THE HERD - Hour 2 - Nick Wright Debates if the Chiefs Should Be in Colin's Top-10

Summary

The Herd with Colin Cowherd

Episode: Hour 2 – Nick Wright Debates if the Chiefs Should Be in Colin's Top-10
Date: September 16, 2025

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Episode Overview

This episode of The Herd Hour 2 revolves around Colin Cowherd unveiling his weekly NFL "Herd Hierarchy" Top 10, a pointed debate with Nick Wright about whether the Kansas City Chiefs belong in the rankings, and broader talk on quarterback play, team fits, and evolving storylines across the NFL. The hour is packed with sharp opinions, coaching insights, and candid conversations about rising teams, embattled QBs, and pivotal moments so far in the season.

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Key Discussion Points and Insights

1. Colin's Herd Hierarchy: The NFL Top-10 (03:11–10:24)

• Teams Ranked:
  1. Green Bay Packers – "I don't think Green Bay has a flaw. Coach, quarterback, run game... they're stacked." (09:00)
  2. Philadelphia Eagles – Noted struggles in the passing game but consistent winners.
  3. Los Angeles Rams – "Their pass rush is insane... highest graded offense... least penalized..." (08:30)
  4. Buffalo Bills – Points galore, but "the back end of their defense... looks slow." (07:54)
  5. Baltimore Ravens – "Best offense in the league," but pass defense worries. (07:26)
  6. Los Angeles Chargers – Solid, but offense hasn't fully clicked.
  7. Tampa Bay Buccaneers – "When you can win and you don't have some of your best players... you're making the herd hierarchy." (06:11)
  8. San Francisco 49ers – Winning despite injuries.
  9. Washington Commanders – "Oldest team in the league. Veteran leadership." (04:09)
  10. Indianapolis Colts – "I think the Colts have a much better roster than people want to admit." (04:16)
  • Chiefs left at 11th, "last time the Chiefs weren’t in our Herd hierarchy, I couldn’t say..." (09:00)

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2. The Chiefs Controversy and Nick Wright’s Perspective (10:24–11:09, 51:04–51:23)

• Nick Wright supports leaving the Chiefs out:
  • “[Right now], they don't deserve [to be in the Top-10]. ...If this were a team's most likely to win the Super Bowl ranking, they would be firmly in the Top-10. But it's where they are right now.” (11:09 & 51:04)
• Both agree KC’s Super Bowl potential is obvious, but based on early season play, the exclusion is justified.

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3. 49ers, Quarterback Play, and the Shanahan Factor (11:09–13:45)

Nick Wright on the 49ers SB Window and Quarterbacks:

• "For you and I, it's been a fun last 15 months watching the Niners. Jimmy Garoppolo was fine... Brock Purdy comes in and... he’s not really the lead actor of the movie... But this year, what if you replace Brock Purdy with a guy everyone agrees can't play? How would that guy look? And that guy is having the best game he’s played in three years.” (11:09)
• He gives significant credit to coach Kyle Shanahan for consistently winning despite rotating QBs and injuries.

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4. Quarterback Protection: Chiefs, Chargers, and Risky Play (13:16–13:45)

• Nick Wright's concern:

  • “The thing I liked the least about the Chiefs’ start... is how much Patrick [Mahomes] is running. ...He saves that for the playoffs. ...They're putting Herbert [Chargers] in jeopardy early and often... I don't love them spending a first round pick on a running back and Justin Herbert's leading them in rushing.” (13:17)

• Colin’s Take:

  • The Chargers need better depth at receiver, and Keenan Allen can't shoulder the load for 17 games.

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5. Baker Mayfield's Resurgence and the Importance of Fit (14:49–16:36)

• Colin argues Tampa is a perfect fit:
  • "Baker is perfect in Tampa... In Cleveland, it was all Hugh Jackson, Greg Williams, the bitter media... He goes to sleepy Tampa, and right now, there is no argument—he’s a top seven, eight, nine quarterback in the league." (14:17)
• Nick adds:
  • "Over the last two years... he is top three or four in the NFL in everything—yards, touchdowns, rating, completion percentage... If you did an MVP list, [Baker], Herbert, Lamar, in some order, are the top three.” (15:22)
  • “The Browns drafted him #1 overall, he wins playoff games... then are done with him after Odell’s dad put out a mixtape? One of the biggest missteps at the most important position.” (16:36)

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6. Quarterback/Coach Fit: Ben Johnson & Caleb in Chicago (17:24–19:52)

• Colin says Caleb Williams and Ben Johnson might not fit:
  • “It’s not the coaching... On script, [the Bears'] two opening drives have been remarkable. But Caleb is too talented...too much horsepower to put him in a box. I don’t think Ben and Caleb works.” (17:56)
• Nick’s Counterpoint:
  • “Even by your expedited process, we’re not there yet with Caleb and Ben, just two games together... Ben Johnson picked the Bears because of Caleb. He must think he can make it work. ...Work in progress is correct.” (18:38)
  • “Dissecting Caleb Williams [while] the Bears allowed 52... was probably the bigger problem.” (19:52)

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7. Wide Receiver Frustrations: A.J. Brown’s Situation (20:00–23:38)

• Colin supports WRs asking for trades:
  • "If A.J. Brown just said, 'I love you, but five catches for 30 yards—this is a terrible fit'... I would totally support it." (21:02)
• Nick agrees and elaborates:
  • “He posted after the Super Bowl... The satisfaction lasted two days. ...Where I get my love for the game is demoralizing a defensive back, showing my excellence. ...AJ Brown told us who he is.” (21:02)
  • “Right now... he’s getting less targets and opportunity than any point in his career. ...If they play this style and lose, it’s at a full boil.” (22:53)

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8. Joe Burrow, Quarterback Durability, and Victim-Blame Balance (23:38–27:26)

• Colin's warning:
  • "Joe Burrow... puts himself in harm’s way. ...I watched Big Ben and Cam Newton—huge men—age overnight. Why? They took shots. ...Eli Manning would literally drop, throw it away, pre-snap reads, get out of hits." (23:38)
• Nick agrees with nuance:
  • "It's tricky... Burrow is so intent and so excellent at big game hunting... He could have checked it down ...He’s trying to hit the big play. ...But sometimes you have to protect yourself in different ways. ...Playing like Big Ben, but Burrow isn’t Big Ben." (24:23)
  • “He is likely going to hold a record that no one wants: the NFL’s first ever three-time Comeback Player of the Year winner. And you don’t want that.” (26:57)

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9. QB Injuries: Impact on the Season (40:21–41:43)

• Five starting QBs already hurt: Joe Burrow, Jaden Daniels, Justin Fields, J.J. McCarthy, Brock Purdy.
• Colin: "This is bad news for the league... Are you watching Marcus Mariota vs. Geno Smith?" (41:02)

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10. College Football Quarterbacks: Disappointments and Surprises (41:43–44:08)

• Arch Manning struggles:
  • "For the season, Arch Manning is completing 55% of his passes. Two of those opponents have been absolute jokers..." (42:57)
  • Colin: “He’s not a thing. It’s over. We’re not talking about Arch anymore.” (43:16)
• USC’s Jaden Mayov and other standouts briefly discussed.

