Bondi Testifies, Progressives Win, & Mattie J Schools The Heifers | The Joy Reid Show LIVE!

Summary

The Joy Reid Show – Bondi Testifies, Progressives Win, & Mattie J Schools The Heifers

Date: February 13, 2026
Host: Joy-Ann Reid
Notable Guests: Pamela Jo Bondi, Rep. Ro Khanna, Rep. Pramila Jayapal, Rep. Jerrold Nadler, Rep. Thomas Massie, Analilia Mejia, Ben Crump, Ms. Maddie J., Rep. Lamonica McIver, Rep. Delia Ramirez

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Episode Overview

This episode of The Joy Reid Show delivers scathing analysis and sharp commentary on the explosive congressional testimony of AG Pam Bondi, the escalating exposure of the Epstein files cover-up, progressive gains in politics, and a raucous, wisdom-filled live Q&A with the indomitable Ms. Maddie J about love, heiferology, and relationships. Joy-Ann Reid and her guests capture the anger, hope, and humor of the week, keeping it real for listeners hungry for independent journalism and community participation.

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Segments Breakdown

1. Congressional Firestorm: Pam Bondi on the Hot Seat

Timestamps & Key Moments

• [03:38–16:00]

  • Topic: House Judiciary Committee grills AG Pam Bondi regarding her politicization of the DOJ, mishandling of the Epstein files, and her unflinching devotion to Donald Trump.

  • Notable Exchanges:

    • Rep. Ro Khanna slams Bondi for transforming DOJ into "Trump's instrument of revenge."

      “Trump orders up prosecutions like pizza and you deliver every time he tells you… Nothing in American history comes close to this complete corruption of the justice function…” — Ro Khanna [03:38]

    • Rep. Pramila Jayapal tries to coax humanity from Bondi regarding DOJ’s treatment of Epstein survivors.

      “Will you turn to them now and apologize for what your Department of Justice has put them through?” — Pramila Jayapal [07:39]
      Bondi refuses to apologize, dodges and deflects.

    • Rep. Jerrold Nadler repeatedly asks:

      “How many of Epstein’s co-conspirators have you indicted?”
      Bondi filibusters and refuses direct answers, leading to pointed interruptions and overt hostility.

    • Republican Rep. Thomas Massie (not aligned with Trump in this exchange) presses Bondi about DOJ’s failure to redact victims’ names but not perpetrators’, naming Les Wexner among co-conspirators.
    • Rep. Ted Lieu exposes contradictions about Trump's relation to Epstein and reveals that there IS documentary evidence about Trump's possible criminal activity relating to Epstein.

      “There is ample evidence in the Epstein file…you said there’s no evidence of crime. I’m showing you…” — Ted Lieu [22:37]

  • Memorable Joy Commentary:

    “Pam Bondi acts like Donald Trump is either her husband or her child... she just crashed out anytime someone did other than [support Trump].” — Joy Reid [15:40]

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2. Progressives Score Wins—Interview with Analilia Mejia

Timestamps & Key Moments

• [27:31–42:52]
  • Topic: Bernie Sanders-aligned Analilia Mejia secures the Democratic primary for New Jersey’s 11th Congressional District.
  • Candidate’s Platform:
    • Tax fairness
    • Affordable housing
    • Medicare for All
    • Defending democracy and the 14th Amendment (“As the daughter of immigrants, I have citizenship because the 14th Amendment says that anyone born in this country has birthright citizenship...Donald Trump wants to take that away” — Analilia Mejia [34:31])
  • Dark Money & AIPAC:
    • Former Rep. Tom Malinowski’s concession statement decries AIPAC/UDP super PAC’s “dishonest ads” falsely calling him MAGA.
    • Mejia and Reid discuss AIPAC’s manipulative tactics:

      “What kind of nation actually has sovereignty if its elected officials have to pledge blind obedience to a massive entity?” — Analilia Mejia [37:24]

    • Joy calls out use of ads with Black women voiceovers targeting a district with a significant Black and brown population:

      “That’s the sneaky crap that AIPAC’s political pact does. It didn’t work.” — Joy Reid [31:45]

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3. Defending Journalism & Constitution: Don Lemon and the War for Rights

Timestamps & Key Moments

• [45:33–61:30]
  • Topic: The prosecution of journalist Don Lemon for covering a protest, DOJ’s suppression of constitutional rights, and attorney Ben Crump’s searing condemnation of ICE and law enforcement.
  • Guest: Civil Rights attorney Ben Crump.
    • Systemic constitutional abuses by ICE: 1st, 2nd, 4th, 5th, 6th, and 8th Amendments threatened.
    • ICE’s lethal neglect and denial of basic rights, especially medical care.
    • DOJ “protecting the powerful,” not victims.
  • Notable Quotes:

    “It’s just heartbreaking. With ICE and their racial profiling, you are guilty and you have to prove your innocence.” — Ben Crump [49:24] "Department of Justice will not try to respect the victim's rights...The fact that they seem to make their priority protecting the powerful..." — Ben Crump [55:36]

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4. Congressional Hearings: Brutality at DHS, ICE & Border Patrol

Timestamps & Key Moments

• [62:18–78:15]

  • Topic: ICE and Border Patrol come under fire in House hearings for brutality, child detentions, and misconduct.

  • Speaker Highlights:

    • Rep. Lamonica McIver:

      "How do you think Judgment Day will work for you with so much blood on your hands?" — Lamonica McIver [65:49]

    • Rep. Pramila Jayapal, Rep. Ro Khanna: Read heartbreaking letters from detained children, press DHS/ICE on hiring, discipline, and lethal actions.

    • Rep. Delia Ramirez:

      "I have just as much respect for you as I do for the last white men who put on masks to terrorize communities of color. I have no respect for the inheritors of the Klan hood and the slave patrol." — Delia Ramirez [72:26]

    • Rep. Dan Goldman:

      "If you don’t want to be called a fascist regime or secret police, then stop acting like one." — Dan Goldman [77:39]

  • Host’s Commentary:

    "Don’t feel that the people you’re voting for are doing nothing...when they are on these hearings, what we expect them to do is to give them hell..." — Joy Reid [78:15]

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5. Special Segment: Ms. Maddie J’s Love, Life, And Heiferology

Timestamps & Key Moments

• [81:12–108:05]
  • Topic: Ms. Maddie J. answers listener questions about love, relationships, and “heiferology” just in time for Valentine’s Day, with her trademark candor and wit.
  • Signature Madhouse Quotes:

    “Men can be heifers too.” — Ms. Maddie J [82:36]
    “A heifer is somebody who try to do things in a divisive way—they worldly, try to be slick, but they dumb in a lot of precepts.” [83:54]

    • Offers actionable (and hilarious) relationship advice, including dealing with disrespectful “heifers,” advice to women in their fifties, and the importance of not “giving away the milk for free.”

    “If you want to be celibate, you’re gonna have to have a good relationship with the Lord thy God. Ain’t nobody else that’s gonna be able to keep you but him.” [100:07] "See, I’m a reformed heifer...how you can tell? Because you don't play them heifer games no more." [88:46]

  • Fan Favorite: Ms. Maddie J. blends church wisdom, raw honesty, and comic storytelling into relationship gold—her segment leaves both the host and audience in stitches.
  • How NOT to handle a “heifer” in your marriage:

    "You just clock her. Fivefold ministry. 1, 2, 3, 4, 5. And fold them." [86:58]

    • On walking in on husband attracting attention:

      "Let me check my book, but that took me back right there...She had some coins in her hand ... Matt J made change with that heifer... Two dimes and a nickel." [105:43]

  • How to Find Her: Ms. Maddie J on Instagram and maddyj.net

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6. Black History Month & Audience Engagement

Timestamps & Key Moments

• [108:00–114:20]
  • Joy announces a forthcoming interactive Black History Month special (Feb. 20):
    • Featuring Michael Harriot, author of Black AF History, joined by Garrison Hayes and Ashley the Baroness.
    • Listeners are invited to email their black history questions to blackafhistory@thejoyr​​eidshow.com
    • Emphasis on Black History Month as American history, encouraging all listeners to participate and learn.

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Noteworthy Quotes & Moments

• “I don’t think I’ve ever seen a more soulless creature than Pamela Jo Bondi. To be honest, Pam Bondi’s absolutely soulless, gutless performance today was really wild.” — Joy Reid [10:48]
• “I wanted to play the whole thing because [Rep. Delia Ramirez] was powerful…let Me remind you, you will not always be in power. One day you will be held accountable for your role in this dark moment in America…” — Delia Ramirez [77:20]
• “The heifers don’t win. Heifers might just get the 1, 2, 3, 4, 5th. And that includes fascist heifers too.” — Joy Reid [114:00]

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Overall Tone & Style

Joy Reid’s tone is incisive, irreverent, and community-minded—leveraging both humor and righteous anger. The camaraderie with guests and the audience-submitted content reflect an inclusive, participatory approach. The show toggles seamlessly between policy analysis (“scary is caring”) and restorative, laughter-filled segments that model resilience and joy.

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Takeaways for Listeners

• DOJ and ICE under Bondi and Trump are under intense scrutiny for abuse of power, cover-ups, and affronts to civil rights—with Democrats making the most of their limited oversight tools.
• A new generation of progressive, independent candidates is pushing the Democratic party leftward and refusing to be bought by dark money interests.
• Civil rights and free press remain embattled but defended by activists, members of Congress, and truth-tellers like Ben Crump and Don Lemon.
• The audience is crucial to the movement—listener participation and support drive not just the podcast but political accountability and democratic renewal.
• Ms. Maddie J is required listening before Valentine’s Day—or any time you need a dose of wisdom, joy, and no-holds-barred truth.

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[For a full mashup of committee hearing highlights, visit The Joy Reid Show channel.]

Transcript

[Joy Reid]

Okay. Well, well, well. Happy Thursday junior everyone. Welcome to the Joy Reid Show. Big ups to everyone who is tuning in, wherever you're tuning in. YouTube, Substack, Facebook, our Twitchies on Twitch. We love you, Twitchies. Hey, Twitchies, throw your hands in the air and waving like you just don't care. Big up to everybody in the chat. The chats are already cooking to all the lemon heads. We know that there is a crossover. So if you are a lemon head, throw a lemon inside of the chats. Let us know that you're there. We appreciate each and every one of you. Big up, especially to our team TJRS members. Oh, our chat this month is going to be a lot of fun. We got to figure out, like, if we want to do a, a subject chat, a topic chat, we're still, we're still cooking on what it's going to be, but we've got a team TJRS insiders only chat coming up for Black History Month. And we've also got something else special coming up for Black History Month. I'll tell you about in a second. But of course, tonight, with three days to go before Valentine's Day, we finally have her here in our grass. The one and only Ms. Maddie J. Will be here tonight to answer your love questions. So thanks to everybody who sent your questions in. We did get many more questions than we can possibly answer tonight. So we, we picked from among the best and most representative ones. So stick around to see that. And as Jason just like semi teased for you, we're not going to actually. That was a mistake.

[Ms. Maddie J]

I didn't mean to do that.

[Joy Reid]

That's okay. It's okay. Because we've got something else special. We, we did one, you know, participant. We love to get, like, user participation. We love for viewers to participate. So we've got yet another viewer participation opportunity. This is going to be great. A super panel. Now you can put it up, Jason, for Black History Month, which is coming up on. It's going to be airing on February 20. Michael Harriot, who is the author of the serial New York Times bestseller Black AF History, he will be joining us. He's going to be at the top of the program to answer your unknown black history question. So if you've got questions, you're like, did they really do that? Did black people really invent that? Anything you have, any questions you have about black history, he's the guy to answer them. So Michael Harris will be here for the first hour. The second hour, we are adding to the panel two great young historian voices, Garrison Hayes and Megan the Baroness will be a part of that. We're really excited about it. Some of our other young historian friends that were not available traveling couldn't do it. We'll bring them in for other programs. I know we have a lot of other friends that we love that are out there doing history stuff. One correction is Ashley the barrister? But that's going to be really exciting. So the way that you get your questions in, if you have a question about black history, even if it's something like you're not sure if it's true, you've heard this about black history, you think it might be true, you want it verified. Just any question you have about black history, send them in to blackaf historyreadshow.com blackaf [e-mail] no question is a bad question. No question is a dumb question. Ask your questions and you're going to get answers from some of the top, smartest people in the entire universe. Okay, so let's get to some news on today. The House Judiciary Committee called Department of Injustice chief Attorney General and very enthusiastic Trump super defender Pam Bondi in this morning. And let's just say the hearing was super spicy. It started with Representative Jamie Raskin laying waste to Pamela Joe, Department of Justice.

