← The Herd with Colin Cowherd
The Herd with Colin Cowherd
THE HERD - Hour 2 - Steelers continue to struggle on offense, the issues with the Chiefs, Jerry Jones is a happy man right now, Greg Cosell, Matt Mosley
00:40:40
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- [00:00]
Greg Cosell
This is an iHeart podcast. Guaranteed Human.
- [00:04]
Colin Cowherd
Remember when people were nice? When we could occasionally stop fighting and come together? Well, here's some good news. The Ripple Effect is here. Hosted by comedian Jenna Kim Jones. It's a show about how powerful it is when we reach out to one another. It's the perfect weekly proof that goodness isn't gone. The Ripple Effect is more than a podcast. It's a reminder that you can start a ripple that changes everything. Listen to the ripple effect on iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts.
- [00:35]
Sponsor/Ad Voice
Thursday Night Football is on. This week the Dallas Cowboys take on.
- [00:39]
Matt Mosley
The Detroit Lions in a new rivalry.
- [00:41]
Sponsor/Ad Voice
With lots of heat. Coverage begins at 7pm Eastern and it's.
- [00:44]
Matt Mosley
Only on Prime Video. Not a Prime member?
- [00:46]
Sponsor/Ad Voice
Not a problem. Simply sign up for a 30 day free trial. Restrictions apply. See Amazon.com Amazon prime for details. Support for the show comes from Public, the investing platform for those who take it seriously. On Public you can build a multi asset portfolio of stocks, bonds, options, crypto and now generated assets which allow you to turn any idea into an investable index. With AI. It all starts with your prompt. From renewable energy companies with high free cash flow to semiconductor suppliers growing revenue over 20% year over year, you can literally type any prompt and put the AI to work. It screens thousands of stocks, builds a one of a kind index and lets you back test it against the S and P. Then you can invest in a few clicks. Generated assets are like EFTs with infinite possibilities, completely customizable and based on your thesis, not someone else's. Go to public.com podcast and earn an uncapped 1% bonus when you transfer your portfolio. That's public.com podcast paid for by Public Investing Brokerage Services by Open to the Public Investing Inc. Member finra, SIPC Advisory Services by Public Advisors llc SEC Registered Advisor Generated Assets is an interactive analysis tool. Output is for informational purposes only and is not investment recommendation or advice. Complete Disclosures available at public.comDisclosures Wasabi is.
- [02:03]
Colin Cowherd
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- [03:32]
Greg Cosell
Now let's get this party started.
- [03:34]
Matt Mosley
You're listening to Fox Sports Radio.
- [03:39]
Colin Cowherd
Here we go, Lions and the Cowboys tonight. I like Dallas. I like their direction. Offense is on fire. Playing with a ton of confidence.
- [03:52]
I think one of the things when you look around the NFL right now.
- [03:58]
Is that the best quarterback doesn't necessarily lead the division. The best coach often leads the division. Mike Vrabel is the best coach. Drake May's not as good as Josh Allen. He's good. Mike Vrabel leads his division. Ben Johnson leads his division. Sean McVeigh leads his division.
- [04:20]
I mean, I, I and we've said before, quarterback is more valuable than coaching. That's always been understood. But I think in Detroit, you have a situation where you lost a brilliant coordinator, Ben Johnson, who's become a so far a brilliant head coach. And I think all the problems stem. It is nothing against the person that replaced him. Detroit still scores points, but not as many. And they're not as powerful with many of the same players. So they were great. In fact, defined. Detroit was on third down and fourth down. Now they're bad on third down with a lot of the same players. So Dan Campbell on what he's seeing with the Cowboys right now, they're hot right now. They're playing really good football. They got a lot of confidence. They're a rugged team. You know, they are built off the O line, D line, but they got explosiveness on the perimeter and Dax playing at a high level, man.
- [05:17]
So look, we know we got our hands full, but. But we're up to the challenge. The scary thing about Dallas is their two guards. Over the last several years they've taken high draft picks with interior linemen. They're both outstanding. So they're, they're interior O line there they got a little problem at right tackle, but that Dallas O line, remember that, that's what carried Dak early in his career. Once again, Dak 10 years later they this O line has a chance to be really something. They're running the football now with conviction. With that, Greg Cosell, 46 years NFL Films, always joins us on Thursday. What's been more impressive to you about the Cowboys? The offense, Greg, or the defense?
- [06:01]
Greg Cosell
I would think the defense, Colin, because look, as you know what the first five, six weeks people are laughing at their defense. And now, you know, they made those trades. Obviously they got Kenny Clark before the season, but the in season trades they have made been really impressive and the trio of D tackles is as good a trio as any in the league. And as you probably noticed three weeks ago, the rookie corner Revel from East Carolina started to play and then this past week on Thanksgiving, he played pretty much every snap. And now what they've done, and I think you'll continue to see this tonight, is now they've played Revel and Bridges who's got a lot of length on the outside, and, and they've moved Bland to the slot where he's better. Bland is not a very good outside corner, so now they moved him into the slot where he first really made his hay in the league and they're much better on the back end. But with what they've done up front, the return of overshown, the trading for Logan Wilson, suddenly this defense, well, it's not top five in the league, but it's a good enough defense to win games.
- [07:07]
Colin Cowherd
All right, so a game that's a little under the radar, although Josh Allen games are never truly under the radar. Bills play the Bengals and here's Joe Burrow. And my take is Cincinnati and Burrow are going to be the number one spoiler in the end. They may not make the playoffs. But what did you see with Burrows first start because the numbers tell me was pretty good.