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Notable Quotes

• Nick Wright: "If this were a team’s most likely to win the Super Bowl ranking, [the Chiefs] would be firmly in the Top 10. But it’s where they are right now, so I’m fine with that." (11:09, 51:04)
• Colin Cowherd on team fits: "Fit is important... Ben Johnson is a timing structure coach and Caleb is terrific in opening drives, but then he starts freelancing—doesn’t look like it fits." (17:56)
• Nick on the Niners and QBs: "It’s been a fun last 15 months watching the Niners... Shanahan deserves a lot of credit for what he’s done this season." (11:09)
• Colin on Baker Mayfield: "Right now, there is no argument—he’s a top seven, eight, nine quarterback in the league... Tampa is the perfect marriage." (14:49)
• Nick on Bears’ decision with Baker: "One of the biggest missteps any team has made at the most important position in decades." (16:36)
• Nick on Burrow: "Burrow is so intent... at what I called yesterday, big game hunting... he was getting the snot kicked out of him." (25:02)

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Important Timestamps

• 03:11–10:24: Colin's Herd Hierarchy breakdown
• 10:24–13:45: Chiefs, Niners, and Nick Wright’s quarterback takes
• 14:49–16:36: Baker Mayfield in Tampa discussion
• 17:24–19:52: Chicago Bears, Ben Johnson, Caleb Williams
• 20:00–23:38: A.J. Brown’s role and wide receiver frustrations
• 23:38–27:26: Joe Burrow’s durability, QB injuries
• 40:21–41:43: Discussion on league impact of QB injuries
• 41:43–44:08: College football QB performances—focus on Arch Manning

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Tone and Style

The conversation is fast-paced, highly opinionated, and full of witty banter. Both Colin and Nick deliver bold takes, often referencing recent games, league history, and coaching philosophy. Throughout, there’s a blend of critical insight and humor, especially when discussing underperforming players or teams in the midst of turmoil.

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For New Listeners

This episode will catch you up on Colin’s latest view of the NFL power structure, open your eyes to the sometimes harsh realities facing young quarterbacks and highlight the importance of fit—between both coaches and players, as well as between talent and organizational culture. Expect confident, sometimes controversial opinions, and a heavy emphasis on quarterback play as the linchpin to NFL success.

Transcript

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[Colin Cowherd]

This is John Middelkoff from three and.

[Jason McIntyre]

Out with John Middelkoff.

[Colin Cowherd]

Thursday Night Football is on.

[Jason McIntyre]

This week the Miami Dolphins take on the Buffalo Bills.

[Colin Cowherd]

Coverage begins at 7pm Eastern and it's.

[Jason McIntyre]

Only on Prime Video. Not a Prime member. Simply sign up for a 30 day free trial.

[Colin Cowherd]

Restrictions apply. See Amazon.comamazonprime for details.

[Jason McIntyre]

Thanks for listening to the Herd podcast. Be sure to catch us live every weekday on Fox Sports Radio and noon to 3 Eastern, 9am to noon Pacific find your local station for the [e-mail] or stream us live every day on the iHeartRadio app by searching Fox Sports Radio or FSR. Now, let's get this party started.

[Producer/Segment Host]

You're listening to Fox Sports Radio.

[Jason McIntyre]

Here we go. Welcome in our number two. Nick Wright's gonna be joining us in a couple of minutes. The so we're two weeks down. We head into week three Thursday night. Buffalo is going to hammer Miami. They're going to have. That's probably going to be a very fluid situation in Miami. If you watch Mike McDaniel at the podium through the first couple of weeks, like he looks unnerved. He has lost his fastball. Like the whole organization now is just swimming in uncertainty. And so I think that will be decided. I wouldn't. If they get blown out, somebody may lose a job. That's what it feels like in Miami. All right, J. Mac, it is the Herd hierarchy. Just a heads up. The Chiefs are not in it. I'll explain that in a second. And here we go.

[Producer/Segment Host]

Herd hierarchy time is now.

[Jason McIntyre]

Let's go.

[Producer/Segment Host]

The top 10 NFL teams according to college. Number 10.

[Jason McIntyre]

I think the Indianapolis Colts have a much better roster than people want to admit. They've already got a star in Tyler Warren, Jonathan Taylor, Michael Pittman, Pierce offensive line controlled the NFL leading team in sacks. Denver. Denver could not get the Daniel Jones. First team in NFL history that went 10 for 10 first 10 possession. I've been on this for two years. I think they have an excellent roster. They've drafted incredibly well. I like their players. If Jones plays at this B2B plus level, they're going to win this division. Colts at 10, number nine commanders now played Packers Thursday. They're going to be fine because Terry McLaurin held out Jaden Daniels and they're one of six teams without an without a giveaway this season like last year. They're very efficient. They don't give it away. They just haven't been able to get the offense right because McLaurin was a holdout. Well, now off the Packer loss, they get extra time. Debo and McLaurin, they play the Raiders who just lost at home. I think Washington, I'm a buyer here, is going to this week look like the Washington of last year. I like them. They're the oldest team in the league. They've got veteran leadership. I like Washington at nine, number eight. I got to give the 49ers credit. They're not even healthy. Top 10 in total offense. Top 10 in total defense, two and oh, both wins on the road, that accounts for something. They've been great on third down, one of the two teams picking up first downs at over a 50% rate. And again Brandon Ayuk's hurt. George Kittle, Brock Purdy, Christian McCaffrey leads the NFL and touches right now. So I'm always impressed when you can deal with injuries, go on the road and win. I don't care who you play. Niners at eight.

