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- [00:06]
Chevron Jones
Okay.
- [00:15]
Joy Reid
Hey, hey, hey, everybody. Happy Wednesday and y' all know what time it is. Welcome to the Joy Reacho. Big up to everybody in the chat. I already see you all chatting it up on the YouTube chat. Big up to everybody who's also on substack, on LinkedIn, on Facebook, wherever you're listening. If you're on an audio podcast, big up to you, too. Y' all know what day it is. You see I got my shirt on finals. This is it. We're about to get our our. Well, we were robbed of the previous win that we should have gotten, but we're about to get our third win. It's going to be a 31 series after tonight, right after this broadcast. We might leave a couple of minutes early just so we can make sure we get to the game. We're not going inside the stadium, but we're going to watch the game in community tonight. Big up Semi. Big up to any spurs fans. If you're not rooting for the Knicks, just don't say nothing about it. How about that? Want to thank everybody who has hit like and subscribe. If you have not done that yet, you still have time, go ahead and hit like and subscribe so we can get in on all this goodness. Please also hit share and when you hit share, send it to all your friends and then also hit the little notification bell and then just hit all so that you can make sure you always know when we go live. Like yesterday, we was an unexpected live. You weren't expecting us to go live. Ah, but we did a makeup show because we missed Monday's show because again, Miles and I were at the game. So we're hoping, and we're very happy to hear apparently that the Orange Mess will not be inside Madison Square Garden tonight. But I can tell you that NIDA just told us our roving reporter NIDA and producer said that they still are blocking off streets in midtown Manhattan. So we're also apparently mayor mom Donnie tweeted that it was Dolan, the owner of the Knicks and the Madison Square Garden who is the one who canceled all the watch parties. So blame it on the billionaires once again, just as we always do because they always the one messing stuff up. So I also want to give one more piece of housekeeping before we get into the show in cheap on Sunday. This coming Sunday, which is no Kings Day and also Flag Day, I will be part of a star studded no Kings event in New York City. It's called Rise Up. Sing out. Rise Up. Sing out. It's Going to be pretty dope. It is like very star studded. It's put on by the Committee for the First Amendment. Jane Fonda restarted that organization that really actually started in the 1950s during McCarthyism. It's called A Concert for the First Amendment. A 90 minute evening of song, solidarity and action at the Town hall in New York City City. It starts at 7:30pm the lineup is amazing. Jane Fonda, Bette Midler, Rufus Wainwright, Sasha Allen, Patti Smith and myself. They've got a whole bunch more artists and celebs they've added and yes, yours truly as well. So if you're in the city celebrating no Kings 4 and also at that point you will also be celebrating the Knicks going 31 in the series, of course, before they finish and close it out in San, in San Antonio. You want to be there. Okay, so on to tonight's issues. Now. I want to, I want to start because that's the good news. Those are, those are the, the highs. Let's get to some of the lows because I just want to give you guys a little bit of context. If you are a member of the African American community or if you're not, I think even more so. I just want to give you some context to where black Americans are at right now. Kind of emotionally, kind of what we're, what we're feeling and kind of some context to the way that your friends and family members or co workers who are black might be feeling in this moment. Okay. And it is summed up by this post by a creator called I am Legally Hype and she posted it on threads. That is the visual. It says, here's a visual for those confused about why some people are frustrated with how the justice system works in this country. Only one of these people was convicted. And you see what that picture is, right? You recognize all of those faces. And so what is the difference between the four people that you see on the screen? Yeah, only one of them faces 35 years in prison after being convicted of murder. And you will not have trouble figuring out which one it is. Of course, his name is Carmelo Anthony, like the basketball star. And this image of him just broke my heart today when that image started circulating on social media. He's just a kid. He's just 19 years old and he was convicted of murder in Collin County, Texas after a one week trial by an all white jury. Even the six alternates on the case were all white. And it took them literally one week. Literally from jury selection all the way to verdict to convict Carmelo and send him to prison until he is 54 years old. Now, the case stemmed from the stabbing of a white teen named Austin Metcalfe. And both of the two were 17 years old at the time. Last April, when an altercation happened during a district track meet. According to NBC News, it was raining and when some athletes. And while some athletes stayed on the field, Carmelo's school did not have a tent erected. So he sought shelter under the tent put up by Metcalf's team, which was a rival team. Now, the two teenagers got into some sort of a confrontation ending with Austin Metcalfe sitting stabbed by Carmelo. Now, Carmelo's lawyers claimed that he was the one who was attacked and was defending himself. A classic self defense case, not unlike the cases of George Zimmerman, the man who killed Trayvon Martin in February 2012 after literally following him and stalking him and being the aggressor and then shooting and killing him, but claiming self defense and getting off in 2012. And Kyle Rittenhouse, also in that little four part photo, who showed up at a Black Lives Matter protest in Kenosha, Wisconsin, where he does not live, carrying an AR15 rifle with which he shot dead two white black lives Matter protesters and they both were freed by juries on self defense. That is part of the context. Now, I want to give you a little bit more context about what happened in this specific case case. And so I want to, I want to play for you. This is a post by a Midas Touch contributing reporter who calls himself Secret Service Sam. It's a fun name, but his, his, his content is actually quite compelling. Jason, this is A4 Service Sam here
- [06:36]
Secret Service Sam
with an update from a staff member who saw the video of the Carmelo Anthony and Austin Metcalf altercation. He says the video was very clear. You can even see the raindrops. You can see four boys walk up to Carmelo who's under the tent minding his business. Now, there was four boys and a few others. He said a couple of the others were distracting the coach while they jumped Carmelo. He said it was really in the rain delay. The twins and a few of their buddies, four of them and three other ones, all one distracted the coach and they surrounded Carmelo. A few seconds later, they jumped him. Austin pushed him. The twins were in the middle. They were all jumping Carmelo. Hunter said Carmelo threw his bag. That is not true. Hunter grabbed his bag, but it shows. They threw his bag away. And under Texas law, you just have to fear for your life. They start hitting, they start hitting Carmelo. Carmelo tried to get away, but Austin pulls him in by the hoodie, he says, and, and they pulled him back under the tent. Austin then put him in a headlock. Carmelo got away. And then you see Austin grab his chest. But all the stuff about Hunter rendering aid, holding the blood in was a lie because he says the coach grabbed him away and pulled him out of the scene. Now also on Fox 4, the staff member was saying they edited the photos of Carmelo to make it look like he had no injuries. But in the original photos, you could see his injuries. Carmelo had welts on his face, on his neck, and you could see locks of hair missing. I will keep you updated on this highly contested trial. They're saying they played the 911 footage in court today and they were saying that they don't know which way this one will go, as you know. I will keep you updated as more information comes in. Secret Service Sam out Sampson for president of the world.
- [08:38]
Joy Reid
And there it is. And that is the most coherent explanation that I was able to find online of what happened in this case. If four men jump one kid, four kids jump one kid and he defends himself. In Texas, as one of our wonderful protest, one of our wonderful members of our chat pointed out, I'm going to scroll back and see if I can see who said it. In Texas, it's a stand your ground state. You do not have a duty to retreat. In Texas, you literally do not have a duty to retreat. It's the same kind of law that was passed in Florida. No duty to retreat. And even though he didn't use a stand your ground defense, that is how George Zimmerman got away with killing Trayvon Martin. Because in Florida, you don't have a duty to retreat. And your ground, you can stand your ground. And your castle, it's castle doctrine is anywhere around you. Essentially, you take your castle with you if you're in your car, if you're in your home. In this case, he was literally in the neighborhood where they were both staying because Trayvon Martin was staying there. In this case, if this young man was jumped by a bunch of other kids and defended himself in Texas under Texas law, you would think ipso facto right. But all white jury, they literally took one week. And I'm talking about including jury selection to find this kid guilty of murder and the same jury then sentences to sentences him to 35 years in prison. Make it make sense. In all the other cases I described to you, the person who shot the other person was the aggressor was the person who showed up to someplace they didn't need to be, killed someone and then got away with it, rendered not guilty by a jury. Okay, you see what's happening here. And I can tell you just a little bit of tea. When I was covering the Trayvon Martin case, we couldn't get the producers sitting inside of the trial to tell us the jury makeup. They just were looking dead at these people and couldn't tell us if there were any black jurors. Turned out there was only one juror of color on that Trayvon Martin case which ended up making the difference because you know, juries can bully one person. I'm still looking for the racial makeup of the jury in the other case I'm going to talk to you about in a minute. But in this case it was an all white jury. Okay, so you get that. So that's, that's part of the context for where black Americans are feeling right now. Now that was yesterday that this conviction and sentencing happened. Meanwhile, on Monday of this same week in South Carolina, an Asian American shop owner was found not guilty of murder. He's another person that was in that little four box. In the 2023 shooting of the a black 14 year old child named Cyrus Carmack. Belton found him not guilty. Now the jury acquitted a man named C.H. rick Chow. Chow is 61 years old. He was charged with chasing Cyrus McCormick 130ft outside of his convenience store in Columbia, South Carolina. Then shooting the 14 year old kid in the back. He claimed self defense saying he acted to defend his son who, who was also chasing Cyrus. And a lot of the conspiracy theory out there is maybe the son really shot him. We don't really know. But we do know that the father, the 61 year old got off. There have been protests everywhere. People are protesting. I believe they got rid of that store because no one, nobody wants to shop in that store anymore. It's bringing up all these issues of these cross cultural situations where immigrants are in black communities because that's where they can afford to open a store but then react with fear and suspicion about their own customers. So it's raising a lot of anxiety and anger. So this is also part of the context. It's giving that whole era when Rodney King happened because right before that a girl I believe was 14 or 15 years old was killed by a Korean Shopwater. So it's giving that energy. Okay, I want you to listen to Cyrus Belton's mom who gave an emotional press conference after the verdict.
- [12:11]
Cyrus Belton's Mom
Racially profiled they followed him around. He was shopping. He took four waters.
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Angela Rye
He put them back.
- [12:23]
Cyrus Belton's Mom
He even showed them by shaking his hoodie that he took nothing and he walked out of the store. He didn't argue with them. He didn't have any confrontation. He didn't curse them. He just walked out. He was respectful and yet too grown people chased him. He fell and they shot him. He shot him dead like as if he was a dog. And I do not understand how that jury can come back and say at the that he was not guilty. He was in a runner stance. It was shown by the pathologist and it. They said he was not guilty. It was devastating for me to get a cold from Alvin S. Glenn letting me know that Rick Chow was released. That broke me more than you can ever imagine. Because my murderer of my son was set free. And it's not fair and it's unjust. And nobody can tell me that this is not racially motivated because I'm not supposed to be on social media anyway. But when I go and I look at my social media, I have racist people coming to my page, going under my son's pictures, leaving the most horrific thing, saying that they're glad he's dead. Good riddance. And I am tired. I don't want this to happen to any other child. No black or brown child. You have to go through this. No parents should have to go through this. This has to stop today. And I just learned today that South Carolina, if you're. If it's a murder charge that they cannot bring in any of your prior acts. Rick Chow shot two people before. Rick Chow costed a child in that store and beat her up with a gun on her hip. And none of that information could be brought to light. And I do not think that is fair. And if that is on the law books, that needs to be changed. Because if that was not there, then my son would have gotten justice. And to allow this person to terrorize this neighborhood for 12, 13 years is ridiculous. And it's just showing that it's okay to treat black and brown people wrong.
- [14:43]
Joy Reid
And it's not.
- [14:45]
Cyrus Belton's Mom
My son loved everybody. He would tell me like, oh, mom, you're being judgmental. You shouldn't do that. That's against God and the devil. Devil shot him dead and he laid right there and we got no justice from South Carolina. And I think it is disgusting. And I cannot even. I don't even know why. I have no words. But every day I will not be able to speak to my son, hear his voice change see him grow, go to promote. He will never get married. I would never hold his grand my grandchildren nothing. But Chow is able to go home with his lion son, Andy Chow, and they're able to have dinner with the wife Alice, who all three of them came out that store and they chased my baby. And I think the entire family should be held accountable because it was racially profiled and I do not think that it is right and they all should be punished. And if the I'm. I don't know what laws that we need to create to help our people.
