The Draymond Green Show w/Baron Davis - Pacers-Thunder NBA Finals Game 1 reaction w/ Shaun Livingston

Summary

Podcast Summary: The Herd with Colin Cowherd – "The Draymond Green Show w/ Baron Davis - Pacers-Thunder NBA Finals Game 1 Reaction w/ Shaun Livingston"

Release Date: June 6, 2025

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Introduction

In this special episode of The Herd with Colin Cowherd, hosted by Draymond Green, basketball legend Baron Davis, and Sean Livingston, the trio delves deep into their reactions and analyses of Game 1 of the NBA Finals between the Indiana Pacers and the Oklahoma City Thunder. The discussion provides an insightful breakdown of game strategies, player performances, coaching decisions, and future predictions.

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Game 1 Reaction and Analysis

Draymond Green opens the conversation by expressing concern over Indiana's performance despite holding a lead. He states:

“If you get your shot up here and a guy gets on your side … that could bother him a little bit” ([44:37]).

The hosts dissect the pivotal moments of Game 1, highlighting the Thunder's late-game rally. Baron Davis emphasizes the significance of clutch performances:

“Haliburton is Mr. Clutch in the playoffs, man.” ([07:56]).

Sean Livingston discusses the complexity of coaching adjustments, citing Rick Carlisle's decisions and their impact:

“Rick Carlisle is playing chess.” ([18:07]).

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Coaching Strategies and Adjustments

A substantial portion of the discussion centers on Rick Carlisle's coaching prowess. Baron Davis praises Carlisle's ability to make in-game adjustments:

“He's not afraid to make those moves.” ([66:40]).

Comparing Carlisle to other coaches, Draymond Green underscores his extensive playoff experience:

“Rick Carlisle know what he doing.” ([74:55]).

The trio debates Oklahoma City Thunder's coaching strategies, questioning their confidence and decision-making in crucial moments:

“OKC don't really feel confident in how they got here.” ([31:15]).

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Player Performances and Matchups

The hosts provide detailed analyses of key players:

• Shai Haliburton: Discussed as pivotal in clutch situations, his ability to make crucial plays under pressure is lauded.

• Pascal Siakam: Highlighted for his consistent performance and leadership on the court.

• Obie Toppin (OB): Recognized for his scoring ability and defensive plays.

Draymond Green critiques Haliburton's playstyle during Game 1:

“He not going to go look to score every time. That's just not his mindset.” ([09:23]).

Sean Livingston emphasizes the necessity for Haliburton to embrace his playmaking role:

“He needs to be more of a playmaker.” ([38:41]).

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Team Comparisons and Historical Context

The conversation draws parallels between the current series and past NBA Finals:

• 2015 NBA Finals: Comparison to the Golden State Warriors’ defensive strategies and team dynamics.

• 2016 Cleveland Cavaliers: Referenced to illustrate how experience and strategic adjustments can influence series outcomes.

Baron Davis reflects on the similarities between OKC and historical championship teams:

“OKC been drawing close similarities to the 2020, the 2014, 2015 warriors squad.” ([51:53]).

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Market Size and Superstar Dynamics

A significant segment discusses whether a player's market size influences their status as the face of the NBA. The hosts debate the necessity of playing in major markets to achieve superstar status:

Draymond Green argues against market size being a determinant:

“LeBron James became the face of the NBA. Cleveland, Ohio. And that's not a big market by any stretch of the imagination.” ([72:34]).

Sean Livingston concurs, emphasizing performance over location:

“It's about production. It's still winning. It's still about that at the highest moments.” ([75:34]).

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Coaching Decisions and Organizational Moves

The episode transitions to discussing the firing of Tom Thibodeau as the New York Knicks coach:

Draymond Green expresses surprise and analyzes the potential reasons:

“It was a step in the right direction … I don't believe that the New York Knicks, as currently constructed today, can win a championship.” ([97:18]).

Baron Davis reflects on Thibodeau's impact and the complexity of coaching dynamics:

“There's a huge part of him and his DNA that got you to that.” ([92:10]).

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Predictions and Future Outlook

As the episode nears its conclusion, the hosts offer their predictions for the series outcome:

Draymond Green voices concern over OKC's ability to maintain their performance:

“We gotta roll with the Pacers.” ([103:14]).

Baron Davis sides with the Pacers, citing their resilience and adjustments:

“I'm siding with the Pacers.” ([103:27]).

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Conclusion

In wrapping up, Draymond Green and Baron Davis emphasize the importance of strategic adjustments, player versatility, and coaching experience in determining the series' outcome. They highlight the critical need for teams to adapt and perform consistently under pressure to secure the championship title.

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Notable Quotes

• Draymond Green on turnovers affecting the game:

  “They created 19 turnovers. That's not good.” ([05:35]).

• Sean Livingston on the necessity of playmaking:

  “You gotta be more of a playmaker.” ([38:41]).

• Baron Davis on coaching strategies:

  “Rick Carlisle made those moves he made tonight. And he's not afraid to make those moves.” ([66:40]).

• Draymond Green on market size:

  “LeBron James became the face of the NBA. Cleveland, Ohio. And that's not a big market by any stretch of the imagination.” ([72:34]).

• Baron Davis on supervising All-Star dynamics:

  “It was a celebration, like a homecoming.” ([79:43]).

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Key Takeaways

• Game 1 Analysis: Indiana Pacers showed resilience but faced critical turnovers leading to their loss against the Oklahoma City Thunder.

• Coaching Impact: Rick Carlisle's experience and adaptability are seen as significant advantages for the Pacers.

• Player Roles: Emphasis on players like Haliburton and Siakam to take on more strategic roles to drive their team forward.

• Market Influence: Superstar status is attributed more to performance and team success rather than the size of the market a player is in.

• Future Predictions: The Pacers are viewed as poised to leverage their adjustments and coaching to potentially win the series.

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This episode offers a comprehensive look into the dynamics of the NBA Finals, providing listeners with expert opinions and in-depth analyses from seasoned basketball veterans.

Transcript

[Draymond Green]

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[Baron Davis]

NBC Nightly News legacy isn't handed down or NBC News.

[Lester Holt]

I'm Tom Brokaw. We hope to see you back here.

[Baron Davis]

I'm Lester Holt. It's Carrie Forward. Tom Yamas is there for us.

[Lester Holt]

Firefighters are still working around the clock.

[Draymond Green]

As the world changes, we look for what endures.

[Lester Holt]

We are coming on the air with breaking news right now.

[Sean Livingston]

We look for a constant and from.

[Draymond Green]

One era to the next, trust is the anchor.

[Lester Holt]

For NBC Nightly News, I'm Tom Yamas. A new chapter begins.

[Draymond Green]

NBC Nightly News with Tom Yamas. Evenings on NBC.

[Tom Brokaw]

The volume.

[Draymond Green]

What's up, everybody? Welcome back to the Draymond Green show with my dog BD With Aaron Davis. We live. What's good, bro? How you doing?

[Baron Davis]

We lying, bro.

[Draymond Green]

It's a special one today.

[Baron Davis]

It's a special episode also.

[Draymond Green]

I got. I got my brother here with me. This. You know, it's crazy because I watch myself in the League every day. You know, I not watch myself, but, like, I just see the process that I'm going through on a daily basis. I live that and I think back to like, what feels not that long ago, but every day I go to the facility now for practice, for a game. I gotta get in the hot tub. And this. This my. My brother that's. That's coming on the show with us today, he used to be in the hot tub. And I used to be like, man, you so damn old. Like, you owe. Why you in the hot tub? Man, you old. Every day you in the hot tub. And he used to be like, it's right around the corner for you. It's going to happen to you too. But this dude mean a lot to me. Three time NBA champion. I got to share that experience with it. An executive in the NBA. Number four pick in the 2004 NBA Draft, coming straight out of high school. The. The. The midi God, the master range. Important, important part of our dynasty. None other than my brother, S Dot, Sean Livingston. Welcome to the young Ronnie.

[Sean Livingston]

Fellas, fellas. Appreciate having me on the platform today. Yes, sir. Yeah, man, I see that. Father Time. Yeah. Full circle.

[Draymond Green]

I tell you what, it's funny because I start getting in the hot tub, like, on my own. You know what else? When I go in there, Doc Lights off. It's also like the calm before the storm too. You know, it's just like zen up. But I would go in and like, see Rick and Danny, you know, So I start doing the body work and they. And they would notice the difference. Like, yo, you ain't been in the hot tub. Like, n. They like, yo, you gotta go get in the hot tub. Yeah, yeah.

[Sean Livingston]

Autumn shots y' all was shooting at me. I coming in with my. My green tea, you know, I'm coming.

[Draymond Green]

Get right.

[Baron Davis]

That's style.

[Sean Livingston]

I'm just trying to last. BD.

[Baron Davis]

They tease it. They teasing you now. Look at it. The minutes pile up, baby. Especially when you win it.

[Draymond Green]

Yes, they do.

[Baron Davis]

The minutes, they pile up. They gonna catch up faster than they would a normal dude.

[Draymond Green]

Now that's a fact. I'm still spry, though, so they ain't caught up yet. I'm still, you know, I'm still a little spry, though, so. But the process, you know, of, like, going through it, like every day, learning the body, learning what you need in the off day, like, lifting more, man. The process of being ready to take the court, though, is crazy. Like, it's a. It requires so much more time than just like, when you just had to work on your game. It's like a totally different type of discipline. And that's what you don't quite understand when you're watching guys go through it.

[Sean Livingston]

You know, it's like the summers for me toward in my 30s was just straight weights and conditioning, you know, just to prepare my body. And then just, of course, the way I played the game, you know, obviously just getting to the spots off the dribble. It's a harder game. Wasn't a three point shooter, it wasn't a spacer. So just. I remember it was a game we were playing and it might have been against the Clippers, and one of the guys came up to me and he was like, bro, this towards the end of my career, like the last year, and he's like, what do your workouts look like? Do you just get it that you shoot all 10 footers, bro? Like, you know what I'm saying? Like, what else do you do? Like, you know, and I'm just like, damn. I had to think about it.

[Baron Davis]

Like, damn, that's a sauce, though.

[Sean Livingston]

That's it. I get straight to it, to the point.

[Baron Davis]

That's it.

[Sean Livingston]

That's it. Like, I want to hit on black. I know I'm hitting, so. But it's, it's it definitely towards the latter part of your career, like, yeah, man, you got to think about all the stretching, the yoga, the. The recovery, all that. So I'm glad you, you in that seat now.

[Draymond Green]

Yes.

[Sean Livingston]

I'm glad to see you.

[Draymond Green]

It's. I got a different appreciation for it, for sure.

[Sean Livingston]

Yes, sir.

[Draymond Green]

Appreciation for sure. But, man, we just watched game one of the NBA Finals. I know y' all watched it. I watched it.

[Baron Davis]

Crazy.

[Draymond Green]

I mean, I think just, just initially getting into it, Holly does it again.

[Baron Davis]

Bd, what do you expect?

[Draymond Green]

He does it again.

[Baron Davis]

What do you. What do you expect, bro?

