How to Build a Successful Podcast: Morgan DeBaun on Community, Networking & Monetization - The Journey with Morgan DeBaun

The Journey with Morgan DeBaun: Episode Summary

Episode Title: How to Build a Successful Podcast: Morgan DeBaun on Community, Networking & Monetization
Release Date: October 29, 2024
Host: Morgan DeBaun | YAP Media

Introduction

In this solo episode of The Journey Podcast, Morgan DeBaun delves deep into the intricacies of building a successful podcast. Drawing from her own experience of growing her podcast to nearly one million downloads, Morgan shares invaluable insights on community building, networking, monetization strategies, and her future plans for the show.

Setting Realistic Expectations and Measuring Success

Morgan begins by addressing a common concern among aspiring podcasters: download numbers. She emphasizes that success shouldn't solely be defined by reaching a million downloads but by the consistent engagement and value provided to the audience.

“Maybe getting a hundred or two hundred downloads per episode is actually not a bad thing. You don't have to be a podcast that gets a million downloads per episode.” (05:15)

Using her own podcast as an example, Morgan explains how her average downloads per episode—ranging from 10,000 to 30,000—are a testament to her podcast's impact and reach.

Community Building Through Authentic Conversations

One of the cornerstone elements Morgan highlights is the importance of authentic, long-form storytelling. Unlike the often fleeting nature of social media interactions, a podcast fosters a deeper, more meaningful relationship with listeners.

“For podcast, the real, real benefit of a podcast is that you all are coming back week over week because we're having a genuine conversation and because I'm actually able to have real value in your lives.” (12:30)

Morgan points out that this consistent engagement helps build a loyal community, making listeners feel like a part of her life, whether they're tuning in during a walk, a car ride, or while unwinding at home.

Personal Growth and Clarity Through Podcasting

Podcasting has served as a personal journal for Morgan, allowing her to articulate and refine her personal philosophy. This process not only benefits her but also provides listeners with relatable and insightful content.

“Having this kind of confessional podcasting space has been really nice for me and I think for anybody who lives a fast-paced life like I do, it can be nice to have something that you do really consistently and just kind of ground you.” (25:45)

She shares how regular episode creation has been therapeutic, offering her a structured outlet to express her thoughts, emotions, and experiences.

Networking and Business Relationships

Morgan discusses how her podcast has been instrumental in expanding her professional network. By featuring various guests, she builds meaningful relationships that extend beyond corporate interactions, fostering a sense of community and mutual support.

“With the podcast, I can connect with people and get to know them better and they get to know me better and then also able to provide them the value of having this platform as the platforms continue to grow.” (35:20)

She emphasizes that treating business relationships as personal connections leads to more genuine and fruitful collaborations.

Monetization Strategies and Challenges

Transitioning to monetization, Morgan shares her journey of partnering with the YAP Podcast Network and the challenges she faced. She highlights the misalignment between impression-based advertising and the value she offers to her specific audience.

“Podcast ad reads is a lot of time. And also, they want things in kind. They want added value, so they want things like being posted on my social media, posted on, you know, all these different things included in the newsletter.” (52:10)

Morgan explains her decision to shift towards sponsorships that offer deeper integration with brands, aligning better with her podcast’s mission and audience.

Financial Considerations in Podcasting

Morgan openly discusses the financial aspects of running a podcast, particularly a video podcast. She outlines the costs involved, including equipment, production teams, and software subscriptions, totaling approximately $4,500 per month.

“It is very expensive to do a video podcast, but I do think it's a requirement in today's world to get the true value out of your time.” (60:25)

She stresses the importance of viewing these expenses as investments that enhance content quality and expand reach across multiple platforms.

Future Plans and Growth Strategies

Looking ahead, Morgan shares her ambitious plans for The Journey Podcast. With the release of her book "Rewrite Your Rules: The Journey to Success in Less Time with More Freedom," she anticipates a significant expansion of her podcast’s scope and frequency.

