← The Jim Acosta Show
The Jim Acosta Show
Beto O’Rourke on Epstein and Texas Redistricting plus Molly Jong-Fast Escapes a Rainstorm to Talk to Jim
01:06:24
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- [00:00]
Jim Acosta
Well, welcome everybody to the Jim Acosta show. It's a special edition because we have Beto o' Rourke here. Beto, it's great to see you. Thanks for doing this again. And you know, I think we should just jump right into this because, you know, one of the things, you know, that, that's been sort of a theme on my show lately is, you know, Donald Trump's in a jam right now. He's in a big time fix. You know, whether it's the Epstein files or the so called big beautiful bill, which, you know, you may have your own name for it. Everybody has a name for it. I called it the big Boulder of bullshit earlier on in the show a few weeks back. But anyway, and so you have to think he wants to extricate himself from this. You got to think that the Republican leaders in Congress, they want to extricate themselves and keep those gavels. And now they've cooked up what looks to be the scheme to do that. And you know that they have now released this proposal for a new redistricting map in Texas that could gain up to five additional seats in, in Texas. I'm just curious. I mean, this is your, this is your home state, this is your turf. What do you think?
- [01:03]
Beto O'Rourke
Yeah, I think you just gave everybody the why in, in terms of why would Donald Trump try to steal five congressional seats in, in the state of Texas? It's because he fears accountability for what he is implicated in when it comes to Jeffrey Epstein. He's fearful of the accountability from the voters on these deeply unpopular policies, you know, kicking tens of millions of people off of Medicaid, using these gestapo tactics to terrorize hardworking Americans, transferring, I think it's just under a trillion dollars of Americans wealth to the richest 1% in the country. None of that stuff is popular, of course. None of that stuff is polling well. He's absolutely in the tank. And on EPSTEIN, I think 90% of Americans want to see the files. Try to get 90% of America to agree on anything like whether they like ice cream, whether, just name it. You can't get 90% except on this pizza.
- [01:59]
Jim Acosta
I think pizza, you might think, I think they, they like, maybe that's it.
- [02:03]
Beto O'Rourke
So, so he, he gets what's going on and he understands that if because of how deeply unpopular he is and this, this desire for accountability on the part of the American public, if he, or if he was to lose the House of Representatives, he would have a check on his lawlessness, there'd be accountability for his corruption and crimes and all of us, whether you're Republican or Democrat or independent, could have the real possibility of free and fair elections conducted in 2028 and, and beyond. And so, you know, the stakes are that clear, if, if we fail to stop this power grab, if we fail to win control of the House, what that means is that you'll have a further consolidation of, of authoritarian power in America. That means more plainclothes, masked agents without badges or warrants sweeping our fellow Americans up off the street. It means that more of Trump's political opponents will be targeted for retribution, for persecution, for violence even. And we've seen that already in America. And it means, and I know some folks aren't taking this seriously, but we should take the man at his word. It means that a Republican controlled Congress will roll out the royal red carpet for a third Trump term in, in 2028, 2029. So this one in Texas is for all the marbles. With that being said, there are many ways that we can fight back and we still have time. And so that's what I hope we're going to have a chance to talk about today.
- [03:31]
Jim Acosta
Yeah, and what are those ways? I know that Texas Democrats in the legislature, they're talking about, what, walking out or putting up some procedural roadblocks. Does that have any hope of actually foiling what they're trying to do there? I mean, it seems to me you almost have to have California and New York step in and do their own thing. I had Kathy Hochul on a few weeks ago, the governor of New York, and she hinted that, well, they may do something like this. She said they were thinking about this. What are your thoughts on that?
- [04:00]
Beto O'Rourke
I want, and I think the country at large wants to see Democrats fight and not just fight back. We always talk about fighting back, and we talk about reacting and responding and even being part of the resistance. And, you know, I think those might have been appropriate postures in another time. I think at this moment, we absolutely have to get off the back foot and onto the front one. We can't await the punch to be thrown by the other side because we can see it coming. It's just like they're winding up in slow motion. We've got to throw that punch first and we got to throw it harder. And so this is what it looks like. It means that we support those state House Democrats in Texas who. You're right, Jim. We will need to leave the state to deny the Republican colleagues a quorum, to redraw these maps, gerrymander, allow members of Congress to choose their own Voters, whatever you want to call it, it's tough, it's expensive. They'll have not only the state troopers in Texas hunting them down, but we can imagine in Trump's America, federal law enforcement, dhs, FBI, who knows, will be searching for them high and low. So this is a precarious proposal, but it's absolutely necessary, given the stakes that we just laid out. And there's a very real chance of success. But they'll need the support of every American who believes in democracy. And I think they'll also, Jim, I think they will inspire a public that is desperate to see a fight. Folks are wondering why are Democrats waiting and watching and reacting and responding if they even do that much? I don't think there's any problem with the public and with the citizenry. I think the real problem right now is the so many people in elected office and positions of power who could actually do something, who are failing to do that, which is point number two. Second way to fight back those governors you mentioned, Governor Hle, Governor Newsom, Governor Pritzker, others who have the power to redistrict to Democratic advantage. I wish that they would seize the initiative and not wait for Texas to strike first because if they do it, it may be too late. And, and so we've got to, we've got to throw that punch. They have the power to do it. I'd love to see them act and to do that now. And then the last thing, the third thing is even if these districts are redrawn, you know, we may have the wind at our back in 26 as we did in 2018 in Trump's first midterm. We've got to make sure that we're right now searching for and fielding the fiercest candidates possible, that we're recruiting volunteers into these campaigns and into operations like ours which are reaching out to and registering new voters to bring into the fight to make sure that we win. Because Republicans are going to have to spread their voters out fairly thin across these five new districts if they are in fact drawn. And that's going to give us some real opportunities, not just in the new districts, but in the old Republican held districts as well. So, you know, Texas, if you care about the future of this country, it all comes down to this state. And those are three ways you in which every single one of us can participate in fighting. Not back, but fighting through, fighting forward and actually winning.
- [07:02]
Jim Acosta
Yeah, well, and typically, you know, guy like me, Beto, I wait until the end of the interview to ask about your future political Plans. But since you kind of teed it up there, I have to ask, are you going to, are you going to do this? Are you going to run for the Senate?
- [07:15]
Beto O'Rourke
I don't know. I'm going to do whatever I can to be as helpful and useful as possible. My dream, Jim, and the, the way I can answer this is to be part of a ticket. So if I could run for Senate. If you had somebody who's just going to knock your socks off at governor, lieutenant governor, Attorney general, I think one or all of us has a chance of punching through, especially if we are complimented by strong candidates for Congress and the State House up and down the ballot. So if I can be part of that team, I'd love it. You know, if, if I can support that team and I'm not a candidate on that ticket, I'll do that as well. I think this moment calls for the best and the most from all of us. So if we have to put egos and careers and candidacies aside, well, so be it, because the very fate and future of the Republic is at stake. So what we're doing right now is we're running this voter registration program with Powered By People. We're holding these town hall meetings all across the state of Texas and really across much of the country right now. You get a lot of people together and bringing them into this fight, and.
