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- [00:00]
Jim Acosta
Hey, everybody. Welcome to the Jim Acosta Show. It is April Fool's Day. Read into that what you will. There's a lot of foolishness going on in Washington these days. And as you can see on screen with me, joining me on today's show is Congressman Robert Garcia of California. Congressman, thanks for doing this. I usually start with some headlines and jump right into it, but I did want to ask you, is this your first Substack live shot that's happening right now?
- [00:28]
Congressman Robert Garcia
Yeah, this is my first Substack show. So I'm obviously happy to have it to be on and happy to be on, obviously. We've done some interviews in the past and so look forward to it.
- [00:37]
Jim Acosta
Absolutely. Well, great to have you on. I'm going to have Don Levin, my old friend from cable news days. He's coming on a little bit later on in the program. And a lot of folks know Anand from Substack. He's going to be joining me in just a few moments as well. So stay tuned for that. But Congressman, in the meantime, let me talk to you about this Signalgate controversy because, I mean, I suppose you could say we are tracking the foolish fallout from the signal gate fiasco. The Washington Post is reporting that members of Trump's National Security Council, including the National Security Advisor Michael Waltz, that they have conducted government business over personal Gmail accounts, according to documents reviewed by the Washington Post. This is obviously on top of using the encrypted messaging app Signal. Gmail is a lot less secure, as you know, Congressman, than Signal. And I just have to get your take on this before we dive into a bunch of other things. This literally just happened. This report from the Washington Post just came out. Your thoughts, your comments?
- [01:40]
Congressman Robert Garcia
I mean, completely irresponsible. There is no question that multiple people here need to resign or be fired. Right? I mean, Pete Hegseth, I think his actions, being the head of the Pentagon and leading our Defense Department, he should be fired or resigned. You know, Mr. Wallace, our national Security Advisor, the Secretary of State, and these are people that are at the highest levels of government. And the fact that they are using unsecure systems to communicate, particularly about war plans and national security, I think is incredibly concerning. Look, Signal as a tool, a Gmail, these are the programs that people use. You know, you're communicating information, things that are non secretive in nature, that's fine. But when you have classified information, and certainly if you're talking about putting our American troops in danger, why you're doing this in unsecured communication channels is beyond us. And Congress has a right to be furious about this. We should be demanding oversight investigations. The fact that House Republicans have decided to essentially cave on this and not really call out the president or the administration is quite cowardly. And I think what's most damning about all this is the fact that we know now that members of that signal chain, God knows how far reaching the Gmail use is. We don't know yet. They weren't even in this country. So the fact that we had people that were in other countries in airspace involved in these chats makes these chats very susceptible to foreign influence and surveillance. So it's very concerning.
- [03:17]
Jim Acosta
Well, I should point out, just to be fair, I mean, an NSC spokesperson did push back on the Washington Post report and say that Waltz did not and would not send classified information on an open account. That's what they're saying. But to your point, I mean, you know, they savage Republicans, savaged Hillary Clinton for this kind of stuff. Donald. I mean, I was out there on the campaign trail in 2016. Trump, time and again went after Hillary Clinton. They were chanting, lock her up at all of these rallies. And here they. I mean, maybe he wasn't, you know, exchanging classified information on Gmail, but just to be doing any kind of government work there, that is what they went after Hillary Clinton for doing, 100%.
- [03:55]
Congressman Robert Garcia
I mean, it just the irony of the constant, constant attacks on Hillary Clinton about her emails, for God's sake, and the fact that they are just carelessly, just carelessly putting out information to each other about national security issues, about plans to obviously put American lives in danger, I think is really concerning. And what we don't know here is how often they've been using these unsecured systems.
- [04:20]
Jim Acosta
Right?
- [04:21]
Congressman Robert Garcia
What information is being sent.
- [04:22]
Don Lemon
And that's.
- [04:22]
Congressman Robert Garcia
Those are the questions that we're asking and demanding for. And right now, the Trump White House is apparently so far sticking with all. With all these. With all these appointees and all these folks that he put in place. So we'll see what they do. I think we're gonna get more information about continuing information about what they've actually been communicating about. And I wouldn't be surprised if at some point some of these folks are gonna have to resign.
- [04:44]
Jim Acosta
And, Congressman, I mean, there's so much to talk about, and it's hard to start, really on one topic versus another. But, I mean, I do think we should talk about Trump's plan to unleash these tariffs tomorrow. He's calling this Liberation Day tomorrow, maybe liberating a lot of Americans from some of the money that they have in their wallets and in their purses. But, you know, he's apparently settled on a final plan for sweeping reciprocal tariffs, as they're calling them over at the White House. Apparently one option examined by the White House, this is according to the New York times, is a 20% flat tariff on all imports, which is advisors have said could raise more than $6 trillion in revenue. I don't know where they're getting that from. But in recent days, Trump has said he doesn't care if the cost of cars goes up. He the whatchamacallit, Scott Besson, the Treasury Secretary, said that, well, there's more to life than cheap TVs. They sort of blase attitude about the way that this may affect prices for everyday Americans. And it sounds as though they seem to know that that's what's going to happen, that the prices are going to go up, inflation is going to get worse, and there's going to be a hit to this economy.
- [05:50]
Congressman Robert Garcia
Well, I mean, you don't have to care about the cost of goods when you're a cabinet full of billionaires and millionaires. We know that majority of these folks, and you mentioned a few of them right now are actually billionaires. And so of course, the impact on the cost of goods or the cost of a car, the cost of housing is not going to matter, but prices are going to go up. We already know that inflation has been a huge concern. The price of goods have been a huge concern for the public. What's going to happen? We can't afford materials to build new homes or when the cost of actually building these homes dramatically goes up, that will have an impact on the housing market. We know we're already hearing from people that need, that need cheap steel, that need access to metals to produce a variety of things, those prices are going to go up. I represent the second largest container seaport in the US Adjacent to the largest container port in Long beach and Los Angeles. This has been incredibly disruptive to ports and goods movement. You probably remember, Jim, like when we had the pandemic and we had, yeah, hundred ships out that couldn't get actually in a lot of disruption around trade. This is going to cause massive disruption because people don't know how much to order, when to order it, who's going to buy what. All of these large suppliers are changing their plans. They're debating what they should import, export. And so ports, port economies, the supply chain, it's gonna, it's gonna be a huge, huge issue on top of goods going up. So massive chaos, I think, in the weeks and months ahead.