[Producer/Segment Host]

Number seven, Tampa Bay.

[Jason McIntyre]

Again, they haven't played great football, but they've won two road games and dating back to last season, they've won eight of their last nine regular season games. Baker Mayfield since he arrived leads the NFL in touchdown passes, second and passing yards in 2023 and last night was classic. They got a punt block, their special teams are a mess and they go on the road and win and so. And they haven't had Tristan. Worse, they haven't had Chris Godwin. So just like Washington, just like some of these teams in front, when you can win and you don't have some of your best players, San Francisco and Tampa, you're making the herd hierarchy.

[Producer/Segment Host]

Number six.

[Jason McIntyre]

Maybe I have them too low. I'd put the Chargers. I do wonder if Hampton and Naji Harris when they're going to pop. Joe Al's been great moving over to left tackle, but let's be honest about the Chargers right now. Yeah, their offense hasn't played well and they've beaten the Chiefs and they've gone on the road and beaten the Raiders. Justin Herbert under Jim Harbaugh, 30 touchdowns and three picks. They don't have a lot of sizzle, but Quentin Johnson emerging is a non bust and actually a legitimate deep threat matters a lot.

[Producer/Segment Host]

Number five, the Ravens.

[Jason McIntyre]

I worry about the back end of their defense, but Lamar Jackson, seven touchdowns, no picks and a passer rating of 136. I compared them last hour to those great Atlanta Brave teams that won a World Series. You can just pencil them in to win their division. The gm, the coach, the owner, all great across the board. Now their past defense is going to bite them in the you know what at some point this year. But through two weeks, best offense in the league.

[Producer/Segment Host]

Number four, the Bills.

[Jason McIntyre]

I worry about the back end of their defense which actually looks slow but they're averaging 35 and a half points a game. Number one total offense in the league. They actually run the football more than people give them credit for. James Cook is really good and their schedule is tomato can. Dolphins, Saints, Patriots coming up like Brady in this division, they're going to want it as long as Josh Allen's in his prime. But I again worry about the back end of this defense because in the AFC there's too many good quarterbacks. The Chiefs are going to get healthy. These games are going to be close.

[Producer/Segment Host]

Number three, the Rams.

[Jason McIntyre]

Their pass rush is insane. Highest graded offense, highest graded passer in Matt Stafford. Again, this team least penalized in the NFL last year. And their defense was the youngest. Eight sacks from six different players. I couldn't even tell you the last time they missed on a defensive draft pick. So, I mean, they're.02 against the Eagles, nine and oh, against everybody else in their last 11 games, I have the Rams at three.

[Producer/Segment Host]

Number two, Philadelphia.

[Jason McIntyre]

Their passing game worries me. I mean, they're the first team to go two and oh, to start a season without a passing touchdown in 25 years. So Jalen Hurts. I mean, A.J. brown has six catches for about 35 yards. So I don't know how that's going to work out. And you know, it almost feels like now more often than not they're reliant on the tush push, but they're not playing offensively with a lot of tempo and they don't, they don't create fear. They just sort of squish you for three and a half hours. I have them at two, number one. Listen, I don't think Green Bay has a flaw. I think the cake was really good and then you added the icing. And Micah Parsons coach, quarterback, run game. Nobody in the league drafts tight ends and wide receivers better than Green Bay. They're stacked and they're not paying any of them. So I think Green Bay is by far and away right now the best team in the league. I have Kansas City at 11. I have Denver. Troubling. They've been sloppy at 12 again. I think the Chiefs will start winning games now. Xavier Worthy comes back, but I couldn't say the last time the Chiefs were not in our herd hierarchy. And with that, my friend Nick Wright joining us live. He probably doesn't like that. Colts pick.

[Nick Wright]

Ewing. I, you know, I mean, you're right, Colin. I don't like, I don't like when you do bad things. I have so much respect for you that. Yeah, you're right. I saw that. And you know what it reminded me of? And you talking about their roster and Daniel Jones hurt. Hierarchy. 2024, week three. Have you seen the Saints and Derek Carr start two? And oh, Alvin Kamara looks like young Alvin Kamara. Soft division look out for New Orleans. I don't if they've won a game since then. I'm not saying that's what's going to happen to the Colts, but it feels very Saints have the best open open to a season in franchise history.

[Jason McIntyre]

Ish.

[Nick Wright]

I do want but I and listen, the Chiefs right now don't deserve if it's based purely on this season, leave him out of the top 10. That's fine. And I think it's what you're yeah, right. And I think what you're saying is correct, which is they if this were a team's most likely to win the super bowl ranking, they would be firmly in the top 10. But it's where they are right now. So I'm fine with that. I would like, if I may, to spend a moment on the Niners because for you and I it's really been a fun last 15 months watching the Niners because you, you know, folks like you and I were like, hey, Jimmy Garoppolo's fine, probably not the bus driver there. And folks are like, look at his winning percentage. And then he leaves there and he's a career backup. And then Brock Purdy comes in and we're like, yeah, Brock Purdy's fine, but he's not really the lead actor of the movie. Folks are like, he left the super bowl field with a lead. What do you give the managers? Respect. He deserves his 50 million. And then you and I are like, well, maybe if he didn't have all his weapons wouldn't be quite as good. And then last year he doesn't and they win five games. And then this year it's like, what if you replace Brock Purdy with a guy everyone agrees can't play? How would that guy look? And that guy is the best game he's played in three years. And now those same people are staring down the barrel of am I going to have to make the argument that Mac Jones actually is great or am I going to have to fold my hand? And you know what? They are looking at Mac Jones, rookie year, Pro Bowler, 10 wins. Maybe it's just a, you know, it took a while to ripen. So I think the Niners Shanahan deserves a lot of credit for what he's done thus far this season. I do it. Can I ask you one Charger question and then I'll give you your showback? Yeah, I am. The thing I liked the least about the Chiefs start to their year is how much Patrick is running. He saves that for the playoffs.

[Jason McIntyre]

He Gets.

[Nick Wright]

And now he's get. I don't love that he feels like he has to. Man. I feel like they are putting Herbert in jeopardy early and often and I don't love that. And late last night when the game is wrapped up, they call a quarterback designed run. Like, I think he is playing the best ball of his life. Without question. I don't love them spending a first round pick on a running back and Justin Herbert's leading them in rushing. I don't love that.

