← The Human Upgrade: Biohacking for Longevity & Performance
The Human Upgrade: Biohacking for Longevity & Performance
Why 18-Year-Olds Wake Up Fresh (And You Don't) : 1410
00:58:50
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A
The stem cells that I get intravenously, whether they're my own or someone else's, it's 100 million. That's an expensive procedure.
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B
A lot of these stem cells are caught in this network of blood vessels and then they die. So the real survival of injection of stem cells is roughly about 20%. You lose your cells, sorry, your health every day. It's literally like your bank account. If your income does not match your expenses on that day, you've run a deficit. You end up with a bankruptcy in a tissue. That's your disease. If we could do this, it would probably be like the strongest long technology so far. The only thing that I know that can slow down a conversion is fasting. So so far, fasting is the only thing that has been shown to like rejuvenate your stem cells. The science shows three days. You need to fast three days cheaper.
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A
You put money back in the bank by doing that. You put stem cells back in the bank.
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B
All we do is that we take you where you are right now and we swing you back 10, 20 years earlier.
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A
You're listening to the Human Upgrade with Dave Asprey. Here's something even the most dialed in biohackers miss. You can look great and feel fine, but you could still be aging fast on the inside in one area but not another. That's because each of your organ systems.
- [01:14]
C
Ages at its own pace.
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A
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C
Alcohol kills your sleep and ages your brain every time you drink it. If you want to relax and connect but still feel clear the next day, there's a better way. And that better way is Trucava Kava Calms your nervous system and enhances social connection by increasing gaba Dopamine and serotonin activity in the South Pacific. They've used kava for over 3000 years for relaxed mental clarity, social connection and resilience, all while supporting brain health and longevity. I'm excited because Tru Kava just released their new instant powders. For the first time, you can get the authentic whole food kava experience in a clean mix and go sachet format. I travel with these powders because they actually deliver all of the relaxing social benefits I want without destroying my sleep score or metabolic health. If you want the relaxing effects of alcohol without the downsides, this is the upgrade. Go to trucava.com and use code Dave. 10 for 10% off. That's T R U K A V A.com for 10% off.
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A
Longevity is a major pillar of biohacking. In fact, biohacking itself, when I created it, was in part to get the bodybuilders and the neuroscientists and the astronauts and the special forces guys and the meditation gurus and the monks and neuroscientists and longevity docs all talking together, because we're all working on changing our state. And this episode is going to go deep on longevity because really, biohacking is longevity and consciousness, if you really boil it all down, because you're going to get your energy back and go, wow, I think I want to live longer. I think I want to live longer. I think I don't want to act like a jerk and be unhappy all the time. And there you go, longevity and consciousness. And that's why you see the biohacking conference as beyond biohacking. And you'll see more and more of that. That's why 40 years of Zen has been a part of this work, which is the spiritual and consciousness side, as well as things like Unlimited Life, my concierge longevity program. And so when we go into longevity, it can be really confusing. When I wrote Superhuman, which is my big longevity book, that kind of set the framework for a lot of them, like, oh, there's four. I call them killers because calling them horsemen just seemed kind of douchey and over overdone. But there's four killers and then there's seven to 12, depending on how you want to call it. Causes of aging. So there's a recipe for aging, and you need to get all the ingredients right. But some ingredients are signals for other ingredients. And just like with the killers, if you get diabetes, it's going to increase your risk of Alzheimer's and cancer and cardiovascular disease. So don't get diabetes. Will be step one. And when it comes to longevity, I'm always about mitochondria. Like, those should be working, otherwise nothing else works. But there are some things that are really important. And one of the pillars of aging was around stem cell exhaustion. You run out of stem cells. So we're going to go really deep in this episode with a good friend who's been on the show before, who's a stem cell scientist and a neuroscientist trained at McGill named Christian Drepo.
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B
Christian.
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A
Christian, welcome back, my friend.
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B
Thank you so much, Dave. Always a pleasure to be here with you.
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A
Now, every time we sit down, I find I learned something new. Whether it's some obscure plant compound that you inhaled in the jungle at some point in your explorations or when we first sat down. I've done a lot of research on a black pepper extract, and it has a downside. And I'm like, all right, here's all my research. And we sat for two hours and we talked about dose and all kinds of stuff. And you actually changed my mind, which is really cool. I'm willing to change my mind, but it takes a pretty good mind to change my mind because I did my homework. So I've, I'd say, earned my respect multiple times. So I'm. I'm looking forward to our conversation.
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B
Thank you.
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A
I want to frame this around that one cause of aging. And again, guys, it's not the only cause. It's just a primary cause. And if there's the only thing you pay attention to, it's probably not going to do everything, but it's going to knock down multiple ducks. Let's talk about stem cell exhaustion. You've been on the show and you've shown with very strong science that stem regen, your company, can release about 10 million stem cells with a dose. Which is interesting because the stem cells that I get intravenously, whether they're my own or someone else's, it's 100 million. That's an expensive procedure. And I'm not saying they're equivalent, but they're pretty similar. But you've done more deep diving on stem cells and longevity than a lot of people are using them clinically for healing. And tell me your latest thinking about stem cells and longevity.
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B
Okay. I mean, you've mentioned a lot of things here that are really important to touch. Let me just open a quick parenthesis. You're talking about 100 million stem cell injection versus releasing 10 million. And I know that oftentimes people ask, like, where is this 10 million coming from. It's very simple. We roughly double the number of stem cells in circulation. And in a nor, it's about 10 to 12 million stem cells in circulation. So that's where this 10 million is coming from. But when you release your own stem cells, you release them in your arterial blood. When you get an injection, it goes into the venous blood. Your venous blood will go first to the lungs. And with the very, very small microvasculature, a lot of these stem cells are caught in this network of blood vessels. And then. Did I. So the real survival of injection of stem cells is roughly about 20%. Okay, so you get 100 million. You get roughly about 20 million that are effective. I mean, it goes deeper than this. But oftentimes when we just look at the numbers, all of these details are kind of lost from the picture. So releasing 10 million is significant.
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A
It is very significant. And for any supplement, it's not really how much you take, it's how much will the body absorb. Correct. And that's why something like spinach is so funny. Oh, it has iron, May, but you can't absorb the iron because it's bound up with oxalate. Or you take a supplement. They used to call them bedpan bullets, like the centrum, those, those nasty multivitamins that are not particularly good for you. They don't break down in the gut, and they find them in bedpans in hospitals. So if you take something and it doesn't go in, you don't get the benefits. And what you're saying is with an IV of stem cells, the majority actually may not make it beyond the lungs, and they can still have benefits. And this is different than injecting stem cells, say in a tooth, you had to extract it or in a joint or something. And again, those are orthopedic, expensive procedures, and those are for repair versus for longevity. Just want to make that clear for listeners.