- [07:23]
Jim Acosta
And I know you've been having town halls, and you had one just the other day where, I mean, just give us a sense as to what you're hearing from voters. Because my sense of it from just watching these is that people are just, I mean, fighting mad at this point. And at one point you said, during your town hall the other night, you said, nancy Mace, censure me. Donald Trump is trying to arrest me. Elon Musk has promised us a primary in the next election. If this is my enemy list, then we're probably doing something right. You had a pretty fired up crowd from what I could tell from some of those reports. But people are outraged. They're really, really angry right now about what's going on in this country.
- [08:04]
Congressman Robert Garcia
People are very angry. And I think I did two town halls back to back Friday and Saturday, and at both town halls, the response was the same. People are pissed. They're angry. They don't want us working on bipartisanship and this kind of idea that somehow we're all going to work together in Kumbaya. They want us to fight. They want us to push back. When I talked about us giving votes on the Senate side to these nominees, they were all booing and they want no votes for Trump nominees. They want fighting every single time. They want us pushing back on Elon Musk. People understand the seriousness of the moment. And I think what I've been telling colleagues in Congress is you've got to gotta match that anger. I think sometimes folks are here in D.C. for a long time and you can disconnect from that anger. So I see that anger from people back home and they really want us to be in this fight.
- [08:56]
Jim Acosta
No, I mean, people are mad. And we're only seeing the beginning stages of Trump putting Project 2025 into action. I mean, I mean, this is what is taking place just today. Washington Post reporting. Senior leaders across the Department of Health and Human Services were put on leave. Countless other employees lost their jobs as the administration began a sweeping purge of the agencies that oversee government health programs. I mean, these are very important health programs. Top officials at the nih, the cdc, the Prevention. Excuse me. And the Food and Drug Administration put on administrative leave, were offered reassignment to the Indian Health Service, which to me, I don't even know what they're talking about there when they're saying, you could go work for the Indian Health Service. I mean, but the cdc, my God, what if there's Another pandemic. We have measles on the rise in this country. This is part of the reason why people are so pissed, as you said, going to these town halls.
- [09:49]
Congressman Robert Garcia
Absolutely. Just imagine if we had another pandemic hit us right now. I mean, it was bad enough when we had Donald Trump the last time, but fortunately we moved quickly. President Biden, I think, really was able to kind of bring us out of that. Obviously, Donald Trump made numerous mistakes during that process, but we had at least a strong CDC and HHS that was functioning, had not been attacked. There hadn't been major cuts at these institutions. We had Dr. Fauci and other experts. Now we have nothing. We have literally a tinfoil hat, in my opinion. Conspiracy theorist, who is Robert Kennedy, who has said all sorts of bizarre conspiracy theories about health, not just about being anti vaccine. He has said horrible things about gay people, about HIV aids, about started measles outbreaks in other parts of the world. And then. And we don't have the same folks. You know, we're cutting positions at the cdc, at hhs.
- [10:46]
Jim Acosta
Yeah.
- [10:46]
Congressman Robert Garcia
We have people now in charge that are, that are not just, you know, maybe have a different, more conservative perspective. They're vaccine deniers that are now put in charge of our public health system. And so I really worry about our country if we were to go through another pandemic. We're just not prepared and we're going to, you know, we know what's going on with the measles. It's very, very scary. People should be very concerned.
- [11:08]
Jim Acosta
Yeah. And I just wish there was more attention being paid to this issue. It's something I've been focusing on on this show. I'm going to continue to do it. I know I don't have a whole lot of time with you, Congressman, but we have to talk about immigration. It's a subject that you and I have talked about so many times. We talked about it on my old program. I want to talk about it here. And you know, the Trump administration is basically saying, whoops, we deported somebody that we shouldn't have. I mean, the Trump administration acknowledged in a court filings, according to the Washington Post yesterday, that it had wrongly deported an immigrant living in Maryland to that prison in El Salvador despite a court ruling prohibiting it. And I guess US Officials are saying they're unable to pressure El Salvador to return the man to the United States. What has been your reaction to this? I mean, first of all, the administration has enough leverage to put people in this prison to begin with, so why can't they get him back. I mean, that's one question, but just the outrage around this. Caroline Levitt was tap dancing during the White House briefing earlier today, trying to explain the administration's way out of this. But this is a scary time. If we can just pull people off the streets, because, I mean, let's face it, they're just racially profiling. Pull people off the streets and stick them in this prison. It's not even a US Prison.
- [12:25]
Congressman Robert Garcia
Horrific, horrifying. I mean, obviously we have a response yet from the White House on how we're gonna pull this gentleman back. But it's not just him. We know of multiple, multiple instances and stories of folks that might be in a different part of their kind of status journey. They might have legal status or temporary residency, a variety of different things. They may not be a US Citizen, but they might have a temporary resident. I was a temporary resident at some point in my life in this country. And some of these folks are being sent to this prison because they have a tattoo. One guy had a tattoo that was an autism tattoo. Had nothing to do with the gang. And you. And by the way, you have a right in this country to get tattoos and tattoos that may reflect your own personal cultural identity.
- [13:07]
Jim Acosta
And so the Defense Secretary has a bunch of tattoos from last time I.
- [13:10]
Congressman Robert Garcia
Checked, some that are very concerning looking tattoos.
- [13:13]
Jim Acosta
That's so weird. Yeah, exactly.
- [13:14]
Congressman Robert Garcia
And so. And so these. We're sending folks to a dangerous El Salvador prison that because of their tattoos and our perceptions of their tattoos. So this is really, really concerning. People should be outraged. And this is happening now over and over again. It's not just people that are, that are in some type of process and their status in this country. It's also, as we know, protesters, student protesters that are out there that might be here on a student visa that are picked up and detained that we can't get ahold of because they might have a different perspective or a view that some of the administration may not agree with. So I think this is a very, very dangerous time. They are trying to quell dissent. They're trying to scare people from their asylum laws and their ability to cover this country and actually seek a better life. And so, yes, it's gonna be real impacts. And I think we've gotta push the administration to get more answers. And every time an incident like this happens, we've gotta cause a lot of alarm to hopefully get these folks back.
- [14:17]
Jim Acosta
And last question. There's this very important Wisconsin Supreme Court race happening today. There's a district in Florida, I think It's Mike Waltz's old seat that is up for grabs right now, if I'm not mistaken, and the Democrat might be able to pull off an upset there. It sounds as though, I mean, if you can somehow cobble together a majority here before the midterm, is that even possible, do you think? I mean, because that would begin, I guess, a stage where you can start having some accountability to a greater extent with this administration. If the gavels suddenly change hands, Democrats have some subpoena power, have the ability to hold hearings. Is that too far fetched? What do you think?