[Jason McIntyre]

No. And I think they felt a receiver shy for 3, 4, 5 years and Keenan Allen has been. But you know, Keenan's not going to play 17 weeks. He won't. He'll get banged up. So I just said this before in last hour. I don't know what Najee Harris and Hampton become, but it's got to be better than this. If you want to win the afc. It's got to be better than this. I would say this. I started my show saying this is years ago. A couple years ago I offered Baker to podcast at the Volume and he said no. But Colin and I are frenemies. We're all good. And so much of what I see with Ben Johnson and Caleb, which is two talented people that don't fit. Baker is perfect in Tampa because Cleveland was all Hugh Jackson and Greg Williams and the bitter Cleveland media. And he goes to sleepy Tampa. And right now there is no argument he's a top seven, eight, nine quarterback in the league. And I think Tampa is a. It's the perfect marriage. Right? Like it just no pressure. The media is helpful. They're not bitter. What do you make of what you're watching?

[Nick Wright]

All right, so a few things. One is maybe take another run at Baker with the pod now that I'm part of the Volume team. Unlike you guys, Baker and I aren't frenemies. We're just actual friends. I'd even maybe be willing to do an extra pot a week if Bake Show's doing it with me. So we should talk about that. As far as your top seven or eight over the last two years, Colin, well, a year and two weeks since the beginning of last season, he is top three or four in the NFL in everything. In yards, in touchdowns, in rating and completion percentage. Right now, Colin, if you were to do an MVP list, he, Justin, Herbert and Lamar, in some order or another, probably the top three. And I think Tampa has a real shot at. And listen, I picked Tampa to go to the super bowl in large part because I thought they could have the number one Seed. I think Philly and Green Bay's divisions are so much tougher than what Baker's going to be dealing with. I think they could have an extraordinary season and starting the year, two games on the road, two games trailing late, two games, game winning drives. That's pretty special. Now, to your point about Cleveland, I think Cleveland could have been perfect for him. And the fact like Cleveland, his ruggedness and trash talking and all of it should have fit Cleveland. But the Browns, in their infinite wisdom, saw a player they drafted, number one overall, win a playoff game for the Cleveland Browns in year three, then almost upset the Chiefs in Arrowhead to go to the AFC title game.

[Jason McIntyre]

Yeah.

[Nick Wright]

And a year later, because Odell's dad put out a mixtape of missed throws, they were like, we can do better. It's one of the biggest missteps any team has made in the most important position in decades. You drafted the kid number one overall. He sets the rookie record for touchdown passes after you had gone 1 and 31 the two years before he got there. Year three, he's winning a playoff game against Pittsburgh and you're done with him. It was bananas what happened. And I'm so glad he is now establishing himself and now staring at this coming off season, one of those $55 million a year contracts because at the moment, he's one of the two best bargains and all in the whole sport.

[Jason McIntyre]

Yeah. And I was saying this morning, there's 102 and O teams and 100 and 2 teams and most of the 02 teams are the teams that every April lead the draft, take the Chiefs out, they'll make the playoffs. They're going to be fine. I think they're fine. And I also think Houston's okay. They just can't run block and CJ Stroud's running for his life. So they Colts look better, blah, blah, blah. But I do think there's a truth about the NFL with a hard cap, that ownership matters, GMs matter. And I look at the Chicago Bears and I said this yesterday, wonderful people get divorced and find their perfect mate. It doesn't mean they're bad people. But fit is important. And Ben Johnson is a timing structure coach and Caleb is terrific in opening drives. And then he starts freelancing and it doesn't look like it fits. It doesn't mean Caleb couldn't work with Andy Reid. But I watched this Chicago thing and I'm like, guys, it's not the coaching because on script, the two opening drives have been remarkable. But Caleb is just too talented there's too much horsepower, you know, to put him in a box. Nick, I don't think it works. I don't think Ben and Caleb works.

[Nick Wright]

So I here is my pushback on that one is even. And I saw your really great, and I say that sincerely, really great spot with Tom Brady last week when you, you mentioned that your new kind of line of demarcation is Thanksgiving year two and that you've sped it up from where you were previously even by that kind of expedited process. We're not there yet with Caleb. We're certainly not there yet with Caleb and Ben, who have two games together. My other pushback to it would be Ben Johnson picked the Bears because of Caleb. So he must think that he, I mean, he obviously watched Caleb, knew who he was as a player and said, yes, that's where I want to go. So I think you are being a little hasty in that regard that this won't work. I do think work in progress is correct. I also must tell you, I feel personally a little silly dissecting Caleb Williams when right above his name on the bar it says The Bears allowed 52.

[Jason McIntyre]

Points to the Lions.

[Nick Wright]

I do think that probably was the bigger problem on Sunday than Caleb freelancing a little bit.

[Jason McIntyre]

I said this is that if I used an example of a young attorney goes to a law firm in your hometown of Kansas City, he's Ivy League, he's sharp, but it's an old law firm with established partners. And after about three years he's like, guys, I'm not getting any cases. I'm gonna go to another law firm. Everybody in the law firm would be like, totally get it. Even the partners totally get it. When Jalen Brunson leaves the Mavericks, he likes, I need the ball in my hands, guys. I need shots. Everybody's like, yeah, of course he does. Luke is the better player. But A.J. brown plays Tennessee, the most run centric team. Philadelphia, even more run centric. He's a top three receiver. Arguably he's an NBA player that can't get any shots. But yet in the NFL, which is all about the shield and unity and follow the coach. It's like a guy can't ask for a trade. I would totally support AJ Brown if he just said, guys, I love you. I got five catches for 30 yards. This is a terrible fit. Go throw to Devonte. Am I wrong on this?

[Nick Wright]

No. And I So a couple things. One is, and you should all email it to if you want because if you this I hadn't heard you make this point, A.J. brown told us as much days after the super bowl. He posted an Instagram photo talking about how and then he wrote in the caption and I'm paraphrasing but about how the satisfaction of the super bowl lasted two days. And then he said and again I'm paraphrasing but it's almost a direct quote where I get my love for the game is demoralizing. A defensive back is showing my excellence, he told us. That's who he is. And that's part of the reason he's become so great that while winning is fun, what he plays for is, you know, dominating his matchup.

[Jason McIntyre]

Yeah.

