Is The West Trading Christianity for Radical Islam & Communism? ft. Andrew and Noleen Sedra

Summary

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The Isabel Brown Show

Episode: Is The West Trading Christianity for Radical Islam & Communism?
Guests: Andrew and Noleen Sedra
Date: January 30, 2026

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Episode Overview

In this episode, Isabel Brown sits down with Andrew and Noleen Sedra, leaders of Echo Church in Sydney, Australia, who are facing potential imprisonment under new "hate preaching" and "conversion therapy" laws passed in Australia. The conversation dives into the rapid rise of authoritarian laws against Christians, the growing influence of radical Islam, and the moral and societal crossroads facing the West. They discuss the spiritual and ideological battle lines now being drawn in Australia and warn America about similar threats. The episode is passionate, urgent, and unapologetically pro-Christian.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Meet the Sedras: Their Story in the Australian Context

• Background: Andrew Sedra (from Egypt) and Noleen Sedra (from South Africa), now leading Echo Church in Sydney ([04:58]).
• Not Just Australian: “At the core, we’re not really Australian... which does make a difference and you’ll understand why as we start to talk a little bit about the spirit of the country.” —Noleen ([05:13])

2. Australia’s Hate Speech Law—What’s Changed

• Passage of the Law: As of yesterday, Australia passed a law criminalizing so-called "hate preaching," with especially harsh penalties for spiritual leaders ([06:33]).
• Definition of ‘Hate’:
  • Offense isn’t about actual harm, but “hurting people’s feelings” or instilling fear—even if that fear is theoretical ([07:01]).
  • “My definition of hate speech is speech that people hate.” —Andrew ([07:30])
  • “You can go to jail for 12 years for what you say or preach from the pulpit. They literally put word by word that they will apply harsher penalties on spiritual leaders and pastors.” —Andrew ([07:39])
  • Psychological damage and feelings of fear are included ([08:42]).
• Expansion to Groups:
  • The law empowers the government to ban organizations they label as hate groups, including foreign groups (e.g., Turning Point USA) ([09:28]).
  • “Anyone who is remotely associated with said group gets 12 to 15 years prison time, which is insane.” —Isabel ([09:50])
  • Donating, attending, or associating can also bring prosecution ([11:07]).

3. Application of the Law & De Facto Criminalization

• Islamophobia Defined as Racism: Islam critical speech can now be prosecuted as racist speech ([12:00]).
• Trigger Event: Law passed days after the Bondi Beach attack by radical Islamists, but, “In response to that, the government didn’t attempt to ban jihadic violence. To the contrary, they’re banning Islamophobia.” —Isabel ([12:06])
• Disproportionate Application:
  • Small Muslim minority (3.5%) responsible for 95% of terrorist activities in Australia (Andrew’s assertion) ([13:23]).

4. Personal Cost: The Reality for Christian Leaders in Australia

• Police Surveillance:
  • Anti-terrorism police have visited Echo Church at least five times due to Andrew’s sermons ([15:15]).
  • “I’ll preach on Sunday and on Tuesday morning...they will send two anti-terrorism police officers for what they call...a hate incident.” —Andrew ([15:49])
  • “We want to make sure that you don’t have any hate in your heart towards Muslims.” —Police to Andrew ([16:32])
• Thought Policing: “They want to police what’s in your heart...So they are policing your feelings. And your thoughts.” —Isabel & Andrew ([16:36]-[17:14])

5. Steps in the Creep Toward Authoritarianism

• Systematic Targeting:
  • “First they went after worship, then they went after the prayer, and now they're going to go after the preaching. Wow. Australia is officially a communist state.” —Andrew ([22:24])
  • “Firstly they go after worship, then they're going to go after prayer, then they go after the preaching. It's systematic—worship, prayer and preaching.” —Isabel ([22:43])

6. Use of Crisis to Restrict Freedom

• Manufactured Consensus:
  • Government response to crises (like terrorist attacks) is to curtail civil liberties, not address root causes ([23:02]).
  • “Never let a good crisis go away.” —Andrew citing Hillary Clinton ([23:05])

7. Social Media, Information, and Censorship

• Censorship Moves: Australia, Canada, and the UK are moving to restrict access to X/Twitter and social media because, “the reason we know what happened in Bondi, because it was on X” —Andrew ([24:15])
• Selective Carve Outs:
  • “There are carve outs for religious groups that they can spread certain hate speech ... there is a carve out for a Muslim Australian, but not for Christians.” —Isabel ([27:31])

8. Alliance of the Radical Left and Islam

• Strange Allies:
  • "Islam is the sword the left will use to cut the throat of America." —Andrew quoting the late Charlie Kirk ([29:58])
  • The left and radical Islam are united by shared hatred of Christianity and the West ([29:44]-[31:57]).
  • “Gays for Gaza/chickens for KFC—it doesn’t make sense but they unite over hatred of Christendom.” —Andrew ([29:58])
• Impact on Demographics and Politics:
  • “Muslims are not conservative...eight out of ten Muslims in Australia vote left.” ([34:02])

9. Christian Disunity and the Call to Stand Together

• Need for Unity:
  • “Religious sectarianism is very big in Australia. It’s a Western disease because we’ve grown up in peace, love, utopian good times.” —Andrew ([50:55])
  • “The reality is, when Islam takes over, when Communism takes over, Islam and Communism do not differentiate between Protestant or Catholic, Orthodox, we are all the same.” ([51:55])
  • There is a plea for Christians in the West—especially America—to unite on fundamental principles (pro-life, freedom of speech, the Lordship of Christ), regardless of denomination ([52:45]-[54:39]).

10. Family as the Cornerstone Solution

• Demographic Reality:
  • Christian family formation lags Muslim family growth rates ([55:25]).
  • “Every second gay person that you talk to, their grandma was a Christian. She didn’t disciple him properly.” —Andrew ([55:25])
• Call to Action:
  • “As for me and my house, we will serve the Lord. Men, you need to be godly, get married, don’t play around with girls ... lead your children, go to church.” —Andrew ([57:08])
  • “When you destroy the family, you destroy society.” —Noleen ([58:09])

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On the Law’s Subjectivity:
  • “My definition of hate speech is speech that people hate.” —Andrew ([07:30])
• On Policing Emotion:
  • “They want to police what’s in your heart. ... So they are policing your feelings.” —Andrew ([16:32])
• Systematic Suppression:
  • “First they went after worship, then prayer, now preaching...Australia is officially a communist state.” —Andrew ([22:24])
• On the Left & Islam:
  • “Islam is the sword the left will use to cut the throat of America.” —Andrew ([29:58])
  • “They both unite over both Islam and socialism...because they both hate Christianity. They both hate Christianity because they both hate freedom...freedom is fundamentally a Christian concept.” —Andrew ([31:00])
• On Christian Passivity:
  • “Church attendance in Australia is 5% ... The reality is, when you abandon God...there will be the judgment of God. And that judgment...is communism and Islam.” —Andrew ([40:34])
• On Family Decline:
  • “We are the ones who are passing abortion...getting our kids to be gay...normalized sex out of marriage. We are the ones who destroyed family and replaced it with hyper-individualism.” —Andrew ([56:44])
• Unity Imperative:
  • “If the church doesn’t unite, we will lose.” —Andrew ([52:45])
• Personal Risk:
  • “Are you willing to keep pushing forward?...‘It’s peace, but it’s possible. But truth at all costs. It’s gonna get worse from here. ... There is no way around it.’” —Andrew ([14:13])

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Important Timestamps

• Guest Introduction and Background: 04:58–05:36
• Australian Hate Speech Law Details: 06:33–12:00
• Bondi Attack & Islamophobia Law: 12:00–13:41
• Terrorism Police at Church: 15:15–17:14
• Stepwise Restriction of Faith: 22:02–22:43
• Media & Social Media Censorship: 24:15–25:13
• The Left–Islam Alliance: 29:44–34:23
• Christian Disunity: 50:12–54:39
• Reviving the Family & Conclusion: 55:25–59:24

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Tone & Atmosphere

The tone is urgent, unapologetically outspoken, and driven by deep faith. The Sedras and Isabel sound shocked by Australia’s rapid changes but hopeful, calling the West—especially Christians—to courageous unity, bold speech, and revival of family and faith. Emotional moments center on their risk of imprisonment, the cost of apathy, and exhortations to Americans not to repeat Australia’s mistakes.

