Episode 940 | "Good Kids"

Summary

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The Joe Budden Podcast – Episode 940 | “Good Kids”

Release Date: June 24, 2026
Host: Joe Budden
Co-hosts: Ish, Parks, Dr. Mark Lamont Hill, with mentions of Ice (“Freeze”), Ramona (“Mona”), and others

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Overview

This episode delivers the classic JBP blend: lively stories, cultural debates, clowning among friends, and sharp commentary on everything from viral moments to hip-hop legacies. A major focus is on “good kids” and how life events and environment shape choices—sparked by the week’s headline-grabbing criminal sentencing. There’s also a spirited eulogy for Clive Davis, sharp takes on parenting, celebrity spending, and high-profile current events. Throughout, the pod captures the hilarious, honest camaraderie that fans expect.

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Key Discussion Points

Father’s Day and Team Bonding [00:27–05:25]

• Vibes: The group recaps their Father's Day activities and a team field trip to a strip club, mocking and complimenting each other’s presence and spending at the club.
• Bonding: Joe suggests “team bonding trips” should happen more often; the sense of crew camaraderie is high.

"We need to do these team bonding trips more often."
— Joe Budden [05:19]

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Apology & Accountability [05:25–07:39]

• Joe apologizes to Ish for overstepping in a previous episode, admitting to “rat shit” and vowing to do better.
• Light banter about old bets—including a 2024 wager about Taylor Swift—keeps the mood playful.

“That was corny shit. That was some corny n**** shit. So I apologize.”
— Joe Budden [05:59]

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Mona’s Viral Altercation [18:14–27:11]

• Context: Mona (a co-host, not present this episode) went viral after a caught-on-camera argument in a Delaware store.
• Recap: The team discusses the incident in detail, focusing on Mona’s attempt to de-escalate the situation and her awareness of her public status.
• Reflection on Safety & Fame: The hosts debate whether, as public figures, it’s smart to frequent familiar but “dangerous” places out of comfort or loyalty to their roots.

“I’m trying to be cognizant of my social standing now ... I was trying to apologize to the lady.”
— Mona via Ish [21:05]

• Broader Conversation: Why do some successful people keep returning to high-risk environments? The pull of community, the ego, and not wanting to "feel too good" for your old neighborhood.
• Consensus: As your status rises, being in the wrong place can be tragic, regardless of intent or comfort.

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Remembering Clive Davis [34:22–55:04]

• Eulogy: Dr. Mark Lamont Hill leads an in-depth look at Clive Davis' career, his cross-genre talent-spotting (Aretha Franklin, Whitney Houston, Alicia Keys, Bruce Springsteen, etc.), and his openness about bisexuality.
• Legacy Debate: A spirited discussion on whether Clive Davis or Berry Gordy (Motown) was the greater music executive:
  • Berry Gordy: Michael Jackson, Stevie Wonder, Marvin Gaye, Diana Ross.
  • Clive Davis: Depth—Springsteen, Houston, Joplin, Manilow, Santana.
  • Ultimately, the Motown lineup holds more “undeniable hall-of-famers,” but Clive’s breadth and multi-decade relevance is praised.

“If you take Whitney Houston’s best five songs ... she can’t look at Marvin Gaye.”
— Joe Budden [49:24]

• Lighthearted Moments: The group riffs on Bruce Springsteen’s discography and even holds a mini Bon Jovi vs. Springsteen debate.

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Earth, Wind & Fire Documentary & Music Nerdery [57:12–61:14]

• Praise for the new HBO Earth, Wind & Fire documentary, with shoutouts to Questlove’s directorial growth and an all-star list of talking heads (Obamas, Stevie Wonder).
• Behind the Music: Appreciation for band dynamics, financial splits, and the TLC required for deep musical storytelling.

“As music nerds, you should absolutely watch it.”
— Parks [57:40]

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“Feederism” & Big Girl Head Banter [61:24–67:04]

• A NSFW, hilarious segue into Joe’s “Fat Girl Cult Doc” viewing on HBO, which leads to a wild sidebar on the sexual prowess of plus-size women (“big girl head is the best brand”) and feederism as a kink.

“Big girl head is categorically ... the best brand of head you could get.”
— Joe Budden [64:00]

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Group vs Solo Identity in Podcasting [17:00–18:09]

• Quick, comedic exchange on whether having their partners in the room “changes” how they podcast—revealing playful truths about public vs. private personas.

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Parenting Styles & Public Discipline [92:46–106:31]

• Controversy: Brandon Marshall posts a video of his son running at 2am as punishment. Is this abusive, constructive, or just a bad look to make public?
  • Mark: Disapproves of the public shaming aspect.
  • Ish: Argues today’s kids are most affected by what goes viral within their world.
  • Joe: Shares his own approach—no beatings, but sometimes public lessons are powerful.
• Broader Points: How do you discipline in a “permanent” internet age? Where do you draw the line between correction and humiliation?

"There's a lesson in humiliation, though."
— Joe Budden [106:02]

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“Good Kids”—Crime, Change, and Accountability [143:54–153:28]

• Catalyst: News of life sentences for the young men convicted in the killing of rapper Foolio leads to the episode’s titular debate.
  • Ish: “They seemed like decent kids ... until the murder.”
  • Joe: Argues that committing murder removes the “good kid” label: “Once those things start to happen, I ain't a good kid.”
  • Nuance: They debate whether trauma or environment can “turn” someone, or if some people are just “not good” from the start.
  • Mark: Introduces the idea that some are born with different capacities for empathy or violence, and the same trauma can affect people differently.

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Killing, Guilt, and Human Nature [153:28–156:12]

• Can you still be good if you kill? Consensus: it’s context-dependent (self-defense, war, etc.), but premeditated violence changes the game.

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Floyd Mayweather’s Financial Woes [157:07–163:34]

• News: Floyd faces felony charges and lawsuits for bounced checks and unpaid debts.
• Sympathy Question: Does his flamboyant lifestyle make it harder to feel bad for him?
  • Mark: Admits less sympathy for someone who flaunts excessive wealth then goes broke.
  • Ish: Counters, says living richly isn’t the same as being mean—or deserving misfortune.
  • Joe: Separates flaunting from committing harm; still, he meets Floyd with empathy, recalling Floyd’s generosity.

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Polyamory Logistics (Neo & Three Girlfriends) [113:00–119:00]

• Sidebar: The crew reviews a viral clip of singer Ne-Yo’s girlfriend, who explains their relationship schedule.
• General Consensus: “Three girlfriends” is more admin headache than sexual fantasy in practice.

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Jay Z’s Hair, Capitalism & Respectability [131:34–137:06]

• Jay Z & Daughter: Jay’s transition from locs to afro highlighted as an act of solidarity with Blue Ivy.
• Response to Rumors: They enjoy the debunking of social media conspiracy theories (e.g., “Jay’s locks are fake”).
• Debate: Is the inevitable product placement (for Beyoncé’s hair care line) cynical or smart? Where’s the line between genuine gesture and calculated commerce?

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Other Notables

• True Crime: Discussion around the Savannah Guthrie kidnapping case and media’s effect on public perception [127:00+].
• Random Humor: Multiple rounds of “ass checks”—laughing at who jumps on group bandwagons, and their signature podcast “inside jokes.”
• Father’s Day Gifts Recap: Cards, mugs, cologne, and a smart “Aura Ring.” [171:01+]

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Notable Quotes

• “Team bonding trips—we need to do these more often!” — Joe Budden [05:19]
• “When your safety is on the line… familiarity don’t mean you’re in control.” — Joe Budden [25:04]
• “If you take Whitney Houston’s best five songs… she can’t look at Marvin Gaye.” — Joe Budden [49:24]
• “There’s a lesson in humiliation, though.” — Joe Budden [106:02]
• “Once those things start to happen, I ain't a good kid...I'm in the streets as a menace.” — Joe Budden [147:20]

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Segment Timestamps

• Father’s Day & Team Night Out – [00:27–05:25]
• Apology, Friendship, & Bets – [05:25–07:39]
• Intros, Crew Banter – [07:39–17:00]
• Podcasting with Your Partner Present – [17:00–18:09]
• Mona’s Viral Moment & Safety/Fame – [18:14–27:11]
• Clive Davis Eulogy & Legacy – [34:22–55:04]
• Earth, Wind & Fire Doc Chat – [57:12–61:14]
• Feederism, Big Girl Head Sidebar – [61:24–67:04]
• Parenting, Public Discipline Debate – [92:46–106:31]
• “Good Kid” Discussion – [143:54–153:28]
• Sympathy for Celebrity Hardship (Floyd) – [157:07–163:34]
• Polyamory/Multiple Girlfriends – [113:00–119:00]
• Jay Z, Hair, & Capitalism – [131:34–137:06]
• Final Reflections, Gifts & Wrap-up – [171:01–174:50]

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Tone & Takeaway

The tone is brash, evolved, and irreverently heartfelt—a true JBP blend. This episode hits deep on the consequences of choices, the blurry lines of “goodness,” and how fame and money magnify every mistake. The group’s vulnerability—apologies, arguments, reflection—makes this more than entertainment. It’s a snapshot of friendship, culture, and the ways old codes clash with new realities.

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For more: Listen to the full episode for the signature chemistry and the unfiltered laughs that only JBP delivers.

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Transcript

[Joe Budden]

The thoughts, views, and opinions expressed by this podcast, whose bullets its hosts offer entertainment purposes only. I repeat, it is not serious. It is not real. No one is exposing, revealing, indicting, or telling you anything about themselves. Also, we do not encourage you to try this at home. We are trained professionals who do not have your best interests at heart or our own. Enjoy the show.

[Ish]

Down right now.

[Joe Budden]

No, I'm just, like, mellow. Great mood. I'm just chilling. I press the button.

[Parks]

I press the button.

[Ish]

Oh, yeah.

[Joe Budden]

Oh, yo. Ten years. It's always a surprise. Ten years. Oh, they doing the podcast. We are. They can hear us. Oh, man. All right, all right. What's up, y'?

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

All?

[Parks]

What's up, man?

[Ish]

What's good?

[Parks]

Everybody feeling good after a nice long weekend? Father's Day. Father's Day.

[Ish]

Yes.

[Joe Budden]

Oh, yeah. It was Father's Day. Shout out to all the fathers out there. I had a good Father's Day.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

I saw your picture.

[Joe Budden]

I had a good Father's Day.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

You had the crew out. You had the whole crew.

[Parks]

Generations.

[Joe Budden]

Tradition. I'm sorry. Tradition. Yeah, we went over. We had brunch at Blue Blue on the Hudson. Shout out to everybody over there. Different from our Harlem spot. We be going to that. We didn't go to a little more expensive do. It's a little more expensive than just everybody getting grits and bacon and eggs. So that'll be the last time we do that.

[Parks]

It's Father's Day, man.

[Joe Budden]

Yeah, but we had a good time. Then my son called me out and Trey called me late. He's like, yo, if you making a move, hit me up, man. I was like, you know what? Bring your little punk ass out so I could talk to you. And we went out for a little bit.

[Parks]

Oh, yeah? Did you go to the spot?

[Joe Budden]

Yeah, yeah.

[Parks]

Had a good time at the spot, man.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Hey, that was a good time.

[Joe Budden]

I forgot.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

We went out.

[Parks]

We had a little pod, pod trip.

[Joe Budden]

Now. We had a pod trip, field trip. A few people didn't show up. Word, word, word.

[Ish]

I was a little tired.

[Joe Budden]

Yeah, I know you was tired. Ish was tired. Imani pumped fake.

[Parks]

Yeah. What's up with that?

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Amani ain't go.

[Ish]

That was shocked me. Cause he's always down for the shit.

[Joe Budden]

Well, he said his kids is coming up for the summer, so that was his very last night of freedom. So it wasn't so shocking to me.

[Parks]

Oh, he had to get some shots up before.

[Ish]

Had to get a couple reps up.

[Joe Budden]

That's funny. So it wasn't too shocking to me.

[Parks]

N It was fun, though. We had a good time.

[Ish]

We had a good time.

[Joe Budden]

I'm glad y' all came.

[Parks]

Hey, I like that spot.

[Joe Budden]

I laughed all night. I laughed everything all right. This is what I learned, though. This is what I learned. Ice look like a mob boss when you see him outside.

[Parks]

That's a fact. That's a fact.

[Joe Budden]

What?

[Parks]

Yeah, you did. Shades, chain. You know what I mean? VIP section.

[Joe Budden]

Ice, if he never talked to nobody,

[Parks]

and I don't know if he did.

[Joe Budden]

No, I'm saying this is my point.

[Parks]

Yeah.

[Joe Budden]

If he never said a word and you just seen him outside, he looked like a killer.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Oh, yeah.

[Joe Budden]

He looks like a mob boss.

[Parks]

Yeah.

[Joe Budden]

He knows the owners got his shades on, know the promoters. Couple people coming in saying what up to him, like he's somebody. You know what I mean? And this lady with him looking like something, she know a couple people. So the girls come over, making all the friends.

[Parks]

Yeah, yeah.

[Joe Budden]

So she come over being a girl's girl, and I'm looking at Ice and I'm like, yo, when he don't talk, this nigga. And I said, holy shit.

[Ish]

It's the old school trick. And it worked again.

[Joe Budden]

Ice looks amazing under the strip club lights.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Fuck.

[Ish]

I said, oh, shit.

[Joe Budden]

It's the old, oldest trick in the book that they got me with. This is in the strip club light. Y' all know that's the old. Do you know the trick?

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Yes.

[Joe Budden]

In the strip club lights, I look like the illest nigga in the world. Yo. That's my man.

[Parks]

You did.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

You did.

[Joe Budden]

Only under the strip club lights, though. You see?

[Ish]

You hear this?

[Parks]

Maybe. Especially under the strip club lights.

[Joe Budden]

There you go.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

That's nice.

[Joe Budden]

Yeah, especially, Especially. Especially. Nah, use that nigga in there. I ain't going to lie. We had a good time. We did. My man.

[Parks]

You know what I mean?

[Ish]

You mean how much money?

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

N. I was texting them the who.

[Parks]

I met a girl. She said I'm just her type, so I had to give her a couple dollars.

[Joe Budden]

She said I'm just her type. That is hilarious, yo.

[Parks]

Yeah.

[Joe Budden]

No.

[Ish]

How much money?

[Joe Budden]

She's the freak of the spot, too. How much money you throw?

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Who?

[Joe Budden]

Who's counting?

[Parks]

Who's counting a couple dollars I saw you throw.

[Joe Budden]

It wasn't craziness. I'm on a budget.

[Parks]

It didn't look crazy. It was more than I threw, but.

[Joe Budden]

It was more than we threw, but

[Parks]

I threw a couple dollars, too.

[Ish]

Now, yours was same.

[Parks]

Yeah.

[Joe Budden]

Parks threw a couple dollars. Ice zelled somebody, too. Yeah, Ice threw a little something. He's held Frank a little something.

[Ish]

I ain't throwing nothing.

[Joe Budden]

She throw boss shit. Boss shit on some mom shit. I don't throw it here, ma. Here missing piece. You throw it on that bitch.

[Ish]

You had to tell to get a fam. Fam, fam. We had a good night. We had a good night. We had a good night.

[Joe Budden]

We had a good time, man.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

It was my birthday.

[Joe Budden]

We need to do these team bonding trips we do more often. I think we do.

[Ish]

That's dope.

[Joe Budden]

What else? What else? What else? Before we start, I. Oh, ish. An apology. I owe you an apology.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

I slept on it.

[Ish]

I don't even know what you saw.

[Joe Budden]

I slept on it.

[Ish]

On what?

[Joe Budden]

The other day, the other pod, when I jumped in minding you and Mark's business, talking about the backflip and you owing him money. And you curse me out. You was right about that. That wasn't my business. That was on some rat shit. And the reality is I was being self centered. Cause I wanted to see you do the backflip. But I shouldn't have said nothing about whatever you owe Mark and Mark getting it. That was corny shit. That was some corny nigga shit. So I apologize.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Just the dry snitch.

[Parks]

I also wanted to see the backflip.

[Ish]

I didn't.

[Joe Budden]

It just didn't concern me. It wasn't my business to jump in. And I do that a lot sometimes. So sometimes and it's wrong. So I want to apologize.

[Ish]

You accept his apology. Yo, move along, my nigga.

[Parks]

Okay.

[Joe Budden]

Oh, no. That's just the beginning. How long you known me, man? Ish. Come on. He know me supposed to stop like that now. Lucky for me. Oh, I did find a bet that we made that did concern me. It's from a pod we did. February 2024. Snake got the date where we bet that in two years. I said, what's her name? Taylor Swift would not be letting anybody get her pregnant. The rest of the room thought that she was really on Travis Kelce so they could see her popping the baby out in two years. And we shook on it. And it's taped. Now, I ain't pressing you about the money. Cause you my man. I love you regardless.

[Parks]

How much was the ticket?

[Joe Budden]

Found it.

[Ish]

Oh, I have no idea what you're talking about.

[Joe Budden]

All right, well, I gotta go to the fouls. All right, man, I gotta go to the fouls. As of now, it's just hearsay. Got you laid out. I'll dig in there, see if I can find it for you. Hey, I don't want it, nigga. Come on. A little swat on it. Yeah, come on.

[Ish]

I'll do it that way.

[Joe Budden]

Yeah, come on.

[Parks]

Take it right over the spot, man.

[Joe Budden]

Hey, Ashley, I might need it now. Hey, all right, come on, let's have. Let's have a good time, man. Let's have a good time.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Let's have a good time.

[Joe Budden]

Let's have a good time. Rainy day vibe.

[Ish]

Yeah.

[Joe Budden]

Let's go. Here we go. Here we go. Hey, who been fucking with my soundboard? Why? I got the chipmunk drop. Mic shake, mic shake, 1212, mike shake. 1212. What's good out there? Always for the ladies. Always for the ladies. Shout out to wherever you might be listening from big Jersey, big New York City, Connecticut, Boston, what's popp there? All the entrepreneurs out there. Shout to the nine to fivers. Everybody on vacation.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Everybody home with the family. No one, no one, no one knows I cry. I want it.

[Joe Budden]

Hey, baby, how you doing? Really been a long time. I never thought would come to pass. Came in with, like, dancing through and shout out to the whole west coast out there. Everybody in the Midwest. You got to say you love me, too.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Well, I'm gonna let you go that easy.

[Joe Budden]

I'm gonna give it up.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Oops,

[Joe Budden]

wrong button.

[Parks]

Listen,

[Joe Budden]

let's keep this applause going right quick. Mic check, mic check. Mic, mic, mic, mic.

[Ish]

Who is that?

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

It's marked on my hill, pussy. I'm from the Weber nitty era. It's the network.

[Joe Budden]

There we go. Flip is on the way. Ramona is here with us in spirit. What episode is this?

[Parks]

940.

[Joe Budden]

Welcome to episode. Damn, these 9 hundreds is moving, ain't they? Welcome to episode 940 of the Joe Button Podcast. I'm your humble, gracious, grateful, extremely happy to be here, host Joe Button. This episode is brought to you by Fueled by Powered By Prize. Fix Practice Gang. You all right? I'm here with a really amazing crew. To my right, flip is on the way. Like I said, our good Brother Philly's finest, Dr. Mark Lamont Hill, is in the building. Mark, how you doing, man?

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

I'm good, man. Well rested.

[Joe Budden]

How could you be?

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

I got a lot of stuff.

[Joe Budden]

I heard about your schedule yesterday.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Oh, yesterday? What was yesterday? Oh, yesterday kicked my ass. Yeah. You're working for the Joe Budden Plantation, Man, I did about.

[Joe Budden]

Hey, hey, hey.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Yo, yo. I was there at 5am I ain't get home about 1am that was a

[Joe Budden]

to the top production, by the way.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

No, it was great. It was absolutely great. We Had a good time. No, I'm good, though. I was sick on Friday when I was here, but I got to rest.

[Ish]

You good now?

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

I got a little bit of rest. Yeah, I'm 100% now. I stayed out the rain. I flew to Chicago on Sunday, which was great. The St Sabina Church had a good time. They shouted y' all out. By the way, they actually prayed for the Joe Button podcast when I got there.

[Joe Budden]

We appreciate that. Thank you. We need every second of it. Yo, please.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

It was dope. I didn't get to do Father's Day, but I decided instead of getting a shitty Father's Day, I called for a postponement. So my Father's Day will be next week.

[Joe Budden]

Cause you weren't here for four.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Yeah, I was gonna get back from Chicago at, like, 7pm they was gonna give me a necktie and, like.

[Ish]

Oh, yeah.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

And a slice of pizza. Yeah, and a slice of pizza. Like, nah, I want my whole shit next Sunday, so.

[Ish]

That was smart.

[Parks]

Yeah.

[Joe Budden]

I hate to be the bearer of bad news. What do you think the whole shit is on Father's Day?

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Brunch and a necktie. A steak.

[Joe Budden]

Okay. Yeah. T shirts, V necks. Damn, I needed some new V necks.

[Parks]

Yeah.

[Joe Budden]

All right. All right, cool. Our good brother ish is here. Mr. Thousand Doors and Up, how you feeling, man?

[Ish]

What up, though?

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

I'm good.

[Joe Budden]

Good, good, good. You sound enthused. Next to him. Come on, stop playing with him. Mr. Kingpin himself. Mr. Take it further. Big freeze in the building.

[Parks]

Mr. Kingpin, how was your birthday, man?

[Joe Budden]

I knew Freeze was that he tapped me at one point in the spot. He was like, yo, man, it's a cool spot. Ain't nothing for me and mine in here. This is for y'.

[Parks]

All.

[Joe Budden]

It's like, all right, nigga.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

I was like, all right, nigga.

[Ish]

Nah, we just, you know. You know, you. You BBL Bandit. We don't. We don't rock.

[Joe Budden]

I'm certainly not the bbl. There's some other people in here. That would be the bbl. The Bandit way for me. How am I the BBL Bandit that you.

[Ish]

That's the.

[Joe Budden]

The.

[Ish]

That.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

I'm new here. Ice. Can you explain it?

[Joe Budden]

I love him.

[Parks]

Work.

[Joe Budden]

I love him, Joe.

[Ish]

You know what I'm talking about, man.

[Joe Budden]

You like the more I have a weight restriction? Yeah.

[Ish]

All right. I'll put it this way. Remember how.

[Joe Budden]

However the weight. However the weight pop up, it got.

[Ish]

This is why I'm not restriction. I got you. Well, yeah.

[Joe Budden]

Remember when you.

[Ish]

Remember when you went in Magic City when we were down there?

[Joe Budden]

Yes.

[Ish]

And you got out of there quick, right?

[Joe Budden]

Yes.

[Ish]

Why?

[Joe Budden]

Because my weight restriction wasn't in my weight.

[Ish]

Well, my weight restriction is on the other end of that scale.

[Joe Budden]

But all I'm saying is that has nothing to do with bbl. There's plenty of girls with BBL in Magic City.

[Parks]

And some girls with bbl, too.

[Ish]

Now he know what we mean when we say bbl.

[Parks]

I do.

[Ish]

Exactly.

[Joe Budden]

We have an audience of millions.

[Ish]

They know what I mean, too. Trust me.

[Joe Budden]

They all do. They all know. Hey, you are the BBL. Benny. Big big mamas. 170.

[Parks]

Ew.

[Joe Budden]

185, 190. Between 190 and 215. Salute to y' all out there. Anyway, did I do ice? Yes, I did ice. Yes, I did ice. All right. Mr. Elmyra's finest parks is here, man. There you go, man.

[Parks]

I'm chilling.

[Joe Budden]

There you go. She was over there giving him a earful. She was.

[Parks]

She was. Salute to her, man.

[Ish]

You was talking.

[Parks]

I mean, it's strip club whispers. Yeah. I mean, it's loud, so not really a whisper, but touchy. That's a lot.

[Joe Budden]

That's a lot.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Wasn't a. No

[Ish]

little touching, a little whispering. I'm with you.