[Nick Wright]

And I happen to think that if CD Lamb catches a ball and if Travis Kelce catches a ball and the Eagles instead of being two and oh are either oh and two or even one and one. This is already a huge story in Philadelphia because the fact of the matter is their passing game which remember last year when they were already on a nine game winning streak. AJ Brown after the Carolina game said we need to improve on passing. That then led to, you know, the Jalen's big game against the Steelers. AJ Reed on the sideline, all of it, the whole thing they were in the midst of they hadn't lost in months. He was frustrated. Now he's getting less targets, less opportunity at any point in his career because they haven't lost. I think it is at, you know, a simmer. It will absolutely be at a full boil if they play this style on Sunday and the Rams beat them. And what I do think is noteworthy is unlike last year when Saquon was en route to 2,000 yards and they were blowing people out. The Eagles deserve credit for getting those wins. But it's not as if if AJ said hey we can be better on offense he would be wrong. Their offense had their best offensive play has been Jalen hurts scrambles and the tush push where the entire team lines up offsides and the guards fall start but the NFL allows it like they have not been prolific right now And I don't wouldn't frustrate. I wouldn't mind if AJ or blame AJ if you were frustrated.

[Jason McIntyre]

Yeah finally I said this yesterday Joe Burrow it gets hurt a lot and you can blame the ownership in the online but Justin Fields gets hurt a lot and Justin Fields puts himself in harm way. Now Josh Allen can get away with it but I watched Big Ben and cam Newton Huge Men 65260. I watched them age overnight. Why they took shots and I watched Joe Burrow. It's like Joe, you're. You've got a normal frame. It's a six two and a half ish 225 man. I'm just saying it is also incumbent. I watched Eli Manning literally drop throw it away pre snap reads get out of hits.

[Nick Wright]

Is this is 100% correct?

[Jason McIntyre]

Burrow?

[Nick Wright]

Yeah. So this is tricky because listen, it's primarily on the Bengals. That offensive line has been bad for five years. It's. There's the. But Burrow is so. I'm so it's so interesting you said Big Ben because I evoked him in this same discussion yesterday but for a slightly different reason last year. Right. Take the Chiefs with Patrick. The offensive line is a mess and Patrick begrudgingly is like okay, I guess it's going to be bang, bang, bang out dink and dunk and you know I'm going to get rid of the ball.

[Jason McIntyre]

Yeah.

[Nick Wright]

Burrow is so intent and so excellent at what I called yesterday. Big game hunting that he is in in week one and in week two before the injury he was getting the snot kicked out of him. Colin. And it wasn't like immediate pressure. It was. He could have checked it down. He could have thrown it away. He's trying to hunt the big play which you know, he had 5,000 yards. Unbelievable year last year, you know, got MVP votes despite missing the playoffs. So he was rewarded for it. But it wasn't shocking to me. He got hurt. It was sad. It makes you worried about him. But sometimes you have to protect yourself in different ways. And the reason I mentioned Big Ben is in the pocket. Colin. He plays a lot like Ben did which is there might be people at my feet. I'm staying there. I'm going to shake you off. But Big Ben was called Big Ben because he was six, five and a half huge and impossible to bring down. Burrow playing this style is just risky and it's it again it. It feels almost like victim Blamey. But your point is correct some your if you're Joe Burrow. You know, if I get hurt the team is absolutely ruined. If we don't hit this third and eight we can recover from it. And it's a shame that he. Now this is where I'll leave it. Colin. He is likely going to hold a record that no one else will ever come close to and that no one else wants which is next year he likely becomes the NFL's first ever three time comeback player of the year winner and you don't want that. And it's a shame for Joe because he's such a great player.

[Jason McIntyre]

Yeah, he's like a $10 million chandelier in an empty mansion. They have no run game so he's always throwing on third and long. They don't protect him. They got. They don't spend money on defense so he's only able to win shootouts. You know Mahomes can win low scoring games. I mean they're tied with the Eagles 10, 10 and half. But there is something to be said about. And again it's. I'm not saying maybe it's 8020 on the Bengals, but when guys getting hurt there's something.

[Nick Wright]

Yeah, and I'm gonna give your producers one other job real quick. You just said 10 million dollar chandelier. There's a great meme that describes that. It's a Lamborghini parked in front of a trap house. Throw that on the screen for Colin at some point. He'll like it because that's what the Bengals built. Burrow Chase Higgins is as nice of a trio as you get. Everything else has, you know, leaky faucets and crack foundations. It's no good. Good to see you brother.

[Jason McIntyre]

All right, Nick Wright. Great stuff. Also last hour, Danny Parkins on the misery of being a Bears fan and Julian Edelman as well.

[Producer/Segment Host]

Be sure to catch live editions of the Herd, weekdays at noon Eastern, 9am Pacific on Fox Sports Radio, FS1 and the iHeartRadio app.

[Rob Parker]

Hey, it's me, Rob Parker. Check out my weekly MLB PODC inside the Parker for 22 minutes of piping hot baseball talk featuring the biggest names and newsmakers in the sport. Whether you believe in analytics or the eye test, we've got all the bases covered. New episodes drop every Thursday, so do yourself a favor and listen to Inside the Parker with Rob Parker on the iHeartRadio app or wherever you get your podcast.

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[Jason McIntyre]

So people know you mean business. There's never been a better time. Just visit GoDaddy.com gdnow and choose from a wide variety of popular domains to find the one that's right for you. Pair that with a professional email that works for all your business needs, from daily communications to email marketing and everything in between. That's a little price for a lot of credibility. For a limited time, get a domain and matching professional email for just 99 cents a month for one year. Go to GoDaddy.comGdNow and look legit with GoDaddy. That's GoDaddy.comGdNow there's never been a better time to choose the domain and email that's right for you. New customer purchases only products Auto renew separately. See terms on site godaddy.com gdnow hey.

[Commercial Announcer]

Folks, this message brought to you by the one and only Official Whiskey of the Herd with Colin Coward Green River Whiskey now here's a story that'll knock your socks off.

[Jason McIntyre]

Picture this.

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You'Re raising a glass to history.

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[Jason McIntyre]

Legend in a bottle today. Cheers to that.

[Commercial Announcer]

A product of Green River Distilling Company, Owensboro, Kentucky. Alcohol by volume varies by product. Greenriverwhiskey.com Please drink responsibly.