- [08:19]
Jim Acosta
You'Re getting a lot of people, I've noticed in some of these clips. It's really great to see. And I just, you know, I think you're absolutely right about this. I think we're in a moment right now, people focus on the presidential elections, guys. The whole ball game here is the midterms. And, you know, unless Trump is put in check, he's just going to keep rolling. I mean, this is, this is the second term strategy. This is Project 2025 in action. We're all seeing it being laid out in front of us, and I think you're absolutely right about that. Is there a way that you could be persuaded to do this? I mean, you know, I think there's a lot of folks out there. You can see folks chiming in right now saying that they want you to do it. What do you need to see? What do you need to hear in order to push that button and pull the trigger?
- [09:04]
Beto O'Rourke
Because I agree with you that this is the fight. You know, if we were to lose this fight, that is control of the House and potentially control of the Senate, depending on what happens in Texas, you know, there will be another fight after 20, 26. But, but in that fight, our backs are, are up against the wall and, and, you know, the firing squad, you know, potentially is, is starting to, to load their, their weapons. In other words, I think the consolidation of authoritarian power, should we fail in 26, is almost unstoppable. You know, it took Hitler 53 days from when he's named Chancellor in January of 1933 until he is absolutely destroyed. German democracy. And at every major turn, you know, the, the press, the politicians, and the German public, you know, waited too late and, and acted with too little force. And he goes from being this buffoonish thug who can barely hold power to being the undisputed master and dictator of the German people. I don't know what Donald Trump is going to do with absolute, tyrannical dictatorial power. I know it cannot be good. I know that it will end what Lincoln called the last best hope of earth. So I think all of us, yourself included, everybody who's watching, we just have to ask, what can I do with what I have where I am right now? And for me, it is traveling, bringing people together, registering voters. If it becomes clear that the highest and best use of what I have is as a candidate, I mean, I think the people of Texas know that I'm not afraid of that. You know, I love Campaigning across the 254 counties of the state. You know, I think I could probably win the Democratic primary for this, but am I the right person to do it? Do I have a team with whom I can win at all these different positions? I think we really have to be certain in this one that we are firing with our absolute best. So, look, the other thing, Jim, is there is no lack of talent in Texas. I mean, so many strong leaders. You have Joaquin Castro, Jasmine Crockett, Colin Allred, Greg Cassar, James Talarico. I mean, the list goes on and on. So I just want to make sure that we win whatever it takes. If I'm part of it as a candidate, if I'm part of it as something other than a candidate, that's fine by me.
- [11:22]
Jim Acosta
Yeah. No, and you're right, that's a hell of a field if that all takes. Takes shape. And I mean, Ken Paxton is quite the character. I mean, he kind of makes this a winnable seat, does he not?
- [11:34]
Beto O'Rourke
You know, you'd think so. And for those who aren't aware, he's a current Attorney general. Yeah, he was a prominent speaker at the Stop the Steel rally in Washington, D.C. that preceded the insurrection attempt on the 6th of January. 20, 21. He's been indicted twice. He was under active FBI investigation for, for fraud. And, and he was also impeached by the Texas House of Representatives, which is a Republican majority institution. So this guy's got quite, quite a track record. But I, I think, as you can appreciate, Jim, much like Trump with that resume, he, ironically, though, he holds one of the highest positions of public trust in Texas. He could run as an outsider. He could say, hey, the system is set up against me. You know, they're, they're, they're fighting me because they're trying to get to you, you know, all that stuff. And so I don't think we can take that for granted that he would be a weak candidate. But I think we can know that should he win power in the Senate, it would be very bad for Texas, it would be very, very bad for the country. All the more reason to make sure that whoever we field, that we have the strongest possible candidates and that we win. There's just, there's going to be no points for effort in, in this one. This is, for everything. This, this is the ball game, and it's going to happen in Texas, both these five congressional seats that they're trying to steal, and, yes, the U.S. senate race and other positions up and down the ballot.
- [13:03]
Jim Acosta
Yeah, I mean, and we talked about Jeffrey Epstein. I mean, I think that's one of the reasons why Donald Trump is so frightened about next year, because he knows he probably thinks in the back of his mind. And Mike Johnson, I guess he thinks this, too, although I think it's not really in touch with reality that they can just delay and postpone this and kick the can and see if they can prolong this until after the midterms and see if they can skate by and hold on to the majority of. And I just don't, I don't see how that's even possible. But when you look at this Epstein thing, what goes through your mind? I mean, you know, just listening to Trump today, he couldn't answer the question as to what he meant when he said Jeffrey Epstein stole one of his employees, Virginia Giuffre, who ended up committing suicide earlier this year. He couldn't even answer that question. And, you know, it's astounding to me that we're even talking about this.
- [13:57]
Beto O'Rourke
Yeah, I mean, one, he, he just looks absolutely guilty and continues to further incriminate himself at, at every turn, every time that he, he talks about it, including this latest bit of news that, that we learned, you know, not that he separated himself from Jeffrey Epstein, because Jeffrey Epstein is a creep, as his spokespeople have been saying, but because Jeffrey Epstein stole a woman, a young woman, from him, woman that he later, Jeffrey Epstein later abused. What did Trump know? When did he know it? He talked about the fact that Jeffrey Epstein liked young women. So I don't know. I think that in the court of public opinion, and as Lincoln said, public sentiment is everything, I think most of the country knows exactly what is happening. Not only Trump's own culpability, but the extents to which he's going to protect the privileged, the elite, the powerful and the wealthy in this country at the expense of literally the most vulnerable people, young women and girls who were trafficked and raped by Jeffrey Epstein and potentially by Jeffrey Epstein's associates. And this is not going away because the American people care about justice. Even if you voted for Donald Trump, even if you might vote for, you know, a MAGA Republican going forward, this is something that you absolutely can't accept, and it's not going to go away. And I agree with you. Mike Johnson, Mike Johnson might have tried to retire Congress for the month of August, hoping that this will go away. I just see it building every single day and connected to this much larger issue, which is not right or left, moderate versus conservative, but top versus bottom. Are we going to allow the wealthiest and the most powerful people in the world who live in America to get away literally with anything, whether it is rape, whether it's murder, whether it is these crimes, or will there be justice? And do we really believe that all of us are created equal and shall be treated equally under the law, no one above it, no one below it, no tyrants, no kings, but a government of, by, and for the people. Who says that Americans don't care about justice and democracy? They absolutely do. And we're seeing it play out in this Jeffrey Epstein, Donald Trump scandal.