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B
Correct. Okay, correct.
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A
So 10 million. What's it going to do?
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B
I mean, 10 million. Well, first, 10 million do this twice a day. Do this for a month. You have released in Your arterial blood 600 million of your own stem cells. So the difference is also not on the one time application, but on the fact that you really get cumulative impact of releasing your stem cells every day. Okay, but, but coming back to what you were talking about in terms of longevity. So stem cells is one of the hallmarks of aging. Stem cell exhaustion, I should say. But I think it's super important to understand what it means stem cell exhaustion, because there are really two sides to stem cells. Number one, it's not really exhaustion. Let's call it decline.
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Okay.
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Your bone marrow, red marrow, converts into fatty marrow. That is a much, much poor secretor of stem cells. It makes much fewer stem cells. So as you age and that red marrow converts into fatty marrow, then you release fewer and fewer stem cells.
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A
Can we stop that process?
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I mean, this would be like an amazing field of research. I guess this is the next field that I would like to go to. Like, how can we slow down the conversion of the red marrow? Because if we could do this, it would probably be like the strongest longevity technology.
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A
Okay, so let's just think about it. We don't want to slow it down. That's like saying, I want to increase my health span. No, you want to live twice as long and be healthier than you are today. That's what you really want. So let's reverse the fatty buildup in our marrow and let's make it like 18 year old, like monster bone marrow. Like that's a better goal.
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B
We could look at this. The big question, and it's really the big obstacle in all that research is that why is it that we have that conversion? Because at the end of the day, when you're 18, you're still growing. I mean, you're not into your full growth, let's say of. Of between, let's say 8 to 15 years old. Yeah, but you need a lot of stem cells to, to fuel that growth. Once you finish that growth, too much stem cells could be detrimental to you in terms of like cancer promotion. And so that there, there's a consequence of that growth burst that is happening on top of oxidative stress and inflammation and all kinds of things. So is there a reason why that number of stem cells decline? And if you reverse it, technically, reconversion is the red flag for leukemia. So somewhere, like, there's probably a very healthy part to it, but it needs to be studied super carefully. So right now, I would say if we just slow it down, we've already have achieved quite something. Something that is quite significant. And so far, the only thing that I know that can slow down a conversion is fasting.
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A
There you go. It's almost like someone should write a big book about that that makes intermittent fasting popular. How long do you have to fast to get bone marrow effects?
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I mean, you can look at the science and you can look at life. The science shows three days. You need to fast. Three days, 72 per fast. Is intermittent fasting going to do it? My Gut feeling is that yes, it will, but it does it into a magnitude that makes it hard to quantify and it's cumulative. You do this a little bit every day. I do believe that it will do it, but so far it has not been quantified.
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A
That's totally reasonable answer. It makes sense. Probably no one studied it, but we know three days works.
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Three days worked. But the most important, I think is that through autophagy, the rejuvenation of stem cells. Because as we age, your stem cells are not as effective as you age. So there are many things that go down. The number, their effectiveness at stem cells, the terrain that signals these stem cells to come. Like there's a lot of things that are slowly going down, but the response of the stem cells to the signaling and their potency as a stem cell goes down as you age because most likely of accumulation of unfolded protein. Like all the stuff that is taken care of when you stimulate autophagy and fasting has been shown to do that with stem cells. So so far fasting is the only thing that has been shown to like rejuvenate your stem cells. So I would say with what we know right now with stem cell research, twice a year do a three days fast and it's going to really support that bank of stem cells that you have.
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A
Okay, so that's an easy. And it turns out it's not free to fast for three days. It's cheaper than eating for three. So you put money back in the bank by doing that, you put stem cells back in the bank. All right, I like that.
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B
So that's one part of exhaustion, like the slow decrease over time as you age. So far there's nothing that we can do against it. But it's not exhaustion. It's just like stem cell decline, if you will. Exhaustion in terms of aging is really exhausting the stem cell pool that we have in every single tissues, every organs and tissues of the body have their own stem cells. They're playing a crucial role in the day to day renewal of these tissues. Life is at the end. And it's really that the key message at the end of this is that life health is really a balance between two phenomenon. Degeneration, tissue turnover and replacing the cells that are being lost. And that's the role of stem cells. So as stem cells decline, you lose that balance. And but day to day, the stem cell layer of tissues help maintain this process when you exhaust these stem cells, because in one of your tissue there's a stress that is above normal. Take colitis in people with gut issues. Whatever it is, every single tissue has a limit into that stem cell layer. When that stem cell population has been exhausted, that's when that tissue is experiencing significant stress. And when you develop the disease associated with that tissue, that's the stem cell exhaustion, that cause of disease formation. And you can replenish these stem cells by releasing stem cells from the bone marrow. That's the therapeutic or the bio hacking strategy to compensate for stem cell exhaustion.
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A
Is there some kind of exercise technique that helps to release stem cells from the marrow? Or is this mostly a supplement game like you do with stem regen?
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B
It's interestingly enough, I mean I was talking about many ways in the past like that you can release stem cells at the end of the day, quite frankly, the only one is to take plant extract that trigger the release of your own stem cells. Physical activity will do it, intense physical activity. But that's because you create micro lesions, microtraumas that call for repair. So you release stem cells to repair these areas in your body. So they're released to repair tissues. So if you now use them for other things, then it's your tissues, your muscles don't have all the stem cells that they need. So at the end it's a clear game of releasing stem cells to repair your tissues. I'm not sure that it, that it really gives you a longevity advantage. Fasting is probably the best one. Yeah, these are the main ones.
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A
It's interesting because your new work, it's about the role of free stem cells as signaling molecules. So it makes some sense that if you're to do, I don't know, the old biohacking things, high intensity interval training or lifting heavy instead of pink weights and going for a long run. The presence of those stem cells to go and repair the muscles may have other beneficial signal effects that could explain some of why some exercise, but not all exercise and not too much exercise is good for longevity. But we don't know for sure.
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We don't know.
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A
So how do stem cells act as signalers? Because this is new information in longevity. No one's talking about this.