- [07:30]
Greg Cosell
Yeah, Burrow's always been a guy. First of all, he's so good pre snap and then getting into the post snap operation phase, he's just one of those guys. He's like a computer chip. He just sees it, it's innate, it's in his dn and he's always been a guy. Now granted he's Got good receivers, we understand that. But he's always been a guy that understands the NFL that if it's one on one you've got to throw the football and that if that doesn't work, that means you don't need another quarterback. It means you need new receivers. But he's got receivers, so he's going to push it down the field. There'll be one on ones against these Bills corners and we'll see how that plays out on the other side. The Bills to me are one of the most fascinating studies on offense in this league. They've got the most physically gifted quarterback quarterback in the league. I don't know the reason why they choose not to throw the ball. Maybe they don't like their receivers, but with the most physically gifted quarterback in the league, they are not a passing team. They don't throw the ball down the field. In fact, they don't want to throw it a whole lot in terms of volume unless they're forced to. But that's not the way they choose to play. And I give Aaron Cromer their O line coach who's been doing this. You probably know Aaron, he's been doing this for 20, 20, 25 years. Absolutely one of the best in the league. Their run game is so good, it's so multiple. It's specific to the opponent. I mean, last week against the Steelers, Cook and Davis had 41 runs combined. Colin, they did not pull an offensive lineman one time. So it was all zone, it was all zone based. Yet we've seen them have that run game where they have the counter run game with Hawes and Gilliam, the fullback, and been successful through the year doing that. So they are very specific to the opponent in how they feel is the best way to attack. But this is a running football team and they only really rely on Josh.
- [09:20]
Colin Cowherd
Allen when they think they need to okay another game. It's basically the season for the Kansas City Chiefs, the Houston Texans. Let's start with Houston. So I prefer offensive coaches, but if you're going to go defense, go young. Mike McDonald, D', Amico Ryan's. I remember before D' Ameco got the job, people in the Niners organization were saying, we're never going to keep this guy. He's just too smart, he's too bright. Well, so I watch Houston's defense. It's the best in the league. Is it schemes? Is it coaching? Because they make every quarterback struggle. It's like they're playing with an extra man. What is it about their defense? Is it just better personnel or coaching?
- [09:58]
Greg Cosell
It's both because obviously if you look at their personnel, they're really good at all three levels. And based on my film study I would argue that Kaylen Bullock is the best post safety in the league this season in his second year in the league at a usc. Your probably very familiar with him being from usc. Really good football player, really good long, smart, good athlete. But obviously we know about Hunter and Anderson. They're really good inside too. No one talks about what they put out there on the inside at the D tackle position. But the one thing about d' Amico Ryan is he's very tactical so in specific situations he will bring pressure and they're very good with their concepts. Now, based on the rest of the league, they're not a high percentage of pressure defense, but they're very schematic and tactical with when they bring pressure and they're very, very good at it and they stunt and they've got guys who can stunt really good athletes. So this is a really difficult defense to play against. You and I are talking on a Thursday. I have no idea what the status is. We know Simmons, the left tackle went on ir. I don't know if Trey Smith, the guard's going to play. We don't know if Joanne Taylor is going to play. So imagine if you have all these backups on your offensive line and now you've got that defensive line that you've got to play against.
- [11:15]
Colin Cowherd
By the way, what is the identity of the Chiefs offense today? What is it?
- [11:21]
Greg Cosell
I would say it's Patrick Mahomes being special. And I'm not trying to be sarcastic. I think the more you watch and I watch, I think I've watched every Mahomes game in the league since he's been in the league. It almost seems to me watching his tape, Colin, that more and more he's become an improvisational stud as opposed to a pocket technician. Now that's not to say he's not capable of playing from the pocket. Of course he is. He's extremely gifted. But it seems the more I watch, the more it's become a case of him getting outside of play design, making incredible plays. That's what he did last week when he almost brought them back to victory, you know, against the Cowboys. It seems there's more and more of that now. He's so good at it that they can kind of survive, although obviously they're 6 and 6 this year. I think this is a game where he's going to move around a lot, but I don't think they have a true identity in the way I think you're using the word Raven Steelers.
- [12:16]
Colin Cowherd
I mean, it kind of feels. Again, it kind of. This is it for Pittsburgh. Is the Steelers offense broken?
- [12:27]
Greg Cosell
I'm not sure. Steelers and offense are two words that go together very much these days. They're a tough offense. I mean, you talk about, you know, identity. I don't know what they are other than the fact that they line up a lot with big people. They play with two tight ends, they play with three tight ends. I think they'd like to run the football, but that's been very up and down. You don't know from week to week if they're going to have any kind of sustaining run game. I'm not sure what the pass game is. They really don't work the middle of the field much at all, which is not a function of the quarterback. Aaron Rodgers can obviously still throw the football sometimes. I feel watching their tape that their number one receivers becoming Darnell Washington at 311 pounds. So it's, it's. I'm not sure what they are on offense and I don't know if right now I feel like watching their tape that you can hang your hat on anything and say, hey, this is what they bring to the table every single week.
- [13:23]
Colin Cowherd
I want to talk about a team that we've kind of forgotten about once they lost their tackles, but we've talked about the Chiefs so much. We've talked about Denver, that quietly, this defense with The Chargers, they're 8 and 4, they're at home. Absolutely. A live shot to beat Philadelphia. I don't even know how they run the ball with this offensive line. I have no idea. It's not good, right?
- [13:46]
Greg Cosell
Right.
- [13:47]
Colin Cowherd
But it's mostly been a defensive story with Jesse Minter.
- [13:50]
Greg Cosell
Yeah.
- [13:51]
Colin Cowherd
Again, I'll ask you the question I did with Houston. Is it coaching or scheme with the Chargers defense? It's number two or three in the league right now.
- [13:59]
Greg Cosell
Yeah, it's both. But I think one of the things that stands out when you watch their defense and they have a lot of players people may not be aware of, they don't know their names, they're not household names, but they've got a lot of pieces that can line up in different positions and they're very multi positional, multi dimensional. Look, we know about Derwin James. He's the name everybody knows. Not a lot of people probably know about Tarheeb. Still a corner who plays outside in their base, moves inside in their sub defenses. And by the way, is very in the dime, really, because they play nickel all the time. It's that big nickel with Derwin James. So in their dime, he plays inside and he's a major part of their pressure packages. Tui Polotu, he's a guy that plays both outside and inside. A really good player. I'm sure not a lot of people are aware of him. Diane Henley, really good linebacker. Another guy that lines up in multiple positions within their different defensive structures. So they have a lot of movable chess pieces within their defense. And Jesse Minter obviously is coaching really well because when you ask guys to have a lot of different responsibilities based on different personnel, that means you're teaching really, really well. Yeah.