- [15:58]
Joy Reid
She went on to call for laws that allow prior bad acts to come in, which by the way would have also helped in the Trayvon Martin case. Because just as a journalist, I wound up finding out back when I was a griot about lots of prior bad acts by George Zimmerman that didn't come in that were not allowed to come in in this case as well. And recall that South Carolina is the place where, where a former Republican executive director named Todd Kincannon, back during the Trayvon Martin era, said that Trayvon Martin was an animal that needed to be put down like a dog and then tried to recover from the outrage at him saying that by saying he just meant that as satire. But that is the world in which we are still living all these years after Trayvon Martin was executed in the neighborhood where he was visiting his dad. This is the context that we are facing for African Americans, is the context black folks are living in, literally, with instances, multiple instances of black men being found hanged in apparent lynchings, but being ruled as suicides that have been ramping up since last year. Multiple cases of suicides. And you know when the last time there was an increase in sort of random hangings of black young men that were all ruled as suicides? It was in 2012. It was during the Obama era. So interestingly enough, these two moments when you had a lot of racial angst and anger, you're seeing a lot of what sure look like lynchings. You're seeing a lot of young black men suddenly either getting killed and then the person killing them walking away with impunity, or being sentenced in the case of this 19 year old child, Carmelo Anthony, to 35 years in prison for apparently trying to defend himself against a bunch of boys who were jumping him. And of course in Texas, everyone is screaming, don't make it a racial issue. Okay? But this is the context that black Americans are living in and this is the context in which they are receiving the evisceration of the Voting Rights act, which is triggering Southern governments, Southern Republican governments, to redraw the maps to make it so that black Americans cannot elect candidates of their choosing who they feel represent them. Having done that after a literal insurrectionist filed a case that went straight to the arms of an insurrectionist on the court, probably the foremost insurrectionist on the Supreme Court, besides, you know, Uncle Thomas's wife. And then he gets to decide that it is actually legal to racially discriminate against black people in the south and take away their voting rights. And this Southern Republican governors, the sort of new Dixiecrats, these neo Dixiecrats, are eagerly redrawing the maps to wipe out black representation across the South. They could take out a third of the Congressional Black Caucus. I just need you to understand that is the context in. In which black Americans are receiving that information while we're also still grieving for babies who are being killed with impunity. And we're having to juggle all of these things all at the same time while a president of the United States destroys the country economically so that we can't even live well and afford things during this hell. It is the nadir. People are calling it the nadir. That's what we have returned to. It is the context that I think is really important for y' all to recognize because that's the context in which we are sitting with all of this. I do believe we have our guest in house. I think y' all let me know if we have our guests ready to go. If not, hold on. I'm waiting for. I'm waiting for word from. From. From. From behind the stage. If our guest is ready to go, I'm give her a couple minutes to get ready. I'm going to give her a couple minutes to get ready. Oh, no, I'm not. She's going to come on right now. Angela Rai, my dear friend, co host of Native Landcod, strategist, you know, political strategist, legal strategist. I'm basically going to utilize all of your skills on tonight. My dear friend Angela, thank you for being here.
- [20:12]
Angela Rye
Thank you, sis. I'm sorry. You know, I was in a text thread responding to you and lost track of time.
- [20:19]
Joy Reid
And look, I turned off my phone so that I wouldn't text you back while I'm on the show.
- [20:24]
Angela Rye
So sad. And n said. I said, oh, God, I gotta go.
- [20:28]
Joy Reid
So can I tell you, I texted this lady. Literally, I was texting Angela Rye like two seconds before I went on the air. So it's legit. Yes, ma'. Am. So I was watching your live that you did earlier in which you talked about just being fed up and mad. And I felt that so deeply in my spirit. You were speaking for me, sis. Talk a little bit about that. Cause I just was teasing. The situation that we have with these young black men either being killed with impunity, or in the case of Carmelo Anthony, facing 35 years in prison for apparently trying to defend himself. Like I said, we can't win either way. And then on top of that, losing our Voting Rights Act. Your thoughts, Joy?
- [21:11]
Angela Rye
You know, I was reading about Carmelo earlier. We recorded our show earlier today, and there are so many things that I think of the number of conversations that you and I have just centering the humanity of young black boys, of black people. So often we are seen as a commodity chattel, which we've seen, been seen as since slavery. And the rights that we have as a result of being deemed property historically suffer. And so the thing that is remarkably challenging to me right now is being able to hold space for the family that did lose their son, but also understanding that there is a black boy whose future is forever changed. This boy was the captain of his football team, captain of his track and field team, a 3.7 GPA, worked at foot Locker, worked at a supermarket. You know, really carrying his weight in ways that most of us, many of us urge our kids, our God kids, our nephews and nieces, you know, siblings, to. To pursue. That was the path that he was on. And in a split second, you know, using a knife that's this long, a switchblade knife, this future's forever changed. Feeling threatened. Nobody's really willing to hear about the fact that his defense team failed him. You called one witness. That witness was his mother. Nobody else centered that boy's humanity. There is no reason that he should have been charged with murder and that he was found guilty of first degree murder. I just will never forgive this injustice system for how we have witnessed for centuries, for centuries, from vigilante injustice to George Zimmerman, to from this we can go. You know, that's a whole book, Joy, but we can go pound for pound everything that's wrong with this and know that it wasn't just about Carmelo Anthony. It is about the supernatural failures of this justice system to us. And so when you look, of course, back at the justice system, not on the criminal side, but on the civil side, what the Supreme Court is willing to do, we can contrast Alabama, Louisiana versus Virginia, you know, and. And the ways in which black people have said you know what? I'm going to lay aside my differences with Abigail Spanberger and say, I know that we need a blue state, because if we have a blue state, finally we're going to be free, Joy. Finally we're going to see liberation. And this half is betraying us left, right and center, mostly center. Trying to. Trying to be the middle of the road. Middle of the road is not courage. And that's really what I was saying today. You know, I'm supporting our dear sister, the chair of the cbc, Yvette Clark, Vince Evans, my little brother, in this process to just get companies to say they agree with us that voting rights should not be on the chopping block. There's somebody that was arguing me earlier
- [23:59]
Karen Attia
saying voting rights aren't on the chopping block.
- [24:01]
Angela Rye
People can still vote. But if you go and vote for somebody in June, that in November is no longer on the ballot because the Supreme Court decided mid election to take them off, that's not really voting rights. That's not really what that is. And so for the black lobbyists in particular, I think it's everybody. But I'm personally offended by the people who I worked on the Hill with, been to coffee with, been happy hours, been in the Congressional Black Associates with y', all Washington government relations group, where I've gotten an award. Y' all don't have the courage to say they should stand up to ensure that your mother, your grandmother, your grandparents, your ancestors, Rosa Parks, Martin Luther King, Fannie Lou Hamer, Bob Moses, Medgar Evers, none of those people, their fight, none of those people should be protected. I. I just, I don't understand what time. Anyway, Joy, I gotta be quiet because this is your show and I'm on a rant and I'm angry.
- [24:51]
Joy Reid
You can rent as much as you want. This, this space is yours, sister. Rant away. Because I think it needs to be said. And I'm trying to just get folks who are not in our community, you know, who are part of this audience, to understand this is the context in which this rage exists. Because we're trying to juggle all of these hurts all at the same time. Jason, I don't know if you could put up this. I think it's ac. No, no, no, no, no, no, no. Sorry, sorry, sorry, sorry. Eight, nine. Yeah, that's cool.
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Godfrey
Going on. I got it.
- [25:23]
Joy Reid
And just mute the sound. If you could put up a nine and just mute the sound because we're literally grieving children.
- [25:29]
Angela Rye
Yeah.
- [25:29]
Joy Reid
That are. That are, like you said, have lost everything. Lost their entire Opportunity, everything they had to look forward to. And at the same time, if we wanted to change the laws to make it so that in a case of a Cyrus Belton, prior bad acts could come in. You got to vote to change those laws.
- [25:47]
Angela Rye
Yes.
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Joy Reid
Right. And you, that means you have to vote in members of your state representative house, the state house or your state senate in order to do that. If you're locked in a district where you can't do that because no matter how early you show up to vote, they've mixed you in with so many people from the other party that your vote will never move or change anything. Or in this case, you think of all the laws that are changed, they're all passed by members of the state representatives in state houses. And if they take away our opportunity to change those people, we can't change those laws.
- [26:17]
Angela Rye
We can't. We can't. I, I guess, you know, the thing that I would challenge us with in this moment is if we don't all as individuals do everything that we can, what do we expect to change? Right? We, we have traditionally said, oh, you know, we know that your rights are, are well worth the fight. And we're going to, we're just, just wait till we get through to this part. We just need you to set your stuff aside for now and right on the setting that aside, then we going to have your back. Sis, when I tell you that has never worked for us. It has never worked for us. And then we have situations like, you know, what's happening in Florida. 20. What you just brought up is, is, is a huge problem for me. I'm watching all of these Democratic organizations put out memos that say post V. I'm not willing to, to concede the point yet, Joy. I'm fighting for voting rights. I'm fighting for the Voting Rights Act. John R. Lewis told us to be get in good trouble. There is a bill named after this man who almost lost his life fighting for voting rights. You think I'm ready to talk about a post post nothing. It ain't post racial or post V. And here's the thing. In their post V, Joy, they see opportunity. It's the land of opportunity to pick up Democratic seats. At what cost, Joy Reid? At the cost of decreasing the Congressional Black Caucus membership at the cost of losing the seats that people just fought so hard for. Congressman Clyburn, Bennie Thompson, Sanford Bishop, they all came in together in 1993 because there was an opportunity to demonstrate that the voting that, that districts that should have been protected by Voting rights were the. By the Voting Rights act were still discriminating. There was racial discrimination that were barriers to entry for folks who make up 55% of black people's population. Total population, total demographic in the south. But in 2026, we post racial now. We post VRA now. And Democrats are ready to say, all right, we'll concede that. Let's just go ahead and run this Dixie crap play over my live body. Joy Reid. I'm not doing it.
- [28:33]
Joy Reid
And by the way, we can make it very specific in Florida's District 20, you know, because Alcee Hastings, one of the people who was in one of those black opportunity districts, you have a Democrat. Oh, yes. The Republicans illegally gerrymandered the map. There is a fair district Florida amendment. It shouldn't have happened, but once it happened, it's the Democratic candidate, Debbie Wasserman Schultz, who was jumping districts to try to take that formerly black held seat. So she's saying, as long as we get a Democrat in there, y' all should be cool with that. It's like, no, we shouldn't at all.
- [29:09]
Angela Rye
Especially when, Joy, tell me if you've seen it, where is Debbie Wasserman Schultz statement on Calais, on Alabama or Louisiana or anything? The only statement she's made has been about Florida gerrymandering. She's not said anything about the impact of these voting rights decisions or on the black people she now seeks to serve. What's the demographics of black people in that district?
- [29:32]
Joy Reid
About 42%.
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Angela Rye
42%. And she's not said a mumbling word about voting rights. I want Debbie Wasserman Schultz to tell us why she deserves to be elected the representative of an area where she's never protected black interests. She's had to be pushed. Nobody's asking for that. Debbie, go run over there with them Republicans. You know, I agree. One of your viewers said, debbie, sit your ass down. I agree. You know, it's, it's just so disrespectful because what that says to them, Joy, is like, oh, I'm gonna run in this area that feels a little less competitive where I won't have to raise as much money and it would be an easier shoe in for me. That's not fair. You know, of course, anybody, like a lot of our leaders have been saying, you know, they could run wherever they, wherever they choose. That's their right. Yes, but should you? That's a different question. You can, but should you? And I think morally and ethically she's failing her obligation to her former Colleague John Lewis. May the ghost of John Lewis haunt her in her dreams tonight.
- [30:34]
Joy Reid
And she made the announcement with a picture of Barack Obama behind her. Someone that, from a lot of reporting, she didn't even get along with. But she knew that she had to project an image of some sort of mystical support from Barack Obama for this because he's vaguely been against gerrymandering. But, you know, so. So I think we. We. I'll set that piece aside. The other piece of it is that we can't get black candidates to realize that eight of them running against Debbie will just produce Debbie. That eight people running against one. That, that there's no willingness among any people to set their egos aside and say, let's all get in a room and figure out which one of us is the most electable and let's do a head to head against her. She may win simply because there are so many black opponents running against her, you know?
