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The Jim Acosta Show
House Passes Epstein Files Bill with Charlie Sykes and Olivia Troye plus Karen Attiah on Saudi Royals with Trump
01:05:07
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- [00:00]
Jim Acosta
Foreign. Welcome to the Jim Acosta show. And this was not just another day that ends in y and the Epstein gate cover up here in Washington. That's because the House of Representatives just voted almost unanimously to release the Epstein files. Only one Republican, Clay Higgins, whoever that is, voted against the bill to open up the files. The measure now goes to the Senate, where who knows what will happen next. I'm joined by Charlie Sykes. Olivia Troy is going to join me in just a moment. And I was up at the Capitol earlier today, some 14 survivors. Charlie appeared with lawmakers from both parties to call for the vote on releasing the files. I'm going to show you a little bit of that in just a few moments, actually. Got to talk. And there's Olivia Troy. She's there as well. Great to see both of you. I was able to speak with one of those survivors earlier today who told me, you know, she voted for Donald Trump. You know, some of these survivors voted for Trump and they are absolutely outraged by his behavior in all of this. But, Charlie, let me start with you first. How big of a victory is this for the survivors? I think I know the answer to that. But how big of a loss is this for Donald Trump who has been fighting this tooth and nail every step of the way and got dragged into this?
- [01:18]
Charlie Sykes
Yeah, well, let's leave the, you know, how much of a victory it is because we don't know yet whether those files are really going to be released. But it is a humiliate, it is a humiliating defeat for Donald Trump, who went absolutely as far as he, as he could go to not have this vote. I mean, it was just a week ago that he's dragging members of Congress into the Situation Room to browbeat them and issuing these fiery denunciations of Thomas Massie and Marjorie Taylor Greene. And in his mind, look, he had reason to believe that they would cave in, that he would get his way because he's gotten his way so often. But he was forced to climb down. He was forced to back down. He did not want this vote. He did not want other Republicans to have this vote. And he adamantly still to this moment does not want certain things in those files to be released. So that, that's why in terms of a victory, it's a huge victory for the, the victims. But until we actually see those documents, I certainly don't, I think we're way past the point of thinking that the Trump administration will, will behave with, in good faith in releasing those documents. So. But, but what a defeat, the fact that he has Basically done in by his own MAGA allies and that his, his toolbox of intimidation has failed.
- [02:39]
Jim Acosta
Yeah. Yeah. Olivia, what do you think? I mean, I think Charlie's right. It's good to have a note of caution here. Apparently, John Thune, the Republican majority leader in the Senate, has said he wants to quickly schedule a vote on this and get this to Trump'. I mean, it depends, I guess it depends on what day of the week or what hour of the day it is as to how Trump responds to all of this. It feels as though his hand is being forced here. Maybe the auto pen will be pulled out for this signing, I don't know. But, Olivia, your thoughts on this?
- [03:10]
Olivia Troye
I actually think he's going to sign it. I think it'll move fairly quickly. I think he wants to put this behind him as fast as possible. And look, I think, you know, regardless of. I'm one of those people that's very cynical. I don't actually think the files will ever actually see the light of day. And if we do, we're going to get a redacted file handed over and that's it. But I, but that's because I'm very cynical, having worked with these people firsthand. And I just don't trust them. And I don't trust, you know, I don't trust Cash Patel, I don't trust Pan Bondi. And so that, that's whose hands it kind of is in, ultimately. But I'll say this, as far as the victims go, what they have been able to do, though, is actually get Republicans to stand up to the bully and they won. And to me, that is the significance of today, is that it showed the power of when you actually stand up to Donald Trump, you can actually have power. And I have been waiting for this moment for a very long time, is what I'll say. And I think it, it showed that, you know, Thomas Massey, Marjorie Taylor Greene, Lauren Bobert, I mean, they all banded together and they didn't waiver, even though they got bullied along the way. And it shows their own power. It's been a lesson and hopefully for other Republicans to see. Well, okay, wait a second. The most MAGA loyalists, Marjorie Taylor Greene stood by them till the end. The victims have rallied around her. And look what happened. He had to give in.
- [04:45]
Jim Acosta
Yeah. And I mean, I, I want to play a little bit of this Epstein survivor that I ran into earlier today and Jenalisa Jones, and she and I spoke just for a few moments after this big press conference was over that Ronna had with Tom Massey and Marjorie Taylor Green and you know, speaking with her, it was, it was moving because, I mean, this is somebody who genuinely supported Donald Trump and now feels better. Let's walk, we'll talk about it. Genalisa, I heard your comments there. You were talking about how you voted for Donald Trump.
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Epstein Survivor (possibly Jenalisa Jones)
I voted for you. But your behavior on this issue has been an national embarrassment.
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Jim Acosta
What are your thoughts today? You know, and what he's been up to in terms of trying to block the release of the files? It sounds like that's been a real disappointment to you.
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Epstein Survivor (possibly Jenalisa Jones)
Well, the whole reason on voting for me, for voting for him was that he ran his campaign so hard on the release of these files and we had been fighting for so long to get these files out that I was like, dang, all right, he's going to really take these people down. So I really thought that he was going to stick by what he said and then to have, now we're just playing this back and forth game and it's really heartbreaking because you ran your kids campaign on this and it's really just as simple as that, that he could release these files and just do it himself. And he has chosen to drag this out and make it a political thing when it didn't need to be.
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Jim Acosta
And it feels like a broken promise to you.
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Epstein Survivor (possibly Jenalisa Jones)
It is a broken promise. So we'll wait.
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Jim Acosta
And what, and why do you think he's been this way this whole time, like trying to block it up until now? Why do you think that is?
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Epstein Survivor (possibly Jenalisa Jones)
He has to be trying to protect other people or doesn't want something to come out because there should be no other reason why he wouldn't want it at least. Right. Like, wouldn't he want to take down the nasty, ugly people that are involved in our government and powerful people? I think that he would, I don't think he would want to have all these horrible people, you know, hiding behind in the dark.
- [06:39]
Jim Acosta
Thank you very much. Thank you. She had to run off there all but Charlie, I mean, this goes to the feeling of betrayal inside maga. They, they.