[Joe Budden]

Big Poe is here. Corey is here. Erickson is here. Tanner and Savon are here by remote. Last but certainly not least, each and every one of you very, very, very, very important people are here. What's poppin? What's poppin'?

[Ish]

Hey, my baby is here, too. I'm not going to do that. My baby's sitting here, too. Why would I not want she. She's everywhere I'm at. She's there.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

I know. If you want the audience to know.

[Ish]

I don't.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

That's what I was doing.

[Joe Budden]

Missing pieces here.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

And you could tell. Cause Ice got a little extra pep in his step today.

[Parks]

Yeah, that's true.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

He a little extra.

[Joe Budden]

The rain didn't bother him at all.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

I was in the kitchen. He's like, where the fuck is my chick fil A? I was like, damn, dog.

[Joe Budden]

Ice got his lady.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Yeah, right.

[Joe Budden]

Got his lady with him. And a Little Wale concert later. Stop playing with Freeze.

[Parks]

Look what you do for your birthday, man. You're Big Book Wale for a show.

[Joe Budden]

You know what I mean?

[Ish]

Strip club Book Wale for a show.

[Joe Budden]

That's hilarious. So come on, beautiful people.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Can I ask you a quick question? Just because I was joking about you. A little joking about you. And you act potting different front of your lady. But do y' all. Like, I know your girl be here. Your lady be here. My lady's been here once, I think. Do y' all pod different when they hear? Like, do y' all feel like y' all act different when they hear?

[Ish]

No, no.

[Joe Budden]

Oh, duh, you gotta.

[Parks]

Well, you weren't around, but I spent the first six years of this podcast doing it in front of my lady, so.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Okay, so it's just like she not there. Yeah, got it. Okay.

[Joe Budden]

Yeah. REM is damn near like a part of this part. Yeah. The producer, like, she's been a fixture in the corner for most of this thing.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Okay.

[Parks]

Yeah.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Cause if my wife come on his pot. Totally different. Just let y' all know that y' all don't recognize me.

[Parks]

Pussy.

[Joe Budden]

Same.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Yes, yes, I'm right with you.

[Joe Budden]

I'm never pardon the same if my girl is around.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

I'm not even gonna pretend.

[Joe Budden]

You think I let my girl know how funny I am when she ain't around? Nigga, I am Eddie Murphy when she ain't around. Bitches.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

This is exactly.

[Parks]

Podcasters.

[Joe Budden]

Yeah, Eddie was.

[Parks]

There you go.

[Joe Budden]

You got any other brilliant questions, Mark?

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

I was just curious.

[Joe Budden]

Well, it dooms me to say that we must start with our co host.

[Parks]

Who's not here.

[Joe Budden]

Who's not here. And normally I would have waited to discuss this till she is here, but she won't be here Friday.

[Parks]

Oh, really?

[Joe Budden]

Okay.

[Parks]

Yeah.

[Joe Budden]

Cause she's got a gig that she called out for fucking months ago.

[Ish]

Got it.

[Joe Budden]

So now. Yeah, you're at the top. You're at the top of the board, Mona. Now we gotta do it, Mona, you're at the top of the board for your virality. You went. I don't know. Y'.

[Parks]

All.

[Joe Budden]

Y' all do it. Cuz, I'm gonna get mad. Go ahead, you do it.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Yeah, it's an issue.

[Ish]

No, you gotta play.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

No, no, it's you.

[Ish]

No, no, no.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

All right. You gonna do Clap Davis?

[Ish]

Yep.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Okay. You promise? It's a bet then you do this one, you leave. No.

[Ish]

Mona went viral earlier in the week for a potential altercation. It wasn't a real altercation. It was more of an argument.

[Joe Budden]

So Mona was in verbal thing?

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Yeah, it was a verbal altercation. Mona was in downtown Delaware. People thought it was Philly. It was not Philly, by the way. It was Delaware. And you can see on the video of her having a conversation with a woman, the woman was a little more animated than Mona at the beginning. And she's kind of walking away. And Mona, you can hear Mona saying, if I did that to you. I apologize. Trying to diffuse the situation. Then the woman kind of walks away like, I don't want. She ain't had time for that. She goes into the store. Mona tries to walk into the store. They close the door behind her and she's like. Basically like, I'm trying to get in the store. She eventually gets into the store, follows a woman into the store. I won't say follows her into the store. Mona says she was going in to purchase something, but she engages the woman further. And the woman is basically, get the fuck away from me. I'm not. This isn't word for word, but this is the gist. And then it clips off. There were people. That's the part that people saw. There's more to the video. It's a very long video, but that's what people saw. Some people were trying to say, like, that Mona was antagonizing women. Other people saying Mona was scared of the woman. Other people were saying, you know, all kinds of things. Personally, I thought, well, I have a few thoughts. But in that moment, Mona, to me, wasn't scared of the woman at all. Not that that should be the point. But to me, she was just trying to be an adult and diffuse the situation and be like, yo, my bad. If something happened and chill the situation out. Personally, I would've just gone another way at some point. But I think it's important to note that that's all.

[Ish]

Somebody sent me the video on, I wanna say, Thursday night. They sent me the video just a

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

couple days before the rest of us got it.

[Ish]

And so I called Mona. I'm like, yo, what the fuck? She's like, dawg, she was like, yo, I really didn't want no trouble. She's like, yo, I'm trying to be cognizant of my social standing now. She's like, yo, the old me, we would have been rumbling. She said, yo, I was trying to apologize to the lady. She like, yo, I really didn't want no trouble. I was telling the lady, basically, if I offended you, let me know what I did. I apologize. And she said, the lady just was. Just wouldn't tone down. And she said, yo, the lady was threatening to mace her and all types of shit. And she's like, yo, I'm just trying to see what I did wrong to you, fam. I don't want no smoke. I don't want no problems. And she was like, yo, she's like, yo, I'm telling you, you would have been really, really proud of me, even the stuff that you didn't see. I tried to diffuse the situation as much as I possibly could versus being the old me that I used to be.

[Joe Budden]

Are you talking about Mona? Yeah. So what you confuse me. Say somebody sent me the thing and

[Ish]

then you talk about. No somebody, a person sent me the video and then caught like somebody DM'd me the video and was like, yo, your girl was just out here about to get it in and sent it to me. So I immediately called her like yo, what the fuck? She was like, yo, it wasn't me. She was like, I promise you I was trying to diffuse the shit. I wasn't on no aggressive shit. The lady was mad aggressive, cursing me out, calling me all types of names and shit. And I was just trying to stand down without any problems. She said, I seen the cameras, I seen all that shit. And I'm just trying to get to another level in my ascension. So I'm a big for that. In speaking to her, did she ever find out what she did to the lady? I think she said something like yo, I put some money on the counter or something. Like I reached around the lady or I was on the side of the lady, I just put some money on the counter. And the lady looked at it as being disrespectful.

[Joe Budden]

Okay.

[Ish]

So she said the lady just went from 0 to 180.

[Joe Budden]

Well the lady said that in the clip, like when she looked like she was charging toward her, she was describing. Cause Mona said what did I do? And the lady said, you came in my store mad aggressive, mad rah rah trying to buy something. And no, it was disrespectful. And no, now get the out the store. So that was in the video and then Mona was saying, no, I can't come to the store. And then they slammed the door on her face. Which to me was the funniest part of the video. That was hilarious. Mona talking to just the door. I'm like, look, Mona still don't know how this, that's something that just plagues my girl. Wherever she at. I be wanting to do that shit. Yo, the crazy when she be talking sometime this lamp, but ain't no door right here.

[Ish]

It was mad phones out there.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

It was the nutty part.

[Ish]

Like it's grown ups and everybody had their phone out just trying to get some tea. That shit was yeah, crazy.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

That's how I hit the Internet.

[Joe Budden]

No, it wasn't crazy. That's what happened every hour, every minute, every day at that store in Delaware that your ass shouldn't have been the fuck out in the first place. So what do we. Why is Mona at the store? I'm gonna say this to her when I see her, so don't think I'm talking about it.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Yesterday. We had a conversation yesterday.

[Joe Budden]

Why are you at the store? Store, yo, look at the store. Look at the store. There ain't a bagel in there. You need to digest. Look around, look at the people around you. Turn left, turn right. And then go and get on the phone and say something about. I thought about my social status, so I ain't swing. No, you didn't. No, you didn't.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

It's hard. I say this. It's hard.

[Ish]

No, it ain't.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

FOMONA is hard.

[Joe Budden]

It's hard. It's hard for people. It is hard. Let me not speak such conviction. But I've had this talk with many people over the course of 25 years as they ascend, and it'd be tough to digest. For some reason, I guess people only know what they know. So if I'm going to get hair glue from this spot that's here on the tough block, and I go there all the time and it don't feel like. Because you so comfortable in it, familiarity, it doesn't feel like there's a problem. I got that problem, too. When niggas is around with guns, I don't bat a eye. It's all right, there's guns around. Cool.

[Ish]

Or that's like somebody saying, yo, how you be at these strip clubs in the Bronx when mad niggas are scared to go there? One, number two, at your level of success and your level of fame, some could argue you have no fucking business being there.

[Joe Budden]

They could argue it. I would have a response.

[Ish]

No, I'm just giving you from the outside looking in. That is the same exact thing as you saying, yo, why the fuck you at this bodega and Delaware?

[Joe Budden]

All right, so now we gonna talk through it. Just because it's an audience.

[Ish]

Gotcha.

[Joe Budden]

The outside looking in should not matter when your safety is on the line, Right? So with all of these strip clubs, I know all of the arms in the building. I could walk in with arms myself in the building. I know the security, I know the gangsters. I know this is. It's a controlled. It's as controlled of an environment as it could be. Not to say nothing will pop up on just a random street. Not so much.

[Parks]

I agree.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

You can't.

[Ish]

That's what I'm saying. But if that's a street that she's very familiar with and know everybody over there. It's kind of the same thing. I know all of the guns around here. I know this person here. I know this person here. I've been coming here forever. It's kind of the same thing.

[Joe Budden]

Joe.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

I don't. I don't.

[Joe Budden]

Or indoor. Outdoor is not kind of.

[Ish]

I'm just talking about the familiarity.

[Parks]

I also think there's a slight difference in that. You could go to a different bodega. You can't go to a different strip club. You know what I'm saying?

[Ish]

We talking about. We in Manhattan. There's seven zillion strip clubs. My point is just. No, I know, but my point is just simply this, yo. Stuff that can happen in a spot that you are not in control of. So. Yo, they might not even be targeting Joe Button. It could be me and Parks beefing. I got the shit on me. Parks got the shit on me. You just a casual bystander. And somebody can ra. I'm not saying me. I know the environment. So it's not me. I'm knowledgeable about everything that's going on. I'm talking about from the viewer's perspective, dog. You not in control of that. And so somebody. If something, God forbid, were to happen to you, the responses would be, he should have not been there in the first place.

[Joe Budden]

I hear that.

[Ish]

You get what I'm saying?

[Joe Budden]

Let's take it off the environment for a second. Mona shouldn't be nowhere with one sock on. What you got to say now, tough ass? Now break it down when you. When you live. Listen what I'm saying.

[Ish]

You just run into the bodega real quick.

[Joe Budden]

I am good, though. I'm done with this topic. I will discuss it when I see Mona.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Here's what they about to say, though.

[Joe Budden]

Y', all, we love her. So y' all just trying to throw

[Ish]

something on right quick.

[Joe Budden]

No, no, but where's the other side? Everybody done lost the side in the crib. No. Oh.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Girl didn't even know who Mona was. That's the other thing. It wasn't like she was doing that. Cause she was mumbling some clout shit. Yeah, yeah. She didn't know who she was. From what I've heard. Like, the girl was actually shocked. Her peoples was mortified that that happened. They just. She was just on that shit. Cause she on that shit. They said, I don't want get sued by other but.

[Joe Budden]

And if she knew anybody on the block, nobody certainly jumped in to try to defuse nothing.

[Ish]

Nah. Because niggas be Fiends for. Oh, shit, I'm gonna get this on camera.

[Joe Budden]

Yeah, I mean, you could have stopped that at Fiends.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

So, Joe, you go to the strip club. Fair point. So you go to the strip club. We all got some shit that we still do that we shouldn't do. What is y' all shit that y' all do that y'. All.

[Ish]

Oh, y' all know I talk about mine. I be in clubs I shouldn't be in. I'm in the hood every day, though.

[Joe Budden]

In the hood. Hood.

[Parks]

Hood.

[Joe Budden]

Yeah.

[Ish]

I shouldn't be in some of these spots. I know that.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

I do, too. Why do y' all still do it? Like, I go, like, Comfort.

[Parks]

They my spots.

[Joe Budden]

Comfort.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Oh, it's just come. Okay.

[Ish]

I mean, I got business there. I got personal shit there. I'm. I'm. You know, I. I. Me, personally, I don't think I've risen to a level where I'm in fear of my safety in these particular environments that surround me like, I'm not there yet. I think if I start to feel uneasiness in my surroundings, then, of course, it's my job to excuse myself from that and dissociate from that. Joe's been famous for 20 something years, you know what I'm saying? So those.

[Parks]

There has to be times where you go, I shouldn't be here right now.

[Ish]

And as I go, for sure, I've been in a couple spots where I'm

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

like, yo, I leave.

[Ish]

Okay, exactly. Then you leave.

[Parks]

Or, like, your friends or your girl or someone will have you somewhere where you're like this. I don't need to be here right now.

[Ish]

Once I get that feeling, I'm out.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Yeah, some of that shit. The ego. Keep you there sometime, though. No, for me, like, I'm not gonna let nobody not let. I'm not gonna let something stop me from being in this place.

[Ish]

I don't need to be here, though.

[Joe Budden]

Yeah.

[Ish]

Ain't nobody staring me down and make me.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

I don't mean like that. I just mean, like, I was full

[Ish]

of energy, radiating, emitting sometimes.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

I was in Philly. I was in Philly a couple times this week handling some stuff, and I was visiting family in the hood. And, like, I walk to the store, I go to the local. Midnight, I'm outside doing shit, and I'm sitting like, I don't need to be here. But then I'm like, I don't leave. And part of that is ego. And then for some people, before we close out is guilt. Like, people feel like I don't want to feel like I'm better than this. I don't feel like I'm better. That's part of what.

[Ish]

From here. This is who raised me. I shouldn't turn my back.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

That's probably what me and Mona talked about. I won't disclose our conversation, but one thing she said. I think she'd be okay with me repeating this. She said, like, I don't wanna feel like I'm too good to be here.

[Joe Budden]

Yeah.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

You know what I'm saying? And that's the thing. Like, I don't wanna act like I'm better than them. I'm gonna go to this store. Like, you could just do Uber.

[Ish]

It's a tough battle trying to find that.

[Joe Budden]

Why is it tough?

[Ish]

Because you don't wanna feel like I'm too good for a spot. But at the same time you might say I shouldn't be here. So it's like a back and forth battle. I'll explain.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

It's not a battle for you, it's a con. No.

[Ish]

Again, Jobant. Famous for a very, very, very.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

And at a young age.

[Ish]

Yeah. You know, I'm. And you come from environment. That was a bad environment. So you getting away from that environment was the most logical and rational thing you should have been doing at that time. You know what I'm saying? Like it makes sense why you. Like, I'm not. Definitely not disrespecting the reason that you. And not out here. And not for nothing in, in Joe's situation. Like you had somebody put a gun in your face.

[Joe Budden]

Yeah.

[Ish]

Like, you know what I'm saying? Like some people don't go that far with the, the, the, the close call.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Yeah.

[Ish]

You know what I mean? So they still.

[Joe Budden]

Lesson learned.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Exactly.

[Ish]

You had good reason to get out. I mean, they learned you. But think about this. And this is a real true story. Especially in the hoods. Yo, it's a lot of successful people that make it out the hood. Right. We don't know that they successful because they never come back. So if you make it to a certain level of prominence or success, you kind of want to go back to the hood sometimes to show to other people that it's a possibility for you to get out. Yeah. That's where it get tricky though.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

And no, it does.

[Ish]

I'm not. Now you come because some people look at you as food now that you came back and oh, well, we starving over here. And you made it. Are you here? I mean, play run with the lions. I can't say much.

[Joe Budden]

Go back to the hood. What hood they done turned? The old Journal Square in the high rises. Whatever hood you grew up in ain't the same.

[Ish]

That's not true. Hold on. Some hood is still MLK gonna be mlk? My nigga, MLK is everywhere around the country. It's some shit going on.

[Joe Budden]

I mean, it's a few. It's a few simple rules of thumb that if you follow it, you'd probably be cool. The harder it is. The harder it is to make it from a town is how easy it is. Just stay away from that motherfucker once you make it. Like, sorry, I don't see just crops of Delaware. Just. You hear those stories of niggas on this. On the, like, Jersey City was tough to make it out from. Guess what? I acknowledge that and I ain't.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Prove it.

[Joe Budden]

Yeah, I ain't coming back. Are you crazy?

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

You go, hell, no.

[Ish]

That's crazy.

[Joe Budden]

On the drive by tip.

[Ish]

Yeah.

[Joe Budden]

There's nothing to do but you see your family and do all that type shit. All that other shit I did in my 20s, you get a car, you want to take it through the Ave. You want to take it through the blocks. You want to take it to fucking Crowns. Yeah, it's over. It's over there.

[Ish]

You ain't going to Crowns no more.

[Joe Budden]

The other day, it was nice out. I was bored in the house on some. I'm a celebrity, so I ain't supposed to be nowhere. So I'm just staying home for 10 days in a row, with the exception of where we went. I'm like, you know, let me hop in the car, take a little drive. I hopped in the car, made a right. It was people outside.

[Ish]

Which car?

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Which car? Yeah, that's good.

[Ish]

Very important.

[Joe Budden]

My red car.

[Parks]

The red car.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

What brand is that? I mean, is that Ford something?

[Parks]

Italian?

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Chevrolet.

[Joe Budden]

That's another F. Okay. At this point, I mean, I made it right. It was mad people outside. It was traffic. It was all types of shit. I pulled over where I was trying to go. While nobody ain't in for me. I sit there, order orange juice, and left in five minutes. Went back in the house. I'm like, what am I doing?

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

But don't you feel. Don't. A party, you want to just roll? Like, I remember, I think about, like, Muhammad Ali when I was a young boy. Like, when I was. He would like, jog down Broad street sometimes when he's in Philly, he would just jog through North Philly, just on Broad street. And, like, it was good to see

[Parks]

him in the hood That's a different era. True.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

In fairness, it is. That's what I'm saying. But that's the image I have, and that's what I keep holding on to. So when I think about you, like, you riding through Jersey City or y' all going through Newark, you know, I mean, like, the people want to see you.

[Ish]

I agree. I just said that.

[Joe Budden]

You know, and if I went to Jersey City, what store, do you think I would stop at a store and buy something? Pull over.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Yeah. Definitely wouldn't get out.

[Joe Budden]

Hey, Jersey City, it take a man, take about three seconds. Go ahead, park Dairy Queen. There you go. Go ahead and try to park now. That's my hood. Yeah, well, nothing ever happened to Joe. But that Dairy Queen, they're gonna be a banana split. They know. They know about me at that Dairy Queen now. See you in a minute. Anyway, we glad, Mona. We glad that you all.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Yeah, that part.

[Ish]

No doubt.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Support her shows, too, y'. All.

[Joe Budden]

Word.

[Ish]

That's my nigga.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Are you okay, Joe? Last. When I spoke to yesterday, you were still mourning a bit from the Clive Davis thing. I think the whole music industry was shook it up.

[Joe Budden]

Oh, yeah, you did? I did speak to you right after he passed?

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Yeah.

[Joe Budden]

You want to tell him what you said?

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

No, I absolutely do not.

[Joe Budden]

You want to go ahead and tell him what you said to me as soon as Clyde passed so they could really see the real Mark, So they could really see the levels you'll stoop to. Come on. Come on. Give it to him.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

If I was really a piece of shit, I would say it. Cause it would be worth. Yeah, but no, I'm gonna say it.

[Parks]

Mark said.

[Joe Budden]

Mark told me.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Right? Nah. The music industry is reeling right now following the death of Clive Davis, who, of course, was one of the great music execs and I would argue maybe the greatest talent finder in American music history.

[Parks]

He's up there. He's in the comedy.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

We should talk about that. We'll get to that after we eulogize him first. We eulogize him first. And also he died in 94.

[Parks]

Long life.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Yeah. They say the good die young. And, you know, he starts. First of all, he's a lawyer by training. Went to nyu, then went to Harvard Law. A lot of people don't know that. Impeccable training. Then he goes into the music business and, you know, first at Columbia Records. And he's at Columbia Records. To me, one of the most interesting times in Columbia records, from like, 67 to 73. I think Aretha was still there for Those last few years, I mean, there was some amazing happening at. At Columbia Records right there. And he was a great talent scout. He then went from there to Ariston and before later founding Jay Records. He was somebody who didn't just build. He wasn't somebody who just created. He wasn't. Who just made money, although he made a whole lot of it. Yeah, he was a talent. He was a talent finder.

[Parks]

He was.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

He had a unique and rare ability to spot talent and across genres, which is another thing. Some execs only can find the soul singer or the pop singer or the rap artist. But when you can see Santana and you can see Janis Joplin, you can see Aerosmith, you can see Bruce Springsteen, then you can see Whitney Houston, which may be his. That's certainly his favorite, his prize sort of talent.

[Joe Budden]

Remind me to come back to Bruce Springsteen.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Okay.

[Joe Budden]

Ask y' all a question.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

But he had an ability to nurture and develop talent. And it's also generational. Some people can do it in an era and then once their moment is gone, but to go from the 60s and then to produce talent in the 70s all the way up to, I mean, Alicia Keys and to keep producing talent decade after decade after decade is a testament, I think, to his talent. You know, there aren't a lot of legends still standing, and he was one of the last ones. And of course, his legacy will live on through the music. It'll live on through the infrastructure, live on through nyu, you know, where he obviously built. Davis School, Clive Davis School. And he was a big mentor. And so some people don't plant seeds, but one thing Clive was willing to do was, you know, plant seeds. He would plant his seed in many, many fertile young artists. And I think it just says everything about him. And so rest in peace, we would say rest in peace to him. We hope that he gets everything that he deserves.

[Parks]

And thank you for your contributions.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Thank you.

[Parks]

Responsible for a lot of great music, no question.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

A lot of great music. Across again, across all the genres. That's, to me, is the amazing part about him, Parks and I. Do you have anything to add to that, Joe? Did he mentor you?

[Joe Budden]

No.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Okay.

[Joe Budden]

I never had anything to do with Aristor or Jay Records or any of that.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

I know sometimes he worked with artists who weren't. He was willing to mentor and plant seeds even when people weren't. Yeah, you don't like gardening directly under his thumbs.

[Joe Budden]

Did a bunch of rappers with him?

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Some did. I know he had some strong relationships with, like, Puff Daddy. He had some, you Know, and so a lot of people came under the bad boy umbrella. He, he. They felt his presence.

[Joe Budden]

All you gotta do is learn from me is if you keep a straight face. Squad. Mark, do this shit. I mean, just let him cook. All right, It's a eulogy.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

What else. What else would we have with a straight face? If anything, we should be crying or sad, but lots of people. I just thought you might have been.

[Joe Budden]

I'm not sure if I ever even. I don't think I've even met Clive Davis. I've never met him.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Stick to that, yo. I don't care what they ask. I don't care what they say.

[Joe Budden]

Mark, why are you being such a jerk?

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

About what?

[Parks]

What are the Clive Davis accusations?

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

I don't know of any. Accusations of what?

[Parks]

I don't know. That's why I'm asking.

[Joe Budden]

Mark, don't tuck your fucking tongue.

[Ish]

He mentored.

[Joe Budden]

You're hinting like there's something.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

He mentored lots of people.

