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The Jim Acosta Show
MAGA Shutdown Day 2 with Senator Chris Murphy and Oregon Attorney General Dan Rayfield
00:44:22
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- [00:02]
A
If there is a shutdown, I think.
- [00:03]
B
It would be a tremendously negative mark.
- [00:06]
A
On the President of the United States. He's the one that has to get people together. Yep, that was Donald Trump back in the day. Welcome to the Jim Acosta Show. And it's day two of the MAGA shutdown here in Washington. America is being held hostage by Donald Trump, who has been doing a lot of hiding from the press ever since his party shut down the federal government. And for good reason. The Washington Post did a quick survey and found 47% blame Trump and the Republicans, 30% blame Democrats. Here to discuss as Connecticut's Democratic Senator, Chris Murphy. Senator, thanks for joining us. Appreciate it. Is it time to put out an APB for djt? What do you think?
- [00:47]
B
Well, I mean, he's right. The president is responsible for bringing people together. Republicans asked to be in charge of everything and voters gave them that control. They run the White House, the Senate, the House of Representatives. We did not have a shutdown during the four years that Joe Biden was president. And the reason for that is not that there weren't huge differences between Democrats and Republicans. It was because Joe Biden and the Democrats reached out across the aisle with plenty of time to spare before these deadlines and worked out a deal. Sometimes it was a short term funding deal, sometimes we were actually able to pass a long term budget. But we knew that the only way to pass a budget, even when Republicans were in the minority, was to listen to them and include in the budget some of their priorities. That's what's required in the Senate. Republicans have not done that in part because Donald Trump thinks he's a king. He doesn't think he needs anybody else. And he wants to take advantage of this crisis in order to more deeply crack down on democracy and dissent and anybody in the federal government that opposes him. So we are in a shutdown because Donald Trump thinks he's a king. And they really don't give a crap about the people whose insurance premiums are going to go up because Democrats have made it clear, hey, if you want our votes, you have to at the very least not raise premiums on everybody who has an Obamacare plan by 75 to 100% this, this fall. So, yeah, we're standing by. If they want to sit down and have, you know, negotiations and discussions, we will, but they've been awol.
- [02:22]
A
And I guess, you know, one of the interesting things that we've seen over the last, I guess, several hours is, you know, Trump put out some truth social post saying he has a meeting today with Russ Vogt, the head of the Office of Management and Budget. And during this post on Truth Social, he says, I have a meeting today with Russ Vogt, he of Project 2025 fame, to determine which of the many Democrat agencies he calls them, most of which are a political scam, he recommends to be cut and whether he goes on to say and whether or not those cuts will be temporary or permanent. I mean, it seems as though, I mean, first of all, remember when Trump said he had nothing to do with Project 2025 during the campaign and now he's touting that Russ Vogue was of Project 2025 fame. But it seems as though Trump is trying to take advantage of this to, I mean, go further than what the Constitution allows and just eliminate federal employees altogether, not even furlough them, just get rid of them. What's your reaction to that?
- [03:20]
B
Well, I mean, it's par for the course. I mean, this is not a president who believes in democracy. This is a president who's going to use any opportunity to try to destroy our democracy. And even though a shutdown, let's be clear, shutdown gives the president no extra powers. So the president doesn't have any extra powers to fly furlough or fire staff during a shutdown. The president doesn't have the ability to close a department during shutdown. It's true that people don't get paid during a shutdown, but a shutdown doesn't allow the president to fire people any more so than he has that power when the government is not shut down. So he's just imagining powers that don't exist. But he's been doing that since the beginning. I mean, he's been intent on seizing spending power for himself. He's turned the DOJ into a witch on operation to hunt his political enemies. He's using the regulatory agencies to make his friends and his family rich. So, you know, all of this is par for the course. And my recommendation to Democrats is don't be bullied by this guy. You know, he thinks that by sort of advertising that he's going to act even more illegally during a shutdown, that we should back down and not fight for the things that matter to our constituents, like insurance premiums low. You can't, if you let a bully win like that, and as a result, the people we represent get hurt. They're going to get hurt over and over and over again. So we just have to stand up for what we believe in.
- [04:47]
A
And do you think that the party leadership is holding the line, you know, to the extent that you'd like to see it held. I mean, one of the questions that, you know, has been talked about in the Democratic Party for several months now is, are they fighting hard enough? Is Chuck Schumer fighting hard enough? Jeffries and so on. Do you get the sense that it's different this time?