- [06:50]
Charlie Sykes
No, yeah, yeah, go ahead. No, I mean that captured it perfectly, that sense of betrayal, the sense of the broken promise. The fact is that much of the pressure to release these files comes from Donald Trump's own base. So the COVID up that he tried to orchestrate was indefensible. And as the victims began to speak up more and more, you realize that Republicans signaled him privately and publicly. It's indefensible and we don't want to have to defend it. And so that's where we're at this moment here now. But we also just sort of throw in the caveat that we didn't need this vote today. We don't need the vote in the House, in this, in the Senate. We don't need him to sign the bill. He could order it released today. He could order it released within five minutes. But obviously he has not done that. He's not going to do that. He may sign this bill, but the COVID up is going to continue. But I think that you're a little, I think that that, that little clip shows why this is so politically problematic for him. There were people who believed him when he said that he was going to expose this cabal of sex trafficking pedophiles. And then he tried to say, never mind. And that's not working for him.
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Jim Acosta
Yeah. And Olivia, let's, I do want to play what Marjorie Taylor Greene said earlier today, because Donald Trump has been calling Marjorie Taylor Greene a traitor repeatedly because of her stance on the Epstein files. And this is what she had to say about that, which is interesting.
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Marjorie Taylor Greene
I was called a traitor by a man that I fought for five, no, actually six years for. And I gave him my loyalty for free. I won my first election without his endorsement, beating eight men in a primary. And I've never owed him anything, but I fought for him for the policies and for America first. And he called me a traitor for standing with these women and refusing to take my name off the discharge petition. Let me tell you what a traitor is. A traitor is an American that serves foreign countries and themselves. A patriot is an American that serves the United States of America and Americans like the women standing behind me. And I want to tell you that this only became possible today because the American people whom we serve as representatives here in Congress, demanded that this vote happen. And they put more pressure on every single elected politician in this city than has ever been put on them.
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Jim Acosta
I mean, Olivia, that's some, that's some wild stuff to hear Marjorie Taylor Greene talking like that. It almost sounds like she's kind of calling Donald Trump a traitor right back to him. I don't know what she was saying about serving foreign leaders, but he did have MBS over at the White House day. We'll talk about that in a little bit. And we can make our own judgments about how that went down. But, I mean, she is not holding back. And I, if I'm Donald Trump, I don't know if I want to mess with her.
- [10:04]
Olivia Troye
You know, I don't think he wants to mess with her. Yeah, we're seeing that play out. I think, look, that was a very powerful, powerful speech he gave in front of the victims. Certainly has their backs. And I think those were scathing remarks. And I would say she knew probably exactly what she was doing in that moment, and she was speaking directly to him. And look, there are a number of people that we know that have been called traitors and they've been called treasonous. And there are executive orders that use that type of verbiage and language where the retribution of Donald Trump continues with a number of people. And I think that good on her for pushing back on that term. And I think it's important specifically, Jim, because she is speaking to her supporters in her district who are MAGA supporters and talking to them. And I hope perhaps that that actually will resonate in some way or when they hear him use words like that in the future, they remember that moment.
- [11:03]
Jim Acosta
Yeah. And Charlie, it just sounds like he's coming unglued. You know, I was going to play this video in a moment of Trump calling Catherine Lucy of Bloomberg a piggy. He told her to shut up and called her piggy on Air Force One, which is absolutely appalling and disgusting.
- [11:18]
Charlie Sykes
But.
- [11:19]
Jim Acosta
And I do want to play that in a little bit, but it just goes to show that he is unraveling. He is coming unspooled. I mean, calling Marjorie Taylor Greene traitor the way he has been behaving. I know we're used to him where our outrage sensors have been worn down, and we're accustomed to him acting in unhinged ways, but this feels particularly unhinged, even for him.
- [11:42]
Charlie Sykes
Yeah, it does. I mean, look, you know, insulting women's looks is not a new thing for Donald Trump. He's been doing that for the last decade. But the fact that it's not working, I think is what is rattling him. And I think it's important to understand why this would rattle him more than other Republicans who've broken with him. It is because she is speaking the MAGA language. She is using MAGA principles to go after him. She's basically saying that he is betrayed, he is not enough. She is not moving to the center. You know, she has not, you know, had her, you know, moment on the road to Damascus. She said, we need to be. We need to go back to first principles. And the one thing if you'll notice, if you watch both Trump and with and JD Vance, they do not want to be outflanked to the right. They don't mind people breaking with them, but if somebody is more MAGA than they are, that they understand that as, as the threat. And of course, now what he has done is he has given her a much bigger platform than she ever has and she's obviously enjoying it. I mean, it wasn't that long ago that Marjorie Taylor Greene was very close to being a pariah. She was kind of a star in maga, but she, you know, but she was kind of a political pariah. Now with, with speeches like that, she is calling him out and she is, as Olivia points out, she is speaking directly to her constituents, to his base. And, and, and, and I have to say that is something that is not something that he's experienced before. It's easy for him to brush off the Mitt Romney's or the Paul Ryan's or like that. This is much more problematic.
- [13:16]
Jim Acosta
Yeah, Olivia, I mean, that's the Charlie that is dead on. That, that is exactly what I heard earlier today. I was at the press conference and, and watched this and you know, Thomas Massey, you know, he, he was saying a lot of things about, you know, the rationale for passing this legislation and standing with the survivors. And you know, I asked at one point of, of all of them, why do they think that Donald Trump has been standing in the way of this for so long? And, and Massey said, well, maybe he's protecting other people and that sort of thing. Nobody really just wanted to come out and say it, Olivia. And that is that he is very likely protecting himself. We don't know that for a fact. We don't know what that is. We don't know what's going on. But there's the April 2011 email that I've talked about time and again on this show. I don't know, you know, if somebody can explain to me, maybe Donald Trump can be asked this question, why in April 2011 Jeffrey Epstein is asking or telling Ghislaine Maxwell that Donald Trump is the dog that has embarked and that he spent hours at his house with victim redacted. And so, I mean, this, this story has not ended. It's going to go to the Senate. Perhaps they'll pass it, perhaps he'll sign it and then they'll start to play games with it. But this email right here, this business right here has not been addressed. And, and there's, there are a few folks here in Washington who want to touch it, but it has to be addressed or we don't know everything that is going on with Donald Trump and Jeffrey Epstein.
- [14:42]
Olivia Troye
Well, yeah, let's be clear on something here. Donald Trump is the king of throwing anyone and everyone under the bus and coming forward with all sorts. And let me tell you, if he somehow is not implicated or something, I mean, if you were completely innocent, he would have thrown everything out already. Right. I mean, we all know that.
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Charlie Sykes
Absolutely.
