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- [00:07]
Warwick Schiller
Journey on magic lies within the trails we ride. You're listening to the Journey on podcast with Warwick Schiller. Warrick is a horseman trainer, international clinician and author who helps empower horse people.
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Van Carraza
From all over the world with the skills, knowledge and mindsets needed to create trusting partnerships with their horses. Warrick offers a free seven day trial.
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Warwick Schiller
To his comprehensive online video library that.
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Van Carraza
Includes hundreds of full length training videos.
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Warwick Schiller
And several home study courses@videos.warwick shiller.com.
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Van Carraza
G'day everyone. Welcome back to the Journey on podcast. I'm your host Warwick Schiller and this week I have two guests at the same time, a husband and wife, Van and Amanda Carraza. So Van and Amanda are involved in a nonprofit out here on the central coast of California called Operation Surf. So Van is the founder and director and Amanda's the executive director. And what Operation Surf does is it teaches veterans with PTSD how to surf to help them with help them with their ptsd. So Van is a former big wave surfer and he was the founder of the whole thing. And Amanda, his wife was initially a volunteer and then she basically involved on the ground floor of the whole thing. And so today we're going to talk about the story of how they got to be doing the amazing work that they're doing, what their journey was to end up doing the amazing work that they're doing. But before we get to our next guest, I want to tell you guys about our new Journey on podcast courses. You know, we have a podcast summit every year where we have the guests come and present over three days and the feedback from that has been absolutely amazing. And my wife Robin thought wouldn't it be a great idea if we could get these guys to do some sort of an online course where people could dive deeper into each of the podcast guests area of expertise. And so at the moment we have 11 of these journey on podcast courses. We have one from Heather Lucas called rewilding. Carla Buckmuller does one on the writer's breath unlocking the power of proper breathing. Jamin Fraser from Australia does one called unhindered. My wife Robin does one called reset your nervous system, reset your life. Hannah Pazquinzo does one called mindful mornings. Everybody's favorite astrologer, Denise Elizabeth Byron does one called flow with the changes. Pete and Louisa Brendel do one on long writing explained. So it's videos on how to long ride if you want to do what they're doing. Super guinea does one called light your life on fire. Shalin Harkin does One called the Genie Within. And Cathy woods does one on mindfulness and horsemanship. And also Emily Ksdotter does one on. If you've listened to her podcast episode and she talked about the Hashemite horses, which fascinated me, she does one called the Seven Lines, the Teaching of the Jordanian Hashemite Horses. And so I can't. I. It's a four part zoom series and I cannot wait to listen to that one. But yeah, if you guys are interested in doing a bit more of a deep dive into any one of these podcast guests, these courses are great. They're exclusive, so you can't get these information, these courses anywhere else. And all you have to do is go to courses.warwickshiller.com and, and you can get started on those. Van and Amanda, welcome to the Journey on podcast.
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Amanda Carraza
Good morning. Thank you for having us.
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Van Carraza
It's good to have you guys here. So what I thought I might do is, you know, you guys involved in an amazing operation and I thought I would just start out with you guys telling us what it is that you guys do and what is each of your individual roles in there. And then what I really want to do is figure out how did you guys end up in this space? Like, there's got to be a great story about how you ended up doing what you're doing.
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Warwick Schiller
Well, you want me to start?
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Amanda Carraza
You go first.
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Warwick Schiller
Okay. Well, so what we do is we use, I have surfing programs that help our military. We, we have programs for local veterans, wounded, non wounded, physically wounded, the invisible wounds. And we also serve our active duty soft community and their spouses. So, you know, it's kind of a, you know, it's a long story of how we got there. That's. I guess that's why we're on here because it's about the journey.
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Van Carraza
You know, it is about the long story.
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Warwick Schiller
So the end, the end thing, that's what we do is we take people surfing, we build connection, you know, through mother nature, surfing, build a community, and ultimately is build relationships based on trust. And so with that, you know, trust is a journey. You know, you just. Trust is not given, it's earned. And we've done a really good job at what we do it based on our culture and our values of being open, honest and vulnerable. And, and so that's kind of like what we do, you know, of why we're here is our occupation. And you know, they, we say like, I'm, she's the operation on the surf. And so, you know, as we get into this, this conversation, a Little bit. Is. Is everything connected to the ocean and what we do in there is what I take care of and everything to make the thing tick and work and operate into. Exist is Amanda. So did I leave out anything?
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Amanda Carraza
Good job.
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Van Carraza
No, that's good. So, Amanda, do you want to. Want to tell us about your role in this, In Operation Surf?
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Amanda Carraza
Yeah.
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Van Carraza
I love what Van just said. He's the surf and you're the operation. Sounds like. Sounds like my gig here with Robin, you know, she's the operation, and I'm the. Whatever else it is.
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Amanda Carraza
Yeah, definitely. So my role is, like he said, the operations. So all the things that drive him crazy is what I do. So administration, behind the scenes, leading the team. And I think over the years we've been doing this together for 15 years. We've figured out what our lanes are and what our strengths are and how do we, like, as a married couple and partnership and kind of devoting our whole life to this, navigate those lanes and how they cross and when they conflict and when we need to lean on each other for knowing, okay, that's his expertise. Okay, that's her expertise. But really, my role is everything out of the ocean. His role is everything in the ocean. And then I think our journeys together, of our own life stories and our own life experiences help shape the product that we give, and it helps shape the culture that we create in our team and our leadership styles, and we truly build a family within our. Our organization. And that really starts, I think, with us as a family.
- [07:32]
Warwick Schiller
Well, yeah, you know, what's coming to my mind is. Is like we're like the yin and yang. You know, we have. We bouncy. We bounce things off each other because our partnership and our friendship, you know, really, and. And understanding who we are and our belief systems of the values of what makes our, you know, our heart beat, so to speak, is just like, when we get confused by the mind is we're able to, you know, bounce things off each other and. And kind of like, you know, get a.
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Van Carraza
A.
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Warwick Schiller
Like a better perspective of. Of our next step. And so I think that's the beautiful part about our marriage, our partnership, our friendship, is that we work together and honor and respect each other. So I think it's really.
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Van Carraza
Yeah, that's pretty. It's pretty obvious. So how did. How did Operation Surf start? What was the. What was the. The catalyst that. That actually started the whole thing?
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Warwick Schiller
Well, it's a long journey, and so Operation Surf started through, like, my journey of my life. You know, I was like, you know, I was a, an only child raised by my dad from, you know, the, the 60s into the 70s, you know, to divorce from the second marriage. And so I went through a lot of journey on my own that really, you know, set up this, this path to where I became very, well, scared. Didn't know it, I could identify it now, but as I, as I went through this, this process, as I developed a lot of, I guess, behaviors and a lot of activities that help, you know, divert the mind from the actual feeling. And you know, there's a lot difference between the 60s and 70s of what it's like in the new millennium of identifying and labeling and all that kind of stuff. And so, and so what I found was, is, you know, I've, you know, I been given a God gifted talent of ability and, and so I really sought my, my escape through sports. And what I ended up really getting into was, was surfing. You know, I was, I was a good team sport person, but I was so hyperactive. They have a label for that now. Couldn't pay attention, couldn't sit still. And I got in a lot of trouble for it is because it was just like, you know, they couldn't get my attention, they couldn't get me what to do. And so as soon as they would speak or, or, or interact with me in a way that I felt hurtful, I would push back. And so what happened in surfing is, is it was, it's an individual thing, you know, and I was, I was, I went into it with a, you know, with a kind of a community, but it really turns into an individual journey. And what I found was as I found peace, I found, I found the ability to learn about respect. I found a, an opportunity to find value. And, and I found a way to, you know, get back at people through just, you know, my term is shredding on their head, so to speak. It's like out, you know, outperforming somebody and doing things, you know, better than somebody when they're verbally and physically abusive. You know, I wasn't into that. And, and so I would really turn to performance, you know, and so it became really, it became really beneficial to me. And so I guess, you know, how it really, really boils down to it is when I was a senior in high school, well, I got it. It's. I guess it's pretty obvious I'm a recovering drug addict and I've been clean and sober since December 16, 2002. But on this journey of just, you know, participating in that lifestyle, I was, I was Going to get arrested for sales of cocaine when I was a senior in high school. And, you know, and my friend got arrested. He told me, like, you know, they're after you. And this is the reason why I'm telling you this, because it's really significant, because this is what really started the whole journey is I went off and I escaped to the ocean, you know, because my life's over. I catastrophized everything. I was living in the wreckage of the future. I was just like, my life is over, right? And, you know, that. That vision about just the pain of something that hasn't happened yet. You know what I mean? And so I go to the beach, I go on the. I get in my wetsuit, I go surfing. I'm consumed by this. This. This thought of this experience I'm going through. And I go in the water and I, you know, and I'm consumed by this thought in the very beginning. And the next thing I remember, it's about two and a half, three hours later, I'm getting out of the water and I'm getting dressed, and I re. And I go, oh, yeah, my life's over. You know, and so for two and a half, two hours, two and a half hours, I completely forgot about the situation I was going in. I was, you know, my life was involved in, right? And so. And the reason why I stay this is because this, this was in the 80s. And so along the way, this is one of the most powerful stories when I told psychologists and psychiatrists is, you know, they were just going, God, that's powerful. You know, and, and later on in it is this, you know, as I was in, you know, you know, the drug lifestyle, you know, I was participating in, you know, basically, you know, criminal action and, you know, to seek my, you know, my addiction. And as I was doing things.
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Van Carraza
I.