- [14:56]
Congressman Robert Garcia
Look, it's gonna be as far as these two congressional seats in Florida. There's two of them. Look, these are tough seats, right? I mean, I think they're Trump plus 30 seats. And so, look, if we can pull off, that'd be amazing. But if we get anywhere close to any of these seats, then I think it's also a signal of what's to come. As far as the elections, this Wisconsin election is very important. Again, we know that if the conservative justice wins, besides being a very conservative voice, he's been clear about his desires to remake the congressional map there. And I think we know that that would cost us even more seats. We want a fair judge, and so these are all concerns. But Democrats, as you know, we just want a real big election in Pennsylvania in the state Senate. So let's hope that we have a good turnout today. I think it'll be very interesting to see what those results will be. Yeah.
- [15:46]
Jim Acosta
Well, Congressman, it's always great to talk to you. I feel like there's never enough time, but I mean, look at the time that's gone by. It's now 4:18. This is not your typical cable news segment where it's five minutes and there's somebody yelling in my ear saying, we gotta go, we gotta go. And we had lots of time to talk there, but. Welcome to Substack. I noticed you started an account. Maybe you'll start doing some stuff here. We'll see. It's very exciting, very interesting. What do you think so far?
- [16:12]
Congressman Robert Garcia
Yeah, no, I think it's great. I mean, look, I think the media landscape is changing. I think we've got to be meeting people different places and we've got to be out there more. So I appreciate what you're doing and we're going to continue to get engaged.
- [16:23]
Jim Acosta
Excellent. Congressman Garcia, great to see you. Thanks a lot. Really appreciate your time. I wish we had more, but we got a lot in there. Thanks a lot.
- [16:29]
Congressman Robert Garcia
Thank you.
- [16:30]
Jim Acosta
All right, thank You. That's Congressman Robert Garcia of California. I'm going to bring in Anand. Anand is. I mean, he's a fascinating. He's one of the thought leaders in this country. The stuff he writes is so brilliant. He has a substack now that is absolutely brilliant. And I have to get to him immediately, as quickly as possible because he has a birthday to celebrate in his family. So I have to get him on his way as a father. Anan, great to see you. I was just. Time is not on our side. I know I have to get you.
- [17:04]
Anand
I actually, I was able to buy a little more time. So we're good.
- [17:08]
Jim Acosta
Okay, good. I just, I appreciate that. But as a dad, I know that feeling and all the pressures. I guess one of the things that we should jump into. I was just talking to Congressman Robert Garcia about this. I want to talk about immigration. I want to talk about these people who have been picked up off the streets and sent to El Salvador and Louisiana and God knows where. But very quickly. And on just your assessment of Cory Booker, apparently, Cory Booker is still doing this filibuster in the Senate. He's been speaking for hours and hours, and it has just been a remarkable thing to watch. A lot of folks have been wondering when the Democrats are going to get their act together. And, you know, this is, I mean, yes, it's not stopping Trump's Project 2025 train in its tracks or anything along those lines, but it is, it's encouraging, I suppose, to see democracy in action. What Cory Booker is doing right now, just. Any thoughts on your mind watching? Yeah.
- [18:01]
Anand
I mean, I think since November and certainly since January, the most important kind of dividing line in American political life is no longer, are you a moderate or a progressive or a liberal? It's, do you have a spine or not? Can you fight or not? Are you afraid of your own shadow or not? We spent a lot of the last year plus hearing warnings from Democrats about apocalypse around the corner. Often those warnings of apocalypse were accompanied by requests for $5. Apocalypse around the corner. Fascism coming from the other side. If you don't vote for us also, can I have $5? A lot of people watching this stream would have donated $5, would have answered that call, taken it seriously.
- [18:52]
Jim Acosta
Yeah.
- [18:53]
Anand
Only to wake up in January, after January 20, and found that the people to whom they had donated $5 in many cases did not have the metal, the spine to stand up often were absent. We've seen great American leaders no longer in office, essentially absent from public life in this time. We've seen elected leaders capitulating. So, yes, when you see someone standing up in the Senate, just the visual of physically standing up and talking and refusing to bow down, it touches something so visceral in us because I think Americans feel so undefended right now. Rampaged by the right and undefended by too many on the left.
- [19:34]
Jim Acosta
Yeah. And I mean, there are so many places to start. I mean, one of the things that Booker said today is, I confess that I have been imperfect. I confess that I've been inadequate to the moment. I confess that the Democratic Party has made terrible mistakes. They gave a lane to this demagogue. I confess we must all look in the mirror and say, we will do better. I think that's something that Democrats have been wanting to hear, too, that the party's just been a little weak at times. And I'm not. You know, let's just face it. It has been weak at times. And. And I think it's encouraging to hear him admit that.
- [20:06]
Anand
Yeah. And let's. I mean, let's have an empathetic read on that. Right. Like, let's take you and me. Right. You and I are right now having a conversation on a phone, on an app whose name we didn't know a few years ago.
- [20:19]
Jim Acosta
It's so true. It's so true.
- [20:20]
Anand
The world has changed. Right. I. I don't want to speak for you, but I imagine that you and I would agree that neither of us was trained to cover authoritarianism in America.
- [20:32]
Jim Acosta
No. Yeah.
- [20:33]
Anand
I don't think you and I were trained to be chroniclers of fascism in the United States.
- [20:39]
Jim Acosta
Right.
- [20:40]
Anand
So just as journalists have had to adapt, you and I are now sitting with thousands of people watching on a. On an app, on a phone, on a new platform. I think the Democratic Party was not trained for this moment either. None of us was trained for this moment. This is the part of American exceptionalism, is we thought this stuff happened in other places and in other times in history, but not to us and not now. It's happening to us now. And you are seeing a divide between people who say, as you quoted there, okay, I wasn't trained for this, but let me become adequate to this. Let me reflect. And that means looking at myself honestly. That means analyzing my shortcomings and other people for whom defensiveness is so important that they would rather protect their ego than honestly look at themselves and rise to the moment. If you are not rising to this moment, and you're a leader in the Senate, you're a leader in the House, you're A leader elsewhere in American life, in a corporation, if you don't have what it takes for this moment, honestly, no shade, but get out of the way, I say.