[Draymond Green]

I mean, cheese, bd. And I say, I say cheese. He ain't about to do it. He not about to.

[Baron Davis]

He about to do it again, bro.

[Draymond Green]

Oh, my go, man.

[Baron Davis]

It was crazy because they just keep fighting, man. And when Nem Hart, I think he air balled the three Pascal laid it up, it was like, oh, they down one. They just set they self up. And I mean, Halberton, that's prime time. That's prime time. Halberd. He knocking them down. He's Mr. Clutch. He's Mr. Clutch in the playoffs, man. What's your thought on that, Sean? Did you watch that?

[Sean Livingston]

Yeah, man. I mean, I wanted to kick it to y' all because you've been in those precious situations. Like, when you watching Halliburton, do you feel like he needs to do more in that fourth quarter? Are you watching him and say, like, where is he at? And he just pop up. Like, you know, like, man, he just. And it's something about too hitting those shots in prior series that it's like, okay, I've been here before. Like, when it comes to me, I'm ready, but I'm watching the game. I hear art. You know, I'm listening to the broadcast. They're like, your best player has to be better. You know, they ready to dig in and put narrative on them. And then, boom, there you go, right? Like, what y' all. What do y' all see when y' all watching, like, the last six minutes of that fourth four star player?

[Draymond Green]

I think in an ideal world, you want to see a star player take over the game. Like, you want to see him.

[Baron Davis]

Yep.

[Draymond Green]

The reality is Halle not really that dude. Like, he that dude as far as like the player that he is, but he not. When I say he not that dude, like, he not going to go look to score every time. That's just not his mindset. He looking to get everybody involved. That's how they team playing. So I think when it comes to Halle, everybody want him to be something that he not. And, like, I mean, I got the utmost love and respect for his game, but he not Shay. When I think of their team, I think the guy who. Who that is for them is actually Siakam. Like, Siakam is when. When in the high pressure moments, like, meet at a game, eight minutes to go in the fourth quarter. How are you going to give you some games? Because he got the ball and he making the plays and he just get it going. But Siakam is the guy that they go to to settle things down, you know, and. And that's the role that he plays for that team. So I think, yes, in an ideal world, you always going to want to see the ball in your best player hands. And I. And what I will say is, can Holly go get the ball more and get them into more things and be more demonstrative during that window about getting them into things and making the plays. Yes, he could, but that's the ball move.

[Baron Davis]

But they don't rock. Like, yeah, they don't really rock like that. Like, the. And me and Dre, we talked about this in the Milwaukee series. I said Indiana not scared of nobody because everybody is green. Everybody got a green light. Nemhard got a Green light. Niece Smith got a green light. Miles Turner can shoot the ball. Obie Toppins can make play. Like they all have a. They all got a freedom that's different and they style a play. So for Halliburton, he trying to unleash that freedom. So you forget about him. And I think that's a sign of a good point guard is you forget that he's controlling the game or trying to control the tempo or recreate a tempo. So then when he do have the ball, you like, oh, he cold. He ain't been in the moment, but he living. He almost like setting it up for the dramatic to live in that moment. And he got. He got big. He. He like big lights, right? It's only. It's only. I mean, it's. It's just certain players that's like that over the history of the league. It's like no matter how big the moment and the light, especially when you in a situation, you down one, you got nothing to lose. Like, the lights get bigger and. And your bravado get bigger. And I think that's especially the type of shots he shoots right this side. He shot against the Knicks where he went out, dribbled out to the three and shot of three and made it. And now you look at this one, he's just said, he's just setting the table. And they freedom allow him to kind of be a disguise. So he don't need to. He don't need to push too much. He can, he can be a little bit more aggressive and looking for his offensive game. But the way he operate that offense and the way that they play with freedom, they got other people who make plays. And to your point, Siakam, he's another dude that plays with freedom that you not really looking at and saying like, damn, man, we gotta stop Siaka because he gets a lot of intangibles. Offensive rebound, pullbacks, leak outs, right? You know, secondary trail one on one, ISO pull ups. So all this stuff is in flow. They're a tough team because they not scared and they got offensive firepower and everybody eats.

[Sean Livingston]

B.

[Baron Davis]

Yes.

[Sean Livingston]

And I like what you said about him being a disguise, right? Because it's like this is who he is. I mean, that's honestly why I really liked his game coming out in the draft. Because he, he is a pass first. That's his personality, that is his mindset. I just, you know, I look at him and I'm like, man, okay, Siakam won the MVP for the Western Conference finals. Is Siakam that Effective without Halliburton. Meaning those hockey assists. We talk about that, right? We had a. When we played right that day, it was like, how many passes can we get? And it wasn't just like, just to pass it around the perimeter. It was more of just the feel the, the energy to the ball. And it's like when you kicking it ahead, you know, this BD user score, it's like, man, you kick it ahead, you get somebody going. Somebody kick it ahead to you. You like, oh, sorry. Oh, he rocking with me. Let's go, like. And I just, I look at that team one day, they're never out of it. The three. The power of the three point shooting.

[Draymond Green]

Yeah.

[Sean Livingston]

You know, you look at their bigs and Miles Obi topping Siakam, space the.

[Draymond Green]

Four, even Thomas Bryan hit threes.

[Sean Livingston]

Thomas Bryant hitting corner threes. So I think the adjustments, looking at this next game, you look at okc, they had to take their bigs out because of the three balls that they, the threes that they were giving up. Do they do at the next game? You know, like they, they already went smaller, but when Indy goes small, they are big.

[Draymond Green]

Yeah, yeah.

[Sean Livingston]

Got two offensive boards in the fourth quarter that were big. One he got on and then another one he scored. Shay didn't box him out. Right. And so you just looking at some of those plays like they're, they're winning on some of those different plays where they have, you know, a bigger lineup when they are small because Miles can stretch. Siakam can stretch top and hit five threes. Right. He started out a little shaky, but he settled in.

[Draymond Green]

Yes, he did.

[Sean Livingston]

And I was watching and I'm like, man, Indy, if they could settle into this game, slow down because they play fast, you know, they, they were still right in striking distance the whole time.

[Draymond Green]

They were the whole time having 19 turnovers in the first half, which is insane. They were still only down 10 points. And I'm looking at them like, yo, they turned the ball over like this. They got 47 points and they've created 19 turnovers. That's not good. Like you, you. You're not capitalizing on none of that. I think they ended up with nine. Like, they had nine. They had nine. They had nine points off those turnovers in the first half. And so that's not good. It never, it never really affect if affected okc, I mean, Indiana the way it should have. And I think when I look at what they just did. Niece Smith, 10 points. Siakam 19 points. Miles Turner, 15 points. Nemhar 14 points. Holly Burton, 14 OB top is 17 points.

[Sean Livingston]

Everybody eats.

[Draymond Green]

That game reminds me of game one, 2015 NBA Finals. And Doc, you were our leader scorer. You had 20 and all the rest of us, 17, 19, 17, 14, 15. Steph ain't had a crazy game. Clay ain't had a crazy game. And we won the game that way, which set a tone for us in that series, you know, and they just did that. And regardless of all the things that happen. And so, you know, when you speak on OKC taking their bigs out, my only thing with that would be they had an eight point lead when they took their bigs out the game.

[Sean Livingston]

Absolutely.

[Baron Davis]

Yeah.

[Draymond Green]

And like you're not gonna out three Indiana. That's not what OKC does. Like so you know, when I watched the end of that game, like, yes, players make plays. But you know, Sean and both me and Doc, we had the pleasure of having when you get in that moment, Steve coming through. And that's. And Steve is a magician in those moments. The bigger the moment, the better Steve gets. And you know, this Mark Dagno first NBA Finals game. This ain't Rick Carlisle first rodeo. Rick Carlisle, Ricardo champion.

[Sean Livingston]

That's right.

[Draymond Green]

Ricardo made the subs that he need to make. He pulled Miles Turner at 307 and put OB top. You know what I'm saying?

[Sean Livingston]

That's right.

[Draymond Green]

He playing chess. And Mark Diagno pulled his bigs out and thought that and went super small. And like to your point, you said even when they small, they still pretty big.

[Baron Davis]

They bigger than you. Yes.

[Draymond Green]

That ain't to their strength. Their strength is checked. Their strength is Hardenstein. And you gotta roll with that. You're not gonna outdo them at what they do. And so agreed.

[Baron Davis]

And you know what? Mess. Mess. And this one messed the Knicks up. To your point as that is, you get cross match. So when you cross match with Indiana, it creates crazy matchup problems. That's why the Knicks couldn't find no pick and rolls when they had Karl Anthony Towns at the five. It's like you, they flying down the court now faster than you and the point guard is six, seven. So now okc, you playing small. But like you said, Indiana is a bigger team. And so when you running back and you cross match now that's how you. They didn't call a timeout. You got Wallace or Halliburton. No Lou Dort. Right. And so they are. And credit to Rick Carlisle because you gotta know when to make that sub to kind of throw the game off. To kind of. To throw it in your favor?

[Draymond Green]

Absolutely.

[Baron Davis]

And they're going to win the small lineup because everybody on their team. Rebound Pascal Siakam, he get garbage dirty rebounds put backs. Halliburton, rebounds. Well from a point guard position. Niece Smith, he flying over. He just flying everywhere. Right. And so that's the big difference is you can't match up with them in transition and set your defense. And that's how they came back.

[Sean Livingston]

That's a great call out. And honestly, that's how they got those threes. Because across match and again, the power of the kick ahead, right? It's like either you got somebody that can get it off the glass and he can push it. And day, day, that's what coming in. You remember Steve, like every time, get it out of bounds, push. Now you got a scrambling. Now we got to get matched up. Boom, open three, right? Or you got a big trying to run down to get a block. No, you're on a three point shooter. You need to now OB topping. Boom, three. Miles Turner, three. So. And I noticed it as well in the beginning. I don't know if you caught it, but OKC did change their lineups to match up.

[Draymond Green]

Yes, they did.

[Sean Livingston]

Sometimes, Sometimes there is, you know, you can outsmart yourself.

[Draymond Green]

Absolutely.

[Sean Livingston]

Match up with the other team instead of making them play your way.

[Baron Davis]

Right, right.

[Sean Livingston]

So it's going to be interesting, this chess match to see what they come back with in the starting lineup.

[Draymond Green]

You know, Go ahead.

[Baron Davis]

No, go ahead. No, because I was going to ask y' all a question. My question is to that point, are the threes hurting you enough? Where you sticking to your big lineup. Did the threes hurt you enough? Because you still, like, like, like Dre said, you still got an eight point lead with three minutes to go. So is it really hurting you for you to make that adjustment when this is your bread and butter and that's.

[Sean Livingston]

Bd Again, those are the questions that coaches that can't sleep at night. That's back to the huddle. Cause it's like, yo, man, we had a lead. We were right there. What were the errors that we made? Now we can end up making. We can over adjust, right? We can over adjust and start trying to do things that are outside our comfort zone. And when, you know, really maybe it was a, you know, it was a loose ball, it was a offensive rebound. We got to get this board. We have to win this possession. The ball is gold, right? They were winning the possession game. And then towards the end of the fourth, you know, again, Indiana was making all of the right plays. And then you watch Caruso foul put, put Nemhardt at the line right off the clock. Little things like that where you have the lead, those are mental errors. And Caruso is a champion. He's a vet again. But it's like those are the things that you inch closer, you inch closer. Now you give them a chance to win it at the buzzard. To win. Probably shouldn't be in that position any.