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Final Thoughts

“If you can’t fight now, you’re not going to be able to fight later... The reality is: this is crazy, Isabel. Because we—I think it’s going to be us this year...” —Andrew ([15:15])

The Sedras’ personal story and Australia’s legal changes serve as both a warning and a rallying cry for the rest of the West. The message is clear: Speak now, unite, rebuild families, and do not be ashamed of the truth.

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Transcript

[A]

Radical Islam is at our doorstep, whether we want to realize it or not. And very few people across Western civilization have the courage and conviction to speak up against it and to speak up and fight against these insane, draconian, authoritarian free speech laws that are threatening to put those speaking the truth in prison for decades. A few of those courageous individuals traveled to the United States to join us here on the Isabel Brown Show. Our friends the Sedras, who are facing the probability of very real prison time for being willing to tell Australians that Jesus Christ, the son of God, is the savior of the world. Today we're sitting down for an incredibly compelling conversation with them about the future of Australia, the West, and how we fight against radical Islam as Christians in the arena on the Isabel Brown Show.

[B]

Foreign.

[A]

Happy Friday. I had the best night ever last night at the world premiere of the Melania film. If you do not have weekend plans, I insist that you go. And before we get into today's incredibly important episode with our friends, the CEDRA's visiting the United States from Down Under, I really have to work on my Australian accent to talk about free speech, the crusade against it in the west and the increasing threat of Islam. I just have to tell you, if you're on the fence about going to see the Melania movie, I absolutely insist that you go spend this weekend doing it. It was perfect. Equal parts documentary, raw film footage and film feature Hollywood movie worthy of an Oscar. It was an absolute pleasure to be at the Kennedy center last night here in Washington, D.C. alongside all of our cabinet secretaries, the President and the first lady, and most importantly, my husband. For our, I think it was third date night since we had a baby. The last time we went to the movies, it was two days before I gave birth. And they put the Return of the no, it wasn't Return of the Jedi. It was Revenge of the Sith back in movie theaters for its anniversary for some year. I think it was the 20th anniversary since revenge of the Sith. It was amazing. Duel of the Fates I'm pretty sure put me into labor. It was a great date night, but we got a little more dressed up this time. Not in disgusting big giant pregnancy PJs, but got to walk the red carpet and have an amazing evening last night. Go see it this weekend if you haven't already. And I know there's a lot of you asking me a lot of questions about the hit, or should I say hit piece that was put on Ali Beth Stuckey from Hillary Rodham Clinton. You literally can't make this stuff up. We'll be talking about that on Monday. And my reaction to the most ridiculous meltdown I have ever seen from from the most successful female podcaster in the world, Alex Cooper. So just trust me, all of that is coming on Monday. Have no fear. In the meantime though, I had a chance while they were here visiting us for the March for Life to sit down with some amazing, incredible heroes fighting for free speech and for Christianity in Western civilization. Our friends the Cedras. You guys might remember Pastor Andrew Sedra joined us on the show a few months ago after election day to talk about the concerns people were having with the rise of those calling for Sharia law and the normalization of radical Islam in the United States as it pertains to our politics. But they are dealing with this day in and day out in Australia. We also did an episode a few days ago covering this draconian, asinine, insane free speech law that makes George Orwell look like elementary school child's play. Well, turns out it's not just a bill anymore, it is now officially a law. And as our friends the Cedras are returning to Australia, the there is a high likelihood that there will be handcuffs waiting for them at the Sydney airport while they were here though, and protected by the First Amendment to the Constitution, even as non US Citizens. We got into it a few days ago talking about the pro life movement all over the world, why the west is so uniquely targeted by these free speech laws and the censoring of people at every opportunity necessary by those seeking to take over an authoritarian power and of course, the threat of radical Islam to the West. Without further ado, for a fantastic kickoff to our weekend, please join me in welcoming the Cedra family, our amazing friends the Cedras. Join us, some of you again, back on the Isabel Brown show, which I'm so excited for. You guys are in town for the March for Life this weekend, which I cannot wait to be joining you tomorrow as we hit the street streets to celebrate a culture of life. But more importantly, I want to talk about everything going on down under because no one understands just how crazy Australia has gotten than you guys. For those who don't know who you are and a little bit about your story, introduce yourself to us.

[B]

Yeah, my name is Andrew. Me and Laleen will lead an amazing church in Sydney, Australia. So we are kind of there, one of the few voices really fighting for the west, fighting for faith, family and freedom. So yeah, we are free from Australia.

[C]

Yeah, originally not though, because I do feel like that is important. We spoke about this earlier, like, I was born in South Africa, Andrew was born in Egypt. So we're not like, at the core, we're not really Australian, which does make a difference and you'll, you'll understand why as we start to talk a little bit about the spirit of the country. So, yeah, but it's fun. It's fun leading a church there. It's, it's fun getting to travel the US as well. Yeah, we're excited to be here and.

[B]

Giving out like a picture of what the future could, would, should look like if you continue with like gay Islamic socialism, whatever, whatever, whatever you want to call it.

[A]

We laugh, but it's not funny actually, because really it is a warning sign, I think, for America. We were talking about this in the green room a few minutes ago, that Australia didn't really have an excuse. You had Europe as the blueprint for how bad this takeover of society and the destruction of the west looks. Like now we are fortunate by the grace of God, we did not go down that, that avenue this last November. But it's something we have to continue fighting against day in and day out here. And now we're looking at Australia and I'm just completely blown away how crazy things have gotten so very quickly on my show. A couple of days ago we covered this new bill that is now a law. In the last 24 hours, it just got passed about free speech in Australia. We talked about it a bit, but you guys know better than we do.

[B]

Give us nothing. So as of yesterday, they passed a law and within it, it contained the hate preaching law.

[A]

So hate preaching law.

[B]

So as of yesterday, my spiritual authority, I can go to jail for what I say and proclaim. And the content of the bill, it's hate speech. And by hate, they defined hate as hurting people's feelings or making them feel unsafe or feel afraid.

[A]

Okay, so what's interesting, I don't want interrupt you, but what's interesting to me about this bill too is that yes, we've seen a lot of crazy hate speech laws in America, in Europe over the last few years. What's different about this Australia law that is now the law of the land, you guys have to deal with this as Australians jail. Yeah, it's not even about the impact of hate though. It's about if your speech could have theoretically caused fear for someone, even if no one actually experienced the impact of a targeted hate speech attack, whatever that's.

[B]

Even supposed to mean, hate speech, which we don't even know what the heck like their current definition of Hate speech. Because my definition of hate speech is speech that people hate.

[C]

That's just what it is.

[B]

It's speech that they hate, speech that they don't like, truth that they find inconvenient. And when you say it, they get triggered and offended. But the current definition, which we're yet to go home and see this year, if they're going to put me in jail, we'll see. What does it actually mean? 12 years in jail for what you say or preach from the pulpit. They literally put word by word that they will apply harsher penalties on spiritual leaders and pastors.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Wow. So the whole bill is designed for passing the leaders. So Muslims obviously do their incitement or violence, but then they put us in the same category as pastors and they lower the threshold and before you know it, apparently I'm a terrorist. Yeah. According to the gay socialist state of Australia. And then they took the bill a bit further where if they. If they think you are doing hate speech, which according to them, it means speech that hurt your feelings.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

That is the definition. That's the best definition you can find legally. We yet to see that in the court. And not just that, the second definition, if you make someone feel afraid. Yeah. Or fear.

