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- [00:02]
A
Joe Rogan podcast. Check it out.
- [00:04]
B
The Joe Rogan experience. Train by day, Joe Rogan podcast by night, all day.
- [00:13]
A
Episodes of guys we've had on Fall into the Camp who had their YouTube channel deleted and were talking about, like, wellness, like doctors talking about COVID stuff.
- [00:25]
B
There was a bunch of doctors that had their. Their YouTube accounts deleted.
- [00:28]
A
Really?
- [00:29]
B
Yeah. It was a weird time, you know? It was. It's a weird time. The. The world of medicine is interesting because you've got so many positives, right? Like, people are healthier. They live longer today than they ever have been before. If you get certain diseases, they have cures for it that didn't exist before. But there's financial incentives involved in prescribing medications that maybe people don't fucking need because they can make more money if more people take these drugs. And that's the problem. Like, there's. We got to separate the baby from the bathwater and know what to throw out, right? And it's. You can't throw out medicine. Like, that's crazy. It's amazing. Like, what these pharmaceutical drug companies, in coordination with all these brilliant scientists, have created is the greatest medicine system the human race has ever known. At least probably as long as maybe the Mayans knew some shit. You know what I mean?
- [01:25]
A
They're doing some magic back then.
- [01:27]
B
Yeah, Maybe some, like, civilizations that collapsed because the Europeans gave them all fucking smallpox, ironically. Who knows what the Egyptians knew? Who knows what those people knew about health and about medicine? But what we know today is that there's incredible stuff that comes out of the pharmaceutical drug companies. But also, they fucking lie to you. They also. They'll publish fake studies or not fake studies, but they'll publish studies that they've engineered to be successful even though they're not going to be. They'll hide data that shows that it causes side effects. They want to make money. And it's not the people that are making the medicine. That's what's crazy. Like, the people that are making the medicine are fucking geniuses. It's the money people. It's always the money people in everything. And that's the same thing with YouTube and that's the same thing with everything. It's the money people. And there's. There's. When you have a giant corporation, you have, like, all kinds of stuff going on. But the number one thing that's going on is everybody has to make more money every quarter. And that's where it gets nutty.
- [02:30]
A
Yeah, it does. And we also live in a culture that wants that like fast food experience, right?
- [02:35]
B
Oh, yeah. Shortcut.
- [02:36]
A
And so it's. We're so susceptible to it.
- [02:39]
B
Yeah.
- [02:39]
A
Right. For everything. For weight loss, to any issue you have.
- [02:43]
B
We're experiencing it a little bit in the comedy community because. And this is, by the way, this is like a normal thing that happens to young comedians. They want to be further than they are. Maybe they think they deserve more than they're getting. They think they deserve more shows, better spots on shows. And it does happen. And then there's also, you know, like, there's a competitive drive involved in it. So there's a little bit of delusion, a little bit of a competitive drive. It's very similar, I would imagine, to fighters. First of all, we just tell everybody, success code. You're a mind coach.
- [03:16]
A
Yes, sir.
- [03:17]
B
You worked famously with Sean Brady.
- [03:19]
A
Yes.
- [03:20]
B
Who I love.
- [03:20]
A
Yeah, he's on here and talked about a little bit.
- [03:22]
B
He's a animal. Yeah, he's fun. He's fun. And he's got, like, extra muscles on his back. I don't know what the that guy does, but he looks like a turtle.
- [03:32]
A
Tattoos coming to life, we were all.
- [03:34]
B
Talking about the other day. We're like, he looks like a turtle. Like, he's got, like a shell on his back.
- [03:38]
A
Crazy.
- [03:39]
B
Just jacked muscle. Like, I know what that is. Like when I see a guy like that, I'm like, that guy will squeeze your into jello like this. He's so strong. And what he did to Leon Edwards was like, holy, man. That's a world champion. And to do it that decisively on a world champion, like, he's completely turned a corner. He was always awesome, but he post the Balal fight completely turned a corner. And a lot of that success he. He attributes to you.
- [04:10]
A
Yeah. It's interesting he talked about this openly, but after the Bilal fight, that's when we started working together. And it was because I think this happens to a lot of fighters, a lot of high achievers, is he built this identity of being unbeatable. Right. So all his belief that was wired around who he was was, I am unbeatable. And so when he lost, everything shattered. And so he was broken. He didn't know how to pick up the pieces. After that, it was like, how is this possible? I believe I'm unbeatable, but then I lost. And so we literally had to go into his nervous system, and it's almost like clearing out. Almost like we're doing surgery at an energetic level of clearing out all the bullshit around these new beliefs that are Starting to form, like in the confusion of, like, I am beatable. When am I gonna lose my next fight? And we had to clear all that and bring him back into that state of being of, I'm unbeatable again.
- [04:56]
B
And how did you learn how to do all this? Like, what's your background?
- [05:00]
A
Yeah, so I was a college football player. And my freshman year in college, I rode the bench and I was looking for solutions. I was a typical meathead. The most important things for me was getting jacked and playing football. Like, I was literally at a supplement shop looking for pro hormones. This is me at 18 years old, just fucking hypertensive, big neck, right?
- [05:19]
B
And by the way, they used to sell some shit people don't know, basically steroids at local supplement shop. There was this stuff that I took once, the strongest shit I ever took in my life. I think it was called Mag 10. Do you remember that? I remember that. It was bananas. It was full on steroids. And after I got off, my dick was like, what are we doing? We don't have any more testosterone left.
- [05:42]
A
That was me.
- [05:43]
B
Took him for like eight weeks. It was crazy. I think I gained like 15 pounds. And I couldn't believe you just buy it from a store. I'm like, this can't be that good if you're just buying. When someone told me about it, I was like, really? And they're like, yeah, you have to try this. There it is. Is that it? I don't know. It's the 2000 anabolic dominance. I don't know if that's the stuff, but you definitely can't get that anymore, can they? They just keep banning what's in there. But here's the other thing about what's in there. Says who?
- [06:11]
A
Yeah, right.
- [06:11]
B
Says who? Who's checking it? We had a problem with my company with on it when we first started. We were. We would send stuff out to third party labs to get it analyzed, right? And we were finding all sorts of things in it that aren't supposed to be in there. Like different vitamins, creatine, all kinds of that's just not supposed to be in there. Like, why is this stuff in? This doesn't make any sense. And this is what you hear about with tainted supplements with fighters all the time. So what happens is we found out that some of these companies that mix your products for you, say if you have like some B3K2 supplement, you put them all together, they're mixing them in the same bin where they're making steroids. They're Mixing them in the same bin where they're making creatine. Like, they don't give a fuck if.
- [06:51]
A
You clear the residue.
- [06:52]
B
Just like if you're shipping that shit overseas, they're just, they don't give a fuck. Okay. They probably don't even want to be working there. They're probably like held at their, against their will.
- [07:01]
A
Yeah.
- [07:01]
B
Like, who knows where this factory is. And so we had to upgrade our factories. We had, we had to figure out where the, the most ethical sources are and make sure. And then we had a third party test again and make sure we're on the level. But that's a real problem. So if you're buying something like that, they can tell you whatever's in there. They'll throw Viagra and D ball and who knows what's in there? Who, like just because it says what it is on the label. There was, there's. That's the wild thing about supplements, right? There's no fda, it's just whack a mole.
- [07:32]
A
Right? They figure out that like someone reports it and then they get rid of it and then whack a mole. The next one pops up, they're like, it's pretty much the same thing with different branding.
- [07:39]
B
Yeah. In some ways it's good, right? Because you can get all these vitamins when have to get a prescription. Because we all know the efficacy of vitamins, it's legit. But in other ways, it's like I read something about Amazon and this is crazy if it's true, is that I think it was like 30% of the supplements on Amazon were forgeries.
- [08:01]
A
Yeah. I think I've seen people putting fake labels and stuff and making it look just like it.
- [08:05]
B
Yeah. See what, see, find out what the number is. And by the way, you know, I don't know how they even determine that number, but it's not zero. And so I stopped buying supplements. Remember, I buy everything from Amazon and I stopped buying supplements from them. I would get like pure encapsulation stuff. And I was like, I don't know. I don't know if I'm getting it from the company. So I just buy it from the company now.
- [08:25]
A
So when you buy it to know it's like pure. It's that good. Good.
- [08:28]
B
Well, that company, Pure Encapsulations is really good. I have no affiliations with them, but I use their stuff all the time.
- [08:33]
A
I think a lot of people have that question though. Like, for me, like you just see 100 brands on Amazon. You're like, well, which one's actually JIT because you know, some of them are trash.
- [08:40]
B
But you just got to find a company that has like a great history of a bunch of people that have tested their stuff and that use their stuff. And Pure seems to be one of those companies. I mean, there's a. I'm just using that name because I use it, but there's a ton of like super legit supp companies where, you know if you're going to get 10,000 milligrams of D3, that's exactly what it is.
- [09:03]
A
Yeah, yeah.
- [09:03]
B
They're just above board. They know what the they're doing like everything else, man. Like you can get the shittiest car in the world or you can get a Mercedes. You know, they know what they're doing.
- [09:13]
A
But you know, people are listening to podcasts like this. We're just kind of like listening to influencers in a way. It's like, oh, Huberman, well, I trust you. So you have supplements, you represent.
- [09:20]
B
All right, well, Huberman is honest and that's the most important thing. This episode is brought to you by Bleacher Report. If you're an MMA fan like me, download Bleacher Report for faster than ever alerts on the latest fights, knockouts and pound for pound rankings. Join the community in Bleacher Report to share your hottest takes, talk upcoming fights and get expert analysis all in one place. Download Bleacher Report to stay up to date on all the action in the Octagon. This episode is brought to you by the Farmer's Dog. I think we can all agree that eating highly processed food for every meal isn't optimal. So why is processed food the status quo for dog food? Because that's what kibble is, an ultra processed food. But a healthy alternative exists. The farmer's dog. They make fresh food for dogs and what does it look like? Real meat and vegetables that are gently cooked to retain vital nutrients and help avoid any of the bad stuff that comes with ultra processing. And it's not just random ingredients thrown together. Their food is formulated by on staff board certified vet nutritionists. These people are experts on dog nutrition and they're all in on fresh food. The farmer's dog also does something unique. They portion out the food to your dog's nutritional needs. This ensures that you don't overfeed them, making weight management easy. Research shows that dogs kept at a healthy weight can live up to two and a half years longer. Head to the farmersdog.com rogan to get 50% off your first box plus free shipping this offer is for new customers only.
- [10:57]
A
That's what we do now, right? We're looking to. These could be doctors, but these people who we put our trust in, it's like, that's kind of like the bar that we're setting for, like, all right, I'm gonna trust you.
- [11:07]
B
Honesty, like, that is everything, right? And including for yourself, like, when everything falls apart, like what happened with Sean after the loss to Bilal, like that the thing in your head, like, what it is is what it is, man. You know, like Max Holloway says, it is what it is. He always says that it's a beautiful way to look at life. Really. It sounds simple, but it is what it is. Like, you're not going to change it by freaking out about it. You're not gonna. You're. You're not going to. This is what it is. That guy was better than you. So how do you get. What are you gonna do? How are you gonna improve? What. What did you do mentally that was different? Was there decisions that you made during the fight? Was there something going on? And if you can't be honest with yourself, you're not going to improve. But if you can be honest with yourself, it can make you stronger. You know, there's a lot of guys that have gone through losses and came back way more dangerous, and there's other guys that go through losses. And there. Maybe they didn't go through a process like yours, or maybe they had a little. Some self belief issues already and, you know, and they were kind of manifesting themselves before the podcast. Maybe they were starting, or before the fight, rather. Maybe they were starting to get imposter syndrome syndrome. You know, like some fighters get imposter syndrome. They start winning and they're like, there's no way I can be the champion. Yeah, this is crazy.
- [12:21]
A
And there's a governor, right? Like a governor car that comes up where it's like, all right, I can be successful up to this level, but anything beyond this is not safe.
- [12:28]
B
It's scary. Yeah, it's scary, but it's like that.
- [12:30]
A
That real animalistic, primal part of yourself that comes out and goes, I couldn't even constantly tell you why, but, like, I can't go there. Like, I can't get to that level of success. If I do, I'm going to tear it all down. And we see people do that, and every year.
- [12:43]
B
Well, it's a. It's a weird fear for people that are trying to be successful because they're listening to this. And, like, that doesn't make Any sense, Like, why would you be? It's because the pressure of maintaining it, especially, I think, if you came from nothing. Because if you came from nothing, that you realize how lucky you are and you realize that, oh my God, look how successful I am. I'm a world champion now, or I'm in whatever you do in life.
- [13:07]
A
Yeah.
- [13:07]
B
And then you start thinking, what if I fuck this up?
- [13:10]
A
What if I can't keep it up?
- [13:11]
B
What if I can't keep it up? What if it all goes away?
- [13:13]
A
Yeah.
- [13:14]
B
And what am I gonna do? What am I gonna do? What am I gonna do? And you start freaking out. And then if you go on social media, you start reading comments about yourself. So for fighters, that's a real problem. Yeah, there's a lot of fighters I see arguing with people. Fuck you, pussy. I'll smack you. Like, don't do that. You are wasting so much energy. I'd rather you do heroin than do Twitter. If you're a fighter, like, get off there.
- [13:37]
A
But what we want to do is we want to get to them a place where they're matter of fact about what they read, which sounds like almost impossible for a lot of people who are listening right now. Like, what do you mean? This person's talking shit about me. But Brady is matter of fact about this now. Like, truthfully, he's wired in a way that where if someone starts to talk some shit about him, he can laugh about it, he can just matter of factly not be emotional about it.
- [13:56]
B
But it's also because he's on a hot win streak right now and he looks awesome and he's super confident. He's got a lot of momentum on his side.
- [14:03]
A
It's a compounding of the belief from the physical experience and then the belief that we've wired into him.
- [14:08]
B
Right.
- [14:09]
A
So it's both of those together, Right. It's like the perfect, perfect confluence of those two factors coming together.
- [14:14]
B
Right, right, right. And then the confidence that comes from these wins, especially the, the, the last one. I mean, God, he looks so good. He looks so dominant. And to do that with a guy like Leon, who, you know, we saw those Usman fights, you know, we saw him knock out Usman. He's really good, man. And for Sean to do that was like, wow, that's a big turn of the corner. Not just a little turn, just a giant turn of the corner.
- [14:40]
A
But stylistically that was kind of a fight made for Sean though, don't you think?
- [14:44]
B
Well, it could be until you take into consideration the second Kamaru USMAN fight because Usman couldn't take him down. That fight was primarily a stand up fight because Leon's takedown defense had gotten so good and I think there was that bump in confidence after the knockout and he really felt like the champion now. So for Bilal to just step in and put a stop to all that and then to see then him lose the title to Jack Della and then see what Sean just did and you look at the whole thing, you're like, what a crazy shark tank. Of all these killers, Leon Edwards, Bilal, Muhammad Della, Madeleina, now you got Islam Makhachev in there. And it's like, who can keep it together the most is a giant factor. Giant factor.
- [15:33]
A
I know you don't really follow football, but like this is like the SEC in football, right? It's the division that has Alabama, lsu, Texas. It's like they're all killers. So any given night anyone could be anyone and it's just like who's going to show up and execute the best? And that's what it comes down to.
- [15:48]
B
And then you got Michael Venom Page, who's like the biggest puzzle in the entire sport. Like he's also a 170. Yeah, that guy. Good luck. Good luck training for that guy. Like just good luck, good luck. Super tall welterweight who moves like nobody, who is a world point fighting champion. Like, that is a totally different thing. That point fighting thing, have you ever watched that shit?
- [16:14]
A
No, I haven't.
- [16:15]
B
Okay. Michael Venom Page was at one point in time the best karate point fighters. And the way karate point fighters fight, they stop after one person gets hit. It's kind of like an elite form of tag with, with lethal weapons. Like these guys are good at these launches forward and blitzes and they're really good at getting out of the way because guys are blitzing at them all the time. So because of the style of the competition, they developed this very unique skill set of being able to close the distance extremely fast with a lot of lot of distance in between them and land very unpredictable shots. Like, he's super creative and he also knows how to wrestle now and he also knows jiu jitsu now. So like now he's a mixed martial arts fighter, but he's got this one skill set that's crazy unique. And I always said that's the thing that's missing in mma because we see what happens when you get like a really elite boxer. We've seen what happens with a really elite kickboxer, a really elite jiu jitsu guy or wrestler. We haven't seen really elite point fighter who learns all those other skills because it's a different thing. It's not like, like, you know, Pereira fights. He's not moving around a lot, dude, he's coming right at you. There's not a lot of dancing, and it's not a lot of, you know, there's not a lot of finesse. He's just Sandhagen moves, you know, Sandhagen is, like, constantly giving you different looks and overloading your mind. Pereira's stalking you, right? It's very. What the MVP is doing is something totally different. Like, you can't even touch him. He's. He's hitting guys, like, guys that have, like, a lot of experience in the ufc. He's hitting him with shots they don't see coming. They can't hit him. Kevin Holland was like, where the fuck is he? I can't even find him. This is nuts. The guy just launches himself at you, pops you, cracks you, and then he's gone. And you're like, okay. He's moving way faster than anybody you've ever fought before and covers way more distance quicker than anybody you've ever fought before. It's like the difference between someone who is, like, standing in front of people and knocking sticks and an elite fencer, you know? You ever see those elite fencers, they dive forward. They dive forward and crack you. This guy can do that with, like, knockout shots.
- [18:30]
A
That's wild.