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Warwick Schiller
Was always reflecting back. If I get caught for this, I won't be able to surf. And, you know, and then I, I would continue to do it because addiction is very powerful. And, you know, and it's not just addiction from drugs, by the way. And so if you want to focus on my, My, My topic of. Of drugs, really look at some similarities that become addictive in all of our lives, right? And so as. As I go through this, this process and I continue to do it because the power of the. Of the obsession, and then I would go do it because my. My addiction needed to be fed. And as I come back and I would tell, you know, these psychologists and psychiatrists this, they go, God, you know, how powerful that is. I go, but I still did it. It goes, but the fact that you would stop in the midst of everything and weigh out the consequences and identify what would happen if you do this stuff is very powerful. And so those two things together is what's really significant because, you know, I went through a lot more stuff. But what happened was, is I got arrested again, you know, in 2002, and then I went through my sentencing in 2000. Well, my sentencing date was to December 16, 2002. And that's my, my, my clean and sober date. And, and as I went into that, that, that process is, I started getting involved in some recovery platforms. And, and so what happened was, is when I obviously went through my journey of stubbornness, you know, pride, ego, you know, I had to self deflate, you know, a concept of thinking and values that I was just so driven on. And so five years later is when I'm doing my work, one of my mentors told me, because he realized how consumed I was of the negativity. I mean, I just consumed. It's just everything. Like when you think negative, it just brings negative. And he basically told me, I go, I don't want you just to think about the negative stuff. I want you to think about the positive things in your life. And then it brought me to surfing and I was able to identify all these positive things that surfing was, you know, brought into my life. And parallel to this is I realized I was very selfish and self centered, but I was basically scared trying to navigate my life however I could, you know, developed all kinds of different, you know, concepts of life and behavior. And so when I got to this point is I realized that service work, you know, fitting myself to God and being maximum service to other people was the part of my process for Van's journey of recovery. And so I still really started saying yes to when people started asking me for help. Like, you know, when an elderly person or a couple needed help moving stuff, you know, I would raise my hand, I would say yes, you know, can you help me do this? I said yes. And then in 2006, I was asked to, you know, help a group of women warriors in transition that were recovering from the Brooke Army Medical center in San Antonio, Texas. And I wasn't able to do it that year because I had commitments, because yes, I was on my journey of, you know, my recovery. So my integrity of not shining on one to do another as I didn't do it. So in 2007, I said I could do it. And so I was Able to, you know, do my first. Be involved in my first group of warriors recovering at the cfi, the center for the Intrepid. And what happened would forever change, you know, my life. And this is how Operation Surf started is. Is I started meeting the. The people behind the uniforms, and I said, I started communicating verbally with the. The. The mental or the. The mindsets of a warrior that's going through the journey of trauma and change and, you know, you know, depression and, you know, now, you know, PTSD and. And. But I'd see them smile. And. And so I made a commitment that, you know, I need to keep doing this. And so every year, we kept doing this more and more. And so in. In 2008, I was given the opportunity to bring out the group on my. On my own, through my surf school, you know, the Van Carrassa Surf School. And when I said yes to that, I needed to name it, like, what's the journey going to be called? Okay. And so a group of my friends got together at my surf school, and Operation Surf was born in 2009. You know, and, you know, the funny thing about it is, as I started this journey in 2008, I started a nonprofit called Amazing Surf Adventures for at risk and underserved youth, because that was my background. And I wanted to give back. I wanted to give back to the youth because if surfing helped me like it helped me, I wanted to help other youth in their process and their journey. And. And so as I started doing this, you know, I was asking, obviously, the community for help is because, you know, I can only financially, you know, provide as much as I could through my surf school because I'm definitely not the wealthiest man in the world, you know, and so as I'm asking the community for support, they're. They're writing checks to me to help me pay for the program. And. And I said, you know, write it out to Van Carraza Surf School. And they're like, you need to start a nonprofit because they want, you know, the. The paper trail. They want the paper trail to be as healthy as possible. And. And I kind of like went like I already did, you know, and so that's why in the beginning, it was called Amazing Surf Adventures. And it didn't start off Operation Surf. And so truly, that's how Operation Surf was started. And every time that I did a program, I learned more and more about the journey of the warrior. And I was able to relate with the thinking and the mindset, basically driven by fear, pride, and ego. And. And so I was basically saying, I know how to help them. And so that's how our curriculum started getting created and that's why we're a curriculum based surf program that has therapeutic results. You don't come to a therapist, you don't come to none of this stuff. But what you do is you go through a process, learning how to surf, meeting new friends, you know, being, being around people, sharing their vulnerabilities. Like I like to say it's okay not to be okay. And I've always been open about my addiction and my recovery, which is like, you're like, why do you say that publicly? You know, is because I'm the first step of the example of vulnerability and honesty without being gripped by the fear of judgment of other people is because I am the person I am today because of my past. And that's probably one of your questions that we got coming on is, and that's how Operation Surf started. And, and so that is what started the relationship with the, with the Brook Army Medical Center. That's what started the, the annual serve programs. And I guess that's pretty how it started. And, and what it is today is through experiences, through the journey.
- [20:52]
Van Carraza
So, so where did you grow up?
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Warwick Schiller
I grew up here in San Luis Obispo County.
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Van Carraza
Oh, okay. So I was wondering where the surf was.
- [21:03]
Warwick Schiller
Yeah, I was, I was born and raised, I was born and raised here. I went to San Luis Obispo High School and you know, I basically grew up here. And so, so I would hitchhike to the beach when I was, you know, a sophomore in high school. Maybe even in ninth grade. I was hitchhiking to the beach. Actually, it was ninth grade when I was hitchhiking to the beach and you know, and I, well, anyway, trouble. So yeah, that's where, that's where it is. It's why we're here. You know, everyone goes Avala Beach. You know what I mean? I'm like, yeah, this place is special.
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Van Carraza
You know, so you, I know that at some point in time you became, you were a professional surfer, weren't you?
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Warwick Schiller
Yes, I, I had a desire to travel the world and surf waves and compete and make a living out of surfing. And so I tried to do that in an area that has no surf industry. So it was very difficult.
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Van Carraza
Yeah, did, but did you manage to, did you manage to travel the world.
- [22:04]
Warwick Schiller
And some places it was all funded, you know, I didn't really have any. I never was, I've never been paid. I've never received a financial check to be a surfer. But I got a lot of in kind sponsorship which was put, put your label on our board and we'll give you products. So you know, for a long time I haven't paid for surfboards or clothes.
- [22:25]
Amanda Carraza
He's an amazing surfer. I'm a toot his horn. Toot toot. He's amazing. He served giant waves, competed all over. He's a stud. So he's, he's definitely a legend and did a lot. Even though he didn't get paid.
- [22:43]
Warwick Schiller
He, the question was. Well, because I was, I wasn't unwilling, I was unwilling to leave this area. Like in order for me to seek and actually do what it took to be a paid, I would probably had to move out of this area and I, I could never leave here. You know, this is a very, very special place, you know, and, and everything worked out just perfect, you know, is because, you know, yes, I traveled and competed in Hawaii, you know, and, and I did my things and. But I really, I really. The big waves and the power waves was really my forte and most of the contests back in the 80s and 90s were in small beach break waves. And so I, I struggled in, in smaller surf. Now today when you look at it, they're going to all these, you know, premium surf spots with some of the best waves. And so like that would be my dream, right? Is because that's what, at that phase in my life, that's what, that's where I clicked, you know, so all the contests, I did really good in Hawaii, you know, but I was basically doing it alone, you know. You know, I was basically traveling by myself trying to do everything, you know, had no community, no team, I didn't have no support. And you know, really look at why we create teams and support and you know, to not be alone is because I lived my whole life thinking I'm alone and, and I kept myself alone in a lot of areas because of the, you know, the fear of being hurt by other people, you know. And I mean I was raised with judgment from people. They were like, why are you doing this? What do you know? You have so much potential. And I was just like, just give me a hug. I couldn't say that. And.
- [24:37]
Van Carraza
Right.
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Warwick Schiller
I can say that now is because now I know what was really driving my poor behavior, you know, know.
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Van Carraza
Right. You've mentioned, you mentioned a number of times something and then you mentioned the word scared and a lot of times there. But you also mentioned you're a big wave surfer. And, and for me scared and big wave surfer don't don't line up. What the scared part, what was the, what was the, what was the fear? Well, is it, was it physical fear of physical danger or was it fear of judgment of others?
- [25:16]
Warwick Schiller
Well, it's kind of both, because the psychological perspective of fear is about judgment, you know, and the actual internal fear is belief, you know, and, and at the time is just like I believed in my ability because I remember going out a lot of times in, in, you know, the duration of my career and just surfing. And I'd look at these very heavy, scary conditions, you know, big, giant waves of some big waves to me, you know, whatever it was. And, and I would sit back and as soon as my mind would start taking over in the fear base, a lot of doubt and I'd have to sit back and say, I believe I can this, you know how to do this. If this happens, what do you do? You know what I mean? How do I avoid this? How do. Because so then, then the ability and the experience and the wisdom starts coming in is because the more that you obtain, the more wisdom and ability that the strength that you get. And so fear is a good motivator. And also one of the things my ability was creating that self worth. But the fear of judgment from other people didn't come from surfing. It's because I was doing what I needed to do. And in my mind I am going to do it better than you, right? And, but I really wasn't vocal about it. I was all action, all action, you know, all action. But in turn was as. I was actually scared to be alone. I was scared of. Because it, you know, long story short, every important person in my life, parents, everyone that I counted on, created fear in my life, you know, and, and so I became very sheltered. My feelings became very sheltered. And so, so when you say fear, fear and scared, Scared of being hurt, fear of the waves was not trusting my ability. So there's all these different things that, and, and so through this journey and my ability and doing this stuff, I've been able to accomplish and ride very scary, very heavy waves at a high level. And that's where I got my, that's where I got my reputation. That's where my reputation exists. And, and I would, well, God provided me something I needed, but a sense of self worth and value that I was not getting in my community or my home.
- [28:08]
Van Carraza
Right, so when did you start the surf school?
- [28:11]
Warwick Schiller
Well, I've been teaching for like over 40 years because as a starving pro surfer, you know, you're trying to do. I worked in a lot of restaurants. So I can surf all day and then eat and work at night and so, you know, you do whatever you need to do and you know, and then I was an entrepreneur in the, in the illegal activity stuff as I would, you know.
- [28:39]
Van Carraza
So let me ask you a question. You said you worked a lot of restaurants? Yeah, my son worked in a restaurant after high school, but he was telling me recently that there's a lot of that extracurricular activity goes on in the kitchen of restaurants.