[Baron Davis]

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[Baron Davis]

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[Draymond Green]

Hey, so we all make mistakes, but owning up is the right thing to do. You know Degree Cool Rush deodorant? Well last year they changed the formula and it did not go well with their fans.

[Baron Davis]

Degree's whole thing is it turns up the sweat and odor protection when you turn up the effort. And good thing it does because Cool Rush fans really turned up the effort to bring back the original formula. One guy even started an online petition.

[Draymond Green]

And Degree Listen they admitted they effed up and are bringing the original Cool Rust scent back. And it's exactly how you remember it. Cool, crisp and fresh. It's back in Walmart, Target and other stores now for under $4.

[Baron Davis]

There's a reason why it's been the number one men's Annie purse print for the last decade. It's the same reason why people were not happy when it changed. So if you never tried it, it might be a good time to see what the fuss is about.

[Draymond Green]

Head to your local Walmart or Target to try the OG Degree Cool Rush for yourself.

[Tom Brokaw]

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[Zoe Saldana]

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[Tom Brokaw]

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[Tom Brokaw]

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[Zoe Saldana]

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[Tom Brokaw]

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[Tom Brokaw]

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[Zoe Saldana]

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[Draymond Green]

If you're Indiana, you didn't play well at all. I mean, you play pretty bad. You win. This is the best way to win a Game 1 in an NBA finals. In any playoff series, but especially in NBA finals and vice versa. If OKC could have actually hung on, it would have been the best way they could win game one. And here's why Steve would always tell us this. Steve would always say, I'm happy we didn't blow that team out. Because if you blow that team out now, you gotta face added steam. When they come out in game two, they come and naturally thing. Naturally you relax a little bit because you feel like, oh, we good. You know, if you blow that team out, Indiana didn't play well at all. They steal this game and now they come back with a free swinging game too.

[Sean Livingston]

Right?

[Draymond Green]

That's, that's a tough position. Like we saw, we saw the Knicks do this last series with Indiana.

[Sean Livingston]

It was the last series. Absolutely.

[Draymond Green]

Now all of a sudden Indiana come out in game two and they on fire. Because we know they capable of that. Like we know they capable of coming out in game two and being on fire. So now if, for, if that happens, now you're in trouble. But here's the thing where I'm not, where I'm not happy with the substitution the change of the lineup is you made your adjustment before the series started. Like, that's something you go to. You go in the game one. You roll with what you know, you roll with what you do.

[Baron Davis]

You roll with what you like.

[Draymond Green]

You ride with that. You don't make your series adjust. You don't lay your trump down your trump card before the series even start. So now your adjustment is to go back to like you making an adjustment after game one that you go two games with your star lineup. Before that was 68 games. 67. 68 games.

[Baron Davis]

Yeah.

[Sean Livingston]

Now you scrambling to. To, you know, to. To figure it out because you. You've already made that adjustment. Instead of maybe enforce your will first, right? Or see what. See what the lay of the land is, you know, before you start showing the trump, you know, before you start showing the. The different adjustments.

[Draymond Green]

You know what that says to me? That tells me.

[Baron Davis]

It says, y' all know y' all heels already already.

[Draymond Green]

But that's. But even a step further than that, that tells me that that coaching style is not confident in how they've looked in these playoffs. Because that means, like, some, like Indiana ain't thinking about changing their style lineup because they are very comfortable with how they've gone through these playoffs. They was.

[Baron Davis]

That's how they got there.

[Draymond Green]

41-4142, right. Like, they feel very confident in what they doing and how they got. And what that says to me is OKC don't really feel confident in how they got here. And that's a very interesting thing to me just to watch. I don't know about. I don't like that at all.

[Baron Davis]

Yeah, I mean, I'm gonna draw a reference to. We believe because before this, before the series, Dallas changed their lineup and the whole thing was, are they going to stay big? Are they going to go small? Like, the whole conversation was what they're going to do before the series even start to adjust to what we knew. And I think part of it is being overconfident because they start off and say, okay, we going to go big. And then they immediately went small, right? And they got to play in our game and they can never get out of it. So when they tried to go big, like we had already figured that adjustment out, then when you go small, we already got like, that's our pace and back to Indiana. Indiana gonna win the small, big lineup.

[Draymond Green]

Absolutely.

[Baron Davis]

The big, big lineup. You already took yourself out. Cause you not weighing in on the positive of the Harkinse thing. You're not weighing in on the Part the positive of what chat is going to bring you. And so when you get to that moment, I'm up eight. Okay. We gonna spread the floor and SGA gonna go to work. Williams gonna go to work. The floor gonna be spread. But Indiana plays basketball like that.

[Draymond Green]

Yeah.

[Baron Davis]

That's the OKC don't finish games like that. You don't finish games like that. So you already off balance. And I think sometimes it can be overconfident to think that. All right, like, we can play. We can play any style.

[Draymond Green]

Yeah, for sure.

[Baron Davis]

And you comfort it.

[Sean Livingston]

So let me ask you. Yeah. So let me ask you, right? Like, as if you see that you on the other side, you're Indiana and now you're seeing the matchups, does that give you confidence? Like, oh, they already adjusting to us, right? Like when you went in Dallas made those adjust. Are you thinking, like, okay, they can't. They're trying to play and catch us. So does that give you confidence as a player? Right. Coming out? Yeah.

[Draymond Green]

Yeah.

[Baron Davis]

Because you, You.

[Draymond Green]

You've.

[Baron Davis]

You figured out how to beat him, right? The way you play. So if you can play, you're. You're more confident saying, if I can, If I can control the pace, if I can control the style, then they can't beat us playing our style in our pace. If we can stay with them with whatever they do, we prove that we can come back. If we can stay with them, then we got a chance to win it. So your confidence meter, it just go up. You ain't even thinking about Indiana not thinking about losing at all. They not thinking about no. Whatever adjustments that they're making, it's an adjustment to win.

[Sean Livingston]

Right.

[Baron Davis]

OKC is trying to figure out how to win.

[Sean Livingston]

Right. Right. And. And they can play better, too. Yeah, Indiana can play better because, I mean, 20 turnovers in the first half, like that, that's the boss.

[Baron Davis]

Like, I, I was.

[Sean Livingston]

I was Throw that in the trash. Like, that's. That's terrible. You know, but to be in striking distance, I mean, again, that's crazy confidence that we can come out and even. Even play better.

[Baron Davis]

Jay, I was waiting for you to say, and Halliburton didn't have a good game. Like, I was waiting for you to. I could hear your voice in the fourth quarter and you like, man, they coming back and Halliburton ain't even. Like, he ain't even visible in the game.

[Draymond Green]

That's a problem.

[Baron Davis]

I could hear you saying that.

[Draymond Green]

That's a problem. When he don't have a good game, he usually don't have two bad ones in a row. If I had to guess, he gonna come out game two so damn aggressive. He gonna come out firing, he gonna come out downhill. Like Halliburton is. Like Halliburton is like Peyton Manning. Like, the last thing you want Peyton Manning doing is playing with the league. Peyton Manning gets to play with a league and he get to dial up anything he want to dial up. Good luck. Like, because you put him in these situations where he could run, he could pass, he could get to the line. Audible. Watch what you audible into. Audible again. You trying to audible. He gone. Like the last thing you want to do with Peyton Manning is put him in that position to just be free swinging and doing what he want to do. And that's now the position that Halle is in. And he going to come out fight.

[Sean Livingston]

And it's interesting to see that he came out the first half. I think he took like five shots. Shay took like 19.

[Draymond Green]

Yes, he did.

[Sean Livingston]

So, you know, I'm thinking to myself in that first half, man, like, one of them setting the tone for what this series is going to look like, and then the other one is just trying to fill it out, right, and catch the flow. But to your point, BD the way that they played all year long, right, like sharing the basketball, trusting each other, there's something about the energy in that, you know, in that system to where when you can constantly sharing it, constantly sharing it, it's going to find you. And in those moments, who they give it to, like Mhart hit big shots. Like Nehard hit a big three. Yeah, he Smith for the Siakam.

[Baron Davis]

But they just know. They just.

[Draymond Green]

And.

[Baron Davis]

And I. I was, I was gonna say this is when he has the rock in his hand. He's. You don't expect a turnover. You don't expect nothing bad. You like, you figure you're gonna get.

[Sean Livingston]

A really good shot, we're gonna get some.

[Baron Davis]

And the whole team knows that. So him had like, like, like Dre saying that Pay Manny analogy is, you know, him with the lead is like he gets to start picking his poison. Like how he want to serve up dishes and going back to the turnovers. He not turning the ball over down the stretch. He's solid. Yeah, he's solid with that rock, right? He's solid with his decision making. And I think that's what Shay needs to kind of pick up more for okc. You gotta be more of a playmaker. You gotta be on your defensive ground. You can't just. You can't just Score the points on this team because they can all score points.

[Sean Livingston]

Absolutely.

[Baron Davis]

You don't have to like make plays, but you don't have to make your big guys more valuable in this series in order for y' all to win.

[Draymond Green]

SGA, to your point. He finished with 38, made 14 mid range jumpers in game one. He lead the league in mid range jumpers. He shoot the mid range at 51%. Obviously. I watched you destroy guys with the midi. Get fouled every time, every game. Once a game, at least you're getting fouled on the midi.

[Sean Livingston]

Yeah.

[Draymond Green]

Do you think that ultimately it could still be as effective versus the threes in today's game?

[Sean Livingston]

No, you need a diversity of play in today's game. And I say that because of just the way the game rules have changed is, and then the way that we prioritize the analytics in today's game. And so with that roster construction, you know, will be built around, you know, spacing the floor, taking the best shots, being more efficient. And you know, again, we come from a different cloth a little bit from, from different eras of how we play inside out. Right. And that trains left the station, fellas, and it's, it's not coming back. You know, I think until, you know, I think you had yokids, you got embiid, you got guys that are dominant in the, in the post. But again, these guys can shoot threes. Yeah, right. And, and you know, again, they, they can playmake out of the post. So you look at what SGA does, he had 38. How many threes did he take? He took six threes as well.

[Draymond Green]

Yeah.

[Sean Livingston]

Right. So, you know, he can also burn you off the dribble from the three. You gotta, you gotta respect it. So now he can get you on his hip. And for a MIDI guy, that's, that's where you want him.

[Draymond Green]

Yeah.

[Sean Livingston]

You know, on your hip, create space, get to your slot. And it was, it was looking beautiful out there. But no, I think you definitely need more diversity in play because of how fast the game is now and you gotta keep the defense guessing.

[Draymond Green]

Yeah.

[Sean Livingston]

You know, I think you, you, you.