[C]

Yeah. So they've actually mentioned hate being not just physical, not just an act of physical violence. They've also mentioned psychological damage. And so it's basically what it is. It's if you hurt someone's feelings or if they just feel afraid for whatever reason without any grounds. And this is the scary part is, who defines hate? Well, it's just the Australian Federal Police.

[A]

On impact.

[C]

Yeah, exactly. And. And I don't think that there's very much of a cause for a trial or a hearing or any kind of back and forth. It's just. No. If the government decide this is hateful.

[A]

Yeah.

[C]

You could be closed down. People in your church could go to prison for just attending.

[B]

Yeah. So they pushed it a bit further. So if you commit hate speech, the political government of the time can consider your organization or your church a hate group.

[C]

Okay.

[A]

So this, the group thing was interesting to me.

[B]

This gets a lot further.

[A]

So they want to ban groups and this is now law. I talked about this on my show when it was a bill, but this is now law in Australia. They want to ban groups, including groups that don't even operate in Australia. So I used the example. I guarantee you It'll be about 30 seconds before Turning Point USA is banned from Australia.

[C]

Yeah.

[A]

And anyone who is remotely associated with said group gets 12 to 15 years prison time, which is insane.

[B]

Yeah, it's great. So if I attend a Turning Point event, which I've spoken to a few, and they consider it hate group, and that is defined by the Minister of the time with no boundaries, definition, push back or fair procedure. Yeah. He can tomorrow morning the Security of State or the Minister of the Terrorists Home Affairs. Home affairs can say, turning Point USA is a terrorist organization. And sorry, it's a hate group. Yeah.

[A]

Which is basically a terrorist organization.

[B]

Which is basically. Exactly. So in that moment. And second, they go to jail. If I donate to it, go to it, attend or speak, I also go to jail.

[A]

Do you think this will cause, like preventing people from coming into Australia as foreigners as well? We've seen a little bit about this in the UK where people are being detained at the airport.

[B]

They're going to be deterring a lot of Americans, Westerners, but they love China. We have a lot of Chinese Indians, so they really want to make Australia China. So they're very happy.

[C]

It'll really be conservatives or people with conservative ideologies that they find offensive.

[B]

So if you donate to it as well.

[A]

Interesting.

[B]

So donation, yeah, that's in the Buildings Affiliation association posting. Yeah, Any, any. So the problem is tomorrow morning I can wake up and the government of the time can say, echo, Church is a hate group in that moment. And second, I go to jail, the church disappears. Any person that donates money to the church or goes to church follows the church will also go to jail. Yeah.

[A]

Wow.

[C]

And it is very specific how they've defined it. They've said, and this is how they get you. They say it's racial hate, national and ethnic. So I'm like, okay, well, what exactly does national mean? Because if I say that, if I have any kind of concerns about China and our environment, our involvement as a country with China, that's now legally considered hateful. It can be considered hateful because now I'm critiquing a national level. So.

[A]

Interesting.

[B]

And I mean, we don't know what this thing means. We have no idea. And then they're going to say Islamophobia is racism.

[A]

No, I'm glad you got into that because really, this bill was introduced as a legislation just shortly after days after the Bondi beach attack. And this was in response to one of the most grotesque terror attacks we've seen in an act of radical jihadic Islam in Australia. And in response to that, the government didn't attempt to ban jihadic violence. To the contrary, they're banning Islamophobia Islamophobia in Australia. This is crazy to me.

[B]

So we had the biggest ever terrorist. Second biggest terrorist attack in the history. We have had the. What happened in December? Literally two Islamic violent men, a dad and his son, opening fire on 2,000 Jews in the midst of Hanukkah on Bondi Beach. It's kind of like Miami. If you have been to Miami. We had 15 Jews die. One young girl called Matilda. She was 10. You had two Jewish rabbis, you had one Holocaust survivor who happened to survive Hitler but couldn't survive Bondi Beach. Australia and Islam. So you had the attack, which was the biggest terrorist attack in the history of Australia. And even though we don't have guns, and this is a crazy thing, Muslims In Australia compromise 3.5% of the population, yet they commit 95% of terrorist activities. Yeah. Wow.

[C]

Yeah.

[B]

This will get me in jail in the future. I'm not sure if it's illegal or not. I will see when I land in Australia. It's too on the way there, But Muslims compromise 3.5% of the Australian population, yet they commit 95% of the tourism in the nation. Yeah.

[A]

I just. I want to pause on what you just said there, Andrew, because the last time you joined us on the show, we were talking about the threat of Islam to the West. And the fact that we're even having this conversation now means when you return to your home in a few days in Australia, there's a very high likelihood they will be waiting for you with handcuffs. Just for exposing the truth about what your experience living in Australia was like or growing up in Egypt, as you told us a lot about the last time you were here. Is that scary to you? Are you willing to keep pushing forward on that? How do you overcome that fear?

[B]

Yeah, honestly, it's peace, but it's possible. But truth at all costs. It's gonna get worse from here. I don't know. I have something in my head that tells me you have to speak. There is no way around it.

[C]

Yeah. I don't think we're built.

[B]

I don't care what they did to me.

[A]

Yeah. As a wife. As a wife, though, how does that feel? I mean, you're thinking I could end up in prison, but certainly it's more likely my husband probably ends up in prison.

[C]

Yeah. Yeah. I mean, I don't know. I feel like we just. Maybe it's the way we're buil. Maybe it's the Holy Spirit. I think it's definitely. Maybe both, but the grace of God, but it's just there is no looking at the direction of our country. The reason it is the way that it is is because of apathetic sitting on the sidelines, not willing to fight mentality and action. And so I'm just not willing to do any of that. I'm not willing to sit back. I'm not willing for the sake of the next generation. I mean like what the ultimate test of a moral society is the the world that leaves its children. I'm not willing to leave the next generation with a more tyran, harsh, less Christian nation. So I mean if like Esther said, if I perish, I perish.

[B]

I'm not. Yeah, I don't want to leave my children, my grandchildren and the people are worst nation. It's if you can't find fight now, you're not going to be able to fight later. Like the reality is this is crazy, Isabel, because we, I think it's going to be us this year because we already had the terrorism police come to our church in the last two years at least five times for my sermon. So I'll preach on Sunday and on Tuesday morning I rock up to church and they will send two anti terrorism police officers for what they call not hate speech. They call it hate incident.

[A]

What did you say that set off a hate incident sermon?

[B]

Muhammad was a PDF file or. Islam is not the religion of peace. Palestine is a joke. It's like, free, free Palestine. I'm like, palestine is not free free. It's the Islamic totalitarian hell hole. It's an oxymoron to say free, free Palestine. Islam is a violent, authoritarian political ideology that pretends to be a religion. Is anything I don't actually know? Because I was like, they got me. They're like, hey, we had a lot of complaints about you of hate. And I told them, actually, I don't hate anybody. Jesus, that love your enemy, like, no. But we're here to make sure that you don't have any hate in your heart towards Muslims. I'm like, dude, in your heart?

[A]

They want to police what's in your heart. Interesting.

[B]

Because we want to make sure that. So that's the thing. Our prime minister said those terrorists had hate in their hearts. And I'm like, so they're policing hearts? Yeah.

[A]

Wow.

[B]

So they're policing your feelings. So you're not, you're not allowed to be fearful of Islam even though you had two Muslims open fire on 2,000 Jews. Yeah. It's illegal to be an Islamophobe, which means illegal to feel afraid from people that have killed at least 100 million Christians in the last 1400 years. And that people that want to kill my family. That's why I moved to the West.

[A]

That and that now chant death to the West.

