THE HERD - Hour 3 - Rich Ohrnberger, Cardale Jones

Summary

The Herd with Colin Cowherd (Hosted by Jason McIntyre & Rachel Nichols)

Hour 3: Rich Ohrnberger, Cardale Jones
Date: August 29, 2025

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Episode Overview

This dramatic, news-packed hour centers on the seismic trade of Micah Parsons from the Dallas Cowboys to the Green Bay Packers—a move described as "league-shifting" and likened to the biggest NFL transactions of the past decade. Jason McIntyre and Rachel Nichols break down the impact on both franchises, debate Jerry Jones’ management, and examine broader implications for the NFC hierarchy. The episode also features in-depth guest appearances by former NFL lineman Rich Ohrnberger and legendary Ohio State quarterback Cardale Jones, discussing the trade and previewing a marquee Ohio State vs. Texas college football clash (with a focus on new Texas QB Arch Manning).

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Main Discussion Themes

1. The Shocking Micah Parsons Trade (02:47–15:24, 20:33–30:51, 38:09–40:20)

• Overview:
  The Packers make an uncharacteristic blockbuster trade, prying away All-Pro pass rusher Micah Parsons from the Cowboys. The move immediately changes the Super Bowl landscape and sets off heated debate about Dallas’s front-office logic and the Packers’ Super Bowl hopes.

• Packers' Perspective:

  • Jason McIntyre lauds the Packers for capitalizing on their window:

    “This puts them in serious Super Bowl consideration. I had them in my Tier Two for contenders earlier this week. They clearly vault to one.” (03:27)

  • Calls it a “seismic” move, bigger than recent trades involving Matthew Stafford, Christian McCaffrey, and Khalil Mack, noting Parsons’ youth and All-Pro production.
  • Emphasizes the shift in organizational philosophy—first-round WR pick in Matthew Golden showing willingness to break from tradition.

• Cowboys' Perspective:

  • Jason argues Jerry Jones was “emotional” and mishandled the situation:

    “Amateurs act on emotion. Pros look at the numbers, and the numbers said, Jerry, you bungled this badly.” (08:25)

  • Dallas loses leverage by waiting too long; the return is underwhelming compared to historic trades.
  • Critiques Jones’ justification for the trade and highlights a disconnect between his statements ("we need to stop the run") and Dallas’s recent draft picks.

• National and League Impact:

  • Rachel Nichols and Jason dissect likely playoff matchups, notably a potential Packers–49ers NFC Championship featuring Parsons vs. Trent Williams.
  • The deal shifts Green Bay’s Super Bowl odds from +2200 to +1200 overnight.

• Notable Quotes:

  • Jason McIntyre:

    “Micah Parsons is already on track to be a first-ballot Hall of Famer after four seasons. He’s in the discussion with the likes of Lawrence Taylor, Reggie White, Myles Garrett.” (04:27)

  • On Jerry Jones’ spin:

    “If I was allowed to use expletives, I would have come out of that quote and said, ‘What the [blank] are you talking about?’” (10:32)

  • Producer’s joke:

    “If Jerry Jones wore his shirt inside out...would anybody in Dallas have the cojones to tell him?...Feels like nobody is telling Jerry what he needs to hear.” (12:55)

  • Rachel Nichols, on Parsons:

    “It was those little things that I think were frustrating...” (15:24, referencing voluntary activities and off-field behavior)

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2. Guest Reactions & Deeper Analysis

Rich Ohrnberger (Former NFL Lineman, PSU alum)

(20:33–32:45)

• Shock and Context:

  • “I was shocked like everybody else. I thought Jerry would come to his senses...” (21:28)
  • Highlights the rarity: only 1 of 29 first-round Pro Bowlers in the modern era left their team before a fifth season—and that's Parsons.

• Trade Impact:

  • “It’s not just franchise-shifting for Packers and Cowboys, but it’s league-shifting. …This takes the Packers to a different level … and plummets the Cowboys’ already paltry chances.” (22:39)
  • Suggests something personal, not just business, led to the move:

    “It felt like this went beyond business for some reason.” (23:38)

• On Parsons’ Character:

  • “From a character standpoint, I haven’t heard anything negative about Micah Parsons... all you see is his leadership.” (24:40)
  • Discusses possible locker room protection, but says nothing truly disruptive was ever public.

Cardale Jones (Legendary Ohio State QB)

(44:27–52:47)

• Initial Reaction:
  • “Another example that Jerry Jones needs to get out of his own way. …I don’t know how you away such a dominant pass rusher…who’s continued to get better each and every year.” (45:01)

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3. College Football Preview — Ohio State vs. Texas (w/ focus on Arch Manning)

(28:12–30:51, 44:51–52:35)

• James Franklin Discussion (Penn State Coach):

  • Ohrnberger reflects on Franklin’s struggles vs. elite competition:

    “You can say one thing and also live in reality...where he is 1-16 against top-5 opponents. That does hurt...” (28:48)

  • Acknowledges Franklin’s need to adapt and evolve; believes this could be the year for a breakthrough.

• Ohio State–Texas Game Preview (w/Cardale Jones):

  • Hype around Arch Manning as Texas' new starter. Cardale’s take:

    “I’m never jumping on anyone’s hype machine unless I can see it consistently for at least two years. …If he was this good, why didn’t he start last year?” (47:30)

  • On whether Arch will be rattled:

    “I wouldn’t say rattled, but this is an environment he’s never played in before...now you’re the guy.” (46:24)

  • Keys to the game:
    • Both teams have new offensive linemen; the real battle will be in the trenches.
    • Emphasizes OSU’s depth at skill positions beyond Jeremiah Smith.
  • Good-natured trash talk after Texas legend Colt McCoy picks Texas by 10:

    “I’m letting you know right now, ain’t no way in heck Texas leaving Columbus, Ohio victorious.” (51:14)

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4. NFL Player Rankings & QB Debate

(33:00–35:45)

• Jalen Hurts’ Top 100 Placement:
  • Rachel Nichols presents debate over Hurts’ ranking (#19), calls criticism “disrespectful.”
  • Jason McIntyre counters that volume stats don’t account for context like game flow and roster strengths.
  • Rachel: “If you were asking someone to win you a Super Bowl, and he went out and won a Super Bowl, what else do you want?”

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5. Washington Commanders Outlook

(35:45–38:09)

• Optimism on offense, skepticism on defense:
  • Rachel: “My rule is the Fight Club rule. What’s the first rule of being a Commander fan? We don’t talk about the defense.”
  • Jason: Puts Washington on the NFC’s second tier with the Lions, Rams, Bucs, and Falcons.
  • Both reminisce on Washington’s storied past; Rachel: “We’re back, baby. Kind of. Maybe not defensively.”