- [18:30]
B
Yes. This is him when he was an elite karate fighter. So this is point fighting. This is what it looks like. It's really weird because the judges make decisions after each contact, but Raymond Daniels here, this is Raymond Daniels, who's also. He was an elite point fighter who then went on and had big success in Glory and also big success in Bellator because of that style. It's like a nutty style. He pulled off one of the greatest. Raymond Daniels pulled off one of the greatest kos I've ever seen in my life. In kickboxing. It was a jumping sidekick that in midair, he turned into a spinning back kick to the face. It's. I've. I've done it to a bag before. I've never done it to a human being. And for him to do it to a human being in Glory. Now, see, if you. You find the kickboxing one, it's from Glory that this is the nutty one where he did, like a 360 degree punch. Watch how crazy this is. Play that, because that's what that was, what you just had. Watch this punch so he hits him with this spinning back kick to the body. He lets him get up. Now watch this. What is that? That is bananas. He ballet punched that.
- [19:39]
A
It's like anime. It's like Dragon Ball Z stuff right there.
- [19:41]
B
If that was in kick like Mortal Kombat, like get out of here. That would never work. But I want you to find his. His kickboxing KO I wish I could remember the gentleman he was fighting. But the guy who fought is legit too. And he hit him with a jump side kick, spinning back kick to the face in the air. So it's like that is a different thing, you know, Uncle I is not going to do that. Pereira is not going to do that. Like those point fighter guys are different. It's a different thing. It's a. You're. You're dealing with this whole new skill set. This episode is brought to you by the Montana Knife Company. I'm very excited to do this ad because my good friend Josh Smith owns the Montana Knife company. It was founded by Josh, who is one of the most experienced master blade smiths in the world. He makes amazing knives. I love them. I have a bunch of them. They're barely over a hundred master bladesmiths in the world and this guy's been one since he was 19. He makes the sharpest knives you will ever use right here in the U. S Of a design tested and built by hunters. Montana knife company is a hunting knife company first and foremost, but they also make some of the best chef knife knives on the planet. I use them all the time in my kitchen. And the best part is all of Montana Knife Company's knives are backed by a multi generational guarantee promise. If you ever need your blade sharpened, just send it back and they'll sharpen them for free. These knives sell out within minutes of being released. So head over to Montana knifecompany.com to see what's available. Now, my favorites, the insanely sharp speedgoat 2.0. I carry that with me every time I go to the mountains. Montana Knife Co. Working knives for working people. The leaping in and cracking you with shit, you're like, what? What the fuck is this?
- [21:38]
A
So I know boxing a lot better than I know ufc. I'm just getting more into UFC recently. What? Where's this guy in his career right now?
- [21:46]
B
He's really high level in the UFC. He's got to be top 10 in the welterweight division. But he like, he shuts people down, man. He shuts people down in a wild way that I. You just don't see much. The only person who figured him out was Ian Garry. Ian Garry out grappled him. He just got ahold of him and grappled him. But watch this. Jump sidekick. This is so bananas, dude. Watch this. Boom. Isn't that nuts? Jump sidekick to the body and in midair turns into spitting back kick to the face. I mean, not everybody can do that, but when a guy can do that, if you don't know that he can do that, you can get up like this. Raymond Daniels can do some wild man. And again, he's pulling it off against elite kickboxers. Unbelievable. I mean, he had a couple of losses where they figured him out. Like Joe Baltelini, he's the first guy, like, really brutalized his legs. Brutalized his legs. He just had a high guard move forward. And Valtolini is like very classic, like hard nose kickboxer. A lot of low kick, strong punches. He just kept breaking down his legs to the point where he just couldn't walk. And then he had kicked him. It's pretty powerful. So that style can be figured out. You know, MVP lost in. He fought Douglas Lima and Bellator and got stopped in that fight because just Douglas was a beast at the time and. And KO'd him. But it's just like. That is a different puzzle, man. Yeah, it's a different puzzle.
- [23:18]
A
It's crazy.
- [23:19]
B
I just love the fact that there's guys like that now in this sport. Where you're looking at this Sport that's like 30 plus years old now, and there's still guys that are complete innovators that are coming in when the whole thing's changing. You're like, whoa, okay. All right, now, now we're doing that. Now we're doing front kicks to the face, you know, now we're doing calf kicks. All of a sudden, like, Bisping went his entire career without getting calf kicked. I mean, that's nuts.
- [23:43]
A
Yeah.
- [23:44]
B
When you think about that, that's crazy. That's crazy. He's a world champion, went through his entire career, no one calf kicked him. That's how weird this sport is. But I think what separates the guys is not just technique, it's. It's not just being a specialist in one very particular area, which is obviously a huge factor, but also the mind. And a lot of guys don't want to get help in that because they think that if they consult a sports psychologist, they're a pussy.
- [24:15]
A
Yeah. 100. Being vulnerable makes me weak. Yeah, Right. That's a core belief for a lot of guys. And so when you believe that to be true, you're not going to create weakness within yourself, so you're not going to seek it out.
- [24:26]
B
Exactly.
- [24:27]
A
And there's also a big stigma around, like, guys in profession, like, anything, right?
- [24:31]
B
Yeah.
- [24:32]
A
There's like a range to comedians. Right? There's a range. People do what I do. There's. There's kind of pussies who do it in a way. Right. There's like people who are very, like, soft.
- [24:41]
B
Be in touch with your feelings.
- [24:42]
A
Yeah, yeah. Like the. Too far to like the woo woo. Or too far to like, hey, I'm gonna follow this textbook. Where really this work is. It's art. At the end of the day, what we're doing, it's like, it's a. It's something you feel your way through, and it requires years and years of practice to get to any level of mastery.
- [24:58]
B
That's interesting. You're talking about, like, managing your brain as art.
- [25:03]
A
Yeah, well, because it's. It's not just the brain, it's the nervous system, it's the whole body. It's the energy body system. Right. So we're talking about. You've heard of like meridians, right, that run through the body. Is that all real chakras?
- [25:13]
B
I hear about that, but those are things that I hear about. And I go, I'll wait to talk to somebody about it. That's a scientist.
- [25:19]
A
You could call it whatever you want. Right. We all feel like. Everyone feels anxiety right here. Like in their solar plexus.
- [25:24]
B
Yeah. You kind of feel in the center of your body. Right?
- [25:26]
A
Right. Boom. Right here. This is the patterns I see with all these elite guys I'm working with. It's like I can just. My awareness with them is I can just feel the same thing they can feel.
- [25:36]
B
Don't you think that's probably constricted breathing, though? Like, constricted breathing. That's where you'd feel it. You'd feel it.
- [25:42]
A
I would say constricted breathing is a byproduct of like a blockage in their body and they just feel it.
- [25:48]
B
Don't you think it's adrenaline, though? It's a giant adrenaline dump. And it's also. There's an anxiety that comes with that if your mind starts spinning out of control. Like, do you. Do you train.
- [25:57]
A
I used to train boxing. Yeah.
- [25:59]
B
Have you ever done jiu jitsu?
- [26:00]
A
I haven't done jiu jitsu.
- [26:01]
B
One of the things that happens in jiu jitsu when guys first get started, like, say if a guy has, like, maybe A distorted idea of how tough he is. And he's like a big, strong, muscular guy. There's those in particular, for whatever reason, seem to have a real problem when they grapple with a really good guy where they get pinned down and then they get like side controlled and mounted and they start hyperventilating. I've seen it like several times from people that have never trained before, but the real buff and they maybe have this idea of who they are and that idea is getting shattered, like just shattered by a guy that doesn't even look impressive, you know, but he's just manhandling you. And the hyperventilating thing, to me seems like a bunch of stuff. It's like the battle with reality. This can't be happening. Oh, my God, this is happening. There's the forgetting to breathe. There's the elevated heart rate, there's the dump of adrenaline. There's all these different things connected.
- [26:54]
A
This is like a. A domino effect, Right?
- [26:57]
B
Right.
- [26:58]
A
Like the constricted breathing, the not being able to think clearly, it's all a domino effect. And kind of how I operate is like the belief is the thing that starts a domino.
- [27:07]
B
Right, sure.
- [27:08]
A
And so if your belief is being destroyed that moment, that's what creates that domino effect of the body and the nervous system reacts in the way it does.
- [27:15]
B
Right.
- [27:16]
A
And so belief is formed in one of two ways. One is just. It's formed through life experience. Right. Like the Goggins of the world, He's a very rare person who just builds belief off of doing it.
- [27:28]
B
Yeah.
- [27:28]
A
How many guys are like that in the world?
- [27:30]
B
By the way, shout out to my brother, David Goggins, who just completed the Bigfoot 200.
- [27:33]
A
Let's go, Goggins.
- [27:34]
B
That do that dude has no knees, ladies and gentlemen. He's got no knees and he just ran 200 miles through the fucking mountains. What did he do it in, like 60 hours? It was posted today. Find out what his time was. This dude has no knees. Like, I don't run. My knee's pretty good.
- [27:54]
A
Well, that's in comparison. I think that's an example of how belief can actually break reality of what's supposed to be possible. Right.
- [28:01]
B
Well, it certainly broke it in the eyes of his doctor. His doctor when they first saw his knees, because he didn't go in for anything for a long time. When the doctor first saw his knees, he was like, I can't believe you can walk on these legs. Forget about run thousands of miles. Like, this is nuts. He was not just bone on bone. His Bone was distorting. So because it was rubbing bone on bone, it was like forming these like little mushroom curves at the end of it. It's like a. It's a type of a. There's a name for it. Like that distortion. It's called wolf something or another. He said it's like theoretical. Like they'd never seen it in a person before, like this.
- [28:37]
A
So, like, all right, if that exists, like, that could work, but it shouldn't. Like we've never seen it.
- [28:41]
B
Maybe that doctor said it. I should be real clear on that because I'm hearing it from David Goggin, you know what I'm saying? And I'm like, what the fuck? He's telling me that. They told me it could never happen.
- [28:49]
A
Before, but regardless, he's breaking what reality is supposed to be. In a way. Right. When you compare it to a very large sample size, he is.
- [28:58]
B
David Goggins is as much as you would say, this is crazy. He's ruining his body. He doesn't have to do this. That's great. But what he's doing is he's carrying a torch for the human will.
- [29:12]
A
Yes.
- [29:13]
B
In a way that very few people have ever done it. Because he's doing it publicly. He's doing it publicly, and that's why I think it's so important. And I talk about it all the time, about how nuts it is. This guy has no knees and he's operating this way. So what does it say? Total? I don't know how they track it.
- [29:29]
A
But he was moving for a total time of two days, one hour and seven minutes.
- [29:34]
B
Oh, so he did it in two days. I thought I saw online. Total. It took three days total.
- [29:38]
A
The 20 hours of stop time, that's like your rest time.
- [29:41]
B
Oh, right. I don't know where the course it.
- [29:44]
A
Says it listed here, which would be the racetracking.
- [29:47]
B
It says when he started and when he finished. Right, Says he's finished. Oh, it doesn't say what time? Yeah, I don't know when they start. Oh, is this all off the website or is this Track Leaders? Yeah. What place did he come in? 93rd. He's also 50. I mean, he's a freak dude, but he's like carrying this torch. You might not want to do what he's doing. I wouldn't do what he's doing. But I'm saying it's kind of crazy that this guy can, at 50 years old, can have these endurance workouts with world class MMA fighters like Israel Adesanya. And he's got Izzy throwing up in a bucket, and he's not even breathing heavy. And he does, like, multiple of those workouts a day in silence. He doesn't listen to music. No one is telling him to do it. He's got no coach.
- [30:31]
A
Yeah.
- [30:32]
B
Like, he's out there, man.
- [30:35]
A
Like you said, he's just built it through pure willpower.
- [30:39]
B
Yes.
- [30:39]
A
I would say most people, almost everyone else in the world, they don't have the ability to build that level of belief through their willpower.
- [30:47]
B
I don't know if they don't have the ability, but they don't do it.
- [30:50]
A
He's 23rd. But if they don't do it.
- [30:52]
B
He was 23rd.
- [30:53]
A
His bib was 93.
- [30:55]
B
Oh, no shit. That's amazing. 23rd place, 50 years old, no knees.
- [31:04]
A
Crazy.
- [31:05]
B
What a monster. What a monster. Imagine that guy was after you. Like, what a monster. It's just. It's beautiful. It's like a beautiful expression of will, because that's all it is. It's just the will to go on, you know, and the discipline to continue to train like that every day. And then every time you test your will, you push it further. He's like, I'm in the lab every day. Like, he's literally learning more about himself while he's doing this.
- [31:32]
A
So why do you think millions of people read his book and then such a small percentage of people can kind of replicate that example he's setting?
- [31:39]
B
I don't think you want to replicate it.
- [31:41]
A
Not to his degree, but to any degree, right?
- [31:43]
B
Yeah, I think it. Exercise three times a week moves what your waterline is. Right. It moves what you expect of yourself, moves that up a few notches. Because, you know, a guy like that's out there. If you didn't think a guy like that's out there and you worked out at the Y three days a week and no one else did, you'd probably be impressed with yourself. You know, I'm out that. Why three days a week using the Nautilus machine. You know, it's on who you're comparing yourself to.
- [32:07]
A
Yeah.
- [32:08]
B
And, you know, obviously I can't compare to David Goggins, but when I. When I know that a guy like that is out there in the world, it raises my own personal standard up a notch. I don't ever. I'm never going to hit where. What he does. I don't have the time. He's working up four or five hours every day. It's crazy. I don't have that commitment either. It's not what I'm interested in. But him doing that has, like, raised mine. When I look at, like Jocko's Instagram and every day it says 4:30 on his Timex, he like, shows his. You know, he's got one of those. What is that watch called? What's that watch that he has that everybody wears? The digital Timex watch. It's a famous classic Iron Man. That's it, right? Is the iron man.
- [32:51]
A
Yeah, I know what you're talking about.
- [32:52]
B
Yeah. This bulletproof watch, of course that's what he wears, like 4:09am that's when he gets up to work out. Yeah, every day.
- [32:59]
A
But guys like that, guys like you, you guys are dogs, right? You want it. You get inspired by that. Some people, they just feel deflated when they see that level, right?
- [33:07]
B
They're just like, that's no, man. You gotta embrace it.
- [33:11]
A
You got to.
- [33:12]
B
It is deflating because you're so far from the finish line, it's deflating, you.
- [33:18]
A
Know, but that's why there. There are fundamental ways to actually build belief within yourself. Like, there's steps to do it. And that's what really I want to drive home for anyone who's listening to this, is that you can build belief and it's not just banging your head against the wall.
- [33:34]
B
I believe you. I'm sure there's systems to it, and that's why I really wanted to talk to you. But the. The whole idea of the meridians, like, how does that factor into it with you? Like, how do you. What do you hang on this idea of like, meridians in the body.
- [33:49]
A
Yeah. So I'll talk about how I came to know them, right?
- [33:52]
B
Yeah.
- [33:52]
A
I was playing football and walked in the supplement shop looking for my next pro hormone.
- [33:57]
B
Oh, that's right. I interrupted you right there.
- [33:58]
A
Oh, good, bro. We came back circle.
- [34:01]
B
We came back, here we go.
- [34:02]
A
Like we needed to. So 230 pound, five foot three dude in there just jacked. And I'm like, hey, what pro hormones do you have? And he looks at me, he's like, you know, he's very like, zen type of dude. And he's like, why do you want it? And I was like, I'm trying to get on the football field. Like, what else could I do? I'm a meathead. Like, I need to get stronger. It's the only thing I can do. And then he's like, say, how do you feel? Like, how do I feel? Like, this is me, 18 years old, atheist, don't believe in anything. Biggest skeptic you're ever Going to meet in your life. And he's like, I want you to try this exercise. And he has me just look off into the peripheries of my eyes.
- [34:37]
B
How long had he known this guy.
- [34:38]
A
By then literally meeting him and he just starts going in on me.
- [34:42]
B
Yeah, yeah. You think he was trying to have sex with you or anything?
- [34:46]
A
Well, we can get into that.
- [34:50]
B
It's just an odd thing to go right into meridians. How do you feel? Like, whoa, trying to get jacked.
- [34:54]
A
Yeah, well, he's just that type of dude. So I call him like a sensei now because I've known.
- [34:58]
B
Oh, you know, I'm still. Yeah, yeah.
- [35:00]
A
No, no. So I'm still.
- [35:01]
B
So he's just a weird guy.
- [35:02]
A
He's a weird guy. Super weird.
- [35:03]
B
A lot of guys would have their hackles up though. Like, what? How do I feel?
- [35:06]
A
100. Oh, no. First I was like, the fuck up, you know, look at that creatine, bro. Get the fuck off. Yeah, you know what I mean? Like that.
- [35:12]
B
The fuck Insecure. Manual energy posturing up.
- [35:15]
A
Yeah, yeah, exactly.
- [35:16]
B
I'm guys trying to fuck me.
- [35:17]
A
But no. He just made everything feel approachable to 18 year old meathead. So he started teaching me these breathing techniques like for meditation.
- [35:24]
B
And he worked at a supplement store.
- [35:25]
A
He was working there at the time.
- [35:26]
B
He was.
- [35:27]
A
He was studying for his neuroscience degree at a college.
- [35:29]
B
Wow.
- [35:29]
A
To get his master's.
- [35:30]
B
What a like fortuitous coincidence.
- [35:34]
A
Yes.
- [35:34]
B
To run into a dude like that. We try to get jacked.
- [35:37]
A
That's life, right?
- [35:38]
B
Right?
- [35:38]
A
It is kind of.
- [35:39]
B
Right? Think about it. You're looking for like the full meathead path and you run into a guy's like, how do you feel? Like what? I don't feel nothing, bro.