“Next year is going to be awesome because I got the book finally coming out. We're releasing the book in a few weeks and just starting to plan out, like, the book tour and everything.” (75:40)

Morgan envisions increasing the podcast’s frequency to two episodes per week, introducing book-related specials, and exploring the possibility of live shows to further engage her audience.

Adapting Content Across Platforms

Morgan highlights the strategic distribution of podcast content across various platforms—YouTube, TikTok, Instagram, and LinkedIn—to maximize reach and engagement. This multi-platform approach allows her to cater to diverse audience segments and create tailored content for each channel.

“The people who listen to my podcast are not the same people who follow me on Instagram and are not the same people who follow me on TikTok and are not the same people who follow me on LinkedIn.” (85:10)

She appreciates the distinct communities formed on each platform, enabling her to deliver more relevant and engaging content.

Conclusion and Final Thoughts

Morgan wraps up the episode by encouraging aspiring podcasters to invest in quality production and embrace the multi-faceted benefits of podcasting—from personal growth to business networking. She underscores the importance of consistency, authenticity, and strategic content distribution in building a successful podcast.

“Use really quick tools like Riverside Descript and continue to invest in a video podcast because it's gonna give you the biggest bang for your buck in terms of being able to use content and redistribute it all over the Internet.” (100:15)

Expressing gratitude to her listeners, Morgan invites feedback and interaction, reinforcing the communal spirit that underpins The Journey Podcast.

Notable Quotes:

On Defining Success:

“Maybe getting a hundred or two hundred downloads per episode is actually not a bad thing. You don't have to be a podcast that gets a million downloads per episode.” (05:15)
On Authentic Conversations:

“For podcast, the real, real benefit of a podcast is that you all are coming back week over week because we're having a genuine conversation and because I'm actually able to have real value in your lives.” (12:30)
On Personal Growth:

“Having this kind of confessional podcasting space has been really nice for me and I think for anybody who lives a fast-paced life like I do, it can be nice to have something that you do really consistently and just kind of ground you.” (25:45)
On Networking:

“With the podcast, I can connect with people and get to know them better and they get to know me better and then also able to provide them the value of having this platform as the platforms continue to grow.” (35:20)
On Monetization Challenges:

“Podcast ad reads is a lot of time. And also, they want things in kind. They want added value, so they want things like being posted on my social media, posted on, you know, all these different things included in the newsletter.” (52:10)
On Financial Investments:

“It is very expensive to do a video podcast, but I do think it's a requirement in today's world to get the true value out of your time.” (60:25)
On Future Plans:

“Next year is going to be awesome because I got the book finally coming out. We're releasing the book in a few weeks and just starting to plan out, like, the book tour and everything.” (75:40)
On Multi-Platform Content:

“The people who listen to my podcast are not the same people who follow me on Instagram and are not the same people who follow me on TikTok and are not the same people who follow me on LinkedIn.” (85:10)
On Content Redistribution:

“Use really quick tools like Riverside Descript and continue to invest in a video podcast because it's gonna give you the biggest bang for your buck in terms of being able to use content and redistribute it all over the Internet.” (100:15)

Final Thoughts

Morgan DeBaun’s episode serves as a comprehensive guide for current and aspiring podcasters, offering a blend of strategic advice, personal anecdotes, and practical tips. Her emphasis on authenticity, community engagement, and strategic monetization provides a roadmap for building a podcast that is not only successful in metrics but also meaningful in impact.

Listeners are encouraged to take inspiration from Morgan’s journey, apply her insights to their own endeavors, and continue striving towards creating valuable, engaging content that resonates with their unique audiences.