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• Jason McIntyre (on trade):

  “It’s not hyperbole to say Micah Parsons is already on track to be a first-ballot Hall of Famer after four seasons.” (04:27)

• Jason McIntyre (on Jerry Jones):

  “Did Jerry just totally misplay his hand here? Well, yeah, clearly he bungled this so badly.” (09:19)

• Producer anecdote:

  “If Jerry Jones wore his shirt inside out…would anybody…tell him?” (12:55)

• Rachel Nichols (on Commanders):

  “My rule is the Fight Club rule…we don’t talk about the defense.” (36:47)

• Rich Ohrnberger (on trade’s impact):

  “It’s league-shifting…this really was a poor move by the Cowboys and it was a head-scratching move for Jerry Jones.” (22:39)

• Cardale Jones (on Arch Manning hype):

  “Let this guy grow into that player that we all hope him to be. Not just self-proclaiming and putting that crown on his head already.” (47:30)

• Cardale Jones (in response to Colt McCoy’s trash talk):

  “Ain’t no way in heck Texas leaving Columbus, Ohio victorious.” (51:14)

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Key Timestamps

• 02:47 — Start of Micah Parsons trade breakdown
• 14:39 — Rachel Nichols on Parsons’ character and locker room anecdotes
• 20:33 — Rich Ohrnberger joins, discusses shock and NFL historical context
• 28:12 — Penn State and James Franklin debate
• 30:51 — College football QB preview: Arch Manning at Ohio State
• 33:00 — Jalen Hurts ranking debate
• 35:45 — Washington Commanders analysis & NFC Outlook
• 38:09 — Revisiting historical NFL trades vs. the Parsons deal
• 44:27 — Cardale Jones joins: NFL and NCAA insights, predictions, and rivalry banter
• 51:03 — Colt McCoy’s “Texas by 10” tease; Cardale’s response

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Tone & Style

• Opinionated and energetic sports talk, with playful banter and strong stances (especially from Jason and Rachel).
• “Insider” perspectives with both criticism and praise for key NFL figures.
• Candid and sometimes sarcastic in addressing front-office failings and player hype.
• Engaged debates that invite both expert voices and personal anecdotes (family, youth sports, and alma mater pride).

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For Listeners Who Missed the Episode

This episode delivers a gripping breakdown of one of the NFL's biggest trades in years and its wide-reaching impact. The passionate hosting duo lay out why Green Bay’s championship window now looks wide open and Dallas’s future outlook is in question. Rich Ohrnberger and Cardale Jones add depth: Rich with league context and behind-the-scenes perspective, Cardale with blunt assessments of player hype and college football’s week-one blockbuster. Throughout, the panel delivers strong opinions, sharp football insight, and enough playful trash talk to fuel your weekend debates.

Transcript

[Jason McIntyre]

This is an iHeart podcast.

[Buzz Knight]

Hi, I'm Buzz Knight, the host of the Taking a Walk podcast, and join me for an upcoming episode with Seth MacFarlane, the creator of Family Guy, talking about his new Frank Sinatra music project.

[Music Podcast Host (unnamed, associated with Sinatra project)]

Anyone who loves music would salivate over something like this. The biggest question for us was what's in these boxes? Really, the most thrilling part was hiring an orchestra and just playing what was in these boxes.

[Buzz Knight]

Listen to Taking a walk on the iHeartRadio app, Apple PODC, or wherever you get your podcasts.

[Katie Couric]

Hey everyone, it's me, Katie Couric. Did you know that I recently joined Substack? Very exciting. It's where I'll be sharing my unfiltered conversations with the people everyone's talking about. I'll also tell you what I'm reading, what I'm watching, what's making me crazy, and what's giving me hope. If you like deep dives, hot takes, and real talk, you're in the right place. Search Katie Couric on Substack and hit subscribe. I'll be there, reporting live, most likely in my pajamas. See you there.

[Jake Hofer]

I'm Jake Hofer and this is back 40, a limited series show on Wire to Hunt, part of Meat Eaters Podcast Network. Each episode I'll be asking eight whitetail hunting pros a focused, thought provoking question about hunting and land management. How do I hunt the best part of the farm with less than ideal access?

[Jason McIntyre]

Should you? That's what the real question is. Stand without good access is not a good stand.

[Jake Hofer]

Listen to Back 40 on iHeartRadio app, Apple podcast, or wherever you get your podcast. I'm Dan, he's Ty.

[Jason McIntyre]

Hello.

[Jake Hofer]

And we're the solid verbal College Football Podcast.

[Jason McIntyre]

Tune in for previews, recaps, bits you won't hear anywhere else, and all the emotional support you need as a college football fan.

[Jake Hofer]

Join us all season long as we ride the roller coaster of this ridiculous sport.

[Jason McIntyre]

Listen to the solid verbal college football podcasts on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

[Jake Hofer]

We don't just love college football, Ty.

[Jason McIntyre]

We live it. Thanks for listening to the Herd podcast. Be sure to catch us live every weekday on Fox Sports radio at noon to 3 Eastern, 9am to noon Pacific. Find your local station for the [e-mail] or stream us live every day on the iHeartRadio app by searching Fox Sports Radio or FSR. Thanks for listening to the Herd podcast. It's the final hour, the power hour. Here on the Herd on a glorious news packed Friday. It's me, Jason McIntyre in for Colin Cowherd joined by Rachel Nichols. We have had a just a spectacular week of news. We've been so fortunate.

[Rachel Nichols]

How long is going to be dicey?

[Jason McIntyre]

Was this the first time Taylor Swift was ever upstaged in her life?

[Rachel Nichols]

I mean, Jerry Jones, man, he can do it.

[Jason McIntyre]