- [35:47]
A
I didn't though.
- [35:49]
B
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- [37:11]
A
Because nobody was talking about anxiety back then, right? You know, I had crazy performance anxiety. I didn't know that was a thing. I was just like, yeah. I was like, I don't feel good. I don't know. What do you mean? Like, nobody was talking about their emotions.
- [37:22]
B
Yeah.
- [37:22]
A
And so he just started teaching me breathing techniques. He taught me up at the meridians, very simple ones that he's like, okay, visualize breathing energy in. This is martial arts stuff, right? So much has to do with breathing. So he was into martial arts as well. Like, all right, I want you to imagine breathing up your governing meridian and your central meridian, which is like right on your spinal cord and up to center line of your body. He's like, all right, breathe in deeply here. How do you feel? I was like, I just feel more confident. I feel stronger. So he started just teaching me how to do simple stuff like that and then bring it on to, like, the football field. I was a D lineman, and so I needed to knock people over. Same thing as martial arts, right. I needed to feel grounded, so I needed to connect to my root chakra, which is, you can call it whatever you want, I don't care. But it's like the root part of your body, the primal, you know, ball sack area down there, the gooch that if you. If you can start to breathe into that area, your body, you will feel more grounded and you can actually become more grounded. So I started using these techniques just to play football. And by doing so, I was like, I don't really care about studying the system super in depth, but I was just taking the tools that were useful to me, like, literally use these and use them to get stronger, like to bench press more. It was just breathing techniques along with visualization, and they're just following this ancient eastern medicine.
- [38:33]
B
How did breathing techniques help your bench?
- [38:37]
A
So there's some breathing techniques I'm sure you do in martial arts, right, you put your tongue behind your teeth, you can start to breathe in deeply. And if you start to visualize bringing energy down through the crown of your head and the meeting at time, kind of like in the just below your belly button there, you can just start to build more energy, more power. You're just focusing energy. That's all you're doing. And then if you visualize yourself lifting the weight, you're gonna lift it heavier and so how much heavier? There's a bunch of research. You could look up tons of different strength based tasks, studies that show that visualization increases strength. Like for example.
- [39:11]
B
So that's just kind of a, kind of visualization. You think that breathing exercise.
- [39:17]
A
I was just stacking what was known as like basic pet LEP imagery P E T T L E P imagery along with these breathing techniques and visualizing a specific way.
- [39:27]
B
Oh, I thought that when they say visualization helps performance, I thought it was like long term. I didn't think it was like right before they did a thing. I thought, I thought, I think it's like part of training, I think.
- [39:40]
A
Okay, so there's two types, right? So there's like, for example, there's literally a study you could look up and it's like a bicep curl. They did the study. There's four different groups. The first group just didn't do anything. Second group just did bicep physical curl. The third group did bicep curl plus visualization of doing curls. The fourth group did just visualization. The group that did the just the bicep curl and the group that did just the visualization performed the same. They had the same increase in strength. And the group that performed the best was the one that did the visualization plus the bicep curl.
- [40:13]
B
Interesting.
- [40:14]
A
And so there's a bunch of studies like that that just show how when you just stack these different tools together, they can be beneficial. Yes. In the short term for like a fighter, for example. Like this is what I'm training my guys when we go into fight camp. Every single time. We're just training the subconscious to be comfortable being in the setting and just training the subconscious mind. Right. We're just wiring, just digging in those grooves of like, this is what's going to feel like this is going to be the experience and just wiring it in a way of having success. And then what I do is I notice, I'm like, how do you feel? How do you feel? How do you feel as we go along here, it's like, oh, there's doubt that's coming up. Boom, let's go in there, there, let's get rid of that. And it's not an intellectual thing to remove doubt. It's a feeling thing in the body. And honestly, I don't care what we call it. We call it in the chakra, we call it just feeling in the body. You can say, all right, I feel doubt coming up right now at this point in fight. Why? Well, I have this memory that's created this scar tissue within my nervous system right now because this has happened before that I believe if I try to do this, then something bad is going to happen. I'm going to lose a fight.
- [41:14]
B
Right.
- [41:14]
A
So we need to actually accept that. Right. Zen proverb. What I can't accept won't change. So you use these breathing techniques to accept your way through it. The body kind of relaxes through it and then we let it go and then we choose the opposite belief. And that's the alchemy of the process.
- [41:30]
B
Do you know how many people were involved in the study that showed that the visualization right before the performance was better? Jamie, did you find it? I found a different one. This is about hip flexors. Different ones. Hip flexors. Interesting.
- [41:40]
A
There's a bunch of them out there though.
- [41:41]
B
Study whether mental training alone can produce a gain in muscular strength. Thirty male university athletes, including football, basketball and rugby players, were randomly assigned to perform mental training of their hip flexor muscles, to use weight machines to physically exercise their hip flexors or to form a control group which received neither mental nor physical training. The hip strength of each group was measured before and after training. Physical strength was increased by 24% through mental practice. Strength was also increased through physical training by 28% but did not change significantly in the control condition. Whatever that means.
- [42:18]
A
That just means that people who didn't do anything, they didn't visualize and they didn't.
- [42:21]
B
Oh, in the control group.
- [42:22]
A
Yeah.
- [42:22]
B
Okay, I'll get it. I thought they were saying a different thing. The strength game was greatest amongst football players given mental training. Mental and physical training produced similar decreases in heart rate and both yielded a marginal reduction in systolic blood pressure. The results support the related findings of whoever that is, that giant name. Interesting. Very interesting. So it definitely has an effect and it seems like it definitely has a positive effect right before you're performing any kind of athletics.
- [42:56]
A
Yeah. And I think these studies are over like at least a six week period of time. So if you want to see like strength based tasks improve over time, like they're Incrementally getting stronger. Right. It's not just then they're kind of maintaining that strength, I imagine, as long as they continue to do the visualization. Yeah.
- [43:11]
B
I wonder, you know, that's the thing is, like, most people that go to the gym, like most people who are listening to this have regular jobs. If they go to the gym, they don't go visualize.
- [43:21]
A
Yeah. This is peak performance stuff we're talking about.
- [43:24]
B
Yeah.
- [43:24]
A
This is pro athletes, elite.
- [43:26]
B
Don't you if you're trying to get better, like, what way do you want to get better? This is good for you, too. Yeah, I know it sucks. You don't want to visualize your kettlebell routines and visualize your muscles growing afterwards, but. But it might be worth a go. I'd like to hear from some people that try it, because if that kind of results. That's pretty.
- [43:43]
A
Oh, it's crazy.
- [43:44]
B
That's pretty nutty.
- [43:45]
A
So, like. Like I'm saying, like, I did this stuff and then I actually abandoned my football career because I liked it so much. And I went on and did research. I got a research grant just to look at the effect of using some of these techniques on bench press and performance and also decreasing anxiety. Because for me, I realized when I was 18, 19, I had crazy anxiety. I was like, all right, this stuff is helping. You know, call it meditation, hypnosis, whatever. You mean if you can progressively relax yourself? Right. Sitting in a float tank. Right. If you can just do that, if you can progressively relax yourself, your anxiety is going to go down, your cortisol levels are going to go down, the whole body is going to thrive. And this is actually, like, connected to so much that has to do with our health. Kind of coming full circle is I see so much other professional athletes come to me with these injuries. The physical therapist. Working on it, working on it, working on it. Nothing's happening. It's just a nagging injury every single time. If I can relax them enough and I can get to the root emotional core of whatever's creating this pain for them. And it's usually emotional. It's actually like a memory or some kind of mental block. Like the governor is coming in. Right. I'll see it. Some guys in, like, the lower minor leagues, he's trying to go up to the major leagues, and it's like these things will just start to express themselves when they're just about to get to that next level. And if we can move through the emotional side of it, the pain disappears.
- [45:02]
B
Right. But not in all injuries. Right. Like there's gotta be, like, legitimate injuries where guys blow their meniscus out, guys have broken shin bones that have to.
- [45:11]
A
Be reconstructed, stuff that can't be explained. Like, a lot of times, right. You go to the doctor. Like, I don't know what your issue is. Right. That happens all the time.
- [45:18]
B
Okay, well, that's a different thing. I mean, the realities of physical injuries that guys get from combat sports training are real. Like, if you have bulging discs in your neck and your arm goes numb, that's. It's a real problem.
- [45:29]
A
Yeah.
- [45:30]
B
You know, it's not just an emotional thing.
- [45:32]
A
I'm speaking about things that are, like, nagging and you're doing the physical therapy and it's not working.
- [45:37]
B
Right.
- [45:37]
A
Okay. If that's you. Okay.
- [45:39]
B
So, yeah, we got to be specific. Right. So you're talking about, like, weird stuff that does come up where they're almost like psychosomatic injuries because guys are responding badly to the pressure.
- [45:49]
A
And not even just the. The pressure. It could just be. It could be an injury that existed before, but it's just not healing. For whatever reason, it's not healing, and it's just kind of recurring. If you can get to the emotional root or keep that, like, I have fun with this now. I always look up, whenever someone tells me their injury, I just look at Chat GPT. What is a spiritual, emotional connection to this injury? And it's usually right on point. I'll be like, what do you think about this?
- [46:13]
B
They're like, oh, yeah, that's spiritual, emotional connection to. But not to, like, legit injuries. Like a broken hand.
- [46:21]
A
Yeah. I mean, you know what I mean? Yeah, for sure.
- [46:23]
B
Like, someone breaks their hand, they gotta get screws and plates in there.
- [46:27]
A
Sure.
- [46:27]
B
Yeah. That's not. You can't look that up on Chat GPT. Yeah, he broke his hand.
- [46:32]
A
I'll give you an example. Like, I have so many of these, Right. It might be like someone has, like, a hamstring that just nagging. Right. A lot of athletes, like, I pop my hamstring, it just won't feel normal again. Right, right. I look that type of stuff up, it's like, all right, well, why is this going away? I work with, like, pitchers in Major League Baseball. It's like, my hip, it's like, well, why. Why is this coming up now? And usually there's always, like, some kind of root, and if we can get to it, we can relieve it.
- [46:57]
B
I bet there's a lot of guys, too, that have. If you think about making a living with your body, you make A living in a sport with your body, where you're putting your body through explosive movements that could blow joints out. So there's always this anxiety.
- [47:09]
A
Yes.
- [47:09]
B
It all could go away.
- [47:10]
A
Yes.
- [47:11]
B
One twist of the ankle, one blowout. I mean, look at people all the time lose their careers in football and in martial arts because they blow a knee out or they blow their back apart, bro.
- [47:23]
A
There's only like 10 core beliefs that create fear in athletes. I've seen, like, there's not that many. And one of them is one you're.
- [47:30]
B
Pointing out right now is like life changing injuries.
- [47:32]
A
Will I be able to sustain it? You know, the core is like, will I be able to sustain this or will I be able to continue to do the thing that I love?
- [47:37]
B
Right.
- [47:37]
A
And of course, like, yeah, if you get injured, then you'll lose it all.
- [47:41]
B
Did you ever talk to Weidman after he broke his leg?
- [47:44]
A
I did.
- [47:44]
B
Did you?
- [47:45]
A
I did, yeah.
- [47:46]
B
Does he openly talk about that? Are we allowed to talk about this?
- [47:49]
A
Yeah, I mean, he gave me a testimonial, so I think.
- [47:52]
B
Okay. He's pretty open, like online, so he could talk about it.
- [47:55]
A
Yeah, he put like a video testimony.
- [47:56]
B
He's one of the toughest guys that's ever fought in the ufc. He's an animal. And that guy in his prime was fucking terrifying.
- [48:04]
A
Yeah.
- [48:04]
B
But that injury that he got is one of the absolute hardest injuries to recover from. That broken leg. When they break their shin in half like that, very few people ever come back. Yeah, I mean, there's one guy, I believe, that's a heavyweight in Bellator. It happened to him. And he's fighting again and fighting well. I don't know his name. See if he can find his name. But Anderson was never the same after his. Tyrone Spong was never the same after his. Weidman was never the same after his. It's just. And psychologically, it's gotta be fucking crazy to think that you threw a super powerful kick that broke your own leg in half and now you're expected. You went through a year and a half of hell to try to just get to the point where you can hit paths again.
- [48:51]
A
Yeah.
- [48:52]
B
And now you're gonna go risk it again. Might kick someone's knee again and break your shin again and do that again, and then you can't walk again.
- [49:00]
A
What we're talking about is like that just so we have physical scar tissue. It's that emotional scar tissue, you know, it's just like, it's hard for those thoughts not to come back into your head. Of like, I need to be extra careful here.
- [49:10]
B
Well, they're reasonable thoughts.
- [49:12]
A
Yeah.
- [49:12]
B
You know, if you think about it. But it's like Chris had that style. I mean that the kick that he threw in Uriah hall was full blast. I mean, he ripped that kick. And then when I heard that snap, I've heard that snap a couple of times and it is the most horrible sound, man, the sound of a bone breaking, like a person's bone breaking. It's like, oh, it gets you like in every cell in your body. Like, God damn, that's awful. I've seen it a bunch. I've seen it at least half a dozen times. I've seen people get a bone broken.
- [49:51]
A
Yeah, it's traumatizing.
- [49:53]
B
Yeah. To come back from that is very hard because we're talking about the anxiety of always worrying about getting injured and then you get injured from maybe it kicked you through. Or Tim Sylvia, Frank Mir, Frank Mir broke his arm. Or Frank Meir, Minotauro, his spiral fracture from that Kimura. Like, fuck. Coming back from something like that is really hard. But what do you do for a fighter when you're trying to rebuild them? Do you. Do you take each fighter as a unique project and you just want to know everything about them and what, what bothers them about themselves, what bothers them about their discipline? So how do you do it?
- [50:34]
A
I'm going to explain what I do. It's going to sound woo woo, but I also want to contextualize it with the fact that I didn't believe in anything. It's just my experience of doing this stuff for 17 years now and just seeing and feeling my way into this art that now I speak about things that the old me, 15 years ago, 20 years ago, would be like, shut the fuck up. But so what I do with any of my clients is I bring them to a very relaxed state. You know, like think of custody Amato, what do you do with Mike Tyson? Like, that's what I'm doing with these guys, right. So I'm bringing them almost into a hypnotic state and I'm bringing them down into this place where they finally let go. They're no longer trying to like, keep me out, defend, keep up this like, identity. They want to project into the world so they can actually get to the insecurities. Because I don't touch any of the beliefs that are working for them. If someone has positive beliefs or successful, I don't touch any of that stuff. All I'm trying to find is their insecurity, their fear, their Anxiety, their doubt. And so I'm just digging deeper and deeper into their body until we start to, like, think about things they want to achieve. And it's like, ooh, what was twitchy there? Right? Something twitches in them. It's like, I'm feeling like I'm getting angry now. Why are you getting angry? Right. Why do we get angry? It's because we're afraid and we're trying to defend ourselves. And so if I find something like that, I feel into it with them, and then I ask them, I'm like, what would what do you believe in be true that make you feel this way right now? And if I sit there long and I hold him in that tension, it'll eventually come up. And through that, we can release that belief. We can accept our way through it first. We can release it, and we can reprogram it.
- [52:06]
B
How are you setting this up? Is this actual hypnosis? Are you doing, like, hypnotic techniques?
- [52:11]
A
Yeah.
- [52:11]
B
Yeah. And how did you learn how to do that?
- [52:15]
A
Same guy, Sensei.
- [52:16]
B
Sensei, yeah. Does he have a cult? Does he have a cult that we could join?
- [52:20]
A
A one of one.
- [52:23]
B
So this guy taught you hypnosis techniques as well?
- [52:25]
A
Yeah, yeah, he taught me a lot of different things. Hypnosis, nlp, timeline therapy. And then I didn't go on and get a secondary degree, so I studied the. I created my own degree. I went to a liberal arts school in la. The mental aspect of human performance. But everything I was learning that was helping me and my teammates, I was learning outside of school.
- [52:43]
B
School.
- [52:43]
A
So I was like, I'm not gonna go get. Spend $200,000 and getting a secondary degree when I'm learning everything else outside of school. So I've just continued to go to workshops, learn, study with different people who know how to do different techniques. And that's how I learned very kinesthetically, the same way that if you're doing martial arts, you're just trying to go to as many masks you can. This guy jiu jitsu, this guy kickboxing. That's just what I've done. I've gone and tried to find different people who are really good at what they do. And that's how I learned through doing and actually experiencing the work of myself first. If it works for me, then I try it on my clients. If it works for them, I just keep it going. And I just. I don't have one technique. I use many different techniques. Whatever the moment calls for, that's what I use.
- [53:22]
B
Are there even degrees that you could get in human performance. That would sort of match the kind of studying that you're doing. Is there anything like if you went to a major university, do they consider human mental performance and human performance, whether it's in athletics or chess or anything like that, where you have to really think through things and deal with pressure, do they consider that a discipline? Is that something that they study?
- [53:48]
A
I think sports psychology, I think you.
- [53:52]
B
Can get a degree that sounds very rudimentary. It is like sports psychology versus human performance.
- [53:56]
A
It is.
- [53:57]
B
When you think about this conversation that you and I are having, one of the things that we're talking about is how important it is to have a mindset that allows you to work your way through difficulties and become successful at a thing and just get out of your own way. Everybody wants to do that. So if that's a real thing, why wouldn't that be taught in every major university?
- [54:23]
A
They won't let you smoke the toad at school. That's why.
- [54:25]
B
But they don't have to specifically advocate for it. But the kids are going to do it anyway. But what's important is that they should recognize that this is a thing.
- [54:37]
A
Yeah.