[Congressman Ro Khanna]

Into Trump's instrument of revenge. Trump orders up prosecutions like pizza and you deliver every time he tells you to go after James Comey, Letitia James, Lisa Cook and Jerome Powell, the head of the Federal Reserve Board and members of Congress like Adam Schiff, Mark Kelly, Alyssa Slotkin, Chrissy Houlihan, Jason Crow, Chris d' Aluzio and Maggie Goodlander, to name a few. And you snap to it. You replace real prosecutors with counterfeit stooges who robotically do the president's bidding. Nothing in American history comes close to this complete corruption of the justice function and contamination of federal law enforcement. The good news is many serious lawyers at doj, including some of your own original employees, have refused your lawless Danielle Sassoon, your original pick for acting US Resigned rather than follow your corrupt order to quash an indictment against Mayor Eric Adams. The political favor from Donald Trump, a Federalist Society member who clerked for Justice Scalia. US Attorney Sassoon refused to participate in this blatantly corrupt scheme. Her top assistant, Hagen Scotten, an Iraqi war vet and two time Bronze Star recipient who clerked for Chief Justice Roberts and then Judge Kavanaugh promptly resigned too, writing to your office, quote, I expect you will eventually find someone who is enough of A fool or enough of a coward to file your motion. But it was never going to be me. You and the President nominated Eric Siebert, a 15 year career prosecutor, to be your U.S. attorney for the Eastern District of Virginia. But after five months of investigating Letitia James and James Comey, he found no evidence to justify criminal charges. So you forced him out. You replaced him with Lindsey Halligan, Trump's personal lawyer from the Mar A Lago documents case, who had zero prosecutorial experience and no qualifications. And then you were humiliated when a federal judge found that this corrupt appointment was blatantly unlawful and threw out Halligan's indictments entirely. And grand juries of American citizens have repeatedly rejected your vendettas and baseless indictments brought by the hacks left at doj. Now, with two different grand juries in Virginia voting down indictments against Letitia James in a single week, and just yesterday, another grand jury shut down your vendetta factory by rejecting indictments against the six members of Congress who had spoken out to remind all service members that they have a duty to refuse illegal orders. You tried to get a grand jury to indict six members of Congress who were veterans of our armed forces on charges of seditious conspiracy simply for exercising their First Amendment rights. I hope you will heed the wisdom and the constitutional patriotism of those grand jurors and not try it again by doubling down on that humiliation as your best lawyers are sacked for having participated in the January 6th case or just flee for the exits. Now, your new lawyers keep lying in court. In dozens of cases, they've been excoriated for lying to federal judges. Chief Judge Boasberg right here in D.C. suggested your department of justice perpetrated a fraud on the court. Other judges found your statements to be, quote, inexplicably misleading, patently incredible, totally inconsistent, and so disingenuous that the court is left with little confidence in that the government can be trusted to tell the truth about anything.

[Joy Reid]

Yeah. So there we go. It was an opening of, you know, pretty, pretty, pretty huge opening. And Jamie Raskin was just one of the people on the Democratic side who laid into Pamela Joe. After that, after Raskin was finished with her representative, Pramila Jaya Paul of the great state of Washington State, she tried to wring some humanity out of Trump's chief legal henchwoman, to no success.

[Congresswoman Pramila Jayapal]

To the survivors in the room, if you are willing, please stand. And if you are willing, please raise your hands if you have still not been able to meet with this Department of Justice. Please know for the record that every single survivor has raised their hand. Attorney General Bondi, you apologize to the survivors in your opening statement for what they went through at the hands of Jeffrey Epstein. Will you turn to them now and apologize for what your Department of Justice has put them through with the UN Absolutely unacceptable release of the Epstein files and their information.

[Pamela Jo Bondi]

Congresswoman, you set before Merrick Garland sat in this chair twice.

[Congresswoman Pramila Jayapal]

Attorney General Bond.

[Pamela Jo Bondi]

I'm going to finish my answer.

[Congresswoman Pramila Jayapal]

No, I'm going to reclaim my time. Because I asked you the Attorney General specific question.

[Joy Reid]

Attorney General that I would like to.

[Congresswoman Pramila Jayapal]

To answer, which is will you turn to the survivors? This is not about anybody that came before you. It is about you taking responsibility for your Department of Justice and the harm that it has done to the survivors who are standing right behind you and are waiting for you to turn to them and apologize for what your Department of Justice has done.

[Joy Reid]

Members get to ask the questions. The witness gets to answer in the way they want to answer the Attorney General.

[Congresswoman Pramila Jayapal]

That's not accurate, Mr. Chairman, because she.

[Pamela Jo Bondi]

Doesn'T like the answer. So, Mr. Chairman, why I have asked. She asked Merrick Garland this. I'm reclaiming my time. When I reclaim my time, I'm not going to get in the gutter for her theatrics.

[Joy Reid]

The time belongs to. The time belongs to the gentlelady. The gentlelady has 17 seconds.

[Congresswoman Pramila Jayapal]

Thank you. You're not going to answer this question, so let me just.

[Pamela Jo Bondi]

Chairman, I'll direct it to you.

[Congresswoman Pramila Jayapal]

What a massive.

[Pamela Jo Bondi]

No, I'm answering a question.

[Congressman Ro Khanna]

Will you restore her time?

[Pamela Jo Bondi]

The witnesses interrupted her with this woman. She's doing the action.

[Congresswoman Lamonica McIver]

Let me have my gentlelady.

[Joy Reid]

The gentlelady from Washington controls the time. The gentle lady has 17 seconds. You can. You can proceed with your final 17 seconds.

[Congresswoman Pramila Jayapal]

What a massive cover up this has been and continues to be.

[Joy Reid]

Donald Trump made the release of the.

[Congresswoman Pramila Jayapal]

Epstein files the center of his political campaign because he thought it would benefit him. Then you got into office. Attorney General claim to have a client list. Say that there was no list. Your deputy Todd Blanch met alone time of the gentle Max to a minimum security prison. And now you continue that you would turn around to the survivors who are standing right behind you. And on a human level, Chairman recognizes the challenge what you have done.

[Joy Reid]

Time is. Time is the gentle. You have no time to yield back. Appreciate that. We appreciate the thought. I don't think I've ever seen a more soulless creature than Pamela Jo Bondi. To be honest, Pam Bondi's Absolutely soulless, gutless performance today was really wild. She refused even as those survivors were standing. She never acknowledged them. By the way, when she walked into the hearing, she. She walked right past them and would not even look at them. That is who Pamela Bondi is. Refused to apologize and kept trying to invoke Merrick Garland. Oh, but it. Oh, but there's more. But wait, there's more. Jerry Nadler of New York tried to at least get her to answer some questions, get some answers. Here's Jerry Nadler giving it a shot.

[Ms. Maddie J]

How many of Epstein's co conspirators have you indicted?

[Joy Reid]

How many perpetrators are you even investigating?

[Pamela Jo Bondi]

First you showed it. I find.

[Joy Reid]

How many have you guided.

[Congresswoman Lamonica McIver]

Excuse me.

[Pamela Jo Bondi]

I'm going to answer the question.

[Ms. Maddie J]

Answer my question.

[Pamela Jo Bondi]

No, I'm going to answer the question the way I want to answer the question.

[Joy Reid]

You're going to ask the question the way I asked it, Chairman Jordan.

[Pamela Jo Bondi]

I'm not going to get in the gutter with these people. I'm going to answer the question.

[Joy Reid]

How many of you invited time again? The time belongs. Claiming my time. The time belongs.

[Pamela Jo Bondi]

I think it's very interesting.

[Joy Reid]

My time.

[Pamela Jo Bondi]

I think it's very interesting. Talks about they indicted the President, Said they indicted him twice.

[Congressman Ro Khanna]

Mr. Chairman, please stop the clock and. Stop the clock and restore his time.

[Congresswoman Pramila Jayapal]

Belongs.

[Ms. Maddie J]

Gentlemen from New York, we will give.

[Joy Reid]

You a few more seconds. We will do that.

[Ms. Maddie J]

But when you ask a question, the witness gets.

[Joy Reid]

You may not like the answer, but.

[Ms. Maddie J]

She gets to answer question was how many of Epstein.

[Pamela Jo Bondi]

They don't like the answer.

[Congressman Ro Khanna]

Chairman, my time.

[Pamela Jo Bondi]

It's honest. So he asked a four minute question.

[Congressman Ro Khanna]

Restore 45 seconds. Mr. N. Please. Mr. Chairman, you can let her filibuster all day long, but not on our watch. Not on our time. No way. And I told you about that Attorney.

[Ben Crump]

General before you started.

[Pamela Jo Bondi]

You don't tell me.

[Congressman Ro Khanna]

Oh, I did tell you because we saw what you did in the Senate lawyer.

[Pamela Jo Bondi]

Not even a lawyer.

[Joy Reid]

Committee will be in order. And that was her the whole hearing. Every time Democrats spoke and one Republican. I don't calling people her instead of Congresswoman. These people. I don't have to answer. I don't have to listen to these people. Yes, you do. These people are doing oversight over you heifer. We have the heiferologist on later, so let me just go ahead and start. We need to get the heiferologists to talk about Pam Bondi because that heifer was out here wilding. She was crashing out the entire hearing. Absolutely wild. But I want you to hear Part two of Pamela Joe's absolutely unhinged, batshit response once a sycophant on the Republican side ceded his time to her so that she could continue to go off at Jerry Nadler's question. Take a look at this. Time is yours.

[Pamela Jo Bondi]

Thank you. First, he brought up the president saying, they indicted me twice. They sure did. They tried to impeach him twice. And you, Mr. Nadler, were one of the leads on the impeachment. I was on the other side. I lived that with you. During impeachment, you said the president conspired, sought foreign interference in the 2016 election. Robert Mueller found no evidence, none of foreign interference in 2016. Have you apologized to President Trump? Have you apologized to President Trump? All of you who participated in those impeachment hearings against Donald Trump, you all should be apologizing. You sit here and you attack the president and I am not going to have it. I'm not going to put up with it. You know, all they want to do, all the American people need to know this. They are talking about Epstein today. This has been around since the Obama administration. This administration released over 3 million pages of documents. Over 3 million. And Donald Trump signed that law to release all of those documents. He is the most transparent president in the nation's history. And none of them, none of them ask Merrick Garland over the last four years, one word about Jeffrey Epstein. How ironic is that? You know why? Because Donald Trump. The Dow, the Dow right now is over. The dow is over $50,000. I don't know why you're laughing. You're a great stock trader. As I hear, Raskin. The dow is over 50,000 right now.

[Joy Reid]

The S and P. Meow. Move over, Melania. Cuckoo. Cuckoo. No one defends Donald Trump like Pam Bondi does. Pam Bondi acts like Donald Trump is either her husband or her child. She at one point said, he's the greatest president in America in history and you will not disparage him in that tone of voice. This lady got up there and crashed out anytime someone did other than. And the Republicans knew the game because the majority of them just got up there and asked her sycophant. That's why I didn't play any of them. They just asked sycophant suck up questions. That's correct, Congressman. She was super polite as long as you were kissing Trump's behind. And then as soon as you asked her a real question, she just crashed out. There was one Republican, though, who did show up to actually work, and that, of course, is Thomas Massie of Course. Who, along with Ro Khanna, is the one who pushed through the law that, yes, Donald Trump signed because he had no choice. It passed overwhelmingly. He signed a law he did not want to sign, which is the act that forces the release of the Epstein files. Thomas Massie and Ro Khanna are the people who push through that law, defying House leadership, going over the head of the speaker of the House to put that law on the floor. So let's just remember history, Pam. The President has been trying to prevent the release of the Epstein files, but he had no choice but to sign the law because they just would have overridden his veto. So he had to sign it. Right. So now here is Thomas Massie questioning Pam Bondi about the fact that Pam Bondi's Department of Injustice redacted the names of the perpetrators, but left in the names of many of the victims.

[Congressman Ro Khanna]

Behind me, I have three documents from the DOJ production that are emblematic of the massive failure of the DOJ to comply with the Epstein Files Transparency Act. To my right is an email that was sent by the victim's lawyers to the doj. It was a list of names not to redact or. Sorry, a list of names not to release. What did the DOJ do with this email? They released this email in the document production. Literally the worst thing you could do to the survivors, you did. And they're getting phone calls. A lot of these people didn't want to be known. And we know you touched the document because you redacted one name and you redacted the lawyer's name, but you left the survivor's name there. The next document I want to show you, that was in the title, the victim's survivors names. All right, the title of this one is Child Sex Trafficking Co Conspirators Fully redacted and by the way, going to unredact them here. Les Wexner is in this. Now, your assistant dep. Your deputy Attorney General said, oh, well, he appears hundreds of times in the files, but he doesn't appear in this file until I forced you to release it, where he's listed as a co conspirator, not to tax evasion, but to child sex trafficking, not to prostitution, not to money laundering, child sex trafficking. And then finally, what we have here, the third exhibit that I have, is emblematic of the FD302 release. These are the documents that we need that you're holding onto and over redacting because they have the names of the men who are implicated. How do we know? Because the survivors gave testimony to the FBI and it's in there. And what happens when you go to the portal at the DOJ to look at what's behind this redaction, another redaction so we can't even see them. And then there's some of these files you've pulled down from the website that we will never see because we can't search the redactions.

[Joy Reid]

So. And now let's hear Pam Bondi wigging out on Mr. Massey.

[Pamela Jo Bondi]

Ask Merrick Garland that the last four years. Did you talk about Epstein?

[Ms. Maddie J]

I am reclaiming my time.

[Congressman Ro Khanna]

I'm glad you're asking about Merrick Garland.

[Joy Reid]

This is bigger than Watergate when I don't answer questions.