- [21:46]
Jim Acosta
You are the problem. And Anand, I mean, I do want to get into. You wrote something very powerful about Signal Gate. I do want to get to that and this whole issue of dei. But let's talk a little bit about what has been taking place where it just seemed. Are we now in a country that you could just disappear people over their political beliefs? I'm thinking, I mean, setting aside the conversation I just had with the congressman about this Maryland man who, you know, now the Trump administration is saying, whoops, sorry, we didn't mean to deport this guy who wasn't supposed to be deported. There's all. Also the Tufts University student. Apparently students were gathering just today in support of that Turkish graduate student, Ramesa Ozturk, who was arrested by masked ICE agents near her Somerville home. Her supporters claim she's being punished for writing a pro Palestinian op ed. What's been going through your mind as you've been watching this? Because when you talk about fascism coming to America, I mean, grabbing people off the streets for their political views, that's pretty damn on the mark when it comes to fascism in America.
- [22:49]
Anand
Yeah. I mean, just think about the fact that you and I are in the year 2025, using the word disappear as a, as a verb of what the government can do in the United States of America. Just step back. If someone had, had told us that 10 years ago, we're having that conversation, we'd be like, what. What would be the grounds for that conversation? It is happening. It is. It is.
- [23:11]
Jim Acosta
You don't think it's hyperbolic? You don't think that's exaggerated?
- [23:14]
Anand
You've seen the videos of it with black clothing and pulling, pulling coverings over their faces. I mean, I recognize the images, as I'm sure you do, from other countries that, that we maybe held ourselves to be different from. I have friends from South America, for example, and this was a really big part of life in Argentina or, you know, other. And, and we know those stories, but we felt impervious to it is happening here. And I think what a lot of Americans who maybe are either apolitical or even sympathetic to Donald Trump don't understand is that once you allow even a little bit of that to enter your political life, it's not about whether you like that one person who's being grabbed or not. It's not about whether you like what they were protesting last Year or not, doesn't matter. What happens in societies like that is trust goes away. And America, I think if you've traveled around the world, you, as I've had the privilege to do you realize America is a country with actually historically very high levels of trust, Anonymous trust. Which is to say I don't have to belong to your tribe to trust you. I'm not going to only pay a contractor who's from my same sub community, because otherwise I don't know if part of what makes a country like this work and the system we have invested in over hundreds of years is anonymous trust.
- [24:43]
Congressman Robert Garcia
Right.
- [24:43]
Anand
I. I will trust that that bank teller is going to actually deposit my money because of so many institutions protecting it. Once you start having things like disappearances, once you have to wonder whether people are informing on you in a college campus, once in Texas, a woman has to wonder whether her neighbor is going to rat out her abortion to the authorities, you start to cross this invisible line where no one trusts anyone, where everybody is looking at everyone in every transaction of life. Like, is your kid's basketball coach spying on you once you cross that place? I've been to those countries. Those countries feel really, really, really different.
- [25:24]
Jim Acosta
No, I mean, my dad's a Cuban refugee, and so I've always taken an interest in Latin American history and disappearing people. I mean, that's a fact of life. That has been a fact of life and in Latin America for decades. And it's one of those legacies that that part of the world is trying to crawl its way out of. It's been a scary time in those kinds of places when it comes to that sort of legacy. And Anand, I do want to talk about Signal Gate because you wrote on your substack page the Inc. Hello to disorder, entitlement and impunity. That was, I guess, your take on dei. I mean, it has been kind of a spectacular sort of falling flat on your face, irony, hypocrisy, whatever you want to call it on the part of the Trump administration that these guys who really should not be in several of these positions, like Pete Hegseth, who was testifying during his confirmation hearings about how we need to have merit at the Pentagon and anti DEI at the Pentagon, they've been scrubbing websites of people like Jackie Robinson and so on just to have this kind of fiasco on their hands, underlines exactly what you're talking about. People who shouldn't be there but apparently.
- [26:36]
Anand
Have impunity, disorder, entitlement and impunity. They, you know, they. It's so interesting that they seized on DEI in the campaign. And then after, you know, when that plane crash happened in D.C. immediately, people in the MAGA world were like, was the air traffic control system a victim of DEI incompetence? So they have this idea of DEI ruining competence in America. And then this administration comes in and brings in the real dei, which is disorder, entitlement and impunity. And you really see it in this group chat, in these kind of emojis, in the complete unwillingness to even look at whether. Whether there's anything wrong here.
- [27:16]
Jim Acosta
Yeah.
- [27:16]
Anand
And let me make two optimistic points about it, because there's not a lot optimism these days. The first optimistic point is if you watching this have ever wondered whether you are competent, if you've ever wondered whether you're smart enough to do something, whether you capable enough to do something, whether you're organized enough to scale some mountain, I want to say to you now, unequivocally, you are no doubt more intelligent than people at the highest levels governing the United States right now. So start that restaurant, start that business, take that leap. If they can run this country. Chase your wildest dreams. And the second optimistic point is what is happening right now under the Trump Musk regime is very dangerous. But I do want to say to people that I think Signalgate reveals this is also the stupidest possible version, it really is, of an authoritarian takeover. And that's important because, yeah, if you look at India, Narendra Modi in India, authoritarian leader. He's not stupid.
- [28:23]
Jim Acosta
No.
- [28:23]
Anand
He's incredibly effective, incredibly concerted.
- [28:27]
Jim Acosta
Right.
- [28:27]
Anand
Putin is not stupid. Xi in China is not stupid.
- [28:30]
Jim Acosta
Not stupid.
- [28:31]
Don Lemon
Right.
- [28:31]
Anand
Erdogan in Turkey, not stupid. Right. So we have a lot of work to do to protect this republic from what's happening. But we have a little bit lucked out. A little bit. I know it doesn't feel like that way to people. These are not the smartest tools in the box for this agenda. If they're not sending their best agenda. No, they're not sending their best. You could imagine a brilliant implementation of this agenda. This is not that.
- [28:58]
Jim Acosta
This is not it. No, that's absolutely true. So are you hopeful? I mean, I see you on Morning show anon. You write terrific stuff. You sometimes sound very concerned about things, obviously, as I am, and we talk to folks all the time on this show who are very concerned about things. But you don't sound hopeless.