- [16:07]
Jim Acosta
Yeah. And to me, I mean, one of the questions to Trump and to Mike Johnson, I mean, Trump, you know, he probably could care less about this question, but to me, it's about, you know, how we treat women in American society. I mean, people, when you say he stole somebody, first of all, they're not women, are not property. A young girl who works in your spa is not property. And, you know, how could he possibly even be thinking about pardoning Ghislaine Maxwell? I mean, that to me, is, that's, it's a, it's an astonishing thing that we're even having this discussions. I mean, when, when Trump talks about somebody stealing an employee of His. It was Ghislaine Maxwell. If you listen to all the experts who probably did that, how could, how could Trump possibly be thinking about pardoning her? And, and apparently the family of Virginia Giuffre, she, they put out a statement saying just that. I mean, it says, if our sister could speak today, she would be most angered by the fact that the government is listening to a known perjurer, a woman who repeatedly lied under oath and will continue to do so as long as it benefits her position. And they also said it was shocking to hear Trump invoke their sister and say that he was aware that Virginia had been, quote, stolen from Mar? A Lago. I mean, the family is just sickened by this. Anybody who has a mother, a sister, a daughter would have to be sickened by this.
- [17:24]
Beto O'Rourke
Yeah, And I think that describes the country right now. And I think they see right through this poi to dangle a pardon in front of Maxwell in return, presumably for her, you know, perhaps implicating, you know, powerful Democrats or powerful Republicans for that matter. You know, throw a little, you know, throw, throw a bone to the public for, in their thirst for justice, but really leave out the most powerful people who are part of this, including Donald Trump. And also, I mean, the thing that agree with you, that is most sickening to deny justice to Virginia, her family, to everyone who was trafficked, accosted, raped, brutalized by Jeffrey Epstein and his associates all these years. I don't think anyone's going to put up with it. I don't think anyone's going to buy the story from Maxwell, especially when the quid pro quo is just so plain and open in sight, not unlike, Jim, the quid pro quo offered at the very beginning of this administration to Eric Adams, the mayor of New York. Hey, right, we'll, we'll, we'll let you off the hook if you will play ball with the administration. That, that's, that's their M.O. that's how they work. So I'm glad to see that America's not putting up with this. And I'm, I'm hopeful and optimistic that we'll ultimately see justice.
- [18:43]
Jim Acosta
And you mentioned ice, and I, to me, this is, and maybe it's because, you know, my dad is a Cuban refugee and I, I feel this personally, and it's, it is close to me, and I know it's close to you because you represented the people of El Paso. I mean, to me, the fact that we're seeing these masked agents, these officers sweeping the country, they're not going after you know, they may be in some cases going after criminals or gang bangers. But you know, I've said this many times that that was probably one of the biggest lies, if not the biggest lie, the 2024 campaign, that they were going to go after the criminals and the gangbangers. They're deporting kids, they're deporting families, they're deporting Abuelas, and I mean, you name it. And I just wonder what your response has been to all of this. I'm sure you've just been just absolutely horrified. But what you've seen, but, and the other thing that I should bring up is that this has been in the news that ICE plans to build this massive detention center in El Paso, I believe, what's going to be the largest detention center in the country. Your response to all that?
- [19:42]
Beto O'Rourke
Yeah. So, yes, they're building the largest one in the country. In that bill that transferred nearly a trillion dollars of American wealth to the richest 1%, that added nearly $4 trillion to the debt that cut tens of millions of people off of Medicaid. They also plussed up, added tens of billions of dollars, maybe close to $100 billion to DHS ICE to build new detention facilities. So ask yourself this. If we have record low northbound migration, which we do, if we have record levels of sweeps through our communities deporting people who were here illegally deporting people who were here legally deporting US Citizens as well, what are all these new detention facilities for? So, you know, you know that old line from, you know, the aftermath of World War II, you know, they first they came for the trade unions and I wasn't a member of a trade union, so I didn't say anything. And they came for the communists, and I'm not a communist, so I don't say anything. Then they came for the Jews and I wasn't a Jew, so I didn't say anything. And now they've come for me and there's no one left to say anything. Trump is betting that you and I will not stand next to people who he has labeled as terrorists or gang ban, gang bangers or illegals or violent thugs or animals, and that he can do this freely, then he's going to take the next marginalized population, he's going to go after that, put them in detention or even worse. And the evil genius of this is almost unspeakable. He'll send you to a gulag in El Salvador. And then once you're there and the courts order him to bring you back he'll say, I have no jurisdiction over the government of El Salvador. That is now their problem. So just watch. He's warned us that he's going to come after the homegrowns, quote, unquote. Those are his words. Next. He's already through executive order, tried to end birthright citizenship, tried to upend the 14th amendment that was ratified in 1868, meaning that if your folks were born in Cuba, but you were born here in the US you are subject to deportation. If he wins his way in the courts, those new deportation centers, including the biggest one in America that is being built right here in El Paso, just think about who that is going to hold it. It is going to be someone close to you, your family, if we do not win power in 2026. Last thing that I'll say is, look, Democrats for far too long have been obsessed with, you know, what is right to the exclusion of being in power, playing by the rules, coloring within the lines. And I get that. But while we've been doing that, Republicans and specifically Trump have been obsessed with power, period, and nothing else. They could care less about what's legal, what's ethical, what's moral, what's right. All they care about is power. If we don't get serious about power, and that means stopping this gerrymander in Texas, winning the House and fighting tooth and nail in every seat in every state in every part of this country, then the absolute worst that we can imagine is going to come true in this country. That's, that's why I'm talking with you today. That's why I'm in this fight. That's why we absolutely have to win.
- [22:44]
Jim Acosta
Yeah. And if I can ask you a hard question, or what I think is a hard question, I mean, one of the things that disturbs me, you see in the polling that the public is turning against Donald Trump and the way he's conducted these immigration raids. But there is still some support for the idea, let's deport undocumented immigrants and possibly en masse. And I wonder, what is the message? How do you communicate to people that we should be a compassionate country? I mean, Reagan, he did amnesty. And I'm not saying give amnesty to criminals and people who don't belong in this country. I don't mean that at all. But how do we communicate that message of compassion that we shouldn't be rounding up families, we shouldn't be rounding up kids and moms and abuelas and I mean, there was an 82 year old man who was deported the Other day he was from Chile and he was deported to Guatemala and the family was told he was dead. I mean, people are just being treated like garbage in many cases by ice. And I just, it's just not, I don't think it's who we are. And I'm just. How do you communicate that?