- [15:09]
Colin Cowherd
I want to. I want to talk about Jackson Dart for a second. So I watch him juxtaposed with Drake May. Drake May does everything well. Drake May was a little reckless his first year. Spent a lot of time in the blue tent. He doesn't anymore. He cleaned it up.
- [15:22]
Matt Mosley
No.
- [15:22]
Colin Cowherd
I watched Jackson Dart and the Giants are so desperate at quarterback. They've been so bad for so many years. They're just clinging to anything that worked. They cling to Tommy DeVito. A couple years ago, I watched Jackson. I watched Jackson Dart and I think he's a bit of a splash player. He's memorable, he's confident. I. Is he a guy that can throw 42 times a game? What is the film say? Not the media, not the fan. What does the film say on Jackson Dart?
- [15:49]
Greg Cosell
Well, the first thing I want to say is we're not going to define his whole career about what we've seen this year. So I want people to understand that. So right now, Jackson Dart is a quarterback that is not seeing things as clearly as you need to. And when you're a quarterback that has mobility, Colin, and you don't see things as clearly as you need to on a consistent basis, what do you do? You run. And that's what he does. And he's very good at it, but he can't take the kind of hits we're looking at now. He spent almost every one of his games, maybe with just one or two exceptions, in the blue tent. And obviously he missed a couple of weeks due to being in the concussion protocol. So ideally, as he plays more, he starts to see things with more clarity, gets a better picture. Pre snap, that translates to post snap. He becomes more of a post snap operator and therefore can drop in the pocket, see it and throw the football because you can't play like this on a consistent basis. It's just, it's not sustainable. And he's not big, by the way, so it's not as if that he can, you know, the body handle all this. So we'll see how it plays out. But like I said, I'm not defining his whole career. He's a rookie on a team that's not very good. So he's. It's just how it's playing out this year.
- [17:04]
Colin Cowherd
Okay, another young guy, Shadour Sanders. I can't go through a segment second start. I, you know, again, what's the film say on Shador?
- [17:13]
Greg Cosell
Yeah, Shedeur was not very good this week. And I think the way I always look at it when I watch young guys, I feel the same way about Cam Ward and is they're still playing a little bit at a college speed. You have to get back in the pocket. You've got to see it. You've got to deliver the football. This week he didn't see things the way he needed to. He left a lot of throws on the field by not turning it loose. When the design of the route concept was clean, it was there. If he threw the ball this week when he should have, Jerry Jeudy would have had 175 receiving yards. And that doesn't even include that play, which was actually a second reaction adjustment play that we just saw. But for the most part this week, the processing just was a little slow. Now again, he needs more reps. This is not a condemnation or a referendum on his entire career and what it's going to be. Colin, he needs a lot of reps. He needs to play to the speed of the NFL game. And right now he's not doing that. And there's one thing that is very coachable, that he had this issue in college and it flared up again this week. He has a tendency when he moves to hold the ball with one hand. You cannot do that in the NFL. That can be coached and cleaned up.
- [18:24]
Colin Cowherd
Okay, the best game of the weekend, Bears, Packers. So let's start with the Bears. I love it. It's so old school. Ben Johnson. Ben Johnson would run it 55 times. I mean, it's. Is it now? First of all, when he got there, he went and got Drew Dalman and Joe Tunney and Jonah Jackson. So it's very clear what he wanted to do. Establish for a young quarterback a big time run game. Is that a beautiful thing to watch when you look at film?
- [18:49]
Greg Cosell
Well, this week it was beautiful. They ran outside zone as their predominant run against the Eagles. And the Eagles they played it the wrong way and they know that you can't play outside zone by playing laterally and just sliding down the line of scrimmage. There has to be some kind of vertical knockback. Now, you don't want to shoot gaps, but there has to be some kind of vertical knockback. And the Eagles didn't do that. You know, they've got the second best running game in the NFL and a lot of people probably aren't aware of that because all you want to talk about is Caleb Williams. That's what most people want to talk about. But their run game's been really solid. The menungay kid has been really good. He's a physical, sustaining, hard runner. And when you compare him and combine him with Swift, you've got a really nice run game. And the O Lion is playing really, really well. And what he does really well. It's almost the old Joe Gibbs philosophy, Colin, of using motion to change run support. Most people don't think of motion as being a factor in the run game, but. But Joe Gibbs did it, you know, years and years ago with the Redskins where you use motion and it dictates run support and changes it in your favor. And that's one thing that Ben Johnson has such a good feel for.
- [19:59]
Colin Cowherd
Okay, listen, I like Jordan Love. I had my questions out of Utah State, but I said if I didn't say his name and I just said there's a tall kid that's athletic with a big arm, takes risks and doesn't throw a lot of picks, everybody would go, oh, that's great. I think he's really talented. I think sometimes there's just, it looks to me like a franchise quarterback. Good arm moves, nice kid, coachable, can ad lib, can be on script or off. What is your favorite quality on film of the Packers? Young quarterback?