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B
Let me take one step back because you're bringing a topic that is absolutely fascinating. So I'm working on my next book that talks about a lot of these things. And the more I'm diving into it, the more I'm like, I don't know, what's the right word? Impressed, touched, Fascinated by all the sciences really coming together. Signaling in the body is something that is not talked about a lot and yet it is like, so, so important. There's signaling at so many different levels in the body. A cell signal signaling to neighboring cells, a nerve cell releasing neurotransmitter, that's a form of signaling cells releasing compounds that will have effect far in the body. So this is your endocrine system. But stem cells through exosomes do a very, very unique kind of signaling, which is releasing pockets of growth factors, peptides, bioregulated peptides. And what they do essentially is orchestrating the repair that is taking place in a tissue which has various steps, but essentially it's shutting down inflammation, stimulating some part of the immune system, shutting down the immune system as well. Once it has done its role of eliminating bacteria, cleaning up tissues, they need to stop. So it suppresses the immune system and it stimulates the repair of the stem cells that are residing in that tissue. So it's basically like a. I don't know how you would call it, like the chief of, like the commanders that comes on the, on the reparation site if you want, and start to coordinate the whole repair system, the whole repair process. Stem cells do that.
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A
Are there a lot of mitochondria in stem cells? You think I would know this, but I've never asked.
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B
I mean, there is a lot. But I think more relevant than saying there's a lot of mitochondria in a stem cell, it's to understand that one stem cell will proliferate, and if it multiplies to its full extent, it's 50 generation. So 50 generation, like you do the math, it takes one cell, one stem cell becomes like billions tissue cells, potentially. Each of these cells need to have multiple mitochondria. So the process of mitochondrial biogenesis, like making new mitochondria in all these new cells, is probably somewhere, I would say one of the greatest, if not the greatest metabolic demand of the body, but so far, not really studied. So it's almost like your greatest demand. And it's like a phantom demand right now, like it's a ghost. Understand or. I've studied the impact of this. It's huge.
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C
Staring at screens all day is wrecking your vision and your brain. You might just think it's aging, but it's not. It's a broken eye brain connection. And it gets worse every hour you spend looking at a screen. If you plan to live to 180 and beyond, you need to protect your dominant sense. Now here's the good news. You can train your visual system just like you train your body or Your Brain Screen Fit is a science backed method built by Dr. Bryce Applebaum that rebuilds how your brain and eyes work together. No eye drops, no appointments, no gimmicks. Just 15 minutes a day to sharpen focus, reduce fatigue and protect your vision.
- [19:11]
A
For the long haul.
- [19:12]
C
I saw real results in just a week. If you strive for peak performance or plan to live a very long time like I do, you want clear vision to match? Go to screenfit.com Dave or use code Dave to get $200 off and try it for yourself. You'll see what I mean.
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A
Literally.
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C
Your omega 3 index is one of the most reliable markers for your longevity.
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A
It measures your EPA and DHA levels in your red blood cells.
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C
And you can raise your omega 3.
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A
Index by taking fish oil. Problem is that most fish oil on the market is already rancid by the time you take it. Oxidized fish oil drives inflammation and it accelerates your aging. It's not a good thing.
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C
That's why I choose Puree fish oil.
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A
Puree delivers 2000mg of long chain omega 3 fatty acids, EPA and DHA in the right forms and the right ratios for longevity. You take EPA because it supports joints, muscles and cardiovascular function. And you take DHA because it builds.
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C
And maintains brain and nerve tissue.
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And here's the best part. Puree tests every batch for more than 2,000 contaminants and for oxidation.
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They're the only brand that's third party tested for each batch and they publish their results online.
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You can scan the QR code on.
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Each bottle and see results for the.
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Exact batch you're taking. So if longevity matters to you and.
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Purity matters to you, clean fish oil.
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A
Should be in your sack.
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Go to puree.comdave that's p u o.
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A
R I.comdave to get 32% off puree fish oil when you start a subscription. That's P-O-R I.com Dave to get the software. And we've looked at Mitophagy, which is getting rid of old mitochondria and replacing them with new ones. And lots of the biohacks do that. But this idea that there's a cost to build a new brain cell, a new neuron and to build a new stem cell and to build a new whatever cell. And there's an extra cost to build all the mitochondria inside the cells. Of course you need all the minerals which most people are depleted of and you need all the fatty acids. And then you need the actual electrical capacity and machinery available to make Those. And if you're going to take one cell that can have thousands of mitochondria and replicate the cell, you have to replicate thousands of them. But here's the cool thing. Mitochondria in the body, they talk to each other. They vote with quorum sensing. I mean, you know that. And they actually use an algorithm that's almost identical to one of our crypto algorithms for establishing trust. So they're like, what's going on over there? What's going on over there? And they all kind of decide almost in real time. So if you're saying, Dave, you're overstating the mitochondria thing. No, this is Martin Paul's work. And these guys are a whole society of bacteria that are doing all sorts of stuff. So we know that if you have a large injection of young, healthy mitochondria, they signal to the other mitochondria the state of the system. And when you have a lot of young, healthy mitochondria, the whole system health kind of upgrades, which means it allocates energy towards healing better. So having more circulating stem cells, having more younger, healthier tissues means more healthier, younger mitochondria, which means a better mitochondrial network, which would make so much sense with everything we're talking about.
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B
Correct.
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A
Okay.
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B
Mitochondrial biogenesis. And it brings another aspect, which, I mean, you're an expert in this. The whole idea of stacking. And what I mean by this is that when we do scientific studies, oftentimes we want to study the impact of one thing on health. And if you put more than one thing, you confuse the whole project. I mean, everybody reacts differently to multiple things. So you never study multiple things. It's very difficult to study multiple things. So you study, in science the impact, let's say, of releasing your stem cells, but in real life, you want to release your stem cells, you want to boost your microcirculation, you want to boost mitochondrial biogenesis. You want to also include a lot of healthy. Because the integrity and the health of the membrane of every single one of these cells, including the membrane of the mitochondria, must have the right proportion of fats. So it's really when you add all of these together that you really maximize the impact of just releasing your own stem cells. They all play together.
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A
I'm so glad you said that. I oftentimes wonder. You get these big, dumb pharmaceutical trials, and I say they're dumb because you can talk to these really brilliant researchers. And guys, I'm not calling you dumb at all. I'm calling the Trial design, dumb. And they're saying, we're going to isolate the one thing. There is no scientific validity to the untested assumption that it is just one thing.
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B
Actually, it is not.
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A
Yeah. What's the one thing that makes lemonade? Is it water, sugar, or lemons? Let's test each one individually. There's no lemonade. So I kind of wonder, okay, you have this amazing drug that you think is going to stop cardiovascular disease. Oh, it doesn't work. But if everyone had fish oil with it, it could work 10 times better. But they never test it, and it drives me crazy. So if you really wanted to design a study for longevity, for outcomes, what is the outcome? Let's throw everything that will do that and let's see if we can make it happen. And then you might want to pull back half of that. You might want to go back. But they never do it because they're not selling everything. They're selling the one thing. And so the study design is based on an untested assumption that a single thing works. And we've learned over and over in biohacking and supplements, in the world of longevity, you can't fix thyroid without fixing testosterone. You gotta do them both or you don't get results. So thank you for saying that. And this is like a functional medicine, longevity and biohacking perspective that I think we could use on the other side, even in pharma, how do you stack things? How do you know what to do?