[Joe Budden]

And you saying things.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

One other thing. He was a pioneer. More. And this is a serious. I don't know if y' all got a chance to read his biography. Who am I talking to? Fuck am I? He wrote an autobiography. And in it, one of the things he talked about was being bisexual. And he was one of the first major industry people and major public figures to say that. And he said at the time that he hoped that coming out as bisexual would help people deepen their understanding of bisexuality, to get. Raise some of the stigma and to understand who he was. And he had relations with men into his 90s. I'm only mentioning it because he mentioned was important.

[Parks]

It's Pride Month.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

That people. That people. And it is Pride Month. And it was important to him that people knew that.

[Joe Budden]

So.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Yeah. So again, he left lots of legacies and lots of marks with a K. I think that's it for Clive. Dave Davis.

[Parks]

Rest in peace. Clyde Davis.

[Ish]

Rest in peace, man. Like you said. Thank you.

[Parks]

Now, do you want to have the fight that we were having?

[Ish]

Yes, I want to hear this fight.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Yeah. So.

[Joe Budden]

Yeah. Don't try to back off of that one.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

No, not at all. Talking this through, I feel even more correct. But you said you wanted to do something with Clyde before that.

[Joe Budden]

Huh?

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Okay. You said before. We did say that.

[Joe Budden]

Oh, I wanted to ask. At the end, I got my. I just want to know who has the tee. Yeah, my shit ain't about nothing important. I just want to know who has the Clive tea.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

There's a lot of them.

[Joe Budden]

He's gone. Rest in peace. But he was 94.

[Parks]

He was in the industry for a long time. I'm sure there is some tea out

[Joe Budden]

there, but it's out there. Please don't make me just fucking go home and imagine what the tea could be.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

And it is piping hot, as they say.

[Joe Budden]

I know it is. I wish somebody would spill it. Do we think that Clive tea will come out anytime soon?

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Absolutely.

[Parks]

Yes, probably.

[Joe Budden]

Yes, absolutely.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Here's the thing. And I know some people, when he died yesterday, were tagging me and saying, I can't wait for Mark's eulogy. So he can really, you know, go in on Clive Davis. And that's not. I have no problem. Y' all know me. I have no problem criticizing people during a eulogy if they deserve it. And he may deserve it, But I don't want to mention a bunch of rumor and innuendo and people's eulogy. It's one thing with Hulk Hogan was like, we know this thing happened, or Dick Cheney, who's a certified piece of shit. That's different. But like, you gonna say that after

[Joe Budden]

you do all that, she your dick.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Dick Cheney? Yeah, I don't care. But for Clive Davis, it's too much speculation, too much rumor, too much innuendo that I don't think that's fair to him, his legacy, or the people who are tied to him, which is a lot of people.

[Joe Budden]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

So I don't wanna do that. There'll be plenty of time for that when it comes out. I'll report it, I promise. But it's just not the time right now, you know, but we were having a conversation about talent and who was kind of. I don't want to misrepresent, but I said that somehow we end up talking about Barry Gordy because we talk about who's left. And I said, Barry Gordy's one of the greatest, obviously one of the greatest talent finders.

[Parks]

The.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

You say he's the greatest. I put Clive Davis above him.

[Parks]

How?

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

And that's where the conversation came.

[Joe Budden]

Who are Barry?

[Parks]

Barry's Michael Jackson, Stevie Wonder, Marvin Gaye, Smokey Robinson. Smokey Robinson. Diana Ross.

[Ish]

Oh, yeah, that's.

[Joe Budden]

That's.

[Ish]

Yeah, you can stop.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

No, he found him and scouted him.

[Ish]

I'm asking from ignorance.

[Parks]

Well, him and his team, you know, obviously we're both these gentlemen. They have.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Yeah, we talk to teams. Yeah. Cause otherwise, if you don't talk teams, it's not fair. Yeah, I think they're the only. To me, they're the two in the conversation.

[Parks]

Agree. I think it's almost impossible to beat that lineup.

[Ish]

It's a nice starting five. That's a mean five, Right? Starting five.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Where Clive Davis wins is the depth and the breath. So I made a little list just to go back to it. But again, I mean, I know y' all don't care about some of these people, so y' all gonna say whatever.

[Parks]

No, these are. There's the monsters on this list.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

But, I mean, to find Janis Joplin, to find Barry Manilow, to find Bruce Springsteen, to find Errol Smith, to find Santana, to find Whitney Houston, I mean, that's a good. This ain't a crazy take.

[Parks]

It's not the craziest take.

[Ish]

It would be the best if there wasn't a person standing right there that got them names that.

[Parks]

Michael Jackson and Stevie Wonder. Sorry.

[Ish]

Yeah. Yeah, that would be. That would be the top.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Does Barry Gordon get credit for Stevie Wonder? I'm thinking this through.

[Parks]

Why wouldn't he?

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

I'm literally thinking about the chronology of him getting to Motown. I was trying to. I thought he was doing some stuff. I might be wrong. I don't know.

[Joe Budden]

It's Barry Gordon.

[Ish]

Is Barry Gordon.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Is it?

[Parks]

Yes.

[Joe Budden]

Yes.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Stevie Wonder is what makes it. Is what makes it, even to me. Competitive. Right?

[Joe Budden]

Yeah. You could take that Barry, man. A little up the street, but no Aerosmith and Aerosmith.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Bruce Springsteen. Santana.

[Joe Budden]

If you. Champ, say Bruce. All right.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

What are you doing?

[Joe Budden]

I keep trying to chill. He's the New Jersey Goat, so I don't have nothing bad to say. But that's two times you. And if you say it again, I'm gonna be forced to say. To say what I'm thinking. Bruce Springsteen, which. We gotta ask the question.

[Ish]

Yo, I think I'm in the same.

[Joe Budden]

How many slaps Bruce got?

[Ish]

He got some.

[Parks]

He's got some slaps.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

He got some slaps. And it's not just that he got slaps. It's also the ones he got.

[Joe Budden]

What are they? All right. Banned in the USA.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Born in the USA 2 Live Crew. You hood rat.

[Joe Budden]

All right. Born in the. That's worse. Yeah. No, it's worse than being banned. Banned is hard. Anyway, I'm not talking about the song. All right. Born in the USA is also kind

[Parks]

of banned in the USA if you ever.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

This song is actually ironic. People were singing it like patriots. Patriotic. It's actually not that.

[Parks]

Yeah.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

People don't listen to song.

[Joe Budden]

What else you got, though?

[Parks]

Dancing in the Dark.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Dancing Dark's a big one.

[Joe Budden]

Is there. Is there a deluxe on that.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Born to run, Thunder.

[Parks]

Born to run. For sure.

[Joe Budden]

Yeah. All right.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Streets of Philadelphia.

[Joe Budden]

I'm gonna keep it a buck.

[Ish]

I don't know nothing.

[Joe Budden]

I got it. I got it.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Born Under a Rock.

[Parks]

This is a big fight in my household, actually, because REM Is a big Bon Jovi fan and we always have the Springsteen versus Bon Jovi fight.

[Ish]

Is there a fight?

[Joe Budden]

What's the fight?

[Ish]

What's the fight?

[Joe Budden]

Wait, what's the fight there?

[Parks]

Bon Jovi's got a little more depth.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

A little bit.

[Parks]

A lot more, actually.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

What do you talk about?

[Joe Budden]

A little bit. So what's the fight?

[Parks]

Who do you. Who's better? Who in the. Versus, who wins?

[Joe Budden]

Yo. Yeah, Bon Jovi wins.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Hey, yo. They don't even get in the ring. What you talking about?

[Parks]

I don't.

[Joe Budden]

I ain't. I can't.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Bruce.

[Ish]

Bruce is the dude.

[Joe Budden]

But. He's like the.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

But again, bro.

[Joe Budden]

Is he white?

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Yeah, he's white, right?

[Joe Budden]

Because he was spray tanning.

[Ish]

Yeah. You say is he white?

[Joe Budden]

He was spray tanning.

[Parks]

I think he's Jewish.

[Ish]

Seeing that. We are the world, Doc.

[Joe Budden]

Yeah. He did not have the greatest performance.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

That wouldn't be the best. Yeah, he didn't belong to him. But again, he's not. He's not in this. I'm not sure he's in the starting five.

[Joe Budden]

Sorry, Clive.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

He's not in Clive starting. I mean, again, there's also Chicago. Pink Floyd.

[Joe Budden]

Love Chicago.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Fucking Patty Smith.

[Joe Budden]

Earth, Wind and Fire.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Earth, Wind and Fire.

[Joe Budden]

You get Chicago, you get Earth, Wind and Fire, you get Pink Floyd.

[Parks]

But Pink Floyd was. That wasn't fully him. He just got them distribution.

[Joe Budden]

You lose. Pink Floyd.

[Parks]

Yeah.

[Ish]

Comes to the US without the.

[Joe Budden]

You gotta get a 0.5.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Yeah.

[Parks]

You gotta give him something.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Yeah, yeah. The list is just. This is just a lot more. It's like. It's like a draft where you get, like, three hall of Famers versus a draft where you get, like, 20, 25 All Stars.

[Parks]

Three of the best that have ever done. Not just Hall Witches.

[Joe Budden]

Like, oh, yeah, Jimmy Kozier. I've loved Jimmy Kozier. So let's not make.

[Ish]

I'm not going.

[Joe Budden]

Clive get Jimmy Clyborne. No. No win against no damn Barry Gordy.

[Ish]

Yes, he does. Your running father. Running father.

[Parks]

Mike.

[Joe Budden]

Stevie.

[Ish]

Marvin Whitney neutralizes one of them.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

No, I'm not giving Marvin Gator.

[Joe Budden]

Whitney neutralizes who?

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

That. He just said, I am not giving Marvin Gator.

[Parks]

How.

[Ish]

No Marvin over. Whitney Houston.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

No, I'm saying yes, yes, yes.

[Joe Budden]

Marvin over with eight days of the week. Eight days of the week. Marvin Gaye over with.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

With respect.

[Joe Budden]

Rest in peace.

[Ish]

Of course. Y' all drunk. Y' all are drunk. Marvin Gay over with.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Yes. Yes.

[Ish]

Out, y'.

[Parks]

All.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

I don't even think that's the show. What are you talking about as a vocalist? Are you talking about over what do you. Or as an artist?

[Ish]

I'm talking about as a vocalist. Her impact, in which Whitney Houston was her for a very, very, very long time.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Not that long. I mean, if we be. Not that that long.

[Ish]

All right.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

I mean, no. I mean, her first album comes out, what, 80. What, 83 ish. Yeah. And my Love Is yous Love comes out in what, 90?

[Ish]

98.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

98. That's 15 years.

[Ish]

That's a long time.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Yeah, but compared to Marvin Gaye. Marvin Gaye started with Harvey Farquhar with Harvey the Moon Girls, which is why I'm not giving him all the credit for. I'm saying Marvin was kind of. And he was already a session drummer before. I'm just saying there's a long stretch before he gets to Motown. And there's time after Motown, you take

[Joe Budden]

Marvin Gaye's best four songs and Whitney's not allowed in that club.

[Ish]

No, y' all are crazy.

[Joe Budden]

Whitney's not allowed in that.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Do it.

[Parks]

Give it.

[Joe Budden]

Give me a section of the glove.

[Ish]

Crazy, bro. You keep saying, give me Marvin's four. Give me Whitney's four.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

What's Whitney's four?

[Ish]

So let me tell. Ask me. Tell me what the criteria is, because it can't be four songs. You can't. It can't be opinionated, because now I'm gonna go. Now I'm gonna go get the songs that broke the records. And now y' all gonna go to. Yo, we not talking about numbers.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

We not talking about. You say she's a bigger selling artist than he is.

[Ish]

Asking you what the criteria is before we pivot with the conversation. The girl sung the fucking national anthem and the shit went four, five, six, platinum.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

I just want to point out. I just wanna point out that Marvin, to that point, but just as an example, Marvin Gaye was kind of the first person at the 84 All Star Game to introduce that departure from the standard march national anthem. So even Whitney's following Marvin's temple.

[Joe Budden]

Yeah.

[Ish]

And Michael Jordan followed Dr. J. Are they a conversation?

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

You talk.

[Joe Budden]

No, they're not calling Marvin Gaye Dr.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Jay's not Dr. Jake.

[Ish]

Nobody brings up Dr. J's name when motherfucking Michael Jordan's name comes into the conversation.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Right? And I'm saying that I don't think that Marvin Gaye and Whitney Houston are you.

[Ish]

So you shouldn't have said it.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

No, no, I was just saying that you.

[Joe Budden]

My point still remains.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

I was just talking about influence.

[Joe Budden]

If you take Whitney Houston's. Call it four or five, I don't care. Take her best five songs and she can't stand. Nowhere near Marvin Gaye yet. No, she can't look at him.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

And then if you get the 10, I don't even know if you.

[Joe Budden]

You could add the Star Spangled Banner that you sung Dolly Parton. And put Dolly Parton up there with her to sing it. Put. Put Cecil Houston.

[Ish]

What's it cece.

[Joe Budden]

Cece Winans. Put the whole family up to.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Dion Warwick.

[Joe Budden]

Get all. Get Brandy. Who else Whitney Houston know Ray J could come. And Whitney Houston better not say, oh, Whitney, with respect. Another New Jersey. She better not say a fucking peep about Mar.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Biggest songs would be I will always love you, Exhale.

[Parks]

I want to dance with somebody.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

I want to dance with somebody.

[Joe Budden]

And go dance with somebody that got a catalog like you. Go dance with somebody that these songs is gonna do.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

This is the second tier.

[Joe Budden]

We talking about sexual healing. Let's get it on. What's going on? Inner City Blues. I want you.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

I heard it through the grapevine.

[Joe Budden]

It's very different levels of art.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Just to tell you, Terrell. I mean.

[Joe Budden]

Yeah.

[Ish]

Ye.

[Joe Budden]

Yeah. Come on. Come on. With respect. With respect.

[Parks]

Respectful.

[Ish]

And that's why. That's what the. The criteria is, because those are songs that's resonating with us. When you start talking about worldwide acclaim and all that other. It's going to be a different conversation depending on who the audience is.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Ah, that Motown sound is pretty global, bro.

[Ish]

You got three number one hits, you know.

[Joe Budden]

Oh, you trying to trap us into the numbers thing.

[Ish]

That's what I'm telling you. Ask what the criteria say. I'm asking you what the criteria is, because now it's opinion.

[Joe Budden]

You think if you include white people that Whitney beats Marvin? Cause I don't. I still don't think that mo. Marvin Gaye ain't some black

[Ish]

people. No black people. I said worldwide acclaim. So that's why I asked what the criteria is, because then it becomes opinionated if we start talking about numbers. Something that's quantifiable. You can't deny those. And it's not opinionated at that point.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Well, but you still have to look at, like, the different eras too, because you don't.

[Ish]

I said, I know.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

I mean, you do. I mean, if there's just more people in the world now in. In.

[Joe Budden]

In 2000, in your travels, you're gonna hear more. You're gonna hear Marvin Gaye song where you go before how will I know comes on, which I do.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Like.

[Joe Budden]

What are we talking about here?

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

I. Yeah, if we're talking about. As an. If you talk about artistry, I don't think it's close. If you talk about sales. Yeah.

[Parks]

Then Whitney might.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Whitney wins the sales fight. And it's not close by far. I think that's what.

[Ish]

It's.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Correct. It's not even close.

[Ish]

It's not close. And it's all I want to bring up. If this young lady never had the problems or the issues that she had, unfortunately, especially toward the latter end of her career, we're not even having this conversation.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Marvin has some issues, too.

[Ish]

He had his issues, too. No, no, no. He has some issues, too. I'm not disagreeing with you. Whitney Houston was the pinnacle for a female artist of her generation, bro. That's a fact.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Yeah, there's a. I don't want to say this. I would be respectful. There's a natural decline that happens to all artists at a certain point. I'm not sure. It's not like she had 20 more years of number one hits in there any more than Aretha or anybody else did. Right. I think that Whitney had a great career. And Whitney, to me, is one of the greatest vocals we've ever seen, One of the greatest artists we've ever seen. I'm not taking nothing away from Whitney. I just think Marvin Gaye. It's almost a little. It's a little apples and oranges, but I think it is. I think Marvin Gaye is just a different level of artist. I think we're underestimating his impact as a writer, as a singer.

[Parks]

And I want to be clear. Back to the original conversation. Marvin Gaye is number three on my list.

[Joe Budden]

There's two above him.

[Ish]

So all I said was, Whitney Campbell cancels out one of the three, and then you're gonna have to go to Clive Davis's depth. So when you start naming four or five or six, seven of these mega artists, I think those six to that one.

[Parks]

Michael Jackson chances out about six of them.

[Ish]

12, maybe more than that.

[Parks]

Yeah.

[Joe Budden]

But he got eight more DOLO.

[Ish]

And now Stevie.

[Parks]

Now Stevie's here.

[Joe Budden]

Oh, wait. Clive got each other. Each other. Man. That he about to rep for Luther.

[Parks]

Oh.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

And now he don't get credit for Luther, but he does get credit.

[Ish]

I didn't know it was all that. That was a five.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

That was unstoppable.

[Ish]

But when you got seven.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

And I could show up with lots of them. Lots of them. But finding Stevie Wonder, Michael Jackson is. Is epic. I don't take anything away from that.

[Ish]

But a nice 50. He still got 50 left. Corey park stopped at about 6.

[Parks]

Yeah.

[Joe Budden]

Did he need to continue?

[Ish]

I don't need no more with.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

I needed to continue. That's why I gave like 25.

[Joe Budden]

You take that Janis Joplin up the street.

[Parks]

I love Janis Joplin as much as the next man, but you still got the Supremes and the Commodores.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

It's a long list.

[Joe Budden]

Nah, there's some heat on there. But all that. Kenny Loggin could go get up again.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

If you talk something about the sales.

[Joe Budden]

I love Kenny logging. Don't do that to Kenny or Kenny

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

G. I fucking hate Kenny G. But the motherfucker sold a lot of records.

[Joe Budden]

I think if you take all the.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

I mean, songbird wouldn't be what I turn on if I want to hear. Like.

[Joe Budden]

I think if you take all the artists to ever exist, it's gonna be tough to beat the multi artist.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

That's the only point I'm making. But it's not like he just said, give me all of them. He actually developed some great talent and he revived some careers. Like that resurgence of Santa of Carlos Santana, that last wave.

[Joe Budden]

Oh, forgot about that.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

That's. Are you kidding? This motherfucker came back at like 50s clef.

[Joe Budden]

Give Klepp that credit. You twisted my arm. Fuck Diana Ro.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

The resurgence of Aretha Franklin again. Like, all these people. Y' all crazy, man. Di Warwick, he had a big. I mean,

[Joe Budden]

you gonna make me chill, chill, chill, chill.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Y' all got it.

[Joe Budden]

Rest in peace to Clyde and salute

[Parks]

to Barry, who's also producing a lot of these artists as well. So that's different level

[Joe Budden]

than the. You.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

What you got to say about R. Franklin, Dion Warwick, Joe Buton.

[Parks]

You can't say nothing about him.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Say nothing about him.

[Ish]

You can't say nothing about Aretha Franklin. He said the resurgence.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Yeah, he was. I mean, nobody checking for the.

[Joe Budden]

The Rose is still a Rose is still.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

That was a dope album. I. I would even.

[Parks]

What are you about to say?

[Ish]

I got.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

There's just a lot of Aretha moments and Clive Davis was. Was a part.

[Parks]

Part of some of. A few of the. A couple of them.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

That's what I said. That's not my main point for Clive. I'm saying he just. I said Santana and Frank wreath all the people he Upped their resurgence too, which is a whole other thing. On top of the talent.

[Joe Budden]

I ain't heard from Santana.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Come on.

[Joe Budden]

I'm about to just disrespect all that

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Maria, Maria smooth shit.

[Joe Budden]

I ain't heard from Santana. Santana.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

That's not true.

[Joe Budden]

Since them little black bald headed twins popped up. Yeah, that don't nobody know their name.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

I don't know what you talking about.

[Joe Budden]

That was a group, though, from Maria.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Product.

[Joe Budden]

Product. Project.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Product.

[Joe Budden]

Product.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

GMB had. Product.

[Joe Budden]

Gmb. Product. Gmb. That was a group.

[Parks]

They had the song with the. Was it matchbox 20 or one of them?

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Yeah, that album was amazing. And it won all the Grammys. And that was all clowns.

[Joe Budden]

Listen, Motown. And that's it. All this you're doing, trying to get a job.

[Parks]

What up, though? Detroit?

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

What up?

[Joe Budden]

Yeah, I don't know. I don't know you.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

You. That's not how you get a job.

[Joe Budden]

I don't know if you're trying to speak at the Clive Memorial, you know you a memorial all star.

[Parks]

Yeah. That's a fact.

[Joe Budden]

He pop up when somebody dies with some kind words. Good at that. Rest in peace. Rest in peace. To Clive and thank you.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Thank you.

[Parks]

Amazing catalog.

[Joe Budden]

Thank you for all of it. His family, friends, fans, fellow artists and executive man mentees, all that. Yeah, there's a lot of them. A lot of them out there. All right, it's time for. Is my favorite time of the show.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Just.

[Parks]

Yeah, yeah.

[Joe Budden]

No, I have to be.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Yeah, that was like a. That was a 54 minute.

[Joe Budden]

We ain't there yet. No, come on. It got to be some more music we can get to. We ain't got to get the projects right now. Let's get all the music out the way. Now that Barry ended Clive.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Barry did not end Clive.

[Joe Budden]

Still living.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

That's about it.

[Parks]

Did anybody watch the Earth, Wind and Fire Dock, by the way?

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

I heard. I did. I did. It was.

[Ish]

I heard it's amazing. I didn't see it. I heard it's fire, though.

[Parks]

It's really good. It's on hbo. Questlove produced it and directed it and all that. Maurice was tough. He was tough, man. He was tough. He was tough on them. He was firing people over.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

He was hard on them. Facts. You ain't seen it yet.

[Joe Budden]

No.

[Parks]

Oh, you should watch it.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

You should absolutely watch it.

[Joe Budden]

It's on my watch list.

[Parks]

Yeah, as music nerds, you should. You should.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

You absolutely. First of all, only Questlove can assemble the people to be talking heads on this dot that he. I Mean, you got Michelle and Barack Obama and Stevie Wonder. I mean, you.

[Joe Budden]

Oh, shit.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

I mean, like, it wasn't just fire, though. Yeah, yeah, But. But, I mean, a whole lot of people. Dorothy wouldn't fire Doc and not get Barack Obama and Stevie Wonder. True. So. But it wasn't just like, a list, like, famous people. It was also, like, people who really knew their shit. So I really enjoyed that part of it. I thought the storytelling was good. I liked his first document, the Sly Stone one. Yeah.

[Parks]

Yeah, that was great, too.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

No, that's the second one. The first one was.

[Joe Budden]

I saw that one.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

The first one was the one that was in theaters.

[Ish]

Yeah.

[Parks]

Oh, the festival.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

That one I thought was good, but it was very clearly a very good first doc.

[Parks]

And it was very niche. It wasn't the star power of Sly or Maurice and Earth, Wind and Fire.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

But with each film quest, love gets better at storytelling, for sure. The elements get better. The organization gets better. I thought the Sly Stone one was amazing. It was the Earth, Wind and Fire one. I thought he. I just thought the storytelling was great. I thought. I thought visually it was beautiful.

[Parks]

Indeed.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

And the music there was so much good. You could actually, you know, some of these docs, you don't get the music in them.

[Parks]

Yeah.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

You got to actually hear the shit.

[Parks]

And Earth Wind Fire's got a lot of slaps.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Yes. And a lot of people. A lot of members.

[Parks]

I could see why the splits would get a little complicated.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

I'm not splitting with 14 people.

[Parks]

In fact, I'll just keep it all.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Let me tell you something, right? I'm not splitting with a nigga who's playing in trouble. Like. No, fuck that. No, man. Yeah. Watching the people leaving into the group, watching. Hearing their childhood stories, how they grew up. I didn't know a lot of stuff I didn't know about, like the separation from his mom. Just all this. All this stuff. And to have the actual members participate in it, too, which a lot of times doesn't happen with docs. Or it's the other extreme. If the members participate, it feels like an infomercial for the group. And it doesn't feel like it tells the truth about the group. I thought it was a nice balance.