[C]

Yeah.

[A]

Over and over and over again.

[B]

So they are policing your feelings.

[A]

Wow.

[B]

And your thoughts. So they come to our church. They're like, yeah, we want to make sure there's no Islamophobia, that you're not going to commit any hate. I'm like, wow. I'm like, what are you from? And then this guy, they're indoctrinated. We're dealing with a police force. I'm like, to him. So have you read any history? Like, I'm like, I came from the Islamic world because they wanted to kill us. I'm like, dude, they kill us. And they're like, wow. I'm like, I thought it's a white Christian nationalist that kills people. I'm like, no, dude, I don't know what the hell you're talking about. And then. All right, they left and they said, we're going to be coming every day to check on you guys to make sure there's no. Which they did.

[A]

Every day.

[C]

They came every day for a week to just check up on our staff. Just check that there is no hate happening.

[B]

So that is the anti terrorism police, which is designed for isis. Yep.

[C]

Coming to a church.

[B]

So I'm isis. Even though I'm the one that escaped the Islamic world for my life, so they reversed it.

[A]

I. I want to center on this for a minute because that alone sounds like something so far out of the realm of possibility. And yet here we are in 2026 in America. We use quite hyperbolic language and everybody is very inflammatory in the media, but by the grace of God, our legal system has not yet really gone down this path. We're thinking about it and it's the threat of every single major election, but we're not quite there. The worst that we really have is that Jake Tapper goes on CNN and calls the White House social media team isis, which did indeed happen just a few days ago. But you don't have the anti terrorism police showing up to your church, threatening to throw you in prison now is a bigger threat to you than ever before.

[B]

They came the last two years and they didn't have the legal ammo. I might be, prophetically speaking, honestly, I don't know. Now they do have the legal ammo. Yeah. So next time they come and knock, knock who there.

[C]

Now they have a law to refer to.

[B]

Actually Have a law to refer to. So back then, they had the intention and the desire. They just didn't have the mechanism. The mechanism. Now they do have the mechanism. In fact, in the group, it said you can go 8 to 12 years in jail as a spiritual leader for inciting. Division.

[C]

Yeah.

[B]

Hate or division. I'm like, the gospel is divisive.

[C]

Yes.

[B]

We're not happy. Kumbaya.

[C]

Yeah.

[B]

Everybody together. So what does that law mean? I'm yet to see.

[A]

Yeah. What in terms of a message of warning, can you say to us about what the warning signs were to get to this point? You mentioned to me in the green room before we started recording, there were other laws passed along the way and cultural changes that passed along the way. Like the fact that it's been illegal to pray for gay people in Australia.

[B]

That's you, babe.

[C]

Yeah.

[B]

In Australia, it's illegal to pray the gay away.

[C]

Yeah. Quite literally. So this, actually, this has been a few years in the making, but it got legalized in our state last year. And we were warning America of this before it happened. And Christian Australians commented on, say, podcasts. We were part of warning America. Christian Australians commented, saying that we were lying, saying that we were being hyperbolic, saying, saying that none of this was true and that we are just hateful until it happened. And our government passed a law under anti conversion therapy law. So this is where they get you. Like I said before, it's very sneaky, the wording they use. So to combat this anti conversion therapy practices, what they consider conversion therapy is a pastor praying for a gay person to be changed. So they're not okay with transformation spiritually, but they're okay with transing your child without your permission. And so what we're dealing with is laws that could put us in prison for as soon as we get off the platform. If I have a conversation with you, if I disciple you, if I have some sort of pastoral conversation, you can take me with your consent, even if it was with your consent at the time, you can go and report me to the Human Rights Commission, who can come and question me and put me in jail for five years for trying to convert you and use already.

[B]

That's already. We already are under that. So right now, if you, Isabelle, decide to be gay tomorrow, you can say, andrew, suppress my identity. And he's a pastor, therefore we need to investigate him. So right now, in Australia, as a pastor, if I pray for a gay person, if I preach one on one to a gay person, if I disciple, mentor, counsel, or do any pastoral gate Any do any pastoral care to a gay person, even with their consent, to get them to turn away from the sin. I would go to jail for five years. And our church, Echo Church, will get fined $100,000 for praying the gay way.

[C]

Wow.

[B]

That is the law of the land. With their consent. So if you pray, if you disciple, if you mentor, the only thing that was protected at the time was the pulpit. Now they just went after the pulpit yesterday. Yeah.

[C]

With the hate speech laws.

[B]

If you remember, in 2020, 2021, the government chose to shut down the church for two years. You could go to the brothel to sleep with the prostitute, but you couldn't go to church to worship Jesus. You could go to the liquor store to buy alcohol and get drunk in your misery, but you couldn't go to the house of the Lord to listen to the word of the Lord. You could go to the races. Black lives matter in Australia, even though we don't have any black people. So I was like, what the hell?

[A]

That never thought about that before, to be honest with you.

[B]

But so you could do all the things but you couldn't go to church to worship. So firstly they went after the worship, then they went after the prayer, and now they're going to go after the preaching. Wow. Australia is officially a communist state.

[A]

Yeah. A totalitarian state.

[B]

It's a totalitarian state. And you saw to America is firstly they go after worship, then they're going to go after prayer, then they go after the preaching. It's systematic worship, prayer and preaching.

[C]

Yeah. But what is so deceptive about all of this though is the language they use. Because, I mean, what's that quote like? Never waste a good crisis.

[B]

It's always after Hillary Clinton. Never let a good crisis go away.

[C]

Exactly. It's always, always some sort of global crisis or national crisis that all of a sudden our government cares very much about all of the minorities in the country and we want to protect you. But I mean, that should be a red flag for everybody that's paying attention is like all of a sudden now Christians are hateful bigots when we quite literally had Muslims shooting down Jews on the streets of Sydney. So it's just like all of this is to the average person, there is no discernment, there's no ability to understand because they have with language for so long and people are now deaf to it.

[A]

That's so important and I think speaks volumes as to what happens next in Australia because so much of this feels quite Orwellian to me that it's not just about controlling the outcomes. Now the Australian government and many other governments around the world as well are working to change people's thoughts and police their hearts. As we were just talking about now, it's about self censorship. It's about preventing people from formulating their own opinions and shaping their own values. Australia just joined the chorus of other nations trying to ban your access to X indefinitely. And other social media platforms, it's Australia.

[B]

Canada and UK are in the process of removing X because the reason we know what happened in Bondi, because it was on X. If it wasn't for X, the day after, the promise will be there's a terrorist attack attacking Jews. Who did it? We don't know. Why did they do it? We don't know. But the good news is we know what's happening. Yeah, Like, I remember a few months after the October 7 attack when Muslims, the day after October 7, Muslims were screaming in front of Sydney Opera House. Gas statues. Gas statues. Gas statues. You can Google the video.

[A]

I remember those videos.

[B]

And then I said, a few months, I knew that a few months later, a church was going to be attacked. Yeah. A few months later, you had a young Muslim boy go to a church 40 minutes down the road from our church. I got an Orthodox church, Assyrian. And that boy stabbed Bishop Marimari. And. And he was about to stab him. He said, allahu Akbar. The media reported. We don't know his intentions.

[C]

I'm like, he said, we're unclear of the motives.

[B]

So this is a funny thing. The bill mentioned everything. Because the bill was created to combat anti Semitism and radical terrorism. The bill did not mention Islam at all.

[C]

Yeah.