[Draymond Green]

Speak, you speak about getting the guy on your hip for the midi. I actually think if I'm guarding Shay, I'm sending him left, I'm riding his right arm and I'm not recovering on the drive. So if he want to go to the rim every time and try to shoot a layup, I'mma have my help come over late. And when I had a help come over late because Shay can pass the ball, but he not a passer. Like last second or you come help last second dish, he ain't passing it like that. Like, once he get his mind on scoring and going to the rim, he getting to the cup. And so I'll help late. And anytime he start driving left, I'm not cutting him off. We used to do it the J.R. smith job because he wanted to step back. Obviously, Shay's a totally different player than jr but it's certain guys Lou will where you don't cut him off because they looking to stop and shoot the step back. And Shay is like that. And if you get your body in front of him, he gonna shoulder you. And if he miss with that shoulder, he gonna forearm you, and he get away with that. And so you can't get in front of him because you take your helper out of the picture and he just shooting a wide open midi every time. I think you actually should ride the hip on him. When we played Boston in the finals a few years back, I noticed something in playing against them and we put this rule in in the series, I noticed that Jaylen Brown could pass, but if you help early on him, he couldn't make the pass. Like, he wasn't at that time, he wasn't strong making the pass if you helped up early. So with him, we will help up soon as he start driving. We would help up early with jt. We know he would make the pass early. So we helped late. Like right at the rim, we helped on jt and it gets that detail at this point. And okay, and I think Indiana, that's something that they need to figure out. Like, do not get in front of Shay. Get him left. Don't get in front of him. Just ride the right arm and force him all the way to the rim. You got Miles Turner at the rim. You got Thomas Bryant at the rim. You got Obie Toppin at the rim. Is he gonna hit enough layups to beat you? And another thing with those layups, when he go and take those tough layups, he fall down. Well, guess what, Indiana, that's to their advantage because they getting out running. So you get. It's one pass, boom, he. He getting across the floor, you running. And so I think, you know, when I look at. When I look at that and I hear you say, like, you want to get that guy on your hip. Do your jump shot was like this. So you. Man, this might be a little ashy.

[Baron Davis]

I was scared of. I was scared of, man, you get.

[Draymond Green]

You get your shot up Here and a guy get on your side, it really don't matter because your shot was way up here. Shay shot got way up there like that. And so that guy ride his hip like that, it could bother him a little bit, I think.

[Sean Livingston]

But go ahead, bd.

[Baron Davis]

No, go ahead, go ahead, fill that in.

[Sean Livingston]

I was going to say just real quick, he does like to get to that spot. I honestly think he likes to go left with, with the, with the midi. Because it's right shoulder.

[Baron Davis]

Yeah.

[Sean Livingston]

Right to the spot.

[Draymond Green]

Yeah.

[Sean Livingston]

When you bring the help now, you give them something to think about. And as we know. So you getting me back. I feel like I'm in the foxhole again. So I'm gonna start again, start to sweat a little bit. When you. We know it's only a couple of guys that can make that type of pass.

[Draymond Green]

Yeah.

[Sean Livingston]

You know, on time, on target. Because when you bring in the double, it's only a few guys. One that they get double teamed offense. So they have to read it. They know it's coming, they know where to outlay. But the bronze, the Lucas, the guys that can really, you know, make that drive and then hit the open man. Right. Because if we know that we're doubling the back line is already we already thinking, okay, I'm in rotations.

[Draymond Green]

Absolutely.

[Sean Livingston]

I'm sinking, I'm ready to shoot out, I'm ready to fill. So that's interesting because he does want to get to that baseline. And he will pull up.

[Draymond Green]

Yeah.

[Sean Livingston]

But if you bring the help now, what is, what is his next move exactly?

[Baron Davis]

You know, so just to play devil's advocate, if you come to okc, right to your point about the midi, it's hard to get to the MIDI because everybody's on the perimeter. If you play your bigs and you get your big sitting down in the block, you gonna have space to ice up. And so it creates a different dynamic because you got. Now you got a couple people below the free throw line in the ghost area. And now for SGA, he can operate in that elbow, that 15, 16 foot. Because I say for you as that with the warriors, which I was so good at. Y' all will push the break, kick a hand to you and you already had the. You already had 10ft. You was already at 10ft with a one on one with action on the backside. And so for OKC, they gotta play these big dudes down the stretch because if you play five out, you play small. Shay can't get to his. He can't get to the mini. He gotta go all the way to the hole. You know, you can get to the mini. Because everybody is hovering around the perimeter.

[Draymond Green]

Absolutely.

[Sean Livingston]

That's a good point. That's a good point. Lastly, just to follow that up. Dre, I don't know if you remember this. We played obviously the 2016, and I hate the. I hate talking about, you know, 20 points in that game one because we. We lost. So who cares the series, but we lost 2016 to Cleveland. We come 2017, and, you know, the Cavs, they're playing kind of the same way, but they're playing. They're actually a better team. And I remember at the time we got KD and Kyrie, the way that he plays, the way that he burnt us, really, in those. That. That game five, Game seven, getting to his spots. And if you watch, you know, being able to, you know, like, I mean, he comes from Kobe school in that way. Footwork, spin, fade, right. Like getting two spots. And I. I feel like I remember Steve talking about we were watching film and it's like you guys that are at the nail, if you could get in and contest from the behind, from the backside, a rear view contest. And I remember K getting a couple of those Dragon those. And just. So that's something to think about with Indiana, right? Just being those kind of in those pockets. It's. It's, you know, it's hard because you don't want to foul in a guy's or whatnot, but it's just something to think about. And to me, that's where okc. I'm watching them in the first half, I'm like, ah, damn. These boys everywhere, they sinking, they rotating. If you turn your back, they own you. You know, they biting down, you know what I'm saying? And they got hands. And so I'm just, you know, that's just kind of the game within the game where you go back, you watch the film, you see how you can, you know, how you can improve on those thoughts.

[Draymond Green]

Absolutely. No, I agree with that 100%. Like, in Indiana, I think they get an opportunity to watch this film, too. I think they'll pick up on some of those little nuances, you know, and that those little things, like you make Shay think about an extra shot or two like this, that can change an entire game, which one game can change an entire series. So you have to pick up on those little nuances as 100%.

[Tom Brokaw]

100%.

[Sean Livingston]

100%. 100%.

[Baron Davis]

Man. OKC been drawing close similarities to the 2014, 2015 Golden State warriors because one, the playoff record, the Offense, the defensive rating, average age of team in the regular season record. Sean Dre, do you think this OKT OKC team is similar to the 2020, the 2014, 2015 warriors squad that y' all was on?

[Draymond Green]

Where I think. Where I think they're similar is the age young guys, you know, with a few vets like Hardenstein, not Chet. And those guys age. Sean, Andre, they weren't our age, you know what I'm saying? So we kind of had that balance. And Bogut, you know, Dee Lee, they were a little older, so Caruso's been there before. Right. So, like, I think they got a few vets, like, we had that kind of settles things down for them. And they got young guys, Shay and, you know, J Dub, just kind of out there running wild, doing their thing, relying on their talent and, you know, obviously thinking the game, but not to the level of the vets, because they've just seen more, you know, and so the vets see more. They help you more. They see these things. They seeing these things develop. And so I think they are in that aspect, obviously. I've seen the playoff record very similar offensive rated. And I think, you know, we were number one. They're like three defensive rating. We're both number one. I saw those things. The end of season record. I think they're 68 with 67. And so I see all of that stuff, and I see a young team that's gone through their lumps like they lost in the second round last year, which was. Seems now to be poised to take that final step. I can see those similarities, but the style of play couldn't be further from the same. I think it's a completely different style of play. All the things I see for sure.

[Sean Livingston]

And.

[Draymond Green]

That can be great. You got to close it out. You got to finish the deal in order for those comparisons to really mean something. If you don't finish the deal, those comparisons don't mean anything. But the style of. The styles of play is what I would say is drastically different.

[Baron Davis]

Similarities, similarities, similarities.

[Sean Livingston]

It's definitely. It's definitely similar. I mean, he nailed all the points. I mean, we really nailed it. Like, listen, they were the best team by far this season, by far. And honestly, watching them too, they did not take games off. Like, that was one thing. If they were supposed to be a team that was that they were a lot better than. They beat the dog shit out of that team. Right, right. And so the habits that they were building, that's what I watched. And I see. I'm like okay. You know, the steps. I think when I came to this team, 2015, I had come from playing with Kevin Garnett, Paul Pierce, Joe Johnson, Darren Williams. These guys were kind of already cemented in their careers. Former champions, veterans. They had a mindset about winning where they expected to win. When I came to Golden State, they had already tasted winning, and I felt like they wanted to win. And I had never been further, further than the semi conference finals. Dre might have been to the conference finals, but none of us had been to the finals. Similar to this team with okc. So watching some of, you know, again, I was interested to see who is going to settle into this game tonight. And then where, you know, is the lights going to be too big? You know, which team is the lights going to be too bright for? But watching OKC towards the end, it does remind me a little bit of our first year going, you know, when. When Kyrie and Kevin Love went down and they went up 2, 1, right. And it's like we're not, you know, like, again, they should. They probably should have won this game. Okay, 1000.

[Baron Davis]

Yeah. For sure.

[Sean Livingston]

And, and, and so watching them, watching the Pacers come back, you start to see a little bit of that expense, inexperience, you know, even maybe on the coaching side and not the, not the shots. But again, this is new.

[Draymond Green]

Yes.

[Sean Livingston]

This is the. And this is now you filling it out. And you. You can only get this by going through it. Right? So that part. Absolutely. So, like, that part now, you know, reminds me. And those are the similarities to where. Okay, now we got to figure it out. Now we got to figure out how to win. Right? Like we, you know, in these moments, too, when it matters. And I think watching them, they have all the ingredients, obviously, you know, they're the favorites, but like you said, you got to walk the walk now. And it's one thing to do it. And just last point on that, when we came in again, none of us had any experience. Bron had went to the finals, what, six, seven years in a row, you.

[Draymond Green]

Know, so 15, he went 11, 12, 13, 14, then 15. That was his fifth year in a row.

[Sean Livingston]

Fifth year in a row. And I just remember I'm coming off the bench, so I'm trying to catch the flow of the game. I'm watching everybody's energy, and I'm just seeing just the difference in how he, you know, how he's approaching orchestrating just the calmness, the poise. Right. Like, and, and, and it. It's contagious. It kind of trickles down, if you will. And I think we were searching for that, right? Because I mean it's Steph first time, it's Clay first time, they what, 26, 27, you know, like so nobody had that experience and but I think, you know, again, this, this is, this is character building for okc. So we'll see what, what they do with it.

[Lester Holt]

Blending Vice's signature dynamic storytelling with the high octane world of sports, Vice Sports brings an exciting and diverse range of programming that goes beyond the game catch action packed live events and exclusive sports documentaries and profiles only on Vice tv.

[Ryan Seacrest]

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[Draymond Green]

Hey, so we all make mistakes, but owning up is the right thing to do. You know Degree Cool Rush deodorant? Well last year they changed the formula and it did not go well with their fans.

[Baron Davis]

Degree's whole thing is it turns up the sweat and odor protection when you turn up the effort. And good thing it does because Cool Rush fans really turned up the effort to bring back the original Formula. One guy even started an online petition.

