Podcast Summary
The Herd with Colin Cowherd
Episode: The Daniel Cormier Show - DC & Ben Askren on ENDING DC vs. Jon Jones BEEF, Pimblett vs. Gaethje, Topuria IS BACK
Date: January 22, 2026
Host(s): Daniel Cormier (DC) & Ben Askren
Episode Overview
This episode brings together former UFC champions Daniel Cormier and Ben Askren for a candid, entertaining conversation focused on resolving sport rivalries, current UFC matchups, business dealings in MMA, and personal comebacks. The central theme is personal and professional growth, featuring DC reflecting on his long-standing rivalry with Jon Jones, discussion of upcoming UFC fights including Pimblett vs. Gaethje, and insights about ascendant stars like Ilia Topuria. Authenticity, humor, and bold opinion drive the conversation.
Key Discussion Points & Insights
1. Ben Askren Addresses Nate Diaz "Controversy"
- [01:06-06:40]
- Ben clarifies his previous comments about Nate Diaz’s UFC record.
- “I made a statement of fact about Nate Diaz's record, and I said, it’s average… If Daniel said, hey Ben, what was your record in the UFC? I’d say it was one and two. You know what? It’s below average. There’s no way to spin that.” — Ben Askren [01:45]
- DC and Ben joke about online trolling and the unique culture around fighter beefs.
2. Online Back-and-Forths and Fighter Personas
- [06:41-09:56]
- Ben shares a personal update: overcoming months of struggle to finally regain his mental clarity.
- “Last Friday… I started crying, bro. For seven months, I haven’t really been able to take care of myself, like really fully. And my brain wasn’t functioning really fully.” — Ben Askren [08:06]
- DC expresses genuine happiness for Ben’s recovery and notes his return to sharp form on Twitter.
3. The Anatomy (and End?) of DC’s Rivalry with Jon Jones
- [10:02-15:02]
- Ben presses DC on why he should forgive and move on from Jon Jones.
- “I think it takes up too much mental space… you just let Jon do what Jon wants to do.” — Ben Askren [10:18]
- DC details why it’s not as simple: “This thing with me and Jones isn’t just because he won, it’s how he won.” [11:25]
- Both agree their rivalry is now mostly for public and media consumption, not personal animosity.
4. Jon Jones’ Future, UFC Trust and the Business of Fights
- [15:11-18:29]
- Uncertainty about Jon Jones vs. Alex Pereira; DC and Ben evaluate Jones’ optimal weight class.
- “Jon’s likely to say, I’m never fighting again.” — Ben Askren [17:52]
- DC questions whether Jon is responsible for ‘leaving the sport better than he found it,’ emphasizing the importance of legacy over self-interest.
5. The Transactional Nature of UFC and Fighter Choices
- [20:13-23:16]
- Debate about fighters’ obligations to their sport and the UFC as a company.
- Ben says, “If you watch how Dana operates, it is a very transactional business… Now that Jon is treating it transactionally, also, and… Connor is treating it very transactionally also.” [22:30]
6. Lightweight Division Drama: Pimblett, Gaethje, Tsarukyan, and Topuria
- [24:41-30:06]
- Arman Tsarukyan’s title prospects are discussed, with DC and Ben convinced the UFC’s decisions are business-driven.
- “If Dana’s a businessman, Paddy Pimblett winning the title is the best outcome. He’s popular… Arman is not going to create the same response.” — Ben [24:56]
- Breakdown of Ilia Topuria’s fighting frequency and “two fights a year” pattern [27:07-27:59].
- Ben rates Arman highly: “He beats Pimblett and Gaethje for sure… Him and Topuria’s a tossup.” [29:22]
7. Upcoming Events & Fight Predictions
- [32:43-33:42]
- DC asks Ben to pick between Gaethje and Pimblett:
- “I’ll probably go, Paddy. Unfortunately. I want Justin to win.” — Ben [33:22]
- Side talk about travel and UFC’s packed event schedule.
- DC asks Ben to pick between Gaethje and Pimblett:
8. Conor McGregor’s Next Opponent and the UFC’s Business Dilemma
- [33:42-37:06]
- Discusses the frustration of Michael Chandler waiting for McGregor.
- DC: “At this point, do you have to give it to Mike (Chandler)? I mean, he has waited and waited and waited for Conor McGregor.” [34:16]
- Ben: “It just seems kind of not right… It’s almost like you have to just fight and hope.” [35:02]
- Speculation: if McGregor returns, he may fight more than once.
9. The New TV Rights Era & McGregor’s Negotiations
- [37:38-40:25]
- UFC’s new media deal and its impact on star power payments.
- “There is no way in hell Conor McGregor is still fighting when they got to renegotiate this. So… you can’t pay him that much because… you’re going to be retired in six years.” — Ben [38:28]
- Gate revenue is now limited: “There’s no gate at the White House. They are not selling tickets.” — Ben [39:19]
Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments
- Ben on mental health recovery: “Last Friday, I started crying, bro. For seven months, I haven’t really been able to take care of myself.” [08:06]
- DC, acknowledging rivalry realities: “It’s how Jon won. That’s why it’s different.” [11:25]
- Ben’s business take: “Dana operates… very transactionally. If you can do something for the company, he’ll push you. If you can’t, he’s ruthless.” [22:30]
- On matchmaking favoritism: “Paddy Pimblett winning the title is the best outcome. He’s popular.” — Ben [24:56]
- About Michael Chandler waiting for McGregor: “At this point, do you have to give it to Mike? He has waited and waited and waited for Conor McGregor.” — DC [34:16]
- On McGregor’s bargaining leverage: “His gate for the Chandler fight was 20 million. Before the fight?” — Ben [40:06]
Important Timestamps
| Timestamp | Segment | |-------------|-----------------------------------------------------------------| | 01:45 | Ben on the facts of records (“That is below average…”) | | 08:06 | Ben’s emotional breakthrough about recovery | | 10:18–11:25 | Ben pressing DC on Jon Jones feud | | 15:11–18:29 | Jon Jones’ future, potential Alex Pereira fight | | 22:30 | Ben’s assessment of UFC’s transactional nature | | 24:56–29:45 | Discussion of Arman, Pimblett, lightweight title scenarios | | 33:22 | Ben predicts Pimblett over Gaethje | | 34:16–35:02 | Chandler’s wait for McGregor | | 38:28–40:06 | UFC’s new deal and Conor McGregor’s changing leverage |
Episode Flow & Tone
The tone is candid and personal, with DC and Ben frequently joking, needling one another, but also digging into the hard truths of sports business and rivalries. Both men offer inside knowledge and don’t shy away from calling out the UFC, each other, or popular fighters for public and private behavior. The banter and honesty create an engaging, authentic episode for both hardcore and casual MMA fans.