[Congressman Ro Khanna]

This goes over four administrations. You don't have to go back to Biden. Let's go back to Obama. Let's go back to George Bush. This cover up spans decades and you are responsible for this portion of it.

[Joy Reid]

And that's where the I want to.

[Congressman Ro Khanna]

Know at what point, at what point did the FBI and the DOJ decide that Lex Wessner was not a co conspirator because our Epstein Files Transparency act requires you please put it back on the screen. To release the internal decision about whether to prosecute him or not. And it's not in the files. And it's not in the files for any of these other men. I'm of the gentleman has may she answer.

[Pamela Jo Bondi]

And he's a hypocrite because he voted against the ban that we were talking about on Deep Fake AI Porn. Only two people voted against it and you were one of them.

[Joy Reid]

Hypocrite. We don't know anything about that bill. But I'm going to guess that it was a performative bill that Pam Bondi supported just so that she could have something to say other than what the Dow is which has nothing to do with you ma', am, or your job. But. And after the hearing, Massie. Oh no, wait. Before we get to that, before we get to that, it was really Ted Lieu. I have to get to this. This is really Ted Lieu who really did catch Pammy dead to rights. Here's Ted Lieu.

[Congressman Ro Khanna]

I want to discuss another man, Donald Trump, who is all over the Epstein files like former friends. Here's the video. Like former Prince Andrew, Donald Trump attended various parties with Jeffrey Epstein. I want to know whether any underage girls at that party or at any party that Trump attended with Jeffrey Epstein.

[Pamela Jo Bondi]

This is so ridiculous. And that they are trying to deflect from all the great things Donald Trump has done. There is no Evidence that Donald Trump has committed a crime. Everyone knows that. This has been the most true transparent presidency.

[Congresswoman Lamonica McIver]

He's the one.

[Congressman Ro Khanna]

I'm reclaim my time. I got your answer. You said there's no evidence.

[Pamela Jo Bondi]

Legislation.

[Joy Reid]

This. This is time belongs to the gentleman from California.

[Congressman Ro Khanna]

Okay. I'm going to put up another document from a witness who called the FBI's National Threat Operation center because I believe you just lied under oath. There is ample evidence in the Epstein file.

[Pamela Jo Bondi]

Don't you ever accuse me of a crime.

[Congressman Ro Khanna]

I believe you just lied under oath. And this is on videotape. You said there's no evidence of crime. I'm showing you. Here is a witness statement who called into the FBI's threat operations center. He drove Donald Trump around in a limo. He overheard what Donald Trump said to Jeffrey on his cell phone. He was so angry. He was going to stop a limo and hurt Donald Trump. And he met a girl who said she was raped by Donald Trump and Jeffrey Epstein. She later had her head blown off. And officers at the scene said that could not have been suicide. No one. No one at the Department of Justice interviewed this witness. You need to interview this witness immediately. Epstein should rot in hell. So should the men who patronizes operation. And as we sit here today, There are over 1,000 sex trafficking victims and you have not held a single man accountable. Shame on you. If you had any decency, you would resign right after this hearing concludes.

[Ms. Maddie J]

Gentlemen.

[Joy Reid]

Has expired. Former prosecutor Ted Lieu. Boom. Jason, we're going to skip through because we're trying to get through that a little bit quicker. Can you please pull up a nine if you could? Because there's somebody else who might have lied under oath when he testified before Congress. And that would be Cash Patel, who said this back when he was testifying a few months ago himself. There is no credible information. None.

[Ms. Maddie J]

If there were, I would bring the.

[Joy Reid]

Case yesterday that he trafficked to other individuals. And the information we have, again, is limited.

[Ms. Maddie J]

So the answer is no. 1 for the information that we have in the files, in the case file. Okay.

[Joy Reid]

Okay. And now let's hear Rokana. This is a 10. This is ro Khanna saying maybe that's not true.

[Congressman Ro Khanna]

Speaker, yesterday Congressman Massie and I went to the Department of Justice to read the unredacted Epstein files. We spent about two hours there, and we learned that 70 to 80% of the files are still redacted. In fact, there were six wealthy, powerful men that the DOJ hid for no apparent reason. When Congressman Massie and I pointed this out to the Department of Justice. They acknowledged their mistake and now they have revealed the identity. Mr. Speaker, six powerful men. These men are Salvatore Navora Zorab Michalade Lupig Leonor Nicola Caputa, Sultan Ahmed Bin Sulayam, CEO of Dubai Ports World, and billionaire businessman Leslie Wexner, who was labeled as a co conspirator by the FBI. Now my question is why did it take Thomas Massie and my me going to the Justice Department to get these six men's identities to become public?

[Joy Reid]

We can leave.

[Congressman Ro Khanna]

And if we found six men that they were.

[Joy Reid]

He said, if we found six men, how many really are there? And we have a picture of them. This is the list. And just so you can see their faces, this is three of the ones that our great intern team were able to find. That's the Sultan who did a tech an email in the Epstein files saying he enjoyed a quote unquote torture video that Epstein shared with him. Les Wexner is the guy on the side there. He owned Victoria Secret and other brands. And so that's Les Wexner. There's so, you know, important for us to just see what these men look like. Let's just leave it there for now because the question that I think everyone should be asking is the question that Ro Khanna asked if they were able to find those six men who they claimed there were no co conspirators, but those people were listed as co conspirators. How many other co conspirators are there? How rich are they and how friendly are they with Donald Trump? Let's move on to our next topic here because there is some good news. Good news for Democrats. A Bernie Sanders backed. Well, I should say for progressives, let me say not necessarily. It's for progressives and Democrats. A Bernie Sanders backed progressive has won the primary to replace Mikey Sherrill in New Jersey's 11th congressional district, which would essentially, if she remains in that seat, move that seat to the left. And now that Cheryl is governor, there is a race and there it is. It hasn't been called by everyone. I think AP still might be holding out, but on a Lilia Mejia is going to be at least likely the interim congresswoman from this district. And here, if you do not know anything about Analila and a', Lelia, here is an ad.

[Analilia Mejia]

Analilia Mejia. And I am running for New Jersey's Congressional District 11. In this moment, it feels like we have to be bold if we are going to pull our country back from the precipice of hate. And the destruction of democracy, as well as build towards something better than the status quo has been. I had the privilege of serving as Bernie Sanders national political Director when he last ran for president, where I saw the possibility that our movement could actually build and transform politics as usual. I deeply believe in the transformative power of community, of organizing, and so I am running to be able to give voice to people who stay up at night worried about how they're going to meet the needs of their family. Myself, for example, my mother has dementia and if it wasn't for the fact that she had to become frankly destitute to become eligible for Medicaid, my sister and I wouldn't be able to work. It is tremendous to be able to count on the support of Senator Sanders, of a leader in our movement who frankly taught me so many lessons about how we connect with people and how we actually can build better policy. Our communities deserve a fighter that will really step up for them.

[Joy Reid]

Another piece of evidence that Bernie Sanders may have lost the primary to Hillary Clinton in 2016, but he definitely and eventually won the war for the soul of the Democratic base. Tom Malinowski, a former congressman from a different district who had been considered a favorite for the deep blue seat, issued a concession statement last night that was also posted on his ex Twitter account in which he praised Ms. Mejia for her campaign, but also added this the outcome of the race could not be understood without also taking into account the massive flood of dark money that Apex spent on dishonest ads during the last three weeks. I wish I could say today that this effort, which was meant to intimidate Democrats across the country, failed in New Jersey 11 but it did not. I met several voters in the final days of the campaign who had seen the ads and asked me sincerely, are you maga? Are you ice? And he concluded by saying, quote, my convictions, including my support for Israel as Democratic and as a Democratic and Jewish state, don't change because of who supports or opposes me. But our Democratic Party should have nothing to do with a pro Trump billionaire funded organization that demands absolute fealty to positions that are outside the mainstream of the American pro Israel community and then smears those who don't fall into line. Then he adds this if AIPAC backs a candidate openly or surreptitiously in the June New Jersey 11 congressional primary, I will oppose that candidate and urge my supporters to do so as well. The threat of unlimited dark money poses to our democracy is far more significant than the views of a single member of Congress on Middle East Policy, unquote. Now, what he's talking about are ads run by the American Israel Public Affairs Committee, which is a super PAC they have that runs political ads. They spent more than $2 million on ads against Malinowski, who is pro Israel because. Not because he's not pro Israel, but because he indicated that it might be possible to limit the funding the aid that's sent to Israel. Just saying that triggered an onslaught of this targeted attack ad barrage from something called United Democracy Project, udp, which is the same super PAC linked to AIPAC that went after Cori Bush and Jamal Bowman in New York. And to call these attack ads disingenuous is a serious understatement. I want you all to take a look at the Andy Malinowski, Adrill's House seat.

[Congresswoman Lamonica McIver]

Tom Malinowski says he'll stand up to Trump. But hold on. In 2019, Tom Malinowski voted with Trump.

[Joy Reid]

And the Republicans to fund ICE, more.

[Congresswoman Lamonica McIver]

Than 200 million for Trump's deportation force. 200 million that got us this. Democrats called Malinowski's vote a blank check for the Trump administration and a betrayal.

[Joy Reid]

We can't trust Tom Malinowski. You notice his response. You notice that they used a voiceover that sounds like a black woman and used this ICE and didn't talk about Israel at all. That's the sneaky crap that AIPAC's political pact does. It didn't work. Not only will they now get the pro Israel congressman that they could have had if he'd won, they also get a very critical of the Israeli genocide Congresswoman who, who will fill that seat until this term expires and then she'll then have to run again. But she goes in now as the favorite congresswoman. Elector joins me now. Congresswoman elect, Congratulations.

[Analilia Mejia]

Thank you. Thank you. I actually, I face off with a Republican opponent on April 16th and then I have to run again in June primary, although I'm seeing the Democratic Party in New Jersey really uphold and the the will of voters and then again in November.

[Joy Reid]

So you have to run three times for the seat?

[Analilia Mejia]

Yes, I have to. It's four races in under a year. I'll become either incredibly have incredible expertise on it or meet every single voter in, in New Jersey's 11th congressional district.

[Joy Reid]

You should ring Raphael Warnock who had to run, I think three or four times for his Senate seat and ask him how that, you know what the vibe is on that. Where is the Democratic Party? Where do they stand on you? We know with your fellow progressive, Mr. Mamdani, who won as New York mayor who is a progressive, a Bernie Sanders progressive. The Democratic Party was very hands off and disinterested in supporting him. What kind of support or not support. What is the vibe you're getting from the party in New Jersey?

[Analilia Mejia]

I'm, I'm honestly, I'm getting the exact opposite. I Today I met with the Democratic Party chairman in New Jersey who has been vocal in support of myself and has pledged to support me not only in this April special general, but also a June primary and into November because we're clear voters in New Jersey, it was a hard fought race. There were 11 candidates who ultimately were on that ballot. We, although, you know, it was a crowded field, we worked really hard to push to get the, to be able to connect with voters across the district. I would say that although I am very clearly a progressive, I believe and I focus on the word progress in the word progressive. I think that we need tax fairness in our government and in New Jersey's 11th district, but obviously across our.

[Joy Reid]

I.

[Analilia Mejia]

Think that we need to do more in terms of affordable housing, not only for first time home buyers, but for renters. I believe that we need to take control of our health care costs. I am a proponent of Medicare for all. I believe that we need to take out the profit driven model that is actually harming people. And I think that we are in the battle, in a battle to fight for our democracy. I am not. You know, to me it is very clear that what Donald Trump, MAGA and Republicans have accepted is the whittling down of our democracy, specifically whittling down the 14th Amendment. As the daughter of immigrants, I have citizenship because the 14th Amendment says that anyone born in this country has birthright citizenship. Donald Trump wants to take that away, sister. Yeah, I mean I should have due process and equal protection, but many of us, you know, I know that we don't. Right. Actually predating Donald Trump this, this particular iteration of his administration. But the bottom line is that we are in a moment of democratic backslide and the relationship between billionaires who have captured our economy and billionaires who are capturing our government. What the common interest, the common foe is an informed electorate is actual participation. And so I jumped in to increase turnout and we did. I jumped in to talk about what's happening, the overreach of this administration. And it is clear and I jumped in to be able to give voice to the concerns of voters across this district who want to have to end the chaos, hatred and violence. And they want to have the kind of economy and nation and Democracy that sees us all as human.

[Joy Reid]

You know, I would love for you to comment on the APAC of it because, you know, I presume they're going to spend money against you in both, as you said, this sort of immediate general election with the Republican opponent. It's a very blue seat, so you should be fine there. And then again when you have to run another primary. But they used the issue of ice, which is so personal to so many people of color, including people like you, because brown people are first on the menu, then black people. Right afterwards, Chicago showed us that we're.

[Analilia Mejia]

Going after black and brown community. Let's.

[Joy Reid]

Absolutely. But the fact that they would. Right, but the fact that they would use that issue when all they actually care about really AIPAC is whether or not people are completely obedient and supine to a foreign government, Israel. That's all they care about. And that is why they spent against Tom Malinowski. What do you make of that tactic?