Yeah, I mean, like, listen, nobody in Brazil cares about Micah Parsons. Well, actually Brazil might care. Let me pivot to a different country. Romania. They love Taylor Swift there. I don't know if they know about Michael Parsons anyways. It was just everyone knows about the star. That's a good point. Dallas is global. Former Ohio State quarterback Cardell Jones Top five, we had to balance it. We got Colt McCoy last hour. Now we get Cardell Jones here in the final hour. But let's start with the trade heard around Jerry World. Micah Parsons has been traded to the Green Bay packers. And if you ask me, Dallas got completely robbed in this deal. I cannot believe that this trade happened. I think obviously Green Bay won the trade. There's many angles to break down here. I'm going to go with the packers angle first because I do think, and I haven't seen a lot of other takes on this, I think the packers are right there as one of the best teams not only in the NFC but in the league. This puts them in the serious super bowl consideration. I had them in my tier two for super bowl contenders earlier this week. They clearly vault to one. I mean, I don't think people realize just how good Micah Parsons is. Okay. This move going from Dallas to Green Bay I believe is bigger than the Matt Stafford trade from a few years ago. When the Rams got Matt Stafford, everybody was excited. Obviously it led to a Super Bowl. But Michael Parsons is in his prime. He's only played four seasons in the league. Matt Stafford was 33, a little older. You know, the Christian McCaffrey trade was big. Khalil Mack trade was big. This is seismic. I mean, folks, Michael Parsons again, I know he takes a lot of heat for inside the locker room stuff. His podcast, we will address that because it bears some discussion. But let me just remind folks, Micah Parsons in year one was runner up defensive player of the year. Okay? He's been an All Pro three times in four years. He has 12 or more sacks in every season he's played so far to start his career. It's not hyperbole to say Micah Parsons is already on track to be a first ballot hall of Famer after four seasons. He's in the discussion with the likes of Lawrence Taylor, Reggie White, Miles Garrett as one of the greatest pass rushers in NFL history. After four years now, we don't know what's going to happen, obviously, but Parsons is a terror coming off the edge. And if you're the Green Bay packers and you look at your defensive roster and you're like, oh, we got Gary. We got some good linebackers, we got a good team. What you didn't have with that blue chip superstar where you go in the divisional round of the playoffs and the opponent looks at how we going to. How are we going to block Michael Parsons? What are we going to have to adjust stuff? You have to scheme specifically for Parsons. Now, teams have done that in the playoffs with some success, but you look at Gary coming off the other edge, and this Green Bay defense suddenly is a wrecking crew. And I would like to point out that their odds after the draft to win the Super bowl were plus 2200. Okay, that was after the draft, and I'll tell you why the draft is important. This morning, they went to + 1200. So right now, the packers are right there. Cream of the crop. They're in the Ravens, Bills, Chiefs, New Niners, they're right there at the top. And the draft is important because I missed this and I was kicking myself this morning for missing this. I think everybody did. But at the draft, the Green Bay packers in the first round, we know what they don't do in the first round, right? They don't take wide receivers. Aaron Rodgers bemoaned that fact. He openly was like, we don't draft receivers in the first round. We need one. I need some help. Packers have a really good wide receiver room. It's deep, it's young, it's talented. They got a lot of guys and they drafted a wide receiver in the first round. I was like, oh, Matthew Gold. It's not like he's Jeremiah Smith or something. Golden, really nice player. He's like 511, a buck 90. I know he's a burner, but it was a mild surprise. They broke character at the draft getting Matthew Golden. And I should have noticed at the time, but smart businesses sometimes adapt and change and say, we've done things one way, we're going to make an adjustment, and we're going for Golden. Now, their wide receiver room, I mean, it doesn't have that high end Jamar Chase, Justin Jefferson, but in terms of depth and talent, it's top four in the league. Golden is going to be that guy. Get him on your fantasy team. Now you add Micah Parsons, a massive trade. What did we hear from NFL pundits all week, guys? Packers, they're not going to get Micah Parsons. They don't do that. They don't make these huge, splashy trades. Haven't done that in forever. Once again, the packers break character. Go out and get a superstar, a blue chip. How do we stop that guy coming off the edge? And I believe the Green Bay packers probably will be in the NFC championship game. I will. I'll say likely against the San Francisco 49ers. And then we get the Trent Williams matchup against Micah Parsons. And boy, Green Bay fans, you've got to be absolutely geeked. I got a buddy who is a Milwaukee brewers fan, and he's a Green Bay packers fan, and he's doing cartwheels. He's like, brewers baseball, packers football. It's a great day in Green Bay. And by the way, for those who are saying, well, packers overpaid, and we'll address it, Jordan loves contract. They got him early, guys. He is only the 13th biggest cap hit at quarterback in the league. You want to take a guess who's first this season? Dak Prescott, biggest cap hit in the league. And let's move to Dallas now and address that side of the trade. I want to start positive because might want to ear muffet Cowboys fans. This is going to be a little negative. So there's this fun exercise that I've been told to do. You know, you turn 30 years old and you're supposed to look back at your younger self and like, write a little letter and say, man, don't you wish you knew this at 20? And then you do it, you know, at 30, you're like, oh, man, in my 20s. Relationship stuff. Maybe you're finding a potential mate. Work, you're getting out of college, and some stuff you could learn, and you give it to your younger self. You hand it down to your kids, relatives. So when you do it at 40, it's mostly about, you know, having kids, buying a house, that next step of life. But when you read about this, the one thing that it keeps coming back to is you need to act with less emotion in relationships, in work. Just chill out, calm down. Now, if you couldn't tell, I tend to get emotional sometimes, specifically about sports. And I think Jerry Jones got really emotional here and made a horrific decision. He told Jane Slater that after news broke this week that there were trade talks for Micah Parsons. Micah and his agent, who his agent's really good, went to The Cowboys with, quote, empathy, and they wanted to get a deal done. And allegedly, according to Micah Parsons, Jerry Jones got very emotional and told Micah and his agent, play on the fifth year or leave. Folks, that is not how you run a football team. That is amateur hour. Amateurs act on emotion. Pros, they look at the numbers, and the numbers said, jerry, you bungled this badly. And for those out there who were screaming, j Mac, wait a minute. They didn't overpay and they got an extra first round pick and they got Kenny Clark. Kenny Clark ain't very good, but that's another story. Guys, the reason that this got this far was because Jerry didn't do this last year. If he had gone last year and said, you know what? We can't afford Ceedee, Lamb, Dak and Micah, you knew this last year, you could have made the deal last year and got more for Micah Parsons, why wait so long? I mean, at worst, if he had done this at the beginning of the off season, Jerry gets a bidding war started among several teams. Now, there's a report that the Raiders had called, but they were late to the game. Just like I understand he's a billionaire, and I understand he's had success, you know, 30 years ago with Jimmie Johnson winning a bunch of Super Bowls. But did Jerry just totally misplay his hand here? Well, yeah, clearly he bungled this so badly, folks, paying Dak and Lamb and knowing that you can't pay Micah like you should have done this last year. Now, Jerry Jones took in, went in front the media on Thursday after the trade. And, guys, he claims he's been thinking about this trade for a long time. We did think it was in the best interest of our organization. Not only the future, but right now, this season as well, we've gained a Pro bowl player in an area that we had big concern in, concerns in on the inside of our defense. The facts are specifically, we need to stop the run. And we haven't been able to stop the run at key times for several years. Boy, if I was allowed to use expletives on the show, I would have come out of that quote and said, what the are you talking about? We need to stop the run. What kind of alternative universe is Jerry Jones living in, folks? Okay, fine. You knew you needed to stop the run at the draft. Let's take a look at the Cowboys draft, shall we? They got an offensive lineman, an edge rusher, a quarterback, a running back, a linebacker, an offensive lineman. Oh, there at pick 217. Mr. We've got to stop the run? You waited 217 picks to get a defensive tackle? What? Like, Jerry's saying stuff that doesn't even make sense. Guys, I got a buddy who's a Cowboys fan. His daughter plays on my daughter's volleyball team. You know, we. We've known each other. We coach soccer together. He texts me. I'm literally crying right now. After the trade, he was like, what are we doing? And, you know, this isn't just Jerry screwing up the mica deal and then trying to lie to everyone's face. Like, what do they call that? I think it's called gaslighting. Hey, we knew we needed to stop the run, so, you know, we added Kenny Clark. Like, bro, what? Come on. Nobody's believing that. And, oh, by the way, Jerry has a recent track record of trades. Remember when they got Mingo, the wide receiver from the Carolina Panthers? Yeah, he's. He's on IR to start the season, and even when he returns, he's looking at being the projected fourth or fifth wide receiver on the roster. They give up a fourth round pick for Mingo, and do you remember Trey Lance? They thought. Jerry thought he had a great deal for Trey Lance. I mean, he gave up a fourth round pick for Trey Lance, not on the roster through a whopping. Oh, he played four games. Trey Lance played four games after Jerry Jones traded for him. I mean, does this guy even know what he's doing? One of the producers here as I'm walking up to the set goes, jay, I had a good line when you left the morning meeting. If Jerry Jones wore his shirt inside out to the facility today, would anybody in Dallas have the cojones to tell him, hey, billionaire owner. Boss, your shirt's inside out because it feels like nobody is telling Jerry what he needs to hear. And the Cowboys right now are a disaster. Although I am very curious, is there a world where we see a lot of negative Micah Parsons stories trickling out of the media? Well, this is why Dallas got off of him. Here's Jane Slater addressing that earlier today.

[Rachel Nichols]

I remember he was sending out a bunch of tweets his rookie season, and it was, you know, getting involved in military and politics. I was like, you might want to be careful. And he just stood on business. And when we asked him, I think it was last year, in the locker room, point blank, I said, why aren't you here for voluntary OTAs? A lot of the guys live in the area. They have a really high turnout. You know, I know it's voluntary, but if you talk to a lot of players, that's how they gel, et cetera. And he said into the camera with his chest, I don't get paid the sort of money some people do to show up here and be at voluntary OTAs. I'm here when I'm supposed to be. So it's, it was those little things that I think were frustrating.

