Jack Posobiec (18:13)

Isabel, thanks so much. And I'm also happy to announce that not only do we have the Human Events Media Group as well as the Post Millennial on board, Court TV actually just came out and is now joining in this as well. So Julie Grant, the great Julie Grant who does the morning show over there, she's been with the, she's been with the network for a long time, one of their best anchors, she just came out and gave a full throated support to this push as well, saying the cameras should be on the pole. Public has a right to know. And I, I just really grateful for, for her support in this fight. And I, I certainly encourage every media organization, left wing, left wing, right wing, whatever side of the aisle you find yourself independent, corporate, it shouldn't matter. We, the public has a right to know. So we can all discuss this. That is our check on the court process. So it's not just the, you know, the two sides, the prosecution and the defense. And by the way, the defense in every case deserves a strong defense. And I certainly support that. I support the right to trial, but at the same time, I support the public' no, because that's our check in a free society against the whole process. And that's why and I've said for the same reason, by the way, federal courtrooms do not have cameras. It's something that I've spoken about for years. I really think that we should have those especially imagine if we could have seen the truth in those J6 trials. Imagine if we could have seen the truth in all of the witch hunts on, on anyone associated with Trump and the Trump movement, conservatives, Republicans, and I'm sure, I'm sure there's going to be more of those coming up soon at some point, you know, in different pockets of the country where there are still BL prosecutors, Daniel Penny, et cetera, et cetera.

Isabel Brown (19:45)

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Jack Posobiec (21:42)

So I think that having the courts be able to show that publicly. By the way, Kyle Rittenhouse, that was public. The, the case with, with George Floyd, Derek Chauvin, that was public. The case with Brian Coburger. Right. Even take the politics out of it. The Idaho sorority sisters who were brutally murdered. That was again put put on camera something that was a national story that everybody played a role in and everybody watched and everybody talked about the Murdoch murders as well. You can go, the list goes on. And so Utah, by the way, really interesting and I do actually think that the judge will deny this request from, from Robinson's lawyers here to ban cameras because Utah actually has a really interesting law that I didn't even know about but digging into this and we've got the court citations all the way up to the Supreme Court citing the precedent on this, the First Amendment etc, but Utah itself has a law on the books that says there is a presumption, a presumption of public access through what they call electronic devices and electronic recording in these court cases. So that means not only what are they allowed, but it's actually presumed that it will be on camera in Utah, which is incredible. It's actually very progressive and open compared to some states where you have to show cause for. For publicity. In this case, it's presumed so they would have to show a very strong reason to not have it public. And they just haven't done so in this case, 100%.

Isabel Brown (23:16)

And I'm really glad that you brought up the Kyle Rittenhouse trial, the Derek Chauvin trial. These are very high profile political conversations that we've been having having in our country over the past few years. And certainly those were very public through media consumption as well. I watched the Kyle Rittenhouse jury verdict on a plane, and I will never forget seeing so many people in the rows in front of me also watching it in real time on their screens on an airplane. You certainly saw the media surrounding the Derek Chauvin verdict so, so strongly, more than any other story that week. So I think it's interesting that people are now using the Derek Chauvin trial in particular as a litmus test to argue why there shouldn't be cameras at the Tyler Robinson trial. Because they're saying, well, that so clearly influenced the jury because they were very afraid of backlash. Their information was leaked, their identity was somewhat out there as a juror who is supposed to be very anonymous and impartial in these situations. But I want to hear your take on this because I think it's obvious, because of the manner in which the world found out about Charlie's death and assassination, because that moment was so public. I don't think that making a trial public is going to further impact any preconceived notions by a jury. All of us nationwide, regardless of where you fall on the political spectrum, are already talking about Charlie's very public execution. So walk us through what that means for you and why that was included in a lot of your social media posts this week.