- [54:38]
B
Like if it's a thing. If we all agree, and I bet any competitive athlete in any sport has experienced anxiety. You've had days where you felt amazing and you performed amazing. And then you've had days where you doubted yourself and you fucked up and you dropped the ball or whatever you did. There's. There's this weird battle that goes on in the head, and it's all. It has a giant result, whatever's going on in your head and how you perform.
- [55:02]
A
Yeah. And you always talk about where do ideas come from? Right. Like, where do they magically come from? I don't know where they come from exactly, but I know how they're getting filtered, and it's just through the beliefs. Because our belief system deletes, distorts, and generalizes information. And the fact that nobody, not nobody, but many people don't understand how that filtration system works just limits so many of us from achieving what we want. Because we're literally like, you all know, like the girl who's, like, dated an asshole and she's like, all men are assholes. Right. She's deleting, distorting, generalizing. Like her best friend who's married to an incredible guy. Right. But when you believe something, you literally shape the world to make it match it.
- [55:41]
B
Right? Yeah, you kind of do. Yeah. And if you believe bad things, bad things will happen to you. No.
- [55:48]
A
Hundred percent. There's millions of pieces of information that you can see, smell, taste or touch in any moment. There's so much sensory information, we can only pick up on a few in our conscious mind in any moment. So that's where the ideas come from.
- [55:59]
B
I also think it's interactive more than we like to admit.
- [56:02]
A
Tell me about that.
- [56:03]
B
I don't think you can manifest your own reality, but I think you have a part in the process and the thinking part about and the visual. Not necessarily visualizing, but staying on a path.
- [56:20]
A
Yes.
- [56:21]
B
There's. There's an element that's going on there that's affecting reality itself. There's a weird exchange of energy between human beings and between reality itself that I don't think we've figured out how to measure. I don't think it's as simple as life is a series of events and it all takes place randomly and good luck to you. Come on.
- [56:43]
A
The synchronicities are undeniable.
- [56:45]
B
Yeah. There's some stuff that's weird. There's some stuff that's weird that makes me think without going full woo woo. Maybe we just don't have a grasp of the full spectrum of all the things that are happening, of all the factors at play and how many of them have to deal with. You know, we would air quote energy.
- [57:04]
A
Yes.
- [57:04]
B
You know, that's where the woo woo comes in.
- [57:06]
A
Here's how I appeal to my rational mind to make this make sense. Right.
- [57:09]
B
Okay.
- [57:10]
A
So I think about beliefs are like the code of our mind that's constantly filtering in the information. All this code does is determine how I'm going to feel. And that feeling either going to make me want to go towards something or pull away from it.
- [57:24]
B
Yeah.
- [57:24]
A
So I just want my beliefs to push me or pull me towards the things that I want because it's gonna lead to me behaving in a way that gets to an outcome as simple as that.
- [57:33]
B
Yeah. Well, that's logical. But everybody's starting from a different place. Right. So there's some people that are starting from a devastating place of a lack of self belief.
- [57:45]
A
Yes.
- [57:45]
B
And for those, it's just gonna be a longer journey to get to some sort of positive outcome. But a lot of people just don't know how to begin the first steps. Like they want to. Like if you just have like no confidence, you feel like shit. You feel like every day is garbage. Everywhere you go you think, oh my God, everyone's gonna hate me. There's a lot of people that walk.
- [58:05]
A
Through life like that you want the first step.
- [58:07]
B
What's the first step?
- [58:07]
A
It's awareness.
- [58:08]
B
Awareness?
- [58:09]
A
Yeah. Set an alarm on your phone every three hours just to ask yourself, how do you feel?
- [58:13]
B
But you feel like shit every hour on the hour, like, I feel.
- [58:16]
A
But you gotta sit in that, right? Because most people, like, cut themselves off, off at, like, the. The head. And they just stay in the thoughts, the negative thoughts, but they don't actually go into the feeling. So that's step one.
- [58:25]
B
Okay?
- [58:25]
A
Just to sit in the shit pit of full awareness of all the feelings. Then from there, set an alarm for the next week that go, okay, feel what's coming up. And then ask yourself, what were you focused on? Then you can start to take some kind of ownership over, like, where are those thoughts coming from?
- [58:41]
B
Right.
- [58:42]
A
How is my focus creating the way that I feel? Right? And you can start to start. You can start to see your beliefs by connecting those dots of, like, all right, why is that making me feel angry? So you have to feel first and then notice what you're focusing on. And then you start to come into this feeling of, all right, well, I'm seeing it, right? It's the. The four stages of learning. You're getting to this place of conscious incompetence. I see that I make myself feel bad. I don't know how I'm doing it. And then you can go, okay, what if I started to flip the focus and I started to build that muscle? Because this is the way I think about the mind and all these things is it's a muscle, just like the body. You can start to train it. Your mind just picks up on these patterns of repetition, just like striking a bag. Just like anything else. If you do something over and over again, right. You say the same things yourself over and over again, the repetition starts to make its way down to subconscious level.
- [59:30]
B
Well, Huberman talked about that. That area of the brain that actually grows larger when you do things you don't want to do. And you build discipline. So it really is a muscle.
- [59:39]
A
So you don't want to focus on the thing that is good for you because it feels like, oh, yucky. It's like, I'm lying to myself. But that's the exercise. Just flip it. Just continue to flip it.
- [59:49]
B
But for some people, they don't know how to get started with these thoughts, like, without hiring a coach. Well, I mean, do you have it laid out?
- [59:58]
A
Yeah, yeah.
- [59:59]
B
What someone should look like.
- [60:00]
A
Second half, from the start, is a literally playbook. Just do everything in the second half of the book.
- [60:04]
B
What doing? I'm. What I'm getting to this is though, like, you know, you're dealing with a guy like Sean Brady. He's already tough as fuck. He's already a, you know, elite MMA fighter. He has this loss, but he's already a beast of a human being. But when you're dealing with people that don't have any athletic background and, you know, maybe they just have a job and they just have no fucking confidence and they're sick of it. They're sick of like living life in this anxiety pit of despair and they want to find a way out. There's got to be like multiple different things that have to happen, right? So it's not just the way you think, but there's also like actions.
- [60:38]
A
And I think this is an action, right? Step into awareness.
- [60:42]
B
Yes, Feel it.
- [60:44]
A
The next set of actions, the next week. Step into awareness of what you're feeling. And what are you focusing on that makes you feel the way? That's another set of actions.
- [60:50]
B
But do you feel like this is all possible for someone to achieve without some kind of physical exercise in coordination with it?
- [61:00]
A
Because what kind of exercise are you talking about?
- [61:02]
B
It seems to me that people with depression in particular, like, one of the best cures for depression is regular exercise. Any kind of exercise, whether it's fucking go, jog around the lake, whatever you want to do.
- [61:15]
A
Listen, even before any of this is low hanging fruits, like in the book, I have people do an intake of their life and I have them also kind of just look at all the low hanging fruit of like if you're drinking vodka bottles at 7am in the morning, that's the low hanging fruit you need to start to find a way through. Drink one instead of three, right? There's all these like, small steps you have to take.
- [61:35]
B
One bottle instead of three, Is that what you're saying?
- [61:37]
A
You know, the tiny bottles.
- [61:37]
B
Come on.
- [61:38]
A
Oh, you know what I'm saying?
- [61:39]
B
Like this, if you're drinking vodka in the morning, like, you've got bigger problems, bro.
- [61:43]
A
I've had clients who are like, you know, high level executives that are so stressed that they drink first thing in the morning. I've had, and I've helped them get off it completely, but it starts with something like that of like, all right.
- [61:53]
B
Well, that's a big duh, right? But what I'm getting at is I think if you want to have less anxiety, you got to wring some of it out of your physical body as well. And that'll help you achieve clarity. You have to think about it like a nutrient that you're taking or brushing your teeth or doing some. Take your medication. You have to really think about it like that. And it doesn't matter what kind of stuff you do. It doesn't matter. Whatever you like to do. If you like to do yoga, you want to go hike with a weight vest on, you want to do push ups in a parking lot, do whatever, do something.
- [62:23]
A
I couldn't agree more.
- [62:24]
B
You just have to do something where you push yourself. Because if you don't, your body stores up. It seems. Yes. Like all this anxiety.
- [62:31]
A
Yes.
- [62:32]
B
And the reason why I believe this, one of the reasons why I believe this is like I've had some of like the best mindsets ever in my life. After yoga classes and long stretching sessions where I'm working on something, I'm just like, you know, I'm gonna stretch out here and I'll just sit and stretch for an hour and a half, two hours. And when I get up, I feel wonderful. I feel like the world is beautiful. I want to hug people. I feel so peaceful. I love doing that. Like right before I do stand up, it's like one of my favorite things is to really stretch out right before I do stand up. And I just feel so relaxed. It's so different. So you're carrying around actual physical tension that affects your mind. That's why I think regardless of the tools that you use in turn. Yes, all of it.
- [63:19]
A
I'm all of it. That's why I'm not just mental performance. Like it has to be. All of it's nutrition so important, right? The gut brain axis. It has to be nutrition, exercise, rigorous exercise. How about your career? Living a life where you have like some sense of meaning, Right. And starting to move towards that.
- [63:37]
B
Right. Don't do something you hate just because it pays you. If you have an option to do something that you might possibly love. If you want a better life, that's the life. Even if you're making less money, that's the life. You don't want to be doing something you don't want to do.
- [63:49]
A
You're trying to decrease the amount of stuck energy in you. That's what you're trying to do. When you feel suppressed, you're not doing what you want to do. The energy gets stuck.
- [63:57]
B
And if you're doing a job that you hate and you know you could be doing something else, you just have never fucking gone for it. Like, ooh, that'll eat away your head.
- [64:05]
A
It's just always there. It's Always there. It's always.
- [64:07]
B
Forever and ever and ever. It'll always eat away at you that you never took a chance. You just. They show up every day, 9am Chunk, Chunk, punch in. Fuck. Just waiting for 5pm Fuck. And then you get off and you're tired.
- [64:20]
A
Yeah.
- [64:21]
B
You know, and then you see other people that didn't do that, and you feel like shit even more. And then, you know, it's like you're 40 and it's too late. You feel like. But it's not.
- [64:31]
A
It's never too late.
- [64:31]
B
Are you breathing? Are you alive? Okay. Then you can figure out something better than what you're doing. You don't have much time left.
- [64:39]
A
Yeah. That self suppression creates a depression in any aspect, right?
- [64:43]
B
Yeah.
- [64:44]
A
Anytime you're trying to just. Just like squeeze in, hold it in, hold it in. Whether it's the inspiration you have, whether it's like, hey, I want to go play this sport, but I just never make time for it. That's self suppression. Like, you have to make time for your natural inspiration to flow through you. And if you don't, I think that's what creates depression.
- [65:02]
B
Well, it's very hard for people to get going just to actually do something. And I brought this up a million times, and I'll bring it up again. Unfortunately, Steven Pressfield has an amazing book called the War of Art, and it's about that suppression that you put on yourself. That. That weird. And he calls it resistance.
- [65:23]
A
Yes.
- [65:23]
B
And, you know, he talks about summoning the muse and deciding that you're professional and show up every day. And I think it's the same with that. It's the same thing. It's like, it's hard to just get off the couch and put your shoes on. Like, Goggins talks about it. He's like, I stare at those for half an hour sometimes. But he always puts him. I believe him for 30 minutes. Yep. 100%. He doesn't lie. He's telling you the truth.
- [65:46]
A
That's wild.
- [65:47]
B
Because he brutalizes himself. It makes sense that he stares at him for 30 minutes, but he probably literally stares at them. Yeah, Fuck you.
- [65:54]
A
He's just cussing him out.
- [65:55]
B
And then he just puts them on. You don't know me, son. Exactly. Then he puts them on. So it's. There's something there.
- [66:03]
A
You know, there is that resistance that Press Will talks about. Like, that's exactly what I'm talking about here. Right?
- [66:09]
B
Yeah. It's doing something to you, whether you're.
- [66:10]
A
An athlete, whether you're a creative. I Mean, I think it applies to everyone. Like the resistance is whatever is holding you back from following your natural inspiration.
- [66:19]
B
Well, I think a big part of that resistance is a fear of failure. There's a thing that hovers over people that's fear of failure. And that, that actually it keeps you from just doing the things that you need to do to be successful. You get afraid for whatever weird reason. It becomes a predominant fear in your head.
- [66:39]
A
Broken code. There's so many reasons. Like, I'll give you an example. So I ran like a big fitness channel when I was trying to make it before I started working with cool clients who are like Sean Brady and built a big fitness community. And I would see that like a mom who's not doing her exercise and it's like, why don't you just do it? Just do it. Just get up, just do it. You deep. You go down into her subconscious find, oh, well, I believe that if I start working out, I won't have time to be the mom that I am right now. And then my kids will leave me completely irrational. But subconsciously, that's what exists down there for so many people. They think they're gonna lose out on something and if they lose it, it's not worth it subconsciously than doing the thing that they're inspired to do.
- [67:21]
B
But it's also sometimes people, their health is bad and then unfortunately, they're not eating correctly and that's why their health is bad and they have zero energy. And so the daunting task of doing something on top of working all day, it's almost like overwhelming to them.
- [67:37]
A
Yeah.
- [67:37]
B
And then if they have kids and they have a bunch of. And then the option is get up at 6am like, no. Fuck.
- [67:42]
A
Well, that's the power of transmuting the energy. So just flipping the energy on it, right? To go from this is gonna make me a worse mom to this can make me a better mom. And maybe that will give them enough juice to actually go do the workout. Maybe, maybe.
- [67:55]
B
I mean, there's gotta be something that you can do to trick yourself into having the energy to get started. But that's kind of what it is. It's like you're, you have to trick yourself into getting started. And then when you get to an elite athlete level like Brady, it's gotta be about making sure the process is airtight.
- [68:15]
A
Right.
- [68:16]
B
It's gotta be like really tuning it in.
- [68:18]
A
Right.
- [68:19]
B
Like making sure it's finely tuned.
- [68:22]
A
Yeah. Basically fight week. I want his energy, I want him to be matter of fact about Everything just a matter of fact, just neutral, just sitting right here. You know that feeling you have in your heart where you're just like, present.
- [68:34]
B
Mm.
- [68:34]
A
Just right there. Right there.
- [68:36]
B
And. But how do you get there? Like, what's the way to get there?
- [68:40]
A
So for him at that elite level, it's going down and it's clearing out anything that comes up during camp. It might be. And this isn't actually Sean, but, like, I work with a lot of other fighters, and for them it would be, oh, I'm losing in some of my sparring sessions. And so their confidence is actually going down because of that.
- [68:55]
B
That.
- [68:55]
A
And so it's literally reprogramming that belief inside of them. And this sounds woo, but if you ever want, we'll do a session. You'll actually be able to feel it with me. And what happens is we transmute the energy to make them feel that it's okay to believe that even when they're losing and sparring, they're getting better. And so if something just shifts inside of them instead of it creating a seed of doubt when they're, like, working on something, they're drilling something and they're not winning everything. Now it's okay. I'm getting better. And it's just a feeling that shifts in them.
- [69:24]
B
Well, that is reality. Right. I mean, as long as they're not getting truly beat up rationally, of course, sparring at a good place.
- [69:30]
A
But that survival instinct or that goes, I should be winning everything.
- [69:33]
B
Yeah.
- [69:34]
A
Doesn't like that. And so we. Sometimes we have to rewire those things. So that's what we're doing as we're going through camp is like seeing what comes up, what's decreasing confidence, what are you dialed in? Everything. You know, I'm working with the other coaches as well and making sure. Are they doing what you want them to do? And if they're not, what's going on here? And that's kind of my job, so.
- [69:53]
B
Has to have it. Rather, it requires a very strong connection between you and the athlete.
- [70:01]
A
Oh, deep. I would say that nobody knows any of my clients better than them, except for maybe their wives.
- [70:10]
B
Better than you know them.
- [70:11]
A
Yeah. It's an extreme intimacy because I talk about something in the book called the core wound. So the worst thing that ever happened to you is the worst thing that ever happened to you. But some people have, you know, they might have witnessed a murder or maybe they lost a parent when they were young, like something really bad. Another person might have been bullied when they're in the Fourth grade and kicked out of a friend group. If we identify what that core wound is for them, that fundamentally hurts their confidence to this day. And we clear that out, we can exponentially increase just their confidence and their self belief. But the only way we get there is they're telling me their deepest darkest secret.
- [70:44]
B
Right, but how do you clear it out? Once you.
- [70:47]
A
There's just some of these techniques. There's something called like hypnosis, right? You can use it with hypnosis nlp. They're all these mind techniques that you can utilize to clear the energy which clears the emotion.
- [70:59]
B
So nlp, that is like that Anthony Robbins stuff, right? Neuro linguistic program. That's what he does, right?
- [71:04]
A
I think it's part of what he does. I don't know, I've never worked with them but.
- [71:08]
B
And did you go to school to learn neuro linguistic programming?
- [71:11]
A
No, I just studied with someone who taught it to me. Yeah, I just learned very well one to one. Just like that's how I learned.
- [71:16]
B
Not totally familiar with it. How. How complicated is nlp? Cuz I know some people like really.
- [71:22]
A
Believe in it all perception, right? I.
- [71:25]
B
That's why is it explain what it means by saying Neuro linguistic programming. What does that mean?