[Jason McIntyre]

Yes. We will see what comes out of the Micah Parsons departure coming up next. Will it be a smooth transition for Micah in Green Bay? We'll talk about that next. Be sure to catch live editions of the Herd, weekdays at noon Eastern, 9am Pacific, on Fox Sports Radio, FS1 and the iHeartRadio app.

[Steve Covino]

Hey, it's Steve Covino.

[Jason McIntyre]

And I'm Rich Davis.

[Steve Covino]

And together we're Covino and Rich on Fox Sports Radio.

[Jason McIntyre]

You can catch us weekdays from 5.

[Rich Ornberger]

To 7pm Eastern, 2 to 4 Pacific.

[Jason McIntyre]

On Fox Sports Radio. And of course, the iHeartRadio app. Why should you listen to Covino and Rich? We talk about everything, life, sports, relationships, what's going on in the world. We have a lot of fun talking.

[Steve Covino]

About the stories behind the stories in the world of sports and pop culture.

[Jason McIntyre]

Stories that, well, other shows don't seem to have the time to discuss.

[Rich Ornberger]

And the fact that we've been friends for the last 20 years and still.

[Jason McIntyre]

Work together, I mean, that says something, right? So check us out.

[Steve Covino]

We like to get you involved, too.

[Jason McIntyre]

Take your phone calls, chop it up, as they say.

[Rich Ornberger]

I'd say the most interactive show on.

[Jason McIntyre]

Fox Sports Radio, maybe the most interactive.

[Rich Ornberger]

Show on planet Earth.

[Jason McIntyre]

Be sure to check out Covino and.

[Steve Covino]

Rich live on Fox Sports radio and the iHeartradio app from 5 to 7pm Eastern, 2 to 4 Pacific.

[Jason McIntyre]

And if you miss any of the live show, just search Covino and Rich wherever you get your podcast and of course, on social media, that's Covino and Rich.

[Steve Covino]

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[Buzz Knight]

Hi, I'm Buzz Knight, the host of the Taking a Walk podcast. And join me for an upcoming episode with Zach McFarlane, the creator of Family Guy, talking about his new Frank Sinatra music project.

[Music Podcast Host (unnamed, associated with Sinatra project)]

Anyone who loves music would salivate over something like this. The the biggest question for us was, what's in these boxes? There were a few unplayed gems that we had been alerted to by Charlie Pinon of Sinatra Enterprises. So we knew that certain songs like shadow of your smile, which actually is not on this record, it'll be on the next one.

[Buzz Knight]

Seth McFarland Don Rickles went up to.

[Music Podcast Host (unnamed, associated with Sinatra project)]

Frank Sinatra and he said, listen, I'm going to be having dinner with this lovely woman tonight. You know, would you come over and say hi? And just so you know, Cause I feel like if she sees that I know you, it's gonna make me look really cool and, you know, I might have a good night. During the middle of dinner, Frank walks over and says, don, hi, how are you? And Don goes, frank, please, I'm in the middle of dinner.

[Buzz Knight]

Seth MacFarlane on the taking a Walk podcast. Listen to Takin a walk on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

[Cardell Jones]

Who cares about truth when the lies more entertaining.

[Angela Rye]

Hey everybody, I'm Angela Rye, co host of Native Lamp with Tiffany Cross and Andrew Gillum. Through the le of politics and culture we talk with you every week to make sense of this madness. I've been telling Angela, I don't even know how to fight back right now. So what I'm focused on is just looking out for ourselves.

[Jason McIntyre]

That's the truth. We're having the same debates that American households are having all over the country.

[Angela Rye]

Rest is certainly a form of self care, but if you are watching your full neighbors starve, not be able to pay bills, your rest is selfish. But the thing is, Angela, this is not the mess we created. So I do understand black folks feeling like, you know what, y' all got it.

[Jason McIntyre]

We're like family, but we disagree all the time. And we love when our listeners chime in.

[Angela Rye]

What would happen if we built our own little Wakandan communities in the rural South?

[Music Podcast Host (unnamed, associated with Sinatra project)]

Tiffany, do not run to no rural South.

[Jason McIntyre]

I don't know what you're on.

[Angela Rye]

What our audience is asking is, okay, fine, you want me to stop resting? What specifically are you asking me to do? Stay informed and take action.

[Steve Covino]

Listen to native land Pod on the.

[Jason McIntyre]

Iheartradio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Welcome home, y'.

[Rachel Nichols]

All.

[Jake Hofer]

I'm Jake Hofer and this is back 40, a limited series show on Wire to hunt, part of Meat Eaters Podcast Network. Each episode I'll be asking eight whitetail hunting pros a focused, thought provoking question about hunting and land management. How do I hunt the best part of the farm with less than ideal access?

[Jason McIntyre]

Should you? That's what the real question is. Stand without good access is not a good stand.

[Jake Hofer]

Listen to Back 40 on iHeartRadio app, Apple podcast or wherever you get your podcast.

[Jason McIntyre]

Welcome back. Rich Ornberger, fourth round pick of the Patriots, went to Penn State, obviously. We'll ask him about James Franklin. Let's bring him in. Radio guy in San Diego. Colt. College football games really doesn't ever stop working. Rich, how you doing, man?

[Rich Ornberger]

Good. Good morning to you, Jason. This. Yeah, this is true. I was up until about 11:30 calling football on the west coast and then woke up for a six o' clock radio show. So you're catching me right in the prime time of my day, man.

[Jason McIntyre]

Yeah, love that. You never stop working. Hey, we have it good. We're talking about sports. Let's start obviously with the big news. Micah Parsons shipped from Dallas. Now, listen, we had several guests on the show this week, Rich, and all of them said the same thing. Oh, Jerry o' Cave at the last minute. Packers, they don't do these big splashy moves, everybody. I don't think anybody called this. Everyone was wrong. How shocked were you that Micah got shipped to Green Bay?

[Rich Ornberger]

I was shocked like everybody else. I thought exactly what you said would come true, that eventually Jerry Jones would come to his senses or Cave or Micah Parsons might come down from whatever number was unapproachable for the Cowboys. I figured that this would, this would go down where one day they would be, you know, 20, 25 years from now, they would be put in. Parsons in the ring of honor at AT Stadium or whatever the sponsor name, right. Will be on the top of the stadium at that point. And he'd be telling stories about how I saw a stat today that in the common draft era, there's only been 29 first round draft picks that have gone to the Pro bowl in their first four years in the NFL and only one of them hasn't played for the same team in their fifth season, and that's Micah Parsons.

[Jason McIntyre]

Wow. Oh, my. That's crazy. Now listen, you, you've been around the league. You were with the Patriots, obviously you, you've seen a lot of things. Does this rank high up there in terms of just wackiness? Because I'll be honest, I think this is bigger than this McCaffrey trade. I think it's bigger than Stafford, bigger than Khalil Mack. It's like Michael Parsons has been pretty damn dominant and it's the Cowboys.