Transcript

A (0:00)

Hi friends, it's Morgan debann and I have some exciting news. My book, Rewrite youe Rules the Journey to Success in Less Time with More Freedom is now available for pre order. Pre orders are so important, not just for me as a first time author, but for the message of this book. Ordering this book helps amplify the message that more people can break free from the grind, rewrite their own rules in life, and live a rich, juicy life full of joy and empowerment. So if you resonate with any of the content that I put out over this last few years, this podcast, any of the stories I share on social, and you've been inspired by my work at Blavity or Afrotech, pre ordering is the best way to show your support and your gratitude for any of the work that I have done. Plus, you'll be the first to get your hands on the book when it launches next spring. And that will mean literally the world to me. So make sure you check out morgandebond.com to secure your copy and join me in this movement to create a life of freedom, abundance, and more importantly, to have the tools and the frameworks that you need to take control of your life. Hey everybody, welcome back to the Journey Podcast. I'm your host, Morgan Devine, and today we are doing a solo episode all about the business of podcasting. I've had my podcast now for over a year where we're about to hit a million in downloads and I wanted to share what I've learned along the way. Hey everyone, I'm Morgan DeBont, a passionate entrepreneur and life advisor. With the Journey Podcast, you'll discover that success isn't about the destination, it's about the journey. I'm sharing stories of amazing people who've taken control of their lives. Join me on my own journey to discover the secret sauce behind reaching success with permission from no one else. A podcast is a an incredible opportunity for anyone who's trying to get to the next level in their life or in their business. I think that people underestimate podcasts because there's so many conversational podcasts that do really, really well. And then there's most podcasts that get maybe a hundred downloads or 200 downloads per episode. And I think that it can sway people and get discouraged people when in the beginning they're not getting that many downloads. And I just want to have this conversation with you guys about what your expectations should be and how to measure success of your podcast. Because maybe getting a hundred or two hundred downloads per episode is actually Not a bad thing. You don't have to be a podcast that gets a million downloads per episode. Like I said, I've had mine for a year and over a year, we're about to hit a million downloads. That means, on average, I do an episode every week. Let's do the quick math, a million divided by 52 weeks. On average, my episodes are getting about 10 to 20,000 or really 10 to 30,000 downloads per episode, which for me is incredible. That doesn't include, you know, all the people who are watching the clips on social media. It doesn't include all the people who are watching it on YouTube and LinkedIn because we live stream on LinkedIn and stuff. So I'm reaching a lot of people every single week. And I just want to walk you all through how having the podcast has accelerated where I want to go in life and also helped me and my business. Number one, a podcast has allowed me to have more space for longer form storytelling and being able to share the context in my story in a way that feels more natural for me. One of my challenges with social media is that it's very much hot takes. And for anything to really do well in the algorithm or like get picked up so that it gets shown to people, you kind of have to be a bit of controversial. You have to be saying something that is counterintuitive. You have to lead with a hook. You have to do all this kind of cutesy stuff to be able to get in front of people. And that's fine. I'm a media person. I know how to play the game. But for podcast, the real, real benefit of a podcast is that you all are coming back week over week because we're having a genuine conversation and because I'm actually able to have real value in your lives. It's not a quick, funny, hot take. It is a relationship that I'm having with every single one of you who tunes in every week. Whether you're listening to this right now while you're on a walk, whether you're listening to this when you are in the car driving your kids to school, or you're literally listening to it or watching it on YouTube, on your big screen while you're unwinding for the day, like, I'm a part of your life, I'm integrated into your life. And I think that's just such a beautiful relationship for me to have with people. One of the things that I've been surprised by is how widespread my podcast has reached. When I first started the podcast, I felt like my Audience was pretty narrow. I was really reaching Black women, professionals and entrepreneurs, Black men who were entrepreneurs. And I love my base of my community, but I also felt like a lot of my messages and information could be more widespread and could be consumed by women of color, not just black women, or could be consumed by entrepreneurs, period. Not just black entrepreneurs. And so I really wanted my podcast to be a place where people had a chance to get to know