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Angela Rye
Yes. And let me say this first, because I didn't talk about Debbie. Now let me go to Sheila, who I don't know as well, but my issue with this group of black candidates is that the incumbent before she resigned because she has resigned her seat avoiding expulsion. Avoiding expulsion because she'd been indicted by this federal government for a misuse of COVID funds to the tune of millions. She believes she can beat that case, and perhaps she could, but not with this administration. I'm so sorry. This is the administration, Joy, that has hired Derek Chavin's former lawyer who's now running the voting rights play. You don't have a fair shot here, sis. So you spend millions of dollars on your defense. You lose because the. The feds very rarely lose your case. Now, let's say that it's a good day in your district and you won. You win that seat, now you give Ron DeSantis a special election because you're not going to be able to stay elected after you are indicted and now charged and now sentenced, by the way, might not even get there in this Congress because even when the Democrats, if they're so lucky, take over, you know who's gonna make an example out of Sheila first? It ain't gonna be the gop. It's gonna be the Democrats because they're gonna be on that same drain. Drain the swamp message that they were on in 2006. So she's messed up three or four ways. Ron DeSantis gets a special. You think he gonna call that special election, Joy, ever? He gonna pull up Greg Abbott. What are we talking about? So I would like for us to understand that every open door isn't yours to walk through. Right. You. If you had to resign Congress to avoid expulsion, what makes you think you won't be expelled at a later day, friend? I really want to know that. And I don't know who the right candidate is. It sounds like all of them have a significant amount of shortcomings. I am intrigued by the way in which Uncle Luke is challenging people verbally. There are some things that I'm worried about in terms of his ground game, financial ability to raise, you know, and I think, you know, he may be relying a little too much on name recognition. That didn't work for him in the Miami Dade mayoral race. Maybe that shifts here because he's been. His voice has been elevated and piercing, cutting through, very highly convicted about what he believes should be the case in the path forward in that race. Maybe. But let me tell you who shouldn't be in there. Debbie and Sheila.
- [33:54]
Joy Reid
And this is coming from the former general counsel to the Congressional Black Caucus. Okay, this is.
- [33:58]
Angela Rye
I'm being so much trouble for this, but I can't lie to the people right now. This is not a smart tactic at all. This is. And also let me say this because the member's not gonna say this, Debbie, if you don't stop lying on the cbc, telling them, telling people that they told you you should run, didn't know if. If they told you you should run, please name the day and the time and the member who told you you should run in that race. Like, I. I bet you $5 I got Looney's 5 on it. That didn't nobody tell you that. And I'll leave it there.
- [34:27]
Joy Reid
We know that that did not happen. And let's go over to Marilyn, because this is the other one that is really important.
- [34:32]
Angela Rye
Oh, you feel strongly about this one, Joy Reid.
- [34:35]
Joy Reid
I feel very strongly. I'm a big supporter of the governor. I generally side with Westmore in all things, but in this case, he and Senator also Brooks, and now, I guess the teachers union in Maryland and lots of other sort of content creators and sort of young folks are lining up behind this guy, Adrian Buafo. But the challenge I have, my friend Angela Rye, is that I'm starting to see what I will call the blackwashing of aipac, meaning it isn't enough for them to run AIPAC candidates who are obviously running on the issue of supporting Israel no matter what and giving unlimited funds to them. They find black candidates who they fund, but they run under a different name. And then they say, no, no, no. My issue is keeping ICE out of the police. That's what Adrian Bouafle says. And he's hiding his ties to the crypto industry. He's hiding his ties to APAC and burying that in a message of affordability. Blackwashing the idea of putting yet another AIPAC toady in Congress. I have a problem with it and a whole bunch of people running against him and he's going to run through the lane for the same reason.
- [35:37]
Angela Rye
You know, I haven't followed this as much. I know that you've been tracking it, so of course, I naturally defer to you on this, sis. But what I will tell you is I think it is imperative that special interests and big money stay out of politics. I think it really does rob the voice of the people. We recorded our mini pod too for Native Land Pod today. And one of the things we talked about, I wanted to ask Andrew and Bakari, what were the most influential moments in their races? You know, when they heard from people when demands were made, what were the, the approaches? And they talked about aarp, the gun lobby and the marijuana lobby. And we walked through like, what were the most influential aspects of this? What I have to say is I take personal issue with the fact that somebody can write a check and have just as much influence over whether or not somebody can organize a group of voters. I think it's not fair and I think it really does rob people who, you know, maybe amazing organizers, but don't have ties to big donors of an, of a fair opportunity. Of course, we have a ton of members now who won't expect, I'm sorry, won't accept corporate PAC donations or any special interest money. And I think that's a smart way to run. But if we're honest, that's going to be in the districts where that are more progressive and liberal, where no matter what you do, you can still kind of break through. That's not going to work as well in places that, where you're running against an incumbent Republican. That's going to be harder. And so I do appreciate what you're saying. What I wish our members would do, especially if they're going to align with aipac, which I think is, you know, not smart in this era. I feel in some ways like it's immoral because it's a rubber stamp for Netanyahu. But what I really wish they would do is say, if you can't stand with me on these five issues, you know, voting rights, affirmative action, reparations, Economics and our economic participation and, you know, maybe a criminal justice reform. And you be clear about it and make statements about it. Every time these issues are attacked, particularly under this president, we aren't doing business because the CBC founder said, no permanent friends, no permanent enemies, just permanent interest. If it is our permanent interest, then we should always have a demand, no matter who's at the table. And I don't know when we lost sight of that. I think it's so unfortunate.
- [37:58]
Joy Reid
It is unfortunate. And speaking of demands, I want to talk to you about this demand by the Congressional Black Caucus, speaking of the caucus, that corporate America come to the table, as you mentioned earlier in this segment, that they need to make demonstrative, open assertion that they support Voting Rights Act. Now, There are about 200 names on that list. We're publishing it on the substack so people can go through it and check them off if you want to. What has been the response so far?
- [38:24]
Angela Rye
So I don't know about who's responded yet. What I do know is companies have started to respond. I talked to somebody earlier. Honestly, that's what spurred my life earlier, where I lost it, because there are folks that are like, look, I'm doing the best I can. And I just can't believe how hard it is for black people like us to ask their companies to make a statement. I'm asking companies I don't represent to make a statement because it's the right thing to do. Joy, I believe it with my heart. All we're saying is, can you stand where you stood five years ago? And if you can't, please tell us what has changed, other than there is a fascist, bigot, racist, white nationalist in the White House. That's what we're talking about. So what you're telling me is his ballroom, his inauguration fund, his priorities on deporting people to countries where they're not even from, his treatment of women and people with special needs and dismantling education programs that protect our kids and getting rid of SNAP and Medicaid and Medicare, all of that is more important than our ability to vote. That is not true. I know it's not true. Fundamentally, it's not true. Morally, it's not true. And so if you still stand with us on civil and human rights, civil and human rights protections that we've had for 63 years, in some instances, 61, 62 in other instances. What are we even talking about? Why is this up for negotiation? Right. That's the part for me. So I'm dying to know what's the problem.
- [39:57]
Joy Reid
And I don't think they'll be able to articulate it because they all rushed to the door to fling it open and embrace black people after the George Floyd murder because they thought that was good politics. If that was phony marketing and good marketing. Right. And now I wonder what has changed about voting rights as an issue that is, it should be nonpartisan. We should all want everyone to have the right to vote and to vote for the people that they feel best represent them. That isn't. That shouldn't even be controversial in the year of our Lord 2026. It's strange that it is.
- [40:28]
Angela Rye
Let me tell you this, because this might make you more mad. So the black mayors have put out a letter standing with the cbc, the Equality Caucus, the Hispanic Caucus, the Asian Pacific American Caucus, the Women's Caucus, all submitted a statement saying they stand with the cbc. I anticipate labor will do something similar. Similar. The attorneys general who've also been impacted by this, having to take these stupid lawsuits to court, filing briefs in response to the stuff that Donald Trump's administration is coming up with and what these states are coming up with. And on top of that, you also have the governors. So if all of these people, all of these entities where you do business in these states, in these counties, in these, in these cities, they're all saying what time it is, and you can't figure that out, we have a real problem. And I think that that's what should happen. Business should halt in these communities. If you can't find your conscience, why are you doing business with people with seared conscience? I don't understand.
- [41:33]
Joy Reid
Is a way that we can choose where to spend our money. It's very simple. If you make a statement, we'll spend money with you. If you don't, we won't. Angela Ry of Native Land Podcast. One of the greatest ever in terms of legal analysis, but also she speaks my spirit. Listen, if y' all hear her ranting on there, because she's speaking for me. She's. She ran for two. Thank you.
- [41:51]
Angela Rye
Plus one. That's what he gets. Like, plus one.
- [41:53]
Joy Reid
Plus one. I appreciate you says. Thank you. Go next, right? Go next. Come on.
- [41:57]
Angela Rye
No, I can't believe I was gonna talk about your shirt. Now. You know the head coach of the San Antonio spurs is from the town. He's from Seattle, Washington. He went to my brother's school, o' Day High School. He. His daddy was on the the Sonics championship team in 1979, the year I was born. Joy Reed.
- [42:13]
Cyrus Belton's Mom
How Dare you.
- [42:14]
Joy Reid
No, ma'. Am.
- [42:15]
Angela Rye
Knick shirt on here and your president got booed there. I can't believe you got that on today.
- [42:19]
Joy Reid
Much love to Mama and Papa Rye. Mama and Papa Rye. Y' all did only one thing wrong. Raise this sister not to be a Knicks fan. We going, girl.
- [42:27]
Angela Rye
I am from Seattle and I'm trying to reclaim my time and my team. I can't even believe you doing this to me, Joy. Re. I love you forever.
- [42:34]
Joy Reid
I love you anyway. Okay.
- [42:35]
Angela Rye
But I hope your Nicks lose.
- [42:38]
Joy Reid
Boo. Love you, Boo. Boo. Bye, Boo. No, no. We gonna win tonight, y'. All. We. We taking it home. We love Angela Ry. Please follow Databland Pod. Subscribe. Subscribe. Subscribe. You can hit on YouTube and they are one of the best and they do these mini pods in addition to the main pod. So please subscribe to Native Land Pod. All right, let me let y' all know. One of our great sponsors on tonight is our our friends at Mudwater. And like many of us, I do rely on coffee to get me through the day. And while I love it, I do not love all the side effects that come with it. Feeling jittery, feeling anxious, and of course, the inevitable crash. But going without coffee seemed impossible until I came across Mud Water. Mud Water is a coffee alternative made with mushrooms and adaptogens, about 1/7 of the caffeine of coffee. So you get the focus and the energy without the jitters, the crash or the anxiety. And it is not just coffee. They also have the original chai chocolate blend, Matcha, which my daughter loves. And tumeric or whatever your caffeinated beverage of choice is. Mud Water. They've got you covered. Every single one of their brands tastes fabulous and is designed to set you up with everything you need to actually build the habit. When you order, you get the full size tin of your choice, right? That blend that you like, plus a free rechargeable frother. And a little frother thing makes it foamy at the top. So it's just like you went to a coffee house. You get free gifts and free shipping. So are you ready to make the switch to cleaner energy? Go to mud water.com that's M u d w t r dot com, Joy. And grab the starter kit. Use the code Joy Joy and you will get 43% off. The frother alone is just worth it. That is right up to 43% off with code joyjoy@mud wtr.com and after you purchase, they will ask how you found them. Please show your support and let them know that we sent you.
- [44:28]
Karen Attia
Okay?
- [44:29]
Joy Reid
I'm sure you guys remember our dear friend from way back, all the way back in amjoy's days. Chevron Jones. Take a look.
- [44:35]
Chevron Jones
It's not fair that we have this one sided conversation when it comes to this issue. Of course parents should be involved with their children's education. But the question is, is the route that we're going in, is it fair for all children? Is it fair for. For all parents? And the answer is no. Now in with this, it is totally okay for us not to understand something. It is. But it's crazy that we are living in a world where if you don't understand it, you ban it. If you don't understand it, you eliminate it. That's not how this works. That's not how it should work. I think every person sitting here, whether for or against this legislation, you bring some type of value and. And we all coexist inside of this world. Whether this pass or does not pass, LGBTQ people will exist. Your children will have to learn how to coexist with those same individuals, period. So you can legislate this type of stuff all, all you want. It's not going anywhere. The detrimental effect of all of this is that when myself and all of us in this, this audience, and once we are dead and gone, you know who going to have to deal with this mess we're making. Our children, our grandchildren, trying to figure out how to be seen, how to be heard all over again. Sure, go ahead, take your political victory lap on this. But you know what? At the end of the day, you know who really we should be trying to see if we can check on? The children who are sitting out here in this audience now. The young people we need to check on. You know who else we need to check on? We need to make sure that the parents feel as if they are supported. Because I'll never tell you, Mr. Chair, and I'm gonna wrap up. I'll never tell any parent how you should raise your child. Never tell a parent how you should raise your child. But it has to be an equal playing field. Because if you can raise your child the way you want to, every parent should be able to do the same. Thank you so much.
