Episode Overview

Episode Title: How To Talk To Someone You Completely Disagree With
Podcast: The Jefferson Fisher Podcast
Host: Jefferson Fisher (Civility Media)
Date: November 25, 2025

In this episode, Jefferson Fisher provides actionable strategies for handling difficult conversations with people whose views are fundamentally different from your own. He dives into why opinion-based debates rarely go anywhere, and instead offers a framework rooted in empathy, curiosity, and maintaining your own peace. The episode is timely, framed around managing tense interactions—like those that often occur at family gatherings—without sacrificing relationships or personal calm.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Don’t Argue the Opinion—Identify the Need

Timestamp: [03:14]

• Fisher’s first principle is to resist the urge to debate the surface-level opinion ("tip of the iceberg") and instead uncover the underlying need or fear driving that opinion.
• He explains that people’s opinions are often anchored in deeper needs for safety, control, or a fear of change.
• "You’re just talking about the tip of the iceberg. But what breaks that down is you’re never going to get them to come your way and you’re never going to get to theirs... What you have to do first is identify the need." [04:45]
• People's expressions of controversial or upsetting opinions are often rooted in anxiety or a deep-seated desire to protect themselves or others.

Actionable Phrases:

• “I can hear you really care about the safety of...”
• “Sounds like you really care about this.”
• “Thank you for sharing that.” ([07:00])

Notable Quote:
"Nobody says anything for the purpose of being wrong." — Jefferson Fisher [05:40]

2. Shift From Proving to Understanding

Timestamp: [12:38]

• Fisher emphasizes that trying to "prove" your point—bringing evidence, facts, or pressing your logic—doesn't change minds, as opinions are anchored in emotion, not just reason.
• Attempts to prove others wrong usually make them dig in deeper or shut down.
• "The more you tell somebody they’re wrong, the more convinced they are that they’re right." [13:22]
• Genuine curiosity, via open-ended questions (starting with what, how, where, when), creates space for conversation and discovery, rather than confrontation.
• Avoid "why" questions, as they tend to trigger defensiveness.

Sample Questions:

• “How long have you felt this way?” ([14:18])
• “Where did you hear this?”
• “What happened there?”

3. Water Your Own Garden

Timestamp: [20:56]

• Using a gardening metaphor, Fisher illustrates the importance of tending to your own wellbeing and peace, instead of fixating on changing others.
• If you try to "water" (fix or nurture) someone else’s metaphorical “bad seeds,” you’re likely creating tension and resentment rather than meaningful connection.
• "If I start arguing against your opinion, what I do is I get my water hose and all of a sudden I’m trying to water yours. When they’ve planted bad seed, what’s that going to grow? ...animosity, contempt..." [22:36]

Techniques for Protecting Your Peace:

• State boundaries gently:
  • “I know we’re not going to see eye-to-eye on this, but I appreciate what you’re sharing.” ([24:30])
  • “I just want to hear what you have to say.”
  • Redirect with warmth:
    • "I’d rather hear about you." ([25:10])

Personal Example:

• Fisher shares about his grandfather intentionally provoking debates and his own decision to just "water his own garden" instead of taking the bait for an argument. ([25:56])

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• “You don’t have to share their opinion to have a valuable conversation...You have to identify the need, not argue the opinion.” — Jefferson Fisher [06:01]
• “Evidence doesn’t work, facts don’t work. Why? Because you’re only hitting the opinion, you’re not identifying the need.” [15:00]
• “I can only tell it to you—I can’t understand it for you.” [21:38]
• On redirecting contentious conversation:
  • "Nobody gets mad if I suggest talking about themselves. I’ve never had that." [25:20]

Episode Structure & Timestamps

• [00:28] Introduction to episode’s theme and promise: How to converse across deep disagreement
• [03:14] Three steps overview
• [03:45] Step 1: Don’t argue the opinion—identify the need (iceberg analogy)
• [07:00] Examples of phrases to acknowledge underlying needs
• [12:38] Step 2: Shift from proving to understanding
• [14:18] Phrasing powerful open-ended questions; pitfalls of “why”
• [20:56] Step 3: Water your own garden (gardening metaphor)
• [22:36] Protective peace and setting boundaries
• [25:56] Personal anecdotes, how to redirect, family examples
• [28:20] Rapid recap of three strategies

Takeaways & Practical Wisdom

• Don’t debate at the surface. Seek out the emotional driver behind someone’s stance.
• Ask to understand, not to convert. Use gentle, open-ended questions to invite explanation rather than argument.
• Protect your peace. Focus on keeping your own “garden” healthy rather than getting drawn into unproductive debates.
• Redirection is powerful. It’s okay to change the subject, respectfully, when you sense a conversation will be unproductive or harmful.

Final Thought

If you find yourself in a conversation with someone you completely disagree with—especially during family events—remember Fisher’s three steps: Don’t argue opinions, seek understanding, and protect your own wellbeing. As he says:
"That’s the key to a lot of peace in your life." [27:48]

For more actionable strategies, follow Jefferson Fisher or pick up his book, The Next Conversation.