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Olivia Troye
And so that is the bottom line. Like, anyone who's ever worked on staff with them, anyone I've talked to that worked in the White House, anyone who's been in this orbit knows that they will throw anything they can if they've got any inkling on you out into the public. They don't care how loyal you are, who you are, whether you're a relative. That's why this is so suspect, the fact that he has now been dragged by a loyalist who goes out and says, I've been loyal to you for way too long.
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Jim Acosta
Right.
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Olivia Troye
And now he's suffering the consequences. And so I think that, to me, speaks volumes. I don't, I don't even need to see emails with his name on it or the references on it.
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Jim Acosta
Yeah.
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Olivia Troye
Because I'm reading the tea leaves and I'm watching him behave, and his demeanor says it all. We all know that.
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Jim Acosta
Right.
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Olivia Troye
I mean, I think that is what is the most obvious thing to, to many of us is just how, how, how scared he is and how he continues to try to obfuscate this, but it's, it's not working.
- [16:11]
Jim Acosta
Yeah, he, he's told on himself. He's telling on himself. But I think we have the moment where I asked that question. I'll just prove that I was at the press conference. We'll play it. How do you think the President has fought so hard to block the release of these files? Why do you think he has fought so hard? If he could do it now, why hasn't he done it now?
- [16:31]
Unknown Representative (possibly a survivor advocate or another lawmaker)
I believe he's trying to protect friends and donors. And by the way, these aren't necessarily Republicans. Once you get to a billion dollars, you transcend parties. You just assume you can pay off whatever party is in charge of the White House, whatever party is in charge of the House of Representatives. And this is about those kinds of people. I think he's been trying to protect them, and I think it also incriminates our own government. This is a complete and total failure of the justice system, as the survivors have witnessed here today. To us, it incriminates the FBI, it incriminates our intelligence agencies, it incriminates police departments in West Palm beach. And that's what has been protected by this either willfully or, or unknowingly, and it's time to end it.
- [17:22]
Jim Acosta
And I would agree with Representative Marjorie Taylor Greene that what matters now is just the action. I don't speculate on what politicians motives are or what's in their heart. The point is the American people have spoken. Congress has spoken. Release the files. It's time for justice. Thank you very much. Thank you. Yeah, forgive my shaky camera work there. That was, that was, that's all on me, by the way, that I, I, and I do have a new iPhone. I don't know what the hell is going on. But anyway, I digress, but I, but Charlie, wow, there's, there's, there's a bit of what Tom Massey was saying there, I think, is that play here, which is this, this notion of the people versus the powerful, the people versus the rich, the people who can afford to be protected in all this. Right.
- [18:05]
Charlie Sykes
And I think that's one of the reasons this resonates. And, and by the way, Donald Trump's attacks on, on Thomas Massie, attacks on him for remarrying his wife died last year. I mean, the viciousness of the attacks, and these are be very hard to come back and have a kumbaya moment. But I have to tell you, and again, you know, you know, kudos to Thomas Massie for, you know, taking this stand, running the risk, you know, and not flinching. However, his explanation, though, doesn't really hold up because his argument is that Donald Trump is doing this because he's protecting other people. When has Donald Trump ever shown a willingness to sacrifice on behalf of anyone else? When has Donald Trump ever been the guy that would fall on his sword to protect anyone in the world? Yeah, this, the whole point of this is the man is not loyal to anybody. And as far as protecting our intelligence agencies or protecting the FBI, if Donald Trump could torch previous administrations, FBI's or intelligence agencies, he would do it in a heartbeat. So the notion that Donald Trump is protecting someone else, really, the more you think about it, you go, no, that really, that's not, that's really not that plausible, is it?
- [19:19]
Jim Acosta
And maybe they're, they were just trying to preserve the possibility. You know, they don't want to piss him off too much because they need him to sign the darn thing. So they, they don't want to poke the bear publicly at this point. I, I, yeah, I'm with you. Yeah.
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Olivia Troye
Yes.
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Jim Acosta
What do you think, Olivia?
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Olivia Troye
I mean, I think that's it. I think they know that, you know, they're walking A fine line here. I think it has been very obvious that Marjorie Taylor Greene has also done it to where he, they've delineated and they've also been very clear that they go out of their way to say, like, you know, we're not saying that he did anything wrong here. We're just standing with the victims. They reiterate that over and over. And I think that that is what they're doing in terms of that. But I, I, I, look, I think Massie is, is correct that this is probably very far reaching into circles and networks and that we probably can only start to guess.
- [20:13]
Jim Acosta
Yeah. I mean, just last night, Larry Summers.
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Olivia Troye
Yeah, yeah.
- [20:16]
Charlie Sykes
The royal family.
- [20:18]
Jim Acosta
The royal family.
- [20:20]
Olivia Troye
And so. Yeah, and so it's interesting. I mean, who knows, right? It's weird that at some point you become interesting bedfellows. See what I did there along the way and with these kind of networks. And I think Matthew's right. You know, it's a question of the powerful and what they can sort of keep underground. And I think you're seeing sort of the power of the people against this. And hopefully, hopefully there is accountability because I just feel awful for these victims and everything they've been through. And they certainly deserve the justice.
- [20:52]
Jim Acosta
Yeah, no, there's no question about it. And Charlie, I guess the big question is where it goes from here. We just, we, we have to, I, I, I think you were saying earlier, indicating earlier that you just, there's not a whole lot of confidence that we're going to see these files. I was talking to Tara, Paul, Mary about this yesterday. She's of the same mindset. And, you know, when Donald Trump was saying, oh, I want the DOJ to investigate Bill Clinton and I want him to invest them to investigate Larry Summers. You know, everybody can now see this train coming that they will say once those investigations get started, oh, it's like Trump with his taxes. It's under audit. They'll say, oh, this is under investigation again, so we can't release these files. We're, we're, we're on. It's like OJ where they're trying to find the real killer, you know.