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B
We need to understand it is the almost unavoidable gap between pure research and clinical application. Like, for example, we have a product, stem regen, release it, put more stem cells in circulation. We have cases sometimes of absolute remarkable recovery. And when we ask the people, so tell me, when did you start to take stem regen in this and what do you think has been the role of stem regen into your recovery? And people will say, well, it's not the only thing that I did. And now it becomes really complex to be able to say what was the contribution of each supplement. So from a research standpoint, you want to isolate them to make the results more clear and the conclusion more clear. But you don't want to do this from a therapeutic standpoint. For a therapeutic standpoint, you want to put everything together, but that is extremely difficult to study. You do, like, you release stem cells and you boost mitochondrial function. You study these two together and you come and you say, yeah, but what about if we added fatty 15 on top of that? Or fish oil? Yeah, okay, then let's add this. And what about if we add it? And then you can go on like this, and you make the study too complicated to be able to draw conclusion. And that's the unavoidable gap between pure research and clinical research. The pure research tells you if something is good or not when it comes to applying it to yourself. You want to stack. It's unavoidable. You want to stack. So for me, if you're talking about releasing stem cells, is understanding, okay, the repair process is how many stem cells you have in circulation. How good are these stem cells? What is the access that they have to the tissue, where they need to go, and how responsive or to the signaling is that tissue to be able to attract and accept these stem cells? These are, I would say, looking from a distance, the four things that you want to do together. You want to increase your microcirculation, you want to reduce inflammation in the tissue, and you want to boost mitochondria. These are like the four main things to do. You can do other things. These are like, I would say, if you're asking what are the main thing to stack with stem cells, it would be those four.
- [26:59]
A
One of the things that I like about your approach is you're a gifted herbalist. In addition to the stem cell and neuroscience side of things, what you do. So you put together stacks and then you run trials on them. Say, what do they do when they're combined in this way? Right. So then you can study it almost like a pharmaceutical, except you're now studying this tested stack that has synergies built in, works. And it's entirely possible that one of the ingredients in one of the Simergen products may not be providing very much benefit on top of the others. But you've proven that the sack works, and that's okay.
- [27:36]
B
It's okay. And then the other thing that is complicated in these kinds of studies is the more ingredients that you add. Every ingredient is metabolized differently in different people. Acts with a different timeframe could lead to different side effects, like other things in different people, to the point that at the end, if you really want to prove something with a stack, you need to dramatically increase the number of participants in a study. And that means cost. So if you start to add, let's say, four things in your stack, then the cost is almost like 10 times higher. So who can pay for the studies where you do stacks? So at the end of the day, it's almost like it becomes like an individual decision. You look at everything that you have, and let's See what seems to be working well for me.
- [28:26]
A
And when you're designing a stack the way you do at Stem Regen, you put together a stack that's likely to work, and you study the whole stack together, but you're not testing how much of each ingredient, because that really is millions and millions and millions of dollars for very little additional knowledge.
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B
Correct.
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A
Right. And certainly I do the same thing when I'm formulating. It's like, we know that the body needs these five things, but there is an upper limit. If you see 55 ingredients in a single pill, there's a good chance that one or two of those might not be compatible with you. So there's diminishing returns from adding complexity to a stack as well. And you have basically four different groupings within the Stem Regen family of things. And it's around those four things you just talked about.
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B
Right?
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A
Okay.
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B
Yeah, yeah.
- [29:13]
A
It seems like a really logical approach, and people can say, all right, I want to take Release, which is like the first one they take to get more stem cells, and then they can direct them, and they can use the other products stacked on top to get that whole system regenerative thing. And I've been using Stem Regen since it first came out. I can't say I. Because you actually sent it to my parents, because I asked you to. And my parents will say that they're relatively skeptical. They're older, and they're also into their supplements. And so I sent it to them, and then after the end of the first couple months of it, they said, you know, they say it's for everything they've ever taken. I can't really tell if it's working right. And they'll say that for coffee, I think I could give my parents meth. And they'd be like, I don't really know if it's working. They would feel it, but they just wouldn't think they would. And, no, I don't give my parents meth. That would be mean. Don't take meth. But the thing that was most telling is they come said, can you send more? Right. So, like, we know it's working, but we don't want to think that. We know it's working, but they don't ask for more of a lot of things. And they've been on this for the last year or two and seen meaningful benefits from it, which is really cool. So thank you for being willing to do that. And that's just a testament. Do I practice what I preach? Yeah, I actually do take Stem Or Jen. And if I send it to my parents, you can be pretty sure that I believe in it.
- [30:34]
B
Very cool.
- [30:35]
A
And by the way, guys, since I'm doing a little Testimonial there. Stemregen Co Dave. 30 and get 30% off. If you want to give this a try, it's worth your time, it's worth your energy, especially if you're putting together a longevity strategy or if you've been injured, had recent surgery, anything like that. If you're in recovery from any kind of thing, even say you wanted to prove that you were really manly by attempting suicide by running a marathon, you might want to take some of this to recover. And I don't want to make light of suicide. I just want to say the guy who ran the first marathon died from running the marathon.
- [31:14]
B
I didn't know.
- [31:15]
A
Yeah, that's why we celebrate that achievement. So a soldier ran, guys who are historians and really study ancient Greece. He ran from Sparta to Athens. I don't know. He ran 26.2 miles to say, the bad guys are coming. And then as soon as he delivered the news, he died of a heart attack. And we're celebrating him by running 26.2 miles. And I think it's awesome. If you want to do that once in your life, take SIM regen when you're done and probably while you're training. A little while ago, I went on this insane trip where I was in Europe and Dubai and then back to the US and back to Europe, and then I was just all over the place for almost two months straight. It was really intense travel, and it took stem regen all the time. But, I mean, could I have just taken my gut back for a week or two? How long do I need to take it in order to get a recovery effect versus longevity effect?