- [71:30]
A
Yeah, I don't even know what the. I don't know how to explain neuro linguistic programming. But I will just tell you what it is. Fundamentally you're just playing with perception, right? So someone has something's easy for me to get rid of is like the, the fear of flying. I have this baseball player this year I'm working with. Every time he gets on a flight he starts freaking out. Unnecessary. So what do we do? We imagine him on the plane and I have him sit, visualize being on the plane and starting to get to that place of anxious. What are the thoughts? Oh, the plane's gonna crash. He knows it's irrational. But why is he feeling this Anyway, we have to go into it, feel the emotion, feel the emotion. Then I have imagined for example a giant picture in his mind, in his mind's eye and this picture is holding him and all the anxiety and the worst case scenario happening and then we boom. Get rid of the color in the picture. And then we imagine this picture becoming super tiny. And then we imagine it just disappearing. And then we put a new picture in there of him being able to fly, not crash. Be able to do it all the time and be successful.
- [72:30]
B
That's it.
- [72:31]
A
That's it.
- [72:32]
B
What if it was 911 and flew right into the tower right after you gave him that advice.
- [72:36]
A
Well, that sucks.
- [72:38]
B
How would you feel? Would that be it? You'd be like, I quit, I'm done?
- [72:42]
A
Yeah. I mean, they sound like very simple techniques, but it's something you have to experience.
- [72:47]
B
Yeah, but it would, it would seem to me that it would be very difficult to get people to actually change their beliefs that easily. Like, the idea sounds solid, but the actual process of shifting how you view the world depending upon the person is like turning a battleship around.
- [73:05]
A
Yeah, it is. It's heavy. I don't know. I mean, this is the stuff that goes beyond the rational mind. Like, if you were to experience it, you'd be like, okay, I get it.
- [73:12]
B
Yeah.
- [73:12]
A
But it's a emotional experience. I mean, how do you. There's some things we can't explain. Right. Like, how do you explain going through the veil on a psychedelic experience? Experience? It's something that you can't really explain when you come back on the other side. It's that kind of thing where it's like, when you're in the experience, it's like, how is this supposed to be possible? I explain the techniques irrationally, but what are you talking about? Same thing. If you have this immense psychedelic experience and you're passing through the veil and you're seeing all these things, having this experience of interconnecting this and you try to come back and you tell someone who's never had a psychedelic experience and be like, what are you talking about?
- [73:46]
B
Yeah, there's not enough. Enough words. No, no words work.
- [73:50]
A
This stuff goes beyond language. It's the same thing.
- [73:52]
B
Yeah. You can say like, I saw a beautiful rose and I'm like, oh, cool, I know what that looks like.
- [73:56]
A
That's why it. Yeah, yeah, exactly.
- [73:58]
B
There's not enough words for a psychedelic experience.
- [74:00]
A
So this work. That's why I like, I put together the playbook. So I give people actual things that they can do. Because I understand not everyone's going to work with me one to one and be able to experience this. But people can do these simple exercises. People can audit their life and they can see some of the patterns of thinking and just the awareness of seeing some of the patterns. You're thinking if you study enough, you might be able to change it. Right. We've all had bad habits and sometimes just gets to a point where like, all right, I'm not doing that anymore.
- [74:26]
B
So this neuro linguistic programming, do you specifically design this? Kind of. So you. What you. You do? That is one of the things you do.
- [74:34]
A
Yeah.
- [74:35]
B
Do you specifically Design different ones for different people that you work with if you're going to work one on one with the client.
- [74:40]
A
Honestly, I don't know what I'm going to do before I go. To go into any session. It's all. I just feel it in the present moment. I mean, you could think of it like, I have all these tools I can use, and then I feel into what their issue is, and then I do my best with the tools I have to fix their issue. I'm just problem solving the moment.
- [74:59]
B
Does it feel weird to do that as a career? I mean, that sounds like a crazy job. It feels like so much. So much weight on your shoulders to try to help a person, like, especially try to help an elite athlete, like knowing what to say and how to get their mind tuned in. Right. And what to. What to introduce and whether or not this technique is effective. Am I doing this right?
- [75:20]
A
I just don't think I. I surrender to something bigger than myself. Right. That's what I have to do, is just allow.
- [75:25]
B
How did you know that you could do it, though? Like, how did you know that this was going to be, like, really effective? Especially on someone like a fighter, where it's like, this is a really complicated gig. Like, you really. You want to talk about a sport where you have to have your mind, right? Like, there's no sport like fighting, because any mistake you make, you're gonna get head kicked.
- [75:43]
A
Yeah, well, I lose, too, sometimes, right? So, like Weidman, I helped him come back, his first fight back from after he broke his leg, and he said that's the best he's ever felt in his career going into a fight. He still lost a fight.
- [75:57]
B
Yeah. There's a physical factor there, too, that whether or not a guy like Weidman never wants to admit, because he's so tough, because he has this incredible belief in himself. But a catastrophic break of a bone like that, when you're in your late 30s, that is hard to come back from, man. That's not simple.
- [76:14]
A
Yeah.
- [76:15]
B
It takes a long time. And, you know, he came back. You know, he. He eventually reached a higher. A higher level than his first fight back. But. But he doesn't, you know, necessarily look like Chris Weidman when he beat Anderson Silva or Chris Wyman, 39 now. Yeah, yeah, unfortunately. And these guys, it's like if you're natural and he's natural, they get to a certain point where the body just can't keep up with the brain. Like, their brain is so strong and they're so tough, but their body is not a 24 year old's body anymore. It doesn't move right anymore. And this accumulation of injuries, regardless of your belief system. Yeah, it's just your foot doesn't work anymore, bro.
- [76:55]
A
You know, I mean, that was me understanding, like, when I was 18 years old. I'm like, I'm not that good at football. Like, I don't have the physical gifts. Like, I'm just not that athletic. I'm not gonna run that fast. And when. So this is how I discovered it, right. I started to learn these techniques. Like, I can do things like get rid of someone's headache very easily with some of these techniques. So, like, I have a teammate had a terrible headache and be like, all right, let's do some of these hypnosis relaxation techniques. He's like, my headache's gone. I'm like, I'm way better than this than I was at football. And that was a spark within me.
- [77:22]
B
That made me want see me. I would take him to the hospital. I'm like, bro, you might be having a stroke. Let's get you to the.
- [77:28]
A
Come on.
- [77:30]
B
When a guy who's a tough guy complains about a headache, I always get concerned.
- [77:33]
A
He wasn't that tough.
- [77:35]
B
He's a football player. He's got to be tough, bro. You want to see tough? Look at LeBron James's feet. I was looking at LeBron James's feet today online. Have you seen him, Jamie?
- [77:43]
A
Yeah, for sure, bro.
- [77:46]
B
How does that guy play elite basketball?
- [77:49]
A
Yeah.
- [77:49]
B
With those up feet. Like, his feet are so broken. And because of all the years of exploding and twisting and turning. And he's been playing professionally for how long? 20 years, which is 21. I think that's bananas.
- [78:04]
A
Yeah. I don't understand.
- [78:04]
B
Think about the amount of explosions he's forced his feet to perform. Imagine moving back and forth and you weigh 250 pounds. Like, that's nuts. That's so much force.
- [78:16]
A
He's not the same species as us. He's something else.
- [78:18]
B
Discipline, bro. But look at those toes. That is bananas. That's bananas. Like his. His toes just take, like, sharp turns.
- [78:29]
A
That may or may not be accurate.
- [78:30]
B
They might not be right. That other one looked better. Yeah, let me see that.
- [78:34]
A
That looks a little better.
- [78:35]
B
It's a little over it, but yeah, it's a little over it, but he might be getting it. Maybe he did that on purpose. Maybe he did that for the picture. Just to be silly.
- [78:43]
A
This is the viral while ago is on the beach.
- [78:45]
B
Yeah, that's pretty obvious. So his big toe Goes under the next toe, it's that twisted in. That's obvious.
- [78:52]
A
It also doesn't like the same foot as that foot.
- [78:54]
B
You know, Brian Simpson was having a problem with that too because he's got wide feet. And I told him about yoga toes. That stuff works, man. You ever use those? They stretch your feet out. You put your toes in there and they stretch. It's like a little rubber stopper in between each little toesy. And it stretches your foot out and makes it, you know, feel better. Relieves the tent, the pressure that you're getting with narrow toed shoes where it's squishing it in the front, your feet up nice. But to be that tough to play basketball with that kind of a foot for 20 plus years, that's nuts.
- [79:27]
A
Yeah, it's taking a lot of to.
- [79:29]
B
Be God run with no knees. Nuts. Nuts.
- [79:33]
A
That's. That's what inspiration does though, you know, I think these guys just want it. They want it. They want to keep going. They want to keep pushing it. They want to see what's possible.
- [79:41]
B
Possible. Yeah. I was watching a fight today, one of my little chat groups that I have with Dean Thomas and Matt, Sarah and John Rollo. A guy was fighting in a box. It looks like a boxing match. And he has one leg. So he's hopping around with one leg trying to this guy up. So if you ever think like, maybe. Here, let me find this. You ever think like, maybe life has been too hard on me, maybe the barriers in front of me insurmountable. Try doing what this guy's doing because this is really kind of crazy. And I don't understand what they're doing because there are. They're barefoot, but they're not kicking. And I guess the guy can't kick because he only has one leg. Maybe they agreed no kicking. But like, why put a shoe on?
- [80:30]
A
Yeah.
- [80:30]
B
You know, I don't understand why, if you guys aren't gonna kick, why don't you have shoes on? It's better for your grandma grip. But this guy's hopping around. Did you get it, Jamie? This guy's hopping around, throwing punches with literally one leg. Look at this. Oh, how nuts is that? One thing, you do have to think it sucks that he only has one leg, but I bet he weighs about 40 pounds lighter that way.
- [80:52]
A
Oh, yeah.
- [80:53]
B
So like he's probably got some strong ass arms, but you can only generate so much force with one leg.
- [80:58]
A
I can't even balance on one leg.
- [81:00]
B
I know, his balance is insane, man. And his movements are really good. Too. Like, there's people that have two legs that don't move that good. It's nuts. The other dude's like, I wish I could leg kick you. Like, that's so not fair. You guarantee that dude can't kick you back?
- [81:17]
A
So explosive.
- [81:18]
B
But it's just pretty nutty that, you know, he's still willing to fight and he's hitting this guy.
- [81:24]
A
I mean, it's the human will. Yeah, it's incredible.
- [81:27]
B
It is incredible. The human mind can do very strange things if you let it keep going down a path and keep getting better and better.
- [81:35]
A
Yes.
- [81:36]
B
You know, you can get to a very strange place that, you know, a lot of people don't want to believe exists.
- [81:41]
A
Yeah. Just to keep expanding the possibilities. Right. Exposing yourself to new things. I think that's why, like, people in my field traditionally, like, they're not doing psychedelics. Like, it's not really a thing that people do.
- [81:56]
B
Why do you think that is? I would imagine. I would think that anybody that's really exploring how the line works, I say.
- [82:01]
A
Maybe more sports psychology, stuff like that, because they're more clinical. They're more clinical people. You know, they're doctors. They're. Yeah, their people are much more clinical, methodical about things. But for me, like, my full ego, death through the bufo toad was fundamentally the most important part of me learning to do what I do. Because in that experience, it created enough space between me and all my beliefs. You know, it's that, like that neuroplasticity that gets created in those moments afterwards where you can actually kind of see things. You can kind of see the. The forest from the trees. If you never have the experience, then, like, this is something people talk about all the time. Right. Is the whole thing the ego is the enemy? It's like. Well, it depends what you're considering, the ego, because you can't get rid of the ego. If the ego dies, then you're just in the oneness. Right. So you need the ego, but you have to build it up. And I think for fighters especially, like, they need massive egos, but they need healthy egos. Egos that are programmed to succeed.
- [82:57]
B
Yeah. No, ego is not attainable. If you're a human being, you're gonna have an ego. You just have to figure out how to manage it. And don't let it burn your house down. You know, it's like that customato quote about fear. Fear is like fire. You can cook your food with it, or if it gets out of control, it'll burn your house down. Yeah, I think that's the case with many, many things, including psychedelics, by the way. I think there's a lot of people that burn their house down. Yeah, I think there's a lot of people that go really far and they lose their grip on reality, and reality gets real slippery, and they sort of try to redefine reality to fit their own narrative. And they seem schizophrenic. Yeah, I've seen that from multiple people that have taken too many psychedelics.
- [83:38]
A
They're just abusing it. You got to use, like, a tool.
- [83:41]
B
Well, yeah, but it's also. Everybody has their own specific way that they interact with the world. And if you're taking psychedelics to justify your specific way of interacting with the world, and then you start indoctrinating other people to your specific way of running the world, and you try to, like, have a branch off civilization, like, that's like this thing that happens to guys in particular. You don't see a lot of, like, female guru psychedelic ladies, you know, or they. They're more like mother figures, but not like gurus. The gurus are all dudes. And it almost always. Sex is always down to pussy. Almost always. Or. Or dick, depending on what you're into.
- [84:32]
A
Yeah.
- [84:32]
B
Because the guy out here in Texas, in Austin, and was. There was a. There's a building that Ron White loved called the One World Theater that we were actually in contract under contract for before I wound up buying the mothership. And that place was run by a cult. And this guy was a gay guy. He was a gay porn star and a hypnotist.
- [84:53]
A
There you go. That's a deadly combo right there.
- [84:55]
B
Who was teaching yoga to folks in West Hollywood and slowly but surely formed a cult. And then after Waco, remember the Waco thing went down, everybody panicked. And the cult awareness network apparently was, like, looking for him and looking into him, because, like, a lot of the family was like, we lost my son. He went to that. So then he decided to change his name, and then he moved to Austin and he had his followers build him a theater so he could dance in front of them. And that's here. And it was. It's. There's a crazy documentary called Holy Hell. But this guy. This is what's crazy. The people that hated him at the end of the documentary, the people that said that he was a giant scammer and he was a piece of shit, and they wish they had never met him. They all said they had gone through this thing called the knowing. And the knowing was like, he Would withhold it from them. And a lot of them were, like, really upset. They weren't getting the knowing. And it was this thing that he would do where he'd make them. I think they were on their knees and he would touch their face and tell them that it was going to happen. And they would all say the same thing. They would all say afterwards. It was one of the most beautiful, the most beautiful experience of their life that they felt a complete, total connection with God. And it changed their worldview and their perception forever. Like, it's available in your mind if you believe. If you truly believe. And they truly believe that this guy was, like, a legitimate mystic, that he was a legitimate guru. And because they believed that even though this guy's a gay porn star and a hypnotist and a psychopath, because they believed that when he put his hands on them, they felt it. So what a complicated relationship you have. This guy who one of the guys left the cult, and he's like, hey, man, this guy's been hypnotizing me and me for 10 years. And then everybody was like, me too. It got crazy. And then they all wound up leaving. But he also did this thing for them.
- [86:52]
A
Yeah.
- [86:53]
B
Where he connected them to God.
- [86:54]
A
Yes.
- [86:55]
B
Which is really nuts, man, because you would think that guy. That guy sucked. I can't believe it. But they're all like. But there was this one day, and this one. It was almost like a part of the little cosmic joke of life.
- [87:09]
A
Yes. Is it a cosmic joke?
- [87:11]
B
This weirdo possesses the ability to literally connect you with God, but he behaves like a demon. He's just butt dudes and just taking all their money, and it's just madness. But what he's able to do when he touches you is real. What a cosmic joke. If that's true, I believe it.
- [87:31]
A
You know, there's all those, like, Indian gurus, right? Where, like, people tell the stories of, like, all they have to do is, like, gaze on me or touch me. I've never experienced any of this. And then you just feel like you've had experience with God.
- [87:43]
B
Yeah, I believe it. I believe if you believe it. That's what I think. I think there are guys that are living a very different life. Just like, you know, we're talking about, like, someone who could get to this David Goggins level of discipline and physical will. I think there's guys like that with meditation. And I think there's guys who get so far out there, and if you recognize that they're so far out there, I bet you sync up with the way they're seeing the world. You let them think for you and you believe in them and then they do something to you. They put their hands on you or whatever. They believe it's going to happen and then your mind allows it to happen. Yeah, I think we have access to a bunch of different states of consciousness. We just don't know the tools to. To access it. We don't know the code to crack to open them. And for some people it's a near death experience which is like. Seems to be a chemical reaction. It's like an undeniable reaction that people have when they come back from the dead. But for other people it's not. For other people, like sometimes it's some sort of a life changing revelation. For some people it's like it's falling in love or having a child or there's something that happens that like rewires the way they see the world and whatever those states are that are inside of us. I can't imagine why there's not courses at major universities studying how to access this stuff. Studying how to achieve endogenous states.
- [89:13]
A
Yes.
- [89:13]
B
Of psychedelic experiences like that. Like James Nestor's book when he talks about holotropic breathing and all these different.
- [89:21]
A
Do you ever do that? Any of the whole.
- [89:22]
B
I've done a bunch of it. Yeah. I've had like legit trips from breathing.
- [89:26]
A
Yeah. I guide some guys, some of my clients, like they leave their body, you know, they have experiences like leaving their body.
- [89:31]
B
It feels very weird. You can get it, especially when you do it. I like to do breathing exercises in a tank. Tank.
- [89:39]
A
In the flow tank.
- [89:39]
B
In the. Yeah, you do it in a float tank. Whoa. Because the flow tank itself is a psychedelic experience. Totally natural. It's the best one because there's no side effects and you can just open the door and it's over. Anytime you're freaking out, like, ah, I can't take it. Open the door.
- [89:54]
A
Yeah.
- [89:55]
B
And then next time stay in a little longer and then settle in. But doing breathing exercises in there, I mean, you might as well be taking mushrooms. You could, you can get some bizarre experiences doing that. That.