me better. And kind of not just because I run Glavity, which is obviously a business that is supporting and founded for the benefit of black people and black culture, but also just my experience as a CEO and as a human being on this earth. So I think that it's been able to accomplish that in a lot of ways. And it's been really nice to just be, you know, out and about and just like, someone introduce themselves and say, oh, yeah, like, I listened to your podcast, or I think I heard you say this. And I'm like, oh, that's so nice. Like, I really appreciate those comments because it makes me feel like it's helping people. The second thing about a podcast that I have found to be helpful, selfishly for me, is that it's helped me get really clear about my personal philosophy on a lot of things. When. When you are every week talking about something, when you are every week needing to show up and have a conversation with an interview with someone that you haven't met or someone that you know but haven't had a deep public conversation with, or you're talking to yourself because you're doing a solo episode like I'm doing now. It adds kind of like a sense of, for me, like a personal journal. Like, I treat my podcast kind of like I'm walking through life and I'm sharing with you all what's happening in my world. And, you know, not everybody approaches their podcast that way, but for me, it's been kind of therapeutic because it allows me to share, share in the moment everything from, like, you know, I gave birth and I'm still recording an episode, like, three or four weeks later. You know, like, I was able to go through different milestones and to have this consistency and to have a place to be able to share my thoughts or how I'm feeling at what I'm working on and what I'm working through. And I think it's been really nice to have that. I'm not someone who journals every week or often. Like, I'll occasionally write down goals and journals and reflections, but having this kind of confessional podcasting Space has been really nice for me and I think for anybody who lives a fast paced life like I do, it can be nice to have something that you do really consistently and just kind of ground you and also allows you to have a bit of a historical archive of everything going on and how you've been approaching or absorbing or digesting the world. I think for some people who have podcasts that very few people listen to, that's probably one of the reasons that they do. It is just like an outlet, you know, But I've really enjoyed that more than I thought I would, particularly as an introvert where I'm like, I don't really want to talk to you, but I do want to talk to you. Actually, this is like my perfect version of talking to you all, which is being able to like get all of my thoughts out and then to be able to engage with people online and then in person when I see you at events or the airport or at a bar or whatever, like, we can have a conversation where there's a little bit more understanding, you know, between us, we're not as much of strangers when we first meet, and I think that there's something really nice about that. Okay. The third thing that has been really helpful for me with starting a podcast from a business perspective is it's given me an excuse to really be able to connect with people that I have in my network but haven't had a chance to provide value to. And one thing about reaching new levels in business is it's really about. I mean, everybody says this. Everyone says it's about who you know, but it's not just about who you know. It's about how people feel when they think of your name. It's about when I'm not in the room and someone says, oh yeah, like we're working with Blam. We're working with Morgan. Like, what feeling does that bring up? It's like, oh, that's great. Like, I think they're awesome. Or is it like, oh man, they kind of suck. Like, I haven't had a good experience with them or I haven't had a good experience with her. Having a podcast where I can connect with people and get to know them better and they get to know me better and then also able to provide them the value of having this platform as the platforms continue to grow has been really helpful because I think for some of my partners and clients, the podcast is another way of blackbody being able to contribute back to their career. And I say that meaning when you are in Business with people you're not only in business with, like, the company. Like, if we sign a deal with Nike or Sephora or McDonald's or GMC or whatever. Like, I'm not just in a relationship with the corporation. I'm in a relationship with the people behind the scenes who decided to say yes to us. I'm in a relationship with the people who have to talk to our employees every single day. I'm in a relationship with the individuals. And so when you approach business from a perspective of your in a relationship with the people, not the corporation, then you want to. You want those people to win. I want the person who said, hey, we're going to pick Blavity to do this brand deal over essence. I want them to feel like they're the smartest person in the room, and I need them to have the results. And part of that is understanding their own structure, motivation, how they're incentivized, who they report to is part, again, treating