[Rich Ornberger]

It's not just franchise shifting for the packers and the Cowboys, frankly, but it's also league shifting. It does, it does have the same feel to it as the Matthew Stafford trade and slightly potentially more impactful because this takes the packers to a different level divisionally inside the NFC North. And this obviously plummets the Cowboys already paltry chances at making themselves into a struggling team from last year into a playoff contender this year. This really was a poor move by the Cowboys and it was a head scratching move for Jerry Jones. He's a guy who typically likes to make a show of his franchise, but at the end of the day he's a businessman and he knows what's good for business. And Micah Parsons would have been a good decision, a good business decision. And so I think something happened here that's not being 100% accurately reported as it stands today. Something, it feels like to me more personal occurred here and whether that be Micah Parsons, and he was pretty honest about his feelings around the these negotiations, didn't appreciate the public nature of the negotiations and some of the things that Jerry was saying during those public negotiations or perhaps Jerry Jones had, you know, something stuck in his craw here, but this felt like it went beyond business for some reason.

[Jason McIntyre]

Yeah, usually after these big trades happen of stars, whether it's NBA or NFL, you start to hear, oh well, this guy's reporting this now. And it was like, well, where was that when it was actually going down in the locker room? I'm just curious. In your time in the league, obviously you saw guys maybe not locked in, goofing off, but it didn't make it into the media. Do you think that maybe there were some people protecting Micah in that locker room? Because you don't move off a star like that if there aren't some lingering issues.

[Rich Ornberger]

I'm never going to say never, but from a character standpoint, I haven't heard anything negative about Micah Parsons. All you hear about, all you read about, all you see is his leadership. Now obviously it's been reported that he was disgruntled with his pay. And there is a prideful nature amongst NFL players, especially the special players like Micah Parsons, where you're looking around the league and you directly tie the amount of respect that your franchise is giving you to the amount of money that they're paying you. And if you don't feel like you're being paid enough, you don't feel like you're being respected enough as a player or as a man. And I think that attitude started to grow within Micah Parsons, and maybe some of that sentiment was shared with teammates. But from a leadership or from, you know, a standpoint of taking the game seriously, I saw and heard none of that coming out of the Cowboys camp. I guess we'll see what reporting unveils itself here in the aftermath as the dust settles and the dust clears. But as it stands right now, all I've heard is that he was a role model and a great example for young players on that team and obviously a huge contributor on the field for the Cowboys. And this came out of the clear blue that he's been traded and he's no longer going to be in Dallas.

[Jason McIntyre]

All right, Rich, let me ask you this. You are being defensive of Michael Parsons. Understandably so. But you did go to Penn State. Michael Parsons went to Penn State. Now, he also sat out his the COVID year. Remember that, Rich? He decided, I'm not going to play at all. Were you surprised at that decision? I don't know if we spoke about that at the time or maybe we hosted a radio show together, but I think we were surprised that Michael would sit out the season.

[Rich Ornberger]

Yeah, look, some of those things, man, when you rewind back to those times, some of those things do linger with people. And of course, it depends on maybe what side of the fence you were on at that time. But I think the further we get from there, I think many people have had the ability to compartmentalize, you know, their feelings or. Or others actions because it was a very unique time in all of our lives. I mean, that that was almost an understanding between the union, the players and the NFL owners that this is just going to be a very different season. It's going to be a very different feeling season and there's going to be obviously, accommodations made and many sacrifices made for those who are actually going to show up and play. And then likewise, there are going to be certain people who are just plain uncomfortable doing it. And I guess as a retrospective, anything's possible. So if you told me that Jerry Jones took umbrage with the fact that he didn't play and then that got somehow reconstituted in his mind eye when he was reviewing Micah Parsons as A player in his organization during these negotiations. I suppose I would believe you, but it would be hard to believe that Jerry Jones would let something that happened literally a handful of years ago affect his decision making today, especially when he's been such a standout player since.

[Jason McIntyre]

All right, let's go to college football. So obviously you went to Penn State, played there before, getting drafted, and a lot of people like the Lions this year to win the national championship. I have a ticket on Penn State. I gotta ask. The James Franklin stat, you see it on the screen there. One in 16 against top five opponents. Listen, I get it if you want to write off, hey, he's one in six, you know, he's two and seven, that's fine. We're talking about a 17 game sample size of gagging in the biggest spots in the sport. Is this the year Franklin overcomes it? Or. I don't know. Maybe it's not that big of a deal to you, Rich?

[Rich Ornberger]

Well, look, it certainly is a big deal. As an alumni, you want to see your team have success. But in terms of James Franklin, and I know him personally, he's a great man. He's a really solid recruiter, and obviously he's been able to create a culture and really have a rebirth culturally there at Penn State after some of the things that that program went through. And it's been incredible the heights that he's brought the program to. Now you can say one thing and also live in the reality that we're living in where he is one in 16 against top five opponents. And that does hurt some of the conversation about the greatness that he has exuded since taking this head coaching position at Penn State. It's. It's a problem, and I'm sure it's one that keeps him up at night sometimes when. When he sees that stat, he's having a similar reaction, I promise you, to the Penn State alumni who would be proud if it was the inverse if you were 16 and one against top five teams, right?

[Jason McIntyre]

Yeah.

[Rich Ornberger]

Doesn't mean he can't win a national title. Doesn't mean he can't win against top five talent this season. Of course it doesn't, because every single football season is a different year. But does it mean that he has to change the approach and continue to tweak this thing and not rely that his way last year is going to be the right way this year? Well, no, he has to continue to evolve and work at this thing and make sure that his teams are ready to play in the biggest moments of the Biggest games where so many times we've seen failures. And I think he's. I think he's up for that challenge. Knowing his attitude and his effort on a daily basis, not only from getting to know him, but also through other former colleagues and players that I was teammates with who have been honor currently on his staff. I think he's the type of coach who won't rest until he fixes this problem. And that fix could be in for 2025.

[Jason McIntyre]

Last question, Rich, real quick. Ohio State, you know, a team you're dimly familiar with, Penn State, big rival. They are hosting a gentleman named Arch Manning making his official launch. I know he started a couple games, but your best guess, just to be clear, we're all guessing as to whether Arch is going to be good, bad, or whatever. Your best guess as to how Arch performs at the Shoe on Saturday.

[Rich Ornberger]

My best guess is he's going to be prepared, obviously, coming from the great football lineage that he does, you know, the family that he comes from, he has access to some of the greatest football minds, and he's a text message or a phone call away. And then he's been raised in this. He's been given the best avenue for success possible. And then also I appreciate the way Texas handled him last year, you know, leaving him a year to be an understudy, learning the speed of the college game more away from the daylight and the bright lights of that stadium down in Austin, as opposed to being thrust into it and showcasing him at times and still having some success. So my. My best guess is that Arch Manning is going to live up to the billing, and I can't wait. I think he's an explosive athlete, which is rare to say about a Manning playing football. And I also think that he's got a live arm he could touch anywhere on the football, and he can do it with the. With the type of feathering and layering that you absolutely need to have with the sort of athletes you're going to see on the defensive side of the ball now in college football.

[Jason McIntyre]

So, Texas Moneyline or what?

[Rich Ornberger]

You know, I don't hate it.

[Jason McIntyre]

I honestly don't hate it. All right, I don't hate.

[Rich Ornberger]

I don't hate the money line. I'll tell you what, that's where the value is. If you believe in Arch Manning, that's a moneyline bet.

[Jason McIntyre]

Okay, Rich Ornberger, radio host, former NFL player, former Penn State star. Thanks a lot, Rich. Have a great weekend, buddy.

[Rich Ornberger]

Anytime, J. Max. You, too.

[Jason McIntyre]

All right. Good stuff. The Penn State side of him was Coming out there. Come on. He's going against Ohio State. Let's go to Rachel Nichols with the news. No, no, no.

[Rich Ornberger]

Turn on the news. This is the Herd line news.