- [28:57]
Warwick Schiller
I don't mean everywhere, but yes, it's very common. Got it.
- [29:02]
Van Carraza
Yeah. I didn't realize that a lot of people that work in the kitchens of restaurants have, you know, have been incarcerated their addicts. Yeah, I didn't, didn't put two and two together.
- [29:13]
Warwick Schiller
Well, it's, it's basically you're what you put yourself around. Obviously if there was a health and wellness driven restaurant, there's probably not a lot of that going on.
- [29:25]
Van Carraza
Right.
- [29:25]
Warwick Schiller
But if you're in a restaurant that has no focus on any of that stuff, you're going to get alcoholism and, and, and drug use. I mean it's just pretty much, it's pretty much everywhere in the world. Right. So yeah, I really wasn't much of a drinker because like I said, I was an only child, so I was always scared and I had no backup. I had no brothers, no sisters. I had, I didn't have anyone to, that I can count on. And so that's why I can identify with the military so much is because I've been hyper vigilant and hypertension very like checking everything, like putting my back up against walls since I was a kid in single digit years of my life. And that's how they live. And so I can relate to all this stuff. Right. And so, you know what I mean? And so there's, there's, that's why the similarities are so important, not the differences. And, and you know, so do you.
- [30:20]
Van Carraza
So you talked about hyper vigilance. Do you feel, and you said you, you know, you were kind of busy minded, you know, the hyper vigilance would have come from the, you know, only child, no brothers, no backup sort of thing. But do you, did you feel like there was some ADHD type stuff there as well? So it's a bit of nature versus nurture.
- [30:40]
Warwick Schiller
Yeah, of course. So my, my, my personality wanting you to, want me around to like me, you know, to pick me on your team, you know that my, my behavior and all that kind of stuff would come out in, in certain elements to try to, you know, to be, I'm gonna say it, Loved. You know what I mean? I just wanted to be loved. You know what I mean?
- [31:10]
Van Carraza
Yeah.
- [31:11]
Warwick Schiller
And, and so I lost track real quick. What was your question again?
- [31:19]
Van Carraza
Oh, well, I was just talking about, you know, the, the nature versus nurture with the, the, you know, the, the hyper vigilance and things like that. But then there's the hyperactivity too. And the hyper vigilance kind of came from not having support. And then there's the, also the, you know, you feel, I was asking, do you feel like you had ADHD type?
- [31:39]
Warwick Schiller
Well, I did. And so the, the, the hyper vigilance came through. I, I won a lot. I beat people in games. I surfed better, I skateboarded better, I rode a bicycle better. I wasn't better in school. But all the physical stuff and all these activities and so you become a target when you're at the top. And like I told you, a lot of people that are basically getting checked by the performance result to other emotions, which is, you know, their, what they need to do to get their value. And so I had to deal with a lot of violence. I, I had to, I had to deal with people wanting to equalize the scenario through violence. And so, you know, I've, I got in trouble when I was a little kid and my dad even said, van, you, you have an anger problem. This was like at sixth grade, like, because I, I had gotten some trouble in school and I was alone and I, I got in a couple fights and I, I hurt a couple people because I'm scared. Right? And, and so when I went through this, you know, this life journey, I've learned to fight without fighting. So like, I've been able to embrace the fact that I don't need to beat you up to feel good about myself. I can avoid a fight and be called lots of names my whole entire life and brush those off so I don't have to engage in the actual physical stuff. I mean, I've had to in the past. I mean, I'm not saying I, I avoided all of it, but the reality is, is I, what I didn't go to engage to fulfill their wishes. And, and I, I, I didn't lose. You know what I mean? And so, but so anyway, I, I was, you know, I, I developed a lot of mindset. Like, you know what really I'm gonna say it is, is when someone engages in physical activities to try to hurt me is, is like, that's what I look at. You're trying to hurt me and to win the game is, is I'm gonna hurt you before you hurt me. And nobody wins. Absolutely nobody wins in that scenario. And more importantly, what I've learned is why are you engaging this stuff? I have went in my own personal journey to understand why I do a lot of things. Why I think a lot of things is because I've been on a self discovery and a self awareness journey for the past 22 years. That actually is part of everything that we're talking about right now is because those things created belief systems and, and effects, and those effects created my behavior and those behaviors created the results of what I had to navigate and deal with. And I had to get to the place to where I had to own my part in that stuff, you know, because I used to point the finger a lot like, oh, this to deal with this. And you, you would understand. Blah. You know what I mean? And just like, I just, you know, it's just. Yeah, it's frustrating.
- [35:30]
Van Carraza
You know, it's interesting though, you said starting, you know, you, you're working on understanding why you do things. And I mean that's, that's the self development journey right there. That's the self discovery journey is you act certain ways, but until you really find out why you act those ways, that's. I think that's where all the truth comes out. Like, ah, they're just coping mechanisms, you know, your addiction coping mechanism, you know, like all of that stuff. Speaking of your addiction, you did say about your sentencing, did you actually have to go to jail or did you go to, did you get put in rehab?
- [36:04]
Warwick Schiller
I got. Well, in the early 2000s, they started realizing that most of our jails were filled with people with alcohol and drug charges. And so they started rehabilitation instead of incarceration. And so as I went through this journey and this opportunity, they. I went to Drug Court Prop 36. And what that did was, is it's. God. I got a long story on this too, but I'm not, I don't know if you want to get into it.
- [36:34]
Van Carraza
But it's a long, It's a long podcast. We want to hear the stories.
- [36:38]
Warwick Schiller
That's why December 16, 2002 was one of the most significant days of my life and thousands of other people's lives. Because that day was about six months after my last arrest. And I was going. I was living life in this, in this addictive world and very hurt, embarrassed, shameful, like. And that night was the last time I got loaded. I used methamphetamines you know, I, I often say that, you know, speed saved my life. And people trip out like, what? And I'm like, yeah, it's the one thing that finally kicked Van's ass enough to like be humble to try to do something different. So that night I had stayed up all night and I had court the next day at 10:00am and there's this, there's some significant things that happened. So as I, as I went in court, right before court, they opened the doors. It was a hallway of courtroom D5 in the Santa, Santa Vispo Superior Court. I was sitting there and I, which I believe is one of my, a spiritual awakening that I had. And I was sitting there and I was like, what choice? You know, what am I doing? Like, all these things are coming at me. And I was realizing that I'm sitting there because of me. Like I finally thought there's no one else to blame but me, why I'm sitting here. And I was, I surrendered. I was deflated, you know, and I, and I also use the words I was sick and tired of being sick and tired. And I realized that if I don't do something different when they open that door, I'm either going to go to prison for a long time or I'm going to die. Because there's so many reasons why I should have died because my, my personality and my behavior is high, tense. I mean I lived a dangerous life. I mean I tell all of our warriors that I go, I liked living a life that almost not making it was the best rush. And they just go, yeah. You know, And I'm like, and I'm like, that's why I could relate, you know, to a lot of the people, you know, I don't. So as I was sitting there, I was like, I realized, I said, okay, because I, as a good non trusting individual, I started asking questions before this day about the programs that were going to, being offered to me and everyone went to jail. So I was like, why take these programs when everyone goes to jail? But what I realized is everyone goes to jail because they don't stop their behavior. Their accountability is one of the coolest thing about this pro. This program is because it's about the level of accountability that was held over my head that allowed me to start making these changes. And so as I was sitting there and I went, okay, I'm gonna quit drinking and using. Well, I'm gonna quit using and I'm gonna take this program. And, and so when I went in there, they go, they, they go, do the dog and pony show behind closed doors. And they come out and then they do the, you know. You know, they do the, oh, this and that. But they already made the deal back in the chambers of, like, what's going on? And so two significant things as they're out in the back. The bailiff that was in. In the courtroom knew me, and I was falling asleep because I had been up, right? So they came by and kicked me in my foot. And they said, wake up. I don't want to take you to jail. Because they knew me. So there's one miracle. Yeah, there's one miracle. Wake up. I don't want to take you to jail. So as they go do their thing, I used to party with the public defender. So he comes back and. And sits down next to me and he tells me that the judge, the da, the prosecutors, all the people probation, they think that you're a waste of our time and you will never get clean. And he said, what's now identify regardless. He said, I know him. If he says he's going to do it, he'll do it. Someone believed in me. When you're hopeless, you never know when you're going to hear the words that might motivate you to move through some of the hardest things that you have to go through through belief. Like, I believe in you, right? And he said, I believe in you. And I told him that if he says he's going to do it, he's going to do it. So right there, I caught the resentment and I said, you will never see me loaded if you don't believe I can do it, because I'm a. I'm a competitor. So God put this element in front of me that was just perfect for Van. So they said, he can't. And I said, I can and I will show you. So for all the wrong reasons, I stayed clean. So I went to this. I went to. They went through this thing and they offered me this stuff, and they said, okay, you need to go to drug and alcohol services and get assessed so we can put you in the program that, you know, that you need to go to. And so my charges weren't so severe that they didn't put me in the highest level of care. They put me. I ended up in the middle part, and they were trying to find out. They were trying to find out who my counselor was going to be and what, you know, where I was going to go. So I go to drug, Drug and alcohol, and they go through. And I sit in there and I. They're doing their assessment, and the guy comes in there and starts asking me questions. He spent about two minutes with me, no time whatsoever. And I went. And he was going to get up and walk away. And I said, whoa, whoa, whoa, wait a minute. What are you doing? I go, we're done here. I go, no, you're not. I am broken. You. There's no way you can figure me out in two minutes. You need to sit back down and ask me more questions. And. And I went through, I don't know how long it was, 45 minutes. He taught me all these questions because, you know, they're counselors, you know, that are doing these assessments. It took them two weeks to figure out what counselor they're going to give me. They're like, who are we going to give this guy to? Right? And so they finally give me this woman. And so here's the other miracle. So I go in. I used to get loaded with obviously a couple of people in the class. And I sat in. In. In group therapy, and I said, oh, I'm never going to get loaded again. You know what I mean? And everyone's, oh, never say never. That's a long time, you know. And so we leave. We leave a group and I'm out there, and my friend goes, I said, never. The worst thing I ever did was have to sit in her office admitting I was loaded again. And I said, she'll never get the enjoyment of me getting loaded. And so there's another. Spite was just my miracle, right? So I was like, I am determined. So with that being said is. It's like the same characteristic I learned to stay out there and stay in trouble. To continue to do wrong behavior is the same trait. To change your life is because if you can use it in a positive way instead of a negative way. So I want our listeners to really understand that mindset that was keeping me in that. That hurt little boy that was living in a man's body that just was lost, stuck on this. This pride and ego stubbornness is to continue to do what I want to do. When I got broken, God broke me to the place I was, surrendered to the fact where I said, I'm going to do this. So what. What I learned through this time is, is these elements in Van's life were exactly what I needed to start this journey. And it's because I did everything I could in my ability to not get loaded, because that was the one thing that everyone said that I couldn't do. Aviator, like, say, you know, you take a drunken horse Thief and take away the alcohol, you still got the horse thief, right? So alcohol and drugs are just a symptom of our problems. That's why I love the why. And everything we do with Operation Surf, it's why when, when we go through our, our, you know, all of our treat, all of our programs stuff with, you know, our team, it's like, why do we do this? Why are we doing this? Why do we do this? Why do we not do this? You know, it's to understand the why. And so through that, you know, I got clarity. And this is why I always say in all of our stuff is I don't tell anyone what to do. I just share my own experiences. We I statements, right? And so I tell the story of sitting in the hall room, courtroom D5. And I made that decision. And the one decision I made was, is I didn't think it all the way through. I didn't have to say, if I do this, this is going to happen, this is going to happen. Is this going to benefit my life? I finally made a decisions without thinking anything through. From that day on, I haven't drank or used. And then I got clarity in the mind. I put myself around solid people going through hard times. You know, some people would stereotype them as loser drug addicts, criminals, but we're just lost people that are living in pain, that have no healthy path, you know, and until hope comes along, it's very hard to change your direction because, you know, change is hard, man. You know, it's. And, and as I, I go through this stuff, the biggest thing is this. The clarity came into my mind and I was able to hear things. And I often say is as I probably heard the same things shared to me, but I was finally able to hear it in a positive way.