- [20:31]
Greg Cosell
I would say there's a comfort with which he plays, which is not an X and O point, but there's a comfort with which he plays. And I would say that what has really stood out this year and he's gotten better, better at is ball placement because they are phenomenal on third down. Colin, they're the best third down conversion offense in the league. And on third and seven plus, which for most teams is pretty much it's time to punt. They convert more than 43% on third and seven plus. That is remarkable. It's almost unheard of. But his ball location has gotten more consistent, more precise year after year. And you combine that with an aggressive mindset, which I believe is essential For a quarterback in this league, he's an aggressive mindset thrower. And now that he's more accurate, more precise with his ball location, he wins on third down. But again, you know, we've talked about coaching on the defensive side, coaching on the offensive side. I think it's a really good mix with Jordan Love and Matt LaFleur. We know Matt LaFleur likes to run the ball, but the other thing that stands out is they do some really good things in the red zone. You know, I'm not a believer in the red zone. I actually heard Ben Johnson talk about this. I'm not a believer in the red zone of just throwing it up and hoping your receiver catches the ball. I'm much more of a believer in schematics in the red zone. And we saw that last week and that's actually going to be the play we show because I think that that's so critical to being able to score touchdowns in the red zone and not just relying on guys going up and making a play, which is a maybe, yes, maybe, no deal. So this was last week against Detroit, and I actually love this play and it's really so simple. You know, sometimes the really cool things are so simple when you really look at them. So here's Love, he's in the gun. Now, what we're starting with here, we're going to start with a two by two formation, meaning that there's two receivers up top to the wide side of the field and there's two receivers to the boundary side of the formation. Now what's going to happen is the two key receivers here are Watson and Dobbs, and we'll see that as we continue with the play. Now Dobbs will go in motion and the corner will follow. Now, you're playing man down here if you're a defense, because there's not a lot of room. You're not playing zone, so you're playing man. So Dobbs is now stacked behind Watson, and the corners, they switched their matchup because of the motion. So, you know what you have now is the corner that was on Dobbs is now matched to Watson and Dobbs is on the outside. So this is really some very simple but very cool stuff. What you're going to see is Watson is going to angle his stem to the outside, okay? So they're going to do what we call a switch release. Watson's going to angle his stem outside and Dobbs is going to then angle his stem inside. But because the corners now have to switch due to this switch release, Concept what happens is Dobbs ends up running. Now his quick outcut against a corner that's inside of him because of everything they've done, the motion, the stack, the switch release. So what happens is he just has the leverage on him. So when he breaks to the outside, Colin, it becomes pitch and catch. It's just really beautiful stuff. It looks so easy, but you know, this is just so beautiful when you watch it. And to me this is what red zone, particularly low red zone offense, meaning 10 yards in, has to be about not just throwing it up to receivers, but this Packer offense. And you're right about Jordan Love. He definitely looks like a franchise quarterback. He's so physically talented and I think mentally he's getting better and better with each each week.
- [24:09]
Colin Cowherd
Yeah, great stuff. Greg Cosell 46 years NFL Films Thanks, Greg.
- [24:14]
Greg Cosell
Thanks Colin. Really appreciate it.
- [24:16]
Colin Cowherd
What's interesting to me folks about Jordan Love and you see this a lot. So he had a really good year in college the year before he came out and then the year he came out it wasn't as good a year because he lost coaches and a lot of people bailed on him. But you had to go back and look at the film from the previous year and it does show that we all know this. Bo Nix is benefiting from Sean Payton and Caleb Williams is benefiting from Ben Johnson. Well, that works in college as well. You know, like the, the when Sark was a college coordinator but he was good enough to be a coach at Texas. Yeah, it was nice having Lane Kiffin and Sark as coordinators when they're both excellent head coaches. So this coaching stuff matters. I the everybody in Green Bay, I hope you understand, you do understand that Green Bay is a well run operation. But I don't get the critics of Jordan Love. I think he's an incredibly special player. Arm movement, size. And again, this matters. Every time you put a mic in front of him says the right thing. I mean again, he never blows up a locker room. There's no passive aggressive. You can tell he cares about stuff beyond himself. It just again, that stuff matters for quarterback. I don't care about other position. Every time you talk to Jordan Love. And by the way, Caleb's gotten very good at this. Caleb Williams. Chicago's media is very aggressive. Jalen Hurts, hyper aggressive Philly media. Jalen hurts, brings the heat down. Caleb Williams, Jordan Love, it's so much a part of this is keep the thing the thing, don't inflame situations. But Jordan is really special. Good kid, one more herd the herd streams 24 hours a day, seven days.
- [26:01]
Matt Mosley
A week within the iHeartRadio app.
- [26:03]
Colin Cowherd
Search herd to listen live or on.
- [26:05]
Matt Mosley
Demand whenever you'd like.
- [26:08]
Colin Cowherd
Hey, it's Rob Parker and Kelvin Washington from the Odd Couple on Fox Sports Rad Radio.
- [26:12]
Greg Cosell
And in addition to hearing us live weeknights from 7 to 10pm Eastern on Fox Sports Radio, we are excited to announce brand new YouTube channel for the show.
- [26:22]
Colin Cowherd
That's right, you can now watch the Odd couple live on YouTube every day.
- [26:28]
Greg Cosell
All you got to do search Odd Couple FSR on YouTube again YouTube just.
- [26:32]
Colin Cowherd
Search Odd Couple FSR.
- [26:34]
Greg Cosell
Check us out on YouTube and subscribe.
- [26:38]
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- [28:54]
Colin Cowherd
As a quarterback, I love sports.
- [28:57]
Greg Cosell
But sometimes when I get hit on my blind side, front side and put on my back, I wonder is sport.
- [29:06]
Colin Cowherd
Clips better than sports?
- [29:08]
Greg Cosell
Because sport clips haircuts is sports on tv.
- [29:11]
Colin Cowherd
Plus a relaxing haircut, hot steam towel.
- [29:14]
Greg Cosell
And massaging shampoo which is better than sports plus sport clips.
- [29:20]
Colin Cowherd
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Greg Cosell
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Colin Cowherd
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- [29:56]
We just had a very polarizing political talk topic. If you did a fast food all star team, we've come to the conclusion, J. Mac, you'd have chick Fil, a spicy sandwich, McDonald's fries, the Wendy's smoothie, cane sauces.
- [30:12]
J. Mac
Oh, okay.
- [30:14]
Colin Cowherd
Frosty for my daughter.
- [30:15]
J. Mac
Got me into raising canes lately.
- [30:17]
Colin Cowherd
I never had it. This is great. The sauces are the best. And then we went back and forth.
- [30:25]
Best burger in and out.
- [30:28]
What?
- [30:29]
J. Mac
Listen, I don't want to get attacked in Los Angeles, but that's. That's way, way off, bro. Come on. Their patties are so small.
- [30:35]
Greg Cosell
How.
- [30:36]
J. Mac
How could that be the best burger when the patties thin?
- [30:38]
Sophie Cunningham
No way.
- [30:39]
J. Mac
I would go five guys.
- [30:41]
Colin Cowherd
Not. Not a bad call. Yeah, yeah. That's the kind of stuff we discuss.
- [30:46]
J. Mac
Discuss during the break I'm here grinding away on gambling lines. You're talking about hamburgers and fries. Okay, I see how you roll.
- [30:53]
Colin Cowherd
Nobody beats the golden arches for fries.