- [05:08]
B
Well, I mean, we are shut down because we did not allow Republicans to run over us and the people we represent. So the people we represent do not want democracy destroyed. They do not support this growing censorship state, and they don't understand why their premiums have to go up by 70% this fall in order to pay for a tax cut for billionaires and millionaires. These are moments where the minority party has leverage. Right. There aren't a lot of leverage moments when you are in this kind of minority. We don't control anything in Washington. And so you need to use these moments to stand up for what you believe in. People want to see us fighting. They want to see us have a backbone. They want to know how we're different from Donald Trump. And when we don't fight hard, especially when the entire enterprise of democracy is at risk, then we don't seem sincere. When we tell people that there might not be a free and fair election in 2026, people say, well, if that's the. Why were you so eager to sign on to a budget that funded the destruction of democracy? So what we're doing here is, you know, protecting our constituents, but we're also signaling to people how urgent the moment is by being willing to hold the line here.
- [06:24]
A
Yeah, yeah. Because, I mean, that's a question that I've raised on, on my show, Senator. And that is, I mean, yes, it's good to fight for those Obamacare subsidies so people's premiums don't rise and so on. But you also have the administration acting like thugs when it comes to these ICE raids you have out there trying to redraw congressional maps and sort of subvert the 2026 election cycle. And it seems to me you, you have a whole host of grievances here to hold the line on here. And, and, and I'm just wondering, I, I suppose there, there may be folks like yourself who would like to maybe dig in a little harder than others and not just, not just say, okay, yeah, we'll sign on to this if you give us the Obamacare thing. Okay, we'll go back to work. What do you think? Am I off the mark there?
- [07:08]
C
Yes.
- [07:09]
B
So. So, yes. I mean, in, in normal Times. Right. You might make, as a minority party, a small demand. And. And just saying, don't raise premiums for this subset of Americans who get their insurance from Obamacare. That's a pretty small priority. Right, but this isn't a normal time. Right. I mean, how in good conscience can I fund a Department of justice that is literally hunting Democrats? How can I sign off on a budget when the President is saying once he gets his hands on that budget, he's going to spend money only in Republican states and he's just going to illegally cancel all the money in the Democratic states? He did that yesterday. He sent out these two announcements that all the New York money in the Department of Transportation and he canceled Department of Energy projects, and he sent out the list of states that he's canceling in. It's every state represented by two Democratic senators, no states represented by Republican senators. And interestingly, maybe the only sort of Democrat who voted yesterday for the Republican continuing Resolution, that state was not on the list. Right. So just a clear signal, if you're loyal to me, you get money. If you're not, you don't get money. How can I sign off on that budget? I'd be a sucker. I'd be a sucker.
- [08:29]
A
So.
- [08:29]
B
So, yes, I think this fight has to be about the ACA subsidies, but it's got to be about also defending the rule of law as well.
- [08:38]
A
Yeah, no, I mean, what you mentioned there about New York being hit, I mean, the OMB announcer was putting a hold on roughly $18 billion of infrastructure funds for New York subway and Hudson Tunnel projects. I mean, that. That affects New York, but it also affects people, I think, commuting from Connecticut into New York to do all sorts of things. So there is that. And I guess, you know, the. The flip side of this, and I'm just curious what you think is, you know, there's a. There's a lot of corruption going on. I mean, just yesterday, the White House press secretary, Caroline Levitt, got mad at a New York Times reporter who was pressing the White House on Jared Kushner's role in the Middle east and how he's been profiting off of his connections to the Middle East. I mean, to the tune of billions of dollars. And you have this investigation into Trump's border czar, Tom homan, accepting a $50,000 bag of cash from an undercover FBI agent last year. I know you've talked a lot about just the outright corruption that we're seeing these days. They're talking about handing out $20 billion to Argentina while there are farmers all across the country that are just getting hammered right now. And I just wonder, you know, there's a lot happening right now and we're just sipping from a fire hose, it seems. Not even sipping, it's just right in our face.
- [09:55]
B
Yeah. And we, and again, we risk normalizing it by making this funding fight just about the health care insurance premiums. Right. Because if Democrats sign on to a budget that funds this level of illegality and this level of corruption without any provisions in the budget to restrain it, then nobody is going to think there's anything wrong with it. Because if there was something wrong with this level of corruption, then why would Democrats sign onto a budget that literally pays people to help Donald Trump rig the economy for himself and his friends? But again, I'm not Pollyannish about this. I realize that, you know, we are not going to be able to get rid of Trump's corruption inside a budget. We're not going to make him act legally by creating some new super law, but we can make it harder for him to get away with it. We can give the courts clearer law to rule on when he is trying to, you know, let's say, use the White House in, in order to hunt down his political opponents or to sell a crypto coin using white, using the White House as a backdrop for his marketing operation. But if, but if the budget doesn't have any constraints on the corruption, then the signal is, well, Democrats didn't really seem to care too much about it, so it must be not that bad.