[Draymond Green]

And Degree listen they admitted they effed up and are bringing the original Cool rust scent back and it's exactly how you remember it. Cool, crisp and fresh. It's back in Walmart, Target and other stores now for under $4.

[Baron Davis]

There's a reason why it's been the number one men's antiperspirant for the last decade. It's the same reason why people were not happy when it changed. So if you never tried it, it might be a good time to see what the fuss is about.

[Draymond Green]

Head to your local Walmart or Target to try the OG degree. Cool rush for yourself.

[Tom Brokaw]

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[Zoe Saldana]

Saldana welcome to T Mobile. Here's your new iPhone 16 Pro on us.

[Tom Brokaw]

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[Zoe Saldana]

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[Tom Brokaw]

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[Zoe Saldana]

Not right now. @ T Mobile.

[Tom Brokaw]

I feel like I have to give you something in return for karma.

[Zoe Saldana]

That's okay.

[Tom Brokaw]

I don't really have much in my purse. Oh, let's see. Hand sanitizer. It's lavender.

[Zoe Saldana]

I'm good.

[Tom Brokaw]

Seriously, Let me check this pocket. Oh, mints.

[Zoe Saldana]

Really, I'm fine.

[Tom Brokaw]

Oh, I have raisins. I'm a mom. Wait, wait one sec. I've got cupcakes in the car.

[Lester Holt]

It's our best iPhone offer ever. Switch to T Mobile. Get a new iPhone 16 Pro with Apple Intelligence on us. No trade in needed. We'll even pay off your phone up to 800 bucks with 24 monthly bill credits.

[Zoe Saldana]

New line $100 plus a month on experience beyond finance agreement $999.99 and qualify imported for well qualified plus tax and $10 connection charge payout via virtual prepaid card. Allow 15 days credits end in balance due if you pay off early or cancel CT mobile.com.

[Draymond Green]

I you you just mentioned OKC being the favor to win. Do you think think people are underestimating how good of a coach Rick Carlisle is, you know, he.

[Sean Livingston]

He.

[Draymond Green]

He obviously coached Dallas, which we just spoke on Brian, who beat Miami, upset Miami in the NBA Finals. Do you think people are looking past that and not that Mark Dno is a great. I think Mark Dno is a great coach, but there's always something to say for the guy that's been there. And here's what I will say. Rick Carlisle is coaching for every coach that has won a championship. Because I'm going to let y' all hit on a little secret, folks. None of the coaches that has won a championship want to have new coaches enter into that fraternity. They like to keep that small. You know, maybe they don't win it, but maybe a guy who's won it has won it. They don't like new applicants, new entries into that. Into that fraternity. So Ricardo, understand Ricardo is coaching for every coach that has won a championship right now. But do y' all think people are underestimating his experience and what he's been through in these different playoff situations?

[Sean Livingston]

Shit. I know more.

[Baron Davis]

You can't, man. If you don't. You know, if you don't think Rick Carlisle is a great coach. I mean, look what he did with Indiana. He took them to the finals. Um, you know, look what he did with Dallas and that run, right? You know, like, reconstructed. Like a reconstructed Dallas team. An older team like Rick Carlisle can coach. Man. Rick Carlisle been in the game. He know the game. He love the game. And you can see he's not afraid to make adjustments. There's a confidence that I think, you know, Dre, we talked about it when we was in New York in the Knicks series. There was just a confidence of, man, what is he doing? Why is this person? Why? And it just worked. He plays 10, he may play 11. He has so much confidence and his players have so much freedom that they over index OB topping tonight, five threes. Right? Is it a genius move? It's the move he made, right? And he's not afraid to make those moves. And I think everything he does is calculated and being in that moment, he has scripts that he can pull from. He has an old playbook that he can pull from and say, maybe this will work. As opposed to okc, where, hey, we had this in the playbook and we had this before the game. If this happens, we can go small.

[Draymond Green]

Yeah.

[Baron Davis]

Still win this game right now.

[Draymond Green]

That's a fact. I think when I. When I look at this, this Indiana team with Rick Carlisle, Dot spoke about our first time doing it, like, and how none of us had Done it. And he spoke on the levels that we had played on. The one person that had been through it out of all of us was Steve Kerr. And he was the one that was kind of telling us, hey, fellas, this is going to be a little different on this day. You're going to have to practice at the arena. We don't really practice at the arenas. That's going to be different. He's like, when you go out to shoot, there's going to be a million people around the court. It just kind of throws off your routine a little bit. You had a. You will have the hunch to start going to talk to people, you know, stay locked into your routine. You know, there was. What was what? Oh, the. The opening practice the day before, where the media come into your practice. Like, he's. He's kind of telling us all these things, preparing us for this moment. Whereas I don't know if OKC has it in Alex Caruso, but having that in the coach, like, it's extremely calming. Like, Steve would just be like, all right, we cool? Like, oh, that happened. All right, no problem. Like, we'll do this now. And the confidence he would have trickled down to us. You know what I'm saying? And so they got Rick Carlisle, who I can see is doing that. He's cool. He's the other side of the pillow. Siakam's obviously doing it, you know, and that team is feeding off that. And I think that's a dangerous thing to have. And the experience that Rick Carlisle can pull from and that playoff run alone, he went through the Lakers with Kobe, he went through kd, Russ, James Harden, RKC Thunder, and then they played Brian, Wade and Bosh. And in all of those series, they were a combined 12 and 3. Like, rick carlisle know what he doing. And he showed that with some of the chess moves he made tonight. And I'm looking forward to watching that matchup amongst the two coaches, the chess moves that they make throughout the course of this series, because I think that's going to be fun.

[Sean Livingston]

Absolutely. And don't forget, I mean, I'm taking it way back now, but this man was with Indiana when Larry Bird took the Pacers to the Finals.

[Draymond Green]

Yes, he was.

[Sean Livingston]

So that was. I mean, we talked 2000, but again, just that experience is invaluable. And, And. And hitting on that with Steve, it's like there's nothing like going through it and then having someone give you kind of the blueprint or snapshot of what to expect, you know, from a From a leadership standpoint.

[Baron Davis]

So, yeah, I felt like Carlisle was in Detroit too. Wasn't he in Detroit when they made.

[Draymond Green]

Conference finals? They went to a couple conference finals with Rick Carlisle in Detroit, let him go and brought Larry Bird and I mean, Larry Brown.

[Baron Davis]

That's right, Larry Brown. Yes, that's. Yes, I remember. Yes. He's seasoned, though. That's the thing is, you know, he has.

[Draymond Green]

Yeah, he got.

[Baron Davis]

He got a lot to draw from. Right. He got a lot to draw from. And I like watching him coach because he make in game adjustments and he's not afraid to make those adjustments, switch those adjustments up. Because a lot of times coaches don't have counters for counters.

[Draymond Green]

Yep.

[Baron Davis]

Right. They have scripts and they have game plans and they go off their script. They go off their game plan, and sometimes you don't have a feel for the actual game or not paying attention to the actual game if it's not going to your plan. And Rick Carlisle was like, you know what? Hold on. This is not going to our plan. Let's switch it up and see if we can find tempo. Maybe we can control tempo and give ourselves a chance. Maybe we can shoot more threes or pick up the pace. Right. You got to have a coach like that, especially in the finals. And Steve Kerr does that too. He did that a lot. I watched y' all make adjustments. I watch y' all make lineup change. Not so and lineup changes, but matchup changes. Start working through other people working through other matchups just to get the Steph, Clay, Katie back in script. Right. Just to get the three points hitting again. And so you have to have these counters and counters for the counter to be able to keep you afloat. And it's just hard to bet against Rick Carlisle because he. He battle tested.

[Sean Livingston]

There's something. There's something. Something to say too, about being poised. And I don't. You know, again, I think this is very underrated from a. Just a human component. You in that head coaching seat in a finals, there's a lot of pressure, but again, this is where that experience comes in to empower and stay with the guy when he messing up. When, when the Pacers came out again, they. They would turn the ball over and I seen it was a couple guys that was a little shaky, you know, and again, just. Just throwing the ball around and that's okay. It happens. But just hearing him from the sideline, hey, it's all right. Next play mentality, you know, it. It gets you out of your own head right to where now, okay, I'm I'm in the game. And some of those guys, you see like, they're in the game in the fourth quarter making big shots now, right? Because they didn't let the first quarter, the first half dictate how they finished the game. And a lot of that is coaching and your coach pulling you when you throw it away right away, you know, telling you next, next shot mentality or, you know, next play, come on, fellas, we got it. And those are the little things in that environment. And we all play with all three of us, you know, we played in okc. We know how loud that arena is. Like, you know, it's pressure. We in the finals, everybody watching. You want to perform. You got whole family watching. You want to put on for your city, put on for your family, every, all, all of that. But you got to just, it's still basketball.

[Draymond Green]

That's a fact.

[Baron Davis]

You gotta be locked.

[Draymond Green]

That's a fact. And also not to be, not to be forgotten, Rick Carlisle also won a championship as an NBA player. So with the Celtics, right? So you know, he is a champion through and through and he, and he's showing that poise. But before we continue with more basketball talk, we have to mention that if you care about NBA history, you need to check this out. One move changed everything. The all new series, the Grudge from Vice Sports is a must watch.

[Baron Davis]

This week's episode takes us back to 1995 when Pat Riley was from the Knicks. Not in a pre. When Pat Riley left the Knicks not in a press conference, but a facts then he joined the Miami Heat and created the franchise. We know today that one move lit the fuse on a rivalry that would define both teams for years.

[Draymond Green]

Relive these twists and turns and look behind the curtain of what was really going on. The finale of the Grudge unpacks every angle. The betrayal, the bad blood and the battles on the court that follow.

[Baron Davis]

Watch the Grudge finale Wednesday at 10pm Eastern only on Vice TV. Find your channel@vice tv.com Move around the.

[Draymond Green]

League a little bit. Conversations going around the league about big name players like Giannis and like, does that player need to go to a bigger market? No. Does the player need to go to a bigger market to become a superstar? Guys like Shaq say a bigger market doesn't matter. However, Stephen A. Believes that market size doesn't matter to only transcendent players like Shaq. Do y' all think market size matters when it comes to being, becoming the face of the NBA.

[Baron Davis]

Championships matter? I mean, um, it's hard to say I mean, it's really hard to say. I think the face of the league is swag.

[Draymond Green]

Listen, I'll tell you why I don't think it matters. Being in the market, being in the big market and becoming a face in the NBA. I'll tell you why I know for sure it don't matter, because LeBron James became the face of the NBA. Cleveland, Ohio. And that's not a big market by any stretch of the imagination.

[Baron Davis]

Different.