them like a human being. And one thing about the podcast is that it allows me to have conversations with people and to say, hey, well, why don't you go on the podcast and let's talk about it? Or, like, let's build this relationship further. And I would say, like, eight times out of 10, the conversation doesn't even happen because people's schedules are crazy. But being able to have something else to offer them that is just a benefit to them and really of very little benefit to me. It's just a conversation is also really nice. And I think that, you know, more and more, the bigger the podcast gets, the more platform and value it will provide to the people who come on the show. It's been so fun to see people pitch us and say, oh, this person must be a guest. I'm like, absolutely, this person can be a guest. I would love to have this conversation with them. And for the show to be a place where we can have a business conversation, but we're also having a live conversation, you know, like, there's not that many podcasts that are a combination of both. I think a lot of podcasts are either, like, super salacious, you know, celebrity gossip, trend, things like that, or it's like, business, business, business, how to start a business, how to grow a business, stock market. Like, it's just very businessy. So I like that this has been a combination of both. And there's not that many women of color that are, like, able to build this platform at scale. So I'm really proud of what we've been able to accomplish now that we've been able to kind of get to the scale of over a million downloads. The other thing that I think people need to consider when they are starting a podcast is the finances of it. It is very expensive to do a video podcast, but I do think it's a requirement in today's world to get the true value out of your time. And because you're setting up time to have a conversation with yourself or with others, having a video element is really important because it allows that content to have multiple lives. So every episode that we do is an episode. It's got four to five social cut downs that go up on YouTube, shorts, TikTok, Instagram. I live stream the episode on LinkedIn. And so I'm taking one piece of content and distributing it in multiple different ways, which is a huge, huge value. If it was just audio, it would be really hard, I think, to have that return on investment. Financially, it does cost more money because we have to have a video editor. We have a podcast producer. I'm my executive producer and even just like the tools. So I use my tech stack as Riverside. We use Libsyn and Descript often as well from like a video editing perspective if we need to. So it does cost money. I think I probably spend like $4,000 a month, something like that. Maybe $4,500 a month would include all the subscription fees. So yeah, it's not cheap. It's not cheap. And then I have all the equipment, like the mics and the things like that. So Yeah, I mean, $4,500 a month is real money. So I acknowledge that it does cost money. Obviously I'm trading money for time. There are people who edit their own podcast, who edit their own audio, who upload all the things themselves. I don't have time for that. So I pay for that service, shout out to my podcast producers. So there is that exchange. Now, in terms of monetization, there's a lot of different ways that you can monetize your podcast. You can sign up with the podcast network. You need to have enough scale or be a successful person, person outside of your podcast in order to warrant a podcast network caring about you. Many of you know I was signed up with the YAP podcast network. I love Hala, she's fantastic. I love everything she stands for. And I think she's done a great job building her podcast network. Our podcast wasn't one of her biggest podcasts on the network. And so ultimately we decided, I decided that we needed to go a different route because what was happening was we were getting all these brand deals, you know, hello Fresh, and all these really great brands. Quint like, things that I legitimately use, but it's very much impression based. So if our podcast show was doing 50 to 100,000 downloads per episode, maybe it would make more sense. But financially, you know, I was only making like maybe 2,000, $3,000 a month, maybe a little bit more. But doing podcast ad reads is a lot of time. And also, you know, they want things in kind. They want added value, so they want things like being posted on my social media, posted on, you know, all these different things included in the newsletter. And I'm like, look, baby, like, to post on my Instagram feed is literally like a minimum of $10,000. So the math is not mathing, you know, like what, right? Or like there was a time when they wanted me to do like video podcast reads and I'm like, for me to make a video is minimum $20,000. So the just, the math just didn't add up because I'm still building this audience on the podcast, whereas on my social channels my audience is already there. And it's a very specific audience that I have. You know, I'm not somebody who has a million followers, but I'm not someone who ever tried to have a million followers because I'm not doing all those things. I'm an executive and I'm CEO first. I'm a business person. I advise people, I give