- [11:20]
A
Yeah. I mean, and you have the Supreme Court, I mean, essentially letting Trump do whatever he wants. Elena Kagan, Justice Elena Kagan has been sounding the alarm. She just did it again, apparently last week about how they've been using this shadow docket, this emergency docket to, you know, from time to time just allow Trump to do what he wants. I've heard you, Senator, talk a lot about, you know, your concerns that our democracy is, is slipping away. And there are some of the Democratic Party who say, you know, we shouldn't talk about democracy so much. We gotta talk about bread and butter issues and just talk about affordability and things like that. But I mean, to me, you know, our democratic freedoms, you know, he's going after late night talk show hosts and, you know, I mean, he's, he's trying to subvert the elections next year. You've got a Supreme Court that's basically let him, letting him do whatever he wants. I think that you are, I mean, you're right on the Mark, it seems to me I, not. I know, I. Maybe as a reporter, you're not supposed to say that to a senator, but it seems to me there's a lot at stake right now.
- [12:26]
B
Yeah.
- [12:27]
A
And it's overstating things.
- [12:28]
B
I don't. Listen, I, I am also making an argument that the party has to be more aggressively economically populous. I think we've got a B for, you know, solutions that meet the moment for voters. Not a, you know, a five dollar increase in the minimum wage, but a $15 increase in the minimum wage, a cap on prescription drug prices. Okay, I'm, I'm for all of that, but I will never, ever get to put that into law if there's not an a fair election in 2026. So none of your economic agenda means anything if Donald Trump rigs our democracy so that the Trump family rules the country forever? And I get it that that sounds a little ridiculous when I say it. Right. And when Gavin Newsom says he doesn't, he thinks Trump doesn't want to have another election, that sounds ridiculous, but, like, it's not. Democracies die, you know, normally not through, like a violent coup. In many countries that are not democracies, elections still happen. It's just that the rules are rigged so that the ruling party never, ever loses. That's what happens in Turkey, in Hungary. I mean, Russia even has elections. And that's what's happening here, is that he's trying to just constrain the space that the opposition party can operate in. He's trying to sort of press people into silence such that he might be at 30% approval ratings next fall, and his party still wins the elections because they've rigged the rules, and then we'll never get to operationalize any of the economic promises we're making. So I just think, like, whether we like it or not, whether the pollsters tell us this is the number one issue or not, democracy is at risk of dying. And if that's the case, that's kind of the number one thing. Like, you know, and, and you have to convince the, and the American public will understand that if you convince them of it. Like, we, we shouldn't also be so fatalistic. Oh, the polls tell us that Americans aren't yet convinced that democracy is dying, but if it's dying, then we have an obligation to go out and lead and explain to people why it's dying. And you know what? I actually think that we'll be able to change some minds if we tell.
- [14:35]
A
The truth is part of the problem and forgive me for, if I'm putting things in terms that are a little too stark here is part of the problem that Joe Biden warned that Donald Trump was a threat to democracy. And then Joe Biden didn't get out of the way in time for the Democratic Party to get its act together in 2024. And then Trump was able to go back into the White House despite the fact he tried to pull off a coup in. In January of 2021.
- [14:59]
B
I don't know. I don't know. I mean, listen, I. I would say that it certainly didn't look like in early 2025, the Democratic Party believed Donald Trump was an existential threat to democracy. Right. We all. We all showed up to the State of the Union speech. We did our sort of normal duty. We. We sort of went through the motions in the early parts of this Trump presidency to make it look normal, even though we told everybody that it was going to be abnormal. I mean, if I have. I don't have, like, a lot of critiques of Kamala's campaign. I thought she did a pretty good job on a short calendar. But I do think that there was a sort of mistake that started during the Biden messaging framework, continued through Kamala's campaign, and that was that we were defending democracy. Right. Rightfully, we were calling this guy, you know, a threat to democracy. But we didn't realize most people are not interested in protecting this version of democracy. Like, people really think the democracy is broken. And they were like, oh, you guys are just a status quo. You think that this democr. Democracy works? It doesn't. It's rigged for the elites and the corporations. And we. We should have spent a lot more oxygen and energy explaining how we would change democracy if you gave us power. And I think we still aren't doing that enough. We're still, frankly, probably spending too much time talking about the economy or, you know, other issues and not enough money, talking about how we would fundamentally change democracy. That'll make people a lot more interested in saving it.