- [46:47]
Joy Reid
And that brilliant young man has left his state senate seat to join the race to replace Congresswoman Frederica Wilson, who recently announced her retirement. And I will note that she have raised $100,000 within 24 hours of announcing his candidacy. Shev was born and raised in Miami Gardens, where that deep blue District is located. He made history in 2020 by becoming the first LGBTQ person elected to the Florida State Senate. Here's his quote from announcement day. I are tired of the same old talk. They're tired of the same old politicians. They're looking for change, they're looking for transparency, and they're looking for new leadership. And I think we're going to bring that to him. If he wins, he'll be the first the states, which is crazy. In 2026. First LGBTQ+ member of Congress and former state senator and current candidate for Congress, Sherrod Jones. My Joy, my. My little brother joins me now. How you doing?
- [47:39]
Chevron Jones
I'm good, sis. What's up?
- [47:41]
Joy Reid
Listen, I, I, first of all, I'm, I'm a bit ashamed of America that you would be the first LGBT.
- [47:48]
Godfrey
It's pretty SAG in 2026.
- [47:50]
Joy Reid
What, what has happened? Well, I should say the first known. Right. Because maybe some people in the past just were in the closet. We just don't know. So let's, let's talk about this race. You know, Fredrika Wilson is obviously a legend. We call her the hat lady around town because she had 5,000 role models. She had the cowboy hat, and she was just, she was just unbeatable while she was in office. But I think a lot of people felt like it was time for a generational change. Is that what, what finally spurred you to come on? Because you were, you were on the fence for a minute whether you were going to jump in.
- [48:19]
Secret Service Sam
Yeah.
- [48:19]
Chevron Jones
No, listen, one, I want to show deference to the congresswoman, even as after she was having the conversations that she was talking about not returning. Yeah. I didn't, I didn't pay too much attention to those rumors because she had not, she and I hadn't had that conversation. I have a very good relationship with the congresswoman. When she did call me and tell me that she was going to, that she was leaving, she hadn't told anybody just yet. I still waited because, again, I wanted to show deference to her. But when she said that she was leaving, Joy, I, I sat down, I prayed about it. I was an incoming leader for the Senate dims for 2028. And after I thought about it, I said, you know what? You know, the fight is really in Washington, D.C. why not? Right? Yeah, let's, let's, let's go for it.
- [49:01]
Joy Reid
It.
- [49:01]
Chevron Jones
Let's take it. Let's continue the legacy of Congresswoman and what she's done and when she was here and, you know, Jordan, and what she's Done in my. In Miami Dade County. The resources that she bought, the lives that she's changed. I was a 500 role model now, 5, 000 role model. So, yeah, it. It took some time to think it through, but I wanted to show her respect first.
- [49:19]
Joy Reid
You Asian yourself? Because if you were a 500 role model, that means 5,000.
- [49:26]
Chevron Jones
Hey, listen.
- [49:27]
Godfrey
Part Parkview Elementary.
- [49:28]
Chevron Jones
I got the pictures to prove it.
- [49:31]
Joy Reid
You're slightly older. Millennial. We'll put it that way. Let's talk about what you think are the biggest issues facing Miami Gardens.
- [49:37]
Godfrey
Why?
- [49:37]
Joy Reid
What is spurring you to want to represent your hometown in Congress?
- [49:41]
Chevron Jones
Yeah, you know what, Joy? I just came back from canvassing a few minutes ago, and I knocked on a door of a Ms. Anderson just a few minutes ago. That's why I got my dry fit on. You know what she said to me? She said to me today. She said that she had to pick between putting gas in her car. True story. And getting her prescription medicine. But that wasn't the first story that I heard. That was the second story I heard where individuals had to choose between something. And another thing. The people in this district are struggling. This is the. The. The. The. The blackest district in the state of Florida because that's the current district that I represent now. And the rental property, the rental rates in this. In this district is extremely high. People are struggling in this area. So why I'm running in this area is because there is not only just a need, there's a desire for leadership in this area. There's a desire for people who, as far as being transparent when it comes to what government is doing for them and how we're going to help them and be honest, where we can't help them at. Because I think people are sick of politicians. I've heard it all day today while I was out walking. And I also understand, Joy, that we're in a very, very crazy time where people just don't trust their government. So what do I believe this district need right now? I think they need an honest leader. I think they need an experienced leader. I think they need someone who's willing to work across the aisle but still hold Republicans accountable for their. I'm not gonna curse, but for their stuff.
- [51:08]
Joy Reid
Oh, let's. Right. And I think I might know your pastor. So don't curse. I ain't gonna curse. So let's talk about some of the others, because in Angela Ryan and I were just on my machete sister. We were just talking about some of the issues with just a lot of outside spending and a lot of interest groups that are jumping into these congressional races spending a lot of money because they want something on the other side. You know what I mean? That's the thing people don't like to talk about. If somebody gives you a lot of money and they're really, really rich, they want. It's not. They're doing it as a charity. They want something. Right. So where are you on taking special interest money and on taking money from aipac?
- [51:42]
Chevron Jones
No, no, I'm not taking any APAC money and special interest money. We are not, we're not taking. The hundred thousand dollars that we raised in the first 24 hours came from small donations. I kid you not. We just sat. We just sat a few minutes ago and I saw someone give me $1 and listen. And I sent that person an email thanking them. Like they sent me a thousand. We raised a hundred thousand dollars in 24 hours. You know why, Joy? Because I think people have seen the work that we have done in this state over the past 14 years and they said, we trust this guy. I'm gonna give him what I have. And, and I'm fine with that. And you, and you're right. Like you, when you start to get taking special interest money and when you start taking corporations money now, now you're beholden to them. Now you belong to these individuals. And at the end of the day, that's when they can tell politicians what to do and not the other way around. And that's what people are sick of.
- [52:35]
Joy Reid
Yeah. Go through a few lightning round issues. If you were in Congress right now, would you vote to force the president to end the war in Iran?
- [52:43]
Chevron Jones
Yes.
- [52:45]
Joy Reid
What about funding ICE as we stand now, Would you vote to fund ice?
- [52:49]
Godfrey
Nope.
- [52:50]
Chevron Jones
Because. Right. I think right now what ICE is doing, they are not using their powers in the way in which they should be used. Especially I would not fund ICE currently right now in the state of Florida because the state of Florida has abused that use.
- [53:05]
Joy Reid
Yeah, Alligator. Alcatraz finally was forced to close down. But the idea that in the state where I lived for 14 years or two of my kids are born, where you live and so many friends live that they actually opened a concentration camp in a swamp is actually shocking that the governor did that and used emergency money to do it. And I know you were in the middle of that fight as well. How do we reverse course in a country that's gone so far that we have concentration camps?
- [53:31]
Chevron Jones
Well, we have to get rid of this administration and we have to take back over The Congress. But, but my biggest fear, Joy, is that even us taking back, taking back over the Congress, we're dealing with an administration that doesn't give a damn about the, the rule of law. I mean they are, I mean they, they see the Constitution as, as a suggestion and not a mandate. I mean, so I mean, how do you fight against this? I mean we now, now we need Republicans who are willing to, to call the President out because making it clear that he has gone too far. But I don't think they, I don't think they have that type of guts to be, to be able to do that. They have not taken a page out of a profile's encourage and I don't think they're going to because they're too enamored with power right now.
- [54:11]
Joy Reid
Let's talk about voting rights. You know, Ron DeSantis, I mean I thought there was a fair district amendment that was passed in 2010. It was passed overwhelmingly, 63%. And now he has gerrymandered the state anyway, you know, thrown sort of these districts into the air. What do you make of the response of the party writ large to it? Angela Wright was talking about the fact that there are some Democrats who are looking at these new maps and seeing opportunity. They're saying, hey, post vra maybe we can still pick up some Democratic seats. Not really caring whether black Democrats get elected as you know, for black folks who have been the base of the party. How do you react to that?
- [54:49]
Chevron Jones
No, well, first of all, I think first it's shallow thinking, right? And I think taking the easy way out is not the way out of this situation that we're dealing with within this country. If, if no one, if, if the individuals who believe that that is the right way to go, if they're not acknowledging the elimination of black representation, that's when our conversation starts and end because it's black representation is a non negotiable for me. I said it about District 20 and I'll say that for anybody. And if you are okay with the elimination of black district and you're saying that oh, as long as we have a Democrat that's okay, you're going to lose a strong base of your party. Right? The Democrats have to be, Democrats have to be careful especially. And I think we're seeing this in Florida right now because people are making it clear that where do we stand in this? Like we have been your most consistent voters and now you all are making it seem, seem like as if it's okay to not just eliminate black districts but also support when other individuals run in predominantly black districts. And I think that's where the problem in lies. And no, it's not okay. And no, everyone, they should be called out. And when we call them out, listen, make it clear that if it was on, if the, the shoe was on the other foot, whether it was a Jewish seat, whether it's an lgbtqc, I mean, you fill in the blank if you will probably be doing the same thing, because everybody deserves a seat at the table.
- [56:10]
Joy Reid
Yeah. And. And by that, do you mean specifically Debbie Wasserman Schultz, should she stand down in District 20?
- [56:16]
Chevron Jones
I think Deb. I think Debbie. I've shared what I think Debbie should do. I said that there was the wrong move for, for Debbie, for Debbie to do that. Debbie's running in, in the seat and I think District 20, they're going to make that decision in a few minutes. I thought the black, the black candidates got together and I thought they were going to make a decision on how they were going to coalesce around one thing. But that's not what's about to happen. I think. No, it's not about to happen, period.
- [56:40]
Joy Reid
Lastly, before I let you go, your race includes Rudy Moise, who has jumped from that Florida. He's the one that dropped out. Rudy Moise got out of that race to jump into the race in the district you're running in. And of course, the former mayor of Miami Gardens is also running as well. How do you distinguish yourself from that somewhat smaller group of people? At least it's not 18 people, thank God.
- [57:04]
Chevron Jones
Let me tell you something, Joy. For the past 14 years, I have not been afraid to go toe to toe with what people would think is Goliath. And that is Ron DeSantis. That's MAGA extremist, and that's even President Donald Trump. I. I'm not afraid of that. The one thing I bring to this table is experience. The one thing I bring to this table is results. That even though I have gone toe to toe with these individuals, Joy, I have still bought over $50 million home to this district. I'm the only one in this race who can absolutely say that. I have not only just written legislation, but also amended legislation to make sure that it doesn't bring harm to our community. Now, I believe everybody who's in this race, they have their own set of qualifications. And so I will not just remove that from them. But what I will tell you that what we bring to the table is the same consistency that I took to the House that got to the Senate that we would take to Congress.
- [57:59]
Joy Reid
And I don't want nobody calling me. Oliver Gilbert is the name of the four. I know him. The former mayor, Miami Gardens. I had a little bit of a menopause moment with that, but. Yes, but, you know, we try not to play favorites. We kind of play favorites a little bit. Because. Listen, Shev, I know what you do. I know your work. I hope people will support you. Because I think what we need in Congress is fresh thinking. I think we need independent thinking. And like you said, we need a fighter. We need somebody who's gone all. Already gone up against a Trump like figure. And if there's no. There's no more Trump like figure, really, than Ron DeSantis. So that was a differential.
- [58:32]
Chevron Jones
The race just took a turn, though. I don't know if you heard. Please tell me Kendrick Meek Jr. Just filed to run.
- [58:39]
Godfrey
What?
- [58:42]
Chevron Jones
Yeah.
- [58:45]
Joy Reid
Kendrick Meek's son.
- [58:47]
Chevron Jones
Yes.
- [58:50]
Joy Reid
Okay.
- [58:52]
Chevron Jones
Okay.
