The Hillsdale College Online Courses Podcast
Episode: American Foreign Policy: The Liberal International Order
Date: October 22, 2025
Hosts: Jeremiah Regan, Juan Davalos
Lecture Narrator / Professor (unnamed)
Overview
This episode serves as the concluding lecture in the American Foreign Policy course, focusing on the emergence and evolution of the “Liberal International Order.” It traces U.S. foreign policy from founding principles through recent presidencies, examining the tension between interventionism and restraint. The discussion centers on how successive administrations—especially Obama, Trump, and Biden—have diverged from, or tried to return to, the Founders' vision. The episode critically evaluates major policy decisions (Iraq, Libya, the Iran nuclear deal, NATO, Ukraine), advocating for an informed, principled approach grounded in the nation’s original ideals.
Key Discussion Points & Insights
Founding Principles on Foreign Policy
- Historical Context: The episode opens by referencing the 1820s Greek struggle for independence and John Quincy Adams’ famous refusal to involve America militarily or financially, despite sympathy.
- Insight: American "blood and treasure is for the preservation of American lives and liberties" ([00:20] – Regan).
- Quote:
"We cannot assign American property or lives to your cause. You need to do that yourselves."
— John Quincy Adams (paraphrased by Regan) [00:20]
- Adams as Expositor: Juan Davalos praises Adams as an exemplar of principled foreign policy ([01:55]).
Consequences of Modern Interventions
-
Libya and the Arab Spring:
- Obama’s intervention in Libya, aimed at ousting Gaddafi, is cited as a well-intentioned disaster, leading to greater instability and the return of slave trade.
- Quote:
"Gaddafi bad, lack of Gaddafi even worse."
— Jeremiah Regan [03:10]
-
Lessons from the Founders and Prudence:
- The Declaration’s warning that "governments long established should not be changed for light and transient causes" is invoked as a caution against impulsive interventions ([03:10]).
The Obama, Trump, and Biden Eras
Obama Administration
-
Campaign and Policy:
- Obama earned credibility by opposing the Iraq War from the start, differentiating himself from other Democrats ([05:33] – Professor).
- Early speeches, like the Cairo "apology tour," promised a new approach:
- Quote:
"I've come here to Cairo to seek a new beginning between the United States and Muslims around the world, one based on mutual interest and mutual respect."
— Barack Obama [08:48]
- Quote:
- Despite rhetoric, Obama continued and sometimes escalated policies (Afghanistan surge, drone strikes, Libya intervention) similar to the Bush years.
-
Impact of Libya and Implications for Non-Proliferation:
-
Breaking a deal with Libya (Gaddafi’s denuclearization followed by U.S.-led regime change) damaged U.S. credibility in securing non-proliferation deals elsewhere (notably, with North Korea) ([12:11]).
-
Quote:
"Breaking a deal we had made certainly weakened our international position..."
— Professor [12:11]
-
-
Rise of ISIS:
- The U.S. withdrawal from Iraq left a "strategic vacuum," allowing ISIS to rise—a “black mark” on the Obama administration ([16:03]).
-
The Iran Nuclear Deal (JCPOA):
-
Aimed to prevent Iran from developing nuclear weapons, but heavily criticized for being temporary, not ratified as a treaty, and for unfreezing Iranian assets.
-
Obama on Asset Return:
"Iran will be returned its own funds... For the United States. This settlement could save us billions..."
— Barack Obama [24:00] -
Mark Levin Critique:
"I look at Obama, I look at that deal where we gave to Iran $150 billion. They don't need to develop nuclear weapons. They can buy them."
— Mark Levin [24:31]
-
Trump Administration
-
America First Foreign Policy:
- Trump campaigns on reversing interventionist tendencies and prioritizing domestic interests.
- Quote:
"With every decision and every action, we are now putting America first."
— Donald Trump (via Davalos) [04:11] - Other candidates, except Rand Paul, continued to support maximalist, interventionist doctrines.
-
ISIS Campaign:
- Trump pursued the destruction of ISIS primarily through supporting local forces, avoiding heavy U.S. direct engagement ([28:49]).