- [23:47]
Beto O'Rourke
So, so two, two quick thoughts. One, yeah, it is absolutely sending his approval by the American public into a deep dive. I mean, arguably the policy issue that he was most popular on going into the 2024 election was immigration. He's polling at 35, 36% on this issue right now. For every reason that you just gave here. Here's the challenge for Democrats and, and I just want to be candid and maybe brutally honest and maybe lose some friends in the process. We fucked this one up as hard as you can. Something up. We talked for decades about immigration reform, comprehensive immigration. Find a Democrat who didn't campaign on comprehensive immigration reform, who didn't identify with the dreamers and the DACA recipients. It didn't support legalizing the status of the dreamers parents. And then look what Democrats did when they had power. They had unified power in 2009, the House, the Senate, the White House. They had it again in 2021, the White House, the Senate and the House. And what did they do with it? And so the American public is like, look, I'm compassionate. I know we're a country of immigrants. My folks or grandparents or great grandparents came from somewhere else. I get it. But this situation is out of control. There's no order, there's no predictability. We don't know who's coming into our country. This thing is messed up and I want someone to do something about it. Now when I gave Democrats power, I really don't know that they made this situation a whole lot better. Donald Trump, this, this is the thinking by many, at least that guy, I don't like the wall, I don't like the cruelty, but at least that guy is going to do something. And I think doing something with all the awful cruelty involved has tremendous power and sway with the American public. I think the challenge for us, those of us who believe in the right thing, is that when we win power again, if we do, we have to use it with the brutal efficiency and effectiveness that Donald Trump has let the courts challenge us as we legalized every dreamer and every dreamer's parents and every hard working American for that matter, who's doing the backbreaking work that otherwise would not be done in this country. And then to your Point of how we, you know, sell this or talk about it, say, you know, look at the contributions that immigrants are making. They're not taking anything from anyone. They are a net positive in the success, in the economic strength, and, yes, in the safety of our communities. El Paso being one of the safest places in America by example, imagine what more they will be able to do as US Citizens in this country. Why are Democrats not making the affirmative case for immigration right now? It's because so many. Too many of them are scared because of what happened in 2024. They think this is a losing issue, that we can't touch it. I really think this is an opportunity for leadership. But, Jim, we cannot just talk. We have to show, and when we win power, we have to use it. We have to literally rewrite these laws in our own image as a country of immigrants, reflecting our values, our reality, and then make sure that we bring as many Americans into this as we possibly can. If we do that, I think we settled this issue in America. If we don't do that, Donald Trump gets to continue to run on it and lead on it in a way that is terrible for this country.
- [27:02]
Jim Acosta
I think you're absolutely right about that. And I think having the pugnacious attitude once Democrats, if Democrats get back into power, is the way to go. And I think if a Democrat came in with the same kind of, you know, I don't want to say gumption or audacity, because that almost sounds positive on Trump's part. But to be as, you know, basically as fuck you as he is when it comes to his issues, if Democrats are. They're like, hey, Donald Trump was a big fuck you to everybody. We're gonna be a big fuck you to everybody.
- [27:33]
Beto O'Rourke
I mean, fdr, Jim, FDR is my example. That guy came in, he said, look, people are hurting. The country is spiraling out of control. There's this choice before us of fascism, which was very popular in America. You know, the Nazis sold out Madison Square Gard. You know, America First. Charles Lindbergh, that was a real choice for America. And he said, you know what? I'm not going to ask pretty please. I'm not going to, like, bend. Bend over backwards to compromise with the other side.
- [28:01]
Jim Acosta
You said, I welcome their hatred.
- [28:02]
Beto O'Rourke
Yeah, we're going to put people to work. We're going to help people who otherwise would starve to death or who would die in absolute abject poverty in their old age after they'd worked their entire life building this country. He remade America using incredible power of the presidency. And, you know, he got checked at times. They caught him trying often. He didn't always succeed. But. But I love the spirit of fdr. We need that spirit back with the Democratic Party going forward. Just, you know, as hard as we possibly can, throwing every punch we can, you know, not apologizing, not asking for permission, just getting out there, getting it done. I want to see the Democratic Party fight.
- [28:41]
Jim Acosta
Yeah, well, we need a couple. What you got over there, Beto? And, you know, I could try to keep going on and on like this, but I don't want to discourage you from coming on in the future, so I won't torture you anymore. But thank you for doing this. Really appreciate it. I just love the fight that you bring to the conversation. And what I'm seeing in the comments is people are saying more of this, please. So thank you so much. I really appreciate it.
- [29:03]
Beto O'Rourke
You got it. Thanks for having me on, Jim.
- [29:05]
Jim Acosta
All right. Good to see you, Beto. Thanks a lot. All right. And I try to pull it out of him what he's going to do about the Senate race. As you saw, I was unsuccessful in doing so. He did not announce that he's running for the Senate on the Jim Acosta show. He should have. No, I'm just kidding. That would have been great. But no, not for lack of trying on my part. I did try, and I think he's absolutely right. I think the FDR example is a terrific example. And I think that's what Democrats are sort of in search of right now. Sort of what is, you know, what, what is the right approach? What is the right tone? What is the right message? And I think some of it is just you gotta have backbone, you gotta have cojones. You got, I mean, not, maybe not literally cojones, but you have to go into this, I think, with sort of the same mindset that Trump has, which is, you know, I'm in here, I got the power, I'm gonna start throwing my weight around. I'm trying to bring in Molly Zhang fast right now because Molly, you know, was scheduled to join us today. I understand she may be in the back of an Uber or a Lyft or perhaps it could be an old fashioned New York City taxi cab. I'm not sure, but there she is. Hi, Molly.
- [30:16]
Molly Jong-Fast
Hi. How are you? Jim Acosta.
- [30:20]
Jim Acosta
I'm great. Why is it so dark where you are? Is it like storming or something?
- [30:26]
Molly Jong-Fast
Storming it. Many problems. We have a lot of problems. I always have a lot, you know me, a lot of problems. No no, no problems. I'm sorry, but at least. Yes, go on.
- [30:40]
Jim Acosta
No, no, what were you going to say?
- [30:42]
Molly Jong-Fast
Yeah, continue. No, I, I was going to say that I have a lot of problems.
- [30:49]
Jim Acosta
Well, I don't think you have a lot of problems. Every time I see you, you're on tv, you have a podcast, you're doing great, you're talking to all these wonderful people. People. I was just talking to Beto o' Rourke and, you know, I think there's. He's kind of out of to give. I think there's a lot of that going around, around right now. What's your sense of it? Are people out of to give or are they scared as what's happening? Oh.
- [31:18]
Molly Jong-Fast
The base is very angry. Right. Can you hear me?
- [31:21]
Jim Acosta
I got you.
- [31:22]
Molly Jong-Fast
Go ahead, hear me. Can you hear me? Can you hear me?
- [31:25]
Jim Acosta
I got you.
- [31:26]
Molly Jong-Fast
The base is very angry. As well they should be. The party told them that, you know, it was the most important election ever and that they.
- [31:45]
Jim Acosta
Oh, I might have lost you there. Molly.
- [31:50]
Molly Jong-Fast
Can you.
- [31:53]
Jim Acosta
Why don't we do this? How about I. It's a bad connection. Let me, let me, let me hop out and I'll, I'll, I'll invite you back in.
- [32:05]
Molly Jong-Fast
Okay? Sorry.