- [32:09]
B
It's a cool question, but we could probably do like a whole podcast just with that question, so I'll try to make it simple. Like I mentioned before, your ability to be healthy is a balance between two things. Normal tissue turnover, you lose cells. How many stem cells you have to compensate. Oftentimes, we think even the way that I talked about it in the past, to simplify this whole equation, to just say, put more stem cells and then your tissue can repair better. And as I'm diving into that science for my next book, something that has come out that I find just fascinating is that it's true. But it's true to a much deeper level. It's not just a stem cell that will go, let's say, in Your pancreas and become a pancreatic cell. Is that the stem cel? It will become new blood vessels, it will become new cells that support the function of your beta cells. So at the end, it's your entire environment that is being rebuilt. So if you start to release your own stem cells in your body, it may take you much longer to restore the environment before you can actually repair the tissue. So it really varies from one person to another. When you start to release stem cells, it's not just like a one to one repair. So depending where you are in your health journey or where your health is, sometimes you may have to take, I don't know, every day for two, three months before you have repaired enough of the overlying structure, if you want of tissues to be able to now start to have a real impact on the actual repair that you will feel. So it starts to work the moment that you start to take it. But the time that it takes for you to start to experience the benefit really varies as to where you are in your health.
- [33:50]
A
So if I'm absurdly healthy, what's the minimum length of time that I want to use stem regen?
- [33:56]
B
If you're super healthy, interestingly enough, it will be hard for you to feel it because you've released your stem cells since the day you're born. You release them every day. Let me put this as a question. If you take something that boosts your immune system, what do you feel out of it? You feel nothing. You don't feel your immune cells working.
- [34:14]
A
Maybe you get less inflammation or you don't get sick when you would have got sick or something.
- [34:17]
B
But if you're super healthy, you already don't have a lot of inflammation, you don't feel it.
- [34:21]
A
I guess I've never. I mean I, I am absurdly resilient and healthy now, but growing up, if I do stuff, I. I know where the inflammation goes ever. Even now I know, I just know how to manage it. But I guess there are people out there, they just, I know of some like they eat like shit and then they just beat their bodies up. They don't sleep and it doesn't seem to affect them at all.
- [34:40]
B
Some people are extremely resilient, I suspect. Actually that's a project that we're working on right now with professional athletes counting how many stem cells is in the bloodstream of a pool of, let's say 50 to 100 athletes. And then make the correlation between how many stem cells they have in their blood and the number of games that they have. Missed because of an injury.
- [35:02]
A
Wow.
- [35:02]
B
Because the reality there that I'm sure this is what we'll find, is that people who are more inclined to injury take one step back. Anytime you have an injury, it's rarely. Because this is a fresh injury, like there was nothing there before. Oftentimes you get repeat micro injuries, micro lesions that do not repair fully, and that's where you're weak, and that's when the injury happens. So if you were able to repair these microlesions before, then you don't have the injury that will make you miss games. So. And you don't repair well if you don't have enough stem cells in circulation. So I am sure the conclusion will be that the people that have more stem cells in circulation don't miss a whole lot of games. People who don't have enough stem cells in circulation miss more games. So in this whole picture, it's just that if you can repair every day better, you avoid the bigger problem down the road.
- [35:54]
A
Wow. It makes so much sense. And this is a question. I don't know if you'll know the answer to it, but I've often thought about this. So when you're healing an injury, whether it's a micro lesion or, say, surgery or you broke something or whatever, there's how quickly do you repair, and then there's how well do you repair.
- [36:12]
B
Correct.
- [36:12]
A
And what we're doing is, you know, we're building new fascia or new whatever the tissue is. And ideally, we have perfectly formed cells that integrate well, but rarely do we have that because we have scar tissue. And scar tissue is basically gnarly growth where you see the scars. If you have more stem cells, do you get less scarring and tissue formation? And we have data on that.
- [36:33]
B
Oh, yeah. There's tons of data on, actually.
- [36:35]
A
Interesting.
- [36:36]
B
Again, if you look at it from a distance, anytime there's pressure on the tissue, an organ, so it's struggling, it's trying to repair, but you don't have enough stem cells in circulation to get a full, complete repair. The tissue itself will try to repair on its own, and that means fibrosis. So that's how you develop fibrosis in the liver. That's how you develop scar tissue. Every in the heart, every single tissue will develop a form of fibrosis if it cannot fully repair optimally. And that's the role of stem cells. The moment you put more stem cells in circulation, then the tissue will utilize these stem cells to repair optimally, and you will dramatically decrease the amount of scar Tissue. We see this a lot with surgeons, so we work with surgeons and then the surgeon that will put their patients on stem regen will see their patients recover much faster. But the biggest, I would say positive is that with very little scar tissue. Take knee replacement for example. Knee replacement surgery. One of the biggest, I wouldn't say side effects, but one of the biggest consequence or remnants of the problem is that the knee will heal, but it will create scar tissue which will then limit the amplitude of the movement, range of motion. That's the main consequences. Oftentimes they have to go back. Oftentimes at times they have to go back, do a second surgery to remove the scar tissue that is limiting the range of motion. Now add more stem cells into the mix and you don't see that.
- [38:08]
A
Wow.
- [38:09]
B
I mean, I even have cases of people. One fellow came to see me one day and as a teenager he had an accident with a chainsaw. So basically the chainsaw hit his calf and it tore the muscle. It healed with scar tissue. And his entire life he was walking, he was limping because his leg was actually slightly bent because of a limitation here, he could not extend his leg. So he just started to release his own stem cells every day. And within a matter of three to six months, he regained full range of motion with his legs. So it's not only during the time of repair, but it's also to understand that it's very, very common for scar tissue to remain physiologically active, meaning it keeps signaling for repair. And when you start to put more stem cells in circulation, then that area can now restart the repair process and remove the scar tissue and heal normally.
- [39:03]
A
That's incredible. And if there's tissue in your body that's signaling for repair and not repairing, that is by definition stressed tissue. It is. And it's going to be releasing systemic inflammatory cytokines. So old scar tissue, we're learning more and more that you can treat it with lasers, with certain oils, with, with scar injection therapy. And I've noticed big differences. I had three surgeries on my knee before I was 23 and several other things like that over the years. And yeah, I have noticed a softening of my scar tissue for sure. I also take high dose serrapeptase which helps, but wow, that's, that's intriguing. So old injuries could potentially heal when there's more stem cells.
- [39:45]
B
Yeah. And, and there's an easy way to test for it. If it's on the skin, it's easy, it's deeper in the body, it's still doable but it's not as easy. But for example, let's say you got a significant scar on your skin. Most of these scars, not all of them, but they're still physiologically active. To test for this, it's very simple. It's better if somebody else does it to you. But take the pulse and then suddenly touch the scar with, I don't know, with a piece of paper, whatever. Just touch the scar. The scar will release adrenaline and adrenaline, the moment that it's released, not long term, but the moment that it's released, create a massive vasodilation. And then suddenly the pulse will shut down. You will see the pressure, the way you feel the pulse goes down for one beat or two. You've just told yourself that that scar is active.