[Analilia Mejia]

I mean, first of all, what a tremendous lesson that they actually taught voters in New Jersey's 11th congressional district. In New Jersey voters and across the country, see, they told on themselves. They let everyone know that it isn't about being in relationship or having conversation or being in community. It was about being blind obedience. Like you said it. What kind of nation actually has sovereignty if its elected officials have to pledge blind obedience to a massive entity? That is not right. What we representatives should be representing the interest of their constituents. That is why we're sent to Congress. I rejected from the beginning of my campaign. I spoke spoke out against APAC, against corporate lobbyists. I spoke out against corporate PACs because I believe between Citizens United and the unscrupulous tactics, it silences democracy, it silences people. And they showed that they were willing to do it to friend or foe. So I think Tom was incredibly, completely right. I think that the an APAC endorsement will signal to New Jersey voters and to voters across the country that in fact what you are getting is a representative that will not listen to you first, that will kowtow to you.

[Joy Reid]

It's interesting that people frame as an issue about sovereignty. But the AIPAC issue about sovereignty, right? I mean, if in fact an American elected official must obey and must always support unlimited funding to a foreign government, no matter what the foreign government is, that seems to me to be the opposite of being for sovereignty. And to try to manipulate black and brown people over an issue so painful as ICE strikes me as completely unethical. Do you believe that AIPAC should register as a foreign Government. And if in government you had the chance to legislate on that, do you think they should register as a foreign lobby?

[Analilia Mejia]

That, you know, that is an interesting question. Can I, can I add something here though? It is also to Jewish people, to Jewish voters, to this idea that, you know, the, the tactics and the, the manipulation that AIPAC is willing to engage in is very, very disturbing. I've been having conversations across the board in this district and folks were really disgusted and they feel very concerned, concerned about what, how it then turns into and feeds into the rising hate that we are seeing in our nation. It, it is a fact that in America today we do have rising anti Semitism in America today, we do have rising anti blackness In America today. People like you, like me, like my Jewish brothers and sisters are actually finding themselves, themselves in harm's way simply for walking in these bodies. And so when we, when APAC uses such terrible tactics, it, it not only undermines our democracy, but it undermines our community and it breaks us apart. I, I am in many ways I have to say I'm glad that they showed themselves for what they are. And I also add however that you know, they, they now want to spin and say that maybe they did it on purpose or maybe, you know, this was like 4D chess. But here's the bottom line. We had a special election on a sleepy Thursday in New Jersey. And my campaign was about connecting to people, speaking truth to power, speaking about the things that are keeping people up at night. We, we were very intentional about knocking on doors, talking to individuals, connecting with folks. I mean, just the number of times that I found myself at 6am at a train station starting voters was unbelievable sometimes. But that's why we were able to deliver victory. It is, and I would say it's not about left or right, it's about right and wrong in this moment. And I think, you know, although I, I am a progressive, I think this was a victory for democracy. This was a victory people having control of their own government. And I'm glad, you know, I'm glad to be able to get to run it again in April 16th.

[Joy Reid]

Absolutely. Yeah. I think the left, white right walls are coming down. It is becoming more about right and wrong. And I think you're starting to see people think that way. Anelili Amahia, Congratulations. Let everybody know one more time, when is the next election? What do people need to gear up for? And if people need, want to support you, what's the website they can go to?

[Analilia Mejia]

Well, you could check me out. You could learn a little bit more about [e-mail] Our next election is going to be on April 16th and we are, you know, our campaign is really, you know, my motto is unbought, unbossed for all of us. That's a shout out to the great, amazing Shirley Chisholm. And I am, I'm just excited and thrilled to be able to represent Democrats, but more importantly, working families, middle class families, working poor families in New Jersey's 11th congressional district.

[Joy Reid]

Well, I think a lot of people are very excited about you. The chats are loving you. So at least you got some support here in these, in these various chats that are listening right now. Best of luck, Analia. You're welcome to come back anytime.

[Analilia Mejia]

Thank you. Thank you. I'm a big fan of yours. So thank you.

[Joy Reid]

Thank you. Thank you so much. All right, thank you very much. And we're going to put the link in the description so that we can make sure that you guys can support this young lady as she continues to rise in politics. I, I suspect she is going to be a star. Let's support one of our sponsors here. We could not do independent media without our incredible sponsors. They step up and step forward to make sure that we and our small but mighty team can continue to bring you this independent journalism and independent media. And the Joy Reid show tonight is brought to you by our friends at Helix. So the question is, how are you navigating this chilly, chilly season? I know you're spending more time indoors, maybe spending more time cuddled up in bed, which can be very helpful. And staying comfy inside of your bed is really about the mattress in very many ways. And your Helix mattress will help to get you there. Now, I myself have had lots of sleep issues. I am an insomniac. I am a side sleeper. I've got the numb shoulder, all the things, all the things, all the things. And so getting the right mattress is critical. Helix does a sleep quiz where they match you with the perfect mattress based on your personal preferences and your sleep needs. It makes buying a mattress super easy. It is an award winning mattress. Helix is the most awarded mattress brand. It's been tested and reviewed by experts at Forbes and Wired and others. They give you free shipping, seamless delivery. They'll deliver your mattress right to your door and that is the easiest way to go. The Happy with Helix guarantee will also ensure that you're very happy with your purchase. You can rest easy with seamless returns and exchanges. And that Happy with Helix guarantee means it's a risk free customer first experience designed to ensure that you are completely satisfied with your comfy new Mattress. Try their 120 night sleep trial and their limited lifetime warranty. So sleep better and actually feel better about life in general. If you have a specific sleep issue, put that on that sleep quiz and that way you can figure out exactly the mattress for you. So here's what you can do. You can go to helixsleep.com joy for 27% off site wide. And this offer is exclusive to the TJRS audience. That is helixsleep.com joy for 27% off site wide. Just make sure that you enter our show name at checkout so that they know that we're the ones who sent you. We love when you do that as well. Helixleep.com joy thank y' all very much. Let me let you guys hear one more clip from this morning's hearings with Pamela, Joe Bondi. And it involves someone that we all know and love very much, a friend of this show.

[Ms. Maddie J]

But that doesn't give you a right.

[Joy Reid]

To go into the Capitol and disrupt Congress, something these guys talk about every, every day.

[Ms. Maddie J]

You can't do that. So when Don Lemon said that he was exercising his First Amendment free press rights, freedom of the press rights, that's.

[Joy Reid]

Not really accurate because he was trampling.

[Ms. Maddie J]

On other individuals rights. And is that, is that true?

[Pamela Jo Bondi]

Chairman we will always protect our churches and the freedom of religion. And yes, that's accurate.

[Ms. Maddie J]

First right mentioned under the First Amendment, freedom of religion, freedom to practice your.

[Joy Reid]

Faith the way you think the good.

[Ms. Maddie J]

Lord wants you to.

[Joy Reid]

Right?

[Pamela Jo Bondi]

That's right. Under the federal government.

[Joy Reid]

And isn't it true that Mr. Lemon met at a shopping center with.

[Ms. Maddie J]

The rioters who entered city's church in.

[Joy Reid]

In St Paul, met with them prior to marching to the church?

[Pamela Jo Bondi]

He did meet. And, and this is a pending case right now. So I will only stick to what is in the four corners of the unsealed indictment. If, if I could. Chairman. Yeah, I'm, there's a lot, a lot more that will come out. But under the four corners of the indictment. Yes, he did. They had an operation called Operation Operation Pull Up. They said they were gearing for a resistance. They met in a parking lot and they caravanned to a church on a Sunday morning when people were worshiping together.

[Joy Reid]

Mr. Mr. Lemon said that he live streamed before entering the church with the rioters. Didn't he say, we're going to head to the operation? Didn't he say this on he said this on camera. Is that right?

[Pamela Jo Bondi]

Yes, Chairman.

[Ms. Maddie J]

Yeah.

[Joy Reid]

And more that he was in Minnesota.

[Ms. Maddie J]

And that, as you said, they were.

[Joy Reid]

Gearing up for an operation.

[Ms. Maddie J]

So you, again, you can't do that. This is why this is, I think.

[Joy Reid]

So important that this guy be held accountable, and I think why you guys have charged him and indicted him. Moving to the second chairman of the committee, Jim Jordan performing for Trump. The two of them were both performing for an audience of one. And let me just, first of all, I wish somebody would depose Jim Jordan about that pedophile coach at his old university that was attacking children while he, as assistant coach, did absolutely nada. I'd love to get him deposed on that someday. And Pamela, Pamela Jo, let me just try to explain how journalism works, okay? If you are a journalist and you are going to cover a march, the first thing you've got to do in order to cover the rally, the march, whatever it is, you've got to find out where it is. And then when you find out where it is, you've got to go to where it is. And if the people who you're covering who are going to do a march are there, those are the people that you're going to follow into where it is that they're doing the protest. That is called journalism. If the protest was happening at a park and you found out that the protest was calling itself Operation Go to the park, the journalist is going to be like, oh, I found information that there's going to be an operation Go to the park. I'm going to go to the park and cover the protest. That's what Don Lemon did. That's called journalism. I mean, you're a lawyer. I'm assuming you can read Jim Jordan. I don't know. But anyway, just want to try to make sure I keep them informed as well. Joining me now is somebody who really understands the law, Attorney General of black America. They call him Ben Crump, whose first novel, Worse Than a Lie, hits bookstores on February 17th. We're going to talk all about the book. Before I do that, I'm going to take full advantage of the presence of my friend Ben. Ben, your thoughts on this idea that they're excited about maybe prosecuting Don Lemon for doing journalism? Oh, you're muted. There you go.

[Ben Crump]

First of all, Queen, let me say how excited I am to be on the Joy Reid Show.

[Joy Reid]

Thank you.

[Ben Crump]

I love you, I adore you, and I just exalt your brilliance.

[Joy Reid]

Thank you, sir. I appreciate you. Thank you. Right back at you, my friend. So let's talk about our mutual friend Don Lemon. What in the fresh hell?

[Ben Crump]

Well, you know, Don, it's ludicrous when I think of them arresting Don like this. And I know you and I talk when they arrested him, and then I talked to Don and his team, but this is so much bigger than even. Don. What ICE is doing is just outright assault on the most basic principles of our Constitution. Obviously, it's an assault on the First Amendment, Joy, our right to freedom of assembly, freedom of speech, freedom of press. But it doesn't stop there. They then go and assault our Second Amendment with the killing of Alex Peretti when they say he didn't have the right to bear arms. And then you go to the Fourth Amendment, the prohibition against unlawful searches and seizures. I mean, they are kicking in people doors without warrants. I mean, they're busting people car windows. I mean, it's just an affront to the Fourth Amendment. And then the Fifth Amendment. Joy Reid. The right to due process of the law. This American notion, this revered principle that you are innocent until proven guilty. But now with ICE and their racial profiling, you are guilty and you have to prove your innocence. And it's just heartbreaking. And then you go to the Sixth Amendment right to counsel, and the fact that you have people in ICE detentions, where you have good lawyers trying to go and offer advice and counsel to them, that is guaranteed by the Constitution of the United States. I only have to go to Gideon v. Wainwright, and the fact that this is what makes America America, but they're denying the lawyers from being able to go into the detention facilities. And then, Joy Reid. Worst of all, worst of all is the downright assault on the 8th amendment guarantee against cruel and unusual punishment. And the fact that you have people in these ICE detention centers that aren't getting their medications, their life saving medications, their insulin, their heart medicine, and they are literally dying in these ICE facilities. And the government seems to have no problem with it. This administration is saying that's just fine. And so it's terrible what they're doing to our brother Don Lemon, but it goes so much worse, so much deeper. And as a civil rights lawyer, you watch the constitutional rights and the elasticity being stretched. And you don't know after this administration, will it ever gain its former dimensions. So that is the war that is upon us, especially during Black History Month.

[Joy Reid]

Oh, here comes. Here comes the WI Fi. Gremlins are getting. Are getting it at Ben. Hopefully his WI Fi will come back. And hopefully you'll come back. He's a little bit frozen right now. We're going to hopefully take him backstage and see if we can get Ben's signal to working in. Because I definitely want to ask him, you know, he's somebody that has sued many a law enforcement agency for cruel and unusual punishment and excessive force. Let's see if he's back yet. Let's see if he's back. Let's try to see if we can bring him back. Ben, are you back?

[Ben Crump]

Am I back?

[Joy Reid]

Yep. I think it was just a little bit of a WI fi issue. Really quickly, before we move on to the book, I have two more quick questions. One, you have sued many a law enforcement agency that people didn't believe would ever have to pay for the brutality and for the brutalizing and murder of civilians, of unarmed civilians. You've now seen these two cases, and if you add Keith Porter and there are multiple other cases of people who've been shot, who've been brutalized, who didn't thank God, die but or. And many who did. Do you think that ultimately these agencies that are under Department of Homeland Security and maybe even some of the leadership will end up facing civil penalties for what they've done and some of the ICE agents, too?

[Ben Crump]

You know, I absolutely believe if the principles of equal justice under the law applies, that they will be held accountable. The fact that you have Alex Peretti and the video is so clear that.