- [21:39]
Charlie Sykes
Yeah, I don't think we should give them the benefit of the doubt. I think you put your finger on it. So think about the incoherence of Trump's position, which is again, not, not particularly unique, where he'll say on the one hand that it's a complete hoax. We've already investigated it. Nothing to see here. Oh, wait, we need now to have a grand jury Investigation, going back and looking just at Democrats. What's that all about? Well, I do think that at some point they'll say we would definitely release them, but there's ongoing litigation and investigation and you know that we can't do that. The other card that I think that he is likely to play is just a national security card. I'm sorry, there are national security considerations here involving foreign countries. We just cannot release them. But the notion that Donald Trump at any point will release unredacted clean files is just incredibly naive. He has gone so far, he has spent so much political capital in not doing that. Now, it is certainly possible, I mean, we saw this during Trump 1.0, that they might release partial elements of this. He might just, you know, he might just sit down and tell Cash Patel and Pam Bondi, redact all the, any Republican, redact any, any reference to me. I just want only the stuff that mentions Bill Clinton or Democrats or anybody else that I'm willing to throw under the bus. He's, he's capable of doing that. So we're far from being done. But again, just a reminder, and as you point out, Jim, how today felt different. It is the second half of November, 2025, and we're still talking about this. Remember when we talked about this earlier and the question is, is this story going to have legs? Every other story in the Trump era lasts for about 48 hours and then we forget about it. You know, we still talk about, you know, the, the Qatari plane, the Air Force One. No, people forget about it. This one is not going away and it's not going. And it feels as if it's getting bigger as it moves ahead and that Trump's attempts at cover up are actually making it even more intriguing.
- [23:43]
Jim Acosta
That's right. Well, on the worst possible scandal for any White House is one that you can't control, where the facts cannot control out of your control, that it's moving out of your control. Right. Olivia, you were going to say something?
- [23:55]
Olivia Troye
Yeah, Well, I was just going to say, to Charlie's point, I think, look, this is what I, what I personally think is happening here and coming from Republican politics. And I think Charlie knows the playbook as well. I think the laying the foundation and the groundwork started today with the speeches and the remarks that Mike Johnson made. Yes, he has stuck to the talking points. I think he is laying the groundwork where he said, oh, well, we don't want to do the vote. We didn't want to do this because we're actually protecting the Victims, we're really standing with them. We're taking the high road on this, really. Victims, it's about you.
- [24:31]
Karen Attia
We're.
- [24:31]
Olivia Troye
We're with you. We're just as much with you. We believe in transparency, but it's really about you. There's people that don't want to be named in this. I think that groundwork, I think that was step one. I think there is a whole plan here of that. They got together, and that's why you saw the flip in the switch in the narrative. And I think they finally came to an agreement, and everyone's in lockstep. And so I think today was day one of, okay, this is how we're going to message on it, and then we're going to proceed from there. That's. That's what I think is happening here.
- [25:01]
Jim Acosta
Well, and we have the Mike Johnson. I think we. You're brilliant. Queuing up of the video here. Olivia, you've done this before. I think we have the Mike Johnson. Let's play the Mike Johnson. Today's been one of those days. We got it.
- [25:12]
Mike Johnson
So what am I to do as a leader in a situation like this? I call my counterpart in the Senate, Leader Thune, and I talked him through this with him and shared our deep concerns. And of course, they share those concerns as well. And so I'm very confident that when this moves forward in the process, if and when it is processed in the Senate, which is no certainty, that that will be. That they will take the time methodically to do what we have not been allowed to do in the House, to amend this discharge petition and to make sure that these protections are there. The authors of the discharge did not allow us to do that here. That's the rules here. But in the Senate, they can correct it.
- [25:51]
Jim Acosta
Yeah, Charlie, if I were at a, you know, a college basketball game or something, I saw a call from a ref, we would all, you know.
- [26:00]
Charlie Sykes
Yeah, exactly. Yeah.
- [26:01]
Jim Acosta
If you could just look at all of our faces while Mike Johnson was talking there. I mean, it's.
- [26:07]
Charlie Sykes
Well, there's another card here. You know, you mentioned from the White House point of view, when they can't control the narrative. I don't think Republicans and Congress can control the narrative, because if that is the talking point, they've settled on that they are protecting the victims. Well, the victims now have a say as well. They have a voice as well. And I thought that PSA they put out the other day was incredibly powerful, and all they have to do is step forward and say, I am one of the Survivors. I am one of those victims, and they are not protecting me by continuing to cover up the Epstein files. Epstein files.
- [26:40]
Jim Acosta
Yeah.
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Charlie Sykes
That is very difficult for the politicians. And I think. And in fact, I guess I would take the other point of view is that this, this feels like it is the. The boulder rolling down the hill. And the smart political move for Republicans is get the hell out of the way. Do not try to stop it. Don't try to control it. Just get out of the way. Donald Trump threw up his hands. We're gonna throw up our hands. Look at that vote in the House. Everybody except Clay Higgins, who, by the way, is your next Supreme Court justice.
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Jim Acosta
One vote against him. What's he getting out of this?
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Charlie Sykes
Oh, he's going to be an ambassador. He's. He will get his reward. But if you're a Republican senator, why, why do you now want to take the vote? What, what person is now going to make the case about why they should keep those, Those. Those documents secret? You know, Trump caved. The House Republicans cave. The Senate Republicans, I think, are going to cave as well. And with every single day. Going back to your first question, the victory for the victims is they spoke out and they had other people who amplified their voices.
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Olivia Troye
Yes.
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Charlie Sykes
And my guess is they are emboldened. By the way, talking with, you know, Tara Palmeri earlier in the year, this was not a given. It was not a given, Right, that they were all going to come out. They were frightened, they had been cowed, they had been threatened. It was by no means a sure thing that they would take the stand or they would have the impact that they've had. There are a lot of women who've come forward about Donald Trump who've been ignored. Right?
- [28:15]
Jim Acosta
Yeah.
- [28:16]
Charlie Sykes
So I think this dynamic is going to be very, very hard to slow down.
- [28:20]
Jim Acosta
I've never seen anything like this. And Mike Johnson was the one who refused to swear on Adelita Grijalava for what, six weeks, seven weeks almost. And, you know, somebody was duly elected. You know, the lengths that they've gone to try to stop these survivors from just getting some. Some truth out of this, some justice out of this. It has to mean one thing, and that they're protecting somebody who is desperately trying to keep some secrets secret, some wonderful secret secret, perhaps, as Trump said in his birthday letter to Jeffrey Epstein. Allegedly. But while I have you guys for a couple more moments, Olivia, your thoughts. We saw the. The Crown Prince of Saudi Arabia, Mohammed bin Salman, at the White House. And, you know, they're selling F35 jets to the Saudis. They were flying over the White House earlier today. And it was at this moment, there was a moment where Trump was asked about Jamal Khashoggi, the Washington Post opinion writer who was murdered, the CIA said, at the ordering of, of mbs, of Mohammed bin Salman. And Trump said, things happen. You know, things happen. I'm going to play some of that in a little bit with Karen Attia, the former Washington Post opinion writer. But, Olivia, your thoughts on that display over at the White House? I mean, today was just one of those days where, and there's today was just one of those days where it was just one horrendous thing after another.