[Rachel Nichols]

Well, Jason, we've had someone else weigh in on the Jalen Hurts debate. Dominican Su said it was disrespectful. Yeah, ranking Hertz 19th on the NFL top 100 list. Remember, sue spent 2022 on the Eagles. And to back up his point, look, the results are the results. J. Mac, this guy has led Philadelphia to four consecutive playoff appearances, two NFC championships, and most importantly, he scored two touchdowns to help them win the Super Bowl. But to the point of those who don't rate, Hurts as high, he only threw 22 passes in that super bowl win. In fact, The Eagles are 20, 219 when Hertz throws less than 30 times. But when he has to air it out, it's not great. You can look at the numbers here. Basically, it gets worse the more that he throws. So J. Mac is 19th. Too low. Too high. Just right.

[Jason McIntyre]

Way too low. Who's sandbagging with those numbers? So I guess, you know, context is needed. Right? How many of those were without Saquon? I saw a crazy stat where they basically barely trailed in the fourth quarter last year. So you're not really throwing Burrows chucking and ducking all game. I, I don't really, I don't have an answer for that. I know that's sad. You have to have a take on everything. As you said earlier. I, I, I don't think it's a knock that he doesn't throw a lot.

[Rachel Nichols]

Like, I mean, the idea is if you have to limit his part of the game plan. Is he really that great a quarterback compared to guys where the, or teams where the quarterback makes the team, you know, Lamar Jackson stand out, obviously. Heart and soul of your team. Josh Allen.

[Jason McIntyre]

Okay, that's good. Lamar's good. So you mentioned Lamar. So I remember when he came in halfway through the season, he really couldn't throw the football. It was just all running. So they catered to him. They get to the playoffs, I'm fairly certain they lost to the Chargers or they beat them. Whatever the result was. Bottom line is like, they catered to Lamar. So the Eagles are catering to hurts his strengths. Very good on the ground. Good when he throws 25 passes and great run game. I don't want my quarterback sitting back there chucking 45 times. What do you, it's more likely like you drop back to pass. You could fumble the stab. Quarterback gets sacked. Quarterback Gets injured. I feel like running is a little more safe. I know it's probably not as efficient.

[Rachel Nichols]

Look, you have Saquon Barkley. So that's the answer to me. I think this is. I get it. I do understand the question. You know, Kevin Wilds, who we'll see in the next hour, you know, he is very determined to not understand the question because to him, Jalen hurt is just way underrated. I get the question, but I don't agree with a lot of people's answer. I'm with Kevin on the fact that this guy is. You were asking someone to win you a Super bowl and he went out and won a Super Bowl. What else do you want from him?

[Jason McIntyre]

He's got nothing left to prove in my book. I love jailers.

[Rachel Nichols]

Yeah, there you go. All right, let's talk a little Red. Oh, Commanders. I almost said it. Almost said Redskins.

[Jason McIntyre]

You're a Washington fan. You grew up.

[Rachel Nichols]

I can't. It's like years of conditioning. All right, Terry McLaurin, very notable contract dispute. But unlike their division rival, the Command, the Cowboys. You see how I got that in there. The Commanders were able to get a deal done. Now that McLaren is back in camp, he says getting back with second year quarterback Jaden Daniels has been like, quote, riding a bike and the two haven't missed a step. Now you know about how I feel about my hometown team offense.

[Angela Rye]

I'm all in.

[Rachel Nichols]

I think there's going to be a little progression here and there, but I'm all in the defense. My rule is the Fight Club rule. What's the first rule of Fight Club? We don't talk about Fight Club. What's the first rule of being a Commander fan? We don't talk about the defense.

[Jason McIntyre]

Bad.

[Rachel Nichols]

They were in the middle. Well, look, they were in the middle of Pack last season, but 35% of the quarterbacks they faced were backups.

[Jason McIntyre]

Wow.

[Rachel Nichols]

Their rushing defense was 29th.

[Jason McIntyre]

Not great.

[Rachel Nichols]

And they got older.

[Katie Couric]

Right.

[Rachel Nichols]

Von Miller's 36. So where are you on the Commanders? Obviously, NFC Championship last year. Not going to win their division. But where do you think they'll be in the NFC picture considering the amazing offense and the Fight Club defense?

[Jason McIntyre]

So we'll go. What? I think we agree Packers, Eagles, ners are at the top in some order. And then I think Washington's probably in that second group. Right. With whether you want the Lions, the Rams, Falcons, or are you Bucks or Falcons?

[Rachel Nichols]

I'm. Yeah, I'm your Bucks.

[Jason McIntyre]

More neither, I think. I think Washington's gonna be good. I I just, you know, it was a charmed season. You'd agree.

[Rachel Nichols]

Yeah, of course.

[Jason McIntyre]

You know, we deserved one. Yeah. Daryl Green's not walking through that door, right? Actually, he might. He. Daryl Green.

[Rachel Nichols]

We don't talk about the defense.

[Jason McIntyre]

So I was in. I grew up in d in the D.C. area. And when we were walking to school, the crossing guards would hand out. I don't know if you remember this. Like Washington at the time. Redskins, Cards. Yes. And Daryl Green was the card everyone wanted.

[Rachel Nichols]

He was.

[Jason McIntyre]

That guy was a legend. He was the fastest guy in the NFL.

[Rachel Nichols]

Yeah.

[Jason McIntyre]

Gary Clark.

[Rachel Nichols]

Great.

[Jason McIntyre]

Was it? I wasn't a Washington fan, but I.

[Rachel Nichols]

The Hogs, Jacoby, the fun bunch.

[Jason McIntyre]

Come on. Washington had a good history and now they're back.

[Rachel Nichols]

Exactly. We're back, baby. Kind of. Maybe not defensively. All right, let's take one last look at the Micah Parsons trade. Jerry said that the Air have been evaluating several teams and deals for months. For months, Jason. But it's inarguable, saying Micah would have commanded much more had Jerry actually truly held a public bidding war. When you look at some of the notable trades that have happened in recent history, I mean, it's hard to argue that he should not have gotten more capital back. And look, you can look here at some recent deals. I know Dallas also got Kenny Clark, but it's not a good look. Right.

[Jason McIntyre]

Wait. Jamal Adams. That's right. Two first and a third. Wow. That was a heist. Bad. I think. Yeah. That was crazy. Laramie Tunsil got more than. Yeah. Folks, who was arguing in the meeting this morning? That is. Jerry did an okay job.

[Rachel Nichols]

I mean, look, to me, that is not good. If you had. If you really. I mean, of all the things that Jerry said in that press conference. We've been talking about this since the spring. I'm sorry. In the spring, when teams hadn't made their plans yet, hadn't committed money yet. First of all, you traded him to the team that has eliminated you.

[Jason McIntyre]

Yeah.

[Rachel Nichols]

The last three times you've been eliminated from the playoffs, you could have gotten him out of the division. How much would the Bills have given you for Micah Parsons?

[Jason McIntyre]

How much?

[Rachel Nichols]

How much would the Bengals have given you any contenders? How much would the Raiders, who already said, hey, what about us? Why didn't we get a shot at this?

[Jason McIntyre]

Would the Chiefs have given it a flyer? Probably. Why not? Right? You're close.

[Rachel Nichols]

At least Green Bay would have had to pay more. Right. Even if you had traded to them. I don't know. Of all the comps to the Lucas situation. I think this is actually the biggest comp because if the Mavericks had made it known Luka Doncic was available, I mean they got back one one first round pick Anthony Davis.