[Joy Reid]

Hold on, hold on, Ben. I think, you know what? Hotel WI fi is the worst. I believe that Ben is at a hotel, and hotel WI fi is literally the absolute worst thing in the world. And so I'm really hoping that we can get him to come back. I guess, producers, if you guys can maybe have him do a speed test. If you just go on speedtest.net and have him test to see if maybe his wifi is a little bit strong enough to get on, because we definitely want to continue talking to him. But, yeah, Jason, it's one of those things where hotel WI fi, man, it's tough. And unless you can have, like, a signal where you can plug directly into. Okay, we're getting one more chance. We're gonna get one more chance. Okay, let's go. We really want to talk about this book. All right, let's try it again. What do you got? Let's. Do you think these guys will be held accountable?

[Ben Crump]

I think definitely in Alex Paretti's case, and I believe in Ms. Good Case, they should be held accountable, but they're going to try to argue quite qualified immunity in her case. As you know, Joy and I, you and I have dealt with on every case. Breonna Taylor, Tyree Nichols, all of them. They say they were in fear of their life. But I don't think it holds up because the video tells us with our own eyes what really happened. She was turning the car away from them.

[Joy Reid]

And very quickly, before we get to the book, Pam Bondi today, I don't know if you watched that hearing today, but the prospect that she wouldn't even look at the victims, Jason, has this really sort of chilling still at C3, it's. She wouldn't even look at them. What do you make of her?

[Ben Crump]

But, you know, it's very disturbing that the Department of Justice will not try to respect the victim's rights. That's the whole reason they are supposed to be in place, is to fight for the victims, the people who are marginalized. And the fact that they seem to make their priority protecting the powerful. I mean, I'm heartbroken as a civil rights lawyer that on their website they say their primary objective is to protect the civil rights of white men to make sure that they are not discriminated against in America.

[Ms. Maddie J]

I mean, it's like that's their new mission.

[Joy Reid]

That is their new mission, protect white men from competition. Let's talk about this book. The book is called Worse than a Lie. It is a novel. You are delved delving into the world of fiction. Tell us, who are these characters and is one of these characters you.

[Ben Crump]

Well, fictional novel, a lot of similarities, George. Just like many of my heroes. Perry Mason, John Grisham's the Rainmaker, Michael Connelly, the Lincoln Lawyer. There are great legal thrillers, but none of them reflect that, you know, a culture and a community that associated with me and many of these young social justice warriors. So what I endeavored to do with Worse Than a Lie was to create a new superhero trial lawyer, one that is thrust into relevant times. We were talking about Alex Peretti in this book on 2008, the night of President Obama's election, Hollis Montrose, a black police officer shot 10 times by four white police officers. And you have immediately this allegory that was intentional, that you have the history, the historic moment of the first black president and the hope. And then you saw people saying, are we going to be in a post racial America? And so I wanted to draw a very clear view that there was going to be a need for civil rights and we were going to see pushback. And it plays out in this legal thriller that's wrapped up in black culture. So it's been receiving good reviews. I can't wait to hear what you think because I value your opinion. But I'm trying to, I'm really trying to inspire the next generation of civil rights lawyers.

[Joy Reid]

And the thing is that, you know, lawyers inspire lawyers, right? I mean, you know, I just did a Medgar Evers book and he was inspired by Thurgood Marshall. Like that was his inspiration. And he wanted to be a lawyer and that's who he wanted to be. And so many young lawyers want to be you. They want to be Ben Crump. I love the fact that you're creating characters that sort of actualize and sort of even, even as a fictional character and give people heroes to look up to. I think that is very cool. Where did you get the idea other than your life?

[Ben Crump]

Well, you know, Thurgood Marshall, he was mega hero. My hero. Thurgood once said, Joy Reed, that most people will never know what really happens inside of a courtroom. So he said that he would write his briefs and his legal memos to be very engaging so they could try to understand, well, what's more engaging than a legal thriller. And you know, so I said, I'm gonna write a civil rights legal thriller because now more than ever we need civil rights heroes in America to keep us fighting on the front line for all humanity. And I think about the Bad Bunny concert, Joy and I just thought about that's the kind of inspiration we need for those people who still believe that we can give our children a better America, a better world where everybody can live out the American promise of life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness. That's what Boli Cooper fights for. And it's his ragtag social justice warrior team that I think people are going to come to love these characters as we go through this series.

[Joy Reid]

I'm really excited about this book, Ben. I want my copy signed though. I'm going to need to get a signed copy. And we will come back and once I've read it, we'll have you come back on. We'll do like a on. We'll do a book review live on the show. People in the chats are loving it. We are going to put this book in the store. You know how we do. We are a book selling show. Worse than a Lie will be available in the store. And remember, everything this month is 20, 25% off. You just have to put B. What is it? BHM Black History Month 100. BHM 100. It's the 100th anniversary of Black History Month. 25% off. But go ahead and order, pre order this book. It comes out on the 17th, but you get your pre orders in just like y' all did with Tiffany Crump. Tiffany. Tiffany Crump. Tiffany Cross's book. You can make sure that it lands on the New York Times bestseller list. Ben, we have already helped. We have Don Lemon and we, we helped an independent media help put Clay Kane's book on the New York Times bestseller list for fiction, for hardcover fiction. And we are going to claim already that we are going to do the same for you. We're super excited about it. And please come back and talk about the book and anything else you want to. Anytime.

[Ben Crump]

Thank you, Joy. Enjoy. Can I just say this?

[Joy Reid]

Yes.

[Ben Crump]

Thank you for always being brilliant and bold. Now we need that more than ever. And you have always been that. And I mean, God knows we need your voice more than ever now, Joy Reid. So thank you, Queen.

[Joy Reid]

Thank you so much, my dear friend. I appreciate you. Ben Crump, everybody. Thank you very much. Jason, can you get a round of applause? Applause. Because he's a brother. He's a good brother. But the Attorney General of black America, we played the bad attorney general with the good Attorney General. We appreciate you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you.

[Ben Crump]

Thank you.

[Joy Reid]

Soon. All right. That's the good Attorney general, the Attorney General of black America. We should just make him the Attorney General of America, period. Because wouldn't we be better off with Ben Crump rather than family Joe Bondi? Let's play one more clip that I really wanted you all to see. This is not from today's hearing. This is actually from here, yesterday's hearing. And this is Lamonica McIver who we've seen on this show. She is a semi regular, one of our elected official guests. And yesterday there was a set of hearings that was around ICE and the, the Border Patrol and uscis, which are the three agencies under the Department of Homeland Security that deal with immigration. Lamonica McIver of the Great state of New Jersey, when she had her time on the mic, everybody got five minutes. Oh, she used hers.

[Congresswoman Lamonica McIver]

Here's Lamonica McIver, senior official, lead in ICE enforcement. Much of today's scrutiny falls on you, and it should. You have seen repeatedly. We have seen repeatedly that Republicans, Trump administration, its dhs, and your agency will do absolutely anything to avoid answering for your actions. When I showed up to inspect Delaney Hall, a private prison that you contract with, ICE tried not to give us an oversight tour. Then, instead of taking accountability for ICE's attempts to keep us from seeing this facility's conditions, to know if people's basic rights were being upheld. This administration is doing all they can to try to put me in prison for 17 years. When I shot and killed Renee Good, Christy Noem called her a domestic terrorists. When Alex Preddy. You all tried to tell us he was threatening officers with a gun, but all we saw was a phone. This administration's clear lies fell apart. Not because someone had a come to Jesus moment, but because we saw these murders from every angle. You are only here because public outrage has become so unavoidable. You are here, Mr. Lyons, because white people are being are getting shot in the face and chest when the cameras are rolling. Because now my Republican colleagues care about optics. But when Keith Porter Jr. A black American citizen, a son, a father, and a man loved by many, was killed by an off duty ICE agent on New Year's Eve, there were no hearings. So this is for him. Today in my district, John Wilson Brutus, a Haitian immigrant, a beloved family man, died within 24 hours of being in ICE custody. He is just one of more than 30 people who have died in ICE custody last year. This is for all of them. Every human being. Your rogue, out of control agency has hurt, hunted down, imprisoned, killed, and continue to hold hostage even after they have agreed to be deported. We know this administration doesn't care about protecting people or sparing lives. We all see so plainly what you are doing. What you have been doing to black and brown folks, immigrants, people silenced in the shadows now in broad daylight, to people peacefully rejecting your cruel agenda in the streets, which is their right to do. This is the despicable but predictable result of an agency that laughs at oversight, receives billions to deploy lethal force on our neighborhoods, and seems to believe that they are above the law and should be without accountability. This administration believes it can act first, explain later, or hell, never, never explain at all as we see here today. You all seem to think you are the highest power who decides which people deserve dignity, protection, due process and due process. But you are wrong. We are here for answers. We are here for accountability. And we are here because people are dying. Let me repeat that. People are dying and you don't seem to care. So, Mr. Lyons, I've heard my colleagues ask many questions over and over again, and you cannot answer them. So let me ask you some questions that you may be able to answer. Mr. Lyons, do you consider yourself a religious man?

[Joy Reid]

Yes, ma'. Am.

[Congresswoman Lamonica McIver]

Oh, yes. Okay. Well, how do you think Judgment Day will work for you with so much blood on your hands?

[Congressman Ro Khanna]

I'm not going to entertain that question.

[Congresswoman Lamonica McIver]

Oh, okay. Of course not. Do you think you're going to hell, Mr. Lyons?

[Joy Reid]

I'm not gonna end. Of course.

[Congresswoman Lamonica McIver]

How many government.

[Joy Reid]

Gentle lady will suspend. A gentle lady will suspend. Chairman, as I. A gentle lady will suspend. As I said. Okay.

[Ms. Maddie J]

Lamonica went there.

[Joy Reid]

Okay. New Jersey is in the house between Allelia and lamonica. That. That might be the team. Allelia and lamonica. Bloop. As the commenter just said. There it is. That was fire. Let's quickly talk about our second sponsor, because then I got a couple more videos for you in this same vein. This podcast is sponsored by our friends at Strawberry Me. Now, let me just ask y' all something. Do you think LeBron, you know, King James, Patrick Mahomes, or Serena got to be the goat got to that status by just guessing? Nope. They had coaching. Every pro athlete has a specialized coach watching their form, calling the plays, and finding the blind spots if they can't see themselves. And this is how they win championships. And this is how we do it in every single field, whether we are an athlete, whether we're in business, whether in academia, whatever it is. It helps to have a mentor. It helps to have a coach. So why are you just trying to win in your career on your own without a coach? You're just grinding away, hoping for promotion, trying to guess the right moves. That's amateur hour. You need a strategist. You need Strawberry Me. Strawberry Me matches you with a professional career coach who breaks down your game film. They help you negotiate that raise, navigate the politics, and execute a game plan that actually works. And the cost, if you think about it, one raise, one promotion, and the coaching pays for itself 10 times over. This is the best ROI in the game, so stop riding the bench in your own life. Go to Strawberry Me. Joy today to get 50% off your first coaching session. Strawberry Me. Because pros don't guess. They get coached to win. All right, coming up in just a short while, the one and only Ms. Maddie J is going to answer your love questions. We have so many good questions. But before we get to that, I just want to play you just a few more clips, because yesterday's congressional hearing on the. At the. On the Department of Homeland Security, which you just heard, Lamonica McIver just a moment ago, it was fire. And they put these three men in the hot seat. So let me just start with some of the questions that Democrats asked about how children and families are being treated by these masked Trump feds. This is going to be D1.

[Congresswoman Pramila Jayapal]

I rate schools, churches, and hospitals. And let's not forget 5 year old Liam Ramos. You used him as a bait and then detained him despite his father's legally. His father legally seeking asylum. Liam is the face of your cruelty in this administration.

[Congressman Ro Khanna]

Under your watch, ICE has booked nearly 4,000 children in. 1,000 of them have been held longer than the court ordered 20 day limit. Recently, ProPublica obtained handwritten letters and drawings from children detained by ICE.

[Joy Reid]

These are letters from children describing what.

[Congressman Ro Khanna]

It feels like and what it does to them when the government locks them up. This is Ariana. She's 14 years old, detained for 45 days. Since I got to this center, all I feel is sadness and mostly depression. This is Mia, 7 years old. I don't want to be in this place. I want to go to my school.

[Joy Reid]

This is Gabby, 14 years old.

[Congressman Ro Khanna]

I feel so much sadness and depression of not being able to leave. This is Maria, nine years old. Me and Dilly am not happy. Please get me out of here.

[Ms. Maddie J]

Mr. Lyons, has ICE hired anyone who.

[Congressman Ro Khanna]

Is charged with a crime related to the January 6th riot here at the Capitol? Sir, I don't. I don't have that information, but I would say no.

[Ms. Maddie J]

Would you, if you could you find.

[Joy Reid]

Out and please report back?

[Congressman Ro Khanna]

Yes, sir, I'll get that.

[Ms. Maddie J]

Would you hire someone who attacked police.

[Congressman Ro Khanna]

Officers here on January 6, even though.

[Joy Reid]

They were unfortunate, unfortunately, pardoned by the President?

[Congressman Ro Khanna]

Sir, we take assault on law enforcement very serious. And we have a good strenuous vetting program, I'm sure. Thank you. Commissioner Scott, how many of your agents.

[Ms. Maddie J]

Have been disciplined for excessive use of.

[Congressman Ro Khanna]

Force over the past year? I cannot comment on ongoing.

[Ms. Maddie J]

I'm not asking you to comment on specific investigation.