- [32:06]
Jim Acosta
No, no, no, you're fine. All right, hang on, guys. This bit, it's been a little while since I've had to do this. This is, you know, occasionally the sub stack machine has a mind of its own, as I like to call it. And I just want to try one more time because Molly and I, we text, we say, you come on my show, I'll come on your show. And I always like Molly because she's like, fuck it, I'm just going to say what I think. Hello.
- [32:31]
Molly Jong-Fast
Hello.
- [32:32]
Beto O'Rourke
I think this is better.
- [32:33]
Molly Jong-Fast
Okay, good. The base is mad. They should be mad. They were told by their leadership that this was, you know, the most important election of our lifetime. And then the, you know, the politicians went on with as sort of business as usual. And I don't think you can have both.
- [32:51]
Jim Acosta
And it's. And they can't put that toothpaste back in the toot. I mean, people like Chuck Schumer, the leadership, they can't. They tried in the beginning to say, oh, well, maybe if we placate him, we play ball a little bit here and there, give him some nominees, he won't act like a fascist. And that was a huge fuck up.
- [33:07]
Molly Jong-Fast
Yeah. And I think the base is furious and I think they have every right to be. I think that Democrats. Look, the fact that there's administration is a screw up. Right. This guy killed like almost a million of his supporters during COVID So like I think it's fair to say as much as like these. So much of the base has done everything that the party has asked them to do. And the fact that they should have to sort of take these sort of, you know, I mean like all these politicians writing books. Okay. For example, like I actually thought Cory Booker's speech was really excellent. But then he just completely undermined himself by being like, and now I have a book. Like you, you do a job. You do the job to serve the public. You don't do the job to like make money and sell books. I mean it's, it's really, you know, and that's the Congressional stock trading. I hate to say this, but like Josh Hawley, good for you for trying to pass this.
- [34:06]
Jim Acosta
I, I agree. Yeah, I agree. I think people are tired of the sort of the status quo of Washington and Democrats might can get angry all they want in Congress and there's some good people there, there's no question about it. But they are now being tagged and associated with what is wrong. And if they don't stop and say, you know what, no more of this shit and why yield some of this ground to people like Josh Hawley? I have no idea. Mr. Raises fist on January 6th but a stop clock is right twice a day. Molly, I have to ask you though about Jeffrey Epstein because do you know.
- [34:45]
Molly Jong-Fast
But I just want to say one other thing. You know what the ruling on not on preventing congressional stock trading is. 80% of Americans do not want their elected members of Congress making money off of them. You can't find 80% of Americans to agree on anything. So that is. Those are ridiculous numbers. I'm sorry, go on Jeff.
- [35:08]
Jim Acosta
Well, I was going to say 80%, I think 90% want to release the Epstein file. So I mean there is something that. Right that's even MAGA Republicans are like, what the fuck? Release the Epstein file.
- [35:19]
Molly Jong-Fast
Yeah, well there's minutes missing of the. I mean, you know I did this, I did this teleprompter training on Wednesday and I was reading old scripts from like earlier this week and you know the video with the minute missing and then they don't know it resets. Maybe it doesn't reset. Like if you are going to run against the deep state and then become the deep state, you need to provide people with answers.
- [35:47]
Jim Acosta
That's right. And I'm so glad you brought up the video because I've Been kind of obsessed with this all week. And because I don't have a good brain, I have forgotten to bring this up a couple of times, but. But CBS News has been all over this. They have already reported that a government source says that the FBI and the Department of Justice are in possession of a copy of the video that does not cut just before 11:59pm to midnight of the night Epstein died in his cell. The other thing that they say is that their analysis of the video shows that the recording doesn't provide a clear view of the entrance to Epstein's cell block. And. And there. There are funny things with the video that don't add up.
- [36:35]
Beto O'Rourke
Oh.
- [36:39]
Jim Acosta
I might have lost Molly again. I got going. I got going there, and I might have lost Molly as a result. Well, shoot. What if I try to. Yeah, she just completely went away there. Let's see. What if I try it one more time? Because we were talking about something I am obsessed with, but I keep forgetting to bring it up. Let's try it one more time with Molly. Let's see if we can make it work. And. But no, I mean this. And while we're waiting to see if we can reestablish Molly, CBS News is reporting a CBS News analysis of the video the FBI made public earlier this month reveals that the recording does not provide a clear view of the entrance to Epstein's cell block. One of several contradictions between official descriptions of the video and the video itself. And, of course, something that has been in the news. And I think a lot of the folks who watch this program probably saw this. CBS also reporting that a government source tells them that they are in possession, that the FBI, the Department of justice, are in possession of the full video. And so Pam Bondi was in this cabinet meeting. I'm talking about the video.
- [37:54]
Molly Jong-Fast
Keep talking. I'm listening. I'm listening. Keep talking.
- [37:57]
Jim Acosta
This crazy video. Remember, Pam Bondi said, oh, this is the problem with the video at the prison. You know, this always happens at 11:59, and it misses a minute. As it turns out, that's not true.
- [38:10]
Molly Jong-Fast
I mean, by the way, can I point out that Bongino is so freaked out by this whole thing because he knows it endangers his highly lucrative podcasting career. I mean, the one thing that is sort of amazing about this is you put these people basically in charge of the federal government, and now all of a sudden, they have these jobs that they don't want to do because they can make more money in the outside world.
- [38:42]
Jim Acosta
And this is actual work. I mean, being the deputy FBI director is actual work and he is probably not. He has not been accustomed to that for quite some time.
- [38:51]
Molly Jong-Fast
Also, it's also work for people who know how to do the stuff the FBI does. I mean, these people have worked, you know, the whole. I mean, James Comey, like him or not, I personally do not and find him to be just falling on all the metrics and how we got here and smug and self satisfied and also a terrible writer. But. And also do we need. I'm sorry, go on. I have. Here's some. Really not to give, but yeah, I just think there, you know, James Comey knows how to be head of the FBI in a way that perhaps.
- [39:34]
Jim Acosta
No, it's so true. Well, Molly is freezing up again, apparently. Okay, this is what people are saying in the comments, that there are really bad thunderstorms going through New York right now. So Molly deserves a medal just for even talking to me right now.
- [39:50]
Molly Jong-Fast
I'm going to be somewhere with stable WI fi in about two minutes, but keep going and I will.
- [39:58]
Jim Acosta
Do you want to pick it up when you get upstairs?
- [40:00]
Molly Jong-Fast
Oh, oh, I'm going to do audio only. I'm going to turn off my. Is that better, Mikasta?
- [40:12]
Jim Acosta
It might be a little bit better, actually.
- [40:13]
Molly Jong-Fast
Better?