- [29:22]
Anand
I'm not hopeless. Once I'm hopeless, they have won. They don't own my hope. I think this is by Far the most dangerous moment in this country since the Civil War. I think there is a very good chance if we don't get our act together that we lose something kind of fundamental in the nature, the character, the working of the Republic. I think this is a group of people who would sell their own mother for parts, let alone our country. So I have no doubt about the danger. But what gives me hope is a couple things. Number one, deep in the bones of the American people, I believe, and people on the right as well as the left. I don't think this is the country of people who like to be ruled. I think there's a lot of people who've been duped. I think there are a lot of people who've been. Who've been brainwashed, been fed a bunch of stuff. When it comes down to it, I don't think the American character enjoys being ruled. I don't think the pain that these people are imposing is going to sit well with people when VA benefits start getting cut and Social Security starts getting cut. I think putting an unelected South African born billionaire in charge of all of this is one of the great strategic blunders of all time, because no one chose it and he's spectacularly unpopular. And I think at the end of the day, what will happen is the only thing that has ever happened in this kind of situation, which is people rise up. You're not waiting for Chuck Schumer. You're not waiting for anybody else. People are going to rise up. There's protests April 5th around this country. The hands off protests. People are going to rise up and people are going to save this country.
- [31:10]
Jim Acosta
Anand, thank you so much. I'm gonna let you go because I know there's a birthday to celebrate in your family. Happy birthday to the little one who's celebrating today. And thanks for coming on.
- [31:18]
Anand
Thank you so much. Thanks for what you're doing.
- [31:20]
Jim Acosta
Much respect to your hair. I have to. I just have to say it. And I just have to say, as one, one guy who cares about his hair to another. Nice work. Good to see you, man.
- [31:29]
Anand
Great to see you.
- [31:30]
Jim Acosta
All right, take care. Let's do it again. That was an on. Okay. It's a fast moving show today, guys. Ladies and gentlemen, I'm about to bring on the one, the only. Let's see if I can do this. Don, you're going to be relating to all of this very soon. Although Don is. Don is something else. He has a. He has a team with him that I'm sure gets. Gets so much Going for him on the air every day. Don. Don is a legendary journalist. I'm talking about Don Lemon, my old colleague. He's coming on right now. We're going to do this. There he is right there. The man, the legend.
- [32:06]
Don Lemon
Never ask.
- [32:08]
Jim Acosta
No, no, I am. Let me just say something right now that I have so much respect. I've always had respect for you, Don, but I have so much respect for you now in that I am juggling so many things these days, doing this on my own that I have. You must be doing this. And the way you've been pulling it off has been extraordinary. And now you're here on Substack. So welcome here to Substack. How are you?
- [32:33]
Don Lemon
I'm doing very well. Look, I wrote a thing the other day on Substack called I'm dancing as fast as I Can. So now you realize, like, trying to do this. And then I have other platforms, including YouTube and, you know, Spotify, iHeart, all those things. It's a lot. Not only, you know, we're used to getting in front of the camera or having some producers, having some help. Everything is already there for us, even people putting our microphones on for us. And this is a whole different thing because you're standing up a business, and you're also. It's a different way. I believe in serving the viewer and the American public. It's a much more interactive way, and I kind of prefer it this way, to be honest with you. So I'm doing well. How are you?
- [33:11]
Jim Acosta
I'm doing great. I have to say that for the first time in the longest time, I like my boss. Maybe I don't love him, but I like him.
- [33:21]
Don Lemon
You're your own boss.
- [33:23]
Jim Acosta
I'm my own boss. That's it. Yeah. No, but all kidding aside, I enjoy it. It's a lot of legwork. But it is very satisfying in that you kind of control your own destiny a bit more. And it's fun to have conversations like this. And there's not like, a producer saying, you gotta ask X, Y, and Z, and then we gotta get to a commercial break and screw all that. You and I could just talk about anything.
- [33:45]
Don Lemon
Like, my dog is laying here. I'm waiting for him to start barking, and then the other one is in his crate. He's gonna be hungry in a minute. I'll be like, oh, I hope you guys can't hear it. But you know what? The people like it. And I do like. Like, you know, you. You don't have to rush off to a commercial break. Either, which was always very frustrating for me.
- [34:00]
Jim Acosta
And I got Duke with me, too. And he, as people have been pointing out in the comments, he's my boss. That's very true. He's one of my bosses. There are several bosses, Don. I guess one of the things we should talk about is Cory Booker, because that's. I mean, you and I are news guys, so we'd like to talk about what's in the news. And Corey's. Let's. This is, like, perfect Don Lemon tv right here, because he's just showing us. There's Tim Kaine, I think, teeing up another Cory Booker soliloquy. I guess I said it was a filibuster. Is this a. I think this is maybe just a marathon speech. It's not technically a filibuster, but it's like a marathon speech.
- [34:34]
Don Lemon
The longest speech in a couple of hours. I think it's gonna be the longest speech ever on the Senate floor. But you probably know better about that than me. Here's a very. I have a very probing question that inquiring minds want to know. Yeah, everyone wants to know. How does Cory Booker pee?
- [34:48]
Jim Acosta
I don't think he does.
- [34:49]
Don Lemon
He.
- [34:50]
Jim Acosta
I think. I think they give him breaks. I think they figure out a way, like, a senator will come up, start asking a long question, and talk for a couple minutes, and Corey will run out, go do that, and come back. I don't think he has the astronaut underwear. Remember the astronaut underwear lady? There was that lady.
- [35:04]
Don Lemon
Yeah. Which was basically depends.
- [35:08]
Jim Acosta
I don't think that's what he's doing. I have to think there's a granola bar involved in that kind of thing.
- [35:14]
Don Lemon
If there's anyone in the chat who knows. But I'm hearing that you can't. And someone said. I looked it up, and they said, you can't. Because I know that from watching the West Wing. But, you know, people are saying, he.
- [35:26]
Jim Acosta
Can'T leave the floor. No, that can't be possible.
- [35:28]
Don Lemon
Yeah. Jim, come on. That's the biggest question I asked my producer today. I'm like, how does he goes, I don't know, Don. Are you really gonna ask that question? I'm saying yes. That's what people want to know.
- [35:40]
Jim Acosta
I guess there have been breaking news situations where you and I have been in the chair and we've gone hours and hours, but they figured out. I can't remember. My mind's mush.
- [35:49]
Don Lemon
But I know, right? Are you getting any sleep?
- [35:52]
Jim Acosta
I. I do. It kind of comes in waves. I. There was a period you know, after, you know, who got reelected, that I was like, what the. Couldn't sleep?