- [47:04]
Van Carraza
Right? It's your perspective and what you.
- [47:06]
Warwick Schiller
And how it's delivered. So if you deliver the same message in a way, that's why I'm all about, you know, how we deliver messages and how we do our programs is because we want to deliver the, the program through our own experiences and not tell you what to do. And you can continue to do what you do, but here's going to be your results. And when you want to change those results, we got some directions, some suggestions for you to take, you know. And so then that whole process, you know, started, you know, this and then I became, I became inspired to be a better man. And once I became inspired to do that, I started the hard work that was looking at the person in the mirror. And then as I started that process, I was starting to realize characters and, you know, poor behaviors, character defects, you know, all these different things, I was able to understand why do the, you know, and through my own recovery journey and, and so all that right there is the reason why the characters of what Operation Surf operate is, is like everything that we do is through my eyes, through my, through my glasses. And I, you know, I tell people all the time is I'm a recovering drug addict and I'm proud of it, you know, but through my journey of making a decision to better my life, I've been able to learn things. And so what I share with your group, your people, whoever's coming is, is my own experiences. And you know, and you know, I, I, I, all the stats and all the boxes to check that I would be something of value, the only one. Well, no, I can't say that. I mean, priority is I made a decision and I was able to be the man I'm supposed to be. And now I am able to do what I do because, because of my journey.
- [49:00]
Van Carraza
And yeah, I mean, you, you, you can only, you're only doing what you're doing because all those things happened and now, you know, that's, that's your journey, isn't it? Like, you were, you're meant to be doing what you're doing and you had to go through all that stuff to gain the perspective you have so that you can help these work.
- [49:16]
Warwick Schiller
But, you know, the cool thing is, is so you take out the, the, the population and you just put the individual in there. And what happened was, is I got around people that I knew that had changed their life. And I was like, curious, you know, and I was like, like, your life is so different, you know, And I was able to learn how to find the similarities instead of differences. Like I, I often say and use this word as, or the statement is, is I was terminally unique. Like, I put myself in such a category that you don't understand, you don't get it. If you went through what I went through, you do the things that I do. And what that did was, is that put me in a state of mind of being alone, isolation, that it's just a sentence for death, right? And, and so as soon as I was able to be amongst things, and that's why I want to say this is one of the biggest gifts I, I was ever received was humility. And I was able to say, like, you know, no matter who you think you are, you know, you're screwing up and you need to do something different. Then I became teachable. And once I became teachable without feeling I'm less than now, that's a journey to start taking directions, admit that, you know, I'm not doing things and not take it in a negative way. But I had to keep on believing. I, I, you know, that, that inspiration to become a better person was more powerful than to live in shame on what it took to be teachable. To, to listen to different things, you.
- [50:52]
Van Carraza
Know, And I just wrote that down. I've never heard that saying before. Being teachable without feeling less than. Yeah, that's a, it's a great distinction. Because being teachable but feeling like you're a piece of or you don't know anything or whatever, that's one thing. But teachable without feeling less than. I love that.
- [51:17]
Warwick Schiller
Well, that's, that's a per. That's why perception is so important in a person's journey is, is because we, I, I realized that, that I, I looked, this is the power of a decision or a choice is because I used to look at things a certain way. And I realized I was so narrow minded in that perception that it, it kept me in jail, it kept me a prisoner of the mindset of how I looked at things and being able to look at things differently as a choice. So I had to, I had to make, I have to make a choice to say, stop. You're feeling like shit because you're thinking about something in a certain way. How can you look at it in a different way to change those feelings? And that is like, that's an inside job. That's recognizing it, knowing that you're about to go spin out of control and going, wait. You can look at things differently. And that's why that whole thing is, is like my journey has taken my darkest times and turn them into the brightest light. It's because of how I use that learning and teaching the tools through mentoring and being an example. Because, you know, to. The most positive thing in my life is to actually see something that matched the words. Because I lived in a world that I would hear all kinds of things, but I would see different actions. And so I would like, no, thank you. And that person can be involved in something that could be the thing that changed my life. But people can fuck things up. Oh, my first F bomb. I tried not to.
- [53:08]
Van Carraza
49 minutes in, it's pretty good then.
- [53:11]
Warwick Schiller
So yeah, dang it, I was trying my hardest not to.
- [53:16]
Van Carraza
So that's all right. You wouldn't be the first F bomb. On the podcast.
- [53:20]
Warwick Schiller
Well, I'm trying to be respectful of, you know, of your audience and, you know, who might, you know, judge because I'm using poor behavior, you know, so hopefully they have some understanding. Where were we? I just got distracted. Squirrel.
- [53:36]
Van Carraza
That's. That's all right. We might switch over to you, Amanda. Like, you need to hear your story, and I especially want to. I want to hear how. How you guys met and how did you guys meet? Let's start there, and we'll go backwards from there.
- [53:50]
Amanda Carraza
Right? Well, first of all, you can see why I married this stud. Good job, honey. You nailed it.
- [53:59]
Warwick Schiller
We just started.
- [54:00]
Amanda Carraza
I just started. So Vienna and I had met. We knew each other through mutual people. I was in a bit of a transition in life. I had been working for attorneys, and that really wasn't my kind of field that I wanted to be in. I was trying to chase down what was I going to be in life? What was I going to do in life? And I had landed on the fact that I wanted to be a helicopter pilot and I wanted to rescue people. And the feeling of being in a helicopter was unlike anything I'd ever experienced. And there was freedom, there was beauty. There was, like, just this overwhelming peace in there. So I was planning to go up to Oregon. I had a school lined up, and I get a phone call from Van saying, hey, would you like to help me with my surf school this summer? I need some help on the admin side. And I thought, oh, that's a great. A great gig. I can leave the law office, I can help him with his business, and then I'll jet up to Oregon. And that summer, obviously, the story changed. But that summer, I really. I helped him with his business, got to know him as a person, and I saw this thing he was doing with Operation Surf, and he had, you know, a couple people helping him, and he was telling me about it, and they needed a lot of help. And I was like, well, I've done a lot of jobs growing up. I can. I can help with this piece, and I can help with that piece. I had the. I had the skills to get things done. And this program, this first Operation Surf program was happening right before I was going to leave, and we put it on. We bought a group of warriors out from the hospital. And I had never met individuals with severe injuries. I had never met people, you know, warriors. I really wasn't exposed to that in my upbringing. And I got to meet some of these men and their stories, and I got to watch them go through this program and see the impact and, like, watch the change that was happening. And it moved me so much that by the end of it, I kind of came to a crossroad of, you know, I could leave and go up and become a pilot and do that. But I felt if I left, Van wouldn't have the support to continue the program. It was very. It was very in its infancy, and I felt like if I stayed, I could help. And that kind of put a little bit of purpose in my life, of maybe this is something that I can make a difference with. Maybe I'll just wait a little before I go become a pilot. So I stayed, and over, you know, the course of the next year, we ended up falling in love, and the rest is history. But that's kind of the story. He says, I spun a web and I caught him. But, you know, it was mutual.
- [57:05]
Warwick Schiller
Well. Well, because we spent. Amanda is the first woman I've been with that I wasn't. I wasn't always the best person. Okay, so she wasn't the first person. Like, I have a target on it. It's like, going, oh, yeah, she's hot. You know, and. But see, all right, if you do your facts, you know, she's a lot younger than I am, and I really wasn't thinking whatsoever at all to being with Amanda. It just. All these things did not line up. And so what happened was, is we spent enough time together for us to actually see who we are. Like, we never did that first date to, like, act like you thought you needed to act so they would want to be with you or stay, right?
- [58:00]
Van Carraza
Yes.