people information, and I love my life and I don't want to be a full time content creator. My audience that I've curated in the community that I represent is a very particular, you know, high net worth business, ambitious people who want to get to the next level. These are people who are trying to do things like use AI tools. These are people who are trying to grow their wealth and are interested in financial advice. These are people who are thinking about how do I use tools like Instacart or Doordash or all these different things so that I can save more time, so I can spend more time doing the things I love. You know, it's a very particular audience that I, I love. I love y'all. Right? So it's not the same thing as like a beauty influencer who's got girls who you know are gonna go buy some beauty and maybe she's got 500,000 followers, but you're spending 20, 30, 40 at Sephora. That's very different than an audience like mine where it's like, if you guys buy and Become a customer of Adobe. That's a thousand dollars plus average customer value. Right. So I think pricing in the podcast world versus non podcast world doesn't totally fit my personality and how I like to spend my time with podcast ad reads and didn't fully match the value of what I felt like is the type of listener that I have. So we're reevaluating it. We're probably going to take the podcast just in house and I get brand deals all the time and just add the podcast into the brand deal so that it can be a sponsorship. So it's not about the spots and dots of the impressions, but it's about the total audience that my brand reaches on any given time. And I think that's going to work out. So if you're a brand that's listening to this, if you're a business brand or a lifestyle brand that this makes sense for, please hit your girl up. Because we're looking for partners that want to do like a more deep integration with the show. And I think you guys will also enjoy that more because I can talk more consistently about why I partnered with these companies. So that's the route that we're going in the future. We'll see how it goes. You all will find out because you'll be listening and you'll see if I am able to pull this off or not. Yeah, I'm looking for sponsors as opposed to like advertisers. Very different perspective on the go to market. For people who are looking to have a podcast network and want to go that route, there's tons of podcast networks. The best way and the easiest way to find a podcast network is to literally just go on itunes and look through people's actual descriptions. A lot of times it'll be in the description of the show. A lot of times there might even be like a hyperlink that might say, like at one point mine said yap and it actually still might. But 10 this episode comes out yap media. So you can find podcast networks that way and do outreach and pitch yourself and see if they're interested in your show. The other thing that I think is important for people to know about podcasts, especially like video podcasts, is that it really does expand your total reach for whatever you're trying to push people to at the end of the day. So like, if you are starting a business and you've grown your business and let's say you are that beauty founder and you're like, okay, I want to reach more people starting a podcast for your company might be a better way to do that, because you're able to have this content and have something always on, and then that's going to help you grow as opposed to being like, okay, let's do an influencer campaign. Maybe take that 60k that you're going to do for an influencer campaign and put behind podcast production and see how it goes. See who you can invite onto the show and, like, see if you're able to reach more people or different people. Because the people who listen to my podcast are not the same people who follow me on Instagram and are not the same people who follow me on TikTok and are not the same people who follow me on LinkedIn. Like, I thought that there was a core group of people that were following me on all these channels, and that has not shown or proven to be the case. I have created a whole new community on my podcast, which is very different than the community that I have on LinkedIn, which is very different than the community that I have on TikTok. And I am just loving it because I'm able then to also tailor the things that I talk about in those particular places. So if you're on LinkedIn, I'm going to be talking more about, you know, Blavity, Inc. Like, I'm very much CEO executive on Blabity, Inc. If you're on TikTok, I'm very much like, I'm just a girl in the world. Like, I'm just Morgan Yvonne, the person here. I'm a mix of both. Instagram, I'm a mix of both. So I think that's been really interesting to see. Just like, the audience expansion and how that's evolved. Let's talk about the future of the Journey podcast. Next year is going to be a really big year for me. Every year is a big year for me. But I think next year is going to be awesome because I got the book finally coming out. You guys know I'm so excited about the book. We're releasing the COVID in a few weeks and just starting to plan out, like, the book tour and everything, hiring a PR firm, like, doing all the things, pumped about next year. I think the podcast is going to