- [36:05]
Don Lemon
I gotta tell you, I had a whole thing. I'm sorry, let me let you finish your story.
- [36:09]
Jim Acosta
No, no, go ahead, please, please.
- [36:10]
Don Lemon
Yeah, so I had the whole thing because, you know, I do my 5 o'clock live on YouTube and I've been doing it for a while and then I was like, okay, maybe the election, I think it's, maybe has a possibility of going another way. And then I got into it and I'm like, oh my God. I think it's going to be what it turned out to be. But I started a show at 10am Called Hot Topics just to talk about things other than politics. And then when he was reelected, I said, I'm going to transition out of this politics and talking about the election and whatever. And then he was reelected. And I said, damn it. Because he takes over everything in the zeitgeist, right? He's at sporting events, he's, you know, in entertainment, he's in arts now with the Kennedy center, like every single thing.
- [36:51]
Jim Acosta
I know what, what is going on with that shit? He's taken over the Kennedy center and he wants the Village People in Kid Rock and all. I mean, he wants to take over the Smithsonian. I, I was going to read you this because Donna Brazile wrote an op ed in the Hill about this and you know, talking about what Trump is trying to do with the Smithsonian. It's a declaration of war on American history, Donna Brazile wrote. And it is, it is what is happening to this country right now, Don?
- [37:18]
Don Lemon
Well, I wish I could tell you, I think, you know, there's definitely the darkest elements and demographics I believe of our country are taking over. And look, I hope it's temporary. I hope it's not for four years. I hope it's not for eight years, because you know what he said, right? But I think that, you know, the underbelly of our culture, of our country is really coming to four. I'm not surprised that the country is, that there are many people in our country who are so ignorant. There are many people in our country who are really racist. And I think that, that there are many people in our country who are fearful and the people I, you know, who I say are racist. They're either racist or fearful of losing their place in society, their preeminence, their, you know, of having the voice in society, which is understandable, right? No one wants to lose power. No one wants to lose their place in society, society. But. And they, and they deem, you know, any sort of leveling of the playing field as discrimination. So finally, you know, when folks started feeling some discrimination not being at the top, they see it as, as, you know, the leveling of the playing field as racist or that someone else is taking their jobs or, you know, trying.
- [38:34]
Jim Acosta
To take down a statue of Robert E. Lee in Charlottesville. And the alt right went bananas and had a riot and a woman died. And yet Donald Trump in an official proclamation executive order, can say, we're going to get rid of, we're going to have J.D. vance remove improper ideology, as he calls it, at Smithsonian Properties. And you know, it's, to me, it's like, don't you have other shit to do?
- [39:00]
Don Lemon
Like, exactly. They don't have other shit to do.
- [39:05]
Jim Acosta
And again, Elon Musk is doing everything, I guess, but, well, that's why he.
- [39:08]
Don Lemon
Says he loves the poorly educated Jim because they're easy to co opt. And that, you know, that doesn't mean, like, you know, you have to have a master's degree. But he loves people who are, who don't, who, you know, maybe forgot what they learned in a civics class if they ever had a civics class, or that he can gin up the fear with those folks, he can co opt them in order to make them fearful. You know, the folks who sit in front of Fox News all day and they just get angry because they just feed them, just spoon feed them all that stuff. So what do they have better to do? Not a lot, because I think a lot of those people are blaming their shortcomings in society on other things. Other people, other forces other than themselves. If I don't accomplish something, if you don't accomplish something, if you don't achieve something and I don't achieve something, then I blame myself. I say, you know what, I could have done better. I'm going to strive and I'm going to try again. Not that, oh my gosh, it's because of people like Jim that I don't have that job, or it's because of people like Jose that I don't have that job. It's because I don't have that job or that position or that house or whatever it is is because I didn't meet the criteria or the credentials for it. But if you are used to having the preeminent voice, right? If you're, let's just be honest. If you're a white man in society and you see all these women, whether they're white or black or whatever, and they're in these jobs, in these positions, and they're ahead of you or above you. You're like, wait a minute. You know, the man is supposed to be the head of the household. So it's that kind of thinking.
- [40:34]
Jim Acosta
Yeah.
- [40:35]
Don Lemon
And, you know, and that gets me.
- [40:37]
Jim Acosta
Back to the conversation I was having a little while ago with Anan. And, you know, Pete Hegseth gets up at his confirmation hearing, you know, guy who comes from Fox, and he's going to be announced as the Defense Secretary. He's at his confirmation hear, he's going off on dei, he's saying, we need merit back at the Pentagon. And he's in this job for what, seven weeks? And he puts war plans. He puts attack plans for airstrikes on the Houthis on signal. Way to go. I mean, I'm sorry. Like, that just blows a hole in all of the crap he was peddling up on Capitol Hill. It just, you know, it just pisses me off to no end.
- [41:17]
Don Lemon
Well, it's confirmation for that. He is not qualified. Two things here. When has America ever been merit based? When you actually think about it, right? And you think about all the people who are in positions of power, especially, and all the. All the chances that they've had to screw up this country. And they have in many ways. When you look at the people who are now in, you know, who have been appointed to positions and confirmed by the Congress and whomever, they're not qualified. You think Pete Hetsup is qualified to be the Defense Secretary? Of course he's not qualified to be the Defense Secretary. You know, he reminds me of this boss I once had who did not last very long at the company I was at, and he was extremely overconfident. And it's just basically the same sort of personality and attitude that, you know, they think that they're qualified for a job that they're. And they're in way over their head, and they don't even realize it.
- [42:10]
Jim Acosta
They don't realize it. No.
- [42:11]
Don Lemon
You may. You may be familiar with that.
- [42:12]
Jim Acosta
I don't know. There's some names that are popping in my head.
- [42:16]
Congressman Robert Garcia
I just.
- [42:16]
Jim Acosta
Is there a thought bubble over here that has a face? Let's not go down that road.
- [42:21]
Don Lemon
We're not going down that road.