- [58:52]
Joy Reid
You know, I feel like we need to have some serious adult conversations within the community because we can't complain that Republicans are gerrymandering us out of power. And then 80 people run for one seat. Because we all see a personal opportunity. That's about ourselves. You know, we sat down and talked for the last, what, 15 minutes, and none of it has been about you and what you want for your personal life. It's literally about the people. And if we can't set our egos aside and have some of these people just see an opportunity and are like, ooh, great. This is a great six figure job for me. And this is not right. We have to stop people who've been. If you passionately wanted this seat, you would have already been running. Who is talking all these extra people in? And I'm sorry to say this, I love all my people, but I'm sorry, what is your qualification, Kendrick Meek, Jr. Because your dad was a congressman. Is that really what we're doing now? Are we seriously saying that anyone with any kind of name ID or whose parent sat in Congress now suddenly feels they're automatically qualified to run? Is that how we're picking members of the same thing that is happening in Maryland, where everybody who's anybody says, no, no, the answer to all these problems is me. I didn't hear you say that. And so that's why I'm supportive of you, because I think we have too many people who they're leading with ego, not with logic or with care for the people. This is a problem. Thank you for that. Bad news. You just. You broke some news on here Today. I didn't know that. I'm not happy about it.
- [60:17]
Chevron Jones
Yeah, well, you're here where I tell you, we knocked on. I knocked on 159 doors today, and not one door I knocked on said that they weren't supporting us. Not one.
- [60:27]
Joy Reid
Keep knocking on those doors. Chevron Jones, I call him Chef because he's my friend. You guys can call him Congressman Sheriff. If you meet him in the street, though, he'll probably let you call himself, too. But no, I will.
- [60:40]
Angela Rye
Thank you.
- [60:41]
Godfrey
All right.
- [60:41]
Joy Reid
Good luck, young man.
- [60:43]
Chevron Jones
Thank you, sis.
- [60:43]
Joy Reid
Posted on what's going on and come back anytime.
- [60:45]
Chevron Jones
I will.
- [60:46]
Godfrey
All right.
- [60:46]
Joy Reid
Thank you very much. All right, y' all see, this is a problem. We have to have these adult conversations with all of these people because we can't complain about the other side if we're also shooting ourselves in the face. Not just in the foot, but in the face. Because we can't consolidate around somebody who is qualified and ready to go. There are plenty of other jobs. You do not all have to run for Congress. There are certain people who I think are right for it. There's a moment for them. They are leaning into their moment. When I tell you Chevron Jones has been fighting the fight, literally in a dog fight with Ron DeSantis the whole time he's been in the state Senate, fighting those agendas from inside. Don't you want that kind of fight in Washington? What are the other people's rationale? I mean, and look, I'm not at corporate media anymore. I can actually weigh in in a different way. And I'm just telling y', all, we have to stop. Stop. Name. You know, name recognition is very important. I think in the case of Luther Campbell, it is very important. It could actually get some folks off the couch. But it's also what you've done. Right? I. I express a lot of support for Luke as well, but it's not because just of the name id, which I think will help get people off the couch in Florida 20, but because he has done things to build people up. His football program has built young people up, particularly young men who are the hardest to get off the damn couch. He has built businesses that have employed people in South Florida that have made people get opportunity to get out of the hood and actually make it. This has been something he's done with his entire life. He's a columnist for the Miami Times. He's waited on politics. He didn't just pop up out of nowhere saying, I'm Luther Campbell. Let me run for Congress. And he's the only one speaking out against the reticence of the Congressional Black Caucus to tell Debbie Wasserman Schultz to sit the hell down. Which they should do. We have to start keeping it real, including with each other, about how to fight against a regime that is playing fast and loose with our rights while the party that most of us vote for is also playing fast and loose with our rights. This is why so many African Americans are pissed off in this moment. Okay, let me take just one moment to welcome you all to hour two of the Joy Reach Show. And note that this hour of the Joy Reach show is sponsored by one of our great friends, MSI Reproductive choices. Very, very, very important one. They want you to know that every year across Sub Saharan Africa, roughly 4 million girls are pushed out of school because of unplanned pregnancies. 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To learn more or to support MSI's work, simply go to MSI United States.org that's M for Modern, S for Save, I for Informed MSIUnitedStates.org or just text my name Reid R E I D to 511-511-Text, read to 511-511 or go to msiunitedstates.org to start changing lives one more time. Text Reid read to 511-511-11 and check it out. It's an impressive organization doing really great work. Text READ to 511 or visit MSI United States.today Text fees may apply. And if you have not done so yet, this is a great time to go ahead and hit. Like to go ahead and hit. Subscribe if you are a lurker, don't be a lurker. You want to be a permanent resident of the TJRS team and we hope that you will do that. And also do hit the little notification bell so that you will always know when we are going live. And if you have not done it yet, go ahead and hit that share button. Copy the link and send that link to five friends. Just send to five friends to let five people know that you are part of the TJRS family. We want you all to join and be around. It's free. Just go ahead and hit subscribe. Just do it please. I want to also note that we are also brought to you on the night on tonight by our friends at Helix and we all know how important sleep is. Boy do I. But one of the things that makes getting a full night's rest difficult is having an uncomfortable mattress. That is where our sponsor Helix comes in. Now Jason and I recently purchased the Helix Midnight Luxe mattress and let me just tell you it has been a game changer. Now I used to wake up so sore from the previous mattress that we had because I'm a side sleeper and I almost dread going to bed at night because I knew I was going to wake up with that arm pain. Sleeping on your side can actually hurt. Now I sleep comfortably and wake up rested and pain free. 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And thank you Helix for supporting this show. Okay, so let me note that we are in an era of unprecedented risk and unprecedented jeopardy I think for the field of journalism. On yesterday's show I can't remember because we had, we've had shows yesterday and today we talked about the mess that's happening at CBS that's getting even worse. And Scott Pelley speaking out and just being very open about the fact that CBS is on fire, Paramount is destroying it and doing so deliberately, trying to destroy. He Even said Murder 60 Minutes, which is our most trusted news program. And that is a problem because as Peli did say in his interview, this is one, the one he did with Anderson Cooper. You actually can't have democracy without a free press. It's very hard to have both. And if the press is taking the knee and bending the knee to the regime, then you pretty quickly, you cannot find out when they are stealing your tax money to give it to January 6th insurrectionists as a form of reparations. You can't find out when they're taking your tax money and building a ballroom for Donald Trump that he promised you that his billionaire private donors would pay for, but suddenly you're paying for it. When he's taking your tax money and paying to refurbish a jet he supposedly got for free, for free from the, from the Saudis or the Emirates and suddenly it's not free, or from Qatar, sorry, you're suddenly paying to refurbish it so that he can transfer it to his presidential library. I don't know that President Obama is opening his presidential library on Juneteenth. And there's not going to be a private plane given to him by Qatar in there that you paid to refurbish and upgrade. But you won't even be able to know when they're stealing your money. They'll be able to do whatever they want to you because the press will be so obedient and quiet that they won't say anything. And then who protects you in an autocracy if the media and the press is on its knees obeying the regime? Once they do that, there really is no hope for you to be able to exercise your freedom in a democracy. So it is no longer a democracy without a free press. So when we see these firings of journalists from mainstream media outlets, from corporate media outlets, we actually have to pay attention. Particularly when they start coming in a series. If they just fired me, you know, I kind of get it. They didn't like that I was talking about Gaza. You know, they don't like that I was talking about Trump. If it's a one off thing, you can say, well, maybe that particular company just didn't like the way that particular person was talking about the regime or was talking about Gaza and they were mad about it and they said, let's go. But it came after they had also done the same thing to Mehdi Hassan. So it's like, ooh, it's a series. It came after they shuffled the shows around to make sure that Ayman Moyudine didn't have a solo show anymore. He was in a group. Feels like a series. If things start to feel like they are serial or that somebody that's a contributor is no longer a contributor because they say something about Donald Trump that he doesn't like and suddenly their contributor deal is gone, right Then you start thinking, oh, there's something more to it. And what you're seeing at places like cbs, it's hard to see it as one offs because there seems to be so much more to it. You have Bari Weiss come in who literally launched a substack whose goal it was to reframe the media in a right wing context and make that cool for the young people. Because she was pissed off that she couldn't do that at New York Times. She goes over there and suddenly the Ellisons buy Paramount, cbs because the woman who owned it before Sherry Redstone was upset that after Tony Ducopel, who was a morning show host, called Ta Nehisi Coates a terrorist, there was an uproar inside of the, of the building. Of course there was, because people were embarrassed by that lack of journalistic integrity. And so she said, well, the solution is I'm going to sell it to an even more super Zionist person than me to make sure that that never happens again and that the narrative on the air on this network that my father created will be always pro Zionist like me. And I will have a narrative I'm more comfortable with. And I'll hire these super Zionists who will hire another super Zionist, Bari Weiss, the same Bari Weiss, and make sure that we switch the narratives not just to be pro Israel, but also to be pro Trump. And we're going to do that because that's going to allow the Trump regime to let us do our mergers. So it's all a good business decision. Good business for us, good business for our friends in Israel, good business for Trump. And we're all happy. Except the journalists are not happy because they're destroying the journalism in the process. They take apart and a CBS Nightly News and turn it into sort of a, you know, like a fanfic for about the administration. Oh, you know, Marco Rubio, I salute you, is suddenly a thing that said on CBS evening news. Suddenly 60 Minutes is being told and commanded by Bari Weiss to change the reality and narrative about what happened in Minneapolis to pretend that Renee Goode and Alex Preddy were among a group of violent protesters. And so they had to get shot when that isn't what happened and it's on tape, but still Bari Weiss wants it done and so they have to do it. And then all of a sudden they just start firing people. They get rid of CBS's whole radio program. They just don't want any truth. They only want what Donald Trump believes. That is what must be said or else you're fired. And then they even fire Scott Pelley. One would think, right, the senior white guy would be safe if anyone was safe in an anti DEI environment. Supposedly he's got the demographics for protection. Apparently not if he's not willing to lie for the regime. So nobody is safe. And we keep telling you all that. Then when fascism comes for the blacks, first they're coming for everybody. Eventually they'll get to everybody. Eventually. Anyone who does not take the knee when that happened in one or two outlets, we had to pay attention. But when journalist and columnist Karen Attia was fired by the Washington Post after more than a decade on the job, including becoming the founding editor in 2016 of the paper's global opinions section, where she recruited Jamal Khashoggi, the late Jamal Khashoggi, as a columnist before he was systematically murdered in 2018, very likely by the Saudi government and. And at a time when she was being elevated to the opinion to opinions columns full on opinions columnists In 2021, she had been writing opinion columns on race, culture, gender and human human rights. And notably she was by the end the only black columnist left at the paper. Her firing on September 11, 2025, after the death of right wing activist and Turning Points USA co founder Charlie Kirk, for the thought crime of pointing out the very obvious double standards when it comes to political violence in America, and for pointing out that the late Mr. Kirk was a white man who espoused violence, which just actually true, it was one of the more telltale signs that American journalism was in crisis and kneeling to autocracy. But it was also notable for the fact that it didn't get the sort of uproarious reaction that we saw when for instance, Jimmy Kimmel was suspended or when it was announced that Stephen Colbert would be his show would be ended after 30 years of the late Show. It was a quieter response, maybe because people don't respond the same way to when these things happen in print. Or maybe there's sort of a numbness to Jeff Bezos for whatever reason, or maybe because it was a black woman. We don't know what it was. But it was a more muted response. Well, it didn't matter because the response from Karen herself was not muted. She did not take it lying down. She launched a Resistance Studies series online, and she filed a formal grievance against the Post, which was aided by the Washington Post Guild and the Washington Baltimore News Guild, arguing that her firing violated fundamental press freedoms. The case went into arbitration on last Thursday. And Karen Attia is going to talk about that with us tonight because we're going to get not just an update on her battle with the Post, but also on her take on the state of journalism today. Because I think where I think it's landing is that rather than these horrors provoking people to change their minds and realize that they've been busted and that they've been caught and that they ought to change course, what you're seeing is these media companies double down and they're doubling down on rinsing out any opposition voices inside of those corporate spaces, or if they allow the opposition voices to remain. Everyone who still works in these corporate media environments, they kind of know the drill. They kind of know that there's a limit to how much freedom you're going to have in order to speak up, particularly when you're speaking up about the administration, about Donald Trump. And I say that to say that there's a reason why when Joe Biden was president, every single corporate media outlet, but for a few, and I don't think ours did it as much when I was at the former the Artist Formerly Known as msnbc, we didn't do it as much as. But people hammered Joe Biden for being elderly and for appearing elderly and for appearing feeble. God forbid if he fell asleep or fell down. It was a narrative. Jake Tapper wrote a whole book about it. We now see our current president literally fall asleep at a Finals, at an NBA Finals game. Kind of hard to fall asleep. It's really noisy in there. Fell asleep there. He's fallen asleep in Cabinet meetings. He's fallen asleep in front of his fellow Cabinet while they're talking, even talking about him. He stays up all night tweeting absolute insanity, as if he's like a middle school, middle school girl constantly tweeting memes all night long until 2, 3 in the morning, and then he falls asleep during the day. There's obviously something cognitively wrong, and yet the media has been very muted on that. You definitely have some reporting on it. You definitely have Some people asking questions about it, but not in the obsessive way that it was done with Joe Biden. And again, I had a lot of problems with Joe Biden. His foreign policy, I thought was an abomination. But I don't think that the coverage of him being old, which was very obvious, he has white hair and he's elderly looking, I think that coverage was completely unfair in the sense that it was obsessive. But with Donald Trump and the insanity of what he's doing, and maybe because they're doing so many crazy things at once, it makes it hard to track it all or to keep track of it all, if they're not stopping anyone who is black or woman from being elevated to one star general in the Department of Defense, or killing fishermen and committing more crimes in the Caribbean, or committing war crimes in Iran, bombing school houses with little girls in them, or allowing Israel to conduct a second genocide. Whatever they're doing, they're doing so much in reparations for former January 6th insurrectionists. It's all so much that maybe the media can't keep up. But what I think we are learning is that without a media that is as focused and dedicated as they were to, for instance, Joe Biden's age and feebleness, if you don't even have that much interest in Donald Trump's feebleness and clear cognitive problems, then we have an issue. And Karen Attia was one of the people who was very focused, particularly on the foreign policy and the race aspect of what we are seeing happen in this country. And without that voice, it's very difficult to understand how the Washington Post credibly conveys to us where we stand in this moment. And I do believe I see Karen Attia has joined us now, so if we could bring her in when she is ready to come on. Maybe not now, maybe not. Okay, well, wait. I'll give it another minute. I think that she's one of those voices that was attempting to sort of help us to navigate the space that we're in, in this moment. And it's difficult to do it without credible journalists who actually have that background and who actually have that interest in doing so. And it's very difficult to imagine how an institution like the Washington Post continues to operate credibly in these spaces, if they even want to, because it's not clear that Jeff Bezos wants to do that. It's clear that Jeff Bezos is very pop, is very happy to pay Melania Trump for a documentary that nobody saw. It's very clear that he wants that. It's not clear what he wants in terms of journalism. And now Karen Atzia joins me. Hello, Karen. How are you?
