.

[Rick Jervis]

He went on stages to power and threw his ass off. He had to do some serious violation for him to do that.

[Fat Joe]

Damn. God. Without you. I used to love that, right?

[Rick Jervis]

Pm Doing that.

[Fat Joe]

Bro. Yo, I with PM Dwight. Yeah, he passed away. Rest in peace, PM Dawn. I remember Finesse had the beef with. My man's the funky man over there in. In Jersey. I live for the funk. Come on.

[Rick Jervis]

I die for the Mr. Funky.

[Fat Joe]

Him and Finesse had a rap battle. Yeah, they super cool. No, they mad cool sometimes. I was just with 50 Cent. We got all that, had all that history with him. You know, you respect people when you go to war with them and you see like, you like, damn. And then, you know, 50 Cent just told me this too many. You said, yo, you know, the beef was never with you. He said you just too loyal. He said you too loyal and you just took their side because you made music with them. But he. I swear to God, he just Told me this one day ago. He was like, yo, I never really had real beef with you. It was just, you know, you jump. And then somebody told me, think about it. Now. Somebody told me, like, I. I try to get two rappers to squash a beef. Big time rappers. I had one ready to squash it. And this ain't 50 Cent. Ja rule. I had one release, Crush it. I went to see the other in this house, and you know what he told me? Yo, Joe, why would I squash this? Because every time I just say they name or diss them, I go viral. There's no way I'm gonna squash that. You believe that people keep problems because they know if they say your name, they're going viral automatically. And so the guy told me, why would I squash the beef? Every time I want to go viral, I just say, these guys, yo, the game is up, man. The chemistry of the game is. Is crazy. But, I mean, think about it, right? You know what I'm saying? We started with Jimmy, and then now he's on a world tour about. You know what I'm saying? I don't think Nas even responded, right. He responded with a casino. He responded with a casino. That was bad. Yo, do you know what 1% of a casino is? 20, 25. I'm sure he got more than that. I'm just saying. Yeah, he responded with a casino.

[Rick Jervis]

We're gonna wrap up with that.

[Fat Joe]

Yeah. Let me tell you something.

[Rick Jervis]

Responding with a casino.

[Fat Joe]

Is it we? Are we at Rock Nation? Every time I thought I had something for Jay Z, you'd be like, out of Monaco, where the grapes are 5, 000, I eat the dis. Like, I'd be like, yo, he's just. The wood that I step on is a million dollar. I'm like, yo, we can't say about this guy.

[Rick Jervis]

That was Juan's bill. Same kids. The most ever spent on Dyckman indictment.

[Fat Joe]

That was Juan's.

[Rick Jervis]

That was Juan's bill.

[Fat Joe]

I mean, I. I think Nas took a page out of his hoes book with this one when he just said, okay, perfect time. And you promoted the casino. Here you go. And on that note, we the biggest in the game. Joe Crack. Hold on. What is it? It's cracked. It's Kiss.

[Rick Jervis]

This ain't that. That ain't.

[Fat Joe]

That ain't this. And the train is coming. Let me tell you something, man. Y' all see what's going on out there, man. Y' all say, subscribe. Do whatever you want to do.

[Rick Jervis]

Like share, subscribe.

[Fat Joe]

That. Damn. You see? So you do know what's going on out there.

[Rick Jervis]

I don't know why you think I'm on the rock, right?

[Fat Joe]

Let me tell you something, man. Like, share, subscribe, whatever the is, listen, it's the inevitable. If y' all want smoke, get at us. If you don't, it is what it is. But the train keep coming, baby. The train. Y' all see this? Everything we talk about, super viral. There's no way to stop it, brother.

[Joseph Reeves]

Show me how good it could get today, God, and show the rest of the world what we already know. It can't get. No better than being hella black, hella queer, and hella Christian. My name is Joseph Reeves. I am the creator and host of Hella Black, Hella Queer, Hella Christian, a fully black, fully queer, fully human, fully divine podcast. From iHeartMedia to hello, Black, Hella Queer, Hella Christian on the iHeartRadio app, Apple podcast, or wherever you get your podcast.

[Ebony]

Welcome to Pretty Private with Ebony, the podcast where silence is broken and stories are set free. I'm Ebony, and every Tuesday I'll be sharing all new anonymous stories that would challenge your perceptions and give you new insight on the people around you. Every Tuesday, make sure you listen to Pretty Private from the Black Effect Podcast network. Tune in on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.

[Jeff Perlman]

I'm Jeff Perelman.

[Fat Joe]

And I'm Rick Jervis. We're journalists and hosts of the podcast Finding Sexy Sweat.

[Jeff Perlman]

At an internship in 1993, we roomed with Reggie Payne, aspiring reporter and rapper who went by Sexy Sweat a couple years ago.

[Fat Joe]

We set out to find him, but.

[Jeff Perlman]

In 2020, Reddy fell into a coma after police pinned him down and he never woke up.

[Fat Joe]

But then I see my son's not moving.

[Rick Jervis]

So we started digging and uncovered city officials bent on protecting their own.

[Jeff Perlman]

Listen to Finding Sexy Sweat on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

[Ebony]

If you're looking for another heavy podcast about trauma, this ain't it. This is for the ones who had to survive and still show up as brilliant, loud, soft and whole. The Unwanted Sorority is where Black women, femmes and gender expansive survivors of sexual violence rewrite the rules on healing, support, and what happens after. And I'm your host and co president of this organization, Dr. Leah Tritate. Listen to the Unwanted Sorority. New episodes every Thursday on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.