- [90:06]
A
Yeah. So we talked about, like, how do we get people on this path? I think it's these types of experiences that like open a doorway. It's like a hard reset. I think actually for most people they should not do psychedelics.
- [90:17]
B
Most people.
- [90:18]
A
People who are like in a really dark state.
- [90:20]
B
You think most people are in a dark. Oh, okay.
- [90:22]
A
No, no. Most people who are In a very dark state. They're struggling with really bad depression. I don't think they should go right to psychedelics. I think there's steps before that I think they can do topic breathing, flow tanks. There's different.
- [90:32]
B
Just get healthy first, too.
- [90:33]
A
Yeah.
- [90:34]
B
You know, take some steps.
- [90:35]
A
But, like, there's things you can.
- [90:37]
B
You know, one of the things that's a really good thing to tell people do. Find a fun physical hobby, something you can get good at, whatever it is, whether it's pickleball or whatever it is.
- [90:46]
A
Yeah.
- [90:47]
B
Find a fun physical hobby that forces you to do a little bit of activity. You know, it doesn't have to be super strenuous, but something that you actually.
- [90:54]
A
Like doing social even better.
- [90:56]
B
You get movement moving. You get moving. And then there's also the thing about getting good at something that for whatever reason, like, really helps people. Like, if you. If you really focus on getting good at something, that thing becomes the puzzle. Instead of just, like, dealing with all the anxiety of life, then that becomes your focus. Your focus becomes getting good at this thing.
- [91:14]
A
Humans need something to pour their energy into 100%.
- [91:17]
B
And if you don't have that, you feel lost. And that's a lot of people in this world. And that's the problem with just having a regular job, which also saps you of your energy, you know, Absolutely.
- [91:28]
A
It could be something very simple, you know, but just find something that you just want to move on a path. Just get on a path, and that just incremental progress feels good.
- [91:38]
B
And the best thing is physical anything, anything that you can do. That's why Jiu Jitsu is so awesome, because you could find that you find the physical struggle, but also this incredible mental puzzle that you're figuring out every day. And then also you're dealing with all these anxieties and emotions and these. These weird feelings like, fuck, I don't want to roll with him. Oh, God damn it. He's going to get me. And you're rolling with people that you got to learn how to relax. You got to learn. And they're like, oh, my God, he didn't tap me this session. Like, maybe you got dominated, but at least you didn't tap. And then next time, maybe you reverse someone, maybe you sweep someone that you never swept before, and you just like, oh, my God, I'm getting better at this. And you've got this puzzle, and then you've also got this extreme physical activity where the rest of the day seems so easy. It seems so, like, so relaxing.
- [92:25]
A
Yeah.
- [92:26]
B
No matter what happens? You're so calm because you've been getting your legs yanked on and your neck yanked on and taken down and side control crushed and getting arm triangle. Then this is easy. Like, no matter what you experience outside of that, your bar for what sucks. It's like your thing you do the most that sucks so hard is what you love.
- [92:49]
A
Yeah.
- [92:49]
B
Which is nuts. So it cures you in a lot of ways. And it's. I think it's the remedy for young men. There's a lot of men that just. And it's filled with nerds. You need to know that, too. Like, that it's not meatheads. You think it's meatheads. It's mostly not. Mostly, it's like, really intelligent people that excel at this physical puzzle. And then through that thing, they develop all this confidence and become, like, much cooler people, much more interesting to hang out with. Like, all my friends that are like, black belts in jiu jitsu, they're all interesting. They're all cool to talk to. Like, if I can talk to a guy and they tell me they're a black belt in jiu jitsu, I'm like, oh, okay. You've gone through the whole thing. Like, you've gone through some. Like, okay, I guarantee you, you and I can find common ground. Like, we could talk.
- [93:34]
A
Yeah.
- [93:34]
B
It's like, there's things that are out there that are available to you that are a vehicle for developing your human potential. That's what I was taught when I was a kid and I was learning Taekwondo. That's how they described it. I never forgot that. A vehicle for developing your human potential. And I was like, that's perfect. Because I think you don't just do it from thinking about stuff and thinking different. I think you need physical stuff that you do. And the best physical stuff is scary stuff.
- [94:03]
A
Yeah. Rite of passage. We don't have many rites of passages. And doing any type of martial arts and having to compete is like. Like, oh, this is scary. It's building. It's building, it's building. What's going to happen? And you kind of have to feed. You have to face that fear of death. In a way, it's like, you know, you're not going to die, but in a way, it feels like it. When you're going to competition, it's like, this person is going to try to hurt me.
- [94:22]
B
Yeah.
- [94:22]
A
And to come through that and get to the other side, there's something that changes in your nervous system for sure.
- [94:28]
B
You've. You've actually experienced Something that very few people ever experience. And it's. It's very different than a street fight because you're agreeing to it and you're training for it. You've got this other person who's like training. You know, they're scary as shit and they're on the other side of the cage. And then you step in and the two of you are about to go to war. It's the nuttiest job in the history of the world. It really is. Other than war and being a firefighter or a cop. It is the nuttiest job in the history of the world. You're agreeing to throw bones at each other in front of the world. Millions of people.
- [94:59]
A
People love it.
- [95:00]
B
And today they just announced the UFC just signed some crazy deal with Paramount. Plus there's going to be no more pay per views. All the events are going to be available for everybody for free. Every pay per view, every fight card that they have. From the apex, which are my favorite. Yeah, Everything is going to be available for free. It's an amazing deal.
- [95:21]
A
I think it's going to explode the sport even.
- [95:22]
B
Oh my God. Through the roof. And it's a super smart move for Paramount. What a great move to not just have the UFC for seven years, but have it for free. Like I don't think Paramount costs. But what. How much does it cost a month?
- [95:38]
A
Eight or ten bucks?
- [95:39]
B
I think ten bucks. So if it's ten, let's say it's ten bucks. That's crazy. That's $120 a year. You could watch every UFC Pay per view. Two UFC pay per views, like 140 bucks. Right? Isn't it? Aren't they like $70? So you get all of them. Everything's free. That's incredible. This support is going to go hypernov.
- [95:59]
A
Because the average person only knows about the star. You know what I mean? But they're kind of detached because they're only watching highlights. Now. They get to actually watch about the stars. They're gonna be so much more bought into the sport.
- [96:08]
B
Yeah. It's gonna be nuts. And it'll be. It's a such a smart move for Paramount because you have a built in audience. It's immediately gonna jump over there because everybody. You have to renew your ESPN subscription anywhere. You know, like you have to renew it. So it's just buy a Paramount subscription.
- [96:25]
A
Absolutely.
- [96:26]
B
By the way, the espn, ESPN has everything too. It's great. I kind of bummed out. And I hope they don't lose the relationship that they had with espn, with all their MMA shows, I hope they don't go like them. They went to Paramount. I hope it's like a mutually beneficial thing. Like the UFC at least does some content still on espn, because I think that's also a big factor in pulling people from, like casual viewers that watch other sports that might occasionally watch a UFC fight, and then they see like Dustin Poirier versus Max Holloway and they're like, holy. And then they're hooked. Right. It's like having that coverage on Sports center, that shit's huge. Having those post fight shows on ESPN plus, that is huge. For the real dorks like me, that's huge.
- [97:10]
A
Yeah. I think even for like the average person that cares more about storytelling, you know, it's like maybe the wives are like, this is interesting to hear about the drama of their life a little bit and the hero's journey.
- [97:19]
B
Yeah, for sure. Yeah. Well, that's. It's unbelievably compelling when you watch two world class fighters fight in a world championship fight. Unbelievably compelling. You know, like when you watch Sugar Sean o' Malley try to get the title back from Rob. That was so compelling.
- [97:37]
A
Yeah.
- [97:37]
B
Sugar Sean changes his whole life. Did you talk with him at all?
- [97:40]
A
I haven't. I'm very curious. I would love to talk with him because I know he cut out weed. Right. And he cut out weed.
- [97:46]
B
Stop jerking off. I believe. Believe. And abandoned all social media.
- [97:49]
A
Yeah.
- [97:50]
B
Which is very fascinating. I might be wrong about the jerking off. I think I might have added that in there. But he recognized that this guy's a. He's a completely different thing. Like Merab is like a David Goggins in that respect that he's so far down the path of pushing himself that it's almost like you're never going to catch him in that game. You know, like six months of not jerking off and staying off. Tick tock. I don't think that's even close to enough. I think what he's been doing has been really insane for a long time. Everybody that I talked to that's trained with that guy say he's superhuman with his cardio and his work ethic is through the roof, man. When DC went to see him the day after he won the title, he was out running. DC went to his house, sicko. And he's film. DC's filming his garage that his garage gym set up. And he's like, this motherfucker is out running. He's out running the day after winning the world title in a Spectacular five round performance where he shows superhuman cardio, like superhuman pressure. There's a few guys like that.
- [99:04]
A
Yeah, it's fascinating to look at just that level. The elite, elite, elite, elite level. And to see the commonalities between them. For me, as someone who loves studying the mind and it's like, what is different about these guys? And then is there anything you could do to catch up? Or are they just built different? Are they just wired in a way?
- [99:22]
B
Did you see the Anthony Hernandez, Roman Delit fight this weekend? No, bro, you got to see that fight. You have to see that fight. Anthony Hernandez is a fucking problem. He's a fucking real problem. He doesn't get tired, man. He pushes an insane pace and he doesn't get tired. He melts dudes. He just melts them. You know, he does stuff where you just go, like, what? How are you pushing this kind of pace? It's like a middleweight version. Someone said it in the, the comments too, that Merab was in Roman's corner because they're both from Georgia and he's like. And Merab is in the corner while Roman fights the middleweight version of Merab. Because it really was like that Fluffy Hernandez is wild, dude. Like whatever he's doing in his training or whether he just has a. Like some people, like Cain Velasquez had a natural cardio gift. I don't know what it is, but it's insane. He submitted Rodolfo Vieira multiple time world Jiu jitsu jump. Just exhausted the fuck out of him and guillotined him, which is just nuts to watch that guy tap. Do you know who he is?
- [100:28]
A
No. I know boxing way more than ufc.
- [100:30]
B
So Vieira is built like a superhero. Like he doesn't even look like a real human. He looks like a cartoonish, like CGI version of what an elite MMA athlete looks like. Just chiseled and fluffy. Doesn't look like that covered in tattoos, you know, looks athletic, you know, looks tough. But Rodolfo Vieira is a. That's him.
- [100:50]
A
Him. Oh yeah.
- [100:52]
B
B row. You know those photos of like what your girlfriend tells you not to worry about? Get what? That one where he's got his sleeves down and by his elbows in the lower. Yeah, that one right there, bro.
- [101:06]
A
Yeah.
- [101:07]
B
What are you talking about? And I don't think Fluffy was even a black belt. I think Fluffy was a brown belt at the time. I want to be correct about that. He's a black belt now, right? Anthony Hernandez, mma. I think he's a black belt. But to submit that Guy was just one of the crazy. Like if you had a, if you had a bet in Vegas, you know, like if you were on DraftKings sportsbook and you bet Fluffy Hernandez to submit Rodolfo Vieira, he'd probably get like 25 to 1 odds. Brown belt. He's still a brown belt. Belt, he's still a brown belt in Jiu jitsu. He submitted a multiple time world champion just by melting him. Just melting him. I'd love for you to talk to that guy, find out what the he's made out of.
- [101:54]
A
I'd love to. Love to hit me up, bro.
- [101:56]
B
He's different, man. There's certain dudes that are just different, you know, like what Goggins likes to call uncommon amongst uncommon men. That dude's uncommon. If I was a middleweight, I'd be like closely watching that guy. Like, Jesus Christ. Because he's also like, every fight he keeps getting better and it's just a storm that starts from the first minute of the first round and never stops. You never get to break. There's no breaths. He's constantly on you. He takes a great shot. 52 takedowns, eight fight win streak, six finishes. Bro. That guy. There's. There's guys that just emerge from groups of like super talented contenders where you just go, holy shit. And that's one of them.
- [102:40]
A
That's awesome. Yeah, I've been looking out for him. I gotta go back and watch the fight.
- [102:44]
B
So for a guy like you, that's like a mental coach, I always like wonder. I'd like to you to like talk to that guy and maybe you can pass some of that on to everybody else. Like, what is he doing? Yeah, how is he? Is he just training harder than everybody else? Is he just. Is it his mindset? Is he just a dog and just. Just does not give a. Because it seems like there's a lot of that there too. He's just mentally super strong and super aggressive.
- [103:09]
A
That's what I love to do. I give these guys these prompts and I just audit and I pull out all their beliefs. And it's super interesting to hear what beliefs create an elite performer. And just hearing all the ones that are making them successful and all the ones that are causing them problems.
- [103:25]
B
Wanna hear what's really crazy? Dude smokes a ton of weed. Ton of weed. Like, I'm gonna quit the weed. This dude's like, give me all your weed.
- [103:35]
A
When I was, when I was doing a lot of boxing, I would. I was smoking a ton of weed. I was smoking Weed every single day. And I don't anymore. But at the time, I was like, you know, I had to get surgery on my nose because I got busted up so many times.
- [103:46]
B
Yeah, I got that surgery.
- [103:47]
A
Yeah.
- [103:48]
B
Oh, my God. Isn't it nice when you get it done, though? I fell down a flight of stairs when I was five, so I've never had a good nose. My nose has been since I was a little kid, so I never could breathe out of my nose. And then years of getting punched and kicked and getting headbutted in grappling classes, I had it.
- [104:05]
A
I was going to the doctor because I was still sparring during COVID and I was going to the doctor, and they were just telling me, oh, I think you have Covid. That's what they told me. They're like, I think you just have stuffiness. We're gonna have you tested from COVID like, two different times. And eventually I just got X rays, and I'm like, oh, your nose is destroyed. Yeah, but I.
- [104:21]
B
What happens like an ear, right? You know, like, ears get cauliflower. You get that same kind of buildup of calcium deposits inside your nose. They have to carve it out.
- [104:31]
A
Yeah.
- [104:32]
B
Ever see what it looks like when they get the chunks and they lay it out for you after they take it out?
- [104:36]
A
They took a piece from my ear.
- [104:37]
B
They took the ear cartilage to rebuild your nose.
- [104:39]
A
The funniest thing is. So I spent a lot of time in Colombia, and I went down there for the surgery and.
- [104:45]
B
You went to Colombia for ear to nose surgery?
- [104:48]
A
Oh, I do everything. All my stuff in Columbia. I got Lasik eye surgery in Colombia.
- [104:51]
B
Jesus. Is this bro?
- [104:52]
A
They invented it in Bogota, Colombia.
- [104:54]
B
Did they really?
- [104:55]
A
They did.
- [104:55]
B
No.
- [104:56]
A
Yeah. Medical stuff's amazing, honestly. Like, this is gonna sound funny, but when I go there, it almost makes the US Feel like a third world country.
- [105:04]
B
That's crazy.
- [105:05]
A
Just because it's so inexpensive. The doctors are good. The facility is great. Anyhow, so I go get the surgery. I come out of it, I'm missing the back of my ear. I didn't understand that part.
- [105:14]
B
Why didn't they do the rib? Usually they did rib cartilage.
- [105:17]
A
They said they might do the ribbon, but I don't know.
- [105:19]
B
They changed their mind and went with.
- [105:20]
A
Your ear, I guess.
- [105:21]
B
What does your ear look like now?
- [105:22]
A
I'll show it to you.
- [105:23]
B
Show me. Okay. You got a missing chunk, son. Whoa.
- [105:29]
A
Yeah. Now it lays kind of flat.
- [105:31]
B
Oh, that's crazy. Not that bad.
- [105:32]
A
Not bad. Not bad.
- [105:34]
B
But you don't grapple so you don't have cauliflower. That would get weird because there would be no structure. So it'd like super droop, like a, like a, like a Labrador.
- [105:42]
A
What do you think? I haven't gotten into Jiu Jitsu just because I was told by some of my friends that, like, I was. I could re. Break my nose just by the pressure of people, like, leaning on it all the time. I just don't want to get the surgery again.
- [105:52]
B
When I got my surgery, I was addicted, fully addicted to Jiu jitsu, so I waited six weeks and I started rolling again.
- [105:57]
A
And how's your nose been?
- [105:59]
B
It's fine. I protected it and I told everybody that I was rolling with, hey, man, I just got no surgery, so please don't like, cross face me if you're trying to get a rear naked choke or something like that. You know, like, there's certain guys that are real mean and they get, they get your back and they'll fucking do.
- [106:13]
A
This with your nose to get you.
- [106:14]
B
To lift your chin up. Up. They'll. They'll go forearm blade right into the nose, which I understand for competition, but for the gym, the problem is, like, you could really break a guy's nose and then him up for the, the rest of his life until he gets it fixed.
- [106:27]
A
What about now when you train? Like, is it. Is it a concern?
- [106:29]
B
Well, I haven't been training in a long time. I haven't been training in over a year. No. No rolling at all in over a year. But it's not a concern. It works great. It's fine. If I got it broken and it was a problem, I definitely 100% get it fixed again. End the benefits of being able to breathe out of your nose. And I've talked to a ton of fighters about this. Some of them are like, I'll wait till after I'm done fighting. But Drekus Du Plessis, who's depending defending his title this weekend, Dricus, he started his career with a up nose in the ufc, and it really affected his cardio. His mouth was wide open. He got it fixed, and there was like this immediate bump in performance. I. I mean, immediate. For sure he was getting better along the way, and for sure he was, you know, figuring out how to tightening up, tighten up his techniques. And he's just an animal, right? But on top of that, having that nose fixed was a significant difference. He didn't have to have his mouth open all the time.
- [107:18]
A
Does the ideal way to breathe, if you can just breathe through your nose, Right.