[A]

Back to today's incredibly important conversation in a second. But first, it's almost Valentine's Day. I can't believe it. And it is time for us to show a little love to ourselves or to that special person in your life. Our friends at Cozy Earth are making it so easy to bring comfort, care, and a little extra love into your everyday life. This year, this Valentine season, they are offering an amazing buy one, get one pajama deal that you won't see any other time of the year. Cozy Earth PJs are truly some of my absolute favorites. I know we're not supposed to be wearing PJs to the airport anymore, per Secretary Duffy, but I have worn them on planes many, many times, and it is an immaculate feeling. This is seriously one of those Cozy Earth favorites that I cannot stop raving about. They're lightweight, but they're still cozy. And somehow it helps you fall asleep faster and way more comfortable and stay asleep longer, which as a mom is basically priceless. Worth any price tag. Plus it sleeps cooler than cotton so you're not waking up overheated in the middle of the night while you're still looking elevated as you sleep. It is thoughtful, comfortable and so easy to love whether you're treating yourself or gifting it to someone special who deserves better. Rest this year in 2026 and here is the best part, they give you a 100 night sleep trial so if you don't love them, which seems impossible if you ask me, you can return them hassle free. Plus there's a 10 year warranty because they know you want this to last. These viral PJs are so good that they sold out during the holidays and now they are back with an exclusive deal only available January 25th to February 8th. We are running out of time people. Head to cozyearth.com today and use my code ISABELLEBOGO I S A B E L B O G O to get these PJs for you and someone you love. And if you get a post purchase survey, make sure you mention that you heard about Cozy Earth right here on the Isabelle Brown Show. Celebrate everyday love with comfort. That makes those little moments count. No, in fact I think to the contrary. If I remember reading the text of the bill from a few weeks ago when this was all originally introduced. There are carve outs for religious groups that they can spread certain hate speech. There's no carve out for Christians obviously, but there is a carve out for a Muslim Australian to be able to protect their religious world.

[C]

Well, as long as it's a direct quote from a religious text.

[B]

And so you conquered the size of.

[C]

The but you can preach criticize the ideology of Islam because that's not a direct quote from the Bible but they can use direct quotes from the Quran that call on the murder of Jews.

[B]

And that is okay, so it's it's crazy stuff. It's Orwellian, it's freedom is tyranny, good is evil. It's it's every single type of definition is flipped left, right and center. It's quiz for Palestine gays. It's the exact same worldview. Like this does not make sense.

[A]

And yeah, everyone just kind of seems to be going along.

[B]

So the bill did two things. It criminalizes hate preaching. So I'm in that category, not Islam. In fact, our prime minister came the day after and said this attack is a perversion of Islam. I'm like I Didn't know. Dude, you're an Islamic scholar now. You are. Mr. Prime Minister is a democratic socialist. Like, like Zohar, Ramandani, Cortez, asc, all that crew. So he's a democratic socialist. He hates religion, obviously, but for some reason now he's an Islamic apologist. He's coming now telling us ISIS does not represent Islam. I'm like, dude, you are now heading into the theological sphere. So he's now an Islamic scholar, he's a defender of Islam and explainer of what Islam is.

[A]

That seems to be confusing a lot of people. And I want to spend a few minutes asking you about your experience growing up and what you can warn the world. I know we've done an episode on this already, but to dive into this from a new perspective with what's happening in Australia, really the only person that was paying attention to this in the American podcasting and media world was Charlie Kirk before he was killed. And he warned for years about this new rising axis between the democratic socialism, extreme left, gay rainbow mafia and what we're seeing with Islam, which seemingly do not go together at all. Ali Beth Stuckey had a phenomenal tweet about this a few months ago saying for those that this doesn't make sense to it literally is all rooted in a hatred of Jesus Christ and a hatred of Christianity. So you're watching these two sides of the spectrum that have nothing in common link arms to take down the church and to take down a Christian worldview which the west was built upon.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Can you explain a little bit as to how these Islamic extremists are using the vehicle of liberal, not even liberal, leftist left wing socialism even though they have nothing in common.

[B]

I remember the day before Charlie was murdered, one of his last tweets on X was Islam is the sword that left we used to cut the throat of America. Leftism has found this evil wicked ideology called Islam to link arm with because by reality America, Australia and the west are very, very Christian. We're not communist. What happened is you have the interesting collusion between communism and Islam, between the LGBQ sex cult and violent Allah, between the woke Marxists and Muslims and they both unite over because it doesn't make sense. Quiz for Palestine, gays for Gaza, chickens for kfc. Nothing makes sense about the whole movement but when you fundamentally look at the whole thing, they unite over both Islam and socialism, both Islam and Marxism, both Allah and Wokeism. They both hate America because they both hate Christianity. They both hate Christianity because they both hate freedom, because freedom is fundamentally. It's not an American concept, it's not even a Western concept. It's the Christian concept. And you will know the truth and the truth will set you free. Where the spirit of the Lord is, there is freedom. Both Islam and socialism, they worship power, we worship Jesus, who is the truth. So they have found the perfect alliance between the two to fundamentally destroy the west from within. And you saw the free, free Palestine cause that was such a moment of alliance between the left and Islam. It doesn't make sense at all. Because there is no freedom in Palestine. As like gays get butchered and killed in Palestine. Even you have stupid Christians who support Palestine for Palestine. Like, dude, like Christians have been genocided in Palestine for the last 100 years. Like Gaza right now. Before 1945, there was like there were 35000 Christians in Gaza. When Hamas took over Gaza, there was 5000 Christians in Gaza. Right now there's only 800 Christians in Gaza.

[A]

Mostly one church.

[B]

Yeah, one church. But the Jews and the Jews and the Jews, I'm like, dude, you need to do your research. Like Islam spread from 250 Muslims in 1948 in Gaza. Now they're up to 2 million Muslims. So Islam has been spreading exponentially in Gaza while Christianity is literally genocided. Less than 1% of people in Gaza are Christians. So when people say free Palestine, Free Palestine and particular Christians subscribe that narrative. I don't know what you mean because statistically, historically, factually speaking, there is no free Palestine. There is no freedom of Palestine. There's freedom in Israel. You can be gay or whatever you want, but there is an unholy alliance between communism and Islam. And you can see Zohra Memdani in Australia, the Prime Minister Anthony Albanese, you can see in uk, Sadiq Khan, he's a socialist Muslim. You can see it with keithama, he's a socialist Islamic sympathizer. You can see now with AUC Ilhan Omar. Yeah, there is a perfect match politically between Islam and communism. And the only conclusion, it's the spirit of the Antichrist. Yeah, they're uniting over their hatred toward America and the West.

[C]

And by the way, this is like going back to just the overlap of liberalism and Islam is even historically, if you look at how Islam invaded Egypt with like all of the ancient Christian civilizations, one thing that you'll see if you look at primary sources is the liberalization of the nation. Like in Egypt, the priests, even in the church, there was cross dressing, there was like argument arguments about like dumb little Things the emasculation of men. Think about this for a second. How easy would it be for strong, aggressive Muslim men to invade a nation where the men are passive, they're weak, they don't believe in fighting, they just believe in love and empathy and, and liberalism. And so I think it's a very good strategy that Muslims tend to see and recognize even more than the Christian West.

[B]

Wow. So there is this weird lie, but Muslims aren't conservative. They're conservative. They're not. Muslims are not conservative. They're conservative internally, but with their voting pattern, they're not. Eight out of ten Muslims in Australia vote left. You. So with the Mandani, at least eight to nine Muslims have voted for the Ramadani. Who squeezed for Palatine's guess for Gaza. Because Muslims are utilitarian.

[C]

Yeah.

[B]

They hate to win, they hate to conquer. They have to take over. And the reality is Christendom is found on the right. We have principles, we have virtue, we have a flag, we have a country, we have a nation. And that is a fundamental threat to Islam. But what you'll find is, is that Islam will be rising exponentially on the left wing in politics because the left doesn't have values, it doesn't have virtues. They hate their own country. So Islam happens to be that perfect mix that finds leftism and liberalism on the left side of politics. So you'll find Islam very, very predominant on the left wing of politics. And you can see this across the globe.