- [29:41]
Olivia Troye
Yeah, I think that was a pretty heinous moment in the Oval Office because to me, it was Trump dismissing U.S. intelligence. I mean, he basically dismissed the entire U.S. intelligence community in front of a foreign autocrat to protect him, to protect a murderer. Let's be clear about that. So, like, I mean, to me, like that this is just another moment where Donald Trump sides with a foreign entity over his own people. Right. And that to me, was just so disgraceful. And I also hate the message that it sent to the world about who we are as a country right now, as America, and the fact that we don't stand with the free press, we don't stand for human rights. I mean, that's basically that moment was, was monumental in, in reminding what I would, I would say the world of what it is, because we've seen this administration, we've seen what they've done with human rights reports at the State Department. We've seen with Marco Rubio, he used to be the champion for human rights. That's no longer the case. And so I think in that, not at all. It was pretty, pretty horrific to see that.
- [30:45]
Jim Acosta
What do you think, Charlie?
- [30:46]
Charlie Sykes
But very much on Brand, remember when Donald Trump was, was asked about, well, Vladimir Putin, Putin murders people, remember what his response was was to Bill O'Reilly, wasn't he said, murder, lots of people as well.
- [30:58]
Jim Acosta
That's right.
- [30:59]
Charlie Sykes
And this takes place at a time when, when the United States is engaged in, you know, mass extrajudicial killings out on the high sea. And you look back on, on Donald Trump's track record of endorsing murder, extrajudicial killings, sadism, brutality. He was a big fan of President Duterte in the Philippines, who was, who is engaging in all of that. He's praised China for summary executions of drug dealers. And once again, you know, as Olivia points out, this reminds me of the famous Helsinki Moment where he stands next to Vladimir Putin and once again throws our intelligence community under the bus in order to curry favor to a thuggish foreign leader. So, yes, it was horrific. It was deeply embarrassing. It was a reminder of the amorality of Donald Trump. But again, it is not the first time we've seen this. There is a through line and a consistency to Trump, and we just saw that, once again, this is who he is, and these are the people that he likes, and these are the people he feels comfortable doing business with.
- [32:09]
Mike Johnson
Yeah.
- [32:10]
Olivia Troye
One thing that really stood out to me, though, that really bothered me was Trump's response to the reporter calling the reporter insubordinate. Yeah, that word to me was pretty significant because I really wanted to be like, insubordinate to who?
- [32:25]
Jim Acosta
To who. Right.
- [32:27]
Olivia Troye
To who. Trump.
- [32:29]
Jim Acosta
Yeah. Don't work. And I think we have a little bit of that video. Let's play it. Of Trump with MBS in the Oval Office. I think we have that standing by.
- [32:39]
Olivia Troye
And the US Intelligence concluded that you orchestrated the brutal murder of a journalist.
- [32:46]
Karen Attia
9.
- [32:46]
Olivia Troye
Eleven families are furious that you are here in the Oval Office. Why should Americans trust.
- [32:51]
Jim Acosta
Who are you with?
- [32:51]
Olivia Troye
And the same to you, Mr. President.
- [32:52]
Jim Acosta
Now, who are you with?
- [32:53]
Olivia Troye
I'm with ABC News, sir.
- [32:54]
Jim Acosta
You're with who?
- [32:55]
Olivia Troye
ABC News, sir.
- [32:56]
Catherine Lucy
Fake News. ABC Fake News. One of the worst. One of the worst in the business. But I'll answer your question. I have nothing to do with the family business I have left. And when I. I've devoted 100% of my energy, what my family does is fine. They do business all over. They've done very little with. With Saudi Arabia, actually. I'm sure they could do a lot. And anything they've done has been very good. That's what we've done. We've built a tremendous business for a long time. I've been very successful. I decided to leave that success behind and make America very successful. And I've made America more successful by far than it ever was. And that it ever could have been. No matter who was president, there would be Nobody bringing in $21 trillion. That I can tell you right now. As far as this gentleman is concerned, he's done a phenomenal job. You're mentioning somebody that was extremely controversial. A lot of people didn't like that gentleman that you're talking about. Whether you like him or didn't like him, things happen, but he knew nothing about it, and we can leave it at that. You don't have to embarrass our guests by asking a question like that just you asked.
- [33:57]
Saudi Official
Mr. President, please allow me to answer. You know, I feel painful about, you know, families of 911 in America. But, you know, we have to focus on reality, reality based on CIA documents and based on a lot of documents that Osama bin Laden used Saudi people in that event for one main purpose is to destroy this relation, to destroy the American Saudi relation. That's the purpose of 9 11. So whoever buying that, that means they are helping Osama bin Laden purpose of destroying this relation, he know that strong relation between America and Saudi Arabia, it's bad for extremism, it's bad for terrorism, and we have to approve him.
- [34:40]
Charlie Sykes
Wrong.
- [34:40]
Saudi Official
And to build our relation, continue developing our relations, it's critical in the safety of the world, it's critical against extremism and terrorism. About the generalists, it's really painful to hear, you know, anyone that been losing his life for no real purpose or not in a legal way. And it's been painful for us in Saudi Arabia. We've did all the right steps of investigation, et cetera, in Saudi Arabia, and we've improved our system to be sure that nothing happened like that. And it's painful and it's a huge mistake, and we are doing our best that this doesn't happen again.
- [35:20]
Jim Acosta
Yeah. I mean, Olivia, you know, if I'm not mistaken, and correct me if I'm wrong, because you were part of the administration the first term, if you were gone before this. Yeah. The CIA, the intelligence community, found that MBS did order Jamal Khashoggi's murder. Is that I'm correct about that. I was looking at this earlier today, so I think I'm.
- [35:41]
Olivia Troye
I think I know.
- [35:41]
Jim Acosta
Yes.
- [35:42]
Olivia Troye
Yes, he ordered it.
- [35:43]
Jim Acosta
He ordered it.
- [35:44]
Olivia Troye
Yes, he ordered it.
- [35:45]
Jim Acosta
And so he's lying right now.