[Jason McIntyre]

Sean McVeigh is so intense as a coach. J. Mac, he got injured during the Tennessee game.

[Commercial Announcer]

He tore his plantar fasciitis is whatever that is.

[Jason McIntyre]

I've heard of it. Yeah.

[Nick Wright]

Yeah.

[Colin Cowherd]

McPhad is so painful, apparently.

[Jason McIntyre]

Yeah, I mean, we, you know, there are. It just used to feel like years ago. There's a lot of defensive coaches and. And there were a couple of hot shot offensive coaches. You know, it could be, you know, Bill Walsh or an Andy Reid or a Don Corel. And there were a handful of really good offensive coaches, but it felt like there used to be more defensive coaches. I mean, Sean McVeigh's coaching tree, Andy Reid. There are so. Shanahan. There are so many good offensive coaches right now. I was. I did a list last night. I was at home and I did a list of quarterbacks I think are capable of getting to the playoffs, and I came up with 21. And then I didn't count Mac Jones, Russell Wilson or Daniel Jones, who all had great weekends. Nor did I count Pennocks or Drake May or Cam Ward, who look really good, but I don't anoint them. We're getting to a saturation point if Cam Ward can play, and I think we both think he can. I'm a big believer in Michael Panicks. I think Drake May is going to get there. I don't know what with Caleb or JJ McCarthy, but I mean, the fact that Russ Mac Jones and Daniel Jones tore the league up. Tore it up Sunday tells you our offensive coaching right now. I mean, I always felt in the NFL there were about 10 teams that needed a quarterback. I mean, is there like six? And. And we're going into a huge quarterback draft. Like, they're, they're. I just watching Daniel Jones, Russell Wilson, Mac Jones, tear it up. I mean, not just play. Okay? Daniel Jones is 10 for his first 10 possessions this year. There's some good quarterback play and excellent offensive coaching. That's all I'm saying. J. Mack with the news.

[Producer/Segment Host]

No, no, no, no.

[Jason McIntyre]

Turn on the news.

[Producer/Segment Host]

This is the Herdline news.

[Colin Cowherd]

Get started with the Houston Texans, those gigantic frauds who let us down last night. Oh, my gosh. C.J. stroud has been putrid. And, you know, we got a guy on staff here trying to sell me, well, the offensive line and the, the blocking tight end and Christian Kirk and all these injuries. Stop it. Okay? C.J. stroud is 4 for 18 on third down, Colin, the Texans are oh and three in their. Oh for three in the red zone. They. Their offense is a joke right now. He knows the offense has to be better. Here's Stroud at the podium.

[CJ Stroud]

As a team, we got to stay together. Everybody's going to talk crazy and we suck. We this, we that. And at the end of the day, we got to stay together and just mesh well and, you know, be honest, have hard conversations. But, you know, I think right now we need more confidence as a, as an offense, at least just confidently playing better together. I think that's a big thing. We're all.

[Jason McIntyre]

Yeah, they can't run the ball, so it's a lot of third and long. They're not great. Four new starters and pass protect. So, I mean, it's. I was thinking this last night when you watched the game, because I thought Houston would win. Houston blocked a punt, had several big passes downfield, had a huge return, but can't pick up a yard. And the only team in the league, it's easier to complete a 15 yard pass than it is pick up two yards on a third and two. They can't pick up short yards. They couldn't against the Rams. They couldn't last night.

[Colin Cowherd]

It's not just the run, though. Stroud is way off target. Colin, they're on the doorstep in the fourth quarter and Stroud misses two throws that a top 10 quarterback makes. And listen, we need to have an honest conversation about CJ Stroud. Yes, he was great as a rookie. Bryce Young struggled and went before him in the draft. CJ Stroud regressed last year and CJ Stroud so far this year against two teams who were in the playoffs last year. I'll give him that. He has looked awful right now. You can't convince me He's a top 15 quarterback in the league. I'm sorry, I'm not going to hear it.

[Jason McIntyre]

Well, Baker outplayed him last night by a mile. Yeah, that's inarguable. Baker Mayfield right now. Now, I think Baker has some advantages. A much better running back room even without Tristan Wurfs better protection. That matters. IME Abuka is also going to be a star. Although he had a drop last night. It was an iffy drop.

[Colin Cowherd]

That was a defender came over and.

[Jason McIntyre]

Made a great play. But I will say Baker's got the better old line without Tristan. Worst. And Baker's got. I mean, they've got like two or three nice running backs. Bucky Irving's good. Good running back.

[Colin Cowherd]

Okay, let's Let me ask you. You love this game. We do it in the off season. But I think it bears mentioning if I told you for the next two years, you could have Jared Goff for CJ Stroud. Who are you taking? You got to think about that.

[Jason McIntyre]

I still like C.J. stroud. I think.

[Colin Cowherd]

Oh, my gosh. Are you out of your mind?

[Jason McIntyre]

Jared Goff has two great backs, a great tight end, a star receiver, and two legitimate pro bolt tackles. Well, what are you playing with? I mean, C.J. stroud is no run game and bad protection.

[Colin Cowherd]

Jordan Love or C.J. stroud?

[Jason McIntyre]

Jordan Love. Easy.

[Colin Cowherd]

You said Baker for sure, right?

[Jason McIntyre]

Yeah, Baker right now over C.J.

[Colin Cowherd]

Now, listen, don't overreact, okay? Trevor Lawrence or C.J. stroud?

[Jason McIntyre]

C.J. stroud.

[Colin Cowherd]

No way. I'm not. I will not stand for that. I cannot wait till they play head to head. I'm just telling you, Trevor Lawrence. Trevor Lawrence is. He's not living up to expectations, but he's not awful. CJ Stroud has shown a lot of awful on tape this year. Look at last year. He's running into sacks, and I know the offensive line's not great. Man, C.J. stroud let me down last night big time. Let's move on to the next story. Listen, this stinks. Jaden Daniels got an MRI after suffering a knee injury against the Green Bay packers, and his status for the Sunday game against the Raiders is in jeopardy. Here's Dan Quinn on his franchise quarterback.

[Dan Quinn]

The strength part of things, the movements, and that's step one, John. Then on the field, the change of direction, the pivoting, the moving, all of those would be the things to go. So we'll just take it, you know, as it goes, you know, through the week. But he'd have to see all of the steps, you know, along this week to hit those marks. The speed, the stopping, the change of direction, all of it.