- [16:25]
A
Interesting, no? And when we've got more time, I'd love to delve into that further because it seems to me, you know, why not have congressional term limits? Why not have Supreme Court term limits? Why not have, you know, there's a whole host of things, you know, an expanded Supreme Court and so on. I know we have a little bit of time left center. I wanted to ask you, because we've seen a number of mass shootings in recent weeks. There was the assassination, of course, of Charlie Kirk but on the same day, there was a mass shooting at a, at a school and church in Colorado. And we've seen several mass shootings since then. And it seems to, and I know this is an issue that's near and dear to your heart because Sandy Hook. But it seems to me we've gotten away from talking about gun safety. And I'll say gun control. I know that the focus group say don't talk about gun control, talk about gun safety. But it seems that we've gotten away from it and now we're just having a debate over political rhetoric fueling mass shootings. We're still not dealing with the, the root cause of it, which is the proliferation of firearms to the point where anybody can get an assault rifle. It's just anybody at any time can get one.
- [17:26]
B
Yeah, I mean, listen, we, we have a lot of polarization here and we have a lot of political extremism, but so do a lot of other countries. But the mass shootings only happen in the United States. And the reason is pretty simple. When your brain is becoming unhinged and you're thinking about taking it out through violence against your fellow citizens, you have easy access to a weapon of mass destruction in the United States and you don't in other countries. And so the quickest way to make this country safer, because unwinding political extremism, that's hard. We don't even totally know how to do that. We 100% know how to keep assault weapons out of the hands of dangerous people. Just don't sell them any longer. And here's the good news. Even though mass shootings have dominated the news and they've been tragic and awful, mass shootings are actually end. School shootings are actually down by big numbers since 2022, when we passed the first anti gun violence bill of any meaning or substance in 30 years. And so we have this experience now where we passed a bill that makes it a little bit harder for dangerous people to get their hands on dangerous weapons. And as soon as we passed that bill, urban homicides, mass shootings, school shootings started to drop. Trump is unwinding a lot of the progress in that bill. He cut off all the funds in that bill to help stop community anti gun violence. He's not enforcing some, some of the things we do to try to go after gun dealers who are irresponsibly putting guns into the black market. So maybe not coincidentally, as Trump's not implementing that bill, you're seeing the numbers. Maybe we'll see the numbers may be Increased. But there's a good news story over the last three years and it's a reminder of why stronger gun laws actually work.
- [19:10]
A
But we don't have, we stick your, Correct me wrong, we still do not have a, a total background check system in this. We don't have a universal background check system.
- [19:18]
B
No, we don't.
- [19:18]
A
Still don't have it.
- [19:19]
B
We still, we still don't, we still don't have it. And you know, and there's simple things. Even if you didn't want to put a background check on pistols universally, why not just put a universal background check system on assault weapons so that no matter where you buy an assault weapon, which is, you know, the tool of a mass killer, you have to prove that you haven't had a history of serious mental illness.
- [19:40]
A
Yeah. Well, Senator, I know, I hate to do this because I know you press your time and your staff will get mad at me if I hold you up too longer. But really appreciate the time. Thanks so much. And thanks for talking about the issue of democracy. It's something I talk about on this show all the time.
- [19:57]
B
Thank you for doing it.
- [19:59]
A
I mean, to me it's like it's the whole ball game. And if we let this one go, I don't know. You know, I agree with you. Like health care, all economy, affordability, all those things are great. But you know, democracy ought to come first. It seems to me. It's just sort of a basic thing.
- [20:12]
B
Somebody said to me years ago, they said there's kind of two issues that matter more than anything else. This is 10 years ago he said democracy in the environment. Because if you don't have a democracy and you don't have clean air and clean water, you know, kind of everything else doesn't matter. So I've always, I've always remembered that. But anyway, thanks for having me on.
- [20:32]
A
Thanks, Senator. Really appreciate your time. Thanks so much. All right. And of course, we appreciate Senator Chris Murphy for joining us. And there are other issues besides the government shutdown. Here in Washington, Donald Trump is still continuing with his invading of democratic led cities across the United States. Portland, Oregon is one of those. And in the state of Oregon, the attorney general is taking Trump to court to try to stop that from happening. So, so let's bring in the attorney general of Oregon, Dan Rayfield. Mr. Attorney General, great to see you. Thanks for doing this.
- [21:06]
C
Absolutely. Thanks for having me.