Jack Posobiec (24:46)

Yeah, absolutely. And I would just point out, by the way, that the reason that the jurors were made public in the Derek Chauvin trial was because one juror in particular himself wanted to be interviewed, was going and doing interviews on CNN and local media, and he was the one who came out and admitted that not only was he someone who had been a member of Black Lives Matter, not only was he someone who had participated in George Floyd rallies, he even flew to Washington, D.C. and met with George Floyd's uncle, walked himself into the courtroom Said that he was completely impartial. He even did, by the way, is what he did a podcast. He had a Black Lives Matter podcast. And he just lied his way onto the jury, and then he himself made his identity public. So that's what you've got on the left in terms of jurors or the Kyle Rittenhouse case. That jury was kept completely private. And the only time that anyone ever tried to publicize the juror's identification was when MSNBC was. Was chasing the jury van through the streets after trial one day. I'll never forget this. They were chasing them through the streets, trying to find where the jurors were being sequestered to try to be able to talk to them, see if they wanted to go public. And the very next day, the judge in that case brought NBC up and said, why were you doing this? Why was this ever done? And said, okay, okay. He threw them out of court. So their identities were never made public. The jury box was never shown on camera, and they were thrown out after that. And so I think that's a standard that absolutely should be upheld. Yes, of course we should protect jurors, but at the same time, we have to make sure that jurors are impartial. And that's why we are looking at the juror identification boards in terms of these questions, I should say the juror questionnaires that come out, because we want to make sure that they do stay. That they do stay impartial, unlike what happened in this BLM case with Derek Chauvin. Now, from my perspective, it's simple. And we wrote in the piece that it. That Charlie Kirk did not have a choice about his murder and about the manner of his murder and the fact that he would be murdered on live stream, on essentially public tv, live tv, in front of the entire world. And that video will live forever. His children will see that video one day. We know they will. It's just the nature of things, and it sucks to say it, but it's just true. And so my. My children have asked me to see, to show them. I'm not showing them. They're too little for that. But at the same time, it exists. Charlie didn't have a say in that. Only his assassin had a say in the manner of Charlie's murder. And as such, the trial itself should also be public, if not only for the public right to access, but also for the public closure. And look, there have been so many questions and so many theories and so much skepticism regarding this case. Were there other people involved what was really going on in Utah, et cetera, et cetera. I say the best disinfectant for all of that is sunlight. Hash it all out in public, let's see. Because what, think about it, if you turn the cameras off, what's going to fill that vacuum? What's going to fill that void? You're going to have misinformation, you're going to have speculation, second party, thirdhand information, etc is going to go out. What else could happen in this day and age? AI. Imagine the AI videos that will start coming out and popping up saying, oh, this is what happened in court today. Or this is a video that was played in the case and you won't have any way to respond because you don't have that video. This is what, years ago, when I first started doing the uninterrupted live streaming on X and just Periscope and Twitter, when we used to have it, I always said what's great about this is that, yeah, the quality isn't great, but it's authenticity. This is a live, unbroken stream of what's happening in reality before my eyes right now. Whether I'm at a riot, a riot or a protest, or the RNC or the dnc, whatever it is, antifa is in front of me and everyone in the world can see it because I can't edit this. This is the only thing that's uned editable in this day and age. You can't recreate it, it can't be AI because it's real, it's happening and it's unbroken. That is the best way. We actually have to fight against misinformation, disinformation, false narratives, etc, and also it's the best way for anyone who does have questions to ask those questions and to push and probe and say, you know, what about this thing? And was that handprint? We, we had a video that came out from GRY Hughes Investigates where, you know, they did find a handprint that to this day, or at least when he was there, a couple was still up on the roof of the, the LOSI building at Utah Valley University and say, wait a minute, this palm print is right there at the same place on the video where you see the individual jumping off and then running across campus to be able to get out. So matching up the evidence, doing independent verification of the things that have been purported to be true is so important in this day and age. And I think that's the best way as a public, as a people, for everyone to have that interaction and have that Ability to be a check and balance in our system of justice.