- [42:23]
Jim Acosta
We're not going down that road. But there is one equalizer in all of this, and that is the economy. The economy is something that everybody can feel, everybody has to deal with. There are the Scott Bessons who are like, you know, saying all the cockamamie things that he said and Howard Lutnick, I'm not talking about those people, but when you put tariffs in place that shake Wall street, that, you know, alarm our allies to the extent that they're going to put on reciprocal tariffs, which is going to, that's going to make the cost of just about everything under the sun go up over the next several months. And I have to think maybe Trump is going to, you know, try to weasel his way out of this and maybe not do all of the things that he's talking about doing. But the economy has already taken a hit. When you have Goldman Sachs saying there's like a 33% chance we're going to go into recession. Nobody was saying that January 20th, that is, we're talking about penetrating that information bubble over at Fox, as you were just referring to over a few moments ago, the economy, if he wrecks the economy, it will do that and it will wake people up and it may give this country a chance. I don't know. I don't, not that I'm rooting for a recession or anything, but what do.
- [43:34]
Don Lemon
You think if they hear about it beyond and look, I don't want to check my 401k. A lot of folks in this country don't have 401ks, though, if they actually hear the right message, because I will often turn it on conservative channels and they're talking about other things. They're still talking about, you know, transgender and all that stuff. Even when there were, you know, even during the height of Signal Gate, when it first started, I would turn on box because I, I did, I want to do my own experiment. And I'm watching and I'm like, when are they ever going to get to Signal Gate? And they barely did. They do it through some odd, some, some odd backdoor way of getting into it by asking someone a question. And then the answer is, well, I don't want to talk about that. That's not important. And you're like, okay, that's how they address it. But I was just, no more than an hour and a half ago, I was just speaking to a farmer who is basically saying, okay, the stock market folks can say what they want. The markets can do what they want. But when you speak to people on the street, that's how you know what is happening. And so the farmers are saying, we're worried about these tariffs. This is not what we signed up for. They're beginning to have, some of them have already had it, but they're beginning to have buyer's remorse because they say the price of their commodities are down corn. And if he's going to raise the prices in order for them to be able to do business, it's not going to be helpful to them at all. And remember, Jim, those are the people who put food on our tables and I believe they are always the canary in the coal mine. Those people, our civil servants who they're firing left and right, all of that is going to make a difference and it's going to penetrate. I believe that does not motivate people to go to the polls today, hopefully and vote maga.
- [45:13]
Jim Acosta
Yeah, I mean they had to bail out the farmers. The last time around, Trump tried to do this stuff and, and they're already talking about doing that this time around. You have to wonder what the farmers are doing. They need to change the channel if they're only watching Fox. I mean, the other aspect of this, Don, that we have to talk about is these town halls. I'm curious what you think of these town halls and the way they've just been erupting because this, this also says to me that there are, there are some penetrations happening in the Fox News conservative media bubble that is over 40% of this country. When you have people showing up at town halls for Republicans in North Carolina, Nebraska and screaming at these members of Congress, those are not Democratic plants. Donald Trump, Give me a break. Don, you and I could go on the road and go to just about any state in the country, go to any red district, open up a town hall and I'm sure we would hear people freaking out about what is going on right now.
- [46:12]
Don Lemon
And we have done that. Not in this, not now, but we have gone and just we've gone to town halls in other towns, lots of them. Every time I go out a lot, as you know, and I do, man, on the streets, I've been hearing about it, hearing about people who have, who are, have regret. But more to your question about these town halls. Yeah, look, I think that the Republicans and the people at those town hall have given Democrats and sort of people and anti Trump people, they have given them a motivation to get out there and protest and to do something. And I believe that was the impetus for the man that I'm watching on my right here, Cory Booker, to do something. Cuz people have been yelling at Democrats, do something.
- [46:53]
Jim Acosta
Do something. Do something.
- [46:54]
Don Lemon
Yeah, do something. And so yes, the Republican leadership has said, oh, don't do any town halls because they don't want the message getting back. One, they don't want the message getting back to the people. But more than anything, they don't want to make their boss look bad, their dear leader look bad. So don't get out there. Don't hold town halls. We don't want Donald Trump to look bad. And they realize Donald Trump is. What he's allergic to is bad press. He hates it. He wants everyone to love him. This is not good for him. Why do you think he's. Why do you think, Jim, you've been there. Why do you think he's inviting the press into the Oval Office every single day? So he can make sure that he changes a narrative from that negative press to what he wants it to be.
- [47:36]
Jim Acosta
I know. And he kind of does it when you and I are on. I mean, is there something going on? There just might be something happening. He's. He's hate watching us, Don. Is that what it is? He is.
- [47:46]
Don Lemon
Look, I think sometimes they're watching because I had a little meltdown. Not really a meltdown. Kind of when the whole thing happened with the H1B visas and everyone. They got online and they were so racist about, why are you letting these Indian people in? The brown people, whatever. And I'm like, vivek, you see, now you see, you get it. And I said a little. The F bomb. I don't know if you can say it on your show. I said, the F bomb.
- [48:13]
Jim Acosta
We'll just do it.
- [48:14]
Don Lemon
Yeah, fuck it, I'll do it. And so now you know. And everyone's like, oh, my God, Don, how you say that? You can't do it. Oh, my gosh. Oh, they were pearl clutching. And I said to them, people are real people. Adults say fuck. They say it.
- [48:28]
Jim Acosta
Yeah. We're not children.
- [48:29]
Don Lemon
The news is not for children and adults, especially now. Yeah. And there are certain words that will only. There are certain words that only define the emotion that you're having. And so I said, yeah, I'm a real person. And I said that. And now I think they heard me because they were expecting me to apologize. And I'm like, no, I'm going to do a Trump. I'm just going to double down, so fuck you. But now everybody. I mean, Eric Swalwell, I can't get through without an F bomb. With Mayor Pete, who you interviewed, Pete Buttigieg. When he said, what a fuck up, I was like, yes, there you go. They must. Must be listening to me.
- [49:07]
Jim Acosta
They must be. They are. They are listening to him. And you, you bring up a great point, Don. And, oh, Duke's bringing me a toy. Duke, get over there. All Right. Hang on. I'm talking to Doc.
- [49:17]
Don Lemon
Get over here.
- [49:18]
Jim Acosta
You can't get both of our dogs.
- [49:21]
Don Lemon
I'm gonna say, look, my. My. My. My studio is so messy. But look, my dog is, like, right here. Do you see him?
- [49:29]
Jim Acosta
There he is there.
- [49:30]
Don Lemon
He's just laying there. He's like, whatever.
- [49:32]
Jim Acosta
Here's Duke right here. Duke, come here. Say hi, Don. Say hi to Don. Come here. Come here. Come here. Come right here.
- [49:38]
Don Lemon
They don't listen. He doesn't care. You're not the boss.