- [58:01]
Warwick Schiller
Never had that. And so we were going through, you know, I was passing gas, and I was dating other girls, and, like, I was just being a dude. You know what I mean? Because I was just like, you know, she's. Whatever, I'll take it over. And then one of my girlfriends was, like, not gonna hang out with me no more. And she goes, what about Amanda? And I'm like, what do you mean, what about Amanda? It's like. And I know girls see things that I wasn't able to, so I started looking at Amanda a little bit different. So it was a long progression.
- [58:35]
Amanda Carraza
Have a traditional dating. Dating life. It wasn't traditional, so. Which led to a lot of challenges that we had to walk through. I think in the early years of our relationships, we've been together for 15 years, but in that beginning time, you know, on the outward of, like, hey, I'm gonna quit my career path, and I'm gonna follow this Passion. And I'm going to help do this. And I'm gonna, you know, actually love this van that's a lot older than me. You know, I had a lot of people going, what are you doing? What? You know, crazy. We had zero money. We had basically the garage as an office.
- [59:20]
Warwick Schiller
I lived in the garage.
- [59:21]
Amanda Carraza
Lived in the garage. It was my best friend. It was all, you know, not kind of what you would think. This is a wonderful path to follow, but I do believe God put us together for a reason. And. And we decided. We may. We made a decision in that first year of.
- [59:41]
Warwick Schiller
On a handshake.
- [59:42]
Amanda Carraza
On a handshake. Are we gonna do it?
- [59:44]
Warwick Schiller
You tell the story.
- [59:45]
Amanda Carraza
He said, you know, are you gonna love me when I'm old? Because I'm older than you. And I said, as long as I'm the only one you love, let's do this.
- [59:55]
Warwick Schiller
And we shook hands.
- [59:57]
Amanda Carraza
We shook hands. And I made a deal. And we made a deal. And, you know, our life is based around. We live a life that is completely. I don't want to say unique. It's not unique, but we have. We do everything right. Our goals are aligned, our vision is aligned, our mission is aligned. Like, we live. Live it. We breathe it, Everything. And when you're able to do that with a partner, you know, you do this with Robin, I mean, it's like your lives are so side by side. And I think having that push together and being able to run a business with somebody that you love and you're in a marriage with, you can go into conflict in a different way and deeper because you love each other and you're not going anywhere. You know, if you get mad at each other, if you get into a dispute, like, you're only trying to get to the. To the better goal, you're not gonna worry about losing them.
- [60:57]
Warwick Schiller
I want to say something that's really healthy about our relationship is. Is like, she lets me do the things that I need to do in my own world to, you know, for me, and she gets to do what she gets to do. And that's how they met you. That's how she met you guys. She went on her horse. Thing is because I encourage these things. I encourage her to go have her own life and to, you know, to, you know, walk the path that's going to bring her joy. It doesn't. We don't have to be side by side. So I want to really make sure the distinctiveness in our. We're not, like, connected to the hip, right? We are side by side with our. Our individualities as a team. And so, you know, it's really funny is because that's why we're sitting here talking to you.
- [61:47]
Amanda Carraza
Yeah.
- [61:50]
Van Carraza
Yeah. So, Amanda, did. I was. The first time I met you was at the. The summit in San Antonio. Is that the first time we met?
- [61:56]
Amanda Carraza
I had actually been to one of your clinics in. Was it Gilroy? The Gate. Gilroy.
- [62:04]
Van Carraza
Oh, okay. Okay.
- [62:06]
Amanda Carraza
A long time ago. And I'd been there a long time ago, but pretty. But the first time I. We really, truly kind of met was at the summit in San Antonio.
- [62:14]
Van Carraza
At the summit. And so, yeah, so that was the first. You were at the. The first summit we had in San Antonio, which you didn't even know what was going to happen. And it was, you know, it's probably a bit like Operation Surf. Like, you start this thing, you don't know where it's going to take you. That first summit, you were there for the magical energy there. So I guess you'd been listening to the podcast before that. That's what brought you there. And here you are. You're now on the podcast. I bet you never thought that was going to happen.
- [62:43]
Amanda Carraza
Did not think. No, I. No, that's a journey. I found. I found you. Let's see. I had a horse. So I'll give you a little bit of my story, too, growing up. So I was ra. I was raised here, too, in the Central coast by a mother, struggled. Single mom, struggled with addiction, struggled with all those things. You know, growing up, she was a horsewoman. She was, you know, a sensitive soul that just encountered the traumas of the world and couldn't. Couldn't cope with it. And so drugs, addiction, all of that was. Was her story. And so my upbringing was really, had a lot of different chapters. Beautiful hardship, all of that. But I had horses and I had animals within my upbringing. And so I was a sensitive child, you know, and I would just spend my time out there with my animals. That was my place of peace. And as I got older, you know, horses fell out of my life. But when I got older, I got a horse again. And then I went on a journey. I think I Googled, you know, horse trainer. And I found you on YouTube. And I was like, there was something about you that was really, like, kind in your teaching. I don't know what it was. But anyway, I grew up here. I grew up here on the Central coast. A little bit of my kind of story around, you know, kind of my pivotal points in life. I, in high school, ended up dropping out of high school, and I didn't have the support I needed to kind of get through it. Felt like failure. Tried to take the ged, which is the, you know, an exit exam to try to get your, you know, out of high school. Failed. That felt like even more of a failure. Ended up, you know, I went on my own journey of exploration as a kid, and I ended up in front of a woman at this little continuation school that was for, like, the worst of the worst kids that couldn't manage anything. They're on probation, in and out of jail. And she sat me down at a table and she asked me about my life, and I was like, wow, like, someone actually is interested in me. And she said, after that, she said, I think it'd be perfect for my program. I want you. And I. I think I was 16 at the time, and I thought, this woman wants me. Like, this person actually wants me. And I ended up getting in her program. Her name is Sharon. She's my angel. She. She was so good to me, and she looked at me as a human, and she let me come when I could come. And I ended up graduating with a diploma early. She got me into College at 16. She got me into taking college courses and completely, like, changed the trajectory of life. And I think those little pivotal moments in all of our lives, you know, when I look back at where those forks in the road could have gone, you know, if I would have passed the ged, what would have happened? If I would have gone and become a pilot and not stayed, what would have happened? You know, and so these beautiful little forks in the road all throughout life are such a gift, if you look at the right pieces of it, that.
- [66:01]
Warwick Schiller
Yeah, we're perfect for each other because we.
- [66:05]
Van Carraza
We both.
- [66:06]
Warwick Schiller
I mean, it's just like Robin Williams, you know, he talks about, you know, hurt. You know, people with a lot of trauma and hurt spend most of their life trying to make people, you know, experience joy. I mean, that's a paraphrase of it, but, you know, the reality is. Is like our. Both of our lives have. Have the trauma, the struggle, the trauma, the. The pain, the sadness, you know, in our own ways and to where we seek. Part of our mission of God's work is. Is to bring people healing. And. And we don't do it through a degree. We do it through reality. And the reality of exposing our own journey and being willing to open up like that, you know, publicly, is one of the most powerful things I think we could do anyone to let them know that they're not alone is because. Yeah, go ahead.
- [66:58]
Van Carraza
I was, I was going to say that's the thing about vulnerability, isn't it? You, you, you tend to think, you know, you scared of being vulnerable because you think people are going to judge you. And when you actually are brave enough to be vulnerable, the only thing you hear is, oh, me too. I. I thought I was the only one that felt that way, but I never told anybody because I thought everybody else would think I'm stupid. And that's not the case because, you know, everybody. Yeah, everybody has that. So, you know, a lot of people, you know, I've been very open about my journey, and, you know, it comes out in the. In the horse stuff, and it comes out in the, you know, the horse training videos. And a lot of people say, you know, you're so brave being vulnerable. I'm like, I don't feel like it's that brave actually. You know, but, yeah, that's something I like about the podcast is people sharing their stories. And, you know, I'm sure you both your stories are going to resonate with someone who. And it might be that might be that spark to make them think, yes, I can do this or I can be vulnerable or I can succeed, or whatever it. Whatever it might be. Speaking of succeeding, Amanda, at that first summit, you succeeded through your first ice bath.
- [68:18]
Amanda Carraza
Yes, I'll tell that story. So. So I was so excited when you first came out with your podcast. I was like, this is amazing. I was already a big fan of you. Then the podcast summit came out. I was like, first in line, let's do it. And I remember going, there's a. Some backstory to the whole. To the summit as well. So I went and I had throughout the summit, and there's an. There's a cool feeling at the summit of, like, this love and this openness that's really, really similar to our programs. And I recognized it right away. I was like, I know that feeling. That is really, really cool that it's such a large group and you can feel that. And in our programs, it's like the same. That same cohesion of love and environment. So. But I had some moments where I was walking. We were in San Antonio and I was walking outside downtown, and I had some panic attacks with. I would see, like, some people high on drugs or, you know, just different individuals. And it brought back traumas for my upbringing. And I didn't realize that I kind of had those up, those feelings. And so it was a bit like I was talking to some friends one Night. And we were talking about, you know, we went down to a deep conversation about our fears. And I was like, you know, one of my worst fears is, like, getting captured and, like, tortured. That's just one of my worst fears. And that was what I was feeling when I was walking the streets. I just felt like I was going to die. And then the conversations around the ice bath started happening, and the first group had gone, and all of the conversation was about how you feel like you're being caught and you're going to die. And I was like, oh, great, I'm on the signup list for tomorrow, so I'm going to go and face my fear. So. And there is a deeper story of my upbringing, of my. My mom had a boyfriend at the time who had this idea that he did want to kill me. He wanted to go after me, do bad things and kill me. And I did run for a while, and so that was a very real fear. And then going to the ice bath, I remember we were at the location and I was like, having a panic attack. I was like, I'll just be in the back of the line. You all go first. I'll wa. I think it was. I saw Bridget and Charlie were there. There were some other people that kind of helped me through it. And then actually taking the ice bath was incredible. I remember just piercing my eyes into Robyn's eyes. Like, do not look away from me. Like, that was the one source of comfort. And she was, you know, incredible. It's obviously a God given gift. Robin has to walk people through that ice bath. And it was huge. It was very monumental for me of facing, you know, my fear and made it through that. And then now, today, as you know, I'm lucky enough to come up to your beautiful ranch. And Robin guides a lot of our spouses in our programs through ice baths and to, you know, give them that transformative experience that. That I got to go get. And I couldn't be more grateful.