[Parks]

That was crazy. Like, half the band had to go get jobs selling TVs and shit for a while. It's crazy. It got deep.

[Joe Budden]

How long is it pause?

[Parks]

Two hours.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

About two hours.

[Joe Budden]

All right, I can't wait. I'm gonna check it out.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

And just one last thing. Just the scene where they get housed at about yeah, yeah. Is a great scene where they're performing and they perform. They got.

[Parks]

Yeah, they got smoked.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

They got smoked.

[Joe Budden]

They got smoked.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Pre versus era. It was like, oh, we gotta go back to drum boy.

[Parks]

And they did.

[Joe Budden]

That's a respectable smoke, though, for sure.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Yeah, that's who you want to get smoked by.

[Parks]

Late 60s, I think. Yeah, maybe early 70s.

[Ish]

Yeah.

[Joe Budden]

Yeah, you're going to get smoked. It was.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

It was. It was at the time where you should get smoked by people.

[Parks]

Yeah, it was right when they first formed as Earth, Wind and Fire. Because. Because Maurice was drumming for. What's my man's name, the piano jazz guy.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Not.

[Parks]

But I'm sorry, just to disrespect him, Vi. I not remember his name, but he formed his own group and they opened up for George pretty early on and just got smoked.

[Joe Budden]

That Clive can't open up when some Motown going on. Yeah. What you talking about?

[Parks]

I mean, he's on Earth when fire is why I thought of it.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

George couldn't put no Motown, but whatever. I'm not sure how to let this rock.

[Joe Budden]

Not at all.

[Ish]

Oh, man.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Yeah. No, it was great. Also, you just really. How freakishly talented some of these artists are. Like, even. Even as he's talking, like, yeah, he's playing the keys. He's like, you know what? I'm gonna just drum.

[Parks]

Yeah, word.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

And he just started drumming professionally. Like he wasn't like some class.

[Parks]

He wasn't even a vocalist.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

No. Wow, they're just so gifted. But it's a great film. I think everybody should watch it. It's one of the good ones for sure.

[Joe Budden]

And where is it? Hbo. Hbo. Oh, that's where. I've been watching my Fat Girl Cult doc. That's why I ain't had a chance.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Wait, is this a cult for fat girls or a cult about fat girls? Both.

[Ish]

Sign you up, coach.

[Parks]

Back to that 185 +.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Is there a QR code you can send me?

[Joe Budden]

No, he. He was. He was £500 and up. Oh, his weight requirement if you got under £500. So the guy. So the guy who. Long story really, really short. The guy who invented the chip so convertible roofs on cars could just go back and forth. Like, the guy who invented that chip has a house and invited a bunch of fat girls to just be there.

[Parks]

Okay.

[Joe Budden]

And he kept feeding them, feeding them and taping them and recording them. And he married one of them. And then the black girl he had some kids with but he was sexually abusing.

[Parks]

Oh, that's terrible.

[Joe Budden]

People. Well, so they Say he's sitting right there saying, they got him. He's like, I ain't do that shit in front of the lady. Yeah, they got him sitting down. No, not in front of them, but just, you know, the solo confessional shot. So he's sitting there saying, no, I didn't do that. And then she wanted it, but it's a mess. It's three episodes.

[Parks]

Sounds good.

[Joe Budden]

And they got all of the fat girls there too, so. No, for real. I believe I learned all type of words like feederism. Who now I The fuck. Feederism. That's what it.

[Parks]

Feeder feederism. Like to feed?

[Joe Budden]

Yes. It's a kink. Well, it was his kink. When you get off on feeding them, feeding them, or seeing big people continue to eat. And it was just. It was crazy.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Wow, that's next level.

[Parks]

Yeah, I'm not gonna kink shit saying.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

But yeah, I can imagine that. That would be a fire head.

[Parks]

Oh,

[Joe Budden]

that's a whole microphone. Fire what? Big. Big head.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

What a.

[Joe Budden]

You think? Come on, let's get on some real quick. You think. You think big head facts is the best head? Yes.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

They act like they eating and they. Whatever the that is right here. You feel it. Instant gratification. You might nut off the first.

[Parks]

Ah.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

You know what I'm saying? If you don't like big dog, don't

[Ish]

ever do your mouth like that.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

You know what I'm talking about, though? Ish.

[Ish]

I do.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

You took a big mama before. It's like they last meal the last time.

[Joe Budden]

Big girl head is categorically. That's good. The best brand ahead you could get.

[Ish]

I'm not gonna say it's the top. This is what I. I think personally, I just think they care more.

[Parks]

Like, that's the key to a good blow job.

[Joe Budden]

Huh?

[Parks]

That's the key to a good blow job?

[Ish]

Yes. Like, if a girl really likes giving head, skinny or big, that shit gonna be fire. Some girls be feeling like it's a chore, it's a task. They don't really want to do it. Big mama. Big girls get head.

[Joe Budden]

Yeah, yeah.

[Ish]

Like they gonna get comfy.

[Joe Budden]

But I don't want separating it between the girls who love giving head and girls that don't. The girls that love getting head, they could go sit out there somewhere in the conversation. Assuming everyone loves giving head, what brands are this? Drunk, white girl head, drunk head, period.

[Parks]

Yeah, that can go either way.

[Joe Budden]

I was getting ready.

[Ish]

Whoa, whoa.

[Joe Budden]

There could be a lot of teeth in there.

[Ish]

They could get the teeth in your shit.

[Parks]

They could be A little ratchet.

[Ish]

Too drunk. She throw up.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Freeze. Freeze, freak.

[Ish]

Shit ain't no free shit. No, you're right.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Freezing my lap.

[Ish]

Nah, I just did think this.

[Joe Budden]

You know why big girl head is dope in 2013? I was inviting them big over just to eat on some feris. No, no, I hadn't sounded. That's what money was just saying, no, join the airplane. No, no, not.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Come on, just one more.

[Joe Budden]

Not to feed them and get like, like, turned on by that. That's not my thing. But I had a chef, and the chef always made a meal for two anyway. And some of them big bitches would have, like, a nice full lip or a nice mouth situation where you would be like, hey, you want to come over for dinner on Thursday?

[Ish]

I wonder.

[Joe Budden]

And they would come over and the chef would bring it, and it would. They never seen a chef, the big bitches. So that because they usually cook for themselves, they be using the one stove. Old college. Oh, you told me they'll cook on anything. But anyway, yeah, the chef would come, bring the plate, and then the chef would leave, and we would eat, and then we would stop eating, and then they would. Then she would eat right to work. I never said nothing. I never asked for that head. She didn't even look like she was in Give head position. Like, stay ready.

[Ish]

Ain't got to get ready. After that, lady got a full Chef Boyardee.

[Joe Budden]

Oh, gobble gob. She was so good at chef boy rd. I know I didn't give enough dick for whatever she wanted to do. Like, she was treating my dick. She was bugging. She was bugging. Yeah.

[Parks]

Salute.

[Ish]

They don't care about the messy face nothing.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Salute.

[Joe Budden]

Yeah, when you ain't got it. When she loves sucking dick so much that your dick is not enough. She looking for. For more. She turn.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

She hold you in.

[Joe Budden]

She start sucking your balls. She start doing the balls and the dick. Like, man, this is a pro. Yo, if I had more dick. Look at the pro.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Look at the pro go.

[Joe Budden]

Judge.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Yeah, judge us. Judge us. Boy, we not to the. A lot of us not to the knee. My. I don't even know what you talking about. Judge us

[Joe Budden]

not to the knee. No.

[Ish]

Don't care about the.

[Joe Budden]

And back in the day, like 2005,

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

are you going back?

[Joe Budden]

You going way back. Like 2004, when me and my was hot. Detroit, we would get a kite, be like, yo, these having a pajama party in Virginia. Oh, you remember when the kiter comes, yo, there a few of them out there. They have A pajama party in Virginia. You want to drive up there? Who got a car? You want to drive up there, nigga? Take a drive up there, nigga. How it turned out, we all such assassins. We all wanted the big bitch. We knew the big bitch on a pajama party. Niggas kept trying to sneak her in the side room, but niggas kept banging on the door. Yeah. What you doing? Yeah. Nah, you ain't coming that. Nah, we on that come out. Nope. No, no. We will have a team meeting before you go get that fucking treat now. No, nigga, that's something we gotta discuss. He's right. He's right. Oh, my God. That is hilarious. You get your five minutes in the bathroom with the big bitch at the pajama party. Oh, my God. How you want to move to Virginia? How you looking for apartments anyway?

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

On the worst day, the best day, Nigga three.

[Joe Budden]

Nigga, I'm talking shit. I ain't a head guy.

[Parks]

Sure.

[Joe Budden]

I got out of there. That was me getting up.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

I was like, what time is.

[Joe Budden]

Is that time? How funny you should ask, Mark. It's time for my favorite part of

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

the show, Prize picks.

[Ish]

That is hilarious.

[Joe Budden]

All right, the NBA Finals are over. The New York Knicks are still your NBA champions. We sold the most merch. We had the most people at our parade. We had the highest point differential and were the only team in history to end the playoffs. Offs number one in offensive rating and number one in defensive rating. Stop playing with us. But there's still other sports that you guys could indulge in. Yo, and speaking as a fan of a championship team, I gotta tell you, the off season feels so different. Yo, I see y'.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

All.

[Joe Budden]

Y' all all into the Greek freak stuff. Look at y'.

[Ish]

All.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Ooh, you just sitting there on your phone.

[Joe Budden]

Who's gonna be on? Oh, where's the Greek Freak. Freak gonna go. Hey, guess who don't give a. Where you go, Nick fans. Hey, he ain't. He don't scare nothing. He ain't scared nothing. I sent it to Tatum, too. They got. Everybody came out Greek freak. Y' all talking about Miami Heat with the Greek freaked up. Yo, as more time passes, it's feeling more and more like, you know, I mean, we might have to repeat all these because we ain't spending the block on the people we was looking for. The Celtics, whoever Brad Stevens, Trout out there. We want to see them. We want to see them boys. We want. We looking for them.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Yeah, G, Spin.

[Joe Budden]

We looking for them boys. Detroit, y'.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

All though.

[Joe Budden]

Oh, we want to see the next one. Hey, guess what? You will.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Hey, we.

[Joe Budden]

We ain't ducking no smoke.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

It's the champs y' all talking about out there.

[Joe Budden]

Yeah, it's next summer.

[Ish]

Holly be back next year.

[Joe Budden]

Holly Halliburton. Oh, yeah. The Pacers thought they was looking for us. I'm gonna be respectful to the Pacer fans. I was only worried about the Pacers when they had Benedict Matheran, they traded them. I don't give a fuck about what the basers are talking about. I don't give a fuck about none of that. Hey, we went and did what the Pacers couldn't do, which was head out west, get our ring, and go at home to our families that love us. Man, Halliburton, we hope you get better. That 10 hamstring shit in game seven, that's gotta. That's almost like. If Jalen Brunson would have got hurt when women, whatever his name is, tried to bring Jalen Brunson. Tried to break Jalen's Brunson's ankle a few times. But you know what happens when your star player is strong. We play. We play through the pain. We don't get carted off the fucking court in a game seven nigga. Why you wasn't still shooting with a broke Achilles or some shit? So we now worried about the Pacers, Pistons, Celtics, Heat or the Cavs. Repeat, repeat.

[Parks]

Time.

[Ish]

If Bronnie go to the Cavs, y' all not worry.

[Joe Budden]

No, LeBron.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

You mean.

[Ish]

Don't.

[Joe Budden]

Don't call him bro.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Oh, I was confused. Yeah, my blood pressure.

[Ish]

I was like,

[Joe Budden]

you work?

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

No, I wouldn't be.

[Joe Budden]

No, that wouldn't work.

[Parks]

Me.

[Joe Budden]

But listen, there's plenty of other sports for you guys to look at. WNBA is on and popping. World cup is rocking. I can't believe they let Norway come over here and do that whole dance in Times Square and win the game. You see that little rowboat shit? Yeah. They had a little robo. Norway niggas try to do the Norwegians. They got it off, though. Well, they won. I mean, I can't say nothing. Messi broke the record. There's the World cup, there's baseball. Homeboy won the Masters. Damn, what's his name won the Masters. Dude, that won in 20, 23. Y' all are good. Anyway, it's a lot going on, so let me give you the. Ish picks of the week. Not before I explain how this works. Pick two or more players, look at their projected stat line, and pick more or less on your for your chance to win big. I don't have a read to get through because prize picks, as you guessed is still counting NBA money. So the ish loser picks of the week ish is going with with Angel Reese for more than 11 1/2 rebounds, Camila Cardoso for more than 13 1/2 points and Caitlin Clark for more than 8 1/2 assists. Don't forget to download prize picks right this very second and use promo code JBP to get $50 instantly when you play your first $5 lineup only on prize picks the official partner of the NBA. So now in walk back time, I do want to walk back my opinion on B2K versus Pretty Ricky. I'm taking it all back.

[Parks]

Really.

[Joe Budden]

I'm walking it all.

[Ish]

Smart man. Smart.

[Joe Budden]

Walking it all the way back. I think B2K might get dog walked on that stage.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

There you go.

[Joe Budden]

I went home and thought about it. B2K ain't got but fucking one and a half albums. I think I forgot about that part because I was actively trying to create a single when their run was happening, when bump, bump bump and all that was going on. But dang God. But I mean if you want to get out the B2K soundtrack, maybe two and a half albums and Pretty Ricky has two albums. I think that Pretty Ricky's music. Let's start. Yeah, it aged much better than BT A lot.

[Ish]

Yeah.

[Joe Budden]

So some of that shit that that should have been that that is a slap for B2K. Today girlfriend will go. I got everything in life and I want except for girlfriend that's gonna go. But all of these songs got that poppy feel to it. Not Pretty Ricky. Not Pretty Ricky.

[Ish]

Nope.

[Joe Budden]

All Pretty Ricky. All Pretty Ricky shit sound like it could go today and will go today.

[Ish]

It goes to today.

[Joe Budden]

That sound like a H town record with a Little Wayne verse. All of it. All of it. So. And then you add that to the fact that I start pretty Ricky with three guaranteed points. Cuz I don't think anything B2K has could beat their three big singles.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Which is My Body.

[Joe Budden]

Which is body. Which is hotline and Grind with Me. Grind With Me.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

What's hotline again?

[Joe Budden]

Don't be stupid. You know how it's five in the morning. There's nothing they could do with it. So I mean three zip already now it's going to be a battle of of the album cuts and Freaky Ricky. Freak Freaky Ricky. Pretty Ricky got a couple of more joints. So I mean yeah, I. I got

[Ish]

Pretty Ricky versus has become a Thing of, you know, guest appearances and all of that. So they might have to go.

[Joe Budden]

They.

[Ish]

They might have to go to that route. Yeah, yeah, might have to. Omarion might have to take over and start doing the features and bring out some folks I got records with to make it competitive.

[Joe Budden]

Anyway, there's a couple of these other Pretty Ricky records I forgot about when I made my initial take. He's bugging a little bit, and this is one of them here.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

I want a sex shit.

[Joe Budden]

Yo, look.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Now listen to the hair boy. Listen how the mattress.

[Joe Budden]

And I think they perform better than B2K.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

So they like each other.

[Joe Budden]

And I think they really hate B2K. I think they hate them.

[Ish]

I can see that.

[Joe Budden]

Why?

[Ish]

If I think I'm better, we better than y'. All. But y' all been getting all of. Y' all got all the congratulations, the credit.

[Joe Budden]

Yeah. Was it B2 battle for them? No, no, no, no.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

It was out before B2K.

[Joe Budden]

No, no. B2K came out in 2002. 2001. 2002. I know, because I didn't handle single album. Pretty Ricky came out as.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Yes.

[Joe Budden]

I was trying to promote a single for my second album that my label was never putting out, and that's what he said.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Yeah. So I said B2K came up before them.

[Joe Budden]

Oh, okay.

[Ish]

I'm sorry.

[Joe Budden]

Yeah, yeah, they came out first. They came out first.

[Ish]

Yeah. So, yeah, five is B2K.

[Joe Budden]

I mean, first air run.05. So that's when I was cold on promo tour at Florida radio stations. I went to Florida promo run. And let me tell you who was on absolute fire in Florida.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Freddie Ricky.

[Ish]

And that's before Pleasure Pete get into his bag. Freeze.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Do you think that Omarion has enough to go against? Like, if Omarion takes over, does he have enough to go against?

[Joe Budden]

Oh, if Amarion jumps in, then B2K wins. But B2K loses. Cause Amarion jumped in. If Amaron got to jump in for B2K to beat pretty Ricky, then y' all lost.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Really?

[Ish]

I. I'm. Omarion jumping in makes it. Makes it a fight. That's how I see that. Cuz Pleasure P got a bag of his own.

[Joe Budden]

Pleasure P bag. Don't want none with Amari.

[Ish]

I'm just saying. No, no, no, no. What I'm saying is, if Pretty Ricky

[Joe Budden]

is already winning over Pleasure P rights. Yeah, Pleasure P rights. I got to look at the records.

[Ish]

If Pretty Ricky's already winning. If we just looking at the groups, Omarion makes it competitive now. Pleasure P's bag will still push Them over the edge. That's all I'm saying. Saying I'm not saying his one on one.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Right.

[Joe Budden]

I'll be watching. I'll be watching either way. TI Got in some hot water for some shitty set up here about verses. Yeah.

[Parks]

Oh, yeah, yeah.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

He called me and said, flip. What did I say? Did I say this? I said, yeah, you did.

[Parks]

Oh, is that why they texted me asking me for the video?

[Joe Budden]

Yeah, yeah.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

I said, it's on Patreon. He said, man, I don't know how to work Patreon.

[Joe Budden]

I said, let me send you a screen. Screen recorded and you know. Yeah. When he said verses was for poor people, but he went on TMZ and explained it.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

He said it was poor people activity. What was his response?

[Joe Budden]

He said, I had a few drinks up there at the Joe Button podcast, which is true.

[Ish]

It happens.

[Joe Budden]

I saw it.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

And he said it live like, can I get another drink? Did he drink that top shelf rum I gave him? No, never.

[Joe Budden]

Nobody drank the Nephews no more. You didn't touch that.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

That would explain it.

[Joe Budden]

No, it'd have been worse. Why you buy that bullshit liquor here and got all the good. Look at your house.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

I thought I was so. I know about whiskey and shit like that, but like rum to me. I always grew up just buying Bacardi,

[Parks]

which is a smart move.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Yeah, just buy Bacardi. But then when y' all clown me so, particularly you parks clown me so much about buying Bacardi. I looked on the list. They only had two kinds. It was Bacardi, which I knew. And was it Nephew Ray and Nephew. Ray and Nephew. The Jamaican shit.

[Parks]

Yeah.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

And the Ray and nephew who bought that, hell, me marked it. But he said. He said it was two times. You know what I mean? That was like lighter fluid. But here's the thing.

[Parks]

Yeah.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Oh, the Ray and Nephew cost twice as much as the. As the Bacardi. So you know, being a bird, I was like.

[Ish]

I was like, hey, yo, I ain't gonna lie. That looked like some that beat, yo.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Are you crazy? He costs twice as much as the In Jamaica was cleaning their body with this in the airport. When I went there, they opened it.

[Parks]

That tastes like when I used to steal liquor out my parents liquor cabinet.

[Ish]

Yeah, the bottle looked like that.

[Joe Budden]

Yeah, it do Everclear type. That's strong.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

I don't drink like that. I just saw it. So I was like, it costs more. It must, you know, must be better.

[Parks]

There is good wrong.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

What is the rum that people should be buying and what makes good Rum.

[Parks]

It sounds like an ad. So I'm not gonna.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

I know how to buy like Jamaican rums and like, you know, like rums from other places. But like when I just go to the store, I just buy what's there.

[Ish]

Cause it's Bacardi.

[Parks]

Bacardi's not the end of the world,

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

but oh, now see, it's better than that. Okay, I'll go back, I'll go back.

[Parks]

As long as you're not getting like. I feel like you had like Bacardi Raz or some shit like that. Bacardi Limone, Bacardi Lamone.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

I'm not a fucking 22 year old girl in the 90s. That might be it.

[Joe Budden]

The other problem with Mona going to that store is I got a good guess in my mind as to how much money she makes every month. And at that number you can't go to Delaware no more, Mona. You have to move from Delaware. I said that when I seen her story one time and she was just filming out the window, I was like,

[Parks]

oh, you can live in Delaware. Just maybe not where she lives in Delaware.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Here's the problem. She live in a good spot. The way she explained it to me was when you live in there at a certain time, all you go one way is you in center, you in downtown, the other way you in the hood. And then the good part, everything shuts down like 4 or 5 o'. Clock. So if you want something, even like a bag of chips, you gotta go the other direction.

[Parks]

I don't believe it.

[Joe Budden]

That's how they keep good people in the good part.

[Ish]

I mean.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Shut up, shut up.

[Ish]

No, that's how they keep crime down. I'm deadass. If everything's shut down at 9 o', clock, you have no reason to be outside. You don't have an excuse.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

In your town, what you doing here? No, in your town. Right, right. Everything used to shut down. Yes. At nine o' clock at night. You have no reason. That's true loitering. You don't have no reason.

[Ish]

Ain't no gas stations over there. You can't even say, yo, I'm going

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

to get gas, officer.

[Joe Budden]

And if they see you all around

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

there, shout out to Mona. For holding it down though. For being mature. Thousand percent way mature. More mature than me. I love Mona for that. Not a lady, but a man. Oh my God, you talking to me like that and somebody might be recording.

[Ish]

You done tore that whole up.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Yeah, but no shout out to my. I really, I like how she handled it. I really think that's a good point. The camera shit. Not just with mono in general. The camera shit will make you do shit you wouldn't. It will amplify it. You almost can't back down.

[Ish]

You don't wanna be embarrassed one way or the other. Or the camera shit could make you feel a little bit more mindful and say, you know what? I gotta chill because I got shit to lose.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Right.

[Ish]

Sometimes the camera reminds you of that.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Yeah.

[Ish]

Like, you know what?

[Joe Budden]

Can't do it.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

But you can't take a L on camera. What do you think about this? To you ass. Who you, who you, who you say goodbye to?

[Joe Budden]

I don't understand.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Who you saying, who is this to?

[Joe Budden]

No. Sometimes it's hard not to go to the store where they killing us at. Sometimes it's hard not to go to that block where them got the machetes. Hey, all you got to do is play this song in your head and picture the people closest to you crying up a storm and it'll change your whole door program process. Hey, if you do that, you won't go to Delaware no more. Hey, if you listening to this broadcast from Delaware, leave now. Get out of there. Ain't nothing there for you.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

No taxes.

[Joe Budden]

I'm not listening to you. There's nothing there that is not Wilmington is cool. Never going to Del call you. Never going call me for what I turned in. I would turn down a trip to Delaware in a New York second. I'm not going to Delaware for nothing. Unless I'm that little Waffle House on my way down south, I'll stop over there. But stopping in Delaware for something.

[Ish]

So it's a Waffle House.

[Joe Budden]

Yeah, yeah,

[Ish]

it's Maryland.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

He did the same thing, the mayor.

[Joe Budden]

Cor, as soon as you get there too. See, that's how they even the Waffle House know that. Yo, stop right in the beginning. Like, if you keep going, it ain't for you.

[Ish]

Get it right here.

[Joe Budden]

I seen something on something going around last week on Instagram they was doing if all the hoods in New Jersey did like a warrior style hand to hand combat with all the hoods in New York City, who wins? And the consensus was that that New Jersey would absolutely dog walk all of them New York hoods. Partly because there's barely any real true hoods remaining in New York. Like they were saying with gentrification. Like how many places are you telling somebody, yo, you shouldn't go over there in New York? Nah, they going wherever the fuck they feel like it. With the exception of maybe six places Seven places.

[Ish]

It ain't like it used to be.