- [107:21]
B
It limits your cardio in a significant way. I noticed, like, a 10 bump in cardio is what it felt like to me. Like, I could feel the difference in being able to breathe out of my nose.
- [107:29]
A
Yeah.
- [107:30]
B
And also to be able to bite down on your mouthpiece. Like, if you're really clamping down on something and you could still breathe perfectly, that was huge.
- [107:37]
A
Yeah.
- [107:38]
B
Because before you squeeze while your mouth is open, that's terrible. Like, you. If you want to squeeze on something, you want to be like this, you want to feel like. And you can't. You can't bite down. I wonder how they've done studies on that. Right. Like, people lifting stuff with, like, certain mouthpieces in. And certain mouthpieces actually increase their strength.
- [107:59]
A
Power lifters use them. Right.
- [108:01]
B
Yeah, I think they do. But for sure. Also to not break your teeth, because I went to a dentist once, and the dentist, like, you like, micro fractures on all your teeth. You're like, do you. Do you lift weights? And I go, yeah. He goes, like, you're clenching your teeth all the time. Oh, yeah. So I stopped doing that so much, and I definitely started. I worked out with a mouthpiece for a long time, like, lifting. But I think there's a certain mouthpiece that they designed that sets your jaw in a certain way, that it actually enhances your strength. Strength. There's like, some sort of a connection between, like, having your jaw perfectly aligned and clamping down on this mouthpiece that allows you to actually lift more weight. Find out if that's true, because I know that that was definitely a marketing claim for this mouthpiece thing, but I just don't remember much of it. But I remember, like, looking into it years ago. It was like a weird mouthpiece with, like, the bottom had, like, a hole cut into it. So you could.
- [108:54]
A
I think I've heard something about this that I know. Grunting is supposed to help you lift more weights.
- [108:57]
B
That makes sense. That's why they keep it out of that LA fitness place. They get mad at you.
- [109:00]
A
Yeah.
- [109:01]
B
Is that. No. Planet Fitness.
- [109:02]
A
Planet Fitness, yeah. I did see a study, because I was looking at all these studies. Increased strength performance. You know, when I was studying all this stuff and I was like, grunting.
- [109:09]
B
That's so crazy that if you. If you lift weights there too loud, they sound an alarm and they kick you out. You try to art the lunk alarm.
- [109:17]
A
The lunk alarm.
- [109:20]
B
That's funny.
- [109:20]
A
It's safe for those people who want to be. It's a nice, safe environment.
- [109:23]
B
Yeah. I get It. But also, don't you want to be inspired by someone who's working out really hard? Like, if I go to the gym and there's a guy there, like, whoa, that guy's there. And you watch that guy do some crazy routine. As long as he's nice, like, what do you care if he's grunting?
- [109:37]
A
But that's kind of society, right? We got the. The padded walls. Many places for people.
- [109:42]
B
Yeah, I guess it intimidates people, it scares them, and then maybe people. What is this, Jamie?
- [109:47]
A
Just a mouthpiece.
- [109:48]
B
Mouthpiece. Yeah, that's it. I don't know if it's proven. Yeah, I don't know if it's proven either, but is this official mouthpiece of the world's strongest man? It's patented. Boosting muscular force and power. Huh? It's patented. So how does it work? Does it say how it works?
- [110:04]
A
No, I was looking. I didn't see any. This is. I don't know. That's what it says.
- [110:10]
B
Thing is, if you believe it works, it probably works.
- [110:13]
A
Yeah. I don't know how many.
- [110:13]
B
Designed to absorb clenching while guiding optimal tongue positioning during high stress exertion. Hmm. I don't know. But being able to breathe out of your nose is giant kids. So if you don't have that, if you've got that problem, get it fixed.
- [110:31]
A
What do you think about if you can weed and fighting? Because I'm gonna ask you a couple different questions. When I was living in la, I knew this neuroscientist, and we ran, like, a little fun study where. Where I was a big stoner. So he had me stop smoking weed for two weeks, I think it was. He tested me, did all these brain tests with me, and then he tested me two weeks afterwards. And I play football. I boxed. Right. So a lot of hits to the head.
- [110:56]
B
Right.
- [110:56]
A
And he said that without weed, he showed, like. It showed that I had a fair amount of, like, brain damage. Like, my brain wasn't functional. They would. When I smoked weed and went back in there, he said there was some kind of, like, neuroprotective effect where, like, I was. My brain was, like, registering as more healthy.
- [111:14]
B
Wasn't part of the problem with CTE and any kind of brain issue in general. Part of the problem is inflammation, right?
- [111:22]
A
Yeah, isn't it?
- [111:25]
B
That's one of the things that they say, like, changing your gut bacteria has an effect on mood. You know, a lot of people that have, like, real gut problems.
- [111:32]
A
So weed decreases inflammation in the brain?
- [111:34]
B
Yeah, it's. Well, weed certainly Increases, decreases, rather inflammation, and that's why people use it for pain management. People with sore backs and. Yeah, people going through chemotherapy. It also improves your appetite for people going through chemo because it's hard for them to eat. But weed most certainly can help with pain management with some kinds of pain. I know some people that have tried it for, like, debilitating pain, and it just doesn't do a damn thing. It just makes them almost more aware of it. But it's variable, man, because I was this Jamie, who's the guy who killed Bin Laden? You know that Navy Seal guy will kill Bin Laden. He's on. Yeah, he's on Instagram. Right. But let's say his full name out of respect. Well, how about look it up and find his Instagram because he. He has something to do with the cannabis business. And, like, this guy's just super badass. Tip of the spear. Special Forces operator, right? And there it is. Robert o'. Neill. Go to his. See if you can find his Instagram. What does it say? That's him. It says, set to pedal pot in New York City. And said it helps get rid of the noise. He's also an advocate it for ibogaine. He's done ibogaine multiple times. But go click on. Go to his Instagram page, Jamie, if you could. I Forget. It's like Mr. Hooyah or something like that. But he said that it. It helps him go to sleep at night. Helps him relax and go to sleep at night. Like, there's. There's scroll down. Go back to the grid and scroll down. There's him in an actual pot farm. Like his own pot farm farm in there. Like where they grow all the stuff that he. He sells.
- [113:30]
A
That makes sense because it has that disassociative effect. Right, right. And so it's easier maybe to get.
- [113:36]
B
Out of your head, but it flies in the face of this very public narrative, which is pot is for lazy people, pot is for losers. Pot's gonna rot your brain. Pot's gonna make you stink. Pot's gonna make you an idiot. Can't find it. I mean, yeah, I don't know where it is.
- [113:54]
A
This company's thing.
- [113:55]
B
I'll find it a second. Maybe that's the far right one with his hands outstretched like Jesus. That's the one. Him talking about ibogaine. And I looked at that Mikuya on Instagram. When a guy like that is smoking weed, you get. You got to throw it out the window. All your preconceived. It's like, everybody is biologically different. And for some people, alcohol just fucks them up. Yeah, for some people, marijuana is a no go. It's not good. They freak out.
- [114:24]
A
But also some people, when you're a dog, you know, like, we're dogs, we like to get after it. We like to work out. We like to do things. Like, I almost like when I was smoking weed every day, to be the guy who could be super fit to be training boxing every day and like, and still be achieving my business and smoke weed every day. Like, I kind of took this, like, weird pride in it for some time as well.
- [114:41]
B
Of like, bro, one of my favorite things to do was to smoke weed and hit the bag.
- [114:45]
A
Yeah. So meditate.
- [114:47]
B
Yeah, man. But you also.
- [114:48]
A
Form goes out the window a little bit.
- [114:50]
B
No, it doesn't.
- [114:51]
A
For me.
- [114:51]
B
It's the opposite. For me. I feel everything. Like, for me, I feel just judging myself, the timing more when I'm hitting things. Like, it feels more coordinated. Like when I'm throwing a kick. It just like I feel the, the. The time to like, accelerate the time to get the hips into it at all. I'm more sensitive. It feels better. Like you, you. You tune into it. It makes my pool game 100 better.
- [115:17]
A
Really?
- [115:18]
B
Oh, 100. It's. It's like steroids for pool.
- [115:21]
A
But I also hear you on the podcast, when you've done it before, like, you stay dialed in to a degree. Like, maybe you don't have the same recall.
- [115:27]
B
That's right. But that's, that's the point that, That I was making earlier. It's different for everybody. It's not like I am different than other people. There's. There's people that don't think the way I think. They don't, they don't have life experiences that I have. They don't have the ability to manage, like, the weirdness that comes with weed, which.
- [115:42]
A
Yeah.
- [115:42]
B
The paranoia. I like.
- [115:44]
A
Yeah.
- [115:44]
B
I genuinely like you kind of need.
- [115:46]
A
Do you like that voice? Just kind of question you a little?
- [115:48]
B
Yeah.
- [115:49]
A
Don't get too big for your britches.
- [115:50]
B
Yes, I like it. I like being scared. I think it's good for you.
- [115:54]
A
Yes.
- [115:54]
B
As long as you use it wisely. Like, you take that weirdness like, oh, maybe I should go give him a call and explain myself better. Maybe I should reach out. Maybe I should do this, this, maybe I should do that. Maybe I should, like, make it easier for these people. Maybe I should. You know, it makes me like, very considerate and I think it's a really potent tool for Managing your state of mind. But that's just for me. I don't know how your mind works. I could. Would only be pretending. Right. Like, we're all on a different mind journey too, right?
- [116:29]
A
Yes.
- [116:30]
B
If you're a person who was beaten by their parents and you were mugged and then this happened to you and that happened to you, and you got over at work and that. And now here you are there. Like, that's very different than a person who's had a lot of, like, success and been real lucky and got to a point.
- [116:47]
A
Yeah.
- [116:47]
B
And has a healthy mind.
- [116:48]
A
Maybe it's more nostalgic. You kind of smoke. What are you thinking about? You know, it gives you time to separate a little bit from being in the grind versus.
- [116:55]
B
Well, my point is, like, if you're all up, maybe pot's not for you.
- [116:58]
A
Yeah, right.
- [116:59]
B
If you're a real mess and you're, like, barely hanging on, like, to regular life, maybe freaking yourself out with potent THC is not the way to go, especially these days.
- [117:09]
A
Yeah.
- [117:09]
B
There's. What I'm getting at is like, maybe as your journey progresses and you get healthy and you get more confident and strong and more successful, maybe then. Yeah, maybe not even then. Maybe that's not your thing. You have to be honest about what's your thing, you know, you have to find. And the problem with things being illegal is you don't have that opportunity. And then you have people that had bad personal experiences with it, and they're like, pot makes you stink. Pot makes you a dummy. Maybe it does that for you. Okay. But it doesn't do that for me. For me, it makes me nicer to my friends. It makes me want to pet my dog. It makes me want to chill out. It's like, it makes me want to have fun with my friends, makes me want to laugh. It doesn't make me stink. Well, it probably makes me stink, but it doesn't make me any dumber, that's for sure. And it makes me more inquisitive. It makes me more interested in, for sure. Subjects that I have no understanding of that are fascinating, like cosmology. There's nothing like getting high and watching a space documentary just to try to put it into perspective, like, what. What it is we're living in. What what is re. The reality of the physical universe and its majesty that's above your head every day. Like, that is. Is when you're high, you're like, how am I not paying attention to this? This is really a crazy thing that this is probably the most profound experience that a person could ever have in their life is like being on a planet going through space. And we completely take it for granted.
- [118:37]
A
I think to a degree it's good to have some kind of cadence where you have something that allows you to kind of step back from yourself.
- [118:43]
B
Yeah, I think it could be weed.
- [118:44]
A
It could be some mushrooms.
- [118:45]
B
Could be just meditative like breathing exercises, yoga class. Yeah. Doing something or running. That's. I think that's a lot of the high of running, you know, when people like really exert themselves. Like you're just thinking about your breath, you're just getting after it. And you five, six miles in, and when you're done, you're like, wow, that runner's high is 100% real. Oh, yeah, 100% real. And that's how they're getting it and that's how they're separating themselves. And I think a person who can regularly run on a, on a regular basis, miles and miles and miles, that's a special person. That's a very unusual person. That's a person of will, you know, a person could just, at any time you can just tag them, let's go run. And they can run. Like that's what Goggins and Cam Haynes do to each other, these fucking psychopaths. Cam Haynes, like, calls Goggins, say, hey, I'm in Vegas, let's go running. And so Goggins calls out a spot check. Like if you have a true friend, he spot checks you. Those motherfuckers ran a marathon in the streets of Las Vegas. They ran 26 miles just because. Yeah, at like a six minute mile pace. Like bananas. Just bananas. Like out of nowhere, like, you didn't know I was coming. I call you, let's go, let's go running. Let's see what's up. And two fucking complete total psychopaths running 26 miles in the Las Vegas heat. Not sick.
- [120:11]
A
Yeah.
- [120:12]
B
So there's people like that out there that are just different. And their journey to be different is taken a long time to get to where they are right now.
- [120:22]
A
What are your beliefs around? Because I have mine just from my experience. What are your beliefs on where they were before they were born? Do you think that this is. They have something in them because of a previous life?
- [120:33]
B
Oh, I don't know. That's a good question. If previous lives were proven to be true, which right now they're not, it's like just an idea. Because you can't know, how could you know? But a lot of people in A lot of religions and a lot of different cultures have believed in.
- [120:49]
A
There's actually, I think what university, maybe University of Virginia. There's a whole department that's studying people who've had these like near death experiences that are going back and talking about previous lives.
- [121:00]
B
It's an interesting question, but there's no evidence, right? There's no data.
- [121:05]
A
Jamie, I don't know if you've seen this or heard of it.
- [121:07]
B
Well, I mean even if these people have stories, unless they have stories that match up with historical facts.
- [121:14]
A
Yeah, well, I think it is oftentimes I think it's like you have like some kids who are just telling you about someone else's life and they should not know it, but they're like, I.
- [121:22]
B
Have heard those stories, but I don't know if those are real because one of the problems is people bullshit. And they, you know, they make things out to be a little bit more profound than they are. So it makes for a better story and if you're a true believer, maybe even juice up the results a little bit. It's hard to know. Yeah, but I'm not opposed to the idea of a reincarnation and I'm not opposed to the idea that some people are just special because it seems like that's real. It seems like there's certain people that just emerge and there's just something about them. And it's not necessarily just the hard work, you know, it's not necessarily just the mindset. There's something about it.
- [121:57]
A
I like the framework of it, of thinking about this infinite game game, you know, because then someone, it's like, well, why am I going to do this work? Like this sounds like a lot of work. All this self introspection. It's like to understand that like you're playing this infinite game.
- [122:08]
B
Yeah.
- [122:08]
A
If you deal with your now, then your life is going to be more peaceful and have more flow in the future. If you don't deal with it, this is just, you know, you're just kicking the ball down the road.
- [122:17]
B
Yeah, well that's true.
- [122:18]
A
At least it is true in this life. And I don't know, I feel it could be true in your next one as well.
- [122:23]
B
If you have a next one. I mean, that's the thing. It's like, like maybe it's not as simple as that. We're just assuming every time we wake up that we're in the same timeline. But just the idea of going to sleep is really kooky. Yeah, it's really kooky. You know you just, you decide to close your eyes every night and you just disconnect from physical reality for hours at a time. And it's necessary and we all just take it for granted.
- [122:48]
A
Where do we go?
- [122:49]
B
Oh, normal. I don't know where we go, but I go to a lot of zombie.
- [122:52]
A
Do you really?
- [122:53]
B
Oh, yeah. I have a lot of zombie dreams. I have a lot of. Last night I had a great zombie apocalypse dream.
- [122:58]
A
We need a dream interpreter in here.
- [123:00]
B
Yeah, well, I don't think I have a whole lot of confidence in the human race keeping it together. You know, at the very best, I'm like 60, 40 plus that we're gonna figure it out.
- [123:10]
A
But that 40% during your lifetime or just.
- [123:13]
B
Yeah, like maybe this week. Who fucking knows? It's all dependent upon what kind of disaster takes place. You know, it's all dependent upon what kind of goes down. And when you look historically has always gone down when people thought could never go down. And that's us right now. And that's why zombie movies work.
- [123:33]
A
Yeah. And that's why they're making them way infiltrating into your brain.
- [123:37]
B
Yeah. I started watching 28 years later Jamie.
- [123:39]
A
Oh yeah, that'll do it.
- [123:40]
B
I shut that off. I was about to go to bed. I was like, it was like 8 o' clock at night. I'm like, let me watch this. I'm like, no, no, no. I. I figured it out 10, 15 minutes and it when they. I don't want to say what happens. I don't want to spoil.
- [123:50]
A
You gotta watch some Barney after that.
- [123:52]
B
But right away I was like, okay, this is one where I'm gonna have to do hours before I go to sleep. Because them zombie dreams, even watching like.
- [123:59]
A
The House of Dragon, Game Thrones, like some gruesome stuff before bed.
- [124:03]
B
Yeah. Like real hardcore, like realistic violence is rough right before you go to sleep.
- [124:09]
A
I mean, just what I know about the mind, how subconscious works. Like, it's just obvious. Every time I go to bed I'm like, like, you shouldn't have done that.
- [124:15]
B
For sure. For sure. Here's what's interesting though. I can watch brutal fights and sleep like a baby. That seems weird. I wonder why that's weird. Because that's real violence. Right. The stuff that I'm seeing in the movies. I know, is horseshit.
- [124:27]
A
Yeah. For some reason it feels more controlled.