- [21:07]
A
Hey, no, it's our pleasure. Thanks so much. And I guess I just noticed, I was perusing around a little bit. I noticed that you, you may have posted that there is potentially going to be a hearing tomorrow. You have filed for a temporary restraining order to try to stop Trump and his administration from deploying the National Guard to Portland. And it sounds as though there may be a development perhaps as soon as tomorrow. What can you tell us?
- [21:32]
B
Yeah, interesting.
- [21:33]
C
Catch people up who aren't maybe following the Portland politics and the realities of the National Guard coming into our cities. We filed a lawsuit in federal district court on Sunday. We immediately, right after that, file for a temporary restraining order for those who don't know what that is. That effectively would pause the president's actions and the first hearing for that. And we'll start tomorrow at 10:00am in Portland, Oregon. Effectively, that's where we will argue in front of a judge with real facts to show that the president doesn't have any of those circumstances that he needs to under statute to federalize the National Guard in our American cities. And this is something that we're, you know, we're starting to see this becoming a thing that the president is wanting to do is normalize the use of the US Military in our cities.
- [22:26]
A
And what is the situation in Portland? Because he's making it sound like it's a hellscape there. And I was just looking at some statistics and the city of Portland put this out in August. This is before, you know, Donald Trump just made this decision to deploy the National Guard there. And it says that Portland recorded the steepest drop in violent crime among all 68 participating U.S. agencies during the first half of 2025. A violent crime in Portland fell by 17%. I mean, you know, there's homicides fell by 35 incidents to 17 incidents, a reduction of 51%. I don't know what your numbers show us, but it sounds as though, and this happened in D.C. you know, they deployed the National Guard in D.C. despite violent crime trending in the right direction here. What, what can you tell us about the facts and the numbers that you see?
- [23:14]
C
Yeah, and we got to take it back to what we all commonly know about our President. Right. And I don't care if you're a Republican or a Democrat. We all know that he's a little loose with his facts. And in a here. And that's polite. Right. But the situation here in Oregon is, I mean, there was one point in time where he was basing his facts on Portland on a video that happened in 2020. This is a guy who's talking about, you know, war torn Portland. And I've joked with, you know, my friends, hey, maybe I should wear a helmet, you know, as I do my interviews, to kind of play up the president's narrative. It's just. It's silly. It's not reality. And that's the best thing about getting in front of a judge, right, is you're able to talk about real facts and all that exaggeration, all that rhetoric really gets grounded in a court of law. And we're able to talk about there's three things you got to have if you want to federalize your National Guard. And it's common sense. It's like, it's why we don't see the military in our cities, because we don't want them there. It's not what their purpose is. You want your police, your sheriff's department, your state police doing these jobs, and the reason you don't see it is you got to have a rebellion. If the President wants to federalize National Guard, you got to have an invasion. Those things kind of make sense, right? And then that third thing is the president, if he can't effectuate or the laws of the United States, then, yeah, you can do that. And none of those conditions exist in Oregon, and that's why we filed the lawsuit. And we'll be talking a lot about those facts tomorrow morning in court.
- [24:44]
A
And I guess what has been your experience, have you reached out to other states or other attorneys general, sort of on the phone talking through some of this stuff? I've talked to Mayor Bass in Los Angeles, and it seems to me that, you know, one of the lessons learned after Donald Trump has done this, putting the Marines in LA, National Guard in D.C. is that you sort of have to do some communication with the local residents and say to them, hey, it may infuriate you that the National Guard is in your community, and maybe Trump will get away with it temporarily and be able to put them in Portland and so on. But it's sort of incumbent upon residents to not overreact and not do anything that will allow Trump to say, aha, see, there you go. And now we're going to go even further. Have you been having some conversations along those lines? Maybe other state, local officials to sort of prevent that, head that off at the pass?
- [25:38]
C
Absolutely. And all of our elected officials, leaders in roles here in Oregon, say the same thing. The folks that are being federalized in the National Guard are Oregonians. They are Oregon citizens, and they take a dual oath. They take an oath to our governor and our state, and they take an oath to the president in the Constitution, the United States Constitution. So as they come into these roles, something we just got to be really aware of and allow us to do the work of showing what the reality on the ground is. I mean, the fascinating and fun thing, if there is anything fun about this moment in time in our history, is that you have this social media trend going on with everyday Oregonians who are posting these videos across, you know, Portland showing, hey, this is what the real Portland looks like. I think I even saw a news article that says that there's going to be a, like there's some naked bike ride or they do some silly event. They do it annually in Portland and they're like, hey, let's do another one right now to talk about how, how silly it is to call in the US Military under these circumstances. But to be serious and think about who we are as Americans to pivot pretty heavily, we don't allow the US Military in our cities. And that, that is something that's ingrained with it. You might see that in a third world country. You don't see that here in America. And this president is normalizing this tactic From California to D.C. talking about Illinois, Oregon, Memphis, and you heard his speech earlier this week to the entire military where he's talking about we can start using our American cities as training grounds. If that doesn't cause alarm bells for folks in this country, I don't know what will. And that's why this case is incredibly important. Because if the President can say anything they want about the facts on the ground in any city and then federalize the National Guard, that is an incredibly slippery slope for our country.