[Joe Budden]

Yeah, it ain't like that.

[Ish]

It ain't like that.

[Joe Budden]

However, in New Jersey, it's a lot of that shit. It's still quite a few of those. And I just thought it was interesting. I never thought about it, but now that I think about it, yeah. I ain't never got beat up by nobody from New York at all.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

They cleaning up Jersey.

[Joe Budden]

Never? Never, Never, no, never, no, never. It's never happened.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Really?

[Joe Budden]

Yes.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Okay.

[Joe Budden]

This nigga's a dick, yo. Oh, I mean, when it was. I see what you're doing.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

I'm glad you live.

[Joe Budden]

I see what you.

[Parks]

Oh, no.

[Joe Budden]

Have I gotten hit? Hit by people in New York, of course. But have I gotten beat up from somebody in New York? That's never happened.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Gotcha.

[Joe Budden]

That's never happened. Got you. Oh, man.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

If there's a. If there's. So if. If there's a beef warrior style battle between New York and New Jersey, you ride in with Jersey.

[Joe Budden]

Are you asking me who I think would win?

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

No, no.

[Ish]

What side? You.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

What side would you be on?

[Joe Budden]

The winning side.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Oh. So where you think the gangsters went? That was in New York. Where you think they had?

[Joe Budden]

Atlanta, Charlotte.

[Ish]

Atlanta.

[Joe Budden]

There's a lot of in Atlanta, Charlotte, D.C. atlanta. Some of them went to Florida. Oh, no, no. They ain't as good.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Brownsville. Ben. I just came from Brownsville. I just came from.

[Joe Budden]

Oh, you on that Mona time.

[Parks]

Yes.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

East New York.

[Joe Budden]

No. Mona was on the flip side.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Stop it. I'm not arguing with anybody on camera. Shout out to Mona. Man, I. With mono.

[Joe Budden]

You do a whole theatric scene when you about to get beat up somewhere you shouldn't be like, you walk to your car, take your watch off, pop the glove compartment, close it, tell OG Just walking you. Nah, nah, nah.

[Ish]

It's cool, it's cool.

[Joe Budden]

Leave Mike gonna do nothing to him. You do a whole movie when you buy.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

No.

[Joe Budden]

Was there.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Shout out to Bino.

[Joe Budden]

Shout out to Bino.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Two. Bino was dead. He was whispering, flip, let it go.

[Joe Budden]

But his.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Here's the thing. I've learned my lesson. Being outside in Brooklyn three in the morning with a chain on her mother Gaston. When they pulled it off my neck, I learned being out there, thirsty, doing what I wasn't supposed to do. Playing around family house. I mean, at home, playing around. Nigga took it, right?

[Joe Budden]

Yeah.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

I'm not playing. So you gotta be theatrical. Because even when they pulled it off my neck and I was yelling. Cause I had to, you know, I had a friend with me.

[Ish]

I was yelling.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

They didn't care about none of that shit. Them niggas came out a dollar. Them niggas came out of minivan. They didn't care.

[Joe Budden]

Brooklyn, another place I don't go, I don't go. And, boy, the party scene be looking nice. And some of the best. Some of the best food. Some of the greatest food I see on socials is right there in Brooklyn. I hit a double tap and scroll away from that little lobster Mac and cheese.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Have you ever had a Dumbo run?

[Joe Budden]

I'm cool. Huh?

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Did you have a Dumbo run when you were going to Dumbo?

[Joe Budden]

One time and one time only. Really? I ain't playing all of that shit. Come on, Joe. Oh, please. I know a layup outside of Dumbo. Wait for all you stupid to come right outside.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

No, they won't.

[Joe Budden]

Yes, they will. I hear you. Yeah. No, I'm cool. Y' all can have Brooklyn. Even when I called BDOT for his esthetician, who in Brooklyn. I called for the. For the home fee. Hey, how much it costs for you to leave there and come to Jersey? Cause I'll pay it. Yeah, I'll pay. I'm not going to Brooklyn.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

It's cool.

[Ish]

No Brooklyn at all for nothing.

[Joe Budden]

Nothing. No ice like that.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

No more.

[Ish]

Especially most of the parts.

[Parks]

It depends on what part.

[Joe Budden]

It don't matter.

[Ish]

You'll go to a show.

[Joe Budden]

When I used to run around and chase, a lot of it was in Brooklyn. And to the people out there that identify with that, they feel me. They feel me. I don't care that they changed it. I used to go to Brooklyn for in rough Pennsylvania Avenue.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

You ain't got mlk. You a Marcus Garvey. Question. Print this out.

[Parks]

What?

[Ish]

Had to print your out.

[Parks]

Print your out.

[Ish]

You riding around the map. Question, shorty. It's a football team on your block. What she tell you? Don't worry.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

They like my brothers. Brooklyn always outside.

[Joe Budden]

That was in Benson Hurst. Risking it all, boy.

[Ish]

I've been all.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

That's a good joke. It is.

[Parks]

It is.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

It was cool.

[Ish]

It was cool.

[Joe Budden]

Where y' all want to go catch

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

that joke since we don't let me catch it. Catch the joke. I'm out the joke. But don't let me catch it.

[Joe Budden]

It wasn't for you.

[Ish]

White people.

[Parks]

Russians.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

I thought it was somebody that we knew. No, no, no, no, no.

[Joe Budden]

You all right.

[Parks]

Any.

[Joe Budden]

Was there anything else in music that needed our attention or didn't need our attention that we're going to give it Attention. Anyway.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Well, it's not a music per se, but Meek Mill was. I see it on the board.

[Ish]

Meek with another tweet, man.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

He sent out a late night tweet. Another one?

[Ish]

Let me read the Meek tweet, man. Meek is guaranteed to give you one. Yo, hold on, I got it.

[Joe Budden]

One thing for certain, y' all gonna always report on a Meek tweet.

[Parks]

They're usually pretty.

[Ish]

They're great. They're absolutely great.

[Joe Budden]

We never get follow up, which is why I be mad. Like, he come to Twitter, he say what he need and we never hear nothing about it again. And we come in the pod, we clown, and then that's the end. So it does the same thing. I want to know if he got progress.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

I don't know Instagram, though.

[Ish]

Meek tweeted, I need a doctor in ac. I messed my hand up. It may be fractured. Yeah, I'm good, but I might need a soft cast. Anybody that could help me.

[Joe Budden]

That's hilarious.

[Ish]

What time was it? That's a good question.

[Parks]

Important question. Yeah.

[Ish]

No. 6:41pm On a hot Saturday.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Yeah. Pretty early in Atlantic City. So I guess that's. This is the part I don't understand, and I love Meek and I think it's a fair question.

[Joe Budden]

This part you don't understand.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

I understand that people hurt their hand. I understand that people need soft cast.

[Joe Budden]

Right.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

I would assume you go to the hospital or urgent care.

[Ish]

At best. I might go to Walgreens or something and just grab.

[Joe Budden]

If I could just grab.

[Ish]

Get something to hold me over for right now.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

So I think I don't get what he was looking for, where to go. I mean, if I know that. I mean, all of us know to look at those places. Was that like Cove or something?

[Ish]

No, but it could be. Now I understand it. Listen, a little more context, okay?

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

That's what I'm saying.

[Ish]

Like if you a local, you know, it could be a shitty hospital and it could be the good hospital. So niggas in your timeline will be like, yo, don't go over there to blah, blah, blah. You gonna be in the emergency room for seven hours. They be killing over there. Go to this hospital.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

That makes sense to me.

[Ish]

So that's a possibility.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

It all makes sense. Although this doesn't think it's a good hospital in Atlantic City.

[Joe Budden]

Okay?

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

There's nothing. There's very few good things in Atlantic City.

[Ish]

Maybe that's why he tweeted it now, because he might know.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

That's true. Me being ac, they fixed up ac didn't they.

[Joe Budden]

No, no. There's absolutely zero reason to be in Atlantic City. If I sit here long enough, I could give y' all a list of hundreds of places not to be nowhere. Yeah, you don't need to be at all. Atlantic City is one of them.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

People move from Atlantic City and go to Delaware.

[Joe Budden]

Really?

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

From Philly and go to Delaware.

[Joe Budden]

My dad was they dead at his little time. He was mad. They kicked their ass right out Atlantic City, where was that?

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Yeah, unless you gambling, you don't need to be in Atlantic City.

[Joe Budden]

You gambling if you in Atlantic City.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

That's a fact.

[Joe Budden]

With more than with something. You gambling with something. Goddamn it.

[Parks]

Well, I hope Meek found the copper.

[Ish]

Yeah, get right.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

But I'm glad you clim because that's the thing. A lot of times people clown Meek for and what he says actually makes sense.

[Joe Budden]

You.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

It just need. He just doesn't sometimes explain the reason why he's asking.

[Ish]

Yo, one thing you going to do, shoot a Philly some bell.

[Joe Budden]

He going to ride for them Philly. Cuz.

[Parks]

I mean, I think you could also just like ask whoever you're there in AC with.

[Ish]

They might not be from AC Fam. You could ask somebody in AC or somebody that you.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

You.

[Ish]

You got somebody to go talk to. He can ask thousands of people that follow. Yeah, true. I get it.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Yeah. I'm shot him. Yo, why are we talking about late night activity? Yeah, this Brandon Marshall thing, I think it's interesting. I have mixed feelings on it.

[Ish]

What happened?

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

So Brandon Marshall made a post on social media where he's showing him forcing his son to run at 2am as a.

[Ish]

How does this.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

How was a kid?

[Joe Budden]

How was a kid?

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

I don't know.

[Ish]

Did y' all see him? Like, how old did he look?

[Joe Budden]

Well, yeah, it was on video.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Looking at his height, it's hard. Cause Brandon Marsh is a big guy. That's why it's hard for me to know. I don't wanna. I don't worry about this. That's all the Internet will focus on is the wrong age. But he was young. And I want to say like 10, but I could be wrong. You know what I mean? Just looking at him real fast. But. And he posted it and said, you know, this is not my friend, it's my son. And I'm teaching him to be a warrior. You know, I'm teaching him discipline. It was a punishment for something. And the kid very clearly didn't want to be running at 2:00am Nobody wants to be running at 2:00am except like Rocky.

[Parks]

Right.

[Ish]

So he about to be 11.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

He about to be. Oh, damn.

[Joe Budden]

I got it.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Nailed it. Okay, so he want. He didn't want to be running. And so the Internet is in an uproar. They said that this is child abuse.

[Joe Budden]

Here we go.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

That this is not healthy parenting, et cetera, et cetera, et cetera, et cetera. And I want to know what y' all thought about it. I have mixed feelings about it. What is the mixed feelings? I would. I don't think we should physically beat our children.

[Joe Budden]

Right.

[Ish]

Yeah.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

So imposing discipline that are alternatives to physical. Physically beating your children seem would make sense.

[Joe Budden]

Right.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

There's a point where the physical punishment or the physical exercise could be nowhere. For example, if you spank your kid. And I said, I'm not gonna spank my kid. I'm gonna have him do a thousand push ups.

[Ish]

Same.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Yeah. I mean, like, I'm not sure that that's better. I'm not saying that's what this is. I'm just saying. So I don't want to say that just because you didn't spank them, that makes it. Yeah, I know. But here's my point. I'm saying I don't, I don't want to assume that just because you're not spanking them that just that any exercises is like an acceptable alternative. I'm conflicted on whether you should have your son do that or not. I actually, I don't feel good or bad about it. The thing I have issue with, the thing that I would not have done, is put it on social media. I don't like the public shaming of it. You know what I mean? I can't say I won't have my son run at 2am I might. I mean, you could make a case to me for why I shouldn't and you might persuade me because again, I'm on the fence about it. But I think when we discipline our kids and put on Instagram, I think to me, that's the part that I don't like because it feels like a little bit like there's a humiliation that comes with that.

[Parks]

That. Was it a disciplinary thing?

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Yeah.

[Ish]

Oh, yes. So. So, yeah.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

It wasn't like, I want you to be a good runner.

[Parks]

Oh, okay.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

It was like you didn't. I told you, say, your brother some syrup. That type.

[Parks]

Got it.

[Ish]

Normally I'd be. I'm, I'm, I'm against the whole put it on Instagram, put on social media. But today. And that's why I asked. Yeah. That's what matters to them, to the children. So it's like I gotta. I almost gotta affect you in your world. I gotta put this out there in the world where it matters to you.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Is that different than our mamas coming up to school and beating us at the school?

[Ish]

Nope, it's the same.

[Joe Budden]

Same thing.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

And I get it. Same thing. But again, I didn't like that either. For the same reason I'm not.

[Ish]

Again, I wouldn't necessarily. I wouldn't have the kid run. Personally, I still would discipline the child, but I'm not against putting it on social media. So it affects your world.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Got you.

[Ish]

I wouldn't do the running part.

[Parks]

Right.

[Ish]

But whatever you decide, you know better than anybody. Like, here we go.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

I couldn't find this 10 year, five years from now.

[Joe Budden]

Hold up, Mark. Oh, sorry, L.A. santa Monica.

[Ish]

Running at midnight on the pier. We wanted to do that. We love to do that. And then there's correction.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Then there's discipline.

[Ish]

You're walking, run, run, discipline. Correction is good. Even two in the morning, we run. I'm going to put my hands on you. But I'm training you up to be a warrior. I'm training you be up to be a leader, to serve, to have discipline,

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

to be better than me.

[Joe Budden]

Run, run.

[Ish]

Let's go. If you don't start running, we're gonna go three miles. So you better start running because you don't know when I'm gonna tell you to stop. You don't want to listen. We run, we work two in the morning.

[Joe Budden]

He's in the car, driving beside him.

[Ish]

Yeah, we should be going at 8 or 9 miles per hour right now. Gonna get to 9 miles per hour all the way to the gas station, which is 3 miles.

[Joe Budden]

The far one, too. The far gas station, not the close one. Tell them, Brandon. I'm at five.

[Ish]

I'm at six.

[Joe Budden]

There we go.

[Ish]

Now we move. Moving.

[Parks]

Run,

[Ish]

discipline.

[Joe Budden]

See, that's the tough part about being a girl, dad. Like waking up.

[Ish]

I'm not opposed to it.

[Joe Budden]

Wait, huh?

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Can't do that.

[Joe Budden]

Waking up, getting out the bed. Come on, Little Miss Marmalade. You didn't. You didn't listen. Come on. Run, run.

[Parks]

Eight miles an hour.

[Joe Budden]

Come on. I got all these girl dancing. Come on, man. What y' all think about this?

[Ish]

Not opposed to.

[Parks]

To it.

[Ish]

I think that we're just in an age where any type of disciplinary action is scrutinized. It's going to draw some level of criticism. Like,

[Joe Budden]

I thought he was going to make some jokes about what?

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

We not going to wake our daughters up to run. That's 1, 2. I. I agree with this.

[Joe Budden]

Let's make some jokes about this. Waking his kid up to go run.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

It's all, yo, dog.

[Ish]

Looked at Rick Brunson like he was crazy.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

You know what my mom did to me, boy. See, that don't bother me. You know what I got why people, look, he's not being punished.

[Ish]

No, he wanted to quit. He's like, no, you can't quit.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Yeah, but I mean, you're training somebody. That's what any trainer would do. I'm saying, like, I'm okay with that. I get it.

[Joe Budden]

But he's training.

[Ish]

That's what he's doing.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

But. But there's a. The difference. For me, again, I don't. I'm conflicted about the particular choice. I think that's up to him as a parent.

[Ish]

Right.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Cause I don't think that that's. I don't think that's abusive. I just think it's just a question of what you like. For me, it's the social media part of it. That's the part I don't like. Because when your mom come and beat you at the school, which I also think is awful for all the reasons, it's to embarrass you, it's to embarrass you. It's to shame you. And for the rest of the school year, you kind of was that dude who got his ass beat at school. Right?

[Joe Budden]

Yeah.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

The problem is the Internet. It never goes away. If I do something at 8, I'm 17 and it's still there. I'm running for president in the school. Hold on until they call you the

[Ish]

King of New York and you put the crown on top of your head. Cause y' all just won the national champ. Because y' all just won the championship, the NBA championship. And now people look back and call your father an amazing person because he pushed you at 1 o' clock in the morning, 2 o' clock in the morning, 3 o' clock in the morning.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

He wasn't being humiliated in that video.

[Ish]

Yes. It wasn't. It wasn't fun.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

He was being pushed. I think it's a joke.

[Ish]

It wasn't nice. He wasn't being humiliated neither. He's saying run.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

No, he's making. He's in a truck riding next to him, telling him if I just truck. Get. I mean, come on, bro. You don't think we laughed just now before your mom. Before your mom came up to the school and beat you? How many times did she talk to you?

[Ish]

No. You showed out in the school.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Yeah. How many times did she warn you?

[Parks]

Yeah.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

You gotta show this consistent.

[Ish]

You are embarrassing me. You know, learn these things in this house. We have manners in this house. We have respect in this house. And once you step outside this house, you are embarrassing me, your father, your family, and thinking that people. If we raised you like that.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

I was disrespectful to my mom. And I gave trouble. She definitely make you rob my mother. I had to walk on the Bell Parkway. Cause I didn't want to listen. Yes, on the side, I did. I was disrespectful. All right. You disrespecting me. Your father not here. All right, Nigga, I don't care. She told me before I went to school, nigga, throwing rocks off the roof into ongoing traffic, you could kill somebody. Exactly. The issue ain't the walk again. I'm talking about the social media part. That's the only thing I'm taking issue with right now.

[Ish]

You have to. I think with any kind of discipline, you have to find what matters to that kid. And it has to affect them there. That's the way you get through to them. Like, whether it be. I got a family member where their moms made them wear the exact same clothes to school for a week because all they cared about was how they look. Yeah. So now I'm gonna make you wear the same outfit for the week. You get what I'm saying? It's whatever, Matt. With me, when I. The first time I came home with Fs, which was freshman year. I'm gonna take your electronics. They came and took all my music.

[Joe Budden]

All that.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Give me that Walkman.

[Ish]

Give me all your.

[Parks]

All your Master P for you.

[Ish]

All your. But. But again, but you have to. You gotta. That's what makes today with our kids. As soon as they up. Give me the iPad. The iPad.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

What year was this? Freeze. I don't necessarily agree with you.

[Ish]

Freshman year.

[Parks]

School.

[Ish]

Let me ask you a question. I'm not trying to argue. What disciplinary action do you deem okay, if they can't. If I can't take your iPad away from you, because that's what you cherish. So this is a form of punishment that I'm going to get a response that I want to get from you.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

What.

[Ish]

What type of.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

He just. He agrees with it. He just said, listen, I don't agree with it. The humiliation part.

[Ish]

He said, I don't agree with the iPad.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

I said, I don't necessarily agree with that. And the reason I'm saying necessarily is

[Parks]

because they got PBS and shit on there.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Can't take my pbs, my Kindle. It's because. And we did this with my daughter when she was a teenager. We took away her iPhone as a punishment. We took it for, like three months.

[Joe Budden]

That's good.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

No, but the problem is, when we were growing up, saying you can't have the phone meant you couldn't use the phone. When you take away somebody's phone now, that's. Often these kids don't go outside. You're taking away all social access. You're taking away all the. It's a bigger punishment than. So I'm not saying you can never take the phone away. I'm just saying when you. When you take the phone, it's not the same. Saying something you can't. You can't use your phone is different than saying you can't have access to any social media. You can't have access to any.

[Ish]

You can't call us in the case of emergency.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

You can't do. The stakes are just higher. But my point, again, just real quick, Just real quick, our ages was 6,

[Ish]

7, 8, and 10. They don't have phones. The iPads are only used in the house.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

So it's not issue with this. I have no issue. I have no issue. And to be clear, I'm not criticizing any of y' all individuals, parents. I'm just saying as we think about the punishment, sometimes they have to be bigger. Cause what we found with my daughter was when we took away her iPhone, which is different than the iPad, Admittedly, it wasn't. It was a much bigger punishment than we expected. We didn't realize how isolated she was from her friends. We didn't realize how isolated. And it actually created more problems than we expected because of the length of it. The punishment. Oh, yeah, you.

[Ish]

I'm about to say you went three months, though.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

That's what I'm saying.

[Ish]

You don't go that long. Like we. You go an appropriate amount of time just to let you know what it's like. You can't access your friends, but it's hard. You don't want to lose that access again. So do what the. You're supposed to do.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Now, here's the thing. Just. Just to use this. I. I don't think my daughter built. I think my daughter let me not use the exam. I don't want to say. Because she's an adult now, and I want her to make her.

[Ish]

Right.

[Joe Budden]

Right. Got it.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

But the punishment that we. The first punishment wasn't three months. First punishment was Three days, then it was a week, then it was a month, Then she snuck and used it anyway. You get what I'm saying? And at some point it's like, do these punishments work? Finding a punishment that works, I'm good with. Finally I hear your point about you gotta find something they care about. Everybody cares about not being humiliated. Everybody cares about not being embarrassed. But to me, just cause you don't wanna be embarrassed doesn't mean that embarrassing them should be the punishment. I just struggle with that and especially on social media because again, everything lives forever.

[Ish]

Again, they call him Rick Brunson, a genius.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

But he wasn't being.

[Ish]

There was criticism for how hard he was training him. He wanted to quit. He's like, no, you're not quitting. No, I think it was, I think, correct me if I'm wrong, I think the mother, his mother was there or something and was like, no, let him go. And he's like no. So again, yo, punishment is punishment. What you call over training somebody. And what Brandon Marshall was calling training. Training low key. When you look and his son is the results all American, first wide receiver picked in the draft. People gonna go back to be like, yo, that is what training looks like. I get what you're saying. Ish. The results may be the same, but the overtraining and punishment are two totally different things. They're not even close. One is being one is a result of an action. True. He Brandon Marshall made him do this. Now he might train him regularly. Cool. We talking about this particular video. Brandon Marshall is running with him. He's in the truck, got the kid running because of something he did.

[Joe Budden]

True.

[Ish]

Right, so this ain't just your.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

That's why he's doing at 2:00am yeah.

[Joe Budden]

And the Rick runs in this case, I want to say that it was under the premise of at any time, if you don't want to be a basketball player, say that and we'll never do this again.

[Ish]

But if you want to be a basketball player, you got to come, you have to.

[Joe Budden]

But if you want to be a basketball player, this is what we're doing. Right.

[Ish]

That's different than I'm punishing you for an action that you did. I mean we doing all this hoot

[Joe Budden]

nanny because of some non physical punishment.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

It is a physical punishment. He's not being beat.

[Ish]

That's true.

[Joe Budden]

It's still physical.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

You're making somebody run three miles is a physical punishment.

[Ish]

Run three miles. He just threatened him saying I'm gonna make you run through.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Running three blocks is a physical Punishment.

[Ish]

Let me ask you a question.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

No, it's literally. No, no. This is just a definition. If I ask you to do something physical as a punishment, it's a physical punishment.

[Ish]

Whether I make you do the chair

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

on the wall, it's a physical punishment.

[Ish]

Hold the books in front of your hands, it's a physical punishment.

[Joe Budden]

When we say physical punishment, we're talking about physical.

[Parks]

Physical abuse.

[Joe Budden]

Yeah, but I don't think you making your kid run three blocks or a mile is necessarily abusive.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

I don't either.

[Joe Budden]

Oh, okay.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

I think it can be. Again, my point is, it can be, though. Putting it on the Internet. My issue is the Internet part of it.

[Joe Budden]

You know, I'm with that, too.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Like. Like, there are ways to. Because. All right. Brandon Marshall and I are in the same fraternity. Right. And I know, which is why I think it's really interesting that he's doing it this way. Right. Because there's a long theory that the only way to enter a fraternity is by beating people in. And then other people say, well, there's other ways to impose physical discipline to create brotherhood other than physically beating people, calisthenics being one of them. So I'm with Brandon on that. I don't have an issue with that. I think, again, let parents decide what they want to do, as long as it's not abusive. I just think that when you humiliate people, and I think the Internet runs the risk of creating humiliation for people.