[Jason McIntyre]

This is what we did worry about out of college. No, I. I said I think he's going to look a lot like Lamar Jackson. Not quite as fast, but a better pocket thrower. But my concern was I don't know if he can stay healthy because he is spindly, he is light. So he got banged up for about two weeks last year, but played, and he's banged up again. I don't think. It's not like a JJ McCarthy where he can't stay healthy at all. But this, I think this was the concern, which is why Debo Samuel is a great get. But make sure the offensive line gets built for the next Several years, because this is not a guy. I've said this. When you have Tua, who's got a smaller frame, you got to have a good old line. The Dolphins haven't. So, like, there's certain quarterbacks in this league, Josh, Allen, Herbert, they can take hits. Jaden's not one of those guys. He needs protection.

[Colin Cowherd]

So if you're playing the long game and you're Washington, I think you got to sit him out. Against the Raiders, it's a non divi, non conference matchup. If you lose, it's not the end of the world. It doesn't impact you next week. However, you're in Atlanta. That's a team that you could be battling for a wild card birth. I think you need him after that. Chargers, that's going to be a very tough game. I personally would sit him and I think the line is telling you that they probably will. It's down to Washington minus three. This was headed towards six because obviously they're on extended rest having played last Thursday. Raiders just played last night and have to travel across the country. I think Mariota can get this job done. Your thoughts?

[Jason McIntyre]

Yeah, I mean, I think when you lay it out that way, it's early. I think they're going to be fine. They've already got a win over the Giants, so. And again, the Raiders are on a short week that you can, you can win with a backup. You could win with Mariota. So I. That's probably the play. I think Washington is going to be fine. I think this is just slowing down the Terry McLaurin, Jaden Daniels relationship, which already felt like it was behind. So I think you worry about that, but I don't worry about the coach, the staff, the quarterback, the playmakers. I don't worry about that.

[Colin Cowherd]

Yeah. So final note, Colin. So we have now five starting quarterbacks who have been injured. It's been two weeks. Okay? You and I bemoan when the NBA playoff stars get hurt. Colin, this is bad news for the league. Joe Burrow's a star. He's out three months. Jaden Daniels is a budding star. Justin Fields, you know, whatever. Jets are unwatchable anyway. McCarthy, that's not great. And Brock Purdy, that. That's terrible. Okay, these are one, two. So this is basically but four playoff teams.

[Jason McIntyre]

Purdy is hurt again. McCarthy's hurt again. Burrows hurt again. Fields is hurt again. So four of those guys get hurt regularly. That's not. That's not nothing against the league. The four of those guys are always banged.

[Colin Cowherd]

No, I'm just saying it's bad for the. Because now, I mean, you're. Are you watching Marcus Mariota versus Gino Smith? I mean, come on. That's not really watchable. Jaden Daniels is playing. I'm doing it.

[Jason McIntyre]

Games of the week are going to be Rams, Eagles, Bears, Cowboys, Niners, Arizona. I think the games that I want to watch are not affected by those quarterbacks. I mean.

[Colin Cowherd]

I mean, I like Jaden Daniels. I mean, I like watching him.

[Jason McIntyre]

I like Joe Burrow.

[Colin Cowherd]

He's always in fun games. It's just. I don't know how you fix this. Quarterbacks are going to get hurt.

[Jason McIntyre]

What do you want, 60 play a year? That's the. That's why. That's why a team like Chicago pays the backup. When Sean Payton got the Denver, he paid Jared Stidham like 12 million. Everybody went, why? And it's like, well, that's what you have to do. It's a legitimate position.

[Colin Cowherd]

Final story is Arch Manning. Colin, listen, we're not going to beat up on the kid. He. He was not great against utep. I think you were recruited by like the likes of UTEP back in the day. Listen, Arch knows he can be better. Here he is talking about it.

[Arch Manning]

I gotta play better. It's not good enough, as y' all can see. I gotta play better for us to. Maybe it slides against Utah, but it's not gonna win us games against sec. I gotta play better. Going back to basics, finishing throws, get my hips through and just focusing on it throughout the week of practice and letting it rip in game. You made it your first one a little bit.

[Jason McIntyre]

I'm just frustrated.

[Arch Manning]

I know I'm better than this.

[Jason McIntyre]

Now they're missing receivers and running backs. So right now the defense is great. They are missing, you know, receivers and backs. And it was a young offense anyway with four new starters in the offensive line. So the offense was going to be a work in progress. To me, it's more arm angles and confidence. It just doesn't look right. And I think that's a big part of quarterback play. It either looks right. That Julian saying for Ohio State when they played, it just looked right. He looked composed. His feet were good. He didn't miss the layup. So right now a lot of it is aesthetics. It just looks like he's struggling.

[Colin Cowherd]

I mean, look at that throw against UTEP. Anyways, he was 11 for 25 for 165 yards. Colin. For the season, Arch Manning is completing 55% of his passes. Two of those opponents have been absolute jokers.

[Jason McIntyre]

Yeah, it's a thing. No, it has been uni.

[Colin Cowherd]

No, no, he's not a thing. It's over. We're not talking about Arch anymore. Producers. No more Arch. Sorry. It's done. They're not. He's not good. There's other quarterbacks we could talk about.

[Jason McIntyre]

There's no question. Anybody cave club. Nick has struggled. I'll tell you. Jaden Mayov at usc. Oh, come on. I'm telling you. Leads the country right now.

[Colin Cowherd]

Oh, okay. I just looked up the line for you. 17 and a half against Sparty. I mean, is this party even field a team at this point?

[Jason McIntyre]

What's going on here? I would watch USC's quarterback.

[Colin Cowherd]

I may have to go to a game. Maybe I'll get the executives to take me to 1.

[Jason McIntyre]

I'm not joking when I say this. If you don't think Lincoln Riley can coach, go look at that quarterback last year and this year he is a draftable quarterback. Now he is an NFL draftable quarterback. Where? I don't know. He's totally draftable. J Mac with a news.

[Colin Cowherd]

Well, that's the news and thanks for stopping by.

[Producer/Segment Host]

The Herd lie news just Julian Edelman.

[Jason McIntyre]

Danny Parkins, the misery of being a Bears fan. That'll show up in the last hour of the Herd.