- [35:46]
Olivia Troye
That was the delineation on it. Yes. And I can tell you. Well, I can't get into incredible amounts of detail, which unfortunately. But I will say that when that news came out. I'll just share this. It was like a bomb went off inside the White House. There was a huge scramble internally. And I think that that was an interesting dynamic to watch because for those of us in national security, yes, it was horrifying. And we had suspected, perhaps, and we were now we had this intelligence assessment saying that this was the case, and we were appalled by it. And the reaction of others, I will say, in the White House was surprising to me because they were going to have to figure out how to navigate this in the future. And so watching this moment for me is watching this whole thing come full circle when that was just quite the propaganda situation that we just saw today.
- [36:41]
Jim Acosta
It was rewriting of history, Charlie, in, in many ways. And you know, when you hear MBS say that the reason why 911 happened was to damage the U. S. Saudi relationship, what a load of horseshit that was.
- [36:55]
Charlie Sykes
Well, I was, I, I was struck by the spin there. I had never. That, you know, this is the way that he has repackaged this terrible thing. That, that. And therefore, if you, you know, raise questions like this, you are doing the work of Osama bin Laden, right? You are, you're accomplishing what he tried to do. So, yeah, the dishonesty there, the immorality, the willingness to. And by the way, I just, I'm sorry to interrupt myself, but the gap between Donald Trump's comfort level with leaders of the free world, democratically elected leaders that he has no problem insulting, berating in the Oval Office and the pattern of just sucking up to people like whether it's Vladimir Putin or whether it's, it's MBS or whether or not it's, it's, you know, the leader of Hungary is, is really what, what a. Tell who, who he emulates, who he, who he admires.
- [37:59]
Jim Acosta
Yeah, well. And I mean, you know, I don't even want to think of what the 911 families are, are thinking right now after hearing what he had to say in the Oval Office. They must be absolutely livid. And Donald Trump, I'm sorry, he should just be ashamed of himself for inviting MBS in there and allowing that kind of propaganda to be spewed out of the Oval Office. I mean, it's just, it's sickening to me. I covered the aftermath of 911 and I saw what New York went through during that time period and we all did as a country. And, you know, they, they did not do themselves any good today, the Saudis with all of that, that we just all go down at the White House. But Olivia and Charlie, great to see both of you. Thank you very much. I really appreciate it. Thanks for all your comments today. I want to bring in Karen Atia, who has been on this program before. She's a former Washington Post columnist and is now very active on substack and independent media. And Karen, the reason why I wanted to talk to you today, and I'm so glad we connected, is that you knew Jamal Khashoggi, you worked with Jamal Khashoggi, and to hear what MBS had to say in the Oval Office, it must make you very upset. As somebody who was colleagues With Jamal Khashoggi. Oh, we have to unmute your microphone. Let's see there. Let's do that. There we go. Yep, we're good.
- [39:29]
Karen Attia
All right. There we go. I know the bad vibes in the air in Washington are just literally affecting everything around me. It feels. Thanks for having me on. I mean, look, it's hard. This is hard. This is hard for a number of reasons. It. It's almost seven years to the day. I remember it, like as clear as it was yesterday, November 16, 2018, when the CIA announced it came through on the Washington Post, had the scoop that they determined that Mohammed bin Salman was responsible for the operation that killed Jamal. And I remember, far be it for me for someone to feel like I was grateful in that moment for an agency like the CIA. Right. But in that moment, I remember it was just. It was like for Jamal to not only been disappeared, but dismembered. It felt like, oh, my goodness, we have some hope. And now to Jim, like, I think one of the more chilling things for me to see today, even before these two thugs got into the office, Something about seeing that blood red carpet, like Muhammad bin Salman stepping out onto this red carpet. All I could think of was the blood on his hands, the blood on the White House's hands of Jamal. And. The fact that the Washington Post, you know, where Jamal was extremely proud to have had a writing home there after being banned from writing. And I want people to know this. A lot of people think that if they know Jamal story, they followed it at all. If they were. Oh.
- [41:47]
Jim Acosta
Karen, we may have lost you there. Did the signal. Is the signal coming back? Oh, shoot. We're really hearing some good stuff up. Karen, You. You lost your signal for a moment, but. Oh, just one word. You were just saying about Jamal because he was in the Washington Post. And the way they've handled this has been a real disappointment to you.
- [42:12]
Karen Attia
Well, yeah, I mean, because a lot of people might not know Jamal was banned from writing in Saudi Arabia before, you know, he. I got a chance to sort of find him and recruit him to write for the Post, but he was banned from writing in. In Saudi Arabia. Not because he criticized Mohammed bin Salman, was banned because he mildly criticized Donald Trump and the emerging relationship between Trump candidate Trump and Saudi Arabia. So that trajectory of him being forced to stop writing them, coming into self exile here to the US he was. He was living here in Virginia. He was a US Resident to writing for the Washington Post for just sadly one year and then being murdered, a lot of that trajectory, Trump was intertwined in all of that. And it is not only painful, it is freaking scary to see. Here we are today. We have once again, you as independent media here on subset, being the first to talk to me about all this. We have a media that is now also afraid of Trump. Right? Yes, yes, Washington Post, which now. And you know, I'm writing this on a. On a forthcoming piece that should publish soon, but I think so much about almost the Saudification of the US Media space. Jamal used to talk to me about the red lines that he and his editors and riyads were not allowed to cross when they were, you know, editing their newspaper. And those edicts coming from far up high. Right. And I think to today, right to the Washington Post, red lines of what we are not allowed to speak about in Bezos's, you know, new direction, his kingdom, we have little broligarch kingdoms or, you know, it's all very much connected. But I think about this a lot that Jamal's trajectory, his. His murder, there were. There were so many clues, warning signs, things that he probably never thought. He thought he'd be safe. You know, here in the U. S. Writing for the paper like the Washington Post, we all thought perhaps we would be safe from. And here we are.
- [44:42]
Jim Acosta
Karen. I mean, you probably heard what MBS was saying. His. His. He said, oh, this was investigated. I mean, he was. It was all lies, what he was saying that there, you know, if they had done a proper investigation, they would have found that. That he had ordered this. That was what our own intelligence community had sent. They have their own version of reality here. I mean, it's. It's astonishing.
- [45:09]
Karen Attia
Yeah. And not just. Not just the CIA, if people remember Agnes Calamard, who is a special reporter for the United nations, also had a United nations inquiry and report basically outlining that there was very, very, very, very little chance that an operation of that scale, the lengths that they went to. To surveil Jamal to capture. And if people remember, these folks tried to put a body double right as just in Jamal's clothes. We saw footage of them cleaning the scene with bleach. They tried to Turkey. We saw all of this play out on our own screen seven years ago.