[Joe Budden]

There's lesson in humiliation, though.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Yo. It's.

[Joe Budden]

It's major lesson. Some people said that I bugged out for coming on. On air in front of all these people and telling my story about Trey. I feel completely opposite. I'm on the total other side of that. There. There's a lesson to learn that you didn't get from all the other places. So let's try it this way. And as it turns out, hundreds of people. He done told me all week, people been coming up to me just knocking sense. So, I mean, there's a difference.

[Ish]

There's a difference. And what I think you're trying to say is when you bring it to the Internet and social media, it never dies. It never goes away. So Trey could be 50 years old, and somebody could still come back and bring this story up and play this and throw it in your face.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

And you're also telling the story of it. What if you had the nest footage of him getting the beats? Right. Would you. Would you have put that on? Would you have put that. Would you have put that on Patreon? No, Right. So if it comes up, if someone did, let's say the guy put it up, that would live forever, and that would be far. I think the value of that would far outstrip, like, what he got from that. The value this week has been great. You told the story. He's also an adult, but you told the story. He got the lesson. Cool. But if the video were to go up, it's apples and oranges. I think it's less. I think they're the same fruit. More than Jalen Brunson. My point is the physical image of somebody being punished, it's humiliation, possibly.

[Ish]

I'm sorry.

[Joe Budden]

Go ahead, Flip.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

I just want to ask a question to Mark. So what do you say to the parents that exhausted all their resources in order to discipline a child and nothing happens? What do you say to that parent? I don't think there's ever such a thing as exhausting all our resources.

[Joe Budden]

Yes, there is.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

I think we all. I think we all. If you're. I don't believe. Why do you think military school is the last option? I think it's the last option people choose. There are other things that could be done. I'm not saying they're wrong again. What I'm saying is that oftentimes before we do something physical, we always say we've done everything else we could do.

[Joe Budden]

Yeah, that's true.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

And I'm saying that there are often other ideas, other resources, other things we can do besides that thing. I'm not saying that that particular thing could be. Is necessarily wrong again. If you want to send your kid to military school and you think that's the choice, have at it. That's not my issue.

[Joe Budden]

So you can't beat your kid, you can't make your kid run a block, and you can't put your kid's punishment on the Internet, bro.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

I didn't say you can't make your kid run. We keep saying that and then arguing it back out. He said the recording. I'm saying make your kid run. I'm saying just don't videotape it. That's what he's saying.

[Ish]

Yo, Joe.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

If he had just told the story of making his kid run, I would have been fine with it.

[Ish]

If Joe would have showed a tape of Trae getting beat up by a guy, that's nowhere near the same as me having my son run some blocks. We not gonna make them parallel.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

I didn't say they were parallel. You're missing my point. The parallel is the fact that the video lives forever.

[Ish]

That's and so when he. 20 years from now, if Trey getting his ass whooped by some stranger whose porch he stepped on, it's going to be viewed totally different than me making my son run as a form of punishment three or four blocks down the street. They are not the same in any way, shape or form.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

But you're talking about on.

[Ish]

That's not humiliation. Yes. On video, that's not humiliation.

[Joe Budden]

I also don't believe in the whole way. If you do something online, it lives forever. As a nigga that be looking for the doofy shit niggas was doing in 2014. It's tough to find.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

It can be.

[Joe Budden]

It's tough to find.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

They can be.

[Joe Budden]

Because some people got money, they'll go and do the shit where you want.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

There's a kid right now. Remember the kid whose dad gave him the George Jefferson haircut? Yes. Yes. He said, you wanna act like a grown man? I'm gonna treat you like a grown man. And cut the kid's hair back to look exactly like George Jefferson. The kid was like 12. That meme still pops up right now. 20 years later, the kid is fucking 30. But it's part of growing up, though. I think that's success for me.

[Joe Budden]

In closing, this is my take. I'm not telling it. I'm not saying it for it to be your take. I'm not telling nobody how to raise their kids. I don't and have never hit my kids. I'm not into that. Same my kids.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

That guy on the porch was the first.

[Joe Budden]

My kids also learn slower than me,

[Ish]

maybe as a result, same thing.

[Joe Budden]

They don't learn it as fast as I learned it. With all of this gentle parenting, this don't work. My mom took that yellow belt out. All she had to do was say, crack. I better fix up, yo.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Yeah, like my mom.

[Joe Budden]

Off the threat, off the look.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

What about the pill?

[Joe Budden]

My mom used to say. My mom used to say, I'm coming.

[Ish]

You coming up to the teeth, yo. When the police, they'll be like, I'm gonna get you.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Yeah.

[Ish]

And I knew to go home, put long johns on, sweatpants on some other shit and put my jeans on top.

[Joe Budden]

I was so.

[Ish]

And go to sleep and hope she don't wake you up.

[Joe Budden]

When the teacher or the principal. I'm calling your mother.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

And they knew what time it was. The teacher and principal knew what was happening.

[Joe Budden]

We are in class now. I gotta go phone home, Take the fucking phone off the hook on the sneak tent. You know how much I gotta do. I gotta change one Time I think I answered and was a parent like

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

I was a dad.

[Ish]

Yo, you had a deep voice when you was young.

[Joe Budden]

No, now I used to do. I used to forge signatures. Anything to not let these teachers know or not let mama know. Yeah, no, that's back when they had

[Ish]

the old answering machines too.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Yeah, the Rwanda. Take that.

[Ish]

Rwanda mother.

[Joe Budden]

Nah, I used to fuck it up. I used to put a whole new tape in there. Cause I'd fuck it up, I be gonna erase half of it. Then the other half. Come on. Nah, we putting a whole new tape.

[Ish]

Delete that number off the call ID box. Word. Word.

[Joe Budden]

I might even change the machine one time. Yo, this. Yo. Joe Budden don't have a parent. Yo. If you're looking for a parent of Joseph Anthony Button, he's raising himself. And if you take that into consideration, he's doing a pretty good job job. Anyway. Mark. Yeah. We making these kids run and we beating them and we putting them online. Take that to the cult. Take that up there with Janice Joplin, Barry Man, Barry Manilow and them. And Bruce, Bruce, Bruce. What's your favorite three Jlin song?

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

I don't have three. What does that have to do with anything?

[Joe Budden]

I'm just talking.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Yeah, they flip. They. They were Clyde and Clive Davis earlier, before you got.

[Parks]

Maybe.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Yeah, he died yesterday. Yeah, I know that, but what. What do you mean they were clowning him? Well, in fairness, we're comparing him to Barry Gordy and just saying who had the biggest, like, impact. Impact or. And like talent development and talent finding people's. And who they said. I said Clive Davis and they were.

[Parks]

The right answer is Gordy.

[Joe Budden]

Yeah, Barry Gordy.

[Parks]

But you can listen to the first.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

The white answer is Clive Davis.

[Joe Budden]

I got you. What else is important? Important, unimportant. What else needs our attention?

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Oh, I want to send. I meant to send you this clip, Joe, of Neo and his girlfriend.

[Joe Budden]

Okay.

[Ish]

All right. Okay.

[Joe Budden]

Shout out to Neo. Neo's still a friend of the show. Even though I don't like. Not one of them country songs he putting out.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

You don't like his country?

[Joe Budden]

Not one of them. Who get three girlfriends and say, you know what? But going country, I'm going country.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Why you don't like it though? You don't like that he's doing it or you don't like how it sounds?

[Joe Budden]

I don't like the song. He could do whatever you want. I just don't like it.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

It'll sound good how it sounds.

[Joe Budden]

You say, that's not for me. It ain't for me. I'm cool.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

So one of Neo's girlfriends. You like, God.

[Parks]

Brooks.

[Ish]

No.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

One of Neo's girlfriends was on an interview. I think she was live. And one of the fans sort of asked, like, how he. He divides his time amongst them or how he. How they spend time together, and she offered her explanation.

[Ish]

Oh, I thought they were Neil, man.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

And all of you three at the same time. Okay, Figured it.

[Parks]

He's got a big house, so what

[Ish]

he's done recently, he'll just, like, see

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

how long he's gonna be gone for

[Joe Budden]

furniture would help, and then he'll just

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

break it up into parts.

[Joe Budden]

So, yeah, that's what's going on at the moment. He was left with the hard work.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Munchy was left with the hard work.

[Parks]

Yeah.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Okay. So you don't have to sit through all the. All the. All the. The messiness of the clip. You get these days.

[Joe Budden]

You get these days. You get these days.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

And then we just schedule it.

[Parks]

It's all about scheduling.

[Ish]

Wait for our days.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

They got a spreadsheet.

[Parks]

It's all about scheduling.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

I thought if you had three girlfriends. This sounds like way more work and less fun than I would have imagined having three girlfriends.

[Parks]

I thought if you had three girlfriends, you would get rugs.

[Joe Budden]

Yo, you get what?

[Parks]

I didn't even see the video, but I can hear.

[Joe Budden]

There's no rugs.

[Parks]

There's not a single rug in the. That apartment.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Just bouncing. They definitely provided the furniture up three ways. Yeah.

[Parks]

Like, same time weak with the couch.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Right.

[Ish]

The 1st through the 14th.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

I. I don't. I've never had three girlfriends at the same time. Like this, but this don't sound fun. This sounds like more work you got to do. Like, cuz you. Everything you do on the first, you

[Joe Budden]

never had three girlfriends at the same time.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

I said like this, where everybody knows they the girlfriend.

[Joe Budden]

We not asking no brothers yet. Don't say that no more to me. What you were saying? Don't say that no more.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

I don't need to respond. I don't need to respond. The truth. Know, the thing is, he knows. Oh, he knows who. Yeah, he just plays dumb. Well, he knows how to be obtuse, just like he did with that. That running. He just. He's playing dumb for y'.

[Ish]

All.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Oh, so he know. Okay, the truth is worse. So when he said that, how can Mark possibly be an Eskimo brother to me? You saying that he.

[Joe Budden]

I don't see it.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

He was fully aware. You wouldn't. Ego's a motherfucker.

[Joe Budden]

Man, he took it.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

So you really do know. So just drink your fucking coffee and move on to the show. Let's get back to Neo.

[Joe Budden]

Y' all little.

[Parks]

Mmm.

[Joe Budden]

Now just sound like y' all ass cheeks whistling when y' all do it together, brother. I didn't say, hey, y' all shouldn't make no noise.

[Ish]

And that was them.

[Joe Budden]

Oh, now what you gonna say now? Take it back. He's gonna put me over there. This guy's crazy.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Three girlfriends? Yeah.

[Joe Budden]

So what?

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

What Flip. What do you make? I mean, you. You got insight on this.

[Parks]

It sounds like a headache.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

I don't have an insight. I'm married. I don't have no. I'm in some Neo. You're a pop culture person. I mean, I don't think it's that difficult once they're all on the same page. I don't know what the pop culture. Every time y' all look, y' all gonna distract me. Whatever he say, let me just say, why are you so worried about. I don't give a fuck.

[Parks]

That was a distraction in itself.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Yeah. I don't know. Listen, if your three girlfriends are on the same page and they know what's going on, it shouldn't be that difficult. I think it makes things three times easier. But you said three times harder. What's the schedule? You come into one place, y' all know what's up.

[Ish]

They don't know what's up.

[Parks]

We come into one unfurnished living room.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

We have no hoopla. I thought in my mind it was just, you got three girls. Y' all just walk around y' all all the time. You over here, you over here, you two hiding it. They all know you is. And.

[Ish]

And you Islamic, so. And your faith, you could have up to four, right?

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

I would never want that.

[Ish]

I'm just saying you could.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

That sounds like a fucking burn.

[Ish]

Everybody gotta have equal.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Shit. Yeah. Yeah, that sounds like a. That sounds like a.

[Ish]

You ain't got enough time to be doing all.

[Parks]

They just have to have equal.

[Joe Budden]

Wait, so you don't even have as many wives as your faith will allow? Don't say nothing. Do me a favor. Don't say that again. I'm getting mad.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Anyway, they're talking about legal marriage, like when you actually formally commit and marry somebody. I've said I don't want to do that to two people. Care to respond?

[Joe Budden]

No.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Okay. So again, drink your coffee.

[Joe Budden]

So, just to let you know, though, I. Her. I a. Yo, that was you.

[Ish]

Y.

[Joe Budden]

She might have been trying to use. She might have been Trying to use me to make you feel some type of way but let you know you

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

didn't know me yet I a hit

[Joe Budden]

but that don't mean I couldn't feel

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

I hadn't responded to you yet that

[Joe Budden]

don't mean I couldn't make you feel some type Yo, I got your button on my line. You could have yeah, you could have felt some type way I ain't hit, though. Don't believe him. Back to my coffee.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Yeah, thank you. Expeditiously.

[Joe Budden]

Hazelnut

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

okay? Yeah, I think I thought, like, polygamy or polyamory. I always thought I was more, like, freewheeling and fun and wild. This just sounds like you got to manage three relationships, dog.

[Joe Budden]

Anything with more than one girl is too much now, yo. Yeah, they annoying.

[Ish]

Yeah. But when one get on the same

[Joe Budden]

page

[Ish]

until she get annoyed, she gonna be annoyed.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Especially if they sketch.

[Ish]

That would be annoying in the beginning.

[Joe Budden]

She miss you.

[Parks]

Okay, not at the beginning, but 10

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

straight days for anybody is a pain in the ass.

[Ish]

That's why I'm only gonna do three.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Keep swapping 10 times. I got you.

[Joe Budden]

You know what I mean? I can't even imagine trying to cheat in the age of unrealistic expectations from chicks. Yeah, like, what does that even look like? Chill, chill.

[Ish]

Yo, honestly speaking, I can't even imagine being. Being single with these expectations. Like, dog, to be single, like, certain. Not everybody's expectation is not the same. So I don't want to say that, but, yo, my. A date is 500. Could potentially be 500.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

You got it.

[Ish]

Who you not to be dating multiples. I got one date every two months. You know what I'm saying? But now, that is crazy. Like, the expectations are just nuts. Like, I don't want. Will we staying in the Bahamas.

[Parks]

Can you imagine if all three of them.

[Joe Budden]

I don't want to stay there.

[Parks]

You imagine if all three of them are mad at you at the same time, which they probably are.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

That's probably a blessing. I get the out the house.

[Joe Budden]

That just sound like excitement, right?

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Oh, y' all mad. You know, we need some space.

[Ish]

You got a problem?

[Joe Budden]

Yes, another piece.

[Ish]

It's crazy. Crazy, son.

[Joe Budden]

Like, yeah, I've slowed down, but I used to try to make my girl mad at least once a month just to get that freedom feeling.

[Ish]

How many more days you got, yo? And you'll say that live on air is crazy.

[Joe Budden]

You know that? You know I know. I'm just saying, wasn't that, like, something anybody do?

[Ish]

No. How many more days you got?

[Joe Budden]

So how y' all get y' all freedom. Freedom Week or Freedom Day. Never mind. I feel like I asked y' all this last part.

[Parks]

Go downstairs.

[Joe Budden]

Getting honesty from y' all is.

[Ish]

Go downstairs.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

My wife go out enough that I just wait for her to go watch your.

[Joe Budden]

About mar.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

I'm serious. I love that. She texted me today. She about to go watch some soccer game. Haiti versus somebody. Some. I was like, go ahead.

[Ish]

My girl works.

[Joe Budden]

My wife works as well. Mark. Wife getting off on him? No, he don't care.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

I'm afraid that's the part you missing.

[Joe Budden]

He understand. Even if that were true, every time bring a story.

[Ish]

And I was like,

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

brazil, it's okay. She's going with a personal trainer. She's fine. He's a good guy.

[Joe Budden]

My girl tried that sh. Too Talk about, oh, we moving. So they came and took the mattress. Son, I got to go to a hotel. No, you don't. No, you don't.

[Ish]

You tried it. She wants to put a pallet on the floor.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Put the sheet on the floor, lay

[Joe Budden]

on the dog bed. Lay on the. Put a little sheet down. Oh, damn.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

I didn't even know you knew what some shits look like.

[Joe Budden]

So st. Girl, Girl. Anyway, don't worry about it. I see you this air mattress real quick. I got you. Oh, I'm talking exactly. Oh, my God.

[Ish]

Hotel.

[Joe Budden]

Y' all crazy jokes is nuts. Imagine your girl checking into a hotel without you.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

No, I can't imagine it.

[Joe Budden]

I can't.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

You. I can't imagine that.

[Joe Budden]

I can't imagine what.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

I can't imagine what. These is crazy. Steve in the car.

[Joe Budden]

Boy.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Your girl can't stay at a hotel without you. I can't imagine it.

[Joe Budden]

But listen, when it comes to. But when it come to these topics, it's fun to. It's. It's fun that I know. Know that me Flip and ice are crazy, and you Ish. And parks are not.

[Parks]

That's true.

[Ish]

Yes.

[Joe Budden]

That helps me when we do this on air like this.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

That's fair.

[Joe Budden]

We are. No, no. Me, him and freeze. You ain't even see it.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Come on, Joe. Girl, please.

[Ish]

Yo,

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

you still gotta use MapQuest with me. You can't even find no shit hotel.

[Joe Budden]

What? Yeah. Mr. Wendell would fucking survive for years without a hole.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

So if your girl.

[Joe Budden]

You can't do a couple nights.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

So in that instance, right.

[Ish]

Your girl.

[Joe Budden]

Yes.

[Ish]

Y' all move to California.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Yes.

[Ish]

You go there as the man to set up shop first, right? Yes. Then she comes. Right. So you want your family to come after?

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Of course.

[Ish]

All right, cool, Cool. So now they. They take the moving people come, they pack all your up, they put it in the truck.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Where's your girl stay home in the

[Ish]

house where she sleep? On the air mattress?

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Yeah, I have a couple of those there.

[Ish]

Good joint. They got this now with the pillow tops. The price of a hotel for the night.

[Joe Budden]

Well, and they.

[Ish]

Well, they got a. I just bought some from.

[Joe Budden]

They got a fridge. They got a fridge in that Range Rover.

[Parks]

Oh, yeah.

[Joe Budden]

Let that seat back. It's a fridge back there. He he nice and comfy. I'mma get my ass kicked.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

I'm getting cursed out for this.

[Joe Budden]

I'm getting up.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

I risk it.

[Joe Budden]

Somebody segue us into like this, cracking

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

a joke about his wife. Man, I'm telling the truth. Don't say that. My wife was in New York last week. I don't like that, though. I don't like. She's a. She's. She's a nice lady. Don't. She's a wonderful lady. That's why I trust her. Like, if she in New York work for the night and she got a meeting the next day, I'm not. Don't drive all the way back to the crib.

[Joe Budden]

Yo, when y'.

[Ish]

All.

[Joe Budden]

I see y' all had issue on this thing together.

[Parks]

When y'.

[Joe Budden]

All.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

It made me. Oh, please. No, no, no, no, no, no, no.

[Joe Budden]

Listen, enough of the now we playing games. Hey, that was cool.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Have a fire respect.

[Joe Budden]

I double stabbed it talking that shit. Kicking knowledge. That's my man. Subs going all the way up subscribe.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

But, yo, you said they gonna come on.

[Joe Budden]

No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

That's what we've been waiting for.

[Joe Budden]

No, no, no, no. Me invite me up there.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Y' all have an open invitation whenever

[Ish]

y' all want to.

[Parks]

No, no, no.

[Joe Budden]

Invite Joe Button up the end of that in this thing together show so I can talk.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Oh, you really come on.

[Joe Budden]

Yes.

[Ish]

What?

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

I'm gonna have a blasted. We take recording Thursday.

[Joe Budden]

Say less.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

All right.

[Joe Budden]

I get to ask questions back like Ish did.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Yeah.

[Joe Budden]

Oh, okay.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

You ask whatever you want.

[Joe Budden]

Oh, great. Yo, you better be careful with you.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

You want play it ain't live. I'mma Joe Button everything that make me look bad.

[Joe Budden]

No, no, no. Oh, my God.

[Ish]

Yo, man, that is funny.

[Joe Budden]

So, yeah. You look good up there, Mark.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

He killed it. And by the way, the subs are through the roof. Check out in this thing to get old.

[Joe Budden]

Don't take a sip when I compliment you.

[Ish]

Say thank you.

[Joe Budden]

This such a door you did again.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

You were dope.

[Joe Budden]

You look good up there.

[Ish]

Yeah. Thank you, sir.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

You almost made your subscribe almost crazy.

[Joe Budden]

I'mma subscribe one of these days.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

One of these days.

[Joe Budden]

One of these days. I'm subscribe.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

I like when you do that is I like when you go up there and just show the real you. Yeah, he killed it, yo. It really killed it, though. Hey, matter of fact, let me think about it. And flip, you welcome, too. Thank you.

[Joe Budden]

I appreciate.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Did you do a couple interviews? A couple. No, I don't. I come there a couple of times. If you need twice, I show twice.

[Joe Budden]

Oh, yeah. Nyla ain't got no single out.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

What you say? Oh, you said, boy. How to hear you say it again? Say it to my face. Say it to my face, boy.

[Joe Budden]

I said, Nyla don't have a single out right now.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Stop bringing up Nyla Black, man. That's my sister.

[Joe Budden]

I was a friend of the show.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Of course.

[Joe Budden]

I'm always. I'm always bringing up Nyla Black son of Nyla and.

[Parks]

And all of our sisters. You know what I mean? Shout out to all of our sisters.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

All of our sisters. Oh, your sisters, too. N N has met my wife, Nyla. My wife is a fan. Nyla is amazing, and I appreciate you for allowing me bringing up. Bringing her up here and sharing her with the world.

[Parks]

Thank you.

[Joe Budden]

All right, Mark, segue us to. Segue us to something fast before grenade call.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

So we did.

[Joe Budden]

Me girlfriend Nancy Guthrie is dead, but it was an accident.

[Parks]

But I don't understand why they were still.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

What is.

[Parks]

Why did they say this, like, a long time ago?

[Ish]

They say this officially.

[Parks]

They said. I read an article in CBS News, which is fairly repeated, that they said that the ransom note. And a note came two days later from the same IP or whatever. It was email, I think it was from the same IP address. And the second note was saying that she passed. We didn't mean for it to happen, but she's gone. And this was obvious at a ransom note? That's correct.

[Ish]

So why they ain't say nothing all this time for months? I don't drag that. I mean, they have proof, though.

[Parks]

But I don't know. This is why I'm confused. Like, why. Why?

[Joe Budden]

See, that's proof to me what somebody

[Ish]

say if the person who got him,

[Joe Budden]

if the person that was supposed to be in their bedroom is not there. And then the person that sent me the ransom note, yo, we took. We took her out of there. We got up out of there.

[Ish]

Yeah, they the ones that sent the ransom note.

[Parks]

And we want millions of dollars.

[Joe Budden]

Yeah, yeah.

[Parks]

And we're gonna take that serious.

[Joe Budden]

And she's no longer with it.

[Parks]

And now she's gone.

[Joe Budden]

And if I look everywhere, look up. Like, if I say, if I was a mother, we would've. Mother be like, as I searched everywhere, she wasn't there. Like, I'm gonna think there's some credence to these letters. That's all I'm saying.

[Ish]

And we ain't seen it since. Maybe, maybe, maybe this person know what they're talking about.

[Joe Budden]

I gotta hear how they accidentally killed Nancy Guthrie.

[Parks]

Well, she was very old, though.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Yeah.

[Joe Budden]

Yeah.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

It doesn't take much to kill somebody.

[Joe Budden]

Yeah, but I want to know what the accident was, because they.

[Ish]

All right.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Yo, what was that?

[Joe Budden]

What he did.

[Ish]

Yo, this is dark.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

What he did.

[Joe Budden]

Yo, that was.

[Ish]

I'm not repeating that.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Let me see.