Isabel Brown (29:54)

I could not have said that any better myself, Jack, because ultimately you're right. There is so much weird conspiracy misinformation, speculation swirling all around the Internet. And I think critics to your call to make sure that cameras are in the courtroom are saying that this would create a media spectacle out of this trial. My only response to that is if you don't think there is a media spectacle out of this trial already, you should spend about five minutes on the Internet. But this is a powerful way, as you mentioned, with sunlight being the best disinfectant for people to cross reference actual evidence, not just random theories or speculation about this particular person in a crowd, which I'm seeing a whole lot of posts on Instagram, on X, live streams on YouTube, etc, all about right now, but real, concrete investigative evidence that's going to be brought forward in cross examination and the arguments from the prosecutors and really cross referenced in real time. So if you could have a message to those who are saying it's maybe not a good idea to put cameras in this courtroom, those dissidents who say this would create an extra media spectacle out of everything, what would you say?

Jack Posobiec (31:03)

Look, guys, it's. It's simple, right? It's not the 1980s anymore, okay? We're never going post O.J. right? Post O.J. we're never going to go back to the old way of doing business. This is the Internet. This is real life. The, the quote, unquote fight for relevance and the narratives and the spectacle. Guess what? It isn't even on tv. It's on these little pieces of glass that we hold in our hand in our pocket every single day 24 7. The push notifications, the videos, the endless scroll, whatever's coming up in the algorithm. So the only way to be able to get the truth out, and this is something that I do every day as well as this is what you do every single day. The only way to do that is to fight falsity with truth and to say we disagree with what this, whatever, you know, whatever the situation is, not just this case, but whatever it is by putting your own video out, putting your own content out and having that camera out there. I think if you turn the cameras off, it makes it look like you have something to hide. And you know, I get it from, from that perspective, I get why now, by the way, there has been a ruling already that they're not going to be showing the Sally ports. That's the entrance and exits of the courthouse and the jailhouse for where Tyler Robinson, the defendant is going to be coming in and out. I get that from a security perspective. I get that from a safety perspective. We don't want someone running up and you know, pulling a Jack Ruby Lee, Harvey Oswald kind of thing here. We want that to be completely safe. I want everyone to be safe, the jurors, the defendant, the judge. I want this case to be done by the book. Not just because, by the way, that obviously, you know, we knew the victim, friends with the victim and you know, and are involved as part of the TPUSA family, but, but because that's the system we have in this country and it's the best system that we have. I think everyone deserves a right to fair trial. And go search my timeline. I've said over and over and over, I don't believe in perp walks. I believe in people having their fair shake in trial. I've said that for Weinstein, I said it for Epstein before, before he exited the scene, let's say. And I think that everyone deserves a fair trial. I really do. And so part of that fairness is making it public so that everyone can see that justice was done. Or in the case of Derek Chauvin, that's just not.

Isabel Brown (33:10)

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Jack Posobiec (36:46)

Look, it's tough. You know, these questions have been around since the idea that jury trials have been around. The same questions arose, by the way, during the Boston Massacre trial all the way back. You know, pre founding of the United States States where you had a bunch of British soldiers who were, you know, infamously on trial for conducting the Boston Massacre. And they were actually defended by none other than John Adams, who was, who went on to become obviously a patriot, a revolutionary and our second president. And so he was someone who, you know, clearly was an American patriot, but also defended the British because he believed they had a right to fair trial as well. And there were many questions about impartiality. I mean, these questions go all the way back to pre founding. It is a question of the trial itself. No, I think that really comes down to, again, the real answer on this. The real answer on this isn't a question of can we be impartial. I don't think that's true. I don't think anyone can actually be impartial or objective. Everyone is going to have some kind of biases. Everyone is going to have a worldview. That's just how human beings are set up. But the way to fight against this, number one, jury selection and jury selection science is a huge way to help to mitigate this. But also we have to restore God to the public square. None of this exists. If we don't believe in God as a creator, and if we don't believe in God as our creator and as the author of our universe and in Jesus Christ as our king, then all of this falls apart because you can just lie. You can just lie your way to a jury. You can lie your way through the trial. You put. If you don't believe the Bible, when you put your hand on it and you swear to tell the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth, then what does it matter? If you don't believe that there is a great judge that is going to, to be, you know, deciding your fate one day, right? What does it believe? You know, there's a, the, not to get too theological, but there's a, there's a line. Never, never trust the oath of an atheist, right? Because what are they, what are they swearing on?