- [40:14]
Jim Acosta
I think it sounds a little bit better. I. I think you're auto tuning. No. Okay, Molly, if you get upstairs or if you get a better cell service, let me know. Just text me and say, I've got it now. I've got it now. I don't think it's going to work with their. With Molly there because it is just such a bad service. I assume it's because of these storms right now. Molly, if you're here, if you're hearing me, if you're listening to me right now, if you. I think what you were saying is you might get upstairs in a few minutes. If you can get upstairs in a few minutes and if you even feel like talking to me, that would be great. If not, don't worry about it. I do want to say. She says I'll be back. Can I wait? She's texting me right now. Yes, of course, I'll wait. Yes, of course. Just let me know when you're ready. Folks, this is. This is. Apparently we thought that there would be flying cars by now in 2025, but apparently we still can't get cell service to work in this country. Have you noticed that? Has anybody. I mean, not to go on a rant, but. But has anybody noticed that? Just about. You could be in a major city, and your cell service could totally suck. And in a rainstorm. I'm sorry, shouldn't your cell phones work? I mean, I thought we were going to have frigging flying cars at this point. We don't have flying cars. We barely have cell service. Duke, by the way, is under me right now. He's got his tennis ball. He's like, this is. You're doing your podcast way later today, and I'm ready to play fetch. Okay. The thing that I do want to bring up, though, while we're waiting for Molly to get upstairs and we'll shift back to Epstein. There's no question about it. But I do want to mention, because I used to work at the White House, and this was how I was going to end the show, by talking about the Dear Leader files. You guys know. You know when I love to talk about the Dear Leader files, I talk about the Dear Leader files. Well, apparently, Donald Trump thinks it's a great idea to have a $200 million new ballroom at the White House. And I just have to say, what the fuck? Why are we doing that? The White House is just fine by itself. There's no reason to add a $200 billion ballroom tomorrow to. To the White House. And I almost said Mar a Lago, and I guess, is it because he's confused and he. And he thinks he's at Mar a Lago, or is it because he's just on a mission to make everything inside the White House and perhaps after outside the White House look exactly like Mar a Lago? Earth to Donald Trump. We, the American people, do not want the White House to look like Mar a Lago. We do not want it to look like, you know, the inside of the ballroom at Mar a Lago. All the fake gold stuff. I mean, I think. I can't remember who I talked about this with on the show before, but if you go to Trump Tower, if you go to a lot of his properties, there's the fake gold in the bathrooms. There's. It's just everywhere, and it's gaudy and it's tacky. And he's constantly pointing to the Oval Office, which, by the way, they're gonna have to get, like, you know, they're gonna have to get the best power washing crew in D.C. the folks who are, like, power washing the Lincoln Memorial. People who are power washing the soot off of the Justice Department, they're in the Treasury Department. I see these guys from time to time. They're doing amazing work. They're gonna have to come in there and just power wash the inside of the White House. If and when Donald Trump eventually leaves, he has put this gold leafing and gold detailing all over the Oval Office. And as somebody who had been in the Oval Office for almost eight years covering this stuff, it is absolutely disgusting. And so I just. I cringe at the thought of what a $200 million ballroom at the White House under the leadership of Donald Trump, under the. I mean, he was over. Does anybody remember this was, like, two weeks ago. He's with the head of the Federal Reserve. He's with Jerome Powell, the chairman of the Federal Reserve, and he's complaining about the cost overruns at the Federal Reserve. He's saying, you know, Jerome Powell, you know, here's a piece of paper in my wallet. And, you know, Jerome Powell's like, no, no, no. This was a different building that you're talking about. It was built five years ago. Trump is complaining about cost overruns at the Federal Reserve down the street from the White House. And yet he wants to build a $200 million ballroom at the White House. Doesn't make any sense to me. That was something I wanted to bring up. But, I mean, again, this goes back to the fact that he wants to be treated like the Dear Leader. He wants it to be, you know, something that, you know, he would. He would have at Mar A Lago. You already have Mar A Lago. We don't need another Mar? A. We don't need the White House to be like Mar A Lago. All right, let's see if Molly want to do this now. And if Molly chimes in, we'll chime in, because I do want to, if we can. I did want to get Molly's take on the Jeffrey Epstein thing. I am glad that she brought up the video from the prison, because that has been a personal obsession of mine. The other thing that we have to talk about before we go, and I'll just wait to see what Molly thinks. If she can do it, great. If she can't, then we'll sign off, is I do want to get to. Okay, hold on, Duke.
- [46:23]
Beto O'Rourke
I'll be there in a second.
- [46:24]
Jim Acosta
Duke desperately wants to play. I do want to get to the statement that was put out there by the family of Virginia Giuffre. This is important. This is something that's been going on, I think, way too long. The Trump administration, Donald Trump, if he wants to roll Pam Bondi out there to do this, whatever you have to do. The family of Virginia Giuffre needs To be told that, you know, there's not gonna be a pardon for Ghislaine Maxwell and that they are going to release the Epstein files. I think if you're going to honor these families, if you're gonna honor the survivors, you have to do that. And so, anyway, I wanna read what the family had to say, and if Molly can jump in and talk about this, we'll do it. But this is what the family of Virginia Giuffre said. They said, quote, it was shocking to hear President Trump invoke our sister and say that he was aware that Virginia had been stolen from Mar? A Lago. It makes us ask if he was aware of Jeffrey Epstein and Ghislaine Maxwell's criminal actions, especially given his statement two years later that his good friend Jeffrey likes women on the younger side. No doubt about it. We and the public are asking for answers. Survivors deserve this. They went on to say in the statement, if our sister could speak today, she would be most angered by the fact that the government is listening to a known perjurer, a woman who repeatedly lied under oath and will continue to do so as long as it benefits her position. All right, let's see if we can get Molly in here now, because I think Molly may have run inside, gotten ready. This is breaking news. Kind of Molly coming in from a rainstorm. The family of Virginia Giuffre. All of these families deserve so much better than this. Hi, how are you? You're home.
- [48:17]
Molly Jong-Fast
I'm home. I have. Did not get my hair blown out. So it's just full on. It is no makeup. It's all.
- [48:28]
Jim Acosta
No, you look great. I have no makeup. Will be no makeup. Whatever. Isn't that makeup?
- [48:32]
Molly Jong-Fast
Not all of us are the iconic Jen Acosta.
- [48:37]
Jim Acosta
No, no, no. Hasn't Pamela Anderson been doing, like, the no makeup thing? And she's with Liam Neeson now.
- [48:43]
Molly Jong-Fast
And we're basically the same. I mean, basically. Basically. So just a complete disaster. I mean, a complete and utter. We are just at the absolute. I just think. I think that everyone in the Democratic base is okay being angry that they're right to be angry, that they were promised a real change to business as usual and it was not delivered. And they have the right to be furious. And. And I don't think that's any. I think. And I think there's going to need to be like, look, there are a lot of really great politicians, Democratic politicians, doing great stuff and the. And, you know, even. And there. And it's not ideological. Like, there are plenty of people like A Chris Murphy or a, you know, in AOC or, you know, they're all different kinds of people on the ideological spectrum from, you know, Sheldon Whitehouse.
- [49:48]
Jim Acosta
Yes.