- [30:56]
J. Mac
Oh, nobody.
- [30:57]
Colin Cowherd
I stopped by their on a regular basis in the summer when I need salt, I just stop by and get a mat and just eat them in the car, drive around. It's great. Yeah, J. Mac with the news.
- [31:07]
Greg Cosell
No, no, no. Turn on the news.
- [31:09]
J. Mac
This is the herd line news. When I need salt, I like that line. I'm gonna start using that. Let's get started with Penn State Colin, not great. Not great at all. James Franklin was fired six weeks ago and they still don't have a hire. Here's where it gets dicey. There are reports that claim they've lost over 20 recruits from their recruiting class. James Franklin went to Virginia Tech. Eleven of those recruits followed him there to the Hokies. Currently they only have two players committed to the class. No coach.
- [31:38]
Colin Cowherd
Well, I don't like firing coaches midseason. I didn't like firing James Franklin. This is not about being right. But I. They were 13 and 3 or something like that last year. He had a. He had a bad stretch. Go ahead and criticize him. But you know what? He got the last laugh because Penn State in the nil era, you can overcome a disastrous recruiting class. But it. It's not good when Ohio State now is the best program in the country. Oregon, USC just finished with the number one class. So it's a bad, bad look and it's a cautionary tale. Be very even in the NFL. I don't like firing mid season. Like, I like what Miami did. Our GM's not the right guy. We're going to let two in Mike McDaniel play out. And I think Mike's a really smart guy and a good offensive coach. You start firing coaches, all of a sudden the assistant comes in. One wins a couple games and everybody wants the assistant. You really think the assistant at Ole Miss is going to be as good as Lane Kiffin? Like, be very, very careful about this stuff.
- [32:36]
J. Mac
It's. It's a tough one. I'll just say this. Penn State could turn it around easily. And yesterday Klatt made a good point. Maybe they're fishing after somebody who's still playing.
- [32:45]
Colin Cowherd
I think that has to be the.
- [32:46]
J. Mac
I don't think it's Kalin DeBoer. I tried to do my homework on that. It seems like I just don't. Would be an unbelievable hire.
- [32:53]
Colin Cowherd
Brian D. Open up the piggy bank.
- [32:56]
J. Mac
I think you, Brian D. Will be a home run. Now listen, this Mike Tomlin stuff feels like nonsense, but Mike Tomlin would crush it at Penn State if he wanted to go that route.
- [33:05]
Colin Cowherd
By the way, I know that Ole Miss Lane left Ole Miss. So I don't want to lump that in there, but my take is everybody, you know, it just. You got to be careful it. And for the record, the reason guys like Lane left Tennessee after one year and everybody freaked out is because these programs, they have no mercy when they want to get rid of you. Well, guess what? Sometimes the coach is going to get rid of you. And so when you see Lane Kiffin leaving early, Lane's theory, I believe has always been, I've been watching my colleagues and peers get fired in season, get dumped after decent seasons forever. I'm going to dictate terms. So James Franklin, basically, when they, when you fire a guy like that, you are telling every good coach they'll can you after a three game losing streak, be very careful.
- [33:52]
J. Mac
No loyalty. There's no loyalty out there. I mean, I'm loyal to you, but there's not loyalty anywhere else. All right, let's move on to Ben Johnson. Colin, listen, I know he's your guy. We got to talk about them every show. But this week is a tough one. They got Matt LaFleur and Jordan Love. There was some smack talk in the off season. Jordan Love said he heard the noise, that Ben Johnson was barking, but he's not listening.
- [34:16]
Greg Cosell
Not worried about those things that are said.
- [34:19]
Colin Cowherd
You know, it's another game.
- [34:20]
Greg Cosell
Obviously, you know, the Bears match up. We're always trying to win that game. They're number one in the nfc, so obviously we haven't played them yet. The only team in the NFC north we haven't seen. So. And you know, two, two games in three weeks. So it'll be a great matchup. You know, they're a good team and like we've always said, you know, it's that one and O mentality. Just handle business this week.
- [34:40]
J. Mac
All business for Jordan Love. You see that? No smiles, no joke.
- [34:43]
Colin Cowherd
My kind of guy.
- [34:44]
Greg Cosell
Yep.
- [34:45]
Colin Cowherd
No silliness.
- [34:47]
J. Mac
You flip flop on that yet or you. You going packers or Bears?
- [34:50]
Colin Cowherd
Just gonna. I'm gonna watch the game with great interest.
- [34:53]
J. Mac
Oh, wow. It's not blazing five. Oh, man, that's disappointing.
- [34:58]
Colin Cowherd
You're okay. It's Thursday.
- [35:01]
Greg Cosell
Early Thursday.
- [35:02]
J. Mac
A little chicken, huh? Huh? All right, final story. Colin, let's go to man Mike Tomlin. So yesterday, Ben Roethlisberger. Okay, yeah. Had his chime in on Mike Tomlin. Said it should be over. Well, today it's five time Pro Bowler. James Harrison, you remember James Harrison, obviously spent 10 years with Tomlin. Now he's been a critic of his former coach. And here's Harrison going off on the Steelers after that disaster against the Bills.
- [35:30]
Greg Cosell
I have never been a person that thought Coach Tomlin was a great coach. I thought he was a good coach. A good coach gets you to play to your potential.
- [35:45]
Colin Cowherd
Okay, well, I think Tomlin is a good coach. I think Timeout.
- [35:50]
Greg Cosell
Good coach.
- [35:51]
J. Mac
He's a Hall of Fame coach.
- [35:52]
Colin Cowherd
Locked.
- [35:52]
J. Mac
Correct.
- [35:54]
Colin Cowherd
No I wouldn't say that.
- [35:57]
Sponsor/Ad Voice
What?
- [35:57]
J. Mac
Tom is not a Hall of Famer.
- [35:59]
Colin Cowherd
He hasn't won a playoff game in eight years.
- [36:01]
J. Mac
Okay, well, he had a career before that. I'm just saying recently. And he's also young. He's got a long way to go.
- [36:06]
Colin Cowherd
First of all, not that many coaches make the hall of Fame. There's really good coaches. Not in the hall of Fame. Look it up.