Isabel Brown (38:41)

Right?

Jack Posobiec (38:41)

And so, yeah, it really does, it really does go back. I would say it harkens back to that lack of God in our society because that means we' our moral core. And if you don't have that moral core, we don't fight for it. Which I know you do. I know I do. I know that Charlie fought for it. Then you're right. Our entire system falls apart.

Isabel Brown (39:01)

In an instant, very, very, very quickly. As we've seen for the last couple of decades, in particular in the United States, in our Last couple of minutes with you, Jack. I know people have been asking me by the thousands. My inbox is incredibly full. I see countless comments about this every day. What can people actually do to support something constructive and meaningful in making sure that justice is served here and that the legacy and movement that Charlie spent his life building and gave his life for continues in the midst of lots of noise and lots of crazy, you know, conspiracy theories on the Internet? What are some concrete building blocks, people they themselves can pick up and contribute in a meaningful way to your fight to make sure that public transparency is reinstated here and Charlie's fight to bring God and bring truth and traditional Western values to our culture.

Jack Posobiec (39:49)

Yeah, Well, I think we actually are going to be launching a petition on this@humanqvents.com so if people want to sign that petition or get involved that way, just to make your voice heard, we're doing that. And if you happen to be a media organization, we certainly are accepting other endorsements of this fight as well. I would just encourage people to write their own open letters and get involved. And on that front, as far as Turning Point, though, it's really simple. The worst thing that we could do for Charlie's legacy, and this is something where I think everyone who knew Charlie didn't even have to have this conversation. The worst thing we could do is stop. The worst thing we could do is say, all right, let's pack it in. Let's fold up the folding tables and take our hats off and take off our freedom shirts and just go home. Because the movement is over now because we lost Charlie. Absolutely not. No. Turning point is continuing. J.D. vance and Erica are going to be down at Ole Miss coming up tonight, and we are, you know, the. The tour goes on. You've done incredible work at the vigils. You've done incredible work every single day in. In carrying on that legacy. And look, none of us are going to be able to fill Charlie's shoes. I don't think anyone's trying to. I. I would certainly hope that no one tries to, because you're not. You're not going to do it. You're not going to get there. I certainly know I won't. But I think if. If everyone takes up a little piece and we get more and more and more people by the thousands to come in, then maybe, just maybe, all of us together could do a fraction of what Charlie did. And that's the way to honor his legacy perfectly.

Isabel Brown (41:14)

Keep the movement going perfectly, said Jack. Oh, my gosh. Thank you for your voice. Thank you for your courage, for wearing that freedom T shirt literally and metaphorically as often as humanly possible. And we will be very sure to keep a close eye on this fight for transparency in the Tyler Robinson trial and have you back on the show very soon.

Jack Posobiec (41:33)

God bless, Isabel. Thanks so much. Hope to see you soon.

Isabel Brown (41:37)