[Draymond Green]

So I think you have to be that great. And I think what more so this brings up is because Stephen A. Was saying, like, the pressure you get and when you playing in New York, or the pressure you get when you playing in la, I want to tell you the same pressure those guys get when they're playing in those cities. LeBron James got that pressure in Cleveland. In Cleveland, if he didn't win, like, there, there's noise, there's this, he can't do it no more. Steph Curry get that same pressure in San Francisco, California. But if you don't win, it's a failure. Can they still do it? Is the dynasty over? When you are that great, the greatness creates the pressure. Every year Giannis, you know, Giannis be having these press conferences at the end of the year. They be super philosophical. You know, they be getting deep in them press conferences. But it be because people are asking questions like, man, why you ain't win? You know, like, those guys are under pressure no matter where they at. Now is the media, from the media standpoint, are they going to talk a little more? Of course the New York Post is going to get more eyes, you know, the New York Times, like, when you're in markets like that, when you're in la. Yes. The Los Angeles Times and, like, different, like, those things are bigger. So I'm not saying the thing don't get bigger, but LeBron James was LeBron James without Los Angeles. Like, and Giannis has become Giannis in Milwaukee, Wisconsin. Like, Joker has become Joker in Denver, Colorado. Luka Doncic didn't become this Luka Doncic when He went to LA. Luca Doncic became that in Dallas.

[Baron Davis]

And why did LeBron go to the Lakers? I ain't gonna get it because that's bigger.

[Draymond Green]

I think that's much bigger than just going to the Lakers. Right. That's a chess move that you're making about the game of life. That's, that's way bigger than just going to play basketball somewhere. So I don't think I disagree. Like, I, I, I think Giannis, what the. I Think what this brings up is, is how many true superstars are there? Because Giannis is actually a true superstar. Whether Giannis is in New York or Giannis is in Milwaukee. Like, yeah, they may have more. A few more national TV games because he's in New York City, but Giannis is going to be Giannis no matter where the hell he at.

[Sean Livingston]

Right? I agree with that.

[Baron Davis]

I agree.

[Sean Livingston]

I agree. No, I agree with that. I think your question is, do you have to go to a big market to be the face of the NBA? I say no, but there. But to elaborate on where you were going with pressure, I think we all understand there are more pressure there. You know, you have more pressure in those bigger markets. And I can see why Stephen A. Says that, because you are the media, right? So, you know, and you.

[Baron Davis]

We.

[Sean Livingston]

We know the. What the media is like in la, New York, you know, Boston, Chicago. Yeah, there. There is cutthroat, right? They seen Mike, they seen Magic, right? They seen Bird. Like, so, yes. And you will all. You will constantly be compared to some of those great players. But to be the face of the NBA, no, it matters what you do on the floor. At the end of the day, if you win, they will come. Period. They will come. And that's the point with Giannis, right? Like, he's been able to establish himself consistently. Every night he goes out, he performs at a high level, and he gives what he gives. And he separates himself right, from kind of the rest, maybe from, you know, all. From the rest of the All Stars, you know, to be in a. All right, so it's still about production. It's still winning. It's still winning. And it's still about that at the highest moments, like, you know, to do it on the stage, right? Like when. When it really matters. Can you put your team in a position to win because of you? Right. Can you carry a team? Right? Because it's. We all know that you're the guy. And so I think, again, those. Those to me, are the true superstars. And I don't think whether it's Memphis, whether it's. You know, I bet you said swag. Appeal matters, right? Because media, the social media, the culture story. Yeah, absolutely. The narrative, so that matters, too. But it still comes down to production. In my eyes.

[Draymond Green]

It does.

[Baron Davis]

Yeah.

[Draymond Green]

But check this out, though. Check this out. Obedient Doc. I think back in the day, the media in New York and LA was different. Back in the day. Yeah. But today we are under that same scrutiny. Like, you gonna first take on. Come on in the morning Stephen ain't gonna be on there crushing you. Kendrick Parker's gonna be on there crushing you. If you are one of the guys like that, that's what they gonna do. And so, yes, it used to be like, man, in New York, the media, they will crush you. In la, the media, they will crush you. But that was before the media culture of what it is became what it is today. And I think now, like, most guys are under that same scrutiny. Like, if no matter the market you in, if you are a star and, like, you wanted to say, screw me, I end up getting discussed on first tape all the time, regardless of what it's about. They're discussing me on that show quite a bit. And I'm not in New York, I'm not in Los Angeles, and by all accounts, I'm not a superstar, but yet I'm always being discussed on that show. So I don't think that necessarily backs up, you know, Like, I think it's the teams that matter. I think it's the guys that matter, like, and how do you make a team matter? The Golden State warriors never matter. We made that team matter, like, and so they're always discussing the warriors now. I think you have to make those things matter. I don't think it's the city anymore, like, because media is nationwide now. Like, it's worldwide. Like, this basketball is a global game. Like, there's someone in Serbia talking about the games. And so I don't think it's specific to only certain markets. I think is specific to certain teams and certain guys.

[Baron Davis]

Yeah, they put this era. They put Ms. Dunks on sports Center.

[Draymond Green]

Yeah.

[Baron Davis]

In the highlights.

[Draymond Green]

Yeah.

[Baron Davis]

You know, so that goes to show you, like, you got Ms. Dunks making sports center where we used to have to, you know, you gotta dunk on somebody, do something, be something. But I think for Giannis, what it is, is it's also like he's tasted gold, right? And for, let's say, the three years that Milwaukee was number one and couldn't do it, he had a story, a journey. It was a hero's journey. When he won his title, it was like, damn, boy, do that man deserve that boy.

[Draymond Green]

Do that man.

[Baron Davis]

Like, has he reached a whole nother echelon and level right. Of legacy that he's carving out for himself in the NBA? And then the next year. And the next year, you not getting close. You getting further and further away from that championship. So I think for Giannis is really. They're not a contender. They're not really contended. And so for him, being a Finals mvp, the Finals mvp, like, being able to taste that, like, he had a great run Back to back MVPs, everybody was talking about Milwaukee. Milwaukee was the talk of town. But when you not win it, you're not winning then. And you. In these small markets, it's hard to be seen and discovered. Like, it's hard to be a face of the league. But to your point, Jake, everybody got media. It's just now it's like for Giannis, it's. He gotta. He gotta be on a winning team.

[Draymond Green]

Does that. Is that team in New York City or Los Angeles, though? Like, does it have to be there? Because that's kind of what they were getting at.

[Baron Davis]

No, he just got to be on a team that wins. Yeah, he just got to be on a team that wins. Right. Because, I mean, you can say playing in New York gonna make you a bigger star. It's gonna get you more endorsements, you're gonna have more to do. But if you not win it and you're a superstar, agonis level, it don't matter where you go. You go to Lakers, you can go to New York. If you don't win and you do the same thing you did In Milwaukee, it's 10 times worse.

[Sean Livingston]

Yeah, absolutely. It's because of what he's accomplished, too. Because of what. Oh, who. You know, we know who he is at this stage in his career, right? Like, what he's capable of. But, I mean, I don't mind what's happening with okc. I don't mind what's happening with Indiana in this matchup. And again, the best teams. You know, Shay was in la, right? And to go through the rebuild now, he was young.

[Draymond Green]

He also went with the Lakers. That's the different. I know you, Josh about the Clippers. I know you got a soft spot, but that's. It's. It's a little different. Bd. Bd. I know y' all got the Clippers, but, you know, BD, you from LA. Y' all know it's a little draft.

[Baron Davis]

Why did LeBron go to the Lakers? I'm just saying, already a superstar.

[Draymond Green]

Well, of course he was LeBron James.

[Baron Davis]

If he was already the face of the league, to go to la.

[Draymond Green]

Come on. Because he was. That's crazy. You're gonna act like in 2007 when we was playing in the NBA Finals over and over and over again. LeBr wasn't LeBron. You gonna really act like that?

[Baron Davis]

Yes, I'm. I'm agreeing with you, bro. I'm just saying, why did he have to go to Helen?

[Draymond Green]

Because it was about more than basketball.

[Baron Davis]

Okay.

[Draymond Green]

So, you know, I think so he still needed a.

[Baron Davis]

He felt like he needed a bigger platform.

[Draymond Green]

No, I think that's about more than basketball. Like, that's also got it. Also at that point, he's in what year?

[Baron Davis]

16.

[Draymond Green]

Who wants to live in Cleveland? I love my folks in Cleveland, but like, I may want to live in Los Angeles. It's great living in Los Angeles.

[Baron Davis]

So yeah, that, I mean, so relay. I. I relate that to Giannis.

[Draymond Green]

For me, that ain't got nothing to do with me.

[Ryan Seacrest]

This podcast is sponsored by Total Wireless, the official wireless partner of ufc. So when you're streaming the fight or sharing those takedown highlights, you need a wireless provider that keeps you close to the action. With Total Wireless, you're covered by the Verizon 5G network, so you don't have to worry about your connection being knocked out at the biggest moments. It's not something you can usually say about a wireless provider, but Total Wireless really has your back. They're in your corner every second of the day, so you never miss a thing. They keep you covered for just $25 a month with four lines without sacrificing the essentials like speed. With Total, you get unlimited 5G data so you can stay ahead of the action and keep up with every knockout. Total Wireless understands you can't afford surprise blows any more than your favorite fighter can. That's why the price is guaranteed for five years, taxes and fees included. The best fighters don't make it to the Octagon alone. They have all in support along the way, and it shouldn't be any different for you. So visit totalwireless.com or visit your local Total Wireless store to learn more about how Total Wireless can be in your corner. 5G access requires a 5G capable device and a 5G service area. Monthly rate on the Total Base 5G Unlimited plan for new subscribers applies only to the monthly rate for your plan. Additional terms apply. See website for details.

[Draymond Green]

Hey, so we all make mistakes, but owning up is the right thing to do. You know Degree Cool Rush deodorant? Well, last year they changed the formula and it did not go well with their fans.

[Baron Davis]

Degree's whole thing is it turns up the sweat and odor protection when you turn up the effort. And good thing it does because Cool Rush fans really turned up the effort to bring back the original formula. One guy even started an online petition.

[Draymond Green]

And Degree listen, they admitted they effed up and are bringing the Original Cool Rush scent back. And it's exactly how you remember it. Cool, crisp and fresh. It's back in Walmart, Target and other stores now for under $4.

[Baron Davis]

There's a reason why it's been the number one men's antiperspirant for the last decade. It's the same reason why people were not happy when it changed. So if you never tried it, it might be a good time to see what the fuss is about.

[Draymond Green]

Head to your local Walmart or Target to try the OG degree Cool Rush for yourself.

[Zoe Saldana]

Hi, Zoe Saldana. Welcome to T Mobile. Here's your new iPhone 16 Pro on us.

[Tom Brokaw]

Thanks. And here's my old phone to trade in.

[Zoe Saldana]

You don't need a trade in. When you switch to T Mobile, we'll give you a new iPhone 16.16Pro. Plus we'll help you pay off your old phone. Up to 800 bucks and you still get to keep it.

[Tom Brokaw]

There's always a trade in.

[Zoe Saldana]

Not right now. @ T Mobile.

[Tom Brokaw]

I feel like I have to give you something in return for karma.

[Zoe Saldana]

That's okay.

[Tom Brokaw]

I don't really have much in my purse. Oh, let's see. Hand sanitizer. It's lavender.

[Zoe Saldana]

I'm good. Seriously.

[Tom Brokaw]

Let me check this pocket. Oh, mints.