[Congressman Ro Khanna]

How many of your agents have been disciplined?

[Joy Reid]

I'm just asking for the total.

[Congressman Ro Khanna]

I'll get that number to you. I don't have it in front of me.

[Ms. Maddie J]

All right.

[Joy Reid]

I'd like you to view this video. This is video of what appears to be pepper spray thrown by a federal agent into Rafael Verraza's car. You okay?

[Congressman Ro Khanna]

Mama, you okay?

[Joy Reid]

Seconds later, he realized his daughter, one year old Ariana, was in the back seat, also battling the chemicals. Are you familiar with this incident? Yes.

[Congressman Ro Khanna]

Okay.

[Ms. Maddie J]

Now, this is a family of United.

[Congressman Ro Khanna]

States citizens who were out to get groceries at a Sam's Club in Chicago. When they arrived, they could see that there was a chaotic operation in the parking lot. They turned their vehicle to leave, at which point your agents sprayed pepper spray.

[Ms. Maddie J]

Out of their vehicle and into the driver's side window of the Verraza's.

[Joy Reid]

Family vehicle.

[Congressman Ro Khanna]

Is it proper procedure to aim pepper.

[Joy Reid]

Spray into the window of a moving vehicle?

[Congressman Ro Khanna]

I'm not familiar. I don't have all the details on this. It's not going.

[Ms. Maddie J]

I'm not asking about.

[Congressman Ro Khanna]

To answer your specific question. Specific question, Is it proper procedure? Try to avoid that. No, it's not.

[Ms. Maddie J]

Try to avoid it because you understand it's dangerous, right?

[Congressman Ro Khanna]

Not just for the driver, but for pedestrians, for other people who could be.

[Ms. Maddie J]

Hit by a car if a driver is blinded. Right?

[Congressman Ro Khanna]

I 100 understand that, but you're talking about intentional versus not intentional.

[Ms. Maddie J]

Now, listen, reclaiming my time from the.

[Joy Reid]

Video, this was clearly intentional.

[Ms. Maddie J]

And you know as well as I.

[Congressman Ro Khanna]

Do that in any other law enforcement agency, if an officer did this, they.

[Ms. Maddie J]

Would be put on leave, investigated and likely disciplined.

[Joy Reid]

A whole lot of people are going to jail when this regime is over. Let's move on. We got two more. I'm going to play two more. Jason, let's do. Yeah, we're going to just do two more. Before we get to our next segment, I want you all to hear Congresswoman Delia Ramirez. She's a congresswoman from Illinois, and this is D2. She just laid waste to these kidnapping goons.

[Congresswoman Pramila Jayapal]

Mother. A Guatemalan immigrant and an American taught me that I have the responsibility to look evil in the eye and to fight it back. Mr. Lyon, Mr. Scott, Mr. Edlow, you have used your power to perpetrate great evil. And it's about time you answer this committee for the lawlessness that you've empowered and defended in your testimony. Mr. Lyons, I want to start with you, and I want to talk about ice, because under your leadership, ICE has shot and killed Silverio, Villegas Gonzalez and Renee good, violated nearly 100 court orders in January alone. You've used banned chokeholds in more than 40 cases, engaged in warrantless arrests despite of a consent decree. And you used children as bait to put 3,800 children in detention. You created traps for people at immigration court who were following the law and doing it the legal way. And you broke the law by entering to people's homes without a judicial warrant in violation of the Fourth Amendment. Now, let's talk about you, Mr. Scott, and CBP next. Under your leadership, CBP has attempted to execute Marimar Martinez, shooting her five times and not releasing the footage that you should release so that we can see the evidence. Murdered Alex Preddy, used chemical agents dozens of times in Chicago after a judge ordered you to stop, conducted warrantless surveillance and racial profiling, and acted with total disrespect and disregard for the law while engaging in roving patrols, plate switching, dangerous traffic maneuvers and observer intimidation. Again, criminals act with that total disregard for the law, and we continue to see it. You would both have us talk about respect for your mission and your agents, but your agencies are unaccountable paramilitary forces. And I have just as much respect for you as I do for the last white men who put on masks to terrorize communities of color. I have no respect for the inheritors of the Klan hood and the slave patrol. Those activities were immoral then, and criminal. And so are yours. And that brings me to you, Mr. Edlow, and USCIS. Truly, USCIS is the most disappointing part of this whole panel for me. Mr. Ello, let me ask you a question. Is USCIS mission to uphold America's promise as a nation of welcome and possibility with fairness, integrity and respect for all we serve? Yes or no? Is that the mission, Congresswoman?

[Congressman Ro Khanna]

The mission is to administer the lawful immigration.

[Congresswoman Pramila Jayapal]

So let me move on. So it is not for the possibility of fairness, integrity and respect.

[Joy Reid]

I get that.

[Congresswoman Pramila Jayapal]

I want to tell you about Mr. About Stephen, my constituent. Mr. Arlo. Steven is a 14 year old with autism who is seeking asylum. This child has spent 60 days in detention center after he was detained with his dad at a check in. Let me ask you this. What kind of agency would strip asylum protections from children, even those with pending asylum claims, and deport minors without due process? You don't have to answer that. Your agency, Mr. Arlo. You are doing that to Steven, my constituent, an eighth grader. You have abandoned the mission and allowed USCIS to become a tool in DHS's abusive enforcement apparatus. Mr. Arlo, it is shameful to see what USCIS has become. As I've said before, dhs, ICE and cbp, they're not really rogue. Congress designed DHS to violate our rights under the pretense of securing our safety. I'm going to say it loud and clear, and I'm proud to stand by what I say. DHS cannot be reformed. It must be dismantled. And something new must take its place. Because if we let DHS persist, it will continue to be a weapon that can be pointed at anyone the government considers the public enemy. And let me tell you, fascism always requires a public enemy. But the power of the people is stronger than the weapons they would wield against us. So, Mr. Lyons, Mr. Scott, Mr. Edlow, you have weaponized the government. You have supported a fascist enterprise at the expense of our constitutional rights. You have violated the law. But let Me remind you, you will not always be in power. One day you will be held accountable for your role in this dark moment in America, in our nation's history. I guarantee it. And with that, Mr. Chairman, I yield back.

[Joy Reid]

Wow, that was powerful. I wanted to play the whole thing because she was powerful. I'm gonna play one more and then we're gonna move on. The last one that I wanna play, Jason, is D4. This is Dan Goldman of New York, and he also was fire. Here is Dan Goldman in your opening.

[Congressman Ro Khanna]

Statement that references to ICE as the Gestapo or the secret police encourages threats against ICE agents 100%. The problem is you have it backwards, sir. People are simply making valid observations about your tactics, which are un American and outright fascist. So I have a simple suggestion. If you don't want to be called a fascist regime or secret police, then stop acting like one.

[Joy Reid]

The Democrats did a really good job in these hearings in the last two days. And I played you a lot of sound tonight because we get a lot of pushback about what are Democrats doing? Are they doing anything? Are they doing enough? Democrats have a limited amount of power. The one thing that they can do is they can be a part of these hearings. They can't even necessarily call the hearings because it is the majority that controls the floor. But when they are on these hearings, what we expect them to do is to give them hell, to give the fascist hell. And when I tell you the Democrats on these two committees have done an excellent job of that. And so they're. So don't feel that the people you're voting for are doing nothing. They are doing some of the things that they could do. And this is one of the things that they are capable of doing, and they're doing it. So I want to commend them for that. We've put a mash up. It's about a 24 minute mashup of the hearings today. And I'm working on one for yesterday. We're going to post these on the Joy Reed show channel so that if you want to just sort of watch it without the interregnums, just to see what the Democrats. And Thomas Massie, I'll give him credit too. We're doing. We're going to do that. Let me give you a quick update before we move on to our next really fun segment, but I want to give you an update on the story we told you about Monday. Remember how Wes Moore and the governor of Colorado, the only black and the only LGBTQ male governors in the country, were disinvited from this White House. You know, it's the sort of National Governors association meeting. Well, now the Democrats have said they will not be attending. Democratic governors have announced they will all 100% of them. They're going to skip the White House dinner that the National Governors association has already designated as no longer an NGA event. And so that is in reaction to Westmore and Governor Jared Polls of Colorado being disinvited. So everybody who reached out to your governors and demanded that they not attend. If you did that, you won. And that is how you win. You got to get people to be accountable. And people responded to their constituents outrage that they would even think about going. So well done. Well done. To everybody in all the chats and big ups, everybody that's here. If you guys have not hit like and subscribe yet, you've got a big contingent watching on substack right now. Big contingent watching on YouTube. We appreciate each and every one of you altogether. You guys are like about what? You guys are almost 20, 000 strong just watching live. That's pretty. That's pretty dope. So thank you all for tuning in. We are now going to do something a lot more fun. A lot more fun because it is almost Valentine's Day. And with the Valentine's Day coming, the love is in the air. But not just love. There are other things in the air, too. And so accountability is also a thing that we can talk about as we head into Valentine's Day because the person who I do believe probably understands the most about love and accountability, in our view, is somebody who also understands heterology. And so we are so excited to bring to you our amazing, great guest. And she is Ms. Maddie J. Ms. Maddie J, please come to the stage. Welcome.

[Ms. Maddie J]

Hey, Joy. How you doing, darling?

[Joy Reid]

Oh, I'm doing so well. So well. So well. Ms. Mani J. Thank you for agreeing to come in and answer the love questions of the people in our chat. They are on fire for you right now. You are getting hearts and you are getting flowers and all your chats. But I want to start before we dig into our. We got lots of questions. Yes. I want to start by asking you in the way that only you really could understand to just comment for just a moment on one of our favorite artists, Cardi B. She represents the good side of the Trinidadian. She's Dominican, so we love her. Cardi B appears to maybe have broken up with her boyfriend, Stefan Diggs. They're sparking these breakup winners after rumors after the Patriots wide receiver, the tough night, the Super Bowl. His team did not win. But apparently one of his four baby mamas showed up at the super bowl with her. With her child by Hamy as the four children by different women, including one from Cardi B. And then another friend of his, an Instagram model. She showed up with really great seats and was posting from there. And it feels like, you know, there's a challenge there. Cardi B did treat herself to a $500,000 Audemars PK timepiece from Betty the Jeweler, who posted it on his Instagram. So she's living our best life. But what do you make of this situation? And do you have any love advice for our the wonderful Cardi B? Because we want her to win at love. She's winning at everything else.

[Ms. Maddie J]

While I, Joe, I don't know a whole lot about these young rappers and things like that, but still, she's a woman and, you know, I'm pro woman and, and wants to be able to give her some sound advicement. You understand what I'm saying? Where I'm resting in right now, the inner heiferology inside me. Because men can be heifers too. I'm. I want you to understand that.

[Joy Reid]

Okay?

[Ms. Maddie J]

Okay. And so what's resting on me right now is that I think she needs to take a break. I think she needs to pull away from it. She's a good. You said she's a good side of trailer dad. Right? So what she, I, I advise her to do right now is just to pull away, just to take break the rest of my thing. Go make a rap song or something about just anything that come up in her mind frame. But right now, is this too much? Yeah, this is too much.

[Joy Reid]

It's a lot. It's too much. It's too much. It's a lot. But if you could just pull back for a moment, just define. You said a man can be a heifer too. Define heifer. For those who are unschooled in heiferology, okay.

[Ms. Maddie J]

In layman's terms, is somebody. It just don't have to be from a perspective of sleeping around or nothing like being trash or nothing like that. A health of somebody who try to do things in a divisive way. They don't mean you no good. They slick. They try to be slick, but they dumb in a lot of precepts and they just try to, you know, they worldly and, and, and try to be just this person that think they all on top of the game, but they know well, they ignorant for one. And men's why I said men's can be helpers is because they try to be in the game when we know the game. Because we really true to women's. We the ace of spades for real.

[Joy Reid]

Amen.

[Ms. Maddie J]

Yeah.

[Joy Reid]

And.

[Ms. Maddie J]

But they try to be slick and don't nothing and they'll trick. That's what it is in layman's turn, in layman's ear.

[Joy Reid]

I think that's important because, you know, the young. The young people don't necessarily understand. You know what I mean? Like we. We know this coming from back in the day.

[Ms. Maddie J]

We had to talk about.

[Joy Reid]

Oh, yeah, let me jump into some of these questions because lots of people needed advice and they wrote in. So we. There's a couple other representatives questions. So here is our first question from our first listener. And it said this here. If a hea walks up to a table where you're eating and acknowledges your significant other, but not you, when she knows you, do you give her the fivefold or him a pair of pajamas? Oh, and he doesn't wear pajamas regularly.

[Ms. Maddie J]

See, Joy, this has happened to me on several occasions when women be disrespected. That's a classic heifer right there. Women who disrespect the woman. And so the heifer at hand needs to be dealt with. First of all, she need to know that you don't play, see? Cause she being disrespectful. She thinks you gonna be sitting there all pious and everything. And you ain't gonna do that for one lady. Sweetheart. Listen good, honey. You let your husband see if he take care of it. If he don't handle it, then you ask the health at hand, say, excuse me, please, can we talk just a little bit outside? Can I just have some conversation with you? And you excuse yourself, baby. I'll be right back. I'll be right back. And you disappear from the scene and you clock that out. However you know how to clock. If you. If you know. If you know this or you know this. Fivefold ministry. 1, 2, 3, 4, 5. And fold them. You use what works best for you.