[Parks]

You'll have to rewind. Rest in peace to Nancy Guthrie, if she is, in fact, gone.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

But just to be clear, Savannah still wants help finding her mom. She came on the Today show today and said, I love you guys and I love this place. This is an unusual and unprecedented, to say the least, to be sitting here. I don't have any comment on the story, the one you just mentioned, and I'm not involved in the coverage, but I can't pretend I'm not here. And so since I just want to take the opportunity to ask people, to really. To beg people to come forward, somebody knows something. And this is a new story today that's on your radar. But this is the life that my sister lives, that I live, that my brother lives, that our extended families live, that our children live every day. And we are in agony. We cannot be at peace. So she's begging people to come forward to help her find her mom and to figure out what's going on.

[Joe Budden]

I ain't gonna lie. If I was the kidnapper and had the mom in the back room, that speech wouldn't make me go back there and untie her.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Would or would not?

[Joe Budden]

Would not.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Oh, yeah, yeah.

[Joe Budden]

Nothing you just read is going to make me go back to. All right, come on. Let me send you back.

[Parks]

Well, no, if she's gone, rest in peace. I don't want to sound insensitive, but if I'm the kidnapper and she's gone and she just passed from maybe a heart, something or something. She's older and they already have my IP address. I'm not about to risk putting myself out there to return you the body.

[Joe Budden]

Well, the ransom note says if you give me $4 million. Then I'll return the body. Did they.

[Ish]

Did they pay anything?

[Joe Budden]

Not to my knowledge, but I'm not in the kidnapper's inner circle.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

That must be a hell of a quagmire, too, if you kidnap somebody and they die, natural causes on your watch.

[Joe Budden]

Right?

[Parks]

Like, you're still gonna get charged for that.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

That's what I'm saying. You're not just getting charged with kidnapping. So now they gotta make some tough decision. What do you think? Ish.

[Ish]

What'd you think?

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Huh? What do you think, Antoine Mar? What do you think?

[Ish]

Thoughts and prayers.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Yeah, thoughts and prayers, man. Shout out to her. That is a painful thing, though.

[Parks]

Yeah, it is, for sure.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

I can't even.

[Ish]

It's very up.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

If someone stole my mom, I don't even know what I would do. Yo, can you stop, bro? You got the chain? Like, God damn. I don't care about the chain. Stop doing that shit, bro. Talking about your fan and selling your ass for the chain. What are you talking about? Stop disrespecting your family. Disrespecting your. Am I disrespecting my family? Are you disrespecting Mama love? I would be devastated if somebody kidnapped my mom and told me I had to pay $4 million. Would you pay it? Hmm? I don't have $4 million. What'd you pay it? I called Joe. If Joe fronted.

[Joe Budden]

Have I met your mom?

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

No.

[Ish]

That's the question he asked.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

She's like, I might not even like your mom.

[Joe Budden]

Like, cool. At least got to meet the lady.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

It's fair. I did my best.

[Joe Budden]

Feel so dope. You're crazy.

[Ish]

Yo, Mark is nuts, bro.

[Joe Budden]

What else? What else, what else? What else?

[Ish]

Absolutely.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

So I think that we. We couldn't solve the Savannah Guthrie.

[Ish]

No.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

No, we couldn't. Mystery. No, we tried, but we were able, successfully, in the last 48 hours to solve the Jay Z hair controversy.

[Parks]

Oh, that's true.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

The Internet. And. And I actually. I'm actually happy this happened. So about two days ago. I think Beyonce is the one who released it, but it's certainly. It's a mini documentary about Jay Z's hair and the transition from his locks to blowing out the fro. Beyonce is narrating it. She's doing the voiceover, and she's telling the story of how that happened and why. In the documentary, she talks about why Jay Z initially got the locs. His daughter. Right. Which was for Blue Ivy, who wasn't feeling as confident about her hair as they wanted her to. And they wanted her to love every aspect of herself. So Jay is a kind of sign of, like, solidarity and love fire. Yeah, he did that with his hair, which I think is dope. And then for the transition, for the roots picnic, they showed the transition, and she said she was worried it wouldn't come out, but it did. And they showed the whole process. I love it for a couple reasons. One, I love what he did for his daughter. I think that's a beautiful thing.

[Parks]

I also love the capitalism of it all. Love the capitalism of it all.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Which part?

[Parks]

It's a commercial.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Oh, I mean. I mean, I don't love that part. No. I mean, but we live. I mean, we live in a world where commercials, it would be selective to

[Parks]

say, I like that part.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Yeah, I hate it.

[Parks]

You just always been anti Jay Z's capitalism, so I was curious how you felt about this capitalism.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

I'm anti all capitalism, but. But I work on a show that has advertisements. I say prize picks every day. It's not like, you know, not every day, but since I started playing, since I was there making money.

[Joe Budden]

Prize picks.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

I beat my chess for prize picks.

[Joe Budden]

Yeah. Cause when you first came here, you was standing on the hill. I think it was quiet.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Yeah.

[Joe Budden]

That nigga would not say that. Prize pick.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Well, I wasn't getting the prize picks resources either. You know what I mean? I wasn't being paid, but once I got that right, you know, found my voice once I eat over that balcony, yeah, I was good. But, yeah, no, I'm anti co. Mark,

[Joe Budden]

do you imagine how much more money you would make if you just came out and said, yo, a small part of me is down with it all?

[Ish]

He is down with it. He definitely.

[Joe Budden]

But he won't say it.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

No, I do say that.

[Joe Budden]

If he says it, I think that money go all the way up, but

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

I'm just not willing to do what it takes for it to go all the way up. There's certain things that I'm not willing

[Parks]

to do, like grow dreads and then get them.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

See, I don't think Jay did that for capitalism. I think I. I believe. I don't think he did that for. I think he did it for his daughter. I believe it.

[Parks]

I believe it. I believe it, too. I believe it, too.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

You know, and I. And I think a lot of shit

[Ish]

just tie up, like, coincident, like, all right, well, since we're going to do this, we can also.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

There's a profit here.

[Ish]

We got a company that.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

And that's the part that I don't love, but I don't you know, you can't avoid that. If Warren Buffett saved somebody from a burning building, I wouldn't, like, not be like. I wouldn't be like.

[Ish]

But then he just so happened to

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

buy the block, right? Now, did he own the building?

[Ish]

Right.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

But the act itself is fine. And so I love the beauty of this part of it. I love the story of it. But I also love the fact that the Internet makes up shit. They just make shit up. And I love the fact that. Cause everybody's saying those locks aren't real shit that we shouldn't even care about. I really didn't care. But it's just a rap reminder that people make shit up. And most of the time, Jay Z and Beyonce don't respond to the shit that people make up. So people just assume, well, if you didn't respond, it must be true.

[Ish]

True.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

So this is just an opportunity to say, you know what?

[Ish]

They still responding, making shit up, even with this. They saying, that's a lace front he got on.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

You can't fucking win, man.

[Ish]

There's people like, yo, listen, dog. First they going by his age. There's not a gray strand in sight. Then they were saying something else. I saw a couple people that had. Have men that have longer hair. It's like, yo, there's no way the hair here is the exact same length as this one here.

[Joe Budden]

Your hair grows differently.

[Ish]

All that type shit. That's the lace front. Like, they're running with it. Some people, you just can't. You can't prove it to them. Like, they're gonna have their thoughts, and no matter what you say or show them, it don't matter. They gonna believe what they going to. What they want to believe, and that's it. And it's a lot of them, especially right now, it's kind of. Of little. I don't know if it's like the tide is turning, but, like, ho was, like, universally loved, and it seems a lot of that is changing. So people are looking for anything to attack him over now, and they riding with it, and they like hammering any point they could find.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

And that's the part I don't actually like, because there are legitimate points of criticism that we should have, and then there's a bunch of shit that like his hair, whether it's a wig or not, that are stupid. And they all get mixed into the same pot, you know, and it's like, it almost cheapens the other critiques, and it takes the weight away from the stuff that we should be saying about people you know, I don't like that. We saw that with Nikki. Right? There are things that we're critical of Nikki, and then people are saying mean things about our kids. It's like, well, let's not do that. Like, that's personal. That's mean. That's not okay. We can have principal disagreements with people, and it all gets thrown into the pot. I think some of this is just generational. Like, there's not the. We have a reverence for our generation's artists, and the next generation be like, them.

[Parks]

Yeah, true.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Yeah.

[Joe Budden]

And they look.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

I think every generation does that, and that's what happens.

[Ish]

Cause we keep pushing. I mean, a lot of us were like, nah, whoever y' all naming, it don't matter. Jay Z's the goat. A lot of times they get a little tired of that. And like, yo, y', all your goat.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

And that's how you end up with niggas disrespecting Marvin K. Honestly, that part.

[Parks]

And Barry Gordy.

[Joe Budden]

That's crazy.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

And Barry Gordy.

[Parks]

I'm about to buy some Beyonce shampoo, though, man. I'm sold.

[Ish]

I was saying that shit.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

I didn't even watch the interview. What is the product being sold? No, I'm not being funny.

[Parks]

She sounds like a bunch of. It's got a hair care line.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Got it. And that's which they're saying he used to do.

[Parks]

Yes, of course.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

To help his hair grow.

[Parks]

Yep.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

I didn't watch it today. I ain't gonna lie.

[Joe Budden]

I just saw.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Once I heard the. About Blue, I was like, my heart was tugged, and I was done. Yeah, they got me.

[Ish]

They showed him taking the locks out and all that.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

I saw some of the combing up. I didn't.

[Joe Budden]

We got it. We got a draw. We got it on Jay Z's here.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Thank you. What you got, Joe Hair.

[Joe Budden]

Now, this really should have went in hour one, but I waited. When I tell you, dog, that. That the sheep stealer did.

[Parks]

Yo, I hate you.

[Joe Budden]

Let me.

[Parks]

Let me find out. You're a throne now, dog.

[Joe Budden]

Oh, the sheep stealer. He ain't come to play.

[Parks]

N Know what the.

[Ish]

He.

[Parks]

He was doing whatever he wanted to.

[Ish]

He a.

[Joe Budden]

He ain't come come to play it over.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Show me a video.

[Joe Budden]

Listen, I gotta pull it up now. Listen, this might be the meanest dragon that we've ever seen on House of Dragon.

[Parks]

No, he's a little special is the thing.

[Joe Budden]

And Raina, he got the.

[Parks]

He got the underbite.

[Joe Budden]

Yeah, but the way Raina. Hey, man, I'm serious. Y' all ain't see it.

[Parks]

I did.

[Joe Budden]

If you only. All right. Y. I won't spoil. Spoil it for people. But that came on the same season. Season three A House of Dragons.

[Parks]

It's out.

[Joe Budden]

Is out. Not only is it out, but many people are saying that that was one of the greatest House of Dragons episodes that they had ever seen.

[Parks]

It probably is the best, actually.

[Joe Budden]

Yeah. They said that that's the dragons.

[Parks]

It hasn't been good, so.

[Joe Budden]

Yeah, so.

[Ish]

I know.

[Joe Budden]

Yeah. But I saw people saying that season. That first episode could have been the season finale of how of the the main. And everybody would have been happy if

[Parks]

it was the same quality. Yeah. Yeah.

[Ish]

That's possible.

[Parks]

They did a lot.

[Joe Budden]

I did a lot. You got to see it when sleep stealing sheep. I mean, sheep steal sheep still. Sheep stealer, man. Seriously?

[Ish]

You didn't watch.

[Joe Budden]

Are you a throne?

[Parks]

He's a feral dragon.

[Joe Budden]

You can't tell me what I watch.

[Parks]

Brain in the dragon.

[Ish]

Yes, he watched that.

[Joe Budden]

I'm telling y' all watched it.

[Ish]

You might believe it.

[Joe Budden]

I watched it.

[Ish]

All right, but. But you don't know what they. What's going on.

[Parks]

So just a little recap at the beginning. Catch up.

[Ish]

Get the out of here.

[Parks]

I watched all two seasons before this and I still don't know what's going on. I gotta watch the recap.

[Ish]

Yeah, you gotta watch recaps now because

[Parks]

I gotta look up the family trees.

[Ish]

And a year or two between seasons, you forget what the happened is.

[Joe Budden]

I love the recap.

[Ish]

You gotta have a. I love to read anything I watch. I gotta have a reason.

[Parks]

His mom that he's kissing. If it is his mom that he's kissing. This is weird. God damn.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Damn it.

[Parks]

Back to the incident.

[Joe Budden]

If more than a week pass. I forgot whatever was on the last episode.

[Ish]

I did. So you watched too much.

[Parks]

Especially with Game of Thrones. That is.

[Joe Budden]

Yeah.

[Parks]

Damn near a different language.

[Joe Budden]

I'm gonna go back and watch the Jared from Subway Doc. Just because the one from 2023. I am. That's it. Just cause I am.

[Ish]

I hear you, bro.

[Joe Budden]

You got three episodes. Jared.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

I think he's home.

[Joe Budden]

You better not be home. We pulling up.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Up.

[Joe Budden]

We get him off the streets if he's on.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Get him off. Get him out of here.

[Joe Budden]

Out of here, Jared.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

What else?

[Joe Budden]

What else?

[Ish]

What else?

[Joe Budden]

We ran through Meek Folio's killers, all sentenced. I happen to see the video of the young man plea pleading with the judge saying that he thinks his life sentence was too harsh, considering he had the same role in the Crime as the. As he did that bug man, he did call her. His girlfriend. Called his girlfriend. And then the judge was like, well, I don't know if this is your current, if this is your former, but apparently she got 15 years.

[Ish]

She got 15 for manslaughter, he gets life.

[Joe Budden]

But he was tried with the whole crew, the four. And that was part of what he was saying to the judge. Listen, I feel like injustice has been done for the same exact role. I got a way harsher penalty and I feel like I'm being penalized because my group, I was on trial with, my group, they did a lot of bullshit. They got life. So I feel like I get life. And I feel like the destination played a part because we were here and then she was wherever she was. But he laid out a case that sounded strong until the judge started talking like, yo, dog, I don't give a fuck about what you said. None of it. You're done.

[Ish]

They said.

[Joe Budden]

What was the response?

[Ish]

They said from the rip that they ain't play that shit like again. They traveled up there to Tampa to do that. That and even the police department, they was like, yo, we are. They took that super serious. Was like, yo, we not having that up here. Like, we going to make examples out of everybody. Don't bring that up here. Whatever y' all got going, keep it down there.

[Joe Budden]

Yeah.

[Ish]

So that whole Killy J coming up here. Yeah, yeah. Not coming up here with that. They. They tried to make examples out of all of them. I. I heard the sincerity in his voice though. When he started appealing to the people from their hood, he's like, yo, bro, yeah, this shit ain't worth it. The shit ain't worth it. He's like, yo, we killing each other. We doing this stuff, we doing that stuff. Only person that's gonna support you is your mother and maybe a friend. And he was like, yo, it's just not worth it. So I saw, I only saw. I saw three of them. One of them seemed like he ain't give a fuck. But the light skinned kid that had the turtleneck on and homeboy just now, honestly, they seem like they was decent kids. Like, decent. You know what I'm saying? And we just be getting caught up in the street and what we think is cool and what the neighborhood is saying and what these rap songs are saying, and it's making these little go do dumb. These kids sound like decent kids. If you took them out of whatever murder they was going on, even though they.

[Joe Budden]

Yeah, that's where he's losing yeah, they're decent kids.

[Parks]

Until the murder.

[Joe Budden]

They're not decent kids. Kids.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

He's trying to say that they grew up in a.

[Ish]

But it's easy. Like, better opportunities than others. Easier said than done. But I think he said, what's easier

[Joe Budden]

to not go shoot. What the Are we doing? Look it. What? Easier said than done.

[Ish]

What. What I'm trying to say is I could see a world where a good kid following behind somebody, gets in the car with them and go do some with them. Him that might not be of his normal character. And now you got to deal with the consequences of that. One of the dudes there, I think that was. I think. I think Fulio. I could be wrong here. Has something to do with his cousin being killed or something. One of them there was on time, and he showed no remorse. He knew what it was. He just waiting to go, yo, send me up. Yes. Like, yeah, I did it. Like, the whole trial. And you could see a person like that maybe recruiting some people to, yo, come on, come slide with me. And they might have just been, I don't know, these niggas. But just seeing the lack of remorse and then seeing these n look like, oh, shit, I made a mistake. Where one nigga like, nah, this wasn't a mistake. I knew what I came to do. I knew what came with it. Sign me up. It is what it is.

[Joe Budden]

Him I'm not talking about. I saw that. He feels vindicated. In his mind, he did exactly what he meant to go, yeah, so I'm not really talking about him.

[Ish]

Get people that might not understand the gravity of all that. Yo, come on. We getting ready to go do this. Come with me. Whatever. Or you trying to get down. Bet you want to get down. Come do this. And they might not have been built.

[Joe Budden]

I'm just not calling that kid a good kid once he makes that decision.

[Parks]

Agreed.

[Joe Budden]

You're not a good kid. Your man talks you into not only getting in the car to go kill this little young nigga on the night of his birthday, but if we taking all details into account, y' all stalked the kid for fucking ages. Yeah.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Yeah, they did.

[Joe Budden]

Good is just not the adjective that comes to mind.

[Parks]

There's other.

[Ish]

With this type of story, you could be right.

[Joe Budden]

No matter how homeboy voice sound, I'm watching this shit, and all I could look at was his arms. All I could look at was his arms. So no matter how his voice sounded, I'm looking at his arms, and I'm like, yeah, this is the kid. They gotta go grab a Gun or somebody do something to him. He ain't. He don't look like he got nothing near fighting him. Nothing.

[Ish]

That's how he look.

[Joe Budden]

That's where my mind. That's where my mind went.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

I think what Freeze is talking about is the kid that, that, that you just riding with your cousin and you

[Ish]

just happen to do something or I think that.

[Joe Budden]

Okay, but that's not what happened here. Okay, but you wasn't just riding and unbeknownst to you, a. You a nigga pulled out and just started killing somebody. That's not this case. I'm only talking about this specific case. I'm not calling these kids good kids is fucking terrorists.

[Ish]

I think that, I think. Not a bad point. I just think that we minimalize these issues in these communities so easily that until that shit really hits you like y' all just killed somebody. And I'm looking at life in prison. And I'm never gonna see my family. I'm never gonna see my friends. I'm never gonna see all that shit. The shit that we took with a grain of salt really ain't to be taken with a grain of salt. It's some real, real, real consequences behind that. Till you see somebody's family crying in a courtroom that you did something today, kid, that hits differently. And again, when you listen to these rap songs and you seeing all of this, it don't really, really, really paint a real picture of what's going on in our environments. And some of these kids could be little corny ass schoolboy kids that just involved in the neighborhood and unfortunately the neighborhood be beating up and shooting niggas.

[Joe Budden]

Then you're not a good kid.

[Ish]

All right, cool.

[Joe Budden]

Then you're not a good kid.

[Ish]

Cool.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

You can, you can be a good kid and change overnight.

[Joe Budden]

Wait, what'd you say?

[Ish]

You can be a good kid and change overnight. That happens? Yeah.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

You can have good grades. You can have. You can live your life being respectful to your parents and you can get picked on and then change overnight.

[Joe Budden]

And then.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Doesn't take away the fact that you

[Joe Budden]

was a good kid or was. It's past tense. The second the change. Change occurs. You're not a good kid.

[Ish]

I see what you said.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

You're not a good kid. Maybe that's the question. Maybe I'm not

[Ish]

somebody that's not getting

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

out of

[Joe Budden]

somebody that's not murdering people. Down with the murder for hire. Putting money on somebody's head to be

[Parks]

murdered, stalking someone, or prepared to murder.

[Joe Budden]

Yeah, I'm dead. Sorry.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

I hear you.

[Parks]

I understand there's other to your point, there's other adjectives. There's probably better adjectives. Misguided, lost, sad, unfortunate situation. There's a lot of things that you could say, but good kid.

[Ish]

Yeah, you're not a good kid.

[Joe Budden]

That's all I'm saying.

[Ish]

Because I'm saying you could have been a good kid and then have gotten.

[Joe Budden]

That was me. I was a good kid in Jersey City 20 gabillion years ago. And whenever the crowd went over here and we was trying to be block versus block, all right, I'll run over here. We'll beat this kid up, all right? You punching him in the face. Whenever he's all right, we'll jump on him. Guess what? What? Once those things start to happen, I

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

ain't a good kid. Yeah.

[Joe Budden]

I'm not a good kid. I don't give a fuck what my mom's friends thought about me. I'm in the streets as a menace.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

I think that's the challenge sometimes. Is that like as parents or as adults? Elders who know you, we remember the best parts of you and we see the best parts of you. A lot of people have no idea who their kids are when they walk outside that house. You know, you still think, oh, that's my baby. And sometimes them babies, like Sam Jackson said, Was it Juice? I know a lot of kids, I know a lot of kids since they was killers. Killers since they was kids.

[Joe Budden]

Exactly.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Like sometimes you gotta remember that too real quick. And I do want to get off the subject. I'm familiar with a situation with a kid who was good and his brother got killed. I mean he overnight changed and he vowed to get vengeance for the person that killed his brother. Then after that he just kept on

[Joe Budden]

going and going and going.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

I mean that was the trigger point for him.

[Ish]

I, I. You listen to Von's music. That's kind of what he said. He saw his best friend get killed in front of him. He said that turned me in that moment I snapped and that turned me into something else.

[Joe Budden]

Now King Von's name is made his way.

[Ish]

No, I'm just talking about people that speak on this to point.

[Joe Budden]

Are you cream Talk about the you

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

don't know where the you came from, bro.

[Ish]

You act like people, people don't happen that cause just go the other way.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

You disagree with one of what he said?

[Ish]

Yeah, that's what I'm saying.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Like you don't know what we're saying. You know exactly what we're saying.

[Joe Budden]

King Von wasn't a good kid.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

We, we don't know anything about him.

[Joe Budden]

We know enough to say he wasn't ever a good kid.

[Ish]

You can't say never. That's the point. You don't know him prior to the.

[Joe Budden]

Got it. You don't know that his friend died and the demon was born. Then he killed 39. Got it. Got it. Listen, I'm unconditioning myself from some of this stupid hip hop shit. Y' all want to carry on.

[Ish]

I'm not even talking about hip hop.

[Joe Budden]

Shing Von was a good kid.

[Ish]

I never said King Von was a good kid.

[Joe Budden]

Safe to assume that.

[Ish]

No, you're putting words in people's mouths. Nobody said that. We're just saying. I'm speaking to him specifically saying something he saw changed him. Same thing. Flip was saying that where the. The dude's brother got killed and in that moment it changed him. And then he became something else.

[Joe Budden]

I'm saying to you, I think King Von in that story is full of shit. King Von is full of absolute shit. May he rest in peace. One a great, great artist.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

So do you think he was the best?

[Joe Budden]

I saw something happen and then the demon was born. No, you was doing bad shit and seen something bad happen. You wasn't just where you were supposed to be, just straight A student, and then you seen some bad.

[Parks]

There's plenty of people that said something

[Joe Budden]

tragic that didn't happen to him.

[Parks]

There's plenty of people that go through something tragic and don't go out and murder a bunch of people.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

For sure.

[Ish]

Yeah.

[Joe Budden]

Like the ones that do.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Here's the part I'm trying to understand how.

[Ish]

Because everybody. Because you wouldn't say that if it was a different trigger. Like some people trigger and they go left. Some people get triggered and go right. You can't necessarily say that because they pick left.

[Parks]

That if left is murdering a bunch of people.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Yeah, I'm just.

[Ish]

I'm saying for whatever it is.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

I hear what he's saying.

[Ish]

For whatever it is.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

He's saying that the fact that some people have awful things happen and don't turn out bad, that doesn't disprove the idea that the thing bad that happened made some people go the other way. Just like some people get abused and become super abusive or some people are an alcoholic and they become drug addicts and some never touch it. One doesn't disprove the other. It's just different. People have the same. Different reactions to the same thing.

[Parks]

I also think there's situations where actual good kids get caught in situations that they might not have even Been in the car with the murderer knowing a murder happened. I've told people that I grew up with that went through this. Those are good kids that got caught in a bad situation, got their life up. Let's save the good kid tag for those people.