[Zoe Saldana]

Really, I'm fine.

[Tom Brokaw]

Oh, I have raisins. I'm a mom. Wait, wait one sec. I've got cupcakes in the car.

[Lester Holt]

It's our best iPhone offer ever. Switch to T Mobile. Get a new iPhone 16 Pro with Apple intelligence on us. No trade in needed. We'll even pay off your Phone up to 800 bucks with 24 monthly bill credits.

[Zoe Saldana]

New line, 100 plus a month on experience beyond Finance Agreement 999.99 and qualifying ported for well qualified plus tax and 10 connection charge. Payout via virtual prepaid card. Allow 15 days credits end and balance due if you pay off early or cancel CT mobile dot com.

[Lester Holt]

Hi, it's Colin from the Colin Coward podcast. That would make sense that I would be the host of the Colin Coward podcast. I mean, that's the way I see it. I've been around long enough to know quality when I see it. Or in this case, when I taste it. Tito's handmade vodka. Good stuff. No flash, no gimmicks. Smooth, clean tasting, made the right way. Okay. I like things that are built to last. A great team, a well run organization. Same goes for my vodka, Tito's. Made in Austin, Texas. Real care, attention to detail, distinct, crisp taste. I was just telling my wife the other day, Tito's is the one Vodka. It has a completely distinct taste. Been my go to for years, so I like to keep it simple. Tito's soda, one lime, a lot of ice. Refreshing, easy. Summer, winter, spring. Totally versatile. Always works. Listen, baseball season's here. Your team's going to play 162 games. A perfect time to kick back with some Tito's. It's what I pour. You should, too. Distilled and bottled by 5th Generation Inc. Austin, Texas. 40% alcohol by volume. Savor responsibly.

[Draymond Green]

The biggest news outside of the NBA Finals is obviously Tom Thibodeau being fired after leading the Knicks to their first Eastern conference finals in 25 years. What was your reaction, both of y' all, reaction to the Knicks letting them go? I've been lucky enough to have two coaches in my career. Have y' all? And honestly, I'll say for myself, I was shocked as hell when Mark got fired because we had just went to two playoff appearances back to back years, and the warriors hadn't seen that type of success. So I was shocked by that. But in saying that, y' all have probably experienced it a little more than I have. What's it like when you feel like a coach should or shouldn't be fired? And do you think it was right that Tom Thibodeau was fired?

[Sean Livingston]

Yeah, I go first because I played probably on more losing teams than y' all two, so I've seen more coaches get fired. It's tough, man. Honestly.

[Draymond Green]

You got three championships. BD played on we believe.

[Sean Livingston]

Come on, slow down, slow down. I'm talking.

[Draymond Green]

Doc. Yeah. I told you he'd be coming on here messing.

[Baron Davis]

Some people wake up lucky, you know what I mean? Some people wake up lucky, you know what I mean? So some people wake up lucky. And you know what I mean? Some people wake up in the, you know, in the nice cedar side. Not so. Yeah, in the clinic, bro.

[Draymond Green]

You know what I mean?

[Baron Davis]

And you gotta, you know, same baby. Right?

[Sean Livingston]

Right.

[Baron Davis]

This is certain babies just handle with care.

[Sean Livingston]

Hey, man, it'd be like that. It's like that. I'm looking at the situation with Nick with the Knicks in New York. I'm like, he's taking you to the playoffs, right? He 1. He was a coach of the year. That obviously doesn't matter anymore. We see, you know, guys that get fired the next year after being coach of the year. But, you know, again, after what they've been through, probably since I've been in the league, they haven't really been relevant, you know, as far as really Believing that they can have a chance to win a championship. I think this is the closest that they have been. And I think you attribute that to Tom Thibodeau, right? You know, obviously Jalen Brunson, you get him. I think he goes to the Knicks because of Tom Thibodeau. And I look at these teams and I played for coaches in similar fashion that because of the way they coach, they will turn a team around. Tom Thibodeau is known in Chicago, when he was with New York, Minnesota, like, of turning a team around and they play playoff basketball in the regular season. And that's because of the habits and how he coaches, you know, his teams. Like they practice, right? Like, we all know that, you know, like he practice, you know, pretty much probably, you know, I'm not gonna say every day, but this man, like, you know, again, he's from the old school. So in that he's not really a coach that's going to make a lot of adjustments. He's probably a coach that's going to make you play his style and his brand of basketball.

[Baron Davis]

Right?

[Sean Livingston]

Now does that lead to. Right. Maybe the organization thinking that he should do things differently. Can you not be on the same page with the organization? Because now are you, you know, is, is he too stubborn in his ways? Right? With, with some of the ways that he operates. Those are the questions. You know, like over the course of each, you know, each, each organization he's at, they're get, they're, they're getting to the conference finals, they're winning 50 plus games every season. You know, these teams have been successful under his watch. And again, you know, sometimes you overcorrect. I think you look at the Phoenix Suns when they had Nash and those guys and they kept getting to the conference finals and conference finals, and now you go and you trade for Shaq and you go and you, you do all these different things and try to switch up and you're right there. And sometimes, you know, sometimes it takes a little nuck, sometimes I'm not. Ball knees, the bound. Like, look at the shot Halliburton hit the first game of that series. If he doesn't hit that shot against the Knicks, right. Is it a different series? Like so all those little things that you question, you say, okay, well it's the coach. And that's the hard part about the NBA, because the gavel will fall on the head coach. He's the first to go. We know that. And now who do you bring in to say this person, whoever they are, we expect them to take us not to the conference finals, to the finals. Right. I think that's kind of the expectation that you're setting as an organization by firing Tom Thibodeau right now.

[Baron Davis]

Yeah, I would say you will. There are always regrets when Thibodeau leaves, because you need. There's a. There's a huge part of him and his DNA that got you to that. Right. But at the same time, there's also maybe a personality. Like, there's a. A team personality disorder or a dysfunction that, as you continue to go, you start to see, like, oh, like, they just play hard and they're talented. Right. And you start realizing that in order to get over things, that Knicks up, you gotta have that Thibodeau personality in that DNA, but you also gotta have somebody who is paying attention to the game. And when I. When we watch the Knicks, you know, the reason why I'm looking at it, and I said at the beginning of the season, during it, you can't play seven guys the whole year.

[Sean Livingston]

Yeah.

[Baron Davis]

And so at some point, you know, this is year five for Tibbs, OG Anunoby, Mikhail Bridges, Josh Hart, Quinn, all them goddamn minutes. Next year, they gonna be hurt, Cat. And so you run the risk of. I mean, it's just a fine line because, like, you run the risk of, like, damn, we was right there. Tibbs got us right there. We bring a new voice in. Maybe he a little bit lenient, but maybe that ain't what they need. You feel what I'm saying? I mean, Dre, we talk about the Knicks. Knicks tape all year. Maybe that ain't what they need. Or maybe they're one or two players away. I remember when Houston let go Trevor Ariza, and, you know, people didn't pay much attention to it, but to me, I said, houston is not going to be the same. Because sometimes it's the dude in the locker room, right, that hold everybody down.

[Draymond Green]

That's a fact. That's a fact. I agree 1000%. I think what just happened to Tibbs is this. And you see it quite a bit in the NBA these days due to, in part, to, I think, the success that we had on that run with Cleveland and the dominance that was going in the NBA at that time. All the conversations nowadays, such as championship, championship, championship. And in turn, people try to ignore the process in getting to a championship. That shit is hard, and it takes time, and the timing is different for many people. Now, if you're firing Tibbs. If you're firing Tibbs, because you just think ultimately, like, he ain't the guy to get upstairs, that's one thing. But if you're blaming him for not winning a championship with this team, that's not the right thing because that's not a championship roster. I don't believe that the New York Knicks, as currently constructed today, I don't think that team can win a championship. I don't give a damn how many players team tips play all year. I don't think that team can win a championship. I think what Tom Thibodeau did and getting that team to their first conference finals in 25 years, I think that steps in the right direction to move it towards the right direction. I think that's a step in the right direction to say, hey, front office, we may be to BD's point a guy or two away and really making this thing go and like really getting over that. Humphrey, me personally, I don't think the guy or two is some small guy. I think they need like one of the ones. I personally think that team needs that. And so no, I don't agree that Tibbs should have been fired based off of this team not winning a championship. As if they were championship or bust and under achieved a payrolls may say that, but the eye test coming from somebody who I believe I know what that looks like now.

[Sean Livingston]

It'S hard too, because you end up measuring yourself against what the Golden State warriors was able to accomplish or the Cavaliers have it. You know, like you, you start looking at the teams and how they, Denver, Milwaukee got, you know, again, you start looking at these teams, how they were put together and you say, okay, we, we've, we've had some success. We are right there. And again, is this the guy that can get us there? I don't, you know, again, they, they have to answer that question. But we're in this era of instant gratification because of what the media and you know, the business and you know, again, we all benefit. You know, we all benefit. So, you know, it is a beautiful thing. The game has grown. You know, we have giants. You know, people have contributed to that over time that we have to think, you know, and obviously the NBA has done a great job, but because of that, now the pressure cooker is a lot higher. You know, the temperature is a lot higher. You know, as far as I need to win right now. Right, like, because again, you know, the process, what it takes, can you go through what OKC went through, you know, get to where they are now and the time that it takes to get there, can you make it through that time in New York at that, right, where, you know, they, they calling for heads out there, right? Their fans or the Lakers, you know, because let's be honest, the fans can be spoiled sometimes, you know, like, especially when you take success, you think it's easy in this world. So it will be interesting to see what happens. But I would agree, I think, you know, they, they could benefit for, you know, from, from adding a couple other pieces, but we'll see.

[Draymond Green]

1,000%, man. Doc, we appreciate you, my brother. Coming on the show means a lot. I know it mean a lot to bd, but she's my dog. It means a lot to me. She's having an opportunity to share the time that I share with you. And come on, chop it up after the finals before you get out of here. Who you got winning this championship? My dog.

[Sean Livingston]

Oh, man, don't do that to me.

[Draymond Green]

Who you got?

[Baron Davis]

Yes, sir. Pick him up.

[Sean Livingston]

Do that to me, man. We out here in the west, man. So I'm gonna go ahead and, I'm gonna go ahead and stay local. Stay local.

[Draymond Green]

Respect. Okay. So you gonna clean it up, man.

[Baron Davis]

Young money.

[Sean Livingston]

I appreciate y' all. Happy home, my brother.

[Draymond Green]

Yes, sir. My dog.

[Baron Davis]

Thank you, thank you.

[Draymond Green]

Appreciate you. Love to the fam too, my brother.

[Baron Davis]

Always.

[Sean Livingston]

Always. Yeah. All right.

[Baron Davis]

It's our first live one, man. Congratulations, John. You did it.

[Draymond Green]

Appreciate you, brother.

[Baron Davis]

We got through it, bro.

[Draymond Green]

That was great. That was cool. You know, we, you know, I, I, I do got two more, A couple more questions that I want to run by you before we get off. But hold on, before we do that, I have to remind you that Ice Cube's big three league tips off. It's new season on Vice TV and the opener is stacked with talent. Saturday, June 14th. The Houston Rig hands led by NBA veterans Gerald Green and Corey Brewer and coached by hall of Famer Calvin Murphy, take on DMV trilogy featuring Earl Clark, Isaiah Abrisko and coached by former NBA champ Steven Jackson. So check that out later.