- [71:38]
Van Carraza
Yeah, it was super. You know, it's super cool to see people go through that journey in the ice bath because, you know, like you said, a lot of times people get in it and there's all the fear about getting in there. And then when you get in there and that cold water hits you and it's. And you get that sensation of just got real, like, in it and, you know, people's faces. You know, I've often said that you would have to be doing something pretty terrible to somebody to have that same facial expression. It's not a. I'M a little bit concerned. Facial expression. It's like, I'm gonna die. Facial expression. And to watch that change into, like when the chemicals hit, that change into that bliss state and then that realization that, like, I've just done a really hard thing and then just almost. You almost get the, like, well, I just did something I was really scared of. What else in life can I do that I thought I was really scared of that, that I couldn't do? And it's. I'm glad you mentioned the, the, the spouses. So. Because I want to talk a bit more about Operation Surf now. We've kind of got your stories out of the way. And I think as far as I know, most of the times you're dealing with, with warriors who out of the service and have ptsd. But you do deal with some special operations that are still active and they come out to you guys and they bring their spouses with them and I imagine. And they're the ones that you've started bringing up here. And Robin have them through the ice baths and we also have. You have KJ do yoga with them and then Jamie do the sound bath, which is amazing. Tell us a bit more about, about that, like the different groups of people that you serve.
- [73:32]
Amanda Carraza
Yeah, we've got kind of four different categories. We call it, number one is recovery. That's the population that's a veteran who has been out for a while, has gone down a path in isolation, struggling, you know, really needs to be brought back to connection, purpose, community. The second is prevention. So focusing on military that are in transition, so they're going to be. Be getting out of the military or they're recently out of the military. And that's a huge transition going from military world to civilian world. And then we've got performance, which is the active duty, so that we focus on giving him that reprieve, that respite. That's where we have the spouse program, where we, you know, bring the whole family unit. And then we have preservation, which is our alumni. So people who go through a program. Our, our belief is we want to change their life, not just their week. We want them to have continued resources. Tool schools walk away with an ability to kind of have a pivotal, one of those forks in the road, a pivotal moment in their life to go forward. So those are kind of our four categories. Do you want to add to that, man?
- [74:46]
Warwick Schiller
Well, yeah, the, the spouse element is, is what. When we started working with active duty special operation forces, their, their job is very, it's very committed and it's, it takes them away and, and the families and the spouses are left to deal with everything. And it's really hard on the families. And you know, so there's a high rate of, of divorce and suicide actually not just with retired, but with active duty also. And so one of the things of it is, is like we give a chance for the spouse to do something with the warrior. And that could be. It's not just men and men as the warriors and the women as the spouses. We have women that are warriors, that are men are the spouses too. I just want to make that really clear. And what happens is, is like they get an opportunity to reconnect, they get an opportunity to fall in love again. We give them an opportunity to do something together alone, without their families or their kids. For sometimes we just had one go through first time in 17 years, first time in 11 years, first time in two years. And it gives them a reminder. And so what the element of the spouse, the formula, the theory is improve the, the warrior by improving the house will allow the warrior to be refreshed to do a better job when they go back to work. So it's kind of like this understanding of, you know, when our house is good, we're good out there and then when our house isn't good, we have to get aligned with each other and we take the time to align with each other before we go out and affect other, other people, you know, and, and so that part is they get to learn something together for the first time often, which is super powerful is because now they're doing something together instead of doing something separate. So there's all kinds of psychological and very proven evidence based data that a lot of these things that we do create so much stuff. And more and more that's coming out, can't wait to share you more in detail about, of, of all this stuff of what we do and how it, you know, it's actually proven to affect people. And you know, Amanda might be able to skim off and tell you a little bit of something, but with this element I want to go back to conversations. And sharing is the power of sharing. Once we start talking, it not only builds connection, but it actually releases a lot of weight behind it when you actually say it out loud. And so when we practice these things that actually we think that we can't do it, when you actually do it, it's exactly what you need to do. And so one of the most important things is, is when you're in an environment that Is I'm going to say safe or lack of judgment or it's not going to affect you in a negative way and someone leads it out first that you could relate to. We've helped people move through the seedling part. The, the, the planting a seed to watering that seed for it just to start. And that is success right there. Just to what to plant the seed and, and let the sapling start is saving marriages and it's, it's making our warriors better that are fighting for our country right now, whatever that may be in your definition. They're out there still doing it. And we've been able to introduce things which is why the spouse is so important in our, our soft community programs. And you know, and there's, there's all kinds of different things about what a spouse brings. It changes the environment of the, the, the group. It's just not a, a boys trip where. Because none of our programs have alcohol in it and you know, because we focus on wellness. Right. And so.
- [79:20]
Van Carraza
Right.
- [79:21]
Warwick Schiller
Most, most of the warrior deals it turns into, you know, they drink all night and then go to work the next morning. And so.
- [79:32]
Van Carraza
So it sounds like. Do you guys have. Apart from teaching these guys to surf to help with things, you. Sounds like you have counselors there as well.
- [79:40]
Warwick Schiller
No, don't.
- [79:41]
Amanda Carraza
So one of the, one of the, one of the things we've found is that we have counselors on speed dial. So we've got our support system that's ready. But.
- [79:55]
Van Carraza
Yep.
- [79:56]
Amanda Carraza
Our focus in our programs is to provide a space for them to breathe and to connect with each other and to practice the tools of opening up and having fun and really, really, really truly finding joy in play, like within play. You heal and you touch back into your inner self and then you just go down the rabbit hole of inner child. Yes, all of that. And I also feel that we've learned a lot over the years of who is a good fit for our program and who is out of scope of care. And if someone needs more support than we can offer, we'll get. Provide them resources and then help them get on a path to where when they're ready, our program will help them in that pivotal part of their life that comes from like a lot of different mistakes we've made through the years and trying to figure that out. But back to the kind of question of the counselor, we don't, you know, if you put a counselor in a room, it can change the dynamic and it can also in the military, if someone says something, it can go on their record. And so they're not willing to talk about that. So we're creating a space that is completely safe, completely open. If someone needs that, we can get them that. But it's really, truly just being a human and connecting and having fun and opening up. We do something called a paddle out. And that's probably the deepest therapeutic moment of our program. Our program is designed with, like, a whole curriculum, so we place this paddle out in a very specific part of the week to allow the right amount of healing. But surfing culture, a paddle out is where you honor somebody who has fallen and passed away. And so you go out in the ocean and you circle up and you share stories, you celebrate their life and.
- [81:57]
Warwick Schiller
The celebration of the pot, the. The positive memories, the. The life of something, not the loss of it, but it's more important to remember that, you know, the, the positive aspects of it.
- [82:10]
Amanda Carraza
And so, so yeah, we host, we. We hold a paddle out and we honor the fallen. And so it's an opportunity for them to really talk about the grief and open up. And I say talk about the grief, but like Vance said, it's in a positive way of sharing, sharing stories. So we do a lot of work within the program, but it's not designed around a counselor or a book or a clipboard. It's. It's purely through. These are the things that have helped our lives. These are the things we've seen work over the years and, and then bringing the right people in the right moment of their journey to really get. Get an effect from the program, which.
- [82:51]
Warwick Schiller
Also is relative to our staff. Like, I just don't. We. We just don't bring in anyone to it. We have, like, there's a, There's a gauntlet of van. You got to get through that. You know what I mean? Is, because there's, there's traits. And like, almost all, all of my, almost all of my surf instructors are people that have destroyed their life and changed it, that actually have the ability to teach surfing at a high level is because the, the environment of, you know, of what people are around is, is it can start or stop the movement that will help. And we want to make sure you do the things that are going to help and not hurt. And so as we, you know, you go through these, these, this process. And so I'll often say I dangle the carrot of surfing. And so you, as a horse man, and you're going to go do something, you're like, I've never surfed. I want to go surfing. You know, you go do this and all of a sudden you're like, meet me. Meeting a group of people on Zoom and you're telling a little bit about, you know, where what, a little bit about your background, why you're coming. And then you hear everyone else sharing this stuff and you're like, whoa, okay, cool. And then you, then you show up and you start going through these things and, and then, you know, you're, you're going to serve, but you're, you're going through all these different things that trigger all these different aspects of, of what we believe is wellness and, and putting people in vulnerable spots, that they continue to do it, but builds that courage. And they're doing something to never do, but they start doing it and they go, that wasn't that bad. You know what I mean? And throughout the week, all of a sudden your relationships are being built and what happens is the type of environment and the quality of the people that you're around for whatever reason, the purpose and the motive behind it really is helpful. So if we had a therapist, it would build the wall taller and thicker immediately. Like if I, if I said, oh, you need to go to therapy, you're going to go, no.
- [85:07]
Van Carraza
Well, see, the reason I asked about the counselors, because the experiences or the things that these people are going through, these guys are going through and the stories that are coming out sounds like they were, sounds like they were question, they would come from questions that counselors would ask. You guys are the counselors. You know, the experience is the counselor. That, that's what brings the vulnerability out. And I, I, I went to a thing a few years ago called a men's emotional resilience retreat, and it was a men's group thing. And I imagine what you guys do is some similar. But the first night there was a three or four day thing, but the first night we all gather around in this house and the guy that's running it says, okay, so what we're going to do, we're going to go in the room, introduce ourselves, and then you're going to share something that you're ashamed of, you've never told anybody in your entire life, and I'll go first. And he said something that was pretty horrible, which opened the door for us to spit stuff. And like, none of, and nobody in the room's a counselor, but it sounds like the same sort of things going on that, that, yeah, I wasn't, when I asked about the counselors, I was wondering if there was a counselor guiding all this transformation or just you guys with the environment there that's providing the transformation.