be critical for that. So I'm thinking about actually doing two episodes per week, one which will be a book special for a few months, where one episode is just, like, tied to the book theme, and then the other one's like my regular podcasting. And then I'm also thinking about maybe even doing a live show, depending on how it all works out logistically. So let me know if you'd be interested in me doing a live show and if so, what city you're in. And yeah, I'm really excited about that for next year. And I think long term, one of the things that I've been realizing is like to get to the next level, I actually really would love to be able to film more of my episodes in person with my guests. Obviously I do these solo episodes which from a data perspective, you guys listen to the solo episodes almost like 50% more than the ones with other people, I think because they're like shorter and to the point and you know you're going to get a lot of value out of them. But I still love doing the interviews because I think it just expands all of us and I think it pushes me even to like have these conversations and really learn somebody else's story and there's someone else's journey. So thanks for rocking with me when I do those interviews. But yeah, I think doing more interviews in person will also make them more engaging for you guys. And obviously the production costs go up like crazy when it's in person because I've got to have like five people from a camera crew perspective, you know, two cameras, lighting, sound, that's four people right there. And then typically some sort of DP director of photography. So that drives the cost up like crazy. That basically becomes a like at a minimum $10,000 shoot and not even including the cost of editing and the like back end post production. So yeah, the investment goes up like crazy. And I was thinking maybe I could do like one per month. So that's over 100k, you know, in video production costs that we would incur. I could potentially try to like batch a bunch of them on a certain day, like shoot in la, batch bunch, Shooting Atlanta, batch bunch. But a lot of times with these high value guests and these people who have incredibly busy schedules that are like amazing people, they're not going to necessarily like fit into a time slot. If I'm like, hey, I'm in LA in three weeks, can you come here? They'll be like, girl, I'm in Prague. True, true. I'm hoping that I'm still able to figure out the logistics behind having more in person shoots. We were also even thinking about moving. I'm now taking this podcast all the way to the left. This is not what's in my show notes. I'm so sorry, Kate, because she wrote a very good script for me. But we've been thinking about moving. We've been thinking about spending a year or like six months in New York or la, just so that Josh and I could have a little bit more time to just like be in the mix a little bit more. I think this has been an amazing season, a slower season for me and intentionally slower season where I've said, you know, hey, let me circle back on this next year when I get invitations and stuff. But I'm really excited to just meet more people, particularly with the book term going to be out and about so much. Anyways, so we're thinking about moving to New York or la. I don't know if we're going to do that because there's also just so much logistical effort to get those kind of things done. But yeah, this is why I should stay on script because now I've rambled. Anyways, back to the point. The point is, from the future of the podcast, I'm hopeful that I'm able to figure out how to get more in person interviews and figure out how to make that work in my schedule so that I can bring you guys higher quality videos. And I think that'll help take the show to the next level. And maybe we just do it occasionally, you know, and I did it occasionally this year, to be fair, I do Tabitha Brown, Chrisette Michelle Fawn Weaver. I mean, I've done some great in person interviews, but I'd like to do more. I think that's it, you guys. I think that's it. So yeah, hopefully this episode was helpful for you. If you're thinking about starting a podcast or you think about why you should continue with your podcast. If you're looking for motivation, if you're thinking about quitting, don't figure out what works for you. Use really quick tools like Riverside Descript and continue to invest in a video podcast because Matt's gonna give you the biggest bang for your buck in terms of being able to use content and redistribute it all over the Internet. And let me know what you wanna see next from the Journey podcast. Like, I love getting your guys feedback and your ideas. You can leave a review. I read all of the reviews. They're so nice. I love them so much and I appreciate every single one of you all who watches the show, who listens to the show, who shares the show. It's been just an amazing experience for me. So thank you for all of your kindness and all of your ideas and I appreciate you. Have a great day and I'll see you guys next week back on the Journey. Bye. Thanks for listening to the Journey podcast. If you enjoyed this episode, make sure you leave a review and head to our Instagram and YouTube to leave a comment. I look forward to hearing how this podcast has made an impact on your own Journey.