- [40:31]
A
Wow.
- [40:32]
B
So now that you know this start to take like stem regen release, put more stem cells in circulation and then mass this scar. Not to the pain, to the point where you create a pain that is like too much, you have to work it, but to the point that it signals. And then, and then. So the more you tear it, microscopic tear, but you tear it with stem cells in circulation. I have literally seen severe burn scar in a matter of a few months, completely disappearing.
- [40:58]
A
Wow.
- [41:01]
B
You need, you need to stimulate the.
- [41:02]
A
Signal and a shout out here for shockwave therapy and wasabi. There you go. That'll help with tissue remodeling.
- [41:09]
B
Correct.
- [41:10]
A
And if you have extra stem cells recirculating. Thanks. Stem regen. And it's, it's pretty incredible when you get that signal and probably whole body vibration, some stretching, but just, just massage of that scar tissue, just really working. It is a way to get that signal in. What about lasers that probably could also drive some.
- [41:31]
B
You mean laser. Because there's a technique that is like a deep tissue laser that allows to actually remove the impact of these scars.
- [41:38]
A
I mean like, like cold laser stuff, not the, not the lasers that are going to cut.
- [41:42]
B
Yeah. I mean, a lot of these methods, like, like pmf, for example, we've used PMF with sports injury for decades.
- [41:49]
A
That's at upgrade labs all the time.
- [41:50]
B
There you go. And what we know today is that the actual mechanism of action of PMF is to stimulate stem cell pooling in an area, stimulate their migration into a tissue, stimulate their proliferation. And if you apply PMF to a test tube with stem cells, you trigger their conversion into tendons, muscles, bones.
- [42:10]
A
Interesting.
- [42:10]
B
So suddenly you have a method that has been very well known to help repair from injuries. And we discovered that its mechanism of action is actually to stimulate stem cell function. So now take stem regen release an hour before your PMF session. And now you basically have more stem cells to receive the signaling coming from PMF and you boost your repair. Stem cells is becoming really like the more I'm looking at it and diving into science, it's like the cornerstone of healing of just about anything in the body. It's fascinating.
- [42:43]
A
What about the brain?
- [42:44]
B
The brain is the same. It's just a little bit more complex and limited. Like you release stem cells and if you go into tissues that have a very rapid turnover, your skin, your gut, these are probably the main ones. You release stem cells, they will go directly to the tissue, become cells of that tissue, and they will actually do the repair. You go to the other end of the spectrum with tissues that have a very slow turnover like the brain, like the heart. And in these tissues, stem cells migra tissue and then locally they start to signal, so they signal to the tissues resident stem cells to do the repair. So that is the reason why in tissues like the heart or the brain, repair is totally still possible, but less than what you would find, let's say in your skin. But, but, but it is triggered and, and orchestrated by stem cells.
- [43:34]
A
That is incredible. So if you're listening to this show, guys, you should probably fast for three days, twice a year, totally free. If you're dealing with scar tissue or recent injury or recovery of any kind, you might want to take some semrijen because it should work better and give.
- [43:53]
B
It some time because that's something. We have not published that data. But when we started this work looking for plans that triggered the release of stem cells, what we saw. And at first it was a challenge because we did the work on ourselves and once, probably like a year and a half to document what's the best dose, what's the best protocol, what's the best time to test? And like after we've worked all of this, then we expanded all this work with volunteers that were. It was in Climate Falls, which is a small town, but volunteers from the town. And we realized that when people come and they are exposed to these plant extracts for the first time, the release on that day is very minimal. The release grows over time.
- [44:35]
A
Oh, so you can't just take it for a day or two.
- [44:37]
B
If you take it like for a few days, you have not really done a whole lot in terms of repair.
- [44:43]
A
So my post flight question earlier. Okay, I've flown around the world multiple times. I get home and I take a bottle of it that's probably not the right strategy. I should take it every day while I'm traveling, correct?
- [44:54]
B
Correct.
- [44:55]
A
Okay. Is there some argument for taking Simragen for three months and then. Then taking a couple weeks off and then starting it again? Or is this a continuous dose kind of thing? Because supplements can fall in both categories.
- [45:05]
B
Yeah, Yeah. I grew up. Grew up. Over the past 25 years, I've researched this whole process and I came to the understanding. That's what I'm going to describe in detail in my next book. But the understanding that you lose your cells. Sorry, your health every day, it's a day to day process. It's literally like your bank account. If you are. Your income does not match your expenses on that day, you've run a deficit. If you run deficits many days over time, you end up with a bankruptcy in a tissue. That's your disease. So you lose that every day. So understanding this process, well, I want to compensate for that deficit every day. So I want to put more stem cells in circulation. So your repair is a long term day to day process. But you could pause. I mean, I don't. But you could pause and you could say, I'm going to do this for two, three months, then I'll pause for a month. So there's probably. I mean, you could, you could totally do it. But you've got to do this for a long time, enough to maximize the actual stem cell mobilization process, which will take place in its maximum impact probably about after like three, four weeks.
- [46:18]
A
Okay, got it. So you need to take it for at least a month straight in order to get to the right zone and then stay in that zone for a while. But if we're talking about fixing a stem cell deficit, I think we just solved the longevity problem. So what we're gonna do, we're gonna make a federal reserve of stem cells inside the body and then we're just gonna imagine that we have more stem cells and then loan them to our bone marrow. Right. Which is then gonna just distribute these phantom cells and there won't be any negative biological. Oh, wait, I'm sorry. That's what they're doing with the US dollar right now. But that's not working very well, guys. Maybe you should quit printing more money. Just saying. Anyway, sorry, that was my political joke. But the idea that you cannot run at a deficit for long periods of time without dying, which will happen to countries that do that, like Venezuela. Right. So we've got to do that. In my books, at least one of them, I describe aging is like death from a thousand cuts. You can't find one cause and we can cluster the causes into those seven to 12, but there's all these micro insults. You have more toxins today. You didn't breathe as well, you had hypoxia. The list is literally hundreds of thousands of things that are net negative. And even with all the monitoring and testing and AI available today, we don't know the whole human exposome. And all the things that for your biology in your current state are net negative or positive complex it. And you don't have to know everything.
- [47:47]
B
You don't.