- [45:57]
Jim Acosta
Yeah.
- [45:59]
Karen Attia
And so to. To say that we shouldn't believe what we. Those of us who follow this, what we saw seven years ago is. Is absolutely. It's just thuggery, Jim. This is just straight up thuggery. And I.
- [46:18]
Jim Acosta
On a global scale.
- [46:19]
Karen Attia
On a global scale. We now know that transnational repression of activists and journalists is increasing we now see, as you've talked about, we've seen our own press freedoms slipping away before our eyes. And the fact that this sends a message to the rest of the world about what America will let you do if you have Trump likes you enough, perhaps if you give enough money, if you promise enough dollar signs and do enough sword dances, you can get away with carving up whoever you want. And America say, well, things happen, right?
- [47:07]
Jim Acosta
It's family members get to make deals with whichever country, or, you know, the corruption that is at the heart of this, too, is astonishing. But I just, you know, I. I didn't want to let this day go by because I know Epstein was such a big story today. But we cannot forget what happened to Jamal Khashoggi. And, you know, we still have freedom of speech in this country. He may think that he's a king, Trump may think he's a king, like. Like Muhammad bin Salman or a crown prince or something like that, but we still have freedom of the press, and we are still allowed to say what a disgrace it was that we saw in the. In the Oval Office earlier today. The president of the United States should be standing up for American principles of democracy and things like freedom of the press, which a journalist from another country ought to be able to have here in the US and he was working for the Washington Post. He was a resident of Virginia. And it's just. It's amazing to me, it's just so sad to me that Trump has allowed the Saudis to get away with this. He's absolutely allowed them to get away with it. With no consequences.
- [48:17]
Karen Attia
With no consequences. And it just further erodes, I keep thinking about what is America's story to the rest of the world now? Right? This is a place where people, particularly journalists like Jamal, could say they could come here and write and be free. I worked with so many of those writers who had come to the Post from repressed countries because they had no space to write anymore.
- [48:43]
Jim Acosta
Yeah.
- [48:43]
Karen Attia
And now what the message that was just sent. At least Biden. At least Biden. And let me an aside. At least Biden. At least they, I don't know, at least tried to couch. Even though, yes, there was that fist bump. And yes, let's remember, they did grant immunity to Mohammad bin Salman under the Biden administration. So I have bipartisan blame on. But this callousness sends a message to people in the rest of the world, writers in the rest of the world who once saw us as this story of. By us, I mean America, as this place of refuge and Safety. Now he's saying you're not safe. Things happen if something happens to you. Like Paul Kagame of Rwanda would say of, you know, a former spy chief of his that ended up dismembered in South Africa. People just tend to die. And so, but you know, Jim, I mean, again, the fact that you remember, the fact that so many people remember Jamal's name that we didn't let this story die for seven years. I think you worked in news. For people to remember something for seven years is incredible. And that's just due to people being able to see with their own eyes and ears that, like, this is wrong. This man did not deserve this. No one deserves this. But there is something about the fact that I think now, seven years later, we can see that democracy or freedom of the press, our ability to speak is something that we can't take for granted at all. You say we have freedom of the press now? I, you know, yes.
- [50:28]
Jim Acosta
But it's. If we fight for it, if we continue, and it's incumbent upon all of us as journalists, whether it's corporate media, public media, independent media, everybody has to, we're all, we're all on that team, you know, where we have to defend this. Right. And if we can run out the clock on the people who want to take it away from us, you know, and just keep battling and keep charging and keep fighting. But, Karen, I'm glad you were here to help me and help all of us keep Jamal's legacy alive and his memory alive. And thank you. I'm glad we connected and made this happen. So great to talk to you. Thank you.
- [51:03]
Karen Attia
You're always, you're always the first. I appreciate you so much for the work that you do and keeping this, you know, front and center. So thanks so much, Jim.
- [51:14]
Jim Acosta
You got it. Take care and make sure we all subscribe and follow Karen on all the socials. That's very important. It.
- [51:19]
Karen Attia
Yeah.
- [51:20]
Jim Acosta
Thanks, Karen. Good to see you. That's Karen Atia. And, you know, the. The last thing I wanted to show you is if you want to know just how much trouble Donald Trump is in right now, if you want to know how worried he is about the Epstein files right now, I mean, yeah, the way he lashed out in the Oval Office earlier in the day, yes, that was, that was quite telling. But it was this moment on Air Force One Friday night, the way he talks to Bloomberg reporter Katherine Lucy. Let's play that video.
- [51:51]
Catherine Lucy
And I had a relationship for many years, but he also saw Strike because I was president. So he dictated a Couple of memos to himself.
- [52:01]
Jim Acosta
Give me a break.
- [52:02]
Catherine Lucy
You're going to find out what did.
- [52:03]
Charlie Sykes
He know with respect to Bill Clinton.
- [52:06]
Catherine Lucy
With respect to the head of Harvard, with respect to all of those people. Well, then you knew, including JP Morgan Chase.
- [52:13]
Jim Acosta
Yeah.
- [52:13]
Catherine Lucy
Jennifer, go ahead.