- [27:36]
A
Yeah, I was going to ask you about his remarks the other day at Quantico to the nation's generals, for Pete's sake. And he's saying not just that he wants to use American cities as training grounds, he's talking about going after what he describes as the enemy from within. And I mean, you know, Portland, Oregon is about as far away from the enemy from within as you can imagine. It seems to me, I've been there, just a city full of wonderful, friendly people and very laid back there in Portland. But when you hear the President use that kind of language, what goes through your mind when he's talking about going after the enemy from within?
- [28:13]
C
You know, I've thought a lot about it because it, it seems like he's not all rationally there sometimes when he's talking about these things. We are all Americans, whether you're a Republican or a Democrat and politicians rhetoric can get out of control. And the way we speak as elected officials, that gets reflected in our community and that can further divide us. And so I've really struggling with the way the president is talking about Americans, you know, these enemies within, because that is not who we are as Americans. That's not the way you want your leader of any country. And I really don't care what your political background is. We should be bringing people together, talking about our common values. And here's a simple one. The simple one in this case is we care about public safety as Americans. And it doesn't matter what your party is. And if you want to work towards a common goal, you don't unilaterally do something to someone. You pick up the phone and you have a conversation. You ask what's going on in your community and how can I help? Not that I know what's good for you. I'm not willing to listen to you. I'm going to do things to you. It's a very different style of leadership that this president has been unwilling to engage in.
- [29:27]
A
Yeah. And, you know, one of the questions I have is, you know, it seems to me the courts have had sort of a, a spotty track record. It's, it hasn't been all wins and no losses in terms of reigning in Trump. The lower courts have had some success in reigning, and Trump, it seems to me, but when it gets up to the level of the Supreme Court, I mean, you know, this probably from observing this from where you are in, in Oregon, it seems to me that the, the Supreme Court, which is pretty tilted heavily in a MAGA direction, they're using the emergency docket, the shadow docket, to just sort of clear out these cases and, and give Trump a blank check. Are you worried that that could happen here? It seems to me that he's, he's trying to move these cases to the Supreme Court to see if he and his people can expand executive powers. And it seems to me one of those areas where he wants to expand those powers and is, you know, putting in the National Guard, militarizing American cities. Yeah.
- [30:25]
C
And what you see right now, like, in the way that I interpret it, and I always try and think about the positive, what America can be down the road. But as I'm looking at the Supreme Court right now, I see them making a lot of decisions when it comes to, you know, procedural things. So far, we haven't necessarily got to the merits. The tariffs case, which our state, Oregon is leading along with Arizona, is going to be in the Supreme Court in a month. That's going to Be really interesting to see how they deal with that on the merits decision. But right now, you see the Supreme Court grappling with what is the role of the courts in the present disputes that are working their way through the court system, which I think is a reasonable conversation to have. I may disagree with the outcomes of some of those decisions, but I think it's a reasonable conversation that you would have as a society. The merits conversations on birthright citizenship tariffs, as those wind through, I think that's going to be a real glimpse about where is the Supreme Court on some of these fundamental issues. The thing that gives me hope is you've had a president who's been attacking the independent judiciary and anybody who studies, you know, democracies and other democracies that study, you know, America. One of the things that's so important about having in your democracy is that independent judiciary that check in the balance co equal branches of government. And when you've seen the president attack the Supreme Court, you've even had conservative justices who have stood up to the president say, no, this is an important function of a democracy. It is that line in the sand. And so I really do have some hope and optimism, and I've always believed this. When you put that robe on, you have to divorce yourself of your political leanings. Now, we're biased. We're human beings. We're going to have those. You can't get rid of it. But I really hope that those justices, as these incredibly important issues on the merits get to them, are able to really do that. And again, some of us are able to do it better than others. Right?
- [32:18]
A
Yeah.
- [32:18]
B
Yeah.