- [36:12]
J. Mac
That would be a star. I think Tomlins. I mean, he's unbelievable. He's had a rough stretch.
- [36:18]
Colin Cowherd
What do you mean? Is Mike Shanahan in the hall of Fame as a coach?
- [36:23]
J. Mac
I. I don't.
- [36:24]
Colin Cowherd
Is he. He's not.
- [36:26]
Matt Mosley
It's just weird.
- [36:27]
J. Mac
Everybody's slandering Tomlin. Now Ben Roethlisberger.
- [36:29]
Colin Cowherd
Slandering.
- [36:30]
J. Mac
He has Ben Roethlisberger. It's over. James Harrison, he's not a great coach.
- [36:33]
Colin Cowherd
Mack, if I go eight years and.
- [36:37]
Compete in certain levels in any business. Eight years without a playoff win, not one. In fact, it's nine years since he went to the playoffs and won a game and scored a touchdown. Like, Greg Cosell came on the air 20 minutes ago. I asked him about the Steelers offense. He's like, yeah, I don't know. Now, this is a guy that's an expert watching film. He's like, I don't even know what I'm watching.
- [37:00]
J. Mac
Is that Tomlin or is that Arthur Smith, the offensive guy?
- [37:03]
Colin Cowherd
Roger, the president of Fox Sports, eventually, if somebody watched our broadcast and said, I don't know what they're doing, well, it's not my responsibility. Right? I got to. I have to do my show. If a team. If you talk about a team and you say to yourself, yeah, I don't even know what I'm watching. Eventually a head coach, a Jimmy Johnson, a Sean Payton, Andy Reid is responsible for the defense. He hires a coordinator, but he has to be responsible for the day to day play and execution and production of all his entire special teams, offense, defense. Mike Shanahan's not a Hall of Famer. I mean, didn't make the cut for 2026. Got a couple Super Bowls. His son's a great coach. Shanahan basically helped create a run system that has still, today is the most copied run system in the league. So this idea that coaches just, hey, they made a couple Super Bowls. Hey, not a lot of coaches make the hall of Fame.
- [38:02]
J. Mac
So, you know, this roster is not great. Tomlin ain't the gm. They tried to draft a quarterback, Kenny Pickett. That was a flop. So then they went For Aaron Rodgers. Disaster. All this is on Tomlin. What about the gm? Is the GM catching no heat. Nobody for trading Pickens.
- [38:17]
Colin Cowherd
Nobody's saying it's all on him. But the highest paid guy in the building is quarterback. You know who the second highest paid guy is oftentimes either. A pass rusher, A head coach. Coach. You're the boss. Yeah, you know, you're. You're. You know.
- [38:28]
J. Mac
So. So usually the boss has to fire lieutenants before he gets.
- [38:31]
Colin Cowherd
How many ocs are we going to go through? How many running backs, receivers, quarterbacks?
- [38:38]
Sophie Cunningham
Okay.
- [38:38]
Greg Cosell
All right. So.
- [38:38]
Sponsor/Ad Voice
So you're ready?
- [38:39]
J. Mac
You're done with Tomlin?
- [38:40]
Sophie Cunningham
It's over.
- [38:40]
Colin Cowherd
I think he'd get hired in a heartbeat. Somewhere else. I would defend him getting hired and, you know, wherever. Miami.
- [38:48]
J. Mac
Maybe it just got stale in Pittsburgh.
- [38:50]
Colin Cowherd
That's right. But the first of all, you know, I mean, I. I just. I'm watching the same team for seven years.
- [38:57]
J. Mac
All I know is Colin, you want to run him out, that's fine. I need a plan. I need a concrete plan. Because you're seeing what's happened at Penn State. Can you imagine if that happened to the Steelers? In the NFL? One of the blue bloods.
- [39:07]
Colin Cowherd
Not going to happen in the NFL. Your calendar is different.
- [39:10]
J. Mac
Well, I'm just saying. No, I mean, you. You better have a plan to hire a coach. You go from Mike Tomlin to. I. I don't know. What are you going to get?
- [39:17]
Colin Cowherd
Ryan Dable.
- [39:20]
Might be good with it. We could hire.
- [39:21]
J. Mac
I don't think he's going to want to work with Aaron Rodgers, that's for sure.
- [39:24]
Colin Cowherd
Well, Aaron's done, you know, he's not going to work with Aaron.
- [39:26]
J. Mac
So Dable's going there with no quarterback. I'd go to Penn State.
- [39:29]
Colin Cowherd
Good. Good. Quarterback draft. You want a playoff game with Daniel Jones? You'd be just fine.
- [39:33]
J. Mac
Boy, JNC Consulting's falling apart here. I don't know. Chapter nine? You know, we might have to. Chapter 11, whatever it's called.
- [39:41]
Colin Cowherd
Yeah, J. Mac with the news.
- [39:43]
Apollo Representative
Well, that's the news and thanks for.
- [39:45]
Colin Cowherd
Stopping by the Herd LIE news. Be sure to catch live editions of the Herd, weekdays at noon Eastern, 9am Pacific on Fox Sports Radio, FS1 and the iHeartRadio app.
- [39:57]
Sponsor/Ad Voice
Support for the show comes from Public, the investing platform for those who take it seriously. On Public, you can build a multi asset portfolio of stocks, bonds, options, crypto and now generated assets which allow you to turn any idea into an investable index. With AI, it all starts with your prompt. From renewable energy companies with high free cash flow to semiconductor suppliers, growing revenue over 20% year over year. You can literally type any prompt and put the AI to work. It screens thousands of stocks, builds a one of a kind index and lets you back test it against the S&P 500. Then you can invest in a few clicks. Generated assets are like EFTs with infinite possibilities, completely customizable and based on your thesis, not someone else's. Go to public.com podcast and earn an uncapped 1% bonus when you transfer your portfolio. That's public.com podcast paid for by Public Investing Brokerage Services by Open to the Public Investing Inc. Member FINRA SIPC Advisory Services by Public Advisors llc SEC Registered Advisor Generated Assets is an interactive analysis tool. Output is for informational purposes only and is not investment recommendation or advice. Complete disclosures available at public.com disclosures this.