[Jason McIntyre]

Don't forget super Max Christie. Yeah, you can't forget. I mean that's massive yet.

[Rachel Nichols]

And so, you know, for Cowboys fans, to me, this is the sort of the real kicker and the knife twist is this is what you got back.

[Jason McIntyre]

And Luka and Marika are the same age when they were traded.

[Rachel Nichols]

Yeah.

[Jason McIntyre]

Are they going to have like a 30 for 30? Does anybody do that? I mean anymore is how those done? Anyways, Rachel with the news.

[Rich Ornberger]

Well, that's the news and thanks for.

[Jason McIntyre]

Stopping by the herd lie news. All right. Earlier in the show, Colt McCoy made a bold prediction. Text us by 10. So we got Cardell Jones, the former Ohio State quarterback, coming up. I'm gonna go ahead and guess he's not backing the Longhorns tomorrow. Be sure to catch live editions of the Herd, weekdays at noon Eastern, 9am Pacific.

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[Buzz Knight]

Hi, I'm Buzz Knight, the host of the Taking a Walk podcast, and join me for an upcoming episode with Seth MacFarlane, the creator of Family Guy, talking about his new friend Frank Sinatra Music project.

[Music Podcast Host (unnamed, associated with Sinatra project)]

Anyone who loves music would salivate over something like this. The biggest question for us was, what's in these boxes? There were a few unplayed gems that we had been alerted to by Charlie Pinion of Sinatra Enterprises. So we knew that certain songs like Shadow of your Smile, which actually is not on this record, it'll be on the next one.

[Buzz Knight]

Seth McFarlane, Don Rickles went up to.

[Music Podcast Host (unnamed, associated with Sinatra project)]

Frank Sinatra and he said, listen, I'm going to be having dinner with this lovely woman and I, you know, would you come over and say hi and just so you know, because I feel like if she sees that I know you, it's gonna make me look really cool and, you know, I might have a good night. During the middle of dinner, Frank walks over and says, don, hi, how are you? And Don goes, frank, please, I'm in the middle of dinner.

[Buzz Knight]

Seth MacFarlane on the taking a Walk podcast. Listen to Taking a walk on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

[Cardell Jones]

Who cares about truth when the lies more entertaining.

[Angela Rye]

Hey, everybody, I'm Angela Rye, co host of Native Lamp with Tiffany Cross and Andrew Gill. Through the lens of politics and culture, we talk with you every week to make sense of this madness. I've been telling Angela I don't even know how to fight back right now. So what I'm focused on is just looking out for ourselves.

[Jason McIntyre]

That's the truth. We're having the same debates that American households are having all over the country.

[Angela Rye]

Rest is certainly a form of self care, but if you are watching your full neighbors starve, not be able to pay bills, your rest is. Is selfish. But the thing is, Angela, this is not the mess we created. So I do understand black folks feeling like, you know what, y' all got it.

[Jason McIntyre]

We're like family, but we disagree all the time. And we love when our listeners chime.

[Angela Rye]

In what would happen if we built our own little Wakandan communities in the rural South?

[Music Podcast Host (unnamed, associated with Sinatra project)]

Tiffany, do not run to no rural South.

[Cardell Jones]

I don't know what you're on.

[Angela Rye]

What our audience is asking is. Okay, fine, you want me to stop resting? What specifically are you asking me to do? Stay informed and take action.

[Jason McIntyre]

Listen to Nativeland Pod on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Welcome home, y'.

[Cardell Jones]

All.

[Jake Hofer]

I'm Jake Hofer and this is back 40, a limited series show on Wire to Hunt, part of Meat Eaters Podcast Network. Each episode I'll be asking eight whitetail hunting pros a focused, thought provoking question about hunting and land management. How do I hunt the best part of the farm with less than ideal access?

[Jason McIntyre]

Should you? That's what the real question is. Stand without good access is not a good stand.

[Jake Hofer]

Listen to Back 40 on iHeartRadio app, Apple podcast or wherever you get your podcast.

[Jason McIntyre]

Back here on the herd. Final hour nearly complete. We have such a great guest, Cardell Jones, legendary Ohio State quarterback, joining us now on the Herd. He obviously led them to the national championship in 2014. A glorious game. Cardell, man how you doing? I know you're fired up about the weekend, but I have to start. I gotta start with some NFL news. You did play in the NFL. The Micah Parsons trade. I'm just gonna wind you up. Go your thoughts on the shocker out of Dallas?

[Cardell Jones]

Man, I think this is a prime situation. Another example that Jerry Jones need to get out of his own way. I don't know how you away such a dominant pass rusher. A dominant player, not just a game changer but a game wrecker so early on in his career and who's continued to get better each and every year. But you know, that's the business side of things. For whatever reason, that's above my pay grade to even understand and comprehend. I'm just speaking as a fan and I wouldn't say a Dallas Cowboys fan, but just as a football fan in general. You see this guy right now making so many plays versus these great quarterbacks in the Daniels right there. I'm not getting rid of him that until I want him to be a part of my organization. To the wheels fall off and unfortunately they couldn't come up to agreement. And now he's going to be a Packer and hopefully Terry Jones is going to come back and bite you in the butt.

[Jason McIntyre]

Packers might win the Super Bowl. All right, let's get to the game. 24 hours. Well, that is like 21 hours from now you get Ohio State hosting the Texas Longhorns. Texas has a new quarterback. His name is Arch Manning. I'm sure you've heard a lot about him. You've probably seen a lot of footage. But I'm just curious, like the scene is going to be pretty wild in Ohio, in Columbus. Do you think Arch is rattled by this at all or being like a veteran? You know, he sat for a few years. He might not be in awe of the scene.

[Cardell Jones]

You know, I don't, I wouldn't say rattled, but this is an environment that he never played in before. The few starts that he had last year was definitely versus lesser opponents but still play at a high level. And then the limited action he saw going into games like A and M, like we see this great highlight here and some other great environments. But now you're the guy, you're not coming in for a spark. You're going to be the guy that's going to take the first snap to the very last snap of the game. How are you going to ride that momentum? How is the environment going to have an impact on your game or your mental and things like that? Those Are questions that steal us unanswered right now so early in his career when it comes to his starting taking over his team as starting quarterback with Texas. I'm excited for both of these young quarterbacks because there's so many unknowns for both of these guys.

[Jason McIntyre]

Yeah. So it's interesting. Steve Spurrier, Urban Meyer, several people have now said it like Arch hasn't done anything. What's with this Heisman height? Why is he the favorite to win the Heisman? Why does every mock draft have him first overall? I don't know. You're a former quarterback. You see that stuff. Do you have have a take on on the Arch banding hype machine right now?

[Cardell Jones]

Well, I mean I'm never jumping on anyone's hype machine unless I can see it for consistently for at least two years. And even if he just started last year, my argument with some of the hype is and this is no knock on Arsenal. I do think he's going to be a great player. I think he's going to be one of those caliber players. I don't think I'm ready to crown him that yet. But if he was this good, why did he start last year? And that's with all due respect to him and our and and Quinn Hurst and everything Texas got going on. But let this guy grow into that player that we all hope him to be. Not just self proclaiming and putting that crown on his head already. These things for themselves individually more than archmanny. But let him go out there and kind of earn those things before we start to kind of get him and pencil him in as the greatest thing since slice bread.