- [47:48]
A
But we do know that you're going to age if you take more hits than you can recover from. So the general longevity strategy and performance enhancement strategy behind all of biohacking is number one, stop doing the things that make you weak. So take less hits. You know, maybe you should clean the mold out of your air filters or whatever else. Right. Don't eat garbage. Right. Uh, maybe you should sleep all those so you're taking less hits and then have more energy which is that have your mitochondria functioning and then make sure that the energy goes to repair. So you have more energy but you have no repair signal or repairability. More energy is going to be like woohoo, I feel good. But you're not going to do this. So you have to direct the energy inwards and having more circulating stem cells so that the parts of the body that are asking for repair both have the energy to repair and have the raw materials and the cells they need. And so this seems like it's very much in alignment. But if you continue living a lifestyle that's really running on credit cards biologically all the time, always in a deficit. I think even if you take stem regen you're gonna have to make a few but not all possible lifestyle changes in order to see full benefits. Is that accurate?
- [48:59]
B
Totally. I mean this is. Let me summarize in a very, in a simple way and that is what I'm going to say here is really the topic of my next book where I dive into all the science and it's. You understand you don't develop problems as you age because suddenly you're having more pressure from the environment. Like your body is not facing excess pressure. It's not what's happening. Like take a very simple example, athletes, as they age, professional athletes get more and more injury. Would you say that's because they're working harder and harder?
- [49:33]
A
Probably not. They actually don't train as hard as they age.
- [49:36]
B
They probably Even train less. But let's say they train exactly the same for 20 years. Nothing has changed in the pressure they apply to their body. Why do they get more injuries? And you can take this concept and spread it to everything in your body. The reality is that because you have a repair system, which is your stem cells that declines as you age. And the gradual loss of this ability to repair makes the degenerative process now to be expressed. And now you see it and you experience it. So that means everything we develop in terms of age related disease or problem is the consequence of a gradual failure of your ability to repair. It's not like stem cells will go and will directly repair your muscle. Yes, they will. But it's a much broader concept. Meaning it's your microvasculature. It's everything that supports your collagen formation. If you have all the cel capable of doing proper collagen, then you don't develop fibrosis in the way that you would do in a tissue that is stress if you did not have proper synthesis of collagen. So you start to really upregulate all the normal physiology of your body by having enough stem cells. And then the problem does not show up because the entire body is functioning better. Everything is a consequence of a gradual failure of our ability to repair. When we understand this, it opens the door to many things. Number one diagnosis, you go and see the doctor and it's going to look at is your problem coming from your flora poor digestion or mortal imbalance, whatever. You run through a whole list of things. Never in this investigation is the question, is this person having a failure of endogenous repair, Their ability to repair. That is never considered into a health examination. So now we need to consider a new thing, which is where is your endogenous ability to repair? Your normal ability to repair? Where is that? And once we've determined this, now it also gives a therapeutic lever, which is I can boost the ability to repair. Because oftentimes you may not change anything to the degenerative process. If you just upregulate your ability to repair, you may totally take care of the problem. You did take care of that problem 20 years ago because you did not have it. Not because today you have more pressure in your life. It's just that before you had more stem cells to compensate for it. When that goes away, the problem shows up. So all we do is that we take you where you are right now and we swing you back 10, 20 years earlier when you had more stem cells in circulation and now the problem goes away. That's the general concept. It's super simple. When you dive in the science of it, it gets complicated, but I find it fascinating because it gets confirmed. I'm confirming this now. The process in the heart, in the liver, in the pancreas, in the lung, in the brain, on the skin, on joints, on virtually every aspects of human health problems develop because of a failure of our innate ability to repair. It's fascinating.
- [52:39]
A
Stem cells as a marker of resilience is a new idea. And resilience is ultimately behind a lot of the reasons I got into biohacking. I'm tired all the time, things aren't working right. And everyone I know wants to be more stress resilient, more environmentally resilient. You want to know kind of in your bones that you can handle anything that life brings your way. And I've never looked at circulating stem cells as a variable, but it seems like it's a valid one. Can I test for that in a lab today?
- [53:12]
B
You can and cannot. And I'm working hard on this right now. So give it a few years. And I think because the technology exists, we quantify stem cells in our studies. So the technology exists. The problem is that you need a flow cytometer. It used to be, it is still fairly expensive. But over the past few years, new small, portable flow cytometers have been developed. So for what, 10, 15 grand you can buy a flow cytometer. So now it becomes a tool that is available for any lab. So I'm working right now to, again, it's a main topic of that next book is as we do, an overview of the entire scientific literature. Can we come out with a number of stem cells that, if we are under that number of stem cells for a normal 40, 50 year old, you know that right now you don't have enough stem cells to offset the normal process of tissue turnover. You will develop problems. And as we go across all the scientific literature, I think I can. I mean, there are many variables. It's not one thing like it's not like black or it's not like all or none, black or white. It's if you go below, let's say one stem cell per microliter, you have not crossed a threshold that your body can still repair, can still react. But if you get something that is just a little bit too much, you don't have enough buffer. If you go below 0.5 stem cells per microliter, you are now entered a zone where you are in deficit. A bankruptcy will show up in the near future. So if you can go now and count these number of stem cells, it will then be a risk factor. Then you can see where you are in your terms of your ability to repair. So hopefully we can in the next two, three years really develop that into many, many labs so people can go and count the number of stem cells. When that is achieved, I think that the number of stem cells in circulation will probably be of the whole list of markers that you go in a blood test. It's probably going to be your most significant marker for you to know, how can I react to anything out of the ordinary that is happening to me and how long can I keep the hell that I have today for the decades to come, it's going to be how many stem cells I have in my blood today.
- [55:23]
A
I'm going to bet that within about 92% accuracy, you'll be able to look at someone's NLRP3 numbers and the downstream inflammatory cytokines like IL6 and other things like that. Guys, if that was nerd talk. NLRP3 is a master regulator of fibrosis and tissue inflammation. And that based on that level alone, you'll be able to correlate it with your stem cell counting with enough accuracy that if with the right ratios, you'll be able to accurately predict the stem cell count without having to actually have a flow cytometer.
- [55:56]
B
In general, there's no doubt in my mind that even today, with the markers that we have, you can establish whether you are in a place of repair or default of repair by things as simple as, like what you just described about inflammation, like crp, for example, if you've got systemic inflammation, and that to me is an interesting one. Let me take a small analogy. Inflammation to me is like smoke when you have a fire. So if you've got a small fire in your house, you've had it for three months, there's tons of smoke in your house, you're choking on it, it's affecting your health. And now medicine, as established that smoke is bad for you. You of course, and the strategy is to manage the smoke, manage inflammation, air filter. But we've never. To me, it's like, go and put out the fire.
- [56:46]
A
No, that's not profitable to put out the fire.