- [49:40]
Jim Acosta
He's like, to do the damn thing.
- [49:41]
Don Lemon
Boomer, come here, Boomi. He's not even moving.
- [49:46]
Jim Acosta
They know it's too well done. They know they don't need to listen.
- [49:49]
Don Lemon
Come here, Boomer. He's not coming. Forget it. I'm not the boss.
- [49:53]
Jim Acosta
Come here. You want this tree?
- [49:55]
Congressman Robert Garcia
You got.
- [49:55]
Jim Acosta
Come right here. No.
- [49:57]
Don Lemon
Yeah, you got to go treat. And then their ears perk up, Right? Do you ever have to, in the middle of your show, get up and walk your dogs?
- [50:05]
Jim Acosta
Not in the middle of the show, no. Have you had to do that?
- [50:07]
Don Lemon
Yeah. So I had a show. I forget what it was. It was some breaking news marathon thing that was going on live, and I had it. And I was like, look, guys, I don't want my dog to pee on the floor or whatever, so I'm gonna go walk. I said, do you mind? Everybody in the chat was like, no, I don't mind. Go walk your dog. I left the feed up with my empty chair, and I came back, and the same number on the screen, and people were watching. It was the same thing. It had not changed. I was like, well, nobody fucking needs me. What the hell's going on? I can just leave it up. So, yeah, walked my dogs for, like, 20 minutes, and it was totally fine.
- [50:40]
Jim Acosta
And so in, like, eight minutes, you're gonna go live on your YouTube show. Is that right? I need to let you go because you gotta go do your thing. Is that it?
- [50:46]
Don Lemon
I go live every day. Look, this is. To be honest with you, Jim, I'm so proud of what you're doing. You know that? I've told you this person, and I'm so proud of what you're doing. And, you know, you've been on Substack, I had a different business model that, of course, did not work out because of you know who. And so I started with. With YouTube. But the. The audience and what you've built here on Substack, I think it's really impressive and good on you. And so now I'm new here and so I hope you guys will accept me and.
- [51:13]
Jim Acosta
And, yeah, Go. Go watch the Don Lemon Show. Go. Go look up Don on substack. Please follow. They're following you here now because you're here now. Subscribe to Don. Don's a great writer. I mean, everything that you do, Don, just top notch. I've always admired your work, always enjoyed working with you, and I hope we can keep doing this. Let's keep doing this.
- [51:34]
Don Lemon
Yeah, we'll keep doing it. And I think, look, we need to support each other. There is no competition. This is friendly, healthy competition.
- [51:39]
Jim Acosta
Absolutely.
- [51:40]
Don Lemon
And look, Jim, you know what? I realized just real quickly, how much I missed writing when I got back on.
- [51:46]
Jim Acosta
So true.
- [51:47]
Don Lemon
I sat down and I wrote, like, five pieces in a row, and I was like, oh, my God, that's so great. I can't. You know, I can't believe that I've missed it so much. So.
- [51:54]
Jim Acosta
Well, I. And I. And good on you for doing that. And I. I found it to be the same thing. It kind of opens up this other side of you that you're like, oh, yeah, I used to do this all the time, and I need to start doing this again, because you know what? It's also kind of cathartic and therapeutic, too. But, yeah, Don, it's great to see you. I'll let you walk the dog. Do what you got to do before you go on and. And go watch Don on YouTube. Watch us later on. This recording will go up on Substack and all these other platforms later. But, Don, great to see you, man. It's so, so good to catch up.
- [52:23]
Don Lemon
Thank you, Jim. Be in touch. I appreciate it. Bye, Jim Acosta.
- [52:26]
Jim Acosta
Bye, Don Lemon.
- [52:27]
Don Lemon
I'll see you later. Bye. Thanks.
- [52:28]
Jim Acosta
Okay, go watch Don.
- [52:30]
Don Lemon
Bye.
- [52:30]
Jim Acosta
Bye. The great Don Lemon. And so Don and I have done so many big stories together over the years. When Don had his show and I was at the White House, you know, there would be a big story happening. And one of the highlights, obviously, of my day would be to go on and break it down with Don, because Don was always real. Don knew how to keep it real. And that was what I think made his show so successful. I think it's what makes Don so successful is that. Is that Don is. Is what. What you see is what you get. He's a real person, and he's a great human being, and he cares about the right things, and he. I kind of feel an affinity with him because he also kind of had to rise up from his bootstraps, pull himself up by his bootstraps and so on. And, and when you do that, you kind of know what life is all about at an early age, and you take that through your journey. So my thanks to Don Lemon. My thanks to Anand. He was awesome. Somebody chimed in and said, please have Anand on again. I am going to do that. Anand writes. He's on substack there. And Congressman Robert Garcia, we're doing this quite frequently on the Jim Acosta show in that we are having members of Congress go on their maiden voyage on substack via this program. We had it last week with Hakeem Jeffries. We had it last week with Pete Buttigieg, who's not a member of Congress. A lot of people think he should be a member of Congress or run for president. And people are saying, please get Bernie. Hey, we'll take them all. Well, Bernie Aoc, I think Eric Swallower, we're working on that. Joy Reid. I'm seeing people chime in on Joy Reid. Cory Booker, that would be amazing as well. Now I'm saying so many names. If I leave somebody out, I'm going to be making somebody mad. But we're certainly trying to do all of those things. And I did not get to talk to Don about doing this town hall idea that Michael Cohen and I have been talking about. We want to loop, we want to rope Don into that and see if we can get him involved in that as well. And I think that may be in the works. I may be speaking out of school here. That may be in the works. But in the meantime, there's so much stuff that we left on the cutting room floor today. The hour goes by quickly, but always, as always, so appreciate everybody tuning in. Really enjoy all the comments that come in fast and furious. And I guess we'll continue to watch and see what Cory Booker does next. I. It's, it's kind of incredible to watch what he's been doing. But what Cory Booker is doing is, frankly, what we should all be doing, and that is caring a whole hell of a lot more about what is going on in our country right now. What Cory Booker is doing is giving voice to a lot of people who have been saying, please do more, please say more, please get out there, do what you can. And we need more of that every day. So, everybody, let's watch Don on his show. We'll watch Corey on another TV or on our phone if we could do that. Watch this recording later if you missed part of the program. But in the meantime, thanks, everybody for watching. Still reporting from Washington I'm Jim Acosta. Have a great evening, everybody. Thanks again for tuning in. Bye.