- [79:02]
Karen Attia
Hey, Joy. I'm good.
- [79:03]
Cyrus Belton's Mom
How are you?
- [79:04]
Joy Reid
I'm good, thank you. So give us the state of play when it comes to. To your filing. I know that you all had an arbitration meeting or hearing last Thursday. How did that go?
- [79:17]
Karen Attia
Yeah, well, in many ways. In many ways, I'm still, like, astounded that I'm having to go through this process after 11 years with the Washington Post. Yes, we went to arbitration after eight months since my firing. We, my lawyers. I was represented by. By the Washington Baltimore News Guild and the Post Guild. I mean, we came away feeling very confident. The Post was not able to very clearly articulate why, if they claimed that my social media Blue sky posts were such a threat, why, you know, they never asked me to take them down. They never even gave me a call. Never even, you know, check to see if my safety was all right. And ultimately, ultimately, their argument that I disparaged white men. Right, That I violated their social media policies because I made the correct observation about America in the aftermath of the Charlie Kirk killing that America coddles, performs empty absolution for white men. Not all white men, not some white men, but specifically white men who espouse hatred and violence. The Post was trying to argue that that was disparagement and unacceptable, gross misconduct. Me, on the other hand, I was saying this is for white men who make a choice to engage in hatred and violence. And if the Post want us to basically, you know, stick their foot in the. Or put their flag in the idea that violent white men deserve protection, as they said, you know, being a protected characteristic, then. Then we could have that debate. But basically, they were proving my point. Also, there were other male columnists, white male columnists, that were literally, you know, and again, I'm just quoting, you know, calling people libards on the same day that I was tweeting, almost doxing, participating in the doxing of people while I was tweeting or posting on Blue sky, that columnist Mark Thiessen still has a job.
- [81:39]
Joy Reid
You know, what's interesting is that I wonder whether if you had written those very same sentences about any of the most violent January 6th insurrectionists who were then pardoned, I think that would be a prima facie case that these white assailants of the Capitol were being coddled, particularly by the President of the United States, and they had pervade violence against police. And if somebody had called them violent, would that have been considered disparagement by the Post, one wonders.
- [82:08]
Karen Attia
Well, exactly. And we, we posed some of these questions directly to the Post. And their answer, you know, in my opinion, they were stumbling and stuttering and, and, you know, not able to. Trying to defend the, the indefensible. We also, again, we were looking at this decision to fire me was made within hours. Right. And so we were also asking where did the call come from? What influenced this or who, perhaps outside of the Washington Post itself. So, you know, asking Adam o', Neill, who's the current editorial page editor, who claims that he received text messages showing my posts, and when we were asking, well, where do they come from? I can't recall.
- [82:57]
Joy Reid
Okay.
- [82:58]
Karen Attia
Text messages, sorry, they disappeared. So you made a decision to fire, you know, me or make this consequential decision without knowing who or what these calls came from, which again leads us to, of course, question the judgment. But also, again, we remember during that time we had prominent government officials calling for witch hunts, calling for people to fire people. This process also for me is about trying to reveal who, who is actually running the Washington Post.
- [83:36]
Joy Reid
Right, yeah. And that is a good question. I mean, we have. To your point, we've seen several cases now that people who were fired because they tweeted anything about Charlie Kirk that was thought laudatory, losing their job, being fired, and then having, you know, being settled with because they turn out to be right. It does turn out that there is a first amendment and that you're not, you don't, you're not required by law to like Charlie Kirk or to revere him. And it seemed to me that there was a period in this country where there was almost a requirement that everyone must revere Charlie Kirk to the point where schools were setting up Charlie Kirk, you know, sort of institutions and adding turning point to the curriculum. It was a strange, weird time. Do you feel in some ways you were getting caught up in that or do you think it was more specific?
- [84:24]
Karen Attia
I mean, I think both. I mean, I think we were arguing that they were looking for an extreme used to get rid of me. As many people may know, or may or may not know, I was the last full time black opinion writer at the Post. I challenged why. Previously, I challenged why there was no attempt to retain any of us award winning black journalists or editors or opinion writers. Right. So there's that. And enjoyed. To your point, about grief, I mean, it didn't escape me, right. That one of the posts that they cited in my termination letters being evidence of gross misconduct was That I said, I refuse to tear my clothes and smear ashes on my face and performative mourning for a man who espoused hatred and violence. And that refusing to do so was not the same as wishing political violence on him. And it's not lost on me that white male leadership saw that me as a woman refusing to literally strip myself. Was evidence of misconduct. And I think just, even just the message that that sends to women journalists. One of the last prominent social media cases that the Washington Post has had to face was when reporter Felicia Somnes talked about Kobe Bryant's a weight rape charges in the aftermath of his death several years ago. And so it's almost like this expectation that women writers, if we don't grieve popular men correctly, the male leadership is going to punish us severely. Right. And the Post has chosen to be a part of that sort of cultural repression, in my opinion, of, of women voices in that way. And yeah, like the whole point of being journalists, and I said this is, is to exercise restraint when others are going through hysteria and we don't have all the facts and we don't have, you know, all the information needed to ascertain, you know, judgment. We're supposed to restrain ourselves and be above hysteria, not feed into it. Right. Yeah. And so it's really just unfortunate that. Beyond unfortunate, it proves my point.
- [86:44]
Joy Reid
I think so. I think so. I have to ask you this, this arbitration process now, does it, does it allow the sort of normal sort of legal form of discovery, like how much are you able to get into what the internal communications were? Because I think it's important for the people to know, the public to know if the Washington Post is being influenced from outside, if Jeff Bezos is exercising direct control over the editorial. You know, people can then make a choice if they want to continue to consume that content. But are you able to get that kind of discovery in this process?
- [87:17]
Karen Attia
We were able to get quite a bit of the discovery into what led to some of the decision making. I mean, honestly, this is part of the reason why I wanted to go through this process and make it as quick as possible compared to a court case. This, as far as I know, this does not preclude me from other ways of, you know, getting to discovery. But. But yeah, we are right now, you know, the latest update in many ways is we, the Post, surprise, surprise, does not want this transcript to be not confidential. So we are hoping that we can, you know, override that and we are hoping that we can, you know, provide a bit more to the A bit more as far as what happened. So stay tuned. I think we're going to get a ruling on that. But yeah, just let it be known that the Post is fighting hard to keep what happened in that meeting a secret, and we're fighting against that. But I can say for. For people who don't know, arbitration is very much like a court proceeding.
- [88:23]
Secret Service Sam
Your.
- [88:23]
Karen Attia
Your lawyers introduce evidence. I get direct examine, cross examine. The Post, after my testimony, actually declined to ask me any questions.
- [88:35]
Joy Reid
Oh. Oh, well, okay. Can I vote for not just the transcript, but the video? Because I feel like it would, like, soothe my soul to watch you destroying those people just as a journalist, being able to question them and not get asked any questions, which is odd. I guess that must have struck you as odd that they didn't want to ask you anything.
- [88:54]
Karen Attia
We're, we're interpreting that as a, what can they possibly ask me? And B, you know, that they have no case. I had a mic. Mic drop moment. Right. And again, just. I have not changed in 11 years. I've written and edited on race, gender, and culture. My social media has been a large part of my work at the Posts. And I'm like, I did everything a journalist was supposed to do in that moment. In the aftermath of the Charlie Kirk killing, I'm not going to ask for violence against this man, but I'm also not going to mourn excessively over someone who espoused violence. He went after black women routinely. Even Joy.
- [89:39]
Joy Reid
I mean.
- [89:40]
Karen Attia
Right. Went after my friends who were professors. I cannot believe do that. Not just as a black woman, but even just as a journalist. It's just not good practice. So it's. To me, I, you know, I was modeling to leadership what journalism looks like. And to be punished for that is, is. But what could possibly happen with arbitration? It is very possible. Should we get the ruling in our favor that I be reinstated?
- [90:10]
Joy Reid
Oh, would you go back? Go back.
- [90:14]
Karen Attia
Here's what I'll say. I, I mean, the satisfaction of reinstatement is. Would be high. I'm very aware. What happened last week made it very clear that these folks, they see me as a threat. Okay.
- [90:29]
Joy Reid
Yeah.
- [90:31]
Karen Attia
But what I will say, you know, for now, I mean, I never should have lost. I never should have lost that job. And yeah, being able to walk through those elevators with the like, double wears Prada like, oh, my God, glasses off and going back to my old desk would be psychologically satisfying. Now I have a lot, obviously, to think about, you know, what, what would be best for my soul and spirit and all that, sure. But do I want that ruling? Absolutely.
- [90:59]
Angela Rye
Hell yeah.
- [91:00]
Joy Reid
I mean it almost might be best to just walk back in there, write two columns and be like peace, like byebye. I love this. Look, I would re up my subscription because I, I, I, you know, I, I did it like they did with Jimmy Kimmel. I canceled my subscription when they fired you and have not looked back since and will not resubscribe. But if you are res, if you are reinstated, I would resubscribe for as long as you are there because I think at the end of the day they are lacking. And I was saying before you got on, we cannot analyze this moment we're in if there is not one black columnist at the Washington Post who can speak truth to power because we're talking about 12% of the country being burdened with the majority of the declination of voting rights, of the right to go to college, of the right to get small business loans being decimated. And there's no one there that can stand speak to that in a credible way. That's a problem.