As we navigate our way closer to the Tyler Robinson trial, I'm incredibly hopeful that we will have as much transparency as humanly possible, to have true faith in our system of justice and to see real justice unfold. But if you think for a second, if you think for a second that the public isn't already leaning one way or another or having an opinion about this one way or another, I urge you to think again. I do not think we live in a country anymore. And I think Jack articulated this really well, where people have such a thing as being completely impartial baked into their minds and hearts. When the entire media apparatus fits in our pocket, when we are constantly, for 8, 9, 10 plus hours a day, consuming these conversations on all of our social media platforms, when our places of employment have become by definition, political in nature, whether we're teachers at school, or we work in the entertainment industry, or we work for the media, we have witnessed this discourse become the heartbeat of American culture, for better or for worse. And we saw a whole lot of the for worse part during the Four King or the no Kings. Ha. I love how I said Four Kings protests. The no Kings protest in the last several years. Let's make no mistake about it, these people would bend over immediately if their favorite dictator asked them to, as I think we're going to see in cities like New York in the next several weeks. At the no Kings protests, though, you saw people grossly, despicably make fun of Charlie Kirk's murder. You watched the public school teacher in Chicago, who still has a job, by the way, simulate shooting herself in the neck as Charlie supporters drove by with signs honoring him and his life. Outside of the Chicago no Kings protest, you watch people dress up with the freedom T shirt and the fake blood dripping down their torso. And you are now watching this unfold for Halloween 2025. Halloween is tomorrow. But many people have already had their Halloween parties throughout the week. And this has become a new trend on social media for people to dress up. God, this is hard to look at. Sorry. Every time I think I'm over crying and getting really choked up about this, it sneaks up on me. This has become the latest trend on social media to dress up as Charlie Kirk. While he was being Assassinated. If that doesn't just send a chill through your spine, I don't know what else possibly could. America, for better or worse, has a vested interest in this trial and a vested interest in watching how our system of justice plays out, because this impacts every single one of us. Whether you personally knew Charlie or not. When TikToks like this one are going viral, of people making fun of this for Halloween, this has become the mainstream American cultural zeitgeist. Watch this. I love gay Halloween because what do you mean you're Charlie Kirk for Halloween? Hands under the face, fake blood dripping down your torso. Her friends over at Libs of TikTok the beautiful. Hiya. Reyk tweeted this this week of one of these photos where it has become a trend, I guess, to meme Charlie Kirk's execution for Halloween. To say the left is a death culture. It's hard to argue with that when you're seeing dozens upon dozens upon dozens of Instagram posts and TikTok videos and viral news stories about people making their Halloween centered around this national conversation. I hope and I pray that as much transparency that can possibly be issued in this court case as possible is put in place by this judge. But it cannot be just Jack Posobic and it cannot just be Human Events Daily and it cannot just be Court tv, who calls upon transparency in this case and specifically reaches out to the honorable Tony Graf, the judge presiding over the Tyler Robinson murder trial in the state of Utah. Write open letters yourself. Eventually there will be a petition, as you heard Jack mention this, to sign the petition yourself. Encourage those that you know with spheres of influence in media, in podcasting, in academia, wherever you possibly can in politics, to continue advocating for transparency here. I know we will be doing that here at the Daily Wire as much as we possibly can. And seek the truth. That's the. That's the biggest lesson that I hope that you can take away from this continued fight for justice. Seek the truth. Because ultimately, we are watching the degradation of our society in very real time. If we can't have general public trust in our institutions to protect our most basic civil liberties, liberties like freedom of expression, the open conversation that we can have in America's public square, which sometimes is on college campuses, it sometimes is on TikTok feeds, and sometimes it's in American courtrooms. It's up to us as American citizens upon which the government is supposed to serve. A government for the people, by the people. It's up to us to continue advocating for these liberties day in and day out, because they are never guaranteed. Charlie understood that better than anyone. Transparency and sunlight are certainly the best disinfectant here, but it's not going to happen by accident, and it's not going to happen if these attorneys have anything to say about it. So wherever we can continue advocating for the truth, advocating for real justice, and trying to preserve this crazy experiment that we call the United States of America, the better. Love you guys very, very much. We are back tomorrow for a special Halloween episode of the show. We are going to be talking about the spookiest subject of all and I will leave it there as a good cliffhanger for tomorrow. Make sure you're subscribed to the channel wherever you are listening or watching to help us grow one person at a time to bring truth and transparency to as many people as we possibly can. And go find us on your favorite podcast platform, either Apple or Spotify, to give us a five star review and download our latest episode. We'll see you tomorrow.

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