- [56:49]
B
Air filters are money man, trying to suppress the inflammation without understanding that the inflammation is created by areas in the body that have not fully repaired, that cannot fully repair because you don't have enough stem cells. And something in that tissue is maintaining that lesion, that micro problem. And until you repair that area, it will keep signaling for repair, which is inflammation. So now you have the problem of inflammation not resolving. Suppressing inflammation is not the solution to the problem of inflammation. It's going to repair the areas that are secreting the inflammatory signals. So in line with what you just said, if somebody has high CRP or markers of inflammation, you know that you don't have enough stem cells in circulation.
- [57:37]
A
Wow. So you just said inflammation's good for you, right?
- [57:40]
B
Inflammation is a signal.
- [57:42]
A
Exactly. If you suppress inflammation, the body won't heal. And prime example, lift heavy and take ibuprofen, you don't get the results of lifting because you suppress the inflammatory signal that caused tissue to recover. So it makes sense.
- [57:57]
B
The only place that is important when you want to suppress inflammation is that when you have problems in your body, because systemic inflammation, meaning too many areas, too many fires in your house, you cannot see the fire you want to suppress. Reduce that smoke so that you can go and see where the fires are. That's the role of a good product. We have developed one signal to suppress systemic inflammation so that you allow the signaling to not be in excess, not be chaotic, so that that signaling can work to really tell stem cells where they need to go to repair. If you want to suppress, you want to deal with a problem that is associated with inflammation, go and repair the areas that are doing the inflammation. At the end of the day, there's no other way. The rest is just like band aid, it's patching.
- [58:46]
A
And you don't want out of control systemic inflammation. That's terrible. And if you're injured and you over suppress inflammation, you don't get good tissue recovery. And this has actually been documented. Now, like certain painkillers like the NSAIDs cause low quality tissue to form versus high quality tissue. But if the entire system is overwhelmed, the stem cells wouldn't even know where to go. So you kind of get rid of the smog so you can go to the sources of the fire and work on those. And the smog should clear. And if you keep your stem cells circulating, they'll clear up the small inflammation throughout the body. So I was kind of joking. Inflammation is good for you. But over suppression of inflammation, which removes the ability to figure out what the problem is, that's a bad thing. And I think we over suppress inflammation, especially around injuries, and we maybe under suppress it around chronic longevity stuff.
- [59:38]
B
I mean, too much inflammation now is called inflammaging, one of the cause of aging. And it misses the most important factor in all of that, which is. It's not the inflammation that is the problem. It's all those areas that are generating the inflammation. Let's just go and repair them and you take care of the problem.
- [59:54]
A
Okay. So feeling that nicotine.
- [59:57]
B
I am. I mean, at first. At first, it was probably a little bit too much.
- [60:02]
A
You did too?
- [60:03]
B
Yeah, my brain was just like. I don't know how to describe it, but. But soon after that first phase, then, yeah, it's very, very, very clear.
- [60:12]
A
Yeah.
- [60:13]
B
Is that your product?
- [60:15]
A
No, no, it's actually. When you can't buy in the U.S. okay. I'm working with a variety of clean nicotine products now, so I can start sharing some more information with listeners. Because for almost 14 years now, I think a very small dose of nicotine has been part of my cognitive and my longevity stack. And I've never smoked. And smoking's bad for you. But I'm just kind of asking because what most people experience. And I've been induced into a lineage that serves hop AI way as well, which is a ceremonial way of using nicotine for going on a little journey where they blowed up your nose. It's. It's a little bit dramatic. We didn't do that. But what nicotine normally does is it grounds you at first, and then the energy kind of comes back up. And most people feel it right between their eyes, kind of their third eye, and. And then it's this clarity comes on. And I think it's great for interviewing. People sometimes see me doing it because I know it just keeps me in the flow state better. And yes, I use more than 5 milligrams a day, and I like it.
- [61:14]
B
I remember in my studies, like, I'm a neuroscientist by training and I never smoke. But I remember I thought it was fascinating because in classical neurology, there's one thing that is specific to nicotine, which is if you take it to relax, it literally relaxes your brain. If you take it for stimulation, it actually stimulates you. Wow. So it's one of those drugs that does not do, like, one thing for the brain. It does different things as to what you're taking it for. I think it's fascinating.
- [61:45]
A
It's probably the mitochondrial uncoupling. And I have no idea what stem cells and nicotine do together. And I'm not proposing anyone listening smoke or overuse nicotine. I'm just suggesting that it's a cognitive enhancer and longevity drug at very low levels. Stemregen Co Dave 30 is where people can go. And that's a big discount. Thank you for offering that to listeners. And Christian, we always have the most fascinating conversations. You are so knowledgeable and not just in one domain, but in multiple, multiple areas. So we can really talk about this and this idea that one of the markers of aging that may be as important as nad more, maybe more, could be circulating stem cells as we age. And I really look forward to being able to add this to things like the DNA methylation, aging clocks that we've talked about on the show before. And just saying, all right, let's do that. So when you've got some studies or some lab tests available, let me know and we'll take some of our Unlimited life members. And these are the kind of people who are actually extending their life and willing to go all in on it. So I'm sure that they'd be happy to be guinea pigs for that and so am I.
- [62:51]
B
So let's do it.
- [62:52]
A
Let's do it. All right. Thank you, my friend.
- [62:53]
B
My pleasure. Thank you.
- [62:55]
A
And of course I will see you at the Biohacking Conference May 27th through 29th here in Austin. Thank you for your special sponsorship so much.
- [63:02]
B
Looking forward to it.
- [63:04]
A
See you next time on the Human Upgrade Podcast.
- [63:13]
D
A Human Upgrade, formerly Bulletproof Radio, was created and is hosted by Dave Asprey. The information contained in this podcast is provided for informational purposes only and is not intended for the purposes of diagnosing, treating, curing, or preventing any disease. Before using any products referenced on the podcast, consult with your healthcare provider carefully read all labels and heed all directions and cautions that accompany the products. Information found or received through the podcast should not be used in place of a consultation or advice from a healthcare provider. If you suspect you have a medical problem or should you have any healthcare questions, please promptly call or see your healthcare provider. This podcast, including Dave Asprey and the producers, disclaim responsibility for any possible adverse effects from the use of information contained herein. Opinions of guests are the right own and this podcast does not endorse or accept responsibility for statements made by guests. This podcast does not make any representations or warranties about guest qualifications or credibility. This podcast may contain paid endorsements and advertisements for products or services. Individuals on this podcast may have a direct or indirect financial interest in products or services referred to herein. This podcast is owned by Bulletproof Media.