- [41:06]
Sophie Cunningham
Is Sophie Cunningham from Show Me Something. Do you know the symptoms of moderate to severe obstructive sleep apnea, or OSA in adults with obesity? They may be happening to you without you knowing. If anyone has ever said you snore loudly, or if you spend your days fighting off excessive tiredness, irritability and concentration issues, it may be due to osa. OSA is a serious condition where your airway partially or completely collapses during sleep, which may cause breathing interruptions and oxygen deprivation. Learn more at don'tsleep on OSA.com this information is provided by Lilly, a medicine.
- [41:44]
Apollo Representative
Company tired of juggling sales tools or spending hours on prospecting just to book a few meetings? Meet Apollo, the Go to Market platform for finding leads, connecting with buyers and closing deals all in one place. Apollo gives you access to over 210 million contacts and AI that handles all your busywork, finding leads, drafting emails and even prioritizing your day. So stop paying for five different sales tools when one does it all. Visit Apollo I.O. and sign up free today.
- [42:13]
Sophie Cunningham
Run a business and not thinking about radio? Think again because more people are listening to the radio and iheart today than.
- [42:20]
Greg Cosell
They were 20 years ago.
- [42:22]
Sophie Cunningham
And only IHEART broadcast radio connects with more Americans than tv, digital, social, any other media, even twice as many teens than TikTok. And that reach means everything. Just think about the universal marketing formula. The number of consumers who hear your message times the response rate equals the results Now. Let's get those results growing for your business. Radio's here now more than ever and iheart's leading the way. Think radio can help your business. Think iHeart, streaming, podcasting and radio, where.
- [42:54]
Colin Cowherd
The reach is real.
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Sophie Cunningham
Let us show you@iheartadvertising.com that's iheartadvertising.com or call 844-844. Iheart one more time. Just call 844-844-Iheart and get radio working for you.
- [43:14]
Greg Cosell
Hey, what's up, everybody?
- [43:15]
Colin Cowherd
Daniel Jeremiah here, and I'm Bucky Brooks. If you love breaking down football from every angle, you're in the right place. Every week on Move the six, Bucky Brooks and I dive deep into the game, from the X's and O's to the front office move moves shaping the league.
- [43:29]
Greg Cosell
We kick things off with Brian Binger breaking down what really went down on Sunday. It is as good a timing, rhythm.
- [43:35]
Colin Cowherd
Offense as there is in the league right now. Then Rhett Lewis joins us for our rookie draft and coordinator of the week, where we highlight the rising stars and the masterminds calling the shots. DJ talked me into a Ronde Gadsden Jr.
- [43:48]
Matt Mosley
He had a monster game.
- [43:49]
Colin Cowherd
Monster.
- [43:50]
Matt Mosley
A monster game.
- [43:51]
Greg Cosell
And you hear from the voices who.
- [43:52]
Matt Mosley
Actually build the game game.
- [43:54]
Greg Cosell
GMs, coaches, and players who give you insight you won't get anywhere else.
- [43:58]
Colin Cowherd
High standards and high care. That's the right combination. So whether you're studying tape or just love great football talk, subscribe to Move the sticks on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.
- [44:14]
Well, he is the host of the Doomsday Podcast, a cowboy. Dallas Cowboy podcast. Cowboys play it tonight cover in the NFL for 24 years. He's a friend. Matt Mosley is joining us, and he's joining us live. Good days in Dallas. It is amazing. Between the George Pickens deal, the Quinn and Williams move, the Micah trade, suddenly the whole world owes Jerry Jones an apology. You cover him. I see you whenever there's games and Jerry's talking, I, I see Matt Mosley, the intrepid journalist, covering him as Jerry. Jerry's on a street. He is hot. Is he soaking in it right now?
- [44:51]
Matt Mosley
He very much is. And, and usually when you see me, it's this, right? That's what I'm kind of behind him. I like, that's my preferred state. Your producers, you know, want me to go ahead and take these off, so I do that to honor them. But, yeah, Jerry is feeling great about things, and, boy, he is now openly talking about the playoffs. And it's, it's been an amazing run for him. And I think this Quinn and Williams thing, you know, it's amazing that Micah is having the kind of season he is and if the Cowboys had continued down the path they were going, that would be the overriding story. Look at this guy blowing up. He's incredible. And yet nobody in conversation around the Cowboys is saying anything about Micah because of the trades that Jerry has made. And I heard y' all talking about Mike Tomlin earlier year and. And whether he's hall of Fame worthy and all of that, but, boy, Jerry put one on the Steelers is what it appears. And that's now looking like one of the better trades of the past five years. Yeah. Who knows what Pickens will be able to do but Jordan. But Pickens is, like, literally stepped in across from CD Lamb, one of the great receivers in the NFL. And Pickens is, at least this season, clearly the best receiver on the team. And he's rehabbed whatever image issues he had. And now that's what Jerry has to do, is find a way to resign this guy.
- [46:14]
Greg Cosell
Yeah.
- [46:14]
Colin Cowherd
Hey, listen, nobody thought Brian Schottenheimer was a strong hire. How do you explain his success? Because I'm on the group that thought you. Nobody else was after him. What do you think the secret sauce has been with Schottenheimer? Dax playing better than he's ever played?
- [46:29]
Matt Mosley
No. Each day he wakes up and he plays that one and done clip that you were saying just to motivate himself. Look at him striding out there. He. You know, he's. He's way better with the media than Mike. That doesn't totally matter if you're not winning or losing. But, boy, when they got on that streak and the Marshawn Nealon tragedy, the way he handled that. I watched Jason Garrett handle a tragedy one time, and that was one of Garrett's finest moments. Yeah, this was an unbelievable moment for Schottenheimer because it showed his leadership. Dak was a great leader, too, but Schottenheimer kind of drove everything. He's handled it beautifully. And watch out for a team that seems to be playing for something bigger than itself. Yeah. And I think some of that's going on with these Dallas Cowboys right now. In trying to honor their fallen teammate.
- [47:23]
Colin Cowherd
You and I have both said Dak Prescott's iq, eq, toughness, resilience, intangibles have always been a plus plus right out of Mississippi State. I always thought he had an average arm. You know, I loved all the leadership. I didn't know how talented he was.