- [92:02]
Karen Attia
It is a problem. But for them it also might be the point.
- [92:06]
Joy Reid
I think it's the point. I think it is the point. It's a problem that they, they're, they're creating on purpose because that's, that's what they want. They want only the voices of the pro Trump, pro maga majority to be heard. Well, that's not the way we're going to do things around here. Before I let you go, tell me what you are doing because I know you are doing a lot out here besides fighting the police Post talk about it.
- [92:26]
Karen Attia
Yeah. So I'm writing, still posting and posting updates actually on the case on Substack so you can find me at the golden hour there. And then because of so much of this, you know, I was teaching on race and media at Columbia and now with the Washington Post firing, it makes it me all the more fired up to teach on race, media and journalism. So I started a school, basically the resistance study series, AKA Resistance summer school. So I'll be teaching race, media and international affairs in July this summer. So folks can go to resistancestudies.com if they're interested in supporting that and taking my class maybe. Joy, I would love to have you on as a guest.
- [93:11]
Joy Reid
I would love that. Done and dusted. Let's do it.
- [93:14]
Karen Attia
Yeah. If you have the time. We are all the things we going on. But again, like you said, I, I just won last night the distinguished service award from the Society Professional Journalists and In my speech, I just. I shouted out my late father, who just passed, and he just told me to keep going, to keep fighting also, because I hate losers. To losing to losers in general. But. But, yeah, Joy. And you, you're such an inspiration as well to. Like, we can. Jobs come and go.
- [93:45]
Joy Reid
Yeah.
- [93:45]
Karen Attia
But the work remains. Like, however we do it, however we fulfill our mission, what we're put on this earth to do. These folks aren't going to stop us. They'll make it hard, but they're not going to stop us.
- [93:58]
Joy Reid
So. So, yeah, they can't stop. Won't stop. And are you going to be at Rise Up. Sing out with me on Sunday, because I heard a rumor that you might be at it. Are you going to be there?
- [94:07]
Karen Attia
I can.
- [94:08]
Joy Reid
Okay, let me make some. Cool. So you should come. You should be a part of this. The Committee for the First Amendment. Yeah. So you should be there. All right, so we're gonna. We're gonna make that happen. Karen Atia, you are a great journalist, a fabulous person, and I love the way you are kicking the Washington Post behind. Keep kicking them. Thank you very much. No, no, she's. She's a fighter. Listen, and that's the kind of journalist that we need in this moment, because we are in the fight of our lives for our democracy. And you cannot have a democracy without full participation from all of the people in all of the communities. If you eliminate and you try to block one of the communities from participation in democracy, guess what you have left? Nothing. You have no democracy left. It actually goes away. So we have to fight these fights not just because we care about journalism. Sorry, my little earphones are falling out. Not just because we care about journalism as a separate profession. If you're not a journalist, and this isn't your thing, it's not bad. It's that journalism is the translation of what authority is doing to you. They're the people who try to transmit to you what those in power, who you elect, are doing to or for you. And if you don't know, because you're not getting honest assessments of that, whether it's on foreign policy or domestic policy, you lose and democracy loses. And the people who you ostensibly elected to represent, you can abuse the hell out of you. And so without journalism that is honest and forthright and unafraid of power, you actually can't have a democracy. And without a democracy, you're living in something else. And I'm not sure anybody wants to live in that. The thing that we would be stuck living in would be I think unlivable in many, many ways. Let me try to get to our next thing because I am very excited to talk about what's going on tonight. Is the game that is happening tonight. That is the make a good for the I think unfair loss officials driven and Trump hex driven loss by the New York Knicks in our last game at Madison Square Garden. But we will be having an update tonight. Now let me actually go ahead and note for you guys just a couple little breaking news items. I'm seeing them in my little slack here that for the second time, for the second night in a row, the US Military is striking multiple targets in Iran on Donald Trump's orders, according to a post by U.S. central Command. So we are back to bombing Iran. That is my breaking news for you on tonight. For what reason? I couldn't tell you to what purpose. I couldn't tell you what we're going to gain from doing that. Probably nothing. And expect your gas prices to continue to go higher and higher and higher. The longer we keep bombing Iran, the more they're going to keep that choke point of the Strait of Hormuz closed and the less likely it is that any of the prices of things that you're paying for are going to go down. They're not going to go down because as long as they hold the strait and keep imposing that toll. As we said, we had a guest on that talked about the fact that we are six months out, we are experiencing right now the amount of oil that went through the strait six months ago because it takes a while for that oil to go into the global market and to start to impact food prices and other prices. The other thing that is made from the products that go through the Strait of Hormuz are obviously fertilizer, meaning that anything that's grown in the ground is going to go up in price for two reasons. One, because of Donald Trump's tariffs, which already screwed things up for farmers and ranchers. And now because fertilizer prices are going to continue to skyrocket. And again, we are now currently living in the hell that was created by the bombing of the strait six months ago, the closure six months ago in February when they first started this bullshit. But now we are going to start to ease into the aftermath, the six month later delayed aftermath of what they were doing six months after per year prior to now. And six months from now, we're going to experience the hell created by what we're doing tonight. So six months from now, meaning going right into the November election right into the Christmas holiday season when things already go up in price because they're increasing prices for you to buy, you know, toys and stuff for your kids for Christmas, those prices are going to go up even more. So expect this country to be in an economic nightmare for at least the rest of this year and probably going into next year. I have seen a lot of anticipation of a deep, deep recession, but not like a recession even as bad as that was an 08 style recession, but something much worse. Because what Donald Trump is doing is he's not just bombing Iran, he's bombing our economy. He is making war against our economy and on our cost of living. A lot of people complained about inflation under Joe Biden. Inflation is now higher than it was under Joe Biden. And a lot of people voted for Donald Trump in order to punish Democrats and Joe Biden and, and by association, Kamala Harris for inflation. Well, inflation is now in the 3.2 range. It's over 3%. And over 3% is bad, bad. And there is no reason to continue bombing Iran on the theory that what if you just bomb them more, they're going to change their mind and suddenly throw up their arms and say, go ahead, go through the strait for free. No, they're not. They control the strait. They're, they've already withstood the amount of bombing that we've done. We've killed their children. We've extended the war into Lebanon, allowing Israel to conduct a second genocide. They've killed more than 4,000 people in Lebanon. They're still massacring people in Gaza and also selling real estate, going ahead and pitching real estate in New York. If you want to buy some real estate on the dead bodies of Palestinians in Gaza and the West Bank. Did you see Gwyneth Paltrow jumped into it? All right, let's move on. Let me play you guys. Let's focus for a moment on the Knicks. I want to play you guys. When, you know, when, when the orange one announced that he was going to attend the Knicks game. The Knicks had at that point had a 46 game winning streak. 46 days. They had not lost a game in 46 days. On the 47th day, the 47th President showed up and they lost. If that's not a hex, I don't know it is. Here's what Spike Lee had to say the morning before the game started. And this was his interview with CNN's Omar Jimenez. President Trump will be there. Some people are upset. Some people are a fan of it. I just wonder, you are The. The Knicks fan ambassador, I think is fair to say.
- [100:54]
Karen Attia
I can't speak for disciples,
- [100:58]
Chevron Jones
but I
- [100:58]
Godfrey
just find it strange
- [101:02]
Chevron Jones
that this had to happen now. Got to get there two hours early. I mean, it's just like, like, just
- [101:14]
Godfrey
taking the focus off.
- [101:17]
Joy Reid
We haven't won since 1973.
- [101:26]
Angela Rye
It should be about the game tonight.
- [101:32]
Joy Reid
And joining me now to break down the vibes rules for tonight's game, the man who will be my hangout partner at City Winery New York to tomorrow night, comedian and co host of 154 Africa podcast, the one and only Godfrey joins. Yo, Yo. I couldn't wait. I said I couldn't wait till tomorrow night. I know we're hanging out tomorrow night, but I'm like, come in one night earlier because I gotta ask you how you feel about the President of the United States destroying the vibes for New York City? I know you're here a lot. You do a lot.
- [102:05]
Godfrey
I didn't destroy it. I didn't destroy it. They were. I was. I'm a winner. Okay? I'm a winner. I know I'm a winner. They lost because they choked. They choked. Can you believe it? They choked. Can you believe it? They choked. They were supposed to win when I was there, but they were intimidated a little bit. Just a little bit. They were very intimidated by me. They're very, very, very intimidated.
- [102:36]
Chevron Jones
They're very intimidated.
- [102:37]
Godfrey
They saw my presence. I was. They were supposed to win and they got scared because the king was in the building, can you believe was a building. So they lost because they choked. And, you know, I. I couldn't believe it. I thought they were going to win and they just couldn't do it. If it were me, I would just like my elections. Three and you believe.
- [103:05]
Joy Reid
Let me ask you, why did you fall asleep, Mr. Mr. Trump, you want
- [103:09]
Godfrey
me to go back?
- [103:09]
Joy Reid
Dr.
- [103:13]
Godfrey
I fell asleep because the team is boring. They bore me. Can you believe it? They bore me. They just. So bad. So bad. So bad. Oh, what were you saying? I'm sorry, Joy. Your show is so terrible. I tell you so. You put me to sleep even in this little interview.
- [103:38]
Joy Reid
Can you.
- [103:38]
Godfrey
Can you believe it? Can you believe it? Can you believe it? Joy Reed. Fake news, Fake news. Fake. Fake news. Big news, Joy.
- [103:59]
Joy Reid
Yeah. Fake news, fake news, Joy. Yes, a little bit. Okay.
- [104:14]
Godfrey
Hand puppet is not easy.
- [104:16]
Joy Reid
It's not. I mean, first of all, did you just, like, acquire the hand puppet? Like, why?
- [104:21]
Godfrey
Somebody gave me this. Girl bought me a hand puppet when I was in Phoenix. Shout out to Phoenix. Stand up live in Phoenix. Downtown Phoenix. She just bought it for me. A hand pup. I said, oh, this is dope. I was like, what? And I want to give a shout out to Sesame street, please.
- [104:39]
Joy Reid
Okay. For.
- [104:40]
Godfrey
Puppeteering is such an art form.
- [104:43]
Joy Reid
It is.
- [104:44]
Godfrey
You know, and they're. They're there. You know, they're up there.
- [104:49]
Joy Reid
I always never could figure out how they would do the mouth and the hands.
- [104:52]
Godfrey
Yeah. I think it's like it's a combination of. Of, of, of these, or at least these. I don't know. Some things they use. People got sticks to move the arms. It's. It's such an art form. It's such an amazing. And. And to make them real. Like you believe Kermit the Frog is a real person. Person, I'm saying, because the movements, the head movements, the, The. The Jim Henson, it just. Puppeteering is amazing art form. And. And I just did finger puppeteering.
- [105:22]
Joy Reid
It is hard.
- [105:23]
Godfrey
I mean, listen, this is a rubber little thing.
- [105:26]
Joy Reid
So I'm trying, but the back, the back.
- [105:31]
Godfrey
I'm back. I'm back. Joy. Joy Riddler. Everybody was asking, where's Donald? Where's Donald? I'm right back here. Can you believe it? I'm back. They want me all the time. They always want me.
- [105:45]
Joy Reid
Yeah.
- [105:46]
Godfrey
Fake news. They got rid of 60 Minutes. It was a little too long. It should have been 60 seconds.
- [105:51]
Joy Reid
Can you believe?
- [105:53]
Godfrey
Should have been 60 seconds. Tick tock. You're gone, planet simple. Plain and simple. I can't believe it. I'm a winner. The Knicks. I hope you win, because if you lose, then that means I laugh all day because I'm the only winner in New York. It's right here. Mandani. He stinks. I don't like him. I don't like. I don't like that he's. I don't like what he's doing. These Muslims, you know. Can you believe.
- [106:22]
Joy Reid
Can you believe it?
- [106:23]
Godfrey
I can't believe it. It's so bad. So sad. So bad, so sad. Biden, terrible.
- [106:30]
Joy Reid
Obama, terrible.
- [106:32]
Godfrey
Kamala, terrible. Can you believe it?
- [106:36]
Joy Reid
I don't even remember what I was gonna ask you. Damn it. I don't remember, but I was gonna.
- [106:42]
Godfrey
Wait. I gotta go. Wait a minute. Where you going? Fake news. Nick's betterwit. Can you believe it,
- [106:56]
Joy Reid
dude?