- [86:32]
Warwick Schiller
It's what I've learned in my own journey of what helped me in my brain, my stubbornness, my. You know what I mean? And so everything that we do is based on my journey. And I don't claim to be anything else but sharing what has helped me. And so I try to plant these, these elements inside our program to help motivate or help inspire the opportunity for things that have been, that have been very significant. And one of the most powerful things that I've been around is not only about nature, it's actually sharing words, talking that, that is the most, what I believe is the most life saving thing is because as soon as you do that, you build connection and then you're not alone. And when you're not alone and you build that trust, you actually might have someone to talk to. And if you're talking to somebody, most likely you're not pulling the trigger, you know, and, and so ultimately trust is one of the most important thing that you can create in any program and.
- [87:36]
Van Carraza
Right.
- [87:37]
Warwick Schiller
So we just have been given an opportunity, you know, God's provided us to be together, you know, and to be able to provide these things that it's, it's very humbling, you know, like, I can't believe, like, you know, who I am and where and what I do now, you know, it's just mind bending because you wouldn't believe how many people were judging me. Cut your hair and get a real job, go to school. Just like opinion after opinion, judgment after judgment. Not one person did what Sharon did to Amanda and said, what's going on? How are you? How can I help you?
- [88:19]
Van Carraza
Yep.
- [88:20]
Warwick Schiller
You know, I mean that right there can save someone's life, you know, so. And sometimes we need hard love, you know, sometimes we need softer love. But most, most of the time some of us need to be told like, you're, you're jacking your life up, dude.
- [88:39]
Van Carraza
Right? Oh yeah. So you guys, there was a, a Netflix documentary called Resurface that was done about, about Operation Surf. That was a few years ago now, wasn't it?
- [88:55]
Warwick Schiller
2017.
- [88:58]
Van Carraza
Okay, yeah. So it's still on Netflix. So if any. Anybody here watching, listening to this wants to watch that. It's the shortish documentary. It's only 25 minutes, 30 minutes long, something like that, but it's called Resurface. How'd that come about?
- [89:12]
Warwick Schiller
Well, there was a, a group of guys that wanted to do a documentary on surfing for veterans with ptsd. And so they started going around and they met a few people in their journey of, of filming for their documentary. And they met Wallace J. Nichols, which wrote the book Blue Mind. And these, these since passed, but he said, you need to go talk to fan. So they came and met with me and, and then as we started that, we just started, it just kind of snowballed into it. It's a documentary about surfing for veterans with post traumatic stress. And a lot of the story is about someone that went through our journey. So, you know, it's a documentary on surfing for veterans, but it's. A lot of it is on us. And there's the Jimmy Miller foundations in there, you know, so. So that's basically how it got going. And as it got going, it's. It started with relationships. And I basically told the producers and the filmmakers, I go, they will talk to you. If they trust you, I can help them trust you by them trusting me.
- [90:50]
Amanda Carraza
And so it took three years to make that film.
- [90:54]
Warwick Schiller
And so I basically just said, you know, if you want to do this stuff. I've been through so many things with film, like so many setting people up to be vulnerable and honest and then getting cut and hitting the floor. And I'm just right. I have put somebody in an uncomfortable place. So I've learned to tell people, if you're doing this with them, you're using it. You're not going to create this feeling of vulnerability and uncomfortable and, and trust and all this kind of stuff and do something that is going to hurt them. And so I became very protective over anyone filming any of our veterans or any of our, any of our people coming through. I've learned through a lot of harmful actions by media that when they come, I will basically tell them straight to their face, if you don't abide by this stuff, you can leave now.
- [91:54]
Van Carraza
Right?
- [91:55]
Warwick Schiller
And I told that to ESPN and they said, whoa, no one's ever told us that. I said, I don't care. I go, my priority are them not you do I want the story out there 100 but they're more important than this out there, you know? You know, right?
- [92:14]
Van Carraza
You're not going to let them use. Use them. Hey, so I just looked up Blue Mind, this book, Blue Mind the Surprising science that shows how being near in or underwater can make you happier, healthier, more connected and better at what you do. By Wallace J. Nichols. He's a marine biologist. How do you know him?
- [92:35]
Amanda Carraza
Yeah, we met Jay a long time ago. We had an article in Southwest, their In Flight magazine. In Flight magazine. It was like probably our Biggest first break. We, it was a small art. It was a, we thought it was going to be a small article. Ended up being like a 14 page thing.
- [92:55]
Warwick Schiller
It was the COVID story.
- [92:57]
Amanda Carraza
Yeah. That changed a big trajectory of our world. I remember half of our living room was our office at the time. We had so many people reaching out for help. We wrote on a whiteboard on our living room of like 27 different categories of people needing help with people flying across the states to knock on our door to like come meet us. But anyway, within that article they had interviewed Jay and so Jay reached out to us and we ended up having a phone conversation. And you know, his mission aligned with our mission and we became really good friends throughout the years. And he was writing this book at the time and, and his passion to change the world of, you know, our view of our ocean and what water does and is was undeniable. I mean his legacy is still going full force. He, Jay was, his story was. He wanted to know what is the science behind water and what does it do at our brain? And so he went to go find a book that explained all this. And as he went out, he couldn't find it. So he said, well, I'll just have to write it then.
- [94:10]
Warwick Schiller
No, he talked to one that was one of his mentor professor people and said, hey, I cannot find anything on the effect of the brain being in, around the water. Is there anything out there? He's all, well, if you can't find it, then go write it.
- [94:24]
Amanda Carraza
Go write it. So he did. Yes, so he did.
- [94:27]
Warwick Schiller
That's how it started. He was just like, well then go write it then.
- [94:29]
Amanda Carraza
You know, but that, that whole concept of blue mind also plays into everything we do. We, we have one of our spouses that went through our program. She's so smart and she's been right now digging into our entire program to look at like what are actually the, the evidence based techniques within nature that you're doing and you're using. She's like, you have no idea what you're doing. And all the different, you know, how you're expanding the window of tolerance and how you' you know, doing the isometric, isometric tremors and the mindfulness. And so she's been pulling all this, you know, science and data. But, but the core of it, you know, the ocean, something about being in and near water just completely is. Changes your brain, changes your chemistry.
- [95:21]
Van Carraza
Yeah. And other thing about the ocean too is. And I feel like this is where, like when I'm helping people with horses and the Ocean does this for people too, is that you are not only in nature, but you have to start like, you can't force nature. You can't make it happen. You can't, you can't paddle when there's no wave. You're going. Can only paddle at a certain point in time in a wave. And it's learning to. You can, you can't control nature. And that's the thing, like helping people with their horses is people usually have trouble with them because they're trying to control the horse and not control themselves and allow the horse to control themselves. But, and I remember I was at a horse expo a few years ago. I was talking to another horseman, famous dude. Anyway, sitting there talking and this lady comes up and she was chatting with, with him and they were talking about she used to surf and now she rides horses. But she said something about, yeah, because she said something about, yeah, I like horses because, you know, you can't have a relationship with the surfboard. And I said, but you realize that you're not having a relationship with the surfboard, you're having a relationship with the ocean. I said, the surfboard and the saddle are the same thing. You're not having a relationship with the saddle, you're having relationship. You're sitting on a saddle while we're having a relationship with the horse. And I said, you know, it's the, the surfboard's the same thing. It, you're on it to have the relationship with the ocean. But I really feel that, that, yeah, I think that's what, you know, my son's a surfer, I'm not a surfer, but I really feel that's what we're. Horses and surfing are very similar, whereas you, you have to get in touch with, with nature and understand you can't control it, you have to flow with it. You know what I mean?
- [97:15]
Warwick Schiller
So a lot of what I'm learning because now I'm a, an observer of the effects of the horse and thing is, is that I, I often say is energy plus energy equals flow. So in order for a surfer to, you know, do what they need to do, you need to flow with the energy that exists. So you have to adapt to the energy what exists there. And what I'm getting is, is like it's the same thing with the horses. You have to adapt to the energy of the horse and bring this, the, the proper energy in with, together to build this flowing connection. And it's pretty similar, if I'm not mistaken. And, and so that's why when I tell everyone, you know, it's like there's, there's energy out there and you have to match the energy with it. So you flow. And the people that do the best or the ones that can learn, educate and flow with the energy and they, they get a. A flow in the environment at different levels, you know, and so, you know, and a lot of that thing is blocked by fear, you know, and if you go into a horse with fear, I've learned that you're probably not going to connect with that horse that much, you know?
- [98:31]
Van Carraza
Yeah, no, it's, it's. I think it's just. Yeah, it's all about connecting with nature.
- [98:37]
Warwick Schiller
And, you know, you just looked at me like, am I wrong?
- [98:40]
Amanda Carraza
No, you're not wrong. That's very true, very true. Sorry.
- [98:43]
Van Carraza
Very.
- [98:43]
Warwick Schiller
I'm talking about. I'm a surfer, so I'm like. All of a sudden I was like, how did I say the wrong thing?
- [98:49]
Van Carraza
No, well, you know, the other thing, too. It's not just surfing. So you've met my son Tyler, when he lived in Hawaii, he had a sailboat, and I'd been out sailing with him. And it's this. It's kind of the same thing. And, you know, handling the tiller of that sailboat, you can kind of feel, you know, there's a. It's almost like you're holding the hand of the ocean. Like, you can feel the ocean through that tiller, through the rudder. And, and yeah, it's, it's, it's all. And you're going to be able to read the ocean. And. Yeah, it's. And the wind. And that's the wind in the boat.
- [99:27]
Warwick Schiller
Like, you are going with a rhythm in the boat. You may feel that, the energy in your hand, but that whole motion and, you know, there's. So, there's just. I don't know, it's. It exists for a reason. You know, people dedicate their lives to both ocean and horses for a reason, you know, And.
- [99:44]
Van Carraza
Yeah, no, I think they're, they're somewhat similar. So what's, what's next for Operation Surf? You guys got any plans? Are you developing? Because I know you can only service so many people. Have you got plans to expand and you got any. Anything new coming up?