[A]

That's a powerful way of looking at this because I think for so many people, the idea that the hatred of America and the self hatred that the left is preaching about, if you are white or if you are Christian or any of the things that generally make up the baseline of our historic nation. And then the death to America component in Islam, they don't seem related, but they really do manifest in the same ways. And that parallel is never discussed in political circles, in the mainstream media, but it's very obvious that it's happening. And it's not just happening in America, it's happening in Australia, the uk, all across Europe, Canada. Yeah, everywhere. What's interesting to me is I'm curious to get your take as pastors, if Christianity can effectively learn how to combat this. Typically we are less organized as a religious group. Certainly post Reformation when people have had so many different interdenominational divisions. The last time Christianity was quite organized to fight for our faith, it got quite a bad rap. The Crusades and history books, you know, I see a lot of crusade memes on social media these days, King Baldwin seems pretty, pretty interesting to talk about, but I don't know that we have the same level of societal courage to be unapologetic about the things that we believe in. And I don't know how we get that back, honestly.

[B]

The beauty of Christianity. We're the religion of the pen. Islam's sword. Islam's word is a sword. Christianity's sword is a word. All we need to do is to speak and proclaim. There's a reason why all these laws are passing. There's a reason why as I'm speaking this, the amount of death threats I get for simply proclaiming the word of the Lord against Islam. All we need is to speak. In Christianity, we do have an offensive weapon. And that offensive weapon is the word of the Lord. Jesus said, I did not come to bring peace, I came to bring war. The Bible said that the sword of the spirit in Christendom, we do have one offensive weapon, which is the word of the Lord. If you simply speak, you will be able to dismantle all the lies, all enemy. There's something, there's a reason why the left and the Muslims are fundamentally anti freedom of speech. Because the moment you speak, lies fade. The moment you speak, all the scales will fall. The moment you simply speak and proclaim the word of the Lord. That's why Jesus was literally charged on blasphemy laws. It's all about speaking. We don't need to raise armies, we don't need to shoot weapons. Unless you're a country, that's a different story. But us as Christians, all we need to do is to speak and proclaim the word of the Lord. And that's the reason Paul said, I'm not ashamed of the Gospel. The problem we have is that most people are ashamed of the gospel. Like Muslims literally worship a violent, bloodthirsty, weird God and a pedophile prophet who married 11 women who declared war on the whole entire world. Their religion is historically ridiculous, factually conspiratorial. It's not real, it's not true. It's stupid. It's the stupidest thing in the world. Historically. Islam, Islam is just like. It's like it doesn't make sense at all that people that never saw Jesus and never encountered Jesus know more about Jesus than the people that hugged, kissed Jesus. Matthew, Mark, Luke, John, all these people. So Islam is ridiculous, yet what they do have is that they are not ashamed. Yeah, even though the religion is stupid. But we have the truth. We have the Bible, we have 2,000 years of church history, we have built the best civilizations. That's why Muslims escape their crap holes to come to America. That will get me in jail.

[C]

Yeah, it's hate speech, babe.

[A]

Self censorship maybe.

[B]

So for some reason, Muslims, if you right now open the borders, Muslims will be running to enter America. They don't go for Muslim states. So there is no logic and coherence in Islam. So my encouragement, Christianity, why Christians? Why are you ashamed of the gospel? Yeah, yeah, you don't need.

[C]

There's nothing to be ashamed of. And like, that's like what Andrew said, just to reiterate that, like, we have the ultimate absolute truth. And by the way, the truth always comes out. Like, we have seen that. We understand that. But that is why I think as much as we are very involved in like, so many conservative circles and we're getting on conservative podcasts and very much fighting to conserve, the real question that we're always asking is what exactly are we conserving and what the first business that we have is? Kingdom business. We're here to bring the kingdom. We're here to fight for the kingdom, which is done. Thank God. In a free country, you don't have to necessarily use force yet unless you're not willing to fight ideologically to fight by speaking. And so that's really our encouragement is as you build the church is like, build the church, speak and declare the gospel. We have the best news for everyone. And that's the beauty of it is Christianity, a Christian nation is not just good for. For Christians, it's good for everyone. For the atheists, it's good for the gays. You. You have the freedom to live how you want to live. And so this is kind of the big thing that we're arguing is that we're not just here as conservatives, we're here as Christians. We have a kingdom to build.

[A]

So important. I got a comment on an Instagram post, I don't know, maybe a week after Charlie died. It was very fresh after everything. And someone commented, isabel, I loved all of your content for years and years and years. I so appreciate all of your political values. But you're just posting way too much about religion now. And I'm so over it. I'm gonna have to unf. Follow you. I said, okay, bye. Like, I don't.

[C]

That's.

[A]

That's the foundation of everything. It has to be the foundation of everything.

[B]

Yeah. And. And you guys have to understand, like, we're talking about it is. But like Australia, we are reaping the consequence of leaving the church. Church attendance in Australia is 5% of Australians go to church.

[A]

Wow.

[B]

The reality is, when you abandon God, when you leave God, when you abandon the Bible, when you leave the God of your ancestors, there will be the judgment of God. And that judgment of God in nations is communism and Islam. Yeah. There is no negotiation. Communism is literally the absence of God. When people, when nations forget God, they become communists. And then when people forget God, there's going to be another evil, violent, demonic spirit that rises, and that is Allah. The spirit of Allah. So America, you have to watch, very simply, if you don't go to church, America will become Australia. Yeah. America at the moment is 30% people go to church in Australia with 37% Christian. So we're already a minority. What Americans don't understand, in the next 20 years, Christianity is anticipated to go down. Thank the Lord for Charlie Kirk's revival that took place because of his blood, because the blood of the martyrs sealed the church. God was very kind to let his blood become a revival. But if you don't go to church, if you don't build the church, if the church of Jesus Christ doesn't grow exponentially, which will lead to Christianity. At the moment, Christianity in America is 70 to 76%. Once you reach the 50, that is where freedom of speech will be taken away. This is very important. We don't have the cultural or moral bullets to have any virtue. We are surrounded by people that don't go to church. So they don't know Jesus, they don't know the truth. They don't have values, they don't have virtue, they don't have morality. So the reality is you can fight politically as much as you want, but if you don't go to church, the formula is very simple. Communism and Islam rises when church attendance goes down.

[C]

Yeah.

[B]

So we don't have the ammo. People in Australia are not discipled by the church, they're discipled by the media.

[C]

Yes.

[B]

That's why they're communist.

[C]

Yeah.

[A]

We were talking in the green room for a few minutes about the cultural difference between the United States and what we're seeing in Australia and in the uk. I'm hearing this from all of my British friends right now that they're almost waking up too late after things have gone way off the rails, and they're saying, oh, my gosh, what do we do? What do we do? What do we do? And lack the gumption and the cultural courage to actually stand up and say something that is very inherently baked into what it means to be An American. It always has been that way, right? That, that's our culture. And I think people have looked at America historically and said those people are crazy. Like they'll say anything that's absolutely wild. And now they're just desperately looking for a seed of that in their own cultures around the world. And yet we're watching that courage slip here as well. If you had a message of encouragement to anyone in the west needing to find that tiny bit of inspiration to just stand up and say something, what would you say?

[C]

I mean, I, what I say is, I mean, you just, you don't have to look very far, look at history, but also just read your Bible. What I always go back to is what we're seeing now is exactly what we saw in Daniel, chapter one. Hezekiah, the king before the exile, he was apathetic. He was given a vision, a prophecy that, hey, the next generation are going to be wiped away. They're going to go into exile. And he said, this is good news because at least I won't be around. At least it's not going to happen under my leadership. So we have, what we're experiencing now is the result of the previous generation being apathetic, not actually living out their Christianity in public, doing it in private, doing it in closed doors, but not actually being unapologetic and unashamed. And what happens is the next generation pay for it. And so if it's not just about you and the generation you live in, then can you at least think about your children? Can you at least consider what kind of world are you going to leave? Are your children going to have the freedom of speech that they currently have? And that's what I love about America. And the foundations of this nation has been you fought for the freedom that you have. Whereas in Australia, a big part of the problem is the foundations of our nation were we took a bunch of convicts from England and put them on an iron.