- [32:18]
A
No question about. And Mr. Attorney General, as we were speaking, my crack executive producer Matt was showing some of the footage you were referring to earlier about the naked Portland bike ride. We can show that again to our viewers. And the hellscape, the war zone hellscape, it's like Apocalypse Now. It's like Platoon on the streets of Portland. They're on bikes, they're. They're drinking their Pinot Noir, they're engaging in naked bike rides, they're having music festivals outside. There's a lady walking her dog. It really, I mean, I, I would be afraid I, I would be ducking and covering right now if I were. It seems to me, I don't know how, I don't know how you made it to this interview, honestly.
- [32:58]
C
You know, Jim, what's the over under that? My communications team is going to tell me never to mention the naked bike ride in Portland again after we get.
- [33:05]
A
Off this, you know, I put money on it. Yeah. But it sounds like. I mean, it sounds like a hell of an event, and it sounds very Portland. I know. I've been there a few times, and one thing I've, I've done there is, is enjoyed the local beverages there. You've got the great craft beer community there. They're fantastic. And then, of course, the pinot. You got the Willamette Valley. You've got great wine making out there. Doesn't sound too terrible to me.
- [33:30]
C
Well, next time you get out here, I'll show you some of my favorite spots.
- [33:34]
A
Somebody, one of our subscribers saying right now, saying, this is my kind of a Hellscape. And, but, but just, just to button this up, I mean, there is something almost otherworldly Twilight Zone, like just sort of, I don't want to say comical, because it's very serious, what Trump is doing, but it's kind of unbelievable.
- [33:54]
C
This is the thing, like, I've been really trying to rationalize this in my head, right? And it's tough to make any sense of the things that are coming out of our president's mouth right now, which I think is very reasonable to sit there and go, you know, where is he in that mental state to be able to say, hey, that it's okay.
- [34:12]
A
With a full deck? I mean, I guess just.
- [34:14]
C
I think those are reasonable considerations to be had. Because what American would sit there and say that it is okay to put the military to train in our cities, that we have the enemy from within? These are bizarre things coming out of anyone's mouth. I mean, even my most conservative friends would say that having the US Military in our streets is unfathomable in terms of where we are as a society. But you have a president, and this is another thing. He leads through fear. There's different styles of leaders, right? He leads through fear. So much so that members of Congress, other elected officials, do not feel comfortable saying how they truly feel in public because they are afraid of him. That is not true leadership. Leadership is where you build respect among people, which takes time, it takes work, and it takes looking towards our common values. And that's just not going on right now, which I think starts to lead and all these things start to add up. If you wanted to continue to lead by fear, how would you do it? You would definitely want to normalize putting the US Military in our cities. So it's a very important time in our history. And I think we as Americans can't be the frog in boiling water. We have to be vigilant we have to be monitoring everything that's going on right now in our society.
- [35:34]
A
Yeah, no question about it. Well, Attorney General Rayfield, thank you very much for your time. We appreciate it. Saves, save some of that pinot for us out there, if you don't mind.
- [35:43]
C
I will, I will. Take, take care.
- [35:45]
A
And if there's any footage of you on, on one of those bikes this weekend, we'll be looking out for it.
- [35:50]
C
But, you know, I think my wife would prefer that I don't get on one of those bikes.
- [35:55]
A
All right, take care. Sounds hazardous. Just if you think that through.
- [35:58]
C
All right.
- [35:59]
A
Take care, sir. Thanks a lot. Good to see you. That's the attorney General of the state of Oregon. The lovely state of Oregon. I, I, I'm, I'm not making this up. I've been out to Oregon several times over the course of my career, mostly work trips. Absolutely beautiful state. Just stunning. And if you ever get a chance, I'm just going to say I'm not getting asked by the Chamber of Commerce of Portland or the state of Oregon or anything like that. Absolutely beautiful state. Highly recommend it, especially the Pinot in the Willamette Valley. But anyway, I digress. Something very interesting. I like it when state officials come on, I'm just going to say this right now. They cut through the bullshit sometimes, don't they? When he said he's not sure whether Donald Trump is playing with a full deck. Isn't that what we're all thinking? Isn't that, isn't that kind of what is on all of our minds right now, Republican or Democrat? Is, is, is Donald Trump playing with a full deck? I don't know. His elevator does not seem to hit all floors. He seems to, let me think of all the other gym isms. He seems a couple of sandwiches short of a picnic. He doesn't have both oars in the water. He's spinning in circles. And, and, and it is a little, it is a little nutty what's happening right now. And, and where is he? He's not out in front of the press during his government shutdown, during the MAGA government shutdown. But it seems to me the lawmakers up on Capitol Hill are aware of this. And a lot of this stems from what he was saying the other day at Quantico when he was talking about using our cities as training grounds of the military and the enemy from within and so on. I don't know if you saw this piece of video, but Pennsylvania Democratic Congresswoman Madeline Dean, she confronted the House Speaker Mike Johnson about this, about how unhinged Donald Trump has been. And let's play a little bit of that video and we'll talk about on the other side.