- [106:57]
Godfrey
Sunny day bringing up clouds away
- [107:03]
Karen Attia
on
- [107:03]
Godfrey
my way People love me every day can you tell me how to get. How to get to Donald Trump Street? Can you believe they're going to make a street out there?
- [107:21]
Joy Reid
I. I can't believe it. No, no. I cannot. I cannot Believe it. I was actually. Dude.
- [107:30]
Godfrey
Joy and pain. Sunshine and red. That's a great song. Frank and Beverly. Can you believe it?
- [107:41]
Joy Reid
I can't. I can't believe it. I can't believe it, Donald. I can't freaking believe it. God.
- [107:50]
Godfrey
Yeah.
- [107:51]
Joy Reid
I was gonna ask you about the World cup because, look, we. We talk about, like, Africa stuff sometimes. I was on 150.
- [107:56]
Godfrey
Oh, Nigeria didn't make it. Nigeria didn't make it. Which is really sad that Nigeria didn't make it. And it's one of the premier teams when it comes to World Cup.
- [108:05]
Joy Reid
Did they not make it? Or they banned from coming in the country? Because, look.
- [108:08]
Godfrey
No, they were. They were. They just got beaten and just didn't make qualifications. Yeah, and my thing, as long as any African country goes in, but I always want Nigeria to go in. But, yeah, I think a lot of it is because Nigeria has so much potential. There's so many young people under 20 in Nigeria. So many. But the Nigerian government does not supply them with a practice field. They don't have any facilities. Yeah, which. Which. Okay, listen. Even in a corrupt government, they always take care of their entertainment. You know? Pablo Escobar put money into his soccer team in Colombia. He got them uniforms. He got them a practice field because he made so much money. He goes, I love soccer. How are you a dictator? And you don't like to be entertained? I don't know.
- [108:56]
Joy Reid
Russell does too. I mean, Russia does too. But I gotta ask you, because I wonder if I've lost the vibe. I'll be honest with you. I don't have the vibe for the World Cup. Normally, I'll be so excited that it's coming here, but it's. It's the guy you just had the puppet for. There's a guy who is one of the stars of Somalia because he is like the.
- [109:16]
Godfrey
Oh, he stopped him, right? They stopped him, right?
- [109:18]
Joy Reid
Yes, they want. His name is Omar Artan. They said he can't come to the country. So it's like we're in a situation where so many of the best players are African, whether they play for a European team or an African team. How are they going to come?
- [109:32]
Godfrey
Yeah, they can't. They gotta. They gotta give them clearance. That doesn't make any sense. I hope FIFA is fighting for them, because that's not cool. That's. That's bullshit. Unless they're trying to get the American team to win.
- [109:44]
Joy Reid
I don't know. Because I know that they were gonna try to ban Iran, but FIFA intervened for Iran. They were Gonna literally try to ban Iran.
- [109:51]
Godfrey
It's, it's getting silly. It's getting. How are people proud of this leadership? How are people proud of it? Because he caters to most of the dumb asses. The dumb, the guys that say, we're gonna make America great again. Make America great again. We gonna make America great again. Yeah, you're gonna make America great again. At least, at least show us some white people that look like they can make America great, but they usually show us a bunch of bums. They show us people that are academically inferior, they're physically inferior, mentally inferior, monetarily inferior, and all they got is racial slurs coming out of a trailer park. Shut the up, Shut the up.
- [110:32]
Joy Reid
It's easy.
- [110:34]
Godfrey
And you're like, we're gonna make America great again. You're fat asses. Really shut up.
- [110:40]
Joy Reid
And the thing about it is the World cup is one of those things that it is the great equalizer. You know, football, as they call it around the rest of the world, is popular all over the world. This is an equal shot. And you see these incredible players that come from a lot of black and brown countries, but in Donald Trump's worldview, they shouldn't be here and get to play. Or if they come, they have to be followed around by ice, snatched up out of their training facilities, sent back if there's any threat they may stay one day longer. How do we host the World cup if that's who we are?
- [111:10]
Godfrey
Yeah, I mean, why are we coming to America in the first damn place? I mean, we don't deserve it. If you're going to be like, treating people like that, that are playing a sport, there should be at least a pass for that. I mean, look at, I mean, as much as they're talking smack, as long as they fire a bunch of black women in federal jobs, they're getting rid of a lot of black people in positions of their administration. But they haven't fired any NFL players or basketball players. I wonder. No, I wonder why don't you make the NFL and the basketball all white again? Because you know why white people won't show up to those games. That's why. So that's why I'm surprised they won't have. They should at least even in their, their grandiose thinking, you know, they can go, oh, no, we want Sock, we want to bring soccer here. We want money. But they're so caught up in skin color and, and just denigrating Africans and brown people that they will rather lose money. Some of these people will Douse themselves with fire. If they said, if you can get rid of blacks, Mexicans, all brown people, I will be douse myself with fire. That's how some of these white folks are. Some of them are that crazy, right? I don't care if everything is. Look at the movie industry. The movie industry is suffering. The only thing keeping up the movie industry are black movies. Sinners. Michael Jackson's at a billion. What's the other? And even congratulations to Marlon Wayans. And the Wayans for Scary Movie did pretty good.
- [112:32]
Joy Reid
Yeah.
- [112:33]
Godfrey
Regardless of what you think about it, it still made some money because they lost the franchise years ago. They got it taken from them. So them making 55, 60 million. I even texted Marlins. I said, congrats on that, man. Regardless, it's a win for us. Black sells. Black people sell. Black Panther. Ryan Coogler, killing the game. Stop it. It's like black movies are holding up the box office right now. Plain, simple.
- [113:02]
Joy Reid
If you haven't seen Is God Is, don't walk right. Run to the theater. It is so good. It is. It's called Is God Is. You gotta see.
- [113:11]
Godfrey
Oh, that's my friend Cara Young. My friend Carrie Young's in it.
- [113:14]
Joy Reid
Her first film. It's crazy. Like, it's incredible. And, you know, my. My buddy Eric Alexander's in this. I went to see her. Yes. But I was like, it's. It's Vivica A. Fox giving the performance of her life.
- [113:24]
Godfrey
Oh, my gosh.
- [113:25]
Joy Reid
So good. It is so.
- [113:27]
Godfrey
Yeah.
- [113:27]
Chevron Jones
Oh, man. I got it.
- [113:28]
Godfrey
I wanted. I'm supposed to see her play next week, Proof. I think it's called Proof.
- [113:33]
Joy Reid
Oh, yeah. It's supposed to be excellent because she
- [113:35]
Godfrey
told me, you better come and see my play. I said, I see. I saw her in Fairly Victorious with Vanessa Bell Calloway. I seen that. So I'm definitely got to remember to go because, you know, with Broadway, you got to remember to go.
- [113:47]
Joy Reid
You got to remember to go because
- [113:48]
Godfrey
I'm so all over the place performing. You got to remember because, first of all, going to Broadway plays can be a little annoying because the seats are mad tiny and tight tiny. And you always got to sit in between two people. Like, it's always two, like, old white women.
- [114:02]
Joy Reid
I was.
- [114:02]
Godfrey
This is my third time watching it. It's such a wonderful play. Oh, my God. You just did. Is this your first time? Oh, it's beautiful. The performances are so fantastic. I'm like this.
- [114:16]
Joy Reid
Oh, okay, great. Excellent.
- [114:20]
Godfrey
Because, you know, when you go to Broadway play, you're. You're different because everything is like, excuse me, excuse me.
- [114:25]
Joy Reid
Yeah, it is.
- [114:27]
Godfrey
And everything is. And your Playbill.
- [114:33]
Joy Reid
And if you can hold on to it because it's so tight. I think it was built for people who were like miniature people. Like, yeah, but there's old school.
- [114:40]
Godfrey
They need to redo Broadway plays. And like, okay, like, when you go to Times Square, sometimes if I feel like watching Transformers 90s, right? I like them big ass. I like paying for the big giant studio chairs where you can go to sleep. I mean, you can go all the way back and the chairs move like, yeah, Optimus prime, bro. You know, they should have that in Broadway plays. Like, all right, it's a good play right here. That's what I'm talking about.
- [115:09]
Joy Reid
Now, that's acting. People would come if they did that.
- [115:13]
Godfrey
Yeah.
- [115:13]
Joy Reid
Yeah. Godfrey, how much will the Knicks win by today? Tonight? You can make it an average, I believe.
- [115:17]
Godfrey
The Knicks. Knicks. I got. Knicks win by 10. Because those referees were cheating, first of all. And they got rid of one of them. The one of them. One of them little handkerchief head ass Negroes. They got rid of him. The guy's name is Brothers or whatever. He's been a notorious, horrible referee, a Wemba. They have been containing him. And he was shoving and knocking, you know, they weren't calling none of that because the Knicks were frustrating. And I think the Knicks got their number. I think so. I'm gonna go by 10 tonight. Next. And you guys, this week, you guys see me, I'll be in Florida. Well, yeah, Florida. Fort Lauderdale. The Improv in Fort Lauderdale. Friday, Saturday and Sunday. Go to GodFreeLive.com if you want to
- [116:00]
Chevron Jones
find where I'm at.
- [116:01]
Godfrey
And I'll be there tomorrow at City Winery.
- [116:04]
Joy Reid
City Winery tomorrow. And then heading for Florida. Say hi to Florida for me, you
- [116:07]
Godfrey
know, or Lauderdale, but you can improv Friday, Saturday, Sunday.
- [116:12]
Joy Reid
Do it.
- [116:12]
Angela Rye
All right.
- [116:13]
Joy Reid
Hit floor. They need the laughs. Trust me. They in trouble. They need laughs. They need to laugh.
- [116:16]
Godfrey
Oh, Florida.
- [116:18]
Joy Reid
Oh, it's a mess. They. Oh, it's a mess. It's a mess. Go help them. Poor people. They need a laugh.
- [116:23]
Godfrey
I'll do my best. Wait. Oh, wait. Wait a minute. Wait a minute.
- [116:26]
Joy Reid
Their little spirits are so. Their spirits are so sad.
- [116:29]
Godfrey
Go next. Go next. Go next.
- [116:33]
Joy Reid
Thank you.
- [116:34]
Godfrey
Go next. Come to Mar a Lago, too, if after your shoot. Can you believe. See you later, Joy.
- [116:41]
Joy Reid
I would almost pay you to do that outside of Mar a Lago. I promise.
- [116:45]
Godfrey
Fake news. Quiet, Joy, quiet. Where are you? Where are you? Obama, I want you. Let's go. Battle again. You piece of. Can you believe he.
- [117:06]
Joy Reid
Bye. He is a first class fool. That is my moment of joy.
- [117:13]
Angela Rye
That's it.
- [117:13]
Joy Reid
That's your moment of joy? I had another one, but I'm not gonna do it now because I can't. I can't do it now. It's. I'll save it for Friday. The moment of that was your moment of joy, Godfrey. All right, y', all, we're gonna leave a couple minutes early because, look, I gotta get myself together. We gotta go watch the Knicks. See, I'm sweating. It's hot in here. I didn't have the AC on. It's a little hot. Moist. But, you guys. Jason, should we do the moment of joy or should we just head on out? What do you think? I'm gonna give you the. I'm gonna leave it up to you, Mr. Reed. He's not coming on. All right, well, we just. I think we're gonna go. I think that was our moment of joy. Thank you all for tuning in. Let's go, Knicks. Let's go, Knicks. We're gonna win this one at home and then we're gonna take it right to San Antonio and stuff it. We're going to end it in your hometown. That is what we're doing. Much love to all of our. Our friends that are, you know, spurs fans. We still love you guys. We're going to beat your team. That's what's happening tonight. All right, y', all, please tune in Friday. A very happy. I know we're going to be very happy because we're going to have beaten the spurs on tonight. Go, Nick. Shut it down. And we'll see you on the next Joy Reed show. Like and subscribe and goodbye. Peace.
- [118:23]
Godfrey
Getting back to the basics, grassroots level. Let me dig a little deeper with the shovel. Plenty can't tell the forest from the trees that I'm hard to detect Like a black hole in the dark Injustice anywhere It's a threat to justice everywhere Let me make this clear I got a bone to pick and I'll never fear the threat of poverty they don't want to talk about it they rap the party so I'm a real talk about it for sure.