- [52:20]
Jim Acosta
Quiet piggy. Quiet piggy. That is how Donald Trump addressed Catherine Lucy of Bloomberg when she was trying to ask questions about the Epstein matter on Air Force One Friday night. This just goes to show you how deeply worried and deeply freaked out Donald Trump is right now when it comes to the Epstein files. And so for folks who think, oh well, they passed this in the House today, we're going to see these files unredacted at any moment without Trump's name scrubbed and washed out. Give me a break. That, you know, I'll believe it when I see it. But putting that to the side, I do want to, I do want to address the elephant in the room. Or is it the pig in the room? Donald Trump, you're the pig. You're the pig. Referring to a journalist, a working journalist who is putting in long hours to cover your bullshit should not be addressed as piggy. On of all places, Air Force One. I know Katherine Lucy. I've worked alongside her for many years and she is a terrific journalist, a dedicated, hard working journalist who works her, you know, tail off making sure that she gets the story right. Just like a lot of other journalists here in Washington. You saw the way Donald Trump addressed Mary Bruce inside the Oval Office earlier in the day when the question came up about Jamal Khashoggi and the Saudis. And I just have to say, on of all days, when the House of Representatives votes nearly unanimously to release the Epstein files, which if they ever come out, will tell us about the appalling criminal, sadistic behavior and actions directed at young girls. Now, women of all days on this day, for Donald Trump to go after Mary Bruce of ABC and just a few days ago calling a reporter for Bloomberg Piggy, I think the question, you know, it's not even a question anymore. Donald Trump, you have a problem, you obviously have a problem with very abusive behavior towards women. And it's sickening. It's not just unbecoming of a president of the United States. It doesn't make you a man. There's something deeply unmanly about this behavior. And so I guess my message at the end of this day to Donald Trump is be a man and, and learn how to treat women with respect, for God's sake. And Catherine, Lucy, Mary Bruce, they deserve our respect and they're and I'm sorry, if you can't handle the questions, then what are you doing having reporters in the Oval Office? If you can't handle the questions. This is the problem for Donald Trump right now, and maybe this is the, the larger overarching, overarching issue in all of this is that he is coming unglued, he is unraveling, he is unwell. And it, it appears to be because of the Epstein files. Think about it, folks. This has been going on since July, since the Department of Justice put out that memo saying that there is nothing to see here, there's nothing going on in the Epstein files. Don't worry. You know, we're just going to move along now. And then last week we see the emails and again, I'm going to bring it up again for the folks at home who are paying attention, keeping score, I'm going to bring it up again. The April 2011 email from Jeffrey Epstein to Ghislaine Maxwell. And remember, these emails came out two days before. He calls Katherine Lucy Piggy. The email from Jeffrey Epstein to Ghislaine Maxwell that Donald Trump is the dog that hasn't barked. The dog that hasn't barked. And he has spent hours at my house with victim redacted. At some point, Donald Trump, you're going to have to tell the, you're going to have to, I'm not going to say you're going to tell the truth about this. We know, we know better than that. But at some point you're going to get asked this question, what is that all about? What is that all about? And what is the behavior that we have seen since these emails have come out? We haven't even seen the full Epstein files. Remember, these emails, they're different from the Epstein files, the Epstein emails, these emails came from the Epstein estate. The files are still to come. The files have not been even, they're not even close to being released at this point. That's what we're in the process of seeing right now. And if he's getting this unglued, this unhinged, this unwell, now what's next? Is this man safe to have as President of the United States anymore where he's going? He's popping off and going nuts and calling people piggy and going off on Mary Bruce in the Oval Office. What is going on? And does anybody inside the White House, does he, Is there anybody there who can help him get a grip? Because he appears to have lost all touch with reality. He appears to have lost his grip entirely on what is taking place inside his own administration from one day to the next. And that is all very important. That is all critical to everything that we're doing dealing with right now. There's no question about it. It's. It's very important stuff. But at a base level, at a human level, what are we doing with a President of the United States of America who calls a reporter piggy? I. I mean, to me, that's just some sick stuff. There's something really wrong with him, and I know there's not a whole lot we can do about it.
- [58:50]
Mike Johnson
Now.
- [58:50]
Jim Acosta
He's in there. He's in the White House. He knocks down the East Wing one week. The other day, they. They say he wants to paint the old Executive Office Building white. He's putting gold everywhere. He's got his little walk of. Walk of shame that he's put along the colonnade, the hall of Presidents. I don't know. He thinks this is Disney World. And he was showing Muhammad bin Salman the hall, the. The Walk of Presidents or whatever the hell that is that he's put outside the Oval Office. This is some weird, nutty that is going on at the White House right now. And it is weird, nutty shit that the President of the United States is calling a journalist. Piggy. Is he 12? That's not a man. That's a pig. That's a pig. And I'll leave it at that. My thanks to Olivia Troy, my thanks to Charlie Sykes, and my thanks to Karen Atia. We are not going to forget Jamal Khashoggi. Mohammed bin salman. I'm sorry, Mr. Crown Prince. This is America. We don't have kings and princes here. We don't have kings and princes here. There is no royal family. We don't. We don't do that here. And if you think you're going to roll into our White House, even though half of it is knocked down, and you're going to lie about 9 11. Screw you. Screw you. 911 was not about damaging the US Saudi relationship. Give me a break. What is this clown show going on over at the White House right now? What is it? Well, I don't know. You've caught me on. I'm on. I'm on a. I'm on a real one today, folks. I cannot believe this. This day has been a disgrace. A disgrace to this country. This day has been a hot mess, and it's all because of Donald Trump. It's an embarrassment. He is an. He is a global embarrassment. And the Republicans who think you got beat on the Epstein files. Now it's going to this. And you think that you're going to be able to stop this thing? Look at who you're protecting. Look at who you're protecting. You're protecting a pig. He's the pig. Still reporting from Washington, I'm Jim Acosta. Have a good evening. I'll see you next time.
- [61:43]
Olivia Troye
This is who you're fighting for. This is who Congress is fighting for. This is who the House of Representatives are fighting for. And hopefully, hopefully, the Senate will fight for us, too.
- [61:54]
Epstein Survivor (possibly Jenalisa Jones)
This fight belongs to us. We lived it, and we know the truth. And we will not wait quietly for institutions to decide when we're allowed to speak. The survivors now coming forward have entrusted us with their stories. We are sharing that information with the proper authorities. And when it can safely be made public, it will be a little reminder that this was me at 14. I was 16 years old. I was a child. I was in ninth grade. I was hopeful for life and what the future had held for me. He stole a lot from me.
- [62:31]
Olivia Troye
I was only 14 when I first encountered Jeffrey Epstein. And my daughter is now almost at that age.
- [62:38]
Karen Attia
One of us who has spoken several times.
- [62:43]
Olivia Troye
Decided she couldn't come because of the threats.
- [62:46]
Jim Acosta
She was too scared.
- [62:48]
Karen Attia
So I want to say, when you threaten one of us, you're threatening all of us. We are together now, and that's never going to change. This is me at 16 when I met Jeffrey Epstein.
- [63:04]
Olivia Troye
And I'm standing here today with a truth that still scares me to say out loud. I'm gonna put this down because I can't hold both, as you guys saw. But that was me when I was 14, when I met Jeffrey Epstein.
- [63:18]
Jim Acosta
This was me at 17 years old. My name is Sky Roberts, and I stand before you as the brother of Virginia Roberts Giuffre, a warrior, a mother and a sister whose legacy will forever resonate in the hearts of those who understand the fight against injustice.
- [63:41]
Olivia Troye
This is me when I met Jeffrey Epstein in 1991. I always share the date when I talk about my story because people rarely, rarely acknowledge how long this has actually been going on.
- [64:51]
Jim Acosta
Sam.