- [49:48]
Molly Jong-Fast
To. Right. I mean, these guys are not like.
- [49:51]
Jim Acosta
You know, there's some serious people up there.
- [49:53]
Molly Jong-Fast
Right, right. And they're not so lefty, but they, but you can't. You know, it's Team Fight versus Team Cave. I mean, that's what Pritzker's. Pritzker's speechwriter and chief of staff had this brilliant speech where she talked about it's Team Fight versus Team Cave. It's not left versus Center.
- [50:15]
Jim Acosta
Yeah, no. And you have to throw the concept of normalcy out the window. The idea of regular order goes out the window. There's no question about it. And I mean, to me, if you're going to fight, you know, you're being handed some serious ammunition right now in the form of Jeffrey Epstein. And to me, Donald Trump looks like, even more so than usual, a bumbling, fumbling idiot. The way he has handled this and everything, every time he opens his mouth, something incriminating or potentially incriminating seems to pop out of his mouth. I mean, how is it that, you know, he has spa workers under the age of 18 that Jeffrey Epstein and.
- [50:57]
Molly Jong-Fast
Ghislaine Maxwell are picking up that they took from him?
- [51:01]
Jim Acosta
They stole?
- [51:01]
Molly Jong-Fast
Yeah, my favorite part of the of I saw a tweet that was something like every time Trump gets talking about. About Epstein, he says something worse. Like, you know, the last time he said, you know, there was a tweet that was like, you know, next time he's gonna say that I was at Bill Cosby's 65th birthday, you know, when I mean, it's just very. He just keeps self incriminating. And I think the reason he's doing that is twofold. Right. One is he's definitely lost his step. You know, The Trump in 2016-2020 was like, about was Lincoln compared to this guy. You know, he's just not the Trump he was. And we can see that. Cuz he looks exhau. And by the way, we're all exhausted. I mean, are you exhausted? I'm exhausted.
- [51:55]
Jim Acosta
I'm exhausted.
- [51:57]
Molly Jong-Fast
So I do think that Trump exhaustion is a real thing, but I also think he just is very worried. Like, you see a person who's very worried about this story. Does that mean he's guilty? No, but does it mean clearly. I mean, look, even if, if, you know, just knowing that guy and a lot of people knew him on the left a Lot, A lot of academics, a lot of, you know, he really was ensconced in the, in the, you know, this sort of literati. I mean, a lot of academics, you know, this. He did these things with this book editor who I knew. I mean, you know, he was, he had like a large group of sort of. He did, he gave a ton of money to mit. Like, a lot of very venerable people knew him. So it's not that knowing him is not the problem, but, you know, like. And he knew Bill Gates, he knew Bill Clinton. I mean, you know, Bill Clinton flew on the plane. The question is, knowing him is not the crime. But there are certainly people who are, who are closer to this thing than others.
- [53:06]
Jim Acosta
I mean, I really don't care. To me, it's like they promised to release the files. You gotta release the files. And if you don't release the files, you are never going to get out of this situation. People, even MAGA people, are going to think you did something wrong. So I don't know how he gets out of this without doing this unless they try to go through and doctor and scrub the files of any reference to Donald Trump, which will also be suspicious. And so I just think he's, I've said it. I think he's kind of fucked. He's in trouble.
- [53:35]
Molly Jong-Fast
I just don't, you know, it was so much buildup about something he knew, he knew he had been on the plane. So, like, you know, were you a slightly more thoughtful person, you might say, build up some other conspiracy, you know, not that it's a conspiracy, obviously, it's not a. You know, there's a lot in that story that is actually real. But I don't know how you pay off the MAGA base with this. I don't do a great. I also think if you release all the files, the problem is there, you know, there's a real question, like, the federal government tends not to release names of people implicated unless they're going to press charges. So do you, do you, do you go through and redact all the names in those files and maybe you do. And if you do, does that answer more questions or are people furious? I mean, they were promising something they never could have done. In some ways.
- [54:31]
Jim Acosta
Yeah. No, that's so true. And when he says the other day, well, I didn't have the privilege of going to Epstein's island, that, you know, he thinks that we're stupid. You know what I mean? Like, first of all, why would you say privileged? That sounds horrible. It also, it sounds as bad as when you say, somebody was stolen from my spa. But he had flown with Epstein.
- [54:51]
Molly Jong-Fast
Right? No, I mean, it's all bad. And I think the way he's dealing with it has made it much, much worse, which is so, I don't know, ultimately, if you, I just don't get, I don't get how you handle this situation.
- [55:10]
Jim Acosta
Do you think the Democrats might be wise to say, well, Donald Trump, if you won't hire a special special prosecutor, we will. You know, we're in the minority. We have enough people, we'll hire our own special prosecutor. It may be non binding. I mean, I don't know, it just seems to me they, they should be doing more with this than what they've done.
- [55:28]
Molly Jong-Fast
They should, they should be doing everything they can. They should try. I mean, they subpoenaed her. There's a vote for that. They subpoenaed. They subpoenaed the whole file. That's going up through the courts. I mean, the fundamental, biggest problem here is that the Supreme Court is really, really into just giving Trump whatever he wants. So I don't know how that works, but yeah, for sure. Look, Democrats should do everything they possibly can, and they must, right? Like, because they need to win elections in order for us not to, you know, further slip into some kind of autocratic disaster. So they need to win elections, and the only way they're gonna win elections is if they deliver for people. And the only way they're gonna deliver for people is if people feel that they're fighting for them. I mean, it's not hard.
- [56:26]
Jim Acosta
No. And by now we should all know that the, you know, he, he makes these tariff threats. He backs off the Tarif today, he backed off the terror threat on Mexico, even though he had said, there's just no way I'm gonna back off these terrorists. I mean, enough with. One of the problems that I have right now is we cover or people cover that nonsense as if it's like something serious that's occurring, when really it is not something serious that's occurring. It is just him fumbling around, making stupid threats, pretending that he's a tough guy.
- [56:58]
Molly Jong-Fast
Well, it's the, it's, you know, it's Donald Trump being the assignment editor, and this is something we saw a ton in 2016, right? Donald Trump, assignment editor, where he would say, you know, maybe I'm going to buy Greenland, maybe I will. But I thought I was thinking about buying Greenland. Yes, I will buy Greenland. So that's a great example of that. And even, by the way, my Favorite part of that in the first Trump administration was when he was like, I'm going to buy Greenland, and then they had all of his lackeys writing fads about maybe buying Greenland is a great idea. I mean, it's unreal.
- [57:39]
Jim Acosta
It's unreal, Right?
- [57:41]
Molly Jong-Fast
Like buying this place that's not for sale is a great idea.
- [57:45]
Jim Acosta
Yeah. But I do think one of the things, and you and I haven't spoken about this in some time, one of the interesting things that has occurred in the last several weeks is people in MAGA world sort of calling him out, calling him out on his bullshit on the Epstein files. There's just little cracks here and there, and, yes, they're starting to circle the wagons again and so on. And I think. Was it Greg Kelly was calling Ghislaine Maxwell the victim? The other. I was like, jesus Christ, are you kidding me with this?