[Jason McIntyre]

Yeah. Now you were a really great quarterback on the run. I mean from the pocket as well. But at your size you weren't taking hits that could, you know, knock you down. Arch Manning is not 65250. He's a big, big kid. But I'm just curious. His biggest strength everybody says is his quickness and running ability. I don't. Ohio State's got some thumpers. I'm worried. I don't think he's going to be running a lot tomorrow. Right.

[Cardell Jones]

You know, I don't think so. I don't think you want to expose your quarterback to too many hits no matter how big or small it may be. You go back to the playoff game last year, the limited action Arch got versus the Buckeyes and Cotton bowl down in Dallas. He took a big hit in the play that he was in and to me, you, as they was replaying to see if it was a fumble or not. You just saw the eyes of arson. I'm like, he's dinged up. So I can only imagine that for, you know, nine or 10 more plays if you want to continue to expose him to running the ball. But he's a playmaker, though. He's a guy. Guy that Texas haven't had in a long time who can really pull the ball down and be a run threat. And also, Steve like to dial up some design quarterback runs for us because to take advantage of his athletic ability outside that great arm he has.

[Jason McIntyre]

All right, let me talk Ohio State. So Jeremiah Smith won catch for three yards in last year's meeting. They clearly were like, we got to shut this guy down. Let's stop him. I think he had just cooked Oregon the last week prior. Do you anticipate them doing something similar and saying, hey, beat us anyway? Except with Jeremiah Smith, I think that's.

[Cardell Jones]

A good way to start to play for the Buckeyes, because if you don't understand and know and have a plan for everywhere number four is going to be, I think you're going to set yourself up to have a long, long day on the back end and a long day on defense. They even got him the ball a few times in the run game last year. But I think you look at Ohio State and places like Ohio State, even if you find a way to limit or eliminate their number one threat when it comes to the offensive weapons, they got other weapons that can beat you. You look at the tight end, Max Claire, who's coming over from Purdue, projected the number one tight end going into this year's upcoming NFL draft after this season. Then Carnell, Tate, Brandon in this. And the list goes on as playmakers for Ohio State. So they're in a great position if you want to try to focus much of your energy on Jeremiah Smith. They got other guys you can look up and they be over 100 yards receiving. And then clearly breaking in some new running backs that also helps.

[Jason McIntyre]

All right, so Cardell, earlier we had Colt McCoy on the Texas legend. He gave us a prediction on the game and he's got this little video for you. Here we go. We do have Cardell Jones on the show a little later on. Ohio State quarterback obviously won a national championship. Do you have any. A message for him perhaps? And we could play it for him. And do you want to get the trash talk started? The floor is yours.

[Cardell Jones]

Yeah.

[Jason McIntyre]

Texas by 10.

[Cardell Jones]

How about that, Cardell?

[Jason McIntyre]

Surprise me. Texas bite. That would be. I think that would Be a stunner, but go ahead, let's hear it.

[Rich Ornberger]

You know what, Cole?

[Cardell Jones]

I'm gonna save my trash talk for later. And we got Vince Young actually on our show, the Script, OSU here in a couple hours and Mac Brown. So I'm going to be talking some crap, but come letting you know right now, ain't no way heck Texas leaving Columbus, Ohio victorious. So I ain't too sure about the score yet, but long as they leave with the biggest thing and that's that.

[Jason McIntyre]

L. Yeah, I mean, it feels like you're right. Ohio State should handle them. I do. Colt McCoy made a good point though, you know. Four new offensive linemen for Texas. Not ideal protecting Arch Manning. You're a huge investment.

[Cardell Jones]

Yeah, I totally agree. But you look at the other side of the ball as well, how they got a of lot of guys shuffled around and playing some different position and off was a line position as well, potentially two new starting transfer tackles and then breaking in some young guys with some experience from last year as well, going against Collin Simmons and that great front seven that Texas has. So I think that's really more of the storyline for me personally. We talk about ours, we talk about Julian sand and Jeremiah Smith, Caleb Downs, and rightfully so. But the battle is going to be won, I think up front. Four, new office alignment for Texas. And Ohio State is breaking in a whole new front seven with guys like Arvel Reese and Sunny Styles taking over new starting roles predominantly at the linebacker position. And new guys like CJ Hicks taking over a completely new position at that rush.

[Jason McIntyre]

Dn Good stuff. Cardell Jones, national championship winning quarterback, also quarterback for the Buffalo Bills. Thanks a lot, man. And good luck with Vince Young and keep up the good work there, buddy.

[Cardell Jones]

Appreciate it. Thanks for having me, guys.

[Jason McIntyre]

All right. Cardell Jones a. I mean, he'll never pay for a drink, maybe not even a meal in Columbus after winning that national championship. Rachel, do you have a score prediction for the game yet? We need exact score.

[Rachel Nichols]

You said 30. 28.

[Jason McIntyre]

No, no, no, I said 27. 13.

[Rachel Nichols]

27. Oh, 13. Yeah, I think it's be more. I think there's gonna be more scoring than that.

[Jason McIntyre]

Oh, yeah, we need a score.

[Rachel Nichols]

I'm trying to will it into existence.

[Jason McIntyre]

We needed like an actual.

[Rachel Nichols]

I don't gamble the way you do, so I don't project scores.

[Jason McIntyre]

Fair enough, Fair enough. All right. Hey, it was a great week. Rachel's debut on the show, a major hit. Just outstanding content. You know, you willed the Taylor Swift engagement wearing red that day.

[Rachel Nichols]

Color that day.

[Jason McIntyre]

All right, guys, we will be back next week. See ya.

[Buzz Knight]

Hi, I'm Buzz Knight, the host of the Taking a Walk podcast. And join me for an upcoming episode with Seth MacFarlane, the creator of Family Guy, talking about his new Frank Sinatra music project.

[Music Podcast Host (unnamed, associated with Sinatra project)]

Anyone who loves music would salivate over something like this. The biggest question for us was, what's in these boxes? Really, the most thrilling part was hiring an orchestra and just playing what was in these boxes.

[Buzz Knight]

Listen to Taking a walk on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

[Katie Couric]

Hey, everyone, it's me, Katie Courage. Eric. Did you know that I recently joined Substack? Very exciting. It's where I'll be sharing my unfiltered conversations with the people everyone's talking about. I'll also tell you what I'm reading, what I'm watching, what's making me crazy, and what's giving me hope. If you like deep dives, hot takes, and real talk, you're in the right place. Search Katie Couric on Substack and hit subscribe. I'll be there, reporting live, most likely in my pajamas. See you there.

[Jake Hofer]

I'm Jake Hofer and this is back 40, a limited series show on Wire to Hunt, part of Meat Eaters Podcast Network. Each episode I'll be asking eight whitetail hunting pros a focused, thought provoking question about hunting and land management. How do I hunt the best part of the farm with less than ideal access?

[Jason McIntyre]

Should you? That's what the real question is. Stand without good access is not a good stand.

[Jake Hofer]

Listen to Back 40 on iHeartRadio app, Apple podcast, or wherever you get your podcast. I'm Dan, he's Ty.

[Jason McIntyre]

Hello.

[Jake Hofer]

And we're the Solid Verbal College Football Podcast.

[Jason McIntyre]

Tune in for previews, recaps, bits you won't hear anywhere else, and all the emotional support you need as a college football fan.

[Jake Hofer]

Join us all season long as we ride the rollercoaster of this ridiculous sport.

[Jason McIntyre]

Listen to the Solid Verbal College football podcast on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

[Jake Hofer]

We don't just love college football, Ty.

[Jason McIntyre]

We live it. This is an iHeart podcast.