Podcast Summary:

The Interview – Brandi Carlile, singer-songwriter: I believe in the separation of church and state
Host: Mark Savage (BBC World Service)
Guest: Brandi Carlile
Date: November 14, 2025
Duration: ~25 minutes

Episode Overview

This episode features a candid and emotionally rich conversation between BBC’s music correspondent Mark Savage and acclaimed American singer-songwriter Brandi Carlile. At the heart of the interview is Carlile’s evolution as an artist, her deep commitment to advocacy, especially for LGBTQ rights, and the intensely personal nature of her new album, Returning to Myself. The episode also explores mother-daughter relationships, unexpected joys and pains of parenthood, Carlile’s pivotal role in Joni Mitchell’s resurgence, and the political anxieties underpinning her latest work.

Key Discussion Points and Insights

1. The Transformative 2019 Grammys Performance

[04:05]

• Brandi reflects on finding mainstream success later than many artists, with her 2019 Grammys performance of "The Joke" as a transformative moment.
  • Quote: "I had success kind of later in life than a lot of people do...I just needed one chance to get seen like that and that people would get it." – Brandi Carlile [06:04]
• The impact was immediate, resulting in a deluge of opportunities and outreach from both fans and celebrities.
  • Quote: "I got phone calls all day long. I got thousands of text messages. So many emails from, like, famous people that I couldn’t fathom reaching out to me." – Brandi Carlile [06:13]

2. Parenthood and “You Without Me”

[06:24]

• Mark recalls witnessing Carlile’s moving performance of “You Without Me” at Glastonbury, noting the powerful audience reaction.
• The song was inspired by Carlile’s realization of her children’s growing independence.
  • Quote: "It’s soul crushing, but at the same time you’re like overwhelmed with pride...those are such funny two feelings to feel at the same time." – Brandi Carlile [07:33]
• Carlile shares stories fans told her about their own “you without me” moments—highlighting a universal parental experience.

3. Bonding with Her Mother Over The Judds

[09:19]

• As a child, her relationship with her mother was fraught; music, specifically the Judds’ concerts, became their bridge.
  • Quote: "She thought she was going to relate to me, she couldn’t...And the Judds, being a mother-daughter duo made us decide to, like, kind of cosplay the Judds." – Brandi Carlile [10:05]
• The duo's tribute performances fostered a deeper, more authentic friendship.

4. Artistic Evolution and Making Returning to Myself

[12:16]

• Carlile discusses searching for fresher musical textures while drawing on nostalgic, formative influences (e.g., her Casio keyboard and the Philadelphia soundtrack).
  • Quote: "I went into the studio with no songs...nothing but a whole bunch of feelings and some weird sense of nostalgia and a midlife crisis and one poem and came out with an album." – Brandi Carlile [14:12]
• This approach reinforced the album’s emotional immediacy and rawness.
• She found herself moved to tears, sometimes before audiences did:
  • Quote: "I’ve never been made to cry with my own lyrics before, like by myself. It’s embarrassing, but that was what happened." – Brandi Carlile [14:56]

5. Joni Mitchell: Friendship, Inspiration, and “Joni”

[16:37]

• Carlile honors her friend Joni Mitchell with a tribute song, capturing both their bond and the intimidating unpredictability of Mitchell.
  • Quote: "She’s a wild woman. She’ll drink you under the table. Yeah, she’s 83. She’ll drink you under the table." – Brandi Carlile [16:45]
• She describes nervously playing the song for Joni, waiting for her reaction.
  • Quote: "A big smile spread across her face after the first tagline of the last chorus...so she made me wait a good minute before she nodded at me and grinned like, this is great." – Brandi Carlile [17:23]

6. Advocacy, Separation of Church and State, and Personal Fears

[18:50]

• Carlile’s song "Church and State" was written in the immediate aftermath of the 2024 U.S. elections.
  • Quote: "I believe so profoundly in the separation of church and state and in the dangers of theocracy creeping into the corners of a democracy..." – Brandi Carlile [19:08]
• She discusses her fear that Supreme Court decisions could threaten same-sex marriage (Obergefell v. Hodges).
  • Quote: "For years [my daughter] has been hearing this...if this happens...that it like orphans you...I felt so ashamed for not explaining it to her." – Brandi Carlile [21:11]
• The song represents both anger and catharsis in confronting these threats.
  • Quote: "Oh God, it felt so good to get that out, all of that just trembling fear and rage just like out of my body and into that song." – Brandi Carlile [19:08]

7. AI and Music

[22:29]

• On artificial intelligence in songwriting, Carlile feels AI lacks authentic perspective:
  • Quote: "AI doesn’t have a point of view...it can only replicate it. It doesn’t have a point of view." – Brandi Carlile [23:06]
• The sole upside she sees: automatic translation of songs into multiple languages for wider accessibility.
  • Quote: "I love the idea of writing songs that everyone can understand." – Brandi Carlile [23:53]

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• “It’s soul crushing, but at the same time you’re overwhelmed with pride.” – Brandi Carlile on parenthood [07:33]
• "We kind of dressed like [The Judds] and sang like them...we developed another level of friendship." [09:55]
• "I went in with nothing but a whole bunch of feelings and some weird sense of nostalgia and a midlife crisis and one poem and came out with an album." [14:12]
• "She’s a wild woman. She’ll drink you under the table...And by wild I just mean unpredictable, untamable..." (on Joni Mitchell) [16:45]
• "I believe so profoundly in the separation of church and state and in the dangers of theocracy creeping into the corners of a democracy." [19:08]
• "AI doesn’t have a point of view...it’s just a tool of synthesis." [23:06]

Timestamps for Key Segments

• [03:20] – Fears about same-sex marriage rights in America, impulse to write “Church and State”
• [04:05] – 2019 Grammys breakthrough and career transformation
• [06:24] – Parenting, Glastonbury performance of “You Without Me”
• [09:19] – Childhood, bonding with her mother over music and The Judds
• [12:16] – Making new album with a fresh, instinctive approach
• [16:37] – Friendship and tribute to Joni Mitchell
• [18:50] – Deep dive into “Church and State,” familial and social anxieties
• [22:29] – Thoughts on artificial intelligence and the creative process

Episode Tone and Final Thoughts

This episode is rich with warmth, vulnerability, and insight. Mark Savage’s gentle curiosity draws out candid, sometimes aching reflections from Brandi Carlile, who mingles humor, nostalgia, and activism. The show offers both music fans and the uninitiated a moving portrait of an artist shaped by her convictions, connections, and evolving creative process.

For additional context and further conversations with influential guests, visit the BBC World Service or subscribe to The Interview on your preferred podcast platform.