[Baron Davis]

The Boston ball hogs with 2022. Big three MVP Kevin Murphy, coached by the Glove. My dog, Gary Payton. Town business. They go against Dallas Power headlined by Glenn Rice Jr. And Royce White, with Hall of Famer Nancy Lieberman calling the shots. This isn't a warm up. It's real competition. Fast, physical and every possession matters.

[Draymond Green]

So don't miss the Big Three season opener. Saturday, June 14th at 6:03pm Eastern only on Vice TV. Find your channel [e-mail].

[Baron Davis]

All right, man, I got a question for you. Talk to me, after watching game one, who do you have winning the series?

[Draymond Green]

I'm worried. I'm worried for OKC. Man, you cost, you caused 21st, 19 first half turnovers and you couldn't score the ball enough to pull away at least to get up 20 points. Like 20 turnovers, like 19 turnovers and a half. That's insane. And all the guys is not playing well. Nobody scored over 20 points or maybe even 17 points. That to me is scary because you held the Pacers to 111 and their MO is defense. You held them to 111 and you lost. Yeah, that's a problem because they gonna get, they gonna get 120. Like they. Yeah, they gonna get anyway, you know. And so to me that signals a big, big, big, big, big problem. And I have to say, if that's going to be the case, man, I got to roll with the Pacers. And I think the Thunder's supposed to win. But between Rick Carlisle, he's just any close game.

[Baron Davis]

I'm siding with the Pacers. OKC has been manhandling them all in the regular season, all up until that eight minute, that three minute mark or six minute mark in the fourth. I don't know. I don't know. I mean, okay, see, they should, they should be the superior team. They, they, they reflected that. Maybe this is just the game that slaps them up and wakes them up. And then I don't know if you know this, but y' all got the Pittsburgh Steelers. Y' all wind up signing Aaron Rodgers. What the y' all think I'm about to do?

[Draymond Green]

We about to trade for John New Smith. We probably gonna trade for another receiver. Super Bowl Pittsburgh. Watch out.

[Baron Davis]

Shout out to Mike to. Absolutely, but I don't think, I think Mike Tollen and Aaron Rodgers ain't gonna get a law. And that's about prediction.

[Draymond Green]

Aaron Rodgers don't come in here.

[Baron Davis]

Drama. It's gonna be some drama in Pittsburgh, baby.

[Draymond Green]

There's a way we go about things in Pittsburgh. And you coming into this culture, you must go about things that way. And he will.

[Baron Davis]

That's Aaron Rogers, man. You can't tell him what to do.

[Draymond Green]

Man, stop it. Listen here. Aaron Rogers coming to Pittsburgh, you coming here, brother on a one year deal. We not putting up with no nonsense. You coming here to play, you coming here to win. And at the end the season, last year, last couple games, you start see Aaron Rogers start stepping up in that pocket, man. He's coming back from that Achilles injury. He was stepping up in the pocket all year and he starts stepping back up in that pocket like Aaron Rogers. So watch out.

[Baron Davis]

I'm excited about it.

[Draymond Green]

Watch out.

[Baron Davis]

You're excited.

[Draymond Green]

Still coming.

[Baron Davis]

You're excited.

[Draymond Green]

Let's go Steelers. So you predicted last.

[Baron Davis]

You predicted.

[Draymond Green]

Oh, go ahead. No, go ahead.

[Baron Davis]

So you Project Super Bowl. I just want that on the record.

[Draymond Green]

Book it. It's happening. All right. Yeah, you can book that last thing before we get out of here. I was very vocal at the All Star Game time about it being trash. I thought it was awful and it made no sense that G League guys got to play in the NBA All Star Game. It's crazy to me.

[Baron Davis]

It made no sense.

[Draymond Green]

Adam Silver came out a couple days ago and said it will be USA versus the world. I like the idea. I think that was dope in hockey. This year was a little different. But in saying that, do you like the idea and what do you see as possibly being the biggest concerns with the idea?

[Baron Davis]

Look, man, the problem is.

[Lester Holt]

Is.

[Baron Davis]

The style. It's like you're not, you're not going. It's hard to get the competitive style in an All Star game when the style you play is very similar to what you're trying to reproduce in an All Star game, right? So like the style that they play now is very similar to like the most magical All Star games that you could see, right. Threes, Doug's highlights, things like that. So now when those dudes go to like dumb down the floss, right, or. Or show you something else, they show you, like, man, we can hit half court shots all day. And so I think personally, like, we've gotten away from. I am an All Star, I represent my team. It make you feel good. It make you feel good for the players on your team, the organization you put on for your city. I say, man, just go back to the jerseys. Let everybody rock their jersey in the All Star Game. East, West. But you know, we'll see what happens. USA versus the world. I just think that it fucks up the voting.

[Draymond Green]

It does. I think that's what I think the.

[Baron Davis]

Biggest thing is the voting.

[Draymond Green]

It changes the voting for sure. I think competing on a world versus USA level is going to create something. Although I don't know if they'll have the same pride that we'll have because it's not necessarily necessarily Canada or Serbia, but maybe they will. I don't know. But you know, I see that they're trying to do.

[Baron Davis]

There's just a lot to ask in the middle of the.

[Draymond Green]

They're ask, you know, they're they're moving the game to the daytime, and I think that that'll make a little bit of a difference. Guys want to get out of there and get the vacation. You getting there earlier, Like, I think. I think that can help a bit. But ultimately, I think if they really good for entertainment, that. That opening practice that they do, they need to nix it and go with a real practice so guys can, like, actually put in some sets and, like, actually, like, talking about making this serious and, like, have some time.

[Baron Davis]

Get a workout in.

[Draymond Green]

Exactly.

[Baron Davis]

Yeah.

[Draymond Green]

Get some shouts if they want to do that. I. I think they should do that. But, you know, you sell tickets to the opening practice and sponsorships, so, you know, you gotta give a little to get a little sometimes.

[Baron Davis]

But I think from the entertainment perspective, you got us versus the world in the middle of the season. I start thinking from a media perspective, just the coverage around the world is gonna actually make it, you know, a media spectacle for sure. I was like, all right, man, we know All Star Weekend coming up in la. What kind of entertainment we gonna have? Is it going to be fugazi? You know, are we going to have a culture involved? Like, All Star Weekend used to be a celebration, like a homecoming.

[Draymond Green]

Yes.

[Baron Davis]

It was where all the players felt like coming.

[Draymond Green]

Yes.

[Baron Davis]

All the players felt like, hey, man, I got to show up at All Star Weekend to see my former teammates, to see my nephew, my godson. You start really start to see, like, yo, we are like a big family and we start getting away with. We start getting away from that. Because now everybody kind of like, oh, you got the corporate party over here. The corporate party over here. But it's like. And everybody's busy, so players don't get a chance to hang out in the lobby. And it'd be 30, you know, like how he was in New York. Like, that's what All Star Weekend used to be like.

[Draymond Green]

Drake, I remember, like, we all going to dinner.

[Baron Davis]

You know what I mean? Like, when you was in All Stars are. Everybody's going to the same places. We all hanging out. We happy to be around each other, this old, young, new, and next to come, you know? And I think that's where we got to get back to. I want to see legends on the sideline of the All Star Game. I don't want to see John Legend. I do not want to see John Legend sitting nowhere on the floor, bro. They don't with basketball. They don't even matter to the game. Right? We don't care that they're watching. Put some legends in those seats and let's tell a story. Right? Man, do. Hey, do not put John Legend on the floor. Okay.

[Draymond Green]

That's funny. Listen, I think.

[Baron Davis]

Man, I'm gonna go kick it. I'm gonna go kick it. Spill this drink on him.

[Draymond Green]

That's. That's hilarious. I. I think. I think it can get better, but I've always said this. It just has to be more about the game. So we'll see.

[Baron Davis]

It got to be about the players.

[Draymond Green]

We'll see. Maybe they can get it right. Hopefully. Hopefully. Do not.

[Baron Davis]

Oh, John Legend.

[Draymond Green]

But, you know, bd. All Star Weekend is the last thing I'll say. All Star Weekend used to be like a cultural phenomenon. Culturally, it's lit like, you gotta go to All Star Weekend. All Star Weekend today is just a corporate. It's just a corporate.

[Baron Davis]

Corporate tea party.

[Draymond Green]

Yeah. And those aren't always the most fun. So, you know, we'll see. We'll see how it go. But we appreciate y' all for tuning in. Our first live episode, Indiana Takes Game one. We want to thank Shawn Livingston for coming on the show. Thank y' all for tuning in. Till next time. That's a wrap from the Draymond Green show with the legend Baron Davis, my brother. Appreciate y' all. Peace research.

[Baron Davis]

Like, subscribe. Comment. Send us shout outs. We out.

[Tom Brokaw]

The volume.

[Draymond Green]

Okay. Have you heard about this? Last year, Degree changed the formula for their Cool Rush deodorant. Their fans rebelled and wanted the old scent back. And ° listen, that doesn't happen often.

[Baron Davis]

They admitted that they effed up and are bringing the original Cool Rush scent back. And it's exactly how you remember it. Cool, crisp, and fresh. There's a reason it's the number one Manzani Perspirant, and it's back in Walmart, Target, and other stores for under $4.

[Draymond Green]

So try it and see what the fuss is about. Head to your local stores to try the OG Cool Rush for yourself.

[Ryan Seacrest]

This podcast is sponsored by Total Wireless, the official wireless partner of ufc. When you're streaming the fight or sharing those takedown highlights, you need a wireless provider that keeps you close to the action. With Total Wireless, you're covered by the Verizon 5G network, so you don't have to worry about your connection being knocked out at the biggest moments. It's not something you can usually say about a wireless provider, but Total Wireless really does have your back. They're in your corner every second of the day, so you never miss a thing. Visit totalwireless.com or visit your local Total Wireless store to learn more about how total wireless can be in your corner. 5G access requires a 5G capable device and a 5G service area. Additional terms apply. See website for details.

[Lester Holt]

Hey, it's Ryan Seacrest for Albertsons and safeway now through June 24th. Score hot summer savings and earn four times the points. Look for in store tags on items like Starbucks ground coffee, Red Bull energy drinks, Spam, Classic Planet Oat milk, Charmin bath tissue, Totino's pizza rolls and Frito Lay chips. Then clip the offer in the app for automatic event long savings. Shop in store or online for easy drive up and go pickup or delivery subject to availability restrictions apply. Visit ALBER Hudson's or safeway.com for more details. Are you still quoting 30 year old movies? Have you said cool beans in the past 90 days? Do you think Discover isn't widely accepted? If this sounds like you, you're stuck in the past. Discover is accepted at 99% of places that take credit cards nationwide, and every time you make a purchase with your card, you automatically earn cash back. Welcome to the now it pays to Discover. Learn [e-mail] Credit Card Based on the February 2024 Nielsen report, this is an iHeart podcast.