[A]

I think that would help actually, that it would create a little bit of a well known idea.

[B]

Was founded. England was very angry that they lost America. So Australia. So with America they send, sorry, my Australian friends, with America they send all the smart people to America. With Australia they're like, we don't want them to rebel so they send all the dumb people to Australia.

[A]

Wow, you're really poking the hate speech bear today.

[B]

If you live in Australia, you're probably dumb and I'm one of you guys. But yeah, the purpose of Australia was to ensure that America doesn't happen again historically. So the English Were like, dude, we're not sending George Washington's again. We're not sending Benjamin Franklin's.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Because they're going to rebel against us to create their own country. So Australia was founded to make sure.

[C]

America, there's no revolution.

[A]

That's so interesting.

[B]

It's just fun.

[C]

Historical fact still exists at the heart of the nation.

[B]

Which is the heart of the nation.

[C]

Yeah.

[B]

Benjamin, who was it? Anybody that trades freedom for sake of safety. Is that Benjamin Franklin?

[A]

It might be George Washington. There's a simple one of the guys from Washington.

[B]

But Australia, with Australia, we always trade freedom for safety.

[C]

Yeah.

[B]

So you end up with neither. But Australia, Australians, you need to study history. You are spiritually a peasant and, yeah. A convict. Yeah. You need to break free.

[A]

I think it's actually important to note too, that's not a derogatory or mean thing to tell people. This is an inspiring thing to tell people because there is such a seed of curiosity right now of what it looks like to actually fight for freedom. And unfortunately, there are countless civilizations across the west right now that are kind of in the latter half of the FAFO sequence where they're realizing now, oh, no, I didn't speak up when I had the chance to speak up. It's like the poem. First they came for this group and I didn't speak up because I wasn't one of them. Now I shudder to think about what's next for places like Australia. I don't know where you go after you've criminalized everything.

[B]

We are now a communist state. Like, that is the absolute. That's tyranny. Like, there is no other way to define it. And the problem is it has been happening in Australia for a very, very long time. In Covid, the church was shot and people like, whatever, whatever. I'm like, you're next, you're next.

[C]

Yeah.

[B]

And then we got criminalized one year and a half ago, praying the gay way. And I was like, guys, you're next.

[C]

Wake up, you're next.

[B]

And guess what? Now Australia, they're complaining, but, hey, you need to fight early.

[C]

Yes.

[B]

And you better fight now because it will get worse.

[C]

It's not too late.

[B]

It's not. I think we can do something. They will see, but we'll, hey, you do your part, let go, do the rest without fighting.

[A]

Do you see a future in Australia where this sounds insane, but Christianity becomes illegal?

[C]

Oh, yeah.

[A]

Where people start being killed for this? I mean, where does this go? Well, people don't fight.

[B]

Christianity is. The conversion therapy bill is designed to make sure, like, when you get saved. It's called the conversion experience. So it is illegal in Australia for a gay person to become a Christian. Christianity is already legal.

[A]

Well. And the hate speech law kind of just cemented that.

[B]

Cemented that. So people need to understand Christianity is illegal. It's just wrapped in a nice language.

[C]

Yeah.

[B]

Like, you know, I mean, it's like. So Christianity is already illegal. Are we gonna get killed? Well, we saw was Bishop Marimari and the media didn't report on it. The media only reported. I was the first person they were trying to silence. It was a Muslim and the media didn't report it was a Muslim. They said, oh, we don't know what happened. So it's already happening. Like, if a Muslim attacks our church, I know the media is not going to report it. I know that already. Because they don't want to cause Islamophobia. Yeah. So we are already living in a communist state mixed with an Islamic regime where you just saw 15 Jews get killed.

[C]

Yeah.

[B]

It doesn't get more Middle Eastern than this. Like, if you saw the video, there was 50 bodies on the floor. Like, when we saw I was finished church, we launched a video. I'm like, what the heck? I thought it was Israel.

[C]

Yeah.

[B]

I was like, no, it's Bondi. Yeah. So the proofs in the pudding, guys. You gotta open your eyes to see what's happening in front of you. Yeah. There is. There is room. There's always space and place to fight. It's not too late. But you do need to do something.

[C]

Yeah. It's not doom or gloom. Like, there is always. There's always a chance to keep fighting. And, I mean, we're not in the stage just yet, unfortunately. I think people are voting in their tyranny. They're voting for.

[B]

Yeah, we voted in our tyranny.

[A]

So as we are here in many states and cities.

[C]

Exactly. Which is. Is actually like, good news. It's the fact that you're voting for. It shows that you can just vote differently. So I have hope, hope, at least a little bit of hope for Australia. At least if the church stands up, then that's all we need. Muslims, when you think about it, they make such a small portion of the population, yet they're so impactful because they are very aggressive and united. So if we can reflect that in the church in the way that the word of God tells us to fight, which is we wage war, spiritually speaking, then we can actually change the nation. And so America, same thing you guys are in a way Better position. And there's so many of you that are fighting.

[A]

Yeah.

[C]

Yeah.

[B]

We don't have the freedom of speech, the freedom of worship, the freedom. Together we have no rights.

[C]

Yeah.

[B]

Like tomorrow they can make me Osama bin Laden legally.

[C]

Yeah.

[B]

There is no. I can wake up tomorrow and they can say, andrew said raise Osama bin Laden.

[C]

Yeah.

[B]

Which means I'm Osama bin Laden.

[C]

Yeah.

[B]

So America, what the laws mean.

[C]

America has the law beside it, backing it up, has a constitution, but it also has the fighting spirit. So I'm. I have so much hope for at least America.

[A]

As a pastor in particular, I'm curious to get your take on the importance of Christian unity. It seems to me in America right now we are a bit more obsessed with pointing the finger at each other as Christians and saying, xyz, your denomination, yada, yada, yada. And it seems to me there needs desperately to be this sense of linking arms and saying, we are one body of Christ, because we truly are on the defensive. We're under attack all over, all over the world. I know the Pope has been very outspoken about this since he became the Pope this last year and is doing everything he can to revive Christian unity from the European and global sense. We have many people trying to do that culturally here in America. Are the problems similar in Australia? And what can we do to religious.

[B]

Sectarianism is very big in Australia. It's. It's a Western thing. It's a Western disease because we have grown up in peace, love, utopian, good times. So we major in minor and we minor in major topics. The reality is when Islam takes over, when Communism takes over, Islam and Communism do not differentiate between Protestant or Catholic, Orthodox, we are all the same. Christianity was eradicated and genocided from Egypt. Whether you're Catholic, whether you're Protestant, or whether you are a Orthodox, it doesn't really matter. The three main sects or sects across the globe, Orthodox, the East, Protestantism, the West, and the Catholic, the West as well. So the reality is we, we need to fight. Theologically, no problem. That's in the house. But when it comes to our political expression, when it comes to our outside expression, we do need to be united. Yeah, Muslims do not get along. After they kill the Jews, after they kill the Christians, after they kill the gays, they start to kill each other. Just look at Syria, look at Pakistan. Muslims, they just don't stop war. But the strength that they do have, they're utilitarian. They see the big picture. And my encouragement to Christians, as someone who fled The Middle east, we're all gonna go.

[C]

Yeah.

[B]

Whether you're a Catholic, you're gonna go. Whether you are a Protestant, you're gonna go. Whether you're Orthodox, you're gonna go. My encouragement to you is to ensure the survival of Christendom. So me and you have the freedom to debate.