- [58:15]
Molly Jong-Fast
Well, but it's not gonna. I mean, giving her a. Giving Elaine a pardon does not help Trump. Right? I mean, it doesn't. It does not help Trump. Like, what does a pardon do for Ghislaine four years after the crime? Is she giving more evidence? No. So what is she doing? She's doing something. And what is it? Yeah, right.
- [58:42]
Jim Acosta
Yeah. No, to me, if he pardon. If he pardons Ghislaine Maxwell, I mean, the whole QAnon thing, I mean, we know that it was an absolute lie and a farce, but I think the people in QAnon might finally start to understand that it was all a lie in a farce, as far fetched as that may sound. People like, Jim, are you crazy? Why would you think that? They're brainwashed and so on. I do think some of them would say, what the fuck? I do think that would happen.
- [59:10]
Molly Jong-Fast
No, I mean, I also think that we have a situation here where you can't keep the balls in the air forever. One of the things Trump did very well was that he said, they're elite. I'm not. I'm one of you. They're this other group. And the reality was, obviously he was an affluent guy from the. My dogs are making me crazy. He was an affluent guy from the coast who was not. You know, there's no reason to think he was like the MAGA bays, but somehow he got them through a number of different brilliant rhetorical tricks to get him, you know, to get his people to think he was one of them. And now that you can only keep that going for so long.
- [60:06]
Jim Acosta
Yeah, yeah. No, I mean, this. I guess you could call it brainwashing. But like this state media control. State media, like control that he has over his base. It depends on participation on their part. And if he does something like pardoning Ghislaine Maxwell and not releasing the Epstein files, I just think that that is going to shake them. And I don't know what the outcome of that is. I could be totally wrong, but I think that we don't know what the outcome of that is. That's just.
- [60:41]
Molly Jong-Fast
Well, we're already seeing that there's some kind of fracturing going on, which is totally fascinating.
- [60:50]
Jim Acosta
Yes. And they'll try to distract us. Today they were trying to say they're going to build this $200 million ballroom part of the White House. I mean, could, could the White House get any more gaudy looking with him living there? That's the. I mean, I don't know, like what's next, you know?
- [61:08]
Molly Jong-Fast
Yeah, you know, there are, there are some real structural problems right now in American democracy that are probably going to eclipse that. Though for me, the one bright spot was that Josh Hawley is trying to pass this bill.
- [61:27]
Jim Acosta
Yeah, I think that's interesting. I do. I think you're right about that.
- [61:30]
Molly Jong-Fast
That was sort of shocking. Like, you know, I don't know what that means. I don't know. I mean, I don't know that he can pass it, but that I was shocked by like to see them do something that's not just stick a fancy.
- [61:47]
Jim Acosta
Or stab and Trump attacked him for it. Trump attacked him for it.
- [61:51]
Molly Jong-Fast
And by the way, the only way that we get back to American democracy, this sort of American experiment, the way that you and I grew up is through a series of laws like that is through the end. You know, we are going to need a real reconstruction like you know, where the country starts to look at how, how the ways in which we have let corruption. Because I don't know how we do.
- [62:22]
Jim Acosta
That though, without expanding the Supreme Court, putting term limits on Supreme Court justices for sure. Term limits for members of Congress.
- [62:30]
Molly Jong-Fast
Right. But the road to Donald Trump is filled with members of Congress trading stocks. It's filled with violations of the Hatch Act. You don't get to Donald Trump without Citizens United. You know, these are the ways we got here. And so in my mind, it's a little bit exciting to see that someone even on the right, even, I mean the God, his wife, I mean they're really. I have so many things I don't like about that family. She argues for anti choice stuff. I mean the two of them. But this is. Right. I'm like, this is what we want and we need more of this.
- [63:11]
Jim Acosta
No, I think you're absolutely right. And maybe that's why we're possibly going to see emerge over the next couple of years somebody who's a bit more of a reformer than what the Democratic Party is willing to accept. Sort of, you know, somebody who is a disruptor, somebody who's going to just start smashing things and see if the party goes along with it in a little bit of the way that Donald Trump did it to the Republican Party. But, Molly, I totally interrupted your evening. Thank you so much for doing this.
- [63:41]
Molly Jong-Fast
I'm sorry that I came on, was gone off. I'm sorry. I. Had it not taken me five hours in the car, I would have been perfectly on time.
- [63:52]
Jim Acosta
I'm so sorry. I'm so sorry.
- [63:54]
Molly Jong-Fast
I'm sorry. So have me back.
- [63:56]
Jim Acosta
We'll do it again. We'll do it again. No, no, no. It's just me. It's just me. What do you mean? It's just a little old me. And we have some, some stuff coming up too, where some enhancements and things that are going to look good. I'm excited heading into the fall. So we're just, we're muddling our way through August, but we're trying to keep the folks informed and, and fired up. But thank you, Molly. Good to see you.
- [64:16]
Molly Jong-Fast
Thank you for having me, Jim.
- [64:18]
Jim Acosta
All right, see you soon. Okay. Well, that was, that was a bit of a roller coaster ride. We, we were, I felt like we were in the car with Molly as she was in the rainstorm making her way inside. You can almost picture in your mind, you know, Molly jumping out of the, out of the car and running inside during a torrential rainstorm in New York. And I do, I saw some of the comments. I do realize that when this storm gets that bad, it can interfere with cell service and so on. But, and I agree Molly looked great. As everybody else is saying as well. I was just reflecting on the fact. I kind of wanted to reflect on the fact that Pamela Anderson and Liam Neeson are seeing each other. I don't know if you guys have caught up with that. It's not to go into celebrity news like Sydney Sweeney. I don't even understand what that whole thing is about. But anyway, people are talking about Sydney Sweeney. But I do think it's cool that Pamela Anderson and Liam Neesom are dating each other. I'm just gonna put that out there. That's my own personal opinion on this. Guys. Everybody, thanks for watching. Really appreciate it. Went a little longer today to try to keep Molly in the show. And Molly, I see somebody chiming in right now. Molly's book is excellent. Make sure you go out there and buy it and we'll talk to Molly again a little bit next time about all of that. But in the meantime, I do want to thank Beto o' Rourke for coming on the program this evening. That was terrific, man. Whatever he's drinking, I want some of that. Whatever he's, whatever he's having, I'll have some of that. He was fired up as he always is. And my thanks always to my, my pal, my friend Molly, John Fast, the wonderful Molly. We'll have her on again soon and we'll fix it where there isn't all of that craziness going on. But in the meantime, thanks everybody for watching. Still reporting from Washington, I'm Jim Acosta. Have a good evening, everybody. Thanks for watching. Take care. Good night.
- [65:59]
Beto O'Rourke
It.