[Joy Reid]

Now, I can't help but notice your accessory. Yeah. Can we talk a little bit about this? Because it's actually very fabulous. Quite. Oh, yes.

[Ms. Maddie J]

They're blinged out. I had my jewelry maker. She. I've been knowing her name. Mindy Lou. Shout out to Mindy Lou from Montgomery, Alabama. Yeah, Mindy Lou. And she is my jewelry maker. And she said, matt G. I think you need. This is petite and you can hold on to it. And you know, and when you get ready to pull it out, it ain't cumbersome enough, nothing like that. You can just have it situated, twink your fingers and things and just pull it out and do the damage.

[Joy Reid]

Now, I hope you young people in the chats are. Are paying close attention because listen, Maddie J. Is giving you all a million dollars worth of game for free on this here moment. So let's. Let's go to the second one here. This is a good one. Hey, Ms. Maddie J. How can you tell if a heifer has truly repented and retired or if they are still a heer in sheep's clothing?

[Ms. Maddie J]

Okay, I can answer that accordingly because I am a reformed helper. I know the game because I done played it. You understand what I'm saying? So I'm a reformed helper. And so how you can tell because I'm a song is you don't play them heifer games no more. You don't play around with minions. You don't flirt at what see a man cross the way and his wife or significant other is with him and you playing games and trying to attraction him and everything. You don't do that no more.

[Joy Reid]

You don't.

[Ms. Maddie J]

You don't play them games. You be straight up and you be real with people. So you can tell a reformed heifer by her behavior because it's unhealthy.

[Joy Reid]

It's uneven. Are you going to share with us a story from your. Your heifer days?

[Ms. Maddie J]

Oh, Lord, I'm gonna share indiscretion because my husband might be listening. Herman may be lit, and sometimes he get kind of moved when he hear about my past. But I'm gonna tell you one thing. I did. I'm gonna tell you this. In fact, it's on my Facebook TV page one time. You know, back in the day, Matt J. Wasn't always fluffy, baby Maddie. Oh, yeah. Mad J. Was something to tell the preacher. And so I had on a bikini at the beach and Herman, my husband, brought me home. I wore the whole bikini, you know, in the. In the car I was sitting. He had a real nice sports car and I wanted McKinney home. And he had a ball game and he let me drive his car with stick shift. And I. I got out the car with my bikini on and he had his whole ball team outside. And I got up, baby, and I walked around and I. Yeah. And that was real heiferosity right there. Entirely 100% helpful because I wanted the men's to see all of this deliciousness and straight. They had Their girlfriends out there too, and half of them, I couldn't stand. And so I got up joined, and I just, you know, slow motion, turn around, let them see the bump on this side and the bump on that side. Bumped in and girlfriends was mad, but eight hot. I didn't care. I was a helper out there heiferizing on the ball field. Yeah, that's it. That's my story. I'll stick to it.

[Joy Reid]

I. I love it. And now that you are reformed former heifer and the youth, you're happily retired from heiferation and from doing heifer things. Yeah. What is the secret? Because this is another question that we had that I think is very appropriate for going into Valentine's Day. What is the. The Maddie J. Secret to a long, prosperous and happy marriage? The person who asked just got engaged and need some tips.

[Ms. Maddie J]

Okay. First of all, you got to inquire of the Lord. And God said, lord, you know, I've been dating this man and things like that, and I just need to know if I'm supposed to be betrothed with him for the rest of my life, because he'd be doing some ignorant things sometime, Lord, and I don't know if I'm gonna be able to stand it. And Lord, this what happened with me. And Lord thy God told me, marry that man. I got permission straight from the heavenlies. So with that, that mean the Lord thy God knew something that I didn't know. Gonna be together thick and thin through all the rainstorms and all that. And it happened like that. So the first thing I tell them, inquire if you believe in the Lord. That's if you believe, you ask them, lord, did this man, is he mine for real? He'll tell you, because the word of Lord thy God said, I will not have you ignorant.

[Joy Reid]

Amen. Amen. Amen. Amen. Well, let's. Let's go on to our next question. This one, I think, is actually really good. This is from A, a good sister. This person has A, as a brother who's got an issue, and she, she or he asks, how can I. How can I help free my brother, brother from a hussy? And then there's A part, B to the question, so how can I help free my brother from a hussy? And B, is a skank, pepperhead, or clanker top worse than a hussy.

[Ms. Maddie J]

Okay, number one, it ain't your position to free that man from anything. Because most of the time in them situations like that, the more you talk to them, the deeper he plunged himself because he probably be type that like risking business. You don't know what it is that woman got to make him all succumbed to her advances he making. See that she'll help a top heifer heiferizing all over the nation and the neighborhood and the ball team. But baby, when them women's had that hook, nobody unhook them. Can't know nobody but the Lord. Your position, baby, is to pray.

[Joy Reid]

That's it.

[Ms. Maddie J]

That's all you can do with him. Other than that you're gonna drive him further away from you. I'm telling you right now, that's Maddie J101. Now your part B is name up. What she said is what's the difference between the heifers and what is the mother?

[Joy Reid]

So, so this person wants to know, is a skank a pepper head, which I've never heard before for and is that worse than a hussy? And then I have to add, is a hussy the same as or worse than a heifer?

[Ms. Maddie J]

Okay, see, really, all the mothers of names, I ain't the only word that I am familiarity with is skank. Oh, now see, difference between a heifer and a skank and a husband in perspective. Them women's, they. Baby, they do some sleeping around. And it be kind of sleeping around where they don't be sleep. Baby, they be working. I have put it on my page that a hood is something else. Baby, she don't never get tired of doing what she do. See, heifer just smart mouth and all that. They try to cause problems. Things like. But a husband, baby bliss. She say what she mean and she mean what she say. And she her, baby, she, you. You put your money where your mouth is. A husband put her mouth where the money. Next question. Baby, I ain't fooling with y'. All. This is the truth.

[Joy Reid]

Okay, please advise. Our next questioner says, please advise Ms. Maddie J. On how you deal with a heifer running in and out of your husband's place of business, making up any excuse to go there. And ads already warned her and him.

[Ms. Maddie J]

Okay, see, we gotta look at these preliminaries right here. First you have. You have a talk with her husband. Because that's always what you do. You don't all the time go for the heifer, right? Because she could be getting permission from your husband. Understand what I'm saying? And you out there looking all foolish. Cause you know he letting her have her way. So you talk to her. Baby, listen, I don't like the hustlers just running in, out your office. I'd like for you to do something about it. If you don't, then I'm gonna do something about it. And then when you say that, when you make threats like that, you got to mean it. You got to mean it. And please, my God, please know how to fight. If you don't know how to fight, baby, you messed up. Because most helpers can fight. And so talk to them. Talk to them. Say, this is what's gonna happen, I'm telling you. And then if you still find out that the health is going in and out now, then you show up at the job and you sit up there. See, you know, if you're gonna be crazy, everybody born crazy, but you're gonna be crazy. You gonna have to be crazy. So you just sit up there in the office when and she come in. Oh, hey, how you doing, darling? Okay. Did we tell you that you cannot come back up here anymore? Okay, that's all right, that's okay. Don't even give a chance. Answer clocker. Don't that slow motion knock her jaw and a glass like that damaged heifer. Damage, damage, damage. More likely she ain't gonna come back no more. Speaking from experience, Joe? I'm speaking from experience.

[Joy Reid]

Oh, my gosh. We have a note from the back that apparently pepperhead is a slang of heifer from the 1950s. Apparently it is an old fashioned term from the 1950s, apparently.

[Ms. Maddie J]

So that new babe, that must be some northern stuff. I'm from down south.

[Joy Reid]

Okay, here's another one. Let's go to our next. Our next question here. And it says, how does a woman. Oh, this is a good one. How does a woman find love who is in her 50s? And this is the second part of the question. What do you think about places that I should be going this question or ask, that could potentially be good places to meet men. How do you feel about meeting men in nightclubs? Or is there any cool afterwork nightclubs that they should be using? So what about women in their 50s that want to meet men in a club?

[Ms. Maddie J]

I will say to you, darling, that you're going on old precepts. You fit in there. Not 50, you 50. And first of all, you're gonna have to make sure everything is in perspection. Everything is lined up the way it need to be. You didn't work out, you look good and everything. And I ain't saying that this is a standard, but you won't have everything conditioned because you don't know what kind of man you're going to be up against. And especially it's been a while since you've been, you know, in the company of man. He may take your breath away. And what you need to be able to do is know how to handle yourself and things like that. Going to a club is ain't it. Because them young boys out there and they looking for some kugerosity. That's what they do. Yeah, oh, absolutely. They want Googles and things like that. Take your paycheck, all your government check, all that check, every check that's being checked. That's what they want. You, you ain't got time for no young boys you want. You are a seasoned man that know how to handle you and things like that. The young boys may know how to handle one way. Yeah, but you want the way of the Lord thy God that he gonna provide for you. He gonna look after you and he gonna care for you. So baby, don't go to a club. I think you need to go to a library. You can go to the grocery store, the market. Picking through your greens and things. Men and women and testify looking through their greens and tomatoes and looking through there and everything. Then somebody looking. Ma', am, can I squeeze your tomatoes? Excuse me. Well, sir. Yeah, you know what? Let me see your grip. That's what you want to look for too. If they can't grip nothing, it starts right there. Keep walking. So I don't need to see you, sir. I'll see you in tomorrow morning. I'm gonna go over here to the mayonnaise section. Next question.

[Joy Reid]

The same question. I've taken mental notes this person has also asked about what does she. What do you feel about women in their 50s who practice celibacy?

[Ms. Maddie J]

I think that's a wonderful thing. You got to be anointed by the Lord thy God to do it though. You gonna have to bend with the Lord to be a cat woman that's been with the Lord. Baby, you got to be with the Lord. And you can't be watching all these shows that come on. Used to, you know, the nasty shows used to come on at night. Now they come on any time of the day. You can be cooking your grits and singing your hymn song and look up. Lord have mercy. Jesus Christ, Lord, help me and see you and your. You can't handle it. So you're gonna have to stay in your word, praying to the Lord and go, lord, I want you to help me. Me keeping all of that because some of it is still alive and still vibrant. And so you're gonna have to if you want to be a celibacy, you're gonna have to have a good relationship with the Lord thy God. Ain't nobody else that's gonna be able to keep you but him. Next question.

[Joy Reid]

Let's go on to. There was a caller, and it was. It was a very long question, but I summarized it. This young woman said that she is a divorce. Single children have all moved out of the house and is now, see, a gentleman. And he started off. It started off great. You know, he seems like a good provider, seems like a good man. But she wants to know, when do you decide that it's the right time to move in together?

[Ms. Maddie J]

See, Joy, I'm old school, okay? I'm old school. I just believe I may not be the right person to ask that question, because moving in. Yeah, ain't no moving in. Do you see all of this, Baby, you don't want to put a ring on it? You move in, we got to be under some kind of contractual agreement. You. I'm not moving in with nobody, my friend. You got your own place, I got mine. We see each other, whatever, but I'm not moving in with you, baby, okay? Because I. I already know that you don't want the cow if you continuing to get the milk for free.

[Joy Reid]

You. Why.

[Ms. Maddie J]

Why would you buy into the cow? Yeah, I wouldn't if my neighbor was giving me milk and ground beef and steaks and things like that. Then she asked me, hey, you didn't want to buy the cab.

[Joy Reid]

No.

[Ms. Maddie J]

Why would I buy anything that I'm getting for free?

[Joy Reid]

Amen.

[Ms. Maddie J]

Amen. That's me, though. I'm old school.

[Joy Reid]

No, you're old school, and I appreciate it. I have to ask you, Ms. Maddie J, we enjoy you so much. You talk all the time about Herman. We feel like we know him too, just from your stories. Please tell us how you and Herman are going to be celebrating Valentine's Day.

[Ms. Maddie J]

Oh, Lord. See, let me tell you. Herman like to be a man of secrets, you know? Now he does. He does. Well, he plans things. He's a planner. I'd be at her. What you gonna do? What we gonna do? Just waiting at it. That's how he talk. Got gravel in his throat and just waiting at it. I'm gonna do it just because I'm impatience and I beat. Want to know. I have no idea what the plans. And I know earlier today in that day, we gonna go to a. A sneaker ball with my good friend Ms. Tracy Williams. She got her thing going on. We gonna go to that. But the night time when it's the right time. I don't know what. Herman got up. He freaking out with his stuff. And I appreciate that. So I don't know. I can't even say I don't know.

[Joy Reid]

Okay. And what would you do? Because you are, as you said, you are reformed heifer. You are now a woman of God. You are a hepherologist. And try to advise the young women and young ladies to be able to act right. What would you do in. At this stage of your life, Ms. Maddie J. If a heifer came for Herman? Oh.

[Ms. Maddie J]

Oh, Lord. Help me, Jesus. Help me, Lord. That hurt. That one hurt. Hold it. Hold it together.

[Joy Reid]

Okay.