- [37:49]
D
Let's watch this President is unhinged. He is unwell.
- [37:54]
A
What are you doing on your side?
- [37:55]
B
Are too.
- [37:56]
C
I don't control how much.
- [37:57]
D
God, please. That performance in front of the generals that I didn't see is so dangerous. You know, I serve on foreign affairs and appropriations. It's the collision of those two things. Our allies are looking elsewhere. Our enemies are laughing.
- [38:11]
A
I just left.
- [38:11]
D
You have a president who, you have a president who is unwell.
- [38:16]
A
You have a president that is unwell. That is a Pennsylvania Democratic Congresswoman, Madeline Dean. And I didn't see the speaker of the House, Mike Johnson, putting up much of a fuss there. He wasn't saying, hold on a second, Congresswoman, how can you say such a thing? Donald Trump is totally, well, he's totally playing with a full deck. He is not a couple of sandwiches short of a picnic. He didn't say any of those things. He was saying, well, there are some people in your party and so on. And, and good for Madeline Dean to call out Mike Johnson on this because I think that's, that's kind of where we're at right now, folks. Donald Trump, there's something going on with them. There's something happening. We, I can't put my finger on it. I can't get inside of his head. I, I've lived rent free in his head from time to time. He was, I don't know if you guys saw this. He put it on Truth Social over the weekend. He was, somehow, he was posting about me the other day. I don't know if you guys saw this. He was posting it about the, the press conference back in 2018 that resulted in my press pass getting taken away. He's still obsessing over that, by the way. I just want to point that out, why he would post about me over the weekend on Truth Social when I don't. Is he aware that I don't work at the White House anymore? I don't have a White House, a current White House press pass anymore. But, but there's something, there's something wrong. And that video, it's just, I think one of the more remarkable pieces of video that I've seen in some time between Madeline Dean and Mike Johnson where she is saying he's not. Well, he's unhinged. And Mike Johnson doesn't seem to say, oh, what are you talking about? That one Viewer comma, right there said it perfectly. As we say in the south. He ain't right. He, he, he definitely ain't right. And, but he's a whole lot of wrong. There's no question about it. And I think, you know, we're at day two of the MAGA shutdown. We're at day two and he's on Truth Social saying, and we could, so we could show this again to our viewers. He was on Truth Social saying that he's going to get together with his director of Office of Management and Budget, Russell Vote. And he says he of Project 2025 fame. Does Donald Trump not remember that during the campaign he was distancing himself from Project 2025? He was saying, I have nothing to do with Project 2025. What Project 2025? What project? What 2025? He's saying, I have a meeting today with Russ Vogt, he of Project 2025 fame. So there you go right there. When Donald Trump talks about fame, he means it in a good way because that's all that really matters to Donald Trump. And he is celebrating. He is celebrating the fact that Russ Vogt, who is now going through the budget, I guess, and trying to figure out which agencies to get rid of and which federal employees to get rid of unconstitutionally, he's now celebrating Russ Vote for being part of Project 2025 after he said during the campaign he had nothing to do with it. He's not in command of his own narrative. He's not in command of what he said five minutes ago, let alone five months ago. And it's, it is, it is because he is not well. It is because he is unhinged. And the speaker of the House seems to know it. If you see in that video, he seems to understand that. Houston, we have a problem. Washington, we have a problem. We have a president of the United States who is unhinged and unwell and the government has been taken hostage. America is being held hostage by somebody who is unhinged and apparently unwell and unwilling to go out in front of the cameras. Have you guys noticed this? He sends out J.D. vance, he sends out Caroline Levitt. Where's Donald Trump? Why aren't you out in front of the cameras defending your shutdown? If it's all the Democrats fault, as you say, where are you? And when you are out there, why don't you make any sense? As that viewer just said a few moments ago, he ain't right. He ain't right. My thanks to Senator Chris Murphy of Connecticut. My thanks to Dan Rayfield, the attorney general of Oregon. Keep, keep your eye on him. Very interesting figure out there on the West Coast. And they've got something on their hands right now with the deployment of the National Guard coming to their state. Yet another state, yet another city where Donald Trump is militarizing Democratic places. And I assume that there's more of that to come. But in the meantime, thanks everybody for watching. Still reporting from Washington, I'm Jim Acosta. Have a good evening. I'll see you next time.
- [43:41]
B
Sa.