[Producer/Segment Host]

Be sure to catch live editions of the Herd, weekdays at noon Eastern, 9am Pacific on Fox Sports Radio, FS1 and the iHeartRadio app.

[Commercial Announcer]

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[Jason McIntyre]

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[Jason McIntyre]

People know you mean business. There's never been a better time. Just visit GoDaddy.com gdnow and choose from a wide variety of popular domains. To find the one that's right for you. Pair that with a professional email that works for all your business needs from daily communications to email marketing and everything in between. That's a little price for a lot of credibility. For a limited time, get a domain and matching professional email for just 99 cents a month for one year. Go to GoDaddy.comGdNow and look legit with GoDaddy. That's GoDaddy.comGdNow there's never been a better time to choose the domain and email that's right for you. New customer purchases only products Auto renew separately. See terms on site godaddy.com gdnow hey.

[Commercial Announcer]

Folks, this message brought to you by the one and only official Whiskey of the Herd with Colin Cowardly Green River Whiskey. Now here's a story that'll knock your socks off.

[Jason McIntyre]

Picture this.

[Commercial Announcer]

Founded way back in 1885, Green River Whiskey is OG Kentucky Cool, the 10th oldest distillery in the state. And get this, it was so valuable back in the day that 20 barrels of the good stuff were traded for shares in a gold mine. That's liquid gold. Literally. But like any great drama, tragedy struck in 1917 with a fire that almost wiped it off the map. Cue the hero music. It was rebuilt on the same hallowed grounds. Let me tell you, better than ever. So whether you're sipping their single barrel bourbon or a smooth straight rye, know you're raising a glass to history, folks. Here's to Green River Whiskey where rich flavor meets richer stories. Hop on over to greenriverwhiskey.com, discover a.

[Jason McIntyre]

Legend in a bottle today.

[Commercial Announcer]

Cheers to that. A product of Green River Distilling Company, Owensboro, Kentucky. Alcohol by volume varies by product. Green RiverWhisky.com Please drink responsibly.

[Colin Cowherd]

Start your Saturday Strong with Big Noon Saturday. Utah and Texas Tech battling for the top of the Big 12. It all kicks off at 10 Eastern with big noon kickoff live from Salt Lake City. Then it's Texas Tech Utah only on fox.

[Jason McIntyre]

Yeah. Texas TechStat program with a billionaire who spent all that money. Yeah.

[Colin Cowherd]

Hey, low key. This is a huge game. I like Texas Tech to go to the playoff. Colin obviously Utah is great at home is a big time game. It's kind of under the radar, but I think there's a fantastic matchup.

[Jason McIntyre]

Utah is the most underrated college football program for 20 years. Yeah, they two in their last 18 bowl games or something like. Utah is so well coached. They are, yeah. I mean I, I'll take Utah in big games at home.

[Commercial Announcer]

I'll take Utah.

[Jason McIntyre]

By the way, here's the Herd hierarchy. I kept Kansas City out of it. It is not standings, but it, it, it's closer to standings than it is projecting who's going to be in the Super Bowl. But I have Packers, Eagles, Rams, Bills, Ravens, Chargers, Bucks, Niners. I still believe in the commanders with Jaden Daniels. I think they just, I think extra rest. If Jaden Daniels played with extra, you know, they played on Thursday night, I think they'll start smoking here pretty quick. I think the Colts are right now. I think you have to be honest about it. Tyler Warren's a star at tight end. They have a lot of weapons that, you know, I was talking to Chris Ballard in the off season. They had joint practices with the Ravens and the packers and all I'm going to say is he left those joint practices thinking we got some players. I think the Colts roster, I went on this for two years. I think the Colts roster is good. If Daniel Jones is going to be B to a B plus that that team's going to win the division. They have the best roster in that division. If Daniel Jones is this, they are winning that division. Absolutely.

[Colin Cowherd]

I know they'll never let us do it, but if you, you really think they have the best roster in the division, we could say 10 best players, Colts versus Jags and the Jags got them. And the Texans probably have.

[Jason McIntyre]

Did you watch Denver's defensive line? The best pass rush in the league the last two years could not get to Daniel Jones.

[Colin Cowherd]

I think they got him three times. But anyways, nevertheless, let me just quickly point out everything is coming up Indianapolis since Indiana Fever got Caitlin Clark, they got. You got the Pacers making all these runs. You got Caitlin Clark and now the Colts are two and oh, all of a sudden the Midwest, you move to the Midwest like there's some kind of gravitational pull that Indiana is like becoming a.

[Jason McIntyre]

The, the organizations have drafted well, the Pacers, the Colts and the Fever. But in the end we spend so much time, I mean worrying about quarterbacks. But when you're surrounded with Pittman and Taylor and Warren and you have an excellent offensive line, Daniel Jones with Shane Steichen Remember Kevin o' Connell liked him. We've always said this about quarterbacks. What coaches like you. Shanahan like Darnold. Kevin o' Connell like Darnold. They liked Darnold. So the bottom line here is Shane Steichen liked Daniel Jones. Kevin o' Connell liked him. I don't think he's great. I think he's kind of a poor man's Alex Smith. But here's Nick Wright on the Chiefs.

[Nick Wright]

Not being in right now, don't deserve if it's based purely on this season, leave him out of the top 10. If this were a team's most likely to win the super bowl ranking, they would be firmly in the top 10. But it's where they are right now, so I'm fine with that.

[Jason McIntyre]

I've always said the top four teams in herd hierarchy, those are teams capable of winning the super bowl. Five on no American public university where.

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[Jason McIntyre]

Because when it comes to quality, the best new cars make the best used cars. So don't miss your chance. Find your certified Toyota today, but hurry.

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These Great offers end November 3rd Toyota.

[Jason McIntyre]

Certified used Vehicle Sales Event where every surprise is a great one.

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Inventory may vary by dealer, participating dealers only. Comprehensive and powertrain are limited Warranties. See TCUV warranty supplement ToyotaCertified.com or your Toyota dealer for dealers details.

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[Jason McIntyre]

This is Colin Coward from the Herd with Colin Coward. A wingman flies close with unwavering dedication. At Folds of Honor, a wingman stands with families of Americans fallen or disabled, heroes. The burial flag given to their grieving family is folded 13 times. As a wingman, your $13 monthly donation provides scholarships to their spouses and children. 13 folds $13 Become a wingman. Join today at foldsofhonor.org this is an I Heart podcast.