[Ish]

We wasn't calling them good kids. I didn't call Von a good kid. He didn't call dude a good kid. We just said that something happened and it put them on a different path.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

I not.

[Ish]

I never said he was a good kid. I don't know that nigga's childhood.

[Joe Budden]

Different path implies that before you went

[Ish]

the different path, it might not have

[Joe Budden]

been different was happening.

[Ish]

It might not have been that path though, bro. Yeah, we can't say that. It might not have been. I'm going out to murder a bunch of. I might not have been the best. I could have been a gang member. I could have just been doing for my. I could have been selling drugs. I'm saying don't necessarily mean I'm out here killing a bunch of. Until I saw somebody that I love got murdered right in front of me. And now I'm pulling bloody. Now I gotta go get back for him. And now that it woke something else up in me. And now I'm out here laying down. Now it's just a circle effect where because I did something to this person, they coming back, coming at me. So now it's just a literal thing that happened like that. And the one thing that sparked it all could. I'm not saying it did. It could have been him seeing somebody get murdered in front of him that he loved. It's a possibility, bro.

[Joe Budden]

Everything in the world is a possibility.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

This is the only part I'm not getting because I hear you, that everybody wasn't an angel before they became this other thing. Are you then saying that some people are just born bad?

[Ish]

Yeah, you are who you are.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Did some kids are just because they were never a good kid.

[Joe Budden]

I don't know if I'm saying that.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Well, because the thing is if they were never a good kid, then that means they were always not a good kid. That's what I'm saying.

[Parks]

I think there are some people that are born bad, by the way. There's some people that have been raised in perfectly normal non traumatic situations that are fucking murderers and monsters. Like I think that does exist.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

That's why I'm asking. I'm trying to get a sense of how y' all see this. I don't have a dog in a fight. I was just curious to Know, because if. If you didn't become a. If you weren't a good kid who became a bad kid at some point, then you had to always be a bad kid.

[Joe Budden]

Right.

[Ish]

So I think there's something in you before you even get here that will determine how you respond to certain stimuluses. So depending on the type of person that you are, it could affect you positively or negative, negatively. You. That same trauma could happen to two people, but depending on who they are inside, their reactions to that are totally different.

[Parks]

I'm not mad at that too.

[Ish]

Yeah, yeah, I agree with that. Some people just are not the most empathetic people.

[Joe Budden]

And when the world sees what your reaction is to some things, then you may not be a good kid anymore.

[Parks]

That's true.

[Ish]

But true anymore.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Sound like y' all just disagree about when and where the.

[Ish]

No, that was true.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

I disagree about everything.

[Joe Budden]

I disagree about every single thing that these people have said on this top. I don't think King Von was a good kid. I don't think that Joe.

[Ish]

Nobody said. Nobody said good things.

[Joe Budden]

You're implying it though, when you say he saw someone die and that's when the demon.

[Ish]

I wasn't a murderer. Don't mean I was a good kid. High school kid, enlists in the service, goes to Vietnam, kills a whole bunch of people in Vietnam. Now he comes back totally changed than he was before he went to Vietnam.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Uh huh.

[Ish]

He was a murderer his whole life. Or did something trigger him, some stimulus that he saw and that he witnessed and that he lived through changed him forever. Good one.

[Parks]

That is a good one. I don't have a retort. I do think that if you sign up to go to war, you're some level okay with murdering people at some point in your life.

[Ish]

What if he got drafted?

[Parks]

That's a different conversation.

[Joe Budden]

Yeah, that's a different conversation when he comes back and the draft changes him. Nobody should say he's a good coach. That's it. That's all I got. That's all I got. That's all I got. We did it, we did it, we did it. Who else is good? Me some more Charles Manson. Yo. No, I gotta hear y'.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

All.

[Parks]

Listen.

[Ish]

Will paint some. Nobody said the list of good people. Not a soul said and he will paint that.

[Joe Budden]

The Long island murderer.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

God damn.

[Joe Budden]

He was good when he was 4.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

That's what they say though, when the parents do the documentary, when they do the voiceovers, they say how great they were as a kid.

[Joe Budden]

I never believed the pan when they come on there with these Guys had

[Ish]

an argument for freeing those brothers from California. Menendez.

[Joe Budden]

Who?

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

The Menendez brothers?

[Parks]

Yeah.

[Ish]

Most of the cast up here, I can't remember specifically who said it was like, yeah, I think there's a world where they got traumatized by their parents and they should be free. A lot of people up here said, I can't.

[Parks]

I think I did say that.

[Joe Budden]

Well, I think they should be free.

[Parks]

They also.

[Joe Budden]

I do think they should.

[Parks]

They also have served 30 or 40 years or something.

[Joe Budden]

Yeah, I think they should be free because. Yeah, they've been there.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

They did 30 years.

[Joe Budden]

They did it.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

They've been, like, since O.J. i think around that time. Yeah. Maybe before.

[Joe Budden]

Okay. That ain't saying. I think they're good people. I just think they should come out.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Man, we're doing a hell of a job. You don't feel like there's any gangsters out here or killers out here that would.

[Joe Budden]

That's good people.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Yes. Yes.

[Joe Budden]

That's a new question. Yes, I do.

[Ish]

So once they kill somebody, they no longer a good person, per your logic?

[Joe Budden]

We know some good.

[Parks]

I think there are situations in which you could kill someone and still be a good person.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

We know they good.

[Joe Budden]

We gonna move this shit all around the world. I think people can kill somebody and still be a good person. In the context of the conversation we are having, I don't think that he's

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

talking about the stalking part. He's talking about dedicating your time to kill this person. I get what he's saying.

[Parks]

Stalking, intentionally murdering someone.

[Joe Budden]

And King Von. Throw him in whatever gumbo you make making. I keep.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

I don't know why Freeze brought him King Von.

[Joe Budden]

Now he's just trolling you.

[Ish]

I know, I know.

[Joe Budden]

I'm not trying to.

[Ish]

No, he's to trying.

[Joe Budden]

Serious. I'm not trying to troll him. I promise you. I'm not trying to throw ice right now.

[Ish]

Well, you are. Because I never said King Von was a good kid. I never implied a good kid.

[Joe Budden]

But every time I say throw King Von in the gumbo, I'm not just talking to you.

[Ish]

Well, you keep.

[Joe Budden]

It's just funny now. What you're trolling not.

[Ish]

You got it, Joe.

[Joe Budden]

You cuckoo.

[Ish]

Yo, this nuts.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

So what makes King Von.

[Joe Budden]

I'm a good kid. Look what they call real, real good.

[Parks]

That's funny.

[Joe Budden]

Real good. Kenneth Cuckoo. All right, let's see. What else, what else, what else? Floyd is popped. We knew he was popped. Foolio. Y' all get life. That was a stupid murder plan.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Well, it ain't just the Floyd's Pop Joe. It's that. Is that he got. He. He caught some felony. Some felony charges now. Or one felony charge or one felony case. And then there's another issue, right? One is that they're saying he took money for the Mike Tyson fight and the Pacquiao fight and the Pacquiao fight, both fights. And Kyle of didn't give it back, and it kind of bounced. Then there's the bad check allegation over $200,000.

[Joe Budden]

Bad check.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

That's for the. For the watch, right?

[Ish]

For the watch, yeah.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Where. Where he wrote a check for a watch. Didn't. Wasn't good check. My man asked for the watch back. Didn't give it back. It's been over a year. My man finally said, yo, I gotta do something about this. Like, one. I. I thought you were wrong on this initially.

[Ish]

You thought he wasn't Pop.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

I underestimated the extent to which I thought, you know, sometimes people aren't liquid.

[Joe Budden]

Liquid, right.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

He's starting to make moves that aren't just like, I'm not liquid. It's like popped. Please sell again.

[Ish]

Like, he's suing his. His own peoples for. Was it 300 million or something? A lot. It's a lot of money that he said, yo, was. Was taken without me knowing. So if I think I got certain bread and it ain't there, and I found out y' all got it and I got expensive lifestyle, I might be really fucked up now.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Is it hard to have sympathy for Floyd? For me, it is.

[Parks]

Hold on.

[Joe Budden]

It's not for me.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

It's not hard.

[Joe Budden]

It's not for me.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

I struggle. I'm not saying it's fair. I'm just saying when I watch his. Watching how he's lived over the last 20. The flamboyance. Come on. The money. It's hard. When I watch people. I watch people get robbed of their money. Right. There's a way that he moves with money that makes it harder for me to feel sympathetic. And I'm not saying it's fair.

[Joe Budden]

I'm just saying it's not fair at all.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

I'm stipulating. I'm not saying. Saying this is fair. But you're saying how you personally feel about. Yeah, that. Yeah, it's like when I watch something like, you poor people, and then they get. They lose their money, I don't have as much sympathy, you know, I mean, it's just harder for me, you know, But I still think it's unfortunate. And I also don't know that he got right I hope. I hope it's true that he didn't just mismanage his money, that, you know, there's some recourse that he can get his money back.

[Ish]

But even if he did, do you

[Joe Budden]

know Floyd have ever said you.

[Ish]

That's what I was. Yo, you took the words out of my mouth. Just because I live a flamboyant life lifestyle, I don't mean I'm necessarily saying putting my middle finger up to people that are poor.

[Joe Budden]

Actually, I might have. I might have seen the exact opposite. I met Floyd when he's in giving mode.

[Ish]

That nigga will go on his pocket. He even gave 10,000, 5,000.

[Joe Budden]

He gave a lot to a lot

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

of people, changed a lot of lives. I don't mean he literally said, fuck you poor people. I'm saying when you walk around through actions, I don't see how y' all could go on vacation with less than 12 watches. I don't see that kind of shit. I'm not part of a character no more. Yeah. And I'm saying that character for me doesn't incur similar.

[Ish]

Okay, so. So let me.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

I'm just telling you, for me, I think.

[Ish]

I think we lose track sometimes. I think. I think that Floyd was a good kid.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Yeah.

[Ish]

It's levels. It's levels to a bunch of shit. Right? There's levels to a bunch of shit. So. And this is where we get caught up in our billionaire conversation or our ultra rich conversation. That's like somebody saying, yo, I have empathy for Mark. If he hits a bad patch because Mark got 300 pairs of sneakers, and that's obsessive. And he don't need 300 pairs, I

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

think that would be reasonable.

[Joe Budden]

But again, Mark is wired different.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

But here's the thing. I'm not. I'm not saying I don't have sympathy because he has a lot of stuff. I'm saying it's the flaunting of it that makes me less sympathetic. If I walked over and came on TV every day and said, y' all wearing the same pair of sneakers twice, y'. All. And then one day all my sneakers got stolen, I wouldn't expect you to have sympathy for me even if.

[Ish]

But that's part of my.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

It's wrong. It's somebody stolen.

[Ish]

I would just put of my job to actually be this person.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Yes. You're just explaining why he does it. I'm just saying it makes me.

[Ish]

Saying it.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

It just makes me less sympathetic.

[Ish]

And a lot of people are like that too.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Let me ask you a question, though. Mark, real quick. Who's the guy that said it was good for Muhammad Ali. The guy that Muhammad Ali made jokes about Frazier. Do you agree that Frazier said that? He made all those jokes about me, and then look who can't talk or whatever. Do you agree with that? No matter what Muhammad Ali did for the people, no matter what. What he stood for, no matter where he was at, stood for black people. He was out there on the front lines. Joe Frazier end up saying that about him. Oh, he said I was the R word. Now look who is that?

[Ish]

Look who can't speak.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Yeah. Do you agree with.

[Ish]

I mean, he got the right to Joe Frazier.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

What I would say he does have a right to say what? I agree with that sentence. What I would say is, to Joe Frazier is like, I don't agree that you deserved it, and I think it's wrong if that happened to you. But I could understand how Joe Frazier, who's on the business end of those jokes, got it, wouldn't have as much sympathy for Muhammad Ali as somebody else as he would for Joe. George Foreman.

[Ish]

It's the same thing I'll be saying about how certain people look at Wendy Williams.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Perfect example.

[Ish]

Like, do we think what's happening to her is a good thing? No. But there are a lot of people that's, like. Because of the way she built her brand.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

If Wendy Williams ruined your sympathy for her, as they.

[Joe Budden]

People with bad hearts get brought up so much in these type of.

[Ish]

Yo, listen to this. Not just that, Floyd. Not out here just ridiculing people and making their life live in hell. Because I'm rejecting rejoicing in the things that my craft has afforded me.

[Parks]

Yeah.

[Ish]

See, I think a lot of people are. That's not a good powerhouse. Wendy Williams was doing mean shit to people and saying mean shit to people.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Cool.

[Ish]

Floyd Mayweather's out here saying, yo, I'm rich, look.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Yeah, but different, bro. Here's the thing. I'm not saying that the parallel isn't that they both did something unethical. It's that one has a consequence to the other. So for me, if Floyd is flaunting money and showing ridiculous spending, and then you broke after showing ridiculous spending, I

[Ish]

don't feel happy for.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

I didn't say I feel happy.

[Ish]

I still have empathy for him, and that's great.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

But what I'm saying is I have less. I find myself having less empathy for someone who has shown what I perceive to be reckless spending and flaunting than someone who didn't. You know, I get that. I just do, you know, and I'm okay with that. You know, again, I'm. Now if I find out that he was robbed, that's different. I have. I don't want. No athlete should deserve to get robbed, and boxers seem to get robbed a lot.

[Joe Budden]

But his story is that he was robbed.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

And I said, if it is true, then I want him to get justice for that. In fact, I remember I started with, shouldn't you be.

[Ish]

It sound like he don't believe that he was robbed.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

I just said, I hope that is the case so that he could have recourse and get his money back, regardless of how he spends it. It's his money. But what I'm saying is, is that in general, it's harder for me to muster sympathy for someone who has shown reckless spending than it is for someone who has not.

[Joe Budden]

It's hard for me to show sympathy when somebody's committed some type of heinous crime. But a bragging that he got a ton of money.

[Ish]

No A from the bottom. No a from the bottom.

[Joe Budden]

I'm not holding that against Floyd.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Neither am I. That's. You're misrepresenting my point. My issue. My issue is.

[Joe Budden]

But you all in it against them,

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Mark, that he beat the odds and came up from the bottom. No, I'm holding up that if you buy 17, if you bought 12 watches. If you say I have to wear a different watch every day. I have 75 cars. Yes, if you are.

[Ish]

If that person goes broke.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Again, not broke from being robbed, because we're mixing two different things. Broke from their habits. I don't care if you throw your money, if you burn your money in the trash can and somebody steals. I have sympathy for you having been robbed. That's not what I'm saying. I'm saying that if you are broke because you recklessly spent and I see that image, right? And I watch the world have to watch that, and I watch the impact that that has on people, particularly people who won't end up with that kind of money. Right. If I see all of that, I'm less sympathetic to that than the person.

[Joe Budden]

This is back to the Brandon Marshall thing where you was like, y' all have a problem with you putting that online. So it's not the fact that Floyd purchases 50,000 watches. It's the fact that it's online that

[Ish]

we know about it. I'm showing it. I'm bragging with.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

There's two pieces to it. Yes, there's two pieces. One is the flaunting of it. I Do that does make me less sympathetic. That's why I started with. And then there's also the flaunting of it. What he's flaunting is reckless spending. He's not just saying, here's my bank account, here's my money, here's my investments. I would. That would be a little bit different to me.

[Joe Budden]

I only don't like that because somebody on the bottom, somebody on a lower rung than you could always look up and say, that's what I said. I said, yes, that's always applicable.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

And I'd be okay with that.

[Ish]

Yeah, he's with that.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

I'm okay with that. If I went for that, he ain't wavering.

[Ish]

He said, I'm with that.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

But his shoe example is a perfect example. If I was broke and he said, I don't got no sympathetic behind his sneakers, that would make sense to me.

[Ish]

That's how rich people said intimate. It's the same. It runs all in that same vein, cuz.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Having 300 pair of sneakers is reckless. It's irresponsible.

[Ish]

Who dictates?

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Oh, it's excessive. How about this? It's excessive.

[Ish]

It could be excessive, but I wouldn't call it reckless or irresponsible.

[Joe Budden]

You don't deserve hardship because you live in an excessive.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

I don't think you deserve it. This is where you take what I'm saying and add another.

[Ish]

You don't deserve sympathy.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

I didn't say you don't deserve sympathy. You're just saying he doesn't have the same. And I start. And I stipulated. This is where our arguments go. Weird. I stipulated. I'm not saying this is fair. True. And then we have a whole conversation. You all trying to convince me of how unfair it is. No, you did. I agree it's not fair. I began with that. I'm just telling you why I feel that way.

[Joe Budden]

Got it?

[Ish]

Got you.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

That's it. You a cold. You a cold. You're a cold man for what you stand for. You cold, yo. It's consistent with what I stand for. It is? Well, yeah, I guess. I guess.

[Ish]

Kind of, I don't know.

[Joe Budden]

Cold blooded. That nigga's cold.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

But I was a good kid.

[Joe Budden]

This is cold. He's cold. He might have been a good kid. You cold.

[Parks]

Still a good kid, I think.

[Joe Budden]

Yeah, he's still a good kid. That's how I know he ain't laying nothing. I laid been a good kid his whole life, man.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Yeah. All right. We got through everything.

[Parks]

I think we did it. The good kids Got.

[Joe Budden]

I think we got through absolutely everything. I'll get to y' all about Pharrell versus Vans at another time.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

I'm gonna run out right now because I gotta get to Newark to speak at Weekway High School's graduation. Shout out any inspirational words y' all want me to share with the crew. From the crew, God bless them. Telling myself these Jeffy's voice, you got any words?

[Ish]

Congratulations, man tell himself this for the freebie?

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Yeah, it's for the Freebie. It was 100% free up. The whole joke, huh? No, but the joke. I'm just saying you leave them work to go. You know, I think that you stand for something. Irony of the person who came the latest about me leaving.

[Joe Budden]

I'm leaving on a conclusion. You came in.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Who you was talking about in that bandwagon comment that you made the last episode? What you talking about? When they was talking about bandwagon with Imani and like that. Jumping on the bandwagon. Who you was referring to, boy? Bandwagon about what? Who were you referring to in the last episode that dropped when you were talking about bandwagon? Bandwagon. Just remind me. I don't know. Somebody was saying something about jumping on the bandwagon. Did you. You watch the episode? Listen, Imani was saying that just because we agree with Joe, that doesn't mean that we have our own minds. That's what Imani was saying. Something about the subject with one of your counterparts from Philly. And you say, oh, some of us do jump on the bandwagon. Who you referring to? I think I said all of us jump on the bandwagon for different things. There's a lot of dog piling. I got smoke with you now. Oh. I mean, I think you jump on the bandwagon the most if boss agree. That's all I wanted to hear. I know that's what you want to hear. I ain't afraid to say that. I just know what you're talking about. That's what I'm gonna need to shit. Hold up, nigga, hold up. That's what I'm saying with you. Get your favorites, sir. No, I don't know you talking about. Go beg them. I don't beg nobody. Stand on. Hey, I'mma get you. Yo, my time up is up. My time is up. I'mma you up. Okay. I'll be waiting me and you outside. And you can't go to the drunk. That's where I'm starting. Oh, it's a damn shame what happened to flu it.

[Joe Budden]

We want to thank Dr. Mark Lamar indeed spending some time with us before his big speaking engagement. Man, go kill that Mark.

[Parks]

Shout out to the graduates.

[Joe Budden]

Yeah. Shout out to the grad graduates, man.

[Ish]

The inner cities that we don't go back to just to feel it, smell it.

[Parks]

Yeah.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

See what it's like.

[Joe Budden]

Please. Oh, there go my chain. Don't worry, it's coming back. I'm home soon. Probably another 10 days, something like that. It's coming back home. Mark, get the out.

[Ish]

He will lobby for the votes, boy.

[Joe Budden]

He don't respect your votes. Y' all crazy.

[Parks]

What?

[Ish]

Well, we gotta do a pick mark.

[Joe Budden]

Huh? Pick, pick what? Picture Mark. Go ahead, man, we'll take the picture. With that about you, it's fine.

[Parks]

Yeah, man.

[Joe Budden]

Listen, man, y' all hold it down. Hopefully y' all have enjoyed this episode as much as we enjoyed delivering it to you. Keep us in your prayers. Lord knows we need to be there. Until the next time we bid you ado farewell. Adio. Cerebra di asta la vista, arvoir, so long, goodbye. Or a simple head knob will suffice. Here you go. Remember, life is a series of moments. And moments pass. So let's make this one last as if it's all we have. And last, but certainly not least, the baddies are insecure, the stagnant women want to travel and the closed minded women want you to teach them things. Grab you with Tylenol, you might need it.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Any plans for the week? Plans for the week?

[Joe Budden]

Plans for the week.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Anybody? Anybody?

[Joe Budden]

Anybody?

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Anybody?

[Joe Budden]

Anybody?

[Ish]

I just around going to Brooklyn tonight for the W show. That's about it.

[Parks]

Oh, come with you.

[Ish]

Brooklyn, Paramount.

[Parks]

Okay. I like that spot.

[Ish]

Yeah, is nice.

[Joe Budden]

Nobody said what they got for Father's Day?

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Nothing. Food.

[Parks]

Socks.

[Joe Budden]

Food.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Food at Cologne.

[Ish]

What kind?

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Jimmy Choo, I think. Shout the Linky.

[Joe Budden]

I didn't say nothing. I slapped the out of you. Why if I didn't say nothing?

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Cuz I'm on that.

[Ish]

You got it on.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

I'm on.

[Joe Budden]

I don't want to get smacked if I didn't say nothing.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

So when did you want to get smacked?

[Joe Budden]

When I say something that warrants getting. So why you. But if I'm quiet, that mean that I thought about the smack and I didn't want it. So did me.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

A smile.

[Joe Budden]

Yeah, I'm cool. Yeah, when I called you and laughed.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Shout out to princess.

[Joe Budden]

No, that was funny.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

I called everybody out of there.

[Joe Budden]

All right.

[Ish]

I'm like, what the.

[Joe Budden]

Hey, how you doing?

[Ish]

I'm like, all right, flip. What you want?

[Joe Budden]

What I got for Father's Day. I got some cologne. I got a charcuterie board.

[Parks]

Nice.

[Joe Budden]

A card, a keychain and a mug.

[Parks]

Not bad.

[Joe Budden]

Not a bad. That's fire. That's fine.

[Parks]

It's a good home.

[Ish]

Baby took me out and she.

[Joe Budden]

She.

[Ish]

She was like, yo, I'm taking you out. And she overheard me talking about I wanted to get that new aura ring that came out, and she surprised me with it. Huh?

[Parks]

Said sex toy.

[Joe Budden]

Oh, I thought you overheard him saying he wanted to get some aura.

[Ish]

No, I got aura.

[Joe Budden]

Or the ring you meant.

[Ish]

No, I got.

[Joe Budden]

I got rings you was talking about.

[Ish]

I got aura.

[Parks]

It's aura ring.

[Joe Budden]

I got smart ring. Okay, Snigger. Boy, you are.

[Ish]

You are the worse.

[Joe Budden]

Yo, it was right there, man. All right, man. What y' all on for the week?

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Anything. Anything. Anything, anything, anything, Anything.

[Parks]

Enjoying the rain, man. That's it.

[Joe Budden]

Y' all are down out there, man. Rest in peace, Tina Marie. Y' all enjoy your week. We'll be back same time, same place this weekend, if God permits. And that's all we got for you. Well, you can set that up, Sam. I can't cut her up now. Sorry, sorry. I got. She got it. She wig outed it. I gotta hear wig out.

[Dr. Mark Lamont Hill]

Again.

[Joe Budden]

Y' all have a good week out there. Go Nicks. Go, Nick. Go, Nicks. Till next time, ass. Yeah. Go. Next championship. Repeat time. Stop playing with us.

[Ish]

They gonna trade some of you in the off season. Y' all gonna be sick.

[Joe Budden]

Jbp. Jbp. Where would you be without the jbp?

[Ish]

We'll fold that up right now.

[Joe Budden]

You've never heard of Joe Bunny?