- [47:42]
I think he's having the best season I've ever seen. I. There's something. I don't know what it is. Me. I don't know what the stats say? What do you make of what we're watching?
- [47:52]
Matt Mosley
I see a marriage between a new head coach we were just talking about and this player that has taken off. And I feel like they feed off each other. He relates better to him, and I think that was already the case even when McCarthy was still here. So I think that's playing a role, and I just think he just feels. And again, you have an incredible duo. I thought it was great that Pickens took off when CD was out and Pickens proved that he could kind of do it on his own. I think that also, you know, when he has a relationship with a tight end, that. With Ferguson, that's been a beautiful thing. But I think he's just. I mean, the maturity is there. It's always been there. But the play and how comfortable he is and also just the maturity of. Even when they get down now, they can't do that tonight.
- [48:42]
Colin Cowherd
They need to.
- [48:43]
Matt Mosley
They need to not get off to one of those poor starts. But even when they were down to the Eagles, even when they were down 21, nothing.
- [48:50]
Greg Cosell
The.
- [48:50]
Matt Mosley
The team responds to him. He rallies the team, and he's just in a. He's in a great place. And in December, by the way, 21 and 8 with about a 97 QBR in his career, we think, because the Cowboys are bad in the playoffs, right? That, oh, man, he's not good at this time of year. He's actually really good in December. And I hear people saying, boy, this is a playoff game tonight. Now, I don't know if that's good for the Cowboys. The Cowboys should play that part of it down. But the Cowboys have been in desperation mode going back three or four weeks now, and they seem to be performing really well in that mode. And if they win tonight, then we can have a serious discussion about the playoffs, because it goes up there around, oh, like, 41 to 45%, according to all the. All the simulations.
- [49:40]
Colin Cowherd
Okay, I got a minute left. Texas Longhorns probably don't make the playoff. You think they'll alter their schedule and start calling up weaker teams? Or is that kind of a threat that Texas is big and they'll keep scheduling big teams?
- [49:57]
Matt Mosley
Well, they got to play these things out, and that'll last through, like, 20, 27. They'll honor those contracts. But you're already seeing teams start to pull out of these games moving forward. So I think they will respond to that. That, you know, I would just say, before we get too caught up in all of that, maybe don't go to ot. I mean, they, they had a kind of a miracle to come back and beat Mississippi State. Is that a good Mississippi State team? It's not Kentucky. They had, they had to come back and they had to pull that one out in overtime. So give them credit for pulling the games out, but I would say they played pretty poorly in about half their games this year.
- [50:39]
Sponsor/Ad Voice
Year.
- [50:40]
Matt Mosley
So this is not a year some incredible Longhorn team is getting left on the sideline. I They've had some great wins. They've had some great wins and one of the and they do well in rivalry games. Give them that. I mean, they put down the great Aggies. Yeah, and they had the other one against Oklahoma. But this is not one of the great Longhorn teams of all time.
- [51:03]
Colin Cowherd
Love youe Honesty. Matt Mosley, Cowboy Insider Listen to the Doomsday Podcast all right buddy, you can put the glasses back on. I certainly appreciate that. I know your future so bright you got to wear those shades the way it is with Matt Moseley. Coming up next hour, Bruce Feldman not in a good mood with the state of college football, it's the herd.
- [51:25]
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- [51:58]
Sponsor/Ad Voice
Support for the show comes from Public, the investing platform for those who take it seriously. On Public, you can build a multi asset portfolio of stock, stocks, bonds, options, crypto and now generated assets which allow you to turn any idea into an investable index. With AI, it all starts with your prompt. From renewable energy companies with high free cash flow to semiconductor suppliers growing revenue over 20% year over year, you can literally type any prompt and put the AI to work. It screens thousands of stocks, builds a one of a kind index and lets you back test it against the S&P 500. Then you can invest in a few clicks. Generated assets are like EFTs with infinite possibilities, completely customizable and based on your thesis, not someone else's. Go to public.com podcast and earn an uncapped 1% bonus when you transfer your portfolio. That's public.com podcast paid for by Public Investing Brokerage Services by Open to the Public Investing Inc. Member finra, SIPC Advisory Services by Public Advisors, llc, SEC Registered Advisor Generated Assets is an interactive analysis tool. Output is for informational purposes only and is not investment recommendation or advice. Complete Discussion disclosures available at public.com disclosures.
- [53:08]
Sophie Cunningham
This is Sophie Cunningham from Show Me Something do you know the symptoms of moderate to severe obstructive sleep apnea, or OSA in adults with obesity? They may be happening to you without you knowing. If anyone has ever said you snored loudly, or if you spend your days fighting off excessive tiredness, irritability and concentration issues, it may be due to osa. OSA is a serious condition where your airway partially or completely collapses during sleep, which may cause breathing interruptions and oxygen deprivation. Learn more at don'tsleep on OSA.com this information is provided by Lilly, a medicine.
- [53:45]
Apollo Representative
Company Tired of juggling sales tools or spending hours on prospecting just to book a few meetings? Meet Apollo, the go to market platform for finding leads, connecting with buyers and closing deals all in one place. Apollo gives you access to over 210 million contacts and AI that handles all your busywork, finding leads, drafting emails and even prioritizing your day. So stop paying for five different sales tools when one does it all. Visit Apollo I.O. and sign up free today.
- [54:15]
Colin Cowherd
This is Jim.
- [54:16]
Matt Mosley
Hello.
- [54:16]
Colin Cowherd
Jim started advertising with iHeartRadio way back in April and now I have customers out the door. And this is Sarah. Hi. She started putting a portion of her marketing dollars in podcasting back. Business is booming.
- [54:29]
Sophie Cunningham
That's why I'm working on a Saturday.
- [54:32]
Colin Cowherd
Want to be like Jim and Sarah? It's easy.
- [54:34]
Greg Cosell
All you have to do is own or manage a business and reach out to iHeart.
- [54:38]
Colin Cowherd
Get started today at 844-844-IHeart or iheartadvertising.com.
- [54:45]
Sophie Cunningham
This is an iHeart podcast.
- [54:47]
Greg Cosell
Guaranteed human.