[Ms. Maddie J]

Help me, Lord. So this happens a lot of times at the church. Church women, they. They be top helpers, really, because it's. It's more women's at the church than it is men's. And so Herman is a nice person. He's a gentleman. He will open the door for you, say, hey, darling, how you doing? And things like that. And so there is attraction to, you know, men's who practice chivalry and things like that. So what I does. Because it didn't happen before. I let Herman. I typically let her. Okay. Because, see, Herman know his wife. No, I don't play. I don't. And it has happened to me. One time we was at a party, and this woman just up there, just coming on Herman. Herman. I was looking. Herman didn't know I was looking. And she was talking to him. I went up, stepped up to him, went to Herman because her my husband. And so she kept talking Joy. Before I know that I clocked her joy. And right here in her spouse portrayal, right there, the voice box. Yeah, I talked to her. And she upchucked blood and water. And she up walk. Oh, Lord, you hear me? And she had some coins in her hand. And she looked at the coin between the blood and the water separated. And she saw that it was two dimes and a nickel. And she said, I swallowed this when I was a little girl.

[Joy Reid]

Girl.

[Ms. Maddie J]

Only thing is, she said, well, when I swallowed it, it was a whole quarter. Matt J. Made change with that help slot. She to chain. There it is. Chain. Blood and water. Two dimes a nipple. Next question. That what matters. J. Do I make change with you, darling? Don't you do that. Don't disrespect me. And I'm right here like you. I ain't here. Don't do that. Let me check my book. But that took me back right there.

[Joy Reid]

Okay.

[Ms. Maddie J]

All right, Ms. Maddie.

[Joy Reid]

J, you are a national treasure.

[Ms. Maddie J]

Wow.

[Joy Reid]

If you did not exist, we would have to invent you. I thank Jason for just stumbling across you on Instagram. I am obsessed. You are incredible. We love you, Ms. Maddie J. Thank you for free Valentine's Day. I feel like hea or non hea. They are all engaged. They are all prepared to face Valentine's Day as women of God and people.

[Ms. Maddie J]

I'm on now.

[Joy Reid]

Thank you very. Listen, if y' all love Miss Maddie J as much as we love Miss Maddie J and we love Miss Maddie J, you can find Miss Maddie J at Mrs. Maddy jmrs.maddiej on Instagram. By the way, if you are a booker out there, yes, she is available to do this and she's available events personalized videos on cameo. You can set a anti he message to your friends Valentine's Day and you can also get all of this goodness by going to www.mattyj.net M A T T I E J.net we're going to put it in the description of this program because we're obsessed with you. Thank you. Thank you, Ms. Maddie Jane.

[Ms. Maddie J]

Thank you. I love you, Joy. God bless. Keep doing what you're doing, baby. Keep doing what you do.

[Joy Reid]

Thank you very much. I appreciate you. You keep doing what you're doing. Oh, Jason, we need a round of applause for Miss Maddie J. Baby, when I tell you my stomach hurts, my diaphragm is a little sore from laughing. But look, people in the chats are saying they really needed this on today. This is the right way to head into Valentine's Day with all and all happen to make y' all happen to listen to Pam Bondi's horrific voice and her screaming Mimi attitude and her nastiness. We felt you guys needed something positive before Valentine's Day, so we decided we wanted to bring you one of our obsessions. And thank you, Maddie J, for answering my DMs. That is how we at we were able to track her down. And she is amazing. So please, you know, I'll follow her. Go to Ms. Maddie J.net and it's Maddie J.net so www.maddyj.net y' all need to. Y' all need to. You are not subscribed to Ms. Maddie J on Instagram. You are missing it. She is a moment of joy every minute of every day. All right, let's let you guys know a little bit of housekeeping. A reminder that you all did so. Such a great job. Thank you to everybody. By the way, who sent in questions to Ms. Maddie J. We apologize if we couldn't get to your question, but we only have so much time and so we answered some of our questions. We are going to do this again. We love user participation. We love it when you guys get involved in the show and we can include you. So your next opportunity to get involved is going to be for Black History Month. We are going to do a huge Black History Month special. It is going to run on the 20th of February, but we're going to give you up until this. Let's give you till the 16th. We will give you right up until the 16th to get your questions in. Michael Harriot, the author of Black AF History, which we are putting in the store so you can purchase your Black AF History. If you want to get ahead of the game and read Black AF History, it's one of the best history books you've ever read. It has been on the New York Times bestseller list like 50, 11 times since it launched. I think it's the one came out like two or three years ago, but it just stays on the New York Times bestseller list. The great Garrison Hayes, who you all love, he's at Mother Jones and does all of this incredible history content online. And of course, Ashley the Baroness. Ashley the Baroness, you've seen her. She does these great history explainers and she is fantastic. And people who are asking about Khalil Green, we did ask for Khalil Green, but Khalil's traveling. So Khalil is going to do something else with us when he gets back from traveling because he is a young man needs a break. So that was our third person that we really wanted to include. But Khalil will do some other stuff for Black History Month. We celebrate Black History Month around here on the Joy Reid Show. We believe that it is still worth celebrating and worth making sure that we are informing ourselves. And by the way, Black History Month is not just for black people. It is for all Americans. It is American history that is inclusive of all of the things that we have contributed to this country. Don't let Pete Hegseth fool you. African Americans have contributed mightily to this country. There's so much that exist in this country that wouldn't be, that wouldn't exist at all were it not for the presence of black people who survived enslavement, survived the Red Raiders of the Ku Klux Klan after enslavement, survived the redemption movement, and really created the culture that is the United States. The unique culture of the United States is inseparable from black History. So. And I hate when people say, well, they gave us the shortest month of the year. No, no, no, no. Black people invented Black History Month. And it was invented to be in February. It was placed in February not because February is short, but because Frederick Douglass's birthday is in February. So it was a creation of African Americans who decided to create a commemoration of black history at a time when black history was ignored altogether, when history books just pretended black people only existed as cattle, as chattel slaves, and had no other history and had no other import. People like Pete Hegseth trying to convince us, convince not just black people to belittle us, but to convince white people to convince Asian people, to convince Latinos that black people just essentially did not exist in history as heroes, as inventors, as scholars, as academics, as anything other than chattel slaves, and that they should be grateful for that chattel slavery because it got them out of the beautiful continent of Africa. So instead of that, I got water right here. Let me take a sip. And so we do Black History Month celebrations not because we're trying to marginalize black history from the rest of history, but because we need to emphasize these points of history, because all other history is essentially white history. What we get in our school systems, what we're taught at school, is everything about even Europe and nothing about the African continent and very little about ourselves. And the people who need to understand that are not just black people. It is all people. So we include everyone in our black history. We want everyone, whether you are white, black, Asian, you know, Latino, whatever your background is, feel free and comfortable to send your questions. If you're just curious about something, if there's something you thought, did they really do that? Did this really happen? Was this part of history accurate? Do I understand something? Use this as an opportunity to learn from three of the smartest people when it comes to history that you could possibly get the chance to talk with. The first hour is going to be all Michael Harriot. We're going to take a bunch of the facts from black AF history. We're going to put them in all these cool categories. Like, did they really. We're going to make it really fun. And then hour two is going to be a great panel. Garrison Hayes and. And. And Ashley the Baroness. It's going to be fun. Put it that way. It's going to be fun. And just like we did with Ms. Maddie J, it is going to be all dependent on the participation of you guys. You guys who are in the chats right now, who are fired up. We need you guys to participate because this is our user participation model that we're trying to make sure this is the difference between regular media and independent media. We can actually interact with you guys. We can actually chat with you. We can be make you a part of the show, and it's a fun thing. What'd you say there, Jason? Oh, I thought you were saying something. This is the thing we love about independent media, that we're able to actually interact. We can see. See what you're saying in the chats. We can. Oh, please. What I was getting ready to say is that, you know, since she was laughing so much in the last segment.

[Ben Crump]

Your throat is dry, so definitely because.

[Joy Reid]

I was in there cracking up. Jason was back there silently laughing, but I could hear him through the studio door. Ms. Maddie J. Is so funny, y'.

[Ms. Maddie J]

All.

[Joy Reid]

We're gonna definitely do this again and bring her back, but let us know in the chats if you want us to bring her back. She is amazing. She is so funny. And she stayed. I mean, that carrot, that is the best. She is the best. We love Ms. Maddie J. She is so much better. Y' all stay away from Herman. You don't want to get that. That. That beautiful rapier applied to you. She had that accessory in her hand. So if you know what I know, don't go near Herman like that. You could talk to him. You can be friendly to him or polite, but just make sure you play. Just be polite and don't get too extra. Ms. Maddie J. Would deal with you because she's a former Hessian. She said that's the most dangerous type of heifer is the retired one. The retired ones who know the game. She knows the game, and so therefore, she can play the game. So we'll absolutely be bringing her back. So the email one more time is black af history. Thejoy readshow.com blackaf history@the joyreachow.com Send us your questions. Oh, okay, wait. Let me remind you guys one more time. Jason is telling me. Just remind me the. I have to remind you guys, I think you have, like, one more week to go to vote for us for the NAACP Image award in best news category. In the best news podcast category, there is the cute little QR code right on the screen. If you want to put your phone up to that, you can go ahead and vote for us. If you've not voted already. We would truly appreciate your vote. We're just. They said you can vote. Jason said you can vote once a day. It's not like regular elections, you can actually just keep on voting. So, you know, go and vote. You know, you can make a difference in elections. Because look at the candidate that we had on today, Anna Lilia. That is voter participation. Look at what you all did, all of you out there in the public, not just those who watch this show, who reached out to your governors and said, you're not going to that White House event. And voila, the pressure was felt. And I think Democrats are clearly feeling the pressure from their base that is saying, we want you to fight. You saw all that footage that I showed you guys of the way that Democrats are moving in this moment. They're realizing that their base does not want performative politics, but they want a fight. And so the part that they did is part of the performance. Yes, you have to perform because you can't force Pam Bondi to comply with the law. But you can bring receipts. Ted Liu did an excellent job of bringing receipts. Everything that happens in Congress is kept in something called the Congressional Record. Everything that everyone says in that sworn testimony, they have to raise their right hand and swear to tell the truth. If you lie, that is actually a felony. It's a crime to lie to Congress. People are talking about Michael Cohen. I interviewed Michael Cohen earlier today on Substack. The thing he got in trouble for was lying to Congress. You can't lie to Congress. You have to tell the truth. And so each of the things that Cash Patel has said in Congress, each of the things that Pam Bondi has said in Congress, if those turn out to be lies, maybe not tomorrow, maybe not next week, maybe not next year, but at a certain point, there will be a new Department of Justice that will actually be a real Department of Justice. And guess what? Accountability can come for these people at any time. So if I was Kristi Noem, if I was Pam Bondi, if I was Cash Patel, if I was Stephen Miller, Tom Holman, this dude who runs ice, if any of these guys, right, this guy who runs cpb, these guys look sharp, because you may need to lawyer up. Because one of the reasons we study history and the reason we care about history is that we see how history goes. And the way that history is generally proceeded is that fascist regimes fall, empires fall. No empire has survived. The British had an empire gone. The Persians had an empire gone. American empire, thanks to Donald Trump, done. Japan, the empire of Japan. These companies, these countries, all of these nations that had empires, the great African kingdoms gone, right? The United Kingdom. The sun was never supposed to set on the British Empire. It set. And fascist regimes, South Africa, fascist regime gone. You know, and each of these will fall as well. And so as much as we say scary is caring, and we try to keep you guys keep it serious and we tell you all the bad news, we always want to balance it with history and hope because history is here to help and history is here to give you hope. Because the way that history generally proceeds is that fascist regimes go down and they go down hard. And so each and every one of the people in this Trump regime that is participating in fascist behavior, just know. Just know the page is going to turn. When that page turns, y' all might need to get y' all sell some liars because as Ms. Maddie J said, the heifers don't win. Heifers might just get the 1, 2, 3, 4, 5th. And that includes fast. Just help us too. Thank you all for tuning in. We will see on Friday. And let me let y' all know, on Friday, we are definitely going to talk about this Savannah Guthrie's mom situation. I've been trying to get to it every show, but we just keep running out of time. Yeah, we're gonna talk about this Savannah Guthrie situation. It's wild. It's a wild. And we're gonna talk about it on Friday. Y' all make sure that you wrote down all those Miss Maddie J tips so that you guys can be ready for Valentine's Day because that's coming up this weekend. Love you guys. Thank you for watching Hit, subscribe and like, and we'll see you on Friday. Let me dig a little deeper with.

[Ms. Maddie J]

The shovel Plenty can't tell the force from the trees that I'm hard to.

[Ben Crump]

Detect Like a black hole in the.

[Congressman Ro Khanna]

Dark Injustice anywhere it's a threat to justice everywhere Let me make this clear.

[Ms. Maddie J]

I got a bone to pick and.

[Ben Crump]

I'll never fear the threat of poverty.

[Ms. Maddie J]

They don't want to talk about it.

[Ben Crump]

They rap a party.

[Ms. Maddie J]

So I'm a real talk about it for sure.

[Congressman Ro Khanna]

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[Joy Reid]

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[Congressman Ro Khanna]

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[Joy Reid]

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[Joy Reid]

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[Congressman Ro Khanna]

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[Joy Reid]

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[Joy Reid]

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