- [124:31]
B
I don't know, I think I'm just used to it. Honestly. I think it's like everything else. I think, you know, there's a lot of doctors that they'll tell you, if they're being honest with you, that there comes a time when people die that it doesn't affect them the same. The same anymore. You know, they're so used to people dying, especially, like, emergency room doctors dealing with, like, traumatic injuries. And do you get accustomed to people dying?
- [124:53]
A
I think it's also the idea of, like, evil, though. You know, if you're watching something, you're seeing evil take place, versus, like, for me, when I watch mma, I'm like, I know these guys. Like, I see. I love these guys. You know, I've never met. I've never worked with a guy who I don't love. They all have great hearts. And, like, I feel this genuine, like. Like goodness. Like, I haven't met that many guys. I don't know them all, but, like, when I see it, I don't see, like, evil.
- [125:17]
B
There's a lot of really, really, really good guys and good women that fight in mma, and it's because of what we talked about before, they've gone through something insanely difficult. They're a very special person. Even people that you don't think are, like, great people, like. Like Sean Strickland, super controversial. Sean Strickland is a great guy. If you get him alone, you talk to him, he's a great guy. He's super smart, super disciplined, saved up a ton of money. You know, he was talking the other day about, like, he's got, like, 4 million bucks saved. Super smart man. Yeah. So he could, like, retire at any moment, live a simple life, and never work again, you know? And he's not. But he's outrageous, you know, he's outrageous. He says wild shit, but it's also. It's like, what do you expect from the way that guy grew up? Like, he didn't grow up the way you grew up.
- [126:01]
A
He's got some unresolved trauma, 100%. And I don't know know, this is something I think some fighters think about. It's like, if I get rid of my trauma, am I going to be weaker? You know, do I need this as an edge? I don't believe they do. That's been my experience.
- [126:13]
B
Yeah, I don't think they do either. But then again, some fighters, they go and do ayahuasca and they come back and they're not.
- [126:19]
A
Kumbaya.
- [126:20]
B
Yeah.
- [126:20]
A
I don't want to fight anymore.
- [126:22]
B
They say that happened to Deontay. Deontay Wilder went and did ayahuasca, and he came back. He just. It's a little too peaceful.
- [126:29]
A
Interesting.
- [126:29]
B
It's hard to say though, because was.
- [126:30]
A
That before or after the Tyson Fury fight?
- [126:32]
B
After. So that's the problem. It's like we might be drawing a force, a fake correlation here because those Tyson Fury fights were fucking brutal. Yeah, they were brutal.
- [126:41]
A
I feel like, speaking of belief, Right. He had an identity that was bulletproof, that was unbreakable. And I watch all the excuses.
- [126:48]
B
Yeah.
- [126:49]
A
Johnson, no offense.
- [126:50]
B
Yeah, no, no offense, but his excuses were kind of crazy.
- [126:53]
A
Yeah. They're just a byproduct of like he believed he was unbeatable. So he had to come up with something to tell the story about how he lost. Lost for himself. It wasn't, I don't even think it was malicious. I think he was trying to cope with what is this reality now?
- [127:05]
B
Yeah, well, what he was, was a spectacular puncher who wasn't a real fluid and movement based boxer. Right. He wasn't a guy like Usyk. Like, USYK is the most fluid movement based boxer the heavyweight division has seen since Muhammad Ali. Right. So what he was, was what Teddy Atlas calls the eraser. Like all the mistakes he made, it was one right hand and they were, they were erased. That he's the most spectacular one punch knockout artist in the history of sport. I think. I mean, his powers, and not a big guy, not in comparison. He fought TYSON fury the first time, he told me he was 209. That's crazy. And flatlined him in like what, the 11th round? Oh, the 12th, right. Dropped him in the 12th, like a.
- [127:50]
A
Minute left or something.
- [127:50]
B
But that 12th round changed the course because Tyson Fury realized that if he goes after deontay and he gets him on his back foot, he doesn't fight as well. And so then he figured it out and he just took it to him. And then he took it to him in the second fight and took it to him in the third fight. But yeah, it's hard when you hear a guy like that make excuses. But you understand, you do more than anybody the destruction of the belief system and how difficult it is for fighters to manage that.
- [128:14]
A
Yeah. But if you do the work to rebuild it afterwards, you're stronger.
- [128:18]
B
Right. But you have to do the work right. And for a lot of guys, again, they don't totally know where to start. Like, say if they have a camp and inside their camp they have a trainer, they have the strength conditioning guy, they have, you know, different coaches for different aspects of their whatever they're doing, whether it's a stretch coach or a boxing coach or, you know, whatever it is. But they don't have a mental guy, you know, they don't have someone who works with you and really makes sure that your mind has the tools to manage itself out of there. And they don't know where to start. Like, where do you. If you're a guy and you're training, you know, let's. Any contender and then he gets knocked out and he comes back from that knockout and you're rebuilding them. But he's got all these confidence issues now. Like, where do you even look like? If you like, I gotta help this guy get back on track mentally, get him back to where he was before. Look, he got caught. It happens. But he's still an amazing boxer, and he's just got to recover from this and he can still get back on the horse and still be a world champion. But where do they even start? Start? You know, if they don't know you, where do they start?
- [129:17]
A
Well, I think they start by going through the process, just feeling into it, and it's always diving into the where you don't want to go. Right. It's okay. What are the insecurities coming up now, where the fears coming up, where the doubts. Usually we try to, like, stay in our head and escape that. It's about going into it, feeling, feeling, feeling into it, and then seeing what comes up there and even, like, writing it down and just bring it into awareness. Once you have awareness of it, then you can actually do something.
- [129:42]
B
Then you can manage it.
- [129:43]
A
Yes.
- [129:43]
B
Yeah.
- [129:44]
A
Yeah.
- [129:45]
B
So this book, how long does it take you to write it?
- [129:48]
A
Like, six months.
- [129:50]
B
The success code, it was a year. But with the High performance playbook for eliminating mental barriers and scaling your career, relationships and health. So did you think about, like, different approaches to, like, different kinds of occupations and different kinds of ways people are living their life and how it applies?
- [130:09]
A
So the first half of the book is my story. Story. It's kind of like, okay, I'm trying to build rapport. So I tell people, this is how I learned all this stuff. This is how it worked for me. These are my client stories. So by the end of the first part, either, like, this guy's full of shit or I believe you, right? And then the playbook starts. And it is something that anyone can use because it's. It's simple stuff. Like, it starts with, like, grade the different areas of your life from 1 to 10, right? And then we're looking at closing the gap in each area. If you're like, my career is at a 4, I want it to be at a 10. Okay, let's get the low hanging fruit of like, what are some of the things you need to stop doing that?
- [130:42]
B
Vodka.
- [130:43]
A
All right, the vodka. Let's cut that out, right?
- [130:45]
B
Those three glasses in the morning.
- [130:47]
A
Yeah, yeah. And just going through that, that auditing system of understanding, like, what's holding you back? What need you more conscious, conscientious about? And then I start getting into the training for the mind later on, do.
- [130:58]
B
This system, this writing this stuff down and having these numbers. Is this something that you invented? Is this something you learned?
- [131:05]
A
Yeah, something I invented.
- [131:06]
B
Yeah.
- [131:07]
A
Yeah.
- [131:07]
B
So you just. How did you come to that conclusion that that's how you should do it?
- [131:11]
A
Works. Yeah. Disc works.
- [131:14]
B
Works for you, works for clients.
- [131:16]
A
Yeah.
- [131:17]
B
So when you first started doing it, was it sort of like, who. What's the best way to mentally manage this situation for this person?
- [131:25]
A
Just trying to solve their problems. That's all I'm trying to do. Just being really creative with my problem solving. And so over the years, I, I just picked up better tools. I've gotten better at practicing things to be able to solve problems better. I wanted to be full time at this. At 22 years old. Wasn't going to happen. I just didn't have the experience. I didn't have enough tools.
- [131:41]
B
That's so young to want to help other people. You know, Most people at 22 are trying to help themselves.
- [131:48]
A
Yeah, it just, it worked for me so much and it transformed my life so much that I was like, well, this is what I'm supposed to do. I want to help other people with this.
- [131:57]
B
Interesting. So how did it transform your life? Like, what were the big benefits?
- [132:01]
A
Where do I begin? I would say it started just with coming back the next season and playing football. I went from riding the bench to becoming a starter to being one of the best players on our team. So it helped me with football. First I was like, all right, cool. That helped. Then I started to get actually confidence from being able to help other people, which I didn't have before. I was never something because football was like, okay. I wasn't great at it. But once I learned the skill, I actually started to build confidence and just learned to manage my own state, my anxiety, my performance anxiety, and just starting to feel confident. So for the first 10 years or so, by knowing about this probably first, more like nine years, I was mostly using more elementary meditation techniques, some hypnosis, some nlp. It wasn't until, I'd say about seven years ago that I started going deep into the beliefs and that transformed My life in a major way. I mean, one thing I did recently was I had hypothyroidism, and I was able to completely heal that naturally.
- [133:00]
B
How'd you do that?
- [133:02]
A
Changing all the underwriting beliefs and then everything, right? Everything I do with any client, it's the same thing I'm gonna do. For me, it's holistic. So of course, I went through a huge gut cleanse, right, because the gut is everything. It's the foundation. So, so did a lot of fasting, elimination diet, cutting out almost all foods except for a few boiled chicken, bowl of carrots, coconut oil. Started slowly noticing how I felt as I started to increase the portion and start to bring other foods in. I did red light therapy. There's some good red light therapy research out there for the thyroid. If you just put it on. There's a study that showed that people were able to cut their medication in half just by using the infrared fluid, right?
- [133:41]
B
Whoa.
- [133:41]
A
Light therapy? Yeah. It's good for a ton of things. Great for the gut. So I just started synchronicity, right? I met this lady on the beach in Miami beach who studies this stuff, red light therapy, specifically for the gut. And I was like, what about the thyroid? And she's like, yeah, of course it'll help. It's light. Light heals everything. So I just started researching it. So it was all. I did a lot of things. I cut out caffeine this year. That was a big thing that I don't think caffeine creates hypothyroidism. But for me, when I turned on that gene, right, Epigenetics, I turned on the gene for. I didn't have to have this, but like, my mom has. My brother has it. And so I had the gene and I put it on through stress, through excessive caffeine, and just a very stressful life in my mid-20s. So the way to turn it off was turn off the things that are associated with that stress response. So pulling out the caffeine just put me more on the parasympathetic nervous system, allowed me to relax more. And then, yeah, all this stuff and just noticing the fears come up when I pull away the things I like, right? The comfort of the food, the comfort of the caffeine. Just all my things that I like, all the comfort and just seeing where the fears that came out through that and just recoding it. Recoding it. This is gonna sound very woo woo. But I was taking the medication because, you know, if you ask a doctor, they tell you you have to take this medication for the rest of your life. And they get mad that you even ask about what an alternative is. Like, I've had doctors be like, be grateful. You just have to take a pill. Like, get out of here. But there was actually experience I had two years ago where a doctor wouldn't give me my medication, even though my blood didn't change. He said, oh, you're gonna have to come back in here every three months. I want to monitor. He tried to put me on, like, subscription plan to pay more money just to keep getting it. And it was, like, flipped on to me. I was like, I'm not doing this anymore.
- [135:19]
B
Wow.
- [135:19]
A
I'm gonna find a way to get off this medication. It just.
- [135:22]
B
This is something that RFK Jr. Is trying to stop. Is financial incentives.
- [135:27]
A
The gatekeeper.
- [135:27]
B
Yeah.
- [135:28]
A
Of this medication. Yeah.
- [135:30]
B
The financial incentives to subscribe, prescribe things, and then gatekeeping, whether or not you can get. Get useful medications. Kind of crazy.
- [135:37]
A
Yeah. But, yeah. So I just had. I did all these things very holistically. Right. Doing son. I'm doing all these things, and then just feeling into my body one day. It was just like, intuition just told me. It was like, hey, you're done. You don't need anymore.
- [135:53]
B
Wow.
- [135:54]
A
And so what I did, of course I asked Chachi BT I was like, I can't just stop taking it.
- [135:58]
B
And what did chatgpt say?
- [136:00]
A
It said, take one day on, one day off. I did that. By the third day of taking it again, my body rejected it. I felt terrible. I felt like a depletion of energy.
- [136:08]
B
It's just three days.
- [136:10]
A
The third day of not taking it. Third day of taking it.
- [136:14]
B
Wow.
- [136:14]
A
So I took it. I didn't take it. And the day that I took it again, my body rejected it. And I was like, I get it. I'm done. And I haven't touched it since.
- [136:21]
B
That's crazy.
- [136:22]
A
I think there's a lot of things like that.
- [136:24]
B
Well, I wonder if that study that shows that visualization increases physical strength. Strength like I want. I really wonder if there's. If you have the ability to accentuate healing if you just concentrate. Like, if you get an injury and the injury is going to heal, but if. If concentrating on that injury helps it heal more. Oh, but how many people actually do that? Right. How many people actually, like, really visualize something?
- [136:49]
A
Well, even just the placebo. Effect of thinking. You got it. So there's a study, I think it was done on ACL surgery, surgeries. I could write. Could be meniscus. It was one of these knee surgeries where they took two groups, they give one, one group the surgery, the other group, they just cut their knee open and then sewed it right back up. Same results over whatever the. Wait a minute.
- [137:08]
B
It can't be ACL surgery because ACL is a stabilizing ligament.
- [137:12]
A
It was one of these knee surgeries.
- [137:14]
B
Yeah.
- [137:15]
A
And they had the same results.
- [137:17]
B
That doesn't make sense. That, that.
- [137:19]
A
Jamie, help me out here.
- [137:20]
B
That seems a little wacky because ACLs are, it's, that's a center that keeps it from moving side to side and up and down.
- [137:28]
A
Maybe it was meniscus.
- [137:29]
B
Maybe that makes more sense.
- [137:31]
A
Yeah.
- [137:32]
B
Meniscus surgeries are rough because when they take it out, then you have this hole there, you have like a gap missing, depending on how much you take out. And some guys get a bunch of their meniscus taken out. Guys even get like artificial meniscus put in or donor meniscus, you know.
- [137:47]
A
But I mean, was that book.
- [137:49]
B
I think visualization is a factor and belief. Yeah. If you, you're not going to regrow your ACL though, with your brain.
- [137:55]
A
No.
- [137:56]
B
If it's not connected, get that shit fixed. But because I know a lot of guys who didn't and then eventually they did. I know a lot of guys got their ACL blown out and they just tried to rehab it, but it kept grinding. So they're always, it's always slipping out. They're always tearing their meniscus more. It's like, dude, just get it fixed. Get it fixed. Six months later you'll be back on the mats.
- [138:16]
A
Get very self fixed.
- [138:17]
B
Yeah. Get your ACL fixed.
- [138:19]
A
Yeah. It's wild though. I mean, if you start going down this rabbit hole of seeing like how many placebo studies have been done. That's why it's so hard to find drugs that actually work.
- [138:26]
B
This is weird.
- [138:27]
A
I think this is sort of.
- [138:28]
B
Okay, what does it say? 180 patients, osteoarthritis knee surgery were randomly assigned to receive arthroscopic debridem. Debridement, arthroscopic lavage or placebo surgery. Patients in a placebo group receive skin incisions and underwear. A similar deep debridement without insertion of the arthroscope. Patients and assessors of the outcome were blinded to the treatment group assignment. Outcomes were assessed at multiple points over a 24 month period with the use of five self reported scores, three on scales for pain and two on scales for function and one objective test of walking and stair climbing. A total of 165 patients concluded and completed the trial results. At no point did either of the intervention groups report less pain or better function than the placebo group. Interesting. But this is just like, I always wonder, like, how bad was their injury? What are we talking about? How many people were there? How many people were in this group? 165 patients. Conclusions. In this controlled trial involving patients with osteoarthritis of the knee, the outcomes after arthroscopic lavage or arthroscopic debridement were no better than those after a placebo procedure. That's kind of nuts, man.
- [139:50]
A
And I think, like, it's weird how we talk about the placebo that way. It's kind of, like, diminishing. It's like, yeah, look, it didn't work. But that's not what happened. The people believed they got the surgery.
- [139:59]
B
Right. That's the fucked up part about placebo effects. It's measurable. Like, the benefits are measurable.
- [140:04]
A
Like, they did heal. They did have less pain. Pain they did have.
- [140:08]
B
The question is, like, would they have healed anyway without it? I don't know. Or is it because they believe that they were healed, that it relaxed them, and then they were thinking, okay, it's healing now. I got the surgery. It's on the right track. It's getting better now. And maybe if they had that mindset, if they could figure out a way to make that mindset without the surgery, they could have. Just do it.
- [140:29]
A
Yeah.
- [140:29]
B
Belief. Belief. All right, dude, the success code. Did you have an audible or an audio version of this?
- [140:36]
A
It's on Spotify. It's audible.
- [140:38]
B
Did you read it?
- [140:39]
A
I did read it.
- [140:40]
B
Nice.
- [140:41]
A
I love when you hear all my. My dirty.
- [140:43]
B
Read their own stuff and a bunch of people sing your praises in the back of the book.
- [140:48]
A
And you can look up my name because I rebranded it, and I haven't changed the name on Spotify. So just look up Brandy Epps and you'll find the book.
- [140:54]
B
What do you mean, you rebranded the book?
- [140:56]
A
Yeah, it's called on Spotify, program to fit fail.
- [140:59]
B
Okay. We'll let people know. Yeah.
- [141:00]
A
So they could program to fail on audible.
- [141:02]
B
Okay.
- [141:02]
A
Success code on everywhere else.
- [141:04]
B
All right, beautiful. Thanks, brother. It was fun. Thank you, brother. All right, bye, everybody.