- [100:02]
Warwick Schiller
Oh, boy, you're cracking. You're cracking an area of sensitivity here.
- [100:09]
Amanda Carraza
No, not. Is it so. Oh, this one's the dreamer. I'm the doer. So we've got passion and we've got reality, but I'll say, yeah, our goals are, are never ending. Our vision is never ending. We have big, big plans right now. We're based in Avila beach, so we're a small nonprofit. We got a team of six and we run week long programs, three month programs, online programs. We're kind of at our capacity, but the need is there. We can get up to 80 applications for one program that has eight spots. So we're at a place in our world of if we want to expand, we have to expand a lot. We have to bring our organization to the next level. We have to get more staff to run more programs, more equipment. And so that's put us on a journey of a goal to raise 1 million, a sustainable 1 million this year and then continue that forward to be able to grow our staff and grow more programs. Ultimately, Van and I have a very large vision to have property and be able to have cabins and run our programs nonstop here on the Central coast. Put our veterans to work, give them jobs, help anybody. But Van. Okay, Van says his turn, his turn. Give him the vision. Van.
- [101:34]
Warwick Schiller
I think the people who have experienced the most sadness are the ones that are always trying to make other people happy because they know firsthand what it's like to feel empty and depressed and they don't want anyone else to feel that way. That's what Robin Williams said.
- [101:50]
Van Carraza
So when you say, that's the wounded healer archetype right there.
- [101:54]
Warwick Schiller
So when you say, are there any plans? So we are now doing things. We've had to stop doing things in order to do other things. And when we stop doing things, there's a feeling like I'm not fulfilling something that's needed when I'm starting new things, it's exposing more need. So when you ask that question, that's why I went, whoa, here we go, you know, is because there is so much need for what we do. More and more is being exposed on how effective and how it helps. But I also feel we are compromising a need to do more, which is allowing us to expand in more areas. And so are there plans for more things? 100%, yes. And one of the things that I really want to say is we are capable of doing things and have been doing things in the past 15 years. But there is a need for support. You know, we understand what to do. We need the ability and the resources to do what's necessary. And that's why I thank you for giving this opportunity, because it's really about expanding the network and the message to share the journey. And part of the journey is creating a village aspect is as Every part of the person in the village is just as important as the other. And each one has a vital thing to do. And the outcomes and the life changing and the, the statements of all the things that we do are because every person in the village. And so to be a part of the village, you know, there's only so much we can do here and there's only so much we can do here. But there's a lot of need that people can do from a lot from afar which is, is, which is support or not even if you can support, tell somebody that can support it. I'm hoping that the authentic people that we are is, is being received. And I, you know, as far as why we're here doing this stuff, we're doing this for other people and that is what drives us is to be able to do whatever it takes to help someone in need. And so really I really encourage anyone out there just to tell our story, you know, do these things. You can reach out and get a hold of us, you know, however possible. And, and I don't want to make this a commercial for it, but it's, it's, this is what makes my heart hurt right here on that question. I mean it really makes me feel like I'm doing and not doing enough and because there's nothing like just the experience of the journey of the humans that we meet, you know. And, and I can, you know, you can never take away, you can change, help, change, but when someone is hurt, man, it hurts people, you know, and, and we've been trying to do the next indicated right move that puts us in a place so where we can help, you know, help the need but also continue to, to help people, not hurt people. And, and so our message is there's so much need out there and there's, and we can't do it alone.
- [105:45]
Van Carraza
And yeah, that's one of the reasons I asked that. So how do. Well, I'll tell you what, before we get to that next bit there, like I mentioned before, if you guys are interested at all, watch the Resurface movie because it really gives you an idea of what's the type of people that they're helping there and the changes that you're making in people's lives. And then you've got to realize, like you said, you feel like you're not doing enough, but you realize how many people go through life and do not get to hugely impact the life of another person. Like make a, like make someone's one person's life completely different and you Guys are doing it all the time. So try not to forget about the, you know, the amazing impact you are having not only on these, these warriors, but their families when they go home too. So I try not. I know you're aware of that, but I just want you to.
- [106:47]
Warwick Schiller
I appreciate, I appreciate that. And, but my, but my life is, is the path. My, my existence is exactly what's more on the horizon, you know what I mean? And, and Amanda knows, like I don't rest, you know what I mean? I'm always, I mean, my phone rings, you know, people call me at 10 o'clock at night and you know, sometimes later, you know, and you know, I'm walking people off thoughts of suicide. And you know, I mean, I deal and I'm gifted. I get to be a place for people and, and so I do have to stop and remember, like I am doing good, I am doing what I can do. But that doesn't stop the drive in me and my drive has become fueled by fire. Is because people need, people need help, you know, and, and we can do more, but we're limited on our resources that we have. And, and I know there's resources out there that are looking for something like what we both do, you know, and, and you know, it's, and that's my drive, you know, and my drive is, is like I'm not, I learned a long time ago I'm not asking for me, I'm asking for them. When I get driven like this, it's like, because I know people are out there suffering.
- [108:19]
Van Carraza
Yeah. So if people are interested in helping out, how do they, how do they fund operation surf?
- [108:25]
Amanda Carraza
Operationsurf.org that's our website. You can go on there, you can learn about our different programs, you can reach out, you can donate right there. Support, volunteer. Everything you need is on the website. Our social media, Instagram, Facebook. It's just Operation Surf that gives you some inside look at what we're doing. Like you said, Resurface gives you a great inside look, but that's, you know, the greatest way. If you're in San Luis, come to Aval Beach. Come see our little office down there.
- [108:57]
Warwick Schiller
I, I want to invite you to contact us and anything that we can do to help you experience the understanding of what we do, you know. You know, there's a lot we can do. We can meet on zoom, we can meet on phone calls, we can. I, I know what it takes to build a relationship and that's to just communicate. And, and if you have any interest, man, please reach out and ask any questions, man. We are an open book and, and if we're doing things wrong, you know what we're. We learn from our mistakes and we continue to move forward, but please reach.
- [109:31]
Van Carraza
Out teachable without feeling less than. I've just. I've got a new.
- [109:36]
Warwick Schiller
Well, that's why I know I've learned through all my mistakes. And when you learn from experiences and better that then what, why, why should I feel less than, you know, it's what I'm willing.
- [109:46]
Van Carraza
Yeah.
- [109:47]
Warwick Schiller
That's why I always ask everyone, yeah, we've done this, but what are you doing about it? What are you going to do right now? What are you going to do for tomorrow? Tell me what you're going to do. That's what matters.
- [109:58]
Van Carraza
Perfect.
- [109:58]
Warwick Schiller
Yeah.
- [109:59]
Van Carraza
So if anybody at home wants to help out, that's how you can contact these guys. There's something I wanted to bring up a bit earlier. Haven't had an opportunity to do it. There's a book you guys remind me of Robin and I, but there's a book I read a while ago and it was called adhd. A Hunter in a Farmer's World. And it basically divides the world up into two types of people, hunters and farmers. And hunters are, you know, they, they, they change focus all the time. You know, that's. Whereas farmers can like put the seed in the ground. And it talks about, in that book about a lot of times with couples, but it talks about businesses. Whereas the, the ADHD brain that, the, the hunter brain, they've got all the ideas and they can, they can get a business to a certain stage, but you need the farmer to be the steady, do the thing. And you and Rob, that's Robin and I, Robin's the farmer, I'm the hunter. So to think I've got that. I've not officially been diagnosed with adhd, but I've had enough therapists go, you know what? I'm pretty sure you got it going on there. Yeah. Interesting book. And you, you guys really remind me of both those two types in the book and Robin and I. Yeah, absolutely.
- [111:18]
Amanda Carraza
That's a hundred percent.
- [111:21]
Van Carraza
Yeah. And that's the thing. You can't do his job and he can't do your job. And that's, that's the same with Robin9. That's where the magic is, I think, you know?
- [111:27]
Warwick Schiller
Yeah, yeah, it's, it's good. That's one of the things I've learned in my journey is to stay where, stay in the lane that I thrive on and stay away from the areas that, that, that frustrate me, you know.
- [111:44]
Van Carraza
Well, the thing is you've, you've got talent and you've got skills that you need to, that other people don't have. And you need to use those where you need to use them and not worry about trying to do somebody else.
- [111:55]
Warwick Schiller
You know what's crazy back to when I, when we met is as I was at a crossroads myself is as I could either continue to do everything by myself and be happy for what I got, or if I want to do more, I have to allow somebody in, help me.
- [112:11]
Van Carraza
Yeah.
- [112:11]
Warwick Schiller
And I said I wanted more. And this was back, I don't know, 200, I don't know, eight. Was it eight or nine?
- [112:21]
Amanda Carraza
Yeah.
- [112:21]
Warwick Schiller
And I said I want to do more. And then eventually I hired somebody and because I wanted to do more and I still want to do more.
- [112:32]
Van Carraza
And here we are.
- [112:33]
Warwick Schiller
Here we are. I love it.
- [112:36]
Van Carraza
Perfect. Well, thank you guys so much for joining me. I've been wanting to get you guys on here for a while and yeah, I think you guys are doing amazing work in the world. Thank you so much for doing that. And yeah, like I said, thanks for joining me.
- [112:48]
Amanda Carraza
Thanks for having me.
- [112:48]
Warwick Schiller
It's an honor. And you know, thank, thank you for, you know, giving us the opportunity to tell our story. I hope we didn't disappoint.
- [112:56]
Van Carraza
No, you didn't disappoint at all. And you guys at home, thanks so much for listening and we'll catch you on the next episode of the Journey on Podcast.
- [113:04]
Warwick Schiller
Thanks for being a part of the Journey on podcast with Warwick Schiller.
- [113:08]
Van Carraza
Warwick has over 850 full length training.
- [113:11]
Warwick Schiller
Videos on his online video library@videos.warwickshiller.com Be sure to follow Warrick on YouTube, Facebook and Instagram to see his latest training.
- [113:21]
Van Carraza
Training, advice and insights.