- Quote:
"We will reinforce old alliances and form new ones and unite the civilized world against radical Islamic terrorism, which we will eradicate completely from the face of the earth."
— Donald Trump (quoted by Mark Levin) [28:33]
-
NATO Critique:
- Trump’s criticism of NATO centered on European allies not meeting their defense spending commitments, leaving U.S. taxpayers with an unfair burden ([29:43]).
-
Rejection of Liberal International Order:
- The Trump era revives the debate over restraint versus intervention, challenging assumptions about American leadership in global affairs.
Biden Administration
- Return to Maximalism:
- Biden is described as steering U.S. foreign policy toward even greater interventionism than Obama, exemplified by deep involvement in Ukraine ([34:29+]).
- Raises the question: How aligned are these policies with the Founders’ advice?
Founders’ Advice on Ukraine
-
Drawing on John Quincy Adams’ 1821 admonition that America "goes not abroad in search of monsters to destroy," the lecture argues the Founders would oppose current U.S. involvement in Ukraine—and would expect American diplomacy to respect prudence, vital national interests, and restraint ([34:29–36:37]).
- Quote:
"America goes not abroad in search of monsters to destroy. She is the well wisher of the freedom and independence of all, but the champion and vindicator only of her own."
— John Quincy Adams (quoted by Professor) [35:49]
- Quote:
Call to Ongoing Study
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The episode closes by urging listeners to carefully study the documents and arguments themselves, and to approach questions of foreign policy thoughtfully as both citizens and voters.
- Quote:
"Try to make up your own mind about what you think is the right course for American foreign policy. And keep that in mind when you go to the polls..."
— Professor [36:30]
- Quote:
Notable Quotes and Memorable Moments
-
On Founding Foreign Policy:
"We cannot assign American property or lives to your cause. You need to do that yourselves."
— Jeremiah Regan (paraphrasing J.Q. Adams) [00:20] -
On Libya:
"There's good intentions, but then there is the consequence of those intentions, and that's not always good."
— Juan Davalos [02:54]
"Gaddafi bad, lack of Gaddafi even worse."
— Jeremiah Regan [03:10] -
On America First:
"With every decision and every action, we are now putting America first."
— Donald Trump (via Juan Davalos) [04:11] -
On the Iraq War and its Lessons:
"Biting off more than they could chew, for trying to do more than was achievable through US arms..."
— Professor [07:31] -
On Nonproliferation & Broken U.S. Promises:
"Breaking a deal we had made certainly weakened our international position..."
— Professor [12:11] -
On Present Policy in Ukraine:
"I think [the Founders] would be bewildered at any argument that suggested we need to be involved in that conflict and insistent that we stay out of it."
— Professor [34:54] -
The Adams Doctrine Revisited:
"She is the well wisher of the freedom and independence of all, but the champion and vindicator only of her own."
— John Quincy Adams (quoted) [35:49]
Noteworthy Timestamps
- 00:20–01:55 — Founding era and John Quincy Adams on foreign policy
- 02:54–04:11 — Libya intervention, consequences of failed good intentions
- 04:11–04:56 — Trump’s “America First” policy and return to founding principles
- 05:33–09:44 — Obama’s campaign, Cairo speech, policy continuities and differences from Bush administration
- 12:11–16:03 — Libya’s aftermath, impact on nonproliferation, rise of ISIS
- 18:50–25:43 — Iran Nuclear Deal details, criticisms, and its reversal under Trump
- 28:33–29:43 — Trump’s ISIS campaign, “America First” doctrine, NATO critique
- 34:29–36:37 — Ukraine, return to founding principles, the unresolved debate over interventionism
Final Reflection
The conclusion asserts that American foreign policy continues to oscillate between interventionism and restraint, a debate still unresolved since the end of the Cold War. The course's final message encourages citizens to critically engage with these enduring questions, informed by the nation’s founding wisdom and an awareness of the real-world consequences of foreign intervention.
For further study: Listeners are invited to take free Hillsdale College online courses to deepen their understanding of American history and principles.