[C]

Yes.

[B]

And have. And play together. Because what we're dealing with at the moment is very unusual and it's not common to the West. The west is now facing an enemy from within. Islam. When America was founded, it was Catholics, Protestants, whatever, but there was no Islam.

[C]

Yeah.

[B]

There was no communism.

[C]

Yeah.

[B]

So if the church doesn't unite, we will lose.

[C]

Yeah. And I think, sorry, there you go.

[B]

Let's fight within the church. But politically, we do have united. We are pro life, we are pro Jesus. Jesus is Lord. Overall, we are all pro freedom of speech. We're not here to force people to become Christian. We believe that in authority and the credibility of the word of God. Jesus is fully man, fully God. That's kind of what Islam is going to attack. Trinity, Bible, there's a lot of. With Catholics, Protestants and Orthodox, we agree on 90%. We do need to learn how to politically get along or we'll be butchered. What's gonna destroy America is the Catholics and the Protestants and the Orthodox fighting outwardly rather than uniting outwardly.

[C]

Yeah.

[A]

Yeah.

[C]

I think we just need to focus on what are the primary issues that will actually cost the next generation, that will actually cost the survival of Christianity. I mean, when you think about this week is the march for life. When you think about, I love it because you see Catholics represented, you see Protestants represented, you see all types of denominations. And as much as that is in other cases, it's annoying to see all the differences. I'm like, the fact that we can unite on the sanctity of life is just one place that we can say, okay, while the Muslims are relying on us aborting our babies so that we die off, while the Muslims are relying on us quite literally going extinct because of abortion because we're legalizing same sex marriage and, you know, the sexual perversion, we can unite on the issues that will actually ensure the survival of Christendom. And so I do think that there is so much room for unity if we link arms, if we speak to these issues, because there's a lot of work we need to do even in the conservative movement around these issues. I think if we can unite and if we can stand firm on the word of God and link arms and we can actually Save this nation.

[A]

I'm glad you brought up the March for Life, because that is why you guys are here right now, which is so exciting. And in my neighborhood and neck of the woods, the march will have already passed by the time this episode comes out. But I'm curious if you have any last words for us in our last couple of minutes together about the importance of reviving the family. What we're watching right now in the pro life world is a bit of a shift that I think is really important, actually, away from just being on defense against the abortion industry. That is so important. But we're making a lot of headway in that space. So now we're shifting on the offensive side towards encouraging people to have children, getting married, reviving this sense of the family as the cornerstone of Western civilization. Again, that work that starts in the home is so important in the survival of Christendom all over the world. Tell me a little bit more about your take on that.

[B]

Yeah, the problem we're having in the west is gayness and liberalism. They're Christian diseases. Every second gay person that you talk to, their grandma was a Christian. She didn't disciple him properly. You look at Muslims, Muslims are very good at passing down the faith. So the problem we have at the moment is that we're not passing the faith faith properly. We're not partnering the faith. You look at every person. You can have your own religion, you can do your own thing. I'll raise them and they'll make their own decision. I'm like the Bible said, train your child in the way of the Lord. When they grow up, they will not walk away from him. So the reality is we need to be family oriented, get married, have children, don't have sex out of wedlock. Enough with being irresponsible. It is time for every man to say, like Joshua, as for me and my house, we will serve the Lord. The problem, by the way, is fundamentally a family problem. At the moment, the replacement rate for Americans Christians is 2.6. In America, the replacement rate for Muslims, sorry, the replacement rate for Christians is 2.1. The replacement rate for Muslim is 2.6. So the problem is fundamentally a baby problem. Like, we can attack and blame Islam as much as we want, but we are the one who are passing abortion. Abortion is illegal in the Middle East. We're the one who are killing our babies. We're the one who are getting our kids to be gay.

[A]

We are the ones.

[B]

And we're the one who have normalized sex out of marriage. We are the One who destroyed family and replaced it with hyper individualism. You got the communist, the Haram Amdani community without family. But you also have the individualism. I'm like, we are family and legacy oriented. We're not individualistic that it's just me. But we're also not communist. Just. Yeah, he said that stupid statement that.

[A]

He said the warmth of collective.

[B]

Shut up, dude. I have a mom, I have a dad. I don't need you. Yeah, I have shelter. So we need to understand men. You need to be godly, get married, don't play around with girls, don't be an Andrew Tate. Don't be all this softy. Look, strong men, you really need to act like a man, get married, lead your children, go to church and be like Joshua. As for me and my house, we will serve the Lord.

[C]

Yeah, I think every problem that come to can just be solved by building the family. The family, the way that the Bible describes it, the family, the way that the church has done it for so long is, you know, marriage, one man, one woman. Like that is something that we need to like reiterate these days too. But also sex is a gift for marriage. Abortion is a. It's detestable in the eyes of God. And so I think everything can really be understood. As soon as we started to break apart the family, as soon as we introduced the, you know, divorce, all of this happens. When you destroy the family, you destroy society.

[B]

So I think family and faith, this is the two things, the corner block.

[C]

Family, faith and freedom. Yeah. So that is the cornerstone of the West. It's a cornerstone of this country. So if you, if we can, every single person, you can point fingers at politicians all you want, but if you are not doing your part building the church, but also building a family, that's the first commandment that God gave was go and multiply, have lots of babies, but also multiply the kingdom values across every place that you step your foot. So I think that that's the hope is that God has given us the BluePR. He's given us the commandment. We just have to start saying yes and actually live it, have the courage.

[A]

To do it and can confirm it is pretty darn awesome to get married and have babies and to pass this down to your family. I sure am grateful that your family is serving the Lord in the most powerful ways. Thank you for fighting on behalf of the West. Thank you for giving courage to so many people all over the world. I will be praying for your return to Australia and that we're not Waiting on a potential prison sentence, which, sadly is not even.

[B]

We do a podcast from jail.

[A]

Yeah, we'll do Zoom. Might reach us. Israeli in jail, maybe. Who knows?

[B]

I don't know.

[A]

You guys may have to fight for that. With some of your new, new problems, how can people continue following you, supporting you? Not that we want to throw them in prison these days too, but how do people continue giving your voice a megaphone?

[B]

We are on all socials. Instagram, YouTube, tick tock, Facebook. Just do Cedra. You'll find a lot of Cedars, Andrew, Saidra, someone else that looks like me who's married to a different girl. Marcus, Cedra, Millie, Cedra, John, Cedric, Rob. Cedric or Echo Church. If you live in Sydney, come pop by. Join the fight at your own risk. Yeah, we need. We need as many people as possible united because, hey, the church is a problem and church of the answer, because leadership is the problem. I believe she's the answer.

[A]

Yeah.

[C]

Yeah. Amen.

[A]

I can't wait to march with you guys at the March for Life tomorrow. And thank you again so much for your question.

[C]

Thank you, Isabelle.

[B]

Thank you.

[A]

I could have talked to them. I remember saying this to my producers at the time. I literally could have talked to them for like, four and a half hours. Unfortunately, we only reserved the studio space for an hour, but we will be sure to have them back and hopefully have a chance to visit them down under in Australia very soon. That is, if I or the Daily Wire as an organization are not barred from Australia by law. I could see that as a very realistic possibility. Pray for that not to happen. And of course, pray for this incredible family and their church in Australia as they seek to transform hearts and minds and bring the gospel to as many people as possible. They are under a very, very, very real targeted threat from the Australian government and it is a high likelihood that there may be prison time in their near future for just having the courage to tell the world that Jesus Christ is our savior. We're praying for them every day and would love to ask you to join us in that again. If you don't have any weekend plans, I insist go see the Melania movie. It is the perfect date night and the movie was so much better than I ever could have expected. Truly knocked it out of the park. We will see you guys back on Monday to break down the ridiculous meltdowns the women of the left are having as we kick off February. Love you guys.